Rick Lovett Responds to John S Captain Allegations

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
It's the Opperman Report. Join Digital Forensic Investigator and PI
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(00:26):
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Speaker 2 (00:34):
Okay, welcome to the Opperman Report. I'm your host, proud
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all kind of fun stuff. Okay, now we've done three
hours this week with mister john S Captain, and this

(01:38):
is the story of the murder of Tiffany Jenks up
there in Portland, Oregon, around twenty twelve. I believe it
was by these three characters. It seems like they're professional
hitman type and I'm really not sure what's going on.
But this couple who came from from Washington State, they
picked up a guy in Oakland, California. They all meet

(01:59):
up at a hotel in Portland, Oregon. This young woman,
Tiffany Jenks, flies into town. Within hours, they're shooting her
in the head and leaving her in our park and
then they're they're out of town. They got to face weapons,
all kinds of suspicious stuff here. So we had mister
Jenks was a former boyfriend of mister Captain. Was the

(02:22):
former boyfriend of Tiffany Jenks a one year relationship fourteen
months approximately, and had some theories that that she was
under mind control. And this was an Illuminati hit, Mark Butterfly,
all kind of stuff like that, and so we had
him on for three hours to uninterrupted to present his
case to the public. He's done about twenty hours worth
of shows in the past week. In one of his shows,

(02:46):
the first show, he mentioned Rick love It, and we
have Rick Lovett on the phone, who also lived with
Tiffany Jenks, and he's going to be giving us his
version of events when what he understands happened in these
circum stances. So, Rick love It, are you there?

Speaker 3 (03:03):
Yes, I am.

Speaker 2 (03:04):
Thank you so much for coming on the show.

Speaker 3 (03:07):
Thank you for having me. Rick.

Speaker 2 (03:08):
Can you tell us a little bit about yourself? Who
is Rick love It.

Speaker 3 (03:13):
I'm a I'm a journalist and science fiction writer. I've
done a lot of science fiction stories for the magazine
that I've Got Got to start in And I've written
science articles about three thousand and thirty five hundred of
them something like that for magazines like Science and New
Scientists and Nature. I also have done travel writing that's

(03:35):
included in those numbers, and bigle news and and I
kind of never quite figured out what they wanted to
do when I grew up and reporting was a really
great place to dabble in everything.

Speaker 2 (03:47):
So you mentioned to me before that you're sixty three
years old and you're a resident of Portland, Oregon. Still, yes,
how did you come into contact with Tiffany Jacks?

Speaker 3 (04:00):
Well, I'm also a runner, and I met her on
a run in I think it was early twenty ten,
as best I can date things off other events in
my life, and she showed up for a run and
we were the two fastest in the group. She was
faster than me, but she was a former state champion
fifteen hundred meter runner, but I was the one who
knew the route, so she had to stay with me.

(04:20):
And by the time we finished five miles, we discovered
were both science speaks and that's how we met.

Speaker 2 (04:25):
So this was twenty ten. Was she still healthy back then,
because I understand she had problems with substances and alcohol
and stuff like that, but in twenty ten she was
fit and out there running.

Speaker 3 (04:35):
She was getting herself back into shape. But yeah, that
was just that was shortly before her father got sick
and or it was diagnosed with cancer. And that was
my one one real taste of the Tiffany. As a
lot of people knew her prior to her final year's decline.
So she was a real firecracker. She was excited about everything.

(05:00):
She was really sharp, multi talented. This is this is
the person who, right, I mean, she'd been a concert cellist,
she'd been a firefighter. She had degrees in physics, economics, marketing,
and geology, and she was just really sharp and really
with it at that time. Things faded later on.

Speaker 2 (05:23):
And this is the time when she was still working
for the dams, the damn authority.

Speaker 3 (05:28):
Yeah, she worked for the Bonneville Power Administration. For those
of us out here, this is a big deal because
they let's see, I'd have to look at their website
to get it described to act with, but they basically
administer and market the power that comes off the Columbia
River system, and they have things to do with salmon,
maintaining flows for salmon and navigation and things like that.

(05:49):
So there's a string of dams up the Columbia and
there they wheel power all the way off all over
the West. I think.

Speaker 2 (05:57):
So, so you were familiar with her when she was
employed by this power administration.

Speaker 3 (06:02):
Yeah, she stayed there, I would think until well, she
had lots of gaps when she started got back into drinking.
She had drinking problems early in her life, but she
when I met her, she'd been on an extended sober run.
So she stayed there with a lot of leaves until
sometime late twenty eleven. Late defined this some time after August.

Speaker 2 (06:26):
Now you're familiar with these theories the right years here, Yeah, roughly,
but you're familiar with these theories going about that perhaps
she was inserted there into this bondable power administration in
order to perhaps sabotage the dams and cause great catastrophes.
Do you think that kind of thing would have been possible?

Speaker 3 (06:46):
I have known. There's someone in my church who worked
with her who tells me that she simply did not
have the ability to do that. And I didn't ask him.
He kind of like started hearing this stuff, and I
came to believe the same thing. I did some calculations
of what would happen if all the water out of
Vonneville Dam came down the river, and they were like, well,
you know, we've seen bigger floods and depending on and

(07:09):
so there just isn't enough water. These are not with
the exception of Grand Cooley, these are not water storage
facilities like Ounoville Dam. These are for power and for
locks of navigation and the control flows through. You know,
this isn't what they were created for, but it's one
of the things they do is to control flows for salmon.
So she just didn't. She probably had the authority, and

(07:32):
she's one of several people who did this. She was
not in charge. She was kind of like a shift
worker on this, and I'm sure she had the ability
to mess it up and cost him a bunch of money,
but she did not have the ability to drown out Portland.

Speaker 2 (07:43):
Okay, Okay, Now, how did it come that she came?
I want to how about this? Then? I guess that
the turning point in Tiffany Jenks's life was the death
of her father.

Speaker 3 (07:58):
I'm sorry I couldn't hear that.

Speaker 2 (08:00):
The turning point in her life was the depth of
her father.

Speaker 3 (08:04):
Yes, that definitely. He had been a stabilizing factor in
her life, and when he died, she basically extended the
wake for six months and then never really She then
went through bounce bounce, sober relapse, sober relapse. One of
the things that I admired about her was her determination,
like some alcoholics has from what I've read to pick

(08:27):
herself up and try again. She just in the time
I knew her best. She never quit trying to pick
herself back up. But she didn't concede for very long
after her father's death.

Speaker 2 (08:38):
So then how did she come to live with you?

Speaker 3 (08:42):
She had lost the job at BPA. I had known
her through running and other things off and on, and
basically with the last chance that she had shed in
her last fifteen months or so, she'd burned through an
awful lot of friends. Alcoholics do that, and I was
willing to give her one last shot, and she was.
She'd lost her job in her disability and retirement had

(09:04):
not kicked in yet, so she was living on a
shoe string. So I let her live in what had
been my office storage from and you know, didn't charge
her rent until she I mean, eventually she started contributing
to the rent. But basically I was letting her have
a place to stay and trying to provide her a
stable environment where she could do her therapy and go

(09:28):
to AA meetings and be away from the location she
had been hanging out in the past, And that was
the goal. And I was also a designated alcohol free
house I took my wine cellar and got rid of it,
for example. So that was one of the rules. No
alcohol in the house an apartment home I keep calling
a house.

Speaker 2 (09:49):
In this room, was she to sleep on the floor.

Speaker 3 (09:53):
Yes, she was. She was supposed to bring in a bed,
but she never got around to it. So she brought
in a film rubber mattress or an air mattress or
something else and pronounced the good enough. But I didn't
have a spare bid, and I was giving her the room.
I didn't feel like going out and buying a bed.
I was never going to need again.

Speaker 2 (10:10):
And was there any kind of romantic relationship between the
two of you?

Speaker 3 (10:13):
No?

Speaker 2 (10:14):
Never, Okay, during the time she was with you. What
about the SSDI disability insurance? We were told that was
about thirty eight hundred a month. What do you know
about that?

Speaker 3 (10:28):
After John Captain took charge of that, she and he
parted company over that for reasons that his story and
hers were somewhat different. And she got me to take
over for a few months afterward until she got charge
of her own finances. And my memory is and somewhere
it's in a file here, was that she got twenty
five hundred a months, and she told me she had

(10:50):
another one thousands from somewhere else, which I assumed might
be here her retirement. So she right, but I only
saw the twenty five hundred and so.

Speaker 2 (10:58):
She was able to get twenty five.

Speaker 3 (11:00):
I mean, boy, I could be misremembering. I could be
misremembering this number. I actually have a file right here.
Let's see what it was, if you don't mind the
blank here while they look it up.

Speaker 2 (11:12):
No, that's okay, I can mention.

Speaker 3 (11:20):
Yeah, oh boy, I'm not actually sure it matters. A
fairly sizable amount of money for disability.

Speaker 2 (11:25):
Yeah right, and this we don't have to worry about
the figure. This was due to her alcoholism and.

Speaker 3 (11:30):
Depression, right, I'm just worried that why I cite a
number one something accuses me of lying and and my
memory is not perfect on all these things anyway. Yes,
so this was social SIDIT, disability whatever. And that wasn't
the question you asked.

Speaker 2 (11:47):
Sorry, Okay, I got two more questions for you, just
in general, before we get back to the story of
Tiffany Jenks. One is, out of all these interviews and
people talking about this story, there's been like twenty shows
in the past week, has any other host or producer
or a reporter contacted you for your side of the story.

Speaker 3 (12:08):
None of the people who have so far done radio interviews.
I have heard from various other print sources they haven't
published yet.

Speaker 2 (12:19):
Got you? And now, since this story has received all
this attention recently in the past couple of weeks, the
past month or two, how has this been for you?

Speaker 3 (12:31):
Here?

Speaker 2 (12:31):
Have any threats coming your way?

Speaker 3 (12:35):
Not interestingly? Well, let's see, but past month or two not.
There have been a lot of threats posted generically. I
counted twenty two before I gave up against people associated
with Tiffany, and these are being posted on Facebook, on
pages run by John Captain, and I haven't been tabulating

(12:55):
them since. But I've only so far I've not gotten
a bunch of weird stuffy made that continue y. I
had something else here I forgot to tell you. In
my background, by the way, it becomes relevant, I'm a
former law professor, so I do know something about the
law in this type of thing. And I was also

(13:16):
a head a PhD in economics, so so I've got
a number of backgrounds in here that might use things
you can draw on.

Speaker 2 (13:24):
Okay, great, now while she was living with you, and
what is what was what was the length of time
she was living in your residence?

Speaker 3 (13:33):
Out a year? Yeah, this, I've been trying to figure
that out for quite a while. I know that she
was here for Thanksgiving and what must have been twenty
eleven and Christmas because she got a reef and it's
still around a little, a little bitty, you know, ornament

(13:53):
type thing. So and that had to be that Thanksgiving
because she was gone by the following Thanksgiving. But she
couldn't have been in a whole bunch before that. So
I'm thinking October to October about the time she met Captain.
I saw her very little.

Speaker 2 (14:11):
Okay, Now, were there any suicide attempts while she was
associated with you?

Speaker 3 (14:18):
No? None that I not how this, none that I
know of. What I do know, although I didn't find
it out until fairly recently, was that well these things
that John Captain refers to probably have heard in twenty eleven,
and she was only in my place nine months of
twenty eleven, so I got it. So the first nine
months of that was really bad on her. And I

(14:38):
know that she was in and out of ers and
rehab and whatever. Again, and again and again, and she
tried to stabilize. What I learned was that she tended.
When she felt herself falling off the wagon, she would
check herself into the er and she'd a friend other
than me who would take her in, and if they
wouldn't hold her, she would declare herself to be suicidal

(15:00):
and that would force them to keep her for seventy
two hours. So I suspect that these are the suicide
attempts that are showing up on the record, and that
she wasn't really suicidal, but that she was playing in
the system so that in a desperate attempt to get treatment.

Speaker 2 (15:17):
You know, that's fascinating. I never even considered that someone
could do that. But that would work, right, Yeah, that
would work, and that would help you with your SSI idea.
I tell you what, the security insurance.

Speaker 3 (15:31):
I never thought about that.

Speaker 2 (15:32):
Yeah, you got twenty a bunch of man, I'm gonna
do this anyway. Would God bless this kid? You know?

Speaker 3 (15:37):
Now? I mean, that's what I'm saying. She kept trying
to pick herself up. She tried shittle whatever the name
is the thing up in it probably was twenty eleven,
and that must have caught a pretty penny up in Seattle,
and I think that lasted for about two weeks. That's
the one where they tried a version therapy on your
on getting drunk. Oh really, Yeah, they give you something

(16:00):
that makes I mean it might be an abuse. The
give you something that makes you really sick, and then
they make you drink and they're trying to make you
associate it with with you know, be getting sick with
getting drunk, so you won't so you won't do it.
But it didn't work for her. It was not for
very long. But bless her, she tried it. She had
a miserable experience doing this.

Speaker 2 (16:20):
Now, what about when she was staying with you? Did
she have a relationship with her family? And did she
have friends?

Speaker 3 (16:26):
Again, I'm having trouble hearing you. When she would get friends?

Speaker 2 (16:29):
Yeah? And what's your contact with her family?

Speaker 3 (16:33):
Yes, she was. I can remember a number of times
when she would talk to her mother, and in the
year I knew her, her mother would come. But again
I don't I never proways say across my mind. I
was needing to keep a log on this stuff. Her
mother would occasionally come to town, or that might have
been before she was living with me, and we'd all
go to church together, and that happened enough times that

(16:56):
I got to know her mother might have been before
she moved in, but she would periodically talk to her mother.

Speaker 2 (17:05):
What was the mother from Burns, Oregon too?

Speaker 3 (17:10):
Yeah, sort of, how's that? Yeah, her whole family comes
from from well her, not her. She grew up in
mostly in the ranch country out in the two Leaves
of eastern Oregon. You could think you're in Nevada. So
you got an idea of what northern Nevada is like,
and that country's somewhat the same.

Speaker 2 (17:30):
And what kind of what kind of church was this?
What faith?

Speaker 3 (17:34):
A Presbyterian?

Speaker 2 (17:35):
Okay, that's interesting because I have a friend with a
Christian ministry up there and in Burns, Oregon and Mexico
where he does this thing with the water pure purification.
Such a small town. I figured maybe he knows her too. Okay.

Speaker 3 (17:47):
I think they probably all know each other out there.

Speaker 2 (17:49):
Yeah, you know, I mean, the.

Speaker 3 (17:52):
Whole county has is it seven or ten? It's either
seven thousand square miles and ten thousand people for ten thousand,
I mean or ten I was a square miles and
seven thousand people it's something like that. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (18:04):
Now, while she was living with you, was there any
indication that she was as like, working as a sex
worker or perhaps involved in drug dealing or anything like that.

Speaker 3 (18:15):
No, nothing, nothing I caught. I can't imagine her doing
a sex worker thing while living with me. And if
she was doing drugs, she was doing it very surreptitiously,
and I wasn't catching it because that would have been
an eviction thing on my card.

Speaker 2 (18:32):
Okay, then what cause should a move from here?

Speaker 3 (18:34):
No?

Speaker 2 (18:35):
No, she was in therapy while she was with this
doctor Weedman.

Speaker 3 (18:40):
I had never heard of Weedman until John Captain brought
his name up. I knew that she had a downtown therapist.
She had another therapist whose name has never come up,
and I'm not going to bring it up, okay, And
she probably had she had and was the only one

(19:00):
whose name I never heard. And she was also doing
she had a DUI and she was having to do
some kind of treatment as part of her probation on that,
and she also had to be doing community service and
that was happening while she was at my place.

Speaker 2 (19:17):
Now, the night she was murdered, she was flying back
from Pendleton, Oregon do you know what she would be
doing up there in Pendleton.

Speaker 3 (19:25):
No. I was shocked to find out she was in
Pendleton because I'd seen her maybe ten days before and
she said she was going to Passo or Richmond or
Tri Cities. So I was like, what is she doing
in Pendleton? Was all I could think. But she was
like that. She would she'd say she was going to
do one thing, and she'd do something else. And this

(19:45):
is particular after I mean, the staying at my place
kind of ceased working for about the time she met Captain.
That's right, why she was over there. Well, she'd obviously
fallen off the wagon, but had done so away from
my place, so I wasn't aware of it, and she
would get bored and she'd start to she'd start traveling around.

(20:09):
So she had friends that she'd go and visit for
a week or ten days at a pop. And I
I don't know much about these friends, and it's quite
possible that she'd go over to start drinking with them.
And uh, I really don't know.

Speaker 2 (20:24):
Did now you didn't know she was she was going
to Pendleton, But did you know? Did she say to
why she was going to these other towns that you.

Speaker 3 (20:30):
Mentioned, well, she let's see the ones that she traveled to.
Most would be around the Portland area and she'd just
get bored and she'd go couch crass. So so she's like,
I'm going to go visit so and so, and I
don't want to name her friends. I'm going to go
to visit so and so for a week. And then
she'd taken the luggage over there and gets stuck and

(20:51):
let's go to the coast and things like that. She'd
like to puddle him because she'd gone there a few
times before. From what I've do on Facebook, Uh thought
of the East Hiel family and scattered around the west.
So so I thought she was going to visited her sibling.

Speaker 2 (21:09):
Now it sounds like when you you just shifted around
or something like that, because you sound a little muffled. Now,
did you move the phone or sound?

Speaker 3 (21:15):
Okay, there you got I did. That's okay, you're back now,
Sorry about that.

Speaker 2 (21:20):
That's fine.

Speaker 3 (21:22):
Now.

Speaker 2 (21:22):
How did it come to be that she left your
residence and went to go live with mister Captain.

Speaker 3 (21:29):
Well, she was. She was starting to get this restlessness going.
One of the things that about her also was she's
smelling fall coming and she just hated rain, and the
thought of rain made her restless. And so that's about
all I know. She disappeared. She was fun to doing that.
I didn't think it was good for her rehab. But

(21:51):
I wasn't here, you know, I wasn't her galer and
and I'm sure she was getting back in touch with
old drinking buddies when I you know, as things developed,
and somehow she walked up at Captains.

Speaker 2 (22:04):
Okay, but you trusted or she had a key to
your house, you know, I thought she was gonna rob
or anything like that.

Speaker 3 (22:08):
I didn't think she did gonna rob me. No, I
didn't anything to rob anyway.

Speaker 2 (22:14):
So then what do you make of her relationship with
mister Captain when she was living with him?

Speaker 3 (22:22):
Oh? I think it was mutually toxic.

Speaker 2 (22:26):
And what brings what brings us to that conclusion?

Speaker 3 (22:32):
I I I observed pieces of it from a distance.
There was a time when, I mean they started really intensely,
and then they split after ten days, and I don't
know what. I think he threw her out, but he
would be the one who would remember that if he

(22:52):
if he does. And she wound up back on my couch,
distraught and he texted like seventy five times in ninety minutes,
and I don't haven't seen the text, but the gist
of them were, you know, alternatingly you bitch and you
throw my heart out and I can't live without you,
and that type of thing. These text no longer exists,

(23:14):
so they're on some phone she no longer has. But
and then she went back to him, and you know,
I'm not fond of it. Ship. And I listened to
them fight once. She but dialed me in the middle
of it, and I treated me to thirty minutes of
their fights and it was really serious.

Speaker 2 (23:32):
Donnybrook, Now, mister Captain's business, This this hot tub business,
what do you know about that?

Speaker 3 (23:46):
It's over in a neighborhood of town, just off eighty second,
and it's it's in a little shopping area that's got
a movie theater and a local restaurant and one of
the better pizza places in town and his hot tub business.
And you know it's and it's right off eighty second.

(24:08):
Is is known for being a you know, for being
a little life part of the town. He has a
few blocks off from it, and a few blocks away
from that is a really nice neighborhood. So it's a
little hard to say Portland has spotted that.

Speaker 2 (24:22):
Way right now, Okay, So now I guess. Uh, the
next thing we should get to is the night of
the murder. M H what do you make that?

Speaker 3 (24:36):
Uh?

Speaker 2 (24:37):
Do you know anything about her her motivation for coming
back from Pedalton back to Portland?

Speaker 3 (24:43):
Uh? Hou say no, I didn't find out anything about this.
If my information on this largely comes from the fact
that through the entire proceeding after her murder, I was
sitting in on the court stuff with her on behalf
of her family, and I joined them in their conferences
with the DA or with my legal background, I wasn't there.

(25:06):
I'm not a lawyer, I wasn't their lawyer. But I
was able to ask intelligent questions of the DA, and
so I know. So I got to follow the proceed
as a friend of the family and we were So
that's my primary thing. So if the DA didn't tell me,
I probably don't know, or if it wasn't in a document,

(25:29):
so I don't know at a guess. What I do
was that twenty four hours before she nearly got arrested
out in Pendleton for creating a disturbance at a hotel
and she.

Speaker 2 (25:47):
Wait, you're breaking up. I can't hear you.

Speaker 3 (25:51):
Tonight.

Speaker 2 (25:52):
You totally broke up. You totally broke up there. I
didn't hear you at all. You said something about her
getting arrested.

Speaker 3 (25:57):
Have you got me back now?

Speaker 2 (25:58):
I got you back now. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (26:04):
I could put you on speakerphone and lay it down,
but I bet that picks up every background noise around. Okay,
So I've got a hole that's about the size of
my head where the phone reception works. Okay, so where
so where did you lose it? So?

Speaker 2 (26:18):
Do you said something about her getting arrested that night?

Speaker 3 (26:21):
Oh? No, she almost got arrested. She was well, she
was drunk at a hotel I don't know what hotel
in Pendleton and created enough of a disturbance which she
scared the night clerk into locking her out and calling
the police. She could be at a starn The word

(26:45):
just eluded me. When she was drunk, she could be
belligerent and I don't know. After that, she disappeared. And
then she surfaced as far as anybody, as far as
I know, on the timeline, buying a one way ticket
from Pendleton to Portland, which she apparently paid for in

(27:06):
the Pendleton airport.

Speaker 2 (27:07):
Now, how when did you buy that chicket? She bought
it right the same night she was flying.

Speaker 3 (27:14):
I'm trying to remember because I don't have copies of
the police report. So she flew in the afternoon, okay,
So she was there trying to check into this hotel
at something like two am or one am or whatever
it was, and then she went somewhere else. For all
I know, she slept under a bridge, and but she

(27:34):
may have found a hotel and shows back up, shows
up at the airport at I think it's four pm
that she flew to Portland. It might be four pm
she arrived at Portland. But Pendleton is a town of
I don't know what it's I better not guess. It's
not a huge town that it's got an airport, And

(27:55):
so I think she just showed up at the airport
with her credit card or she's music credit card and
card and bought a ticket.

Speaker 2 (28:02):
Okay. So then if that's the case, if this was
a spontaneous trip, then would be unlikely that these people
would be there the day before waiting for her.

Speaker 3 (28:11):
That has crossed my mind. I think the critical thing
on this figuring out what happened. There is the timeline,
and I don't have access to the full timeline. I
think John does in some of the documents he has
that I don't have the police report and things like that.
But as I understand it, these folks booked a ride

(28:31):
share from Oakland to Portland to meet that that was
to be the two guys, yeah, and to meet Michelle
Warden Brosie, and their ride share broke down in Salem
and she had to go down to Salem to get them.
And I think that they called for her, if I

(28:52):
heard right in the various brief pres if I remember
right at like nine pm. So if I'm right on that,
at nine pm, they were in Salem, and they would
have had to have left Oakland in time to get there,
not to mention booking the right share, So it seems
really hard to figure out how they could have set
this up.

Speaker 2 (29:10):
Okay, now she was she met these characters at Mystic
strip Club? Now was she? Is that of common for
her to frequent a strip club?

Speaker 3 (29:23):
It wouldn't surprise me. The Mystic is next to something
called Falco's Pub. There's at least two and maybe three
of these things on that clock. It's not a great district.
All that's been improving. So you know, Falco's actually looks
like a decent sports bar, but I never wanted to
go there. But there's at least two of them that
share a parking lot, and I think there might be more.

(29:45):
You can find this on a Google map. And Tiffany
was into dive bars. I knew this once because she
traps me into being a designated driver and we went
to places that that I wouldn't have anything to do with.
And so a strip club dive bar wouldn't terribly surprise me,
or even a strip club that's not a super dive
bar wouldn't terribly surprise me. Pretty much, any place that

(30:11):
would let her drink when I mean she was capable
of running her her blood alcohol was sky high, So
so she's looking for the places the drinner let her
drink when when other places would give her the boot.

Speaker 2 (30:25):
Now would it be unusual for her to meet up
with strangers and just hop in a car with them
and go for a ride.

Speaker 3 (30:30):
And I don't see it as out of characters as
John does. She was a risk taker, and she prided
herself in the diversity of her friends. She was she
you know, as a blonde white woman. She would hang
out in hookahs bars, hookah bars, hooka lounges whatever they're called, right,

(30:52):
and try to make friends with Middle Easterners, and she worked.
She never had any troubles with those people, and she
made she made quite a few good friends out of
good people out of the people she knew that way.
I know, one could he runs a local business and

(31:13):
so so she liked she liked to take adventures, and
she'd liked to take risks. And what I was saying,
she was getting bored. That was a year before at
my place. Like I could steal her doing it, Like,
you know, a stable environment was not something that she
was at that time in her life really good at
dealing with. So yeah, I could see her doing that

(31:33):
very easily. She'd be very easy for them to coach
into the car.

Speaker 2 (31:42):
Okay, you know what, this might be good time to
take a commercial break. Uh we're here with Rick love It.
And he's been mentioned in this case here. He was
a roommate. He kind of rented a room or gave
her room to uh Tiffany Jenks. And then ultimately she
wants up getting killed in front of this mister, we
should have picked up in front of this strip club,

(32:04):
taken to a park and then shot in the head,
and then the story's kind of gone from there to
kind of a big conspiracy theory. We'll be right back
with more of Rick Lovett after these messages, And now
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check out our online infidelity investigation. William Ramsay is a
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(33:34):
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(33:55):
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So check out Children of the Beast Alistair Crowley's Shadow
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(34:35):
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Copy of that book. Now we's back up on Amazon
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(37:19):
we said, the show is brought to you by pscoco
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and go into the chocolate business with the Phoebe side.
We're here today with uh Rick Levett. Rick love It
and he was the roommate for Tiffany Jenks Uh and
we're describing the night of her murder. Now, Rick, after

(37:40):
this murder took twice? How soon that was it till
you found out that she was murdered?

Speaker 3 (37:46):
So first of all, I moved my phone with a
bitter reception right.

Speaker 2 (37:48):
Now, Oh yes, much better. Okay, try standing up on
one Try standing up on one foot.

Speaker 3 (37:59):
At my table when I put it on speakerphone. So
that way, if I moved my head, you don't lose
the reception anyway. But by the way, before I answer
that question, while you were gone, I looked up the
stipend and it was twenty one thirty one, gotcha, and
at least according to the letter that I have from

(38:19):
Social Security administer. So I found out she was dead.
I'm trying to guess it was twenty four hours later,
but I'm really yeah, it was not. It was when
somebody emailed me and said they'd heard that Tiffey was dead,
or or pmd me on Facebook or whatever it was.

(38:40):
And I didn't believe it until I went online, and
by that time it was all rules are the news,
and so it was a real shock.

Speaker 2 (38:47):
And were you contacted by the police at the police Evanter.

Speaker 3 (38:50):
You I contacted the police and talked to them myself.
They would have gotten around to me eventually, But a
lot of Tiffaney's friends called the police.

Speaker 2 (39:02):
Okay, And was there a funeral service a memorial?

Speaker 3 (39:06):
Yes, there were two memorial services. One was out in Burns.
There was another one that I felt and two of
her friends set up at the Presbyterian church. She attended
here in Portland.

Speaker 2 (39:17):
And did everybody attend?

Speaker 3 (39:20):
Everybody defined as John Captain did not.

Speaker 2 (39:23):
But her mother family you, yes, yes, I.

Speaker 3 (39:29):
Was quite surprised. They all traveled in three hundred I mean,
the whole family traveled in and they're scattered across a
lot of the West. And since they'd already had a
memorial service for her out in Burns. I had done
this because her Portland friends couldn't afford to travel out
to Burns. It's three hundred ish miles yeah, out there,
And so I was rather I was very surprised to

(39:52):
have the Oh no, the family was not. They wanted
to come meet her friends and honor what we were doing.
I was quite touched.

Speaker 2 (39:59):
The police came to why do you think John Captain
didn't attend?

Speaker 3 (40:04):
Probably because he knew that she was idly hated people
did not like him in her family, A lot of
her friends did not like him. They Kiffany had told
a lot of people who wasn't to abuse his relationships.

Speaker 2 (40:20):
Now at first, was everyone getting along and trying to.

Speaker 3 (40:23):
Work and I had on that. I do not know
she was telling the truth on that, but that was
the story that she told. So so people were leery
at him. Now in the church, I'm sorry I interrupting you.
He was invited. The church was very clear that anyone
who came to mourn was welcome.

Speaker 2 (40:46):
Okay. Now, also to uh at that time, was everyone
working on the case together, like everyone was trying to
help the police and solve this case together?

Speaker 3 (40:55):
Right? Yeah, everyone was. I mean, see what we what
do we mean by working on the case. Mostly we
were offering the police anything we knew. For example, one
thing that several of us knew about Tiffany was that
she went through cell phones like there was no tomorrow.
And so anybody who had a cell phone number that

(41:15):
she'd ever used was giving it to the police. So
they track records, okay, and and think that that we
weren't going around interviewing witnesses like John did. The police
wasn't asked this not to Well, they didn't have to,
but they have to not to share information with him
because he was interviewing the witnesses and interfering with the investigation.

Speaker 2 (41:37):
Oh really, that was a specific problem at the time.

Speaker 3 (41:41):
It was a specific request that came what anything that
we knew that was not official, We being me and
the family and the friends, we were asked not to
relate to John. It was trime to relay it to John.
But but he was he he can do a lot
of work really fast and uh so, so they were

(42:02):
wanting to do things in their order and not having
not having him beating him to them. I think he
was beating him to.

Speaker 2 (42:09):
The witnesses, gotcha? Okay, okay, Now when did things become
antagonistic between John and the family and everyone.

Speaker 3 (42:23):
It was a gradual process. I mean, give other than
the fact that that that, you know, the relationship that
they said was kind of it was was frowned upon
by many people. I know that I I flied to
Chicago to visit my mother. I think it was like
the day after I learned that Tiffany had died. That

(42:44):
was a very weird fight. And while I was gone,
he we left he says he left two messages, but
I only know of one. We left a note on
my door demanding that I call him, uh now, and
I had a and somebody else I take in strays.

(43:08):
I had someone else living in that room at that time.
So once I'd done this, you know, started doing that.
I did this more. I can't remember actually what order
just always went in. But anyway, who was very fighting
by this and split. So I know that the message
to me, and I called him a couple of days
of elisods but and talked to him. And at that

(43:30):
time he was mostly just distraught. One of the reasons
that people didn't talk to him much at the start
was he was tex boyfriend and uh you know, so
everybody was a little nobody knew what happened. It did.
It took a day or two to know that he
didn't have anything to do with it, right and uh so,
so people are a little nervous about talking to him.

(43:52):
And once he got over that, I talked to him.
He was really distraught and almost incomprehensible. But but he
was just basically really distraught. And and then he started
getting more and more into series and he wanted help.
He repeatedly wanted me to drop my job for a
couple of weeks. If we put our heads together, we
can solve this thing, he'd say. And I was willing

(44:13):
to let the purpole. I had been instructed not the work.
We asked not to work with them. And secondly, I
was waiting to see what the cops got. And when
I wouldn't do those things, he got more and more antagonistic,
until it got pretty unhappy about six months later.

Speaker 2 (44:30):
And wasn't this saw fairly quickly though, because they had
swiped their driver's licenses at the bar.

Speaker 3 (44:37):
Yes, it was. It was. It's actually legally a very
interesting case, which is a friend of mine in law food.
It isn't what you want in a murder case. Yeah,
the the what what broke it was that somebody reported
that she had been at that bar that night, and
so they went and got the video cameras of the

(44:58):
bar and found her right away. So all the people
who got into the car with and then we're able
to check their IDs off the id slife. It turned
out that the bar is not supposed to retain that
information under liquor licensing law. So there is the case.

(45:18):
Actually hings two years later on whether or not they
could use those IDs in the prosecution, and yeah, it
really it was like my lawyer friend was like, you know,
it's too bad that this didn't come up the first
time in something simple like a dui rather than a murder.
And the ruling was that even though they were the

(45:40):
bar was not supposed to do that, it voluntarily handed
it over to the police cooperating. The police didn't try
to drag it out of the meis and they're the
hearing on this and therefore it's basically and the police
could use it even though they couldn't have gotten it themselves,
and that's how they made the IDs, and from that
point on it was a man hunt or man and

(46:01):
woman hunt.

Speaker 2 (46:03):
Well, so then once they had identified these the three
suspects and pretty much had him in custody, John wasn't
satisfied with that.

Speaker 3 (46:15):
I don't know when he became dissatisfied that, but no,
he always wanted more. One of the issues that's in
this case that you've been working on, I'm sure, is
that nobody really understands why they did it, and some
of us, ultimately I'm one of them, have come to
grips with the fact that we live with ambiguity in

(46:35):
our lives, and this is an ambiguity that, as far
as I can tell, I will always have. Why did
Brunelle shoot her? As the DA put it to us,
you don't have to have motives to prove a murder,
And he in his sentencing hearing wouldn't speak anything other
than monosyllables. There was a camera in the courtium and

(46:57):
he wanted it out. He might have explained things there
have been no camera, but the reporters had the right
to be there, and that camera just intimidated him into
I mean into drunks, and so we never got it.
We never got much of a statement from him, we
got any kind of See, they did make statements that

(47:18):
were mutually contradictory. I've seen them, or I've seen the
summaries of them, and John keeps citing them. But it's
impossible with that who's telling telling the truth at all?
And I believe Warden Rosie changed her statement four times,
so nobody, nobody really knows why they did it. You
can make a lot of hypotheses. What's your favorite one, Well, listen.

Speaker 2 (47:44):
I could maybe I'll go into that after the interview Okay,
it seems really hanky to me, you know, the whole
shooting thing and these guys come in to town, the
facing weapons. Thrill kill could be one also too. Whenever
I see things like rip clubs and these our rental
hot sub type places, you know, a lot of cameras around,

(48:05):
they could be a blackmail angle to these sexual type
of you know, you know, a sexual blackmail, you know.
And uh, and especially if if you if a person
who was a powerful figure in Portland, a political figure
something like that was being blackmailed because they were on
video at at a hot sub place and with one
of these strippers, they could also manipulate the court shenanigans

(48:29):
in the background and the police, uh investigation. Uh, just
a theory, you know.

Speaker 3 (48:36):
Yeah, that's one and I think my and I had three.
And one of the things that is that the two
helpers got off light and everybody knows this, uh, and
I know some of the legalities of that, which doesn't
seem to have come out. But one of my favorite

(48:56):
theories from the get go was it was a throwkill
and these people were just cooping for somebody, and Tiffany
made a really good victim. But it's also possibly was
a drug deal gone sour, because uh she she was
into drugs as well as alcohol. And another theory is
she's got at one time I thought she'd gotten crossways
with the cartel or you know, Brunell had a history

(49:23):
of anger management problems and he and he' knites somebody
in the past, but not been prosecuted for it because
they weren't sure who started it and he might he
might be a haircutter.

Speaker 2 (49:35):
And but there was a rape of an eleven year
nine year old child in the animal toe room.

Speaker 3 (49:41):
I'm confused about that. Yes, there was. There was child
in the less station. Robinette got charged with that and
convicted and is still in jail. I think you can
look up the prison records. I think he's serving five
years on top of what he's serving on in in
Tiffany's case, and so he would not be out yet.

(50:01):
I heard the kid was the child was twelve or thirteen.
It was Warden Brosie's daughter. John keeps saying nine. I
have never read the case on that, so and I
don't know whether they protected the identity of the victim anyway,
And what I know from the Tiffey Jenks murder side

(50:23):
of it, that is, you know, from what we were
dealing with was that Warden Brosie was really angry at
him when she found out, which doesn't track with a
fun story that had occurred in the hotel room. But
they're also probably an enormous amount of drugs and alcohol
going on with these people, and so let's tossible she

(50:45):
was passed out.

Speaker 2 (50:47):
Now now the issue too, we had discussed previously about
these bags that perhaps maybe there was something in the bags,
because there was some show about the bags. You related
to me that it was common for her to carry
her whole entire wardrobe were her ten bags, six bags,
three four bags, and you get to get stuck with
these bags. Cabs wouldn't pick her up and she would
be stuck with all her She carried a lot of luggas.

(51:07):
You had her all the time.

Speaker 3 (51:09):
Yeah, frequently, I won't, I won't go with all the
time because they don't know all of them. But yet
this is her in Pendleton for something under a week,
because I've seen her, I mean her and Pendleton on
short notice with all those bags. Just this typical Kriffany, Okay,
so because I have collected her once at a hotel,
and I couldn't believe how much stuff she had, and

(51:30):
she would abandon it if she couldn't carry it, and
then just buy more clothes.

Speaker 2 (51:34):
Now you've heard all these stories, You've been listening to
some of these interviews recently. But this theory of mind
control and the Illuminati, and that her family was friends
with R. J. Reynolds family and stuff like that, what
do you know about any of that?

Speaker 3 (51:49):
Nothing? What I hear is what I had heard. I
hadn't heard of the Illuminati as anything other than its
Keen Brown fiction until John Captain started talking about it.

Speaker 2 (52:00):
And what do you know about her family being connected
to our J Renal family?

Speaker 3 (52:05):
Only that John Captain says they are okay?

Speaker 2 (52:08):
And did you ever notice any kind of indications that
she could be on her mind control or hypnosis or
anything like that.

Speaker 3 (52:16):
No, But again, this is not something I'm into, so
I wouldn't know whether or not. I mean, I wouldn't
care to argue with somebody about that. What I know
is that Tiffany could get very weird, and I think
that especially when she was drunk, and she could get
really dark like she did with the psychologists. And I
interpreted that as her. I know that John talks about

(52:38):
her demons. I think her demons are internal emotional things.
And there was whatever it was that had I knew
that she'd been drinking since high school off and on,
and whatever it was that drove her to this was
I think the demons she was talking about. And I
mean he reported some bad things that have happened to her,

(53:01):
and apparently other confirmed them in what he has has said.
So you know, actually I think tough life.

Speaker 2 (53:11):
In an email I heard from her mother. In fact,
John read the email to me. Her mother said that
her father had written her off before his death.

Speaker 3 (53:21):
That was new to me. Yea, if it happened, it
was it was fairly late in the process. What what
was happening here a lot was that she was a
relapsing alcoholic. And I have a friend who's written books

(53:42):
about that. He's thirty maybe five years sober now, and
one of his mantras sort of is that in those books,
one third make it through rehab the first time, one
third need to go again or more than again, and
another third are did and just don't know it yet.

Speaker 2 (54:00):
Hm hmm.

Speaker 3 (54:01):
Now, and that's pretty typical of that of that lifestyle
that she was in. So if I people didn't come
rushing to her aid all the time, because they've done
it a bunch of times.

Speaker 2 (54:12):
Yeah, I'm familiar with that. I've felt you know, I'm
the same. I've had people cometely to the same kind
of thing.

Speaker 3 (54:17):
Now, so you know, yeah, it's sadly common.

Speaker 2 (54:22):
Yeah, now let me let me because we only got
about we only got about five minutes left. So I
want to ask you, now, have you listened to the tape,
the tape recording of her with a therapist where it
goes tap tap tap, and then suddenly her voice becomes
like a child's voice. Now you know her voice. Do
you notice anything odd about that?

Speaker 3 (54:42):
I couldn't. I've never been able to hear a change
in her voice. I've listened to that a number of
times trying to hear out what it is that John
Captain thinks he's hearing in there, and I can't hear it.
She sounds very distraught, but she sounds very just thought
through that entire well, the one that uh put the
entire thing up through the entire interview. I mean, she's sobbing,
she's talking in a small voice, and she's and she

(55:04):
doesn't change as far as I can tell, So I
have no idea what he's talking about.

Speaker 2 (55:09):
Okay, is there anything I haven't asked you that you
think it's important you want to get out?

Speaker 3 (55:16):
Yeah, two things in here. He's misinterpreting some of some
of the things in the case and aren't coming out.
First of all, the two helpers were charged with conspiracy,
and that just seems to have disappeared in this So
they were charged with conspiracy to prevent murder, but the
grand jury threw it out. So the police think, like

(55:36):
you did, that there was something what was your word,
hinky going on here, but they couldn't prove it. And
that doesn't mean that they don't believe there was something
wasn't something hinky, but they couldn't prove it. And that
left nothing under Oregon law but hindering prossecution, which at
the time was an eighteen months sentence with a presumption

(55:58):
of probation on first defense. So these one year and
thirteen month sentences are actually at the high end of
the scale. Gotcha that Now Oregon has apparently amended that
law quite possibly in response to this case. Because I
was telling people that that was something they should do,
and it's now a five years of element.

Speaker 2 (56:19):
Okay, that makes sense. That makes sense.

Speaker 3 (56:23):
Yeah, and that just makes sense out of a whole
bunch of what went on in there.

Speaker 2 (56:26):
Yeah, what else do you want us to know?

Speaker 3 (56:32):
He was not under a gag order. That was a
restraining order from Tiffany's mother, quite a different thing. And
anyone can read the case that these sites can discover
that he was not banned from the corkroom by the prosecution.
He was banned from the corkroom by the defense under
a witness sequestration order. With that's assume you're familiar with.

(56:53):
Those things are like bog standards. And this list of
five witnesses he likes to talk about that included tiff
is bizarre. But it was written by the defense and
it was clearly a boiler plate term in no account
motions where they just copied it out of out of
another motion and didn't realize it didn't make sense. But
they were seeking background information on these five people who

(57:15):
they were considering calling this witnesses, or who they thought
the DA might be calling this witnesses, and it included
all other witnesses the DA might put on their lists.
So so he's just missreading a lot of this stuff.

Speaker 2 (57:26):
And why do you think that is? Do you think
John Captain's like a malicious person, just a liar, or
just do you think it it could be just grief?

Speaker 3 (57:38):
Well, I think it's a comedy of grief and the
fact that it's legally unsophisticated, and so I think he's
reading this stuff backwards some of it. And but no,
I think he's I think he you know, I think
he's seriously grieving and that he's looking to find meaning
in this and is grasping at whatever meaning he can

(58:01):
find because he doesn't want to accept the fact that
neither her death was sirly random or that we will
never know why?

Speaker 2 (58:11):
Okay, And do you have any any contact with him now?

Speaker 3 (58:16):
No? Well, no, no, I've I've not had much in
the way of direct contact with him. I try to
avoid it.

Speaker 2 (58:24):
And are you still in contact with her mother and
her family named like.

Speaker 3 (58:27):
That off and on? Yes, I am, since a three
hundred miles away. I haven't heard him for a while,
and they don't do much online anymore.

Speaker 2 (58:40):
Do you know what their reaction is to all us?

Speaker 3 (58:44):
I am sure that they're really unhappy.

Speaker 2 (58:47):
Okay, all right.

Speaker 3 (58:49):
I mean, if they're they're they're a grieving family who
lost their daughter, who who keeps having us dragged around
all over the place.

Speaker 2 (59:00):
Yeah, we had like two minutes. What do you want
to leave us with?

Speaker 3 (59:05):
I think that would be basically basically I want I
want to make it clear that I think that John
sincerely believes what he's talking about, and I have been
very careful never to call him a liar. I just
think he's an error, which is a very different thing.
And I want to also leave you with the fact
that Tiffany, because she's coming off here, is all these

(59:27):
nasty things. Tiffany, as I first met her, and so
many of her friends remember her, was just this well
Edward memorial service, one of them described her as this
blazing comment that would come through your horizon every now
and then, and you know, and and leaving joy and
and and excitement in a wake. But she's the hold

(59:51):
still very well. So I like to remember her as
this blazing comment. Rick. Love it.

Speaker 2 (59:57):
Thank you so much, my friend. If anything new comes up,
I want you to get in touch with me and
we'll put you right on the air.

Speaker 3 (01:00:01):
Okay, okay, thank you