Peegs Postgame LIVE: Final Four Edition with Jeff Rabjohns -- April 3, 2025

The Hoosiers haven't played a game in weeks, but we still put together our first-ever Peegs Postgame LIVE that featured a guest on Zoom, Jeff Rabjohns, to go along with our callers. We talked a lot about new head coach Darian DeVries and his approach, the transfer portal, and a whole lot more.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:09):
How you doing, everybody, I'm Ken Bikoff and welcome to
the Peaks podcast. Wanted to put a little intro on
what we're doing here. We held a call in show
on the Peaks dot com website with Jeff rab Johnson.
We're going to get to that in just a second.
A couple of things about what we had its call
in show, and some of the ran into some technical issues.

(00:31):
First time we've done a call in show while also
having another guest on zoom. Normally they run live on YouTube,
and I had Rabbi on Zoom, got great stuff from him.
Wanted to incorporate the callers as well. The problem was
that Rabbi couldn't hear the callers. The callers couldn't hear me.

(00:56):
It's my microphone was not great because of a mistake
I made in setting up the system to where my
microphone was coming to my webcam instead of this professional
one that I have in front of my face and
that I've spent hundreds of dollars on. It's unfortunate, but

(01:18):
it is what it is. Rabbi sounds great as always,
the callers sound great as always, so chalk up the
audio issues for the way I sound to me clicking
the wrong button. It'll get fixed in the future. It
won't be a problem again. Everything that you do as

(01:39):
a learning experience. And so, without any further ado, here
is what we ran on YouTube live on a Peaks
Postgame Live without a Postgame Final four edition. I hope
you enjoyed it. You're gonna learn a lot. I promise.
Hi you doing everybody. I'm Ken Bikoff and welcome to

(01:59):
the Pegus Postgame Live Final four Edition. There hasn't been
a game in a little while, but at the very
least we are live and we're excited to be here
with you on YouTube our first ever effort to try
to kind of do this in a little bit different way.
Jeff rab Johns will be with us in just a

(02:21):
few minutes. Let me know in the chat if you
could hear me. Okay, that's a really important part of
the program. Here. Rabbi is on a call. He gets
a lot of calls in their stuff that he has
to do and says he can't cut it short. I'm
guessing he won't tell us who he's on the phone
with the second that he gets on here. But we're

(02:43):
thrilled to be on with you on a Thursday night.
I was kind of planning on doing this Wednesday night
to begin with, but then with the weather that we
were going to be dealing with, I did not want
to risk losing power. I hope everybody stayed as safe
as they out there, and the good news, I suppose

(03:08):
is that at least in the Bloomington area, we were
pretty safe. I know at my house, I had a
tree fall on my deck and my shed, so I'm
beginning a new deck and a new shed this summer.
That happens Sunday. So I've been dealing with some things,
but I'm here to talk about about basketball, football, Hoosiers,

(03:30):
Darren Debriz everything that goes along with it, and I
want to hear from you. Eight one, two, three, nine, three,
twenty six hundred is the number looking forward to hearing
from you. Want to hear your thoughts on on on this,
this program and the way that it's developing. I will

(03:50):
start with with with this much, at least at least
for me, is I like the way it's coming together.
You know, Darren Devrees, I think has come in and
has not rushed things, and I think that that is
a really important part of things. You don't want to
be a be somebody who's just uh trying to bring

(04:12):
in anybody who can be there. You want to you
want the right guys, and it helps that you have.
Some of the assistant coaches are have been announced. Drew
Adams was announced a few days ago. Nick Norton was
announced as an assistant coach, UH just a couple of

(04:32):
hours ago. UH he was with the Breeds at the
Indiana High school basketball state finals, so it was it
wasn't a surprise that he was he was there, but
they finally announced him. And so the Hoosiers are coming together.
It has been a heck of a couple of weeks,
to say the least for Indiana basketball. It is something

(04:54):
that UH is exciting. I'm very excited to see how
the program is going to come together. Was it the
higher that I, you know, the big splashy name that

(05:14):
people thought it was going to be. I don't believe
that that's really where we're at. Jeff rab John's finally
has has joined us, and we joined us live now
here on the Peak's post game. We started up started
this up. Sorry that you were you know, I told

(05:35):
them all that you were on a call and that
you probably wouldn't be telling us to exactly you were
you were talking to right off the bat. But Rebbie,
how are you doing? You're on mute, but you're on mute.
There we go, There we go. That is better.

Speaker 2 (05:55):
Yes, see, I need to go to the ken bikof
school a podcast, you know, and just be better about
the technology.

Speaker 3 (06:02):
That's that's what I need to know.

Speaker 2 (06:04):
The problem is love portal season that neither one of
them stopped drinking.

Speaker 3 (06:08):
Near one of them stop drinking.

Speaker 2 (06:09):
That's one time of year obviously high interest for IU
fans because we're all getting to watch together the rebuild
of the Indiana basketball roster. But anyway we go into
whatever you want tire off with questions or however you
want to go, Well.

Speaker 1 (06:23):
Let's go ahead and just start with just the whole
you know, how the past couple of weeks have gone.
Your impressions of the job that Darren Devrees has done
since being announced, since his press conference. One of the
things that I was just talking about before you hopped
on was how I've been impressed with the fact that
they are they are building the program, but not hurrying

(06:49):
with anything. They certainly want this to to build right
and it isn't a matter of Okay, we have a
whole flurry of information that's going to come out. It
seems that they're being deliberate about it.

Speaker 3 (07:01):
Yeah, I think several things stand out to me.

Speaker 2 (07:05):
You know, we had a chance, bigs dot com had
a chance to sit there and go down and visit
with coach Debrees and talk to him for a while
there in his office, and several things to that, one
of which was we talked about the roster rebuilding. He
mentioned how they want to be intentional about it. They
don't want to grab guys just to grab guys. They're not,
in his words, collecting talent to trying to put together

(07:26):
a team. And I think that's a really good thing.
It does mean commitments may happen a little slower than
might make the fan base happy, but I don't think
they need to be chasing optics right now.

Speaker 3 (07:40):
I understand there's a lot of anxiety and who's your nation?

Speaker 2 (07:43):
I get that, but this is about putting together a
basketball team. So the fact that he's going to be
intentional about it, I think is good. Talking with him
about specific characteristics that he wants for the players. It
was pretty interesting. It was funny because I asked him,
I said, okay, wait, they're going to go thirteen scholarships
if they can. They're not going to go fifteen because

(08:05):
one of the reasons is if you go more than thirteen,
there's deductions to your revenue sharing. They don't want to
do that. Their aim is fifteen. I'm sorry, their aim
is thirteen thirteen scholarships. So we're talking about I said, okay,
let's go through some skills that you want. He kind
of went through, you know, point guard, post players, you know,
wings and forwards. I said, how many guys do you

(08:25):
want on your team who can shoot threes? And he
looked at me like I just asked him, you know,
have you ever heard of maloney? And he said, ideally
all of them. I said, okay, So certainly shooting is
going to be a big priority for Indiana, and obviously
his son Tucker brings significant shooting. Very good shooter, Drake
really good. You know, the eight games he was healthy

(08:45):
for West Virginia, Connor in right, the point guard was
over forty percent on catch and shoot threes before he
had his shoulder injury. So that's pretty interesting. Some of
the other guys that they're looking at in the portal,
and we can get into some of the names that
we've already discussed if you'd like. But you know, shooting
is something that that is definitely going to be a priority.

(09:06):
So that's something that I think is interesting. And then
he also mentioned he kind of went back to the
point about it it's not a collection of players, and
he said, they have to fit together. It's a team
that has to play basketball. It's not individuals doing individual things.
And obviously there were times over the last two years
that maybe there were some people had individual skills, or

(09:26):
reportedly had individual skills, or maybe previously had shown some
individual skills, and you know, the pieces there's a little
bit of land of misfit toys on the roster last year,
you know, playing two true post players at the same
time who needed the same real estate. We kind of
looked at it and was like, that doesn't really fit,
if you will. So I think the fact that he's

(09:47):
aiming for fits is something that's that's going to benefit
Indiana to moving forward.

Speaker 1 (09:52):
Well, you know, let's talk about those pieces fitting together,
because this is actually something that we've seen in now
it's getting to be distant past. But Tom Crane's early years.
You know, I forget the first year his roster building.
Over those first you know, two three seasons, two three

(10:13):
and four, you saw pieces that really came together and
fit well together. And that's how you ended up with
Christian Watford and Jordan Halls and Derek Elliston and Cody
Zeller and all those guys that fit together really well.
You got the movement recruits that Yogi Ferrell. And then

(10:33):
after that point, I felt like Crane stopped putting the
puzzle pieces together and fell more in love with with
just talent and figuring out, we'll figure out how to
get these guys to play together. The roster building and
putting that puzzle together, to me is what has been

(10:54):
missing for the most part over the past eight years.
Heared on you.

Speaker 2 (11:00):
Yeah, it certainly has. And you look at like Romeo Langford. Year,
Romeo Langford played incredibly well as an individual. You know,
he was third in the country among freshmen scorers in
power for conferences, so he played really well.

Speaker 3 (11:16):
But there weren't the proper pieces around him.

Speaker 2 (11:18):
You didn't have other shooters, and Romeo himself really wasn't
a shooter at that point in time, So you needed shooting,
didn't really have it. You need athletes who could drive
or stretch the floor, didn't really have it. And Woodson's
teams you had. Tray Jackson Davis was just a phenomenal player,
generational level player, top ten in multiple categories now your

(11:38):
basketball history. But you really didn't have shooters who could
stretch the floor. You know, milerk Cop did a little
bit here and there, but he was more of a
catch and shoot guy. They didn't really have anybody who
could break you down off the dribble. They didn't have
multiple shooters who could really spread the floor and create
space for Tray Jackson Davis. Trace became a really good
passer out of the post, which helped a little bit,

(12:01):
but that was still dependent upon one player specific skills.
And I think that's one of the things that Darren
de Brees really wants to do is build a roster
that has guys, you know, multiple guys who can shoot
from three, multiple guys who can spread the floor. And
if you watch West Virginia's offense under Darren de Brees,
here's one thing that Trevor and I are and a

(12:22):
shot and I were talking about this. He want us
to start up possessions. The lanes open wherever the ball goes.
If the defense swings too hard to that side, then
you can swing the ball opposite and you get an
open shot. If the defense doesn't react properly, or one
guy closes out too hard because the lane's open, there's
a driving lane, or if you do a really quick

(12:44):
high ball screen. You know, Darren de Brees likes the
Creighton thing of trying to score in twelve seconds. You
swing the ball to one side, then you bring it
back up top to a really quick high ball screen.
When the guy turns, the corner of the lanes open.
Those are kind of things that really help space. The
floor shooting is the biggest thing in space is the floor,
but where you put your players also create space. And

(13:04):
I really like his concepts of how he creates space,
especially in early offense.

Speaker 1 (13:10):
And you also want to be sure to try to
find a guy who can create off the dribble, create
his own offense when when things kind of break down.
To me, Miles Rice could do that a little bit,
but he wasn't consistent enough with it, and so what
you ended up with was some pieces that might be
able to work, but it just didn't fit together with Devies.

(13:31):
You know, at each of his stops, he is he's
used to building a roster and getting the most out
of guys, but also making sure he had a group
of guys that could play together well. And that's what
I again, like you said, I know that there are
some fans that are concerned about the pace of people committing,
but making sure you have the right guys is as

(13:53):
important as signing guys with any kind of speed.

Speaker 2 (13:58):
Yeah, the only thing that matters at the end of
the day is what's the roster look like in November
when you take the course right that that's really what matters.
Whether you get them in April, early April, mid April,
late April, whether you get him in May you know it,
it really is inconsequential. And again, we all understand the
anxiety that's in who's your nation right now? But at

(14:19):
the end of the day, the team what matters is
the team that takes the four November.

Speaker 1 (14:23):
Okay, let's talk about some of the guys that we
know will be part of that team in November, and
let's talk about you know, just Tucker Devrees. Right off
the bat, I know that he's to me, if you're
looking for a player who is going to be able
to come in and be a leader when you have
so many different you know, players from all over the

(14:43):
place are going to be coming together. The coach's son,
who has played with them at different spots, seems like
he's going to be able to help his dad teach
the offense and teach the finer points of what's going
on because he's so familiar with it. How important will
he be?

Speaker 3 (15:00):
I think he's incredibly important.

Speaker 2 (15:02):
You know, he's I believe he's currently still ranked number
eleven in the country among transfer portal prospects, so that's
a fantastic evaluation of his skill set. He's got tremendous range,
easily out to twenty five twenty six feet, maybe even
a little further than that, so you can do a
lot of things with him behind the arc. He's got
the ability to put the ball on the deck some

(15:23):
you know, he's probably more of a four than a three,
but things are kind of melding a little in today's world.
That he can put the ball on the deck, he
can drive some. The other thing I really like about him, mean,
he understands how to relocate. You know, some guys are
standing still shooters, but they stand in one spot and
that's really all they do. And if the defense screws

(15:43):
up and leaves them open, hey great, open three. But
the guys who are really dangerous and the ones who
really understand how to relocate and how to read the defense,
and I think Tucker Derees has a lot of that
to him.

Speaker 3 (15:53):
He's a guy who has a.

Speaker 2 (15:55):
Variety of ways to get open, a variety of different
shots that he can make. And he's also a guy
the ball doesn't stick in his hand when it should.
If he's got a chance to make a play, make
a play. But if he doesn't, you'll see him catch
the ball and move the ball quickly it doesn't stick,
and then there you know, I was watching a bunch
of clips of Tucker Derees made shots.

Speaker 3 (16:15):
There were a number of times the.

Speaker 2 (16:17):
Ball hit his hands, then he made a pass, then
the lad in the possession, he gets it back.

Speaker 3 (16:21):
And to me, that that's something.

Speaker 2 (16:22):
That's really going to be helpful for Tucker Derees in
his dad's offense. This coming season at Indiana, he.

Speaker 1 (16:30):
Won two three, nine three twenty six hundred is the number.
Lines are open. We're taking your call, so please, you know,
calls you want to hear from you and hear your
thoughts on the higher your thoughts on how everything's coming
together with the roster. But you know, as we wait
for calls, you know, Connor Enwright, just tell me a
little bit about that kid from DePaul.

Speaker 2 (16:52):
Yeah, point guard from De Paul obviously played for Darren
de Brees before Drake. The number that stands out the
most is his thirty seven point five assists rate, ranked
number six in the country among Power four Conference players.
And he did that on the Paul team that wasn't
a great shooting team. So that means he's really good
at creating offense for others. That's the number one thing

(17:14):
that stands out. Number two, Like I said, he was
a little over forty percent on catch and shoot threes
before his shoulder injury.

Speaker 3 (17:21):
That's a really good rate.

Speaker 2 (17:22):
That means if the ball somewhere else in the offense
and the defense sort of leaves him or they go
double Tucker or one of these other total prospect players who.

Speaker 3 (17:31):
I think they're going to have a really.

Speaker 2 (17:32):
Good chance at. You know, he can he can knock
down a three. I mean the other thing is like
talking to him, and I hope I'm assuming everybody's had
a chance to read our conversation with him though we
published on pigs dot com the other day. But he
really understands how to lead a team. And there's a
difference between being best player and being leader. Sometimes your

(17:53):
best player is your leader, but not always. He really
need a leader out there who can really get everything
set up. I think his ability to run Darren Devreese's offense,
run it really well, get the ball where it needs
to go, get the ball where it needs to go quickly.
I think those are the things that are really going
to help him be a really solid player for the Loosiers.

Speaker 1 (18:12):
Eight one, two, three, nine three, twenty six hundred is
the number, Rabbi. This is my my my test here
is if you're going to be able to hear our
callers as he calls it. So let me know, you know,
and you know, give me a thumbs up if you
could hear him when he comes on a caller, If
I can have your name, where you're from, and what
you got caller you there, I can't hear him. I

(18:46):
heard something for a second there, color at the seven
h four number. Are you there?

Speaker 4 (19:00):
And no? Hello?

Speaker 1 (19:05):
Yeah, I can hear you. Hello, Yeah, I can hear you?
All right? You can you hear me?

Speaker 5 (19:17):
I'm here?

Speaker 1 (19:17):
Are you there, Robbie? Could you hear him at all?

Speaker 3 (19:22):
I could not know.

Speaker 1 (19:22):
Okay, I think he's he's not hearing me on the line. Yes,
I could hear you. Go ahead, and he's gonna be
on a little.

Speaker 5 (19:31):
Bit of a gay not through my phone but through
the internet. But first of all, I want to thank
Jeff and the crew at peaks dot com because they
do an incredible job of covering IU basketball and I
hate they take so much grief from so many people
for not reporting what they want them to report. But
the thin thing I am encouraged by, and I want

(19:53):
your response on, is I just see coach Devreees as
being someone who is incredibly detailed, who has a system,
who knows what he wants to do. And I hate
to bring this up because people will will say you're
an old man, and but that's what Bob Knight did.
Bob Knight knew what he wanted to accomplish, and he
got the recruits that he needed. And I just feel

(20:17):
like Coach Divrees is in the same line and he
is going to be very successful because he knows what
he needs to accomplish.

Speaker 1 (20:28):
I appreciate that. Let me check with Rabbi, were you
able to hear any of that?

Speaker 3 (20:33):
I wasn't give me a clip note.

Speaker 1 (20:35):
Okay, first off, he wanted to let you know that
you guys do a great job, and he's sorry that
you got that. You guys get the grief that you
get sometimes along the way. So so there's that. And
he also said that he likes that Darren Dvrees knows
what he wants and uh and the wanted kind of
what he wants his program to look like, and he's

(20:58):
going about it the right way when it comes to uh,
the same way that Bob Knight did. That he liked
that process along the way.

Speaker 3 (21:09):
I appreciate. I appreciate the compliment.

Speaker 1 (21:12):
Well, your your thoughts on that kind of that comparison
of building a roster and knowing where you want a
program to go.

Speaker 3 (21:19):
Well, I think it's the number one thing you have
to have is a vision. You know, how do you
what do you want it to look like?

Speaker 2 (21:24):
Okay, you got to start there. There's no guarantees that
you get there. But you have to have a vision.
Scott Dolson even said it h during the press conference
when they introduced their degrees. He said, we want Indiana
basketball to have an identity, and I think everybody would
agree that. For a good number of years now, Indiana
has not had an identity. You don't turn on the game.

(21:46):
If you took names off the jerseys and said who
is that plan? You really wouldn't know other than maybe
you playing two bigs. But as far as style of play,
there really was an identity. So I think that's good.
But you know, it has to happen. So I'm going
to wait, you know, a couple of years here and see,
you know, how does the vision you know turn out?

(22:07):
But I do like the fact that there's a clear
vision and a clear plan. And it was interesting sitting
in Debrees's office talking with him.

Speaker 3 (22:15):
It reminded me of sitting in Kurt Signette's.

Speaker 2 (22:17):
Office right after he was hired talking to him. Now,
that is not a comparison of what successes will look
like or not. Okay, all I'm discussing there is dit
it in somebody's office and asking them a bunch of questions,
and there's a clear vision and one thing. And you
know this, you've done this a long time. When you
have a chance to sit and talk with somebody for
you know, thirty forty forty five minutes or whatever, if

(22:39):
they answer questions with specifics, they really have an idea
of what they want to do. If it's a lot
of generalities and cliches, you kind of wonder sitting there
talking with their debrees. Every question I asked, or the
Trevor Anderstock asked, was answered with very specific things. Style
of play, what they want certain positions to look like,

(23:00):
what they want specific skills to be, what they want
to do with this or that. So I think when
you get specifics when you ask questions, I think that's
a very encouraging sign.

Speaker 1 (23:09):
Absolutely, And and that that is when you have coaches
that aren't going to talk around it, that means that
they are confidence a confident guy, and that they believe
in what they're doing and they don't believe that they
have to prove anything to anybody because they've been successful
and it's already worked for them. And to me, that's
a big, a big part of the equation. I always

(23:31):
felt that you know, Archie, we didn't Archie was on
because we didn't get to know him. I think I
feel as well as as some of the other coaches
he was I don't know. I just you know, my
interactions with him weren't bad, but it was just different
than what I've seen and seen elsewhere. But just knowing

(23:53):
when you ask a guy question, he's able to give
you an immediate answer, and he's very clear, and he's
not talking a coach speaking all that. It does make
a huge difference. No question. We have a question here
on the chat. Donald asked, will Coulnpert Channey, Jordan Halls
and maybe Dane Fife come back to assistant coach with DeFreeze.
Your thoughts on.

Speaker 2 (24:13):
That as of right now, my guests would be, No,
The offices at cook Hall have been cleaned out. That
was not a head coaching decision. That was more of
an institutional decision to allow a new coach to have
a clean slate. If you will, he's going to hire

(24:34):
who he wants to hire. Obviously, he's already brought in
his own strength and conditioning coach. He's got two assistants
already hired, three more coming. I would say right now,
I don't expect that things can change. But right now
I'm going to lean on the phrase I used even

(24:56):
before wood he was officially out, that the chance for
a our reef set for Indiana basketball is still pretty likely.

Speaker 1 (25:05):
Yeah, and let's talk about that a little bit because
that clean slate part of it, uh, I think is
interesting and needed because you haven't had like a clean
slate start normal transition really, I mean, top to bottom.
The transition from Crean to Archie Miller was was a

(25:28):
little bit better, I feel than some of the other ones.
But the Bob Knight transition to Mike Davis was a mess.

Speaker 4 (25:36):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (25:36):
The Davis to Kelvin Sampson came with a lot of
different baggage. The Sampson to Crean transition was a mess.
And then you had the Queen to to Archie trans transition.
Even that involved a lot of players being there and

(25:57):
a lot of guys that played different styles and all
that same thing kind of happened with Woodson to where
you had those holdovers and that's not unusual. But now
we're talking about a program that the roster has has
kind of been on, you know, cleaned out, even all
the way down to trainers and things that nature Obviously

(26:20):
Tim Garl's not coming back and we're not gonna uh
you know, it isn't retained. That's just all part of
of you know, doctor Rank retiring and and everything. It
is a true hard reset And how much of a
benefit can that be for Darren Debrees as he gets
this thing going.

Speaker 2 (26:41):
Well, I hope everybody knows this, but just for clarity, doctoring,
Tim Garrel, medical people like that, those were not the
decisions of a new head coach. Okay, right right, everybody's aware,
but just to make sure that everybody understands that that
was not the decision of a new head coach. As
far as like the clean slate, you know, it gives
somebody an opportunity to say, Okay, here's how I want

(27:04):
this thing to look.

Speaker 3 (27:05):
This thing meaning the.

Speaker 2 (27:06):
Program, the structure of it, and the infrastructure of it.
And certainly IU has a glorious history, and if you
want certain people who are in college basketball to return
and be a part, that's great. There's absolutely nothing wrong
with that. But there's also nothing wrong with hiring a
new CEO, which is what basketball and football coaches are

(27:29):
in today's world. In addition to being coaches and recruiters,
there's nothing wrong with telling the CEO it's your company,
build it how you want, and then we're going to
judge on the results.

Speaker 3 (27:38):
And that's totally fair. But I do think sometimes programs
that have great history get a little caught up in nostalgia.
And you know, we've seen that at other places. It's
not that's not I you specific. You know, Georgetown did
it with Patrick Ewing, Saint John's did it with Chris
Molan years ago. Houston did it with Clyde Drexler.

Speaker 2 (28:00):
Are times people get caught up in nostalgia because if
you were a great program and you have great memories, sometimes.

Speaker 3 (28:08):
You like seeing those people come back and be part
of the program.

Speaker 4 (28:10):
Right.

Speaker 2 (28:10):
But there's nothing wrong with those feelings, there's nothing wrong
with those emotions. But it's often dangerous to make too
many modern day decisions just based on nostalgia. And that's
where I think allowing a reset to occur is a
reasonable way to go. It's no guarantee of success, or
it's no guarantee of non success, but it is a

(28:31):
reasonable way to say, Okay, we're going to hire a
new CEO.

Speaker 3 (28:34):
We're going to let the new CEO build this thing.
The way he wants.

Speaker 1 (28:39):
We have a question actually on the Peak's message board
that they're asking and saying, maybe we could ask a
question on the threat. It says, if you could compare
what IU basketball will look like under d Rock, what's
that current program? And is I use what current program is?
Are you're going to look like?

Speaker 2 (28:57):
I think in the ideal world, something like Creighton. That's
probably the one that comes to mind the quickest. In
part he was there, he learned under Dane Altman. When
Dana was there, he learned under Greg McDermott. He wants
a number of guys on the roster, including frontcourt guys
who could make threes. He is going to demand that

(29:20):
people play defense, but he really understands in today's game,
you have.

Speaker 3 (29:24):
To be able to score.

Speaker 2 (29:27):
So I think Creighton's probably the one that comes to
mind right now. That doesn't mean you're going to get
Creighton year one, okay, but if you're talking about what
I think it might resemble over time, Creyton's probably something
that comes to mind. I was talking to an NBA
scout and he actually brought up Gonzaga. I think that's

(29:49):
going a little too idealistically or perfectly.

Speaker 3 (29:54):
I mean, okay, I mean, who wouldn't want to be
Gonzaga over the last you know, six, a, ten, whatever.

Speaker 2 (30:01):
I don't know that there's some things that few does
that are a little different than some of the Creighton models,
but there are similarities. But Creighton's that's a really good question.
Whoever asked that, that's a good question. Creighton's the one
that probably comes to mind for me.

Speaker 1 (30:17):
And before people panic and think, oh my god, Indiana
and Creighton in the same sentence, Creighton's been a damn
good program for a very long time under Dana Altman
and Greg McDermott. And so I just don't really want,
you know, there to be this idea that you know,
Indiana is going to be or people some Indiana fans
will look down on on Creighton. They absolutely shooting shouldn't.

(30:41):
If Indiana was Creighton over the past, you know, twenty years,
twenty five years, we'd be thrilled as can be that
that would be the results we get. So I just
want to make that very clear.

Speaker 3 (30:53):
That's a good point.

Speaker 2 (30:53):
And I was also answering the question more from a
stylistic absolutely not not you know, results, We're going to
see what the results are I don't think anybody can
sit there and say promise results or even predict the results.
But style of play, kind of basketball youre going to watch.
I think you're going to see smart basketball. I think
you're going to see a team that understands really how

(31:14):
to hunt threes, to hunt good quick offense, and there's
going to be a demand for effort on the defensive end.

Speaker 3 (31:21):
And there's going to be some just more modern.

Speaker 2 (31:24):
Concepts on defense than Indiana's had over the last eight years.
I think you're going to see a better understanding of
how to defend three point shooters, not leave them.

Speaker 3 (31:35):
No more of this nail.

Speaker 2 (31:36):
Slot rim wrap from the nineteen nineties and all that job.
I just think you're going to see better concepts.

Speaker 1 (31:42):
And my god, that will be unbelievable to watch, just
because I mean, there are so many times this year
when I was watching the game and I would just
think to myself, what the hell are they doing out there?
What is going on? And it's it got hard to
watch week after week after week. And I'm excited that
you have a head coach that is confident, that believes

(32:03):
in what he's going to do and isn't on the sidelines,
thinking that he he invented the sideline there. I'm really
excited about that because it is something that that we
haven't had for the past four years. Blue Devil on
the Chat asks when should we expect the two other
assistants to be hired?

Speaker 6 (32:26):
Yeah, I would say I think within a week.

Speaker 3 (32:34):
That's my best best guess right now, I'm pretty confident
on that. But again, here's the thing.

Speaker 2 (32:44):
When you're trying to hire really good assistant coaches, you're
trying to hire them.

Speaker 3 (32:48):
Away from a good job.

Speaker 2 (32:49):
You're trying to tell them pick up, move, come here
to Bloomington, Indiana, work for us, and leave leave a
job you're already at.

Speaker 3 (32:57):
That doesn't happen overnight the time.

Speaker 2 (33:01):
So I think, you know, with some of the people
that Darren Debris knows in college basketball, I think there's
a chance, I know, there's a chance that he gets
you know, some pretty good assistant coaches who are pretty good,
pretty well connected in the recruiting world. And to me,
the number one thing assistants have to do is open
the doors in recruiting. You have to do that. You

(33:21):
the head coach can run practice. You can have a
bunch of different people who are now you know, helping
with you know, scouting, game plans, all that. Good assistant
coaches have to open doors in recruiting, and I think
I think Darren de Brees has a pretty good chance
to put together a really nice staff here at the.

Speaker 4 (33:37):
End of the day.

Speaker 1 (33:38):
Well, that actually leads to the next chat question from Craig.
He says, Rabbie, it feels like coach Debrez has already
made relationships in Indiana major priority. Can you express how
important that is for IU and why it was lacking
the last decade or so for IU coaches?

Speaker 2 (33:55):
Well, why I was lacking. Let me answer that in reverse.
Why I was lacking in last at least from Woodson's
tenure was what do you just what he is?

Speaker 3 (34:04):
Really wasn't that involved in recruiting.

Speaker 5 (34:06):
He didn't like it.

Speaker 3 (34:07):
He didn't want to get involved.

Speaker 2 (34:08):
He would sometimes show up four deep and then there
wouldn't be a lot of communication. Uh, And that's just
the way it was. Archie tried, you know, he did
he did well at times. You know, he got Trace Jackson, Davis,
got Romeo language, you know, Galloway and Leo. I think
we're gonna go play for Indiana Indiana wanted them regardless
if you and me were coaching. But you know, our

(34:30):
Archie did work at it, but he just never really built,
you know, real relationships.

Speaker 3 (34:36):
And here's a couple of things that Darren de Breeze
has already done.

Speaker 2 (34:39):
I was at the Indian of High school basketball state
finals and there was a guy who is pretty meaningful
in state came up to me and said, Mabby Man.

Speaker 3 (34:48):
He's like, I got a call from coach to Breeze.

Speaker 2 (34:50):
The other day and I was like, okay, cool, and
that means what exactly? And I was like, why are
you telling me that? And he's like, wood he never
called me back. In four years everyone's heard from Mike Woodson. Okay, well,
that's certainly good for coach de Reeve. And obviously Darren
de Brees went to the Indiana High school basketball state finals.

Speaker 3 (35:08):
That's a good thing.

Speaker 2 (35:09):
Just show up, be seen and that sends the message.
I'm the IU coach, I'm paying attention to Indiana high
school basketball, whether there's a guy out of there on
the floor that they decide to recruit or not, whether
they get involved with des Brisco, the stud from Christmas
Adds or whoever Jason Gardner junior, the outstanding sophomore, whether
they get involved with him or not. A guy being

(35:31):
the head coach of Indiana week one on the job,
showing up to the Indiana High School State Finals is
a visual that tells everybody, I'm paying attention to your kids.
I'm gonna come see in very smart move. And then
just the other night, Trent Sisley's playing in the t
Potland Nationals up at Hamilton Southeastern and Woody I'm sorry.
Darren Dearees goes up there with the two assistants who

(35:53):
are on staff now, Drew Adams and Nick Norton. You know,
he shows up for his kid, and obviously everybody knows
there was an issue with Liam McNeely. Liam signs, right,
where's the head coach from Indiana. Well, now we're seeing
that Indiana has a head coach.

Speaker 3 (36:09):
Is going to shot. I think it's really important.

Speaker 2 (36:12):
And he's reached out to a number of people, so
relationships aren't going to be built in a week, but
just the fact that he's reaching out to people and
showing up in the state of Indiana is a good
first step. Again, if nothing else, for the visual that
Indiana has a head coach has gone to freak can
show up to key things in the state of Indiana.

(36:34):
Very good move by Daran Debrides.

Speaker 1 (36:35):
What I always wondered about wood he was if it
was a matter of him kind of not changing with
the times in terms of what you need to do
to recruit players in twenty twenty five or twenty twenty one,
where you know this whole span that he's been here,
because I know a lot of times when it was
you know, Bob Knight that was recruiting, it was the assistance.

(36:57):
I got everything in the night, finished things off and
finished It always feels like there, it felt like there
was kind of that same approach by Woody, but recruiting
has changed and there's so much more that goes into
it now than maybe once was. That doesn't let him
off the hook, because I know he had people who
were telling him, Hey, you got to do this, Hey

(37:18):
you got to do this, Hey you got to do this,
and he didn't want to listen to him. The fact
that nobody's telling Darren Debrees how to recruit because he's
been doing it for years, I think is not half
the battle. But Jesus, it's better than what we've seen.

Speaker 3 (37:32):
Yeah, it certainly isn't you know.

Speaker 2 (37:35):
There were some people who and I know you brought
this up when you and I were talking one time
about you know, maybe Woody watched Night do it, you know,
in Night's heyday, and thought it was more of a
come to me. Well, Bob Knight was the premier coach
in college basketball for damn near three decades.

Speaker 3 (37:51):
Right. He won three national championships.

Speaker 2 (37:53):
He had other teams that were phenomenal that maybe went
to a Final four, or maybe you know, there was
an injury and they austin the elite eat or whatever.
But Bob Knight was a clearly an elite coach for
roughly three decades. And when you have multiple banners up, yeah,
you can play the closer role.

Speaker 3 (38:12):
And also, Knight went two.

Speaker 2 (38:14):
Things like the Indiana Basketball Coach Association clinics and spoke
a number of times.

Speaker 3 (38:19):
Everybody knew Bob Knight and Night.

Speaker 2 (38:22):
Also, you know, he invited all kinds of people to
practices for years, high school coaches, whatever. So many people
felt welcomed at IU basketball. They felt like they knew Night,
even if they didn't really know him. They felt a
little bit of some kind of connection. I got to
go to a night practice or night came and spoke
at the clinic. Guy was out those kind of things.

(38:43):
When he came in from the NBA. Nobody knows him.
He doesn't know anybody, and he was distant from people,
and there were a lot of people who were like,
I can't send my kid there because I don't even
know the guy. I don't I don't know what he's about.
And it wasn't that they like specifically distrusted or disliked.
There was no relationship. And when there's no relationship, if

(39:07):
you're a high school coach or an AU coach or
whatever and you're in charge of helping direct a really
talented player, you're not going to send him to somebody
you don't know at all.

Speaker 3 (39:18):
You're not.

Speaker 2 (39:19):
I mean that's one of the reasons, like tom Izzo
has done pretty well. That's the state of Indiana for
a number of years.

Speaker 3 (39:24):
Now.

Speaker 2 (39:25):
You know, he comes down here more than the public realizes.
And there are times afterwards he'll take a high school
coaching staff out to dinner or something. I mean, he
didn't have to do that now because he's tom Izzo.
I'm talking about the tom Izzough that was really starting
to get it Gore, but he mats sure to build
relationships and talk to people and spend time with people.

(39:45):
And I remember seeing him in some open gyms in
the fall and I'm like, coach, what you're doing here
and he's like, ah, you know, I just I'm spending
the day in Indiana, so I'm trying to hit three schools.
A great thing, you know. I saw him in one
gym one time. They wasn't even close to a player,
but could go play for tom Iso. But he was
already in the state and he just decided, Hey, I

(40:06):
can hit one gym in the morning, I can hit
somebody right after school.

Speaker 3 (40:09):
I can pop over here and.

Speaker 2 (40:10):
Say hi to these guys, you know, in the evening
before I hop on the jet and go back. So
you know, that builds relationships and what you just never
felt like that was necessary and that was unfortunate.

Speaker 3 (40:22):
It was really unfortunate.

Speaker 2 (40:23):
But that was that's the past now because Devrees doing
what we've seen him do talking to people.

Speaker 3 (40:29):
He's already reached out to you. Very good first step.

Speaker 1 (40:32):
Yeah, and it always came across to me as it
was Darren Devrees and and even Kurt Signette to do a
certain extent, but Darren devrees the way he has hit
the ground running, it is kind of like I want
them to know who I am so that we could
build this relationship, as opposed to it always felt like
Mike Woodson felt they should know who I am. And

(40:54):
that point. That difference in wanting to make sure that
you touch base and you get to know that person
as a post to assuming they already know you, I
think you know, changes that dynamic a little bit. Another
question from the Pig's message board right now, do you
expect any high school additions to this class outside? And
first off, let's start here, start with just Trent Sisley

(41:15):
and what you've seen from him.

Speaker 2 (41:18):
Yeah, Trent sis originally from Heritage Hillis High School and
something Indiana spinished senior year at Mont Vert Academy, one
of the national fret school powerhouses. He had tremendous senior year,
averaged in double figures for a team that I think
finished with four or five guys averaged between like eight
points and thirteen points. So he's a productive player Offensively,

(41:39):
he was their second leading rebounder going to the Chipotle Nationals,
so he showed that he could rebound against really legit athletes.
And when I say legit athletes, you're watching the Chipotle
Nationals and the games that I watched opening night in
the quarterfinals. Every single front court player who is a
senior is going to a high major program. That's the

(42:00):
level of competition that Trent Sisily played every night. Not
one season, not once a month, that's every night. So
he was very productive. He developed in practice. They basically
run the mont verg program and in some of the
other prop school programs like La La Mere up up
in the Port, Indiana and others. They run them like
college programs. You have class and you eat, then okay,

(42:23):
it's way training or it's you know, practices.

Speaker 3 (42:26):
And then skills.

Speaker 2 (42:27):
It's it is operated in a college program type mentality.
He really developed his shooting as well. He shot around
forty one percent from three point range, not a huge
sample size, but as a six foot seven six foot
eight forward who is being tasked with defending post players
a lot and also a lot of rebounding, for him

(42:49):
to be able to improve his shooting, I think that's
a very good sign. I think that's something that's going
to come as Sicily develops a little more in college.
So I see Trent Sisley is a really good addition,
and he's ranked top seventy in the country, very deserving
of that. But his senior year at Mount Verd accelerated
his development as a player. That that that really sped

(43:11):
things up for him. So I think he plays a
little bit here and there as a freshman, but instead
of starting his freshman year needing to take six seven steps,
I think he's only got to take two or three
to be a guy who starts getting more meaningful minutes.
So and you know, he projects as a four year player.
If you get a kid out of one of these
prep schools who projects a four year player, you have

(43:34):
somebody with accelerated development, and you have somebody who's got
a chance to be a contributor sooner than normal and
can be an impact player sooner than normal.

Speaker 1 (43:42):
And how about the question about adding high school players.

Speaker 3 (43:47):
I think it's possible. And I know that's going to
sound like a really terrible answer, but here's the reason.

Speaker 2 (43:53):
They got to figure out the portal stuff first, right,
So if you get.

Speaker 3 (43:59):
Let's say you get nine guys out of the portal
who you really like.

Speaker 2 (44:04):
Or maybe ten, let's say ten, transisty would be or eleven,
So you got eleven people. A part of it's going
to be okay. The portal guys, how many of them
have multiple years left? Because that's one thing de Breeze
wants to do is try to get to the point
where you're not portal dependent every spring every year. So
how many guys do you have that maybe have two
or three years left. If it's a whole bunch of

(44:25):
guys who have one year left, maybe you can only
take one or two high school guys.

Speaker 3 (44:29):
If some of the portal guys have two or three years.

Speaker 2 (44:32):
Left, then maybe you could add a couple of high
school kids. So right now, I'm gonna leave it as
possible for high school editions, But there are some guys
out there, in my opinion, who if I get what
it wants in the portal, I think there's a chance
they have another slot, maybe two for high school kids.

(44:52):
And I think there's a chance there is another high
school edition. Two might be a little too many right now,
but I think there's a good chance there could be
another one.

Speaker 1 (45:00):
Yeah, I kind of agree with that. And also when
it comes to recruiting high school kids, those relationships have
to be built, you know, a couple of years back,
and so there's more of an opportunity for class of
twenty six maybe to have some of that as well.
Derby on the chat asked, what will other coaches who
are recruiting IU players in the portal think of the

(45:22):
lack of hustle and in some cases sheer laziness. Will
that affected recruitability? This is looking back a little bit,
but it's it's an interesting question because of the fact
that it's the idea that you're always making tape, no
matter what you're anytime you're on the court, you're making tape.
You know, what, do you think that some of the
other coaches who are looking at tape at guys that

(45:44):
played last year might see in terms of some of
the not great effort we saw or or some of
the loafing.

Speaker 2 (45:54):
Yeah, I think with some coaches who really study tape,
or some coaches who have staffs that really study tape.

Speaker 3 (45:59):
I think that's going to have an impact.

Speaker 2 (46:01):
I think there are some guys who may end up
making less in nil next year than they made this
past year. At Indiana, there's also this, However, there are
some head coaches who just don't spend, in my opinion,
the proper amount of time studying tape.

Speaker 3 (46:14):
They look at the highlights and go, oh, man, I
want that shiny new object. Give me shiny new object.

Speaker 2 (46:20):
And there's also some coaches who an assistant coaches will
tell you this all the time. The guys on your
team you see all their warts, the guys on other teams.
If you just watch highlights, you think everybody who's not
on your team is better than everybody who's on your team.
And sometimes people get over recruited, Like there was one

(46:41):
guy who a couple of days ago went to a
school or I don't think it's gonna play very much,
but his people put together as a great tape and.

Speaker 3 (46:53):
They convince people, oh, there's twenty schools after him. It
was like four or five schools interested.

Speaker 2 (46:58):
But they convinced this one school there's twenty schools, big
names are coming after him. You got to get it
done now if you want him. And the coach kind
of panicked and went, yeah, okay, fine, we'll take him.
Gave him probably twice the nil he's worth, but there
was a little bit of a panic there. So sometimes
coaches do panic and take guys so it's it's really
programmed specific. But I do think there are a couple

(47:19):
of guys who played it out of you last year. Unfortunately,
I think they're their their contract. Well, we're not supposed
to call a contract they're nil. Is going to go
down a little bit.

Speaker 4 (47:29):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (47:29):
Hunter Perea is who you just described right there by
the way. I mean, that was a guy that had
his amazing highlight tape. But just if the highlight tapes
are great, there highlights for a reason.

Speaker 2 (47:43):
Honor Perea was one of the first people for whom
an assistant coach said he's a YouTube player. Yeah, I
meaning he looks great on YouTube, but when you actually
watch the game, you're like, ooh, got a long way
to go.

Speaker 1 (47:55):
Yeah yeah, And yeah, you mentioned anil and I know
that you know in the portal and and let's let's
talk about this a little bit in general. Uh, contracts,
and you say, you know it's nil, it's not contracts.
Should there be a situation where these start to become
more contracts that also include a scholarship as a benefit

(48:20):
because of the fact that you know, this year to
year thing isn't sustainable basically is my point. So do
you see a future in which you sign out of
high school and you have a two year contract to
begin and you and you can only get out of it.
What what kind of changes do you think it's going
to be made when it comes to ni L and

(48:44):
how some of the guardrails might end up going up.

Speaker 3 (48:48):
I'm one hundred percent favorite contracts.

Speaker 2 (48:49):
Have been one hundred percent favorite contracts for a long time, uh,
for for these reasons. And I was talking with some
NBA people just today out there at Chipotle Nationals, and
they NBA people ultimately laugh at the college basketball model
right now. They laugh at it because they say, you
guys don't have free agency in college basketball because one,
everybody's a free agent every year. That's not free agency

(49:12):
because you can't sign guys to a two year deal,
three year deal, whatever.

Speaker 3 (49:15):
They said. The other thing is like in the NBA,
we actually have a salary cap.

Speaker 2 (49:18):
If we sign a guy in twenty twenty five to
a three year deal, we have to look at, Okay,
who would we then not take in twenty twenty six
and twenty twenty seven. We actually have to build a
roster with Looking forward, college programs could just get a
bunch of boosters together and go, hey, you got twenty
million dollars, Go buy a bunch of dudes, Buy a
bunch of dudes, go to the final four. And then

(49:40):
twenty million is gone and all the dudes are gone,
and you start over and do you have another twenty
million or maybe you only got ten. It's one, it's
not free agency. Two, it's not actually a salarycap structure
of any kind. I'm in favor of contracts. One. It
would eliminate that. It would eliminate everybody being a free agent.
Every year you come out of a heighth school, you sign it.

(50:00):
You sign a two year deal or a three year deal,
or if you want to sign a four year deal,
sign a four year deal. Or you come out of
the portal after you're going to the portal after your
freshman year. Somebody's willing to give you a two year deal.
You signed a two year deal.

Speaker 3 (50:12):
If you leave before your deal is up, you have
to sit.

Speaker 2 (50:18):
No exceptions, no exceptions, no exceptions other than for serious
family situations or coaching changes. But as far as just
personnel player personnel making a decision, I want to go
look at the open market. No, you got a two
year deal, and the college players for years, you heard
these people saying they they make money, they should be

(50:40):
treated like pros.

Speaker 3 (50:41):
Okay, then let's treat them like pros. Pro sign contracts.

Speaker 2 (50:46):
If a guy signs a three year deal with the
Indiana Pacers and after the first year his role isn't
exactly what he wants, well, too bad.

Speaker 3 (50:54):
Get better?

Speaker 2 (50:55):
You know you know you are, you signed a contract.
Contracts would fix a lot of this, a lot of problems.
They would eliminate the everybody being a free agent every year.
They would allow you actually to build a roster moving
forward with a number of years, and they would reduce
some of the tampering because if I'm coaching Indiana and
I got ken Bykoff signed to a three year deal,

(51:17):
other schools aren't going to try to get you to
go into.

Speaker 3 (51:19):
Portal because they know you'd have to sit for a year.

Speaker 2 (51:22):
So it's like it would create more roster stability, and
it would just create better balance of putting together rosters
year to year. I'm one hundred percent in favor of contracts,
one hundred percent.

Speaker 1 (51:33):
You have another question about about Louke Goody and getting
his red shirt application approved in a return to IU,
Your thoughts on that.

Speaker 2 (51:42):
Yeah, the process is underway, and the way it works
is you initially have to apply for a red shirt
that there are no guarantees, even like if somebody says
at the beginning of the year, the plan is the
red shirt on paper, you have to apply for it
once your season ends. So he's applying for a red
shirt from the season when he only played ten games
at Illinois. The issue is this, he played ten games.

(52:05):
He came back and played after he was hurt, so
you can't make the argument that the injury entered his season.
But he's gonna go ahead and apply for the waiver.
If it gets denied, his family's plan is to get
a lawyer and fight and either win the legal fight
or maybe the NCAAA, which has been getting crushed in
court case after court case, maybe it goes.

Speaker 3 (52:26):
You know what, we don't.

Speaker 2 (52:29):
Want another legal fight for one kid on one team.
All right, we'll grant the appeal and let it go.
But that's where it is right now. But there is
no guarantee. This is not like a traditional situation where
you were hurt early in the year, missed the rest
of the year and everybody knows it's going to get
rubber stamped. This is probably an uphill battle at this
point in time, at least the waiver process with the NCAA.

(52:49):
It's been described to me as an uphill battle. Then
they're gonna if they get denied, then they're gonna go
to the you know, the legal fight and go from there.
But if he does people, that's this as well. If
he does get a fifth year, it's all about a
fifth year in Indiana. He's not looking to go on
the portal. He wants another year to Indiana.

Speaker 1 (53:07):
I'm gonna try to call in section again. I don't
know that you're gonna be able to hear this, Rabbi,
And I promise you this, folks that were watching, we'll
get this figured out. This is, you know, the the
whole part of taking calls and do it and do it.
You haven't grabbed you on in zoom and all that.
We're going to get this figured out. But for right now,
call her. I'm gonna go to you and you're gonna

(53:29):
hear me say it. In the second. I think that
there's probably gonna be a little bit of a delay.
We had just picked up another caller here, and so
this will be interesting. Caller, if I can't have your name,
where you're from, and.

Speaker 4 (53:39):
What you got, I'm John from Seymour, Indiana. Go ahead, John, Okay,
you answered pet RABBI answered my question really about the
man I L. I think because I was wanting to
know what what well be done about the ni L

(54:03):
because it seems like it's kind of a mess right now.
But I do just have kind of a silly question.
I'm an old guy. I'm about seventy eight years old,
and I remember when Bob Knight came to Indiana and
a lot of people thought they went from the hurry
and Hoosiers to to the defensive minded Hoosiers. And I

(54:24):
remember Fred Taylor saying that Bobby Knight will cut a
swath through the Big Ten. And I think Fred Taylor
was right about that, and Bobby went on to become
one of the greatest coaches of all time, in my opinion,
the greatest. My just a silly question I have is

(54:48):
where did where did coach Debris get the nickname d Rock?
And I'll hang up and listen to you.

Speaker 1 (55:00):
All right, Ravid, So the question here, Thank you so much. Calin.
This is John from Seymour. He's saying, you know, he
said that you had already answered about what could be
done about nil, but he's seventy eight and went, friend,
saw I you go from the Hurry and Hoosiers and
Fred Taylor Hurrian Hooters to Bob Knight and defense. Fred
Taylor said Bob Knight would cut a swath through the

(55:21):
Big ten. And indeed he did. His silly question that
he wanted was and he described it himself as a
silly question. Question is where did coach debriz get the
nickname d Rock?

Speaker 3 (55:35):
That goes back to his days at Crayton.

Speaker 6 (55:38):
I don't really know who first gave it to him,
but a number of people when he was an assistant
coach at Creighton were calling him d Rock and it
just kind of it's Duck.

Speaker 2 (55:49):
So he dates back to his Creighton days. But I'm
not too sure like which assistant, which player gave it
to him, but yeah, it goes back to his Creton days.

Speaker 1 (55:58):
On the peeg zach message board, well are you trying
to add portal players who have more than one year
of eligibility in order to try and balance the roster?

Speaker 2 (56:07):
Ideally, yes, but job one for the portal is get
enough impact players ideally get enough impact.

Speaker 3 (56:15):
Players to have a good year for next year.

Speaker 2 (56:17):
You know, that's why they're looking at people like Reed
Bailey from Davidson, Farrel Payne from Texas in and m
Elijah Freeman D two stud who I think has every
chance to be a very good player at the power
for level. So yeah, would they like guys with multiple years,
They would, but year one sometimes you gotta do what.

Speaker 3 (56:41):
You gotta do to try to be competitive in year one.

Speaker 1 (56:44):
Another question is do you think the first player or
two will be harder to get due to uncertainty of
how the roster will look, whereas if we have five
or six it'll be easier to see a vision of
the roster. I mean it basically, he's asking, you know,
how difficult is it to be the first guy to
say yes?

Speaker 2 (57:01):
Yeah, I think that's fair because early on, you know,
you have to see a vision of something that doesn't
tangibly exist. You know, Connor en Wright saw the vision
because he played for Darren to reach before.

Speaker 3 (57:14):
But yeah, I think.

Speaker 2 (57:14):
It's it's a little tougher, you know. That's that's why
I think they're in a fight for Josh Dix. Yeah,
standing shooter from Iowa. You know, there's several schools involved there.
Dix wants to make a decision here in the next
day or two. But I believe he's truly torn based
upon people I talked to tonight, tonight being Thursday night.
But yeah, it's it's a little bit tougher when when

(57:37):
you are starting from scratch and when you've got to
convince the first few guys to come in. Yeah, I
think that's I think it's a very fair way to
look at it.

Speaker 1 (57:46):
And we've got another call. Has been very patient on
this though. Again, this is not the smoothest situation, and
it'll get fixed. But you know, call her. If I
could have your name where you're from, what you got
from a six seven eight number? Go ahead, Ken, this
is Kent from Atlanta. Yes, I could hear you. Go ahead.
I don't think he's listening on YouTube. That's that's uh

(58:08):
the issue here that we're having. All Right, I'm gonna
go ahead and drop that CA. I'm gonna I'm gonna
close up the call and until we work that out,
and we'll go ahead and reach out to Kent to
who we actually know, uh and already so you know,
another question, Uh that we have from Donald on the
chat is I saw the headline about Yukon. Half the

(58:28):
players entered the portal, didn't get a chance to read
the details. Might any good players join i U's new
roster and who? I think he's asking specifically about Yukon there,
But you know that that's that's a difficult thing. But
I would let's let's talk instead about guys entering the portal.

(58:51):
Yukon obviously is a very successful program, uh, Terry Morgan
for for IU, A lot of players have entered the portal.
Your thoughts on people so freely going into the portal
that we see, I know, for me personally, anything that

(59:12):
gives the players options I think is a positive. However,
it is a little baffling to see how many people
go into the portal, and I understand they're just exploring
what might be out there, but it is just so
easy to enter the portal and really create so many

(59:33):
headaches throughout the college basketball world.

Speaker 3 (59:39):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (59:39):
I think there are a couple of different groups, several
different groups of players here in the portal. There's the
guys at lower levels who had really good season want
to level up. There's guys at the power foward level
and I'm going to take coach and changes.

Speaker 3 (59:52):
Off the table.

Speaker 2 (59:53):
There's guys at the powerfoard level who didn't exactly love
the role, don't feel like they're good, have an opportunity
to move up the depth chart. They feel like they
need a fresh start somewhere else. There are people who
are at schools where those schools either don't have great
NIL or player A isn't getting the NIL he thinks

(01:00:15):
he should get, and so he feels like he's going
to go get the NL he should get somewhere else.
That's almost like an actual free agent situation. You know,
you play for the Union of Pacers. They offer you
a million dollars a year. You think you're worth twelve,
they say no final offer eight you go to be
a free agent. That's another group. And then there's also

(01:00:38):
this group. And this is something that I think, like
most of the public doesn't like to hear, but it's truth.

Speaker 3 (01:00:44):
Someone say it. There are people whose agents, uncles, family.

Speaker 2 (01:00:50):
Members, high school coaches, whatever, have heard from other schools saying, hey,
you know, by Coon's doing really well. They're at Big
State U and you know, I know he's got two
months left in the season. But man, if he enters
the portal, we take him, we'd start him at the two.

Speaker 3 (01:01:08):
We give him eight hundred grand. You know, think about this,
this opportunity. And there are.

Speaker 2 (01:01:13):
Players who have heard that from maybe three, four or
five schools who are like, well, I'm not getting this
from where I am. I know I got these three
or four opportunities out there.

Speaker 3 (01:01:23):
I'm going to the portal.

Speaker 2 (01:01:25):
So there are people who you know, and I know
everybody says, oh, that's tampering. It's illegal on paper. Yeah,
reality happens all the time. Right There's one player who
just recently picked a school that had been recruiting him
since Christmas. Okay, these things happen, not supposed to happen.
Nobody likes him. I have no idea what the hell
you're supposed to do to stop it. When people have
agents and everything else. It's just part of the new

(01:01:47):
world right now. How you fix that, I don't know,
but I'm just telling you there are players who entered
the portal who have been essentially told these four or
five schools are serious about you, and they're willing to
do w salary.

Speaker 3 (01:02:00):
Or wnil are you willing to do this? And they
go into the portal.

Speaker 2 (01:02:04):
So those are the main groups of people, like why
do people go into the portal? And then there are
some the I guess the fifth group would be the
people who just get really really really bad advice. Oh
going to the portal. You're you're making only one hundred
now going the portal?

Speaker 1 (01:02:19):
Oh raby zoom frozeen. Oh no, oh no, I'm stuck.

Speaker 3 (01:02:24):
To oh no oh no.

Speaker 1 (01:02:29):
All right. I think we're back live. I think we're
back live. I think that is a bike Off Studio
internet issue that just popped out there. Sweet god, what
a mess. I tell you. The weather's been uh messing
with my house. It's awful. And you said we should

(01:02:52):
go you should come to the Bike Off School of podcasting. Bullshit.
Not with the way that I've been going.

Speaker 2 (01:02:58):
No way, you know, tornado, severe thunderstorm's power outlet cause problems.

Speaker 1 (01:03:04):
Let me ask you this about tampering. Uh. And I
guess I would have to go back and check on
the contracts of Archie Miller or anybody else. I haven't
actually done it yet, but uh, I noticed that in
Darren Debreeze's contract is mu that we we got a

(01:03:25):
chance to take a look at There was a line
in there about not being able to talk to another
school well under under contract without written notice. Uh. Is
that something that standard or is that something that I've missed? Uh?
I I've been thinking about this lately because of the
fact that so many guys, you know, they lose a

(01:03:47):
tournament game on a Saturday. They introduced us a new
head coach on Tuesday. Obviously, their agents have been talking
to people and back channels. I'm not naive I know
how this works, but I don't know that I've noticed
that contract information before. I just wanted to get your
thoughts on that.

Speaker 3 (01:04:05):
I've seen it before for coaches contracts.

Speaker 2 (01:04:07):
I've always wondered how enforceable it is, and then what
exactly are you going to do about it, especially if
somebody is represented by, you know, a fairly big agency
or whatever who use an institution are going to deal
with again, are you going to get get get into
a fight with with a big, big agency.

Speaker 3 (01:04:25):
I just I just don't think.

Speaker 2 (01:04:27):
I think that's put in there to try to create
guard rails. I just don't know how real those are.

Speaker 7 (01:04:33):
Yeah, that's uh, It's it's just so interesting to me
that that we live in a. We live in a
world of lies when it comes to college sports as
it is, we get lied to by coaches every time
they're in front of a microphone. You know, there's coaches
that will tell you that you know, they don't have
an update about their star player who got injured in
the first half.

Speaker 1 (01:04:52):
You know, I haven't heard anything yet. Again, you're lying
to us and we just all accept it and it's
just all part the equation. But that part I think
is is uh is interesting. And you know when you
have portal players that they have agents talking to to them, coaches,

(01:05:14):
that's happening with them as well. Like you said, I'm
not sure how you enforce this or clean it up,
but it You know, you've been covering recruiting for a
long time. Portal obviously changes things, so does nil. But
do you feel like recruiting and the whole process has

(01:05:38):
become cleaner over the year or you know, over the
past couple of years because of this stuff, or is
it just the normal dirty stuff that's just now being
done out in the open.

Speaker 2 (01:05:51):
Yeah, I don't know, and I have to think about it,
but I don't know. The cleaner is a word I
would use. I think the payments to players are now
just they're above the table rather than the table, right,
And that's really the bigest thing that happened.

Speaker 3 (01:06:04):
None of this stuff is new.

Speaker 2 (01:06:05):
It's just now allowed so people can market the fact
that they had big nil schools can talk about it,
brag about it if you want, and negotiations are just
a little more normal, where before negotiations were, hey, sh
don't tell.

Speaker 3 (01:06:21):
Nobody can get it. Hey, by the way, I got
four hundred if you can get me that kid.

Speaker 2 (01:06:26):
You know, it's like now it's like, hey, n four
hundred enough, what do you need for your guy? Oh
you need five hundred? Okay, yeah, we'll do five hundred.
But you know, and now it's just it's all above
the table. So that is a positive that it's above
the table. That is a positive because now everybody can
swim in the pool without problems.

Speaker 3 (01:06:46):
You know, for years, a lot of schools, you.

Speaker 2 (01:06:48):
Know, Indiana was one of them, tried to play by
the rules and certain things, where other schools were pain
players and everybody knew they were.

Speaker 3 (01:06:55):
A pain player.

Speaker 2 (01:06:56):
And now Indiana can say, hey, we got some serious
boosters involved, we got we got millions of dollars in
nil come to Indiana and we're gonna pay you. Well,
So if you're looking for positives, that would be one.

Speaker 1 (01:07:09):
Well, it's an interesting world we live in, to say
the least, and it's interesting times for Indiana basketball. Last
question I'll have for you before I let you go.
You know, this is a program that has h is
a proud tradition fans that that are desperate for success.
They're desperate to see something good that they could cheer

(01:07:31):
about and not cheer about, you know, despite other things.
Think about the attitude of the fans before and after
Woody's resignation announcement, and just the fact that there was
a certain faction of fans that when they they didn't
want to cheer for an Indiana winner, were disappointed when

(01:07:53):
Indiana won because it wasn't going to trigger. They were
worried it wasn't going to trigger the change that they
felt was needed. We'd have no crystal ball. We don't
know if this is going to work. I thought Archie
Miller was going to work when he was hired. It didn't.
I was very wait and see on Woody and was

(01:08:14):
unimpressed with the hire when it happened. It didn't work out.
I'm not surprised by that for this one. Indiana, I
think a lot of fans nobody was like, oh, Darren
de Brees is going to be the guy that that
they expected. But what do you think is about you know,
is it about Darren Debries that could really deliver on

(01:08:35):
what Indiana You know, Indiana fans' hopes are. And I'm
not even talking about a sixth banner. I'm talking about
just getting back to being competitive in the Big Ten,
being out there competing every every week, and giving IU
fans something true that they could hold on to in
terms of an identity and a competitiveness that they've come

(01:08:56):
to expect.

Speaker 2 (01:08:58):
Well, I think you hit on a key right their identity.
I think that's one thing that Darren de Brees has.
He has a really clear idea, a vision of how
he wants his team to play. And if you look
at his team, very seldom that they actually get blown
out during his time at Drake or his time at
West Virginia.

Speaker 3 (01:09:15):
And I'm not.

Speaker 2 (01:09:16):
Saying losses are ever, okay, but there's a difference between
being really competitive. Sometimes you lose, sometimes shots don't go
in the last pants, okay, But do you walk away
saying my team played hard, my team played smart, my
team defended, my team took good shots. My team really
made sure they controlled the defensive boards, didn't give up
a bunch of you know, they weren't being lazy on

(01:09:37):
block astsid giving up a bunch of second change points.
Are you proud of your team? Are you proud of
the way your team played? And I think the race has.

Speaker 3 (01:09:43):
A pretty good plan for that.

Speaker 2 (01:09:45):
So I have optimism here as we sit here today
that this has a really good chance of working out.
And again that's not a prediction of number of wins
or anti tournament runs or whatever, but one of the
things Indiana has to do, they just have to get
back to the point to where they are consistently competitive.
I mean, just this past year, they signed the number

(01:10:07):
two portal class in the country. Then they fly down
there to the Bahamas and they just get absolutely dog
walked by Louisville, dog walk destroyed, and all, well, you know,
we're just getting everything together. Louell had thirteen new scholarship
players the first year head coach. Man, don't give me
that nonsense. The next night, Okay, we're gonna get it together.
Gonzaga blows in and off the court again, they go

(01:10:31):
up to you know, during the regular season, lose by
twenty five, Iowa, lose by twenty five.

Speaker 3 (01:10:36):
At home Illinois. Those kind of things need to stop.
That's part of job one.

Speaker 2 (01:10:41):
Obviously winning is the priority, but au has to be competitive.
They got to play smart, they got to play organized,
and Indiana needs to get back to playing the brand
of basketball. When people walk out of assembly Hall or
turn off the TV after the game, whether i you
won or lost, they go that was a well played game.
They were coached correctly, the kids played hard. The fundamentals

(01:11:03):
were there. If any Enna can get there, then they're
making progress.

Speaker 1 (01:11:07):
That's what was infuriating to me at the end of
the season when Mike Woodson was talking about, you know,
we're playing our best basketball. It's like, you're five and
three in your last eight games, got your ass kicked
by twenty five against Illinois and Iowa and in Gonzaga
and Louisville and all these these games where oh, great,
you're competitive in March cool, you know, that's that's what

(01:11:30):
you should have been doing. And even then it's a
it's a double digit loss to Oregon twice, so to me,
that was something. But that's the past. Now grabbing that's
the past and.

Speaker 3 (01:11:42):
We can will.

Speaker 2 (01:11:44):
I will leave people with one last thought if I may, Yes,
there will be new names Merge and the portal.

Speaker 3 (01:11:52):
There will be new names. They're not out there yet,
there will be new names. I have great confidence in that.

Speaker 1 (01:11:58):
There you go, Rabbie, thank you so much for joining
us on this little call in with an extra video
person experiment that we're running that we will do again
and get and get it done better. I promise you that.

Speaker 3 (01:12:12):
Sounds good.

Speaker 2 (01:12:13):
Man, have a great night. I appreciate everybody at Fall
and sending questions.

Speaker 1 (01:12:16):
Well that's all the time we have on the Peaks
post game Live. I want to thank you for listening.
I want to remind you of visit Peaks dot com
for the very best of how you football and basketball coverage.
You're gonna find anywhere nobody covers who's recruiting better than
Jeff rob John's, Matt Weaver, Trevor Andershock and Jared Kelly.
So come be a part of a thriving, exciting community
at Peaks dot com. Folks, you are not going to
be disappointed. Folks are out of time, but for now

(01:12:38):
and for Jeff, Matt Trevor and Jared, I'm kem Mike
alf saying thanks for listening, everybody,