A JUNGIAN LOOK AT APOLLO AND HERMES STORY

Episode Transcript

(00:01):
Welcome to the Philosopher's Circle. ThePhilosopher's Circle attempts to answer the most profound
questions we all have in life.It is your guide to the fundamental nature
of existence, society, and howwe think. Joined Doctor Carlos as he
discusses philosophy with leading philosophers, theologiansand more. And now here is doctor

(00:24):
Carlos. Today. We're going tobe looking at the myth of Apollo and
Hermes and the cattle theft, andthen we'll also apply the Youngian theory onto
it. So here's the myth.Hermes, newborn and precocious, stole a
herd of cattle belonging to his olderhalf brother Apollo. He clearly cleverly hit

(00:45):
his tracks by making the cattle walkbackwards and using branches to sweep away the
footprints. When Apollo discovered the theftand confronting Hermes, and boy was he
upset, the young god denied everything. Zeus, their father, intervened and
ordered Hermes to return the cattle,so basically didn't believe them. To appease
Apollo, Hermes invented the liar andgave it to him as a gift.

(01:06):
Apaulo is so charmed by the instrumentthat he forgave Hermes, and an exchange
for the instrument gave him a Cadusius. Cadusius is a herald's staff and made
him the messenger of the gods.And if you know, some of the
medical institutions will use that. TheCadusius again, if I'm saying it right.
Au c A d u ce uS is a symbol featuring two serpents

(01:29):
intertwined around a wing staff, oftenassociated with medicine and healthcare. Again,
the origins are complex, though theCadusius traditionally associated with the stories of Hermes,
the messenger of the gods, aswell as the god of trade,
thieves and travel. The staff,called the karakian k e r y k
e i O n and Greek,was a symbol of peace, negotiation,
and commerce. The two serpents calledaround the staff are said to represent balance

(01:52):
and duality, which is a verycommon theme throughout history. Sometimes people confuse
it with the rod of Asclipius ac e p i U S. The
correct symbol for medicine healthcare is therad of Aesclippius, which features a single
serpent entwined around a staff with nowings. The Greek god as Sclippius was
a gorod of healing and medicine,so it accurately represents healing and medical practice.

(02:15):
So what was the misuse about.Well, the confusion between the Cadusius
and the rod of Aesclipius began inthe early twentieth century, particularly in the
US. The Army Medical Corps adoptedthe symbol as it's insignia in nineteen oh
two, leading to widespread use ofthe symbol of medical contexts, and there
you go. Symbolic interpretations of theCadusius of the Twin Servants are often seen

(02:36):
as representing the balance between life anddeath, good and evil, health and
illness, always that duality component thatwe've talked about before, and it kind
of kicks us in over to Youngiananalysis in the story of Hermes again.
Hermes there obviously represents the trickster archetype, embodying cunning, wit and transgression of
boundaries. Apollo represents the heroes archetyperight, symbolizing order and reason. The

(02:59):
theft present the integration of the shadow. Hermes being younger might symbolize the unconscious
or repressed aspects of the psyche theshadow, challenging the established order of Apollo.
So basically it's almost like looking atas a composition character and acting right.
And movies sometimes put two or threeindividuals if it's a historical fiction,
into one character, calling it acomposition character, and you can see this

(03:22):
might be it. If you wantedto look at the Youngian lands, where
Apollo and Hermes are really one person, and you can see them battling the
good and the bad within them.The conflict and the eventual reconciliation between Hermes
and Apollo could represent the process ofindividuation, the integration of these different aspects
that we all have to be awareof, and it's always the ultimate goal,

(03:42):
according to Youngian analysis, is toreach individuation. This integration, the
identifying that we have bad and goodin us, and how do we integrate
those two things. Zeus's intervention cansymbolize the self archetype, the regulating center
of the psyche that brings balance andresolution. The self is the combination of
the conscious and the unconscious, andthe psyche puts it all together. The

(04:08):
unconscious, the conscious, the archetypes, the shadow, the anima animus.
Everything is in there, but theself is almost like the ego if you
think about it. From Freud,the transformation of conflict into cooperation, Hermits
becomes Hermes, becoming the messenger ofthe gods aligns with Young's emphasis on the
transformative power of psychological integration and theconcept of Joseph Campbell's hero's journey. The

(04:30):
cattle could symbolize vitality or life force, the instrument the musical instrument represents creativity
and harmony, and the cadusia symbolizescommunication and mediation, so you can see
it as a story of psychological growthand integration that we all need. It
shows how seemingly oppos opposing forces likecunning versus order, youth versus experience,
can be reconciled to create a morecomplete and balanced or whole psyche, which

(04:55):
we're all trying to achieve,