WRONG TURN 4 BLOODY BEGINNINGS

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:31):
None. Hello everyone and welcome to
the Pod and the Pendulum, the show that covers all the horror
franchises one movie in one episode at a time.
And we are here this week to continue our journey in the
backwoods West Virginia with wrong Turn 4 bloody beginnings.

(00:55):
And I am not alone. Thankfully we have a quartet of
us here today including in the Co host chair, the founder of
the Spectre Cinema Club and alsothe Co host of his new podcast
Tainted Love, Mr. Devon Taylor. Devon, how are we?
Hello, hello, I'm doing fantastic.
You can call me a stash for thisif we're giving wrong turn names

(01:18):
based on physical traits so everybody also give yourself a
wrong turn name. I call dibs on stash for this
one. For those of you that I can't
see, I have my mustache. Excellent.
This is going to be a fun episode for those of the
listeners that like to hear Mikeand Devon disagree about movies.

(01:39):
I think already this is going tobe a really good time today.
We should enjoy this, but we have a pair of guests with us
today, returning for the first time in a long while.
Has it been since, like Jaws, the Revenge saw which side I?
Think. Saw 73D.
OK. I think I, I think I defended

(01:59):
once again a over hated, under loved sequel because that's the
only reason I get to come hang. Out so we've had you for like
Jaws the Revenge saw 7 We've we've got you on for some
clunkers. I I I'll hold on.
I I'll give you all your clunkers because you have to
hear y'all Blair Witch 2016 Alien Covenant.

(02:24):
That's not it. Well, OK, so none of these are
clunkers to me. So to be fair, Alien covenant
raw, which was actually the non clunker, yes.
Texas Chainsaw Massacre, 2022. Plunker Jeez, Joss three saw.
Yeah, I was on the revenge, but.That's right, that's right.

(02:47):
They just. Blended and then saw the final
chapter. Fair enough.
Well, if you don't recognize thevoice.
She is the founder of Final Girls Feast, the Gastro horror
website and podcast. Miss Sarah Stubbs.
Sarah, how are we? Hello, hello.
And I don't, I don't have a backwoods name, but but I am

(03:08):
definitely the the cannibal queen here.
So, you know, I maybe I'll just go with that.
Fair enough. And we have a first time guest
with us today who looks like he's regretting every choice he
made to join us today. He's like, what did I get into
from Gay of the Dead? And also the creator and Co

(03:29):
editor of Queer Horror, a film guide, Mr. Sean Ably.
Sean, how are we? I'm well, and you're right.
I'm like I I did my beard for this.
Why am I here? This feels like the biggest
mistake I could have made today.Wow, right out of the gates you
have that backwoods beard. I.
Do you know my insanely? Jealous.

(03:51):
It's and I guess I'll be the beard today, but I could also be
the the gay one, which I guess is a little foreshadowing for
what my entry point into this film is.
It's it's interesting to hear your clunkers.
You mentioned Alien Covenant. I am an alien Stan.
I like every flavor of alien. I like them with predators in

(04:13):
Covenant. I like them, you know, so much.
I I there's not, you know, Alienthree.
I enjoyed it at the time, not even in retrospect like it was
wrapped. So yeah, I'm I was just on
another podcast and I won't cross promote, but defending a
shot on a shot well certified, forgotten and I inflicted them
friends. Of the pod.

(04:34):
Yeah, yeah, I, I inflicted on them 555-A shot on video gem out
of Chicago from like 1980. And it is, it is my if you go to
my letterbox, it is the one and only film I have on there and it
gets five stars. This is how.
This is how like much I love this terrible film.

(04:58):
So I I feel you. Only that's the only literally
the only on your letterbox, and you'll never add another.
I feel like I'm kind of stuck inmy bit at this point.
If I do add another one that I've sort of betrayed the bit
and then I have to do all of them.
Like I can't put just one more than I have to catch up and I'm
way too lazy for any of that. My hot takes an alien covenant

(05:21):
is everything except for the Xenomor stuff is five stars.
Like it's a great non alien movie and then it's like Oh
yeah, we needed to add this in as well.
And also Prometheus is the second best film of the whole.
Series. That is so true.
That is so. True, I'm not a Prometheus.
Prometheus truthers rise up. Yeah, I'm a big fan.

(05:43):
I love this. I think.
I think if we're doing those rankings, I would actually pull
Aliens out because it's an action film where I feel like
all the rest of them are full onsci-fi horror.
Well they're horror with a sci-fi overlay and Aliens is
kind of. Aliens is genius, love it to
death but I feel like it's its own thing.

(06:05):
Yeah, I think I had that lower in my rankings.
I think I have it behind even Part 3.
What? Yeah.
I'm not a big Aliens fan if I'm going to be honest.
Like I, like I, I think it's toosci-fi for my taste and I'm not
a big sci-fi person so it's realhard to get me on board with

(06:26):
anything sci-fi. Like if you see me, you know,
four or five star ratings on anything sci-fi.
It must have been real good 'cause that is not my life.
Interesting. What about like the, you know,
my favorite genre which is sci-fi horror, things like Event
Horizon? Like are you on board for that?
I, I do like event Horizon because it's very horror based,

(06:46):
right? Like if, if it leans into the
horror, I'm all about it. But if it starts going too far
into like, you know, robots, action, stuff like that, I'm I
get bored easily. Yeah, when I say I wasn't scared
in Aliens because it is an action film first with the
sci-fi overlay. So I feel you on that one if

(07:08):
you're the sci-fi isn't your jam, I can.
I can. Which is why I set it aside.
Which is why I put it in its owncategory for me to love by.
Itself, I hope we get a sci-fi entry for this franchise.
You know, I feel like the hillockers do need to go to
space. Wrong turn I.
Would like we took a wrong turn like the astronauts going to
Mars and they take a wrong turn in space and end up and know

(07:32):
what? Happened because they're taking
black hole. No, they got to take the
hillikers to space cryogenicallyfrozen so that they can get rid
of them. It's how they're getting rid of.
They can't. Feel pain.
They can't feel the pressure in space.
So if let's not give them we hitrecord, I think we're like, how
long do we think we're going to go today?

(07:53):
I'm like, we'll be under 90 and this is what happens.
This is why every show is like 21/2 hours long.
I love it. It's the best parts of the show.
I, I always tell my husband I'm like, it's pot in the pendulum.
I I'm going to be gone at least two hours.
It's never, it's never less. Devon was at a poker game and

(08:14):
he's like with another show and they're like, are you getting
out of there in less than 3? So yeah.
That's I should have probably picked a more comfortable chair.
Sorry my friend, we can take peebreaks and get different
furniture, it's all. Right pillows behind my back.
Before we do our initial thoughts on this one here, just

(08:34):
a quick bit of house Cape keeping.
If you haven't already, please make sure wherever you're
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(08:55):
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(09:17):
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(09:40):
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at patreon.com/pod of the Pendulum.
And that is it for housekeeping.So let's go to our initial
thoughts on this one and Sean asour guest, our first time guest,

(10:05):
do you want to kind of give us like just your overview of like
how you fell into wrong turn Andthen this particular entry like
is this you mentioned loving sci-fi horror?
Like, are you also like a backwoods horror guy as well?
Well, of course I my first tastewas the original Wrong Turn,
which I enjoyed. You know, a big Elijah Dushku

(10:27):
fan. I'm also a big fan of Lindy
Booth. I know that's a very back then
that was a very specific fandom because she really hadn't done
much except she did Wrong Turn and she did Dawn of the Dead
remake right around the same time.
I'm kind of obsessed. She was.
In another one too, wasn't she in one called like the woods or
something and it had like a Bruce Campbell like blip like if

(10:49):
you like you'll miss him kind ofrole.
She was in. I feel like she.
Was in. It was.
Yeah, she was in Cry Wolf, I believe, the one that was made
by Katie Couric's nephew way back then.
Yeah. And, you know, I'm sort of
obsessed with Canadian content and like that look of Canadian,
of science fiction shows that you can just tell were shot in

(11:11):
Vancouver or Toronto, and she's Canadian, so she sort of made
the rounds of everything that was shot up there.
But yeah, wrong turn, which I feel like it's definitely like
the first taste is free. And now we're sort of hooked
into the rest of them. And unwillingly, I would say I'm

(11:31):
not a huge fan of this film. The the main reason I jumped at
the chance to talk about it is it's the one film the franchise
so far that has any queer content in it.
And you know, I, like I said, like you said, I created and Co
edited queer horror film guide and you know, we were, it's like

(11:51):
900 films that all have queer content in them, horror films
that have queer content. So this is the one that popped
up. So it's the one that I know the
best, unfortunately. Oh gosh, how how I I just feel
like this is the laziest one of the entire franchise.
It just feels like the the script over part. 3.

(12:11):
Over Part 3 because this one feels like the script is a
pamphlet. It's it's not a script.
It is a placeholder between times that we kill people and
I'm like AI like a good set themup and knock them down.
I absolutely feel like that is aperfectly legitimate form of
horror movie. But this like there's 14 people

(12:34):
in it or something. I refuse to learn their names
because they don't care if I know their names.
Like it's just the most generic like they have a mold and they
filled it and then they were like pulled out an actor and
they're like, all right, put blonde hair on this one.
Like it's just the the laziest of lazy generic horror movies.

(12:54):
But that being said, it has 2 bonuses, 2 pluses in my column
for me. One, the kills are pretty great.
They're always trying to top theEmmanuel shrieky kill and the
first one where she gets killed in the tree and with the, the,
the, the, I can't remember, it'sa hatchet or a shovel that cuts

(13:19):
her head in half and then her body falls out of the tree.
They're they're they're always trying to best that one, which
they never do, but they're pretty good in this one and
spoiler alert, there's two lesbians in this film and they
make good use of them if you're a straight guy who likes to
watch lesbians and they almost make it not.
Argue that. Right.

(13:40):
I'll advocate for the straight guys.
You know, I'm a gay dude, but I can appreciate pretty ladies
that kiss each other and they yeah, they almost make it.
And then they are killed in the film's best kill.
So if you're gonna go out, go out like these two pretty
lesbians. Yeah.

(14:00):
So I mean, that's my initial thought.
I found myself scrolling on my phone between the kill scenes
during the rewatch. I mean, I watched them as they
come out because I'm a completist.
But yeah, I felt, and I don't want to completely shit on it
because there is some artistry at work here and I know they

(14:22):
shot it in a very short amount of time.
And as a person who's made filmsin like 9 days, I get it.
And I also think that they they literally said it in the winter
so they could have that last kill.
Are we allowed to like really give specifics on these things?
I don't want to like. You can do Yeah, we spoiled.
This is a we assume that either people have seen the movie or

(14:46):
they're like, I am never gonna watch this movie but I enjoy the
witty banter. If someone is upset that we
spoiled wrong turn for bloody beginning wearing your, I'm
sorry, that's on you, right? Right, right.
That's more about you than priorities, right?
If you so, yeah. That is with all this stuff
going on in the world right now.If spoiling a 2011 direct to

(15:08):
video 4th franchise entry in a franchise is what gets you up,
if that's what radicalizes you, then we have some big problems.
I found out the lesbian dies. I'm storming the capital so they
die in the they die in the best way.
They they get killed, they get decapitated on a snowmobile in

(15:31):
the snow unexpectedly near the very end, Which by the way, Tim
Sullivan did in one of his 2001 Maniacs movies.
And I can't remember if he did that first or not.
But yeah, it's the best kill. But it really feels like the
entire film is built is is set in a snowy climate.
So they could get these ladies on a snowmobile and chop their

(15:51):
heads off. But I'm thankful for that
because like, we don't get a lotof snow bound.
We don't get enough snow bound horror.
Yeah, winter. Horror is not, as is not
utilized nearly enough. No, I mean, there's physical
production reasons for that, butsure.
I'm trying to even think like one of the bloody one of the
urban was the urban legends Bloody Mary?

(16:13):
Was that set in the snow? I feel like that was a snowy 1.
I don't. Think so, because that was like
a film. No, that's final cut.
I you know, it's been so long since I I've memory hold Urban
Legends 3, I haven't. I haven't seen anything past the
first. One, we've covered it here for
the show and it's like my brain only has so much space, so I've

(16:34):
immediately forgotten it. So as as the person who have
said like this is the Citizen Kane of cannibal film set in an
asylum, what are your initial? Thoughts.
I mean, I wish I had something that witty to say about it, but
I do actually really love this one.
This is my second favorite out of the franchise and believe it

(16:57):
or not, the original is like #4 or five For me.
It is not even, it does not. You know what?
No, it doesn't even make the topfour.
Whoa. So Yep, Nope, I am.
I am all about the sequels in this series and this one.
I tell you, I'm going to argue with the best kill because
Fondue. What's his name?

(17:18):
I wrote his name down because I wasn't going to remember his
name either. Daniel.
Liver and onions and Fondue Daniel that is the best kill in
the movie. I have seen this movie several
times and it still is so intenseto me that I just sit there with
my hands gripping my palms because it's so like them just

(17:39):
slicing off his skin and making cannibal fondue.
Chef's kiss. Literally I this movie I after
three like I watched these all chronologically over the summer,
like over the course of like twoor three days like so I just
back-to-back. There was no break.

(17:59):
Did you do the? Summary.
No, you know what? And I had fun with it, but 3 is
so bad, 3 is like atrociously bad that I had no hopes for this
one. I was like, oh great, it's gonna
be garbage in the snow. Funsies.
Nope, I was I was so happy to bewrong.

(18:21):
I I was thrilled, you know, after coming off the high of
seeing 2 because 2 is my favorite 3 broke my heart in
like 1000 pieces. I was like, what the hell is
this garbage? No, this franchise is going in
the shitter like what happened? And then this movie and I was
like, oh, hey, OK, I'm, I'm, I'mhere with this.

(18:43):
Like I, I, I love that they moved it indoors because the
other entries, they run around the forest for the whole time.
It's kind of like found footage where you can only see somebody
running through the forest screaming Craig, you know, so
many times before it becomes repetitive.
So I like that this moved inside.
I like that there's snow and it's not summer or spring.

(19:07):
I the the kitchen set and I'll we can get more into that later
is a good set piece. So I I think that this movie did
enough differently to keep the franchise fresh.
Devon, I know you'd like to takea moment as the wrong Turn 3
defender after like watching it last night, if you want to take

(19:31):
a minute and do that. And then your initial thoughts
on this one. So this is going to be 1 where I
just start banging my head I think against the keyboard.
Oh, I know that's all right. Yeah, because it's one of the
ones if I would have watched this sooner, I would have made
myself would have made myself available for that recording.
But yeah, because I back-to-backthree and four yesterday.

(19:53):
And so So what I'll say is according to Sarah, you know,
because of like the ride from coming from three 3 is very
important to this franchise because.
It like knocks it down and puts expectations in the dirt, so you
can really only go up from three.
So it's kind of important in that way.

(20:13):
I thought 3 being like who? Who would have thought?
Wrong turn prison break movie. Hey, at least that one's outside
in the woods, unlike this one. I'm sorry, Sarah, like this
movie 4 is too much inside, not enough snow.
I think I got false promises in this movie, but I thought three,

(20:34):
you know what, I don't know, it had a weird kind of charm to it
having Chavez be the like kind of secondary human antagonist
amongst it and it just being a three finger, just like 1 V like
tenning in the woods. I was like, I don't know, I had
fun with three, not going to lie, like even amongst the the
janky CGI, I thought there was some fun kills on that one

(20:55):
because, because what I've noticed with this one and with
three and this one, Declan, he is, he is pro the cannibals.
He's team cannibals. The first two movies are pro
human. He's like, Nah, Nah, Nah, he's
he's pro cannibals, which is, you know, which is if that's
your bag and that's what you come to this franchise for, then
at this point, that's kind of what's keeping you in it.

(21:18):
I have a separate list amongst my like various franchise
rankings for specifically for 4th entries, because I think
it's always a very an interesting, it's a it's a
pivotal point for a franchise like, OK, what are we doing?
Are we going to do a soft rebootlike Halloween or are we going
to continue the story like Hellraiser or are we going to do
a prequel, which often happens in this number four slot.

(21:42):
And you guys know me, I love a prequel.
I'm, you know, pair of paranormal activity three the
first purge. I love my prequels.
This one unfortunately, does notgive me the prequel goodness
that I want, you know, because since this franchise has next to
no continuity, there's no Eastereggs or anything to really pull

(22:04):
from. They add a little bit of extra
back story with like, OK, they not only, you know, got mutated
from the, the radiated water, they were also put in this
sanatorium, which is like not only like it's weird because
they say it's not an insane asylum.
They say it's a sanatorium whereit's like they isolate people
with diseases. But then in that breakout scene

(22:26):
at the beginning, they are like depicted like this is an insane
asylum. I don't know.
So anyways, but so it really adds that.
And then we have like these likethree brothers, but it doesn't
really give us any extra. It's like, well, we kind of
empathize with them a little bitlike 2 movies ago already.
And they kind of did it better in two.
So it didn't really give me that, like, satisfying

(22:47):
prequelness. I would have also rather them
stick with the teenage versions of the of the brothers.
But I don't know. Yeah, I kind of agree with Sean
that this movie address is. Yeah, we have this amorphous
BLOB of a friend group. Couldn't tell any of them apart.
Don't know any of the guys namesapart from each other, you know,

(23:09):
So it's like you just have this amorphous BLOB to kill them all,
which OK, fine. Like again, like that's what
we've seen in three and four is no survivors.
Like we're just we're going to give you all these people.
So we just have this giant cast of people just to kill them all
and that's fine. But it takes like the first half
of the movies pretty snoozy before we really get to that.
But then it does get better, at least for me, once we do get out

(23:32):
into the snow and it's like, OK,we're in the wrong turn groove
now. So I don't know.
This movie kind of felt sauceless, felt a little stiff.
I don't like how much time we spent inside and didn't really
give me the prequel goodies I wanted.
So I will also watch 3 over thisone personal.
Yeah, when you sent that messageon the Slack yesterday, like, I

(23:56):
don't know, guys, I think I'm liking three more than Part 2.
No, I said it. I said it's tied with two.
OK, and but but no let's. Go to the tape keep.
Going 2 is slightly better, 2 isslightly better.
I said I like 3 better than one,which I do.
I don't really like 1 so. They kill a dog in three they.

(24:18):
Do I know? I know.
That was a bummer. Is automatically bottom.
That was a bummer. They killed a dog I I put
unnecessarily as well. I put my phone down instead of
responding for a few minutes because I just didn't feel like
I was at a place where I could respond in a way that would be
respectful. It's my favorite thing to do is

(24:39):
just set the slack on fire. That's my it's my favorite thing
to do. And I almost like texted other
Co hosts I'm like is Devon fucking with me right now?
He must be. Is he OK?
He's. Messing with me.
He's messing with me because Arielle, who's not with us
today, like she did promise me like look, three's bad. 4 is a
lot more fun. Like you're going to enjoy 4.

(25:01):
And about like 15 minutes into Part 4, I did message her.
I'm like, all right, I'm diggingthis a lot more.
Like I thought this was a solid rebound.
It's not ahead of Part 2 for me,but it might be in my top three
for overall rankings. I really like the reboot from
2020. One that's, well, that's my #3
actually. So my ranking is 2 for reboot,

(25:24):
so like and it's my top three. And this is no, this is a series
that doesn't have like a stand out, you know, like classic
entry. This is not like we are in, you
know, the Exorcist territory where you have like 1, you know,
pinnacle of horror and then you have like a bunch of like also

(25:45):
rans like these are all kind of like meat and potatoes types of
of films or they're just like straight to video with the
exception of the 1st. Come here.
Come get your slop. Here you go.
You know you want this nasty, greasy slop.
That's what. This, there's, there's
something. I mean, if we're if we're going
to be technical, this is the this is like the early aughts

(26:06):
and the tail end of the early aughts.
So it's come get your gore, comeget your torture porn.
Come on, you know you want your mean spirited horror come.
Get and they know they will get people like us.
Like Mike was in the in the Slack channel.
He was like, he was like, oh, you just skipped 3.
And I was like, never. I was like, I don't skip entries
in this, OK? Whenever I started, I'm in it.

(26:26):
And this franchise knows that there's people like us like
that. They're like they're gonna watch
all seven of these, you little sickos.
Wait till you get to which one is the one with Doug Bradley?
Is that 5? I think it's 6.
Is it 5 or 6? Five is that.
Is it the one with the reality show?
No, that's no the reality show's2.

(26:47):
Two. OK, see this is how generic.
Doug Bradley's in five. Doug Bradley's in five.
I have to say that I I'm not a huge fan of the series in
general. The first one, I think to your
point about no standout entries,the first film in this franchise
feels like a sequel. It feels like there's already

(27:10):
been another one that was reallygreat and now we're doing now we
have Lindy Booth and Eliza Dushku, right, like it's and
Jeremy, whatever the fuck his name is, I can't remember, but
Sisto Sisto right, It feels and there's no grounding to it, if
that makes sense. Like and I think that's in
retrospect. What what this friend, what the

(27:30):
people who own the like control this IP have not done and into
their detriment is they didn't ground the franchise at the
beginning and then be meticulousabout the lore moving forward.
Like if you look at the saw franchise, they are fucked like
they are meticulous about like bringing people back and how it

(27:53):
all connects and everything likethat.
This feels like there's a new crew every single time.
Like the people that are on the IP they're.
Pretty much what? Right, like the fact that Declan
is except. For yeah, this is supposed to be
the Declan. This is supposed to be the crew
from the first one, right? Because there's only three of
them in the first one. But then but then 2 is just this

(28:13):
like giant family and we're like, where are they all?
Coming from, I think that feels that way because the first one
is the only one that had a theatrical release.
So when you're making straight to DVD sequels nobody cares
about, you know they want to make movies that if you want to
come in fresh at entry 4, you could watch this movie without

(28:34):
really having any prior knowledge of the franchise.
And you can do that with any single one of the movies.
And they just do that with threefinger.
They're just like, as long as weput one in that everybody will
recognize each time, they're like, we'll be solid.
And then it's like, hey, there'sour boy, OK?
I don't even, I don't even thinkthat matters if you're, if I'm
going to be honest. Even for direct to video movies

(28:55):
though, like going through like the five disc Blu-ray set so
far, like all of them. And I kind of missed this day of
like physical media where unlessyou're buying, you know, like a
boutique label that is going to go out of their way to kind of
like pack it with features. Like even this disc had like a
commentary on it, a making of featurette, a bunch of deleted

(29:19):
scenes, a blooper reel. So it was like, yes, we know
it's like direct to video, but you're getting like a ton for
your buck. Like at the amount of actual
care in the commentary. Like I watched the commentary
for it for like the second viewing for this and it was like
a good commentary, like a lot offun.
Not gonna say it was like the most informative in the world,

(29:41):
but you could tell that like Declan O'Brien knew what he was
making and had a lot of. Fun, you know, Yeah, that's what
I'll give him. He at least through the two
entries of his that I've seen sofar, Yeah.
He might not be like, you know, the best director or writer or
anything, but like, he likes, helikes doing these.
Like I can at least like watch these movies and be like, you

(30:03):
know what? He's I can tell he's like not
just like, you know, be collecting a paycheck.
Like I like I feel like he enjoys doing this.
I feel like I can feel that through the movie.
So I'll give him credit there. I'll.
But I will say this, dialogue isfree.
Dialogue costs nothing. There's no like I'm a writer by

(30:23):
trade. Like not just like my book and
everything, but like, I've been a screenwriter.
I've written for television. I'm a playwright.
Dialogue is free. And this this film to me is like
the perfect example of why writers are hates Hollywood, why

(30:43):
we went on strike because everybody thinks they can do it.
Everybody thinks they can write a movie.
And so they're like, I'll just scribble something down.
And now, oh, but here's these great kill scenes and it's just
laziness. And that's what really drives me
crazy about this movie is that it takes 0% more effort to write
interesting dialogue than it does to fill the space between

(31:06):
kill scenes. And so I don't give Declan
credit because I've seen that behind the scenes stuff and I've
seen him say, you know, basically putting priority on
the kill scenes. So that to me is not, I mean,
that's a person, that's a traffic cop, that's a person who
can get on set and knows how to call action and knows how to

(31:28):
block actors and knows how to like use his 16 days and his
budget well. But that's not genius
filmmaking. That is a thing that puts more
product on the shelves that is mediocre that we have to swim
upstream through to get to the actual good stuff.
And of course, everybody likes what they like.
So I don't mean to like shit on people who like this film.

(31:49):
But think anyone is comparing Declan O'Brien with like Martin
Scorsese or Orson Welles? Like, I don't think that's the
comparison. Right, but he could be like Jim
Winorsky in his best days. But not everyone can write like
Elaine May either. You know what I mean?
Like it's. Just right.
Then don't do it. Then don't do it.

(32:10):
If you can't write, don't do it.Backwoods horror, I don't want
good. Like the fun of backwoods
cannibalism horror is not good scripts.
It's not like I'm not watching those to be like, oh, let me go
watch the Citizen Kane. Like if I want something like
that, I'm going to go watch raw or I'm going to go watch, you
know, fresh or something that ismeant to be somewhat more

(32:35):
elevated. And I don't mean elevated
horror, I just mean elevated from that.
When I'm watching a wrong turn movie, I want to see fondue.
I want to see like cannibalism badasses, you know, fighting
each other. And I I just like.
I don't want, I don't want good scripts on this, do you?

(32:56):
Truly not do you truly not want good dialogue?
Like would you if this was like written by somebody?
Like I look at Eli Roth, which we can have problems with him as
a person, but like Thanksgiving,the movie was like a standard
slasher, but like fun and engaging because it like.
I found it to be poorly, poorly written and misogynistic as

(33:18):
hell. But you know, I, I, I hate Eli
Roth. I think he's a talentless hack
who copies everybody like he. His writing may be good because
he copied a good writer. Well, he also green Inferno.
Is I mean can't green inferno isCannibal Holocaust like but set
in a modern time? Like he's not original.

(33:40):
He's he just copies everyone else and then throws some gore
in and then makes it slightly misogynistic or racist and calls
it a day. Like I, you know I.
I'm curious to know what you think about Quentin Tarantino in
that context, because he also islike the homager of homagers,
right? Homage is different than copying

(34:03):
something and trying to pass it off as your own.
Eli Roth is like the kid who copied your homework, but said I
he wrote it. Quentin Tarantino's like, hey, I
was inspired by her homework. I admit it.
Interesting. There's there's a difference in
that. I actually never thought because
yeah, I look at or, you know, again, I'm not going to go to

(34:24):
the mat for Eli Roth's character, but his work, I've
never found him to to be anything other than, you know, I
am trying basically what QuentinTarantino is doing.
Like I am trying to work in thisgenre and you know, homage to
the greats. Green Green Inferno.

(34:46):
I can't really defend that movie.
Again. There's a lesbian in it, but
they make her shit herself before they eat her one.
Big swing he took away from whathe usually does.
Well, maybe a couple like Knock Knock and I haven't seen Knock
Knock. But it's different from his
typical fair house with a clock in the walls.
Like when he did a kids movie with a name Jack Black, and I
think it was Cate Blanchett. I could be wrong.

(35:08):
And like the first half that we saw was actually very strong.
And then my daughter started like projectile vomiting popcorn
and we had to leave and we've never finished the movie.
But like the first half I'm like, this is really strong.
I hear what you're my thing is. And I I don't want to stereotype

(35:29):
horror fans of which I am one, but I feel like the person who
would reach for wrong turn off their shelf or would like rent
it for 4 bucks isn't coming to this.
Would almost be upset if like the dialogue was incredible at
the expense of the kill scenes and the gore.

(35:50):
Like the only reason I'm watching wrong turn 4, it's
because like it's the premise ofthe show we cover every like
there's never would have been a reason for me to pull this and
it was Ari's pick for a franchise.
I feel like the person that would immediately gravitate
towards something like this. And I I could be wrong, but I
feel like they're in it for the kill scenes.

(36:13):
And like a director that can like use those 19 days to like
block those well and shoot them well at the expense of, I mean,
the dialogue here as it is, is not.
And there's some stuff that it'sso bad it becomes hilarious when
it shouldn't be, which we'll talk about.

(36:34):
But I see what you're saying. As a as a writer, I could see
you being like, this is offensive to your profession.
It's like, it's like I find Doctor Loomis in the Halloween
movies, like offensive to my profession because like, you
don't shoot your patients 6 times as a form of treatment.
Like that's just not, it's just,it's bad for, it's bad for

(36:57):
therapy, you know? How many times do you shoot your
patients? What's the acceptable number?
Recap. Them twice, give them a warning
shot, you nick them a little bitand then so.
And wait, I I have to say though, there there was not
entirely bad writing. There was a great line which I
actually wrote down in my notes where they talk about turning

(37:18):
Porter into a porterhouse. And I'm sorry, but if that line
did not make you laugh, you haveno soul.
Because that I was, that's like the second time I've heard it.
And I still was rolling on the floor at how silly it was.
Like, if you're not throwing, ifyou don't have cannibalism puns
in your film. I mean, are you a good writer at

(37:42):
that point? I I feel like I don't know.
To your point, I think that is funny.
And I do. I want to give props to the
actors who again swimming upstream against this script,
one of whom, again, I don't knowtheir names because I refuse to
learn them. The gentleman who sees his
friend being eaten as a fondue has to burst into a room and say
they're eating him and some sortof fondue and like, do that with

(38:05):
a straight face and be scared. I'm like, good for you, good for
you, Canadian actor. Well, I think we're kind of
already into the movie. So I think with the background
stuff, which we usually do separate, I'll just roll it in
because there's only a few little bits here anyway.
So let's keep this going becauseI already feel we're into it in

(38:31):
terms of like choices they made.I've I found like the the
starting point of this film, like that first opening scene
immediately surpassed anything in the previous entry and set
the tone for like what I was going to get into, including the
fact that you're using like Strauss's black blue Danube,

(38:52):
Danube as your choice of music. I thought that was like a super
playful choice to make, especially against all that
violence and chaos. And what it made me think back
on was I could Part 3. It starts with like the folks
that are like white water rafting and the music they use.
There was kind of this intense kind of ominous music that to me

(39:16):
it didn't fit with like what theaction was on screen.
And it already let me know like this is going to be a super edge
lordy try hard horror movie. Just from that choice of music
in the start of Part 3, We're here.
You have like all of these escaped convicts breaking out

(39:36):
and it's like, and it could havebeen like the soundtrack.
Hue could have been what we would come to expect from a
horror movie, but instead you have this light, playful piece
of classical music that is like,OK, I'm not taking myself too
seriously when watching this movie I kind of know what I'm in
for right from the outset. I.
Was just going to say if that's that's actually like 1 funny

(40:00):
because like one of my like least favorite tropes in a
movie. It's like, OK, let's put some
classical music behind a like crazy scene.
And it's like, but at the same time it's like, hey, like like
you said, like it at the same time, I think there is something
that it like triggers in your brain just to like insert it in
there and do it, you know? So it's like, you know, it's one
thing I I can't stand, especially like when it's like

(40:21):
one of these kind of songs, but it's whatever.
But like, I think it does, like you said, like it at least, you
know, can, you know, click something in somebody's brain
like what they're going to be doing.
But again, I wish we would have stayed with the the teenage
versions of the of the brothers,because I think they they, they
like kind of had a a different energy to them.
And I think it would have been interesting to like kind of see

(40:44):
them when they're like still like kind of figuring out their
like styles and everything, you know.
But then they like, they like dothis like pre like this portion
and then they like go forward, like, I don't know, like a few
like, like then we go to like early adult versions of them.
So I, I do wish they again, like, I wish we would have spent

(41:04):
more time like with them, like actually as like the teenagers
like kind of honing their cannibal kill skills.
Well, and also what's interesting about this film and
the early, the, the prequel, this of the, you know, beginning
of the film is not only are theycannibals, but they, they
practice auto cannibalism, whichwe have not really seen in the

(41:27):
other films. And so I, I found that to be
like an interesting because likewhen you think of hillbilly
horror, backwoods horror and thecannibals, it's always them
eating other people, not really them eating, not even family
members, but themselves. Like, you know, when they're
serving, it's, they go look for other people.
They're not like, Oh, let me chop off my hand and eat my hand

(41:48):
it. But this they, and then they,
they give that whole like, Oh, well, because they're inbred,
they can't feel pain. So guys just chomping on his own
little fingers, you know, and that's how he became three
fingers. And I think getting that lore as
someone who's really big into cannibalism and horror and

(42:10):
gastro horror, like I love that.Like I love getting Gastrolore
as it were and so. Did it also kind of feel like
it's men like to anybody else like this, like a little intro
to them? Also felt like I like the intro
like a superhero movie. Like, like, you see that one?
He filed his teeth down to make him, you know, flat, you know,

(42:30):
whatever, like a saw and just like, OK, so what's the next
guy's power? And they're like, he's got three
fingers. It's like, well, all right.
Like it just like felt like a like a weird like kind of like
some like independent like gritty comic book like
introduction to the three brothers.

(42:51):
I love that there's not one piece of dialogue in the
prologue that doesn't give us a piece of information.
Right. Like literally every sentence is
expository. You know?
He did this to himself. He did this to himself and my
favorite is the the the Chekhov's gun.
Here is the Chekhov's door release where literally the

(43:13):
actor is tasked withholding his at the door facing the camera
and saying we can let them all out all at the same time, but
only in an emergency like a fire.
It's like, I wonder what's goingto happen.
I feel like the prologue settinghangs on two things. 1A subtitle

(43:37):
that says we're in 1974 and the second being the female doctor's
dress which is the 1970s dress. But literally there's nothing
else in the prologue that says 1974.
Nothing. Nothing.
And that dress has to do a lot of work.
And I, you know, maybe it's because I'm a homosexual, but
like, her dress was the first thing I clocked like a medium.

(43:59):
Like, wow, that's really nice, Yeah.
It seemed like appropriate work attire for the Santa.
It seemed like she was ready to go to Studio 54.
Right. Everybody else is in white
jackets. Literally everybody else is in
white jackets. And she's like, you know, headed
out to the discotheque afterwards.

(44:23):
I also realized as we're talkingabout this, they put all three
of them in the same cell. Yes.
Why? Like what?
Again, because these are not prisoners.
They even say that at one point.He goes, he goes, I know what
you're thinking, but they're notprisoners.
Instead of just letting her say it again, like just everything
being exposition, but like they're they're not prisoners.

(44:45):
Technically, they're just this is like for housing like.
But I guess even in that still vein, if they're all three sick,
you wouldn't put them all in thesame cell together.
So I guess my logic is still. Busted there.
Do you know who else says they're not prisoners?
Prisons. You know, I mean, that's also
who I know what you're thinking then.
You'd be right. I think you have to also kind of

(45:08):
assume that this sanitarium is maybe not on the up and up all
the way because like, you see this a lot in horror where the,
you know, patients are mistreated and they're kept in,
you know, multiple people in a room when they shouldn't be.
And I think that's that's sort of illustrating the mistreatment

(45:30):
of these three, which furthered their descent into madness.
And I forget who said it earlierabout this movie feeling like
they want you to root for the cannibals versus the, you know,
the the protagonists that we aren't committing to remembering
names except for Daniel cause offondue.

(45:52):
They want you to remember the cannibals.
And I think that that's why we get the X-Men superpowers of
each because they they are this is this is Declan telling us,
hey, I want you to remember who these people are, not who the
protagonists are. And we're supposed to feel a
little sympathetic and how they're they're, you know, using

(46:14):
the electrocution on the female doctor because presumably they
have had this treatment. So they have been mistreated,
which could have led to some of this behavior.
Oh yeah, we see the teens watching it later.
They they find the film of it whenever they do it.
But yeah, like I I love again, like they they that was my other

(46:35):
pro of three was I was like, yo,like they made me a fan of three
fingers. The fact that it like it was
just like, look, this motherfucker go and I was like,
hell yeah. So like Declan again, at least
he kind of again does like kind of show his hand that he does
prefer the boys. It's just then after this
opening, though, we get like theyou know, it's like, OK, cool.

(46:56):
Like we, we get the prequel opening, but then like we just
spend like 30 minutes of this like friend group that again,
like their faces all the same. Like literally all of them
besides the the the black lesbian and the Asian lesbian.
Everybody else, it's just a person.
Just that guy, that gal over there.

(47:17):
So. Can you be a horror trope
though? I have you ever.
I would argue that this is a bighorror trope.
I wish it was just like too muchof this then, you know, like we
hang out like a lot of them, like partying in wheelchairs and
like. Running around, I would tell you
my bloody My Bloody Valentine, the Ogi know.
Everybody loves it. I argue every time that the
biggest flaw of that movie is you can't tell anybody apart.

(47:40):
They all look the same. They all have.
You can't tell like now, My Bloody Valentine.
Movie The movie. The short round super Canadian
dude. I don't know about that.
But but they're fairly, most of them are fairly unmemorable.
Like you can easily swap them and get confused, which is where
My Bloody Valentine 3D actually kind of excels because they they

(48:03):
cut back the cast a little bit and you can tell who's who.
But this is like horror thing. Like I think you're again, it's
that whole you're not supposed to care so much about the
protagonists. You want them to feel expendable
because there isn't writing to make everybody feel.
That's a big that's big at this point in horror as well.

(48:25):
Like by the 2000s all the way through like the mid of the
decade. It's like we don't really give a
shit whatsoever about the characters.
Like you're coming to watch people get killed.
It's kind of like what happened with like a lot of the Elm
Street movies and Friday the 13th as they got like later in
their run. It's like you're here for the

(48:46):
killer and you're not here for the cast.
And I think that's a detriment. And it's like, that's not a
feature that definitely is a bugfor me in horror.
Like I even if I love the killerin the movie, I still want to
have characters that I'm rootingfor to kind of escape their
fate. I think the movie is like is

(49:07):
just trying to do it both ways, because I don't care that
they're all homologous because they are all just here to die.
We see that that's exactly what's gonna happen.
There's gonna be no survivors inthis, which is totally fine.
It's just like, and I'm not evenone to like complain about
runtimes usually, but this is like 93 minutes with credits and
you feel like every minute of it, at least for me.

(49:28):
So it's like, I feel like again,like if we're gonna just not
take the time to actually write out like the interesting
character dynamics and spend again, it's like 35 minutes of
like just hanging with these folks that again, I can't by the
end of that 35 minutes, we stilldon't know their names or like
they try to set up some like little, oh, this person's with

(49:49):
this person. They're just all paired off
together except for the one single gal.
Like they're just so they're just like they don't really do
anything. So it's like again, like, hey,
make this a a 77 minute like real, like, you know, lean
machine, you know, is mainly what I'm getting at.
I don't I don't disagree. I like as much as I like this

(50:10):
movie. It does.
There are parts of the runtime that you can feel it a little
bit and I I definitely I'm I'm ahuge proponent of the 70 minute
horror movie. Like that is one of my favorite.
Like if you can make a set, if you can make a 60 to 70 minute
horror movie and make it good. Looking at you Host, because

(50:31):
Host is a perfect example of a under 60 minute horror movie
that still scares the hell out of me every time.
Not a fan. Whether you like found footage
or not, I. That movie scares I.
Love found footage. I am not a fan, although I did
screen it for like a Halloween party for like my daughter's
friends, Like so for like young teen women, they were like very,

(50:55):
you could hear them downstairs screaming at certain parts.
And I'm like, OK, this just happened.
So it does work. It just wasn't for me.
I guess that means I'm a young teen woman because I.
Really love them. Right.
I was like, oh, are you calling me young?
Why, thank you. I.
Mean, I yeah, I wouldn't if I could just chime in on the
protagonist thing. I think it's interesting that at

(51:16):
during this chunk of horror era,it turned from like, if you
think again of like the slasher movie where we're introducing
all the characters that you killed.
I look at the Friday the 13th series and again, with a tiny
bit more effort, even though those characters are like stock
characters and they don't reallyhave a character, they have an
attitude all the way up through,you know, Jason X They, they,

(51:46):
they endeavour to make them likeable, right?
Like we, we want to like them. And then we're sad when they are
killed or not sad, but like we feel something.
But then there was that turn in the mid 2000s where it was like,
let's make all the characters assholes.
Right. And you get the you got like the
Jason Mewes clone in Freddy versus Jason and Brandy's

(52:09):
character. And sorry to jump in.
No, no worries. Yeah, it just it it it is an
interesting turn of turn for me because again, if we just you,
you always wonder why are these people hanging out together?
Like, what if they're sniping ateach other and it doesn't seem
fun and somebody's the asshole? Like I don't hang out with those
people. Like I go on trips with people I

(52:29):
don't hang out with like jerks. Yeah.
So it would just it would take so little.
And, you know, I wouldn't want them to have good dialogue
because I wouldn't want Sarah tonot like the film.
But but if they were literally just not shitheads, I would be
1000% more invested in this filmand I didn't.
Think these people were shitheads though.
Like I actually made a note. Yeah.

(52:51):
I mean, I'm not I thought they were kind of like bland.
They were like definitely not the most dynamic group.
But even this like the our introduction to them is you have
like basically 2 roommates having sex with their partners,
which is not something you see in a horror movie.
And then like one of the other roommates kind of walks in and
she doesn't like canker sex shame them.

(53:13):
Like they all laugh about it. And that to me right away was
like, that's a breath of fresh air because that honestly, that
character that is not getting something like divine again, I
cannot remember the names of anyof them, but that's usually the
one that comes in that is like, oh, this is disgusting.
You're all a bunch of perverts. This is gross.
And they all I mean, I think. She does call them slut bags,

(53:35):
but it's not. Like she's just like, she's just
like why right now? She was like, why not?
Why are you doing this? She was like just why right now?
Which which was a funny. A.
Fun setup to this friend group, but then like after this,
there's kind of nothing else to them.
And I kind of, I think that's what I was disappointed.
I was like, OK, maybe we are going to get this like what a
little a little Poly friend group in 2011.

(53:57):
Oh, Declan, you're ahead of the game.
But then no, it's like we have like this like kind of set up
and then the rest of it is like they do just like, oh, all the
girls hate all the guys, ha ha, ha.
And it's like, are these middle schoolers like what are we
doing? I don't know.
It didn't feel like that the character to me like that you
were just mentioning Sean like they one that's most emblematic

(54:19):
of like that trend of like we hate these fuckers is literally
named Chad in the Friday the 13th remake.
And as it's it's Chad, like the blonde hair, the one who's like
your tits are spectacular and he's like cheating on his
girlfriend and he's got like thehouse on the lake and nobody
really wants to be there for him.

(54:40):
They're just like he has a supernice house on the lake and
that's why we're here and he's such a Dick.
Like that to me is like your prototype, like he is like the
Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, like that is the, you know, top of
the pinnacle for that type of character here.
These characters like they're boring.
Like there's no doubt about it. Like they're very boring.

(55:02):
But I don't watch this thinking like the intent stand on each
other and like they actually do try to help each other out as
best they can, at least so that.Except for the one.
Except for the 1 gal like. I who's like the name?
But she's like, she's like I we're let's vote, let's vote to
go save this guy. I vote no.

(55:23):
And everyone's just like, are you crazy?
Like. Right, I since we've touched on
it, can we talk a little bit more about that four way sex
scene? Do it like so again, I'm not
that Privy to straight relationsand what the young kids are

(55:44):
doing today, but do the do the straight people and the gay
people all fuck together in the same room?
Like is that a thing that happens cuz that?
I just couldn't. Believe it.
I couldn't believe it. Oh, I in LA my friend.
Oh yes, totally, I know many. Of you, I live in LA.
I know many. Oh, me too.

(56:04):
Well, we'll have to go. You'll have to come come to get
drink at my bar. Absolutely.
But I mean, I know people, yes, because I learned on the dating
app field of the term heterocurious.
So some people are like, I'm notopposed to the idea of some gay

(56:25):
stuff, but I'm not quite there myself.
I don't know, maybe that's what was kind of going on with this
friend group because the way it was shot was like, funny.
I didn't realize they were in the.
Same room. It was an L-shaped room L.
Like the? Room was an.
L That's what I was gonna say isthey the like the way that the
wall was was there was definitely like a point like a
90° angle. So I don't think that they were

(56:48):
like beds next to each other like hotel room style.
They were in the same room, but not easily.
Visual right? Like.
Shoot. Coverage.
Who knows? Right.
Well, you can like. Peek around, but you you're not
like doing it right next to each.
Other I should say it wasn't. Another movie.
Too, It wasn't a four way technically.

(57:09):
I guess it's more that they wereeach having sex with their
partners. The two couples were together,
both having sex in the same roomat the same time.
That to me, like if it was a four way, I do know those
people, but yeah, it just felt weird that they were and and.
Did you do that in Texas Chainsaw Massacre?
The beginning. Oh.

(57:31):
Like is that like did they have like 2 couples having sex
simultaneously? But like in the there is another
horror movie that has something like this where they're like in
the same room but not. No, because it's it's not
because they have two separate hotel rooms.
It's the two brothers. And like, they're like, he's
going to avoid the draft and they're in that kind of dingy.

(57:52):
Motel. But there's another movie that
oh God, it's killing me. It'll come to me like, you know,
at like 2:00 in the morning, I'll be like, this was it?
But I feel like this is like been done in other horror movies
as well where they're like sharing rooms but not sharing
partners. Right.
Yeah, and this gives me the these are college kids vibe,

(58:13):
like that's a big dorm room or shared like campus apartment.
Vibe, right? They're very attractive college
students, very attractive college.
Well, and the black lesbian is from Canada's Next Top Model.
Did not know that. Yeah, I'm a fan of that.
I was a fan of that franchise. So it's like America's Next Top

(58:35):
Model but Canadian? $0.80 on the dollar.
I love that for her. I love that she's one thing.
Also particular is as far as representation as well.
Like not only having a black lesbian, but a very dark skinned
gal as well, which is very important.
And like, she is fucking gorgeous.

(58:56):
Yeah. Easily the hottest person of
this cast in my opinion. Yeah, and she nudes up.
She nudes up. She does.
Yeah, this this movie for 2011 is surprisingly progressive for
the time. Like, right.
Like, this was not a time where you would see that kind of
representation without it being like, this was fairly, you know,

(59:19):
male gazy. But it wasn't, like, at the same
time, it didn't feel gross. Yeah.
Like, it wasn't play. It didn't feel exploitative.
It just felt like this is just her, like having sex and that's
what she does. And it wasn't like there wasn't
emphasis drawn to it. The movies of.
Yeah, they didn't like. I had more sex as the entries go

(59:42):
on Yeah from from the first one,the the most sex that we get is
like a like awkward like almost blowjob and like that's like
really it. But then as these movies kind of
progress, yeah, they have just gotten just more, more smuttier.
Just a little smuttier, because why not for.
Three. Like there's really nothing in
three. No, no, there isn't.
It's about it's about it. There's it's talked about 3 but

(01:00:05):
it but yeah, there's nothing here's.
The thing I'm I feel like 3 feels like it was made to be a
late afternoon sci-fi channel original movie from back in the
day. And so I think that's why it
doesn't really have any sexiness.
The like the characters are all very militant and then it feels
like, it felt like. And then like some like, you

(01:00:28):
know, Dad is just like casually watching this and he's like,
wait, is that a cannibal? Oh, whatever.
This is, you know, action. Yeah.
The one thing? Yeah, it feels like a late
afternoon. Movie like the one thing I
clocked when they introduce her character and they 'cause they
show her from the top up and she's obviously enjoying
herself, I'm like, oh, she's a lesbian Because there's not,

(01:00:48):
they're not going to have in these movies like a guy going
down on a woman. Like because every, every like
dude at that point would take the movie, I'd go, I don't do
that. Which that's why I immediately
clocked it as she is a lesbian. Interesting.
Well, I have you know, I wouldn't be a good gay dude if I

(01:01:09):
didn't point out that yet again,no gay men like we're still.
It's now 2025 and I could I justwrote a book with 1000 entries
in it about queer content in horror movies and I could
probably pull out maybe 5 that have.
Interesting. Two dudes going at it with any
sort of like, explicitness. Have you?

(01:01:32):
And of those five, how many weremainstream?
Oh, none. 00 percent. Yeah, exactly.
Yeah. And you know any man from
Richard Griffin in there? Yeah, many.
OK, because he is a filmmaker I love and I know he's like
strapped for danger. Strapped for danger, too.
He's trying to think what else? He has.
He's a disco. Exorcist I don't think has any

(01:01:53):
like gay male sex in it. But it has naked dudes.
It does. The Gay is the Sun, which is the
nudist nudie cutie UFO mashup that he did, is like a nudist
colony. So it's full frontal nudity
front to back. Yeah, we have a lot of his stuff

(01:02:14):
in the book. I love him.
I'm a big fan. Same here.
Well if we ever do any of his films we need to have you back
on then. We use the screen a ton of his
ton of his films in Boston back when I like we were in like a
monthly screening, so. They all have the best titles
too. Yeah.
Doctor Frankenstein's Wax Museumof the Hungry Dead, like shit
like that, I love it. In a horror wax museum, like all

(01:02:38):
shot in like Count Orlok's wax museum.
Yeah, ton of cool stuff there. I think this is the second time
his films have come up in this. Just covering the wrong turn
series. I I think no, it came up when we
did our exorcist rankings and wedid like other exorcism movies
because of the disco exorcist. All right, I made a note

(01:03:03):
Chekhov's toe zone sign. You show that at the beginning
when they all. I think this speaks to the
writing part of it and the lack thereof is like you show the
snow fall off the sign and I made a note when I was doing my
initial notes on the 1st watch along.
I'm like oh that will come into play later.

(01:03:23):
Like they'll escape get there and the cars will be have been
towed. And that really doesn't play
into it whatsoever aside from three fingers.
Like runs his own towing companyon the side that feels.
Like well, he takes he goes and takes their stuff away at the
end so he tows it away. I don't love that.

(01:03:45):
It does feel like something thatmaybe got cut and like they're
doing pre production and they get to the site and they fall
behind and like, well, what can we get rid of right, The shots
of the cars being pulled or liketaking the entire group out to
shoot a. 60 seconds, what does it matter when none of them are
going to survive anyway? So there's like, who cares if
their cars get taken away? Though I agree they they never

(01:04:07):
made it to the car. But yeah, you can totally tell
that was meant to be like something like they're going to
remember this part and then right.
And then, yeah, it didn't followup on it.
It's not called stolen car for, it's called wrong turn for.
I will say see both Sean and andDevon, what you've said about
like the setting and the beginning of the movie.

(01:04:29):
I would have liked if they kept it in the 70s and instead of
focusing on this 20 something years later and you have like
your session 9 abandoned asylum.Instead of that, you have the
cleanup crew that has to come in.
Like once you discover and I know you can only talk about the
movie you get and not the one you play in your head, but like

(01:04:52):
sending like the crew of of likewhatever team it is that has to
like fix this mess. Because when you come cut to 20
years later, it's only this threesome that are still there.
Like where are all the other patients?
Where are the bodies of all the doctors, nurses, psychiatrists?
Like what happened in like in that in between time that would

(01:05:16):
have been a fun movie to watch, especially cuz like the person
who plays three finger in the beginning is an actual like 10
year old kid. The the other two were like
grown men playing like 10 year olds.
But think it's like Blaine Siperdo like and the commentary
O'Brien is like, yeah, we actually got like a 10 year old

(01:05:38):
to play this role. Like that could have been a lot
of fun to have like 10 year old mutants running about fucking
the shit up and having people trying to like put the catch the
toothpaste back in the tube at that point.
Can you imagine the what the move again, We're not this isn't
the movie we got, but I I thought the same thing is like,

(01:06:00):
why doesn't it stay in 1974? In my first thought was we'll
budget because they would need, you know, period accurate props,
but but I'm contradicting myselfbecause they did it with a dress
like they told me, you know. But wouldn't wear coats, right?
Wouldn't it be cool if the moviewas those 3 mutants now ruling

(01:06:23):
over this asylum and the, and the patients in the asylum like
them creating their clan and like turning all of these people
into the cannibals that they areand just what those dynamics
would be. I mean, again, if there's no
cars, there's no turning wrong in that scenario.
But, you know, if we're just thinking creatively, I don't

(01:06:46):
know, I feel like that would be,well, an interesting movie I
would love to watch. Or I thought it could have been,
I mean, I guess we, we, I mean, we got like a couple of these,
but really not too many until more recently.
Like if like again, like Declan is obviously, you know, team
cannibals. So like if they were just like
the quote UN quote protagonist, or at least I just told from
their point of view, I think even because then it's like, OK,

(01:07:08):
if it's from their point of viewand it's versus this homogeneous
glob of random friends, then it's like, OK, then whatever,
you know, because again, I'm notlike being set up to follow
them. We're already you know, so it's
like if we were following just behind the boys, then I think
even that would have just then could have been an excuse on why

(01:07:30):
we don't really get anything interesting from the friend
group. Like just like, OK, because
we're behind the boys anyways. Like that's, that's what we kind
of came here for. Because really in the
second-half once like the the the brothers are like like to
introduce more and they're just like, you know, full out and
about they're not a mystery anymore.
Like once they're like, you know, full on assaulting, then
it's like, OK, now. And now we're, you know,

(01:07:51):
starting to cook a little bit. It's just like, you know, we
open with them and then we kind of go away and then like just
sprinkle it in. Like they are like, you know,
like again, like we know that they're there.
That's what we kind of came herefor.
So it's like just the the whole kind of structure of this movie
is is very odd. Is there I don't know maybe you

(01:08:14):
guys can answer this question for me.
I don't know why I have such a hard time keying into the three
mutant characters for this entire franchise.
I just I you know, like Freddy'seasy Jason ZZ pinhead, all the
all of the people, all the iconic people, but I just and
maybe it's because they they look different from movie to

(01:08:35):
movie. Maybe it's because, I don't
know, we see them in such quick flashes.
I just have a hard time getting on board with these folks and,
and investing in their antics like I do with a, you know, a
more iconic thing. And I I don't.
This goes along with what I was saying about the the first one

(01:08:57):
of this series feels like it's already a sequel.
It's already not the first one. But by the way, I don't know if
you've recorded your wrong turn the first one yet, but did you
talk about the fact that the guywho wrote it is a born again
Christian who also wrote the left behind movie for Kirk?
Cameron, I did not clock that. Yeah, he's he makes a nice

(01:09:18):
living writing Christian movies as well as horror movies.
You know what, I feel like I looked that up in the IMDb and
did not clock it mentally to like make a note of that later
on. Yeah, anyway, but yeah, so
that's my thing. I just I have a hard.
Fair, he only did. That I have some thoughts to.
Be fair, he only did the first left behind movie according to

(01:09:40):
letterbox. He only wrote the first gotcha
and he's done like a bunch of like action stuff like Marine
Four movie. That's what we talked about.
I know he talked about that likethe John Cena miss like.
And I think, doesn't he write for TV like he does a lot of TV
writing, I think. Yeah, I, I reached out to him to
talk to me about for an article that I did Frank for Fangoria

(01:10:02):
about Christian horror movies. And he's not shy about being a
born again Christian and a horror person.
So it's interesting. Anyway, Sarah, do you have any
thoughts on that this idea that like the kind of our antagonists
in this series, like they don't quite reach that iconic status

(01:10:23):
of like other slasher killers from earlier periods or even
this time frame? I think I feel like you kind of
see this a lot, like even with like the Hills have Eyes, like
yes, we know Jupiter and you know all of them, but like
they're not, they don't stand upin the pantheon of like horror

(01:10:43):
killers. And I think that that's
partially because even as mutants, they're still kind of
one of us. There's nothing truly
supernatural about them. They're, you know, they, they
may not be able to feel pain, but they can die.
Like they, they can be shot, they can be killed.

(01:11:03):
Whereas like Freddie, you can't really kill Freddie.
Like there's always some specialthing you have to do.
Jason, you can't kill Michael Myers.
You can't kill even leather faces kind of above the level of
just being a human. And so I think, and you see this
a lot, like with like cannibalism horror, is that the

(01:11:25):
cannibals are just kind of either human like us, which
makes them scary because they could meld in, or they're
mutants and thus they're otheredvery much.
So like you are, you're not supposed to identify with them
or. Which is why I also kind of like
that we get a little bit of sympathy with these guys in the

(01:11:46):
beginning. And you see sympathy for like I
feel that Leatherface is a very sympathetic killer.
Like I always feel terrible for Leatherface.
I'm like, you know what? Yeah, come, you know, come here
'cause I love you. Like I very much like, I, I have
a whole article that I want to write about this because I feel
like there is some otherness that gets portrayed on

(01:12:09):
Leatherface a lot. But I feel that this is kind of
a watered down version of that where it's they're just, they're
just kind of sort of like us, which makes the even more
terrifying that they eat us, I think because they could eat us.
For me, it's a couple things. It's #1 even like with Freddie,

(01:12:31):
you have a whole back story and an iconic look, but with Jason
and Michael, you have like you learn enough about them from
other characters and their reactions.
Like Jason's back story, it's like a child who drowned when he
was 8. And Michael's back story, you
see him as a child's killer and then you get like Doctor Loomis
giving his whole back story overa couple movies.

(01:12:52):
So you get enough there to glom onto.
And plus they have like a more iconic look to them with the
hockey mask and the shape mask. But the other thing, you know,
we've mentioned Texas Chainsaw. So this family is the most like
one that would be like an analogto like the family from Texas
Chainsaw. And here there's really not a

(01:13:13):
lot that distinguishes the threekillers that we have here.
They're pretty interchangeable aside from like a couple of them
are much bulkier and three fingers like smaller and spry.
But there's nothing in terms of their personalities and how they
interact with themselves and others where you take the Sawyer

(01:13:33):
family and you take the hitchhiker versus the cook
versus Leatherface and grandpa, and they all have their own
distinguishing characteristics. Then you add Bill Mosley as chop
top in Part 2, and he's his own unique animal.
Like they feel so much more, youknow, part in the pun fleshed

(01:13:55):
out that you have enough to givethem this iconography that this
film doesn't earn. Like this is just what if we
took the mask off of Jason and had a character run around for
90 minutes? Killing people.
So the, the franchise is like it's, it's in a really like hard

(01:14:16):
place and they try multiple different things.
Cuz like up to this point, like the first movie, we're focusing
on the three of them. And then the second one we have
like a whole family. We have like 6 of them.
But then the third one they likesimplify and then they just
focus on three finger. I mean, they have his like
little son, but his son gets killed and then, hey, we have a
little sympathy for three finger.

(01:14:36):
We watch him the whole team again, another point for wrong
turn three against this movie, because if you just simplify
down, then you do at least have one person that you're like
focusing on and like you kind ofhave that.
And they did that throughout thefranchise, like 3 fingers, the
only one that's in every single movie.
But at the same time, they don'tkey in enough for enough like

(01:14:59):
personality because then if you focus on only one, then they're
just the hatchet movies, which are also happening around this
time, you know. So it's like, OK, well, we have
to have more than one. So let's go back to three of
them again in this movie. But like, you know, you said, we
don't we really don't get enoughseparation other than three

(01:15:19):
finger kind of being like a little bit more intelligent and
like also like a little bit morespry.
So yeah, they get they they kindof have a in a tough place of
like establishing like the the true identity of like, you know,
of being able to do like truly like get behind them versus, you
know, because again, all we really see is like, we see that

(01:15:39):
again, we add that they were locked up and experimented on.
It's like, OK, so like, you know, you still feel something,
but then at the same time it's like, it's also still tough
because it's like they really are, you know, super hunters and
cannibals. So it's like, well, you know,
you're never really going to gettoo much.
I don't know, I guess since because compared to the Texas
Chainsaw movies, and I think I saw somebody made a note of

(01:16:01):
this, that this movie series is very explicit with its
cannibalism. So I think that's where you kind
of lose out on like, you know, we we know that Leatherface eats
humans, but we don't see it and we don't see him like relish in
it, you know, like it's not in our fate.
You know, it's kind of funny, but like, you know, in this is
like they are very much like, Ohno, we are like eating people.

(01:16:23):
We love it. And so it's like at the end of
the day, that's always going to be a tough sell to like, you
know, get behind the boys per SEwhen you're when you're watching
this. And and that's actually really
interesting because at this time, when this came out, we'd
already seen the Texas Chainsaw Massacre remake, we'd already
seen the Hills Have Eyes remake.They took the cannibalism

(01:16:45):
subplots out of those. The early aughts was not big
into cannibalism like we were. We were cool with killing
people. We were cool with torturing
people. But cannibalism was not as,
yeah, cannibalism was like this weird.
Like, you know, we, they, we really backed off in cannibalism
and horrors. So it's having this be so

(01:17:06):
unabashedly cannibal, I think iswhy they don't make them as
personable. Because then it's just this kind
of, we have these like scary cannibals that could come get
you at any time. Because now we have hot
cannibals. We're in sexy cannibals.
Now, yeah, we're now we are. Now we are in.
Now we're in the the Timmy Chardonnay cannibal, you know,

(01:17:29):
lifestyle where every every cannibal's high and I'm still
waiting I'm still waiting for a not tragic ending cannibal
romance. Like y'all like give it to me.
Like why, why does every cannibalism romance have to end
in tragedy? Like they don't.
Let's let let's let them eat together in love forever,

(01:17:50):
please. I would give it to.
Me, I would argue that the the that German film where the guy
asked the cannibal to cook and eat him was a happy ending,
right? Everybody got what they wanted
in that movie. Yeah, what's?
That story, that. Movie I need to.
Wasn't that like an actual case in?
Germany, Yeah. It was based on the actual case

(01:18:12):
of a guy who is a cannibal and asadist, and he advertised for
someone that wanted to be. Necromantic.
Not necromantic, but I do love that movie.
And then he found somebody who was willing to do it, and he
killed the guy, as I recall, andis now sitting in prison.
But there've been a couple movies about it and about like
the sexual sort of tension between the two of them.

(01:18:34):
I should know these because, quite frankly, I wrote
extensively about them, but I can never remember the names.
But it brings me to the point that I was going to make, which
is I think in like the Texas Chainsaw cannibal Uber, we're
we're seeing them use humans as food, but we're preparing that
food, right? Like it's like in Texas Chainsaw

(01:18:56):
Massacre 2, it's in the chili. Whereas in the wrong turn movies
or like say our, you know, our Italian cannibal movies, we're
actually seeing people like takebites out of people.
And I think that's also a crucial.
Difference they make liver and onions in this though.
They do, but they're also like they used to have.
A sampling. They.
Used to cook them a little bit more in the earlier entries like

(01:19:17):
especially in two, like 2, they like make like actual like meal
meals. But in this like, yeah, by this
point in the in the 3rd and 4th,we're just like kind of going
straight to your. Point to your point, the prep is
behind the scenes and off camerain the Texas Chainsaw movies.
Like you're not seeing like you're literally not seeing how
the sausage gets made in like Texas Chainsaw 2.

(01:19:40):
It's actually a joke like that. We know like the secret when
when when the cook says the secret ingredient is the meat,
like we have a laugh because we know where that meat's coming
from where. And maybe this is a good time to
talk about like the fucked up fondue scene.
Like, this is this is the centerpiece of the film.

(01:20:02):
Like, this is what, you know, I think fans would be like, this
is what they would want in this kind of movie where you're
literally see him being strippedfrom his, his flesh stripped
from him and then prepared in front of you on screen.
And that's a big difference. By the way, I found those films
I was talking about. The gentleman's name is Armin

(01:20:25):
Muse. He was the Cannibal and the two
most prominent films are German.One is called Grim Love with two
M's in 2006 with Keri Russell's in That one and another one
called Cannibal. They are both ex What?
Year did cannibal. Come out also 2006 they're both

(01:20:48):
I. Asked because there are like 15
movies named Cannibal. Right, right.
Apparently Uli Lemel's Diary of a Cannibal is also based on it.
Anyway, both the movies I mentioned are absolute endurance
tests, so you know, we love those, but be forewarned.

(01:21:08):
Fair enough, Sarah's pulling stuff off the shelf.
I'm trying to see if I actually own this already because I do
have a couple movies named Hannibal they're adding.
To my watch list. That's funny.
I I I liquidated my DVD collection and that's a whole
other monologue, but I had so much stuff that I had never

(01:21:31):
watched and forgot that I owned when I.
Went through it. Oh I I'm I'm basically compiling
a physical archive of gastro horror.
So anytime I see any gastro horror I buy it like.
That leads me to my my question for you then, Sarah is like,
what do you make of your opinionis the one that I want to hear

(01:21:51):
the most on this, on the fucked up fondue scene and how would
you prepare this and what would go well with it if you were
doing? Like, I mean, they do it that
first, for all intents and purposes, they do it right.
Like if you ever go like if you've ever been to the melting
pot or something and you get themeat fondue because that there

(01:22:12):
are two fondues in well, three if you want to count dessert.
But in terms of savory, people think of cheese and then there's
usually like an oil based one, which is what you do for meat
And you you're served raw meat and you dip it into this like
boiling oil that's usually got like seasonings and other stuff
in it to make it taste good. And that's how you cook the

(01:22:33):
meat. So how they do this is actually
not off base at all like this. This is why I love this scene
because it's so fun. It's like, I'm like, they are
really, they're really fucking doing this.
Like, and I remember the first time I watched this, I was like
shrieking. I was like, I called my husband.
I was like, they're fondueing him like it's cannibal fondue.

(01:22:58):
And I, I gave this movie an extra half star based on that
scene alone. Like, because you don't see like
usually when people are cooking like human meat in a movie, it's
like they're throwing it on the fire.
They're doing something boring. It's going in a soup like, but
fondue was so creative that and then they, they RIP the guy

(01:23:21):
open, pull out his liver and then take a piece of onion and
make like little liver and onionfondue skewers.
Like I, if I, if I liked cow liver, which I don't, I am, I'm
purely like, I'll eat chopped liver because my family is
Jewish. Like I, I love good chopped
liver. It's, it's just in my blood.

(01:23:44):
I can do, I can't do cow liver though, but I would do if I was
gonna recreate a recipe for my website, I would make, I would
do skewers like that. I if I could figure it out, I
would do it. Like I think I love that they
utilize this, this giant kitchenbecause it's such a great set
piece for this film. Like you don't think when you

(01:24:06):
see asylum movies, you never think about the kitchen.
It's always the cells or the big, you know, communal
bathrooms, but you never think of like the kitchen.
And so to have this giant kitchen set, you know, kind of
like Jurassic Park or Sacrifice game has a really great kitchen

(01:24:27):
set. You get to see like them, like
lay him out. And they really do love barbed
wire. In this movie, everybody's tied
up with barbed wire. And I like, I, I'd like.
There's no other. It's too serious.
I used to love that appreciationfor Barbed.
Wire, yeah, that is like, you know.
I just like. I just wonder how they have so

(01:24:49):
much like and it's not easy to tie someone up with barbed wire.
Like they act like it's like string.
Well, they can't, but like barbed wire's hard.
They. Just do it.
They just chop their hands up and they do it.
But it's just like it's hard to bend, like it's metal, it's
thick metal. And I just, I, I, I think it's

(01:25:09):
fun. And then you just like there's
they do it so slowly, they cut him and carve him so slowly that
it is so intense. And this film has pretty decent
practicals for being a straight to a straight to DVD 4th entry
sequel. Usually by this point you're
just seeing crappy computer blood that like the third one is

(01:25:32):
terrible, the CGI and the third one is God awful.
And this one, they're like, hey,we're gonna do a little bit less
CG. It's.
Mostly practical with CG to enhance it and you can.
Exactly. Usually tell when they do that.
And you're right, like there aresome terrific effects in this
film. I I just that scene and then the

(01:25:54):
the Porter into a Porterhouse line.
My gastro, my gastro horror loving heart just really
appreciates this movie so much. It's got some great shots.
Also, though, like when Claire gets killed, she's the blonde
who gets hung with the barbed wire in the beginning and she
falls down and then the two faces are just like looking at

(01:26:15):
each other. That shot is so good.
That's my. That's my favorite kill of the
movie because again, as you mentioned, I love the series
pension and creative ways to keep using barbed wire.
It's just like just when you think they you know, you know, I
loved in I loved in three them like causing the bus accident
with dragging the barbed wire from the truck.
I thought that was neat. And then in this one, I really

(01:26:38):
like this kill because I mean, it's like it's a it's a long
kill. Like it's like they they very
much just like hold the whole thing out.
Like, you know, homies just taking all the blood in the face
with his mouth open and everything like whatever, a
little good for him, you know, really stick it out for his gal
there. But like he's just like taking
all his blood and then her like you see, like the neck

(01:26:58):
stretching because of the barbedwire and everything.
Yeah, I'm, I'm a big fan of they're, they're just consistent
ways of coming up with creative ways to use barbed wire.
Big fan. I literally have a note on my
notes that says sure do love barbed wire.
Yeah, they do. It's like the machete in Friday

(01:27:20):
the 13th or a knife and Halloween or the Freddy's finger
gloves like barbed wire is the is like the what they're using
is their weapon more often than not.
And sometimes it's razor wire, right?
Like sometimes it's just plain old, your dad's barbed wire.
And sometimes I think in that scene we're just talking about,
I think it's a razor wire that'slike cutting your head off.

(01:27:42):
I think it's interesting. And I, I as much as I was
talking shit, I would like to give the production some credit
for the, for the fondue thing because that was really big in
the 70s. And so the connection could be
made that these this trio of young people learned about that
in the 70s. And so that's a connection to

(01:28:03):
where they come from. There were two things about the
fondue scene I found fascinating, on top of the fact
just. It's a really cool, practical
kill. One of them being in the
positive side was like, there's something to me that's very
disturbing about that switch going off in the character where

(01:28:24):
one minute they're screaming like, help save me, and then
they just get to a point where it's too much and they're like,
just kill me. Just put me out of my misery.
I find that really disturbing that, you know, I've given up.
There's no way out. I'm cooked just like make it
quick, make it easy. I don't want to suffer anymore
like that is the kind of. Horror.

(01:28:45):
Pun intended, by the way. Pun intended because you said
I'm cooked. I'm cooked.
Literally they're cooked. Also Daniel is the spitting
image of one of my ex roommates and a friend of mine where and I
texted screenshots of him in themovie to friends.
I'm like this is Morgan like andthey're like holy shit, this is

(01:29:05):
Morgan like it right down to like the haircut and the white
tshirt and jeans. Like I'm like this is my ex
roommate. But that switch going off like
there's nothing I can do to get out of this.
Just put me out of my misery. That is the kind of horror that
psychologically I find super disturbing and it's actually

(01:29:27):
hard for me to get through. That is undercut by the friends
that are behind the door, like to basically rock, paper
scissoring, whether they should go back and save him, Which
starts off as a pretty, like, fascinating thought experiment.
Like, what would you do? And how would this debate go?

(01:29:47):
But it goes on for so long, likewell past the point anyone would
be debating, that it becomes around to being.
This is kind of hilarious because they're like, we don't
know what's going on and they keep debating and debating and
debating. And they could have probably
saved him if they hadn't basically brought it to like a

(01:30:10):
Senate subcommittee to die by death there.
Like that is what happens in this.
Scene that's kind of repetitious.
They they do it a couple times too, because there'll be times
it's like, OK, do we barricade in or do we make a break for it?
And then it's like they debate debate, debate and then finally
they make a move and that's likeNope, you took too long.
They they set up another trap for you.

(01:30:31):
You know you took too long doingthis now you're going to get got
this way. So like they they kind of do
that a couple times again. That's why I was like man, why
are we still inside right now? We're spending too much time
barricading ourselves in rooms and talking and debating things
like we don't got time for all that.
We're all if we're going to pickthem off, let's pick them off
let's get outside. So again, I don't know about

(01:30:53):
everybody else, but like the tworeasons I came on for this
episode. I was like, it's going to be the
prequel 1 and it's going to be the one in the snow.
So again, I was like, we're spending a lot of time outside.
But once we do get into the snow, I mean, it's decent.
It's not exactly what I'd want for a wrong turn snow entry, but
at least once we do outside, cuzthe whole thing has been, I

(01:31:14):
guess at least it has been the snowstorm.
Like keeping them in because I will say like there's a there's
a couple fun uses of the snow. I will give them credit, like
the one set piece where they have to tunnel through the snow
in the window to finally get outside.
Like this is like when we're finally making that transition.
I thought that was a fun, intense scene.

(01:31:36):
Like it was like they're, they're blocked in and then
like, you know, you say you haveto do enough time and then at
1.1 gal is like crawling throughand it caves in like towards the
middle. Other gal like tries to like go
back and like get her, but then it's too late.
She has to go back through And then, you know, she ended up
getting got. But I thought that was like a, a
really fun scene to transition us to, to the outdoors and a

(01:32:00):
good utilization of the snow. But then after that, then
they're just like, all right, let's RIP people's head off with
a snowmobile. Let's put, you know, let's, you
know, put, put it on their like body and like use the, the, the,
you know, rudder part or whatever.
After that, you know, it's kind of whatever.
But I thought the transition outdoors was nice.

(01:32:22):
But not enough of it, is what you're saying.
Yeah, you didn't I? Mean because by this point that
I think it's like, I think there's like 2020 minutes left
in the in the movie. And then especially once the,
the, the, the brothers get the, the snowmobiles, then it's like,
oh, well, they're just like kindof fucked at this point.
And it's just then like kind of running in a circle until they
get got. But I did, I did like the fake

(01:32:44):
out when we did think that like the two lovers, it's like, hell
yeah, they're they're gonna be the ones to make it out.
And it's like, Nope, not even them either.
But we kind of saw that in the third.
It wasn't the lovers, it was thesingle girl and the.
Lesbian. Right, right, right.
Yeah, the the other lesbian got killed by the rudder of.
Snowmobile. And then, yeah, so it was her
and it was her and the gal with the the nice eyebrows.

(01:33:06):
Forget what her name is, but sheshe was the the other one, yeah.
That's how that's how much they look alike.
Because I didn't realize that until literally you said it that
it wasn't the two lesbians that lived because I thought it was 2
lesbians. No, it's just the one the.
One and to be fair, we don't know the orientation of the
other girl exactly, so it's. Like, yeah, they've kind of,

(01:33:27):
they kind of teetered the line with her sexuality of like,
well, hey, I like that you're flirting with me, but hey, I
have a boyfriend. But you know, put a couple like
White Claws in me and things could get crazy.
It's they're shooting like in actual snow, like the snow
Blizzard. Like they're like, Yep, that was

(01:33:48):
real, wasn't CGI snow. And like the first scene where
there's snow blowing there, they're like, it was relatively
warm. It was -20° when we filmed this
scene and they said it got down to like -45 because they're
shooting like in Winnipeg and they're shooting like that
Asylum is there. They're shooting on.
It's kind of like session 9 where they shoot the old

(01:34:10):
Danvers, like mental state, the state mental hospital in
Danvers, Mass for session 9. Same thing here.
They're shooting in an abandonedasylum aside from like the cells
were a built set and like the big like living room with the
fireplace was a curling club. But other than that, like Sean

(01:34:30):
you mentioned, like this script is terrible.
Part of that might be like, they're like writing to the
scenery. They're like, oh, we have a
giant auditorium, let's write a scene for this.
The kitchen they found. Let's write a scene for this.
Absolutely. I mean the, you know, the time
wasting of like going down hallways and being in a room and

(01:34:52):
getting out of a room. It's, it's all in service of,
you know, that place and not being able to go anywhere and,
and having to, you know, fill 90minutes, which makes me wonder
about the scene where they breakthe window in the snows outside
because they're obviously using a practical location.
And so that was the thing that sort of stood out.

(01:35:13):
I'm like, oh, wait, no, there's some production value here.
How did they do that? Cement tube.
Cement tube. So the cylinder tubes you would
use like the big long cement tubings that are basically used
to support structures, they grabbed one of those film like
basically packed snow all aroundit and gave it that crawl space

(01:35:38):
for actors to kind of safely go through it.
Is that the inside of it? Because that was like when
they're in the hospital or the cemetery or whatever.
Interesting, I missed that on the PCs.
Yeah, and they said they broke real glass like we don't have,
we don't have the money for likesugar glass.
So no, that's real glass. Excellent.

(01:35:58):
So yeah, I mean the making the most of the set, I do wish there
was more outside, but you don't have the money to build like an
indoor. When you look at the first like
Ron turn movie, like the scene where they're jumping out of the
radio tower into trees, like that's an all indoor like built
set. Because you've got 12 million to

(01:36:19):
play with versus like 1,000,000 bucks maybe for this movie and
you just can't kind of go ahead and and you're just gonna make
do. But I do wish.
Which is a bummer because I knowthat is like logistically why we
don't get a ton of winter set horror in general because it
just a lot of sets don't have the money to buy the heated

(01:36:41):
tents that certain movies can afford and stuff like that.
But but that's why I wish it's like some of these bigger
franchise entries would if that do kind of get those budgets,
it'd be nice to see more winter set horrors.
So it's just a bummer that because that's on all the
posters, it was like this is gonna be the snowy 1.

(01:37:03):
But you know, and it's like the wrong turn franchise is known
for being outside, you know, like, you know, so like, I don't
know it. So just this as far as like the
the percentages or the ratio that we kind of get between
indoor and outdoor. And this was just kind of
jarring because now it's just like, well, if we're in this
like kind of building and doing this runabout, this didn't have

(01:37:24):
to be the wrong turn cannibals. This could have been sub in a
monster, sub in a ghost, like sub in whatever.
And like, it would kind of stillbe the same movie.
So it's like if we're gonna do wrong turn in the snow, then
it's like the the kind of Hallmark is that a majority of
it is outside. But I get it.
I get it logistically. The last thing I have is just

(01:37:47):
the ending of this film, like when you mentioned it right at
the outset, Sean, like the two heads flying off in the snow
with the razor wire. And then you have the other
character that is like basicallyskied out of there.
Like she pulls like a. Jack.
Nicholson at the end of the signing and like, dies like 50
yards from the road where she could have been rescued.

(01:38:08):
Like Declan O'Brien. He's 2 for two and these like
super grim, nobody survives endings like we're going to kill
everybody. And I find that fascinating.
It's like our motto is like, fuck those kids.
Like O'Brien definitely had thatin him where it was very kind of
like cynical and nihilistic ending to his his films.

(01:38:33):
Yeah, well, I thought, I thoughtthat one was particularly mean.
That was mean because it was like, you see that she like gave
up, like she like she took her skis off.
She like sat down like up against the tree and just like,
you know, like kind of accepted her fate.
And then you see how close it was.
Like that was mean. But then also the other one that
was mean but funny whenever theylike stabbed their friend to

(01:38:53):
death because they like see somebody with a bag over their
head and like it's the cannibal and they all stab him.
And then my my favorite piece ofdialogue from this entire movie
is in that scene, they like stabbed the person and then they
realize it's their friend. One person goes, well, why
didn't he say anything? And then the other girl goes,

(01:39:14):
because the bastards cut his tongue out is just like, but the
girl that said why didn't he sayanything killed me.
Is is super hilarious. But yeah, so 2 very like, very
mean and like kind of devious kills in this.
I feel like this is of the time,though, because like Texas
Chainsaw Massacre, the beginning, same kind of, you

(01:39:37):
know, downer of an ending vacancy like this is like late,
early odds horror, especially like the the like 2000 tens
elevens as we're coming, like I said earlier, as we're coming
out of like the 9/11, the post 911 horror period.
All these endings are so grim and mean, like everything is

(01:39:57):
super like no happy ending for anybody.
You the Strangers came out around this time like we're
we're seeing horror be just likesuper mean.
And I think there's also like a European influence there, right?
Like Dutch, horror is always just very.
Low high tension French extremity.

(01:40:18):
Yeah, super bum out. Extremities stuff of that time.
Yeah, like, you know, even, you know, like the cannibal movie,
like the Cannibal Holocaust, like all these things where it's
just like Nope. And I have to tell you, I
actually prefer that. Not because I want a bum out
ending, but I'd like an ending I'd like.

(01:40:38):
I've gone into this at length onother podcasts under other
subject headings, but it fits here.
The thing about horror movies that I'm so drawn to, I think as
a queer guy, is the beginning, middle and end of the trauma,
right? You can just go through the
whole cycle and then be done. And whereas like when you're
growing up queer, it's an unending trauma that re UPS

(01:41:00):
every day. And so you can sit in front of
these movies and just have an experience where it's like
people going through something tough, but then it's over.
Fascinating. Yeah, So I kind of enjoy like
the button, you know, I, I, I less like the dot dot dot
question mark just because I feel like I'm being manipulated
as an audience member and it feels lazy to me as from a

(01:41:21):
writing standpoint. I, I hate the and I've said like
IA lot of times we'll just discount the last 30 seconds of
a horror movie. Like it looks like everybody's
gotten away. And then you have that question
mark at the end. And I'm like, you know, I just
don't even accept that is Canon at that point.
That's when they're pulling the.That's when they're pulling the.

(01:41:42):
Just in case ending the like OK like this could be the end if it
is our last shot but then like oh if we get another 1 then.
So we need a sequel. You know, so it's like, yeah,
those are those are like super annoying.
So like, I actually like your your point there.
And that's just like, hey, well,if they're all dead, they're all
dead. Like that's, that's the end of
it, you know, click clack and then we see the boys just, you

(01:42:03):
know, pick, you know, drive on up, pick it, pick the bodies up
onto the next one. Like, you know, so like I kind
of I dig the cynical ending as well.
The the one for three I thought was just super funny with the
guy going back for the money andthen the guy I can't trust a con
shoots him and then and then he gets shot by three finger and
it's like, all right, like I guess no, I guess the gal in

(01:42:25):
three she does survive This, I think is like one of the first
ones where it's like truly 0 survivors, right.
I I mixed on it like 20 year oldSarah hated anytime the main
protagonists died. I was not a family.
And so now as 40 year old Sarah going back and re watching a lot

(01:42:45):
of early on horror I find that I'm mixed.
Sometimes I appreciate it when it feels earned and then
sometimes I just get annoyed because it just feels like they
were just trying to be mean spirited and it wasn't.
It wasn't earned throughout the rest of the movie.
Texas Chainsaw Massacre, the beginning is a as a a good one

(01:43:06):
for that. Like when I saw it when it came
out in theaters, I did not like it.
Now as I'm older, I'm like, well, it was a prequel.
Obviously they couldn't get awaybecause then they would have
gotten caught. Like it makes sense.
It's earned throughout the tone of the whole movie kind of
being, you know, really a big, like it's a big downer of a
movie. Like the whole thing, like all
the main characters really don't.

(01:43:28):
They don't get any good like forthem, like they're that that
plays to the Vietnam tone of thefilm.
And this movie I feel earns it like because it's just like the
by the end, it's so silly that they just get their heads
whacked off by barbed wire. That and it almost feels like it

(01:43:49):
wasn't even the killer, like thethe cannibals who did it.
It was just that there was a fence there.
Yes. And so that's why that feels,
yeah, it's just like, you can't help but be like, what the fuck?
Yeah, cuz it's out of nowhere. It's so quick.
Like you hear one of them yell no and the next thing you know.

(01:44:11):
Well, they they start traps, though we've seen that they are
trap setters. But when they pull out of the
shot it no it looks like a big fence.
Wow. I think it's just supposed to be
a fence. Yeah, I took it as just a fence.
Yeah, I took it because you see the crane shot and it's like

(01:44:32):
going. Waves.
Yeah. So I don't think they could have
like created that fence that quickly.
Then that is extra bummer. Damn.
I think to your credit, to your points here about the Texas
Chainsaw prequel, I watched thatfilm and to the very last
second, I thought, I think they're gonna let her get away.

(01:44:55):
I did too. Right.
Like to the film makers credit, I was like OK, so this will be
Canon that somebody actually escaped, but the family is still
there. So I look at that as like expert
film making or storytelling at least, where there's other films
that just. And that doesn't feel mean, that

(01:45:15):
feels Canon, where sometimes it just feels mean.
Right. Yeah.
The vanishing. You know, The Vanishing, as much
as I like the skill of that filmor Funny Games, those feel like
they're punishing me as an audience member and.
That's Henneke's whole point in.Yeah, I know, I know.
It's like 1. Of the I, I, you know, I've

(01:45:35):
tried. I can't get into that movie for
me. Inside is like an ending that I
can't watch again. Like I find that for a lot of
the great Christmas, a lot of it's a great movie.
Like don't get. It's a terrific piece of and
they've never come close to replicating anything like that.

(01:45:58):
Their latest 1 is more like a police procedural than anything.
It's not bad, but it's not greateither.
The end of that film it that helpless feeling at the end of
it. That is what I find really
difficult. I don't want to give away the
end of Like the Wrong Turn reboot yet, but I think the end

(01:46:22):
of that film is a great use of like the reverse of what we're
talking about, which I really appreciate it.
And I thought they did that and how they do that too, felt
different from anything I'd really seen and appreciated how
that was done. I agree.
I agree. Just say much more you would.
It would totally spoil it. Yeah.

(01:46:43):
So we'll save that. We have that in a couple weeks.
So that one's new enough where we'd advise listeners go in and
check that out before we get to it in two more weeks.
Anything else, folks? Do we have anything?
Else I I just want to touch baseon 7 because I'm not going to be
on that episode, but that's one of the few instances where I'm
OK with the fact. Well, I'm not OK with it.

(01:47:05):
I think it was a misstep, but they took cannibalism out of
that one. That one's not about cannibals
either. Correct.
And so, but it's still ranks really high because I think it's
actually a really solid movie. It it literally could have been
a it. I think if they had kept
cannibalism in it could have been my favorite.
OK, you know what's so funny? Sarah.

(01:47:26):
Sarah in my first contact was she was in my DMS about gastro
horror. I don't know if you remember
that. I do.
That was like too. I wanted because I was like, oh,
should I buy the book now? I'm trying, I'm I'm really
trying low buy right now. I'm trying not to buy books
because I have a bad, I have a bad spending habit.
Yeah. And I was like, OK, do I need
this book or can I wait? I ended up buying it and there's

(01:47:51):
enough that I'm like, OK, well, I can reference this So.
But yes, I the gastro horror thing is like a whole
fanaticism. It's it's this whole shelf of
movies behind me is all gastro horror and cannibalism except
for except for like my vinegar syndrome, Severin all my all my

(01:48:11):
boutique distributors. They have their own shelves and
I don't mix like I'm weird. My brain is weird.
I'm but. Want to build my own closet for
all my physical media this summer?
I want my. Very I have a criterion.
Closet. I have shelves of physical media
between books and movies in every single room of my house

(01:48:32):
except the bathrooms. I'm jealous every room has
bookshelves. On that note, Devon, any last
thoughts? I mean, yeah, I was just overall
just kind of 5050 on this movie.Like, again, like once we do
like kind of get going in the second-half and spend a little
more time with the boys, get outside, then I'm like, OK, like
this feels like what I kind of assumed the movie would be.

(01:48:53):
It just like kind of takes a while to get there, but at the
same time, like, I don't know, this one just doesn't kind of
have the same energy or kind of there's no like kind of saucer
style in this one for me that like that, you know, screen that
it doesn't have the the wrong turn spirit quite.
Even though they literally say it, they say I think he's made a

(01:49:15):
wrong turn. In a snowmobile.
So I mean, they did at least give me that, but but at the
same time, I don't know that it this one just doesn't quite feel
in the identity, which is also an issue if you're going to be
doing a prequel movie, you know,I feel like the prequel movie
should be all about the identityof the the franchise.
And I think this movie kind of just goes more the the lazy

(01:49:37):
route of plug and play and like,which is, you know, it's fine.
It's it's whatever. I didn't hate my time with this,
but it's currently through at the watch through.
This is at the bottom of my list.
So it's it's whatever. Well, let's plug some stuff,
then let's try that again. Let's let's end today with some

(01:50:01):
plugs. And Sarah, where can our
listeners find you and what haveyou been up to?
I'm on all socials as Spooky Sarah says.
My site Spooky sarahsays.com I just had an article on gastro
creature features come out on Night Time magazine so you can

(01:50:21):
check it out there. Final Girl's Feast is back since
January. We had to take a hiatus because
my Co host's daughter had and beat cancer.
So we had taken about a year offactually.
So we are back and recording 2 episodes a month.
So be sure to check us out on Final Girls, feast.com and

(01:50:45):
wherever you listen to podcasts.And Geeks Who Eat still lives,
but quietly. That's a very quiet life for
Geeks Who Eat these days. But yeah, so just come find me.
Sean, how about yourself? Well, I'm gay of the dead pretty
much everywhere. Sometimes there's hyphen,
sometimes there's not. But all the, all the regular

(01:51:07):
places, Facebook, Instagram, blue Sky, grudgingly on TikTok,
I've got a Patreon Gay of the Dead where I'm rolling out my
next book, which is going to be interviews with queer LGBTQ film
makers who work in horror. And that's a that's a years long
process. Some of the interviews started
back in 2009 when I was doing myGay of the Dead blog for

(01:51:31):
Fangoria and I just keep updating them.
So it's going to be a pretty extensive book.
My book, Queer Horror, a film guide that I Co edited and I
created is out. It's a big book and it's really
expensive and that that part doesn't sit well with me.
So if you can't afford the sticker price, the retail price
of that book, DM me wherever youcan find me and I can hook you

(01:51:53):
up with one that's at least a little bit cheaper because it's
important to me that that book can get into the right hands.
I use my bylines in Fangoria pretty frequently.
Oh. Oh, I just had this super cool
thing happened where I got to cover John Carpenter getting his
star on the Walk of Fame for Fangoria.
Very cool. Yeah.
I was like, right there. They'll be some pictures in an
article by the time this post. They'll be pictures in an

(01:52:15):
article on the Fangoria website.Excellent.
Thank you guys both for coming on.
You're both of course, welcome back.
So we know we'll get make sure you get the list of what we're
covering and sign up Devon yourself what's going on with
both Tainted Love and also the Spectre Cinema Club.

(01:52:37):
Yeah, you can find me on SpectreCinema Club, new episodes every
Tuesday. We are currently doing a month
on sub genre switches. Movie going in, You think it's
one thing and then if it was, yeah, it's something else.
So we started off with One cut of the Dead and Kill List and
then over on Tainted Love, we just dropped an episode on Femme

(01:52:58):
from 2024. A very intense, very erotic,
lots of sex, very great conversation there.
So you can hear Tainted Love every other Wednesday and you
can find me at all the usual places at under score, Daddy
Disco and Sarah. I believe it was for your Shape
of Water episode. Was that you that did the

(01:53:20):
deviled eggs with the salmon? Because if that was you, I, I
saved the I saved the recipe. I'm going to try it because I'm
a slut for deviled eggs. I'm a Midwest boy I.
Have so many deviled eggs. I have so many deviled egg
recipes. Like we joked that we used to
like create deviled egg recipes for geeks who eat like too
often. And so I think we have like 3 or
4 deviled egg. Recipes.
I'm going to try them all. I'm, I love me some deviled

(01:53:42):
eggs, so hell yeah, I love that.Well, folks, you can find the
show at Pod and Pendulum over onBlue Ski Pod and Pendulum over
on Instagram and you can go to podandthependulum.com.
In order to go to all of our back episodes.
We're closing it in like 285 andthey're all up there and could

(01:54:04):
also subscribe to any pod feed from there as well.
You can find and again, the Patreon page is patreon.com/pod
on the Pendulum. If you want more, you can find
me at Mike's Noonian over on Blue Ski, Same over on
Instagram. Follow me in letterbox at Mike
Chump change and you can. That's where I would say come to

(01:54:26):
find me. I do have more than one movie
posted up on my letterbox feed. That is the most devious.
Like that broke my brain, Sean. That absolutely broke my head.
But yeah, follow me over there as well.
And thank you so much to our listeners.
We appreciate all of you all. We'll be back next week with

(01:54:48):
Wrong Turn 5. Devon gave me some excellent
ideas for like future bonus episodes.
I jotted down meanest endings and horror, like grimmest
meanest endings, but also like apart 4 rankings episode.
Just going through all of the part fours we've done to date

(01:55:10):
and then. Just doing the ranking.
Because I think that you're right, it is the turning point
and I find a lot of the films, if they don't have the best
entry, it's the most fun entry or one of the highlights to.
Watch, there's a book on that. I have it at Really.
Yeah, it's Somebody wrote a bookand I'm so I'm bereft that I
don't remember the name of this author.

(01:55:31):
But EM Meeks I will have to buy that.
OK, I check it out of the library.
It's on a very big stack of books in my house, right?
Excellent. Well listeners, thanks so much.
Have a fantastic week and we will be back again really soon.
Take care of y'all.

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