October 15, 2025 • 49 mins
The Cardinals lost for the fourth straight game, this time to the Indianapolis Colts. Jacoby Brissett started for the Cardinals at quarterback and played well. The offense played better than it had previously, but the defense failed again. Jess and Seth talk about Brissett's play, the offense, the defense and whether there is or should be a quarterback controversy.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Z Z. This is the Rise Up Sea Red podcast
all about the Arizona Cardinals and the NFL, featuring insider
and outsider perspectives. Enjoy the best hour of Cardinals Talk
(00:23):
on the Web.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Now Here are your hosts, Jess Root and Seth Cox.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
Those are the Cardinals fans and welcome to the latest
edition of the Rise Up Seward podcast, the bestarre a
Cardinals Talk on the Web. I'm your host Jessroots fromcardsware
dot com, USA, today's NFL wre site that covers the
Arizona Cardinals, and this is episode seven hundred and nine.
It is our review episode as we look back at
the Cardinals thirty one to twenty seven lost in week
(00:53):
six to the Indianapolis Colts. And to help me with
that is my co host Seth Cox from Revenge of
the Birds dot com espienationsers on a Cardinals site and
Seth it was a Honestly, the Cardinals performed better than
I thought. I thought they were gonna get smoked, and
they did better they I guess it's out of the
(01:16):
losses that the Cardinals have had, this is the best
feeling loss I suppose, wouldn't you.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Say, I mean, I guess if if that's how you
want to look at it, it's it's interesting that that's
become the like rationale, right, It's like, oh, I feel
better after this loss than I did the other losses.
And to me, that's just a sentiment of like kind
of telling on yourself that you don't really care about
(01:43):
windsor losses, you just care about who's under center in
those wins or losses. Yeah, and something that you know,
I've already pointed out before, you know, is Kyler Murray's
win percentage excellent. Absolutely not. I mean we talked about
it for forty something something like that win percentage, but
(02:09):
it's better than the now sub twenty two percent win
percentage that they have.
Speaker 3 (02:14):
With double double their win total without Kyler that one win,
they doubled it.
Speaker 2 (02:21):
So so yeah, it's just interesting to see how how
people go about it and stuff like that, because I
have the same feeling I've had for five weeks now
that man, the defense that was supposed to be the
solid foundation of this team really sucks in the fourth quarter.
Speaker 4 (02:44):
Yeah, it does.
Speaker 3 (02:45):
We will talk about the defense, but we have to
talk about because everyone's talking about it, and this is
this is this is not burying the lead. And this
is we're going to talk about Jacoby Brissett and the
performance of the offense. We're going to talk about, you know,
Kyler moving on from Kyler, and then we'll get to
the defense because we can't we can't not talk about
(03:05):
that right stuff. So let's start by talking about Jacoby
Brissett and the offense. This offense on honestly performatively, statistically,
full on production. This looked like the offense that we
expected from the Cardinals this year. They put up twenty
seven points, They had four hundred yards, the first time
they cracked four hundred yards this year. Jacob Prissett threw
for three hundred and twenty yards two touchdowns, did have
(03:27):
the one pick. It was not a dominant rushing performance,
as they rushed for only eighty eight yards. But you know,
they were down to two running backs for most of
the game with Michael Carter and Bam Knight, as we're
no no James Connor, no Tree, Benzon and Amariti Mercado
got hurt as well. But like you look at what
(03:49):
the offense did four hundred yards nine to fourteen on
third down. They that the three hundred and twenty they got.
You got big performances from Trey McBride, a catches aty
two yards and a touchdown. Say Jones had his finest
like I think he I think he surpassed all of
his previous Cardinals production.
Speaker 4 (04:10):
In one game.
Speaker 3 (04:11):
He had five catches for seventy nine yards, Michael Wilson
four catches forty four yards, one two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight.
Nine different players had receptions. So Brissette was giving the
ball around. Yeah, So what what are your thoughts about
the overall performance of the offense in that in that game?
Speaker 2 (04:30):
I thought they did a nice job, uh, you know,
working the passing game because they couldn't run the ball again.
You know, it's one of those things that you you
watch the game unfold, and it was always going to
come down to if they could get a stop like
(04:51):
it has for the last six weeks, and something you
and I have talked about is that they just haven't
at all. And so to see the offense, you know,
this is the first time the offense had the ball
last technically I mean technically not but right like technically
had the ball last right like to go.
Speaker 3 (05:11):
Down, and they they had an offensive chance to go
win a game this time.
Speaker 2 (05:15):
Yeah, yeah, and that's the that's the first time this
has happened all season and and just couldn't get it done.
You know, It's it's funny because it's not too far
off the career averages from what Brissett did. I know,
the yardage at three hundred and twenty yards was was
(05:36):
up there. But like, if you look at his career
in general, one of the things you see is that,
you know, he's about a sixty percent asser as a
or you know, he he was sixty one point four
percent in this game his career sixty one. You look
(05:56):
at you know, the yards per attempt, they're right in
the line with his career, and so it was it
was that game of volume, right, Like this was the
most passes Brissette has thrown since twenty twenty two, when
he threw forty five passes for the Cleveland Browns that season.
(06:22):
It is the fourth most passes he's thrown in his career,
you know, it was. It was the third most passing
yards in his career. And you look at you know,
like his quarterback rating, this isn't I mean, that wasn't
even a top twenty game and so I think when
(06:43):
you look at how Brissette performed, it was comparable to
what the expectation should have been. Like I said, the
yardage was a lot, and I'm not taking anything away
from the yardage, but the yards per attempt, those those
(07:03):
type of things, they fall, you know, kind of right
in line with what we've seen from Brissette throughout his career.
And it was just that they they were able to
or chose to give him a higher volume of throws,
like I said, the fourth most attempts in his career
in a game. And it's an interesting juxtaposition of why,
(07:31):
because I think it was that they felt that was
the best way to control possession because they knew that
Indianapolis would would be able to move the ball, so
(07:53):
to speak, like like the Cardinals did a decent job
against Daniel Jones, would, wouldn't you say, But offensively, they
had to keep the ball in the time of possession
in their in their hands, and once again they they
did that. Something you've kind of pointed out over and
over and over and over and over again is that
(08:17):
the defense every week should never be tired. Because the
Cardinals win the time of possession, they're not on the
field as much, and it just seems like they in
those situations they can't get off the field. And this
week without Murray and his legs, because as we talked
(08:37):
about going in this game, he's been their best runner
all season, just because between James connor injury Trey Benson's injury,
he's been the most consistent guy. They were at a deficit,
you know, before the De Mercado injury, and so they
they leaned on Jacoby Brissett and he was he was
more than up for the job. I mean, he even
had a nice little little run right where he's animals
(09:00):
for twelve yards, picked up an extra first down and
kind of set them up. But it kind of goes
back to the problem with the offense in general. When
jacobri Bressett has, you know, roughly a fourth of your
rushing yards in a game, your your your run offense
(09:23):
is lackluster at best.
Speaker 3 (09:25):
Right, And what I look at is like if Brissett
had a fine game, like the passing game looked much
smoother than it had in previous weeks. The play calling
was also different. They called far more passes and as
a result, they they were not behind the sticks nearly
(09:47):
as much. They did much better in a lot of things.
The the receivers stepped up overall, and you have to
like Brissett did a fine job. And when I see
the performance like that, well, if Brisset did that, what
would Murray have done comparatively? And I'd like to think
(10:11):
we like, if Brissette could do this, Murray would have
done that.
Speaker 4 (10:16):
Well.
Speaker 3 (10:16):
Maybe maybe not the volume of yards, maybe had to
run a few, but the idea that they could get
to four hundreds. We've watched Kyler take a offense do
four hundred yards. We saw it regularly last season. And
I also look at this and say, oh, did the
the Colts just tell on themselves a little bit that
they let a James connerless Trede Benson list Kyler Murray
(10:39):
list and then for most of the game Marvin Harrison
lists Cardinals offense roll up four hundred yards? Did that
they defensively give themselves give, you know, release a fraud
alert in terms of their defensive play. I don't want
to take away from Brissette did did because the numbers
(11:01):
are there, he got guys involved, there was production, but
there's also a reason for that. Now, did it look,
did it look smoother and better than what we'd seen
from the offense with Kyler Murray through for most of
the time. Yes, it did. And drive wise they were
(11:23):
they were so much better. Like in the second half.
Well there they went touchdown, touchdown, field goal and then
failed on the final drive, which was ultimately the part there.
And you know, Prissette couldn't quite make the play that
he needed to. He made one play, but the one
that counted he did not. You can, if you want,
(11:45):
blame Brissett's throw to cause Marvin Harrison having to go
back which led to him getting hit and tackled and
then had this helmet hit the ground because he had
to go back for a pass a little behind him. Obviously,
the interception after the mc wilson interception was terrible, but
(12:06):
overall Brissett did well. The Running Game reminded me of
old times, right, it reminded me of old times. You
know Cardinals in the Running Game. But I will say
this either way, Kyler or Brissett. To see a number
of players get involved offensively and have production. The fact
(12:29):
that Jay Jones stepped into Marvin Harrison's role had five
catches for seventy nine yards. McBride had a very McBride game,
eight catches for seventy two. Like I said, Michael Wilson
picking things up, Elijah Higgins having a couple of catches.
But we do have to like Zay Jones. Production wasn't
because necessarily Jay Jones had a great game. He simply
(12:52):
moved into Marv's position, and basically what we would have
seen if Marv doesn't get hurt, Zay probably has one
or two catches and Marv goes for over one hundred,
which is kind of what we would have expected. And
so overall, there's not much to complain that. There's not
much to criticize about the offense other than the timeliness
(13:13):
at the final drive and we get to see it
once again. You know, will Hernandez in the lineup was
a difference maker, even if Will Hernandez himself is not
greeting out particularly well, that unit, getting that offensive line
unit that honestly, it's the first time since Week one
(13:33):
of last year that they had those five starters in
the game together, the offensive line that was envisioned for
all of last year. They played one quarter last year,
one quarter before Jonah Williams went down because by the
time Johan Williams came back, Will Hernandez was down. And
so to get the Paris Evan yelled Will and Jonah
(13:57):
offensive line finally to get other you know, I think
that contributed to a lot of sum of their uh
success offensively.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
Yeah, And and I mean you saw, you saw how
the game would is gonna go or things of that intro.
I was talking to somebody offline a little bit about it,
and and you know they were talking about just the
willingness to adjust things for Jacobe in the nature of
(14:34):
what they did, and and it talks and it shows
that the offense or what the offense in terms of
how they want things to go, and and the fact
that they don't have a running game kind of speaks
(14:54):
to to the the problem with this style of offense,
right is it it is based heavily on on being
able to run play action passings of that nature, and
and not being able to do that all year, you know,
it created this needing to throw the ball all over
(15:15):
the field and and so to get four hundred yards
of offense, you know, that's great, Like that's a that's
a great accomplishment in and of itself. And and and
you look at it, and they outgained the the Colts,
(15:35):
they outpossessed the Colts, They were better on on they're
down than the Colts. You know, they tied the turnover battle.
And so you look at that and you go, well,
how do you lose that game? I mean, the net
numbers overall should speak to this being a team that
that wins this game. But the reality becomes once again
(15:57):
that that this the way that the offense operates is
that it cannot close out games. And like we said,
for the first time, it was a chance to close
(16:18):
out the game with them having possession, and it didn't happen.
So it was different in how it went how it
went about things. But you know, for the first time
they had the chance to put the game away and
win with you know, thirty some on seconds left I
think it was, And we once again saw sorry, fifty
eight seconds. We once again saw that this coaching staff
(16:50):
really struggles with the end of game situations. And that's
something that we talked about last week. You know, Jonathan
Gannon left with what all three timeouts in his back pocket, right, uh.
Speaker 4 (17:10):
Kind of stave him.
Speaker 3 (17:10):
He gets he gets an end of season bonus for
unused timeouts, right, exactly like me and my sick leave
that I am that I am banking so that I can,
you know, have twelve hundred hours banked by the time
I retire in a few years. And the same thing
with the timeouts.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
But think about this dress. They got the ball first
and ten at the twelve, right, so you can get
a first down or score touchdown, and there's a minute
sixteen left in the game. The Cardinals didn't call a timeout.
They never ran the ball. They never like they played
(17:50):
the end of the game like they had no timeouts
left and they had to score, which they did. I
don't want anybody to get that wrong, but but they didn't.
I mean they never ran once and and they gained
(18:11):
three yards and that that great running game. And and
so you look at you look at that, and you go,
what were you doing? I mean, the Colts were calling
time out because they were like, shoot, we all know
(18:36):
if the Cardinals do score, we can go tie it
up in three plays maybe maybe maybe.
Speaker 4 (18:43):
Four that would have happened, Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2 (18:50):
And so and so you look at it, is that
why are you at the end of the game playing
as though you're the team that doesn't have the ball,
and you're the team that's not controlling the clock and
potentially the outcome. That was just a really interesting sequence.
(19:14):
It has nothing to do with Jacoby has I don't
think a whole lot to do with with Petsing, but
maybe it does. Maybe maybe Gannon was like, I'm not
using the timeouts in case we don't score, but like,
I don't know, why would you look at it from
that lens right, like, Oh, we're not going to score,
(19:36):
so I want these timeouts in case we in case
what like you have to score four points. So even
if you know, by some miracle you stop the Colts
once they got the ball back with fifty three seconds,
what was your plan? Like you had to score a
(19:57):
touch so you're just hoping for a hell mayor like
it's just again these end of game, end of or
end of half, Like we've talked about it before. There's
just I don't know, it's something missing and this I
know this didn't have to do with Brissette, but it
led to the offense as a whole, and you're going,
what are you doing? Like why are you not buried
(20:21):
on first and ten from the twelve because you can
get a first down, you can run the ball, you
can run draws, you can run screens, you can do
a whole bunch of different things because you have all
three timeouts and you're forcing the colt's hand at this point.
It was just a really interesting, interesting end of the
game scenario there for the Cardinals.
Speaker 3 (20:45):
Next on the Razz of Secred podcasts, Bestar Cardinals Talking,
we talk a little bit more. It's about the quote
unquote quarterback controversy that we're trying to stir up. That's
got an next and Rise of Secret Back on the
Rise of Sered podcast Best Our Cardinals Talk, lib talking
quarterback controversy or it feels like people want a quarterback
controversy after one solid start by Jacoby Brissette. Yeah, Jonathangann
(21:11):
is not having anything of it. He says Kyler's the starter.
People asking well it can would it be good just
to rest Kyler this week so that he gets to
buy as well? He's healthy enough to play, He's gonna play.
I feel that that question and answer is kind of
(21:32):
silly because we don't know whether Kyler has a multi
week injury to begin with, right, So to ask, oh,
you know, just rest him, because if he doesn't play
against Green Bay, it could it could look like either way,
it could look like, oh, he's not quite there. So
(21:56):
we're just gonna rest him. He could play, but we're
not gonna make him. We're not gonna do it. Or
he's healthy and or he's not healthy, like one of
the two things. So I think it's paints people into
a corner and there's no good way for Gannon to answer,
and so he did the best he could.
Speaker 4 (22:13):
He's like, if he's healthy, he's gonna play. He's gonna play.
Speaker 3 (22:17):
I would like to point out kind of the hogwash
that there was in the report. So Saturday night, Adam Shefter,
espn Ian Rappaport NFL Network both reported that they expected
Jacobe Prissette to start, that they get that information from
the team somewhere. Rapaport also added this tidbit, saying that
(22:38):
the Cardinals were leaving the door open and would decide
on Sunday. And then in the same tweet, if you
were talking about and then in the same breath, said
that that injury could sideline him more than one week.
I'm like, which isn't Is he gonna play or is
he gonna miss more than one week? And then Gannon
kind of told on himself after the game that he
(23:01):
knew on Saturday whether Kyler was going to play or not.
And so the extra line that Rappaport had of the
door is still open, the door was never opened. They
decided on Saturday. In fact, the Cardinals always decide on Saturday.
They might rarely have a true game day decision, but
(23:21):
pretty much they planned. They make their roster moves based
on that one hundred percent. And so yeah, it's really
interesting how that goes. But the notion that Jacoby should
replace Murray, how crazy is that? Like, is have we
(23:43):
got the way? Has Kyler been so bad that he
needs to be replaced by a guy that's always going
to be replaced?
Speaker 2 (23:52):
I mean, it's just the nature of the beast. When
you don't win enough, that's how it's always going to be.
And that's something that you know, you and I have
talked about. It's just it's always interesting to me. And
again I've never said that you shouldn't move on from Kyler.
(24:16):
I think you and I have done a pretty good
job of being like, no, if the right guy is available,
you absolutely go do it. It's just moving on for
the sake of moving on. Is it's how you end
up well being the Cardinals, right like you just you
(24:36):
end up chasing your tail so to speak, in the
same sucky suckiness that you've you've had for basically the
the history of the franchise. And and for the Cardinals.
(24:58):
You know again, I you have a guy that has
a you know, zero point four four to three winning percentage,
and that's not good. I don't want anybody to think
that I'm saying it is good. You're you're basically a
seven and ten team every year. Nobody wants to be
seven and ten every year. On the flip side, the
(25:22):
Cardinals are now and I just want to make sure
I'm correct on this four and fifteen without Kyler, and
so that's a you know, point two one one winning percentage.
Speaker 4 (25:43):
And that is that's including his entire career, right.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
Yeah, all seven years that he's been you know, on
the team, so usually only health reasons that he hasn't
started again. So I guess the question is, do you
is it the average to slightly below averageness of the
(26:13):
Cardinals with Murray or is it the just bad of
the other quarterbacks that you prefer. And so that's always
what my question is. Now, you know, if Jacobe comes
out and wins, and they move to five and fifteen
(26:33):
in the twenty games that Kyler Murray has missed, and
you have a you know, a point twenty five winning percentage,
and you can look at it from that course of things,
But you know, again, what are are you waving? Here's
the thing if you go with with Brissette moving forward,
(26:58):
which is what it is, whatever are you're waving the
white flag and you're saying, Okay, we're going a different
way in twenty twenty six. By the way, you will
still have Jacoby Brissette as your starter in twenty twenty six, right,
because like, you're you're not going to start a rookie,
(27:19):
would you? I mean, I would not think so, but maybe,
I mean, who knows. That. Being said, you also are
dangerously close to being the Tennessee Titans or you know,
the the Jaguars or who was the other team that
(27:40):
drafted a quarterback number one and then fired everybody immediately.
Like that's what you're kind of looking at. And that's
and that's what makes it hard because if you if
you start Jacoby this year and you only win four games,
so you know he goes to and whatever that would be.
(28:05):
You're basically at that point saying, well, we know that
he's going to be bad next year, but it's you know,
we're gonna get a rookie and east that person in
the job with Jonathan Gannon and maybe a new OC
I don't know. Maybe not again, I don't know, but
(28:29):
I would love to know. What the thought is that
Brissette gives you a better chance to win? Is it
just based off the one game like that you're like, well,
you know, I had three hundred and twenty yards passing, okay,
And again, Jess and I have said like he had
a nice game, Like it wasn't terrible, it was good,
(28:55):
I wouldn't say it was great by any means. And
and they he had them in a position where they
could win a game. I guess if that's the goal,
then we should probably just ignore the first five games
and act like they lost those games and they were
never in a position to win any of those games, right,
(29:16):
because that's that's the reality of it. And so and
so that's what the question becomes, is like what is
what are you trying to accomplish overall this season, you know,
are you trying to accomplish continuing to build and win,
(29:37):
or are you trying to accomplish like we can, you know,
get back to to throw in the ball and having
four hundred yards of total offense and losing football games
that way as opposed to three hundred and fifty yards
of total offense. I guess, I guess if that fifty
(29:57):
yards is what makes fans happy, then you know, you
go with what makes fans happy?
Speaker 4 (30:01):
Right, makes sense? Makes sense.
Speaker 3 (30:04):
Coming out of the next of the podcast, Best our
Cardinals Talk in the Web, time to talk about something
that we needed, that we've been talking about for a while,
and that's the problems on defense. Coming on Extra NICUs,
he read back on the rise of this here podcast
Best our Cardinals Talk on the Web. Finally, finally people
are talking about the defense now that Kobett is in
the lineup and he made everyone feel happy. So now
(30:27):
all that's left is the fourth quarter defense that the
Cardinals have. And I will say this, I will say this,
you can't you have to remember that Indianapolis came in
with one of the top offenses in the NFL. Jonathan
Taylor is a beast. He's the league, the league's leading
rusher and touchdown score. Tyler Warren is a fantastic tight end.
(30:49):
They've got good weapons, and Daniel Jones's happened a really
good year. But the fourth quarter the Cardinals turn. The
Cardinals defense turns the Swiss cheese and is much. And
here's the thing, Drew nick Rowlis gets a lot of love.
I when are we going to start talking about roles
(31:11):
in the fourth quarter because they keep giving up big plays.
They don't stop anybody. Now, it was both offense and defense.
But here, here is the third Here, here's the second
half for the Colts. It's field goal, touchdown, touchdown, and
(31:32):
then ran the clock out.
Speaker 4 (31:34):
And so.
Speaker 3 (31:37):
Jonathan Taylor goes for over one hundred and twenty, Daniel
Jones has who touchdown passes, Tyler Warren has six catchs
for sixty three yards, and it just continues to be
where they've I think I saw the stat from somebody
is that the Cardinals have made five fourth quarter stops
(31:59):
this year, five and technically one of those was Tennessee's
interception touchdown, Because if you get an interception, that's technically
a stop. And so in six games there's been four
four defensive stops, right, and that's great, that's.
Speaker 2 (32:19):
So bad, right, And like I talked about, like, they
haven't forced a punt since the first game in the
fourth quarter, Like literally since the eight fifty seven mark
in the first quarter or fourth quarter of the first game,
they have not forced a punt on defense. And people, again,
you and I talked about this, but people were like, well,
it's because Kyler and the offense can't stay on the field.
(32:40):
It's like, okay, So so that just excuses every offensive
or every defensive laps in every single game. And so
I was curious, Jess, and so you know, you know me,
I'm a curious fellow, and so I was just, you know,
kind of curious, like what what is the issue, Like
(33:04):
what what does it stem from? And is it something
that has been a problem and it really has. And
what's interesting is, you know, again it's it's hard to
go back and look at things and get a grasp
for how they went and stuff. But you know, Jonathan
Gannon's defenses as a whole, in losses, they typically have
(33:38):
a lead before surrendering the game. So what I mean
by that is is like, it's not like there's a
lot of games where the Cardinals or you know, his
one season with the Eagles, even though they lost only
four games total, it's not like a lot of those
(33:58):
games are like, oh, they just get their doors blown
off from the jump, right. You know, in that Eagle season,
he had a game where he had a fourteen to
seven lead after the first quarter and the Commanders went
on to score sixteen points before the Eagles were able
(34:25):
to do anything again, and then they ended up losing
thirty to twenty one. In that In that Eagle season,
there was a game where the Eagles had a twenty
seven to seventeen lead with nine minutes to go in
the third quarter and ended up losing forty to thirty four.
(34:45):
That's that's twenty three points in twenty four minutes of
game time. They lost a game to the New Orleans Saints.
That was the one game where you could say like, oh,
his defense didn't get trounced, right, Like they just they
(35:06):
just lost kind of like kind of like the Bills
game last year, where like it got off to a
rough start on defense and then and then you know,
they just were never able to get back into it,
and then of course there's the Super Bowl, which everybody's
aware of, you know. The the Eagles have a twenty
four to fourteen lead at the half. They they go
(35:28):
up twenty seven to twenty one, and then very Jonathan
Gannon in Arizona like right, twenty four to fourteen at
the half, the Eagles or the excuse me, the Chiefs
score and and make it twenty one twenty four. The
(35:53):
Eagles offense goes on, goes out and uses eight minutes
of game time and gets held to a field goal. Tough,
I know, to just give to get held to a
field goal, but eight minutes a game time, Jesse, it
goes from nine to thirty to one forty eight in
the game. They kick a field goal, they go up
(36:13):
twenty seven to twenty one. What does Jonathan Gannon's defense do?
They immediately allow the Eagles to go and score or
sorry that the Chiefs to go and score again. So
now it's twenty eight, twenty seven Kansas City. The Eagles
(36:37):
offense goes three and out. Chiefs get the uh that
long return from Kadarius Tony. They score again. Now they're
up thirty five twenty seven. So finally the Chiefs offense,
you know, gets back into it four minute, four plus
minute drive and it's tied again, thirty five to thirty five.
What what happens again, Jess? Immediately the Chiefs go down
(37:04):
like this is. And again it's really hard to see
these things when you're winning, right, you're fourteen and three,
you go to the Super Bowl. Everybody, hey, everybody's happy.
But when you look into it, there are the warning
signs were there. They're just cluttered by greatness. That was
(37:25):
that that Eagles roster. And now it's happening. You know,
it happened last year in the Minnesota game, right where
there wasn't a lot of games where the Cardinals were
were up big and then then gave up a bunch
of points. It was usually close games, right whereas back
(37:45):
and forth, back and forth and forth. But you can
look at a couple of those games, right, you can
look at, uh, the Carolina game, that was one where obviously, sorry,
the Minnesota game obviously is the first one where they
have the lead late in the game, four hundred and
six total yards of offense. They hold the Vikings to
(38:09):
two hundred and seventy three yards of offense and lose
how do you lose that game? Jess, Like, how do
you lose that game? And it's in it, you know,
it was always like, well it was Kyler. Kyler, you know,
threw that bad interception. Yeah, so so it was you know,
it was Kyler, and you're like, okay, you know, you
(38:30):
don't think much of it. You're like whatever, like, you know,
quarterback cost you a game. But but then again you
look deeper into it and you go, well, the second half,
the Vikings missed a field goal, they punted, and then
they went touchdown, field goal, touchdown. In the second half,
(38:53):
the Cardinals went field goal, touchdown, interception, field goal. They
held the ball more more than the Vikings and they lost.
And so it was like, well what And then you
go back to the Panthers game, right, kind of similar,
(39:14):
and so the writing's been on the wall like this.
Whatever they do laight in games is an issue of
of like being able to get stops consistently. And it
goes back to Gannon's time in Philadelphia, which makes the question,
(39:38):
you know, and you talked about it with Rallis, like
is it a Rallis thing or is this how Gannon
wants his defense run in those situations, and it's starting
to feel like the answer is that's how Gannon wants
his defenses run in those situations.
Speaker 3 (39:52):
Right, Yeah, it's basically what it kind of looks like,
is is exactly that is he doesn't want to and
and the thing is he's Here's where things are faltering
is that they're not getting home when they rush for
they don't have the pass rush to be able to
(40:13):
do it. And if they do have the pass rush,
then the secondary is that they never get both parts
in the sync late in the game.
Speaker 2 (40:23):
Well, and that was something you and I talked about
quite a bit. Right Again, one of the things that
you and I have harped on is that this defense
they did a nice job in terms of points and
we can't take that away. Like they were third in
points per game entering this week. They're now fourteenth, by
the way, So make of that what you want. The
(40:48):
issue became they didn't create negative plays, and that's what
you and I had been talking about quite a bit, right, Like,
there was no negative plays from this team. Their their
league average in terms of turnovers, they don't they don't
(41:08):
do a particularly great job of stopping the pass. Uh
they face the most passing attempts in the league, and
then they've obviously until this last week and then they've
given up like the fourth most passing yards in the league.
And we talked about that quite a bit. It's it's
interesting that when you went and spent all that money,
(41:34):
allot that investment, and you don't get pressures, tackles for
lost force, fumbles, interceptions, or pass breakups consistently. Like they're
twenty first in the Havoc rating, which is all of
those metrics combined into one, you know, first divided by
defense or defensive snaps played. They're twenty first. They just
(41:55):
don't create negative plays and so so that that puts
them at a deficit because, as you said, if they're
not getting home, if they're not getting home consistently, then
they're there. It's death by a thousand cuts. And that's
(42:18):
almost worse. Right, Like, at least if it was a
big play, like consistent big plays, you'd be like, ah,
they just got to figure out how to stop them.
But it's not. It's like it's like, you know, six
yards here, eight yards here, six year and you're like,
holy crap, can you guys get off the field, And
it's consistent in the second half of games. And that's
(42:40):
and that's what somebody's gonna have to really bear down
and look into, is like are they calling the defense differently?
Are or are other teams just that much better at
making adjustments to what the Cardinals are doing? And then
there's no counter adjustment by the Cardinals. They're like, well,
this is what do what can we do to fight back?
(43:04):
They've already figured out what we do right like that,
that's kind of what it seems like. We get a
week out.
Speaker 4 (43:13):
Yeahh such a I mean, how can we change things?
Speaker 3 (43:20):
That's the thing is is I don't think it's going
to get any better this week with Green Bay because
they can run the ball, they've got a good passing game,
and then on top of that, like not even defensively,
but offensively, they've got a pass rush that's like it
this this The Colts hit Jacoby Brissette twelve times in
(43:47):
that game. They had just the just the two sacks,
but he was hit twelve times. And well that's turning
back to the offense. But defensively, like they've got to
make a stop in.
Speaker 2 (43:58):
The fourth quarter.
Speaker 3 (43:59):
That that that's the sad thing is that we expected
this defense to be better, and while through three quarters
it's been better, the money quarter it's not been good
at all. It's been just as bad as it's been
since Jonathan Gannon took over. That it's no different. The
difference is that the offense was struggling to if the offense,
(44:21):
if the offense has been if the offense had been
performing the way it performed last week, you know, we'd
be we'd be wondering about the defense, but we wouldn't
be freaking out. But now it's like you look at
the Saints game, Okay, they were just think they were ahead,
they were comfortably in Carolina, but then like you can't
stop any we can't stop Matt Jones, darnold. You know,
(44:43):
there's always big plays, and there's that's the thing. There's
always big plays that come with it. And so it's
I don't know what the answer is. I don't know
what the answer is for this, But unless it changes,
I don't think it's gonna matter what the offense does
unless we get back to to Pro Bowl.
Speaker 2 (45:01):
Kyler, Right, And that's what it comes down to, right,
more than anything else that you and I've kind of
discussed in this whole thing is that you guys can
say like, oh, well, you know, he's got to be
better or Jacobe okay, all that's fine, well and good
like if that's your if that's your takeaway, then you
(45:25):
know we can we can go with that. But is
it going to lead to wins? And and it feels
like the obvious answer is no, it's just not And
and well, you know, how do you know? Because in
(45:47):
seven years they don't win. They win half as much
when he's not the quarterback. Whether or not you think
that matters, it does. And so you have to have
the the guy that gives you the best chance to
(46:08):
win games. And so if you're saying like, well I
think Jacoby does, it's like okay, then then keep doing that.
There's nothing wrong with it at all. But don't be
upset with with the outcome, because the outcome is going
to be they're not going to win games. Like that's
just we've seen it time and again, so there's no
(46:31):
reason to to think that. You know, what is that
the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over
and over and expecting a different results. And that's kind
of where I'm at with all of this. Is like
I don't expect much. And you know, I understand in
(46:51):
in this organization that that Murray is a you know,
a quarterback that that's going to be seven in ten.
They're gonna they're going to be a seven and ten
team because that's just what he has been. But I
also understand in this organization that the alternative is a
team that's going to be, you know, three and fourteen
(47:15):
or four and thirteen at best. So would I rather
see three additional wins the season? Yes, that would be
my answer.
Speaker 3 (47:28):
Yes, absolutely, and that that essentially is it until they
get things fixed. That if it can be fixed, the
offense will have to be good. Otherwise, like the only
way to avoid this is to build a big enough
lead is to build a multi score league that.
Speaker 2 (47:48):
And then just hang on for dear life.
Speaker 3 (47:49):
Yeah, exactly exactly. And with that, we will go ahead
and wrap up this edition of The Rise of Here
with podcast It's our Cardinals Talking. We got two more
shows this week as we get ready to for the
Cardinals to play the Packers. I've got Mark Oldacres who
joined me in the off season to do our opponent
preview and Seth and I'll be back later this week
to do our own preview picks and prediction. So until
(48:11):
then that's seth Cox. I'm Jess Ruth. Thanks for listening.
As always, we're back again soon.
Speaker 1 (48:16):
Thanks for listening to the latest edition of the Rise
Up Sea Red podcast. Listen to previous episodes and subscribe
to the show on Apple Podcasts, Stitcher Radio, Audio Boom,
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(48:37):
We'll be back soon for the best hour of cardinals
talk on the web, Rise Up Red, CEA, B, Red
Sea Red, and of course Rise Up Sea Red.
Speaker 3 (49:05):
Theve is it B? There is it B?
Speaker 4 (49:09):
There is it B?
Speaker 1 (49:12):
There is It
Z Z. This is the Rise Up Sea Red podcast
all about the Arizona Cardinals and the NFL, featuring insider
and outsider perspectives. Enjoy the best hour of Cardinals Talk
(00:23):
on the Web.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Now Here are your hosts, Jess Root and Seth Cox.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
Those are the Cardinals fans and welcome to the latest
edition of the Rise Up Seward podcast, the bestarre a
Cardinals Talk on the Web. I'm your host Jessroots fromcardsware
dot com, USA, today's NFL wre site that covers the
Arizona Cardinals, and this is episode seven hundred and nine.
It is our review episode as we look back at
the Cardinals thirty one to twenty seven lost in week
(00:53):
six to the Indianapolis Colts. And to help me with
that is my co host Seth Cox from Revenge of
the Birds dot com espienationsers on a Cardinals site and
Seth it was a Honestly, the Cardinals performed better than
I thought. I thought they were gonna get smoked, and
they did better they I guess it's out of the
(01:16):
losses that the Cardinals have had, this is the best
feeling loss I suppose, wouldn't you.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Say, I mean, I guess if if that's how you
want to look at it, it's it's interesting that that's
become the like rationale, right, It's like, oh, I feel
better after this loss than I did the other losses.
And to me, that's just a sentiment of like kind
of telling on yourself that you don't really care about
(01:43):
windsor losses, you just care about who's under center in
those wins or losses. Yeah, and something that you know,
I've already pointed out before, you know, is Kyler Murray's
win percentage excellent. Absolutely not. I mean we talked about
it for forty something something like that win percentage, but
(02:09):
it's better than the now sub twenty two percent win
percentage that they have.
Speaker 3 (02:14):
With double double their win total without Kyler that one win,
they doubled it.
Speaker 2 (02:21):
So so yeah, it's just interesting to see how how
people go about it and stuff like that, because I
have the same feeling I've had for five weeks now
that man, the defense that was supposed to be the
solid foundation of this team really sucks in the fourth quarter.
Speaker 4 (02:44):
Yeah, it does.
Speaker 3 (02:45):
We will talk about the defense, but we have to
talk about because everyone's talking about it, and this is
this is this is not burying the lead. And this
is we're going to talk about Jacoby Brissett and the
performance of the offense. We're going to talk about, you know,
Kyler moving on from Kyler, and then we'll get to
the defense because we can't we can't not talk about
(03:05):
that right stuff. So let's start by talking about Jacoby
Brissett and the offense. This offense on honestly performatively, statistically,
full on production. This looked like the offense that we
expected from the Cardinals this year. They put up twenty
seven points, They had four hundred yards, the first time
they cracked four hundred yards this year. Jacob Prissett threw
for three hundred and twenty yards two touchdowns, did have
(03:27):
the one pick. It was not a dominant rushing performance,
as they rushed for only eighty eight yards. But you know,
they were down to two running backs for most of
the game with Michael Carter and Bam Knight, as we're
no no James Connor, no Tree, Benzon and Amariti Mercado
got hurt as well. But like you look at what
(03:49):
the offense did four hundred yards nine to fourteen on
third down. They that the three hundred and twenty they got.
You got big performances from Trey McBride, a catches aty
two yards and a touchdown. Say Jones had his finest
like I think he I think he surpassed all of
his previous Cardinals production.
Speaker 4 (04:10):
In one game.
Speaker 3 (04:11):
He had five catches for seventy nine yards, Michael Wilson
four catches forty four yards, one two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight.
Nine different players had receptions. So Brissette was giving the
ball around. Yeah, So what what are your thoughts about
the overall performance of the offense in that in that game?
Speaker 2 (04:30):
I thought they did a nice job, uh, you know,
working the passing game because they couldn't run the ball again.
You know, it's one of those things that you you
watch the game unfold, and it was always going to
come down to if they could get a stop like
(04:51):
it has for the last six weeks, and something you
and I have talked about is that they just haven't
at all. And so to see the offense, you know,
this is the first time the offense had the ball
last technically I mean technically not but right like technically
had the ball last right like to go.
Speaker 3 (05:11):
Down, and they they had an offensive chance to go
win a game this time.
Speaker 2 (05:15):
Yeah, yeah, and that's the that's the first time this
has happened all season and and just couldn't get it done.
You know, It's it's funny because it's not too far
off the career averages from what Brissett did. I know,
the yardage at three hundred and twenty yards was was
(05:36):
up there. But like, if you look at his career
in general, one of the things you see is that,
you know, he's about a sixty percent asser as a
or you know, he he was sixty one point four
percent in this game his career sixty one. You look
(05:56):
at you know, the yards per attempt, they're right in
the line with his career, and so it was it
was that game of volume, right, Like this was the
most passes Brissette has thrown since twenty twenty two, when
he threw forty five passes for the Cleveland Browns that season.
(06:22):
It is the fourth most passes he's thrown in his career,
you know, it was. It was the third most passing
yards in his career. And you look at you know,
like his quarterback rating, this isn't I mean, that wasn't
even a top twenty game and so I think when
(06:43):
you look at how Brissette performed, it was comparable to
what the expectation should have been. Like I said, the
yardage was a lot, and I'm not taking anything away
from the yardage, but the yards per attempt, those those
(07:03):
type of things, they fall, you know, kind of right
in line with what we've seen from Brissette throughout his career.
And it was just that they they were able to
or chose to give him a higher volume of throws,
like I said, the fourth most attempts in his career
in a game. And it's an interesting juxtaposition of why,
(07:31):
because I think it was that they felt that was
the best way to control possession because they knew that
Indianapolis would would be able to move the ball, so
(07:53):
to speak, like like the Cardinals did a decent job
against Daniel Jones, would, wouldn't you say, But offensively, they
had to keep the ball in the time of possession
in their in their hands, and once again they they
did that. Something you've kind of pointed out over and
over and over and over and over again is that
(08:17):
the defense every week should never be tired. Because the
Cardinals win the time of possession, they're not on the
field as much, and it just seems like they in
those situations they can't get off the field. And this
week without Murray and his legs, because as we talked
(08:37):
about going in this game, he's been their best runner
all season, just because between James connor injury Trey Benson's injury,
he's been the most consistent guy. They were at a deficit,
you know, before the De Mercado injury, and so they
they leaned on Jacoby Brissett and he was he was
more than up for the job. I mean, he even
had a nice little little run right where he's animals
(09:00):
for twelve yards, picked up an extra first down and
kind of set them up. But it kind of goes
back to the problem with the offense in general. When
jacobri Bressett has, you know, roughly a fourth of your
rushing yards in a game, your your your run offense
(09:23):
is lackluster at best.
Speaker 3 (09:25):
Right, And what I look at is like if Brissett
had a fine game, like the passing game looked much
smoother than it had in previous weeks. The play calling
was also different. They called far more passes and as
a result, they they were not behind the sticks nearly
(09:47):
as much. They did much better in a lot of things.
The the receivers stepped up overall, and you have to
like Brissett did a fine job. And when I see
the performance like that, well, if Brisset did that, what
would Murray have done comparatively? And I'd like to think
(10:11):
we like, if Brissette could do this, Murray would have
done that.
Speaker 4 (10:16):
Well.
Speaker 3 (10:16):
Maybe maybe not the volume of yards, maybe had to
run a few, but the idea that they could get
to four hundreds. We've watched Kyler take a offense do
four hundred yards. We saw it regularly last season. And
I also look at this and say, oh, did the
the Colts just tell on themselves a little bit that
they let a James connerless Trede Benson list Kyler Murray
(10:39):
list and then for most of the game Marvin Harrison
lists Cardinals offense roll up four hundred yards? Did that
they defensively give themselves give, you know, release a fraud
alert in terms of their defensive play. I don't want
to take away from Brissette did did because the numbers
(11:01):
are there, he got guys involved, there was production, but
there's also a reason for that. Now, did it look,
did it look smoother and better than what we'd seen
from the offense with Kyler Murray through for most of
the time. Yes, it did. And drive wise they were
(11:23):
they were so much better. Like in the second half.
Well there they went touchdown, touchdown, field goal and then
failed on the final drive, which was ultimately the part there.
And you know, Prissette couldn't quite make the play that
he needed to. He made one play, but the one
that counted he did not. You can, if you want,
(11:45):
blame Brissett's throw to cause Marvin Harrison having to go
back which led to him getting hit and tackled and
then had this helmet hit the ground because he had
to go back for a pass a little behind him. Obviously,
the interception after the mc wilson interception was terrible, but
(12:06):
overall Brissett did well. The Running Game reminded me of
old times, right, it reminded me of old times. You
know Cardinals in the Running Game. But I will say
this either way, Kyler or Brissett. To see a number
of players get involved offensively and have production. The fact
(12:29):
that Jay Jones stepped into Marvin Harrison's role had five
catches for seventy nine yards. McBride had a very McBride game,
eight catches for seventy two. Like I said, Michael Wilson
picking things up, Elijah Higgins having a couple of catches.
But we do have to like Zay Jones. Production wasn't
because necessarily Jay Jones had a great game. He simply
(12:52):
moved into Marv's position, and basically what we would have
seen if Marv doesn't get hurt, Zay probably has one
or two catches and Marv goes for over one hundred,
which is kind of what we would have expected. And
so overall, there's not much to complain that. There's not
much to criticize about the offense other than the timeliness
(13:13):
at the final drive and we get to see it
once again. You know, will Hernandez in the lineup was
a difference maker, even if Will Hernandez himself is not
greeting out particularly well, that unit, getting that offensive line
unit that honestly, it's the first time since Week one
(13:33):
of last year that they had those five starters in
the game together, the offensive line that was envisioned for
all of last year. They played one quarter last year,
one quarter before Jonah Williams went down because by the
time Johan Williams came back, Will Hernandez was down. And
so to get the Paris Evan yelled Will and Jonah
(13:57):
offensive line finally to get other you know, I think
that contributed to a lot of sum of their uh
success offensively.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
Yeah, And and I mean you saw, you saw how
the game would is gonna go or things of that intro.
I was talking to somebody offline a little bit about it,
and and you know they were talking about just the
willingness to adjust things for Jacobe in the nature of
(14:34):
what they did, and and it talks and it shows
that the offense or what the offense in terms of
how they want things to go, and and the fact
that they don't have a running game kind of speaks
(14:54):
to to the the problem with this style of offense,
right is it it is based heavily on on being
able to run play action passings of that nature, and
and not being able to do that all year, you know,
it created this needing to throw the ball all over
(15:15):
the field and and so to get four hundred yards
of offense, you know, that's great, Like that's a that's
a great accomplishment in and of itself. And and and
you look at it, and they outgained the the Colts,
(15:35):
they outpossessed the Colts, They were better on on they're
down than the Colts. You know, they tied the turnover battle.
And so you look at that and you go, well,
how do you lose that game? I mean, the net
numbers overall should speak to this being a team that
that wins this game. But the reality becomes once again
(15:57):
that that this the way that the offense operates is
that it cannot close out games. And like we said,
for the first time, it was a chance to close
(16:18):
out the game with them having possession, and it didn't happen.
So it was different in how it went how it
went about things. But you know, for the first time
they had the chance to put the game away and
win with you know, thirty some on seconds left I
think it was, And we once again saw sorry, fifty
eight seconds. We once again saw that this coaching staff
(16:50):
really struggles with the end of game situations. And that's
something that we talked about last week. You know, Jonathan
Gannon left with what all three timeouts in his back pocket, right, uh.
Speaker 4 (17:10):
Kind of stave him.
Speaker 3 (17:10):
He gets he gets an end of season bonus for
unused timeouts, right, exactly like me and my sick leave
that I am that I am banking so that I can,
you know, have twelve hundred hours banked by the time
I retire in a few years. And the same thing
with the timeouts.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
But think about this dress. They got the ball first
and ten at the twelve, right, so you can get
a first down or score touchdown, and there's a minute
sixteen left in the game. The Cardinals didn't call a timeout.
They never ran the ball. They never like they played
(17:50):
the end of the game like they had no timeouts
left and they had to score, which they did. I
don't want anybody to get that wrong, but but they didn't.
I mean they never ran once and and they gained
(18:11):
three yards and that that great running game. And and
so you look at you look at that, and you go,
what were you doing? I mean, the Colts were calling
time out because they were like, shoot, we all know
(18:36):
if the Cardinals do score, we can go tie it
up in three plays maybe maybe maybe.
Speaker 4 (18:43):
Four that would have happened, Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2 (18:50):
And so and so you look at it, is that
why are you at the end of the game playing
as though you're the team that doesn't have the ball,
and you're the team that's not controlling the clock and
potentially the outcome. That was just a really interesting sequence.
(19:14):
It has nothing to do with Jacoby has I don't
think a whole lot to do with with Petsing, but
maybe it does. Maybe maybe Gannon was like, I'm not
using the timeouts in case we don't score, but like,
I don't know, why would you look at it from
that lens right, like, Oh, we're not going to score,
(19:36):
so I want these timeouts in case we in case
what like you have to score four points. So even
if you know, by some miracle you stop the Colts
once they got the ball back with fifty three seconds,
what was your plan? Like you had to score a
(19:57):
touch so you're just hoping for a hell mayor like
it's just again these end of game, end of or
end of half, Like we've talked about it before. There's
just I don't know, it's something missing and this I
know this didn't have to do with Brissette, but it
led to the offense as a whole, and you're going,
what are you doing? Like why are you not buried
(20:21):
on first and ten from the twelve because you can
get a first down, you can run the ball, you
can run draws, you can run screens, you can do
a whole bunch of different things because you have all
three timeouts and you're forcing the colt's hand at this point.
It was just a really interesting, interesting end of the
game scenario there for the Cardinals.
Speaker 3 (20:45):
Next on the Razz of Secred podcasts, Bestar Cardinals Talking,
we talk a little bit more. It's about the quote
unquote quarterback controversy that we're trying to stir up. That's
got an next and Rise of Secret Back on the
Rise of Sered podcast Best Our Cardinals Talk, lib talking
quarterback controversy or it feels like people want a quarterback
controversy after one solid start by Jacoby Brissette. Yeah, Jonathangann
(21:11):
is not having anything of it. He says Kyler's the starter.
People asking well it can would it be good just
to rest Kyler this week so that he gets to
buy as well? He's healthy enough to play, He's gonna play.
I feel that that question and answer is kind of
(21:32):
silly because we don't know whether Kyler has a multi
week injury to begin with, right, So to ask, oh,
you know, just rest him, because if he doesn't play
against Green Bay, it could it could look like either way,
it could look like, oh, he's not quite there. So
(21:56):
we're just gonna rest him. He could play, but we're
not gonna make him. We're not gonna do it. Or
he's healthy and or he's not healthy, like one of
the two things. So I think it's paints people into
a corner and there's no good way for Gannon to answer,
and so he did the best he could.
Speaker 4 (22:13):
He's like, if he's healthy, he's gonna play. He's gonna play.
Speaker 3 (22:17):
I would like to point out kind of the hogwash
that there was in the report. So Saturday night, Adam Shefter,
espn Ian Rappaport NFL Network both reported that they expected
Jacobe Prissette to start, that they get that information from
the team somewhere. Rapaport also added this tidbit, saying that
(22:38):
the Cardinals were leaving the door open and would decide
on Sunday. And then in the same tweet, if you
were talking about and then in the same breath, said
that that injury could sideline him more than one week.
I'm like, which isn't Is he gonna play or is
he gonna miss more than one week? And then Gannon
kind of told on himself after the game that he
(23:01):
knew on Saturday whether Kyler was going to play or not.
And so the extra line that Rappaport had of the
door is still open, the door was never opened. They
decided on Saturday. In fact, the Cardinals always decide on Saturday.
They might rarely have a true game day decision, but
(23:21):
pretty much they planned. They make their roster moves based
on that one hundred percent. And so yeah, it's really
interesting how that goes. But the notion that Jacoby should
replace Murray, how crazy is that? Like, is have we
(23:43):
got the way? Has Kyler been so bad that he
needs to be replaced by a guy that's always going
to be replaced?
Speaker 2 (23:52):
I mean, it's just the nature of the beast. When
you don't win enough, that's how it's always going to be.
And that's something that you know, you and I have
talked about. It's just it's always interesting to me. And
again I've never said that you shouldn't move on from Kyler.
(24:16):
I think you and I have done a pretty good
job of being like, no, if the right guy is available,
you absolutely go do it. It's just moving on for
the sake of moving on. Is it's how you end
up well being the Cardinals, right like you just you
(24:36):
end up chasing your tail so to speak, in the
same sucky suckiness that you've you've had for basically the
the history of the franchise. And and for the Cardinals.
(24:58):
You know again, I you have a guy that has
a you know, zero point four four to three winning percentage,
and that's not good. I don't want anybody to think
that I'm saying it is good. You're you're basically a
seven and ten team every year. Nobody wants to be
seven and ten every year. On the flip side, the
(25:22):
Cardinals are now and I just want to make sure
I'm correct on this four and fifteen without Kyler, and
so that's a you know, point two one one winning percentage.
Speaker 4 (25:43):
And that is that's including his entire career, right.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
Yeah, all seven years that he's been you know, on
the team, so usually only health reasons that he hasn't
started again. So I guess the question is, do you
is it the average to slightly below averageness of the
(26:13):
Cardinals with Murray or is it the just bad of
the other quarterbacks that you prefer. And so that's always
what my question is. Now, you know, if Jacobe comes
out and wins, and they move to five and fifteen
(26:33):
in the twenty games that Kyler Murray has missed, and
you have a you know, a point twenty five winning percentage,
and you can look at it from that course of things,
But you know, again, what are are you waving? Here's
the thing if you go with with Brissette moving forward,
(26:58):
which is what it is, whatever are you're waving the
white flag and you're saying, Okay, we're going a different
way in twenty twenty six. By the way, you will
still have Jacoby Brissette as your starter in twenty twenty six, right,
because like, you're you're not going to start a rookie,
(27:19):
would you? I mean, I would not think so, but maybe,
I mean, who knows. That. Being said, you also are
dangerously close to being the Tennessee Titans or you know,
the the Jaguars or who was the other team that
(27:40):
drafted a quarterback number one and then fired everybody immediately.
Like that's what you're kind of looking at. And that's
and that's what makes it hard because if you if
you start Jacoby this year and you only win four games,
so you know he goes to and whatever that would be.
(28:05):
You're basically at that point saying, well, we know that
he's going to be bad next year, but it's you know,
we're gonna get a rookie and east that person in
the job with Jonathan Gannon and maybe a new OC
I don't know. Maybe not again, I don't know, but
(28:29):
I would love to know. What the thought is that
Brissette gives you a better chance to win? Is it
just based off the one game like that you're like, well,
you know, I had three hundred and twenty yards passing, okay,
And again, Jess and I have said like he had
a nice game, Like it wasn't terrible, it was good,
(28:55):
I wouldn't say it was great by any means. And
and they he had them in a position where they
could win a game. I guess if that's the goal,
then we should probably just ignore the first five games
and act like they lost those games and they were
never in a position to win any of those games, right,
(29:16):
because that's that's the reality of it. And so and
so that's what the question becomes, is like what is
what are you trying to accomplish overall this season, you know,
are you trying to accomplish continuing to build and win,
(29:37):
or are you trying to accomplish like we can, you know,
get back to to throw in the ball and having
four hundred yards of total offense and losing football games
that way as opposed to three hundred and fifty yards
of total offense. I guess, I guess if that fifty
(29:57):
yards is what makes fans happy, then you know, you
go with what makes fans happy?
Speaker 4 (30:01):
Right, makes sense? Makes sense.
Speaker 3 (30:04):
Coming out of the next of the podcast, Best our
Cardinals Talk in the Web, time to talk about something
that we needed, that we've been talking about for a while,
and that's the problems on defense. Coming on Extra NICUs,
he read back on the rise of this here podcast
Best our Cardinals Talk on the Web. Finally, finally people
are talking about the defense now that Kobett is in
the lineup and he made everyone feel happy. So now
(30:27):
all that's left is the fourth quarter defense that the
Cardinals have. And I will say this, I will say this,
you can't you have to remember that Indianapolis came in
with one of the top offenses in the NFL. Jonathan
Taylor is a beast. He's the league, the league's leading
rusher and touchdown score. Tyler Warren is a fantastic tight end.
(30:49):
They've got good weapons, and Daniel Jones's happened a really
good year. But the fourth quarter the Cardinals turn. The
Cardinals defense turns the Swiss cheese and is much. And
here's the thing, Drew nick Rowlis gets a lot of love.
I when are we going to start talking about roles
(31:11):
in the fourth quarter because they keep giving up big plays.
They don't stop anybody. Now, it was both offense and defense.
But here, here is the third Here, here's the second
half for the Colts. It's field goal, touchdown, touchdown, and
(31:32):
then ran the clock out.
Speaker 4 (31:34):
And so.
Speaker 3 (31:37):
Jonathan Taylor goes for over one hundred and twenty, Daniel
Jones has who touchdown passes, Tyler Warren has six catchs
for sixty three yards, and it just continues to be
where they've I think I saw the stat from somebody
is that the Cardinals have made five fourth quarter stops
(31:59):
this year, five and technically one of those was Tennessee's
interception touchdown, Because if you get an interception, that's technically
a stop. And so in six games there's been four
four defensive stops, right, and that's great, that's.
Speaker 2 (32:19):
So bad, right, And like I talked about, like, they
haven't forced a punt since the first game in the
fourth quarter, Like literally since the eight fifty seven mark
in the first quarter or fourth quarter of the first game,
they have not forced a punt on defense. And people, again,
you and I talked about this, but people were like, well,
it's because Kyler and the offense can't stay on the field.
(32:40):
It's like, okay, So so that just excuses every offensive
or every defensive laps in every single game. And so
I was curious, Jess, and so you know, you know me,
I'm a curious fellow, and so I was just, you know,
kind of curious, like what what is the issue, Like
(33:04):
what what does it stem from? And is it something
that has been a problem and it really has. And
what's interesting is, you know, again it's it's hard to
go back and look at things and get a grasp
for how they went and stuff. But you know, Jonathan
Gannon's defenses as a whole, in losses, they typically have
(33:38):
a lead before surrendering the game. So what I mean
by that is is like, it's not like there's a
lot of games where the Cardinals or you know, his
one season with the Eagles, even though they lost only
four games total, it's not like a lot of those
(33:58):
games are like, oh, they just get their doors blown
off from the jump, right. You know, in that Eagle season,
he had a game where he had a fourteen to
seven lead after the first quarter and the Commanders went
on to score sixteen points before the Eagles were able
(34:25):
to do anything again, and then they ended up losing
thirty to twenty one. In that In that Eagle season,
there was a game where the Eagles had a twenty
seven to seventeen lead with nine minutes to go in
the third quarter and ended up losing forty to thirty four.
(34:45):
That's that's twenty three points in twenty four minutes of
game time. They lost a game to the New Orleans Saints.
That was the one game where you could say like, oh,
his defense didn't get trounced, right, Like they just they
(35:06):
just lost kind of like kind of like the Bills
game last year, where like it got off to a
rough start on defense and then and then you know,
they just were never able to get back into it,
and then of course there's the Super Bowl, which everybody's
aware of, you know. The the Eagles have a twenty
four to fourteen lead at the half. They they go
(35:28):
up twenty seven to twenty one, and then very Jonathan
Gannon in Arizona like right, twenty four to fourteen at
the half, the Eagles or the excuse me, the Chiefs
score and and make it twenty one twenty four. The
(35:53):
Eagles offense goes on, goes out and uses eight minutes
of game time and gets held to a field goal. Tough,
I know, to just give to get held to a
field goal, but eight minutes a game time, Jesse, it
goes from nine to thirty to one forty eight in
the game. They kick a field goal, they go up
(36:13):
twenty seven to twenty one. What does Jonathan Gannon's defense do?
They immediately allow the Eagles to go and score or
sorry that the Chiefs to go and score again. So
now it's twenty eight, twenty seven Kansas City. The Eagles
(36:37):
offense goes three and out. Chiefs get the uh that
long return from Kadarius Tony. They score again. Now they're
up thirty five twenty seven. So finally the Chiefs offense,
you know, gets back into it four minute, four plus
minute drive and it's tied again, thirty five to thirty five.
What what happens again, Jess? Immediately the Chiefs go down
(37:04):
like this is. And again it's really hard to see
these things when you're winning, right, you're fourteen and three,
you go to the Super Bowl. Everybody, hey, everybody's happy.
But when you look into it, there are the warning
signs were there. They're just cluttered by greatness. That was
(37:25):
that that Eagles roster. And now it's happening. You know,
it happened last year in the Minnesota game, right where
there wasn't a lot of games where the Cardinals were
were up big and then then gave up a bunch
of points. It was usually close games, right whereas back
(37:45):
and forth, back and forth and forth. But you can
look at a couple of those games, right, you can
look at, uh, the Carolina game, that was one where obviously, sorry,
the Minnesota game obviously is the first one where they
have the lead late in the game, four hundred and
six total yards of offense. They hold the Vikings to
(38:09):
two hundred and seventy three yards of offense and lose
how do you lose that game? Jess, Like, how do
you lose that game? And it's in it, you know,
it was always like, well it was Kyler. Kyler, you know,
threw that bad interception. Yeah, so so it was you know,
it was Kyler, and you're like, okay, you know, you
(38:30):
don't think much of it. You're like whatever, like, you know,
quarterback cost you a game. But but then again you
look deeper into it and you go, well, the second half,
the Vikings missed a field goal, they punted, and then
they went touchdown, field goal, touchdown. In the second half,
(38:53):
the Cardinals went field goal, touchdown, interception, field goal. They
held the ball more more than the Vikings and they lost.
And so it was like, well what And then you
go back to the Panthers game, right, kind of similar,
(39:14):
and so the writing's been on the wall like this.
Whatever they do laight in games is an issue of
of like being able to get stops consistently. And it
goes back to Gannon's time in Philadelphia, which makes the question,
(39:38):
you know, and you talked about it with Rallis, like
is it a Rallis thing or is this how Gannon
wants his defense run in those situations, and it's starting
to feel like the answer is that's how Gannon wants
his defenses run in those situations.
Speaker 3 (39:52):
Right, Yeah, it's basically what it kind of looks like,
is is exactly that is he doesn't want to and
and the thing is he's Here's where things are faltering
is that they're not getting home when they rush for
they don't have the pass rush to be able to
(40:13):
do it. And if they do have the pass rush,
then the secondary is that they never get both parts
in the sync late in the game.
Speaker 2 (40:23):
Well, and that was something you and I talked about
quite a bit. Right Again, one of the things that
you and I have harped on is that this defense
they did a nice job in terms of points and
we can't take that away. Like they were third in
points per game entering this week. They're now fourteenth, by
the way, So make of that what you want. The
(40:48):
issue became they didn't create negative plays, and that's what
you and I had been talking about quite a bit, right, Like,
there was no negative plays from this team. Their their
league average in terms of turnovers, they don't they don't
(41:08):
do a particularly great job of stopping the pass. Uh
they face the most passing attempts in the league, and
then they've obviously until this last week and then they've
given up like the fourth most passing yards in the league.
And we talked about that quite a bit. It's it's
interesting that when you went and spent all that money,
(41:34):
allot that investment, and you don't get pressures, tackles for
lost force, fumbles, interceptions, or pass breakups consistently. Like they're
twenty first in the Havoc rating, which is all of
those metrics combined into one, you know, first divided by
defense or defensive snaps played. They're twenty first. They just
(41:55):
don't create negative plays and so so that that puts
them at a deficit because, as you said, if they're
not getting home, if they're not getting home consistently, then
they're there. It's death by a thousand cuts. And that's
(42:18):
almost worse. Right, Like, at least if it was a
big play, like consistent big plays, you'd be like, ah,
they just got to figure out how to stop them.
But it's not. It's like it's like, you know, six
yards here, eight yards here, six year and you're like,
holy crap, can you guys get off the field, And
it's consistent in the second half of games. And that's
(42:40):
and that's what somebody's gonna have to really bear down
and look into, is like are they calling the defense differently?
Are or are other teams just that much better at
making adjustments to what the Cardinals are doing? And then
there's no counter adjustment by the Cardinals. They're like, well,
this is what do what can we do to fight back?
(43:04):
They've already figured out what we do right like that,
that's kind of what it seems like. We get a
week out.
Speaker 4 (43:13):
Yeahh such a I mean, how can we change things?
Speaker 3 (43:20):
That's the thing is is I don't think it's going
to get any better this week with Green Bay because
they can run the ball, they've got a good passing game,
and then on top of that, like not even defensively,
but offensively, they've got a pass rush that's like it
this this The Colts hit Jacoby Brissette twelve times in
(43:47):
that game. They had just the just the two sacks,
but he was hit twelve times. And well that's turning
back to the offense. But defensively, like they've got to
make a stop in.
Speaker 2 (43:58):
The fourth quarter.
Speaker 3 (43:59):
That that that's the sad thing is that we expected
this defense to be better, and while through three quarters
it's been better, the money quarter it's not been good
at all. It's been just as bad as it's been
since Jonathan Gannon took over. That it's no different. The
difference is that the offense was struggling to if the offense,
(44:21):
if the offense has been if the offense had been
performing the way it performed last week, you know, we'd
be we'd be wondering about the defense, but we wouldn't
be freaking out. But now it's like you look at
the Saints game, Okay, they were just think they were ahead,
they were comfortably in Carolina, but then like you can't
stop any we can't stop Matt Jones, darnold. You know,
(44:43):
there's always big plays, and there's that's the thing. There's
always big plays that come with it. And so it's
I don't know what the answer is. I don't know
what the answer is for this, But unless it changes,
I don't think it's gonna matter what the offense does
unless we get back to to Pro Bowl.
Speaker 2 (45:01):
Kyler, Right, And that's what it comes down to, right,
more than anything else that you and I've kind of
discussed in this whole thing is that you guys can
say like, oh, well, you know, he's got to be
better or Jacobe okay, all that's fine, well and good
like if that's your if that's your takeaway, then you
(45:25):
know we can we can go with that. But is
it going to lead to wins? And and it feels
like the obvious answer is no, it's just not And
and well, you know, how do you know? Because in
(45:47):
seven years they don't win. They win half as much
when he's not the quarterback. Whether or not you think
that matters, it does. And so you have to have
the the guy that gives you the best chance to
(46:08):
win games. And so if you're saying like, well I
think Jacoby does, it's like okay, then then keep doing that.
There's nothing wrong with it at all. But don't be
upset with with the outcome, because the outcome is going
to be they're not going to win games. Like that's
just we've seen it time and again, so there's no
(46:31):
reason to to think that. You know, what is that
the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over
and over and expecting a different results. And that's kind
of where I'm at with all of this. Is like
I don't expect much. And you know, I understand in
(46:51):
in this organization that that Murray is a you know,
a quarterback that that's going to be seven in ten.
They're gonna they're going to be a seven and ten
team because that's just what he has been. But I
also understand in this organization that the alternative is a
team that's going to be, you know, three and fourteen
(47:15):
or four and thirteen at best. So would I rather
see three additional wins the season? Yes, that would be
my answer.
Speaker 3 (47:28):
Yes, absolutely, and that that essentially is it until they
get things fixed. That if it can be fixed, the
offense will have to be good. Otherwise, like the only
way to avoid this is to build a big enough
lead is to build a multi score league that.
Speaker 2 (47:48):
And then just hang on for dear life.
Speaker 3 (47:49):
Yeah, exactly exactly. And with that, we will go ahead
and wrap up this edition of The Rise of Here
with podcast It's our Cardinals Talking. We got two more
shows this week as we get ready to for the
Cardinals to play the Packers. I've got Mark Oldacres who
joined me in the off season to do our opponent
preview and Seth and I'll be back later this week
to do our own preview picks and prediction. So until
(48:11):
then that's seth Cox. I'm Jess Ruth. Thanks for listening.
As always, we're back again soon.
Speaker 1 (48:16):
Thanks for listening to the latest edition of the Rise
Up Sea Red podcast. Listen to previous episodes and subscribe
to the show on Apple Podcasts, Stitcher Radio, Audio Boom,
or many other podcast platforms so shows are delivered directly
to your mobile device. Please give the show a five
star ready and always support the sponsors who support the show.
(48:37):
We'll be back soon for the best hour of cardinals
talk on the web, Rise Up Red, CEA, B, Red
Sea Red, and of course Rise Up Sea Red.
Speaker 3 (49:05):
Theve is it B? There is it B?
Speaker 4 (49:09):
There is it B?
Speaker 1 (49:12):
There is It
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