March 7, 2025 • 52 mins
On this episode of "The Rounds" TJ De Santis, Brandon Mccaghren, Matt Elkins, and Keelan Lawyer preview the upcoming UFC Fight Pass Invitational & UFC 313 cards. They also discuss what might be next for Alex Pereira should he win Saturday night, if the Fight Pass Invitational should implement divisional championships, and if Justin Gaethje's rematch with Rafel Fiziev is a better match than the originally scheduled fight with Dan Hooker.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Oh, there's a cool and not a canon nor out
in the while. If you keep pushing going a heavy roll,
soul is on fire.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
All right, I'm gonna start talking right now because this
song is so awesome and I don't want the world
to see me dancing and singing. Start the Rounds.
Speaker 3 (00:20):
So the number one podcast in the world.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Hey everybody, I'm TJ, just saying this along with the
man who knows b.
Speaker 3 (00:26):
Mac Brandon mccatherine. It's weird, Brandon.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
We're in the same building, but you insisted on not
being in the same room as me as we did
this podcast.
Speaker 3 (00:34):
I don't really know why.
Speaker 4 (00:36):
Well, it's just a general rule I like to keep.
If I can avoid being in the same room with you,
I like to do that. And so here we are.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
Let me say I arrived last night. We're in Las Vegas.
FPI is tomorrow. Came to your room last night. You
haven't left your room since you got here. It's a
parent by the amount of food that is stacked up
in there. But that's a whole other situation. We've got
more stars on this show. My favorite and I think
(01:06):
everyone's mother's favorite star of the Rounds. It is the
mouth of the South Matt Elkins on a new and
improved sound setup.
Speaker 3 (01:15):
Let's hear those sweet.
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Pipes, ladies and gentlemen.
Speaker 6 (01:20):
It is great to be live with you all now
at the Rounds v's up.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
Yeah, we're making it happen, come hell or high water.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
And none of this would be possible without the man
who really can do pretty much anything. I like to
call him Keelan Can because Keelan can do anything, Keelan
Lawyer holding it down. Back at the main Rounds studio headquarters,
how are you hello?
Speaker 7 (01:43):
Everybody doing great? Missing my main man b Mack. He's
in a poorly lit hotel rooms.
Speaker 3 (01:50):
I mean, do you really miss him? Like this is
time away?
Speaker 2 (01:52):
I guess maybe it makes the what they say, the
distance makes the heart grow fonder.
Speaker 7 (01:57):
I get his spinny chair today, so that's cool.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
That's Bmac will testify. That's my least favorite thing about
when Brandon's in the main studio.
Speaker 4 (02:05):
Yeah, he always get in trouble because I moved to
my just spin and like a jute Yeah here, but
I'm leaned in close on this mic.
Speaker 3 (02:13):
So yeah, So we're making it work.
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I'm excited to try these chips. I have not done
so yet. Did you bring any?
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Speaker 3 (03:34):
What a strong endorsement, to be honest with.
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You, Ohan's got one bag.
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He probably hid that as soon as it came in, too,
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Speaker 2 (04:55):
I like it absolutely all right, let's get into some
jiu jitsu talk. It will kick off our buy or
sell category of the show, my favorite segment each and
every week here on the rounds we got we got
to buy or sell a little drop now.
Speaker 4 (05:11):
I mean he's he's eating jerky chips over there.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
Man. You see he slacks Keelan can But it's more
like Keelan could wouldn't be You.
Speaker 4 (05:21):
See what happens when the room I guess, man.
Speaker 3 (05:24):
You gotta crack the whip.
Speaker 5 (05:26):
I don't appreciate this treatment.
Speaker 3 (05:27):
Sorry.
Speaker 6 (05:28):
The gym always runs a little different when the coach
is out of town, you.
Speaker 3 (05:30):
Know, all right?
Speaker 2 (05:34):
First topic of buy or Sell this week, The f
P I hits the Apex tomorrow here in Las Vegas,
and it's being billed as the most stacked FPI card today,
headlined by a rematch between Nicky rod Nick Rodriguez and
Victor Hugo got a phenomenal co main event, Oliver Taza
(05:54):
takes on the all action Pinato Canudo buyer b Mac.
Is this the most stacked UFC fight passivetational card we've
ever seen?
Speaker 4 (06:07):
Bye? And I would have bought it even harder if
we hadn't lost the main event with Adele Fornarino versus
Fion Davies that that was set to be probably the
most anticipated match that we could have right now amongst
active competitors on the scene. At the top level, I
think everybody still wants to see Gordon versus Craig. Everybody
(06:30):
still wants to see Gordon versus Nicky Rod, but it
doesn't look like that's really gonna happen. I think maybe
we we're ending nearing the end of the Gordon Ryan air.
I don't think we're gonna get to see him compete
too many more times, if at all. And so yeah,
based on who's available, I mean, this card is top
to bottom. It's phenomenal. Nicki Rod versus Victor Hugoes the
(06:52):
new main event, yep, and that's a rematch again. I
think this is either the I know it's at least
the third time they've met, maybe the fourth time. Victor's
gotten him each time either by decision or by points.
Their last matchup was very close, very close. It really
came down to it looked like it was gonna be
(07:12):
anybody's match on a decision, and then Nicky took a
chance jumped on a straight ankle lock. At the end
of the match, Victor took advantage and put him down
positionally ended up getting a just because the way it
ended a pretty clear cut decision. So yeah, I think
Breonna Saint Marie versus Elizabeth Clay is another rematch. That's
(07:33):
a I think that's their third one. They've split one
in one. Loves Canudo, that's a you got Taza back
in the card, dude, Ronaldo Junior in the house, Nathan
had it stepping up from the PGF. Gonna be taken
on Achilles Roacha. That's a killer match. That's my If
(07:53):
you don't know, now you know match guys. Olyippi Coast
has taken on Ronaldo. He's ADCC medalists, and it's just
stacked all the way up and down. You've got a
couple of youngins and uh Kassiamura is on the card.
I think she's somebody who shows a lot of promise.
So I'm very very happy with this card.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
Actually, yeah, absolutely, Sarah Galvao on this card taking on
Kasi Amorta, and I think you have to buy because
this is the most stacked, you know, on paper, and
it lost, like you said, a huge main event. And
when you are still able to put on a card
that is this highly anticipated?
Speaker 3 (08:32):
Easily, I think it is the most stacked. Are you
buying it as well? Matt Alkin, Yeah, you gotta buy that.
Speaker 6 (08:38):
Nikki rod is musty TV right now in the in
the industry. I think that these cards keep getting better
and better, So I am buying that.
Speaker 5 (08:45):
It's the biggest one to date. But I am hopeful that,
you know, I would love to see our boy Gordon.
Speaker 6 (08:50):
Ryan get get it together and be able to compete
a couple more times on some of these shows. But yeah,
I do think that this this card sounds super excitement.
Especially I'm to see some of the PGF vets getting
in there rustling some feathers, so it's going to be
a good one.
Speaker 3 (09:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:05):
Daniel Saffler on this card as well. We saw him
in PGF season six. You know this, you know, we
talk about Gordon. I think we all owe Gordon a
debt of gratitude for what he's done to elevate the sport,
and that's something that has been really high on his
mind throughout his you know, career run that he not
(09:25):
only you know, wants to establish himself as the king,
but also really sort of elevate the sport of jiu jitsu,
and he's always going to be a narrative. Especially with
Nicky Rod in the main event, there's a narrative of Gordon.
I think we have a lot to you know, sort
of you know, tap up Gordon each and every time
we see him, because he's elevated the sport at the
highest level, and now the UFC is all in. What
(09:48):
they're trying to do here in twenty twenty five is
really change the sport of jiu jitsu and how it
is promoted. And we're going to get a good example
of that coming up here on Thursday Night tomorrow. That
leads me to my next sort of question here on
buy or sell. Belts have always been a mainstay the
(10:13):
reason you fight.
Speaker 3 (10:14):
It's prize fighting.
Speaker 2 (10:15):
Obviously, there's money involved, a lot of high stakes, you know,
beyond just getting that win in your hand raised, But
belts and divisions and rankings, it's something that we've always
seen in combat sports. So I'm gonna start with you,
Matt Alkins, buy or sell the Fight Pass Invitational needs
(10:36):
to implement belts and a ranking system for their divisions.
Speaker 5 (10:41):
It definitely helps.
Speaker 6 (10:43):
I think that that's just one of the best promotional
values that you can you can give to somebody, like
even at just like a local jiu jitsu tournament, a
local wrestling tournament, a local MMA fight, you hand them
the little twenty five cent medal and it just feels
some type of way. You throw a strap a belt
over their shoulder, and now all of a sudden, it
feels like the World Wrestling Championship, the heavyweight title and
(11:04):
everything like that. So I think that it's a must.
As soon as you create the rankings and everything like that,
the people are going to start dissecting.
Speaker 5 (11:10):
It gives good talking points.
Speaker 6 (11:12):
I think that it's absolutely must happen that they organize
some of those promotional things.
Speaker 2 (11:18):
Yeah, you know, I don't think I need to even
ask b Mac if he is buying this, because I
know you and the PGF board bought a sweet belt
the last couple of seasons to give the PGF champion.
The belt is the focal point. And I mean, I
don't want to speak for you, B Mac, but I
think you're buying this thing all day.
Speaker 4 (11:37):
I'm definitely buying it. It's important we need to have
a number one so that we can have storyline like
how can you rise to become number one if there's
not a number one to be had, right, And so
let's set somebody at the top and yo, I don't
care who it is, anybody you want to give the
belt to, and let's start building a path to get
(11:59):
that thing. I think that gives not just for the athletes,
but for the fans too. It gives us something to
talk about, It gives us matches to make. It gives
us people to fall in love with as they try
to make their way towards the top of the mountain,
or people to learn to hate, Like how do you
have baby faces and heels if there's nothing that they're
fighting for?
Speaker 3 (12:20):
Yeah, and if you're just.
Speaker 4 (12:22):
If the narrative is always just going to be how
much do these guys get paid? Which look an important
narrative that's great or all jiu jitsu's underrate. Whatever the
narrative is, it's like it's like charity case, like pay
attention to us, Like no, no, no, we need hard storyline.
And hard storyline is developed by having a guy at
(12:43):
the top of the mountain and having everybody else fight
to take what's his.
Speaker 3 (12:48):
And that's the thing too.
Speaker 2 (12:49):
The narrative it goes beyond just the belt, because like
you said, you don't even necessarily care who gets it
at first. Once there's a champion, and once you do
your post fight interview in the APEX and say you're
the champion, you're the number one in the world. Because
you have that belt, people might make an argument that
someone else is the champion, and then they become the
people's champion, and then that drives a desire to see
(13:10):
them get that opportunity. And I just I think that
there couldn't be anything more powerful in this jiu jitsu
sport right now than saying someone is the UFC's grappling champion.
Speaker 4 (13:24):
I think it's absolutely the number one thing that has
to happen for Five Pass Invitational to build what it
is that they're trying to build. I think that's more
important than who the athletes even are.
Speaker 6 (13:35):
Yeah, and I think we've worked through that phase where
maybe that kind of stuff wasn't in place. I feel
like they kind of stuck their toe in the water
a little bit. But I do, like I said, these
cards are getting better and better, and I do think
that it's time for them to make that call.
Speaker 2 (13:48):
I just want to see what a UFC Grappling Championship
belt looks like to me.
Speaker 4 (13:53):
It's not even really about the bling of the belt,
like that's just cool or whatever. It's a nice photo lot,
but it's not really about that. Like it could be
like Mat said, it could be a five dollars medal
at the top. It doesn't matter. It's it's saying that
I'm number one and having no one be able to
argue with it, and it's striving to become that and
(14:14):
either doing it or falling short. Like I need those
stories as a consumer, I need those stories. As a viewer.
I need those stories. I need to be able to
fall in love with these guys along their journey as
they you know, go out there and win main events
and as they crash in front of everybody. I need
those things.
Speaker 2 (14:33):
Yeah, and just the concept of going out there and
having a match where someone's trying to take that away
from the defending champions everything.
Speaker 6 (14:41):
Yeah, it's gonna give them chances to create characters as well.
You saw that in the in like the early wrestling
like WWFWWE days and then of course like the UFC
does a tremendous job.
Speaker 5 (14:51):
Do you guys at the PGF do a.
Speaker 6 (14:52):
Tremendous job, like pushing and promoting narratives and characters and
stuff like that. And as soon as you strap a
belt on somebody's waist, that's yeah, that's where it starts.
Speaker 3 (15:03):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
Absolutely, And we're at a time now where jiu jitsu
rank and those belts have never kind of been more
meaningless than they are. Like I remember calling Daniel Montasoyo
a blue belt and he's crushing black belts on that stage,
and it's like, there should be a championship belt. Like,
obviously your belt rank is important to your journey, but
when it comes to competitive sports, those belts don't really matter.
(15:26):
Black belt versus a purple belt doesn't mean what it
meant ten fifteen years ago. And I know you're saying
it doesn't matter what it looks like, b MAC. I
just I have tremendous faith in the UFC in developing
a belt that I would want to buy the six
hundred dollars replica.
Speaker 4 (15:42):
Of Well, I'm not saying it doesn't matter, I'm saying
it's less important.
Speaker 2 (15:47):
Fair enough, all right, there's another belt on the line
in Las Vegas this weekend.
Speaker 3 (15:53):
Alex poetson Pejeda.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
He puts his light heavyweight championship on the line against
mangamed Uncleliev by or Sell b MA will start with you,
Uncle Live has a chance in this fight.
Speaker 4 (16:07):
Sell absolutely sell. You know, coming into the last time
that I was at T Mobile, or actually two times
ago that I was at T Mobile with the UFC,
you were there TJ. Proshka versus Pooton, and I was
probably one of the only people who was saying that
I thought pro Hoshka had had a little bit of
a chance. I felt like he was getting overlooked a
(16:29):
little bit, and that turned out to be not true
at all. He got totally smashed out. Yeah, this time,
I feel like people are saying that Uncle Liev has
a chance, and I'm taking the other side. Uncleliev has
no chance. I don't see a world where he wins this.
I don't see a path to victory for him. He's
gonna come out and out. I don't think he's gonna
(16:51):
come out and out wrestle. And if he does, he's
got to get through that range. He's got to enter
dangerous territory just to get close. I know he's a
sucker for leg kicks. He's gonna get eaten up. I
think second round, dud, I see a blowout on the
on the way.
Speaker 3 (17:08):
I'm with you. I'm selling it all day.
Speaker 2 (17:11):
A lot of people that are buying it, or even
just at least entertaining it. They point to the Unclaiah
wrestling game as a path to victory. He just doesn't
do it often enough in fights that he should be doing.
Speaker 4 (17:25):
His takedown percentage is not that good.
Speaker 3 (17:28):
It's some like twenty percent, That's.
Speaker 4 (17:29):
What I'm saying. Man, It's not like he's some incredible wrestler.
That's not true.
Speaker 3 (17:36):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:37):
One thing that I will say that sort of worries
me about Beta is he is long in the tooth.
He's had a long career, maybe not on the MMA
side of things, but a long established kickboxing career. There
is some miles on him, and he's been incredibly active.
If there is something that happens in this fight where
we see an uncle aya of victory, the only concern
(17:57):
and thing that I think that would open that up
is maybe he's not the guy fights constantly. He's making
the most of a short window, but he's already put
together a resume that makes him one of the greatest
UFC fighters of all time and this guy was, you know,
making his UFC debut two three years ago. It's it's
pretty impressive. Matt Alkins. Is there any way you're gonna
(18:19):
buy an Unclelia victory or or.
Speaker 3 (18:21):
You selling brother?
Speaker 6 (18:23):
You gotta you gotta protect the bank a little better
than that. I'm gonna be selling that for sure. Even
even if you got a guy that you're expecting him
to take him down and out wrestle.
Speaker 5 (18:32):
Him, a guy like Alex Pereira.
Speaker 6 (18:34):
He does a fantastic job learning in the in the fight,
and so is he gonna Is he gonna secure five
takedowns and put him away? I think that he's got
to take him down and submit him on the on
the first one, because as the fight goes longer, he's
only gonna be more savvy and more picky with the exchanges.
Speaker 5 (18:50):
And he's obviously one.
Speaker 6 (18:51):
Of the best strikers that we've ever seen in any
of the divisions.
Speaker 2 (18:56):
Yeah, no, I to me, And this is the one
I think sort of unfortunate thing about Poeton And it's
maybe just my perception, maybe not the reality, but when
he fights, it's not a pop culture sort of talking
point like he deserves all of the attention that gets
(19:17):
casual viewers to turn tune in, like when it when
e Connor McGregor fights, or when a Floyd Mayweather fights,
Like I wish that his sort of brand was a
bit more established with people that maybe don't pay attention
to the UFC week in and week out.
Speaker 3 (19:32):
But uh yeah, I mean he must think.
Speaker 4 (19:37):
I think I sort of disagree with you there. I
think he's hitting across across lines a little better than
you might think. And also you mentioned earlier guys really
only been in the UFC for like three years.
Speaker 3 (19:51):
Yeah, it's crazy.
Speaker 4 (19:52):
So for him to be where he is mainstream right
now after just a two and a half three year
UFC career, think is actually pretty pretty telling as to
like how much the UFC has risen up in the
pop culture, like in the in this the mass culture,
like people get it. Yeah, the champion in the UFC,
(20:15):
if he's interesting, like that guy is interesting.
Speaker 2 (20:20):
So we we have come a long way. Because I
remember when Anderson Silva was destroying people and making it
look like it was and nobody, nobody seemed to care
as much, and a lot of it was the language barrier.
I think Anderson didn't speak English until the last couple
of fights, like he spoke English, but not publicly on
the mic. Uh, Alex Pejeda has captivated fans by really
(20:45):
saying one word, and that's shrauma.
Speaker 4 (20:48):
I think that's part of his appeal. He's he's a
guy of mystery. He's a man of mystery, and so
that's that's kind of cool, Like what is he talking about?
What is he thinking? Like, he's just nothing, dude, He's
a stone.
Speaker 6 (21:03):
I do think that if he if he wanted to
be a little more boisterous and speak out and stuff
like that, he could maybe grow his fan base a
little bit more. But you see, like the correction after
a guy like Connor McGregor comes and changes the game,
people really enjoyed some of the corrections in the other
direction where it just wasn't as mouthy or flashy or
(21:24):
whatever it is. And I do think that he gets
a lot of respect across the across the board and
kind of in pop culture. But like you're saying, he's
a very stoic, mysterious guy, and uh, I think that
a lot of people would like to see maybe a
little more from him, because obviously he's an incredible and
incredible athlete, which gets the people going.
Speaker 4 (21:44):
He's got a great sense of humor too, Like he
didn't mind like a little joke being played on him.
You know, he doesn't mind like having some having some
fun with his character a little bit. And I think
that's you. He's got a couple of little signature things
he does. The stare down the arrow, well, you know
that's that's cool man. Little things like that hit really hard.
(22:05):
Little memes.
Speaker 6 (22:07):
Have you guys seen the sparring footage that the owner
of Karate Combat runs the goat shed I think it's
in Southward or something like that. Did y'all see this
young kid sparring with Alex Pereira and just threw him Alex.
You know, Poton put himself to the wall to kind
of like show this kid like the kid was trying
too hard, put himself against the wall, and this kid
(22:29):
crow hops in and is wooms. I mean, this kid's
one hundred and maybe seventy pounds, young kid clearly just
like overdoing it, and he just like, I mean just
completely fatal or Milianco just eats this overhand right from
this kid.
Speaker 5 (22:45):
And then he didn't he did not kill the kid.
Speaker 6 (22:48):
I was just like he has such you know, even
in just jiu jitsu, some young kid tries some goofy
neck crank or something like that.
Speaker 5 (22:55):
No, you know, no arm in.
Speaker 6 (22:57):
Triangle, you feel a little disrespected. You might have to
put put a little heat on him. But uh, he's
he was very calm and relaxed. I just couldn't believe,
like seeing that like behind the scenes kind of thing
from him was uh kind of telling of you know
his uh.
Speaker 5 (23:13):
Is yeah, because I would have I would have killed
that kid.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
I mean, I don't know.
Speaker 2 (23:18):
I don't know if that kid is brave or an
idiot to try to go that.
Speaker 3 (23:21):
Heart against Poeton. I mean he's an idiot.
Speaker 5 (23:24):
That kid is a complete moron.
Speaker 6 (23:26):
That kid game to the to the camera afterwards, it
was like speed kills power. It's like brother, what brother God?
In the South, in the South, we say God, bless you.
Speaker 3 (23:38):
I thought, its bless your heart. Yeah, bless your heart.
Speaker 5 (23:41):
Yeah, you know, it's all the same.
Speaker 3 (23:43):
B Max says that to me sometimes and I just
like walk off in shame. Bless your heart.
Speaker 5 (23:48):
It's like, damn, Shame's powerful.
Speaker 3 (23:51):
And then you hit me with of course, thank you.
Speaker 4 (23:53):
That's favorite when he does something ridiculous and I go,
of course you did.
Speaker 7 (23:57):
Hey boys, we've got a great buyers. Oh right here,
God on this Dana White snoop boxing promotion with TKO
and the Saudi's give me thoughts.
Speaker 2 (24:09):
Here's the thing with Dana when it comes to combat
sports and marketing, you have to buy almost everything he says.
I do think power Slap was going to have legs.
I'll be completely honest with you. Power slaps not necessarily
my thing. They just signed a seventy five million dollar
deal with YouTube. It's got legs and he's able. Anything
(24:31):
that Dana touches, he's got the minus touch. Anything he touches,
it just turns to gold. Now boxing it's a different beast,
it's a different animal. But you can already. I mean,
it's all rumors. I don't know exactly what's going on.
I haven't heard anything, but the people that Dana has
been talking to, you know, uh, the chic turkey like
(24:51):
he's doing what he needs to do behind the scenes
to put everything in place so that when he does
come out and make an announcement it's gonna be game changing.
The only thing that would cause me any sort of
doubt is just the boxing world. It's full of politics.
A lot of people don't want to take fights that
are dangerous. But uh, you know, with Dana and you
(25:15):
know Saudi money, I think they're going to be able
to get through all of that. And if Dana focuses
on boxing, it's probably going to become the biggest boxing
promotion in the world.
Speaker 4 (25:24):
I'll buy Dana absolutely crushing this. I'll sell boxing is
different than everything else. It's a different beast. I don't
buy that at all. How you do anything is how
you do everything. And if these guys that are involved
in boxing now don't want to get on board with
an obvious winning promotion, then you raise up a generation
(25:45):
that will get on board and you make new stars.
And you know, some guys won't be on board with that,
and that's cool. But Dana's gonna crush that. Like you said,
he power slap dude, power slap crushing it. Yeah, UFC
crushing it yeh in TKO. I mean they're coming for blood, dude.
(26:08):
They want every combat sport, they want every industry, and
I think right now is the time for everybody to
kind of go Yeah. I think we should all get
on board and at least learn and play ball with
these guys for a little while if we want, if
we want the industry to grow, so I think if
boxing wants to grow and become bigger and better, we've
(26:30):
seen the current model. Hey, it works for some guys, right,
doesn't work for the majority, and it doesn't work for
most fans. Let's be honest.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
What I think Dana will do right in what you
said is it doesn't work for most fans. Is we
need to get guys that are five and zero fighting
real fights. Most of these guys don't want to have
tough fights until they're twenty to oh. And you know,
I think the best thing that any up and coming
mixed martial artists can do, even before they get to
the UFC, is take a fight where they face adversity.
(27:00):
You don't want to face adversity under the brightest lights
in the sport. And I think it'll be interesting to
see if Dana puts on regular boxing events, if we
see that culture change to where I mean, you've got
guys with the contender that are two and oh, three
and oh taking on the toughest fights of their life
and that's just not heard of in in boxing, and
(27:23):
I think you have the nail on the head be Mac.
The culture is going to have to change, and if
you're not going to be on board, then you're not
going to probably be invited to one of the best
parties in all the combat sports.
Speaker 5 (27:36):
I gotta I gotta step in. I feel like I
gotta sell on this idea.
Speaker 6 (27:42):
Even though I do believe in Dana white Man, I'm
a huge fan of what he's done for the sport
of mixed martial arts. I think that for me, it
kind of resembles I don't know if you guys remember
the XFL, the Extreme Football League, but that was that
was put on by Mr McMahon, Vince McMahon from the WWE,
and it looked to have some legs behind it. I
(28:05):
think that we had the Birmingham Thunderbolts here in town
for a season or whatever it was. I think that
it's a big industry to tap into, and I think
that if he is able to successfully find something that
is different about the promotion instead of just another boxing promotion,
which obviously he's a very he's a great businessman, he's
gonna come at it from a different angle. But before
(28:27):
I guess what I should say is, before I'm buying it,
I want to know what that twist is. I want
to know what that take is, because historically, whether it
be for promotional value or whatever, some of the boxing
industry loves to loves to disagree with our.
Speaker 5 (28:41):
With our boy Dana.
Speaker 6 (28:43):
But I am I'm very I'm absolutely paying attention because
I do think that it could be ultra successful, but
I definitely think that the culture behind boxing is gonna
be a little reluctant to to buy it in the
very beginning.
Speaker 2 (28:56):
I'm gonna sell your XFL analogy though, because what Vince
mick Man doing with sports entertainment and he tried to
come into a sport that is very much a x's
and o's sport, and Dana's not trying to come into
a stick and ball sport to try to change the narrative.
He's coming into a combat sport, which he knows that
(29:17):
space better than anybody. He's flourished in that space better
than anybody. I get what you're saying, but I don't
think it's apples to apples and saying that Dana is
trying to do something with a sport that you know
isn't already sort of his bread and butter. And also too,
a lot of people don't know Dana's roots are in boxing.
You know, he was focused on boxing. He wasn't necessarily
(29:39):
a promoter, but he comes from a background where boxing
was long his first love before it was MMAH.
Speaker 6 (29:49):
And I definitely think that the boxing, the boxing community
could use a little hand man.
Speaker 5 (29:56):
I think that you see the rise of MMA compared
to boxing as old as boxing is a or.
Speaker 6 (30:00):
I definitely think that there's some wiggle room to make
some corrections and make some adjustments, and so I am
excited to see how he does that.
Speaker 5 (30:07):
But I do think it's a very very large task.
Speaker 3 (30:10):
We'll see what happens.
Speaker 4 (30:11):
I'm just most interested in the word league. What is that?
What is that? He's a boxing league? What is that?
How does that structure look? I think that's the real
telling difference here, like if this could be successful or not?
Like what are you gonna build as far as infrastructure
is concerned. That could be the big difference in whether
(30:33):
it works or whether it doesn't. I'm I'm buying. I
think I think it works. I think just that you're
trending towards the word league tells me that you've got
something else up your sleeve besides super fights.
Speaker 2 (30:44):
I would be impressed if he's able to pull off
a league. I still think that the league concept in
combat sports, especially cancuss of combat sports, it is very difficult.
Speaker 4 (30:54):
To do well. It can look at look, it can
look a lot of different ways. But what is the
concept of a league if you can just basically like
boil it down to preseason, regular season, postseason, right and
and a defined time so that people can be into
it this season and then ramp up for it again
(31:15):
next to like that's that's the part of the announcement
that interests me the most. What is that structure going
to look like?
Speaker 2 (31:24):
The only thing I worry about that the idea of
league is you kind of hamstring yourself in giving fans
what they want. If you have to have a league
structure where certain you know, fighters have to fight this
guy before they can have the fight that that we
all want, you're you're doing yourself a disservice. But if
it's a league in a season in the sense of
(31:45):
like the Contender Series, they have seasons, they have a
twelve week season, it's more of like a television season
then then yeah, that's fine.
Speaker 3 (31:52):
But if it's if it's this is.
Speaker 2 (31:53):
Your schedule, you have to fight all three of these guys.
Speaker 4 (31:57):
That idea, that's a very broad idea.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
Yeah, right, what.
Speaker 4 (32:04):
Does that structure look like? I think that's going to
be the key determining factor to whether or not this
venture is successful.
Speaker 2 (32:12):
Let me ask you this, because I think worldwide, I
think there are more mixed martial arts in UFC fans
than there are boxing right now. I think that this
is the combat sport of this generation. When you look
at even jiu jitsu, I think it's easier to get
MMA fans to get into the idea of jiu jitsu
(32:34):
because it looks a lot like mixed martial arts, it
can feel a lot like mixed martial arts. I don't
know if the average MMA fan who buys a pay
per view once a month, if they're all of a
sudden going to be all in on boxing.
Speaker 4 (32:48):
I think they're all in on boxing. I think it's
just as hard of an ask, or maybe even harder
as you're alluded to, to get an MMA fan to
go to boxing versus get an MMA fan to go
to jiu jitsu. Like to me, jiu jitsu feels much
closer to MMA than boxing does. Boxing does not feel
like a fight. Everybody calls it a fight. Boxing does
(33:10):
not feel like a fight. Every time they get into
a fight and boxing they break them up for cheating
like that is great. The I don't understand you bring
up very interesting I'm being honest.
Speaker 2 (33:23):
Do you think Dana Do you think Dana might have
a take on changing the rules a little bit, maybe
allowing a bit more clinch fighting in boxing, because, as
you said, when when things get a little bit grimy,
when when guys mix it up on the inside, referees
intervene a lot and separate them. I mean, I'm not
trying to say reinvent the sport a little bit, but
(33:43):
I would like guys to I think.
Speaker 4 (33:45):
The sport does me a little bit of reinventing, That's
what I'm saying.
Speaker 3 (33:49):
Yeah, I hope.
Speaker 4 (33:50):
Somebody's got some kind of idea to reinvent it because
I love to watch people fight and get punched in
the face, and I just can't every time I sit
down to watch a boxing that I got excited about,
I just leave the like disappointed.
Speaker 3 (34:04):
Right, because you didn't get what you wanted you didn't
get the fight. Yeah, yeah, I'm with you on that.
Speaker 2 (34:09):
It'd be interesting to see the adjustments that are made
from from that standpoint final buy or sell segment. It
goes back to our UFC three thirteen card. If Alex
Pajeda gets through Magum and Uncle Ive the way that
we kind of feel he does, his next fight is
at heavyweight.
Speaker 3 (34:28):
Anybody buying it?
Speaker 2 (34:29):
I mean the John Jones potential fight with Alex Pajeda.
Speaker 3 (34:34):
For UFC Heavyweight Championship.
Speaker 2 (34:36):
Man, I would give all the money I have to
watch that fight, mister Elkins.
Speaker 6 (34:45):
I'm going to as a fan, I would I would
buy that one hundred percent.
Speaker 5 (34:51):
I would love to see him fight at heavyweight.
Speaker 6 (34:53):
I think that as he maybe enters to the end
of his career, that would be an amazing accolade to
add to the mix. I just I didn't the UFC
get they got rid of multiple division champs simultaneously.
Speaker 5 (35:07):
Is that correct?
Speaker 2 (35:09):
What do you mean, uh, that they don't calling out
the division?
Speaker 4 (35:16):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (35:16):
Yeah, yeah, which I think that that's a that create
you know, allows there to not be as many log jams.
Speaker 5 (35:21):
But you know what's his incentive?
Speaker 3 (35:24):
Now?
Speaker 6 (35:24):
You know, I guess it's a stat on ESPN, But
I mean man to be able if he was able
to hold all three belts at once, like.
Speaker 5 (35:31):
My boy gonna do it for the GRAM.
Speaker 6 (35:33):
But uh, you know, I I'm definitely interested to see him,
like he's gonna fight the winner of a Jones aspinall matchup.
Speaker 5 (35:42):
Brother.
Speaker 6 (35:43):
Like I said, I'll agree with TJ. I'll empty the
bank for that. I would definitely buy that.
Speaker 5 (35:47):
Pay per view. But I don't know that we're gonna
see my man do it.
Speaker 3 (35:50):
Here's the thing, the narrative there.
Speaker 2 (35:52):
I would almost want it to be both John Jones
and Alex Paid his final fight because not only would
it be for the UFC's Heavyweight Championship, but you might
as well make another belt and just put goat on it,
because because whoever walks out of that fight their hand
raised with their stock where it's at right now, they're
(36:13):
gonna lay claim to the greatest combat sports athlete of
all time in my opinion.
Speaker 6 (36:18):
When you talk about pop culture, could you imagine, I
mean that would be something that we talked to. You know,
we're talking for years about John Jones versus poetan remember
you know everybody, Oh and I'm like freaking.
Speaker 4 (36:28):
Out John Jones versus peda loser leaves.
Speaker 5 (36:33):
The UFC, Francis Nganu into the chat brother.
Speaker 4 (36:39):
Oh man, I think that Francis and Ghano ship has sailed, dud.
I think in the UFC, especially well in the in
the in the world. His big breakout pay per view
sold ten thousand pay per views.
Speaker 6 (36:54):
Yeah yo, in the boxing one, no.
Speaker 5 (36:58):
No mma even uh of course, listen, you didn't even.
Speaker 3 (37:03):
You didn't even come top of mind that that happened.
That's how poor show did.
Speaker 4 (37:07):
No but the millions of dollars and he's got ten
thousand pay per view buyers.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
Now, the one thing that might be a disclaimer on
that is the pay per view model has changed a
lot that I don't know if that was terrestrial, like
I bought it on my television with my remote. I
tend to think it was all platforms. But yeah, when
when you're cares, right, yeah, who cares?
Speaker 5 (37:32):
I feel definitely not.
Speaker 4 (37:33):
If that's the number on any metric that you paid multiple,
multiple millions of dollars to find, it's a disaster.
Speaker 3 (37:42):
Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 5 (37:42):
So you're saying that Francis would go into the GFL.
Speaker 4 (37:47):
Maybe not just yet. And this is no shade on
Francis as a fighter. I'm not saying he's dying. I'm
saying the narrative on him is. I mean they're gonna
have to build it up from scratch again. Yeah, that's
that's a disaster, dude. Ten thousand pay per view buys
is a disaster. Yeah, And it's a disaster at a
jiu jitsu event, Like, oh no, what happened? And then
(38:08):
we take the biggest, strongest, most widely regarded, baddest dude
on the planet in an MMA fight and we debut
him out here against another guy who's very, very good,
and we sell ten thousand pay per views and we
spend ten million dollars. Yo, I don't know what to
tell you, Like, you can't walk away thinking that that
(38:30):
went well.
Speaker 3 (38:30):
Now.
Speaker 2 (38:31):
I think it was a reality check for Francis's team that. Yeah,
Francis is regarded as as a great heavyweight, one of
the best in the world. But Francis and Ghana without
the letters UFC attached to him just doesn't move the
needle unfortunately.
Speaker 6 (38:46):
I think, especially he didn't have anybody to dance with
outside of the UFC. Like already the boxing narratives are
kind of dried up. Some of the some of the
fights are kind of you know, those the heavyweight division,
I feel like has had a lot of the attention
and some of the big fights, and I feel like
some of those narratives are a little bit played out.
And if he had, if there were cross promote promotional
(39:08):
MMA titles or something like that, then I think that
we would be interested in seeing some Francis and Ghana fights.
But do I want to watch him dispatch of another
dude in the PFL ever again?
Speaker 5 (39:18):
Absolutely not.
Speaker 4 (39:20):
You know, you said that a lot of the heavyweight
storylines have played out. I'll use that as a segue
for me to say that I'm buying Pereta moving up
the heavyweight for his next fight, because the heavyweight division
in the UFC needs But Aida, they got one compelling storyline,
and it's that those guys won't fight right, you know,
(39:43):
Like the best storyline in the heavyweight division is Jones
and aspinall and we can't even get him to have
a match. We need put Areta in there. And he's
already made his rounds, dude. Look, he's already made his
rounds through light heavyweight. He made his rounds through middleweight.
We see what he is, and we see what he
is compared to the rest of the light heavyweight division.
(40:05):
We're running unclave out there. Okay, all right, listen, guys,
last one and last one. He's at the end of
the seminar. He's rolled twelve rounds and he's going, okay, okay,
I'll get one more with you, and he gets one
more and then thanks for coming to town. And it's
time for him in the heavyweight division and the heavyweight
division needs him.
Speaker 6 (40:24):
Yeah, such a testament to him as a fighter that,
like we said, every division, every division needs him.
Speaker 4 (40:30):
You know, that's a great point.
Speaker 3 (40:32):
Yeah, all right, So that's buy or sell this week.
Speaker 2 (40:35):
Now it's time for hot takes, and we're kicking off
with matt Elkins hot take this week, which I think
it's it's it's it's it's a hot take, definitely, but
I think there might be some plausibility to it.
Speaker 3 (40:51):
I'm gonna give the floor to matt Elkins.
Speaker 2 (40:53):
The hot take is that John Jones smashes Tom aspinall
should they meet inside the US He's octagon.
Speaker 3 (41:01):
You're saying, it's one way traffic.
Speaker 6 (41:04):
Brother, Listen, after I saw the way that Cyril Gone
moved around, and I was just like, oh my lord,
he's never gonna be able to touch him. And when
I watch other heavyweights, they just don't move like that.
They just don't have the instincts. I think that Tom
Aspinall is an incredible fighter. Tom brother, please don't beat
me up. But like I said, do I think that
he's gonna go out there and dispatch it the greatest
(41:26):
of all time. Every time that John Jones steps steps
out and comes back in, he is very, very focused.
Speaker 5 (41:33):
He's not coming back.
Speaker 6 (41:34):
Off this layoff with all this hype with a fight
and not being prepared and not in shape and not
ready to rumble, even if it's his last thing, even
if he's on the back nine of his career.
Speaker 5 (41:42):
Brother Ice is him.
Speaker 2 (41:45):
Yeah, I feel there's legs there. I feel there's more
pounds than victory for John than Tom. I mean, John
needs to make sure he just doesn't get hit. I
still am a little worried about him in the heavyweight division.
If he gets hit hard on the chin by a heavyweight.
He stood in front of steep A didn't take any
damage really that was significant. He did get hit a
(42:08):
couple of times Cyril Gone looked like a fish out
of water.
Speaker 3 (42:12):
Didn't do anything? Did John Jones?
Speaker 2 (42:14):
So an Aspenall victory, it's there, But you know, John's
got highly underrated grappling skills, phenomenal wrestling.
Speaker 3 (42:24):
I just he'd be my favorite.
Speaker 2 (42:27):
I don't know how big of a favorite, but I
think a smashing a vintage performance of John Jones.
Speaker 3 (42:34):
It's definitely on the table. Bemack what he feels.
Speaker 4 (42:36):
Not the only guy who remembers who John Jones is,
am I The only guy here that remembers is is
John Jones. Matt Elkins is John Jones. The guy who
sees somebody that he's more skilled than and more experienced than,
and works just as hard or harder anyway, is that
(42:59):
John Jones? Is that what he showed us in his career.
That's not the John Jones that's gonna step in there
against Tom Aspinall, dude.
Speaker 6 (43:09):
I think that he's got a lot of respect for
the young man. I think lifting heavy.
Speaker 4 (43:13):
I have no doubt that John Jones should be the
favorite and that he will win the fight. But to
think that that he's gonna come he's this new guy
now that he's at the end of his career. I
don't know if I buy that. Yes, especially I hope so.
I like a good I like a good baby face turn.
Speaker 6 (43:32):
I like that especially as the barbecue dad version of
John Jones.
Speaker 3 (43:38):
Brother.
Speaker 5 (43:38):
I'm just not betting against him. I just can't help it.
Speaker 6 (43:40):
If we talk about prime John Jones or whatever versus
this guy, not even a conversation, but can he beat
the overweight, slowest version that we've ever seen. Hopefully he's
got a shot at it. But like I said, if
he id them, I'll just you'll see the I'll just
send you the cheers emoji.
Speaker 4 (43:59):
I mean, that's that's not something I think John Jones
will win.
Speaker 5 (44:05):
To not lose John Jones.
Speaker 4 (44:07):
A walkover on aspinall I think is a step out.
I think it's a step out.
Speaker 2 (44:12):
It's fair when he when you look at the the
last few fights of Jones at two hundred and five pounds, like,
I'm not going to say that he wasn't prepared, but
he fought down. I think in a lot of ways
to the level of his competition. You know, split decision
against uh Thiago Meheta Santos, a fight against Dominic Rays
that a lot of people thought that Rays did enough
(44:35):
to win. Even going back to the first Alexander Gustison fight.
I mean, there were there were people that scored that fight,
uh for for Gus so.
Speaker 4 (44:44):
Even when he was fighting Cormier he was on substances
and not taking it too seriously.
Speaker 6 (44:50):
I do think that the two gusts of some fights
are kind of what our argument is. If the guy
that shows up at the first fight, Aspinall definitely gonna
shut me up. If the guy that shows up for
that second fight rolls in there, Tom Aspinall is gonna
be in trouble. Baby.
Speaker 4 (45:05):
I don't think a ball wins the fight regardless of
which John Jones shows up.
Speaker 3 (45:10):
We're not seeing ten eight rounds though.
Speaker 4 (45:11):
And you're one of the John Jones characters leaves a
big window for Tom Aspinall and one of them leaves
no window at all. I guess my question is, did
we forget somehow that this second version of John Jones exists,
and that not just exists, but he's likely to show
(45:32):
up and run the show.
Speaker 5 (45:35):
Only time?
Speaker 3 (45:36):
Brother? Yah?
Speaker 2 (45:38):
All right, my hot take this week. We were talking
about it last week. It was very unfortunate Dan Hooker
out of his fight with Justin Geechee. It's definitely a
blow to the card, but Gage's well, it's a blow
to the card in the sense that we're not getting
that highly anticipated fight, but a rematch with Raphael Physive
(46:03):
is phenomenal, and I actually think that that's my hot
take that this card has gotten better. This is a
better matchup, and I think we're gonna get more for
our money seeing these two rematch. I mean, Physis is
a tank of a man. He mixes it up in
(46:23):
a just way that everyone loves to see fight. Gaigee's
nickname is the Highlight. I think that this fight is
a better fight than Dan Hooker, who you know, has
looked good, but Dan's been, you know, someone who's been
bit by the injury bug.
Speaker 3 (46:39):
He's had long layoffs.
Speaker 2 (46:41):
I don't really know if I was sold on the
idea that we were going to see the best Dan
Hooker take on Justin Gaegee Saturday night at T Mobile. Obviously,
now Hooker injured and out, we definitely weren't going to
see it. I think this is a more competitive, more interesting,
and more fun fight seeing these guys running back.
Speaker 4 (47:00):
I totally agree with that take. I thought the first
Gaygee versus Phyziv fight was an incredible fight. It was
entertaining even I've went back and watched it two more
times since then, and it's still an entertaining fight. And
I tell you what else it does for us is
it gives us championship storyline potential. Still with Physive, we
(47:23):
still don't know who Physiv could be, right, I think
we I think we know who Dan Hooker is and
by the way, that's a gangster, but it's not a champion.
Speaker 2 (47:35):
Yeah, Hooker is a guy who takes Fight of the
Night checks time and time again. I don't know if
Hooker takes some world titles, you know what I mean? Uh, Physive,
there's still upside there that I think remains unexplored, and uh,
We're going to see a fight that means a lot
more when it comes to future opportunities, because I think
people were looking at Gaiche and Hooker as just this
(47:57):
sort of special that's it.
Speaker 4 (47:59):
It's just a fight to see who can get who
can kill somebody, which, hey, I'm down for Gaigie versus Phyziv.
There's storyline on the other side of that for both guys,
Like is this the fight where Gaigee. Look, he's peaked
and now and now he's continuing his slow descent. I'm
(48:22):
not saying that's what's going on, just saying that's a
question that could be asked. Is this physive? Can he
rise to this level? He's lost one to Gaigee already.
Is he better than the guy that lost to Gaigee?
We know he's down for a war. I think there's
still a lot of meat left on the bone as
far as the physique storyline goes.
Speaker 2 (48:42):
You think physiv Matt has an opportunity to get a
big win here, rise the ranks and is he championship material.
Speaker 3 (48:49):
In the UFC?
Speaker 6 (48:50):
You know, listen, the little Just Bleed character that lives
inside of my dark heart wants to say, like who
is that guy? You know what I'm saying, Like I
want to see Dan Hooker versus Justin Gaichie ten times
before I want to watch that other guy. He's an
incredible martial artist. Okay, but the Dan Hooker versus Justin
Gaigie fight for me personally?
Speaker 7 (49:13):
Uh?
Speaker 5 (49:14):
Like I said, Just Bleed, baby, I just.
Speaker 6 (49:17):
I need to see that that's gonna give you know, Like,
let's look at Max Holloway versus Ricardo Lomas. Maybe not
the highest level matchup of all time, but one of
the most iconic moments. I think that Hooker Gaichie gives
you maybe one of those iconic moments, and I just
I hate that the boys are not gonna get to
dance it out.
Speaker 3 (49:36):
I hate I look all this.
Speaker 4 (49:39):
All this does for me is tell me that you
didn't watch their first fight.
Speaker 6 (49:43):
Listen, I didn't say that Phyziv is not an incredible fighter.
Speaker 4 (49:46):
I'm not say to me right now. I didn't watch
Gaigie versus phys One.
Speaker 5 (49:52):
I would watch Justin Gaeche fight. Who is the other guy?
That's what I'm saying. You tell me that guy is
gonna run.
Speaker 3 (49:58):
The politician here answering your question, B Mac, I'm not.
Speaker 4 (50:02):
Watch did you watch gay Gee versus One?
Speaker 6 (50:06):
I'm saying that I've never watched a single Physia fight.
Speaker 3 (50:09):
Because who is that guy? You need to beat me
up as soon as we're show you.
Speaker 2 (50:16):
As soon as we're done with this show, Matt, you
need to log onto UFC Fight Pass and I'm going
to be apologized to B Mac.
Speaker 6 (50:24):
I'm gonna be so sad for the rest of my
life that Dan Hooker and Justin Gaatechie are never going
to fight each other. God bless physiv And as he
makes it to the top and becomes the champion or
whatever that guy's doing, because nobody's paying attention, but Justin
Gaigie versus Hooker off the card is a blow to
my dark heart. My little grinch heart has shrunk three
(50:44):
sizes again.
Speaker 4 (50:46):
You get off this call and you watch that fight,
and then you post a full and complete apology to
public apology on your Instagram.
Speaker 3 (50:59):
You destroy your credibility right now.
Speaker 5 (51:01):
You listen, It's fine.
Speaker 4 (51:04):
As a human.
Speaker 5 (51:06):
I didn't say that the dude wasn't a fantastic fighter.
I'm saying that, Damn.
Speaker 3 (51:12):
I do know.
Speaker 6 (51:12):
He's the little guy with the top knot, the short,
stuffy guy with the top knot.
Speaker 5 (51:15):
We know exactly you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 3 (51:17):
But he's a devastating muay Thai style striker who put
it on.
Speaker 6 (51:22):
Justin Dan Hooker and Justin get you're gonna stand there
and slug it out in my like I said, my
little just bleed, I'm gonna be shoving popcorn and bud
light in my face as I watched those two run it.
Speaker 4 (51:36):
You would do that with this, You're gonna get you.
Speaker 3 (51:39):
Yeah, yeah, you might even be more brutal. It might
even be more brutal. You're insane if you think it's
a snooze.
Speaker 6 (51:49):
Something right now, who is that guy?
Speaker 2 (51:56):
And I appreciate it because this is the right treatment
that matt Elkins gets. You embarrass yourself, probably your family.
We still love you, We still love you.
Speaker 5 (52:06):
Don't come and see me, come and see me.
Speaker 3 (52:10):
I need to watch my mouth. Matt Elkins can kill me.
Speaker 5 (52:12):
So we would put it to paper rock sys ors TJ.
I never do you like that? Brother?
Speaker 3 (52:17):
Okay, thank you. I appreciate it. On the way out here.
Speaker 2 (52:21):
Grapplers, the new season of the PGF documentary available now.
Speaker 3 (52:25):
New episodes come out on Friday.
Speaker 2 (52:27):
It's one of the best sports documentaries out there.
Speaker 3 (52:30):
And I'm not just saying that.
Speaker 2 (52:31):
If you are someone who enjoys stories, watch Grapplers, available
now on YouTube. That does it for us for b
mac Brand, mccatherine, the Uninformed, matt Elkins on TEJ to Dannis,
We'll see you next time for more of the rounds.
Speaker 3 (52:48):
Yeah,
Oh, there's a cool and not a canon nor out
in the while. If you keep pushing going a heavy roll,
soul is on fire.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
All right, I'm gonna start talking right now because this
song is so awesome and I don't want the world
to see me dancing and singing. Start the Rounds.
Speaker 3 (00:20):
So the number one podcast in the world.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Hey everybody, I'm TJ, just saying this along with the
man who knows b.
Speaker 3 (00:26):
Mac Brandon mccatherine. It's weird, Brandon.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
We're in the same building, but you insisted on not
being in the same room as me as we did
this podcast.
Speaker 3 (00:34):
I don't really know why.
Speaker 4 (00:36):
Well, it's just a general rule I like to keep.
If I can avoid being in the same room with you,
I like to do that. And so here we are.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
Let me say I arrived last night. We're in Las Vegas.
FPI is tomorrow. Came to your room last night. You
haven't left your room since you got here. It's a
parent by the amount of food that is stacked up
in there. But that's a whole other situation. We've got
more stars on this show. My favorite and I think
(01:06):
everyone's mother's favorite star of the Rounds. It is the
mouth of the South Matt Elkins on a new and
improved sound setup.
Speaker 3 (01:15):
Let's hear those sweet.
Speaker 5 (01:16):
Pipes, ladies and gentlemen.
Speaker 6 (01:20):
It is great to be live with you all now
at the Rounds v's up.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
Yeah, we're making it happen, come hell or high water.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
And none of this would be possible without the man
who really can do pretty much anything. I like to
call him Keelan Can because Keelan can do anything, Keelan
Lawyer holding it down. Back at the main Rounds studio headquarters,
how are you hello?
Speaker 7 (01:43):
Everybody doing great? Missing my main man b Mack. He's
in a poorly lit hotel rooms.
Speaker 3 (01:50):
I mean, do you really miss him? Like this is
time away?
Speaker 2 (01:52):
I guess maybe it makes the what they say, the
distance makes the heart grow fonder.
Speaker 7 (01:57):
I get his spinny chair today, so that's cool.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
That's Bmac will testify. That's my least favorite thing about
when Brandon's in the main studio.
Speaker 4 (02:05):
Yeah, he always get in trouble because I moved to
my just spin and like a jute Yeah here, but
I'm leaned in close on this mic.
Speaker 3 (02:13):
So yeah, So we're making it work.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
We're making it work on the road, and of course
none of this would work without our great sponsors. You know,
the first one to ever jump on board. It's Godfather
Jerky Chips. Where's the clip?
Speaker 4 (02:30):
I thought right now, I ain't come to me jerky.
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You know what I mean? You to call me Godfu.
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There we go, Godfather Jerky Chips, Go get yours at
Godfather Jerky Chips dot com. Uh spelled a little bit different,
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Speaker 3 (02:58):
You want to you want to get on the the
spelling of this for us?
Speaker 4 (03:01):
Yeah, you just flipped that a upside down. It turns
into a V.
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Speaker 6 (03:12):
So you say it after a little bit of moonshine,
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Speaker 3 (03:18):
What is that promo code? B Max?
Speaker 4 (03:20):
I think you can just use the code b MAC.
Speaker 3 (03:22):
All right, awesome.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
I'm excited to try these chips. I have not done
so yet. Did you bring any?
Speaker 4 (03:31):
Uh? No, because I ate them already.
Speaker 3 (03:34):
What a strong endorsement, to be honest with.
Speaker 4 (03:36):
You, Ohan's got one bag.
Speaker 3 (03:38):
Well, there we go.
Speaker 2 (03:40):
He probably hid that as soon as it came in, too,
so you didn't get to it.
Speaker 4 (03:43):
Hold on a sing too how many.
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I've been hiding them and you're not getting them.
Speaker 3 (03:50):
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Speaker 6 (03:51):
Hey, they got a they got a black pepper flavor
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Speaker 5 (03:58):
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Lemon pepper is the best one though.
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Speaker 4 (04:10):
That's the slogan. Godfather Jerki Chips. They got the pepper.
Speaker 3 (04:14):
I like it. I like it, TJ.
Speaker 5 (04:16):
That's a little thing that we call flavoring here in
the South. Brother.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
I like flavor, and if you know me, I like
to add salt to everything. But Salt Electro Lights actually
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Speaker 3 (04:44):
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Speaker 4 (04:45):
And in both jiu jitsu companies too, which is cool.
It's nice to have everybody playing in the same league here,
we're all moving in the same direction.
Speaker 2 (04:55):
I like it absolutely all right, let's get into some
jiu jitsu talk. It will kick off our buy or
sell category of the show, my favorite segment each and
every week here on the rounds we got we got
to buy or sell a little drop now.
Speaker 4 (05:11):
I mean he's he's eating jerky chips over there.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
Man. You see he slacks Keelan can But it's more
like Keelan could wouldn't be You.
Speaker 4 (05:21):
See what happens when the room I guess, man.
Speaker 3 (05:24):
You gotta crack the whip.
Speaker 5 (05:26):
I don't appreciate this treatment.
Speaker 3 (05:27):
Sorry.
Speaker 6 (05:28):
The gym always runs a little different when the coach
is out of town, you.
Speaker 3 (05:30):
Know, all right?
Speaker 2 (05:34):
First topic of buy or Sell this week, The f
P I hits the Apex tomorrow here in Las Vegas,
and it's being billed as the most stacked FPI card today,
headlined by a rematch between Nicky rod Nick Rodriguez and
Victor Hugo got a phenomenal co main event, Oliver Taza
(05:54):
takes on the all action Pinato Canudo buyer b Mac.
Is this the most stacked UFC fight passivetational card we've
ever seen?
Speaker 4 (06:07):
Bye? And I would have bought it even harder if
we hadn't lost the main event with Adele Fornarino versus
Fion Davies that that was set to be probably the
most anticipated match that we could have right now amongst
active competitors on the scene. At the top level, I
think everybody still wants to see Gordon versus Craig. Everybody
(06:30):
still wants to see Gordon versus Nicky Rod, but it
doesn't look like that's really gonna happen. I think maybe
we we're ending nearing the end of the Gordon Ryan air.
I don't think we're gonna get to see him compete
too many more times, if at all. And so yeah,
based on who's available, I mean, this card is top
to bottom. It's phenomenal. Nicki Rod versus Victor Hugoes the
(06:52):
new main event, yep, and that's a rematch again. I
think this is either the I know it's at least
the third time they've met, maybe the fourth time. Victor's
gotten him each time either by decision or by points.
Their last matchup was very close, very close. It really
came down to it looked like it was gonna be
(07:12):
anybody's match on a decision, and then Nicky took a
chance jumped on a straight ankle lock. At the end
of the match, Victor took advantage and put him down
positionally ended up getting a just because the way it
ended a pretty clear cut decision. So yeah, I think
Breonna Saint Marie versus Elizabeth Clay is another rematch. That's
(07:33):
a I think that's their third one. They've split one
in one. Loves Canudo, that's a you got Taza back
in the card, dude, Ronaldo Junior in the house, Nathan
had it stepping up from the PGF. Gonna be taken
on Achilles Roacha. That's a killer match. That's my If
(07:53):
you don't know, now you know match guys. Olyippi Coast
has taken on Ronaldo. He's ADCC medalists, and it's just
stacked all the way up and down. You've got a
couple of youngins and uh Kassiamura is on the card.
I think she's somebody who shows a lot of promise.
So I'm very very happy with this card.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
Actually, yeah, absolutely, Sarah Galvao on this card taking on
Kasi Amorta, and I think you have to buy because
this is the most stacked, you know, on paper, and
it lost, like you said, a huge main event. And
when you are still able to put on a card
that is this highly anticipated?
Speaker 3 (08:32):
Easily, I think it is the most stacked. Are you
buying it as well? Matt Alkin, Yeah, you gotta buy that.
Speaker 6 (08:38):
Nikki rod is musty TV right now in the in
the industry. I think that these cards keep getting better
and better, So I am buying that.
Speaker 5 (08:45):
It's the biggest one to date. But I am hopeful that,
you know, I would love to see our boy Gordon.
Speaker 6 (08:50):
Ryan get get it together and be able to compete
a couple more times on some of these shows. But yeah,
I do think that this this card sounds super excitement.
Especially I'm to see some of the PGF vets getting
in there rustling some feathers, so it's going to be
a good one.
Speaker 3 (09:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:05):
Daniel Saffler on this card as well. We saw him
in PGF season six. You know this, you know, we
talk about Gordon. I think we all owe Gordon a
debt of gratitude for what he's done to elevate the sport,
and that's something that has been really high on his
mind throughout his you know, career run that he not
(09:25):
only you know, wants to establish himself as the king,
but also really sort of elevate the sport of jiu jitsu,
and he's always going to be a narrative. Especially with
Nicky Rod in the main event, there's a narrative of Gordon.
I think we have a lot to you know, sort
of you know, tap up Gordon each and every time
we see him, because he's elevated the sport at the
highest level, and now the UFC is all in. What
(09:48):
they're trying to do here in twenty twenty five is
really change the sport of jiu jitsu and how it
is promoted. And we're going to get a good example
of that coming up here on Thursday Night tomorrow. That
leads me to my next sort of question here on
buy or sell. Belts have always been a mainstay the
(10:13):
reason you fight.
Speaker 3 (10:14):
It's prize fighting.
Speaker 2 (10:15):
Obviously, there's money involved, a lot of high stakes, you know,
beyond just getting that win in your hand raised, But
belts and divisions and rankings, it's something that we've always
seen in combat sports. So I'm gonna start with you,
Matt Alkins, buy or sell the Fight Pass Invitational needs
(10:36):
to implement belts and a ranking system for their divisions.
Speaker 5 (10:41):
It definitely helps.
Speaker 6 (10:43):
I think that that's just one of the best promotional
values that you can you can give to somebody, like
even at just like a local jiu jitsu tournament, a
local wrestling tournament, a local MMA fight, you hand them
the little twenty five cent medal and it just feels
some type of way. You throw a strap a belt
over their shoulder, and now all of a sudden, it
feels like the World Wrestling Championship, the heavyweight title and
(11:04):
everything like that. So I think that it's a must.
As soon as you create the rankings and everything like that,
the people are going to start dissecting.
Speaker 5 (11:10):
It gives good talking points.
Speaker 6 (11:12):
I think that it's absolutely must happen that they organize
some of those promotional things.
Speaker 2 (11:18):
Yeah, you know, I don't think I need to even
ask b Mac if he is buying this, because I
know you and the PGF board bought a sweet belt
the last couple of seasons to give the PGF champion.
The belt is the focal point. And I mean, I
don't want to speak for you, B Mac, but I
think you're buying this thing all day.
Speaker 4 (11:37):
I'm definitely buying it. It's important we need to have
a number one so that we can have storyline like
how can you rise to become number one if there's
not a number one to be had, right, And so
let's set somebody at the top and yo, I don't
care who it is, anybody you want to give the
belt to, and let's start building a path to get
(11:59):
that thing. I think that gives not just for the athletes,
but for the fans too. It gives us something to
talk about, It gives us matches to make. It gives
us people to fall in love with as they try
to make their way towards the top of the mountain,
or people to learn to hate, Like how do you
have baby faces and heels if there's nothing that they're
fighting for?
Speaker 3 (12:20):
Yeah, and if you're just.
Speaker 4 (12:22):
If the narrative is always just going to be how
much do these guys get paid? Which look an important
narrative that's great or all jiu jitsu's underrate. Whatever the
narrative is, it's like it's like charity case, like pay
attention to us, Like no, no, no, we need hard storyline.
And hard storyline is developed by having a guy at
(12:43):
the top of the mountain and having everybody else fight
to take what's his.
Speaker 3 (12:48):
And that's the thing too.
Speaker 2 (12:49):
The narrative it goes beyond just the belt, because like
you said, you don't even necessarily care who gets it
at first. Once there's a champion, and once you do
your post fight interview in the APEX and say you're
the champion, you're the number one in the world. Because
you have that belt, people might make an argument that
someone else is the champion, and then they become the
people's champion, and then that drives a desire to see
(13:10):
them get that opportunity. And I just I think that
there couldn't be anything more powerful in this jiu jitsu
sport right now than saying someone is the UFC's grappling champion.
Speaker 4 (13:24):
I think it's absolutely the number one thing that has
to happen for Five Pass Invitational to build what it
is that they're trying to build. I think that's more
important than who the athletes even are.
Speaker 6 (13:35):
Yeah, and I think we've worked through that phase where
maybe that kind of stuff wasn't in place. I feel
like they kind of stuck their toe in the water
a little bit. But I do, like I said, these
cards are getting better and better, and I do think
that it's time for them to make that call.
Speaker 2 (13:48):
I just want to see what a UFC Grappling Championship
belt looks like to me.
Speaker 4 (13:53):
It's not even really about the bling of the belt,
like that's just cool or whatever. It's a nice photo lot,
but it's not really about that. Like it could be
like Mat said, it could be a five dollars medal
at the top. It doesn't matter. It's it's saying that
I'm number one and having no one be able to
argue with it, and it's striving to become that and
(14:14):
either doing it or falling short. Like I need those
stories as a consumer, I need those stories. As a viewer.
I need those stories. I need to be able to
fall in love with these guys along their journey as
they you know, go out there and win main events
and as they crash in front of everybody. I need
those things.
Speaker 2 (14:33):
Yeah, and just the concept of going out there and
having a match where someone's trying to take that away
from the defending champions everything.
Speaker 6 (14:41):
Yeah, it's gonna give them chances to create characters as well.
You saw that in the in like the early wrestling
like WWFWWE days and then of course like the UFC
does a tremendous job.
Speaker 5 (14:51):
Do you guys at the PGF do a.
Speaker 6 (14:52):
Tremendous job, like pushing and promoting narratives and characters and
stuff like that. And as soon as you strap a
belt on somebody's waist, that's yeah, that's where it starts.
Speaker 3 (15:03):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
Absolutely, And we're at a time now where jiu jitsu
rank and those belts have never kind of been more
meaningless than they are. Like I remember calling Daniel Montasoyo
a blue belt and he's crushing black belts on that stage,
and it's like, there should be a championship belt. Like,
obviously your belt rank is important to your journey, but
when it comes to competitive sports, those belts don't really matter.
(15:26):
Black belt versus a purple belt doesn't mean what it
meant ten fifteen years ago. And I know you're saying
it doesn't matter what it looks like, b MAC. I
just I have tremendous faith in the UFC in developing
a belt that I would want to buy the six
hundred dollars replica.
Speaker 4 (15:42):
Of Well, I'm not saying it doesn't matter, I'm saying
it's less important.
Speaker 2 (15:47):
Fair enough, all right, there's another belt on the line
in Las Vegas this weekend.
Speaker 3 (15:53):
Alex poetson Pejeda.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
He puts his light heavyweight championship on the line against
mangamed Uncleliev by or Sell b MA will start with you,
Uncle Live has a chance in this fight.
Speaker 4 (16:07):
Sell absolutely sell. You know, coming into the last time
that I was at T Mobile, or actually two times
ago that I was at T Mobile with the UFC,
you were there TJ. Proshka versus Pooton, and I was
probably one of the only people who was saying that
I thought pro Hoshka had had a little bit of
a chance. I felt like he was getting overlooked a
(16:29):
little bit, and that turned out to be not true
at all. He got totally smashed out. Yeah, this time,
I feel like people are saying that Uncle Liev has
a chance, and I'm taking the other side. Uncleliev has
no chance. I don't see a world where he wins this.
I don't see a path to victory for him. He's
gonna come out and out. I don't think he's gonna
(16:51):
come out and out wrestle. And if he does, he's
got to get through that range. He's got to enter
dangerous territory just to get close. I know he's a
sucker for leg kicks. He's gonna get eaten up. I
think second round, dud, I see a blowout on the
on the way.
Speaker 3 (17:08):
I'm with you. I'm selling it all day.
Speaker 2 (17:11):
A lot of people that are buying it, or even
just at least entertaining it. They point to the Unclaiah
wrestling game as a path to victory. He just doesn't
do it often enough in fights that he should be doing.
Speaker 4 (17:25):
His takedown percentage is not that good.
Speaker 3 (17:28):
It's some like twenty percent, That's.
Speaker 4 (17:29):
What I'm saying. Man, It's not like he's some incredible wrestler.
That's not true.
Speaker 3 (17:36):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:37):
One thing that I will say that sort of worries
me about Beta is he is long in the tooth.
He's had a long career, maybe not on the MMA
side of things, but a long established kickboxing career. There
is some miles on him, and he's been incredibly active.
If there is something that happens in this fight where
we see an uncle aya of victory, the only concern
(17:57):
and thing that I think that would open that up
is maybe he's not the guy fights constantly. He's making
the most of a short window, but he's already put
together a resume that makes him one of the greatest
UFC fighters of all time and this guy was, you know,
making his UFC debut two three years ago. It's it's
pretty impressive. Matt Alkins. Is there any way you're gonna
(18:19):
buy an Unclelia victory or or.
Speaker 3 (18:21):
You selling brother?
Speaker 6 (18:23):
You gotta you gotta protect the bank a little better
than that. I'm gonna be selling that for sure. Even
even if you got a guy that you're expecting him
to take him down and out wrestle.
Speaker 5 (18:32):
Him, a guy like Alex Pereira.
Speaker 6 (18:34):
He does a fantastic job learning in the in the fight,
and so is he gonna Is he gonna secure five
takedowns and put him away? I think that he's got
to take him down and submit him on the on
the first one, because as the fight goes longer, he's
only gonna be more savvy and more picky with the exchanges.
Speaker 5 (18:50):
And he's obviously one.
Speaker 6 (18:51):
Of the best strikers that we've ever seen in any
of the divisions.
Speaker 2 (18:56):
Yeah, no, I to me, And this is the one
I think sort of unfortunate thing about Poeton And it's
maybe just my perception, maybe not the reality, but when
he fights, it's not a pop culture sort of talking
point like he deserves all of the attention that gets
(19:17):
casual viewers to turn tune in, like when it when
e Connor McGregor fights, or when a Floyd Mayweather fights,
Like I wish that his sort of brand was a
bit more established with people that maybe don't pay attention
to the UFC week in and week out.
Speaker 3 (19:32):
But uh yeah, I mean he must think.
Speaker 4 (19:37):
I think I sort of disagree with you there. I
think he's hitting across across lines a little better than
you might think. And also you mentioned earlier guys really
only been in the UFC for like three years.
Speaker 3 (19:51):
Yeah, it's crazy.
Speaker 4 (19:52):
So for him to be where he is mainstream right
now after just a two and a half three year
UFC career, think is actually pretty pretty telling as to
like how much the UFC has risen up in the
pop culture, like in the in this the mass culture,
like people get it. Yeah, the champion in the UFC,
(20:15):
if he's interesting, like that guy is interesting.
Speaker 2 (20:20):
So we we have come a long way. Because I
remember when Anderson Silva was destroying people and making it
look like it was and nobody, nobody seemed to care
as much, and a lot of it was the language barrier.
I think Anderson didn't speak English until the last couple
of fights, like he spoke English, but not publicly on
the mic. Uh, Alex Pejeda has captivated fans by really
(20:45):
saying one word, and that's shrauma.
Speaker 4 (20:48):
I think that's part of his appeal. He's he's a
guy of mystery. He's a man of mystery, and so
that's that's kind of cool, Like what is he talking about?
What is he thinking? Like, he's just nothing, dude, He's
a stone.
Speaker 6 (21:03):
I do think that if he if he wanted to
be a little more boisterous and speak out and stuff
like that, he could maybe grow his fan base a
little bit more. But you see, like the correction after
a guy like Connor McGregor comes and changes the game,
people really enjoyed some of the corrections in the other
direction where it just wasn't as mouthy or flashy or
(21:24):
whatever it is. And I do think that he gets
a lot of respect across the across the board and
kind of in pop culture. But like you're saying, he's
a very stoic, mysterious guy, and uh, I think that
a lot of people would like to see maybe a
little more from him, because obviously he's an incredible and
incredible athlete, which gets the people going.
Speaker 4 (21:44):
He's got a great sense of humor too, Like he
didn't mind like a little joke being played on him.
You know, he doesn't mind like having some having some
fun with his character a little bit. And I think
that's you. He's got a couple of little signature things
he does. The stare down the arrow, well, you know
that's that's cool man. Little things like that hit really hard.
(22:05):
Little memes.
Speaker 6 (22:07):
Have you guys seen the sparring footage that the owner
of Karate Combat runs the goat shed I think it's
in Southward or something like that. Did y'all see this
young kid sparring with Alex Pereira and just threw him Alex.
You know, Poton put himself to the wall to kind
of like show this kid like the kid was trying
too hard, put himself against the wall, and this kid
(22:29):
crow hops in and is wooms. I mean, this kid's
one hundred and maybe seventy pounds, young kid clearly just
like overdoing it, and he just like, I mean just
completely fatal or Milianco just eats this overhand right from
this kid.
Speaker 5 (22:45):
And then he didn't he did not kill the kid.
Speaker 6 (22:48):
I was just like he has such you know, even
in just jiu jitsu, some young kid tries some goofy
neck crank or something like that.
Speaker 5 (22:55):
No, you know, no arm in.
Speaker 6 (22:57):
Triangle, you feel a little disrespected. You might have to
put put a little heat on him. But uh, he's
he was very calm and relaxed. I just couldn't believe,
like seeing that like behind the scenes kind of thing
from him was uh kind of telling of you know
his uh.
Speaker 5 (23:13):
Is yeah, because I would have I would have killed
that kid.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
I mean, I don't know.
Speaker 2 (23:18):
I don't know if that kid is brave or an
idiot to try to go that.
Speaker 3 (23:21):
Heart against Poeton. I mean he's an idiot.
Speaker 5 (23:24):
That kid is a complete moron.
Speaker 6 (23:26):
That kid game to the to the camera afterwards, it
was like speed kills power. It's like brother, what brother God?
In the South, in the South, we say God, bless you.
Speaker 3 (23:38):
I thought, its bless your heart. Yeah, bless your heart.
Speaker 5 (23:41):
Yeah, you know, it's all the same.
Speaker 3 (23:43):
B Max says that to me sometimes and I just
like walk off in shame. Bless your heart.
Speaker 5 (23:48):
It's like, damn, Shame's powerful.
Speaker 3 (23:51):
And then you hit me with of course, thank you.
Speaker 4 (23:53):
That's favorite when he does something ridiculous and I go,
of course you did.
Speaker 7 (23:57):
Hey boys, we've got a great buyers. Oh right here,
God on this Dana White snoop boxing promotion with TKO
and the Saudi's give me thoughts.
Speaker 2 (24:09):
Here's the thing with Dana when it comes to combat
sports and marketing, you have to buy almost everything he says.
I do think power Slap was going to have legs.
I'll be completely honest with you. Power slaps not necessarily
my thing. They just signed a seventy five million dollar
deal with YouTube. It's got legs and he's able. Anything
(24:31):
that Dana touches, he's got the minus touch. Anything he touches,
it just turns to gold. Now boxing it's a different beast,
it's a different animal. But you can already. I mean,
it's all rumors. I don't know exactly what's going on.
I haven't heard anything, but the people that Dana has
been talking to, you know, uh, the chic turkey like
(24:51):
he's doing what he needs to do behind the scenes
to put everything in place so that when he does
come out and make an announcement it's gonna be game changing.
The only thing that would cause me any sort of
doubt is just the boxing world. It's full of politics.
A lot of people don't want to take fights that
are dangerous. But uh, you know, with Dana and you
(25:15):
know Saudi money, I think they're going to be able
to get through all of that. And if Dana focuses
on boxing, it's probably going to become the biggest boxing
promotion in the world.
Speaker 4 (25:24):
I'll buy Dana absolutely crushing this. I'll sell boxing is
different than everything else. It's a different beast. I don't
buy that at all. How you do anything is how
you do everything. And if these guys that are involved
in boxing now don't want to get on board with
an obvious winning promotion, then you raise up a generation
(25:45):
that will get on board and you make new stars.
And you know, some guys won't be on board with that,
and that's cool. But Dana's gonna crush that. Like you said,
he power slap dude, power slap crushing it. Yeah, UFC
crushing it yeh in TKO. I mean they're coming for blood, dude.
(26:08):
They want every combat sport, they want every industry, and
I think right now is the time for everybody to
kind of go Yeah. I think we should all get
on board and at least learn and play ball with
these guys for a little while if we want, if
we want the industry to grow, so I think if
boxing wants to grow and become bigger and better, we've
(26:30):
seen the current model. Hey, it works for some guys, right,
doesn't work for the majority, and it doesn't work for
most fans. Let's be honest.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
What I think Dana will do right in what you
said is it doesn't work for most fans. Is we
need to get guys that are five and zero fighting
real fights. Most of these guys don't want to have
tough fights until they're twenty to oh. And you know,
I think the best thing that any up and coming
mixed martial artists can do, even before they get to
the UFC, is take a fight where they face adversity.
(27:00):
You don't want to face adversity under the brightest lights
in the sport. And I think it'll be interesting to
see if Dana puts on regular boxing events, if we
see that culture change to where I mean, you've got
guys with the contender that are two and oh, three
and oh taking on the toughest fights of their life
and that's just not heard of in in boxing, and
(27:23):
I think you have the nail on the head be Mac.
The culture is going to have to change, and if
you're not going to be on board, then you're not
going to probably be invited to one of the best
parties in all the combat sports.
Speaker 5 (27:36):
I gotta I gotta step in. I feel like I
gotta sell on this idea.
Speaker 6 (27:42):
Even though I do believe in Dana white Man, I'm
a huge fan of what he's done for the sport
of mixed martial arts. I think that for me, it
kind of resembles I don't know if you guys remember
the XFL, the Extreme Football League, but that was that
was put on by Mr McMahon, Vince McMahon from the WWE,
and it looked to have some legs behind it. I
(28:05):
think that we had the Birmingham Thunderbolts here in town
for a season or whatever it was. I think that
it's a big industry to tap into, and I think
that if he is able to successfully find something that
is different about the promotion instead of just another boxing promotion,
which obviously he's a very he's a great businessman, he's
gonna come at it from a different angle. But before
(28:27):
I guess what I should say is, before I'm buying it,
I want to know what that twist is. I want
to know what that take is, because historically, whether it
be for promotional value or whatever, some of the boxing
industry loves to loves to disagree with our.
Speaker 5 (28:41):
With our boy Dana.
Speaker 6 (28:43):
But I am I'm very I'm absolutely paying attention because
I do think that it could be ultra successful, but
I definitely think that the culture behind boxing is gonna
be a little reluctant to to buy it in the
very beginning.
Speaker 2 (28:56):
I'm gonna sell your XFL analogy though, because what Vince
mick Man doing with sports entertainment and he tried to
come into a sport that is very much a x's
and o's sport, and Dana's not trying to come into
a stick and ball sport to try to change the narrative.
He's coming into a combat sport, which he knows that
(29:17):
space better than anybody. He's flourished in that space better
than anybody. I get what you're saying, but I don't
think it's apples to apples and saying that Dana is
trying to do something with a sport that you know
isn't already sort of his bread and butter. And also too,
a lot of people don't know Dana's roots are in boxing.
You know, he was focused on boxing. He wasn't necessarily
(29:39):
a promoter, but he comes from a background where boxing
was long his first love before it was MMAH.
Speaker 6 (29:49):
And I definitely think that the boxing, the boxing community
could use a little hand man.
Speaker 5 (29:56):
I think that you see the rise of MMA compared
to boxing as old as boxing is a or.
Speaker 6 (30:00):
I definitely think that there's some wiggle room to make
some corrections and make some adjustments, and so I am
excited to see how he does that.
Speaker 5 (30:07):
But I do think it's a very very large task.
Speaker 3 (30:10):
We'll see what happens.
Speaker 4 (30:11):
I'm just most interested in the word league. What is that?
What is that? He's a boxing league? What is that?
How does that structure look? I think that's the real
telling difference here, like if this could be successful or not?
Like what are you gonna build as far as infrastructure
is concerned. That could be the big difference in whether
(30:33):
it works or whether it doesn't. I'm I'm buying. I
think I think it works. I think just that you're
trending towards the word league tells me that you've got
something else up your sleeve besides super fights.
Speaker 2 (30:44):
I would be impressed if he's able to pull off
a league. I still think that the league concept in
combat sports, especially cancuss of combat sports, it is very difficult.
Speaker 4 (30:54):
To do well. It can look at look, it can
look a lot of different ways. But what is the
concept of a league if you can just basically like
boil it down to preseason, regular season, postseason, right and
and a defined time so that people can be into
it this season and then ramp up for it again
(31:15):
next to like that's that's the part of the announcement
that interests me the most. What is that structure going
to look like?
Speaker 2 (31:24):
The only thing I worry about that the idea of
league is you kind of hamstring yourself in giving fans
what they want. If you have to have a league
structure where certain you know, fighters have to fight this
guy before they can have the fight that that we
all want, you're you're doing yourself a disservice. But if
it's a league in a season in the sense of
(31:45):
like the Contender Series, they have seasons, they have a
twelve week season, it's more of like a television season
then then yeah, that's fine.
Speaker 3 (31:52):
But if it's if it's this is.
Speaker 2 (31:53):
Your schedule, you have to fight all three of these guys.
Speaker 4 (31:57):
That idea, that's a very broad idea.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
Yeah, right, what.
Speaker 4 (32:04):
Does that structure look like? I think that's going to
be the key determining factor to whether or not this
venture is successful.
Speaker 2 (32:12):
Let me ask you this, because I think worldwide, I
think there are more mixed martial arts in UFC fans
than there are boxing right now. I think that this
is the combat sport of this generation. When you look
at even jiu jitsu, I think it's easier to get
MMA fans to get into the idea of jiu jitsu
(32:34):
because it looks a lot like mixed martial arts, it
can feel a lot like mixed martial arts. I don't
know if the average MMA fan who buys a pay
per view once a month, if they're all of a
sudden going to be all in on boxing.
Speaker 4 (32:48):
I think they're all in on boxing. I think it's
just as hard of an ask, or maybe even harder
as you're alluded to, to get an MMA fan to
go to boxing versus get an MMA fan to go
to jiu jitsu. Like to me, jiu jitsu feels much
closer to MMA than boxing does. Boxing does not feel
like a fight. Everybody calls it a fight. Boxing does
(33:10):
not feel like a fight. Every time they get into
a fight and boxing they break them up for cheating
like that is great. The I don't understand you bring
up very interesting I'm being honest.
Speaker 2 (33:23):
Do you think Dana Do you think Dana might have
a take on changing the rules a little bit, maybe
allowing a bit more clinch fighting in boxing, because, as
you said, when when things get a little bit grimy,
when when guys mix it up on the inside, referees
intervene a lot and separate them. I mean, I'm not
trying to say reinvent the sport a little bit, but
(33:43):
I would like guys to I think.
Speaker 4 (33:45):
The sport does me a little bit of reinventing, That's
what I'm saying.
Speaker 3 (33:49):
Yeah, I hope.
Speaker 4 (33:50):
Somebody's got some kind of idea to reinvent it because
I love to watch people fight and get punched in
the face, and I just can't every time I sit
down to watch a boxing that I got excited about,
I just leave the like disappointed.
Speaker 3 (34:04):
Right, because you didn't get what you wanted you didn't
get the fight. Yeah, yeah, I'm with you on that.
Speaker 2 (34:09):
It'd be interesting to see the adjustments that are made
from from that standpoint final buy or sell segment. It
goes back to our UFC three thirteen card. If Alex
Pajeda gets through Magum and Uncle Ive the way that
we kind of feel he does, his next fight is
at heavyweight.
Speaker 3 (34:28):
Anybody buying it?
Speaker 2 (34:29):
I mean the John Jones potential fight with Alex Pajeda.
Speaker 3 (34:34):
For UFC Heavyweight Championship.
Speaker 2 (34:36):
Man, I would give all the money I have to
watch that fight, mister Elkins.
Speaker 6 (34:45):
I'm going to as a fan, I would I would
buy that one hundred percent.
Speaker 5 (34:51):
I would love to see him fight at heavyweight.
Speaker 6 (34:53):
I think that as he maybe enters to the end
of his career, that would be an amazing accolade to
add to the mix. I just I didn't the UFC
get they got rid of multiple division champs simultaneously.
Speaker 5 (35:07):
Is that correct?
Speaker 2 (35:09):
What do you mean, uh, that they don't calling out
the division?
Speaker 4 (35:16):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (35:16):
Yeah, yeah, which I think that that's a that create
you know, allows there to not be as many log jams.
Speaker 5 (35:21):
But you know what's his incentive?
Speaker 3 (35:24):
Now?
Speaker 6 (35:24):
You know, I guess it's a stat on ESPN, But
I mean man to be able if he was able
to hold all three belts at once, like.
Speaker 5 (35:31):
My boy gonna do it for the GRAM.
Speaker 6 (35:33):
But uh, you know, I I'm definitely interested to see him,
like he's gonna fight the winner of a Jones aspinall matchup.
Speaker 5 (35:42):
Brother.
Speaker 6 (35:43):
Like I said, I'll agree with TJ. I'll empty the
bank for that. I would definitely buy that.
Speaker 5 (35:47):
Pay per view. But I don't know that we're gonna
see my man do it.
Speaker 3 (35:50):
Here's the thing, the narrative there.
Speaker 2 (35:52):
I would almost want it to be both John Jones
and Alex Paid his final fight because not only would
it be for the UFC's Heavyweight Championship, but you might
as well make another belt and just put goat on it,
because because whoever walks out of that fight their hand
raised with their stock where it's at right now, they're
(36:13):
gonna lay claim to the greatest combat sports athlete of
all time in my opinion.
Speaker 6 (36:18):
When you talk about pop culture, could you imagine, I
mean that would be something that we talked to. You know,
we're talking for years about John Jones versus poetan remember
you know everybody, Oh and I'm like freaking.
Speaker 4 (36:28):
Out John Jones versus peda loser leaves.
Speaker 5 (36:33):
The UFC, Francis Nganu into the chat brother.
Speaker 4 (36:39):
Oh man, I think that Francis and Ghano ship has sailed, dud.
I think in the UFC, especially well in the in
the in the world. His big breakout pay per view
sold ten thousand pay per views.
Speaker 6 (36:54):
Yeah yo, in the boxing one, no.
Speaker 5 (36:58):
No mma even uh of course, listen, you didn't even.
Speaker 3 (37:03):
You didn't even come top of mind that that happened.
That's how poor show did.
Speaker 4 (37:07):
No but the millions of dollars and he's got ten
thousand pay per view buyers.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
Now, the one thing that might be a disclaimer on
that is the pay per view model has changed a
lot that I don't know if that was terrestrial, like
I bought it on my television with my remote. I
tend to think it was all platforms. But yeah, when
when you're cares, right, yeah, who cares?
Speaker 5 (37:32):
I feel definitely not.
Speaker 4 (37:33):
If that's the number on any metric that you paid multiple,
multiple millions of dollars to find, it's a disaster.
Speaker 3 (37:42):
Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 5 (37:42):
So you're saying that Francis would go into the GFL.
Speaker 4 (37:47):
Maybe not just yet. And this is no shade on
Francis as a fighter. I'm not saying he's dying. I'm
saying the narrative on him is. I mean they're gonna
have to build it up from scratch again. Yeah, that's
that's a disaster, dude. Ten thousand pay per view buys
is a disaster. Yeah, And it's a disaster at a
jiu jitsu event, Like, oh no, what happened? And then
(38:08):
we take the biggest, strongest, most widely regarded, baddest dude
on the planet in an MMA fight and we debut
him out here against another guy who's very, very good,
and we sell ten thousand pay per views and we
spend ten million dollars. Yo, I don't know what to
tell you, Like, you can't walk away thinking that that
(38:30):
went well.
Speaker 3 (38:30):
Now.
Speaker 2 (38:31):
I think it was a reality check for Francis's team that. Yeah,
Francis is regarded as as a great heavyweight, one of
the best in the world. But Francis and Ghana without
the letters UFC attached to him just doesn't move the
needle unfortunately.
Speaker 6 (38:46):
I think, especially he didn't have anybody to dance with
outside of the UFC. Like already the boxing narratives are
kind of dried up. Some of the some of the
fights are kind of you know, those the heavyweight division,
I feel like has had a lot of the attention
and some of the big fights, and I feel like
some of those narratives are a little bit played out.
And if he had, if there were cross promote promotional
(39:08):
MMA titles or something like that, then I think that
we would be interested in seeing some Francis and Ghana fights.
But do I want to watch him dispatch of another
dude in the PFL ever again?
Speaker 5 (39:18):
Absolutely not.
Speaker 4 (39:20):
You know, you said that a lot of the heavyweight
storylines have played out. I'll use that as a segue
for me to say that I'm buying Pereta moving up
the heavyweight for his next fight, because the heavyweight division
in the UFC needs But Aida, they got one compelling storyline,
and it's that those guys won't fight right, you know,
(39:43):
Like the best storyline in the heavyweight division is Jones
and aspinall and we can't even get him to have
a match. We need put Areta in there. And he's
already made his rounds, dude. Look, he's already made his
rounds through light heavyweight. He made his rounds through middleweight.
We see what he is, and we see what he
is compared to the rest of the light heavyweight division.
(40:05):
We're running unclave out there. Okay, all right, listen, guys,
last one and last one. He's at the end of
the seminar. He's rolled twelve rounds and he's going, okay, okay,
I'll get one more with you, and he gets one
more and then thanks for coming to town. And it's
time for him in the heavyweight division and the heavyweight
division needs him.
Speaker 6 (40:24):
Yeah, such a testament to him as a fighter that,
like we said, every division, every division needs him.
Speaker 4 (40:30):
You know, that's a great point.
Speaker 3 (40:32):
Yeah, all right, So that's buy or sell this week.
Speaker 2 (40:35):
Now it's time for hot takes, and we're kicking off
with matt Elkins hot take this week, which I think
it's it's it's it's it's a hot take, definitely, but
I think there might be some plausibility to it.
Speaker 3 (40:51):
I'm gonna give the floor to matt Elkins.
Speaker 2 (40:53):
The hot take is that John Jones smashes Tom aspinall
should they meet inside the US He's octagon.
Speaker 3 (41:01):
You're saying, it's one way traffic.
Speaker 6 (41:04):
Brother, Listen, after I saw the way that Cyril Gone
moved around, and I was just like, oh my lord,
he's never gonna be able to touch him. And when
I watch other heavyweights, they just don't move like that.
They just don't have the instincts. I think that Tom
Aspinall is an incredible fighter. Tom brother, please don't beat
me up. But like I said, do I think that
he's gonna go out there and dispatch it the greatest
(41:26):
of all time. Every time that John Jones steps steps
out and comes back in, he is very, very focused.
Speaker 5 (41:33):
He's not coming back.
Speaker 6 (41:34):
Off this layoff with all this hype with a fight
and not being prepared and not in shape and not
ready to rumble, even if it's his last thing, even
if he's on the back nine of his career.
Speaker 5 (41:42):
Brother Ice is him.
Speaker 2 (41:45):
Yeah, I feel there's legs there. I feel there's more
pounds than victory for John than Tom. I mean, John
needs to make sure he just doesn't get hit. I
still am a little worried about him in the heavyweight division.
If he gets hit hard on the chin by a heavyweight.
He stood in front of steep A didn't take any
damage really that was significant. He did get hit a
(42:08):
couple of times Cyril Gone looked like a fish out
of water.
Speaker 3 (42:12):
Didn't do anything? Did John Jones?
Speaker 2 (42:14):
So an Aspenall victory, it's there, But you know, John's
got highly underrated grappling skills, phenomenal wrestling.
Speaker 3 (42:24):
I just he'd be my favorite.
Speaker 2 (42:27):
I don't know how big of a favorite, but I
think a smashing a vintage performance of John Jones.
Speaker 3 (42:34):
It's definitely on the table. Bemack what he feels.
Speaker 4 (42:36):
Not the only guy who remembers who John Jones is,
am I The only guy here that remembers is is
John Jones. Matt Elkins is John Jones. The guy who
sees somebody that he's more skilled than and more experienced than,
and works just as hard or harder anyway, is that
(42:59):
John Jones? Is that what he showed us in his career.
That's not the John Jones that's gonna step in there
against Tom Aspinall, dude.
Speaker 6 (43:09):
I think that he's got a lot of respect for
the young man. I think lifting heavy.
Speaker 4 (43:13):
I have no doubt that John Jones should be the
favorite and that he will win the fight. But to
think that that he's gonna come he's this new guy
now that he's at the end of his career. I
don't know if I buy that. Yes, especially I hope so.
I like a good I like a good baby face turn.
Speaker 6 (43:32):
I like that especially as the barbecue dad version of
John Jones.
Speaker 3 (43:38):
Brother.
Speaker 5 (43:38):
I'm just not betting against him. I just can't help it.
Speaker 6 (43:40):
If we talk about prime John Jones or whatever versus
this guy, not even a conversation, but can he beat
the overweight, slowest version that we've ever seen. Hopefully he's
got a shot at it. But like I said, if
he id them, I'll just you'll see the I'll just
send you the cheers emoji.
Speaker 4 (43:59):
I mean, that's that's not something I think John Jones
will win.
Speaker 5 (44:05):
To not lose John Jones.
Speaker 4 (44:07):
A walkover on aspinall I think is a step out.
I think it's a step out.
Speaker 2 (44:12):
It's fair when he when you look at the the
last few fights of Jones at two hundred and five pounds, like,
I'm not going to say that he wasn't prepared, but
he fought down. I think in a lot of ways
to the level of his competition. You know, split decision
against uh Thiago Meheta Santos, a fight against Dominic Rays
that a lot of people thought that Rays did enough
(44:35):
to win. Even going back to the first Alexander Gustison fight.
I mean, there were there were people that scored that fight,
uh for for Gus so.
Speaker 4 (44:44):
Even when he was fighting Cormier he was on substances
and not taking it too seriously.
Speaker 6 (44:50):
I do think that the two gusts of some fights
are kind of what our argument is. If the guy
that shows up at the first fight, Aspinall definitely gonna
shut me up. If the guy that shows up for
that second fight rolls in there, Tom Aspinall is gonna
be in trouble. Baby.
Speaker 4 (45:05):
I don't think a ball wins the fight regardless of
which John Jones shows up.
Speaker 3 (45:10):
We're not seeing ten eight rounds though.
Speaker 4 (45:11):
And you're one of the John Jones characters leaves a
big window for Tom Aspinall and one of them leaves
no window at all. I guess my question is, did
we forget somehow that this second version of John Jones exists,
and that not just exists, but he's likely to show
(45:32):
up and run the show.
Speaker 5 (45:35):
Only time?
Speaker 3 (45:36):
Brother? Yah?
Speaker 2 (45:38):
All right, my hot take this week. We were talking
about it last week. It was very unfortunate Dan Hooker
out of his fight with Justin Geechee. It's definitely a
blow to the card, but Gage's well, it's a blow
to the card in the sense that we're not getting
that highly anticipated fight, but a rematch with Raphael Physive
(46:03):
is phenomenal, and I actually think that that's my hot
take that this card has gotten better. This is a
better matchup, and I think we're gonna get more for
our money seeing these two rematch. I mean, Physis is
a tank of a man. He mixes it up in
(46:23):
a just way that everyone loves to see fight. Gaigee's
nickname is the Highlight. I think that this fight is
a better fight than Dan Hooker, who you know, has
looked good, but Dan's been, you know, someone who's been
bit by the injury bug.
Speaker 3 (46:39):
He's had long layoffs.
Speaker 2 (46:41):
I don't really know if I was sold on the
idea that we were going to see the best Dan
Hooker take on Justin Gaegee Saturday night at T Mobile. Obviously,
now Hooker injured and out, we definitely weren't going to
see it. I think this is a more competitive, more interesting,
and more fun fight seeing these guys running back.
Speaker 4 (47:00):
I totally agree with that take. I thought the first
Gaygee versus Phyziv fight was an incredible fight. It was
entertaining even I've went back and watched it two more
times since then, and it's still an entertaining fight. And
I tell you what else it does for us is
it gives us championship storyline potential. Still with Physive, we
(47:23):
still don't know who Physiv could be, right, I think
we I think we know who Dan Hooker is and
by the way, that's a gangster, but it's not a champion.
Speaker 2 (47:35):
Yeah, Hooker is a guy who takes Fight of the
Night checks time and time again. I don't know if
Hooker takes some world titles, you know what I mean? Uh, Physive,
there's still upside there that I think remains unexplored, and uh,
We're going to see a fight that means a lot
more when it comes to future opportunities, because I think
people were looking at Gaiche and Hooker as just this
(47:57):
sort of special that's it.
Speaker 4 (47:59):
It's just a fight to see who can get who
can kill somebody, which, hey, I'm down for Gaigie versus Phyziv.
There's storyline on the other side of that for both guys,
Like is this the fight where Gaigee. Look, he's peaked
and now and now he's continuing his slow descent. I'm
(48:22):
not saying that's what's going on, just saying that's a
question that could be asked. Is this physive? Can he
rise to this level? He's lost one to Gaigee already.
Is he better than the guy that lost to Gaigee?
We know he's down for a war. I think there's
still a lot of meat left on the bone as
far as the physique storyline goes.
Speaker 2 (48:42):
You think physiv Matt has an opportunity to get a
big win here, rise the ranks and is he championship material.
Speaker 3 (48:49):
In the UFC?
Speaker 6 (48:50):
You know, listen, the little Just Bleed character that lives
inside of my dark heart wants to say, like who
is that guy? You know what I'm saying, Like I
want to see Dan Hooker versus Justin Gaichie ten times
before I want to watch that other guy. He's an
incredible martial artist. Okay, but the Dan Hooker versus Justin
Gaigie fight for me personally?
Speaker 7 (49:13):
Uh?
Speaker 5 (49:14):
Like I said, Just Bleed, baby, I just.
Speaker 6 (49:17):
I need to see that that's gonna give you know, Like,
let's look at Max Holloway versus Ricardo Lomas. Maybe not
the highest level matchup of all time, but one of
the most iconic moments. I think that Hooker Gaichie gives
you maybe one of those iconic moments, and I just
I hate that the boys are not gonna get to
dance it out.
Speaker 3 (49:36):
I hate I look all this.
Speaker 4 (49:39):
All this does for me is tell me that you
didn't watch their first fight.
Speaker 6 (49:43):
Listen, I didn't say that Phyziv is not an incredible fighter.
Speaker 4 (49:46):
I'm not say to me right now. I didn't watch
Gaigie versus phys One.
Speaker 5 (49:52):
I would watch Justin Gaeche fight. Who is the other guy?
That's what I'm saying. You tell me that guy is
gonna run.
Speaker 3 (49:58):
The politician here answering your question, B Mac, I'm not.
Speaker 4 (50:02):
Watch did you watch gay Gee versus One?
Speaker 6 (50:06):
I'm saying that I've never watched a single Physia fight.
Speaker 3 (50:09):
Because who is that guy? You need to beat me
up as soon as we're show you.
Speaker 2 (50:16):
As soon as we're done with this show, Matt, you
need to log onto UFC Fight Pass and I'm going
to be apologized to B Mac.
Speaker 6 (50:24):
I'm gonna be so sad for the rest of my
life that Dan Hooker and Justin Gaatechie are never going
to fight each other. God bless physiv And as he
makes it to the top and becomes the champion or
whatever that guy's doing, because nobody's paying attention, but Justin
Gaigie versus Hooker off the card is a blow to
my dark heart. My little grinch heart has shrunk three
(50:44):
sizes again.
Speaker 4 (50:46):
You get off this call and you watch that fight,
and then you post a full and complete apology to
public apology on your Instagram.
Speaker 3 (50:59):
You destroy your credibility right now.
Speaker 5 (51:01):
You listen, It's fine.
Speaker 4 (51:04):
As a human.
Speaker 5 (51:06):
I didn't say that the dude wasn't a fantastic fighter.
I'm saying that, Damn.
Speaker 3 (51:12):
I do know.
Speaker 6 (51:12):
He's the little guy with the top knot, the short,
stuffy guy with the top knot.
Speaker 5 (51:15):
We know exactly you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 3 (51:17):
But he's a devastating muay Thai style striker who put
it on.
Speaker 6 (51:22):
Justin Dan Hooker and Justin get you're gonna stand there
and slug it out in my like I said, my
little just bleed, I'm gonna be shoving popcorn and bud
light in my face as I watched those two run it.
Speaker 4 (51:36):
You would do that with this, You're gonna get you.
Speaker 3 (51:39):
Yeah, yeah, you might even be more brutal. It might
even be more brutal. You're insane if you think it's
a snooze.
Speaker 6 (51:49):
Something right now, who is that guy?
Speaker 2 (51:56):
And I appreciate it because this is the right treatment
that matt Elkins gets. You embarrass yourself, probably your family.
We still love you, We still love you.
Speaker 5 (52:06):
Don't come and see me, come and see me.
Speaker 3 (52:10):
I need to watch my mouth. Matt Elkins can kill me.
Speaker 5 (52:12):
So we would put it to paper rock sys ors TJ.
I never do you like that? Brother?
Speaker 3 (52:17):
Okay, thank you. I appreciate it. On the way out here.
Speaker 2 (52:21):
Grapplers, the new season of the PGF documentary available now.
Speaker 3 (52:25):
New episodes come out on Friday.
Speaker 2 (52:27):
It's one of the best sports documentaries out there.
Speaker 3 (52:30):
And I'm not just saying that.
Speaker 2 (52:31):
If you are someone who enjoys stories, watch Grapplers, available
now on YouTube. That does it for us for b
mac Brand, mccatherine, the Uninformed, matt Elkins on TEJ to Dannis,
We'll see you next time for more of the rounds.
Speaker 3 (52:48):
Yeah,
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