July 15, 2025 • 36 mins
In this weeks episode Sarah tells us about firefigher turned arsonist, John Orr. We hope you like erection jokes.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Hey, I'm T Lisa and I'm Sarah. Welcome to the
Ship show A half asked true.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
Nope, I'm so glad this is mine. This is gonna
be great. You want to try that again? Why did
I say pee? Why was there repeat? A half a
true podcast? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (00:19):
Okay, Hey, I'm T Lisa and I'm Sarah. Welcome to
the Ship show A half asked true Prime podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
Okay, We're only one hundred episodes.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
And I still can't speak, which is honestly not new information.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
So it's fine.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
No, we just had to redo the intro. I don't
know if I'll leave a dinner or not. We are
recording two episodes in a row because mine didn't record. Unfortunately.
Now Sarah's gonna tell me a story. We are not
the brains in the mouths are not connecting and working
anymore or the ever though was mine ever connected? I
(00:55):
think there's been a disconnect my entire life.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
I do have just a to.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
Add bandard scripted and also because I forgot to say
it when we were recorded doors, I took Connor to
he has for McDonald's on the way home from one
of his appointments last week, and so I'm like, oh yeah,
that's fine. Whatever.
Speaker 2 (01:12):
It was lunch time.
Speaker 1 (01:13):
Well, you know, you plush your order, you pull up
the first window to pay, then you go the second window,
pulled up to the first window, and the kid and
there was you know, I gave him my payment. I
saw a tattoo on his arm, and I'm like, normally
I don't talk to people or say words to people.
I'm just hi, thank you, cool, goodbye. But I asked
him where you got a tattooed done? And then when
he told me, I.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
Responded with perfect, and then drove.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
Out what was the tattoo? It was just like it
was like an eye on his arm, but the work
was good, Like it wasn't the tattoo that like, it
was just that it was good work.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
So I'm like, hey, where did you get like because
I need to find a tech artist.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
So when I think because in my mind, I've heard
of the place that he told me, and I've heard
really good things about it.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
So I was like, that's what you should have said,
my brain.
Speaker 1 (01:57):
Said perfect, and then I drove forward and I'm like,
what the fuck this is itt me the.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
Rest of my life.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
It would have been really funny if he like when
you pulled up, he walked to you next window to
give you your stuff. Yeah, so that was extremely embarrassing
for Like, I'm sure it did not even FaZe him,
but I literally like that was weird.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
Weird.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
I can never go to the McDonald's again. So I
forgot to tell you that. But yeah, I'm like a perfect, perfect,
fucking idiot.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
I'm an idiot. I cannot be that like, looks great.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
I've heard of that place before, heard great things about
that place, Okay, but in my head like two looks great, buddy,
My perfect was too that it's a place I heard
of already, and like, I'm getting another good review.
Speaker 2 (02:38):
For that place.
Speaker 1 (02:39):
That perfect was for you, not for me, But my
brain said it out loud, and so it's better. I mean,
I don't know what would be worse, you saying perfect
and driving away or you just like silently nodding and
then driving away.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (02:52):
It's all embarrassing. Sorry, McDonald's kid. I'm socially awkward, and
this is why I just don't talk to people.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
Yeah, we're socially awkward.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
So we're like, you know what, once a week, let's
put that out to the the world.
Speaker 2 (03:07):
The world needs to know how awkward I am.
Speaker 1 (03:09):
Also, we forget to talk about the brand cheeseburger case.
Speaker 2 (03:13):
I don't want to, you know.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
I am so disappointed only Colberger obviously, as we were
talking about in case somebody understood my cheeseburger.
Speaker 2 (03:24):
I just this is just how my brain works.
Speaker 1 (03:26):
I am disappointed because they did not consult the families.
Was families did not seem to want the plea deal,
and that bothers me.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
Am.
Speaker 1 (03:36):
I like glad that they don't have to be put
through a trial and everything, obviously, but if they wanted
that exactly, they wanted the entire truth to come out
they wanted. I'm wondering if when they do the official sentencing,
if it'll be like the BTK thing where he just
sat and talked, because usually they the prosecution goes.
Speaker 2 (03:51):
Through all the evidence.
Speaker 1 (03:52):
Yeah, and like for BTK, I'm not comparing at all.
It's just the first one that pops because BTK talked
for like seven years.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
If something like.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
That will happen or not, I don't think that he
has to speak at all. I think the prosecution goes
through all of the evidence and the judge considers all
of that with the official sentencing.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
I'm not sure if that's how it works. I'm not
sure either or not, but I agree that, but the
family should have.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
Been consulted or or even the heads up, like hey, yeah,
because it seemed like they were pretty blindsided by it
as well, like they didn't weren't like warned. When I
saw the first headline of that, it was on Facebook,
and I was like, this has to be fucking fake.
It's literally saying I'm like, okay, like I don't believe it,
and then I think.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
I I googled.
Speaker 1 (04:38):
I did not googled, and I sent it to you
literally immediately after I did. Oh no, because I sent
it to you, you send it to me. And then
it was the next morning that I saw anothers that
was when you were drinking. I promise I'm not an alcoholic,
but yeah, because that's when I started calling him cheeseburger, right,
And I was very upset by it.
Speaker 2 (04:55):
But yeah, that's you know, I like, again, I get it,
but I hate it. Yeah type thing I don't know.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
Also said, no, I just remember my brain has probably
broken because I somehow missed my.
Speaker 2 (05:05):
Pot's medication last night. Oh beautiful.
Speaker 1 (05:07):
And when I went to take my beads this morning.
I'm like, that shouldn't still be in there. My brain
is probably literally melting down.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
Did you have any No, I don't know, just fucking moving, packing, well, unpacking.
I moved. Also trying to figure out chemicals for a pool.
I can't mess me about that.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
They seating the guy at the pool store when I
brought my water. So I brought my water sample into
the pool store and I was like, hey, before you
put the little testrope in there, you should know I
just moved into this house a few days ago and
I haven't done anything at all with this water, so
do not judge the results.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
And the guy put the thing in.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
He was like, I got I was like eh, I said,
do not judge the results. And then he was like, okay,
well you know what kind of chlorine are you gonna put?
Are you thinking about whatever? It was like, whatever you
tell me to, That's why I'm here.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
I don't know. There was different types that you get,
there's all kinds of differen he listed them off. I was like, well,
for this, what.
Speaker 1 (05:58):
Would be the cheapest, best, fastest way to level this
out is what I'm looking for really, And so he
we did liquid chlorine? Was it a five gallon thing
and a bunch of you know, other stuff whatever pool
things and whatnot, but the chlorine was the major one.
And this man looked at me and said, are you
gonna be able to get that? Like pick it up
(06:20):
or whatever? And I just assumed came out like to
the car. I was like, yeah, I can put that
in my car. What are you talking about? And he
goes no, like can you lift it and dump it
into your pool because my pools in above ground pool?
Speaker 2 (06:28):
Yeah? And I looked at him like.
Speaker 1 (06:30):
Yes, I thought he was joking, and he was very sincere.
Speaker 2 (06:34):
Are you sure you can do that? And I was
like yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:37):
He goes no, but like do you have somebody there
to help you? And I was like no, and I
don't need someone to help me because I can do it.
And he goes, okay, but if you run into any trouble,
just call a store and I'll drive out to help you.
And I was like, I will not be doing that.
Speaker 2 (06:51):
I will not be giving you my address.
Speaker 1 (06:53):
Meanwhile, just the weak prior, my husband was literally purposely
saying you're just ladies and can't do this, so that
we your things.
Speaker 2 (07:01):
Oh, I bet you can't pick that up.
Speaker 1 (07:02):
And I was ignoring him and I the second time
he said something like that, I wanted to just put
it down and be like, oh no, yeah, he was
obviously joking. I'm like, sir, your reverse psychology doesn't work
on me. I was already going to do this anyway.
Speaker 2 (07:15):
Now it makes me not what to do exactly, That's
what I'm saying. Yeah, So we have one one man
knowing that we can do it, and then another like,
aren't you're just a little lady. Are you sure? Are
you sure you can do that?
Speaker 1 (07:26):
It's someone going to help you. I was like, no,
I don't. I don't need write that at all. And
guess what, guys, I obviously did it.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
She may have gone in with it. No I'm kidding, No,
I didn't.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
I was on the stairs, like the steps or whatever,
and I was like, if I fucking fall into this
pure chlorine, that would be.
Speaker 2 (07:41):
A bad thing for your skin. Before I jump into
my case, I we're going.
Speaker 1 (07:48):
To go and do our socials so we don't forget.
You can find us on Facebook at the Shit Showy
True Crime Podcast, and you can find us on Instagram, Twitter, TikTok, YouTube,
at the Shit Show TCP. You can email us at
Shit Show TCP at gmail dot com. Please give me
a fucking case suggestion or tell me I'm doing a
good job. Please subscribe and review on Apple Podcasts. That
(08:09):
really helps if you write a review, alps to push
us out to more people, which I mean, don't we
all want more people to hear this? Yes, I mean
in theory. You can like and comment on Spotify again,
just help us push us out obviously, share us with
your friends and follow us in.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
All of the places.
Speaker 1 (08:25):
Yeah, and thank you to all of our new listeners.
We appreciate the boost. Continue sharing us. We appreciate. Okay,
thank you.
Speaker 2 (08:33):
We are done for today. Podcast to journed.
Speaker 1 (08:37):
Okay, just kidding. We're gonna get into my case now.
John Leonard Or was born April twenty sixth, nineteen forty nine,
in Los Angeles, California. He was one of three brothers,
which seems like a lot of boys in chaos. My
dad is one of four brothers, and I always like
anytime my grandma talked about them as kids and like
(08:58):
how are you still here?
Speaker 2 (08:59):
Hey? Pure chaos? All right. So John had a.
Speaker 1 (09:02):
Pretty normal life growing up, even though his parents did
end updorcing when he was like sixteen, but overall it
seemed like he would, you know, a normal childhood. He
was a smart kid and excelled academically. After John graduated
from high school and on his eighteenth birthday, he joined
the United States Air Force. When he got out of
basic training, John was assigned to jet mechanics school, but
(09:23):
then he transferred to firefighter school. So I'm assuming like,
when you like sign up, usually they kind of give
you an idea of which dirreuction you're going to write.
And he was like you, no, thank you. I would
like to be a firefighter please.
Speaker 2 (09:35):
And that's good. Okay, I guess.
Speaker 1 (09:37):
Pretty soon after, John also married his high school sweetheart, Jody,
So got out of high school, immediately joined Air Force,
married high school sweetheart.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
What people do? It seems like a normal do a
normal plotlin All right? Yeah.
Speaker 1 (09:51):
When John was twenty one, he was honorably discharged from
the Air Force and moved back to LA with Jody.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
So he did like the normal like four years and
then moved on. Okay.
Speaker 1 (10:00):
There, John applied to the Los Angeles Police Department but
was sadly rejected after failing a psychological exam. After that,
John applied to multiple other agencies, including the Los Angeles
Fire Department, and there he was given an offer, but
it was unfortunately later rescented after he also failed more
testing for them.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
Well, part of what was he failing I couldn't figure out.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
For the fire department, I didn't see which testing he failed,
But for the police department it did say the psychological aspect,
but not why. Okay, I need to know why, but
find why. Okay, So something's there that they were picking
up on and were like, no, I'm as far as.
Speaker 2 (10:38):
They were doing those back then, it was like the sixties. Yes, yeah, it.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
Seems like the LAPD was pretty corrupt then true, maybe
he just didn't have the right ind who knows, he
wasn't the right type of corrupt, right. So John seemed
to be struggling to find a footing in both his
professional life and his home life. Things between him and
Jodi seemed to be deteriorating, and the same time they
got divorced. Okay, So like I said, it happens, fell apart.
(11:05):
I'm sure the stress of him trying to find work
probably added a lot too.
Speaker 2 (11:09):
For sure.
Speaker 1 (11:10):
The couple did have two daughters together named Lori and Carrie.
Things did start to turn around for John now twenty
five when he got hired on at Glendale Fire Department
in nineteen seventy four. It was a significantly lower paying job,
but still a job as a firefighter. Nonetheless, not long
after John was hired on at the what I say,
(11:32):
Glendale Fire Department, he pretty quickly got promoted to captain
and then also fire investigator. John seemed to have found
his calling. He turned out to be really good at
identifying the causes of fires and any devices used to
start them. So like, he was really good at going
into the fires and like being able to find wherever
the incendiary stuff where it started?
Speaker 2 (11:55):
The why can I not think.
Speaker 1 (11:57):
I had a second ago? And then I was thinking
of something off, like where this could be? Got orientation?
That's not the right where brain work? Please, I don't know,
I can't think of the word. But either way, he
was really good at finding like where what a fire started.
I'm glad it's not just me, no, because.
Speaker 2 (12:12):
I just had it.
Speaker 1 (12:12):
And then I was like, I wonder where this case
is going? And then I dropped it out of my mind.
I guess I don't know, it's fine. Accelerant that is
a word, not the one I was looking word.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Get it? Yeah, like where it started? What is the
what's another word for? Like that? I would just say
where it started?
Speaker 1 (12:32):
Yeah, and if an accelerant was He was really good
at finding those things. So unfortunately for southern California around
this time, there was quite a few, like there was
an increase in oursens that we were happening. But John
was becoming a well known student of fire and his
reputation as an instructor was growing as well. He specialized
in how to catch a firebug basically, like he just
(12:53):
was really good at being able to identify those things,
and I guess also teaching other people how to more
easily identify them as well. October tenth, nineteen eighty four,
quick trigger warning. There is at death, but it is
This is the only mention of it. On October tenth,
nineteen eighty four, a fire at Old's Home Center hardware
(13:14):
store broke out in South Pasadena, and sadly, it claimed
the lives of four people. Seventeen year old Jimmy Sentick.
I don't know, I don't know if my computer ato
correct at this or not. Twenty six year old Carolyn Kraus,
fifty year old eight A Deal, as well as Deal's
(13:35):
two year old grandson, Matthew. This fires seem to have
been started near a bag of potato chips, which acted
like quote, a sack of solid fuel.
Speaker 2 (13:44):
What have you not seen that? No?
Speaker 1 (13:46):
People like, apparently you can start fires with potato chips
because of all the oils in it.
Speaker 2 (13:51):
Okay, makes me never want to eat them?
Speaker 1 (13:54):
Yeah? Good, And as my gi doctor put it, I
can just eat chips all of the time because they
have the sodium content that I So, it was ignited
by a cigarette that burnt down until it lit, a
pack of matches, and a sheet of paper, which side
note it is wild to me they can identify it
down to like this cigarette on a piece of paper
started this fire. The La County Sheriff's Department first ruled
(14:16):
the fire as an accident that they thought was most
likely caused by faulty wiring, but once John from a
neighboring fire department was on the scene, he insisted it
was arson. And then again, like I said, out of order,
they'd found like I guess, he found the cigarette and
the matches in the paper how is any of that
left when it I just think like building down and
(14:36):
everything can't be arsin right unless I think if you're
looking for it to be arson right, you make a
case for almost every fire, you know what I mean.
I don't know. I have a feeling there's junk science
and thus possibly In nineteen eighty seven, after another fire
broke out, firefighters found an incendiary device made of a
cigarette matches and a yellow piece of paper. Oh, the
(14:58):
same as the eighty four fire that claimed four lives.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
This time there was.
Speaker 1 (15:04):
A print, but when the print was tested, the findings
were dismissed, with one investigator investigator saying, quote, you ought
to tell your arson investigator to keep his mits off
the evidence. It was touched by John Or's left ring finger.
Uh huh. Okay, so you know he was there. He
helped identify, uh huh the cause of the fires. Possibly, yeah.
(15:25):
So John had a sound reputation. He was often the
first to arrive and often took control of the scene
of whatever fire he was responding to.
Speaker 2 (15:34):
Weird, very weird.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
The fire prevention inspector in the nineteen nineties from Glendale
Fire Department would later say, quote, people looked up to him.
He always knew where the fire hydrants were. We just thought, wow,
this guy has such knowledge. He was miraculously fast at
finding the causes of fires. He could dig through the ashes,
narrow it down, and we'd be like, man, you were good.
(15:58):
So it seemed like, you know, we're really looking up
to him, because again he was also an instructor, teaching
other people how to identify these fires.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
So he was.
Speaker 1 (16:08):
And in that second fire nobody died or no, So
just that first, just.
Speaker 2 (16:12):
The first fire.
Speaker 1 (16:13):
Yeah, More and more fires were started, and by nineteen
eighty nine a pattern seemed to be rising. But as
one article put it, he had an uncanny ability to
find incendiary devices amid the rubble and charred earth of
a fire setter's handiwork. So John seemed like he was
getting kind of a big head from all of this, though,
(16:34):
you know, from me, I think it's because he knew
where the incendiary devices were before the fire started. He
was really good at finding them. I don't know what
you're implying right now, Okay, I'm just asking it was
just really good at his job, okay, and identifying things.
But John bragged that he caught more than forty Cereal arsonists.
(16:55):
Whether that's true or not, I obviously didn't find for
reasons that'll be told pretty soon. We also like explored
the methods in psychology behind the fires that he was,
you know, finding from artist in articles for the American
(17:16):
Fire Journal, and you can still find his articles today.
Speaker 2 (17:20):
I skimmed that's as much as I did.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
Somebody else wants to go read them there there, But
John was the reassuring face when dozens of homes in
the Glendale Hills area were destroyed by more fires. So
hundreds of fires had been set, some outside, but lots
of them were like in stores, like the first deadly fire,
and in nineteen ninety a fire and College Hills destroyed
dozens of homes. So, like I said, there are like hundreds,
(17:46):
if not I think one article even said thousands of
fires in this time period that were being set. And
this like South California area, Like I said before, a
pattern was becoming more and more clear. Investigators, of course,
came up with a y nickname for this arsenist. You
want to just you're not your first, You're not gonna
get it, but you want to give a guess. I
don't know pillow pillow, Pyro pillow, Yeah, because he because
(18:10):
the arsenists oftentimes targeted shops with poly eurothane bedding, So
I'm guessing targeted places I would easily catch on.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
Fire, like and yeah burn, okay, but yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:21):
Again, honestly, it might be one of my favorite nicknames
that somebody's come up with. You know, that's just like
fire f yours sitting around drinking. Absolutely one of them
said that, and then everyone was like, God, hell.
Speaker 2 (18:33):
Yeah, Pyro, same thing. Too many peas.
Speaker 1 (18:38):
Yeah, that's for sure how I had to come about,
Like right, there's no way something else, all right. Then
in nineteen ninety one, On wrote a novel called Point
of Origin after he was inspired by a fiction writing
class at the Glennsdale Community College. So the hero in
his plotline was Phil and unwavering, gun toting arson investigator
(18:59):
in LA and the villain of his story was Aaron,
a socially stunted pyromaniac who found sexual pleasure in starting fires.
Speaker 2 (19:07):
Is this his alter ego? This is his book? He
got inspired to write a book.
Speaker 1 (19:14):
I feel like he's writing down in secrets. Sexual pleasure
from a fire is very not when I can even
remotely try to wrap my brain around.
Speaker 2 (19:23):
Yeah, I don't. I don't know. It's not what I'm into.
Speaker 1 (19:26):
I am sat in front of the fire for the
last three nights and never once did I feel around.
Speaker 2 (19:31):
It's good to know you are all right. So Erin
was good to know because I'm taking your used fire pit.
Speaker 1 (19:37):
All right. So Aaron was also a veteran firefighter who
used his specialized knowledge to get away with it. So
again Aaron's the villain and his point of origin story.
Aaron loved the Santa Ana winds because they helped spread
the fires. Again, it was just still the character so
he can get even bigger boners. Yes, it's a nice
(19:58):
stiff wind. Okay, what the fuck listen what we're on
like hour three?
Speaker 2 (20:06):
Yeah, okay, okay.
Speaker 1 (20:08):
So Aaron's signature method of starting a fire was a
cigarette that Sally burned down to light a beat of glue. Okay,
I guess, flammable clue. This gave Aaron a ten minute
head start to get away from the scene before and
then come back. Oh well no, not in the book,
but in real life. Then he's eight ten minutes to
(20:29):
leave and come back and be the first one on
the scene, yeah and be like, oh my goodness, how
did this fire start?
Speaker 2 (20:33):
I don't know which you're implaying again? But okay, okay.
Speaker 1 (20:37):
In chapter six of John's book, Aaron leaves one of
his signature and Cyndier devices in the foam cushion of
a hardware store called Cows in South Pasadia.
Speaker 2 (20:48):
Cows Cows c a l.
Speaker 1 (20:51):
That fire killed four people in the book. Okay, all right,
so this isn't John's diary, No, this is a this
is a quote from his book. Well, what I'm getting
to read is a quote from his book.
Speaker 2 (21:02):
Okay, all right.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
So John wrote in the book that the fire was
ineflete termed accidental, and he went on to write quote
Aaron wanted the Cow's fire to be ruled arson. He
loved the inadvertent attention he derived from the newspaper coverage
and hated it when he wasn't properly recognized. The deaths
were blotted out of his mind. It wasn't his fault,
(21:24):
just stupid people acting as stupid people.
Speaker 2 (21:27):
Do you set the fire?
Speaker 1 (21:28):
So you are the stupid person doing stupid person things
and four people died? So right, But again, this is
just a character in his book no basis in real life?
Speaker 2 (21:38):
Gotcha completely fictional? Ten four? Okay, back to reality, not
John's fictional novel super Fictional.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
The real life arsonist also began setting fires around conferences
that fire investigators went to all across the state of California,
so almost as if like they were taunting fire investigators.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
Almost.
Speaker 1 (22:00):
Yeah, But Marvin Casey and our son investigator from Bakersfield,
was also tracking a pattern, and because of the fires
popping up around the conferences, he thought to cross reference
the fires with the list of attendees from those conferences.
I actually I should have Fixisically, I think it ended
up being a list of attendees from like one fire
conference that like a fire had broke out up and
(22:23):
he got the list down to like ten people, okay
out of I think imagine what that would be like
to just sit there and realize, like, you know what,
it's got to be somebody. I know, it's got to
be somebody. It's a firefighter. Yeah. It's like every crime
show where they're like, I think it's a cop.
Speaker 2 (22:40):
Right, yeah, exactly, this time we think it's a firefighter.
Speaker 1 (22:43):
Yeah. So as we said, like possibly thinking that it
was one of your own is probably a hard thing
to wrap your head around, because like, well, a job
is to prevent things like or stop things from that
like that happening.
Speaker 2 (22:53):
Yeah, and you don't want to tell people because yeah,
you don't want the word back.
Speaker 1 (22:58):
Yeah, don't know exactly who it is yet, you know
what I mean? Yeah, yeah, I mean because you still
he did, like get the list down to life, Like
I think it was like ten people, and John was
obviously on the list because he attended all of the
things and having somebody that everybody supposedly looked up to
and this, that and the other, Like I bet he
was on the initial list of ten and not being
(23:19):
considered at all, right because again, even when his fingerprint
showed up on a piece of paper from a different scene,
like oh of course John was at all of these
conferences and stuff. That's like his fucking jam remind him
to keep his mids off. Yeah, yeah, So it's not
something you would really think you would have to ever consider.
So at this point, millions of dollars of damage had
(23:40):
been done and countless people have obviously been affected because
there were dozens of homes that had burnt down. There
were dozens or you know, hundreds of businesses and things
like that.
Speaker 2 (23:48):
Like that four people died, and yeah, and the.
Speaker 1 (23:51):
Very first fire that I mentioned, like four people died
like they were just going to a hardware store to
grab probably grab something real.
Speaker 2 (23:58):
Quick, and then they lost their lives.
Speaker 1 (23:59):
I think one or two of them were employees. And
then obviously the grandmother with a grandson was a customer.
Like I said, when I skipped ahead and didn't read
my notes, Marvin obviously had John's name on the shortlist
of people. So all eyes were truly on John, now
not just for his innate skills as a firefighter, but
now because he was being investigated for starting the fires.
(24:24):
A tracking device was put on John's car. Did they
do this for all ten or they narrowed it down
to me? I think they narrowed it down enough further. Yeah,
at this point and with all of the information and everything,
I think they narrowed it down enough to like so
they're like, Okay, we need to see, like actually track
him to see where he's going if he's at the
fires before he should be at the fires, right, Yeah,
(24:45):
John or the insanely gifted arson investigator, was arrested in
December of nineteen ninety one for multiple fires. Amongst John's
belongings that was taken into evidence was his one hundred
and four thousand war manuscript for that book that he
was writing. Okay, it's a lot of fucking words on
how many words June four thousand.
Speaker 2 (25:07):
Yeah, that would be like every case I've written for this. Yeah,
that's a lot.
Speaker 1 (25:14):
So obviously the book that is so closely sounding like
the first fire at the hardware store. John of course
insisted that the book was fiction, but in a letter
to a publisher, John at one point described the book
as a quote fact based work that follows the pattern
of an actual arsonist that has been setting serial fires
in California over the past eight years. And that was
(25:36):
according to the Associated Press. Yeah, but he could say,
like I've been investigating me, right, Yeah, that's what I
was thinking too, because I don't think that I don't know,
I mean, because he is.
Speaker 2 (25:48):
Investigating.
Speaker 1 (25:49):
On the surface, he is a fire investigator. He has
seen lots of different types of fires and causes and whatnot,
and he has helped capture other snis there you know,
it could very much.
Speaker 2 (26:03):
That's likely.
Speaker 1 (26:03):
It is slightly fact based because that's his profession and
that's what's in the books. I think it's like his diary,
but I need more evidence. In another passage from John's book,
he wrote, Oh, to Aaron, the smoke was beautiful, pausing
his heart rate to quicken, and it's breathing to come
and shallow gasped.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
And he was penis too and large, trying to.
Speaker 1 (26:21):
Control his outward appearance, and looked normal to anyone around him.
He looked around and saw nothing. The lot was empty.
He relaxed and partially stroked his erection.
Speaker 2 (26:30):
Oh stop it, Oh, I was joking. No, what the fuck?
How embarrassing for John? Yes, surely were you going to
publish this, like now we all know you get hard
in front of a fire.
Speaker 1 (26:41):
Oh, and for that to be the connection, Like, holy
fuck me, Yeah, I read that. I'm like that obviously
has to go in here. Sorry, I'm flabber acid and
my gases are flabbered. I don't know what to do now.
John's lawyer tried to dismissed the book as quote pornographic fiction.
(27:03):
So he was writing smart for men who for arseniths, arsenists,
men people who erect in front of a fire. I'm
just like, imagine being one of the first responders. Right, like,
let's say you're right around the corner, it's called you like,
I'm fucking on it. Yeah, either it's just like John
standing there jerking off.
Speaker 2 (27:25):
It's uncomfortable. This is your case anyway.
Speaker 1 (27:29):
The book, of course, was just a small piece of
the puzzle and evidence against John. It also included forty
videotapes and seventy audio tapes made at dozens of fires
communications with law enforcement authorities. Were they videos of the
jerking off?
Speaker 2 (27:44):
Yeah? What were they videos of?
Speaker 1 (27:45):
I think the fires so you could jerk off at
home to them. I wonder if he got the same rise.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
No, I mean you can't.
Speaker 1 (27:51):
How many dick jokes can we make in the last
five minutes? And there was testimony for more than one
hundred witnesses as well. The face I'm jerking off at
the fires? No, just that he was just there before
he was probably because he was They're like any no,
but he had a tent in his pants.
Speaker 2 (28:09):
It was really weird. He was already all sweaty for
some lashing. I don't like he was red. He was
kind of making some noises.
Speaker 1 (28:15):
Oh my god, Sorry, I cannot take erection seriously.
Speaker 2 (28:18):
Sorry, the pause. Sorry, I couldnt take erection curiously anyway.
Speaker 1 (28:24):
I'm headed from laughing. Okay, well then I gotta bring
my heart right back to our largest fan is upstairs
being like, what are they giggling about?
Speaker 2 (28:32):
Erections?
Speaker 1 (28:33):
Various serious stuff down here, serious fire erections. Okay, Okay,
I'm fine, this is fine.
Speaker 2 (28:38):
We're almost there. Okay, that's what John was saying it.
I'm gonna have to learn how to like mute. My
last okay was that it I'm going to have done
with you. I think so, all right.
Speaker 1 (28:49):
John was of course found guilty with the amount of
evidence against him.
Speaker 2 (28:53):
He was found guilty and gross in.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
July of nineteen ninety two. This was on three of
five arsen charges that he was found guilty on. For
this portion, he was sentenced to three or no. Thirty
not three three zero years in federal prison. In nineteen
ninety three, on pled guilty to three more fires, and
in nineteen ninety eight, John was tried at the state
(29:18):
level for twenty one counts of arson and four counts
of first degree murder for the people who had lost
their lives in the nineteen eighty.
Speaker 2 (29:25):
Four Stars fire. That was gonna be my next question.
Speaker 1 (29:27):
Yeah, so it's not like the first trial was the
federal level and then now we're onto the state level.
Speaker 2 (29:33):
Thank you for the hands, welcome motions away.
Speaker 1 (29:36):
Up here is federal way down here state. Yeah, and
then below that and of course we're not doing video
for this. And anytime I'm like waving my hands, it's
there's no video. So for that fire that claimed the
lives of four people, John was sentenced to life in prison.
So why would John, a man tasked to examine and
(29:56):
find the cause of the fires, be the one setting
down He obviously always got boners at fires. That's why
he wanted to be a firefighter in the military.
Speaker 2 (30:06):
Yeah, like I can.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
Was he studying fires and as a kid and no one,
I mean he knew you know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (30:15):
Yeah, like little fires for sure.
Speaker 1 (30:17):
I Yeah. During his trial, John's lawyer claimed he suffered
from OCD in a form of pyromania, and some tried
to say that he also had a hero complex or
was he just purely driven? I was sexual nature. I
was wondering that too, Like being first on the scene
before I knew about the boner stuff, to like be
the first one to get anybody out of the house,
(30:40):
to be the hero.
Speaker 2 (30:41):
Take control, tell everybody where.
Speaker 1 (30:43):
Whatever it could be that and bonus, if he's there
really early, he.
Speaker 2 (30:49):
Gets to have his gets to playtime. Why would you
say he's so gross?
Speaker 3 (30:54):
It's that's so ed Nord's good and r D s
k o G Norskg, a former bomb investigator who studied
John's case, said, quote, he wanted to be a cop
real bad.
Speaker 1 (31:07):
His crew hated him. He's not a big, rugged fireman
I was at Farmer. He's pudgy. He's pretty fastidious and neat.
Doesn't go in for the pranking and hyjiinks the firemen do.
So he doesn't get along with these guys. He's pressy
yeah and pudgy. Shirt to John, I'm also pudgy, cutchy
(31:31):
and prissy. Let's do it so yeah, like they's coming out.
Didn't like surprised his coworkers didn't actually like him, right,
did they possibly look up like, oh shit, that guy's
actually really good at his job.
Speaker 2 (31:42):
Sure, but like like he's not my friend. But then buddy,
but now like we know, he wasn't actually really good
at his job.
Speaker 1 (31:48):
He just was creating his He was doing job security
at the most in the weirdest way possible. Yeah, So
I guess John, who was in like avid non smoker,
would keep a pack of cigarettes in his office with
a skull and crossbones on it to demonstrate the dangers
of smoking. Or was that his own little inside joke
(32:10):
with himself of I'm starting.
Speaker 2 (32:12):
All these fires with these cigarettes, yeah, and this, and
I get to put this right on my desk where
nobody's going to know.
Speaker 1 (32:18):
Right, That's what I think is more because like he
even in his book, he made it out like the
character was deprived of attention when they didn't properly identify
the fire as oursen.
Speaker 2 (32:31):
So like I do think the book very much mirrored
a lot of what he was doing and saying.
Speaker 1 (32:37):
Even though he kind of like tried to, he still
claimed that the book had nothing to do.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
With The book had everything to do with what was
going on.
Speaker 1 (32:44):
Oh right, Yeah, when you told that publisher that it
was somewhat fact based, you were not lying, right. So
John is still in prison today. I think one article
said he's like seventy five now or something like that.
As of like February of this year. He still denies
any connection to the novel and his actual life. But
like sir, hello, we see right through your bulging pants.
Speaker 2 (33:10):
I thought we were done. I could help it. Yeah,
so that's this. I'm like, oh, in ourson case, can't
be that bad. Yes, they were going to be bad.
Speaker 1 (33:20):
Were you talking about I was thinking of Yeah, I
was thinking purely, we're just setting things on fire. And
I didn't when I first found it, I'm like, oh, nobody, no.
Speaker 2 (33:27):
No death this week. I went into this thinking no
death this week for Sarah. But she was wrong. She
was wrong.
Speaker 1 (33:33):
Yeah, because there was fucking terrible death, like sir you
and also the amount of damage you did to people's
lives just so you could jerk off.
Speaker 2 (33:41):
Is wild and Sana.
Speaker 1 (33:43):
Yeah, I was gonna say, like people lost their whole
homes and businesses, like their likelihoods. Yeah, because and I
never saw any mention of pets. But you can guarantee
that your pets and these homes. I mean, well don't
why do you get to bring because he's fucking terrible.
But yeah, and there's apparently Apple tv US or whatever
the fuck it is just put it recently put out
a show a series loosely based on John's story. It's
(34:07):
not like Firebug or something like that. I gave zero
fox about any books or movies or shows based off
of his shitty erection life. So affrection like, oh yeah,
that's so sorry for that terrible case.
Speaker 2 (34:21):
You're welcome.
Speaker 1 (34:23):
No, I think like I was just thinking about the
cigarettes on his desk again, like that like fucking evil maniacal,
Like right, no one knows that, rights whatever, Like I'm
smarter than everybody here. Yeah, and he doesn't smoke, but
yet he yeah, just to pretend like he's better than others.
That's that's the prissy part, better than other people because
(34:43):
he doesn't smoke, and like in the nineties, everybody fucking smoked,
So you're the weird one out.
Speaker 2 (34:49):
John.
Speaker 1 (34:51):
He's like, I'm not getting the lung cancer, Sarah, but
he probably is from all of the smoke from the fires,
right exactly, how do did you even get to his erection?
If he they have the whole fucking firefighter get up on, Well,
I maybe he had his firefighter get up in his car.
He goes and sets the fire. He has a real
quick erection, then he puts his fire fairer stuff on.
(35:12):
Maybe he puts his firefirer stuff on, and then he
takes his arms out of his sleeves into the onesie
uniform and then he just jerk off inside his uniform grows.
Speaker 2 (35:23):
You asked, I didn't mean to let me see.
Speaker 1 (35:27):
Can I think of another way?
Speaker 2 (35:29):
Okay? So that's John or a terrible part. He sucks? Yes, okay.
Speaker 1 (35:34):
So my sources were AETV dot Com, there was an
article by Jordan Pryman, there was an all That's interesting
article by Kaylina Fraga, and in La Times article by
Christopher Gofford, and another ATV dot com article by Maria Rippito,
and then obviously Wikipedia, and then a murder Pedia as well.
Speaker 2 (35:57):
Oh, murder Pedia because he yeah, four people and he's
the worst. Yeah, that was That was weird.
Speaker 1 (36:04):
Hi.
Speaker 2 (36:04):
Hello, I'm so sorry. Allright, we did our socials. That's
the end of Sarah's case.
Speaker 1 (36:10):
I'm sorry everybody had to listen to all of our
bad boner jokes. Literally, I can't control it. It's not
just like John's boner's. They're they're wild.
Speaker 2 (36:18):
Please.
Speaker 1 (36:18):
On another note, everybody wash your water bottles. If you
don't have the instruments to wash your water bottle, please
just get drunk and order them on Amazon and then
realize you ordered them. The next day, I didn't do that,
don't ask me about it.
Speaker 2 (36:33):
That is all we have for this week. Thanks for listening.
Hey Bye, hey bye,
Hey, I'm T Lisa and I'm Sarah. Welcome to the
Ship show A half asked true.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
Nope, I'm so glad this is mine. This is gonna
be great. You want to try that again? Why did
I say pee? Why was there repeat? A half a
true podcast? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (00:19):
Okay, Hey, I'm T Lisa and I'm Sarah. Welcome to
the Ship show A half asked true Prime podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
Okay, We're only one hundred episodes.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
And I still can't speak, which is honestly not new information.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
So it's fine.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
No, we just had to redo the intro. I don't
know if I'll leave a dinner or not. We are
recording two episodes in a row because mine didn't record. Unfortunately.
Now Sarah's gonna tell me a story. We are not
the brains in the mouths are not connecting and working
anymore or the ever though was mine ever connected? I
(00:55):
think there's been a disconnect my entire life.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
I do have just a to.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
Add bandard scripted and also because I forgot to say
it when we were recorded doors, I took Connor to
he has for McDonald's on the way home from one
of his appointments last week, and so I'm like, oh yeah,
that's fine. Whatever.
Speaker 2 (01:12):
It was lunch time.
Speaker 1 (01:13):
Well, you know, you plush your order, you pull up
the first window to pay, then you go the second window,
pulled up to the first window, and the kid and
there was you know, I gave him my payment. I
saw a tattoo on his arm, and I'm like, normally
I don't talk to people or say words to people.
I'm just hi, thank you, cool, goodbye. But I asked
him where you got a tattooed done? And then when
he told me, I.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
Responded with perfect, and then drove.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
Out what was the tattoo? It was just like it
was like an eye on his arm, but the work
was good, Like it wasn't the tattoo that like, it
was just that it was good work.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
So I'm like, hey, where did you get like because
I need to find a tech artist.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
So when I think because in my mind, I've heard
of the place that he told me, and I've heard
really good things about it.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
So I was like, that's what you should have said,
my brain.
Speaker 1 (01:57):
Said perfect, and then I drove forward and I'm like,
what the fuck this is itt me the.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
Rest of my life.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
It would have been really funny if he like when
you pulled up, he walked to you next window to
give you your stuff. Yeah, so that was extremely embarrassing
for Like, I'm sure it did not even FaZe him,
but I literally like that was weird.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
Weird.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
I can never go to the McDonald's again. So I
forgot to tell you that. But yeah, I'm like a perfect, perfect,
fucking idiot.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
I'm an idiot. I cannot be that like, looks great.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
I've heard of that place before, heard great things about
that place, Okay, but in my head like two looks great, buddy,
My perfect was too that it's a place I heard
of already, and like, I'm getting another good review.
Speaker 2 (02:38):
For that place.
Speaker 1 (02:39):
That perfect was for you, not for me, But my
brain said it out loud, and so it's better. I mean,
I don't know what would be worse, you saying perfect
and driving away or you just like silently nodding and
then driving away.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (02:52):
It's all embarrassing. Sorry, McDonald's kid. I'm socially awkward, and
this is why I just don't talk to people.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
Yeah, we're socially awkward.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
So we're like, you know what, once a week, let's
put that out to the the world.
Speaker 2 (03:07):
The world needs to know how awkward I am.
Speaker 1 (03:09):
Also, we forget to talk about the brand cheeseburger case.
Speaker 2 (03:13):
I don't want to, you know.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
I am so disappointed only Colberger obviously, as we were
talking about in case somebody understood my cheeseburger.
Speaker 2 (03:24):
I just this is just how my brain works.
Speaker 1 (03:26):
I am disappointed because they did not consult the families.
Was families did not seem to want the plea deal,
and that bothers me.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
Am.
Speaker 1 (03:36):
I like glad that they don't have to be put
through a trial and everything, obviously, but if they wanted
that exactly, they wanted the entire truth to come out
they wanted. I'm wondering if when they do the official sentencing,
if it'll be like the BTK thing where he just
sat and talked, because usually they the prosecution goes.
Speaker 2 (03:51):
Through all the evidence.
Speaker 1 (03:52):
Yeah, and like for BTK, I'm not comparing at all.
It's just the first one that pops because BTK talked
for like seven years.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
If something like.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
That will happen or not, I don't think that he
has to speak at all. I think the prosecution goes
through all of the evidence and the judge considers all
of that with the official sentencing.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
I'm not sure if that's how it works. I'm not
sure either or not, but I agree that, but the
family should have.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
Been consulted or or even the heads up, like hey, yeah,
because it seemed like they were pretty blindsided by it
as well, like they didn't weren't like warned. When I
saw the first headline of that, it was on Facebook,
and I was like, this has to be fucking fake.
It's literally saying I'm like, okay, like I don't believe it,
and then I think.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
I I googled.
Speaker 1 (04:38):
I did not googled, and I sent it to you
literally immediately after I did. Oh no, because I sent
it to you, you send it to me. And then
it was the next morning that I saw anothers that
was when you were drinking. I promise I'm not an alcoholic,
but yeah, because that's when I started calling him cheeseburger, right,
And I was very upset by it.
Speaker 2 (04:55):
But yeah, that's you know, I like, again, I get it,
but I hate it. Yeah type thing I don't know.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
Also said, no, I just remember my brain has probably
broken because I somehow missed my.
Speaker 2 (05:05):
Pot's medication last night. Oh beautiful.
Speaker 1 (05:07):
And when I went to take my beads this morning.
I'm like, that shouldn't still be in there. My brain
is probably literally melting down.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
Did you have any No, I don't know, just fucking moving, packing, well, unpacking.
I moved. Also trying to figure out chemicals for a pool.
I can't mess me about that.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
They seating the guy at the pool store when I
brought my water. So I brought my water sample into
the pool store and I was like, hey, before you
put the little testrope in there, you should know I
just moved into this house a few days ago and
I haven't done anything at all with this water, so
do not judge the results.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
And the guy put the thing in.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
He was like, I got I was like eh, I said,
do not judge the results. And then he was like, okay,
well you know what kind of chlorine are you gonna put?
Are you thinking about whatever? It was like, whatever you
tell me to, That's why I'm here.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
I don't know. There was different types that you get,
there's all kinds of differen he listed them off. I was like, well,
for this, what.
Speaker 1 (05:58):
Would be the cheapest, best, fastest way to level this
out is what I'm looking for really, And so he
we did liquid chlorine? Was it a five gallon thing
and a bunch of you know, other stuff whatever pool
things and whatnot, but the chlorine was the major one.
And this man looked at me and said, are you
gonna be able to get that? Like pick it up
(06:20):
or whatever? And I just assumed came out like to
the car. I was like, yeah, I can put that
in my car. What are you talking about? And he
goes no, like can you lift it and dump it
into your pool because my pools in above ground pool?
Speaker 2 (06:28):
Yeah? And I looked at him like.
Speaker 1 (06:30):
Yes, I thought he was joking, and he was very sincere.
Speaker 2 (06:34):
Are you sure you can do that? And I was
like yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:37):
He goes no, but like do you have somebody there
to help you? And I was like no, and I
don't need someone to help me because I can do it.
And he goes, okay, but if you run into any trouble,
just call a store and I'll drive out to help you.
And I was like, I will not be doing that.
Speaker 2 (06:51):
I will not be giving you my address.
Speaker 1 (06:53):
Meanwhile, just the weak prior, my husband was literally purposely
saying you're just ladies and can't do this, so that
we your things.
Speaker 2 (07:01):
Oh, I bet you can't pick that up.
Speaker 1 (07:02):
And I was ignoring him and I the second time
he said something like that, I wanted to just put
it down and be like, oh no, yeah, he was
obviously joking. I'm like, sir, your reverse psychology doesn't work
on me. I was already going to do this anyway.
Speaker 2 (07:15):
Now it makes me not what to do exactly, That's
what I'm saying. Yeah, So we have one one man
knowing that we can do it, and then another like,
aren't you're just a little lady. Are you sure? Are
you sure you can do that?
Speaker 1 (07:26):
It's someone going to help you. I was like, no,
I don't. I don't need write that at all. And
guess what, guys, I obviously did it.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
She may have gone in with it. No I'm kidding, No,
I didn't.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
I was on the stairs, like the steps or whatever,
and I was like, if I fucking fall into this
pure chlorine, that would be.
Speaker 2 (07:41):
A bad thing for your skin. Before I jump into
my case, I we're going.
Speaker 1 (07:48):
To go and do our socials so we don't forget.
You can find us on Facebook at the Shit Showy
True Crime Podcast, and you can find us on Instagram, Twitter, TikTok, YouTube,
at the Shit Show TCP. You can email us at
Shit Show TCP at gmail dot com. Please give me
a fucking case suggestion or tell me I'm doing a
good job. Please subscribe and review on Apple Podcasts. That
(08:09):
really helps if you write a review, alps to push
us out to more people, which I mean, don't we
all want more people to hear this? Yes, I mean
in theory. You can like and comment on Spotify again,
just help us push us out obviously, share us with
your friends and follow us in.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
All of the places.
Speaker 1 (08:25):
Yeah, and thank you to all of our new listeners.
We appreciate the boost. Continue sharing us. We appreciate. Okay,
thank you.
Speaker 2 (08:33):
We are done for today. Podcast to journed.
Speaker 1 (08:37):
Okay, just kidding. We're gonna get into my case now.
John Leonard Or was born April twenty sixth, nineteen forty nine,
in Los Angeles, California. He was one of three brothers,
which seems like a lot of boys in chaos. My
dad is one of four brothers, and I always like
anytime my grandma talked about them as kids and like
(08:58):
how are you still here?
Speaker 2 (08:59):
Hey? Pure chaos? All right. So John had a.
Speaker 1 (09:02):
Pretty normal life growing up, even though his parents did
end updorcing when he was like sixteen, but overall it
seemed like he would, you know, a normal childhood. He
was a smart kid and excelled academically. After John graduated
from high school and on his eighteenth birthday, he joined
the United States Air Force. When he got out of
basic training, John was assigned to jet mechanics school, but
(09:23):
then he transferred to firefighter school. So I'm assuming like,
when you like sign up, usually they kind of give
you an idea of which dirreuction you're going to write.
And he was like you, no, thank you. I would
like to be a firefighter please.
Speaker 2 (09:35):
And that's good. Okay, I guess.
Speaker 1 (09:37):
Pretty soon after, John also married his high school sweetheart, Jody,
So got out of high school, immediately joined Air Force,
married high school sweetheart.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
What people do? It seems like a normal do a
normal plotlin All right? Yeah.
Speaker 1 (09:51):
When John was twenty one, he was honorably discharged from
the Air Force and moved back to LA with Jody.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
So he did like the normal like four years and
then moved on. Okay.
Speaker 1 (10:00):
There, John applied to the Los Angeles Police Department but
was sadly rejected after failing a psychological exam. After that,
John applied to multiple other agencies, including the Los Angeles
Fire Department, and there he was given an offer, but
it was unfortunately later rescented after he also failed more
testing for them.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
Well, part of what was he failing I couldn't figure out.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
For the fire department, I didn't see which testing he failed,
But for the police department it did say the psychological aspect,
but not why. Okay, I need to know why, but
find why. Okay, So something's there that they were picking
up on and were like, no, I'm as far as.
Speaker 2 (10:38):
They were doing those back then, it was like the sixties. Yes, yeah, it.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
Seems like the LAPD was pretty corrupt then true, maybe
he just didn't have the right ind who knows, he
wasn't the right type of corrupt, right. So John seemed
to be struggling to find a footing in both his
professional life and his home life. Things between him and
Jodi seemed to be deteriorating, and the same time they
got divorced. Okay, So like I said, it happens, fell apart.
(11:05):
I'm sure the stress of him trying to find work
probably added a lot too.
Speaker 2 (11:09):
For sure.
Speaker 1 (11:10):
The couple did have two daughters together named Lori and Carrie.
Things did start to turn around for John now twenty
five when he got hired on at Glendale Fire Department
in nineteen seventy four. It was a significantly lower paying job,
but still a job as a firefighter. Nonetheless, not long
after John was hired on at the what I say,
(11:32):
Glendale Fire Department, he pretty quickly got promoted to captain
and then also fire investigator. John seemed to have found
his calling. He turned out to be really good at
identifying the causes of fires and any devices used to
start them. So like, he was really good at going
into the fires and like being able to find wherever
the incendiary stuff where it started?
Speaker 2 (11:55):
The why can I not think.
Speaker 1 (11:57):
I had a second ago? And then I was thinking
of something off, like where this could be? Got orientation?
That's not the right where brain work? Please, I don't know,
I can't think of the word. But either way, he
was really good at finding like where what a fire started.
I'm glad it's not just me, no, because.
Speaker 2 (12:12):
I just had it.
Speaker 1 (12:12):
And then I was like, I wonder where this case
is going? And then I dropped it out of my mind.
I guess I don't know, it's fine. Accelerant that is
a word, not the one I was looking word.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Get it? Yeah, like where it started? What is the
what's another word for? Like that? I would just say
where it started?
Speaker 1 (12:32):
Yeah, and if an accelerant was He was really good
at finding those things. So unfortunately for southern California around
this time, there was quite a few, like there was
an increase in oursens that we were happening. But John
was becoming a well known student of fire and his
reputation as an instructor was growing as well. He specialized
in how to catch a firebug basically, like he just
(12:53):
was really good at being able to identify those things,
and I guess also teaching other people how to more
easily identify them as well. October tenth, nineteen eighty four,
quick trigger warning. There is at death, but it is
This is the only mention of it. On October tenth,
nineteen eighty four, a fire at Old's Home Center hardware
(13:14):
store broke out in South Pasadena, and sadly, it claimed
the lives of four people. Seventeen year old Jimmy Sentick.
I don't know, I don't know if my computer ato
correct at this or not. Twenty six year old Carolyn Kraus,
fifty year old eight A Deal, as well as Deal's
(13:35):
two year old grandson, Matthew. This fires seem to have
been started near a bag of potato chips, which acted
like quote, a sack of solid fuel.
Speaker 2 (13:44):
What have you not seen that? No?
Speaker 1 (13:46):
People like, apparently you can start fires with potato chips
because of all the oils in it.
Speaker 2 (13:51):
Okay, makes me never want to eat them?
Speaker 1 (13:54):
Yeah? Good, And as my gi doctor put it, I
can just eat chips all of the time because they
have the sodium content that I So, it was ignited
by a cigarette that burnt down until it lit, a
pack of matches, and a sheet of paper, which side
note it is wild to me they can identify it
down to like this cigarette on a piece of paper
started this fire. The La County Sheriff's Department first ruled
(14:16):
the fire as an accident that they thought was most
likely caused by faulty wiring, but once John from a
neighboring fire department was on the scene, he insisted it
was arson. And then again, like I said, out of order,
they'd found like I guess, he found the cigarette and
the matches in the paper how is any of that
left when it I just think like building down and
(14:36):
everything can't be arsin right unless I think if you're
looking for it to be arson right, you make a
case for almost every fire, you know what I mean.
I don't know. I have a feeling there's junk science
and thus possibly In nineteen eighty seven, after another fire
broke out, firefighters found an incendiary device made of a
cigarette matches and a yellow piece of paper. Oh, the
(14:58):
same as the eighty four fire that claimed four lives.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
This time there was.
Speaker 1 (15:04):
A print, but when the print was tested, the findings
were dismissed, with one investigator investigator saying, quote, you ought
to tell your arson investigator to keep his mits off
the evidence. It was touched by John Or's left ring finger.
Uh huh. Okay, so you know he was there. He
helped identify, uh huh the cause of the fires. Possibly, yeah.
(15:25):
So John had a sound reputation. He was often the
first to arrive and often took control of the scene
of whatever fire he was responding to.
Speaker 2 (15:34):
Weird, very weird.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
The fire prevention inspector in the nineteen nineties from Glendale
Fire Department would later say, quote, people looked up to him.
He always knew where the fire hydrants were. We just thought, wow,
this guy has such knowledge. He was miraculously fast at
finding the causes of fires. He could dig through the ashes,
narrow it down, and we'd be like, man, you were good.
(15:58):
So it seemed like, you know, we're really looking up
to him, because again he was also an instructor, teaching
other people how to identify these fires.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
So he was.
Speaker 1 (16:08):
And in that second fire nobody died or no, So
just that first, just.
Speaker 2 (16:12):
The first fire.
Speaker 1 (16:13):
Yeah, More and more fires were started, and by nineteen
eighty nine a pattern seemed to be rising. But as
one article put it, he had an uncanny ability to
find incendiary devices amid the rubble and charred earth of
a fire setter's handiwork. So John seemed like he was
getting kind of a big head from all of this, though,
(16:34):
you know, from me, I think it's because he knew
where the incendiary devices were before the fire started. He
was really good at finding them. I don't know what
you're implying right now, Okay, I'm just asking it was
just really good at his job, okay, and identifying things.
But John bragged that he caught more than forty Cereal arsonists.
(16:55):
Whether that's true or not, I obviously didn't find for
reasons that'll be told pretty soon. We also like explored
the methods in psychology behind the fires that he was,
you know, finding from artist in articles for the American
(17:16):
Fire Journal, and you can still find his articles today.
Speaker 2 (17:20):
I skimmed that's as much as I did.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
Somebody else wants to go read them there there, But
John was the reassuring face when dozens of homes in
the Glendale Hills area were destroyed by more fires. So
hundreds of fires had been set, some outside, but lots
of them were like in stores, like the first deadly fire,
and in nineteen ninety a fire and College Hills destroyed
dozens of homes. So, like I said, there are like hundreds,
(17:46):
if not I think one article even said thousands of
fires in this time period that were being set. And
this like South California area, Like I said before, a
pattern was becoming more and more clear. Investigators, of course,
came up with a y nickname for this arsenist. You
want to just you're not your first, You're not gonna
get it, but you want to give a guess. I
don't know pillow pillow, Pyro pillow, Yeah, because he because
(18:10):
the arsenists oftentimes targeted shops with poly eurothane bedding, So
I'm guessing targeted places I would easily catch on.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
Fire, like and yeah burn, okay, but yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:21):
Again, honestly, it might be one of my favorite nicknames
that somebody's come up with. You know, that's just like
fire f yours sitting around drinking. Absolutely one of them
said that, and then everyone was like, God, hell.
Speaker 2 (18:33):
Yeah, Pyro, same thing. Too many peas.
Speaker 1 (18:38):
Yeah, that's for sure how I had to come about,
Like right, there's no way something else, all right. Then
in nineteen ninety one, On wrote a novel called Point
of Origin after he was inspired by a fiction writing
class at the Glennsdale Community College. So the hero in
his plotline was Phil and unwavering, gun toting arson investigator
(18:59):
in LA and the villain of his story was Aaron,
a socially stunted pyromaniac who found sexual pleasure in starting fires.
Speaker 2 (19:07):
Is this his alter ego? This is his book? He
got inspired to write a book.
Speaker 1 (19:14):
I feel like he's writing down in secrets. Sexual pleasure
from a fire is very not when I can even
remotely try to wrap my brain around.
Speaker 2 (19:23):
Yeah, I don't. I don't know. It's not what I'm into.
Speaker 1 (19:26):
I am sat in front of the fire for the
last three nights and never once did I feel around.
Speaker 2 (19:31):
It's good to know you are all right. So Erin
was good to know because I'm taking your used fire pit.
Speaker 1 (19:37):
All right. So Aaron was also a veteran firefighter who
used his specialized knowledge to get away with it. So
again Aaron's the villain and his point of origin story.
Aaron loved the Santa Ana winds because they helped spread
the fires. Again, it was just still the character so
he can get even bigger boners. Yes, it's a nice
(19:58):
stiff wind. Okay, what the fuck listen what we're on
like hour three?
Speaker 2 (20:06):
Yeah, okay, okay.
Speaker 1 (20:08):
So Aaron's signature method of starting a fire was a
cigarette that Sally burned down to light a beat of glue. Okay,
I guess, flammable clue. This gave Aaron a ten minute
head start to get away from the scene before and
then come back. Oh well no, not in the book,
but in real life. Then he's eight ten minutes to
(20:29):
leave and come back and be the first one on
the scene, yeah and be like, oh my goodness, how
did this fire start?
Speaker 2 (20:33):
I don't know which you're implaying again? But okay, okay.
Speaker 1 (20:37):
In chapter six of John's book, Aaron leaves one of
his signature and Cyndier devices in the foam cushion of
a hardware store called Cows in South Pasadia.
Speaker 2 (20:48):
Cows Cows c a l.
Speaker 1 (20:51):
That fire killed four people in the book. Okay, all right,
so this isn't John's diary, No, this is a this
is a quote from his book. Well, what I'm getting
to read is a quote from his book.
Speaker 2 (21:02):
Okay, all right.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
So John wrote in the book that the fire was
ineflete termed accidental, and he went on to write quote
Aaron wanted the Cow's fire to be ruled arson. He
loved the inadvertent attention he derived from the newspaper coverage
and hated it when he wasn't properly recognized. The deaths
were blotted out of his mind. It wasn't his fault,
(21:24):
just stupid people acting as stupid people.
Speaker 2 (21:27):
Do you set the fire?
Speaker 1 (21:28):
So you are the stupid person doing stupid person things
and four people died? So right, But again, this is
just a character in his book no basis in real life?
Speaker 2 (21:38):
Gotcha completely fictional? Ten four? Okay, back to reality, not
John's fictional novel super Fictional.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
The real life arsonist also began setting fires around conferences
that fire investigators went to all across the state of California,
so almost as if like they were taunting fire investigators.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
Almost.
Speaker 1 (22:00):
Yeah, But Marvin Casey and our son investigator from Bakersfield,
was also tracking a pattern, and because of the fires
popping up around the conferences, he thought to cross reference
the fires with the list of attendees from those conferences.
I actually I should have Fixisically, I think it ended
up being a list of attendees from like one fire
conference that like a fire had broke out up and
(22:23):
he got the list down to like ten people, okay
out of I think imagine what that would be like
to just sit there and realize, like, you know what,
it's got to be somebody. I know, it's got to
be somebody. It's a firefighter. Yeah. It's like every crime
show where they're like, I think it's a cop.
Speaker 2 (22:40):
Right, yeah, exactly, this time we think it's a firefighter.
Speaker 1 (22:43):
Yeah. So as we said, like possibly thinking that it
was one of your own is probably a hard thing
to wrap your head around, because like, well, a job
is to prevent things like or stop things from that
like that happening.
Speaker 2 (22:53):
Yeah, and you don't want to tell people because yeah,
you don't want the word back.
Speaker 1 (22:58):
Yeah, don't know exactly who it is yet, you know
what I mean? Yeah, yeah, I mean because you still
he did, like get the list down to life, Like
I think it was like ten people, and John was
obviously on the list because he attended all of the
things and having somebody that everybody supposedly looked up to
and this, that and the other, Like I bet he
was on the initial list of ten and not being
(23:19):
considered at all, right because again, even when his fingerprint
showed up on a piece of paper from a different scene,
like oh of course John was at all of these
conferences and stuff. That's like his fucking jam remind him
to keep his mids off. Yeah, yeah, So it's not
something you would really think you would have to ever consider.
So at this point, millions of dollars of damage had
(23:40):
been done and countless people have obviously been affected because
there were dozens of homes that had burnt down. There
were dozens or you know, hundreds of businesses and things
like that.
Speaker 2 (23:48):
Like that four people died, and yeah, and the.
Speaker 1 (23:51):
Very first fire that I mentioned, like four people died
like they were just going to a hardware store to
grab probably grab something real.
Speaker 2 (23:58):
Quick, and then they lost their lives.
Speaker 1 (23:59):
I think one or two of them were employees. And
then obviously the grandmother with a grandson was a customer.
Like I said, when I skipped ahead and didn't read
my notes, Marvin obviously had John's name on the shortlist
of people. So all eyes were truly on John, now
not just for his innate skills as a firefighter, but
now because he was being investigated for starting the fires.
(24:24):
A tracking device was put on John's car. Did they
do this for all ten or they narrowed it down
to me? I think they narrowed it down enough further. Yeah,
at this point and with all of the information and everything,
I think they narrowed it down enough to like so
they're like, Okay, we need to see, like actually track
him to see where he's going if he's at the
fires before he should be at the fires, right, Yeah,
(24:45):
John or the insanely gifted arson investigator, was arrested in
December of nineteen ninety one for multiple fires. Amongst John's
belongings that was taken into evidence was his one hundred
and four thousand war manuscript for that book that he
was writing. Okay, it's a lot of fucking words on
how many words June four thousand.
Speaker 2 (25:07):
Yeah, that would be like every case I've written for this. Yeah,
that's a lot.
Speaker 1 (25:14):
So obviously the book that is so closely sounding like
the first fire at the hardware store. John of course
insisted that the book was fiction, but in a letter
to a publisher, John at one point described the book
as a quote fact based work that follows the pattern
of an actual arsonist that has been setting serial fires
in California over the past eight years. And that was
(25:36):
according to the Associated Press. Yeah, but he could say,
like I've been investigating me, right, Yeah, that's what I
was thinking too, because I don't think that I don't know,
I mean, because he is.
Speaker 2 (25:48):
Investigating.
Speaker 1 (25:49):
On the surface, he is a fire investigator. He has
seen lots of different types of fires and causes and whatnot,
and he has helped capture other snis there you know,
it could very much.
Speaker 2 (26:03):
That's likely.
Speaker 1 (26:03):
It is slightly fact based because that's his profession and
that's what's in the books. I think it's like his diary,
but I need more evidence. In another passage from John's book,
he wrote, Oh, to Aaron, the smoke was beautiful, pausing
his heart rate to quicken, and it's breathing to come
and shallow gasped.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
And he was penis too and large, trying to.
Speaker 1 (26:21):
Control his outward appearance, and looked normal to anyone around him.
He looked around and saw nothing. The lot was empty.
He relaxed and partially stroked his erection.
Speaker 2 (26:30):
Oh stop it, Oh, I was joking. No, what the fuck?
How embarrassing for John? Yes, surely were you going to
publish this, like now we all know you get hard
in front of a fire.
Speaker 1 (26:41):
Oh, and for that to be the connection, Like, holy
fuck me, Yeah, I read that. I'm like that obviously
has to go in here. Sorry, I'm flabber acid and
my gases are flabbered. I don't know what to do now.
John's lawyer tried to dismissed the book as quote pornographic fiction.
(27:03):
So he was writing smart for men who for arseniths, arsenists,
men people who erect in front of a fire. I'm
just like, imagine being one of the first responders. Right, like,
let's say you're right around the corner, it's called you like,
I'm fucking on it. Yeah, either it's just like John
standing there jerking off.
Speaker 2 (27:25):
It's uncomfortable. This is your case anyway.
Speaker 1 (27:29):
The book, of course, was just a small piece of
the puzzle and evidence against John. It also included forty
videotapes and seventy audio tapes made at dozens of fires
communications with law enforcement authorities. Were they videos of the
jerking off?
Speaker 2 (27:44):
Yeah? What were they videos of?
Speaker 1 (27:45):
I think the fires so you could jerk off at
home to them. I wonder if he got the same rise.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
No, I mean you can't.
Speaker 1 (27:51):
How many dick jokes can we make in the last
five minutes? And there was testimony for more than one
hundred witnesses as well. The face I'm jerking off at
the fires? No, just that he was just there before
he was probably because he was They're like any no,
but he had a tent in his pants.
Speaker 2 (28:09):
It was really weird. He was already all sweaty for
some lashing. I don't like he was red. He was
kind of making some noises.
Speaker 1 (28:15):
Oh my god, Sorry, I cannot take erection seriously.
Speaker 2 (28:18):
Sorry, the pause. Sorry, I couldnt take erection curiously anyway.
Speaker 1 (28:24):
I'm headed from laughing. Okay, well then I gotta bring
my heart right back to our largest fan is upstairs
being like, what are they giggling about?
Speaker 2 (28:32):
Erections?
Speaker 1 (28:33):
Various serious stuff down here, serious fire erections. Okay, Okay,
I'm fine, this is fine.
Speaker 2 (28:38):
We're almost there. Okay, that's what John was saying it.
I'm gonna have to learn how to like mute. My
last okay was that it I'm going to have done
with you. I think so, all right.
Speaker 1 (28:49):
John was of course found guilty with the amount of
evidence against him.
Speaker 2 (28:53):
He was found guilty and gross in.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
July of nineteen ninety two. This was on three of
five arsen charges that he was found guilty on. For
this portion, he was sentenced to three or no. Thirty
not three three zero years in federal prison. In nineteen
ninety three, on pled guilty to three more fires, and
in nineteen ninety eight, John was tried at the state
(29:18):
level for twenty one counts of arson and four counts
of first degree murder for the people who had lost
their lives in the nineteen eighty.
Speaker 2 (29:25):
Four Stars fire. That was gonna be my next question.
Speaker 1 (29:27):
Yeah, so it's not like the first trial was the
federal level and then now we're onto the state level.
Speaker 2 (29:33):
Thank you for the hands, welcome motions away.
Speaker 1 (29:36):
Up here is federal way down here state. Yeah, and
then below that and of course we're not doing video
for this. And anytime I'm like waving my hands, it's
there's no video. So for that fire that claimed the
lives of four people, John was sentenced to life in prison.
So why would John, a man tasked to examine and
(29:56):
find the cause of the fires, be the one setting
down He obviously always got boners at fires. That's why
he wanted to be a firefighter in the military.
Speaker 2 (30:06):
Yeah, like I can.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
Was he studying fires and as a kid and no one,
I mean he knew you know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (30:15):
Yeah, like little fires for sure.
Speaker 1 (30:17):
I Yeah. During his trial, John's lawyer claimed he suffered
from OCD in a form of pyromania, and some tried
to say that he also had a hero complex or
was he just purely driven? I was sexual nature. I
was wondering that too, Like being first on the scene
before I knew about the boner stuff, to like be
the first one to get anybody out of the house,
(30:40):
to be the hero.
Speaker 2 (30:41):
Take control, tell everybody where.
Speaker 1 (30:43):
Whatever it could be that and bonus, if he's there
really early, he.
Speaker 2 (30:49):
Gets to have his gets to playtime. Why would you
say he's so gross?
Speaker 3 (30:54):
It's that's so ed Nord's good and r D s
k o G Norskg, a former bomb investigator who studied
John's case, said, quote, he wanted to be a cop
real bad.
Speaker 1 (31:07):
His crew hated him. He's not a big, rugged fireman
I was at Farmer. He's pudgy. He's pretty fastidious and neat.
Doesn't go in for the pranking and hyjiinks the firemen do.
So he doesn't get along with these guys. He's pressy
yeah and pudgy. Shirt to John, I'm also pudgy, cutchy
(31:31):
and prissy. Let's do it so yeah, like they's coming out.
Didn't like surprised his coworkers didn't actually like him, right,
did they possibly look up like, oh shit, that guy's
actually really good at his job.
Speaker 2 (31:42):
Sure, but like like he's not my friend. But then buddy,
but now like we know, he wasn't actually really good
at his job.
Speaker 1 (31:48):
He just was creating his He was doing job security
at the most in the weirdest way possible. Yeah, So
I guess John, who was in like avid non smoker,
would keep a pack of cigarettes in his office with
a skull and crossbones on it to demonstrate the dangers
of smoking. Or was that his own little inside joke
(32:10):
with himself of I'm starting.
Speaker 2 (32:12):
All these fires with these cigarettes, yeah, and this, and
I get to put this right on my desk where
nobody's going to know.
Speaker 1 (32:18):
Right, That's what I think is more because like he
even in his book, he made it out like the
character was deprived of attention when they didn't properly identify
the fire as oursen.
Speaker 2 (32:31):
So like I do think the book very much mirrored
a lot of what he was doing and saying.
Speaker 1 (32:37):
Even though he kind of like tried to, he still
claimed that the book had nothing to do.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
With The book had everything to do with what was
going on.
Speaker 1 (32:44):
Oh right, Yeah, when you told that publisher that it
was somewhat fact based, you were not lying, right. So
John is still in prison today. I think one article
said he's like seventy five now or something like that.
As of like February of this year. He still denies
any connection to the novel and his actual life. But
like sir, hello, we see right through your bulging pants.
Speaker 2 (33:10):
I thought we were done. I could help it. Yeah,
so that's this. I'm like, oh, in ourson case, can't
be that bad. Yes, they were going to be bad.
Speaker 1 (33:20):
Were you talking about I was thinking of Yeah, I
was thinking purely, we're just setting things on fire. And
I didn't when I first found it, I'm like, oh, nobody, no.
Speaker 2 (33:27):
No death this week. I went into this thinking no
death this week for Sarah. But she was wrong. She
was wrong.
Speaker 1 (33:33):
Yeah, because there was fucking terrible death, like sir you
and also the amount of damage you did to people's
lives just so you could jerk off.
Speaker 2 (33:41):
Is wild and Sana.
Speaker 1 (33:43):
Yeah, I was gonna say, like people lost their whole
homes and businesses, like their likelihoods. Yeah, because and I
never saw any mention of pets. But you can guarantee
that your pets and these homes. I mean, well don't
why do you get to bring because he's fucking terrible.
But yeah, and there's apparently Apple tv US or whatever
the fuck it is just put it recently put out
a show a series loosely based on John's story. It's
(34:07):
not like Firebug or something like that. I gave zero
fox about any books or movies or shows based off
of his shitty erection life. So affrection like, oh yeah,
that's so sorry for that terrible case.
Speaker 2 (34:21):
You're welcome.
Speaker 1 (34:23):
No, I think like I was just thinking about the
cigarettes on his desk again, like that like fucking evil maniacal,
Like right, no one knows that, rights whatever, Like I'm
smarter than everybody here. Yeah, and he doesn't smoke, but
yet he yeah, just to pretend like he's better than others.
That's that's the prissy part, better than other people because
(34:43):
he doesn't smoke, and like in the nineties, everybody fucking smoked,
So you're the weird one out.
Speaker 2 (34:49):
John.
Speaker 1 (34:51):
He's like, I'm not getting the lung cancer, Sarah, but
he probably is from all of the smoke from the fires,
right exactly, how do did you even get to his erection?
If he they have the whole fucking firefighter get up on, Well,
I maybe he had his firefighter get up in his car.
He goes and sets the fire. He has a real
quick erection, then he puts his fire fairer stuff on.
(35:12):
Maybe he puts his firefirer stuff on, and then he
takes his arms out of his sleeves into the onesie
uniform and then he just jerk off inside his uniform grows.
Speaker 2 (35:23):
You asked, I didn't mean to let me see.
Speaker 1 (35:27):
Can I think of another way?
Speaker 2 (35:29):
Okay? So that's John or a terrible part. He sucks? Yes, okay.
Speaker 1 (35:34):
So my sources were AETV dot Com, there was an
article by Jordan Pryman, there was an all That's interesting
article by Kaylina Fraga, and in La Times article by
Christopher Gofford, and another ATV dot com article by Maria Rippito,
and then obviously Wikipedia, and then a murder Pedia as well.
Speaker 2 (35:57):
Oh, murder Pedia because he yeah, four people and he's
the worst. Yeah, that was That was weird.
Speaker 1 (36:04):
Hi.
Speaker 2 (36:04):
Hello, I'm so sorry. Allright, we did our socials. That's
the end of Sarah's case.
Speaker 1 (36:10):
I'm sorry everybody had to listen to all of our
bad boner jokes. Literally, I can't control it. It's not
just like John's boner's. They're they're wild.
Speaker 2 (36:18):
Please.
Speaker 1 (36:18):
On another note, everybody wash your water bottles. If you
don't have the instruments to wash your water bottle, please
just get drunk and order them on Amazon and then
realize you ordered them. The next day, I didn't do that,
don't ask me about it.
Speaker 2 (36:33):
That is all we have for this week. Thanks for listening.
Hey Bye, hey bye,
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