December 21, 2024 • 37 mins
Segment 1 with Karla Trotman starts at 0:00.
As Baby Boomers prepare to retire, family-owned businesses across the nation are at a pivotal crossroads. Transitioning leadership and ownership is a complex process, often more challenging in family-run businesses, especially for Black-owned enterprises that face unique obstacles in succession planning and recognition.
Karla Trotman, who CEO of Electro Soft, Inc.,a Black-owned electronics manufacturing company, has first-hand experience with all these challenges.
With her own story of leading Electro Soft, Inc. through COVID-19 and a long transition process, Karla brings a wealth of personal experience and practical advice. She is also the author of "Dark, Dirty, Dangerous: The Vibrant Future of Manufacturing", where she explores how diversity and inclusion can redefine American manufacturing.
Segment 2 with Kate Gladdin starts at 22:01.
I have talked about the importance of resiliency every since I wrote my second book called "Bounce!: Failure, Resiliency, and Confidence to Achieve Your Next Great Success".
Kate Gladdin is an international speaker, certified life coach, resilience specialist, and podcast host. Named one of Australia’s 100 Women of Influence. A native of Sydney, Australia, she now makes her home in Wyoming with her husband, Nate, and enjoys playing in the snow with their pup, Jaku.
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-small-business-radio-show--3306444/support.
As Baby Boomers prepare to retire, family-owned businesses across the nation are at a pivotal crossroads. Transitioning leadership and ownership is a complex process, often more challenging in family-run businesses, especially for Black-owned enterprises that face unique obstacles in succession planning and recognition.
Karla Trotman, who CEO of Electro Soft, Inc.,a Black-owned electronics manufacturing company, has first-hand experience with all these challenges.
With her own story of leading Electro Soft, Inc. through COVID-19 and a long transition process, Karla brings a wealth of personal experience and practical advice. She is also the author of "Dark, Dirty, Dangerous: The Vibrant Future of Manufacturing", where she explores how diversity and inclusion can redefine American manufacturing.
Segment 2 with Kate Gladdin starts at 22:01.
I have talked about the importance of resiliency every since I wrote my second book called "Bounce!: Failure, Resiliency, and Confidence to Achieve Your Next Great Success".
Kate Gladdin is an international speaker, certified life coach, resilience specialist, and podcast host. Named one of Australia’s 100 Women of Influence. A native of Sydney, Australia, she now makes her home in Wyoming with her husband, Nate, and enjoys playing in the snow with their pup, Jaku.
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-small-business-radio-show--3306444/support.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
Get ready for all the craziness of small business. It's
exactly that craziness that makes it exciting and totally unbelievable.
Small Business Radio is now on the air with your host,
Barry Moultz.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Well, thanks for joining this week's radio show. Remember this
is the final word in small business. For those keeping track,
this is now show number eight hundred and nineteen. Well,
as baby boomers prepared to retire, family owned businesses across
our country are pivotal crossroads. Transitioning leadership and ownership is
a complex process, often more challenging in family run businesses,
(00:42):
especially for black owned enterprises that face unique obstacles in success,
planning and recognition. My next guest is Carla Trautman, who
is the CEO of Electrosoft, a black owned electronics manufacturing company,
who has first hand with these challenges. Carlo, welcome to
the show.
Speaker 3 (01:00):
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
Well, first, tell us about your company and how it
relates to the whole family business landscape.
Speaker 4 (01:08):
Well, we Electrosoft is an electronics contract manufacturer, so we
build electronics for other companies in the industrial and government sectors.
Speaker 3 (01:19):
My father and mother.
Speaker 4 (01:20):
Actually started the business thirty eight years ago on the
kitchen table.
Speaker 3 (01:24):
Graduation, and I thank you very much.
Speaker 4 (01:27):
And like most children, I wanted nothing to do with
your family business, your normal.
Speaker 3 (01:33):
See that struggle? Yeah, I mean you see the struggle.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
Why would have my life to be that hard? Right?
Speaker 3 (01:39):
Exactly? No one wants that.
Speaker 4 (01:42):
But you know, I went to school and got the
college degree, took the corporate route, and what I found
while I was working was that when you see that
family business and how you're able to wear a lot
of hats and get a lot of things done, corporate
America does not work that way. You know a lot
of me things about the meeting in corporate America, whereas
(02:03):
in smaller businesses, family business, you just have to get
things done.
Speaker 3 (02:08):
And seeing that made me think differently about how I
really wanted.
Speaker 4 (02:12):
My life to pan out when I had children. And
then legacy started to play in my mind and for me,
my parents were those baby boomers, and had I not
stepped up eleven years and I guess fifteen years ago
at this point and said I had interest in.
Speaker 3 (02:30):
Taking over the family business that they would have sold.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
So, Carla, how do most family businesses decide whether they
should transition to the next generation or if they should sell.
Is it just based on interest of the next generation
or is it a financial decision.
Speaker 4 (02:48):
I think oftentimes parents obviously would want to pass their blood,
sweat and tears and all that equity over to their children,
but children are just not interesting. Did in taking over
the beauty salon, the fleet of limousines, whatever the business is.
(03:08):
Because we've been told to go and find your passion.
Find your passion, you'll never work a day in your life.
But we also know that sometimes passions don't pay the bills.
And I think what school really has taught us is
that you go to college, you get that good job
that's your passion, and you make a lot of money,
and everyone fight for the c suite, but in reality,
(03:32):
everyone can't be in the c suite. And most businesses
that are in this country are family businesses, small businesses,
people who are making a living. And I believe that
what we need to do is think differently about the
family business. We need to think about it as an asset,
(03:54):
and we need to learn that this asset you don't
have to run it, You can get someone else to
run it. This asset is something that will sit on
your balance sheet, will allow you to leverage your dreams
if that's what you want to do. Because now you
have this additional asset on your balance sheet, we need
to think differently about it. And I don't think we
(04:15):
know enough about it and or know enough about transitions
or how it works, because it's for some reason shrouded
in secrecy that because we don't know, we tend to
not delve into it. And I think we just have
to sell it. Think that you know, okay, my kids
don't want it. I have to get rid of it
because most of the baby boomer's equity and their net
(04:38):
worth is tied up in their business and they want
to be able to extract it so they can live
their building years stress free.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
So Carla, were you advocating for Is that there's a
third choice instead of passing it on to you know,
a new generation or sell it, is actually hire someone
to run it.
Speaker 4 (04:56):
That's what I believe. I would rather do that then
get rid of it. I think that there's well right now,
I think there's going to be a lot of value
in getting these businesses. You don't have to if it's
a million dollar business, you don't have to write a
million dollar check to get it. There are some amazing
ways where you may not even have to write a
check at all, or it comes from you directly. In
(05:19):
order to take over or purchase a business, whether it's
yours or another person's family owned business, we just have
to become smarter about it. I mean, I don't think
in this economy right now that I would start anything
from scratch with all the businesses that are going to
be available.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
So what have you found? You know, because I do
a lot of work in family businesses and it's you know,
the generational shift is hard. I mean, the statistics show
that when you go from one generation next, you're fifty
percent less likely to succeed, or your chance of success
or only fifty percent. What pivots, what pitfalls did you
encounter when you were taking over for your folks.
Speaker 4 (05:56):
Well, I think one of the things that you encounter
is that you hope that the staff will look at
it as a good thing, right, not that oh gosh,
this kid is coming in to take over and they
have no idea what they're doing. So for me, it
was really important to win the trust and respect of
the staff. So for three years before I bought my
(06:17):
family out, I was running the company behind the scenes
and no one had any idea, And so when we
did the final announcement, like, we just want you to
know that Carl is now the owner, CEO, president of
the company. And if you've noticed nothing changed in the
past three years, it's good because she's been running it
for the past.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
Three right exactly, and you didn't even know that.
Speaker 3 (06:40):
Yeah, yep.
Speaker 4 (06:42):
We also had gone to our major customers and told
them our plan, and I think they liked knowing that
there would be no disruption in supply.
Speaker 3 (06:52):
And they liked me.
Speaker 4 (06:53):
Anyway because if they had known me for so long,
and you know, I think that was part of it,
a very basic thing. But for me other parts where
I went and established my own banking relationships. I didn't
go with the bank that we already had as a business.
I wanted to make sure that these are going to
be relationships that are beholden to me. I had gotten
(07:15):
my own attorney, I had gotten looked into said okay,
I do like the accountants, so.
Speaker 3 (07:20):
We'll keep the accountant.
Speaker 4 (07:21):
But really created the team that I felt would be
a strong team for me. I created a board of advisors.
They had no fiduciary duty. I don't have to take
their advice, but to really help me steer my strategic
plan forward. And I joined a CEO group with a
(07:43):
coach leading to help us all kind of stay honest
with one another and stay true to our strategic plan.
So I think where people fail is that they don't
put the proper guidelines or tools in place, create their
own relationships, create trust, and say I don't know when
they don't know. Because it's not something you can just
(08:04):
figure out. It does require some education in finesse.
Speaker 2 (08:09):
So, Carlo, you mentioned that you bought your family out.
Now the asset transitions to other generations all sorts of
different ways, right, Sometimes things get bought out, there's a
financial transaction between one generation another. Sometimes the asset has
just passed along because it can be inherited anyways. In
your case, what did that mean you bought your family out?
Speaker 4 (08:31):
It was a financial transaction where I had to go
to a bank and get a loan to pay, so
that it was structured in a very unique way. There
were some shares that were gifted, there were some money
exchanged hands, there was a loan that had to happen,
and then I do pay my dad a bit of
a consulting fee as he helps out here and there,
(08:55):
and that's also structured in the deal.
Speaker 3 (08:57):
So I think you could. I've heard so many ways
that deals can be structured.
Speaker 2 (09:01):
That's why I ask, because there's so many different ways.
Speaker 4 (09:03):
Yeah, yeah, so ours was.
Speaker 3 (09:05):
I don't think it was overly complex.
Speaker 4 (09:07):
But we went to the table and we walked away
from the table.
Speaker 3 (09:10):
He was no longer the owner and I was.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
You know, I think what people have to understand is
that if this is the major asset of a family, right,
there has to be some financial compensation to the past
generation because they've got to live on something, right, whether
it's upfront or over time or something like that. However,
if this is if this family business is a minor
part of the assets of the family, then sometimes it's
(09:34):
just passed down as inheritance.
Speaker 3 (09:36):
Correct.
Speaker 2 (09:38):
So tell us, tell us about I mentioned on the
outset that this is especially challenging for black owned enterprises.
Tell us about unique obstacles that you found in this process.
Speaker 4 (09:53):
Well, I would say that definitely, banking was difficult in
the beginning for us, even though we had the assets.
I had the assets, I had a whole career, I
have a you know, things that I had amasked Over time,
banks were trying to push us to SBA, and I
(10:14):
was always wondering, like, you know, I know this because
it's government backed and it's.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
Risk right.
Speaker 4 (10:20):
Yeah. For me, I honestly just didn't feel it was
necessary and I didn't want to deal with the paperwork,
quite honestly, So I was just like, well, why can't
I just have a regular, conventional loan. And there was
only one bank willing to offer the loan and it
was for seventy five percent of what I was really
(10:41):
asking for.
Speaker 3 (10:43):
So that was tough, just.
Speaker 4 (10:45):
Going to bank after bank after bank trying to get
someone to not push an SBA loan. Not that there's
anything wrong with it. I think that they're great tools,
but I just felt that, you know, I want to
do this quick and dirty and get.
Speaker 3 (10:56):
It over with.
Speaker 4 (10:58):
The other thing that we didn't know what we were doing.
That's the other part that was probably as when you
think of going to the smartest people that you know,
oftentimes with us, we didn't know anybody who had transitioned
to business from my generation to the next. We didn't
know who to go to. We didn't know that there
(11:18):
were conferences and other advisors at the time, and luckily
I had When I was in high school, an amazing
guy came in to teach us about financial planning and
he stuck in my mind and I reached out to him.
And he was a managing partner of a well known
financial planning company at the time, and I reconnected with him, like,
(11:43):
you know, twenty five thirty years later to say, hey,
do you know how to transition to family businesses? He's
like absolutely. He wasn't the only person we talked to,
but I felt there was more of a trust factor
and I needed someone that could go toe to toe
with my father because he was dragging his feet a
little bit after a while, because originally he said it
was going to take three years, but it took eleven
(12:05):
to transition because he just wasn't ready, and well, we
didn't and we didn't have a plan. The plan was
a mental plan. He had an idea of a plan
of what he wanted. He wanted his children to all
three work and take over this business. But I realized that,
you know, sometimes all three just don't want to work together,
(12:26):
or they can't work together, which was the case with
me and my family. So now we had to get
used the planning company to help us, or get a
third party assessment of who would be best to run
the business and what do these other children really want
to do? And I think that again, we didn't know
(12:46):
that these tools were available. We really thought we just
had to kind of like fight it out and figure
it out, and then we didn't have access. So the
lack of knowledge, the lack of access, the issue with capital,
and then once I didn't have a network at first,
like who do I go to about family business issues?
(13:09):
Is it normal to fight with your family and have
fights and family meetings?
Speaker 2 (13:14):
You know?
Speaker 3 (13:14):
I didn't realize that was normal. It felt very isolating
for us at times.
Speaker 4 (13:20):
And I believe that if we had, if I'd known
more people that had gone through it, that were more
vocal about it, it would have helped us tremendously earlier
in this process. Which is why I wrote about the
process in my book, because even though it's a manufacturing book,
I really did talk about the landscape of our family
(13:41):
business and what it took to move it from one
generation to the next, especially from a black family perspective,
because there's so many things that we did not know,
did not have access to So I.
Speaker 2 (13:54):
Want to talk to you about the access for a
little bit. You said, as a black family, do you
feel that when you went to the bank looking for
money that you were being held back because you're a
woman or because you were black.
Speaker 4 (14:07):
Yes, I do, and mainly because the money that I
was asking for. My father was even willing to guarantee
the money that he was going to get from me,
so they could have gotten it all back with him
as a guaranteer. And not only did he have assets
that were able to cover that, and I had assets
(14:30):
to cover We had more than enough. The business had
assets to cover it, and it.
Speaker 3 (14:36):
Was still a now.
Speaker 2 (14:38):
And the reason they was just that the risk, the
risk was too high. The risk was too high because
of who you were and what you look like, right,
that was the risk factor. Tell me more about your
brother and sister. Had they had an interest in being
owners of the business or being involved in the business,
(14:59):
or very quickly it said I'm doing something else.
Speaker 4 (15:02):
Well, I have two brothers. They're both younger than me,
once ten years younger, one is three years younger. My
brother's one that's closer in age to me. Just he
felt that it was more of a duty and an
obligation as opposed to it being something that he was
passionate about. He's more of an artist. He's more he
(15:22):
likes ip things, but he was not into the manufacturing.
My other brother was just you know, he was I
think he's there is a sense of duty as well.
But when it came down to you think about it,
my dad always said to me, people go into business
with people who have something to offer, and it always
stuck in my mind because I realized that these were
(15:45):
going to be the people I'm in business with. I
would be using all of my assets, I would be
using all of my education because I had gone to school,
I had the corporate career, I had an MBA and
gone out in the world. I even had an online business,
so I kind of had an idea of what I
was going to be doing on a day to day basis.
(16:06):
I really wasn't sure what their roles were going to
be and and their dedication to it. And I asked them, like,
what does happiness look like to you? And nothing remotely
interests them in the business as far as what would
derive happiness for them, And I just said to my
dad and my mom, I was like, I don't think
(16:28):
I want to work with them. I don't want to
be the one that puts forth everything and then have
to write a check over for sixty six percent on
an annual basis. That just doesn't seem fair to me.
And at first they said, well, you know, that's not
how we wanted, like how we envisioned this, and I
was like, no, I get it. I get you envisioned
it a certain way. I just don't want to do it,
(16:52):
like it doesn't make sense to me. And I said,
there's this. So eventually we came to an agree because
of the advisoryutine they had said that there's ways to
make things equal with other assets.
Speaker 3 (17:07):
It doesn't necessarily have to be the business.
Speaker 2 (17:09):
Right exactly, because your parents will have other assets as
the all of buyout, those can be split three ways.
Speaker 3 (17:14):
Correct.
Speaker 4 (17:15):
But you know it's like sometimes people make it plain
for you and you're like, oh, yeah, yeah, I guess
for sure.
Speaker 2 (17:21):
Let me ask you one more question, because I think
it's really important that you know, black owned family businesses
survive because of minority community development. What's your thought on that?
Speaker 3 (17:36):
Well?
Speaker 4 (17:36):
Absolutely, I mean it's hard for me to think in
that way because we're an electronics manufacturing. So but what
we do offer in that community sense is that we
allow young people if they can see it, they can
be it. So many children come here, people of color,
young people of color, and they say, I've never seen
a woman run a business. I never knew a woman
(17:57):
could be in them. I never knew. Yeah, well, you
know where we depends where you live, right, what do
you have access to?
Speaker 3 (18:07):
What are you used to seeing.
Speaker 4 (18:09):
We're not in a city like in center city Philadelphia.
We are actually in the suburbs and a lot of
these kids are, especially in some of these classes, are
the only children of color in their classes because they're
coming to look at STEM careers and it's unfortunate. I
think that within the Black community, though, we do need
(18:32):
to still have the cooperative economics because people of color
tend to hire other people of color and at a
higher rate.
Speaker 3 (18:40):
Same with women.
Speaker 4 (18:41):
Bosses tend to hire more women because they're really cognizant
of what we want our workforce to reflect. We want
that diverse the diversity of thought, the diversity of.
Speaker 3 (18:53):
Expertise and skill, and we need that.
Speaker 4 (18:58):
We need to continue building out out the Black community
or any diverse community with more businesses that are able
to meet the need of the community right and that.
Speaker 2 (19:08):
Looked like the community. So Carla, thanks so much for
being on the show. Where can people catch up with you?
Speaker 4 (19:14):
Well, if you can go to electrosoft ink dot com.
You can also go to my website, Carla Trotman. That's
Carla with de Qua Trotman trot mn dot com.
Speaker 2 (19:25):
Carla, thanks so much for the Small Business radio show.
We'll be read back. My work with thousands of small
business owners over the last twenty years inspired me to
write my next book on how to make changes. Well,
that's not exactly true. More accurately, my frustration and the
resulting challenges working with small business owners forced me to
(19:46):
write this new book. Let me explain. I'm often asked
by companies and small business owners that I don't know
to help them. Typically, they're feeling stuck by a problem
and their companies can't move forward. After analyze the situation,
we mutually decide on a go forward strategy. I help
them assemble a detailed plan to make any changes and
the critical sess factors and actions that need to be completed.
(20:10):
They agree that taking these actions will help them solve
their issue. For their company and make them more money,
and then almost nothing happens. Unfortunately, most small business owners
implement a few easy steps but never take the critical
or difficult ones that could make a difference. This has
(20:31):
long frustrated me, since we worked really hard on putting
together this plan, and at the beginning we were both
excited about the result. I wrote my new book, Change Masters,
How to Actually Make the changes you already know you
need to make to figure out why small business owners
do not make the changes or take the actions that
they know will help them reach their goals. Where is
(20:53):
the gap between sincere intent to make these changes and
the actions to actually do it holds most people back
and keeps them stuck on the same path over and
over again. Why are they still so comfortable and not
making these changes and staying on a path that clearly
doesn't work for them? One thing is it's not adding
(21:14):
to their happiness, and it's not adding to their feelings success.
What steps do they need to take to slowly break
free and start to make those changes today that will
help them in the long run. In my new book,
I reveal much of the psychological research around why change
is just so hard for so many people and real
life strategies that every small business owner can employ right
(21:37):
now to make the changes they need to make in
their companies to grow. So get my new book, Change Masters.
Remember I'm not trying to convince you to make a change,
but rather help you make the changes you already know
you need to take.
Speaker 1 (21:55):
Stick around to get your small business unstuck. More of
small Business with Barry Moles.
Speaker 2 (22:02):
Over the last twenty years, I have talked about the
importance of resiliency ever since I wrote my second book
called Bounce Failure, Resiliency and the Confidence to achieve your
next great Success. My next guest is Kate Gladden, who's
an international speaker, certified life coach, resilience specialist and podcast hosts.
She was named one of Australia's one hundred Women of Influence.
(22:25):
She's a native of Sydney, Australia. Now she makes her
home in Wyoming with her husband Nate and enjoys playing
in the snow with her pup Jack who Kate, Welcome
to the show.
Speaker 5 (22:36):
Thank you so much for having me. Barry and I
love that we both share a passion for resilience.
Speaker 2 (22:42):
Absolutely and we also share a passions for Australia on
Australian accents. So first of all, tell me one way
that Wyoming is different than Australia. I guess all depends
on well, different from Sydney for sure.
Speaker 5 (22:57):
Basically everything opposite to Sydney.
Speaker 2 (23:00):
So I loved Sydney.
Speaker 5 (23:01):
I didn't leave out of lack of love for Australia.
I just happened to fall in love with an American.
So that's my story.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
But there you go, Lucky, Lucky Nate and Jack who.
So let's talk about resilience. You know, let's define our terms.
How do you define resilience?
Speaker 5 (23:17):
I you know, there is see I often heard it
as like as bouncing back, which is one way to
think about it, But as I've gone through my journey,
I realize it sometimes it's less about just trying to
bounce or snap back and more about building a set
of skills that I believe kind of helps you face
the world with courage, cope with change, and honestly like
(23:38):
learn how to become mentally strong and not in spite
of our challenges, but really because of them.
Speaker 2 (23:43):
You know, it's interesting because when twenty years ago, when
I or more than twenty years ago, I published book
at bounced. They want to call the book bounce back,
and I didn't want to call the book bounce back
because I don't always think you bounce back. Sometimes you
just bounce right, you just go in a different direction.
It's not always. So that's why I never liked the idea, oh,
we're going to bounce back, because I think what bouncing
(24:05):
and resilience is about, it's really about, Okay, you know,
if something difficult happens, you have a pity party, you
kind of cheer the darkness. But somewhere along, like you
let ghost, you get another opportunity of success.
Speaker 3 (24:19):
Mm hmmm. That's a very good distinction there.
Speaker 5 (24:21):
Like you said, it's not about going back, it is
and that's what resilience is. And I've done studies into
you know, post traumatic growth and everything, and it really
is about those who do get to that growth phase
after trauma and tragedies and setbacks. It's they don't try
and build the old. It's about taking the pieces and
trying to build something new and moving forward. So I
(24:43):
love that you made that clarification there.
Speaker 2 (24:46):
Yeah, something additional I didn't get the title of your book,
tell us about it? Where the inspiration came from why
focus on resilience?
Speaker 5 (24:54):
Yes, so my book is called Okay, now what How
to be resilient when life it's tough? I have? Yeah,
I chose that title because I think how many times
in life you're like, Okay, now what am I going
to do?
Speaker 2 (25:07):
So in there somewhere right, it's like WTF, Right, so
now what exactly?
Speaker 5 (25:17):
So you could fill in the blanks there, But you know,
the reality is we all get hit with the unexpected,
and you know, in fact, kind of research shows it's
on abridge about twelve to eighteen months. Will all go
through major life changes, and some of them we choose
and some of them we definitely don't. And for me,
what put me on this path of resilience was you know,
(25:38):
I actually I was graduating a university. I did a
business degree majoring in marketing. Thought that was going to
be the path I'd follow in life in the corporate world.
And then just for one Saturday morning, three thirty in
the morning, my phone starts ringing.
Speaker 3 (25:53):
I'm thinking, oh gosh, no.
Speaker 5 (25:55):
One ever calls when the good news at this hour,
and unfortunately it was the worst news of all that
my beautiful big sister who I absolutely adored and was
so close to, was tragically killed in a motorbike accident
over in Thailand.
Speaker 2 (26:10):
Horrible.
Speaker 5 (26:12):
Yeah, So that's that shattered me in the worst way.
But I had something deeper than pain, and that was
love for my sister. And I became determined to stop
living at the effect of everything that was happening to
me and being such an emotional rollercoaster and so anxious
that all the time because I was such a people
(26:33):
please are a perfectionist, trying to control the world, just
thinking if I keep everything together, I'll be okay. And
that really it took me on this whole new path
around learning these mental and emotional skills of how to
better control my response to the things that happened. Because
we can stay in the power of our response. That's
when we stay in the power to choose kind of
(26:54):
what comes next, what lessons we take, and what we
create from even the worst circumstances.
Speaker 2 (26:59):
You know, I love which is say it was about
stopping living at the effect of what's happening around us.
And I think a lot of us who are on
the other side of the political divide where the election
didn't go the way that we wanted to. We're trying
to deal with how is these other events that are
going on, how is it affecting us, and not really
let those other events dictate the way we're living our life.
So I love that you said that.
Speaker 5 (27:21):
Yeah, yeah, I mean naturally like events definitely influence our lives,
but it's.
Speaker 2 (27:27):
Not only run it necessarily.
Speaker 5 (27:28):
Yeah yeah, Like okay, Like now what are you going
to do? And I think channeling if you are feeling
anger in justice, like my sister, so it wasn't her fault,
like there was a driver speeding along the wrong side
of the road when he hit her, and the tire
police over there like never properly charged him for the accident,
Like there was no justice there, and obviously my family
(27:52):
we were in a lot of pain and anger. But
it's like where do you channel that? That's your choice.
And so again it's not about fighting the old but
building the new, Like we channel there into creating a
charity in her honor. We give grants to performance and athletes.
You know, I'm an advocate for the travel safety because
Nicole wasn't wearing a helmet, so I at least took
that lesson of like we need to take our safety seriously,
(28:12):
no matter where we are in the world. And so
it's okay if you feel you know, angry or upset
about something, but it's still channeling into something that's greater
than yourself. It's going to create or contribute something rather
than just tearing down you know, what's going on around
you or yeah, kind of ruminating over what you can't control,
you know.
Speaker 2 (28:30):
I find that when people have these kinds of events,
or they go through failure or death as you were
talking about, a lot of times they stayed too long
in this place of you know, grief, right or this
place of failure, or this place of blaming other you
know people, or something like that. I think there's a
benefit to stay there for a day or week or
whatever it is. But somewhere along the line you got
(28:52):
to just move on because it doesn't really do you
any good.
Speaker 5 (28:57):
Yes, yes, So that's why part like I've got these
I called the three r's to resilience. You know, we're
going to have our little catch you.
Speaker 2 (29:07):
Usually three or five or seven or whatever it is, right, Yeah,
it would have been five if you could have thought
of two more, but we said I led three.
Speaker 5 (29:16):
Yes, yes, so I asked. But the second So firstly,
I kind of teach people to like recognize just the
way what your brain's focusing on the way you're interpreting
the advent and the stories you're telling yourself about it
really is what is impacting you the most, so kind
of seeing like things are what they are, and it
just kind of trying to slow your brain down a
(29:36):
little and look at what's within your control and look
and not But the next hour is to reflect because
sometimes your thoughts and perspective will be very valid, it
will be true, will be justified. But the more important
question to reflect on but is it helpful? Like do
you take productive action or show up in a way
that you're proud of when you're thinking and feeling this way,
(29:59):
And I think if you can take time to reflect on,
you know, holding onto the blame or bitterness isn't punishing
the other person or the world. It's ultimately punishing you
and making your life harder. It does, you know, it
takes time in this phase. One of it, you know
is an overnight thing. But if you can kind of
show that to yourself, it does get to that point
where you're willing to let go of that you know,
(30:21):
current perspective or blame and make that transition more into.
Speaker 2 (30:26):
Empowerment.
Speaker 3 (30:27):
Obviously, focusing on what.
Speaker 5 (30:29):
You're grateful for and positivity is great, but I actually
believe too a lot of resilience can be channeled into
not just looking for the positives and what you're going through,
but also the problems. Which sounds quite ironic, but I
think when we look for ways we can solve problems
surrounding what we're going through. Like for me, it was
the problem of an Australian tourist dying in Thailand every
(30:51):
three days. That's something I wanted to solve for Yeah,
like that, just like I'm like, that's not okay on
my watch. So many of them were from senseless accidents,
and so I found purpose through troublem solving. And so
I think, if it's not about trying to feel happy
about what you're going through, but if you can create
purpose in it, that's what gives you the strength to
(31:12):
you know, start taking those those steps forwards and you know,
not letting it make you bitter.
Speaker 2 (31:18):
So you know, it's one of the things that I
always talk about in the old expression where it's kind
of like drinking poison expecting the other person to die
right somewhere along line you let go. Why do people
have such a hard time Kate in letting go and
moving on? Is just ruminating around the pain feels familiar
(31:38):
or what's really going on?
Speaker 5 (31:40):
Oh, that's a good question. I think it's a few
there's a few layers to it. It might be a
little different for different people, but I do think there
is what you mentioned, like the you know, the body
can get addicted or used to just feeling a certain way.
So if you're used to feeling pretty hopeless or some
self pitying, it kind of just knows that as familiar,
(32:03):
you know. And I think when you choose to take responsibility,
there suddenly comes a huge onus on you to step
up and to take action. It's hard, Like sometimes it
is easier to you know, throw the covers over your
head and watch another rerun of Friends and just ruminate
on the world. So I think it it can be
a tough pill to swallow at times. And I think
people think also like if you let go of the
(32:27):
blame or something you're saying like it's okay, what's happened,
and I really try and make clear it's like you're
not saying that you like what's happened or what you're
going through, but you just choose to accept it because
the kuta should have woods are only you know, digging
you further into the ditch. So you know, unfortunately there
(32:47):
may be some people that never make that choice to
let go of it, and that hurts my heart because
I also learned the hard way how short life is.
And if you can really the sooner you take ownership
over your response, soon you know you get more power
back to live life on your on your own terms.
And you know, I found so many incredible examples through
(33:09):
you know, just other people as well when I was
dwelling in self pity who went through far greater adversity
than me. Yeah, so I think also looking out into
the world to hear other people's stories of what's possible
is really powerful. Especially I was twenty years old, like
none of my friends who ever lost a loved one before,
I felt very alienated. So I do believe in the
(33:30):
in the power of a good community and surrounding yourself
with other people that on the days where you do
want to show in the towel, you know, they they
give you a reason to keep holding on.
Speaker 2 (33:41):
So quickly review the three steps again for reziliens building,
what are the one, two, three?
Speaker 5 (33:47):
Yeah, so the three are So the first hour is
to recognize, which I kind of laugh. I never realized
that astriyants say ah funny.
Speaker 2 (33:54):
And then everyone says all different ways.
Speaker 5 (33:56):
So I just realized when one day when I tried
to spell Australia and I said ah, and the girls
like ah, and I was like, oh wait, because if.
Speaker 2 (34:04):
We don't say Australia, I mean, it's all the same.
Speaker 3 (34:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (34:09):
So, so the three hours I created to help people
step into the power to choose their response. So the
first is to recognize. So by that I mean really
recognize your thoughts as just thoughts and not facts or
circumstances happening to you. Because so often we're quick to
spiral into our thinking like this is going to ruin
(34:30):
my life, I'll never find another job, everyone hates me.
Like we tell ourselves stories that we think are happening
to us. And so the first step is to recognize
is really just slow your mind down and kind of
separate out the facts of what's actually going on versus
our thoughts about it to kind of firstly slow your
mind down and begin to realize that your emotional reaction,
(34:55):
the biggest part of it is stemming from again, where
your mind's at right now. Not where you're well, the
world's that, but what's happening in your mind with your
thoughts and stories. And again this doesn't instantly make you
feel positive when you can see it's just your thoughts,
but it does give you some power back right because
i'mlike the external events that may be going on, we
(35:16):
can work through changing our thinking and giving us more
power back over changing how we feel and react to it.
Speaker 2 (35:23):
So that's number one. Number two, that's number one.
Speaker 5 (35:26):
Number two then is, like I said, sometimes we don't
want to change our thinking. We're like, no, this shouldn't
have happened and they shouldn't have done that, or we
feel very justified, like I definitely feel very justified that
my sisters shouldn't have died, and I do wish you
was in my life. But the question to ask yourself
is are these thoughts helpful even if they are true
and valid?
Speaker 2 (35:47):
Are reflector okay? And then number three we're just we're
just running of time.
Speaker 5 (35:54):
Number three is to redirect, So redirect your mind to
find more powering thoughts. So I like to teach often
like the power of powerful questions to get your brain
back to more flexible thinking rather than just the rigid
negative thinking. So I share those throughout the book of
some questions and things to open your brain back up.
Speaker 2 (36:14):
So the last question I have for you, Kate, is
when someone now they read the book and they say, Okay, now,
what what should the response be when you ask yourself? Okay, now,
what what's the next thing?
Speaker 5 (36:28):
What's the next thing?
Speaker 2 (36:29):
Okay? Now?
Speaker 5 (36:30):
What how am I going to choose to respond? Is
what I hope they ask themselves.
Speaker 2 (36:34):
There's the fourth R in the second edition of the book.
You can add the fourth R and just put me
in a footnote. Okay, Okay, thanks bery Kate. I appreciate
you joining us from Wyoming. Where can people get a
copy of the book and catch up with you online?
Speaker 5 (36:52):
Yeah, so kategladden dot com is my website, Gladden with
an I and yeah, they've got any questions. You can
find me on I'm most active on Instagram and LinkedIn.
So again, Kate Gladden, and I'm giving away a free
chapter of the book. If you jump on my website,
you'll see got there, so if you want to check
it out try before you buy. You can access that
(37:12):
on my website too.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
Kate, thanks so much for joining us, and I want
to thank everyone for joining us. This week I got
to thank our incredible staff, our booking producer Sarah Schaffern,
our sound and video editor Ethan Moltz. If your serious
abo'll be more successful in twenty twenty five, give me
a call seven seven three eight three seven eight two
five zero email me at Barry at Molts dot com. Remember,
love everyone, trust a few, and pal your own canoe.
(37:36):
Have a profitable and passionate week.
Speaker 1 (37:39):
If you can find Barrymoltz on the web at Barrymolts
dot com or more episodes of Small Business Radio at
small Business radioshow dot com
Get ready for all the craziness of small business. It's
exactly that craziness that makes it exciting and totally unbelievable.
Small Business Radio is now on the air with your host,
Barry Moultz.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Well, thanks for joining this week's radio show. Remember this
is the final word in small business. For those keeping track,
this is now show number eight hundred and nineteen. Well,
as baby boomers prepared to retire, family owned businesses across
our country are pivotal crossroads. Transitioning leadership and ownership is
a complex process, often more challenging in family run businesses,
(00:42):
especially for black owned enterprises that face unique obstacles in success,
planning and recognition. My next guest is Carla Trautman, who
is the CEO of Electrosoft, a black owned electronics manufacturing company,
who has first hand with these challenges. Carlo, welcome to
the show.
Speaker 3 (01:00):
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
Well, first, tell us about your company and how it
relates to the whole family business landscape.
Speaker 4 (01:08):
Well, we Electrosoft is an electronics contract manufacturer, so we
build electronics for other companies in the industrial and government sectors.
Speaker 3 (01:19):
My father and mother.
Speaker 4 (01:20):
Actually started the business thirty eight years ago on the
kitchen table.
Speaker 3 (01:24):
Graduation, and I thank you very much.
Speaker 4 (01:27):
And like most children, I wanted nothing to do with
your family business, your normal.
Speaker 3 (01:33):
See that struggle? Yeah, I mean you see the struggle.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
Why would have my life to be that hard? Right?
Speaker 3 (01:39):
Exactly? No one wants that.
Speaker 4 (01:42):
But you know, I went to school and got the
college degree, took the corporate route, and what I found
while I was working was that when you see that
family business and how you're able to wear a lot
of hats and get a lot of things done, corporate
America does not work that way. You know a lot
of me things about the meeting in corporate America, whereas
(02:03):
in smaller businesses, family business, you just have to get
things done.
Speaker 3 (02:08):
And seeing that made me think differently about how I
really wanted.
Speaker 4 (02:12):
My life to pan out when I had children. And
then legacy started to play in my mind and for me,
my parents were those baby boomers, and had I not
stepped up eleven years and I guess fifteen years ago
at this point and said I had interest in.
Speaker 3 (02:30):
Taking over the family business that they would have sold.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
So, Carla, how do most family businesses decide whether they
should transition to the next generation or if they should sell.
Is it just based on interest of the next generation
or is it a financial decision.
Speaker 4 (02:48):
I think oftentimes parents obviously would want to pass their blood,
sweat and tears and all that equity over to their children,
but children are just not interesting. Did in taking over
the beauty salon, the fleet of limousines, whatever the business is.
(03:08):
Because we've been told to go and find your passion.
Find your passion, you'll never work a day in your life.
But we also know that sometimes passions don't pay the bills.
And I think what school really has taught us is
that you go to college, you get that good job
that's your passion, and you make a lot of money,
and everyone fight for the c suite, but in reality,
(03:32):
everyone can't be in the c suite. And most businesses
that are in this country are family businesses, small businesses,
people who are making a living. And I believe that
what we need to do is think differently about the
family business. We need to think about it as an asset,
(03:54):
and we need to learn that this asset you don't
have to run it, You can get someone else to
run it. This asset is something that will sit on
your balance sheet, will allow you to leverage your dreams
if that's what you want to do. Because now you
have this additional asset on your balance sheet, we need
to think differently about it. And I don't think we
(04:15):
know enough about it and or know enough about transitions
or how it works, because it's for some reason shrouded
in secrecy that because we don't know, we tend to
not delve into it. And I think we just have
to sell it. Think that you know, okay, my kids
don't want it. I have to get rid of it
because most of the baby boomer's equity and their net
(04:38):
worth is tied up in their business and they want
to be able to extract it so they can live
their building years stress free.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
So Carla, were you advocating for Is that there's a
third choice instead of passing it on to you know,
a new generation or sell it, is actually hire someone
to run it.
Speaker 4 (04:56):
That's what I believe. I would rather do that then
get rid of it. I think that there's well right now,
I think there's going to be a lot of value
in getting these businesses. You don't have to if it's
a million dollar business, you don't have to write a
million dollar check to get it. There are some amazing
ways where you may not even have to write a
check at all, or it comes from you directly. In
(05:19):
order to take over or purchase a business, whether it's
yours or another person's family owned business, we just have
to become smarter about it. I mean, I don't think
in this economy right now that I would start anything
from scratch with all the businesses that are going to
be available.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
So what have you found? You know, because I do
a lot of work in family businesses and it's you know,
the generational shift is hard. I mean, the statistics show
that when you go from one generation next, you're fifty
percent less likely to succeed, or your chance of success
or only fifty percent. What pivots, what pitfalls did you
encounter when you were taking over for your folks.
Speaker 4 (05:56):
Well, I think one of the things that you encounter
is that you hope that the staff will look at
it as a good thing, right, not that oh gosh,
this kid is coming in to take over and they
have no idea what they're doing. So for me, it
was really important to win the trust and respect of
the staff. So for three years before I bought my
(06:17):
family out, I was running the company behind the scenes
and no one had any idea, And so when we
did the final announcement, like, we just want you to
know that Carl is now the owner, CEO, president of
the company. And if you've noticed nothing changed in the
past three years, it's good because she's been running it
for the past.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
Three right exactly, and you didn't even know that.
Speaker 3 (06:40):
Yeah, yep.
Speaker 4 (06:42):
We also had gone to our major customers and told
them our plan, and I think they liked knowing that
there would be no disruption in supply.
Speaker 3 (06:52):
And they liked me.
Speaker 4 (06:53):
Anyway because if they had known me for so long,
and you know, I think that was part of it,
a very basic thing. But for me other parts where
I went and established my own banking relationships. I didn't
go with the bank that we already had as a business.
I wanted to make sure that these are going to
be relationships that are beholden to me. I had gotten
(07:15):
my own attorney, I had gotten looked into said okay,
I do like the accountants, so.
Speaker 3 (07:20):
We'll keep the accountant.
Speaker 4 (07:21):
But really created the team that I felt would be
a strong team for me. I created a board of advisors.
They had no fiduciary duty. I don't have to take
their advice, but to really help me steer my strategic
plan forward. And I joined a CEO group with a
(07:43):
coach leading to help us all kind of stay honest
with one another and stay true to our strategic plan.
So I think where people fail is that they don't
put the proper guidelines or tools in place, create their
own relationships, create trust, and say I don't know when
they don't know. Because it's not something you can just
(08:04):
figure out. It does require some education in finesse.
Speaker 2 (08:09):
So, Carlo, you mentioned that you bought your family out.
Now the asset transitions to other generations all sorts of
different ways, right, Sometimes things get bought out, there's a
financial transaction between one generation another. Sometimes the asset has
just passed along because it can be inherited anyways. In
your case, what did that mean you bought your family out?
Speaker 4 (08:31):
It was a financial transaction where I had to go
to a bank and get a loan to pay, so
that it was structured in a very unique way. There
were some shares that were gifted, there were some money
exchanged hands, there was a loan that had to happen,
and then I do pay my dad a bit of
a consulting fee as he helps out here and there,
(08:55):
and that's also structured in the deal.
Speaker 3 (08:57):
So I think you could. I've heard so many ways
that deals can be structured.
Speaker 2 (09:01):
That's why I ask, because there's so many different ways.
Speaker 4 (09:03):
Yeah, yeah, so ours was.
Speaker 3 (09:05):
I don't think it was overly complex.
Speaker 4 (09:07):
But we went to the table and we walked away
from the table.
Speaker 3 (09:10):
He was no longer the owner and I was.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
You know, I think what people have to understand is
that if this is the major asset of a family, right,
there has to be some financial compensation to the past
generation because they've got to live on something, right, whether
it's upfront or over time or something like that. However,
if this is if this family business is a minor
part of the assets of the family, then sometimes it's
(09:34):
just passed down as inheritance.
Speaker 3 (09:36):
Correct.
Speaker 2 (09:38):
So tell us, tell us about I mentioned on the
outset that this is especially challenging for black owned enterprises.
Tell us about unique obstacles that you found in this process.
Speaker 4 (09:53):
Well, I would say that definitely, banking was difficult in
the beginning for us, even though we had the assets.
I had the assets, I had a whole career, I
have a you know, things that I had amasked Over time,
banks were trying to push us to SBA, and I
(10:14):
was always wondering, like, you know, I know this because
it's government backed and it's.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
Risk right.
Speaker 4 (10:20):
Yeah. For me, I honestly just didn't feel it was
necessary and I didn't want to deal with the paperwork,
quite honestly, So I was just like, well, why can't
I just have a regular, conventional loan. And there was
only one bank willing to offer the loan and it
was for seventy five percent of what I was really
(10:41):
asking for.
Speaker 3 (10:43):
So that was tough, just.
Speaker 4 (10:45):
Going to bank after bank after bank trying to get
someone to not push an SBA loan. Not that there's
anything wrong with it. I think that they're great tools,
but I just felt that, you know, I want to
do this quick and dirty and get.
Speaker 3 (10:56):
It over with.
Speaker 4 (10:58):
The other thing that we didn't know what we were doing.
That's the other part that was probably as when you
think of going to the smartest people that you know,
oftentimes with us, we didn't know anybody who had transitioned
to business from my generation to the next. We didn't
know who to go to. We didn't know that there
(11:18):
were conferences and other advisors at the time, and luckily
I had When I was in high school, an amazing
guy came in to teach us about financial planning and
he stuck in my mind and I reached out to him.
And he was a managing partner of a well known
financial planning company at the time, and I reconnected with him, like,
(11:43):
you know, twenty five thirty years later to say, hey,
do you know how to transition to family businesses? He's
like absolutely. He wasn't the only person we talked to,
but I felt there was more of a trust factor
and I needed someone that could go toe to toe
with my father because he was dragging his feet a
little bit after a while, because originally he said it
was going to take three years, but it took eleven
(12:05):
to transition because he just wasn't ready, and well, we
didn't and we didn't have a plan. The plan was
a mental plan. He had an idea of a plan
of what he wanted. He wanted his children to all
three work and take over this business. But I realized that,
you know, sometimes all three just don't want to work together,
(12:26):
or they can't work together, which was the case with
me and my family. So now we had to get
used the planning company to help us, or get a
third party assessment of who would be best to run
the business and what do these other children really want
to do? And I think that again, we didn't know
(12:46):
that these tools were available. We really thought we just
had to kind of like fight it out and figure
it out, and then we didn't have access. So the
lack of knowledge, the lack of access, the issue with capital,
and then once I didn't have a network at first,
like who do I go to about family business issues?
(13:09):
Is it normal to fight with your family and have
fights and family meetings?
Speaker 2 (13:14):
You know?
Speaker 3 (13:14):
I didn't realize that was normal. It felt very isolating
for us at times.
Speaker 4 (13:20):
And I believe that if we had, if I'd known
more people that had gone through it, that were more
vocal about it, it would have helped us tremendously earlier
in this process. Which is why I wrote about the
process in my book, because even though it's a manufacturing book,
I really did talk about the landscape of our family
(13:41):
business and what it took to move it from one
generation to the next, especially from a black family perspective,
because there's so many things that we did not know,
did not have access to So I.
Speaker 2 (13:54):
Want to talk to you about the access for a
little bit. You said, as a black family, do you
feel that when you went to the bank looking for
money that you were being held back because you're a
woman or because you were black.
Speaker 4 (14:07):
Yes, I do, and mainly because the money that I
was asking for. My father was even willing to guarantee
the money that he was going to get from me,
so they could have gotten it all back with him
as a guaranteer. And not only did he have assets
that were able to cover that, and I had assets
(14:30):
to cover We had more than enough. The business had
assets to cover it, and it.
Speaker 3 (14:36):
Was still a now.
Speaker 2 (14:38):
And the reason they was just that the risk, the
risk was too high. The risk was too high because
of who you were and what you look like, right,
that was the risk factor. Tell me more about your
brother and sister. Had they had an interest in being
owners of the business or being involved in the business,
(14:59):
or very quickly it said I'm doing something else.
Speaker 4 (15:02):
Well, I have two brothers. They're both younger than me,
once ten years younger, one is three years younger. My
brother's one that's closer in age to me. Just he
felt that it was more of a duty and an
obligation as opposed to it being something that he was
passionate about. He's more of an artist. He's more he
(15:22):
likes ip things, but he was not into the manufacturing.
My other brother was just you know, he was I
think he's there is a sense of duty as well.
But when it came down to you think about it,
my dad always said to me, people go into business
with people who have something to offer, and it always
stuck in my mind because I realized that these were
(15:45):
going to be the people I'm in business with. I
would be using all of my assets, I would be
using all of my education because I had gone to school,
I had the corporate career, I had an MBA and
gone out in the world. I even had an online business,
so I kind of had an idea of what I
was going to be doing on a day to day basis.
(16:06):
I really wasn't sure what their roles were going to
be and and their dedication to it. And I asked them, like,
what does happiness look like to you? And nothing remotely
interests them in the business as far as what would
derive happiness for them, And I just said to my
dad and my mom, I was like, I don't think
(16:28):
I want to work with them. I don't want to
be the one that puts forth everything and then have
to write a check over for sixty six percent on
an annual basis. That just doesn't seem fair to me.
And at first they said, well, you know, that's not
how we wanted, like how we envisioned this, and I
was like, no, I get it. I get you envisioned
it a certain way. I just don't want to do it,
(16:52):
like it doesn't make sense to me. And I said,
there's this. So eventually we came to an agree because
of the advisoryutine they had said that there's ways to
make things equal with other assets.
Speaker 3 (17:07):
It doesn't necessarily have to be the business.
Speaker 2 (17:09):
Right exactly, because your parents will have other assets as
the all of buyout, those can be split three ways.
Speaker 3 (17:14):
Correct.
Speaker 4 (17:15):
But you know it's like sometimes people make it plain
for you and you're like, oh, yeah, yeah, I guess
for sure.
Speaker 2 (17:21):
Let me ask you one more question, because I think
it's really important that you know, black owned family businesses
survive because of minority community development. What's your thought on that?
Speaker 3 (17:36):
Well?
Speaker 4 (17:36):
Absolutely, I mean it's hard for me to think in
that way because we're an electronics manufacturing. So but what
we do offer in that community sense is that we
allow young people if they can see it, they can
be it. So many children come here, people of color,
young people of color, and they say, I've never seen
a woman run a business. I never knew a woman
(17:57):
could be in them. I never knew. Yeah, well, you
know where we depends where you live, right, what do
you have access to?
Speaker 3 (18:07):
What are you used to seeing.
Speaker 4 (18:09):
We're not in a city like in center city Philadelphia.
We are actually in the suburbs and a lot of
these kids are, especially in some of these classes, are
the only children of color in their classes because they're
coming to look at STEM careers and it's unfortunate. I
think that within the Black community, though, we do need
(18:32):
to still have the cooperative economics because people of color
tend to hire other people of color and at a
higher rate.
Speaker 3 (18:40):
Same with women.
Speaker 4 (18:41):
Bosses tend to hire more women because they're really cognizant
of what we want our workforce to reflect. We want
that diverse the diversity of thought, the diversity of.
Speaker 3 (18:53):
Expertise and skill, and we need that.
Speaker 4 (18:58):
We need to continue building out out the Black community
or any diverse community with more businesses that are able
to meet the need of the community right and that.
Speaker 2 (19:08):
Looked like the community. So Carla, thanks so much for
being on the show. Where can people catch up with you?
Speaker 4 (19:14):
Well, if you can go to electrosoft ink dot com.
You can also go to my website, Carla Trotman. That's
Carla with de Qua Trotman trot mn dot com.
Speaker 2 (19:25):
Carla, thanks so much for the Small Business radio show.
We'll be read back. My work with thousands of small
business owners over the last twenty years inspired me to
write my next book on how to make changes. Well,
that's not exactly true. More accurately, my frustration and the
resulting challenges working with small business owners forced me to
(19:46):
write this new book. Let me explain. I'm often asked
by companies and small business owners that I don't know
to help them. Typically, they're feeling stuck by a problem
and their companies can't move forward. After analyze the situation,
we mutually decide on a go forward strategy. I help
them assemble a detailed plan to make any changes and
the critical sess factors and actions that need to be completed.
(20:10):
They agree that taking these actions will help them solve
their issue. For their company and make them more money,
and then almost nothing happens. Unfortunately, most small business owners
implement a few easy steps but never take the critical
or difficult ones that could make a difference. This has
(20:31):
long frustrated me, since we worked really hard on putting
together this plan, and at the beginning we were both
excited about the result. I wrote my new book, Change Masters,
How to Actually Make the changes you already know you
need to make to figure out why small business owners
do not make the changes or take the actions that
they know will help them reach their goals. Where is
(20:53):
the gap between sincere intent to make these changes and
the actions to actually do it holds most people back
and keeps them stuck on the same path over and
over again. Why are they still so comfortable and not
making these changes and staying on a path that clearly
doesn't work for them? One thing is it's not adding
(21:14):
to their happiness, and it's not adding to their feelings success.
What steps do they need to take to slowly break
free and start to make those changes today that will
help them in the long run. In my new book,
I reveal much of the psychological research around why change
is just so hard for so many people and real
life strategies that every small business owner can employ right
(21:37):
now to make the changes they need to make in
their companies to grow. So get my new book, Change Masters.
Remember I'm not trying to convince you to make a change,
but rather help you make the changes you already know
you need to take.
Speaker 1 (21:55):
Stick around to get your small business unstuck. More of
small Business with Barry Moles.
Speaker 2 (22:02):
Over the last twenty years, I have talked about the
importance of resiliency ever since I wrote my second book
called Bounce Failure, Resiliency and the Confidence to achieve your
next great Success. My next guest is Kate Gladden, who's
an international speaker, certified life coach, resilience specialist and podcast hosts.
She was named one of Australia's one hundred Women of Influence.
(22:25):
She's a native of Sydney, Australia. Now she makes her
home in Wyoming with her husband Nate and enjoys playing
in the snow with her pup Jack who Kate, Welcome
to the show.
Speaker 5 (22:36):
Thank you so much for having me. Barry and I
love that we both share a passion for resilience.
Speaker 2 (22:42):
Absolutely and we also share a passions for Australia on
Australian accents. So first of all, tell me one way
that Wyoming is different than Australia. I guess all depends
on well, different from Sydney for sure.
Speaker 5 (22:57):
Basically everything opposite to Sydney.
Speaker 2 (23:00):
So I loved Sydney.
Speaker 5 (23:01):
I didn't leave out of lack of love for Australia.
I just happened to fall in love with an American.
So that's my story.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
But there you go, Lucky, Lucky Nate and Jack who.
So let's talk about resilience. You know, let's define our terms.
How do you define resilience?
Speaker 5 (23:17):
I you know, there is see I often heard it
as like as bouncing back, which is one way to
think about it, But as I've gone through my journey,
I realize it sometimes it's less about just trying to
bounce or snap back and more about building a set
of skills that I believe kind of helps you face
the world with courage, cope with change, and honestly like
(23:38):
learn how to become mentally strong and not in spite
of our challenges, but really because of them.
Speaker 2 (23:43):
You know, it's interesting because when twenty years ago, when
I or more than twenty years ago, I published book
at bounced. They want to call the book bounce back,
and I didn't want to call the book bounce back
because I don't always think you bounce back. Sometimes you
just bounce right, you just go in a different direction.
It's not always. So that's why I never liked the idea, oh,
we're going to bounce back, because I think what bouncing
(24:05):
and resilience is about, it's really about, Okay, you know,
if something difficult happens, you have a pity party, you
kind of cheer the darkness. But somewhere along, like you
let ghost, you get another opportunity of success.
Speaker 3 (24:19):
Mm hmmm. That's a very good distinction there.
Speaker 5 (24:21):
Like you said, it's not about going back, it is
and that's what resilience is. And I've done studies into
you know, post traumatic growth and everything, and it really
is about those who do get to that growth phase
after trauma and tragedies and setbacks. It's they don't try
and build the old. It's about taking the pieces and
trying to build something new and moving forward. So I
(24:43):
love that you made that clarification there.
Speaker 2 (24:46):
Yeah, something additional I didn't get the title of your book,
tell us about it? Where the inspiration came from why
focus on resilience?
Speaker 5 (24:54):
Yes, so my book is called Okay, now what How
to be resilient when life it's tough? I have? Yeah,
I chose that title because I think how many times
in life you're like, Okay, now what am I going
to do?
Speaker 2 (25:07):
So in there somewhere right, it's like WTF, Right, so
now what exactly?
Speaker 5 (25:17):
So you could fill in the blanks there, But you know,
the reality is we all get hit with the unexpected,
and you know, in fact, kind of research shows it's
on abridge about twelve to eighteen months. Will all go
through major life changes, and some of them we choose
and some of them we definitely don't. And for me,
what put me on this path of resilience was you know,
(25:38):
I actually I was graduating a university. I did a
business degree majoring in marketing. Thought that was going to
be the path I'd follow in life in the corporate world.
And then just for one Saturday morning, three thirty in
the morning, my phone starts ringing.
Speaker 3 (25:53):
I'm thinking, oh gosh, no.
Speaker 5 (25:55):
One ever calls when the good news at this hour,
and unfortunately it was the worst news of all that
my beautiful big sister who I absolutely adored and was
so close to, was tragically killed in a motorbike accident
over in Thailand.
Speaker 2 (26:10):
Horrible.
Speaker 5 (26:12):
Yeah, So that's that shattered me in the worst way.
But I had something deeper than pain, and that was
love for my sister. And I became determined to stop
living at the effect of everything that was happening to
me and being such an emotional rollercoaster and so anxious
that all the time because I was such a people
(26:33):
please are a perfectionist, trying to control the world, just
thinking if I keep everything together, I'll be okay. And
that really it took me on this whole new path
around learning these mental and emotional skills of how to
better control my response to the things that happened. Because
we can stay in the power of our response. That's
when we stay in the power to choose kind of
(26:54):
what comes next, what lessons we take, and what we
create from even the worst circumstances.
Speaker 2 (26:59):
You know, I love which is say it was about
stopping living at the effect of what's happening around us.
And I think a lot of us who are on
the other side of the political divide where the election
didn't go the way that we wanted to. We're trying
to deal with how is these other events that are
going on, how is it affecting us, and not really
let those other events dictate the way we're living our life.
So I love that you said that.
Speaker 5 (27:21):
Yeah, yeah, I mean naturally like events definitely influence our lives,
but it's.
Speaker 2 (27:27):
Not only run it necessarily.
Speaker 5 (27:28):
Yeah yeah, Like okay, Like now what are you going
to do? And I think channeling if you are feeling
anger in justice, like my sister, so it wasn't her fault,
like there was a driver speeding along the wrong side
of the road when he hit her, and the tire
police over there like never properly charged him for the accident,
Like there was no justice there, and obviously my family
(27:52):
we were in a lot of pain and anger. But
it's like where do you channel that? That's your choice.
And so again it's not about fighting the old but
building the new, Like we channel there into creating a
charity in her honor. We give grants to performance and athletes.
You know, I'm an advocate for the travel safety because
Nicole wasn't wearing a helmet, so I at least took
that lesson of like we need to take our safety seriously,
(28:12):
no matter where we are in the world. And so
it's okay if you feel you know, angry or upset
about something, but it's still channeling into something that's greater
than yourself. It's going to create or contribute something rather
than just tearing down you know, what's going on around
you or yeah, kind of ruminating over what you can't control,
you know.
Speaker 2 (28:30):
I find that when people have these kinds of events,
or they go through failure or death as you were
talking about, a lot of times they stayed too long
in this place of you know, grief, right or this
place of failure, or this place of blaming other you
know people, or something like that. I think there's a
benefit to stay there for a day or week or
whatever it is. But somewhere along the line you got
(28:52):
to just move on because it doesn't really do you
any good.
Speaker 5 (28:57):
Yes, yes, So that's why part like I've got these
I called the three r's to resilience. You know, we're
going to have our little catch you.
Speaker 2 (29:07):
Usually three or five or seven or whatever it is, right, Yeah,
it would have been five if you could have thought
of two more, but we said I led three.
Speaker 5 (29:16):
Yes, yes, so I asked. But the second So firstly,
I kind of teach people to like recognize just the
way what your brain's focusing on the way you're interpreting
the advent and the stories you're telling yourself about it
really is what is impacting you the most, so kind
of seeing like things are what they are, and it
just kind of trying to slow your brain down a
(29:36):
little and look at what's within your control and look
and not But the next hour is to reflect because
sometimes your thoughts and perspective will be very valid, it
will be true, will be justified. But the more important
question to reflect on but is it helpful? Like do
you take productive action or show up in a way
that you're proud of when you're thinking and feeling this way,
(29:59):
And I think if you can take time to reflect on,
you know, holding onto the blame or bitterness isn't punishing
the other person or the world. It's ultimately punishing you
and making your life harder. It does, you know, it
takes time in this phase. One of it, you know
is an overnight thing. But if you can kind of
show that to yourself, it does get to that point
where you're willing to let go of that you know,
(30:21):
current perspective or blame and make that transition more into.
Speaker 2 (30:26):
Empowerment.
Speaker 3 (30:27):
Obviously, focusing on what.
Speaker 5 (30:29):
You're grateful for and positivity is great, but I actually
believe too a lot of resilience can be channeled into
not just looking for the positives and what you're going through,
but also the problems. Which sounds quite ironic, but I
think when we look for ways we can solve problems
surrounding what we're going through. Like for me, it was
the problem of an Australian tourist dying in Thailand every
(30:51):
three days. That's something I wanted to solve for Yeah,
like that, just like I'm like, that's not okay on
my watch. So many of them were from senseless accidents,
and so I found purpose through troublem solving. And so
I think, if it's not about trying to feel happy
about what you're going through, but if you can create
purpose in it, that's what gives you the strength to
(31:12):
you know, start taking those those steps forwards and you know,
not letting it make you bitter.
Speaker 2 (31:18):
So you know, it's one of the things that I
always talk about in the old expression where it's kind
of like drinking poison expecting the other person to die
right somewhere along line you let go. Why do people
have such a hard time Kate in letting go and
moving on? Is just ruminating around the pain feels familiar
(31:38):
or what's really going on?
Speaker 5 (31:40):
Oh, that's a good question. I think it's a few
there's a few layers to it. It might be a
little different for different people, but I do think there
is what you mentioned, like the you know, the body
can get addicted or used to just feeling a certain way.
So if you're used to feeling pretty hopeless or some
self pitying, it kind of just knows that as familiar,
(32:03):
you know. And I think when you choose to take responsibility,
there suddenly comes a huge onus on you to step
up and to take action. It's hard, Like sometimes it
is easier to you know, throw the covers over your
head and watch another rerun of Friends and just ruminate
on the world. So I think it it can be
a tough pill to swallow at times. And I think
people think also like if you let go of the
(32:27):
blame or something you're saying like it's okay, what's happened,
and I really try and make clear it's like you're
not saying that you like what's happened or what you're
going through, but you just choose to accept it because
the kuta should have woods are only you know, digging
you further into the ditch. So you know, unfortunately there
(32:47):
may be some people that never make that choice to
let go of it, and that hurts my heart because
I also learned the hard way how short life is.
And if you can really the sooner you take ownership
over your response, soon you know you get more power
back to live life on your on your own terms.
And you know, I found so many incredible examples through
(33:09):
you know, just other people as well when I was
dwelling in self pity who went through far greater adversity
than me. Yeah, so I think also looking out into
the world to hear other people's stories of what's possible
is really powerful. Especially I was twenty years old, like
none of my friends who ever lost a loved one before,
I felt very alienated. So I do believe in the
(33:30):
in the power of a good community and surrounding yourself
with other people that on the days where you do
want to show in the towel, you know, they they
give you a reason to keep holding on.
Speaker 2 (33:41):
So quickly review the three steps again for reziliens building,
what are the one, two, three?
Speaker 5 (33:47):
Yeah, so the three are So the first hour is
to recognize, which I kind of laugh. I never realized
that astriyants say ah funny.
Speaker 2 (33:54):
And then everyone says all different ways.
Speaker 5 (33:56):
So I just realized when one day when I tried
to spell Australia and I said ah, and the girls
like ah, and I was like, oh wait, because if.
Speaker 2 (34:04):
We don't say Australia, I mean, it's all the same.
Speaker 3 (34:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (34:09):
So, so the three hours I created to help people
step into the power to choose their response. So the
first is to recognize. So by that I mean really
recognize your thoughts as just thoughts and not facts or
circumstances happening to you. Because so often we're quick to
spiral into our thinking like this is going to ruin
(34:30):
my life, I'll never find another job, everyone hates me.
Like we tell ourselves stories that we think are happening
to us. And so the first step is to recognize
is really just slow your mind down and kind of
separate out the facts of what's actually going on versus
our thoughts about it to kind of firstly slow your
mind down and begin to realize that your emotional reaction,
(34:55):
the biggest part of it is stemming from again, where
your mind's at right now. Not where you're well, the
world's that, but what's happening in your mind with your
thoughts and stories. And again this doesn't instantly make you
feel positive when you can see it's just your thoughts,
but it does give you some power back right because
i'mlike the external events that may be going on, we
(35:16):
can work through changing our thinking and giving us more
power back over changing how we feel and react to it.
Speaker 2 (35:23):
So that's number one. Number two, that's number one.
Speaker 5 (35:26):
Number two then is, like I said, sometimes we don't
want to change our thinking. We're like, no, this shouldn't
have happened and they shouldn't have done that, or we
feel very justified, like I definitely feel very justified that
my sisters shouldn't have died, and I do wish you
was in my life. But the question to ask yourself
is are these thoughts helpful even if they are true
and valid?
Speaker 2 (35:47):
Are reflector okay? And then number three we're just we're
just running of time.
Speaker 5 (35:54):
Number three is to redirect, So redirect your mind to
find more powering thoughts. So I like to teach often
like the power of powerful questions to get your brain
back to more flexible thinking rather than just the rigid
negative thinking. So I share those throughout the book of
some questions and things to open your brain back up.
Speaker 2 (36:14):
So the last question I have for you, Kate, is
when someone now they read the book and they say, Okay, now,
what what should the response be when you ask yourself? Okay, now,
what what's the next thing?
Speaker 5 (36:28):
What's the next thing?
Speaker 2 (36:29):
Okay? Now?
Speaker 5 (36:30):
What how am I going to choose to respond? Is
what I hope they ask themselves.
Speaker 2 (36:34):
There's the fourth R in the second edition of the book.
You can add the fourth R and just put me
in a footnote. Okay, Okay, thanks bery Kate. I appreciate
you joining us from Wyoming. Where can people get a
copy of the book and catch up with you online?
Speaker 5 (36:52):
Yeah, so kategladden dot com is my website, Gladden with
an I and yeah, they've got any questions. You can
find me on I'm most active on Instagram and LinkedIn.
So again, Kate Gladden, and I'm giving away a free
chapter of the book. If you jump on my website,
you'll see got there, so if you want to check
it out try before you buy. You can access that
(37:12):
on my website too.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
Kate, thanks so much for joining us, and I want
to thank everyone for joining us. This week I got
to thank our incredible staff, our booking producer Sarah Schaffern,
our sound and video editor Ethan Moltz. If your serious
abo'll be more successful in twenty twenty five, give me
a call seven seven three eight three seven eight two
five zero email me at Barry at Molts dot com. Remember,
love everyone, trust a few, and pal your own canoe.
(37:36):
Have a profitable and passionate week.
Speaker 1 (37:39):
If you can find Barrymoltz on the web at Barrymolts
dot com or more episodes of Small Business Radio at
small Business radioshow dot com
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