July 21, 2025 • 20 mins
The average American spends the equivalent of 60 days a year on their phone.
A few years ago, author Richard Simon made a transformative decision—he turned off his smartphone for a year, and in no time enriched virtually every facet of his life, from his relationships with his family and friends to how he slept, ate, and exercised. Now he shares every detail of a detox we could all benefit from in his new book- "UnPlug: How to Break Up with Your Phone and Reclaim Your Life".
Our conversation included:
Why Hacks Don’t Work: Putting a rubber band around your phone, deleting social media apps, or going grey scale is not going to cut it.
Break-Up Styles to Explore: Simplify Your Phone Off-by-Default Getting Rid of It Altogether Quitting with Someone Else Managing Withdrawal (because it won’t be painless at first)
The logistics: i.e., learning to live without GPS
What to do with all of that newfound time?
Tales of deepened relationships, improved focus, creativity, and peace of mind
Reintegration after a screen cleanse: pros, cons, and pitfalls
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-small-business-radio-show--3306444/support.
A few years ago, author Richard Simon made a transformative decision—he turned off his smartphone for a year, and in no time enriched virtually every facet of his life, from his relationships with his family and friends to how he slept, ate, and exercised. Now he shares every detail of a detox we could all benefit from in his new book- "UnPlug: How to Break Up with Your Phone and Reclaim Your Life".
Our conversation included:
Why Hacks Don’t Work: Putting a rubber band around your phone, deleting social media apps, or going grey scale is not going to cut it.
Break-Up Styles to Explore: Simplify Your Phone Off-by-Default Getting Rid of It Altogether Quitting with Someone Else Managing Withdrawal (because it won’t be painless at first)
The logistics: i.e., learning to live without GPS
What to do with all of that newfound time?
Tales of deepened relationships, improved focus, creativity, and peace of mind
Reintegration after a screen cleanse: pros, cons, and pitfalls
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-small-business-radio-show--3306444/support.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
Get ready for all the craziness of small business. It's
exactly that craziness that makes it exciting and totally unbelievable.
Small Business Radio is now on the air with your host,
Barry Moultz.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
Well, thanks for joining this week's radio show. Remember this
is the final word in small business. For those keeping track,
this is now show number eight hundred and forty. Well,
according to my next guest, the average American spends the
equivalent of sixty days a year on their phone. A
few years ago, author Richard Simon made a transformation decision.
(00:38):
He turned off his smartphone for a year and in
no time enriched virtually every fact of his life, from
his relationships with his family and friends to how he slept,
aid and exercise. Now he shares every detail of the
detox we can all benefit from in his new book Unplugged,
How to break up with your phone and reclaim your life. Richard,
(00:59):
are you s sure you spent a year without your phone?
Speaker 3 (01:02):
It seems unbelievable, Erry, I can confirm it was an
entire year.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Wow. You know, the longest I've ever done without my
phone is three weeks when the kids were eight years old,
and now they're in their thirties. We would go on
a big trip every other year for three weeks and
I would turn off my phone and I would tell
you the first week was torturous, but the second two
weeks were magical.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
Yeah, your observation is spot on. Like any behavioral addiction
and the dozens of people who I interview in profile
in the book, it can be two to three days,
or it could be as long as two or three weeks,
as almost always withdrawal period, and then ultimately, once the
reward pathways in the brain had been recalibrated and you
(01:50):
get to really experience life, you realize, wow, it is
really nice on the other side.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
Of this, Yeah, the worst part was the phantom vibration
in my pocket, thinking that the phone was ringing even
though it was off. I was just using it as
a camera.
Speaker 3 (02:07):
Yeah, what you actually experienced terms of the phantom rings
is one of the most common reactions. I remember when
I was going through my detox. I'd just be standing
in line at the grocery store. I just wanted to
reach for it, and I couldn't because I wasn't there.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
So where did this start, Richard? Why do this? Why
start this experiment?
Speaker 3 (02:28):
So as a father of two kids at the time
and a husband, it was putting a strain on so
many facets in my life. You know, it will resonate
with your listeners. Certainly in terms of my professional life,
I was really having a difficult time in terms of
accomplishing deep work being a technology professional at Georgetown University,
(02:50):
and certainly in terms of relationships in terms of my
wife and my kids, I wasn't as present as I
wanted to be. And then certainly in terms of myself,
I wasn't able to embrace solitude. Whenever I had a
stress or a worry or a concern wherever it was,
I just brought out the constant companion model that is
the phone, and that was really impacting me in terms
(03:11):
of investing in myself. So it's putting a strain on
so many facets, and that's when I really needed to
do something about it.
Speaker 2 (03:19):
So where are the Because I think it takes a
tremendous amount of courage to actually start this experiment. Where
did that come from? And why did you give yourself
permission to do it?
Speaker 4 (03:30):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (03:30):
So I had been experimenting for years at that point.
There are so many different self help books and articles
out there that espouse hacks, and as noble as those
hacks or shortcuts are, with a true behavioral addiction that
most of us are experiencing.
Speaker 4 (03:48):
It just didn't go far enough.
Speaker 3 (03:49):
So things like deleting social media apps, digital sabbath, turning
your phone to gray scale, screen time restrictions, Floyer method,
putting a rubber band around it.
Speaker 4 (04:02):
I tried, like, I don't done.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
That, it doesn't work off exactly, a screensaver that says
it's off for a reason, stupid.
Speaker 4 (04:13):
That didn't work either exactly.
Speaker 3 (04:16):
So many of us are trying these things and they
just start cutting it.
Speaker 4 (04:19):
So.
Speaker 3 (04:20):
I remember reading a book from an Australian media professor
who decided he was going to do a digital detox,
and he did something even more drastic than what I did,
and he basically took a close to five week journey
on a container ship from Melbourne and Australia to Singapore
and he basically brought nothing with him. Now, I think
(04:42):
I'd have had a much more difficult time making the
case for my wife if I told her I was
going on a five week containers journey with no one
able to reach me by times he needs like a
really drastic and severe case to sort of like actually
take you to more of a middle ground. And for me,
my middle ground with my wife was like, I want
to turn my smartphone off for a year, and I
really want to reconnect with you. I want to reconnect
(05:03):
with the family. I want to be a more present
father and husband. And that was the case that I made.
So it took you know, reading and exposed myself to
a pretty drastic case for me to then decide, you
know what, I should just turn.
Speaker 4 (05:16):
Off my phone.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
You know, you say turn off your phone. Did you
not have a cell phone or all, or just not
have a smartphone.
Speaker 3 (05:23):
Yeah, So from all the interviews I did for the book,
I outlined four different breakup styles, so four different ways
that you can try turning off your smartphone. And for me,
the philosophy that I embraced is something that I've coined
the off by default philosophy. So basically, I made sure
I was accountable, you know, as my wife.
Speaker 4 (05:43):
And my inner circle.
Speaker 3 (05:45):
I still carried my smartphone around with me. So let's
say I took the kids to the zoo, I went
to the office in DC. I still had my smartphone
with me. I just left it off. Now has provided
some assurances for my wife that, you know, God forbid,
our oldest son has an anaphyletic reaction. He's a food allergies.
(06:06):
That I did have a smart phone with me and
then I could turn it on, so that gave her
some ease, But it also gave me that ease of Okay,
it's not on. So I was still experiencing the detox experience.
So that was the breakup style that I embraced.
Speaker 2 (06:19):
So how was your wife with that breakup style because
she couldn't reach out to you because your phone was off?
How is that?
Speaker 3 (06:27):
Yeah, just like for me, she also experienced the bit
of that with dre all too. You know, for the
first week for both of us, it was it was rocky.
You know, I have a whole section in the book
about preparation. You could prepare all you like when it
comes to the behavioral addiction. There's gonna be withdrawal, not
just for you, but also for those nearest and dearest
to you, and that included my wife. So we prepared
(06:49):
a lot, and you know, we really did our best
to plan as best as we could. But yeah, there
were a few moments I remember the first week where
she was she was mad, like she was mad that
she couldn't get in touch with these specific moments. But
then after we got past it the first week or two,
my gosh, like everything changed. I mean, something that I
think will really resonate for listeners is, you know, we've
(07:11):
grown accustomed to during the workday texting back and forth
with our spouse or with our partners. We text, we
text and forth back and forth so much that before
you know it, by the evening time when you get
back home, when you're having dinner with your loved ones,
you already know everything else that happened throughout the day,
so there's like nothing to catch up one. So for
(07:31):
us there was like this almost excitement in terms of
us getting home. Like now it's more normal, but at
the time this was like like newfound discovery for each
of us because like there were so many things that
we wanted to share, so we weren't wasting that appetite
during the day. Instead, we were not only fulfilling our
you know, our our hunger needs with our dinner, but
(07:52):
we were also like fulfilling our emotional needs too by
talking with one another actually verbally at the table the
same thing after put the kids to sleep. Our general
process when we put the kids to sleep was right afterwards,
we head over to the sofas in the living room,
we pop out our phones and we would just either doom,
scroll or stream or take it over for a couple hours.
(08:13):
So even though you're together, truly not together so any rate,
my wife and I became that much closer because of
that process. And yeah, she was grateful by after one
two months she was like, I like this husband so
much more.
Speaker 2 (08:29):
You know, it's interesting. I talked about the big trips
we went on, and we made all the kids do this,
and as they got older, and you know something, the
conversations at meals were so much better because there was
no distraction from the phone. We actually had to connect
with each.
Speaker 3 (08:42):
Other absolutely being present like that is so important. And
since you know, many listeners are small small business owners
and they're in the working world, and something I will
point out is that even if your smartphone is let's say,
a requirement for your professional life, you should also know
(09:04):
that it's really important to separate your business and personal
digital footprints. So, for example, I interview an on call anesthesiologist.
Speaker 4 (09:15):
I mean this is going to be the most extreme case.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
It's an on call anesthesiologist at John Hopkins Hospital, someone
who's literally saving lives. A work smartphone is absolutely required
for this individual, and I profile him in the book
and go into a whole deep dive. But the short
of it is is that when he leaves the hospital,
he leaves his work smartphone plugged in. He doesn't take
(09:38):
his work smartphone with him. So you might ask, all right,
so how does he do his notes and how does
he able to be an on call doctor He doesn't
have his work smartphone. Well, he got permission from the
hospital to use not a two way pager. No, no, no,
he has a one way pager. His argument is, why
(09:58):
would I want to bring absolute craziness from my workday
to my personal life.
Speaker 4 (10:05):
I have a life, I have kids, I have family.
You know, I.
Speaker 3 (10:08):
Wouldn't want to bring that crazes and I want to
be present. So even though it's a bit of an
extreme case, I think it's a great example. Whether you're
an electrician, whether you're a roof or whether you're a
marketer or social media strategist, whatever it is, Sometimes a
smartphone is required for work, but it is so important
that it's an important case study, that it doesn't necessarily
(10:28):
have to be brought into your personal life too.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
Now, Rigide, one of the other things you talk about
is another breakup style is simplify your phone. What does
that mean?
Speaker 3 (10:38):
Yeah, so simplifying your phone is to transition from a
smartphone to a basic phone. Some people call them flip phones,
some people come them to call them dumb phones. But
for the four breakup styles to talk about, I recommend
at least sixty days of having your smartphone off, So
in this case, having your smartphone off for sixty days
(10:58):
and switching over your SIM card over to a basic phone.
This is by far the easiest of the four breakup styles,
in a large part to the fact that you still
have a phone. Now for the sake of the detox.
There are hundreds of basic phone models, but I really
recommend going as.
Speaker 4 (11:18):
Basic as possible.
Speaker 3 (11:20):
So something like an Alcatel or a TCL Flip or
a Nokia something you could buy for eighty dollars or
less from a Best Buy. And what's so good about
one of these phones is that all it can do
is call and text. And the truth is is that
you're not going to really want to text on these
phones because it is just so annoying and so hard
(11:43):
to have to punch the numbers the T nine texting
interface over and over again. But ultimately you're just going
to want to call the person. So switching over to
a basic phone can really be transformative. Like I interviewed
as school principal who you can imagine for a school
principle between amalies and teachers and thus it's a public
(12:04):
school system in Chicago, the school administrators, he was in
over one hundred text message threads a day and was
at over six hours a day on a smartphone. Switches
over to a basic phone and he all of a
sudden became in control of his phone rather than it
being control of him.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Well, one of the other methods you talk about is
quitting with somebody else. I assume that makes it a
little bit easier.
Speaker 3 (12:29):
Yes, there's something that's incredibly powerful with turning off your
phone and doing it with either a loved one like
a spouse or a partner, or perhaps a dear friend
or even a work colleague. There is something that's incredibly
powerful about that because there's all of a sudden a
true accountability. So when you're going through the withdrawal. The
(12:52):
first week or two you have someone to lean on you.
You're going to have hours of newfound time that you
didn't have before. The average American adults spends more than
five hours a day on their smartphone. All of a sudden,
you're going to have hours freed up. What are you
going to fill in for your replacement activities? You're going
to want to create.
Speaker 4 (13:08):
A menu of options. You checked in.
Speaker 3 (13:11):
You do regular check ins with the person you're quitting with,
and you could see, hey, I committed to Sunday morning
going to church, or I committed to Monday evenings going
to this restaurant with this individual.
Speaker 4 (13:23):
Are you doing it?
Speaker 3 (13:24):
So doing it with someone else is powerful. In the book,
I profiled two couples, one from Northern Ireland and one
from Italy. One from Italy went just interest to Think
Listeners because he's a financial analyst and operating a small
business and he quit with his life and an experience
(13:47):
was incredibly powerful and they're still doing that. Couple is
still doing their breakup this day five years later.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
Well but how have you know, and with any addiction
is withdrawal, right, so how do you manage your withdrawal.
Speaker 3 (14:01):
Yeah, so symptoms vary among the people that I profiled.
Some are more mild, lasting two or three days and
could be just more mild anxiety, and for others it
could be for sure and more severe. It could last
two or three weeks. Some people have headaches, some people
can have night sweats, And that's how much of a
behavioral addiction.
Speaker 2 (14:20):
This is physical problems people have.
Speaker 4 (14:23):
Richard, absolutely correct.
Speaker 3 (14:28):
You just have to realize that there is the other side,
the other end, and once you get past that withdrawal,
it's just golden from there. So I talk about in
the preparation phase before going through a process like this,
it's really important to establish a support group, whether it
be family or friends or colleagues, making sure you have
everyone on board.
Speaker 4 (14:48):
Like if you have a boss at work, you.
Speaker 3 (14:52):
Want to make sure that person is aligned with what
you are doing. So too with spouse, you want to
make sure that person is on board and is on
your side. That way, when you're going through any withdrawal symptoms,
going through the process, ultimately you have someone to lean
on and they're here to support you.
Speaker 2 (15:12):
So one of the things that I would have the
hardest time doing without especially when I'm driving is GPS.
So do we pull out the old maps?
Speaker 3 (15:19):
What do we do?
Speaker 4 (15:22):
Yeah? So it's really exciting this phase. You know.
Speaker 3 (15:25):
I have a whole sidebar on this in the book
about an immigration attorney who moved from the United States
to Spain who didn't use the smartphone and had to
engage with the city with actual paper maps. And how
empowering of a process that is for me personally. You know,
(15:45):
for my year long detox, either my life or myself
would jot down directions on a notepad before I would
leave to take the kids to a birthday party, or
I would print out directions from Google Maps and I
would engaged with maps that way.
Speaker 4 (16:01):
Now, the first one or two.
Speaker 3 (16:02):
Times I did this, it was absolutely frightening to not
have the GPS voice as my navigator. But after a
while I really started to enjoy it. So even so
to this day, since my detox is over, if a
drive is forty five minutes or less, I will always
write down or print out directions just like my go
to I'll still have my smartphone on me is off,
(16:23):
I'll still my smartphone with me as a backup, but
I really like to engage with directions. If something is
much longer, let's say we're going an hour and a
half or more and we're the family, then oftentimes I
will use it as a GPS. But here's the important lesson,
which is, you know, two weeks ago, we took the
kids to our Hershey Park before camp started, and the
(16:44):
drive from Baltimore to Hershey Park is about an hour
and a half, and we ran into some traffic and
I decided to turn my smartphone on and put the
GPS on while we were in the car. But what
happened when we arrived at Hershey Park and arrived at
our destination, I turned my smartphone off. And I wouldn't
have been able to do that if I didn't go
through that whole detox process. But what I realized from
(17:06):
the detox is that I'm a much better person. I'm
a much more present person with my phone off. So
I knew that the phone would be able to enhance
my life at that moment, so I used it for
the GPS. But then when I got to the destination,
I knew I wanted to have it off so if
the rest of the day I could be present with
my family.
Speaker 2 (17:25):
So is that really an example of how you've reintegrated
the phone after your screen cleanse.
Speaker 3 (17:31):
That's correct, and that is the end goal. And now
it's the book that it came out a few weeks ago,
I'm starting to hear from listeners who are already starting
their experimentation and already starting to think through it. And
I'm starting to see some of these success stories come through.
And that's one of the things that I've just been
so amazed by as I started this whole process with
(17:51):
the book launch, is that ultimately the goal is is
that let's say you're on your phone like the average American,
say four or five hours a.
Speaker 4 (18:00):
Day, whatever it might be.
Speaker 3 (18:02):
The goal is that at the end of the day,
you can look at your smartphone and you can say,
all right, I spent an hour and twelve minutes on
my phone. Forty five minutes of that was a phone call,
let's say, with my father, twenty minutes of that was
using GPS, and seven minutes of that was sending messages
like to my kids. And then you're like, okay, I
(18:23):
can account for what I'm doing versus you look at
your phone you see four and a half five hours
on Safari Instagram texting, WhatsApp, whatever it might be, and
you're like, gosh, what did I do with my day?
Speaker 4 (18:36):
So yes, the goal is.
Speaker 3 (18:37):
With reintegration, after you've recalibrated the reward pathways in your
brain to be able to account for this is what
I did to use my phone and this is how
it enhanced my life.
Speaker 1 (18:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (18:47):
I love that the talle book is called Unplug How
to Break up with your phone and Reclaim your life. Richard,
I appreciate me on the show Where Can People Catch
Up with you?
Speaker 3 (18:56):
So it probably won't surprise listeners to hear this, But
I have no social media account, but I do have
a personal website www. Dot Richard dash Simon dot com.
And the book is available at all bookstores wherever books
are sold.
Speaker 2 (19:14):
And you could probably buy it online on your smartphone.
Speaker 4 (19:17):
Right that is possible?
Speaker 2 (19:19):
It is I wouldn't know. Richard, thank you so much
for joining us, and I got to thank everyone for
joining this week's radio show. I want to thank our
incredible staff, our booking producer Sarah Schaffern, our sound editor
Ethan Moltz. If your serious, I'll be more successful this year.
You got to give me a call. I've set up
a private line on my cell phone seven seven three
eight three seven eight two five zero, or you can
(19:42):
email me from your computer at Barry at Molts dot com. Remember,
love everyone, trust. If you impel your own canoe, have
a profitable and passionate week.
Speaker 1 (19:53):
You can find Barrymoltz on the web at Barrymolts dot
com or more episodes of Small Business Radio and Smallbiz
Radio Show dot com.
Get ready for all the craziness of small business. It's
exactly that craziness that makes it exciting and totally unbelievable.
Small Business Radio is now on the air with your host,
Barry Moultz.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
Well, thanks for joining this week's radio show. Remember this
is the final word in small business. For those keeping track,
this is now show number eight hundred and forty. Well,
according to my next guest, the average American spends the
equivalent of sixty days a year on their phone. A
few years ago, author Richard Simon made a transformation decision.
(00:38):
He turned off his smartphone for a year and in
no time enriched virtually every fact of his life, from
his relationships with his family and friends to how he slept,
aid and exercise. Now he shares every detail of the
detox we can all benefit from in his new book Unplugged,
How to break up with your phone and reclaim your life. Richard,
(00:59):
are you s sure you spent a year without your phone?
Speaker 3 (01:02):
It seems unbelievable, Erry, I can confirm it was an
entire year.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Wow. You know, the longest I've ever done without my
phone is three weeks when the kids were eight years old,
and now they're in their thirties. We would go on
a big trip every other year for three weeks and
I would turn off my phone and I would tell
you the first week was torturous, but the second two
weeks were magical.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
Yeah, your observation is spot on. Like any behavioral addiction
and the dozens of people who I interview in profile
in the book, it can be two to three days,
or it could be as long as two or three weeks,
as almost always withdrawal period, and then ultimately, once the
reward pathways in the brain had been recalibrated and you
(01:50):
get to really experience life, you realize, wow, it is
really nice on the other side.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
Of this, Yeah, the worst part was the phantom vibration
in my pocket, thinking that the phone was ringing even
though it was off. I was just using it as
a camera.
Speaker 3 (02:07):
Yeah, what you actually experienced terms of the phantom rings
is one of the most common reactions. I remember when
I was going through my detox. I'd just be standing
in line at the grocery store. I just wanted to
reach for it, and I couldn't because I wasn't there.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
So where did this start, Richard? Why do this? Why
start this experiment?
Speaker 3 (02:28):
So as a father of two kids at the time
and a husband, it was putting a strain on so
many facets in my life. You know, it will resonate
with your listeners. Certainly in terms of my professional life,
I was really having a difficult time in terms of
accomplishing deep work being a technology professional at Georgetown University,
(02:50):
and certainly in terms of relationships in terms of my
wife and my kids, I wasn't as present as I
wanted to be. And then certainly in terms of myself,
I wasn't able to embrace solitude. Whenever I had a
stress or a worry or a concern wherever it was,
I just brought out the constant companion model that is
the phone, and that was really impacting me in terms
(03:11):
of investing in myself. So it's putting a strain on
so many facets, and that's when I really needed to
do something about it.
Speaker 2 (03:19):
So where are the Because I think it takes a
tremendous amount of courage to actually start this experiment. Where
did that come from? And why did you give yourself
permission to do it?
Speaker 4 (03:30):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (03:30):
So I had been experimenting for years at that point.
There are so many different self help books and articles
out there that espouse hacks, and as noble as those
hacks or shortcuts are, with a true behavioral addiction that
most of us are experiencing.
Speaker 4 (03:48):
It just didn't go far enough.
Speaker 3 (03:49):
So things like deleting social media apps, digital sabbath, turning
your phone to gray scale, screen time restrictions, Floyer method,
putting a rubber band around it.
Speaker 4 (04:02):
I tried, like, I don't done.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
That, it doesn't work off exactly, a screensaver that says
it's off for a reason, stupid.
Speaker 4 (04:13):
That didn't work either exactly.
Speaker 3 (04:16):
So many of us are trying these things and they
just start cutting it.
Speaker 4 (04:19):
So.
Speaker 3 (04:20):
I remember reading a book from an Australian media professor
who decided he was going to do a digital detox,
and he did something even more drastic than what I did,
and he basically took a close to five week journey
on a container ship from Melbourne and Australia to Singapore
and he basically brought nothing with him. Now, I think
(04:42):
I'd have had a much more difficult time making the
case for my wife if I told her I was
going on a five week containers journey with no one
able to reach me by times he needs like a
really drastic and severe case to sort of like actually
take you to more of a middle ground. And for me,
my middle ground with my wife was like, I want
to turn my smartphone off for a year, and I
really want to reconnect with you. I want to reconnect
(05:03):
with the family. I want to be a more present
father and husband. And that was the case that I made.
So it took you know, reading and exposed myself to
a pretty drastic case for me to then decide, you
know what, I should just turn.
Speaker 4 (05:16):
Off my phone.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
You know, you say turn off your phone. Did you
not have a cell phone or all, or just not
have a smartphone.
Speaker 3 (05:23):
Yeah, So from all the interviews I did for the book,
I outlined four different breakup styles, so four different ways
that you can try turning off your smartphone. And for me,
the philosophy that I embraced is something that I've coined
the off by default philosophy. So basically, I made sure
I was accountable, you know, as my wife.
Speaker 4 (05:43):
And my inner circle.
Speaker 3 (05:45):
I still carried my smartphone around with me. So let's
say I took the kids to the zoo, I went
to the office in DC. I still had my smartphone
with me. I just left it off. Now has provided
some assurances for my wife that, you know, God forbid,
our oldest son has an anaphyletic reaction. He's a food allergies.
(06:06):
That I did have a smart phone with me and
then I could turn it on, so that gave her
some ease, But it also gave me that ease of Okay,
it's not on. So I was still experiencing the detox experience.
So that was the breakup style that I embraced.
Speaker 2 (06:19):
So how was your wife with that breakup style because
she couldn't reach out to you because your phone was off?
How is that?
Speaker 3 (06:27):
Yeah, just like for me, she also experienced the bit
of that with dre all too. You know, for the
first week for both of us, it was it was rocky.
You know, I have a whole section in the book
about preparation. You could prepare all you like when it
comes to the behavioral addiction. There's gonna be withdrawal, not
just for you, but also for those nearest and dearest
to you, and that included my wife. So we prepared
(06:49):
a lot, and you know, we really did our best
to plan as best as we could. But yeah, there
were a few moments I remember the first week where
she was she was mad, like she was mad that
she couldn't get in touch with these specific moments. But
then after we got past it the first week or two,
my gosh, like everything changed. I mean, something that I
think will really resonate for listeners is, you know, we've
(07:11):
grown accustomed to during the workday texting back and forth
with our spouse or with our partners. We text, we
text and forth back and forth so much that before
you know it, by the evening time when you get
back home, when you're having dinner with your loved ones,
you already know everything else that happened throughout the day,
so there's like nothing to catch up one. So for
(07:31):
us there was like this almost excitement in terms of
us getting home. Like now it's more normal, but at
the time this was like like newfound discovery for each
of us because like there were so many things that
we wanted to share, so we weren't wasting that appetite
during the day. Instead, we were not only fulfilling our
you know, our our hunger needs with our dinner, but
(07:52):
we were also like fulfilling our emotional needs too by
talking with one another actually verbally at the table the
same thing after put the kids to sleep. Our general
process when we put the kids to sleep was right afterwards,
we head over to the sofas in the living room,
we pop out our phones and we would just either doom,
scroll or stream or take it over for a couple hours.
(08:13):
So even though you're together, truly not together so any rate,
my wife and I became that much closer because of
that process. And yeah, she was grateful by after one
two months she was like, I like this husband so
much more.
Speaker 2 (08:29):
You know, it's interesting. I talked about the big trips
we went on, and we made all the kids do this,
and as they got older, and you know something, the
conversations at meals were so much better because there was
no distraction from the phone. We actually had to connect
with each.
Speaker 3 (08:42):
Other absolutely being present like that is so important. And
since you know, many listeners are small small business owners
and they're in the working world, and something I will
point out is that even if your smartphone is let's say,
a requirement for your professional life, you should also know
(09:04):
that it's really important to separate your business and personal
digital footprints. So, for example, I interview an on call anesthesiologist.
Speaker 4 (09:15):
I mean this is going to be the most extreme case.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
It's an on call anesthesiologist at John Hopkins Hospital, someone
who's literally saving lives. A work smartphone is absolutely required
for this individual, and I profile him in the book
and go into a whole deep dive. But the short
of it is is that when he leaves the hospital,
he leaves his work smartphone plugged in. He doesn't take
(09:38):
his work smartphone with him. So you might ask, all right,
so how does he do his notes and how does
he able to be an on call doctor He doesn't
have his work smartphone. Well, he got permission from the
hospital to use not a two way pager. No, no, no,
he has a one way pager. His argument is, why
(09:58):
would I want to bring absolute craziness from my workday
to my personal life.
Speaker 4 (10:05):
I have a life, I have kids, I have family.
You know, I.
Speaker 3 (10:08):
Wouldn't want to bring that crazes and I want to
be present. So even though it's a bit of an
extreme case, I think it's a great example. Whether you're
an electrician, whether you're a roof or whether you're a
marketer or social media strategist, whatever it is, Sometimes a
smartphone is required for work, but it is so important
that it's an important case study, that it doesn't necessarily
(10:28):
have to be brought into your personal life too.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
Now, Rigide, one of the other things you talk about
is another breakup style is simplify your phone. What does
that mean?
Speaker 3 (10:38):
Yeah, so simplifying your phone is to transition from a
smartphone to a basic phone. Some people call them flip phones,
some people come them to call them dumb phones. But
for the four breakup styles to talk about, I recommend
at least sixty days of having your smartphone off, So
in this case, having your smartphone off for sixty days
(10:58):
and switching over your SIM card over to a basic phone.
This is by far the easiest of the four breakup styles,
in a large part to the fact that you still
have a phone. Now for the sake of the detox.
There are hundreds of basic phone models, but I really
recommend going as.
Speaker 4 (11:18):
Basic as possible.
Speaker 3 (11:20):
So something like an Alcatel or a TCL Flip or
a Nokia something you could buy for eighty dollars or
less from a Best Buy. And what's so good about
one of these phones is that all it can do
is call and text. And the truth is is that
you're not going to really want to text on these
phones because it is just so annoying and so hard
(11:43):
to have to punch the numbers the T nine texting
interface over and over again. But ultimately you're just going
to want to call the person. So switching over to
a basic phone can really be transformative. Like I interviewed
as school principal who you can imagine for a school
principle between amalies and teachers and thus it's a public
(12:04):
school system in Chicago, the school administrators, he was in
over one hundred text message threads a day and was
at over six hours a day on a smartphone. Switches
over to a basic phone and he all of a
sudden became in control of his phone rather than it
being control of him.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Well, one of the other methods you talk about is
quitting with somebody else. I assume that makes it a
little bit easier.
Speaker 3 (12:29):
Yes, there's something that's incredibly powerful with turning off your
phone and doing it with either a loved one like
a spouse or a partner, or perhaps a dear friend
or even a work colleague. There is something that's incredibly
powerful about that because there's all of a sudden a
true accountability. So when you're going through the withdrawal. The
(12:52):
first week or two you have someone to lean on you.
You're going to have hours of newfound time that you
didn't have before. The average American adults spends more than
five hours a day on their smartphone. All of a sudden,
you're going to have hours freed up. What are you
going to fill in for your replacement activities? You're going
to want to create.
Speaker 4 (13:08):
A menu of options. You checked in.
Speaker 3 (13:11):
You do regular check ins with the person you're quitting with,
and you could see, hey, I committed to Sunday morning
going to church, or I committed to Monday evenings going
to this restaurant with this individual.
Speaker 4 (13:23):
Are you doing it?
Speaker 3 (13:24):
So doing it with someone else is powerful. In the book,
I profiled two couples, one from Northern Ireland and one
from Italy. One from Italy went just interest to Think
Listeners because he's a financial analyst and operating a small
business and he quit with his life and an experience
(13:47):
was incredibly powerful and they're still doing that. Couple is
still doing their breakup this day five years later.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
Well but how have you know, and with any addiction
is withdrawal, right, so how do you manage your withdrawal.
Speaker 3 (14:01):
Yeah, so symptoms vary among the people that I profiled.
Some are more mild, lasting two or three days and
could be just more mild anxiety, and for others it
could be for sure and more severe. It could last
two or three weeks. Some people have headaches, some people
can have night sweats, And that's how much of a
behavioral addiction.
Speaker 2 (14:20):
This is physical problems people have.
Speaker 4 (14:23):
Richard, absolutely correct.
Speaker 3 (14:28):
You just have to realize that there is the other side,
the other end, and once you get past that withdrawal,
it's just golden from there. So I talk about in
the preparation phase before going through a process like this,
it's really important to establish a support group, whether it
be family or friends or colleagues, making sure you have
everyone on board.
Speaker 4 (14:48):
Like if you have a boss at work, you.
Speaker 3 (14:52):
Want to make sure that person is aligned with what
you are doing. So too with spouse, you want to
make sure that person is on board and is on
your side. That way, when you're going through any withdrawal symptoms,
going through the process, ultimately you have someone to lean
on and they're here to support you.
Speaker 2 (15:12):
So one of the things that I would have the
hardest time doing without especially when I'm driving is GPS.
So do we pull out the old maps?
Speaker 3 (15:19):
What do we do?
Speaker 4 (15:22):
Yeah? So it's really exciting this phase. You know.
Speaker 3 (15:25):
I have a whole sidebar on this in the book
about an immigration attorney who moved from the United States
to Spain who didn't use the smartphone and had to
engage with the city with actual paper maps. And how
empowering of a process that is for me personally. You know,
(15:45):
for my year long detox, either my life or myself
would jot down directions on a notepad before I would
leave to take the kids to a birthday party, or
I would print out directions from Google Maps and I
would engaged with maps that way.
Speaker 4 (16:01):
Now, the first one or two.
Speaker 3 (16:02):
Times I did this, it was absolutely frightening to not
have the GPS voice as my navigator. But after a
while I really started to enjoy it. So even so
to this day, since my detox is over, if a
drive is forty five minutes or less, I will always
write down or print out directions just like my go
to I'll still have my smartphone on me is off,
(16:23):
I'll still my smartphone with me as a backup, but
I really like to engage with directions. If something is
much longer, let's say we're going an hour and a
half or more and we're the family, then oftentimes I
will use it as a GPS. But here's the important lesson,
which is, you know, two weeks ago, we took the
kids to our Hershey Park before camp started, and the
(16:44):
drive from Baltimore to Hershey Park is about an hour
and a half, and we ran into some traffic and
I decided to turn my smartphone on and put the
GPS on while we were in the car. But what
happened when we arrived at Hershey Park and arrived at
our destination, I turned my smartphone off. And I wouldn't
have been able to do that if I didn't go
through that whole detox process. But what I realized from
(17:06):
the detox is that I'm a much better person. I'm
a much more present person with my phone off. So
I knew that the phone would be able to enhance
my life at that moment, so I used it for
the GPS. But then when I got to the destination,
I knew I wanted to have it off so if
the rest of the day I could be present with
my family.
Speaker 2 (17:25):
So is that really an example of how you've reintegrated
the phone after your screen cleanse.
Speaker 3 (17:31):
That's correct, and that is the end goal. And now
it's the book that it came out a few weeks ago,
I'm starting to hear from listeners who are already starting
their experimentation and already starting to think through it. And
I'm starting to see some of these success stories come through.
And that's one of the things that I've just been
so amazed by as I started this whole process with
(17:51):
the book launch, is that ultimately the goal is is
that let's say you're on your phone like the average American,
say four or five hours a.
Speaker 4 (18:00):
Day, whatever it might be.
Speaker 3 (18:02):
The goal is that at the end of the day,
you can look at your smartphone and you can say,
all right, I spent an hour and twelve minutes on
my phone. Forty five minutes of that was a phone call,
let's say, with my father, twenty minutes of that was
using GPS, and seven minutes of that was sending messages
like to my kids. And then you're like, okay, I
(18:23):
can account for what I'm doing versus you look at
your phone you see four and a half five hours
on Safari Instagram texting, WhatsApp, whatever it might be, and
you're like, gosh, what did I do with my day?
Speaker 4 (18:36):
So yes, the goal is.
Speaker 3 (18:37):
With reintegration, after you've recalibrated the reward pathways in your
brain to be able to account for this is what
I did to use my phone and this is how
it enhanced my life.
Speaker 1 (18:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (18:47):
I love that the talle book is called Unplug How
to Break up with your phone and Reclaim your life. Richard,
I appreciate me on the show Where Can People Catch
Up with you?
Speaker 3 (18:56):
So it probably won't surprise listeners to hear this, But
I have no social media account, but I do have
a personal website www. Dot Richard dash Simon dot com.
And the book is available at all bookstores wherever books
are sold.
Speaker 2 (19:14):
And you could probably buy it online on your smartphone.
Speaker 4 (19:17):
Right that is possible?
Speaker 2 (19:19):
It is I wouldn't know. Richard, thank you so much
for joining us, and I got to thank everyone for
joining this week's radio show. I want to thank our
incredible staff, our booking producer Sarah Schaffern, our sound editor
Ethan Moltz. If your serious, I'll be more successful this year.
You got to give me a call. I've set up
a private line on my cell phone seven seven three
eight three seven eight two five zero, or you can
(19:42):
email me from your computer at Barry at Molts dot com. Remember,
love everyone, trust. If you impel your own canoe, have
a profitable and passionate week.
Speaker 1 (19:53):
You can find Barrymoltz on the web at Barrymolts dot
com or more episodes of Small Business Radio and Smallbiz
Radio Show dot com.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
My Favorite Murder with Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark
My Favorite Murder is a true crime comedy podcast hosted by Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark. Each week, Karen and Georgia share compelling true crimes and hometown stories from friends and listeners. Since MFM launched in January of 2016, Karen and Georgia have shared their lifelong interest in true crime and have covered stories of infamous serial killers like the Night Stalker, mysterious cold cases, captivating cults, incredible survivor stories and important events from history like the Tulsa race massacre of 1921. My Favorite Murder is part of the Exactly Right podcast network that provides a platform for bold, creative voices to bring to life provocative, entertaining and relatable stories for audiences everywhere. The Exactly Right roster of podcasts covers a variety of topics including historic true crime, comedic interviews and news, science, pop culture and more. Podcasts on the network include Buried Bones with Kate Winkler Dawson and Paul Holes, That's Messed Up: An SVU Podcast, This Podcast Will Kill You, Bananas and more.
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.