S4 E13 - Echo of Glory

Tonight @leebrown2 is joined by @rocketrichman (Ben Richman) and for a very important update from @PaulHitSheet to discuss a rather controversial and crazy London derby.

Episode Transcript

(00:03):
You know, there's no place Iknow if I would, I wouldn't want
to breathe Ryan here. And youknow, in this minute of trying to
bring success to one of the biggestfootball clubs in the world, the basic
under the like principles that yall onmy team to play football that scares the
life out of every opposition. That'sthat's kind of the end game. Welcome

(00:35):
to the Varside Spurs podcast and joiningme today to help me unpack some rather
eventful proceedings. Here's Ben Richmond.Hello, Ben, how are you mate?
Yeah, very well, thanks Lee. How are you? Yeah?
Not bad? Actually we were.We were waiting for Paul Kramer to join

(00:55):
us. He might join us abit later on. So if listeners hear
someone all of a sudden new voicejoin us during the pod, then yeah,
that's who it will be. Sowe'll see. But he's been a
naughty boy. He hasn't turned uptonight so so far. Soir anyway,
Ben, would you like to tellus a little bit about yourself, Like
how long have you been aspersa porter? Yeah? So yeah, so forty

(01:18):
three now started going. First seasonticket was nineteen eighty eight and I've had
a season ticket from there. Butfirst game I went with a good friend
and his dad was eighty seven.I've actually working out and starts a few
about a month before the Cat finaleighty seven it was with Yeah, Clive

(01:41):
Allen scored a hat trick. I'mjust trying to think of it was oh
yeah, norledge knowledge at home CliveAllen hat trick. Yeah, And then
from that, from that day Iwas absolutely obsessed. Yeah, like the
rest of us, obsessed and rathernuts because yeah, in my life,
yeah, it's the best part ofit really is one of the biggest focuses

(02:04):
of life. I I you know, I don't know how many of the
listeners know you, but I've sortof kind of known you, have known
for a long while, and Iknow your spurs nuts absolutely spurs bonkers for
years and years and years. Soyeah, I don't think many people could
meet someone more you know, fullycoys as you. So I also someone

(02:30):
a little dicky bird tells me youhad a running with George Graham once.
Did you want to tell us abit about that? Yeah, well I
lived I lived in Chickwell where thetraining ground was, so being as sad
as I was, I used tofinish school. When I was off score,
I'd spend ninety percent of my lifedown Chickwell training ground lacks per lane,

(02:51):
and you obviously meet all the players. I still get to know them,
and yeah, actually ninety five percentof them very friendly and start used
to stop the old days, dependingon who the manager was, a few
of the managers would not let playersstop. But there was a day with
Genola, so that was Actually itwas the period where Genola got dropped.

(03:14):
Do you remember the cars? Ithink was that kais aloud? Yeah blood
first years back in Europe for awhile, wasn't I think? Yeah?
And Ganola was on the bench forthat game, the game in Germany,
but I think it was the yearafter actually, but yeah, I remember
Genola. There was there was allrumors that he was going to leave in
the papers that week, and therewas about five of us down the training

(03:36):
ground and we were sort of allbuilding each other up, and our wing
Graham comes out. We're going toask you what you know, what's going
on and why how we can dropour best player, because at that point
I was going to every single Waygame and the Way season ticket, and
you'd go away leaves you remember,and you wouldn't have a shot on goal,
and it was literally, you gofor Genola because we were so bad.
We win a few home games butlose pretty much every away game,

(03:57):
come home miserable. So what didwe go for. He's going to watch
Genola? Really, so we sortof built ourselves up because it was like
it was all in the paper thathe was going to go. Because those
days that you could transfer any time, couldn't you. It wasn't the transfer
windows. So it was funny.Ganola actually came out first in his car
and he was such a I don'tknow if you ever came across him.

(04:19):
He was such a lovely guy.Everyone says the same, like probably the
nicest footballer for how for how bighe was at the time, he was
just wonderful guy. He came outof the training ground, he was driving
out first, so we go andspeak to He said, David, it
does it? Is it true aboutyou leaving? And he said, yeah,
the manager doesn't want me and he'sa cow and he wouldn't even tell

(04:40):
me himself. Mister Sugars had totell me this morning. So me and
this other guy he was always downthere, we sort of said and we
don't leave, you know, juststick it out because your last longer than
Graham. He's not going to lastlong. And Genoah sort of set as
you know. He said, hejust doesn't want me. He's not going
to play me. I love theclub, but I don't know how long
I can do this war blah blahblah. Anyway, so he got us

(05:02):
going no word of a lie.Of the car behind him was Jim Groan
coming out to me. And thisguy built himself up so much. So
I've knocked on his door and knockedon his window and he's ignored us at
first, so I've give him anotherlittle tap on the window, pulls it
down with a really angry face.He's like, yep, what do you

(05:25):
want. I can't do a jobvoice. But that's he said to me.
Yeah, what's the issue? SoI said, Davish just told us
that you want him out of theclub. He said, yeah, that's
right. And although I said,can I ask you why, I said,
because I go home and away andI said he's our best player.
I said, he's the only onewho entertains us, and we're rubbish anyway,

(05:46):
So at least give the fans someenjoy it. And anyway, he's
gone on this massive rands me andthis guy about how Ginola's lazy, doesn't
work hard in training, and I'veheard the opposite actually, and I think
if you if you read things now, everyone always says Ganola was actually the
hardest working because he knew he hadto be, because he said Graham hated
him, and he just had tokeep proving him wrong. So he went

(06:10):
on this massive round about Zenden wasif you watch Sendon and he said,
that's a proper Wingo work back.Anyway, he was few. We just
had a massive, massive and basicallyfrom there we've come out and Genola's hanging
around because he would sign for everyone. Genola would sign every autographic, but
he wasn't like all the other players. So Genola saw us having a finger

(06:30):
him. So I've gone and toldGanola what he said. He was absolutely
livid, like living it. Soyeah, but there was quite a good
few stories like that with different man. But do you know, over the
years, you actually realize a lota lot of the players actually you know,
you think they don't, you know, you read things, players don't
care. He was someone Genola whojust really, really cared he was,

(06:55):
Yeah, but Graham just seemed totarget him, didn't they. I think
he realized that, you know,onerobably didn't fit the way he wanted to
play. But sometimes managers come in, don't there, and think I've got
to I've got to change something.I've got to send a message to someone.
And someone's going to basically be theone out to to, you know,
to show my authority and realize itwas so popular. It seemed it
seemed to me or you know,outside looking in, that he was the

(07:15):
one he identified and he was goingno matter what people thought. Was a
little bit oddly for it was abit of a jealousy thing because I think
when he played, actually George Graham, I think he had a bit more
flair than people thought. He was. A bit he wasn't the type of
manager that he ended up he was. He was a flair player. Yep.
Absolutely, So, right, shallwe jump ahead into this game?

(07:38):
I mean where do we begin?I might What I might do is that
I mean almost the game's incidental toall the other kind of like themes that
are running through this whole thing.So what I might do is kind of
like try and break it down alittle bit into I'll sort of obviously touch
upon the key things that happened ina game, but I might start with,
like just getting out of the waysome of the sort of negatives that

(08:01):
people have talked about. We'll lookat some of the controversies, and then
then I think we're kind of finishedwith looking at the big positives. I
think they did come out of thisgame, so or whether you think that
was the case or not, sobe interesting to see how you kind of
read it. But there's been amix of views, I think from pundits

(08:22):
and also from fans alike. Sowhat did you what didn't you like about
this game? Ben? I thinkit was the obvious thing. Really,
you know, I love it.I do love Romeroo. But you know,
my friends next to me, wesort of had a disagreement. But
then when I when I look backat it, they were saying straight away,
he's acting like an idiot, youknow, just the way he was

(08:45):
charging around. I mean, Iknow he was doing that at the end
of last season, the middle oflast season under contain just lost his discipline.
But at the time I was sortof sticking up for him, saying
it was a highly charged Derby andI look back at it and think,
you've got you know, with therale we scot now is he's got to
be so much better than that.And you know he's just got a calm
down. I mean, he's aWorld Cup winner. It's been given the

(09:05):
responsibility. I mean, could Sonnyor one of the other players calmed him
down quicker? Probably, But hewas on one. He's gone at the
pitch, he's done that kick.He's then got back, He's done a
stupid kick out. He's so chargedup and he's being honest. He was
the biggest negative. I mean becauseof his age a bit now and his

(09:26):
responsibility. Where a dog. Hewas disappointed, but I thought, okay,
he's twenty. Yeah it was Iknow, he played the Arsenal game.
He did funny enough the Arsenal gamehe was on a yellow and he
showed such maturity. But I thinkChriz Romero led the way with the way
he was. It's charged him upand he's you know, he's going to
make the other challenge and I thinkit just rolled into one, really,

(09:50):
didn't they? I have to agree, mate. It just feels to me
that a number was done on him. You know, and he's it's like,
you know, we know that there'sa beast inside Romiro and the way
that and just kind of trusted him, and as you pointed out, it's
giving him the vice captaincy as well, and it appeared in it for the
first number of games. It's kindof quietened him down a bit, so

(10:11):
he seemed to be more mature.You know. Most people have been talking
about actually Romero is, you know, one of the outstanding defenders in the
Premier League this season, but itseems like some of the other players that
probably know him and maybe it's someof it. Again, one of my
negatives is like we let Potcha shihouse and we know he does, you
know, get affect us, andI think early on it did affect us,

(10:35):
you know, so that would beone of mine sort of negatives.
But it kind of feeds directly intowhat you're just saying about Romero really is
that they got under his skin andtoo easily. I mean the kickout,
you know, it was sort ofsort of petulant, but the kickout that
he did on Cole Will that couldhave got him sent off alone. I
learn from that. And then hehad the Brazilian thing going on with Silva

(11:01):
bazillion Argentine then to act it,and I think Silva knew how to wind
him up. Silver years old experience, experience, they all know, you
know, we sort of mayor whathe's done last year. He's got to
be smarter than that though. Imean even you could imagine before even like
Enzo probably texting him and winding himup and then in the game again you
know, in his ear and allthat kind of and but but you know,

(11:24):
someone like that in that role thathe's got, he's got to be
just a bit more disciplined. AndI mean you he is a fantastic defender,
Yeah, he has that in him, and he's been sent off I
think more times than any other Premierleague defender in in sort of within him,
but I think about a year orsomething. So he's you know,
that is a he is a flawin his game. And maybe one of

(11:46):
the reasons that And gave him thatvice captaincy was to kind of like say
to him, look, you havesignificant responsibility, we we rate you,
but you know you've got to showthat those leadership qualities. But he let
it all go, didn't he.I mean that hard balance leaders you want.
You don't want him to lose hisphysicalness. But you know, as

(12:09):
I say, the kickout totally unncessaryif he just you know, if he'd
only made the bad challenge in thebox, I don't think that people would
have been as angry with him,because there's some people and I'm sort of
in the middle. I thought hewas a bit harsh actually sending off it
should have been a penalty, no, a doubt yellow card. But there
is actually more and more people andI've seen non Spurs runs. It's not

(12:31):
just the bias this from us seeingthat he did. He did follow through.
There's no doubt we did get theball and sort of Enzos leaned in.
So I wouldn't have been as angryif it was just that, but
it was all It was the wholething of kicking the ball out the way
he kicked the ball out, theway he's launched at Parma. You know
that that was the issue to me. Yep, we've got someone else joined

(12:54):
us. I'm thinking it might bea man, Paul, but it could
be it could someone else. Sowe'll see who that is when it joins.
When they join us, so beyondstandby for our listeners anyway. So
yeah, yeah, I agree,it's just a shame because I just I
do love him as a defender.He's got all the kind of qualities that

(13:15):
I like. He's aggressive, andhe's you know, any's skillful the way
he's kind of in previous games joinedin the attack. There's so much to
love about his game. But hehas to get on top of that one.
And I mean he is actually fairlyyoung still as well, isn't he
Bramier? Was he twenty three,twenty four, twenty four? Yeah,
it's the annoyance losing him for free, you know, it's not only a

(13:39):
one game bad We lose him forfree. And then obviously which I'm sure
we're talking about, like the Vande Ben with his now you know,
so we get the dumble Yeah,yeah, yeah, that's you know,
that's one of the other obviously significantsort of negatives about the game that we
probably will lose. Well yeah,I mean we will lose vandervein for a
bit. We know, no ideayet, have we got. I mean,

(14:03):
I think he had a similar injurywhen he was at Wolfsburg and I
think he was out for eleven weekswith that one. Yeah, that's that's
really worrying. Yeah, well youknow, but but my, my,
my, you know, apart fromnot heeding the warning signs, we talked
about a doggie as well, andyou know, clearly there was another incident
that he could have just got straightred for. You know, we we

(14:24):
were we were not only a bityou know, quite pumped up. Fine
because you know, we'll come ontothat as a positive in a minute,
where you know, we looked reallystrong at the beginning. But I think
that you know what used to doit with us, didn't it. I
mean, you know, we weloved Poch, but what he was good
at is the dark arts, andhe started to you know, he got

(14:45):
that into us, didn't they.You know that you remember the Battle of
the Bridge and stamping on you know, Lamella stamping on Fabricass's hand and didn't.
So you know, it was alot easier to get away with Lamella's
little snidey challenges and stuff. Nowyou just can't get away. You're very
very lucky to get away with anything. You can't sign up. But you

(15:05):
know, but but that that iskind of I suppose part of his things.
I suppose in one of the Argentinianways, isn't it. They like
to bend and break some of therules. That's just part of it.
But we should be wiser to that. But anyway, you know, I
mean, obviously you know that's thenegative, and the scores are negative,
but there is a lot, Ithink, within this game above and beyond

(15:28):
that. So we'll go through thefirst half, touch upon some of the
sort of major incidents and controversies,and like I said, and then towards
the end we'll finish off. Youknow, actually where this leaves us in
a positive sense if we can sortof try and sort of make this a
kind of almost like a therapy sessionfor some of us. So I thought

(15:48):
we started really well. You know, we looked really confident, and after
kulla Seft's goal, which I thinkis a slight defection, wasn't it,
it looked like this was only goingone way. I mean, did you
feel the same, Oh, it'sjust the first first eighteen minutes or twenty
minutes if best football I've seen usplay I think in three years. At

(16:11):
twenty minutes, we were just absolutelybreathtaking, you know, with Johnson.
I felt so sorry for Johnson becausehe had reech James completely on toast.
Yeah. Him, that's like KulaSesky started absolutely brilliantly. You know,
if that second goal goes in,yeah, I just thought the move I
mean, the second goal which wasdisallowed, the movement there in the past.

(16:33):
Honestly, it was so good.You know, we're all kind of
like jumping up and down in aroundour seats and looking at each other incredulously
thinking, wow, that was thatwas such a good goal. There's such
a good team goal. Such ashame it didn't stand, you know.
But again with var we'll get intoa bit later on. That took what

(16:59):
seemed like an eternity to make thatdecision. Yeah, it's just this.
It's just you feel like every whereyou go to these games, and even
if you're sitting at home, youget a little bit more of a quick
idea. But I mean, yeah, you're just in that ground. You
just can't enjoy anything. It's justso impossible. Now, you know,
the song goal should have been anamazing moment and you're just wait, you

(17:22):
know, and it's a bloody anothertoe now, yeah exact. I mean
I know they had one as wellas it. You know, I'm not
moaning, just on the spur.Well, obviously you want side to be
with the Vai working for us,but in terms of in terms of the
whole game of stopping and the startingwas just I mean it did add to
the drama if I look at it, but when you look back, it
was just very neutral. Maybe,but it torture for us. Yeah,

(17:45):
it was painful. Yeah, butI mean you know at that point,
even then, even when that goalwas disallowed, you know, the feeling
was I know I felt I knowpeople around me felt it as well.
It's like we're going to blow theseaway. I mean it really felt like
this could be like a three four, five nil thrashing of this lot because

(18:06):
they were all over the place.It didn't look good at all. And
yeah, so it was it wasa big shame var to go and spoil
that one. But then I supposethey came to the rescue when we had
they had two goals. This allowedthat Stirling had one and Carsdo had one.
Yeah, but that that I thinkit felt to me that that rattled

(18:29):
us, like at that point thatwas near the point where Carl well kick
we're talking about with Romero, wasn'tit, And we just seemed to unravel
a bit there. Do you feelthe same. I think literally from the
moment it actually could say a Dogiekicking out because I think the Dogies was
before Romeo's kick out. A Dogiestackled Bobby g Chelsea up. Then Romero

(18:52):
is gone and done his stupid thingkicking out, and then he's done the
stupid kick Awave and Cassado where Casascored, and then so yeah, from
that moment, you know, geta player sent off and it's just then
you then you think this, right, this game has completely changed. But
until we obviously had the ten men, you still think. You still think
we'll get around it, you know. You know again it's different playing Loot

(19:17):
and obviously with ten men, andit's going to be playing Chelsea. But
I just thought, honestly, Ithought that I thought, you know,
whatever way you dress it up withMero cost us the game, didn't they
really he did? Yeah, whenyou went we went down to ten,
that was it, basically, wasn'tit. I Mean, I know Chelsea
haven't been great, but you knowthis this is their game of the season.
Is like west Ham, isn't it. You know they if they can
win this one, then you know, so you knew what we were going

(19:41):
to be in for, but Ijust felt like, you know, after
those kind of couple of moments whereyou know, Sterling Cassado's goals were disallowed
and then the you know, theincident around where they were looking at what
happened to you know, around ColeWill, it just you could sort of
feel that energy, the momentum swinging. And then of course, like you

(20:03):
say, you know, we mentionedRomero getting sent off for you know,
I mean I think fifty to fifty. You know, you know he didn't
go over the We didn't know hisfoot on top of the ball and go
over it and into the guy.You know, he played the ball,
but it was you know, itwas a bit dangerous husual story. Like
it's the consistency. If you wereseeing the same every week. If I

(20:26):
were sending players off every week forthat, then you don't mind so much.
But it's one one week you're sendinga platter off for doing what we
done. The next day won't andyou just it's just impossible to know what
the refs are going to do.And that's all the vir is going to
do. You should say yeah,yeah, And then of course up steps
what's his name, Palmer and andand converts the penalty. Pretty good penalty

(20:51):
overall. Yeah, annoyingly for CarriI nearly got his hands to that.
He did. Yeah, very veryclose. We'll get onto Vicario because I
think he deserves almost like a chapterin himself because he was he was just
unbelievable. But yeah, we'll cometo him. We'll save a little space
for him, share we Yeah.So yeah, I think, you know,

(21:15):
I think we both feel that,you know, maybe this was the
kind of fifty to fifty. Imean, I can see why he was
sent off, but I can alsosee why he might not have been sent
off because it was you know,he wasn't even looking at the player,
but you know, and Jinny's postmatch press conference he took it on the
chin. Yeah, do you kindof feel I mean, don't if you

(21:36):
feel the same that it was feltalmost inevitable after the coal Will incident that
we seem to sort of get awaywith one there that perhaps this was it
was almost like coming what's that withLee? Sorry? He almost felt like,
you know, because of the coleWill incident, this one he was
definitely not going to get away with. Oh sorry, yeah, no,

(21:56):
get no. To be honest withyou, as I said, you say,
I think that big part obviously inthe re is probably full. I
haven't done and there's probably heard itin his ear piece that he's missed something
or something was missed by R.And yeah, they must weigh all that
up as well what they've done before. Yeah, I think we've got mister
Kramer join us. Paul Kramer,are you there? Can you read us

(22:19):
ground control to Yeah? Oor Cramer? Can you hear me? I can
hear you. I can see you. You look like you're in a nightclub,
but I suspect you're in a taxior something. I'm driving training ground.
I was thinking I should pop injust to see if vander Vanni is
there or not. Yeah, couldyou give him a massage? Would that?

(22:41):
Would that be acceptable? Yeah?Well from us are a message?
What did you say? Yeah,I'm not inspector cluse. Actually I'm going
to swing by the training ground literallyaround. Well, I tell you what
we do. I don't want youto kill yourself or anybody else. So

(23:04):
what we'll do is well, aswe're going along, just feel free to
chip in or listing. I've beenlistening for the last fifteen minutes. So
cool, cool, everything I've agreedwith every single word you've both said.
Well, you know, I meanI would say that we're both I was
going to say the opposite, Ben, I was going to say, we're

(23:26):
both geniuses. So you know,yeah, that's nice to meet you.
Carry on your conversation, and I'lljust not say a word till I'm outside
the trading ground, which will bein about five minutes. Right, okay,
Right, Agent Kramer is on thecase. We'll carry on, Ben,

(23:47):
So let's uh do do do?What where are we now? Is
kind of throwing the keeper was thelast thing. Yeah, we are going
to make a bit about him.Oh, I'll tell you what I was
going to do. I was goingto talk about the very very promising Johnson,
who I thought just looked magnificent,And of course then we had to

(24:10):
substitute with everything. We had tosubstitute him off and bring dire on.
But what I'll do is I thinkwe should say actually a couple of words
about both of those players, becauseyou know, Dyer's had come in for
a lot of stick and disrespect,I think, and it's worth touching upon
his kind of contribution. To thisgame. But also you know in the

(24:30):
twenty minutes or so that Johnson wason, what we thought about his contribution
as well. So Ben starts offwith your thoughts on Johnson. Yeah,
I thought Johnson's said earlier before wescared the life out of Briege James.
I know reach James has been injuredand they literally I thought, as I
said, I thought we had himon toast and yeah, if these bull
in for Son, yeah, Iwas looking forward to seeing him more.

(24:53):
I was gutted when he went off, but I mean I totally got it.
You had to take one and calleda siskin. I think because Johnson
has been out and he's had thesemuscle fatigue issues, he was the easy
one to take off because we've tenmen would have to do more running.
Yeah, he's probably and he's thinkingof the games ahead. But I think
Johnson would have been absolutely distraught because, as I say, like to run

(25:15):
James like that. You don't seemany people do that to release James,
do you really? Yeah? Absolutely, mate. You know what you said
about him having on toast, heabsolutely did, and he's you know,
I suppose like you were saying,K's like the juristale bunny, isn't he.
He just keeps going and going andgoing, you know, so I
think that's probably why in terms ofthe engine we're going to need. But
being down to ten men, butyeah, Johnson just looks so promising,

(25:38):
and which is a relief because aswe found out today, we've got rich
Arlison who's going to be having surgery, isn't he, So we're going to
need him in that position. Yeah, because we've lost You've got r.
Carloson out, Solomon out. Imean, even Cession who could do I
don't know why he can do it, to be honest on that. Yeah,

(26:00):
he's a boss, he's a body, says On. So yeah,
you've got three left side now RiCarloson as well. Yeah, I mean
yeah, I mean you don't reallywant to be moving Son left because he's
been he's been doing really well inthe middle. So yeah, we're yeah,
we don't don't want to sound likehow he rent up down to the
bare bones, aren't we? Yeah? Yeah, Well, as we go
over to the training ground, Moleis he there, he looks like he's

(26:22):
frozen. Well I think he hasfrozen, right, Okay, Well,
in that case, Eric Dyer,what did you think of that? Yeah,
I was delighted for him. Imean, I've never been one to
really get on Dias back like alot of fans. I understand he's not
been you know, been good enoughfor the last two three years, but

(26:45):
I think again he gives everything.He's a top guy. I'm not saying
that's that's enough to be a topsfirst player, but he came on and
yeah, I mean him and tobe fair, Emerson as well. I
thought they both did excellent considering thecircumstances. And yeah, it's such a
shame with that goal because I mean, we'll finished. It's unble Oh yeah,
yeah, we'll come. We'll cometo that obviously for that when we

(27:06):
look at the second half. Butthat, yeah, that was cracking and
finish. But just overall, Ijust thought when he came on, he
you know, he felt like asafe pair of hands, you know.
And again I've talked about in fact, you may or may not have heard
the pod that I did a littlewhile back, and we were talking about

(27:30):
about how dire has been disrespected somuch and we you know, we we're
worried about that kind of attitude andbecause at some point, we're probably going
to need him. And in fact, you saw when in that video,
didn't they when he arrived at thetraining ground and basically said you're not going
to use this. It just feltlike, you know, everyone is kind
of like kind of ostracized him.But boy, when he came in,

(27:55):
I thought he you know, consideringeveryone thought, oh Christ, you know
he's there. He's too slow toplay a high line. He wasn't.
I thought he did an absolutely admirablejob and he felt like a strong presence
on He did so many blocks andlow crosses coming in he cleared And I'm
not I don't think he's the arnswerif I'm going to be totally underage,

(28:18):
but he can do it, onlydo his best. And from what I've
understand, you know, talking topeople who watch a lot of youth,
they don't quite think Phillips is theunder twenty ones. They don't quite think
Phillips is ready, you know,and it probably will. I mean,
at some point it's going to bedire and Phillips maybe unless dates slots in
which I don't, Well, he'sbeen berg isn't. They're going forward for

(28:41):
a bit possible? You know what? Yeah, he did himself proud,
and I'm really pleased with him becausehe's a top guy. And yeah,
his attitude wasn't one of head downand feel sorry for myself. He came
on, came in and he yeahhe was brilliant. He really was.
So I think it's about forty oneminutes and and then gets a yellow card

(29:03):
for I believe, stepping outside histechnical area, which I don't know how
he gets that when Arteta seems torun up and down that bloody technical area.
Yeah, yeah, you see,as you say, well the arsenal
bringing them into it, You're right, artists as a joke is up and

(29:26):
down out in the area right onthe touch line basically you know, abouts
a slide tackle someone and still doesn'tget booked. And and first time I've
ever seen him lose his call,Yeah, gets a booking. I was
quite surprised, and I don't thinkhe ever did it at Celtic because I
know a lot of Celtic fans andthey said he never loses his never loses
his ship at all. So yeah, no, it's I don't think he

(29:49):
cares. But yeah, I'm surprisedhe was booked. But but it's like
you know, it just it justfelt odd that you know that that would
happen. He considering loads of say, Artista seems to run up and down
the bloody and random raving and goingmental. I mean, stoppages were driving
and man, you heard obviously afterhis press conference and he just said the

(30:11):
stoppages were you know, I thinkit was just driving him insane. How
long each Yeah, you know,I can't think of a game like that,
can you be the stoppage it well, twelve minutes were added, weren't
they vire with those var stoppages andyou know, and reviews and everything,
twelve minutes were added to the endof that game. So some somehow Christ
knows how, but somehow we managedto get to halftime still one one.

(30:37):
Yeah, And any closing thoughts onthat on that first half of Mayhem,
No, it was it was.It was just a horrible way to go
into halftime because you just you know, you're just thinking how many second half
really? And then obviously because we'dhad to take Johnson off, you're thinking
I knew, I did know,I did think and wouldn't got all men

(31:00):
behind the ball, so I knewwe'd probably see goals. But obviously just
thinking they'll be in Chelsea of ustrying to do some attack, implay bits
and pieces. Yeah, absolutely,and you know what it's like, you've
seen a mixture of responses. Again, we'll get into that a bit later,
but surely we kind of knew thiswas potentially going to come. He

(31:22):
warned us of this, and Celticfans have talked about it. I think
you know other clubs has played forHe said that there's always been that one
game where people have gone, like, have sut up and gone, wow,
he's actually doing this, you know, and against all the odds,
He's done something which is unbelievably youknow, really unorthodox, let's say.

(31:48):
And and in terms of like hisapproach to the game, which most people
just wouldn't do because they wouldn't wantto be humiliated. He is like,
you know that echoes the glory thing, isn't it. You know, he's
just that basically your mayor's way highand just and just go for it.
You know, there's to dare isto do. Kind of feel honestly,

(32:08):
what we saw last season, youknow when we got thumped and Newcastle and
uh, you know, Liverpool scoredthe four against the week after. I
know, we've got free but Ithought to myself, do you know what
we didn't we had we had direon then, and we had Emerson and
sense off, and you're just sortof thinking, like, we've got to

(32:29):
try and do something because we're notgoing to be able to hold if you
had vanderm mayor I still on thepitch and we would have lost. If
we would have lost a couple offorward players. He may have done something
slightly different, but not much different. But the point is he looked at
it and thought, we probably haven'tgot the defensive players on the pitch anyway,
no body go for it, youknow, you know, and I

(32:50):
think we didn't go crazy. Imean, okay, later on things sort
of looked that way, but youknow, when we played and we still
had Son mainly just playing as theout and out striker, didn't we And
you know, we were just beingquite sort of brave about it, but
not but not reckless or anything.But then of course we ended up with

(33:14):
very shortly into that second half Vandeven hamstring when Madison got a knock and
both of those had to go off. I mean, the vander n one
looked really innocuous to me. Ididn't even know. I'm asking people around
me what's happened here and likewise withMadison, and immediately you lose two of
your key key players. And thenwhat are you thinking? I mean,

(33:40):
what were your thoughts at that moment? Ben, You're just thinking about it,
To be honest, I thought thegame's gone anyway, something about the
weeks ahead, the fact that youknow the fact that we've lost Band of
Ven obviously for however long, you'velost Romo, and then you've lost Madison,
and you started to speaking Jesus.You know, it's just horrendous.
But you know what lead level goingsthis later. But if there's any manager

(34:02):
who can be a bit clever makethings work in different positions, I think
and is the man. I'm notsaying that we're not going to conceive obviously
more goals, and we have firsteight games, and you know, we
could take a pump in somewhere likeSitting in a few weeks, could even
be one of the next two.But I think he'll be creative and he'll

(34:22):
work ways that we'll get our attackingplay going and you know, we can
maybe outscore team we might who knowsthat dire and whoever played center Weiberg or
Emerson or even Phillips. It might, we might, it might surprise us.
But you know what, I've gotno regrets the way Ange's played the
other day. We're writ in ituntil the last five ten minutes, and

(34:44):
we'll even the last yeah, fiveminutes, and do you know what I
think we'll go. I'd go awayfrom that game. And I always remember
that game for what AND's tried todo. You know, Like I said,
we will come because I think there'sso much to pick a part in
that, like you know, andI think that's going to have a whole
chapter in itself as well. Ithink. But but then you know,

(35:05):
we get to like the cards keptcoming. Sar got one, cold Will
got one Jackson, and then BumpDoggie gets his second for that challenge on
Sterling. I mean, as suchan obvious sending off, there had to
be a yellow card that one,and off he goes. And then at
nine, men were thinking, okay, this's damage limitation now. But Andrew,

(35:30):
just like you've just mentioned, thinkingquite the opposite. You know,
he's as well getting hung for asheep as a lamb as I saying goes
he just he's just thinking, well, I mean quite rightly, to be
honest, I mean, let's faceit, if you're down to nine men,
he was well losing a game likefour one as two one, Yeah,

(35:52):
because that at that point, youknow, we you know, we
somehow still clung on. I supposewith Cario keeping us into the in the
in the match and we'll look athim in a second. But then and
then I think it's Jackson, isn'tit? Who who scores next? And
which makes it two one? Andyou know you fear then that it's going

(36:14):
to be an absolute thumping, butbut nothing of the sort. You know
the Cayo. Have you ever seena keeper's display like that? And I'll
be honest, I was thinking,I didn't think you're getting to the point
we're thinking this guy just won't bebeat tonight. I mean, obviously some
of the some of their finishing wascrap. But he's he you know,

(36:36):
he celebrates a lot. I've scoredto go every say he's a machine and
he's a monster, and he's he'she's bigger than Lowis, isn't He's big,
a bit taller, but he justwith his feet agile and even you
know, everyone was worried a littlebit about his feet when he first come.
He's so good of his feet.We've looked so good defending corners this
season because I think with Hugo towardsthe end, and I loved Hugo,

(36:59):
I mean, he's getting away thatpeople giving him a stick, but there
was that element when we had corners. You're always worrying Hugos just became very
weak at crosses and were seeing somany from corners and with with with,
I just don't feel like that.I feels, you know, they all
come and sweep it up or butI mean literally you say he's sweeping.

(37:20):
He was. He's a sweeper keeper. Wasn't he like he was a line
like people have just like showed thesephotos, haven't they of this high line
on the center line, which waswhich was brilliant. But Vicario was like
you know, was playing like adefender as well as a keeper. And
there was one point I think ifI could remember rightly, because I was

(37:42):
about four or five points in bythat point, I think Jackson comes running
at him and he just spreads himselfand saves, you know, basically like
we didn't have to handle it,but basically sort of like blocks him from
you know, from from having ashooting chance. Well, the worry pool,

(38:02):
so that the worry league obviously wasI thought he was going to I
thought he was going to miss atackle and get set off and then we
end up with then when out ofeight men, I was getting to the
point of saying to my mates,maybe we want to get I think it's
sick, is it if we getto five or six, I just call
the game off. Yeah, that'swhy we were think he goes, we
might as well because we end uphaving someone in goal. Would have been

(38:23):
quite funny, to be honest,when Yeah, but you did, like
it was his timing of the tackleswith Carrio I was so good. But
you were thinking the amount they weregetting through that last twelve minutes or fifteen
as you you were thinking, ohthat he's going to he's going to get
sent off here. Yeah, yeah, And you know, and you had
to think, like as a shipas Chelsea are, you know, eleven

(38:45):
against nine, we had no rightto stay in the game as long as
we did, no right whatsoever.And and you know, and again there's
a number of superb brave performances thatwe saw. I mean not just tactically
that you know, the way thatwe played was brave, but you know
in terms of the way that wejust put everything on the line. You

(39:06):
know, at the end it wasthere was nothing left in any tank.
But the Cario was just I mean, the crowd just absolutely went wild for
him, didn't they mean it startedsinging that sort of that that song,
didn't they be I don't think I'veever known the Plaids come in where people
were worried so much because I think, you know, they had seen a

(39:30):
few things in Italy that they carrieda bit and the people were a little
bit concerned, like you know,Hugo had been there years and I know
Hugo and a bad year, butthey were thinking, oh, this isn't
this is a second choyous keeper,not a first choice. I know they've
been people saying Donna Rum had said, sorry, it's one of the ex
keepers, had said who was it? The Italian goali who said sorry?

(39:52):
Ye had said what a great keeperis and he can be the next best.
But no one was really listening,including me. He's just been,
yeah, been incredible. I mean, all the signings have, but he's
stood out massively for me. Hecould it could be just brilliant scouting,
but also might just also be aslice of luck as well. But you

(40:14):
think, who would you have himor or Raya? Oh without doubt him
And and to be honestly, Iwas annoyed. I was annoyed with Mitsvaria
at the time because I did rightray I know he's not started well,
but no, I'm delighted. I'mreally delighted Racarry. And the thing is,
you know, I think people aftereven against Brenford, people were worrying,

(40:37):
still thinking, oh, you know, he looked a bit dodgy with
his feet. But since Brentford andhe made some good says with Brentford,
But since then, I just thinkeveryone's absolutely thrilled with him. Yeah,
I think, and he's the biggestthing that there's a massive character shouting at
them and he's like he's been thereyears, isn't it. You can see
that straight away you need a bigpersonality. And I think that one of

(40:59):
the things that seems to come outfrom the sort of leaks out of the
club about Hand's interview in the Players, that was one of the things he
said you know, more or lesshe would have walked here, you know,
to spurs and and and and itseems like he's he amongst a few
others have sort of like grabbed that, you know, that ball by the
horns and just said I'm having it. You know, I've got a chance

(41:21):
here to make a real big mark. And and he, you know,
he's really shown himself to be oneof the league's top keepers. He's gonna
he's going to he's going to betested a lot, I think over the
next few weeks. No, yeah, we've got we've got three three games
with makeshift offense and yeah, soyeah, you know, the City game,

(41:42):
we'll talk about it feels like afree hip of the next two.
You know, we're gonna need We'regoing to need him, aren't we.
Yeah. Absolutely, well, Imean I'm going to just dish myself up
a slice of humble pie now becauseactually I've I've always been not the biggest
fan of Hoiberg, but actually everytime he's coming he's done a cracking job.
And I thought, you know,no more so than actually that game

(42:04):
where I thought he really did looklike you know, it's a cliche,
but he did look like a warrior. I mean that that that that that
you know the I think it wasagain Jackson who headed down and and he
hit it and it went over overthe But but his reaction to stopping that
goal going in you could so itmeant something it didn't. I think these

(42:28):
ego has been hit a little bitas well. It's clearly got an incredible
attitude. Is someone you know getsdropped. He's not in the dressing room
sulking, which is huge. I'mthe same as you. I'm not a
huge on boy Berg. I thinkhe was always a six out tense and
he would have it was oddly thebig games that he would seem to be
great and then the smaller games wherehe was annoying me, you know,

(42:50):
And I don't think he's really ana player. But I think no one
can ever say about Hoyberg is youknow, people could compare him with Foind
and all that, but he's not. He's better the point and he's a
clever player, but he's limited inwhat the way Ange wants to play.
But there's no one who can saythat his attitude is not spot on,
absolutely brilliant from getting dropped, howhe's played it when he's come on in

(43:14):
most games and I think you know, he's going to play a huge part
now four fallback midfield. We're needhim now over the next few weeks.
So well, you know, andif he's got anything about him, which
he has, you know, he'sshown that he's got that character and he's
got that graft he want to show. People want to approve it. Do
you know what if he would havebeen on the pitch, he's probably the

(43:35):
one who would have been calming downRomero. I think Kine used to be
very good at that or in thereferees face a bit calming him down.
We are missing that. I mean, son Is Sony has been brilliant as
a captain. But I do thinkHeiberg is very good. He's a talker,
you know, he's and we've takenaway Caine, you're taking away Hoiberg
too, of the bigger leaders.Yeah, yeah, so that's it.

(44:00):
He's brilliant. Yeah yeah, Iagreed, mate. And then on the
seventy ninth minute, our old friendDyah, as we mentioned before, smacks
one. It must have been likea what a testicle off side there something?
But you know that's the sad thingthat I didn't even celebrate because the
game was so crazy. Yeah,I saw that flag go up immediately,

(44:21):
and obviously the back in mind thinkingplease, you know, just give us
some love, and you're thinking it, my but I just always you always
think the worst now, because what'sthe point of getting excited? Well,
do you know what though, whenthat when that one went in and I
went I did go mad, likeme and my son would like falling over
the seats practically. And then ofcourse you know, we saw that the

(44:43):
goal wasn't announced, was it?And you ended up with the inevitable var
review and you know then that something'sup. But but I think at that
point what what would have probably happenedis that then we would have shut up
shop. Then I think we werejust gone back into like in seeing the
game out. I think the reasonwe went all like pushed the high line

(45:07):
right up was to try and getsomething out of the game, because you
like we're saying you as well losingfour one as two to one, right,
you know, so to get somethingout of the game at that point,
I think that would have been it. We had enough sort of defensive
solidity amongst you know, on thepitch be able to sort of just to
try and see out the last fifteenor so minutes. And I think,

(45:28):
to be honestly, the big thingwas if you had Didda Droppa playing for
Chelsea or you had to, thenI could sort of see people saying and
AND's probably still would have done doneit now and as we do now,
but you're maybe thinking like sitting ina few weeks, if he does it
there, then may be okay,rightful criticism. But I think he knew
Chelsea's finishing up until that last fouror five minutes. He's not stupid,

(45:51):
then, is he? He's notstupid? I mean, you know he
wouldn't fancy ten yeel crucifcation, wouldhe know? He's like, you know
he's going to basically he's going togo for you know that because he thinks
that there are a bit blunt.I mean certainly say that that was probably
one of the worst hat tricks we'veever seen from But look at them Jackson.
You were saying about and it's beentoo attacking here and that he's just

(46:15):
this way. They should look atthe Arsenal game, and they should look
at the other previous away games becausehe has gone he has gone in tactically,
and it has been done. Hehas, he realizes, so he's
not just some coach who's not gotany tactical if he didn't have any tactical
now, so he was just hespecifically went yeah that on purpose. It
was a decision he made on thebasis of we're probably going to lose anyway,

(46:38):
let's try and make something out ofthis. And it nearly works.
Yeah, it nearly worked. Andthat's the thing. So I think that's
why a lot of pundits haven't universallyslaughtered him. I mean a lot of
them are saying that it's they've neverseen anything like it before, but actually
a pundits like Neville and Carriger likethis is unbelieve. But it almost worked,

(47:01):
and which it did. We hadnine minutes added and we were still
at two to one in with thechance right the way through to the ninety
fourth minute because Ben and Kerr hada head of whide, didn't he Son
had a shot that went wide inDyer's goal obviously was disallowed. We were
well in that game, you know, with no right to be at all

(47:22):
then, and they were exhausted,you know, we were exhausted and I
think, do you know what Ithink they I think and and the team
they should have no regrets. Theythink I think it was it was really
enjoyable. And look, if wecame out there losing two one and we
hadn't given it a go, youknow, what's the difference, I mean

(47:43):
exactly, you know, and itwould have been like, you know,
okay, we're maybe would have kindof taken it on the chin. But
I think what was positive, andwe'll get onto that at any moment now,
actually is actually the courage that weshowed in trying to get a result
that we had no right to getan understanding. You know a number of

(48:05):
people have said you might as welldie on your feet and die on your
knees. You know, I've heardthat said a number of times now.
So yeah, I think I thinklet's just in fact, let's just jump
ahead now. I mean, he'syou know, Jackson's last two goals in
the last two or three minutes.You know, clearly they'd worked it out
by that point when we were likeabsolutely shattered, they just you know,

(48:28):
they could just flick one round usover the top and then you know,
but by you know, it doesn'tmake the game any worse. I mean,
I know it seems so at fourone to two one, but it's
you know it, we kept himat you know, we kept them within
a distance where we could have donesomething about it, right up to ninety
fourth minute with nine men that one. I think that shows you how crap

(48:51):
they are. Well, the fansat Tottenham, as you know over the
years, don't get up and cheerlike they did if they don't think the
players have given it all and puton a show. And that that says
it for me. That's all weneed to know. What the fans and
all the punters went out. They'reproud of them, and that's what that's

(49:12):
that's what we go football for,you know, for the players to try
and win games and to give iteverything. And that's what we did.
We had a right good go andyou know, and that's why when you
come away from that match, youknow, you know me, don't get
me wrong, I'm disappointed with theresult, but I'm not. I'm not,
you know, devastated about how itall turned out, because I think

(49:34):
that there's so many good things thatcame out of that. So I think
I think let's let's let's do thatwe like, let's look at now that
you know the biggest positives to comeout of that game, so you want
to yah, Yeah, the biggestpositive is it's the free I think where
Ann has been brilliant. And hedid this at Celtic. As I say,
I've got a lot of Celtic friendsand they said to me he uses

(49:58):
his sub superb in terms of whenI say superbably, not even the timings
of his sub. He makes thesquad feel important. So as you said
about Heuerberg coming on, I knowDiary can't say he hasn't used him,
but Heierberg and Emerson he makes themfeel like they're part of the team.
So when they're only getting five minutesunder contail or two minutes, they just
feel, well, we're coming onto waste a bit of time. He

(50:20):
makes them feel important and that they'repart of the squad and they're not only
getting five two minutes, so they'reready. And that's the biggest positive for
me. That the fringe players nowwe're going to need over the next few
weeks. And I know the Fulhamgame early season that was so early on
in the season they didn't cover themselvesin gloy, but it's hard when you
haven't had a lot of football,but I feel a little bit more confident
that Heuierberg can come in somewhere outof position or look, as I say,

(50:45):
Die has Addie Stickney. He hasn'tplayed well over the last years,
but look he's had a bit offootball now to get his confidence up in
a big game. Fans were behindhim. That will mean a lot to
him going into the Wolves game.So that's a huge plus. Johnson was
a massive plus. I thought Emersondid really well, so when he came

(51:06):
on, he really you know,he really came and did well. A
dog, obviously a dog losing aDargon Romero is huge in Vanderven. But
look we've got we've got to getto January now rather Romero back in three
games. A dog is only onegame, isn't it. Yeah, yeah,
vander Ben is the big gap forCario is obviously that massive, massive

(51:27):
pluss. I just hope he's not. He looked a bit he was walking
off with a bit of a limp, so I'm just praying. Yeah,
I think, I think yeah.I mean, my biggest positive, I
think, as my biggest takeaway isthey showed that they totally believe in the
manager. Yeah, you know,and and and obviously we couldn't say that

(51:50):
of a Conte last season. Thisthis season so far, you know,
from the way that they did whatyou expect an Ange team to do with
that courage, the way they playedthat that that you know that that you
know, we never stopped because theydidn't attitude really did show despite the loss.

(52:15):
Was it was actually which is whyI think it really got under the
skin of a number of their theirfans. That which is you know why
we're not so despondent about it isbecause actually we're now can see, Yeah,
they they get it. They theyunderstand what he wants and are prepared
even under the most tough circumstances likethis where you know, a young a

(52:38):
lot of young players there they couldjust fold up like a deck chair,
and they didn't. They actually showedan incredible amount of resilience and courage,
I thought, And I think that'swhy at the very end of the game
you had a standing ovation from thefrom the from the you know, from
the crowd, because they they whatthey witnessed there was was everything we just

(53:00):
we want from a team to giveus a dig considering the odds they were
up against and Lee, it wouldhave been easy for Ang to come out
after the game. And by Romero, I don't think you would have a
dog because of his age. Butyou know and say, you know,
he's got to learn his lessons,but he will never do that in public.
Yeah, you know, like wepursue our how annoyed we all assuming

(53:22):
you heard him said you know,he'll learn from it, blah blah.
And look if they did it threeor four times, it becomes a different
thing. But I think that Ang'shistory suggests it he will never ever publicly
And look, we've had Contain andJose dig out players lose a dressing room.
Yeah, and I think you sawtoday that I know it's only focus
on the train, but they alllooked. You know, they're going to

(53:43):
trainings. That bet there's a smileon their faces. I bet there's a
spring in their steps. But Imean, did you ever say a four
one defeat and they're going to bebecause they know the crowd really appreciated the
graft and shift and and what whatthey what they put into that game eleven
versus a eleven, we destroyed thatlot. Yeah, yeah, I agree,
you know, which makes it reallythat's what really, that's why I'm

(54:07):
you know, looking at the mayorhas really wound me up because it just
didn't need to do it, butit's gone. The thing is if it
was the first time he'd done butonce his head goes, that's where you
need someone to get him after thatfirst kick out and say that's enough.
Now you're going to cost us thegame. But we didn't really have anyone

(54:28):
to do that. That's that's theproblem. And he's got to learn himself
obviously. Yeah, well, youknow the way that finished high risk but
potentially high reward, it nearly paidoff. You know you could see that.
I mean we you know, thelook to disbelief amongst ourselves at that
kind of courage because I now,under the previous manager he would have just

(54:50):
tried to just make it. Itdamaged limitation. But you know, the
biggest difference for me is usually I'llbe looking at the weekend losing all these
players and I'd be absolutely dreading it. Now we might get beats Saturday,
but you know we are going outthere to try and score some goals.
We might if I'm actually looking forwardto seeing us play again under content house.
I was dreading the weed and Ijust wanted to I just wanted to

(55:13):
go. But I'm actually looking forwardto seeing what creative ideas is that.
Okay, we lose Madison, hemight put bench coin, he might put
g O in. Yeah, he'sgoing to do something that's going to He's
not going to find excuses. He'sjust yeah, exactly, you know,
And I don't know, I meanwith with Conte, we don't need to
dwell on him too much. Buthe needed to hire extra buses to throw
everyone under, didn't he. Youknow, he's just he was unbelievable.

(55:37):
And you know the fact that hethen was saying that you know, it's
never going to change no matter whichmanage it, well, you know,
sorry son, but yeah, you'recompletely wrong. It just shows you that
one man can actually change the culture. And and he and and certainly has
you know that that that you know, it might feel like a bit of
a digression, but that photo thatwas recently just sort of came out with

(56:00):
everybody including all the you know,the catering staff and everybody in that photo.
It is indicative of what he's doingto this club. And and and
you can feel that togetherness that youcan feel that there, you know,
this this family sort of feel amongsteverybody, but also that they they don't
give everything like they did the othernight, if that's not there. And

(56:23):
we've heard stories, haven't we ofAnge talking apparently of age talking to him
about not just how much what itmeans to play for the club, but
also why do you play football inthe first place, you know, what
does it mean to you and yourfamily? And going beyond that into the
psychology of you know, what thismeans to their their their families and their

(56:44):
you know, and and and themdeep down personally, because then you're really
tuning into the person and you know, and what motivates them. And I
think he's he just just understands howto do that, and that is the
exciting thing. Yeah. Nice,It's another thing. I know. Apparently
does his speeches early in the day, so lunch or tear or whenever he

(57:06):
does it. But I've noticed abig the players seems to be getting there
the eight o'clock kickoff. The otherday, they arrived at quarter to five,
So you're wondering if he's doing hisspeech early on the ground. But
you know, because you see playershe say that once he does his speech,
you feel like you're pumped up thenlike he does hours. But yeah,
it's just just little things. It'salso apparently like some of the other

(57:30):
coaches, he just get lets himget on with it and also lets them
do some of the speeches and thendoes some part of it, but not
the whole thing. Is because he'sworried that, you know, they'll get
bored listening to his voice. Sowhen he says something it means something.
It's not just you know, hejust won't ramble or go through videos for
hours and hours and end with everyone. When he says something, it's it's

(57:54):
it's pertinent, you know, itmeans something. So yeah, I mean
I think we you know, whetherby accident or design, we we really
have got the right man here,so you know, anyway, so let's
put that game to bed. Let'slook ahead to Wolves and that's this Saturday,
isn't I believe? Yeah, well, yeah, we've got to stitched

(58:16):
up again with the early kick.We got done last week with the Monday
Friday, but look, we haven'tgot your We've got to get on with
it, so exactly that may exactly. Yeah, So if we assume then
that you know, we might havea few injuries, anyone you think might
end up taking to the field.How do you see this game going?

(58:37):
Yeah, it's a yeah, it'sa question of does he play Geo or
does he go Benticore? I thinkBent and Court. I think because you
know, yeah, I did thinkhe would. But the only reason he
may not it is just because ofobviously it's come off the a c L
played Monday. How many How longdid he plan Monday? In the end?

(58:57):
I played about thirty did he Yeah? So maybe he starts Bentacle and
goes Ben. To course, Sar, you've also got the skip option.
I mean, I think he'd ratherplay Bentacle than skip Skippy. Skippy did
okay either? I actually I thoughthe had a good game when he came
on. He put a good passthrough. But yeah, so okay,

(59:20):
well, I mean yeah, sowe were as anyone's guess who's going to
be fit apart from vander Vim andwe can pretty much say he won't be
And of course I've got feeling he'llgo Emerson. I've got feeling Mike go
Emerson and Daryah And then it's aquestion is Ben Davis back if Ben Davis
is back, then Ben Davis WIwas slotting obviously left. And then he's

(59:43):
got Phillips on the bench. AsI say the people, I've seen a
couple of the games and he's notmassively impressed me. Phillips Doringson has been
the one eye fell but you knowwhat do I know? And he's training
with the first team. Dorington isn'tapparently, Yeah, he's the one who
looks Phillips to me, it hasn'tlooked great in the air or no,
but listen, whoever he plays,you've got you've got to trust. And

(01:00:06):
he watches them all week training andyeah, but it's a question. I
think the biggest question. Is itgoing to Ben's goor is it going to
be Geo coming in? Yeah?Where do you play Hoiberg? If if
Davis is fit and he plays Emersonand Dire, then maybe you just put
Hoiberg in the middle with Sar Yeahyeah, no, good shout, which
probably is which is probably where we'llgo, because I don't think Davis's injury

(01:00:28):
was a big one according Toron.But you know what, you know,
I know we've all kind of threttedand worried about those players. You know,
if they if they're out of ourteam, then we've got nothing.
But I think you're right, Benin the sense that whoever any of those
fringe players won't feel that they've gotnothing to bring. Whatever happens, we
will have a good go. They'regoing to be missing netto you know,

(01:00:52):
that is huge for them, Soyou know it's not gonna be easy.
I think Wolves Away is a toughgame at any time, even though they
through the two cent a half,so a bit of a unit and what's
the other lad's gone there of course, but the two cent you know,
is it going to be hard?I wonder if Dot has he been playing

(01:01:13):
or is he I'm not sure actuallyto be fair, I think he's been
on the bench a little bit.Has he been playing, Yeah, he's
played in his scored actually recently aswell. Yeah. Yeah, you have
a point to prove. So forlisteners, we're right at the very end
of the pod and Paul joints us. Now we're just about to do predictions.

(01:01:34):
Paul, and we'll do a coupleof minutes if you want to add
any thoughts on the Walls game andwhat to look forward to. I notice
you've gone for the nineteen seventies stylemustache there as well, looking rather Swedish
porn star. Yeah. It's partof my November campaign and I'm pleased to
I've raised one thousand pounds plus.Well done you. How does anyone support

(01:01:57):
you, Paul? If they wantto do that, it's up on the
November I've got a link on myTwitter profile which hit sheet but if I
send it to you maybe you canbe tweeted on. Yeah. Yeah,
cool, we'll do. I've justhot footed it from the first training ground.
And then the good news is Mickeyvan Derven is that home as sleep

(01:02:17):
Okay, no inside on his injury. He was at training today so I
don't think it's going to be asbad as we all fear. This is
an exclusive Well to the far Sidepodcast if he if he makes it for
the Wolves game, we'll be sendingyou a bottler Burrello at least a case
a case of. I really don'tthink he's going to be playing, probably

(01:02:40):
not Saturday, but I think he'llbe fine for the the Man City game,
so he'll miss maybe Wolves in thevillain cool. All right, well
let's let's let's let's do a predictionso let's put that in the mixer.
All right, will you kick usoff? Who do? What do you
think the score will be? Well, I think we're gonna draw three all,

(01:03:02):
even though that's not maybe the resultwe all want, but we need
to rebuild and start again. Andwhat we saw on Monday night, which
I'm still recovering from. I've beenlying down in the dark room for the
last two days. I think we'regonna we're gonna that that what we saw

(01:03:25):
on Monday night. I don't thinkthat's the last time we will see something
like that. So I just feelthat that's the way it's going to be.
It's gonna be a roller coaster,okayal emotions and and whatever. So
Ben, three all for you?So what about you? Ben? Yeah,

(01:03:45):
I think there's obviously gonna be goals. I'll go for a three to
two Tottenham. I think Johnson.I think Johnson would be read up after
coming off the other day, sohe's at least he's got fresh legs.
The only problem is is obviously playingwith nine men and a few of those
lads are going to be really tired. But he uses his sup well,

(01:04:06):
doesn't he. So we have toget for an annoying thing. Isn't even
macrlo. I know he's been terrible, but even Macrlinson's got this injury now,
so we can't even can't even callon him for this sort of going
really properly. Well, I'm goingto go for two nil to Spurs.
I think will be more solid thanpeople think. And I fancy Johnson to

(01:04:30):
get a goal. I'm gonna bereally specific here, and I also fancy
Song to get one. So uhand then normal services resumed. We're back
in the title race. Anyway.On that note, thank you for joining
us boys. Thank you for yourhuge contribution tonight, mister Kramer. And
well what I mean is the solidwork you've done at the training ground for

(01:04:55):
us, getting Van der Ven readyfor the weekend. So thank you.
Well, maybe not this weekend,but weekends in late November. Yeah cool
cool, right, Okay, Onthat note, come on you Spurs.
Thanks Lee. Cheers, guys,cheers. You know there's no place on

(01:05:15):
Earth I would I wouldn't want tobe right here. And you know,
in this minute of trying to bringsuccess to one of the biggest football clubs
in the world, the basic underline principles that I want my team to
play football that scares the life outof every opposition, Like that's that's kind
of the end game.