Grief, Loss, Therapy, And The Violence of Healing

Jake Palumbo discusses the intersection of mental health and music, exploring themes of healing, grief, and the importance of therapy. He shares personal experiences with loss, panic attacks, and the challenges of isolation, while also emphasizing the value of coping mechanisms and the therapeutic process. The discussion culminates in insights about his upcoming album, 'Euthanasia for the Stupid', which aims to address societal issues through a lens of humor and critique.













Chapters 
(00:00) Introduction to Mental Health and Music
(03:38) The Concept of Violence in Healing
(06:33) Personal Struggles and the Impact of Loss
(09:45) The Double Life of Public Success and Private Pain
(12:46) The Importance of Therapy and Professional Help
(15:32) Navigating Vulnerability in Music
(18:42) Experiencing Panic Attacks and Anxiety
(21:31) The Role of Friends and Family in Mental Health
(24:41) Confronting Trauma and Finding Healing
(35:41) Experiencing Anxiety and Panic Attacks
(44:55) The Struggles with Medication and Mental Health
(51:46) Coping Mechanisms and Creative Outlets
(01:02:59) Navigating Grief and Loss
(01:04:17) Upcoming Projects and Artistic Direction

Jake Palumbo Links:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jakepalumbo/
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/artist/1LAjUUeNbeMzDC3EzSZbw3?si=Z2-2oCfTSk-FxRUfl4vGfw
Bandcamp: https://spacelabrecordings.bandcamp.com/
Website: https://jakepalumbo.com/


Follow Me on Social Media:
https://www.instagram.com/thevoncastshow/
https://www.instagram.com/shibavon/ 
https://www.iamvon.net/

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Welcome to the Vaughan cast show. Hope everybody's doing well. Happy Monday. Everybody hope you're good weekend

(00:05):
Today I'm here with Jake Palombo the homie who is a rapper producer mixed engineer at space lab recordings
How'd you in the podcast years ago?
Years ago, but today I'll be more talking about mental health the violence of healing
Coping with grief and loss panic attacks
Isolation and you're a coming album you the nature for the stupid

(00:29):
It's a cool name
First and foremost, man. How are you today? I'm good man. Thank you for having me. It's good to be back
You're right. We did I think our last interview was
2019 or 2020 somewhere in there around the later pandemic
I think I would yeah, I was gonna say sometime when the world was
Was kind of shut down. So yeah, it's good to be back man. I'm good

(00:54):
Staying active staying busy, you know trying to navigate the insanity of the world and get some music out and while we're here
But yeah, I'm good man. It's good to be back good to hear man me too. Just trying to do things
Day of time type stuff dude. I bunk your
Current album violence of feeling I really like it

(01:15):
There's one line of stuck to me like some about family cells plasma. I can relate
Yeah, um, you know, I'm coming from where I come from especially like growing up in
You know, some people may know some people may not you know
I spent the first half of my life in Tennessee and I spent the last almost 20 years at this point in Brooklyn

(01:39):
but growing up in Tennessee and
Poverty Stric in Appalachia selling plasma is like a just a way of life for most people like if that's a way that you can
Convert some extra grocery money or whatever you need
You know selling plasma is is kind of a way of life where I'm from and that line in particular I was just kind of commenting on

(02:04):
It was like a commentary on the fact that bothers me that I haven't gotten rich enough that I can make sure that none of my friends are family
Have to do that anymore. Yeah, but yeah, no, that's that's definitely a thing where I come from it's
Yeah, I was doing that back in a day. I got I got holes in my on my arms from that

(02:25):
But yeah, that was a thing to do man. You need extra money for whatever
It's but yeah, I definitely saw what I heard that I'm like that's the first time I heard about it in a song
Some plasma that that that that was a deep cuz oh shit. That was me a few years ago. Well, I like
Yeah, way way back
But I definitely understand the crime and you gotta like eat certain things you're drinking a bunch of water all this stuff

(02:49):
I have an extreme
Fobia of needles like I don't even like getting blood work done
So that was something I could never do but you know most of my friends and family did yeah
I I have a fob of needles - I can get tattoos and like I can I don't know I can do blood work

(03:10):
But like I got to look away and let them know kind of thing, but not what the plasma stuff man
Yeah, man, so your latest project violence of healing. I dig that title. It feels like a violence and healing
They're like they contradict so talk to us about the concept of that that phrase in that title

(03:31):
Like most of this interview it's gonna be a multi-tiered answer
Because yeah, there's
Yeah, it's like an onion the more layers you start peeling back
But so like on the surface. Yeah, violence and healing
sound like oxymorons, but like once you actually start to lift the hood up and look underneath the hood

(03:55):
You'll find that just about every form of healing
Does involve some type of confrontation?
Whether that is confronting the people who
Gave you this trauma to try to get them to take accountability for it or whether it's

(04:17):
Taking accountability with yourself and having to confront yourself about some of the mistakes you might have made
I'm saying that to say that like to truly heal you rarely
Get out of it without some type of confrontation
So like that's something you learn once you start actually

(04:39):
You know going through the healing process, but why I chose that as an album title
is that um
You know obviously the object of the album was to heal and to
Basically make an open book to explain to everyone what was wrong with me

(05:04):
But as the kids say I chose violence while doing it. Oh, you know, there's that phrase like he chose violence
Um, I kind of chose violence in the process of making that album in that like there is virtually nothing on this record that is

(05:24):
Metaphorical or like has artistic license or is you know just based on a true state
story
There's nothing vague like it's almost like a game of mad lives almost and that each song is like this person

(05:44):
Did this to me and this is how I ended up feeling and in most cases like I'm not protecting these
people's identity
I basically am setting out to make a rap song about everyone who ever caused me pain and
And that's part of why they're probably will eventually have to be a part two or part three to this series because there was only so much I can get out in 10 songs but

(06:13):
You know I basically just
It's kind of hard to it's kind of hard to answer that question without actually describing the circumstances that led to me making this album
The album that came out before this was plant-based lib tard which you know is my most successful solo project to date on

(06:40):
But if you heard plant-based lib tard
the first
You know 13 tracks on this album are what you would describe as typical Jake Palombo
You know it's snorkey humor it's social and political commentary
It's anger it's bravado. It's me explaining why I'm cool and why you're stupid

(07:04):
You know and then when you get to the very end of the album
There's a song called a lot to unpack which is basically four minutes of me going
And describing this breakup that I had just went through

(07:26):
Um, you know that's that song a lot to unpack I
Was very
Weird at first about putting it out because it was so directly and
explicitly vulnerable
But it ended up I think it's my second most stream song on Spotify. I think I'd have to go check

(07:50):
But you know it has like 250,000 plays on Spotify as of 2025
so
What I was afraid of doing and sharing this vulnerable moment ended up being one of my bigger records so
The kind of

(08:11):
I'm sorry, I'm talking in circles a little bit because no pun intended there is a lot to unpack here
So I go through this breakup and like you know, I'm 40 years old like I've been through breakups like this is not my first
rodeo
But this was my first abandonment in life

(08:31):
Like by that point I had been through death loss my father's suicide like I had been through all types of tragedy
but I had never been abandoned
and so that
Happened and begin you know begins me spiraling a little bit a few months later

(08:52):
My mother dies after a seven-year battle would breast cancer
Lupus and hemocromatosis
A few months after that I get a tax warrant from New York state and
for underpayment of corporate tax and across the next several months they basically forcibly seized

(09:13):
22,000 dollars
From me based on tax returns that they had already accepted in processed so in this like seven month stretch
I lose the woman that I had been with for almost five years
I lose my mother and then the government takes all my money and all my hard work, you know my nest egg is essentially going so

(09:35):
all that loss
in that period of time
My mental health starts going completely and totally off the rails now what makes this even weirder
Is that plant-based lip tart is doing very well
It was my first record to get a million streams. It was you know, I was

(09:58):
Doing all kinds of radio runs and getting more love for it than I had gotten for anything up to that point
So the problem is is that privately my life is falling apart my mental health's going off the rails
But publicly on a day-to-day basis like I have to get up and smile for the internet and do the Jake Palombo thing

(10:19):
Because even though I was sinking into an abyss, I wasn't gonna let that like undo what I had worked for for over a decade
So I'm kind of living this double life at this point like I'm getting up and I'm giving motivational advice of how to navigate the music business
And I'm posting my raps and my beats and you know social media is a carefully curated experience of our best moments

(10:43):
But privately like what I was going through was completely different so
I reached a point where I'm like, you know
And you know we'll get into what you know the rock bottom that I hit later in the interview
But I reached a point to where I was like if I disappeared off this planet tomorrow

(11:07):
I need to leave a documentation of why I feel this way
And going back to the choosing violence thing I'm like these people that hurt me whether it was
The woman that abandoned me or whether it was
Artists I had falling out with whether it was other people in my life that could cause me hurt like these people are still walking around out here

(11:35):
In many cases still following me on social media
And
You know I need to document what these people did so I just chose violence I guess you'd say
It's like if I committed suicide tomorrow where I'd got hit by a bus or I
You know this album would stand as my last will and testament of like this is the documentation of what I was feeling like

(12:02):
Before I dropped off the earth
Sorry, that was a long winded answer, but uh no, it's like a lyrical manifesto
Some what yes, uh, yeah, I can relate with a lot of this the violence and healing. I think for me
I got cleaned two and a half years ago and I was running from

(12:27):
That feeling that visceral feeling of stuff. I was running from just frustration past issues
You know, I wasn't able to cope with emotions
properly
You know, I started using like mid to like late teens early 20s and I think
It just became my go-to for everything and so when I stopped well the reason I didn't want to stop was I felt like

(12:53):
the stuff I was running from would catch up to me and
It's not so much violent, but I get that it's a violent feeling you know you're under fighter flight
You know for me at least and I thought healing was just like okay. I'm just I'm just gonna chill
I'm gonna get better, but I think healing for me and in this term as a recovering addict is I threw up the bandaid off

(13:19):
I've been using substance to heal or just num it out and it was tough
You know um and I thought it'd be all all good. I'll just stop
But no stuff I had to really confront things from my past I had to confront how I
Did people wrong? I people how people wrong me and how I

(13:42):
deal with emotions and that's difficult
Uh, so yeah, uh, it does seem like an oxymoron first, but it is it is tough
And I think that's a reason why I didn't go and quote one to heal because I knew that once I stopped
All this stuff would catch up to me from from years and I said you know, let's keep going

(14:03):
I'm gonna keep going and with the vulnerable music
I'm doing that right now with some music with some songs and it's tough man like before
I just it'd be like not happy go lucky, but just I'd wrap about some cool stuff some slick shit some funny lines and some camera and shit
You know just some funny stuff and it's cool
Some bars as people would say, but when you're writing about like really vulnerable things sometimes I sit back

(14:27):
I'm like, damn do I really want to put this out like this is this is a lot
quote unquote this might be used as ammo against me in a potential disbound
That's like what's going on in my head, but sometimes I feel like I got to do it, you know
I don't always like like writing about it, but it feels good
Writing about it after so I can definitely relate to that and again my condolences with your loss and your mind that's

(14:50):
pretty difficult, you know
Thank you. Yeah, man, so um yeah to that point really quickly though um
You know, you're talking about the the anxiety of should I do this or not
Even as steadfastly
You
Driven as I was to make this album it was not without its

(15:15):
There were several times like when I was mastering the record when I handed it in about maybe four or five hours before it went live on Spotify
I had giant moral dilemmas about like you know these are
Real people I'm talking about this is not you know artistic license like you know

(15:36):
I knew it was a few times I felt weird about like did I overshare and
To be honest like yes, I did overshare at a lot of times on the album and that's
That's why like there were people who uh
People who I know personally
The most common thing people told me was uh

(15:59):
This is a great piece of art, but I have a hard time listening to it
because
Hearing you talk about feeling this way is uncomfortable for me
Uh, but yeah saying that to say like even as you know as as as
Convinced and driven as I wise to go about doing all this like that

(16:19):
I definitely had points where I was like was this too much should I have not said this on a right there's
Even a song where it lost my mind where I say I probably shouldn't say that I don't want to rap song
Um, so yeah, man
Yeah, 100% man and uh
So
Yeah, do I I totally get that and I think

(16:40):
Maybe feel better but the same time it's like man did I go too far and because I'm kind of mindful of that too
I don't really say names in mine, but it's just like I don't know you know
I feel like some of these people on my when I think about it's like sometimes people can't respond back as they don't rap
But I don't want to this people or anything but I'm kind of mindful of that

(17:01):
But there is definitely like a fine line you got to walk
I think it's subjective it depends on the person
Some people like really air out business and in songs and everything and it depends on what you trying to go for
But I think in your perspective, it's more like you got to get out of your chest
You know, it's not like defamation character per se, but it's just like this is what happened how I feel about it

(17:24):
Um, so in the beginning of the album the first track you talk about like
You know um
Seeing a therapist and being a psychiatrist psychiatric patient. What made you decide to get professional help?
Just to keep it
10 bands um

(17:45):
I was going to commit suicide
And when I say that like I don't just mean that you know, I felt like I couldn't go on anymore
Because I think everybody feels that way at some point
I'm talking about like I made a will of what I wanted done with my assets. I

(18:06):
Made a Google Drive where I organized the roughly 300 some
At that point I had about maybe 300-ish beats that hadn't been used yet
And I started making folders of give these to this guy give these to this guy give these to this guy so that after I'm going
You know, there can still be fill in the blank and Jake Palombo albums made um

(18:30):
I reached the point, you know, and I've talked about this
Not that much, and you know, I've made
Small references to it here and there in my music, but you know my father committed suicide when I was
22 I guess uh
You know, it's 20 years ago um

(18:54):
And I had reached a point where I just felt like I wasn't going to
ever heal and
I just needed the pain to stop and so
I postponed doing it because
We still needed to sell my mother's house like after she passed away

(19:16):
because uh
You know
Me and both of my siblings, you know, definitely uh
Can you use the bread from it and I wanted to make sure that they were able to get
Their share of it so like I had to go down the Tennessee and help get the house cleared out
Everything like that so I was postponing it uh

(19:40):
Until we can get all that handled and
Somewhere along the way I had a change of heart um
But I knew that I had gotten into a serious abyss
That I wasn't gonna be you know and it's so funny too because

(20:01):
You know when I talked frankly about like yeah, I was gonna commit suicide
The number one thing that people say to me is like oh my god like why didn't you know you can reach out to me anytime and and so on and so forth
And and what I've had to tell them is like at no point
Did I feel like I had no one to talk to

(20:23):
I've got friends. I've got family if if it came down to it
I could go on Instagram and say yo, I'm feeling low right now and I would have an inbox full of strangers
willing to talk to me
That's not the problem like having people to talk to
Was not the issue

(20:45):
The thing is is like your friends and your family can be as willing to help as they want to be but they're not mental health professionals
Unless they are like you know, maybe if your uncle is a therapist or a psychiatrist then you know
That doesn't apply but but for 99% of us like even our most willing friends and family they're not mental health professionals

(21:08):
So the same way that you shouldn't go to a sushi chef to find out how to grill a good hamburger
um
You know, I realized that like this was a problem and I needed to see a professional about it
So what ended up happening was I went to my primary care doctor

(21:28):
You know, I've been I've been self-employed for 16 years
uh
You know, I've worked for myself in space lab recording since November 2008 now that's cool
But one of the downsides to that was that you know, I didn't have health insurance until about three years ago

(21:49):
Um just because like it was too cost prohibitive and even to get
Uh, affordable care plan. I had to make myself a low-paid employee in space lab recordings
You know what I mean like I let the company have all the money, you know, I mean that shouldn't be saying that in the interview
but point being is that uh

(22:12):
I finally had health insurance and so I was at my primary care doctor and I mentioned to my primary care doctor that uh
I wanted to go about starting the process of getting some mental health treatment and so they gave me a questionnaire to fill out
and
My approach like from that day to even

(22:34):
Literally, I had therapy yesterday. I have therapy on Thursdays um
I approached it with the attitude that like if I don't keep it 10,000
Like if I hold anything back
There's no point in doing any of this like I don't think the doctors and the professionals can treat me

(22:55):
correctly
If they don't know exactly everything that's going on with no filter
So I filled out this questionnaire and they were rather alarmed by my answers
And I ended up getting held for a psych evaluation that would hold medical center for several hours
and uh

(23:15):
There was a really nice woman named Melanie who
Was the supervisor of the psych department there and she was like come back tomorrow. I want to talk to you
I just want to talk to you
And she listened to me and heard my story and uh

(23:36):
You know initiated the process she put me in contact with NYPCC which is the new york psychiatric
counseling center
Uh, it was uh, it's in bushwick. It's near my studio. It's actually walking distance from my studio
Uh, but this place accepted my insurance
um, you know, because

(23:58):
Not every mental health treatment place accepts every type of insurance, you know, so I lucked up and found someone that did
and everybody there was really good to me um
And I ended up getting matched with a therapist that I really
Really connected with uh
I specifically asked like I would rather when it comes to doing therapy. I would rather talk to a woman

(24:25):
Um, because it's really easy for me to open up and be vulnerable to a woman
Whereas I don't think I would be quite as much and talking to a man
I think there would be even even if I went into it with the right attitude
I think there would just because of social conditioning. I think there would be some little amount of like me

(24:47):
Being standoffish and not wanting to open up. I just don't think I could have the same experience talking to a man
so they matched me up with a
Really awesome therapist and over the last two years
Uh, it will last month made two years that I've been in therapy
I credited to me still being alive today um because the thing about going to therapy is that

(25:18):
A lot of people maybe get it misconstrued and I think I even did too when I started it they think that like
Your therapist is not Yoda
The in terms of like you're not there for them to tell you some sage wisdom that fixes all your problems
They can't do that um

(25:39):
What they can do is put you through exercises and ask the right questions that get you sharing things that have happened in your life
That help you work through things to then discover the answer yourself
Like that's what a good therapist you know essentially should be doing is

(26:03):
Is giving you the framework to work through this and figure out the answer as you go
So you know the first like
Six months of therapy almost all we talked about was me processing
Abandonment and everything I went through and why I felt like I got the short end of the stick and

(26:28):
And
Eventually as you go on in therapy you're gonna start digging up things that happened in your past that you have probably been repressing for some amount of time um
You know even on down to like losing my father
I thought that I had processed it and accepted it because my

(26:57):
Like me going hard to achieve my dreams
Is me extracting vengeance on a world that took my father
So it's like every time I accomplish a goal or I hit a milestone or I get something off the bucket list
That's me just like punching life back into face
So because I live in this Jake Palombo world, you know, that's been going for 16 years

(27:24):
I thought like everything was okay
What I discovered through therapy
Is that okay? Maybe I found a healthy way of dealing with it
Instead of putting it into substance abuse or putting it into you know
You know some kind of negative outlet I put it into dreams and goals and like how much cool stuff can I accomplish like that's a healthier

(27:54):
Mechanism than a lot of things I could have done
But at the end of the day that's that's just a mechanism like I have never grieved
Like I never grieved my father. I just
Delt with the aftermath and I'm like I'm gonna turn this pain into power and

(28:15):
You know I I
Did a great job of avenging it. I guess you could say but I never took the time to be like a sad little boy that was sad that
You know this happened. So I'm saying all that to say that like I would wreck I think
That thing 90% of the population should be in therapy

(28:36):
I think there's five to ten percent of all humanity who does not need some type of professional assistance, but um
But saying that to say that I fully credit therapy to the fact that I'm still alive having this conversation with you
Therapy is often difficult like yes. I cry while you know not every session

(29:00):
But like yeah, maybe one out of every five or six sessions. Yeah, I'm gonna be like
At some point
Like doing that work is not easy
But the aftermath of having worked through that stuff is so valuable
That I actually really do look forward to Thursdays at two o'clock

(29:21):
Like I have this I think the other value of therapy is just
I have this closed empty room where it's just me and this person
That I have an open space to say whatever I want to say no matter how
Unhinged it might be and I will tell you this my therapist has learned more about underground rap and the

(29:46):
Stuff that goes on behind the scenes than she ever cared to know. I'm sure
um
She know about a lot of people's
BS and nonsense um, but anyway saying that to say that just having that weekly safe space to know that I can go win and just let
Whatever it is out no matter how crazy it might sound

(30:09):
And there's
Thank god it's covered by my insurance, but you know, even if it did cost money like I think it would be worth the price of admission
Yeah, um, yeah, thank for sharing that man. I'm glad you're still here. I'm glad that you realize that hey
I do need help because I want to commit suicide type thing

(30:31):
Um, it's good you recognize that and got the help you need I also agree man like I feel like everybody this I think society would benefit if
Everybody got therapy if it's more accessible. It's just the cost and I just I really do wish that one of the one day
this country can have
Therapy for free or well relative low cost because my sessions are like 320 each but because of insurance I pay nothing

(31:00):
And I look forward to my sessions every week too. It's a Monday at 4 p.m
Always look forward to it now like write stuff down like oh, what can I talk about and like you said
Therapy isn't just like a you go to therapy and they give you advice and you're good a lot of it is
They don't really do the work for you. They show you what you can do and a lot of you got a process on your own and it takes time

(31:22):
Um, and I also feel like sometimes I'm going in circles talking to my therapist, but she's very patient
I also feel the same way um, I'm more comfortable talking to a woman
But in my 12 step program my sponsor is a guy and I'm getting better at that
But yeah, I feel the same way where like yeah, I'll open up to a woman more or do it a guy kind of thing

(31:43):
um
Yeah, man, no, that's really cool. That's really cool that it's helping out and
um, you can say what you want to your therapist to me. I'm still like I'm pretty sure to certain things if I said
I think like the thing is if they feel like you or you might commit harms yourself for others
Like seriously then they might escalate it, but for the most part you can say what you want

(32:08):
um, so yeah, man, not that that's really good dude, uh, that you are
Getting the help you need and it's working out
Two and a half years later. I did save your life and it's really good
again, I do feel like
Talking is a professional is so much different than talking to your friends
Because I agree like I have friends I can go to and talk to which helps

(32:30):
Uh, but they're not
Professionals and if a couple of them are
But it'd be conflict of interest. I couldn't do you know um
I remember long time ago. I have a friend who was in the mental health thing. I remember uh
Yeah, like we we partied together
We just drugs together and she's like oh, yeah, I can never be at therapist because of this because it's a conflict of interest

(32:55):
And like you said
Confident with friends and family. Yeah, we can they can help out. I think it's great
But it's also nice to have an unbiased professional like
opinion or feedback
Because I further most part your friends and family will side will take your side and people are and friends and family can be really good to talk to

(33:16):
But again, it's just nice to have like somebody that doesn't know your background
It doesn't have like a really much of say of like your past but just it's like a third person perspective
And also and one of your songs you talk about uh
Experiencing panic attacks. I feel like people experience panic

(33:36):
But that's really not panic attacks or they make it the same they might think it's the same thing
uh
For you like what what was that like?
Experiencing panic attacks and public at the in the subway station and all that
So I at first didn't really know that I was experiencing a panic attack. I thought I was having a heart attack

(33:58):
um
so
Another thing going back into the long history of things leading up to this I
In 2019 I suffered a transient ice-schemic attack which is a minor stroke
um and
After undergoing a bunch of tests, you know on my heart my lungs my brain everything they couldn't find any medical cause for it

(34:26):
and
The only thing they were able the only theory that was credible that they could chalk it up to was that this was caused by
anxiety and mental anguish
Now I had made a joke for many years leading up to that that my head was going to explode one day
And that's kind of almost what happened is my head almost exploded one day

(34:49):
So saying that to say that when I started having panic attacks, you know
This is in the months following my breakup and my mom passing away and me
Getting a large sum of money taken from me by the government uh
You know it started out uh, you know in the train stations uh

(35:11):
You know they felt like I was having a heart attack like my left arm would get a little bit numb. I would start sweating
I would feel disoriented
Uh, my face would get flushed um, you know, I'd look my I'd be red like a tomato
Um, my heart would start going really fast and then start beating

(35:33):
A rhythmically like you know your heart's normally a steady beat it would start beating
You know sounding like the drummer for mud vein or something um, you know playing some weird off-time signature
um, and I was experiencing what were basically heart attacks symptoms
so

(35:54):
That became a
I
Don't know I guess just call it a sore spot for me in my attempts to get treated because
Everything good and nice and wonderful. I have to say about the therapists that I've dealt with along the way
I don't really have anything good to say about the psychiatrist's I've dealt with along the way who were in charge

(36:22):
of prescribing medication and not to get too far off into that when I first get into treatment the
psychiatrist put me on they wanted to put me on anti-depressants which I did not want to go on because in my opinion
I am not depressed. I am dealing with
anxiety that is so debilitating that it is crossing over into physical symptoms

(36:49):
I wake up trying to feel great every day, but these circumstances
Speaking of circumstances just to make a quick detour
That has to do with what we're talking about on the violence of healing track four is a it's either four or five
Is a song called watch you walking

(37:10):
Now this song is about the fact that my ex
Who I told you broke up you know my first abandonment this major breakup that I just went through
When we broke up and she moved out of the apartment I'm sitting in now
The apartment she moved into is five blocks from my studio

(37:32):
So quite literally every day that I go to work
I have to deal with the anxiety that I might run into her
And that has happened enough times to make that a realistic fear
So I have a pretty large coffee and tree habit

(37:55):
And so there's a coffee shop in front of my building and you know the other thing is done outdoors also
So I have to walk outside several times per day just in a regular workday at the studio
And up until very recently every time I would walk outside

(38:15):
I would have to be on guard of
What if I run into her
What if she's got her boyfriend with her
What if this what if this and then I start panicking my palms get clammy
I start shaking a little bit like I've got Parkinson's my heart rates going through the roof my face is flush

(38:35):
Like I'm dealing with this four or five times a day
And so
I spent the better part of the year just in this constant state of like
Just my anxiety literally it literally burned off lean tissue like I lost 40 pounds

(39:02):
And in a year in some change
Like it was literally just you know, I also wasn't eating like I was supposed to be because my anxiety was just so through the roof
So the problem in what got me very
I guess kind of disgusted with the system was
I tried it their way at first like they prescribed me anti depressants

(39:27):
Which did nothing to help me and robbed me of my creativity
You know like even my day job like working as a producer in an engineer like I have to come up with creative solutions on the fly
Where people tell me yo Jake I want it to sound more purple
I have to on the fly like figure out what that means and how to execute it

(39:51):
I was completely unable to do that
On any kind of anti depressant
And so for my anxiety
They gave me several different drugs that were completely useless
They gave me uh
Oh, uh, what was it? Oh, I can't remember the name of the first one

(40:14):
But it was basically prescription Benadryl it was it was literally an anti-histamine
You know, and I asked them I'm like so when I'm having a panic attack
I'm supposed to just go to sleep. They're like that's what you're telling me then they gave me bus par bus parole
With it was supposed to be an anti-anxiety
It did nothing. I went through like three anxiety and so the whole time I'm seeing what's going on here

(40:39):
In that they're being hesitant to prescribe any kind of narcotic
Anxiety medication
Even though the doctors say that I medically qualify for it
Now that's a whole other story in and of itself
I spent the better part of a year and a half trying to get answers on that
and

(41:01):
Basically what it boils down to is that because I have the insurance that I have and because I was honest on my intake forms
That I have occasionally used alcohol and marijuana um
There's basically a check mark next to your name that says we're not going to prescribe you
X an X or volume or anything like that

(41:23):
Now was that something I did recreationally your dam right it was and I love
It was great
I think of how much that would have helped me get through the last few years now here's the thing is like do I enjoy it recreationally?
Yes
Did I medically qualify for it? No or I'm sorry did I medically qualify for it? Yes

(41:45):
Those two things can be true at the same time without either of them being false
But because of bureaucracy that wasn't ever going to happen for me
now
There's so much fentanyl and stuff like that out there now in like over 50% of street drugs back in the day
I would have just bypassed the medical system entirely and just went and got some but that today is too dangerous

(42:11):
Um and I like being alive
So you know, I never took that route but saying all that to say and
The bureaucracy of the medical system and again
I'm grateful that my insurance covers my therapy because that's been more useful than anything
but

(42:31):
Because of the bureaucracy and stuff in American medical
They
You're just gonna have to raw dog this like you're just gonna have to these debilitating panic attacks that feel like hard attacks and
Make you in this into this sweating tomato on the train that everyone's staring at like you just got to do

(42:53):
With that because we don't let the pours have
You know real anxiety medication
So um saying all that to say that like
experiencing panic
Is just that like you're panicking like oh no, what am I gonna uh?
That's different than having a panic attack having a medical panic attack feels very akin to having a heart attack

(43:21):
Yeah, okay. Thank you for their first shading that and that's unfortunate that they didn't uh
Give you like like Xanax essentially
Uh just because you said that I mean
I feel like if you recreationally use it it's cool
But they should also have some things that do you abuse this do you like how many times you do it? Uh now I'm pretty honest
I remember like when I just got clean recently when I got clean two and a half years ago

(43:46):
I got my wisdom tooth taken out. I could have lied
Because you know before they gave me like viking in
And this time I was like oh shit. Yeah, I was like you know
Can you give me something that's not habit forming?
Right it's tough like it was tough for me that I'm glad I went that route
But I can see you know why they'd want to be mindful of like giving out that stuff like I have ADHD

(44:09):
And I am honest with my psychiatrist so she'll probably will never prescribe me at all
You're not good, but in your case. Yeah, I mean if it's if it's debilitating like that
I think they should give you maybe like
Trasadone or something a low form of it, you know um
When you describe panic attacks the only time I
I could remotely

(44:30):
Relate to that was when I was heavy and doing coke
And like I noticed like my left when you send your left arm getting it. I'm like oh shit
My left arm got numb too or like I could really move. I was like sweating
That's a very very uncomfortable feeling. I mean obviously
Mine was kind of like brought on by me ingesting substance is by yours is more like stuff to happen to you and you know

(44:55):
So it's different
Um, I wouldn't as somebody having a panic attack at work and I saw it for the first first annoying time seen it
And there was a lady next there was someone next to them. I think it was like her
Psychic or somebody helping her out and I notified the manager. I'm like, should I like
Call an ambulance or something because she like she looked like she was having a very difficult time

(45:19):
She couldn't breathe. I even asked like hey, do you want me to call an ambulance and the lady said no
It's okay. She's having a panic attack. She'll get through it
So somebody was helping her coach her and it was you know the breath it was like a store wasn't too busy, but
I don't
New York subway station. I feel like that's like
Times a hundred so it's not somewhere you want to have a meltdown at trust me. It's

(45:43):
No
Yeah, man, so not it's good that you got some therapy, but yeah, it's just unfortunate like there's a lot of
Red tape with the medicine. I know and CVS now they don't carry um
Coding I think for the reason because people try to rob and you know there's like there's like

(46:04):
Timers on narcotic medicines. I get it, but yeah, I get that um
So and you
And the song isolate which I really like I isolate a lot you said I want to isolate myself because I've grown to hate myself
Can you gonna talk about that like what?
That is I think that's maybe the one lyric on the entire album

(46:29):
That is not a hundred percent literal and contains some tiny little bit of artistic lightestens
I said that because I'm I am making the chorus. I needed something that rhymed with isolate myself deprecate myself, you know
but
So I have a bad problem with isolation like while all this was going on like I would just stop communicating with people um

(46:57):
And I'm not just talking, you know, I would
Clients would be trying to book me for studio sessions and stuff like that and I would be slow to get back to them and things of that nature
and so I specifically did not experience a
Huge degree of self-hatred
But I know that a lot of people who have isolation problems do

(47:21):
And so that like I said that's maybe the only lyric on the whole album that's not like completely literal
I wasn't going into isolation because I hated myself so much
I said that because I know that's the case for a lot of people um
but uh
as

(47:43):
Maybe just some degree of wise because one of the one of the reasons that I would isolate for so long was because I never wanted
To remake that contact
Like if somebody tried to hit me up and I don't get back to them for three to five days
When I finally do get back to them I have to have an explanation for why it took so long to get back

(48:07):
So I can either tell you the truth. I could say hey. I was in the abyss of mental, you know meltdowns
And then you're gonna look at me like uh huh, you know
Or I can lie to you and say oh
I'm still I've been so busy like yo. I'm a swamped
And usually I would just default to that because

(48:28):
Some people I can keep it, you know, 10 bands with them
And then other people like yeah, I don't want to tell you why I haven't replied to anybody in five days
Right uh, I hear you that makes sense
Uh, yeah, cuz it's like
I'm like that with some lines
Isolate myself self-manicate myself hate myself. Okay. Yeah, that makes sense

(48:52):
Cuz for me have a line in a song. I'm working on it says like a paranoia got me severing connection
Calm down height my anxiety depression for me the isolation and self-hatred it
I can relate to that because like
The reason I did drugs for the most part one of the many reasons I didn't like myself
I don't like where I was in life and
With drugs typically

(49:14):
The more you do the more you try to start to get paranoid and so the more you isolate
Like I would get like an anxiety attack if somebody like message me or called me
So I put my phone down do not disturb and just I don't want to deal with it, you know um
And yeah, man, I think that for me that that that uh that line hit cuz
I just want to be alone. I'm just like so tweaked out so on one that I have a hard time going to grocery store like

(49:41):
I have to really do like mental health exercises like fuck. Okay. I first I got a shower
I'm like it's like a to-do list like this is a grueling to do list just to get out of my room
Take a shower and go in public just because that was so high. So I can relate to that a lot um
And then in the same song you have a line that goes once you step out the clinic done the block called reality

(50:07):
Coping exercise to prevent self-casualty
Can you share with us that exercise because someone might benefit from it? I'm also so this is actually it's that's so there that's
A two-part answer so that line stems
The reason I wrote that as such is because I had a cynical attitude to what the psychiatrist would tell me

(50:31):
When I would be trying to get a real prescription for real anxiety medication
Part of the problem is that you have to play dumb
Because the minute I say hey, why not just prescribe me X and X or volume
I just became a drug seeker
And they're gonna write me down on paper that you know, I'm a drug seeker

(50:52):
So I had to pretend like I didn't even know what any of that stuff was I just had to show them that like hey
This stuff you're prescribing me is not working. Can we try something else? What else is there? And so
In me trying to get this psychiatrist to
Take my physical symptoms seriously

(51:13):
She would always brush it off and say when you feel that way just use your coping exercises
When you feel that way just use your coping exercises use your coping exercises when you're having a panic attack come on
Use your coping exercises and so at first I was like fuck your coping exercises
but

(51:35):
As time went on and I get into therapy
You know, I still had suicidal thoughts on into
You know occasionally still had suicidal thoughts on into about maybe a year ago. It's probably been a year more since I've had any
Reason to feel that way
But

(51:58):
What I ended up doing
You know, I'm very big on writing things down like I write albums about people that hurt me. I make lists
I you know and so what I did was about maybe two years ago
I made a list that I keep in my phone of the seven reasons I should not commit suicide and

(52:25):
They one day I might share this list with the internet
But it ranges everything from you know
You made your best album at 40 there might still be some cool stuff around the corner to you know
When I'm in still like you at this age to you know your nephew thinks that you're literally the greatest rapper that ever walked the earth

(52:51):
and so I made this list of reasons that I should not do that
And I tell you what whenever I felt that way
I would pull out that list and read it to myself
And once I was done reading all seven of them and the last thing on the list was like your father committed suicide

(53:17):
Like both of y'all can't do that
Like really both y'all gonna get lost to that
When I would finish reading that list
That list was so convincing that like I couldn't argue with it
When I would finish reading that I'd be like damn man you got a point like oh

(53:39):
You know
And so when I would finish reading that list I would be like
Yo, I really can't do this like if I do this I'm gonna be selling myself short
I'm gonna be denying myself
The ability to rack up whatever future wins are coming to me

(54:01):
And so ironically I end up I was like oh well, I guess that's a coping exercise huh
Yeah, no that's cool. I think there's definitely a balance from like medication and therapy
again
I relate to the part where you said you can't name a specific drug

(54:24):
I was in therapist friends or a friend that knows about therapy. They just said whatever you do
Don't say you need this
Don't don't use a specific medication because del thing is your drug seeking
Yeah, so like you said you kind of have to play dumb or just oh I feel this way
But I don't know what to get do you have recommendations as opposed to yeah, man. I want Adderall abdhd

(54:45):
Fuck no, right? Yeah. Yeah, can't do that you kind of can't advocate for yourself right? Yeah
Yeah, man, um, so
This is a very broad question, but how do you manage how you balance all this?
You know personal life and your music career
It's not easy. Oh, it's not easy whatsoever. Um, I basically

(55:10):
I wake up between six and seven a.m. I go to bed
Anywhere between midnight and one a.m. Uh
I
Just have to go hard every day because like you know to
To keep enough money coming in and to keep this business running, you know

(55:32):
I have to work long days in the studio working on other people's music
Then I have to find time to work on my own music because that's the whole reason we're here in the first place
Um, then I have to find time to you know
Deal with my personal relationships and my loved ones and to
Have time to watch WWE Network and you know, uh, you know do whatever

(55:57):
It's not easy man like it's not like this is one aspect where my obsessive personality
And the fact that my brain goes a hundred miles a minute always and like I I can't sit still for very long
Like I have a very difficult time being idle um

(56:20):
That's one aspect where I guess it works in my favor in that like
I just don't have a lot of idle time and in my day ever
Um, even if I'm just catching up with friends or relaxing or doing something
I'm like yes self-care
We're caring for ourselves. Uh, you know um

(56:41):
It's not easy at all
I don't even necessarily know how I do it other than just trying to use every usable minute of my day
And that can be an exhausting way to live at times um
That's the one thing like I I value my money very

(57:04):
Highly, but my time is so much more valuable to me because time can never be recouped
It can never be gotten back like you know um
I don't know. I just try to use every single minute of my day
But juggling at all is not easy at all being a small business being an artist and
Then trying to be a good person a good brother a good friend a good uncle a good whatever you got to be

(57:31):
I'm always at any given time. I'm always behind on something
Uh, and I always say the day that I'm caught up on everything. That's probably when I should worry um
But yeah
Yeah, no, just general question. It's tough. I like that just
kind of

(57:52):
The you
Time you can't get back got to make the most of it um
This is also not a general question, but you went through different types of loss and
Over the past few years
What are some things that the topping you cope with grief and grief and loss?
It depends um

(58:15):
I guess the general answer for all of that is talking about it in whatever format that that is like in terms of
grief from my relationship and abandonment and pain and feeling like you know, I was hurt
I deal with that through making an album about it. I'm talking about it, but I'm talking in the form of rhymes

(58:39):
When it comes to the loss of like losing both my parents
I deal with that in speaking of them regularly
You know my mom's only been gone for
About four years now my dad's been gone for 20
But in both cases

(59:03):
You know, I speak of them regularly like in my social media posts and in my music
I'm always making reference to them and I do feel like there's people
Who never met either one of my parents, but because they followed me for such a length of time
I feel like they have an idea of what my mom and dad were about like this is what I wanted you know my mom

(59:28):
Loved being a hip-hop mom and like was super encouraging of what I did like
My dad is where I get my musical ability from but he's also where I get my work ethic from and learning how to treat women and you know things of that nature
A lot of that pain I
Just try to speak about it

(59:50):
In whatever form that is like you know whenever it's mothers or fathers day like post in a throwback pick and a
Little essay and just telling you what great people they were or I
Guess and I maybe should throw it out of future disclaimer that if you break Jake Palombo's heart he might make an album about you so um

(01:00:11):
You know going forward for the rest of my relationship life just that's why but but it's the common denominator is is talking about it and I think
Being able
I feel fortunate
That like I have no shame in doing any of this

(01:00:34):
Because yeah, I'll make an album like the violence of healing knowing that it's gonna be a difficult album to promote
Knowing that the hip-hop radio shows that normally play my stuff or not gonna
Show love to this album because like where are you gonna fit these songs like in between?
You know

(01:00:56):
The song about you know the streets versus the song about break dancing in graffiti like where do you fit the song of
You know the man having the mental health breakdown like there's no real space for that so I'm saying all that to say that
You know not everyone is a rapper so like for other people it might be journaling about it or it might be

(01:01:19):
Writing poetry about it or it might be blogging about it or it might be
You know whatever, but I'm saying that to say that like by wearing this stuff on my sleeve and having no shame and communicating about it
Of like yeah, hey this person hurt me and it really hurt or
Hey like, you know this person died and I really miss them and here's why I

(01:01:43):
Feel like hopefully it's trying to help normalize that to where other people don't feel weird talking about that stuff
Yeah, I like how you go about it though because it's not a disc because people do that though some people like go about it in a disc
But I think you're just
Sharing how you felt in your perspective. You're not necessarily like this in these people

(01:02:08):
uh and yeah talking about it helps
I mean I had a hard time talking about this kind of stuff for a very long time even to my friends because I felt like like
You had a line I think I remember me where you said like I got a bunch of friends. I don't want to stress about my problems
I felt the same way for a long time because I'm like, you know
They have so many other problems. I don't want to burden them, but

(01:02:30):
They told me no, no actually I want you to reach out to me like
Next time you want to get high talk to me because it seems like a lot of the times you want to get high to escape something or you don't want to talk about it
And I'm learning to do that now. It's hard sometimes. I always feel like because a lot of my friends they have like families
They're like a mom or a dad. I don't want to get right after them. I don't want to like but they they they're the ones to say talk to me

(01:02:56):
We issue
So yeah, I can relate to that a lot man um
Because it's just it's tough. I'm getting better
Talking about that kind of stuff and that's a good that you talk about your parents and kind of like let the memory live on
They're still here and I'm pretty sure a lot of people couldn't relate to that. I have a friend. She lost her

(01:03:17):
She lost her dad too a long time ago and lost her mom recently a few years ago around the pandemic and it devastated her
Um, she's doing better now and she also had suicidal thoughts
But she's doing better now and she you know she posts about her mom here in there of
Last question man. Uh, you have an upcoming project. You're the nature for the stupid

(01:03:38):
He tells more about that and what to expect um
So yeah being that uh, you know being that I'm too
Hey, I got the violence of healing done and out and off my chest and being you know, I'm in I'm about two years into being in therapy
You know, I'm feeling a bit better now. So I you know, I it's time to get back to making a new album and

(01:04:04):
This new album is a little more in line with what I did on plant-based lib toward
Uh, you know with what people come to expect from a Jake Palombo album, but
The
The unifying theme and why it ended up getting called euthanasia for the stupid is that

(01:04:27):
I'm kind of just ranging against the stupidity in the world
Whether it's bad information whether it's what's happening politically whether it's you know, uh humans
Ability to get doped so easily by con people uh, whether it's you know, what's going on in the current administration with the government whether it's

(01:04:51):
You know, I
Most of the time when I make an album I have the title before I ever
Have any songs whether it's plant-based lib toward violence of healing any album. Take it till you make it like I had those titles first before I had in the music

(01:05:11):
And the title kind of dictated how the record came out sounding
This is the first time I didn't have a title when I went in
And by the time I had about eight songs
I'm like, you know the universe the the unifying theme of all this is that via rhyme form
I'm basically just kind of taking stupid people and hitting them in the hammer and saying oh my god

(01:05:35):
Look at this how do you not see the truth?
bro
and so
You know that's uh, that's kind of where we are and so
You know, it's back to
It's back to I guess what you would expect from a more traditional Jake Palombo album the humor the political and social commentary the snork

(01:05:57):
the uh, you know just the biting
Kind of wit and humor
But one thing I will say that putting the violence of healing out
And being so open and vulnerable for an entire record
I think there will always be some element of that in my music
From now until when I quit like because in a way, I'm just like

(01:06:22):
What's the point of making this music if we don't like really fully share everything that we've got to say
So you know, there may be a little a little
Bit of that here in their mixed-in but for the most part it's me going back to war against idioms
idiocracy
You know any accuracy was a great comedy movie, but it's starting to look like it was a documentary

(01:06:45):
Oh, yeah
100% man
I do get that and for me too, it's like I kind of want to get this project. I'm working on out of the way because it's like
I want to get back to like
I mean, it's fun making a vulnerable music, but it just it takes a lot out of you
Yeah, my song is back then. It was more about partying and having fun

(01:07:06):
Also, I'm kind of conflicted on my damn. I don't do drugs anymore. I'm talking about parting for so long
What am I what am I gonna do? So I think I got to take it
Data time for that
So yeah, thanks again for this conversation man. I'm glad we either sit down. I'm just talking about everything going on
I'm glad you're doing better. I'm glad you put this album out. It's a really good album. I think my favorite one is remember me

(01:07:29):
That's a really good one. So favorite track
good one
Do you have an idea of when this will come out the youth major for the stupid by the summer?
We're we're close to being done
I'm just waiting on a feature or two and then the album cover art and then it should be ready to go out
And for the most part, it's mostly finished. Okay. Cool. Where can we find you online?

(01:07:54):
Uh
Anywhere Jake Palombo I
Jake Palombo.com is the official website. It's being rebuilt as we speak
We got a new Jake Palombo.com being unveiled this summer. I'm on Instagram at Jake Palombo same thing with Twitter Facebook
Tick-tock

(01:08:14):
You know anywhere you can find I'm on blue sky like yeah pretty much any network just
You can find me there Jake Palombo
You know in between the musical stuff. I do a lot of videos and you know stuff to try to help
You know
Independent artists navigate their way through this crazy matrix of insanity that uh, yeah, you know

(01:08:37):
Being a creative can be
But yeah, it's happy with me. We're always working on something. Oh, thank you, man. I have a good one. I'm ended here. Thank you