February 28, 2025 • 49 mins
In this conversation, Michael shares his life story, detailing his journey from Vietnam to the United States, the challenges he faced growing up, and the life-altering decisions that led to his incarceration for nearly 20 years. He discusses the cultural adjustments he had to make, the influence of gangs during his high school years, and the harsh realities of prison life. Michael reflects on the lessons he learned during his time in prison, the importance of having a plan for reintegration into society, and the significance of family connections. His story is one of resilience, personal growth, and the power of hope.
Original Episode Aired April 2022
Chapters
(00:00) Introduction and Podcast Overview
(00:00 Michael's Early Life and Cultural Adjustment
(04:13) High School Challenges and Gang Culture
(10:04) Life-Changing Events and Incarceration
(12:06) Adjusting to Prison Life
(18:04) Prison System and Overcrowding Issues
(24:02) Preparing for Release and Life After Prison
(27:01) Reconnecting with Food and Family
(29:48) Life Lessons from Prison Cooking
(32:14) Navigating Prison Dynamics and Personal Growth
(34:53) Reflections on Change and Growth
(36:05) Adjusting to Life After Prison
(39:27) Reconnecting with Family and Culture
(41:43) Using Technology to Stay Connected
(43:35) Finding Purpose and Employment After Release
(45:24) The Importance of Planning for the Future
(46:38) The Surreal Experience of Freedom
IG https://www.instagram.com/cali.ogmike/
Follow Me on Social Media:
https://www.instagram.com/thevoncastshow/
https://www.instagram.com/shibavon/
https://www.iamvon.net/
Original Episode Aired April 2022
Chapters
(00:00) Introduction and Podcast Overview
(00:00 Michael's Early Life and Cultural Adjustment
(04:13) High School Challenges and Gang Culture
(10:04) Life-Changing Events and Incarceration
(12:06) Adjusting to Prison Life
(18:04) Prison System and Overcrowding Issues
(24:02) Preparing for Release and Life After Prison
(27:01) Reconnecting with Food and Family
(29:48) Life Lessons from Prison Cooking
(32:14) Navigating Prison Dynamics and Personal Growth
(34:53) Reflections on Change and Growth
(36:05) Adjusting to Life After Prison
(39:27) Reconnecting with Family and Culture
(41:43) Using Technology to Stay Connected
(43:35) Finding Purpose and Employment After Release
(45:24) The Importance of Planning for the Future
(46:38) The Surreal Experience of Freedom
IG https://www.instagram.com/cali.ogmike/
Follow Me on Social Media:
https://www.instagram.com/thevoncastshow/
https://www.instagram.com/shibavon/
https://www.iamvon.net/
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Hey there! My name is Vaughn and this is the Vaughncast Show. This is a podcast that focuses on
(00:08):
mental health, breaking societal stigmas, harm reduction, addiction and recovery. If you like what
you hear, subscribe and leave a review on Spotify and Apple Podcasts. Also, follow the podcast
Instagram @thevoncastshow where I post video content from the show. All right, let's get into
(00:33):
today's episode. Welcome to the Vaughncast show. Cheg, I'm Michael with me. I met you like just
online stuff. Man, I heard about your story. You know, from what I gather, you know, you definitely
had a life to change the experience when you were doing, man. Those don't know. Michael has been
(00:54):
what you were locked up for like almost 20 years? Yeah, almost 20 years. You know, the goal of this
is just to really not really highlight what you did, but just how you changed the person as a man,
kind of thing, man. So thank you for taking your time out to do this, bro. Yeah, thank you for
(01:16):
having me on your show, man. I appreciate it. No problem, man. So, yeah, let's get into it, dude.
All that stuff, you know, was going in the beginning, dude. Where did you go up?
So basically, I'm from Vietnam, Saigon. I came over here when I was eight years old. Okay.
(01:37):
When I started off in Texas, Houston and living in my grandma. Those are 14 years.
And, you know, from there, we moved to California, LA, and I lived there for a few years as well, until
we moved to Orange County. And so since Orange County, I've been here ever since, you know, my whole life.
(02:02):
Nice. Was it was it tough for you when you, you know, went to Vietnam to California and stuff?
Was it kind of tough to meet new friends or adjust to the culture of everything?
Yeah, the culture shock. It was, it took a lot of adjustment. I need to get used to everything.
(02:22):
The thing that was even harder for me was getting the same reciprocation from your own people as well.
And I find that interesting because, you know, coming over here, I thought, you know, all Vietnamese,
all Asian, we all together, you know, that wasn't the case, man. Oh, really? Yeah.
(02:45):
You know, you got the American Asians and they look down on you, they're like, oh, you know,
it's just a five, whatever. So basically they're not taking you anywhere, they're not accepting you.
I always find that weird, like, man, you know, you speak the same language.
You know, we got same last names. Well, the meaver, like, was going on.
(03:06):
Yeah, it's different. It's different, bro. I get you.
It took a lot of adjustment because, you know, coming over here, like, you know,
I get racism from the whites. I get racers from from the Hispanics. And then last but not
least, what hurt the muscles, you know, like, that being outcasted by your own people at times, you know?
(03:30):
So like when you go to school, you see like all the fobs sitting around the top tables and you
got the Asian American kids sitting around, you know, their table. And it wasn't because of like a
language barrier because you know, they speak Vietnamese, they choose not to, but in a way, like I said,
they just kind of like outcasted you. Yeah. Yeah. It's different. I mean, it's the same thing
(03:55):
like in Filipino. It's like the first generation and like the 1.5 generation is like the people that
came here and they're like, yeah, they call it, you know, Filipino. Oh, you're fine. You know, you
can tell the accent and everything. But yeah, it's weird how there's a disconnect between that
because you're in there. You're Filipinos. But like, maybe just your mindset and how things are,
(04:17):
how you view things are different. Did you like school when you went to school or you're going
up? Was that a thing you enjoyed in that really? I did enjoy school. Yeah, I really did. Even though
like there was a language barrier, but you know, I learned, I learned English pretty well. I picked it
up very fast. And yeah, school was good. I enjoyed it. I was making good grades. So it wasn't a thing,
(04:43):
but I think it was just like me trying to fit in socially. Yeah. That was the hardest part. Yeah,
bro. I compared to now how kids grow up and you know, how helpful for the new agents, you know,
coming over here like they're not going through that as much anymore. So it's not as bad as it was
back then. Yeah, man. I was stuck in ESL class when I came here from the Philippines at age 7. But
(05:08):
when the Philippines, English is our second language. So I knew pretty much a lot. Right. Right.
Were you taught it was was was English taught in Vietnam? No, no. At that time, no, when I was growing up,
like it was taught, but you have to be in the rich family to like actually, you know, go to school for
(05:31):
that, you know, but I mean, it wasn't it wasn't necessary. So no, I grew up here. I came over here
pretty much blank man like like an empty canvas, you know. Yeah. I think for us because we were
under like the rule of America for so long that we were so westernized, but Vietnam, you know,
(05:53):
it stayed pretty much Vietnam. I mean, there's some like westernization, but you know,
from where I got it, America didn't they didn't win. They didn't conquer the country. So I don't
think it was really in for us for the Philippines like English is second nature because, you know, under
the rule, but like what what what what subjects did you like? Did you like all of it or just some of it?
(06:19):
History, map, fine. I love all those. Yeah. That was never good. That was okay. Yeah. It was history.
It was just interesting to learn the history of America and everything. Yeah.
Definitely. It was interesting too. I didn't learn my, I was really young in the Philippines,
(06:40):
I didn't learn much about history of the Philippines, but I don't know too much. So when you're like
an early teen in high school, like was it easier for you to fit in at that time?
Yeah, I was easier to fit in to go to my band, you know, I have my own sort of friends and you
have to own click of circles. Right. And it wasn't bad as how it was going up when you were like
(07:04):
elementary school or not. We're doing your high. Yeah. But I school was a lot better in a way,
but also was like one of my hardest trying times as well. Right. Right. Were there any like powers
you enjoyed? Like any support you'd play basketball or anything or anything like that? Yeah. I was
(07:24):
big on basketball, elementary, junior high, I was in basketball team, but when I got to high school,
I didn't really play basketball from the school in the way, but I did play a little bit here and there.
Yeah. Yeah, dude. I mean, I, I, I really pick up sports much. I mean, I did like in middle school.
(07:44):
I wasn't good enough in high school to make the team for basketball. So,
so you said it was like trying times for you. Was it like, I guess the teenagers, it's like the rebellious
phase, right? You trying to fear who you are and whatnot. What was like, give us like a picture of
like what your, it was like high school for you, man. Was it like kind of tough and a sense of like
(08:07):
just the people you're not with? High school was tough because my generation grown up during high
school. It wasn't all about studying. It was more about like, I don't know, gang banging. Right.
Right. So, I was going that era like during the 90s, it was all about gangs. Like, no matter where
(08:29):
you go, you're going to see the biggest formation of gangs in every school lined up. So, everywhere you
go, it's gangs, gangs, gangs, gangs. So, you can't get away from it. Mm. And you're...
for my own community either. But, I mean, if you were able to get away from it, you would have
liked the really most fortunate ones. Yeah, you know what, man, it's interesting. My, my
(08:51):
uncles have a very similar story in that sense where they came to America. Now, I want to say like
during 12 and 13, like the early high school years, so they really took them to adjust. But they were
living in Panorama City. And at that time, a lot of gangs too. You know, they joined Filipino gangs.
They don't work out, you know, but I think they did add a necessity. I don't know if they really wanted
(09:16):
to, but at the time, I think from where I gather, like, you know, the, the teenos were like kind of
like just harassing Filipinos. You know, anyone without my teacher, right? So, they figured, you know,
we got to like click up, we guys protect ourselves. You know, so they joined the Filipino gang.
That's pretty much how most 90s gangs was pretty much formed, especially for us. Like, it wasn't
(09:39):
because we were just trying to form a gang to get into trouble. We were just forming a gang to
defend ourselves from, from, you know, other races that was, you know, given us problems and
bullying us at school. And most of us were, you know, like I said, we all come from innocent
background. So it's not like we just, you know, had a thought of like, oh, yeah, I want to be a gang
(10:03):
gang. Anything. No, it's not about that. It's just, you know, we're looking out for each other. We're
helping each other out. So, you know, it's just like a bunch of school buddies walking together. We
watch either each other's back on the school and make sure nobody pick on us. Nobody, you know,
mess with us. So it started out like that, you know? Right. And eventually, of course, it evolved,
(10:25):
you know, mentality got stronger. We are, those got stronger, you know, mind, body, physical. Right.
It just like I said, the whole game just evolved. And now you have two bigger stuff. Yeah.
I don't want to play a gang out there, whatever. But, you know, I'm assuming you were doing that.
(10:46):
And it led to just escalating, I guess, and things that were maybe a
illegal, violent and whatnot. From what I gather, I mean, you were doing the street stuff.
You know, I was hanging out at Lisa, highly sick. You're listening. You know, she told me,
"Vayley, what happened?" Like, you know, you're maybe living in the same area than one day you got locked up.
Like, how old were you when that happened? I was 20 when that happened. Yeah. So I was 20 when I got
(11:19):
locked up. And, you know, it changed my life, obviously. Right. I was a poster of events. But,
you know, I just had one year old daughter that I left behind. And, you know, just about like losing her,
not seeing her, not seeing her grow up. It really hurt, you know. I understand the blood. I mean, I can't even
(11:42):
really like, how about that was. I mean, shit, dude, like, what was going through your head the time? I mean,
you know, you did this thing and they gave you 20 years. Or like, what was it? 20 years, right? The
game you took was a game. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. What was going through your head at that time? Life was
without possibility or all. Holy shit. You know, that that that was an eye-opener. But, you know, like I
(12:06):
said, I just prayed a God and I just said, you know what? Whatever I've done, let me do my time.
And, you know, I just pray to God that it's not going to be life. And that's it. You know, you have
a thing and then I'm easily say, do I fuck you? So you play, you play, right? Right. Right. So in a way,
that comes to acceptance of it. It's actually like karma, right? I think. Oh, well, yeah, you can say that,
(12:31):
you know, whatever it is. Right. Right. It happened and happened. You know, yeah. It was just one of those
things that it just happened, man. You know, right. I've got come to accept it. You took responsibility,
took responsibility of it and whatever the outcome. Okay. You have no choice. You know, I think it's
one of my, I don't want this choice. I want another choice. Right. Right. Man. So, like the first five
(12:58):
years, I mean, was it like tough for you to adjust to the culture inside? Yeah. I mean, the first five
years, I mean, I spent what four years in county jail, not in my case. And it was, well, you know, if
you've never been in a county jail fighting a case, what really long to most, but just being in the
(13:21):
county jail long, it's a mental game. Right. And you got to have the strong mentality to be in there
and know exactly what you're doing. And, you know, sadly, most people come in and they're not
prepared for it. And their mind is not strong enough to, to, to will it. And
unfortunately, they do break, you know, right. And, um, and the thing like, you're going to court,
(13:49):
the DA, the judge, the whole system, they're going to play this mind game. They're going to prolong
your court cases to see how long you can last. This is the tactic, you know, they play this game
to where you can't stand to being an inside county jail no more that you would actually change your
plea. Oh, wow. Yeah. Yeah. I was there for number one tactic to hold you in there for as long as they can
(14:15):
to prolong, prolong, prolong until you say, you know what, just give me whatever I'll take it,
just get me out of here. So that, that was the thing. And, you know, majority of time, like I say,
your mind's not ready for that. You will hold. And most people do take guilty, please just to get out
of the county jail. And, you know, that ultimately you're not going to get the best you're looking for,
(14:38):
obviously. Yeah. Were you in LA County or were you in a different, were you in OC? I was in OC.
Okay. Okay. Um, I've been at county before and I don't know how it is in OC. I know they kind of
segregate you. So if you're Asian, you're the other with black people, the black, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
They still do that. Obviously, only in California, they segregate you on. So basically, you know,
(15:03):
Asians, they love with Asian, whites with white, blacks with black, you know, so yeah. And in LA
county is whites and Mexicans, they stay on one side. Right. Right. And then that's not the,
yes, interesting. I know how that was in OC County. Um, so the first four years you were there,
(15:25):
but then you went to prison? Yeah. So basically, I got the guilty sentence and, um,
went to prison, got sentenced to 20 years. Um, you know, I did most of my time,
started off of Pelican Bay, level four. Okay. And you know, after a few years, my point dropped,
(15:49):
went to a level three, started went to Pleasant Valley. And then that's, at that time, you know,
there was a lot of like, um, issues with the prison and how it was being handled. Right. Especially
with the governor at the time and everything. And there was an overcrowding with prisons.
(16:11):
Our knowled was governor at the time. And, you know, he even knew he helped him with anything. And
with that new, free strike law that I was out in the back way back there. New old bishop today.
No white. He was going, huh? Wow. So the old, the main reason for the free strike law, like,
nobody was going to go home with you. If you had free strikes on new, even if it was like a non-violence,
(16:36):
soul like a piece of bread, some type of goods and a store, which is like, you know, non-fellowny,
but because of the free strike, they will lock you people for life. Right. Damn. So you had a lot of
people who was coming in for petty, petty case, petty crimes, and they were getting life. Damn,
(16:59):
dude. We're getting life. So as you can tell, like, you just do the math, you know, you have 100,000
people that come into prison every year. And only let's say one third of them actually get to parole.
Right. So there's, there doesn't leave that much room for the newcomers to come in and take up that space.
(17:26):
Right. So they were taking taxpayers' money, building up, you know, triple racks, they call it e-beds,
and they turned the gym where we, you know, play basketball and have racks. So they closed that
down. They built, you know, double bunks. They filled that up as well. And it was crazy, man. It was
(17:48):
just like a, it was like modern day slavery, you know? Yeah. Just living in a ship full of
guys was just sweeping in the day room. It was like, "Can't it's our Dean?" "No, yeah." So, you know,
human rights came in because, you know, the inmates, we had some good prison lawyers and all that.
They were filing for lawsuits against the prison, the governor themselves, and everything because,
(18:14):
you know, human rights. He was locking us up, putting too many people in prison, and we're not
games, health benefits. We're not getting any, pretty much sanitary. There's not enough
restaurants, there's not enough time to shower, you know? So people was going through a couple days
(18:35):
mission shower because they can get to it. And it was pretty bad, man. So what happened after that?
Did they overturn that? Did they, you know, we won, and of course they had to come up with something
but I mean it literally took them 10 years to like trying to fix everything. So they sent
(18:57):
multiple states. So they had private contracts with private prisons.
With that private prison contract, they had to shoot everybody out of state from Mississippi,
Oklahoma, Arizona, and even with that, the funds just going to go dry, you know?
(19:20):
Right. Because, you know, like I said, in a day, that's all taxpayers' money, and you do not
want to know how months they spent on all that. And it wasn't like a quick fix, of course,
that was just like a band-aid. Right. You know, and so they start coming out with new laws,
and making new changes. You know, the governor don't want us to leave. Prison board don't want us
(19:41):
to leave because, in a day, why? That's all money in the pockets. They might tell you, yeah, we're
spending a lot of money, you know, housing these inmates, but they're not telling you for every
admit we're housing, we get about, you know, $10,000, $20,000 per inmates in a pocket.
I don't know that that's crazy. Yeah. So they're making money. You know? It's like a capital
(20:04):
ance, like I said, you know? You might buy the cattle's in for a certain amount of fee,
but yet when you sell them back out, you get more profit. So basically that's what they're
getting, making out of us. That's crazy, man. Yeah.
Prison, the prison pays for itself, you know, the inmates take care of the prison, maintain,
cook, clean, fix. Right. So really, they don't have to hire nobody. And
(20:29):
what can they do with their author making money? Yeah, man. So you stayed in California,
your poll set your toll time? Yeah. After the time, they moved me out to Arizona, of course,
into Mississippi. Okay. And then, you know, when the whole private prison was closing down because
(20:52):
lack of funding, they started losing a lot of money. So they brought majority of dollars just
back until they closed up all the whole private prison. Right. So like, let's say like year,
I've touched your 10 years, like halfway through you, you're getting a lot of people doing your
(21:14):
thing. Like, what was it going through your mind? It wasn't in like 10 years into your sentence.
10 years into my 10 years. I'm just looking back like, you know, I'm losing all these years.
I'm gonna lose some more years ahead of me. But I mean, as far as like, adjustment, I'm fully adjusted.
I'm doing the same routine every day, just taking care of myself, trying to bear myself mentally.
(21:40):
And most of all, like, you know, when you go to sleep, but no, you reflect on life decision, you know,
what is and what could have been done. But like I said, you know, for stun and stun, you just go
with it now. Yeah. You don't really look back too much about it because
and like there's no rewind button. So, you know, we don't really look back too much about that. We just
(22:05):
go on where our lives now. Like we always do. Right. Something you mentioned was your routine. What's
your routine like? I know inside of like a very strict time, you gotta wake up a certain time. What
now? What was your routine like? My routine was pretty strict. It was on time. I'll wake up like around
(22:25):
5 or 6 in the morning. I'll make my, you know, routine check up on my people, my boys. I'll check
up on them, make sure everybody's okay. I'll make my coffee, get ready to go to the child, come back,
start cleaning up my area. And after that, get ready for your work out, come back in. If I do have
(22:52):
education like college courses and everything, which I try to keep busy, I go do that. Or if I have a job,
like I'll just work in a kitchen. So whatever my day is with the prison, I'll have that day. I'll
have that time for it, you know. And then if I have time for myself, I'll sit back. I'll just
hang out, write a couple of letters to the family or try to have a phone call. And you know,
(23:17):
most of the time we just do a lot of cooking, eating, and whatever we can't just pass by the day,
you know. Right. How was your family handling all this during, you know, throughout your sentence?
Man, I'm grateful for them and I'm glad that, you know, I thank God every day for giving
the strength to continue on and holding on. It was hard for them, man, you know. Yeah.
(23:45):
I never been locked up close to home. I live in OC, but you know, like all the places I've been locked up
was either like borderline to a next state or to the next state, you know. So their drive was pretty
much like from from my first prison in Pelican Bay, it was like a what? 13, 14 hour drive. Yeah.
(24:13):
And you know, my, my dad was like taking a initiative and, you know, just trying to see me every six months.
And you know, it's hard, man. Yeah. Yeah. You know, he packed up the whole family, he dropped for 13, 14
hours all the way up to Pelican Bay and they only get to see you for a few hours. Right. And then he
(24:35):
dropped back home. Yeah, man. What was it? Yeah, dude. Is it, was it, um, was it through the glass? It
let you have like some some time to like, well, you have contact visit. Basically you sit in the big room.
Each and me have to own table with the family. That's good. And the guest to pack, then you
probably get like maybe an hour and a half. But you know, if it's on a good day, you get like maybe three,
(24:59):
four hours. And that's it, you know, that's it. Oh, you're just happy to see them.
Yeah. I'm happy to see them. Okay. Right. So like, within the 15 years, man, what, what's going on
through your head? I mean, like, you have what you've done most of your sentences. 15 years out of 20.
What was going through your mind, man? Almost to the home run. Yeah. Almost to a home run.
(25:28):
So yeah, I mean, I was looking forward to that. I was preparing myself.
Pretty much just prepping myself to be ready to when I get home. Like I told myself, like, I don't
want to be one of those guys that just go home and and and and sit around and wonder what I'm going to do.
I want to have a game plan to ready. Right. And see what I will do. Like I made a plan. I made plan A,
(25:55):
plan B, plan C. Make sure I go through all that one fill. I have the next backup. Right. Right. And
tell me one. I can't go enjoy COVID lockdown. That was the crazy. Right. That's right.
Right. I remember I see your picture. You first got all your shit, man. That's crazy.
It was trippy like hardly any cars in the street. And you know, people playing fast. It was really
(26:20):
different, man. It's really different. I wasn't used to it, but I was always bracing myself for it.
Nobody knew this COVID thing was real and all right. Right. It was just crazy. But I think my first trip
was to Walmart just to get some clothes. Right. And I was just tripping off off of everything.
(26:45):
Like the colors, you know, the noise, the people. So it took me a few weeks to get adjusted to.
Maybe a market. I can imagine, dude. I mean, you went from just like, you know, a solitary, not
solitary, but you locked up. You don't see a lot of people. You see the same people. But then you
are out in society. Yeah. You see things in prison like black and gray. Yeah. It was just gray color.
(27:10):
That's not the trees. No grass. Stuff like that. It's just concrete dirt. Yeah. And you know,
that's it. What was your guy? What was your first meal out, man? What did you want? What did you get?
Man, I was far from from the city. So we were outskirts of some towns. So the closest thing we could
(27:33):
get was, uh, what was that panic spread? Panic spread, bro. Hey, no, man. I'm not gonna lie. It was
the best thing ever. It's the closest thing to Chinese food. Yeah. Yeah, man. Did you get the
orange chicken and beef broccoli? I sure did. Yo, I used to get panics. I was like, I'll fire, but
hell yeah, man. Oh, man. Shit, I must have tasted awesome. But what kind of drink did you get, bro?
(28:00):
Oh, I got me a beer. Yeah, beer. They have beer in the panic stress. No, we want your liquor.
I got beer. What would you get? What'd you get, bro? Oh, I got me a colinac.
Nice. Did it taste as good as it did before? It tastes even better. Nice, bro.
Damn, that's awesome, man. Fuck, I'm just when I finally got locked out when you got out,
(28:25):
that's so awesome, bro. Like, I know, you know, it was very trying times and you made it out, man. Like,
shit, dude. Like, well, go back a little bit. Like, when you were locked up, like, did you enjoy cooking?
I know we had a, I told you about spread. I don't want to, I don't fucking spread. What'd you eat, dude?
I cooked a lot in there. I did everything. Pretty much I just make up my own meals, you know. I don't really
(28:49):
go to the chowell anymore. Yeah. The prison food sucks. They're just feeding you none but picks
lots, you know, potatoes, our type of potatoes and the fucking mac and cheese. And, you know, that's,
that's not the human being can be eating and that's fucking, you got no fucking joy. But, you know,
we do have pork feet. We do have packages from vendors that you can buy and we're pretty blessed that
(29:16):
they actually do cater to like Asians as well and Hispanic and all that. Yeah. So, you know, we do
have like Mexican seasonings and Mexican meats. Right. And of course, we have like Chinese hot
and stuff like so that's a holy, holy, holy food style. Yeah, man. So, all that is combined, like, you can
(29:38):
get to do you on a, but yeah, you know, cooking was one thing that like just kind of like
put your mind at ease. So, that was something that I do on the daily. Right, right.
Are you got jag, bro? I saw a picture of you fucking, "Ret, bro, are you, when you going in or not?"
Now, I was just kidding, low guy, man. I was just kidding.
I fucking, I saw a picture of you in a gym. I'm like, damn, full. Like, how many burpees did you do a day,
(30:02):
bro? Good old days. I probably do like a thousand. Damn. But nowadays, you know, working everything,
life catching up, age catching up. No, you still look, bro, you still look like you're in your like
early 30s and like 20s, bro. I try, I try. Crazy dude. Like, did you read any books like you're in there?
(30:27):
Like anything that stuck out to you, I'm sure you read a lot. I read a lot of books. So, you know,
the first thing stuck out to me was like, I think beginning of my time, you know, with dad,
for dad, how I invest your money, how to make money. You know, everybody's going to talk about
like art of war and art of stuff. But to me, it's like, you can read about it, but you're not kind of
(30:49):
put that into actions and then focus pretty much for a few. Yeah. So, you know, let's just face it,
how often are you going to use that book, use it at the book or apply it to life, you know. Yeah.
For me, I just read more of like self-help books, more like "team your mindset, how to change your
(31:11):
personality in a way to where it's just like, you don't let people trigger you as much." So,
spoke like that. My dad used to send me in meditation books because he knows like I have anger issues. So,
those books do actually help. Yeah. So, I try to apply that daily, with everything I do, you know.
(31:34):
In prison, it's a multi-part, obviously, you know, you get a whole bunch of everybody. Yeah.
They will test you, they will try you, they will get under your skin very bad and it's just like I said,
how you deal with it, you know. And being in prison, like once you act out, you're not acting out by
(31:57):
yourself, once you act out, that we flex back on the whole race. Right. Right. Right. On the whole card,
you know, each race you car, car. So, basically, whatever I do is going to reflect back on me and my
people. Same thing goes for them. Right. So, you gotta be more considerate and really pick your
(32:18):
battles. If it's worth it, okay, we're all gonna do this together. Right. Nobody really want to fight for
themselves or buy themselves, you know. Right. Right. It says in prison, even though you want to fight,
buy yourself, other people won't, won't abide by that, you know. Right. Right. So, that's the one thing
you have to be real careful about. So, things like that, it teaches you how to pick your battles and,
(32:43):
you know, just to like weave through all the bullshitters and, okay, which one you want to take
more seriously. Right. Right. Do you have any advice or suggestions for people like going through a,
you know, similar case or just that kind of street stuff, man. Like what, you know, you did a lot,
you know, you grew up a lot and then reflecting back, like, I said,
(33:04):
far as like the street stuff, I can say, you know, it's not about where you're from or, or anything.
Tattoo don't make you a man, bang, bang, will make you a man. It's how you act appropriately to things.
You can be a thug, but, you know, get your shit right, get your money right, get your life right.
(33:24):
You don't gotta be a dumb guy after fucking street, you know, rocking and talking all
to because best matter was all about, it's all about accidents. Right. Well, you know, you have a
catch yourself in a situation when you're getting locked up or, you know, just like accordingly, don't,
don't, you know, don't act too much of on how you were in the street because you could be a
(33:48):
fucking, you know, five star general old G in the street, you come in prison, you know, body. Right.
Right. No, you're nobody. You're eating the same slop there eating, sharing the same damn toilet.
Right. You're gonna wash your back every time you're taking a piss or shit or showers or, you know,
yeah. Yeah, man. Sad is going to be shit no more. Money don't be shit either. If you fucking go on
(34:12):
lockdown and you can't use that money to buy your soul food, you're in the same as the rest of us.
No, so, right. That's why a lot of people come in and say, like, yeah, I'm just down the street.
I don't think that's yours. You know, but, man. Right. Yeah, man. Oh, yeah, like, you see him like,
you've done a lot of growing, man. Like looking back when, you know, when you're 20 to now, like, what,
(34:35):
do you feel like change? Like, what did you learn when you're inside? You know,
I mean, oh, yeah, that's when, um, prison change a lot, but like, is that the prison don't help you change?
The prison helped you grow because they put you in certain scenarios and situation. So you're locked
up with a bunch of killer thieves and rapists. You know, and you got to decide like,
(35:02):
which way to maneuver. And of course, obviously, you're not going to fuck with everybody.
Right. You want to put the right person you're going to hang out with. Even your own people, you know.
And, you know, you got the drugies, you got the, you got the gamblers, you got the fun.
(35:23):
No whole bunch of weird people in there. Right. Right. Right. But throughout all that, I mean, there are some good people in there that you can pick in
home all those, you know. Right. But, um, the prison is not going to help you change. They just help you grow. Right. But another day, how you want to grow, that depends on you. There's, there's no open book about, you know, what you should do in
(35:52):
certain scenario, that's, that's your decision. Mm hmm. Within that decision, you know, there's always going to be causing effect. You make that decision.
Then there's going to be an effect on that, you know. Right. Right. Right. Now you being a man like, you just make that right decision. Right.
Yo, but you make that decision and then and then you go from there. And like I said, you know, me. I spend time with good people. I surround myself with good people.
(36:22):
And then those people, they help you grow as well. You know, so how you affect them, they affect you. Right. That's is it. Like you hang around with the dope heads. What I mean, what they do, you're going to do. Right. Right.
So that's basically it. Um, shit, man. So when you, when you got out COVID, man, like, um, it was different. Like, um, what, like, what else are you doing?
(36:50):
Like, I mean, um, what did you try other foods instead that you haven't tried before? We got out. Well, when I came out, all the restaurant were closed. Right.
Yes, I forgot. Uh, they take out everything. Um, I didn't get to try as much food as I wanted to. I mean, I did go get myself like, you know, some fun to go.
(37:11):
Whatever Asian food, the Asian restaurant that was open, um, but pretty much it was off the go. But I was, you know, for more focus on like, just trying to find what the family. Right.
And then I was focusing on like, let's just say trying to get a job. Right. So obviously no place was hiring at that time. So the only thing I thought of was, you know what? I got myself a car.
(37:40):
Trying to put gas and then I just got a door dash job, man. Nice man. How I was door dash.
It was, I was doing it with good during COVID, man. I made, I made money, you know, I made money. And, um, that's one thing I was happy about. Like, I was just going out there, doing my thing. I pushed like, maybe five, six hours a day.
(38:03):
And, you know, I was making like, what, maybe five, six hundred a week. I mean, yeah, what's going on? But I mean, it was, you know, it's income. Right, bro. Um, well, that's awesome. Do I mean, no, a lot of people are doing door dash back then.
So you can all family. When you came home, like, your daughter is like what she was like 15, 16, like, earlier, it's like a teenage years, man. I mean, how was that kind of reconnecting with her stuff? She saw you, you're out.
(38:31):
Oh, um, being in there, I don't get to talk to this much. Right. I do on, I say, hi, to her and try to communicate with her. But, you know, being a kid, like, they don't know you too well. Right. They might know who you are, but they don't know you because you don't really, you're not there. You know, you're not there physically. You don't have the physical connection with them. Mm hmm. And for a kid is, it's hard. Yeah.
(39:01):
And with her growing up, um, without me in her life, you know, like, basically, I'm a total stranger. You know, she knows who I am, but she don't know me. That's a person. You know, me as dad, but, you know, um,
I knew while I was getting myself into I knew it was going to be like a big hill for me to to cross over on that. But like I said, that's my daughter and I'm going to do everything I can to reconnect with her. And which I do. Right.
(39:33):
Good. Good.
So today, like, we're very connected. We're good. You know, I would make time for her. I was like, hey, let's go somewhere.
That's my thing. That's my thing with her. Like I look up on Google find new place to go with you. Yeah. Um,
Well, besting right. I'm going to go to face. Right. So I interact with her. I'm I'm sure that she's a part of my life wherever, wherever I am, whatever I'm doing, I'm sure I make that.
(40:02):
Good, man. That's respected. Yeah. That's awesome. Man. Um, shit. Uh, yeah, a lot of time to catch up on movies, man. Like, what were you watching?
Like anything that stuck out to you that you watched when you got out. I was a movie club. I mean, I had a phone and prison too.
Oh, okay. Okay. I just got you up on on everything. Not now. Just watching over to series. You know, like all the game down.
(40:28):
Run.
Okay. Okay. I mean, can we say that? I don't want to. I don't. Yeah. I mean, we can say that. I don't want to. I mean, I added that out. If you want, I don't want to, you know,
get your butt and trauma for anything. But, uh, okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Now, okay. More transparency. Like you were wrong. Same face with group. I didn't know you were in jail. Someone told me that. Like,
(40:52):
Linda's like, yeah, fool. I was in jail. I'm like, what the fuck, bro? How is he? Why do you fucking get that shit, dude? Uh, he told me like she can tell about yourself. He always said the white background and everything. Oh,
that makes sense. Exactly. So I lived up. But yeah, it was funny, bro. Like, yeah, you know, you know, my guy falls in jail. I mean, prison. I'm like, what the fuck? How do you?
(41:16):
I mean, I don't even guess, bro. You know, but, uh, crazy dude. Uh, I mean, this is the thing nowadays where they make the phone and prison. You know,
I mean, yeah, I didn't have my share of it. He also got that kept me company as well. That was one thing that kept me like, uh,
(41:37):
connected to, to, to society to the three, you know, right, right. And, you know, that was my, my gateway to reaching out to my family and keeping in touch with them as well. So that was my main thing.
But, you know, like social media, it helped me pass the time. Yeah. I'm like, you know, you just want to know what's going on around your city.
(41:57):
I know what's new. What's popping. Right. Right. Oh, music movies. Nice stuff like that. So I mean, like I said, when I got home, like I also prepared for all that because I already knew what's going on out there. Right. Right.
Won't just ease myself in with the society with the people and get used to places that that that was a, a, a, a, a powerful, you know, definitely, definitely. Yeah.
(42:21):
Shit, man. It's awesome, bro. I mean, um, yeah, I'll link the video, but you made a pretty cool cooking tutorial. Dude, that's pretty good, man.
Is that what you eat? That's awesome. And I feel like good, bro.
Yeah. Thank you. I appreciate. Um, you know, my cousin was pushing me towards that because he was like, you know, people would like to know what you do in prison. Yeah, dude, especially when it comes to cooking, like how did you stay up with, with, you know, the food because obviously the food in their sucks.
(42:53):
What did you do to, you know, to make your meals in there and let's say if you want to make some food, you want some past Thai or whatever it is.
Like how did you get through all that?
Well, you know, it took a while for me to push me to do it, but I'm glad he did.
Yeah, man. Um, if that's the same cousin, I think you're talking about it's pretty cool, bro. He's a funny guy. I think, you know, yeah, yeah.
(43:20):
Yeah, funny guy. Um, cool. Yeah. Funny guy. I'll say that. But oh shit, dude. Um, and, bro, it's awesome. Bro, I mean, yo, thank you for taking your time out. Man, it's a really cool conversation. Bro, I mean, I'm so glad that
you're out, man. Like when I find it online, I was so happy due because like, fuck, dude, 20 years, man. Um, seeing like overall, you had a really high spirit, just really positive.
(43:45):
Cause I know that, you know, that's, that's tough, man. I mean, doing all that shit in just 20 years, bro, that's a long time. You know, and I'm glad that you were, you're able to just like have a strong will, strong mind to, to get out of it, doing it.
And, and, and, and, and just like surpassed that, that obstacle in your life. Um, yeah, what are you up to these days, man? I mean, you're just like, hey, now get a job. Normal day stuff.
(44:10):
Yeah. I mean, I, I got a job at the mall work place that, you know, I've been planning to go back there every since I was in prison. So,
I finally got the job I wanted and, you know, from there on, you just educate yourself and just move on up, you know, I don't want to stay at the same place all this.
(44:30):
But, you know, I think we make it in me and you get a place to work with good places to start off. And, and they like, I did what I want to do. I accomplished that, you know,
good. So, and they just, you find ways to elevate yourself. Right. Right. Man. Um, shit, bro.
Where can we find your social media? I mean, do you do social media?
(44:52):
Uh, yeah, I do. Um,
the YouTube, the YouTube channel though. Like, was it what would I look up? It is Cali dot OG Mike. Okay.
Yeah. Okay. Cool, bro. Hey, well, you know, thank you for having this conversation. Um, glad, you know, you're cool with it.
(45:14):
Cause I always wondered like, damn, before I don't want to ask you online, but it's cool to hear your story, man. Um, inspiring, bro. I mean, like, you went through a lot and you came out as a better person.
And, uh, yeah, man, you're family, y'all and everything good. Dude, that's good, man.
Yeah. Thank you. I appreciate that. No problem.
Coming home like for guys that's in there, you still have a day to go home, look forward to that. Make plans going from plan long minutes.
(45:43):
Yeah, I like that.
And you're, you're going to say you're so a little failure, you know, just have some hope, got some dream.
I know sometimes like people have like 15, 20 years left and they're like, man, what am I going to do? Yeah, I mean, just have a plan, even though like you have 10 years, 15 years left, you know, still have a plan in your, in your mind, because your days are not over yet.
(46:07):
Right. Right.
A lot of older guys tell me to like, you know, it's not over until it's over. So have a plan and continue with that because that is going to help you by far more than anything else in your life, because you have something to to look forward to, you know, right.
(46:27):
And if you don't have anything to look forward to, then all your days in there, you're going to be miserable. You're going to be lost. You're going to be stressed out.
So I always have a plan and that that was my thing. My plan was, you know, go home, do this, do that.
And it kept me saying, well, I can't go home like, yeah, go home like I went through everything that I planned. I went to plan a plan B plan. See, I followed all that.
(46:53):
So those are things just have a plan. Right. Don't give life and, you know, I always have to outreach to where you could find somebody in community, your family to help you out if you have something like that to fall to.
Right. Right. Man, what was it like when you got a parole, bro, when you were you out of that shit?
Mm. It was so real.
(47:17):
People used to say like the air smells differently. Yeah, no, spread on the other side. And I was like, yeah, it does.
Yeah, it's good, man. That's awesome.
Yeah.
The favorite color change, you know, you're not no longer seeing things black and gray. Don't know what it's like. She colored. Yeah.
And just after man like it's like a big, gloomy, gray cloud lifted off of me, you know, all the weight off my shoulder just lifted as well.
(47:47):
It felt good. Yeah. It was surreal. I thought I was dreaming. I took me a few days just to like get real comfortable with things. Yeah. Yeah.
Even like being around my parents, I was happy to share, but like,
I couldn't, I couldn't, I couldn't, um, I couldn't really show it, you know? Yeah. Yeah.
So it was a little bit, it was a little bit different, but I mean, I loved it though. It was surreal. It was like I'm free walking.
(48:14):
Hey, but it's real, bro, you know, see walking. It's not a dream. You live in it, bro. So again, thank you. Thank you, man. I'm just so proud, bro. You were, you done.
It's awesome. It's inspiring. It's like, fuck, man. That's awesome. You did your old bed and just kept staying like a genius, grew as an individual as a man. That's that's a very, um,
really hard to say. It's, uh, admirable, bro, because it could have gone so many other ways, but you held it down, man.
(48:43):
Yeah. Thank you. I appreciate it. No problem, bro. You have a good one, man. Take care.
You too. Oh, oh, next time next time in the area, man, we'll get some, we'll get some Vietnamese coffee, bro.
I'm down, man. I'll take you. All right. There's a place. I think I'm happy. I heard, I heard, cafe, a Lou has really good coffee.
Oh, yeah. The coffee that is born, man. All right, bro. Take care, man.
(49:03):
I let her go. Take care. All right, later. Hi, peace.
[BLANK_AUDIO]
Hey there! My name is Vaughn and this is the Vaughncast Show. This is a podcast that focuses on
(00:08):
mental health, breaking societal stigmas, harm reduction, addiction and recovery. If you like what
you hear, subscribe and leave a review on Spotify and Apple Podcasts. Also, follow the podcast
Instagram @thevoncastshow where I post video content from the show. All right, let's get into
(00:33):
today's episode. Welcome to the Vaughncast show. Cheg, I'm Michael with me. I met you like just
online stuff. Man, I heard about your story. You know, from what I gather, you know, you definitely
had a life to change the experience when you were doing, man. Those don't know. Michael has been
(00:54):
what you were locked up for like almost 20 years? Yeah, almost 20 years. You know, the goal of this
is just to really not really highlight what you did, but just how you changed the person as a man,
kind of thing, man. So thank you for taking your time out to do this, bro. Yeah, thank you for
(01:16):
having me on your show, man. I appreciate it. No problem, man. So, yeah, let's get into it, dude.
All that stuff, you know, was going in the beginning, dude. Where did you go up?
So basically, I'm from Vietnam, Saigon. I came over here when I was eight years old. Okay.
(01:37):
When I started off in Texas, Houston and living in my grandma. Those are 14 years.
And, you know, from there, we moved to California, LA, and I lived there for a few years as well, until
we moved to Orange County. And so since Orange County, I've been here ever since, you know, my whole life.
(02:02):
Nice. Was it was it tough for you when you, you know, went to Vietnam to California and stuff?
Was it kind of tough to meet new friends or adjust to the culture of everything?
Yeah, the culture shock. It was, it took a lot of adjustment. I need to get used to everything.
(02:22):
The thing that was even harder for me was getting the same reciprocation from your own people as well.
And I find that interesting because, you know, coming over here, I thought, you know, all Vietnamese,
all Asian, we all together, you know, that wasn't the case, man. Oh, really? Yeah.
(02:45):
You know, you got the American Asians and they look down on you, they're like, oh, you know,
it's just a five, whatever. So basically they're not taking you anywhere, they're not accepting you.
I always find that weird, like, man, you know, you speak the same language.
You know, we got same last names. Well, the meaver, like, was going on.
(03:06):
Yeah, it's different. It's different, bro. I get you.
It took a lot of adjustment because, you know, coming over here, like, you know,
I get racism from the whites. I get racers from from the Hispanics. And then last but not
least, what hurt the muscles, you know, like, that being outcasted by your own people at times, you know?
(03:30):
So like when you go to school, you see like all the fobs sitting around the top tables and you
got the Asian American kids sitting around, you know, their table. And it wasn't because of like a
language barrier because you know, they speak Vietnamese, they choose not to, but in a way, like I said,
they just kind of like outcasted you. Yeah. Yeah. It's different. I mean, it's the same thing
(03:55):
like in Filipino. It's like the first generation and like the 1.5 generation is like the people that
came here and they're like, yeah, they call it, you know, Filipino. Oh, you're fine. You know, you
can tell the accent and everything. But yeah, it's weird how there's a disconnect between that
because you're in there. You're Filipinos. But like, maybe just your mindset and how things are,
(04:17):
how you view things are different. Did you like school when you went to school or you're going
up? Was that a thing you enjoyed in that really? I did enjoy school. Yeah, I really did. Even though
like there was a language barrier, but you know, I learned, I learned English pretty well. I picked it
up very fast. And yeah, school was good. I enjoyed it. I was making good grades. So it wasn't a thing,
(04:43):
but I think it was just like me trying to fit in socially. Yeah. That was the hardest part. Yeah,
bro. I compared to now how kids grow up and you know, how helpful for the new agents, you know,
coming over here like they're not going through that as much anymore. So it's not as bad as it was
back then. Yeah, man. I was stuck in ESL class when I came here from the Philippines at age 7. But
(05:08):
when the Philippines, English is our second language. So I knew pretty much a lot. Right. Right.
Were you taught it was was was English taught in Vietnam? No, no. At that time, no, when I was growing up,
like it was taught, but you have to be in the rich family to like actually, you know, go to school for
(05:31):
that, you know, but I mean, it wasn't it wasn't necessary. So no, I grew up here. I came over here
pretty much blank man like like an empty canvas, you know. Yeah. I think for us because we were
under like the rule of America for so long that we were so westernized, but Vietnam, you know,
(05:53):
it stayed pretty much Vietnam. I mean, there's some like westernization, but you know,
from where I got it, America didn't they didn't win. They didn't conquer the country. So I don't
think it was really in for us for the Philippines like English is second nature because, you know, under
the rule, but like what what what what subjects did you like? Did you like all of it or just some of it?
(06:19):
History, map, fine. I love all those. Yeah. That was never good. That was okay. Yeah. It was history.
It was just interesting to learn the history of America and everything. Yeah.
Definitely. It was interesting too. I didn't learn my, I was really young in the Philippines,
(06:40):
I didn't learn much about history of the Philippines, but I don't know too much. So when you're like
an early teen in high school, like was it easier for you to fit in at that time?
Yeah, I was easier to fit in to go to my band, you know, I have my own sort of friends and you
have to own click of circles. Right. And it wasn't bad as how it was going up when you were like
(07:04):
elementary school or not. We're doing your high. Yeah. But I school was a lot better in a way,
but also was like one of my hardest trying times as well. Right. Right. Were there any like powers
you enjoyed? Like any support you'd play basketball or anything or anything like that? Yeah. I was
(07:24):
big on basketball, elementary, junior high, I was in basketball team, but when I got to high school,
I didn't really play basketball from the school in the way, but I did play a little bit here and there.
Yeah. Yeah, dude. I mean, I, I, I really pick up sports much. I mean, I did like in middle school.
(07:44):
I wasn't good enough in high school to make the team for basketball. So,
so you said it was like trying times for you. Was it like, I guess the teenagers, it's like the rebellious
phase, right? You trying to fear who you are and whatnot. What was like, give us like a picture of
like what your, it was like high school for you, man. Was it like kind of tough and a sense of like
(08:07):
just the people you're not with? High school was tough because my generation grown up during high
school. It wasn't all about studying. It was more about like, I don't know, gang banging. Right.
Right. So, I was going that era like during the 90s, it was all about gangs. Like, no matter where
(08:29):
you go, you're going to see the biggest formation of gangs in every school lined up. So, everywhere you
go, it's gangs, gangs, gangs, gangs. So, you can't get away from it. Mm. And you're...
for my own community either. But, I mean, if you were able to get away from it, you would have
liked the really most fortunate ones. Yeah, you know what, man, it's interesting. My, my
(08:51):
uncles have a very similar story in that sense where they came to America. Now, I want to say like
during 12 and 13, like the early high school years, so they really took them to adjust. But they were
living in Panorama City. And at that time, a lot of gangs too. You know, they joined Filipino gangs.
They don't work out, you know, but I think they did add a necessity. I don't know if they really wanted
(09:16):
to, but at the time, I think from where I gather, like, you know, the, the teenos were like kind of
like just harassing Filipinos. You know, anyone without my teacher, right? So, they figured, you know,
we got to like click up, we guys protect ourselves. You know, so they joined the Filipino gang.
That's pretty much how most 90s gangs was pretty much formed, especially for us. Like, it wasn't
(09:39):
because we were just trying to form a gang to get into trouble. We were just forming a gang to
defend ourselves from, from, you know, other races that was, you know, given us problems and
bullying us at school. And most of us were, you know, like I said, we all come from innocent
background. So it's not like we just, you know, had a thought of like, oh, yeah, I want to be a gang
(10:03):
gang. Anything. No, it's not about that. It's just, you know, we're looking out for each other. We're
helping each other out. So, you know, it's just like a bunch of school buddies walking together. We
watch either each other's back on the school and make sure nobody pick on us. Nobody, you know,
mess with us. So it started out like that, you know? Right. And eventually, of course, it evolved,
(10:25):
you know, mentality got stronger. We are, those got stronger, you know, mind, body, physical. Right.
It just like I said, the whole game just evolved. And now you have two bigger stuff. Yeah.
I don't want to play a gang out there, whatever. But, you know, I'm assuming you were doing that.
(10:46):
And it led to just escalating, I guess, and things that were maybe a
illegal, violent and whatnot. From what I gather, I mean, you were doing the street stuff.
You know, I was hanging out at Lisa, highly sick. You're listening. You know, she told me,
"Vayley, what happened?" Like, you know, you're maybe living in the same area than one day you got locked up.
Like, how old were you when that happened? I was 20 when that happened. Yeah. So I was 20 when I got
(11:19):
locked up. And, you know, it changed my life, obviously. Right. I was a poster of events. But,
you know, I just had one year old daughter that I left behind. And, you know, just about like losing her,
not seeing her, not seeing her grow up. It really hurt, you know. I understand the blood. I mean, I can't even
(11:42):
really like, how about that was. I mean, shit, dude, like, what was going through your head the time? I mean,
you know, you did this thing and they gave you 20 years. Or like, what was it? 20 years, right? The
game you took was a game. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. What was going through your head at that time? Life was
without possibility or all. Holy shit. You know, that that that was an eye-opener. But, you know, like I
(12:06):
said, I just prayed a God and I just said, you know what? Whatever I've done, let me do my time.
And, you know, I just pray to God that it's not going to be life. And that's it. You know, you have
a thing and then I'm easily say, do I fuck you? So you play, you play, right? Right. Right. So in a way,
that comes to acceptance of it. It's actually like karma, right? I think. Oh, well, yeah, you can say that,
(12:31):
you know, whatever it is. Right. Right. It happened and happened. You know, yeah. It was just one of those
things that it just happened, man. You know, right. I've got come to accept it. You took responsibility,
took responsibility of it and whatever the outcome. Okay. You have no choice. You know, I think it's
one of my, I don't want this choice. I want another choice. Right. Right. Man. So, like the first five
(12:58):
years, I mean, was it like tough for you to adjust to the culture inside? Yeah. I mean, the first five
years, I mean, I spent what four years in county jail, not in my case. And it was, well, you know, if
you've never been in a county jail fighting a case, what really long to most, but just being in the
(13:21):
county jail long, it's a mental game. Right. And you got to have the strong mentality to be in there
and know exactly what you're doing. And, you know, sadly, most people come in and they're not
prepared for it. And their mind is not strong enough to, to, to will it. And
unfortunately, they do break, you know, right. And, um, and the thing like, you're going to court,
(13:49):
the DA, the judge, the whole system, they're going to play this mind game. They're going to prolong
your court cases to see how long you can last. This is the tactic, you know, they play this game
to where you can't stand to being an inside county jail no more that you would actually change your
plea. Oh, wow. Yeah. Yeah. I was there for number one tactic to hold you in there for as long as they can
(14:15):
to prolong, prolong, prolong until you say, you know what, just give me whatever I'll take it,
just get me out of here. So that, that was the thing. And, you know, majority of time, like I say,
your mind's not ready for that. You will hold. And most people do take guilty, please just to get out
of the county jail. And, you know, that ultimately you're not going to get the best you're looking for,
(14:38):
obviously. Yeah. Were you in LA County or were you in a different, were you in OC? I was in OC.
Okay. Okay. Um, I've been at county before and I don't know how it is in OC. I know they kind of
segregate you. So if you're Asian, you're the other with black people, the black, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
They still do that. Obviously, only in California, they segregate you on. So basically, you know,
(15:03):
Asians, they love with Asian, whites with white, blacks with black, you know, so yeah. And in LA
county is whites and Mexicans, they stay on one side. Right. Right. And then that's not the,
yes, interesting. I know how that was in OC County. Um, so the first four years you were there,
(15:25):
but then you went to prison? Yeah. So basically, I got the guilty sentence and, um,
went to prison, got sentenced to 20 years. Um, you know, I did most of my time,
started off of Pelican Bay, level four. Okay. And you know, after a few years, my point dropped,
(15:49):
went to a level three, started went to Pleasant Valley. And then that's, at that time, you know,
there was a lot of like, um, issues with the prison and how it was being handled. Right. Especially
with the governor at the time and everything. And there was an overcrowding with prisons.
(16:11):
Our knowled was governor at the time. And, you know, he even knew he helped him with anything. And
with that new, free strike law that I was out in the back way back there. New old bishop today.
No white. He was going, huh? Wow. So the old, the main reason for the free strike law, like,
nobody was going to go home with you. If you had free strikes on new, even if it was like a non-violence,
(16:36):
soul like a piece of bread, some type of goods and a store, which is like, you know, non-fellowny,
but because of the free strike, they will lock you people for life. Right. Damn. So you had a lot of
people who was coming in for petty, petty case, petty crimes, and they were getting life. Damn,
(16:59):
dude. We're getting life. So as you can tell, like, you just do the math, you know, you have 100,000
people that come into prison every year. And only let's say one third of them actually get to parole.
Right. So there's, there doesn't leave that much room for the newcomers to come in and take up that space.
(17:26):
Right. So they were taking taxpayers' money, building up, you know, triple racks, they call it e-beds,
and they turned the gym where we, you know, play basketball and have racks. So they closed that
down. They built, you know, double bunks. They filled that up as well. And it was crazy, man. It was
(17:48):
just like a, it was like modern day slavery, you know? Yeah. Just living in a ship full of
guys was just sweeping in the day room. It was like, "Can't it's our Dean?" "No, yeah." So, you know,
human rights came in because, you know, the inmates, we had some good prison lawyers and all that.
They were filing for lawsuits against the prison, the governor themselves, and everything because,
(18:14):
you know, human rights. He was locking us up, putting too many people in prison, and we're not
games, health benefits. We're not getting any, pretty much sanitary. There's not enough
restaurants, there's not enough time to shower, you know? So people was going through a couple days
(18:35):
mission shower because they can get to it. And it was pretty bad, man. So what happened after that?
Did they overturn that? Did they, you know, we won, and of course they had to come up with something
but I mean it literally took them 10 years to like trying to fix everything. So they sent
(18:57):
multiple states. So they had private contracts with private prisons.
With that private prison contract, they had to shoot everybody out of state from Mississippi,
Oklahoma, Arizona, and even with that, the funds just going to go dry, you know?
(19:20):
Right. Because, you know, like I said, in a day, that's all taxpayers' money, and you do not
want to know how months they spent on all that. And it wasn't like a quick fix, of course,
that was just like a band-aid. Right. You know, and so they start coming out with new laws,
and making new changes. You know, the governor don't want us to leave. Prison board don't want us
(19:41):
to leave because, in a day, why? That's all money in the pockets. They might tell you, yeah, we're
spending a lot of money, you know, housing these inmates, but they're not telling you for every
admit we're housing, we get about, you know, $10,000, $20,000 per inmates in a pocket.
I don't know that that's crazy. Yeah. So they're making money. You know? It's like a capital
(20:04):
ance, like I said, you know? You might buy the cattle's in for a certain amount of fee,
but yet when you sell them back out, you get more profit. So basically that's what they're
getting, making out of us. That's crazy, man. Yeah.
Prison, the prison pays for itself, you know, the inmates take care of the prison, maintain,
cook, clean, fix. Right. So really, they don't have to hire nobody. And
(20:29):
what can they do with their author making money? Yeah, man. So you stayed in California,
your poll set your toll time? Yeah. After the time, they moved me out to Arizona, of course,
into Mississippi. Okay. And then, you know, when the whole private prison was closing down because
(20:52):
lack of funding, they started losing a lot of money. So they brought majority of dollars just
back until they closed up all the whole private prison. Right. So like, let's say like year,
I've touched your 10 years, like halfway through you, you're getting a lot of people doing your
(21:14):
thing. Like, what was it going through your mind? It wasn't in like 10 years into your sentence.
10 years into my 10 years. I'm just looking back like, you know, I'm losing all these years.
I'm gonna lose some more years ahead of me. But I mean, as far as like, adjustment, I'm fully adjusted.
I'm doing the same routine every day, just taking care of myself, trying to bear myself mentally.
(21:40):
And most of all, like, you know, when you go to sleep, but no, you reflect on life decision, you know,
what is and what could have been done. But like I said, you know, for stun and stun, you just go
with it now. Yeah. You don't really look back too much about it because
and like there's no rewind button. So, you know, we don't really look back too much about that. We just
(22:05):
go on where our lives now. Like we always do. Right. Something you mentioned was your routine. What's
your routine like? I know inside of like a very strict time, you gotta wake up a certain time. What
now? What was your routine like? My routine was pretty strict. It was on time. I'll wake up like around
(22:25):
5 or 6 in the morning. I'll make my, you know, routine check up on my people, my boys. I'll check
up on them, make sure everybody's okay. I'll make my coffee, get ready to go to the child, come back,
start cleaning up my area. And after that, get ready for your work out, come back in. If I do have
(22:52):
education like college courses and everything, which I try to keep busy, I go do that. Or if I have a job,
like I'll just work in a kitchen. So whatever my day is with the prison, I'll have that day. I'll
have that time for it, you know. And then if I have time for myself, I'll sit back. I'll just
hang out, write a couple of letters to the family or try to have a phone call. And you know,
(23:17):
most of the time we just do a lot of cooking, eating, and whatever we can't just pass by the day,
you know. Right. How was your family handling all this during, you know, throughout your sentence?
Man, I'm grateful for them and I'm glad that, you know, I thank God every day for giving
the strength to continue on and holding on. It was hard for them, man, you know. Yeah.
(23:45):
I never been locked up close to home. I live in OC, but you know, like all the places I've been locked up
was either like borderline to a next state or to the next state, you know. So their drive was pretty
much like from from my first prison in Pelican Bay, it was like a what? 13, 14 hour drive. Yeah.
(24:13):
And you know, my, my dad was like taking a initiative and, you know, just trying to see me every six months.
And you know, it's hard, man. Yeah. Yeah. You know, he packed up the whole family, he dropped for 13, 14
hours all the way up to Pelican Bay and they only get to see you for a few hours. Right. And then he
(24:35):
dropped back home. Yeah, man. What was it? Yeah, dude. Is it, was it, um, was it through the glass? It
let you have like some some time to like, well, you have contact visit. Basically you sit in the big room.
Each and me have to own table with the family. That's good. And the guest to pack, then you
probably get like maybe an hour and a half. But you know, if it's on a good day, you get like maybe three,
(24:59):
four hours. And that's it, you know, that's it. Oh, you're just happy to see them.
Yeah. I'm happy to see them. Okay. Right. So like, within the 15 years, man, what, what's going on
through your head? I mean, like, you have what you've done most of your sentences. 15 years out of 20.
What was going through your mind, man? Almost to the home run. Yeah. Almost to a home run.
(25:28):
So yeah, I mean, I was looking forward to that. I was preparing myself.
Pretty much just prepping myself to be ready to when I get home. Like I told myself, like, I don't
want to be one of those guys that just go home and and and and sit around and wonder what I'm going to do.
I want to have a game plan to ready. Right. And see what I will do. Like I made a plan. I made plan A,
(25:55):
plan B, plan C. Make sure I go through all that one fill. I have the next backup. Right. Right. And
tell me one. I can't go enjoy COVID lockdown. That was the crazy. Right. That's right.
Right. I remember I see your picture. You first got all your shit, man. That's crazy.
It was trippy like hardly any cars in the street. And you know, people playing fast. It was really
(26:20):
different, man. It's really different. I wasn't used to it, but I was always bracing myself for it.
Nobody knew this COVID thing was real and all right. Right. It was just crazy. But I think my first trip
was to Walmart just to get some clothes. Right. And I was just tripping off off of everything.
(26:45):
Like the colors, you know, the noise, the people. So it took me a few weeks to get adjusted to.
Maybe a market. I can imagine, dude. I mean, you went from just like, you know, a solitary, not
solitary, but you locked up. You don't see a lot of people. You see the same people. But then you
are out in society. Yeah. You see things in prison like black and gray. Yeah. It was just gray color.
(27:10):
That's not the trees. No grass. Stuff like that. It's just concrete dirt. Yeah. And you know,
that's it. What was your guy? What was your first meal out, man? What did you want? What did you get?
Man, I was far from from the city. So we were outskirts of some towns. So the closest thing we could
(27:33):
get was, uh, what was that panic spread? Panic spread, bro. Hey, no, man. I'm not gonna lie. It was
the best thing ever. It's the closest thing to Chinese food. Yeah. Yeah, man. Did you get the
orange chicken and beef broccoli? I sure did. Yo, I used to get panics. I was like, I'll fire, but
hell yeah, man. Oh, man. Shit, I must have tasted awesome. But what kind of drink did you get, bro?
(28:00):
Oh, I got me a beer. Yeah, beer. They have beer in the panic stress. No, we want your liquor.
I got beer. What would you get? What'd you get, bro? Oh, I got me a colinac.
Nice. Did it taste as good as it did before? It tastes even better. Nice, bro.
Damn, that's awesome, man. Fuck, I'm just when I finally got locked out when you got out,
(28:25):
that's so awesome, bro. Like, I know, you know, it was very trying times and you made it out, man. Like,
shit, dude. Like, well, go back a little bit. Like, when you were locked up, like, did you enjoy cooking?
I know we had a, I told you about spread. I don't want to, I don't fucking spread. What'd you eat, dude?
I cooked a lot in there. I did everything. Pretty much I just make up my own meals, you know. I don't really
(28:49):
go to the chowell anymore. Yeah. The prison food sucks. They're just feeding you none but picks
lots, you know, potatoes, our type of potatoes and the fucking mac and cheese. And, you know, that's,
that's not the human being can be eating and that's fucking, you got no fucking joy. But, you know,
we do have pork feet. We do have packages from vendors that you can buy and we're pretty blessed that
(29:16):
they actually do cater to like Asians as well and Hispanic and all that. Yeah. So, you know, we do
have like Mexican seasonings and Mexican meats. Right. And of course, we have like Chinese hot
and stuff like so that's a holy, holy, holy food style. Yeah, man. So, all that is combined, like, you can
(29:38):
get to do you on a, but yeah, you know, cooking was one thing that like just kind of like
put your mind at ease. So, that was something that I do on the daily. Right, right.
Are you got jag, bro? I saw a picture of you fucking, "Ret, bro, are you, when you going in or not?"
Now, I was just kidding, low guy, man. I was just kidding.
I fucking, I saw a picture of you in a gym. I'm like, damn, full. Like, how many burpees did you do a day,
(30:02):
bro? Good old days. I probably do like a thousand. Damn. But nowadays, you know, working everything,
life catching up, age catching up. No, you still look, bro, you still look like you're in your like
early 30s and like 20s, bro. I try, I try. Crazy dude. Like, did you read any books like you're in there?
(30:27):
Like anything that stuck out to you, I'm sure you read a lot. I read a lot of books. So, you know,
the first thing stuck out to me was like, I think beginning of my time, you know, with dad,
for dad, how I invest your money, how to make money. You know, everybody's going to talk about
like art of war and art of stuff. But to me, it's like, you can read about it, but you're not kind of
(30:49):
put that into actions and then focus pretty much for a few. Yeah. So, you know, let's just face it,
how often are you going to use that book, use it at the book or apply it to life, you know. Yeah.
For me, I just read more of like self-help books, more like "team your mindset, how to change your
(31:11):
personality in a way to where it's just like, you don't let people trigger you as much." So,
spoke like that. My dad used to send me in meditation books because he knows like I have anger issues. So,
those books do actually help. Yeah. So, I try to apply that daily, with everything I do, you know.
(31:34):
In prison, it's a multi-part, obviously, you know, you get a whole bunch of everybody. Yeah.
They will test you, they will try you, they will get under your skin very bad and it's just like I said,
how you deal with it, you know. And being in prison, like once you act out, you're not acting out by
(31:57):
yourself, once you act out, that we flex back on the whole race. Right. Right. Right. On the whole card,
you know, each race you car, car. So, basically, whatever I do is going to reflect back on me and my
people. Same thing goes for them. Right. So, you gotta be more considerate and really pick your
(32:18):
battles. If it's worth it, okay, we're all gonna do this together. Right. Nobody really want to fight for
themselves or buy themselves, you know. Right. Right. It says in prison, even though you want to fight,
buy yourself, other people won't, won't abide by that, you know. Right. Right. So, that's the one thing
you have to be real careful about. So, things like that, it teaches you how to pick your battles and,
(32:43):
you know, just to like weave through all the bullshitters and, okay, which one you want to take
more seriously. Right. Right. Do you have any advice or suggestions for people like going through a,
you know, similar case or just that kind of street stuff, man. Like what, you know, you did a lot,
you know, you grew up a lot and then reflecting back, like, I said,
(33:04):
far as like the street stuff, I can say, you know, it's not about where you're from or, or anything.
Tattoo don't make you a man, bang, bang, will make you a man. It's how you act appropriately to things.
You can be a thug, but, you know, get your shit right, get your money right, get your life right.
(33:24):
You don't gotta be a dumb guy after fucking street, you know, rocking and talking all
to because best matter was all about, it's all about accidents. Right. Well, you know, you have a
catch yourself in a situation when you're getting locked up or, you know, just like accordingly, don't,
don't, you know, don't act too much of on how you were in the street because you could be a
(33:48):
fucking, you know, five star general old G in the street, you come in prison, you know, body. Right.
Right. No, you're nobody. You're eating the same slop there eating, sharing the same damn toilet.
Right. You're gonna wash your back every time you're taking a piss or shit or showers or, you know,
yeah. Yeah, man. Sad is going to be shit no more. Money don't be shit either. If you fucking go on
(34:12):
lockdown and you can't use that money to buy your soul food, you're in the same as the rest of us.
No, so, right. That's why a lot of people come in and say, like, yeah, I'm just down the street.
I don't think that's yours. You know, but, man. Right. Yeah, man. Oh, yeah, like, you see him like,
you've done a lot of growing, man. Like looking back when, you know, when you're 20 to now, like, what,
(34:35):
do you feel like change? Like, what did you learn when you're inside? You know,
I mean, oh, yeah, that's when, um, prison change a lot, but like, is that the prison don't help you change?
The prison helped you grow because they put you in certain scenarios and situation. So you're locked
up with a bunch of killer thieves and rapists. You know, and you got to decide like,
(35:02):
which way to maneuver. And of course, obviously, you're not going to fuck with everybody.
Right. You want to put the right person you're going to hang out with. Even your own people, you know.
And, you know, you got the drugies, you got the, you got the gamblers, you got the fun.
(35:23):
No whole bunch of weird people in there. Right. Right. Right. But throughout all that, I mean, there are some good people in there that you can pick in
home all those, you know. Right. But, um, the prison is not going to help you change. They just help you grow. Right. But another day, how you want to grow, that depends on you. There's, there's no open book about, you know, what you should do in
(35:52):
certain scenario, that's, that's your decision. Mm hmm. Within that decision, you know, there's always going to be causing effect. You make that decision.
Then there's going to be an effect on that, you know. Right. Right. Right. Now you being a man like, you just make that right decision. Right.
Yo, but you make that decision and then and then you go from there. And like I said, you know, me. I spend time with good people. I surround myself with good people.
(36:22):
And then those people, they help you grow as well. You know, so how you affect them, they affect you. Right. That's is it. Like you hang around with the dope heads. What I mean, what they do, you're going to do. Right. Right.
So that's basically it. Um, shit, man. So when you, when you got out COVID, man, like, um, it was different. Like, um, what, like, what else are you doing?
(36:50):
Like, I mean, um, what did you try other foods instead that you haven't tried before? We got out. Well, when I came out, all the restaurant were closed. Right.
Yes, I forgot. Uh, they take out everything. Um, I didn't get to try as much food as I wanted to. I mean, I did go get myself like, you know, some fun to go.
(37:11):
Whatever Asian food, the Asian restaurant that was open, um, but pretty much it was off the go. But I was, you know, for more focus on like, just trying to find what the family. Right.
And then I was focusing on like, let's just say trying to get a job. Right. So obviously no place was hiring at that time. So the only thing I thought of was, you know what? I got myself a car.
(37:40):
Trying to put gas and then I just got a door dash job, man. Nice man. How I was door dash.
It was, I was doing it with good during COVID, man. I made, I made money, you know, I made money. And, um, that's one thing I was happy about. Like, I was just going out there, doing my thing. I pushed like, maybe five, six hours a day.
(38:03):
And, you know, I was making like, what, maybe five, six hundred a week. I mean, yeah, what's going on? But I mean, it was, you know, it's income. Right, bro. Um, well, that's awesome. Do I mean, no, a lot of people are doing door dash back then.
So you can all family. When you came home, like, your daughter is like what she was like 15, 16, like, earlier, it's like a teenage years, man. I mean, how was that kind of reconnecting with her stuff? She saw you, you're out.
(38:31):
Oh, um, being in there, I don't get to talk to this much. Right. I do on, I say, hi, to her and try to communicate with her. But, you know, being a kid, like, they don't know you too well. Right. They might know who you are, but they don't know you because you don't really, you're not there. You know, you're not there physically. You don't have the physical connection with them. Mm hmm. And for a kid is, it's hard. Yeah.
(39:01):
And with her growing up, um, without me in her life, you know, like, basically, I'm a total stranger. You know, she knows who I am, but she don't know me. That's a person. You know, me as dad, but, you know, um,
I knew while I was getting myself into I knew it was going to be like a big hill for me to to cross over on that. But like I said, that's my daughter and I'm going to do everything I can to reconnect with her. And which I do. Right.
(39:33):
Good. Good.
So today, like, we're very connected. We're good. You know, I would make time for her. I was like, hey, let's go somewhere.
That's my thing. That's my thing with her. Like I look up on Google find new place to go with you. Yeah. Um,
Well, besting right. I'm going to go to face. Right. So I interact with her. I'm I'm sure that she's a part of my life wherever, wherever I am, whatever I'm doing, I'm sure I make that.
(40:02):
Good, man. That's respected. Yeah. That's awesome. Man. Um, shit. Uh, yeah, a lot of time to catch up on movies, man. Like, what were you watching?
Like anything that stuck out to you that you watched when you got out. I was a movie club. I mean, I had a phone and prison too.
Oh, okay. Okay. I just got you up on on everything. Not now. Just watching over to series. You know, like all the game down.
(40:28):
Run.
Okay. Okay. I mean, can we say that? I don't want to. I don't. Yeah. I mean, we can say that. I don't want to. I mean, I added that out. If you want, I don't want to, you know,
get your butt and trauma for anything. But, uh, okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Now, okay. More transparency. Like you were wrong. Same face with group. I didn't know you were in jail. Someone told me that. Like,
(40:52):
Linda's like, yeah, fool. I was in jail. I'm like, what the fuck, bro? How is he? Why do you fucking get that shit, dude? Uh, he told me like she can tell about yourself. He always said the white background and everything. Oh,
that makes sense. Exactly. So I lived up. But yeah, it was funny, bro. Like, yeah, you know, you know, my guy falls in jail. I mean, prison. I'm like, what the fuck? How do you?
(41:16):
I mean, I don't even guess, bro. You know, but, uh, crazy dude. Uh, I mean, this is the thing nowadays where they make the phone and prison. You know,
I mean, yeah, I didn't have my share of it. He also got that kept me company as well. That was one thing that kept me like, uh,
(41:37):
connected to, to, to society to the three, you know, right, right. And, you know, that was my, my gateway to reaching out to my family and keeping in touch with them as well. So that was my main thing.
But, you know, like social media, it helped me pass the time. Yeah. I'm like, you know, you just want to know what's going on around your city.
(41:57):
I know what's new. What's popping. Right. Right. Oh, music movies. Nice stuff like that. So I mean, like I said, when I got home, like I also prepared for all that because I already knew what's going on out there. Right. Right.
Won't just ease myself in with the society with the people and get used to places that that that was a, a, a, a, a powerful, you know, definitely, definitely. Yeah.
(42:21):
Shit, man. It's awesome, bro. I mean, um, yeah, I'll link the video, but you made a pretty cool cooking tutorial. Dude, that's pretty good, man.
Is that what you eat? That's awesome. And I feel like good, bro.
Yeah. Thank you. I appreciate. Um, you know, my cousin was pushing me towards that because he was like, you know, people would like to know what you do in prison. Yeah, dude, especially when it comes to cooking, like how did you stay up with, with, you know, the food because obviously the food in their sucks.
(42:53):
What did you do to, you know, to make your meals in there and let's say if you want to make some food, you want some past Thai or whatever it is.
Like how did you get through all that?
Well, you know, it took a while for me to push me to do it, but I'm glad he did.
Yeah, man. Um, if that's the same cousin, I think you're talking about it's pretty cool, bro. He's a funny guy. I think, you know, yeah, yeah.
(43:20):
Yeah, funny guy. Um, cool. Yeah. Funny guy. I'll say that. But oh shit, dude. Um, and, bro, it's awesome. Bro, I mean, yo, thank you for taking your time out. Man, it's a really cool conversation. Bro, I mean, I'm so glad that
you're out, man. Like when I find it online, I was so happy due because like, fuck, dude, 20 years, man. Um, seeing like overall, you had a really high spirit, just really positive.
(43:45):
Cause I know that, you know, that's, that's tough, man. I mean, doing all that shit in just 20 years, bro, that's a long time. You know, and I'm glad that you were, you're able to just like have a strong will, strong mind to, to get out of it, doing it.
And, and, and, and, and just like surpassed that, that obstacle in your life. Um, yeah, what are you up to these days, man? I mean, you're just like, hey, now get a job. Normal day stuff.
(44:10):
Yeah. I mean, I, I got a job at the mall work place that, you know, I've been planning to go back there every since I was in prison. So,
I finally got the job I wanted and, you know, from there on, you just educate yourself and just move on up, you know, I don't want to stay at the same place all this.
(44:30):
But, you know, I think we make it in me and you get a place to work with good places to start off. And, and they like, I did what I want to do. I accomplished that, you know,
good. So, and they just, you find ways to elevate yourself. Right. Right. Man. Um, shit, bro.
Where can we find your social media? I mean, do you do social media?
(44:52):
Uh, yeah, I do. Um,
the YouTube, the YouTube channel though. Like, was it what would I look up? It is Cali dot OG Mike. Okay.
Yeah. Okay. Cool, bro. Hey, well, you know, thank you for having this conversation. Um, glad, you know, you're cool with it.
(45:14):
Cause I always wondered like, damn, before I don't want to ask you online, but it's cool to hear your story, man. Um, inspiring, bro. I mean, like, you went through a lot and you came out as a better person.
And, uh, yeah, man, you're family, y'all and everything good. Dude, that's good, man.
Yeah. Thank you. I appreciate that. No problem.
Coming home like for guys that's in there, you still have a day to go home, look forward to that. Make plans going from plan long minutes.
(45:43):
Yeah, I like that.
And you're, you're going to say you're so a little failure, you know, just have some hope, got some dream.
I know sometimes like people have like 15, 20 years left and they're like, man, what am I going to do? Yeah, I mean, just have a plan, even though like you have 10 years, 15 years left, you know, still have a plan in your, in your mind, because your days are not over yet.
(46:07):
Right. Right.
A lot of older guys tell me to like, you know, it's not over until it's over. So have a plan and continue with that because that is going to help you by far more than anything else in your life, because you have something to to look forward to, you know, right.
(46:27):
And if you don't have anything to look forward to, then all your days in there, you're going to be miserable. You're going to be lost. You're going to be stressed out.
So I always have a plan and that that was my thing. My plan was, you know, go home, do this, do that.
And it kept me saying, well, I can't go home like, yeah, go home like I went through everything that I planned. I went to plan a plan B plan. See, I followed all that.
(46:53):
So those are things just have a plan. Right. Don't give life and, you know, I always have to outreach to where you could find somebody in community, your family to help you out if you have something like that to fall to.
Right. Right. Man, what was it like when you got a parole, bro, when you were you out of that shit?
Mm. It was so real.
(47:17):
People used to say like the air smells differently. Yeah, no, spread on the other side. And I was like, yeah, it does.
Yeah, it's good, man. That's awesome.
Yeah.
The favorite color change, you know, you're not no longer seeing things black and gray. Don't know what it's like. She colored. Yeah.
And just after man like it's like a big, gloomy, gray cloud lifted off of me, you know, all the weight off my shoulder just lifted as well.
(47:47):
It felt good. Yeah. It was surreal. I thought I was dreaming. I took me a few days just to like get real comfortable with things. Yeah. Yeah.
Even like being around my parents, I was happy to share, but like,
I couldn't, I couldn't, I couldn't, um, I couldn't really show it, you know? Yeah. Yeah.
So it was a little bit, it was a little bit different, but I mean, I loved it though. It was surreal. It was like I'm free walking.
(48:14):
Hey, but it's real, bro, you know, see walking. It's not a dream. You live in it, bro. So again, thank you. Thank you, man. I'm just so proud, bro. You were, you done.
It's awesome. It's inspiring. It's like, fuck, man. That's awesome. You did your old bed and just kept staying like a genius, grew as an individual as a man. That's that's a very, um,
really hard to say. It's, uh, admirable, bro, because it could have gone so many other ways, but you held it down, man.
(48:43):
Yeah. Thank you. I appreciate it. No problem, bro. You have a good one, man. Take care.
You too. Oh, oh, next time next time in the area, man, we'll get some, we'll get some Vietnamese coffee, bro.
I'm down, man. I'll take you. All right. There's a place. I think I'm happy. I heard, I heard, cafe, a Lou has really good coffee.
Oh, yeah. The coffee that is born, man. All right, bro. Take care, man.
(49:03):
I let her go. Take care. All right, later. Hi, peace.
[BLANK_AUDIO]
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