September 17, 2025 • 44 mins
Episode Highlights with David and John
- Red flags when it comes to supplements and what to watch for
- Understanding bioavailability when it comes to supplements
- Synergy in supplements and how this can take something from 1+1=2 to 1+1=10
- How to get a much larger effect from supplements when synergistic then when taken alone
- What sulforaphane is and how it is so beneficial - it has 39 pro-health mechanisms in the literature
- Curcumin and how bioavailable forms are a highly underrated supplement
- Supplements that give the biggest bang for the buck
- Toxins and nutrient deficiencies and their role in chronic disease
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Well, on to My Body's podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
This episode is brought to you by Native Path and
in particular, something I have been experimenting with and really
really loving lately. And here's what you need to understand.
A lot of us think calcium is important for our health,
especially for our bone, But is this actually true bad news?
It turns out maybe not, or at least there's more
nuance here. One of the largest bone health studies ever
(00:27):
conducted followed thousands of women taking calcium and oral vitamin
D daily and the results were surprising, but not in
the way he would think. They saw no significant reduction
in their risk of fractures, and they saw no improved
bone density. So all those calcium pills might not be
doing what we think, and it turns out they might
actually be counterproductive. But here's where it gets interesting. A
(00:48):
brand new study found that women who did one thing
every morning consistently for six months gained seven percent bone density,
which is massive. This is the same amount of bone
mass the average person losing is over the course of
five years after a certain age. So what did they do?
It was not a medication or even a workout. Came
down to one simple thing added to their morning routine
(01:10):
and that's why a lot of people, especially people over fifty,
are making this one simple change and seeing massive results.
I'm sure you're probably curious what it is, and it's
a particular protein from one of my favorite brands called
Native Path, and they're offering all of you up to
forty five percent off of this, plus free shipping and
a free gift. Right now, you can visit save with
(01:32):
Nativepath dot com slash wellness Mama to find out what
it is and how to implement it and save up
to forty five percent. So again, that special site for
forty five percent off is save Save with Native E
PA t H dot com slash walness Mama and see
(01:52):
why people are adding this to the routine with amazing results.
This podcast is brought to you by by Optimizers and
in particular their product that holds My Heart, which is
their magnesium Breakthrough. My goal this year is to continue
to focus on my wellness and to create more harmony
and resonance. And we all know that the foundation of
health is a good night's sleep. I talk about that
(02:14):
so much on this podcast, and magnesium is the one
nutrient that helps my sleep so much as well as
so many other aspects of my health because magnesium is
vital for so many things within the body, and it
is nearly impossible to get enough from food anymore, and
magnesium breakthrough from bioptimizers is in a category of its own.
They have seven different forms of magnesium in one supplement,
(02:37):
and since magnesium is involved in over six hundred different
biochemical reactions in the body, no other supplement on the
market offers all seven types of magnesium in one bottle.
Pretty Much every function of your body is upgraded when
you take magnesium regularly, from the quality of your sleep
to your brain function, from metabolism to stress levels, and
so much more. This is one of the few supplements
(02:58):
that lives on my nightstand, and I'm a little odd,
but I take every morning because I actually get energy
from it, though most people notice that it's better at
night now. Studies point to a lot of benefits of magnesium,
including that it may help improve sleep quality, especially by
supporting healthy sleep onset and have more peaceful nights. My
nuesium is also involved in stress management support, and it
(03:19):
may help maintain energy levels and positive mood, while also
supporting mental clearness and relaxation. Museum is also important for
healthy imbalanced muscle tone and providing the building blocks to
strong bones, and it promotes a balance stress response, supports
relaxation and I feel much calmer when I'm regularly taking magnesium,
So let's base it even if you're twenty twenty five.
(03:41):
Resolution is not all about focusing on your health like minus,
how are you going to be able to shave your
goals in any area without enough quality sleep and stress management.
Check out Magnesium Breakthrough and make it part of your
daily routine this year as well for better sleep, better
stress response, and much more. They have a three hundred
and sixty five day money back guarantee and you can
(04:01):
find it at to buy Optimizers dot com, slash Wellness
Mama and use the code Wellness Mama for a discount.
So that's b io P T I, M I Z
E r s dot com, slash wellness Mama and the
code Wellness Mama for a discount. Hello and welcome to
the Wellness Mama Podcast. I'm Katie from wellnesswama dot com
(04:22):
and I am back today with David Roberts and John
Jildea from Mara Labs to talk about selfor fane understanding
supplements and the science of bioavailability. And if you have
not heard from these guys before, I love learning from them.
John is a Johns Hopkins train PhD. With sixty scientific
publications from over twenty NIH funded studies. He is an
(04:44):
expert in cell culture exosomes, performing all the science behind
the gut supplement you may have heard of called Restore.
He was also instrumental in the initial stabilization of sulforafane
in a product called broccoly which I take. And David
Roberts Holton MPH from Johns Hopkins, a master's in b
from UVA and a bachelor's from Duke Key, has more
than twenty years of public health experience on three continents,
(05:06):
and he co founded the gut supplement Restore. In this episode,
we go deep on synergy, bioavailability, what to look for
in supplements, red flags and supplements, and so much more.
I always learn so much from these two. Let's join
them now. David and John, welcome back. Thanks for being
here again.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
It's great to be here, Katie. Thanks for having us again.
Speaker 2 (05:27):
Well, if you guys missed it, I'm going to link
to our first episode in the show notes. That one
was all about salt. I learned a whole lot and
definitely have some action steps I will be experimenting with
in my own life immediately after that conversation. I have
a feeling the same will be true for this conversation,
because anytime I talk to you guys, I learn so much,
and I know this conversation will be no exception. And
(05:47):
we're going to dive into the science of supplements, bioavailability,
understanding what's actually in our supplements, and how to choose
good ones. I know this is a big and broad topic.
Maybe as some background, We're definitely going to get into
the ones that are good and the ones you guys
have created specifically. But before we get there, can you
walk us through maybe some red flags to be aware
of when it comes to buying supplements, looking for supplements,
(06:10):
and maybe things people might not know to be cautious about.
Speaker 1 (06:13):
That's a big question. I'll start and then John could
jump in. So basically, the first thing to keep in
mind is what's in the capsule, and so there are
fillers typically in the capsule, and there are flow agents
that are in the capsule, and on the extreme amount,
like there is a sleep supplement. I'm not going to
mention it. But if somebody we both know, Katie, sixty
(06:35):
percent of the capsule was filler. It was like filled
with P protein and inflow agent, and then forty percent
was the actual molecule that they're selling. And so that
brings up, so what's in the capsule and what's the
amount of the things that you're trying to get. So
this was sleep supplement has like five HDP and it
was hardly any It wasn't enough that was going to
(06:57):
actually move the needle with their suggests to serving size.
And so you know those are two things. Is what's
in the supplement and is the amount that you're getting
in your serving size actually going to do anything? What
do you think?
Speaker 3 (07:10):
Yeah, that's a good point. I would guess that the
way I look at the supplement industry is that I
made the ones that I thought were missing. I still
have a bunch more that I want to make. But
to make the connection between cell culture studies and what
you should put in your mouth is sort of an
entire world on its own. So going from your mouth
(07:32):
to the cellar you're trying to affect is super important, important,
And when you look at cell culture studies, where you
take a product like percumen and you see this unbelievable
effect on an F cappa B or literally any en cancer,
any molecular and signaling pathway. You're looking at. Kin just
(07:54):
looks like it should be the best molecule on earth.
But biovailability of curricumen is so low. It's unbelievably low,
and so there's been a bunch of studies that are
positive from just taking regular curcumen. So my interpretation of
that is that you're affecting just the cells that are
(08:16):
lining your intestines. And I don't want to boohoo that,
because that's an important part of decreasing inflammation, is the
cells that are lining your intestine and your colon. So
that's important to decrease inflammation in that realm. But if
you want to get inflammation reduced anywhere else in your
(08:37):
whole body, you have to get it asked the intestines
and in high enough concentration to actually have therapeutic effect
at the cells you're trying to get it to. So
that's what we were designing. We knew what concentration that
we want to get to at the cell, and that's
(08:57):
how we dose our products. So that we know that
a gets at the concentration that affects basically signaling, and
then we test in a person that it affects that
that cell type for kurkumen. When we developed our product,
we knew that we wanted to get to a highness
concentration in order to inhibit AIL six. Very good marker
(09:18):
for this the target of Kirkman, which is nfkappa B.
It's a master regulator of inflammation, and so that's how
we formulated that product. Another important aspect of this is
that we're looking for synergies. So there's a lot of
synergies out there that are sort of very unrecognized, and
(09:41):
so if you can if you can't get you know,
fifty micro mole of kirkumen to a cell, it's just
not possible right now, how would you do that? So
our strategy is that you combine a couple of other
things together that all work in different halfways in order
to inhibit n F capab. And so that is a
(10:04):
clear one that we've shown for sulforaphane. Sulforaphane inhibits n
F kapab, curcumen inhibits n F capab, aristratin inhibits f CAPAB,
but they all do it by different mechanisms and they're synergistic.
So even a lower concentration, if you take two of them,
are affecting the end pathway in a therapeutic way. And
(10:27):
that is sort of how we've designed all our supplements,
and so I probably should talk about the other side
is what are things that I won't be formulating and
selling from here. And they're all the ones that if
you just do a mass spect analysis of the product
(10:48):
and it has the amount that's in there, and that
product is had a dose that doesn't have any problem
with bioavailability, that product is fine. And there's a large
number of supplements out there that you don't have to
have a special formulation for just the right dose. And
so I wish there was a list somewhere. Maybe we'll
(11:10):
work on that sometime as just a list of supplements
that don't have any problem with bioavailability and that you
can take that and you can basically assume that you're
going to match the studies using that supplement.
Speaker 1 (11:22):
Yeah, I mean it's important because I mean we got
into this because both of our wives had cancer and
basically looking at their cells in our lab, especially my
wife Maura. But like you see, like Kirkman was number
one and killing your type of cancer. There are like
dozens of papers on how Kirkyman kill is great for cancer.
(11:45):
But then like, how do you know what you take
is actually getting to the cells and it wasn't. And
so coming up with actually, over a lunch conversation, if
you remember that, coming up with a way to get
the Kirkuman attached to something, to get it through the
gut barrier into the blood to the cells in so
(12:05):
that what you read in those studies actually can happen.
And that's like what we've been researching and studying and
trying to make happen. And the whole idea of synergy
so additive, if it's additive, it's one plus one equals two,
so it's what you would expect. But a synergistic effect
one plus one equals five, you know, or ten, and
(12:26):
so it's much larger than the individual's effect than the
individuals combined. And so what John's saying is you can
by combining these supplements, we're finding that you can get
a much larger effect than is possible if you just
take one of the compounds and that's through that because
(12:46):
they're working at different angles, and he was talking to anfocapopy.
That's the holy grail of information. A lot of the
pharmaceutical companies, that's the target they're aiming for when they're
creating an anti ins laboratory. And so the fact that
we have some natural compounds that really impact that is huge.
Speaker 2 (13:04):
Yeah, this is such a fascinating concept to me. And
I know we hear those terms like bioavailability and synergistic
tossed arounds, but I feel like most people don't have
a deep understanding of those or even know how to
analyze in the scope of supplements if what they're taking
is going to have those properties or not how much
they're actually absorbing. I know some of that feels very ambiguous,
and I would love to kind of get each of
(13:25):
your perspectives and of course hopefully touch on some of
the ones you've gotten to formulate as well. But from
your perspective, what are some of the general kind of
highest ROI compounds that we can take as humans. I
know there's some bio individuality here, but in general, what
are some of the highest roi and or what are
someones to generally avoid or that you would say like
we're not getting a good bang for the buck, or
(13:46):
that we're not absorbing most likely.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
Yeah, I mean, so basically Kirkcuman has less than one
percent by availability. And so the blessing and the curse
of the supplement industry is that it's not regulated, and
so people can say things and they you have to
be truthful, but like if you're not truthful, then somebody
actually has to cough up the money the cash to
(14:09):
sue you unless they actually see this. And so basically
everyone says they have the best Kirkuman on the market,
everybody across the board. You go on Amazon, we have
the best Kurkuman here, and you know because we have
we combine it with black pepper or something of that.
And so, but what's the truth. And so basically the
truth is, you know, even biovail quote unquote bioavailable, So
(14:33):
kurk supplements don't get enough Kirkman through the gut barrier
to make a biological difference. And then if you're taking turmeric,
you know which one's biological difference I should say outside
of the GI tract. Inside the GI tract, it could
be great. We did find one curcumin that has three
(14:54):
percent kurkumen ninety seven percent detergent, and that actually gets
through the gut barrier amazingly. But how it does it
is it's just really the detergent irritates the gut so
much that makes it permeable and the kirkman gets through.
And so what ends up happening is it you just
get a instead of reducing your inflammation, you get a
(15:15):
massive spike in the inflammation, which in ile si in
terms of Bisle six. But kirkumin is lipid soluble. It's
fat soluble. Kirkuman, reseratrol, ten, burbering, e GCG are five
things that are lipid soluble. Can you think of anything
else in the city. Yeah, there's a bunch of them
(15:36):
A seventeen seventeen. Those five are the ones we used regularly.
But basically, unless you're attaching it to something to get
it through the gup barrier, it's not happening. And so
the technology we're bringing to the market is and we're
showing it, we can prove it that it's actually getting
these compounds to the cells and making them in a
(15:59):
biologically relevan way, so you can impact your biology and
feel the difference. You can feel a difference pretty quickly,
even within one serving.
Speaker 3 (16:08):
I think because of our reason for getting interested in supplements,
we ended up finding out which ones were the most
effective at the cell through our screening, because we put
on a couple hundred natural compounds onto these cells to
see which ones actually affect pathways the best. And when
(16:29):
you run into the fact that they're super effective but
not bioavailable, we call that the lowest hanging fruit in
the supplement industry. Is that you have a supplement that's
already proved in thousands and thousands of papers to function
in the correct way. Everyone knows that inflammation is driving
aging and chronic disease. But if you're not getting any
(16:53):
pasta gut barrier, you're missing out on the vast majority
of cells in your body. And so that would be
super low hanging fruit. Curcumin sort of from a researcher's
mind that reads lots and lots of papers, So when
I read the curcuman literature, there's there's many papers out
there comparing all the different curcumens, and so me, being
(17:14):
a bench scientist person that actually does the testing, I
feel like I'm useless unless I'm actually doing experiments with
my hands. When I read those papers, I see a
glaring problem in the research. And the glaring problem is
nobody studies curcumen. They don't measure curcumen. The prevailing way
all of those studies are measured is you take a
(17:37):
curcumin product, you extract blood, and then you have to
rip off the in the case of curcumen, the glucoronidation
and sulfation that happens to curcumen when it goes through
the liver. And the problem is those two forms of
(17:59):
curcumins have no activity. So why are we measuring the
amount of sulfated and glucoronidated percumen in the blood if
that has no function? So we measure curcumin. And it's
just the bottom line if you if you can, if
you can't get percumen into the blood and without messing
(18:25):
up the barrier that you are getting it through, I
think you'd be better off just taking regular curcumen that's
not absorbed.
Speaker 1 (18:33):
Yeah, and so like I just to answer the ROI
what's a supplement that to gives your ear biggest bank
for the buck? I mean, one thing you can think
about is what's a supplement that does a lot of
different things at once. And so the one that comes
to mind, I mean probably because we make it exel it,
(18:54):
but because we research it also is sulfurr of fame
has thirty seven I think, or as it thirty nine
thirty nine different pro health mechanisms in the literature, two
thousand papers, a lot of them from JOHNS. Hopkins, the
molecules discovered at John Hopkins. But like that's a lot,
you know, and I'm not sure, and they're not just
you know, little things, they're huge things. And so anyway,
(19:17):
that's that would be one biggest bang for the buck.
And I know because of the synergistic again there's that
word way they work together is you know, curcum and
selfurffing together do amazing things. And so you know, that's
that would be a one suggestions. Sorry, they're our products.
Speaker 3 (19:40):
I have one that I can probably plug that I
tell a lot of people to take. It's because one
of my nutrition heroes sort of wrote the first paper,
and that's Bruce Ames. Yeah, Bruce Ames is the most
referenced researcher in history as far as I know, at
least that was a short time ago, and he's the
person that discovered arcinogenicity, and so the AIM's assay is
(20:04):
how you determine if something's a carcinogen. Well, it's amazing
that he did the original study that's so referenced, but
then through the rest of his career he came up
with this idea that it's nutrient deficiencies that are actually
driving chronic disease and not actually oxins or carcinogens that
(20:26):
he's famous for. So when a person is is that influential.
I think most people now agree that it's both toxins
and nutrient deficiencies that are driving chronic disease. He came
up with a supplement mixture that I think works in
a huge number of people and there's no problem with bioavailability.
(20:47):
And this is a particular nervous system supplement, the combination
of lapoic acid alpha lapoic acid with acetyl l carnatine.
And so he showed in animals that it reduced the
cognitive age of old rats by half. They started performing
like rats were that were half their age. And so
(21:11):
it's just a one two punch of getting carnetine inside
cells and lapolic acid, which is a factor for oxidative metabolism,
and people would be it would be really good for
them to listen to this guy because he has a
lot to say. And he discovered what's called a cory bar.
(21:32):
Cory bar has all of the micronutrients and minerals that
he found were deficient in population. So he wanted he
made this thing called the Corey bar, did a number
of studies for it to plug up all the holes
that he found in nutrient deficiencies.
Speaker 1 (21:49):
Yeah, a lot of those lines caliber. If you can
take those as supplements, or you can take those as
just a diet. You know, in your diet, I like
to grind up and so they what that does is
it's that liver is the most nutrient dense food we
can get, so you're getting a lot of the If
you're wanting to make sure you're not nutrient deficient, that's
(22:09):
a way to do it. And we both buy cows
and have cow livers. You can just grade it into
like keep it frozen, graded into ground beef, could do
about ten percent. We both have the children. If you
have about ten percent of your ground beef as liver,
you can't taste the difference, especially if you spice it.
If you start approaching more than that, then they can
(22:29):
tell that they'd all like it. But we also use pluck,
which is a spice, but it also has its freezing,
it can has tree stride organs. I use that Naturals.
We don't sell that brand. It's Chriss Crasher's brand, and
they have a organ as well as a multi vitamin.
So ways to make sure you're not nutrient deficient.
Speaker 2 (22:50):
These are so many good tips in that one response.
This episode is brought to you by Native Path and
in particular something I have been experimenting with and really
really loving lately. And here's what you need to understand.
A lot of us think calcium is important for our health,
especially for our bone, but this is actually true bad news.
(23:14):
It turns out maybe not, or at least there's more
nuance here. One of the largest bone health studies ever
conducted followed thousands of women taking calcium and oral vitamin
D daily and the results were surprising, but not in
the way you would think. They saw no significant reduction
in their risk of fractures, and they saw no improved
bone density. So all those calcium pills might not be
(23:34):
doing what we think and it turns out they might
actually be counterproductive. But here's where it gets interesting. A
brand new study found that women who did one thing
every morning consistently for six months gained seven percent bone density,
which is massive. This is the same amount of bone
mass the average person loses over the course of five
years after a certain age. So what did they do.
(23:55):
It was not a medication or even a workout. Came
down to one simple thing added to their morning routine.
And that's why a lot of people, especially people over fifty,
are making this one simple change and seeing massive results.
I'm sure you're probably curious what it is, and it's
a particular protein from one of my favorite brands called
Native Path, and they're offering all of you up to
(24:17):
forty five percent off of this, plus free shipping and
a free gift. Right now, you can visit save with
Nativepath dot com slash Wellness Mama to find out what
it is and how to implement it and save up
to forty five percent. So again, that special site for
forty five percent off is save Save with Native E
(24:39):
PA t H dot com slash Wellness Mama and see
why people are adding this to the routine with amazing results.
This podcast is brought to you by by Optimizers and
in particular their product that holds my heart, which is
their Magnesium Breakthrough. My goal this year is to continue
to focus on my wellness and to create more harmony
(25:01):
and resonance. And we all know that the foundation of
health is a good night sleep. I talk about that
so much on this podcast, and magnesium is the one
nutrient that helps my sleep so much, as well as
so many other aspects of my health because magnesium is
vital for so many things within the body, and it
is nearly impossible to get enough from food anymore. And
(25:21):
magnesium Breakthrough from Bioptimizers is in a category of its own.
They have seven different forms of magnesium in one supplement,
and since magnesium is involved in over six hundred different
biochemical reactions in the body, no other supplement on the
market offers all seven types of magnesium in one bottle.
Pretty Much every function of your body is upgraded when
you take magnesium regularly, from the quality of your sleep
(25:44):
to your brain function, from metabolism to stress levels, and
so much more. This is one of the few supplements
that lives on my nightstand. And I'm a little odd,
but I take every morning because I actually get energy
from it, though most people notice that it's better at
night now. Studies point to a lot of benefits of magnesium,
including that it may help improve sleep quality, especially by
(26:04):
supporting healthy sleep onset and have more peaceful nights. My
Nusium is also involved in stress management support, and it
may help maintain energy levels and positive mood while also
supporting mental clearness and relaxation. Museum is also important for
healthy imbalanced muscle tone and providing the building blocks to
strong bones, and it promotes a balance stress response, supports relaxation,
(26:26):
and I feel much calmer when I'm regularly taking magnesium,
So let's base it. Even if you're twenty twenty five.
Resolution is not all about focusing on your health like minus,
how are you going to be able to shave your
goals in any area without enough quality sleep and stress management.
Check out Magnesium Breakthrough and make it part of your
daily routine this year as well for better sleep, better
(26:47):
stress response, and much more. They have a three hundred
and sixty five day money back guarantee and you can
find it at buy optimizers dot com, Slash Wellness Mama
and use the code Wellness Mama for a discount. So
that's b io p TI m I z e rs
dot com, slash wellness Mama and the code Wellness Mama
for a discount. You mentioned selforfane, and I would love
(27:12):
to go deeper on this because I've written about this
in the past, including how you can grow your own
brocoli sprouts, And I was originally introduced to this through
Rohnda Patrick, and at the time, my understanding was pretty
much the only way to get it in a bioavailable
form was to grow your own brocoli sprouts, and there
were all these things you could do to make them
more bioavailable and so forth. However, when I met you guys,
I found out there actually, you guys are the only
(27:34):
ones who have created a stabilized form of this for
people like me who no longer want to make brocoli
sprouts three times a week. But I feel like soulforfane
is still like a less known supplement for how beneficial
and powerful it is, So I would love to go
a little deeper on the science of soulforaphane, what makes
it so powerful and so hard to measure? As well
as like what you guys did differently to stabilize the
(27:55):
sulffhane along with the cousin molecules that make it so effective.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
Yeah, so when Rona Patrick was putting that out there,
I think that was that which was true. You could
only grow broactly sprouts to basically get a sulfuri fane.
And you know, I think there's a company where there
is a company in France that has a stabilized sulfurifraine.
They extract through kind of chemical solvents. We do it
(28:20):
through water and so you don't have the same you know, residues,
and so we think ours is better. We know ours
is better. But anyway, you know, it's a French product,
so it's a little hard to get here anyway. But
basically sulfurrofane again was discovered in nineteen ninety two. I
had to up at Chouance Hopkins. They did all much
of the research. They actually had a center called the
(28:40):
Chemo Protective Center where they would actually it was centered
around for a long time growing broccoli sprouts and disseminating
the broad free broccoli sprout liquids too that were measured
and standardized to researchers so they could do studies not
just at Hopkins, but other places since then they stopped
(29:01):
growing those, and think Jedd fayhe left Hopkins, but basically
they be ahead of the research. And so what we
did was basically what mare and we were growing enough
broccoli spouts for like ten families and in the summers
they get moldy or their shrewe flies, or if you
have to travel you miss a batch. And so anyway,
I just we're having lunch them, like, you know, it
(29:23):
would be nice if this was in the capsule. And
so I think a couple of years later we were
having lunch again. He's like, kind of a matter of factly, yeah,
I think I stabilized sulfuri faine. And so the issue
is it's not stable. So if you actually grow them
broccoli sprouts and juice them and try to extract the
sulfuri fine, it degrades and they degrades quickly within hours
(29:47):
to days, and so it's not shelf stable. And what
John did was he figured out how to stableize it
and make it shelf stabled. So basically why that's important
is because of all the things it does, and the
three main things we talk about a inflammation, it's potently
anti inflammatory and brain health. It produces a molecule called
a brain to drive noo terrific factor BDNF, which is
(30:09):
at the center of brain health. So that molecule protects
existing neurons, but it also helps grow new neurons, which
we didn't think was possible even a few years ago.
Provide a decade ago, I guess. And then also detox,
So detox is big. It's big on social media. Everyone
wants to do a detox, but there are three phases
(30:30):
to detox. Sulfurre frade works in all three phases, but
it's the best natural molecule at phase two detoxification. And
so part of that and the other side of that
is and that detox a phase two detox work goes
through something called the NRF two pathway, which does a lot.
That pathway was also responsible for turning on two hundred
(30:54):
different antiox genes that can produce two different antiox and
that's called the antax response system. And so that stays
on for seventy two hours. So if you think of
vitamin C, that's an antoxicant, right, but one vitamin C
molecule can negate one proox to it, and so and
then it's done, whereas with sulfur of fane, it just
(31:16):
keeps pumping out. Once that genees turned on, it stays
on for up to seventy two hours, and it keeps
pumping out these antioxidants. And so it's in some ways
sort of the master antioxidant because of how it can
pump out so many antioxidants. So yeah, I mean there
are more ways that sulfur effin as far as benefits
and how it works, but those are three main things
(31:38):
we talk about, and we've talked a lot about bioavailability.
Sulfuriffin has no problem with being biavailable, and so it
gets through your gut barrier and gets to the cells
that the historical issue has been that it's not stable.
And so but you know, we if you go on Amazon,
everybody has sulfurifain, but they actually it's like the Wild West.
(32:00):
They advertise they say, you know, fifty milligrams of sulfurifane,
but it actually has none. We turn it over and
look at the supplement facts. It has the molecule that
comes before sulfuriffin called glucrarafin or sulfuriffine glucosm lane. Those
are the precursor. So you have a head of broccoli,
it has glucorrafinin the precursor in that you start chewing it,
(32:21):
it breaks the cell wall, which has this enzyme called
marosinase that is released from the cell wall. It interacts
with the glucraffenin to make sulfurifane. You swell it, you
get a benefit. But again if you try to harness
that sulfur effine, historically it degrades. And so what we
bring through the market is sulfurifane in the capsule, which
(32:41):
is important because if you're just taking a capsule leukerafinin
you may get some sulfurifine benefit, you may not. It's
just it's a crap chew. And so with with our supplement,
you know what you're getting. And when we made it,
actually you know, this was eight years ago. Now we
were making it and we were noticing it was like
for all of us it was working so quickly. We
(33:02):
were like, well, like how quickly does this stuff work?
And so we did our internal study friends and family,
co workers, just to kind of do it quickly, where
basically we took ten milligrams also of our broc lead
and we did a kind of before and after, and
we saw that basically the the that one dose ten
(33:26):
milligrams reduced this aisle six about thirty percent in twenty
four hours. And so that's enough that that kind of
explained why we're all feeling so quickly. So it works quickly.
Speaker 2 (33:38):
That's amazing, And I will link to that in the
show notes so people can read more about it. You
have educational resources available as well, and I'll also link
to my blog posts where I went really deep on
soulf fane when I first learned about it and was
so excited about it. I know we're getting to the
end of our time and I could talk to you
guys all day long, but before we wrap up, I
really want to also dive into something called gel Perfect,
which I know like GLP ones have gotten their moment
(34:01):
of fame right now. I feel like they're being talked
about so widely, and they tend to also have some
downsides that maybe are not talked about as much. And
it seems like you guys have developed something that might
be a safer end, potentially very effective alternative for people,
especially who don't want to go the injectible peptide route.
And that includes some things I personally love, including EGCG
and ALA which I've taken for years. But can you
(34:23):
explain the gel Perfect supplement and what you guys put
in there from a bioavailability and synergy perspective to make
it so effective.
Speaker 1 (34:30):
So basically that with the background, like you said, we
would say the geo you want peptides or are potentially
more infamous than famous because there are some downsides. Right,
there's muscle wasting, which you don't want necessarily as we age,
we want more muscle, not less. A lot of the
weight loss is there's certainly fat loss, which is great,
(34:51):
but there's a muscle loss as well, which is not
so good. Muscle being your glucose sync and so that's important,
but also it's pricey people. What happens when people come
off of it and we realizing, you know, I think
we for years we're like, we're not doing it, We're
not going to because we think of weight loss products
as sort of sleazy, you know, people trying to sell
(35:12):
you something and they don't really work, right, and so
we're for for years we're like, we're not doing a
weight loss supplement. But just we saw like there's a
big problem, like and we're on the cusp, like it's
We're like, we're on the beginning side of seeing a
problem of people coming off of these gop ones and
what do they do? Do they want to gain weight again,
(35:33):
et cetera. So we're like, well, let's at least talk
about it. And so we talked about it, and you know,
we looked at EGCG. Some studies says it does nothing.
Some studies say it actually is does work with weight loss.
There's one study in twenty sixteen, I believe, where they
had one hundred and fifty fifteen women and they should
that it actually EGCG green tea from Green Tea actually
(35:57):
significantly impacted women's way and their BMI body mass index
as well as their cholesterol five percent decreased of cholesterol,
all good things. There's one thinking about well a mechanism.
There's one study showing EGCG decreasing the hunger hormone called
grillin forty percent in this mouse study, and so we're like,
(36:20):
let's let's try that. And so John worked on basically
a study of attaching EGCG to our patent pending protein
that basically gets it through the GUP barrier. We're like,
let's see how much more of this EGC gets through
than just regular green tea. And what we found was,
(36:41):
on a conservative side, two hundred and twenty five times
more egcg gets through your GUP barrier with our patent
pending when we attach it to this molecule. So that's
a big thing. And so actually when we started doing
sort of the initial taking ourselves, taking this product ourselves,
none of us were hungry. We're like, holy smokes, Like
(37:03):
it totally decreased the grillin and so that was that
was like, Okay, this is actually a real thing. Berberine
and lil polk acid also really really good at decreasing
bloodshed glucose spikes. That's important for a lot of different ways.
I'll let John get into and it works really well. Again,
we attached the berber into this protein that we're patenting,
(37:25):
a patentine. It's a protein and that we attach a
sea based carbohydrate to and that's sort of the magic.
But you know, both have glucose monitors and we were
taking it ourselves and our blood glucose was dropping a
lot like mine was. I tried to keep it under
one hundred and it was surprisingly one fifteen one day,
(37:47):
I took three two and a half hours later it
was seventy, which is like whoa. And so that's actually,
you know, maybe a little bit too much. But it's
also good to get your book gluicos low if you're
keto adapted. But yeah, John, I'll let you give some
of the benefits of from the blood glucose spike angle.
Speaker 3 (38:06):
I think a lot of people don't realize that the
harm that happens from just glucose being high in your
blood just in general, so that you eat, you eat
a meal that has you know, insulin inducing abilities, and
the spike in blood glucose, well that what happens is
the insulin. That's what it does, is it makes you
(38:28):
absorb the glucose that's in the circulation. So that high
glucose driven by insulin getting into the cell is the
driving force between advanced glycation and products. And basically your lipids,
your proteins are altered so that they're not functioning well
(38:48):
and so every protein, every enzyme, every lipid in the
cell is harmed and it's very hard to reverse. And
so trying to not have a spike in insulin and
not have a spike in glucose is super important for
just anybody trying to get healthy in any way. And
(39:10):
so everyone knows the chemoglobin A one C is the
measurement for diabetics, and that's basically that pathway that I
was just describing. So if you can reduce that effect,
you'll put everybody in the right trajectory towards health. And
so that was one of the big things for all
(39:32):
three of those molecules are known to decrease glucose, and
then of course I have to plug. The other supplement
is curcumen. So curcumin decreases insulin better than any other
natural compounds. So if you wanted to supercharge your GLP one,
which decreases grilling, induces GLP one if you combine that
(39:54):
with curcumin, purkumen is the best molecule in many studies,
even meta analysis, for reducing circulating insulin. And probably everybody
knows that the amount of insulin in your body is
the best predictor of longevity. Every study in animals where
you reduce the amount of insulin, they live longer. Every
(40:15):
study where insulin is higher, you live less long.
Speaker 1 (40:19):
And that's the issue with GP one peptid.
Speaker 3 (40:21):
Right, Yeah, So the molecules themselves, they are GLP one agonists,
so they aren't GLP one. They go to the receptor
and turn it on and you know, get these effects.
They're very strong effects to and one of the ways
that it will make you lose weight in a way
that ours won't is that decreases stomach emptying, so you
(40:45):
slow down digestion so it stays in your stomach and
stays in your small intestines for longer, and so that
can be a sense of satiety. So that's a mechanism,
but it's not great to just have your food churning
in your stomach for a long periods of times. Now,
that's actually if it happens outside of taking this GP
(41:08):
one agonist, that's you know, a bad finding is to
have low low stomach emptying and.
Speaker 1 (41:16):
Do the GP one agonists that they increase insulin blood insulin.
Speaker 3 (41:21):
I can't remember if it's what they do with insulin.
I'd have to look into that, but for sure you
want both glucose low. It makes losing weight easier if
you decrease grilling, which is the hunger hormone, and then
you also lower insulin. So I think that that those
are things to consider for longevity and general health.
Speaker 1 (41:44):
In the pook acid talk a little bit about it.
It's such just a I say, it's the best mal
supplement nobody talks about. We talk about it though, and
instead that's why because it does so well with mitigating
blood glucose spikes. We included that and does it in
a different way than burbering include to that into the
geoperfect So yeah, we've gotten some great reviews from it.
(42:06):
It's not like John said, those theopi ones are super potent.
It's when that's not We don't have that, you know,
but it's a natural it's it does work, and so
we you know, we just suggest people that try because
we have a unconditional money back guarantee. If it doesn't work,
it's fine refund to you.
Speaker 3 (42:25):
So yeah, I would say one piece of information is
probably unknown that I'm really super excited about is if
you can get burberine, asked the intestinal barrier which putting
it onto our proprietary carrier, does you can get the
molecule inside cells? Berberine is actually this gene called semic inhibited,
(42:48):
and that would be different then then even the other
molecules for weight loss, and semic is a transcription factor
that regulates glucose metabolism and once it's inside to sell,
so the seemic turns on all the glycolytic enzymes or
basically a fermentation, So when you don't have enough oxygen,
(43:12):
you'll switch over to running off of glucose and affermentation
like manner and so seemics can actually block that pathway
that's generally not good. So that would be something that's
different than a GLP one agon us and be beneficial
for lots of different things inhibiting semic.
Speaker 2 (43:32):
Amazing well, I feel like I learned so much from
you guys. Every time we chat, I'll make sure I
link to everything you guys have mentioned in the show
notes so people can keep learning and go deeper and
get the products. These are ones I take regularly and
have definitely felt a difference from and for today's episode.
I hope we get to do more in the future,
but for today, I'm so deeply grateful for your time,
for all that you've shared, and for how much I've
(43:53):
learned today. Thank you both so much for being.
Speaker 1 (43:56):
Here, Hetie, thanks so much for having us, And as always,
I think you for your very good questions.
Speaker 3 (44:02):
Yeah, I had a great time.
Speaker 2 (44:03):
Thank you, and thank you as always for listening and
sharing your most valuable resources, your time, your energy, and
your attention with us today. We're all so grateful that
you did and I hope that you will join me
again on the next episode of the Wellness MoMA podcast.
If you're enjoying these interviews, would you please take two
minutes to leave a rating or review on iTunes for me.
(44:25):
Doing this helps more people to find the podcast, which
means even more moms and families can benefit from the information.
I really appreciate your time and thanks as always for listening.
Well, on to My Body's podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
This episode is brought to you by Native Path and
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So that's b io P T I, M I Z
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code Wellness Mama for a discount. Hello and welcome to
the Wellness Mama Podcast. I'm Katie from wellnesswama dot com
(04:22):
and I am back today with David Roberts and John
Jildea from Mara Labs to talk about selfor fane understanding
supplements and the science of bioavailability. And if you have
not heard from these guys before, I love learning from them.
John is a Johns Hopkins train PhD. With sixty scientific
publications from over twenty NIH funded studies. He is an
(04:44):
expert in cell culture exosomes, performing all the science behind
the gut supplement you may have heard of called Restore.
He was also instrumental in the initial stabilization of sulforafane
in a product called broccoly which I take. And David
Roberts Holton MPH from Johns Hopkins, a master's in b
from UVA and a bachelor's from Duke Key, has more
than twenty years of public health experience on three continents,
(05:06):
and he co founded the gut supplement Restore. In this episode,
we go deep on synergy, bioavailability, what to look for
in supplements, red flags and supplements, and so much more.
I always learn so much from these two. Let's join
them now. David and John, welcome back. Thanks for being
here again.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
It's great to be here, Katie. Thanks for having us again.
Speaker 2 (05:27):
Well, if you guys missed it, I'm going to link
to our first episode in the show notes. That one
was all about salt. I learned a whole lot and
definitely have some action steps I will be experimenting with
in my own life immediately after that conversation. I have
a feeling the same will be true for this conversation,
because anytime I talk to you guys, I learn so much,
and I know this conversation will be no exception. And
(05:47):
we're going to dive into the science of supplements, bioavailability,
understanding what's actually in our supplements, and how to choose
good ones. I know this is a big and broad topic.
Maybe as some background, We're definitely going to get into
the ones that are good and the ones you guys
have created specifically. But before we get there, can you
walk us through maybe some red flags to be aware
of when it comes to buying supplements, looking for supplements,
(06:10):
and maybe things people might not know to be cautious about.
Speaker 1 (06:13):
That's a big question. I'll start and then John could
jump in. So basically, the first thing to keep in
mind is what's in the capsule, and so there are
fillers typically in the capsule, and there are flow agents
that are in the capsule, and on the extreme amount,
like there is a sleep supplement. I'm not going to
mention it. But if somebody we both know, Katie, sixty
(06:35):
percent of the capsule was filler. It was like filled
with P protein and inflow agent, and then forty percent
was the actual molecule that they're selling. And so that
brings up, so what's in the capsule and what's the
amount of the things that you're trying to get. So
this was sleep supplement has like five HDP and it
was hardly any It wasn't enough that was going to
(06:57):
actually move the needle with their suggests to serving size.
And so you know those are two things. Is what's
in the supplement and is the amount that you're getting
in your serving size actually going to do anything? What
do you think?
Speaker 3 (07:10):
Yeah, that's a good point. I would guess that the
way I look at the supplement industry is that I
made the ones that I thought were missing. I still
have a bunch more that I want to make. But
to make the connection between cell culture studies and what
you should put in your mouth is sort of an
entire world on its own. So going from your mouth
(07:32):
to the cellar you're trying to affect is super important, important,
And when you look at cell culture studies, where you
take a product like percumen and you see this unbelievable
effect on an F cappa B or literally any en cancer,
any molecular and signaling pathway. You're looking at. Kin just
(07:54):
looks like it should be the best molecule on earth.
But biovailability of curricumen is so low. It's unbelievably low,
and so there's been a bunch of studies that are
positive from just taking regular curcumen. So my interpretation of
that is that you're affecting just the cells that are
(08:16):
lining your intestines. And I don't want to boohoo that,
because that's an important part of decreasing inflammation, is the
cells that are lining your intestine and your colon. So
that's important to decrease inflammation in that realm. But if
you want to get inflammation reduced anywhere else in your
(08:37):
whole body, you have to get it asked the intestines
and in high enough concentration to actually have therapeutic effect
at the cells you're trying to get it to. So
that's what we were designing. We knew what concentration that
we want to get to at the cell, and that's
(08:57):
how we dose our products. So that we know that
a gets at the concentration that affects basically signaling, and
then we test in a person that it affects that
that cell type for kurkumen. When we developed our product,
we knew that we wanted to get to a highness
concentration in order to inhibit AIL six. Very good marker
(09:18):
for this the target of Kirkman, which is nfkappa B.
It's a master regulator of inflammation, and so that's how
we formulated that product. Another important aspect of this is
that we're looking for synergies. So there's a lot of
synergies out there that are sort of very unrecognized, and
(09:41):
so if you can if you can't get you know,
fifty micro mole of kirkumen to a cell, it's just
not possible right now, how would you do that? So
our strategy is that you combine a couple of other
things together that all work in different halfways in order
to inhibit n F capab. And so that is a
(10:04):
clear one that we've shown for sulforaphane. Sulforaphane inhibits n
F kapab, curcumen inhibits n F capab, aristratin inhibits f CAPAB,
but they all do it by different mechanisms and they're synergistic.
So even a lower concentration, if you take two of them,
are affecting the end pathway in a therapeutic way. And
(10:27):
that is sort of how we've designed all our supplements,
and so I probably should talk about the other side
is what are things that I won't be formulating and
selling from here. And they're all the ones that if
you just do a mass spect analysis of the product
(10:48):
and it has the amount that's in there, and that
product is had a dose that doesn't have any problem
with bioavailability, that product is fine. And there's a large
number of supplements out there that you don't have to
have a special formulation for just the right dose. And
so I wish there was a list somewhere. Maybe we'll
(11:10):
work on that sometime as just a list of supplements
that don't have any problem with bioavailability and that you
can take that and you can basically assume that you're
going to match the studies using that supplement.
Speaker 1 (11:22):
Yeah, I mean it's important because I mean we got
into this because both of our wives had cancer and
basically looking at their cells in our lab, especially my
wife Maura. But like you see, like Kirkman was number
one and killing your type of cancer. There are like
dozens of papers on how Kirkyman kill is great for cancer.
(11:45):
But then like, how do you know what you take
is actually getting to the cells and it wasn't. And
so coming up with actually, over a lunch conversation, if
you remember that, coming up with a way to get
the Kirkuman attached to something, to get it through the
gut barrier into the blood to the cells in so
(12:05):
that what you read in those studies actually can happen.
And that's like what we've been researching and studying and
trying to make happen. And the whole idea of synergy
so additive, if it's additive, it's one plus one equals two,
so it's what you would expect. But a synergistic effect
one plus one equals five, you know, or ten, and
(12:26):
so it's much larger than the individual's effect than the
individuals combined. And so what John's saying is you can
by combining these supplements, we're finding that you can get
a much larger effect than is possible if you just
take one of the compounds and that's through that because
(12:46):
they're working at different angles, and he was talking to anfocapopy.
That's the holy grail of information. A lot of the
pharmaceutical companies, that's the target they're aiming for when they're
creating an anti ins laboratory. And so the fact that
we have some natural compounds that really impact that is huge.
Speaker 2 (13:04):
Yeah, this is such a fascinating concept to me. And
I know we hear those terms like bioavailability and synergistic
tossed arounds, but I feel like most people don't have
a deep understanding of those or even know how to
analyze in the scope of supplements if what they're taking
is going to have those properties or not how much
they're actually absorbing. I know some of that feels very ambiguous,
and I would love to kind of get each of
(13:25):
your perspectives and of course hopefully touch on some of
the ones you've gotten to formulate as well. But from
your perspective, what are some of the general kind of
highest ROI compounds that we can take as humans. I
know there's some bio individuality here, but in general, what
are some of the highest roi and or what are
someones to generally avoid or that you would say like
we're not getting a good bang for the buck, or
(13:46):
that we're not absorbing most likely.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
Yeah, I mean, so basically Kirkcuman has less than one
percent by availability. And so the blessing and the curse
of the supplement industry is that it's not regulated, and
so people can say things and they you have to
be truthful, but like if you're not truthful, then somebody
actually has to cough up the money the cash to
(14:09):
sue you unless they actually see this. And so basically
everyone says they have the best Kirkuman on the market,
everybody across the board. You go on Amazon, we have
the best Kurkuman here, and you know because we have
we combine it with black pepper or something of that.
And so, but what's the truth. And so basically the
truth is, you know, even biovail quote unquote bioavailable, So
(14:33):
kurk supplements don't get enough Kirkman through the gut barrier
to make a biological difference. And then if you're taking turmeric,
you know which one's biological difference I should say outside
of the GI tract. Inside the GI tract, it could
be great. We did find one curcumin that has three
(14:54):
percent kurkumen ninety seven percent detergent, and that actually gets
through the gut barrier amazingly. But how it does it
is it's just really the detergent irritates the gut so
much that makes it permeable and the kirkman gets through.
And so what ends up happening is it you just
get a instead of reducing your inflammation, you get a
(15:15):
massive spike in the inflammation, which in ile si in
terms of Bisle six. But kirkumin is lipid soluble. It's
fat soluble. Kirkuman, reseratrol, ten, burbering, e GCG are five
things that are lipid soluble. Can you think of anything
else in the city. Yeah, there's a bunch of them
(15:36):
A seventeen seventeen. Those five are the ones we used regularly.
But basically, unless you're attaching it to something to get
it through the gup barrier, it's not happening. And so
the technology we're bringing to the market is and we're
showing it, we can prove it that it's actually getting
these compounds to the cells and making them in a
(15:59):
biologically relevan way, so you can impact your biology and
feel the difference. You can feel a difference pretty quickly,
even within one serving.
Speaker 3 (16:08):
I think because of our reason for getting interested in supplements,
we ended up finding out which ones were the most
effective at the cell through our screening, because we put
on a couple hundred natural compounds onto these cells to
see which ones actually affect pathways the best. And when
(16:29):
you run into the fact that they're super effective but
not bioavailable, we call that the lowest hanging fruit in
the supplement industry. Is that you have a supplement that's
already proved in thousands and thousands of papers to function
in the correct way. Everyone knows that inflammation is driving
aging and chronic disease. But if you're not getting any
(16:53):
pasta gut barrier, you're missing out on the vast majority
of cells in your body. And so that would be
super low hanging fruit. Curcumin sort of from a researcher's
mind that reads lots and lots of papers, So when
I read the curcuman literature, there's there's many papers out
there comparing all the different curcumens, and so me, being
(17:14):
a bench scientist person that actually does the testing, I
feel like I'm useless unless I'm actually doing experiments with
my hands. When I read those papers, I see a
glaring problem in the research. And the glaring problem is
nobody studies curcumen. They don't measure curcumen. The prevailing way
all of those studies are measured is you take a
(17:37):
curcumin product, you extract blood, and then you have to
rip off the in the case of curcumen, the glucoronidation
and sulfation that happens to curcumen when it goes through
the liver. And the problem is those two forms of
(17:59):
curcumins have no activity. So why are we measuring the
amount of sulfated and glucoronidated percumen in the blood if
that has no function? So we measure curcumin. And it's
just the bottom line if you if you can, if
you can't get percumen into the blood and without messing
(18:25):
up the barrier that you are getting it through, I
think you'd be better off just taking regular curcumen that's
not absorbed.
Speaker 1 (18:33):
Yeah, and so like I just to answer the ROI
what's a supplement that to gives your ear biggest bank
for the buck? I mean, one thing you can think
about is what's a supplement that does a lot of
different things at once. And so the one that comes
to mind, I mean probably because we make it exel it,
(18:54):
but because we research it also is sulfurr of fame
has thirty seven I think, or as it thirty nine
thirty nine different pro health mechanisms in the literature, two
thousand papers, a lot of them from JOHNS. Hopkins, the
molecules discovered at John Hopkins. But like that's a lot,
you know, and I'm not sure, and they're not just
you know, little things, they're huge things. And so anyway,
(19:17):
that's that would be one biggest bang for the buck.
And I know because of the synergistic again there's that
word way they work together is you know, curcum and
selfurffing together do amazing things. And so you know, that's
that would be a one suggestions. Sorry, they're our products.
Speaker 3 (19:40):
I have one that I can probably plug that I
tell a lot of people to take. It's because one
of my nutrition heroes sort of wrote the first paper,
and that's Bruce Ames. Yeah, Bruce Ames is the most
referenced researcher in history as far as I know, at
least that was a short time ago, and he's the
person that discovered arcinogenicity, and so the AIM's assay is
(20:04):
how you determine if something's a carcinogen. Well, it's amazing
that he did the original study that's so referenced, but
then through the rest of his career he came up
with this idea that it's nutrient deficiencies that are actually
driving chronic disease and not actually oxins or carcinogens that
(20:26):
he's famous for. So when a person is is that influential.
I think most people now agree that it's both toxins
and nutrient deficiencies that are driving chronic disease. He came
up with a supplement mixture that I think works in
a huge number of people and there's no problem with bioavailability.
(20:47):
And this is a particular nervous system supplement, the combination
of lapoic acid alpha lapoic acid with acetyl l carnatine.
And so he showed in animals that it reduced the
cognitive age of old rats by half. They started performing
like rats were that were half their age. And so
(21:11):
it's just a one two punch of getting carnetine inside
cells and lapolic acid, which is a factor for oxidative metabolism,
and people would be it would be really good for
them to listen to this guy because he has a
lot to say. And he discovered what's called a cory bar.
(21:32):
Cory bar has all of the micronutrients and minerals that
he found were deficient in population. So he wanted he
made this thing called the Corey bar, did a number
of studies for it to plug up all the holes
that he found in nutrient deficiencies.
Speaker 1 (21:49):
Yeah, a lot of those lines caliber. If you can
take those as supplements, or you can take those as
just a diet. You know, in your diet, I like
to grind up and so they what that does is
it's that liver is the most nutrient dense food we
can get, so you're getting a lot of the If
you're wanting to make sure you're not nutrient deficient, that's
(22:09):
a way to do it. And we both buy cows
and have cow livers. You can just grade it into
like keep it frozen, graded into ground beef, could do
about ten percent. We both have the children. If you
have about ten percent of your ground beef as liver,
you can't taste the difference, especially if you spice it.
If you start approaching more than that, then they can
(22:29):
tell that they'd all like it. But we also use pluck,
which is a spice, but it also has its freezing,
it can has tree stride organs. I use that Naturals.
We don't sell that brand. It's Chriss Crasher's brand, and
they have a organ as well as a multi vitamin.
So ways to make sure you're not nutrient deficient.
Speaker 2 (22:50):
These are so many good tips in that one response.
This episode is brought to you by Native Path and
in particular something I have been experimenting with and really
really loving lately. And here's what you need to understand.
A lot of us think calcium is important for our health,
especially for our bone, but this is actually true bad news.
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It turns out maybe not, or at least there's more
nuance here. One of the largest bone health studies ever
conducted followed thousands of women taking calcium and oral vitamin
D daily and the results were surprising, but not in
the way you would think. They saw no significant reduction
in their risk of fractures, and they saw no improved
bone density. So all those calcium pills might not be
(23:34):
doing what we think and it turns out they might
actually be counterproductive. But here's where it gets interesting. A
brand new study found that women who did one thing
every morning consistently for six months gained seven percent bone density,
which is massive. This is the same amount of bone
mass the average person loses over the course of five
years after a certain age. So what did they do.
(23:55):
It was not a medication or even a workout. Came
down to one simple thing added to their morning routine.
And that's why a lot of people, especially people over fifty,
are making this one simple change and seeing massive results.
I'm sure you're probably curious what it is, and it's
a particular protein from one of my favorite brands called
Native Path, and they're offering all of you up to
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This podcast is brought to you by by Optimizers and
in particular their product that holds my heart, which is
their Magnesium Breakthrough. My goal this year is to continue
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(25:01):
and resonance. And we all know that the foundation of
health is a good night sleep. I talk about that
so much on this podcast, and magnesium is the one
nutrient that helps my sleep so much, as well as
so many other aspects of my health because magnesium is
vital for so many things within the body, and it
is nearly impossible to get enough from food anymore. And
(25:21):
magnesium Breakthrough from Bioptimizers is in a category of its own.
They have seven different forms of magnesium in one supplement,
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Pretty Much every function of your body is upgraded when
you take magnesium regularly, from the quality of your sleep
(25:44):
to your brain function, from metabolism to stress levels, and
so much more. This is one of the few supplements
that lives on my nightstand. And I'm a little odd,
but I take every morning because I actually get energy
from it, though most people notice that it's better at
night now. Studies point to a lot of benefits of magnesium,
including that it may help improve sleep quality, especially by
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for a discount. You mentioned selforfane, and I would love
(27:12):
to go deeper on this because I've written about this
in the past, including how you can grow your own
brocoli sprouts, And I was originally introduced to this through
Rohnda Patrick, and at the time, my understanding was pretty
much the only way to get it in a bioavailable
form was to grow your own brocoli sprouts, and there
were all these things you could do to make them
more bioavailable and so forth. However, when I met you guys,
I found out there actually, you guys are the only
(27:34):
ones who have created a stabilized form of this for
people like me who no longer want to make brocoli
sprouts three times a week. But I feel like soulforfane
is still like a less known supplement for how beneficial
and powerful it is, So I would love to go
a little deeper on the science of soulforaphane, what makes
it so powerful and so hard to measure? As well
as like what you guys did differently to stabilize the
(27:55):
sulffhane along with the cousin molecules that make it so effective.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
Yeah, so when Rona Patrick was putting that out there,
I think that was that which was true. You could
only grow broactly sprouts to basically get a sulfuri fane.
And you know, I think there's a company where there
is a company in France that has a stabilized sulfurifraine.
They extract through kind of chemical solvents. We do it
(28:20):
through water and so you don't have the same you know, residues,
and so we think ours is better. We know ours
is better. But anyway, you know, it's a French product,
so it's a little hard to get here anyway. But
basically sulfurrofane again was discovered in nineteen ninety two. I
had to up at Chouance Hopkins. They did all much
of the research. They actually had a center called the
(28:40):
Chemo Protective Center where they would actually it was centered
around for a long time growing broccoli sprouts and disseminating
the broad free broccoli sprout liquids too that were measured
and standardized to researchers so they could do studies not
just at Hopkins, but other places since then they stopped
(29:01):
growing those, and think Jedd fayhe left Hopkins, but basically
they be ahead of the research. And so what we
did was basically what mare and we were growing enough
broccoli spouts for like ten families and in the summers
they get moldy or their shrewe flies, or if you
have to travel you miss a batch. And so anyway,
I just we're having lunch them, like, you know, it
(29:23):
would be nice if this was in the capsule. And
so I think a couple of years later we were
having lunch again. He's like, kind of a matter of factly, yeah,
I think I stabilized sulfuri faine. And so the issue
is it's not stable. So if you actually grow them
broccoli sprouts and juice them and try to extract the
sulfuri fine, it degrades and they degrades quickly within hours
(29:47):
to days, and so it's not shelf stable. And what
John did was he figured out how to stableize it
and make it shelf stabled. So basically why that's important
is because of all the things it does, and the
three main things we talk about a inflammation, it's potently
anti inflammatory and brain health. It produces a molecule called
a brain to drive noo terrific factor BDNF, which is
(30:09):
at the center of brain health. So that molecule protects
existing neurons, but it also helps grow new neurons, which
we didn't think was possible even a few years ago.
Provide a decade ago, I guess. And then also detox,
So detox is big. It's big on social media. Everyone
wants to do a detox, but there are three phases
(30:30):
to detox. Sulfurre frade works in all three phases, but
it's the best natural molecule at phase two detoxification. And
so part of that and the other side of that
is and that detox a phase two detox work goes
through something called the NRF two pathway, which does a lot.
That pathway was also responsible for turning on two hundred
(30:54):
different antiox genes that can produce two different antiox and
that's called the antax response system. And so that stays
on for seventy two hours. So if you think of
vitamin C, that's an antoxicant, right, but one vitamin C
molecule can negate one proox to it, and so and
then it's done, whereas with sulfur of fane, it just
(31:16):
keeps pumping out. Once that genees turned on, it stays
on for up to seventy two hours, and it keeps
pumping out these antioxidants. And so it's in some ways
sort of the master antioxidant because of how it can
pump out so many antioxidants. So yeah, I mean there
are more ways that sulfur effin as far as benefits
and how it works, but those are three main things
(31:38):
we talk about, and we've talked a lot about bioavailability.
Sulfuriffin has no problem with being biavailable, and so it
gets through your gut barrier and gets to the cells
that the historical issue has been that it's not stable.
And so but you know, we if you go on Amazon,
everybody has sulfurifain, but they actually it's like the Wild West.
(32:00):
They advertise they say, you know, fifty milligrams of sulfurifane,
but it actually has none. We turn it over and
look at the supplement facts. It has the molecule that
comes before sulfuriffin called glucrarafin or sulfuriffine glucosm lane. Those
are the precursor. So you have a head of broccoli,
it has glucorrafinin the precursor in that you start chewing it,
(32:21):
it breaks the cell wall, which has this enzyme called
marosinase that is released from the cell wall. It interacts
with the glucraffenin to make sulfurifane. You swell it, you
get a benefit. But again if you try to harness
that sulfur effine, historically it degrades. And so what we
bring through the market is sulfurifane in the capsule, which
(32:41):
is important because if you're just taking a capsule leukerafinin
you may get some sulfurifine benefit, you may not. It's
just it's a crap chew. And so with with our supplement,
you know what you're getting. And when we made it,
actually you know, this was eight years ago. Now we
were making it and we were noticing it was like
for all of us it was working so quickly. We
(33:02):
were like, well, like how quickly does this stuff work?
And so we did our internal study friends and family,
co workers, just to kind of do it quickly, where
basically we took ten milligrams also of our broc lead
and we did a kind of before and after, and
we saw that basically the the that one dose ten
(33:26):
milligrams reduced this aisle six about thirty percent in twenty
four hours. And so that's enough that that kind of
explained why we're all feeling so quickly. So it works quickly.
Speaker 2 (33:38):
That's amazing, And I will link to that in the
show notes so people can read more about it. You
have educational resources available as well, and I'll also link
to my blog posts where I went really deep on
soulf fane when I first learned about it and was
so excited about it. I know we're getting to the
end of our time and I could talk to you
guys all day long, but before we wrap up, I
really want to also dive into something called gel Perfect,
which I know like GLP ones have gotten their moment
(34:01):
of fame right now. I feel like they're being talked
about so widely, and they tend to also have some
downsides that maybe are not talked about as much. And
it seems like you guys have developed something that might
be a safer end, potentially very effective alternative for people,
especially who don't want to go the injectible peptide route.
And that includes some things I personally love, including EGCG
and ALA which I've taken for years. But can you
(34:23):
explain the gel Perfect supplement and what you guys put
in there from a bioavailability and synergy perspective to make
it so effective.
Speaker 1 (34:30):
So basically that with the background, like you said, we
would say the geo you want peptides or are potentially
more infamous than famous because there are some downsides. Right,
there's muscle wasting, which you don't want necessarily as we age,
we want more muscle, not less. A lot of the
weight loss is there's certainly fat loss, which is great,
(34:51):
but there's a muscle loss as well, which is not
so good. Muscle being your glucose sync and so that's important,
but also it's pricey people. What happens when people come
off of it and we realizing, you know, I think
we for years we're like, we're not doing it, We're
not going to because we think of weight loss products
as sort of sleazy, you know, people trying to sell
(35:12):
you something and they don't really work, right, and so
we're for for years we're like, we're not doing a
weight loss supplement. But just we saw like there's a
big problem, like and we're on the cusp, like it's
We're like, we're on the beginning side of seeing a
problem of people coming off of these gop ones and
what do they do? Do they want to gain weight again,
(35:33):
et cetera. So we're like, well, let's at least talk
about it. And so we talked about it, and you know,
we looked at EGCG. Some studies says it does nothing.
Some studies say it actually is does work with weight loss.
There's one study in twenty sixteen, I believe, where they
had one hundred and fifty fifteen women and they should
that it actually EGCG green tea from Green Tea actually
(35:57):
significantly impacted women's way and their BMI body mass index
as well as their cholesterol five percent decreased of cholesterol,
all good things. There's one thinking about well a mechanism.
There's one study showing EGCG decreasing the hunger hormone called
grillin forty percent in this mouse study, and so we're like,
(36:20):
let's let's try that. And so John worked on basically
a study of attaching EGCG to our patent pending protein
that basically gets it through the GUP barrier. We're like,
let's see how much more of this EGC gets through
than just regular green tea. And what we found was,
(36:41):
on a conservative side, two hundred and twenty five times
more egcg gets through your GUP barrier with our patent
pending when we attach it to this molecule. So that's
a big thing. And so actually when we started doing
sort of the initial taking ourselves, taking this product ourselves,
none of us were hungry. We're like, holy smokes, Like
(37:03):
it totally decreased the grillin and so that was that
was like, Okay, this is actually a real thing. Berberine
and lil polk acid also really really good at decreasing
bloodshed glucose spikes. That's important for a lot of different ways.
I'll let John get into and it works really well. Again,
we attached the berber into this protein that we're patenting,
(37:25):
a patentine. It's a protein and that we attach a
sea based carbohydrate to and that's sort of the magic.
But you know, both have glucose monitors and we were
taking it ourselves and our blood glucose was dropping a
lot like mine was. I tried to keep it under
one hundred and it was surprisingly one fifteen one day,
(37:47):
I took three two and a half hours later it
was seventy, which is like whoa. And so that's actually,
you know, maybe a little bit too much. But it's
also good to get your book gluicos low if you're
keto adapted. But yeah, John, I'll let you give some
of the benefits of from the blood glucose spike angle.
Speaker 3 (38:06):
I think a lot of people don't realize that the
harm that happens from just glucose being high in your
blood just in general, so that you eat, you eat
a meal that has you know, insulin inducing abilities, and
the spike in blood glucose, well that what happens is
the insulin. That's what it does, is it makes you
(38:28):
absorb the glucose that's in the circulation. So that high
glucose driven by insulin getting into the cell is the
driving force between advanced glycation and products. And basically your lipids,
your proteins are altered so that they're not functioning well
(38:48):
and so every protein, every enzyme, every lipid in the
cell is harmed and it's very hard to reverse. And
so trying to not have a spike in insulin and
not have a spike in glucose is super important for
just anybody trying to get healthy in any way. And
(39:10):
so everyone knows the chemoglobin A one C is the
measurement for diabetics, and that's basically that pathway that I
was just describing. So if you can reduce that effect,
you'll put everybody in the right trajectory towards health. And
so that was one of the big things for all
(39:32):
three of those molecules are known to decrease glucose, and
then of course I have to plug. The other supplement
is curcumen. So curcumin decreases insulin better than any other
natural compounds. So if you wanted to supercharge your GLP one,
which decreases grilling, induces GLP one if you combine that
(39:54):
with curcumin, purkumen is the best molecule in many studies,
even meta analysis, for reducing circulating insulin. And probably everybody
knows that the amount of insulin in your body is
the best predictor of longevity. Every study in animals where
you reduce the amount of insulin, they live longer. Every
(40:15):
study where insulin is higher, you live less long.
Speaker 1 (40:19):
And that's the issue with GP one peptid.
Speaker 3 (40:21):
Right, Yeah, So the molecules themselves, they are GLP one agonists,
so they aren't GLP one. They go to the receptor
and turn it on and you know, get these effects.
They're very strong effects to and one of the ways
that it will make you lose weight in a way
that ours won't is that decreases stomach emptying, so you
(40:45):
slow down digestion so it stays in your stomach and
stays in your small intestines for longer, and so that
can be a sense of satiety. So that's a mechanism,
but it's not great to just have your food churning
in your stomach for a long periods of times. Now,
that's actually if it happens outside of taking this GP
(41:08):
one agonist, that's you know, a bad finding is to
have low low stomach emptying and.
Speaker 1 (41:16):
Do the GP one agonists that they increase insulin blood insulin.
Speaker 3 (41:21):
I can't remember if it's what they do with insulin.
I'd have to look into that, but for sure you
want both glucose low. It makes losing weight easier if
you decrease grilling, which is the hunger hormone, and then
you also lower insulin. So I think that that those
are things to consider for longevity and general health.
Speaker 1 (41:44):
In the pook acid talk a little bit about it.
It's such just a I say, it's the best mal
supplement nobody talks about. We talk about it though, and
instead that's why because it does so well with mitigating
blood glucose spikes. We included that and does it in
a different way than burbering include to that into the
geoperfect So yeah, we've gotten some great reviews from it.
(42:06):
It's not like John said, those theopi ones are super potent.
It's when that's not We don't have that, you know,
but it's a natural it's it does work, and so
we you know, we just suggest people that try because
we have a unconditional money back guarantee. If it doesn't work,
it's fine refund to you.
Speaker 3 (42:25):
So yeah, I would say one piece of information is
probably unknown that I'm really super excited about is if
you can get burberine, asked the intestinal barrier which putting
it onto our proprietary carrier, does you can get the
molecule inside cells? Berberine is actually this gene called semic inhibited,
(42:48):
and that would be different then then even the other
molecules for weight loss, and semic is a transcription factor
that regulates glucose metabolism and once it's inside to sell,
so the seemic turns on all the glycolytic enzymes or
basically a fermentation, So when you don't have enough oxygen,
(43:12):
you'll switch over to running off of glucose and affermentation
like manner and so seemics can actually block that pathway
that's generally not good. So that would be something that's
different than a GLP one agon us and be beneficial
for lots of different things inhibiting semic.
Speaker 2 (43:32):
Amazing well, I feel like I learned so much from
you guys. Every time we chat, I'll make sure I
link to everything you guys have mentioned in the show
notes so people can keep learning and go deeper and
get the products. These are ones I take regularly and
have definitely felt a difference from and for today's episode.
I hope we get to do more in the future,
but for today, I'm so deeply grateful for your time,
for all that you've shared, and for how much I've
(43:53):
learned today. Thank you both so much for being.
Speaker 1 (43:56):
Here, Hetie, thanks so much for having us, And as always,
I think you for your very good questions.
Speaker 3 (44:02):
Yeah, I had a great time.
Speaker 2 (44:03):
Thank you, and thank you as always for listening and
sharing your most valuable resources, your time, your energy, and
your attention with us today. We're all so grateful that
you did and I hope that you will join me
again on the next episode of the Wellness MoMA podcast.
If you're enjoying these interviews, would you please take two
minutes to leave a rating or review on iTunes for me.
(44:25):
Doing this helps more people to find the podcast, which
means even more moms and families can benefit from the information.
I really appreciate your time and thanks as always for listening.
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