September 28, 2023 • 43 mins
This week on the podcast we are joined by Hannah Dixon. Hannah is a VA and Freelancer Coach, Recruiter, and the Founder of Digital Nomad Kit. Committed to creating a more equitable future through the freedom and accessibility of freelancing, her teachings have readied 27,000 learners in over 170 countries to work with leading entrepreneurs across all industries. With 15 years as a full-time digital nomad, her insights are highly sought-after, contributing regularly to publications like Business Insider and Forbes, and delivering global talks on her areas of expertise. In this episode of the podcast, Hannah shares a bit about her travel story and how she got into working as a VA, why she created Digital Nomad Kit, why becoming a VA is a great career for travelers and digital nomads, tips for getting started as a VA, and much more! This episode is jam packed with goodness! Enjoy! In this episode:
- Hannah’s travel origin story
- Hannah’s discovering of remote work, the ability to work online, and how it changed the course of her career
- Finding VA opportunities early on in Hannah’s career
- The shift of being a virtual assistant and turning it into your own business and community
- The locations and countries Hannah has been staying since starting a career as a VA
- Tips for those who may be interested in starting a career as a VA and where to start
- Balancing productivity of your business while traveling
- The method of choosing a destination and how long the stay should be
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:02):
Hello, and welcome to the WorldWanders podcast, a proud part of the
wander Barn podcast network. I'm Ryan, I'm Amanda, and we're your hosts.
We're a traveling couple and digital nomads, taking you on our adventures as
we explore locations, destinations, andcareers. Enjoy the show. Hello everyone,
and welcome back to another episode ofthe World Wanders podcast. I'm really
(00:24):
excited that you're joining us for today'sepisode of the show, and today on
the podcast, I'm really excited tobe joined by Hannah Dixon. Hannah is
a virtual assistant or VA and freelancecoach, recruiter and the founder of Digital
Nomad Kit. She's committed to creatinga more equitable future through the freedom and
accessibility of freelancing, and her teachingshave readied over twenty seven thousand learners in
(00:48):
over one hundred and seventy countries towork with leading entrepreneurs across all industries.
With fifteen years as a full timedigital nomad, her insights are highly sought.
After contributing regularly to publications like BusinessInsider and Forbes and delivering global talks
on her areas of expertise in thisepisode of the podcast, Hannah shares a
bit about her travel story and howshe got into working as a VA,
(01:11):
why she created Digital Nomad Kit,why becoming a VA is a great career
for travelers and digital nomads, tipsfor getting started as a VA, and
much more. She shares so muchgood stuff, and I just really appreciated
how open she was and how willingshe was to share tips for those of
you who are wanting to work remotelybut maybe don't know what your skills,
(01:32):
your passions are, or how youcan apply those online. She's got lots
of tips and tricks for that,especially related to the world of being a
virtual assistant. So I hope thatyou enjoyed this episode, and without further
ado, here is Hannah. Hannah, Welcome to the show. I'm really
excited to have you here with metoday. Thank you for having me.
Yeah, I'm excited, and it'sactually kind of fun for me because usually
(01:53):
I have to share the mike withRyan, and I'm excited to not have
to do that today. Hell yeah, I get to ask all the questions
I want to ask. Can youshare with listeners where you're joining us from.
Yes, I'm in Portavaiata, rightnow in Mexico. Amazing, And
where are you from? Originally?I grew up in the UK. I'm
an American set of fun and livinghere in Mexico. Now, Okay,
(02:15):
that's cool. I feel like weneed to get into all things that plus
you know how you ended up inMexico and all the things you do.
But maybe we can let's back upand talk about, you know, your
kind of introduction to travel. Canyou share a little bit about your I
guess travel origin story. You couldsay, yeah, sure. So when
I was I want to say fifteen, I think I was in the UK
(02:37):
and I was leaving for the schoolholidays. You get six weeks in the
UK, and my teacher said tome I must have been sixteen. I
think I was sixteen. And myteacher, who was like a great mentor
to me, I was like,you know, the nerdy, bullied kid
who stayed with a teacher at lunchtime. So I was always of this
teacher. I said, what areyou going to do for the holidays?
I said, I don't know,maybe get like a weekend job or something.
(02:58):
And she said, you know,you can get a pass for and
travel if you want. You cango around Europe, and I was like,
what, Oh my god, Ican get a passport and I can
go on my own to Europe.So I did. I got my passport
and I did one of those InterRailtrips around Europe, and that was the
beginning of a lifelong journey. Really, it kind of just sparked something in
there that just rang so true.I left school, I didn't go to
(03:20):
university. I started traveling. Longstory very short, got into a very
abusive relationship, which also then helpedme propel back out into the world traveling
because my escape was literally getting ontothe road, something I wanted to do
anyway, So it just came easierand I started my journey with work exchanges,
so working on bars, farms,hostels. I worked with husky dogs
(03:42):
for a long time in Austria.So that's kind of how I sustained my
travel in the beginning days, atthe beginning years, really, and that's
really it. Yeah, it's kindof my entire adult life has been traveling.
Yeah, I mean, even likeyour late teens, which is so
cool to have this introduction of like, hey, I could go do this
thing and then just fall in lovewith that and do it. Basically for
the rest of your life, whichis really cool. And you kind of
(04:05):
talked about like doing the work andtravel thing, but maybe in a way
that that we kind of had todo it. I guess at this point,
like there wasn't remote work as muchat that point. I'm curious,
at what point did you kind ofdiscover like remote work, like the ability
to work online. So I actuallywas in Italy at the time that everything
(04:25):
changed for me. I was workingon a construction site because I clearly know
a lot about construction, and Igot invited to a party in Milan with
friends that i'd worked with. I'dworked in fashion for one year back in
London, and I had friends inMilan who went to this fancy party and
they invited me, and I showedup with like plaster and cement all over
(04:46):
my clothes and I was like,it would be really nice to have some
money because I couldn't afford to buyclothes for this party. So I went
back to the UK to get areal job, you know, the whole
thing that everyone was telling me todo, and I did. I got
a job in a bar for acouple of months, and then I met
somebody who was working online and theonly thing. I didn't even own a
laptop at the time, but theonly thing I heard was hold on a
(05:06):
second. You work on the internetfrom home. That means you can do
that from anywhere, right. Iwas like, so I can keep traveling.
So I was like, please tellme everything you know, and she
did and we founded our first companytogether. She was a web web developer
and SEO expert, and I didn'teven know what those words meant at the
time, but I was like,just teach me, like I will jump
(05:26):
in, I'll do what I can, and just kind of how we did
things. Turned out that these clientsalso needed more than just websites. They
needed social media management, and theyneeded inbox management, they needed travel booking,
they needed all these kinds of thingsthat I was learning on the go.
And it wasn't until somebody said tome or referred to me on a
team call as their virtual assistant.I was like, oh, there's a
name for the sin's what I'm doing. So that was my introduction. It
(05:51):
was messy. It was like Ididn't know what I was doing. I
bought my first laptop and I figuredit out, and it took a couple
of years but turned out to bepretty successful in the end. Yeah,
And just for context, a yearwas that, I want to say,
twenty thirteen ish, twenty twelve maybe, okay? Cool? And at that
point, how long had you beenlike how long it had been where you'd
(06:12):
been like working and traveling like doingthat for five years? Okay, cool?
Awesome, So you started traveling.I guess I'm just trying to do
math in my head since like twothousand and seven, eight, two thousand
and seven, two thousand and eight. Yeah. Yeah, I don't have
like a I don't have a verystrict timeline of less and like not good
at keeping track. But I've beentraveling for fifteen years. Yeah. No,
that's amazing. I think it's reallyinteresting. Like we started traveling in
(06:33):
two thousand and eleven when we graduatedfrom university, and that was the first
time we met somebody who was likeworking online. We were at a hostel
in Switzerland and he was a programmer, and I remember we were like,
what you're like doing work from thishostel? You're not Swiss? Like what
like is this even a thing?Because like two thousand and eleven is like
(06:54):
not that long ago, but it'salso a completely different world when you think
about technology, Like I think wewere traveling with like one iPad between us,
Like we left our cell phones athome. We would literally like screenshot
from like hostile World the directions.We'd screenshot the directions from the email,
so we had them on the iPadand then we would just like follow them
(07:15):
and we had like Lonely Planet booksthat we like looked up. I'm like,
how different is twenty eleven travel tolike twenty twenty three. Like I
feel like people starting out now arelike you did, what, Like,
I know, it's completely transformed.I think about that. I think about
before I traveled, even before anytechnology. I remember traveling to Thailand on
my own with no technology and likea physical map. Like it's wild to
(07:40):
think about now. Yeah, absolutely, I mean it's just like such a
different, different landscape. But it'scool to hear that you were doing like
online work, I mean, wayway before pandemic. I feel like Ryan
and I started in like twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen ish, and that felt
like very pre pandemic working on line, and you're even before that, So
(08:01):
I'm curious for you at that point, Like what was it like to find
these va jobs or was it liketo find online opportunities. I don't know
that it was much trickier than itis now. Well, much easier than
it is now, but it wasdifferent and the way that, you know,
the communities were smaller, I found, so sometimes it was actually easier
to find work in some ways.But then there were so many there were
(08:22):
so many new people coming into thespace that there was this real competitive thing
that I don't think exists anymore becausenow I feel like there's this everybody can
find a space for themselves. There'sso many people that are open to hiring
remote workers, hiring freelancers, andthere's so many things that you can hire
them for that there's really a spacefor everyone to make something. Whereas before
it was kind of like do youoffer social media design, do you offer
(08:45):
this? Do you offer not socialmedia design, social media management, and
web design? And it was alittle bit more rigid, I find so
in that way, like if youdidn't quite fit what people wanted, the
competition was higher, I feel,but there was more space to stand out
if you're building a personal brand,which is what I moved into and sort
of started to build a company aroundwhat I was doing, and I think
that's what really took me from sortof getting by too flying high. Sorry
(09:07):
for the cliche, but yeah,I think that building a brand around it
and then starting to build a communityaround it. People were craving community,
I feel at that time, youknow, that's really what took me from
you know, being a virtual assistantto training virtual assistance was through having this
community that I built at the time. I don't know how it was for
you, but I feel like whenwhen I got started, I didn't know
(09:28):
what a digital nomad was, youknow, I'd only recently found out what
a virtual assistant was. And whenit dawned on me that there was this
term digital and there were other peopleout there doing it, I was searching
for information, you know, likegive me information, like trying to get
everything I could. And it wasvery much like one demographic that we saw.
It was like the young white manin Chang Mai. I was like,
(09:50):
that doesn't really relate to me,and there's got to be other people
out here doing this that, likeyou know, other women, are queer
people, people of color. There'sgot to be people out here doing so.
I start out the community myself becauseI'm like, whoa, I'll just
stop my OWD thing, and Idid, and that's kind of where everything
grew from there. Yeah, yeah, for sure. Yeah, I feel
like I can definitely relate to thatin some senses, Like I feel like
(10:13):
maybe a bit different because I wassort of like, oh, it seems
like there's a lot of computer programmersor a lot of people who are,
like I don't know, not reallyworking and I don't know if they're living
off trust funds or like you know, people are doing like things with the
stock market, and I'm like,yeah, I don't have enough money to
like throw it all at the stockmarket and hope I get some money back.
Like I don't get what people aredoing. And I feel like it
was kind of like, hey,I need some just like people people like
(10:37):
you and I who are we're downto work. We're down to hustle,
but we want to do it onthe internet, Like how do we figure
out how to do that? AndI feel like in the beginning for us,
it was like, Okay, howcan we convince people to do these
jobs online? Like that we don'thave to be here in person for these
types of roles and just doing alot of stuff to kind of make it
work, which I feel like,I'm kind of like hearing you say that
(10:58):
you did as well, like justa lot of different kind of piece will
piece work to kind of like,you know, pay the bills until you
figured out something that can help youthrive a little more. Absolutely definitely in
the beginning. Yeah, yeah,I'm curious. Can you talk us through
like the shift of I guess beinga virtual assistant and maybe working for a
bunch of people, you know,making enough money to do the thing which
(11:20):
feels so good at first, andthen being like, Okay, it's time
to step it up and starting tobuild your own brand, your own build
business, your own community. Yeah. I think for me, I got
to stage for context. The firstever job I took on was it wasn't
up work, but it was oneof those you know, gig platforms.
It was the first thing I tookon and it was five dollars and it
was for an article called the toptwenty six random number, Top twenty six
(11:46):
cities to raise children in the UnitedStates. That's kinds such an expert on
this, And it took me threedays of exactly living in all these cities.
Yeah, so it took me threedays of research and a lot of
work, and I delivered it andthere was an option to tip me,
and they didn't tip me, andI was kind of like, are you
(12:07):
kidding? Like five bucks at threedays of work. So that was the
first sort of like, I needto make the sustainable. This doesn't this
can't work like this. There's gotto be another way. There's people out
there doing this, so that I'vejust got to find how. So,
you know, I was seeking clientsin different places and that kind of thing,
and getting clearer on my service stackand that kind of thing. But
then as things grow, as Ibuilt that community more out of a need
(12:30):
for me wanting to connect with morepeople, my success started really taking off.
And that was through a few things. I think it was through I
had mentorship, I'd invested in programs, I was building my network a lot,
and if I'm quite frank, Ithink a lot of it was quite
intuitively. I'm good at public relationsas something I've always you know, I've
always made sure I was in mediapodcasts, you know, getting in the
(12:54):
news, that kind of thing,so that all, you know, elevated
my position and it got to apoint where I was earning a minimum five
thousand dollars a month, every singlemonth, and then sometimes ten thousand most
short term projects as well that Iwas taking on. And when I was
sharing what was happening for me mybusiness in this community, people began asking
me, like, what, Iwant to see that kind of success?
How are you doing this? Andit hadn't occurred to me that people might
(13:15):
want to learn from me. I'dnever gone into this thinking I want to
train people in this, but thereappeared to be this need and so around
this time, I was just like, I don't know how to help people.
I've never been in a position whereI'm training or teaching. But I'll
try, you know, I'll trysomething. And so I threw together this
five day challenge, which I stillrun to this day. Funnily enough,
(13:35):
it's transformed over the years and it'sgot enough soon, don't you I do
on the seventeenth. Yes, SoI threw this together and I literally I
put it out there and I dideach day as it came. So like
day one, I was like,right, so, what would you do
on the day one of being ofit? You would do this day two?
What would you say? And Ikind of just did it in the
(13:56):
moment with people and like invited peoplewhen to kind of make it a collaborative
sort of effort, and it worked. At the end of the week,
like a bunch of people got jobs. I was like, from like having
no experience to getting jobs, andI was like, maybe I know some
stuff. Maybe I've learned some coolstuff that I can pass on. And
that was really the very sort ofhumble beginnings. I didn't anticipate doing this
(14:20):
and skip forward to today we've trainedthirty thousand people when we were one of
the leading CHU assistant organizations at trainingorganizations in the world. So I mean,
I guess it was the right pathto take. Yeah, I mean,
none of congratulations. That's amazing.It's amazing that you've been able to
serve so many people, and it'sreally cool, Like I think there's a
lot of people who kind of lookat, you know, people like us,
(14:41):
who are you know, not fromMexico. Living in Mexico. We
get to like have a great climate, we get to eat grade food,
and they say like, how canI do that? And I think it's
really amazing to be able to belike, hey, I can actually teach
you, like what I did,and you can replicate it in a way
that like serves you and your business, which is super cool. Absolutely.
Yeah. I feel like when thethings I really love about what you're doing
(15:01):
in your business is like one ofthe things we found when we started is
as we were doing research kind ofin I guess maybe like twenty fourteen,
twenty fifteen, that kind of timewhere we were like, Okay, how
could we keep traveling in a moresustainable way, like make money on the
road. I feel like so muchof it was like people in the travel
industry, so travel bloggers, youknow, travel YouTubers, I guess,
(15:24):
travel podcasters. Podcasting wasn't that bigat that point, but there was like
a few people doing it, peopledoing like travel tours, travel agents,
travel photographers, that type of thing. I feel like that's where we thought,
were like, we love travel,so maybe we should create something within
travel. And I think it's reallycool that even early on, you created
something that's like it allows you totravel and create this lifestyle, but it's
(15:46):
not necessarily travel travel related. MYeah. Absolutely. I think one of
the things that I really like aboutthe career in general, the VIA career,
is that you can take your interestseven if they're not, you know,
professionally aligned, and you can kindof weave that into your work.
If you're really into yoga, youcan be working with people who have online
yoga courses. If you're really intoI don't know, cheeseburgers, you could
(16:07):
do menus for burger you know.Like there's so many things that you could
do by taking your interests in thebringing them forward. So it doesn't need
to just be related to travel anymore. It can be you can bring you
to the table, which I thinkis beautiful. Yeah, yeah, that's
amazing. I want to get intolike va more specifically and why this is
a really great career. But beforewe do that, I'm kind of curious,
like, as you were doing allof this, like building your business
(16:30):
and just working online, where wereyou traveling to? Like, were you
kind of all over the world.What was kind of your rhythm at that
point. So the first few yearsbefore I was working online, it was
mostly around Europe just for ease andcosts really, you know, being in
the UK, that was much easierto hop around there. Over the years,
I've spent a lot of time inBangkok, Thailand. It is like
(16:51):
my favorite city in the whole world. I did spend around three years,
not all at the same time,but sort of like over a four or
five year period, three years inand out of Sardinia, Italy, and
just more recently, I kind ofsort of base myself on a continent and
then travel around. That makes sense. So I'm like, right now I'm
based in Mexico and I'm traveling around. But a lot of places I'm going
(17:15):
have been to. I stopped countingat fifty eight, so maybe sixty countries,
seven to sixty one countries something likethat. But the longest periods I've
spent I've been in Bangkok, Budapest, Sardinia, and now Mexico. Okay,
awesome, very cool, amazing.Let's get into some more details about
VA work, because I think thisis really cool. Like I said before,
it's like an opportunity for I thinkso many people, are so many
skills. Why do you feel likethis is like a great career for somebody
(17:38):
who might want to be a digitalnomad or even just like work remotely.
For a few reasons, I thinkone, the barrier to entry is pretty
low. You don't necessarily need aformal education to move into this work.
Even sometimes resumes become a little bitirrelevant. It's more about having a portfolio
and demonstrating that you can do whatyou say you can do. And I
think it's important to note as wellthat there's sometimes this misconception that virtual assistance
(18:03):
to really techie work or and somedo absolutely do. But the categories of
work really fall into three buckets.You've got administrative work, creative work,
and technical sort of work, andthey can totally overlap. But let's just
take the admin one for a moment, because I feel like this is easier
for a lot of people to moveinto, especially if they're completely new to
working digitally in any way. Evenif the only thing that you could do,
(18:26):
which is rare in today's very techsavvy and you know, Internet savy
generations, But even if the onlything that you could do is create a
Microsoft word document and turn it intoa PDF, for example, there is
someone in the world that doesn't knowhow to do that, you know,
and you have to come from thatperspective that exactly or doesn't want to do
it. Yeah, there's all thesedifferent things. So whatever it is that
you're coming to the table, ifthere is someone out there who will pay
(18:48):
you for those skills. So it'sreally about owning what you already know and
then bringing online. And the moreyou learn, the more you can earn
in this career. So that's alsothe cool thing. You might start entry
level rates and you might end upon one hundred dollars an hour and a
year or two times. There's somuch space to grow in it, and
there's so much space to play withwhat you're offering in terms of your services,
with the types of people you wantto work with. So for me,
(19:08):
especially if you're someone who's like alike a multi passionate person, there's
so much space to just again bringyou to the table, start with what
you've got, and grow with thatand take that with you anywhere in the
world. You know, compared toremote jobs, which while remote a lot
of them maybe geographically limited to certainareas or you know, still having to
show up at certain times, youhave that autonomy to work at times that
(19:30):
suit you. We have a lotof neurodivergent folks who move into this work
as well, and I think it'sreally accessible for people like that because you
get to work at times that workbest. Forew for example, I work
really good in the nighttime. I'llstay up all night working and everyone thinks
I'm weird, but I'm like,I get my best work done and nobody's
telling me when I can and can'tdo that. So it's accessible. It's
a low barrier to entry. It'sreally fun work, and there's so much
(19:52):
variety in it, and you reallydo have potential to, like I said,
learn and earn more. Yeah.Yeah, I love what you're talking
about with NEURODII divergent people as well, because I feel like there's I don't
know, I feel like I feellike we're all different, right, Like
we all function differently, we allhave different minds, we all think differently,
and I think it's really important toyou rather than trying to like fit
into molds or boxes, to findthings that we can really thrive in.
(20:15):
And I think that if your brainjust thinks differently or you work best,
like you said at night, it'slike finding a career that allows you to
do that is a really amazing thing, rather than like trying to force yourself
into like a nine to five,which I mean, quite honestly, I
think the Monday to Friday nine tofive works for very few of us.
So yeah, exactly. Yeah.And so for somebody who's maybe thinking like,
(20:37):
Okay, this sounds really cool,I would love like all these things.
Do you have any tips for likegetting started as a VA. Yeah.
I mean it's really about identifying whatthose existing skills are and not disregarding
your previous experience in the offline worldbecause it's so very relevant, and also
then looking at So if I wasto say, right now, here's what
you do to get started, Iwould say, get sheet paper, put
(20:59):
three columns. In the first column, you want to put down what am
I good at? And I don'twant you to limit to limit it to
only what you're good at in yourprofessional life. Are you good at baking?
Are you good at you know?Because it's going to start informing your
interests as well. Then you've gotwhat do I enjoy it? So then
from that list of what you're goodat, only bring the stuff you enjoy
it. Because I always say there'sno point building a business by design.
If you're going to be doing stuffyou hate doing, like you might as
(21:21):
well get a job you hate doing. It's the same thing. So if
you're going to make the effort andmake the leap, because it is effort,
and it is a leap to startyour own business. You might as
well start it on the wrong I'mnot on the wrong foot, on the
right foot. You might as wellstart it on the right foot doing things
that actually light you up. AndI just want to make one distinction here.
A lot of people will say,folly your passion and the money will
(21:42):
come. I don't subscribe to that. I subscribe to you. Folly your
interests and let them evolve and changeover time. But as long as you're
interested in, you're engaged, you'regoing to find the work enjoyable. Finding
your passion can be a really intimidatingtask for a lot of people. I
find it's I don't feel like allof us have this one thing that we're
going to do for the rest ofour lives. So you know, look
at your interests, look at yourinterests. What do you actually enjoy it
(22:03):
out of those things you're good at, and then start to look at and
you can you can literally take almostto any business that exists right now as
a model for this, and justthink of you do a little spider diagram
if you want, and think ofall the moving parts that happen in that
business and where your skills and interestscan align with that. So these businesses
that you're going to look at,they might be ones that actually already identify
(22:25):
with that. So again, let'sgo back to that yoga yoga enthusiasts.
Let's say you're really good at yoga, you love yoga, you so you've
got two things right there. You'regood at customer service as well, so
maybe you want to be supporting ayoga instructures, Facebook, community community management,
that kind of thing. So youstart to branch out and realize all
these tiny little things are things thatcan be outsourced. So really just doing
(22:45):
like a brain dump of like okay, x wiz a yoga studio, they
need this, this, this,this, this, this, where could
I pick up pieces from that?I'm probably not demonstrating it well, it's
a better visual, but yeah,looking at what your what your existing skills
are, what you're what you enjoydoing out of that, and then how
that can meet and market need isa good place to start because I think
(23:08):
one of the pitfalls that a lotof people fall into in this work is
moving into it with this idea ofI'm good at a lot of stuff and
I want to help everybody, whichis a noble cause, but it's it's
it's really hard to do that becausewhen you're speaking to everybody, you're ultimately
speaking to nobody. People want tofeel spoken to. They want to hire
people in their business who speak theirlanguage, who understand their business model,
(23:30):
and that comes with a premium aswell, So you're going to get more
money with that as well. Yeah, that totally makes sense. Yeah,
yeah, yeah, I love that. And then any like, once we've
kind of identified what we're what we'reinterested in, what our skills are,
where should people go to like applyfor things like do you recommend up work
or there are other sites that aregood for that. I'm I'm kind of
(23:52):
anti these brand people thinking of theright words, and I'm not don't use
these platforms. I'm saying don't usethem as a main avenue because what we've
found in you know, thirty thousandpeople is enough for me to have gained
some data on what works and whatdoesn't work and what works more effectively.
And what we've found over the yearsis that what seems to work more effectively
(24:15):
is the networking. It is thebuilding the personal brand. It is building
authority around your area, your niche, your services and referrals ultimately the backbone
of a really successful VA business.Now does it harm to have a profile
on these platforms and if you seesomething apply for it. No, of
course it doesn't. But I thinktaken a really proactive approach instead of the
(24:36):
more traditional job market approach, whichis applying for opportunities, it's rather creating
opportunities. So yeah, I wouldreally recommend you know, hanging out,
whether your ideal clients are hanging out, make sure you're providing some value networking
behind the scenes. You can dothings like getting in the media. There's
plenty of different ways that you cansort of boost your authority in your area,
(24:57):
and oftentimes it's just asking for thesales. So example of there's a
really simple quick tip that a lotof people don't do. Especially if you
you know, if you I've identifiedthe services you can offer, maybe you
start putting them into practice in yourown business. For example, if you
want to be an Instagram manager,your Instagram is going to be shit hot,
(25:18):
right, that's your portfolio piece.You want to be a web designer,
your web design you your website isgoing to be awesome. You want
to be a writer, you starta blog, you have this portfolio piece
to bring forward to validate what you'resaying you can do. And then you
can go onto social media because you'vebeen networking in the right places, going
to LinkedIn or Facebook or wherever itis that your audience is hanging out,
and you can literally say I haveavailability to take on one client next month
(25:41):
doing X y Z DM me likeyou need to let people know you're in
business as well. I think there'sthis it's not a build it and they
will come scenario right. You needto be very proactive and that's that's a
really simple thing you can do.You can apply to multiple areas of your
business. I would post on socialmedia and say I want to get on
twenty podcasts this month, and thenpeople are going to m here's how I
(26:02):
can bring value. Here's what Ican do here sow I can back up
what I can do. And it'skind of like, you know, if
you ever go in the United States, I feel like this is the United
States thing. You drive around andyou see like a motails that have a
sign like vacancy no vacancy. It'sthe same thing, and you need to
tell people you're open for business,and so just simply that action on a
(26:22):
regular basis, paired with the networking, paired with you know, creating niche
specific content, paired with asking forreferrals, and also then providing a great
service for your existing clients in orderfor referrals to actually take place. It's
really effective. So I know that'ssorry, there's a long tangent, but
yeah, no, no, Imean that's like so many golden nuggets and
they're like really really helpful information.So I appreciate the tangent. And yeah,
(26:47):
I mean I don't have a lotof experience with those platforms you're talking
about, but I feel like justhearing your example of like you know,
spending days and hours and hours ofyour time for like five dollars is like,
I'm kind of like, you know, we're worth more than that.
And I think one of the thingsthat's challenging about those platforms is like they
(27:07):
you kind of have to get thereviews right. It's like people are not
going to just pay you one hundreddollars an hour when you're like brand new
on the platform. But I feellike if you can build your own Instagram
or your own website or maybe both, and like showcase is somebody what you
can do, what your skills are, I feel like they're going to be
much more open to the idea oflike paying you more right off the get
go. Yeah. Absolutely. Andone of the examples I always give is
(27:30):
if somebody came to me and said, you know, I want to work
with you. I'm a general adminVA I want to work with you.
My rate is fifteen twenty dollars anhour, and then I look at the
prof and I'm like, I don'tknow, I don't know this person,
you know. And then someone elseapproaches me and says, hey, I've
noticed that you are not showing upon Instagram and the way that you should.
(27:51):
And I work with you know,queer entrepreneurs who of course creators,
and my rate is thirty five dollars. I'm hiring that person because I'm like,
you get me. I don't needto explain everything to you, so
you know, doing your research aboutthe types of people you want to work
with, and then I really tailoringyour messaging as well. Yeah. I
think that that's one of the thingsthat just like with the general job market,
we like miss in a big way. It's like people just create like
one cover letter that they change likethe name on it and the company and
(28:15):
one resume and they just like sendit out to all these companies and then
they're like why is and nobody callingme back? And it's like, what
have you done to demonstrate that you'relike a really great fit for this?
Like do you know anything about thecompany? Do you know anything about the
position? And I feel like,you know, today's market is like competitive,
right, and I think especially toget a job that we're excited about
the pays, well, it's likewe have to show to the person like,
(28:36):
hey, I know something about you, and here's why I'm a great
fit for you, and that personis going to be willing to pay a
higher rate, just like you said. Absolutely. And I think it's important
to note as well that Niche orNiching, however you want to cool it.
We can argue about that. ButI say, Nicheing, I don't
know about you. You did good, Yeah you're in the good crew.
Yeah I'm Canadian, I say ztoo, So I'm extra cool with Niching.
(29:00):
I find that a lot of peoplesometimes are concerned that it's going to
limit them, right, it's gonnaI'm closing the gap so small that I'm
not going to find anyone. AndI think the little bit of reprieve that
you can have with that in theVA space is that you don't need to
niche necessarily by industry or by eventhe type of job or a role that
the entrepreneur or business is fulfilling.You can also niche by values, which
(29:25):
we're finding is really effective in thecurrent market. So, for example,
I really want to work with peoplewho in their business in some way are
impacting the environment positively. So thatleaves scope for like what this could be
a construction company that does sustainable building, or it could be a life coach
who helps people. I don't knowif you know what I mean. So
(29:45):
it really does leave the scope abit wider. If you're feeling like niching
by an industry is difficult, youcan also niche by values. Yeah,
I love that. I think it'sreally important to you to like look at
our values. Like I think,you know, people are going to do
what they're going to to do,and I think everyone's kind of entitled to
their own beliefs and the way theyoperate their business. But I think there's
naturally going to be things that wealign with more. And it's like,
(30:07):
again, if we're building lifestyle bydesign business by design, it's like,
let's get clear on like who we'reexcited to work with and why we're excited
to work with them. And ifit's like, hey, I want to
work with like email entrepreneurs, orI want to work with an all mail
team, or I want to workwith you know, people who are giving
back in some way, you know, it's like, let's identify that so
that we can really feel aligned withthe people who are supporting Absolutely. Yeah,
(30:30):
I love that. I want toswitch gears and ask a little bit
about you know, just kind ofyour your lifestyle with your business, because
I know it's a lot to belike moving around all the time and whatnot.
So I'm curious for you a littlebit about like, you know,
balancing productivity like running a business whilealso traveling because I think one of the
things we found is in the earlydays when we were making less money and
(30:52):
we were just taking on like youknow, projects here and there, we
had a lot more like oh wellthere's nothing to do today, let's go
explore out that. It's like,you know, we have more professional jobs,
built a business, that type ofthing. It's like, okay,
well, like stuff's got to getdone, so you know, we've got
to figure out how to do thisbalance. So I'm curious for you how
that looks in terms of like managinggetting work done while also exploring. Yeah,
(31:15):
I think very similarly to you thatin the beginning days there was a
lot more time to just sort offrolic around and enjoy the surroundings. And
well, I definitely do still enjoymy surroundings. I think I've slowed down,
and I think for the work,but also, you know, we
had stopped a dog here in Mexico. Like there's things that just have naturally
slowed us down, but the businessbecoming more of a serious thing and needing
(31:38):
requiring more attention. You know,I'm managing a team now, I manage
a team around the world, andso that you know, having to align
with them for calls and stuff likethat has required us to slow down so
that you know, I can bemore present and I can be then actually
take intentional time off. So forexample, I recently went to Canada,
of all places, for a weekwhere I actually completely switched off and people
(32:01):
were like, honey, you're alwayson vacation. I'm like, no,
I need a vacation for my vacation. I'm not. I'm working like I
live here most of the time,and then I'm starting to take vacation.
So I've definitely slowed down to thepoint that I'm questioning if I could be
called a digital nomad anymore. Butyou know, semantic socide, I'm based
here and I take trips when Ineed to recharge. More. That said,
(32:22):
there are certain things I do,Like I said, I work better
in the evening, so I dodedicate like certain evenings for working and then
certain evenings for hanging out with mywife or going out with friends or that
kind of things. So having amore structured schedule that works for me.
And I don't mean, like whenI say having a structured schedule, it
doesn't need to align to anybody else'sidea of what a good structure is really
(32:43):
because mine works very much for me, and I definitely recommend creating one that
works for you too, But itis about having one where you can hold
yourself accountable for like I will actuallyget this done at this time because this
is when I work good or Iwill actually go see people at this time
because I've already accounted for this anothertime. Or chunking your clients into certain
days, you know, like Mondayand Tuesday I work with client one,
wednesdays of work with client two,those day work with client three, and
(33:05):
Fridays of mine like that, youknow, or working the weekends that you
can go do things in the week. So it really is about creating a
structure that works for you. ButI think the overall sort of messages that
slowing down has enabled me to buildmore impact, build more wealth, and
ultimately to enjoy the time that Ido have exploring at a higher level as
well. Yeah, for sure,I feel very aligned with that. I
(33:27):
feel like we're very much in thesame position. And I have digital nomad
in my personal Instagram bio, andI was recently thinking, I feel like
I should take this out because I'mnot really I'm like more of an expat
at this point. Like we havea home base as well. We've been
here for a year and a halfat this point, almost two years.
You know, it's like we're planningto continue basing here for now. I
don't think it's forever, but we'vereally enjoyed like kind of slowing down like
(33:52):
we did a number of years whereit was like, you know, a
month was a long time to bein a place, and it's really it's
really hard to strike that balance oflike I'm focusing on work and I'm getting
stuff down and I'm feeling really goodabout the quality that's coming out of it,
and then I'm also like getting achance to get to know this destination
that I'm in, because it kindof sucks to go somewhere really cool,
(34:13):
like to be in like Port ofIata, for example, where you are
and be like, oh, I'velike haven't got to explore any of the
amazing beaches or go to any ofthe cool restaurants, or like go to
any of the amazing events or livemusic or whatever whatever it is that you
want to do. It's kind oflike, well, why am I here
if I'm not exploring. But thenit's a really slippery slope of like,
hey, I'm going on like thisbeach trip and this speech trip and I'm
(34:35):
doing this thing and oh crap,I haven't checked my emails for six days,
and like business is slipping. Yep, that that happens sometimes, Still
so it's it's a little trial anderror, but I totally agree with it,
and I think that staying in placeslonger as well. I don't know
how it is feeble. I havefound, which I'm I'm actively working on,
is that I've found that you know, I'm here in Putovyata and I've
(34:57):
been here I don't want to say, three or four months now, and
i haven't gone out as much asI should because I'm like, oh,
we're going to be here for ayear, so I've got time. I've
got time. And that's what peopledo when they live in places that they
consider their home, right Like youdon't explore your home. So I'm like,
no, I need to make anactive decision to do this. So
you know, again, allocating timefor that is really important. Yeah,
for sure. We like to kindof like set We've had the same thing
(35:21):
and we just like, did thishike We've wanted to do, like basically
since we moved to Cadetro. Wejust did it a couple of weeks ago.
Mind you like when we moved here, I was very pregnant and then
we had a baby, then wehad a new board. You know,
there's like excuses and reasons why wehaven't done it. But we finally got
out and we're like why did wewait so long? But something we did
kind of prior to pregnancy, smallinfant, that type of thing was we'd
(35:43):
actually like set we'd be like,what are our top things to do here,
and like write it on a pieceof paper, put it on the
wall, kind of bucket list style, because it's like, Okay, if
we have three months or six months, whatever we have, let's be really
intentional about like this weekend, we'redoing X thing, or we're going to
X restaurant or whatever, because itis easy when you do have time to
like also just get in your rhythmand go to the same place as constantly
(36:05):
or not explore. We experienced thisin Panama. We thought we were going
to spend a year there and thenthe pandemic happened and we decided to leave.
And there's like some of the topattractions in Panama City that we have
not done. Actually, what's interesting, as you mentioned the pandemic, I
feel like the pandemic also slowed downa lot of the longer term nomads just
it was a natural slow down.It was a natural like, oh,
(36:29):
maybe we needed this to focus onour business a little totally. Yeah,
we found that it was like,well, we can't go anywhere, so
I guess we'll just like stay putand like focus on other things. Yeah,
totally. I'm curious on that note, how you choose destinations, Like
what's do you and your wife havelike a process in terms of like choosing
a destination, how long you staythere, that type of thing. Yeah,
(36:51):
it's a very very intense process actually, So we get lots of post
it notes and then we put downlike the place. We'll always have places
in mind, right, so they'llbe like four to five places that we're
thinking of, and we tend togo back to places we know or we
know we're going to be similar toplaces to be like right now because we
kind of kind of got the vibefor what we like. And we'll put
the names of those places on thetop row of post it notes. And
(37:15):
then we have like our priorities.So our priorities are conveniences. We're really
big on, like is there goodfood delivery? Are there ubers? You
know? Can we get around withease? I don't drive, for example,
so that you know, transportation isa big one for me. Then
for our specific case, like isit LGBTQ friendly, because like I'm in
the past, we've gone to placeswhere I've made concessions and like, correct,
(37:35):
we'll be discreet, but I'm like, I'm at an age, but
I don't want to have to practicediscretion to be who I am anymore.
So yes, So now it's likeis it friendly enough that we can live
there and hold hands and not belooked at funny? Equal, that's one.
I think the quality of the food, Like, so we're vegans,
so like high quality, healthy foodsin abundance. There a recent addition,
(37:57):
do they have dog parks? Isit dog friendly? Yeah? It's definitely
shifted over the years from like whatcool bars are in town to like is
there a good physiotherapist? So thenwe have these things exactly no meds in
the thirties, and so then wekind of rank these places on a on
(38:19):
a one too, however many pointswe have, and then we tally up
at the end and I think it'sthe place with the lowest amounts of points
is the winner, and it alwayscomes out as Thailine. But then we
never go, which is weird.It just feels so far away. I
used to live there, and Ijust I think with a dog now,
it feels hard to like she hasto go in cargo. She's a big
dog, so but Mexico's is closeseconds. So that's where we've landed.
(38:43):
Okay, cool, Yeah, no, thanks for sharing that. It's nice
to hear like somebody else's process.So and I just really resonate with like
things shifting, like the first tripI was mentioning earlier that we did in
twenty eleven, it's like real recent. I think we're like twenty two or
something like that, and we'd recentlygraduated from university and it was like,
you know, what hostiles have thebest vibe? Like do they have bars
(39:04):
there? Do they do like barcrawls? And now I'm like, can
I like push a strollers there?Like other people like that have kids.
I'm like, is it too noisy? Because I'm a grandma. I got
a bed at like nine thirty ten. That's funny. I think it's cool
to see like the evolution personally though, like of and I think it's really
(39:25):
normal as you like go through differentchapters of life to be looking for different
things, and it's it's nice tolike, you know, acknowledge those with
yourself or your partner whoever you travelwith, and like be able to be
like, Okay, what are ourpriorities? And I think it's cool because
it leads us to different destinations rightas we're like in different chapters of life.
Yeah, And I also think what'sinteresting is to revisit places you've visited
maybe years ago, and to seehow you relate to them differently at this
(39:49):
different stage in your life. So, for example, we're going to Columbia
in August, and I haven't beenthere since twenty seventeen, and I've changed
a lot since then, and whatwas important to me there is going to
then it is very different to whatwould be important to me now. So
it'll be interesting to see places withthis new lens as well. Yeah.
Yeah, it's actually funny that youmentioned that, because we just went to
Columbia at the beginning of twenty twentythree, and we I guess the last
(40:10):
time we went we went to baronKia for Carnival in twenty twenty, like
right before the pandemic, but priorto that, like the last time we've
been in Medine was twenty fourteen,Like we're not working remotely staying in hostiles.
Like we walked by one of thehostles we stayed in and I was
like gross, like I would literallylike somebody could not pay me to stay
there. Now I'm always laughing.I'm like, did I get boozio?
(40:31):
Did I just get older? Yeah? I know, right, I know.
I used to be so critical ofmy parents, and obviously they're still
in a different category with everything fromme, But I used to be so
critical of them of like, oh, you're such prudes with like where you
stay and like blah blah blah.And now I'm like, Okay, I
kind of I'm getting it, Likedon't want to stay in that like mixed
dorm with like sixteen other people.I'm good, Nope, amazing. Well,
(40:57):
I'm curious what's next for you guys, You guys Jane and PV for
a while. What's kind of thetravel plans? What do you guys have
on your reader? It's a questionmark right now. It's something that we're
actively discussing. We're definitely staying here. We're seeing We've got a year long
rental, which is the first I'vehad in many years. So that's a
commitment in itself and then I mean, we have residency here, so we'll
probably stick around for the next coupleof years. I think we have two
(41:20):
years left on that and then wecan decide if we want to do permanent
I think there's just a question markright now about aging parents and grandparents in
Europe and whether or not we wantto go spend maybe a year or two
there before heading back. I'm inthe process of obtaining my Italian citizenship through
ancestry, so that would give meaccess to the European Union again because Brexit
sucks as a UK person. Soyeah, there's a discussion around that really,
(41:45):
and I think that's also another agespecific thing. Yeah, Mexico and
or Europe something like that. Amazing. Well thanks for sharing that, And
I'm curious where can people go tofollow along with your journey, Hannah,
or maybe learn about you or ifthey want to be via learn from you
all that good stuff. Yeah.Sure, my profiles everywhere. Our digital
nomad Kit that's ki t on Instagram, on threads, which is new as
(42:08):
of a few days. I'm stillstill resisting it. I'm not sure about
it. It's so fun, it'sso fun. I'm hooked. Yeah,
digit Kit, digit kit dot com. If you want to join the five
Day Challenge and now we touched onit. We run those every two months,
so depending on when this goes live, there will be one coming up
at some point. Totally free.Really good introduction if you are interested in
(42:30):
pursuing something like this, or atleast experimenting and seeing if it could be
a good fit for you. Amazing. Thanks so much for your time today.
This has been really awesome. Thankyou for having me. It's been
great to connect. Thanks for listeningto this episode. If you want more,
and make sure to check out theWorld Wanders Insider, available on Patreon
at Patreon dot com. Slash theWorld Wanders for show notes, head over
to the World Wanders dot com.Find us on social media at the World
(42:52):
Wanders Podcast, and join the privateFacebook community at World Wanders, a community
for travelers. You can always getin touch with us at info at the
world wanders dot com. And ifyou enjoyed the show, don't forget to
subscribe and leave a review. Itreally helps us find new listeners. See
you next time.
Hello, and welcome to the WorldWanders podcast, a proud part of the
wander Barn podcast network. I'm Ryan, I'm Amanda, and we're your hosts.
We're a traveling couple and digital nomads, taking you on our adventures as
we explore locations, destinations, andcareers. Enjoy the show. Hello everyone,
and welcome back to another episode ofthe World Wanders podcast. I'm really
(00:24):
excited that you're joining us for today'sepisode of the show, and today on
the podcast, I'm really excited tobe joined by Hannah Dixon. Hannah is
a virtual assistant or VA and freelancecoach, recruiter and the founder of Digital
Nomad Kit. She's committed to creatinga more equitable future through the freedom and
accessibility of freelancing, and her teachingshave readied over twenty seven thousand learners in
(00:48):
over one hundred and seventy countries towork with leading entrepreneurs across all industries.
With fifteen years as a full timedigital nomad, her insights are highly sought.
After contributing regularly to publications like BusinessInsider and Forbes and delivering global talks
on her areas of expertise in thisepisode of the podcast, Hannah shares a
bit about her travel story and howshe got into working as a VA,
(01:11):
why she created Digital Nomad Kit,why becoming a VA is a great career
for travelers and digital nomads, tipsfor getting started as a VA, and
much more. She shares so muchgood stuff, and I just really appreciated
how open she was and how willingshe was to share tips for those of
you who are wanting to work remotelybut maybe don't know what your skills,
(01:32):
your passions are, or how youcan apply those online. She's got lots
of tips and tricks for that,especially related to the world of being a
virtual assistant. So I hope thatyou enjoyed this episode, and without further
ado, here is Hannah. Hannah, Welcome to the show. I'm really
excited to have you here with metoday. Thank you for having me.
Yeah, I'm excited, and it'sactually kind of fun for me because usually
(01:53):
I have to share the mike withRyan, and I'm excited to not have
to do that today. Hell yeah, I get to ask all the questions
I want to ask. Can youshare with listeners where you're joining us from.
Yes, I'm in Portavaiata, rightnow in Mexico. Amazing, And
where are you from? Originally?I grew up in the UK. I'm
an American set of fun and livinghere in Mexico. Now, Okay,
(02:15):
that's cool. I feel like weneed to get into all things that plus
you know how you ended up inMexico and all the things you do.
But maybe we can let's back upand talk about, you know, your
kind of introduction to travel. Canyou share a little bit about your I
guess travel origin story. You couldsay, yeah, sure. So when
I was I want to say fifteen, I think I was in the UK
(02:37):
and I was leaving for the schoolholidays. You get six weeks in the
UK, and my teacher said tome I must have been sixteen. I
think I was sixteen. And myteacher, who was like a great mentor
to me, I was like,you know, the nerdy, bullied kid
who stayed with a teacher at lunchtime. So I was always of this
teacher. I said, what areyou going to do for the holidays?
I said, I don't know,maybe get like a weekend job or something.
(02:58):
And she said, you know,you can get a pass for and
travel if you want. You cango around Europe, and I was like,
what, Oh my god, Ican get a passport and I can
go on my own to Europe.So I did. I got my passport
and I did one of those InterRailtrips around Europe, and that was the
beginning of a lifelong journey. Really, it kind of just sparked something in
there that just rang so true.I left school, I didn't go to
(03:20):
university. I started traveling. Longstory very short, got into a very
abusive relationship, which also then helpedme propel back out into the world traveling
because my escape was literally getting ontothe road, something I wanted to do
anyway, So it just came easierand I started my journey with work exchanges,
so working on bars, farms,hostels. I worked with husky dogs
(03:42):
for a long time in Austria.So that's kind of how I sustained my
travel in the beginning days, atthe beginning years, really, and that's
really it. Yeah, it's kindof my entire adult life has been traveling.
Yeah, I mean, even likeyour late teens, which is so
cool to have this introduction of like, hey, I could go do this
thing and then just fall in lovewith that and do it. Basically for
the rest of your life, whichis really cool. And you kind of
(04:05):
talked about like doing the work andtravel thing, but maybe in a way
that that we kind of had todo it. I guess at this point,
like there wasn't remote work as muchat that point. I'm curious,
at what point did you kind ofdiscover like remote work, like the ability
to work online. So I actuallywas in Italy at the time that everything
(04:25):
changed for me. I was workingon a construction site because I clearly know
a lot about construction, and Igot invited to a party in Milan with
friends that i'd worked with. I'dworked in fashion for one year back in
London, and I had friends inMilan who went to this fancy party and
they invited me, and I showedup with like plaster and cement all over
(04:46):
my clothes and I was like,it would be really nice to have some
money because I couldn't afford to buyclothes for this party. So I went
back to the UK to get areal job, you know, the whole
thing that everyone was telling me todo, and I did. I got
a job in a bar for acouple of months, and then I met
somebody who was working online and theonly thing. I didn't even own a
laptop at the time, but theonly thing I heard was hold on a
(05:06):
second. You work on the internetfrom home. That means you can do
that from anywhere, right. Iwas like, so I can keep traveling.
So I was like, please tellme everything you know, and she
did and we founded our first companytogether. She was a web web developer
and SEO expert, and I didn'teven know what those words meant at the
time, but I was like,just teach me, like I will jump
(05:26):
in, I'll do what I can, and just kind of how we did
things. Turned out that these clientsalso needed more than just websites. They
needed social media management, and theyneeded inbox management, they needed travel booking,
they needed all these kinds of thingsthat I was learning on the go.
And it wasn't until somebody said tome or referred to me on a
team call as their virtual assistant.I was like, oh, there's a
name for the sin's what I'm doing. So that was my introduction. It
(05:51):
was messy. It was like Ididn't know what I was doing. I
bought my first laptop and I figuredit out, and it took a couple
of years but turned out to bepretty successful in the end. Yeah,
And just for context, a yearwas that, I want to say,
twenty thirteen ish, twenty twelve maybe, okay? Cool? And at that
point, how long had you beenlike how long it had been where you'd
(06:12):
been like working and traveling like doingthat for five years? Okay, cool?
Awesome, So you started traveling.I guess I'm just trying to do
math in my head since like twothousand and seven, eight, two thousand
and seven, two thousand and eight. Yeah. Yeah, I don't have
like a I don't have a verystrict timeline of less and like not good
at keeping track. But I've beentraveling for fifteen years. Yeah. No,
that's amazing. I think it's reallyinteresting. Like we started traveling in
(06:33):
two thousand and eleven when we graduatedfrom university, and that was the first
time we met somebody who was likeworking online. We were at a hostel
in Switzerland and he was a programmer, and I remember we were like,
what you're like doing work from thishostel? You're not Swiss? Like what
like is this even a thing?Because like two thousand and eleven is like
(06:54):
not that long ago, but it'salso a completely different world when you think
about technology, Like I think wewere traveling with like one iPad between us,
Like we left our cell phones athome. We would literally like screenshot
from like hostile World the directions.We'd screenshot the directions from the email,
so we had them on the iPadand then we would just like follow them
(07:15):
and we had like Lonely Planet booksthat we like looked up. I'm like,
how different is twenty eleven travel tolike twenty twenty three. Like I
feel like people starting out now arelike you did, what, Like,
I know, it's completely transformed.I think about that. I think about
before I traveled, even before anytechnology. I remember traveling to Thailand on
my own with no technology and likea physical map. Like it's wild to
(07:40):
think about now. Yeah, absolutely, I mean it's just like such a
different, different landscape. But it'scool to hear that you were doing like
online work, I mean, wayway before pandemic. I feel like Ryan
and I started in like twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen ish, and that felt
like very pre pandemic working on line, and you're even before that, So
(08:01):
I'm curious for you at that point, Like what was it like to find
these va jobs or was it liketo find online opportunities. I don't know
that it was much trickier than itis now. Well, much easier than
it is now, but it wasdifferent and the way that, you know,
the communities were smaller, I found, so sometimes it was actually easier
to find work in some ways.But then there were so many there were
(08:22):
so many new people coming into thespace that there was this real competitive thing
that I don't think exists anymore becausenow I feel like there's this everybody can
find a space for themselves. There'sso many people that are open to hiring
remote workers, hiring freelancers, andthere's so many things that you can hire
them for that there's really a spacefor everyone to make something. Whereas before
it was kind of like do youoffer social media design, do you offer
(08:45):
this? Do you offer not socialmedia design, social media management, and
web design? And it was alittle bit more rigid, I find so
in that way, like if youdidn't quite fit what people wanted, the
competition was higher, I feel,but there was more space to stand out
if you're building a personal brand,which is what I moved into and sort
of started to build a company aroundwhat I was doing, and I think
that's what really took me from sortof getting by too flying high. Sorry
(09:07):
for the cliche, but yeah,I think that building a brand around it
and then starting to build a communityaround it. People were craving community,
I feel at that time, youknow, that's really what took me from
you know, being a virtual assistantto training virtual assistance was through having this
community that I built at the time. I don't know how it was for
you, but I feel like whenwhen I got started, I didn't know
(09:28):
what a digital nomad was, youknow, I'd only recently found out what
a virtual assistant was. And whenit dawned on me that there was this
term digital and there were other peopleout there doing it, I was searching
for information, you know, likegive me information, like trying to get
everything I could. And it wasvery much like one demographic that we saw.
It was like the young white manin Chang Mai. I was like,
(09:50):
that doesn't really relate to me,and there's got to be other people
out here doing this that, likeyou know, other women, are queer
people, people of color. There'sgot to be people out here doing so.
I start out the community myself becauseI'm like, whoa, I'll just
stop my OWD thing, and Idid, and that's kind of where everything
grew from there. Yeah, yeah, for sure. Yeah, I feel
like I can definitely relate to thatin some senses, Like I feel like
(10:13):
maybe a bit different because I wassort of like, oh, it seems
like there's a lot of computer programmersor a lot of people who are,
like I don't know, not reallyworking and I don't know if they're living
off trust funds or like you know, people are doing like things with the
stock market, and I'm like,yeah, I don't have enough money to
like throw it all at the stockmarket and hope I get some money back.
Like I don't get what people aredoing. And I feel like it
was kind of like, hey,I need some just like people people like
(10:37):
you and I who are we're downto work. We're down to hustle,
but we want to do it onthe internet, Like how do we figure
out how to do that? AndI feel like in the beginning for us,
it was like, Okay, howcan we convince people to do these
jobs online? Like that we don'thave to be here in person for these
types of roles and just doing alot of stuff to kind of make it
work, which I feel like,I'm kind of like hearing you say that
(10:58):
you did as well, like justa lot of different kind of piece will
piece work to kind of like,you know, pay the bills until you
figured out something that can help youthrive a little more. Absolutely definitely in
the beginning. Yeah, yeah,I'm curious. Can you talk us through
like the shift of I guess beinga virtual assistant and maybe working for a
bunch of people, you know,making enough money to do the thing which
(11:20):
feels so good at first, andthen being like, Okay, it's time
to step it up and starting tobuild your own brand, your own build
business, your own community. Yeah. I think for me, I got
to stage for context. The firstever job I took on was it wasn't
up work, but it was oneof those you know, gig platforms.
It was the first thing I tookon and it was five dollars and it
was for an article called the toptwenty six random number, Top twenty six
(11:46):
cities to raise children in the UnitedStates. That's kinds such an expert on
this, And it took me threedays of exactly living in all these cities.
Yeah, so it took me threedays of research and a lot of
work, and I delivered it andthere was an option to tip me,
and they didn't tip me, andI was kind of like, are you
(12:07):
kidding? Like five bucks at threedays of work. So that was the
first sort of like, I needto make the sustainable. This doesn't this
can't work like this. There's gotto be another way. There's people out
there doing this, so that I'vejust got to find how. So,
you know, I was seeking clientsin different places and that kind of thing,
and getting clearer on my service stackand that kind of thing. But
then as things grow, as Ibuilt that community more out of a need
(12:30):
for me wanting to connect with morepeople, my success started really taking off.
And that was through a few things. I think it was through I
had mentorship, I'd invested in programs, I was building my network a lot,
and if I'm quite frank, Ithink a lot of it was quite
intuitively. I'm good at public relationsas something I've always you know, I've
always made sure I was in mediapodcasts, you know, getting in the
(12:54):
news, that kind of thing,so that all, you know, elevated
my position and it got to apoint where I was earning a minimum five
thousand dollars a month, every singlemonth, and then sometimes ten thousand most
short term projects as well that Iwas taking on. And when I was
sharing what was happening for me mybusiness in this community, people began asking
me, like, what, Iwant to see that kind of success?
How are you doing this? Andit hadn't occurred to me that people might
(13:15):
want to learn from me. I'dnever gone into this thinking I want to
train people in this, but thereappeared to be this need and so around
this time, I was just like, I don't know how to help people.
I've never been in a position whereI'm training or teaching. But I'll
try, you know, I'll trysomething. And so I threw together this
five day challenge, which I stillrun to this day. Funnily enough,
(13:35):
it's transformed over the years and it'sgot enough soon, don't you I do
on the seventeenth. Yes, SoI threw this together and I literally I
put it out there and I dideach day as it came. So like
day one, I was like,right, so, what would you do
on the day one of being ofit? You would do this day two?
What would you say? And Ikind of just did it in the
(13:56):
moment with people and like invited peoplewhen to kind of make it a collaborative
sort of effort, and it worked. At the end of the week,
like a bunch of people got jobs. I was like, from like having
no experience to getting jobs, andI was like, maybe I know some
stuff. Maybe I've learned some coolstuff that I can pass on. And
that was really the very sort ofhumble beginnings. I didn't anticipate doing this
(14:20):
and skip forward to today we've trainedthirty thousand people when we were one of
the leading CHU assistant organizations at trainingorganizations in the world. So I mean,
I guess it was the right pathto take. Yeah, I mean,
none of congratulations. That's amazing.It's amazing that you've been able to
serve so many people, and it'sreally cool, Like I think there's a
lot of people who kind of lookat, you know, people like us,
(14:41):
who are you know, not fromMexico. Living in Mexico. We
get to like have a great climate, we get to eat grade food,
and they say like, how canI do that? And I think it's
really amazing to be able to belike, hey, I can actually teach
you, like what I did,and you can replicate it in a way
that like serves you and your business, which is super cool. Absolutely.
Yeah. I feel like when thethings I really love about what you're doing
(15:01):
in your business is like one ofthe things we found when we started is
as we were doing research kind ofin I guess maybe like twenty fourteen,
twenty fifteen, that kind of timewhere we were like, Okay, how
could we keep traveling in a moresustainable way, like make money on the
road. I feel like so muchof it was like people in the travel
industry, so travel bloggers, youknow, travel YouTubers, I guess,
(15:24):
travel podcasters. Podcasting wasn't that bigat that point, but there was like
a few people doing it, peopledoing like travel tours, travel agents,
travel photographers, that type of thing. I feel like that's where we thought,
were like, we love travel,so maybe we should create something within
travel. And I think it's reallycool that even early on, you created
something that's like it allows you totravel and create this lifestyle, but it's
(15:46):
not necessarily travel travel related. MYeah. Absolutely. I think one of
the things that I really like aboutthe career in general, the VIA career,
is that you can take your interestseven if they're not, you know,
professionally aligned, and you can kindof weave that into your work.
If you're really into yoga, youcan be working with people who have online
yoga courses. If you're really intoI don't know, cheeseburgers, you could
(16:07):
do menus for burger you know.Like there's so many things that you could
do by taking your interests in thebringing them forward. So it doesn't need
to just be related to travel anymore. It can be you can bring you
to the table, which I thinkis beautiful. Yeah, yeah, that's
amazing. I want to get intolike va more specifically and why this is
a really great career. But beforewe do that, I'm kind of curious,
like, as you were doing allof this, like building your business
(16:30):
and just working online, where wereyou traveling to? Like, were you
kind of all over the world.What was kind of your rhythm at that
point. So the first few yearsbefore I was working online, it was
mostly around Europe just for ease andcosts really, you know, being in
the UK, that was much easierto hop around there. Over the years,
I've spent a lot of time inBangkok, Thailand. It is like
(16:51):
my favorite city in the whole world. I did spend around three years,
not all at the same time,but sort of like over a four or
five year period, three years inand out of Sardinia, Italy, and
just more recently, I kind ofsort of base myself on a continent and
then travel around. That makes sense. So I'm like, right now I'm
based in Mexico and I'm traveling around. But a lot of places I'm going
(17:15):
have been to. I stopped countingat fifty eight, so maybe sixty countries,
seven to sixty one countries something likethat. But the longest periods I've
spent I've been in Bangkok, Budapest, Sardinia, and now Mexico. Okay,
awesome, very cool, amazing.Let's get into some more details about
VA work, because I think thisis really cool. Like I said before,
it's like an opportunity for I thinkso many people, are so many
skills. Why do you feel likethis is like a great career for somebody
(17:38):
who might want to be a digitalnomad or even just like work remotely.
For a few reasons, I thinkone, the barrier to entry is pretty
low. You don't necessarily need aformal education to move into this work.
Even sometimes resumes become a little bitirrelevant. It's more about having a portfolio
and demonstrating that you can do whatyou say you can do. And I
think it's important to note as wellthat there's sometimes this misconception that virtual assistance
(18:03):
to really techie work or and somedo absolutely do. But the categories of
work really fall into three buckets.You've got administrative work, creative work,
and technical sort of work, andthey can totally overlap. But let's just
take the admin one for a moment, because I feel like this is easier
for a lot of people to moveinto, especially if they're completely new to
working digitally in any way. Evenif the only thing that you could do,
(18:26):
which is rare in today's very techsavvy and you know, Internet savy
generations, But even if the onlything that you could do is create a
Microsoft word document and turn it intoa PDF, for example, there is
someone in the world that doesn't knowhow to do that, you know,
and you have to come from thatperspective that exactly or doesn't want to do
it. Yeah, there's all thesedifferent things. So whatever it is that
you're coming to the table, ifthere is someone out there who will pay
(18:48):
you for those skills. So it'sreally about owning what you already know and
then bringing online. And the moreyou learn, the more you can earn
in this career. So that's alsothe cool thing. You might start entry
level rates and you might end upon one hundred dollars an hour and a
year or two times. There's somuch space to grow in it, and
there's so much space to play withwhat you're offering in terms of your services,
with the types of people you wantto work with. So for me,
(19:08):
especially if you're someone who's like alike a multi passionate person, there's
so much space to just again bringyou to the table, start with what
you've got, and grow with thatand take that with you anywhere in the
world. You know, compared toremote jobs, which while remote a lot
of them maybe geographically limited to certainareas or you know, still having to
show up at certain times, youhave that autonomy to work at times that
(19:30):
suit you. We have a lotof neurodivergent folks who move into this work
as well, and I think it'sreally accessible for people like that because you
get to work at times that workbest. Forew for example, I work
really good in the nighttime. I'llstay up all night working and everyone thinks
I'm weird, but I'm like,I get my best work done and nobody's
telling me when I can and can'tdo that. So it's accessible. It's
a low barrier to entry. It'sreally fun work, and there's so much
(19:52):
variety in it, and you reallydo have potential to, like I said,
learn and earn more. Yeah.Yeah, I love what you're talking
about with NEURODII divergent people as well, because I feel like there's I don't
know, I feel like I feellike we're all different, right, Like
we all function differently, we allhave different minds, we all think differently,
and I think it's really important toyou rather than trying to like fit
into molds or boxes, to findthings that we can really thrive in.
(20:15):
And I think that if your brainjust thinks differently or you work best,
like you said at night, it'slike finding a career that allows you to
do that is a really amazing thing, rather than like trying to force yourself
into like a nine to five,which I mean, quite honestly, I
think the Monday to Friday nine tofive works for very few of us.
So yeah, exactly. Yeah.And so for somebody who's maybe thinking like,
(20:37):
Okay, this sounds really cool,I would love like all these things.
Do you have any tips for likegetting started as a VA. Yeah.
I mean it's really about identifying whatthose existing skills are and not disregarding
your previous experience in the offline worldbecause it's so very relevant, and also
then looking at So if I wasto say, right now, here's what
you do to get started, Iwould say, get sheet paper, put
(20:59):
three columns. In the first column, you want to put down what am
I good at? And I don'twant you to limit to limit it to
only what you're good at in yourprofessional life. Are you good at baking?
Are you good at you know?Because it's going to start informing your
interests as well. Then you've gotwhat do I enjoy it? So then
from that list of what you're goodat, only bring the stuff you enjoy
it. Because I always say there'sno point building a business by design.
If you're going to be doing stuffyou hate doing, like you might as
(21:21):
well get a job you hate doing. It's the same thing. So if
you're going to make the effort andmake the leap, because it is effort,
and it is a leap to startyour own business. You might as
well start it on the wrong I'mnot on the wrong foot, on the
right foot. You might as wellstart it on the right foot doing things
that actually light you up. AndI just want to make one distinction here.
A lot of people will say,folly your passion and the money will
(21:42):
come. I don't subscribe to that. I subscribe to you. Folly your
interests and let them evolve and changeover time. But as long as you're
interested in, you're engaged, you'regoing to find the work enjoyable. Finding
your passion can be a really intimidatingtask for a lot of people. I
find it's I don't feel like allof us have this one thing that we're
going to do for the rest ofour lives. So you know, look
at your interests, look at yourinterests. What do you actually enjoy it
(22:03):
out of those things you're good at, and then start to look at and
you can you can literally take almostto any business that exists right now as
a model for this, and justthink of you do a little spider diagram
if you want, and think ofall the moving parts that happen in that
business and where your skills and interestscan align with that. So these businesses
that you're going to look at,they might be ones that actually already identify
(22:25):
with that. So again, let'sgo back to that yoga yoga enthusiasts.
Let's say you're really good at yoga, you love yoga, you so you've
got two things right there. You'regood at customer service as well, so
maybe you want to be supporting ayoga instructures, Facebook, community community management,
that kind of thing. So youstart to branch out and realize all
these tiny little things are things thatcan be outsourced. So really just doing
(22:45):
like a brain dump of like okay, x wiz a yoga studio, they
need this, this, this,this, this, this, where could
I pick up pieces from that?I'm probably not demonstrating it well, it's
a better visual, but yeah,looking at what your what your existing skills
are, what you're what you enjoydoing out of that, and then how
that can meet and market need isa good place to start because I think
(23:08):
one of the pitfalls that a lotof people fall into in this work is
moving into it with this idea ofI'm good at a lot of stuff and
I want to help everybody, whichis a noble cause, but it's it's
it's really hard to do that becausewhen you're speaking to everybody, you're ultimately
speaking to nobody. People want tofeel spoken to. They want to hire
people in their business who speak theirlanguage, who understand their business model,
(23:30):
and that comes with a premium aswell, So you're going to get more
money with that as well. Yeah, that totally makes sense. Yeah,
yeah, yeah, I love that. And then any like, once we've
kind of identified what we're what we'reinterested in, what our skills are,
where should people go to like applyfor things like do you recommend up work
or there are other sites that aregood for that. I'm I'm kind of
(23:52):
anti these brand people thinking of theright words, and I'm not don't use
these platforms. I'm saying don't usethem as a main avenue because what we've
found in you know, thirty thousandpeople is enough for me to have gained
some data on what works and whatdoesn't work and what works more effectively.
And what we've found over the yearsis that what seems to work more effectively
(24:15):
is the networking. It is thebuilding the personal brand. It is building
authority around your area, your niche, your services and referrals ultimately the backbone
of a really successful VA business.Now does it harm to have a profile
on these platforms and if you seesomething apply for it. No, of
course it doesn't. But I thinktaken a really proactive approach instead of the
(24:36):
more traditional job market approach, whichis applying for opportunities, it's rather creating
opportunities. So yeah, I wouldreally recommend you know, hanging out,
whether your ideal clients are hanging out, make sure you're providing some value networking
behind the scenes. You can dothings like getting in the media. There's
plenty of different ways that you cansort of boost your authority in your area,
(24:57):
and oftentimes it's just asking for thesales. So example of there's a
really simple quick tip that a lotof people don't do. Especially if you
you know, if you I've identifiedthe services you can offer, maybe you
start putting them into practice in yourown business. For example, if you
want to be an Instagram manager,your Instagram is going to be shit hot,
(25:18):
right, that's your portfolio piece.You want to be a web designer,
your web design you your website isgoing to be awesome. You want
to be a writer, you starta blog, you have this portfolio piece
to bring forward to validate what you'resaying you can do. And then you
can go onto social media because you'vebeen networking in the right places, going
to LinkedIn or Facebook or wherever itis that your audience is hanging out,
and you can literally say I haveavailability to take on one client next month
(25:41):
doing X y Z DM me likeyou need to let people know you're in
business as well. I think there'sthis it's not a build it and they
will come scenario right. You needto be very proactive and that's that's a
really simple thing you can do.You can apply to multiple areas of your
business. I would post on socialmedia and say I want to get on
twenty podcasts this month, and thenpeople are going to m here's how I
(26:02):
can bring value. Here's what Ican do here sow I can back up
what I can do. And it'skind of like, you know, if
you ever go in the United States, I feel like this is the United
States thing. You drive around andyou see like a motails that have a
sign like vacancy no vacancy. It'sthe same thing, and you need to
tell people you're open for business,and so just simply that action on a
(26:22):
regular basis, paired with the networking, paired with you know, creating niche
specific content, paired with asking forreferrals, and also then providing a great
service for your existing clients in orderfor referrals to actually take place. It's
really effective. So I know that'ssorry, there's a long tangent, but
yeah, no, no, Imean that's like so many golden nuggets and
they're like really really helpful information.So I appreciate the tangent. And yeah,
(26:47):
I mean I don't have a lotof experience with those platforms you're talking
about, but I feel like justhearing your example of like you know,
spending days and hours and hours ofyour time for like five dollars is like,
I'm kind of like, you know, we're worth more than that.
And I think one of the thingsthat's challenging about those platforms is like they
(27:07):
you kind of have to get thereviews right. It's like people are not
going to just pay you one hundreddollars an hour when you're like brand new
on the platform. But I feellike if you can build your own Instagram
or your own website or maybe both, and like showcase is somebody what you
can do, what your skills are, I feel like they're going to be
much more open to the idea oflike paying you more right off the get
go. Yeah. Absolutely. Andone of the examples I always give is
(27:30):
if somebody came to me and said, you know, I want to work
with you. I'm a general adminVA I want to work with you.
My rate is fifteen twenty dollars anhour, and then I look at the
prof and I'm like, I don'tknow, I don't know this person,
you know. And then someone elseapproaches me and says, hey, I've
noticed that you are not showing upon Instagram and the way that you should.
(27:51):
And I work with you know,queer entrepreneurs who of course creators,
and my rate is thirty five dollars. I'm hiring that person because I'm like,
you get me. I don't needto explain everything to you, so
you know, doing your research aboutthe types of people you want to work
with, and then I really tailoringyour messaging as well. Yeah. I
think that that's one of the thingsthat just like with the general job market,
we like miss in a big way. It's like people just create like
one cover letter that they change likethe name on it and the company and
(28:15):
one resume and they just like sendit out to all these companies and then
they're like why is and nobody callingme back? And it's like, what
have you done to demonstrate that you'relike a really great fit for this?
Like do you know anything about thecompany? Do you know anything about the
position? And I feel like,you know, today's market is like competitive,
right, and I think especially toget a job that we're excited about
the pays, well, it's likewe have to show to the person like,
(28:36):
hey, I know something about you, and here's why I'm a great
fit for you, and that personis going to be willing to pay a
higher rate, just like you said. Absolutely. And I think it's important
to note as well that Niche orNiching, however you want to cool it.
We can argue about that. ButI say, Nicheing, I don't
know about you. You did good, Yeah you're in the good crew.
Yeah I'm Canadian, I say ztoo, So I'm extra cool with Niching.
(29:00):
I find that a lot of peoplesometimes are concerned that it's going to
limit them, right, it's gonnaI'm closing the gap so small that I'm
not going to find anyone. AndI think the little bit of reprieve that
you can have with that in theVA space is that you don't need to
niche necessarily by industry or by eventhe type of job or a role that
the entrepreneur or business is fulfilling.You can also niche by values, which
(29:25):
we're finding is really effective in thecurrent market. So, for example,
I really want to work with peoplewho in their business in some way are
impacting the environment positively. So thatleaves scope for like what this could be
a construction company that does sustainable building, or it could be a life coach
who helps people. I don't knowif you know what I mean. So
(29:45):
it really does leave the scope abit wider. If you're feeling like niching
by an industry is difficult, youcan also niche by values. Yeah,
I love that. I think it'sreally important to you to like look at
our values. Like I think,you know, people are going to do
what they're going to to do,and I think everyone's kind of entitled to
their own beliefs and the way theyoperate their business. But I think there's
naturally going to be things that wealign with more. And it's like,
(30:07):
again, if we're building lifestyle bydesign business by design, it's like,
let's get clear on like who we'reexcited to work with and why we're excited
to work with them. And ifit's like, hey, I want to
work with like email entrepreneurs, orI want to work with an all mail
team, or I want to workwith you know, people who are giving
back in some way, you know, it's like, let's identify that so
that we can really feel aligned withthe people who are supporting Absolutely. Yeah,
(30:30):
I love that. I want toswitch gears and ask a little bit
about you know, just kind ofyour your lifestyle with your business, because
I know it's a lot to belike moving around all the time and whatnot.
So I'm curious for you a littlebit about like, you know,
balancing productivity like running a business whilealso traveling because I think one of the
things we found is in the earlydays when we were making less money and
(30:52):
we were just taking on like youknow, projects here and there, we
had a lot more like oh wellthere's nothing to do today, let's go
explore out that. It's like,you know, we have more professional jobs,
built a business, that type ofthing. It's like, okay,
well, like stuff's got to getdone, so you know, we've got
to figure out how to do thisbalance. So I'm curious for you how
that looks in terms of like managinggetting work done while also exploring. Yeah,
(31:15):
I think very similarly to you thatin the beginning days there was a
lot more time to just sort offrolic around and enjoy the surroundings. And
well, I definitely do still enjoymy surroundings. I think I've slowed down,
and I think for the work,but also, you know, we
had stopped a dog here in Mexico. Like there's things that just have naturally
slowed us down, but the businessbecoming more of a serious thing and needing
(31:38):
requiring more attention. You know,I'm managing a team now, I manage
a team around the world, andso that you know, having to align
with them for calls and stuff likethat has required us to slow down so
that you know, I can bemore present and I can be then actually
take intentional time off. So forexample, I recently went to Canada,
of all places, for a weekwhere I actually completely switched off and people
(32:01):
were like, honey, you're alwayson vacation. I'm like, no,
I need a vacation for my vacation. I'm not. I'm working like I
live here most of the time,and then I'm starting to take vacation.
So I've definitely slowed down to thepoint that I'm questioning if I could be
called a digital nomad anymore. Butyou know, semantic socide, I'm based
here and I take trips when Ineed to recharge. More. That said,
(32:22):
there are certain things I do,Like I said, I work better
in the evening, so I dodedicate like certain evenings for working and then
certain evenings for hanging out with mywife or going out with friends or that
kind of things. So having amore structured schedule that works for me.
And I don't mean, like whenI say having a structured schedule, it
doesn't need to align to anybody else'sidea of what a good structure is really
(32:43):
because mine works very much for me, and I definitely recommend creating one that
works for you too, But itis about having one where you can hold
yourself accountable for like I will actuallyget this done at this time because this
is when I work good or Iwill actually go see people at this time
because I've already accounted for this anothertime. Or chunking your clients into certain
days, you know, like Mondayand Tuesday I work with client one,
wednesdays of work with client two,those day work with client three, and
(33:05):
Fridays of mine like that, youknow, or working the weekends that you
can go do things in the week. So it really is about creating a
structure that works for you. ButI think the overall sort of messages that
slowing down has enabled me to buildmore impact, build more wealth, and
ultimately to enjoy the time that Ido have exploring at a higher level as
well. Yeah, for sure,I feel very aligned with that. I
(33:27):
feel like we're very much in thesame position. And I have digital nomad
in my personal Instagram bio, andI was recently thinking, I feel like
I should take this out because I'mnot really I'm like more of an expat
at this point. Like we havea home base as well. We've been
here for a year and a halfat this point, almost two years.
You know, it's like we're planningto continue basing here for now. I
don't think it's forever, but we'vereally enjoyed like kind of slowing down like
(33:52):
we did a number of years whereit was like, you know, a
month was a long time to bein a place, and it's really it's
really hard to strike that balance oflike I'm focusing on work and I'm getting
stuff down and I'm feeling really goodabout the quality that's coming out of it,
and then I'm also like getting achance to get to know this destination
that I'm in, because it kindof sucks to go somewhere really cool,
(34:13):
like to be in like Port ofIata, for example, where you are
and be like, oh, I'velike haven't got to explore any of the
amazing beaches or go to any ofthe cool restaurants, or like go to
any of the amazing events or livemusic or whatever whatever it is that you
want to do. It's kind oflike, well, why am I here
if I'm not exploring. But thenit's a really slippery slope of like,
hey, I'm going on like thisbeach trip and this speech trip and I'm
(34:35):
doing this thing and oh crap,I haven't checked my emails for six days,
and like business is slipping. Yep, that that happens sometimes, Still
so it's it's a little trial anderror, but I totally agree with it,
and I think that staying in placeslonger as well. I don't know
how it is feeble. I havefound, which I'm I'm actively working on,
is that I've found that you know, I'm here in Putovyata and I've
(34:57):
been here I don't want to say, three or four months now, and
i haven't gone out as much asI should because I'm like, oh,
we're going to be here for ayear, so I've got time. I've
got time. And that's what peopledo when they live in places that they
consider their home, right Like youdon't explore your home. So I'm like,
no, I need to make anactive decision to do this. So
you know, again, allocating timefor that is really important. Yeah,
for sure. We like to kindof like set We've had the same thing
(35:21):
and we just like, did thishike We've wanted to do, like basically
since we moved to Cadetro. Wejust did it a couple of weeks ago.
Mind you like when we moved here, I was very pregnant and then
we had a baby, then wehad a new board. You know,
there's like excuses and reasons why wehaven't done it. But we finally got
out and we're like why did wewait so long? But something we did
kind of prior to pregnancy, smallinfant, that type of thing was we'd
(35:43):
actually like set we'd be like,what are our top things to do here,
and like write it on a pieceof paper, put it on the
wall, kind of bucket list style, because it's like, Okay, if
we have three months or six months, whatever we have, let's be really
intentional about like this weekend, we'redoing X thing, or we're going to
X restaurant or whatever, because itis easy when you do have time to
like also just get in your rhythmand go to the same place as constantly
(36:05):
or not explore. We experienced thisin Panama. We thought we were going
to spend a year there and thenthe pandemic happened and we decided to leave.
And there's like some of the topattractions in Panama City that we have
not done. Actually, what's interesting, as you mentioned the pandemic, I
feel like the pandemic also slowed downa lot of the longer term nomads just
it was a natural slow down.It was a natural like, oh,
(36:29):
maybe we needed this to focus onour business a little totally. Yeah,
we found that it was like,well, we can't go anywhere, so
I guess we'll just like stay putand like focus on other things. Yeah,
totally. I'm curious on that note, how you choose destinations, Like
what's do you and your wife havelike a process in terms of like choosing
a destination, how long you staythere, that type of thing. Yeah,
(36:51):
it's a very very intense process actually, So we get lots of post
it notes and then we put downlike the place. We'll always have places
in mind, right, so they'llbe like four to five places that we're
thinking of, and we tend togo back to places we know or we
know we're going to be similar toplaces to be like right now because we
kind of kind of got the vibefor what we like. And we'll put
the names of those places on thetop row of post it notes. And
(37:15):
then we have like our priorities.So our priorities are conveniences. We're really
big on, like is there goodfood delivery? Are there ubers? You
know? Can we get around withease? I don't drive, for example,
so that you know, transportation isa big one for me. Then
for our specific case, like isit LGBTQ friendly, because like I'm in
the past, we've gone to placeswhere I've made concessions and like, correct,
(37:35):
we'll be discreet, but I'm like, I'm at an age, but
I don't want to have to practicediscretion to be who I am anymore.
So yes, So now it's likeis it friendly enough that we can live
there and hold hands and not belooked at funny? Equal, that's one.
I think the quality of the food, Like, so we're vegans,
so like high quality, healthy foodsin abundance. There a recent addition,
(37:57):
do they have dog parks? Isit dog friendly? Yeah? It's definitely
shifted over the years from like whatcool bars are in town to like is
there a good physiotherapist? So thenwe have these things exactly no meds in
the thirties, and so then wekind of rank these places on a on
(38:19):
a one too, however many pointswe have, and then we tally up
at the end and I think it'sthe place with the lowest amounts of points
is the winner, and it alwayscomes out as Thailine. But then we
never go, which is weird.It just feels so far away. I
used to live there, and Ijust I think with a dog now,
it feels hard to like she hasto go in cargo. She's a big
dog, so but Mexico's is closeseconds. So that's where we've landed.
(38:43):
Okay, cool, Yeah, no, thanks for sharing that. It's nice
to hear like somebody else's process.So and I just really resonate with like
things shifting, like the first tripI was mentioning earlier that we did in
twenty eleven, it's like real recent. I think we're like twenty two or
something like that, and we'd recentlygraduated from university and it was like,
you know, what hostiles have thebest vibe? Like do they have bars
(39:04):
there? Do they do like barcrawls? And now I'm like, can
I like push a strollers there?Like other people like that have kids.
I'm like, is it too noisy? Because I'm a grandma. I got
a bed at like nine thirty ten. That's funny. I think it's cool
to see like the evolution personally though, like of and I think it's really
(39:25):
normal as you like go through differentchapters of life to be looking for different
things, and it's it's nice tolike, you know, acknowledge those with
yourself or your partner whoever you travelwith, and like be able to be
like, Okay, what are ourpriorities? And I think it's cool because
it leads us to different destinations rightas we're like in different chapters of life.
Yeah, And I also think what'sinteresting is to revisit places you've visited
maybe years ago, and to seehow you relate to them differently at this
(39:49):
different stage in your life. So, for example, we're going to Columbia
in August, and I haven't beenthere since twenty seventeen, and I've changed
a lot since then, and whatwas important to me there is going to
then it is very different to whatwould be important to me now. So
it'll be interesting to see places withthis new lens as well. Yeah.
Yeah, it's actually funny that youmentioned that, because we just went to
Columbia at the beginning of twenty twentythree, and we I guess the last
(40:10):
time we went we went to baronKia for Carnival in twenty twenty, like
right before the pandemic, but priorto that, like the last time we've
been in Medine was twenty fourteen,Like we're not working remotely staying in hostiles.
Like we walked by one of thehostles we stayed in and I was
like gross, like I would literallylike somebody could not pay me to stay
there. Now I'm always laughing.I'm like, did I get boozio?
(40:31):
Did I just get older? Yeah? I know, right, I know.
I used to be so critical ofmy parents, and obviously they're still
in a different category with everything fromme, But I used to be so
critical of them of like, oh, you're such prudes with like where you
stay and like blah blah blah.And now I'm like, Okay, I
kind of I'm getting it, Likedon't want to stay in that like mixed
dorm with like sixteen other people.I'm good, Nope, amazing. Well,
(40:57):
I'm curious what's next for you guys, You guys Jane and PV for
a while. What's kind of thetravel plans? What do you guys have
on your reader? It's a questionmark right now. It's something that we're
actively discussing. We're definitely staying here. We're seeing We've got a year long
rental, which is the first I'vehad in many years. So that's a
commitment in itself and then I mean, we have residency here, so we'll
probably stick around for the next coupleof years. I think we have two
(41:20):
years left on that and then wecan decide if we want to do permanent
I think there's just a question markright now about aging parents and grandparents in
Europe and whether or not we wantto go spend maybe a year or two
there before heading back. I'm inthe process of obtaining my Italian citizenship through
ancestry, so that would give meaccess to the European Union again because Brexit
sucks as a UK person. Soyeah, there's a discussion around that really,
(41:45):
and I think that's also another agespecific thing. Yeah, Mexico and
or Europe something like that. Amazing. Well thanks for sharing that, And
I'm curious where can people go tofollow along with your journey, Hannah,
or maybe learn about you or ifthey want to be via learn from you
all that good stuff. Yeah.Sure, my profiles everywhere. Our digital
nomad Kit that's ki t on Instagram, on threads, which is new as
(42:08):
of a few days. I'm stillstill resisting it. I'm not sure about
it. It's so fun, it'sso fun. I'm hooked. Yeah,
digit Kit, digit kit dot com. If you want to join the five
Day Challenge and now we touched onit. We run those every two months,
so depending on when this goes live, there will be one coming up
at some point. Totally free.Really good introduction if you are interested in
(42:30):
pursuing something like this, or atleast experimenting and seeing if it could be
a good fit for you. Amazing. Thanks so much for your time today.
This has been really awesome. Thankyou for having me. It's been
great to connect. Thanks for listeningto this episode. If you want more,
and make sure to check out theWorld Wanders Insider, available on Patreon
at Patreon dot com. Slash theWorld Wanders for show notes, head over
to the World Wanders dot com.Find us on social media at the World
(42:52):
Wanders Podcast, and join the privateFacebook community at World Wanders, a community
for travelers. You can always getin touch with us at info at the
world wanders dot com. And ifyou enjoyed the show, don't forget to
subscribe and leave a review. Itreally helps us find new listeners. See
you next time.
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