Revelation 9: God's people supernaturally protected from God's wrath!

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These Final Days Ministries: www.TheseFinalDays.org

Bill, Terri, John, & Pastor Ryan continue their look at what is one of the most popular "proofs" of a Pre-Tribulation Rapture offered by those who promote this doctrine: the notion that John's depiction of being called up to Heaven in Revelation 4:1-2 is symbolic of the Body of Christ being Raptured before the start of the Great Tribulation and the reign of the Antichrist.  In this episode:  Who are the 144,000 in Revelation 7 who are supernaturally "sealed" for protection from God's wrath just before the Great Tribulation begins?  What is this "sealing" exactly, and is this event entirely unprecedented?  Are there any clear depictions of this "sealing" protecting God's people on Earth in Revelation's narrative of the Great Tribulation period?  What does all of this mean for Christians, and does this shed any light on the timing of the Rapture?  Important stuff... Take a listen!

This podcast regularly discusses these topics:  Bible Study, eschatological, end of the world, End Times, Last Days, Book of Revelation, Pre-Tribulation Rapture, Post-Tribulation Rapture, Rapture, Great Tribulation, Second Coming, Third Temple, Second Coming of Christ, the Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Two Witnesses, Four Horsemen, Apocalypse, Israel

#rapture #eschatology #revelation #endtimes #secondcoming #raptureofbride #lastdays #bookofrevelation #tribulation #antichrist #thirdtemple #biblestudy #jews #oldcovenant #israel

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Brook lydgert Wood and Brandon Lake with Honey in the
Rock on your Celebration Radio Network. And good Friday morning.
It is sixteen and a half minutes after the hour,
and my troop is in here. Pastor Ryan, John and Terry.
Good morning, gang.

Speaker 2 (00:14):
Good running.

Speaker 3 (00:15):
I hope you guys are doing great.

Speaker 2 (00:17):
Yes, yes, happy, yes, yeah, okay, great, good to be here.
My alarm clock went off on time.

Speaker 3 (00:22):
So yeah, your alarm clock.

Speaker 1 (00:26):
I mean you were here really early today. What the
usual is anyway?

Speaker 2 (00:30):
Yeah, well it's all the set up. So I think
we mentioned, Yeah, you're on TikTok right now, yeah, so
right now as we speak. Yeah, so we're filming this day.

Speaker 3 (00:39):
Gave to the phone.

Speaker 2 (00:40):
So yeah. So actually, anyone listening on the air, if
they if they want to like see what we actually
look like or the back of my oh no, they
are these good looking faces, just go to TikTok and
then these final days or look for these final days ministries.
I'm sure to find it, right. I think it's just
these final days and you'll see it's streaming live. Yes
as we speak.

Speaker 1 (01:00):
Yes literally so And speaking of speaking, Yes, Israel and
Hamas have agreed to a series of pauses pastor right, Yeah,
in the Gods of War. So it looks like that
they're gonna do something for the Well, why don't you
cover this?

Speaker 2 (01:20):
Yeah, so you said that this came in at four
o'clock this morning for this morning. Yeah, and and there
there's been chatter about this over the last couple of days.

Speaker 1 (01:28):
So I I saw those emails too, but I wanted
this one because it's the latest news.

Speaker 2 (01:33):
Well not only the latest, but last I saw, which
was like last night, I think, uh an agreement had
not been reached. So this is this is news to me, right,
So yeah, so uh so again, like like Bill just read, so,
Israel and Kamas have agreed, and of course through the negotiators,
which is the United States the condor doing that in Egypt, right, Egypt,
I think are the current negotiations. You're right, you're writing

(01:54):
about the about the polio thing. So there's been a
really bad outbreak of polio in the Gaza strip. And
when I say really bad, I mean there's been a
few kids diagnosed, but they're but they suspect if they
diagnose a few, there's probably hundreds or not that and
polio is a terrible thing. So my my grandfather actually
had polio as a kid, that's my mom's father, and

(02:14):
spend his whole life crippled, you know.

Speaker 3 (02:16):
Because right, so it's it's not not something to.

Speaker 1 (02:18):
Just you know, right, you know, you can wipe that,
you know, just brush that off kind of thing, right,
you know, take a couple of aspirin and call me
in the morning.

Speaker 3 (02:25):
It doesn't work that way.

Speaker 2 (02:27):
It impacts these kids for life. Yeah, So, so humanitarian crisis,
which this whole thing has been, you know, from day one. Anyways, right,
we all know what's happening in Gaza.

Speaker 3 (02:35):
You believe it's almost been a year.

Speaker 2 (02:37):
I know, I know, I can't believe it's taking Israel
this lawn to eliminate Hamas. Those guys are dug in
way deeper than than I expended, of course the idea expected, right,
and it's just terrible. So that so that so they're
reporting like forty thousand dead dead Palestinians, maybe half of
those are civilians or whatever. Again, it's it's a or

(03:00):
and Coma started it and backing the whole thing. It's
it's going to be mad at somebody, don't be mad
at Israel. So so anyways, yeah, so in order to
inoculate more than six hundred thousand children against polio. So, uh,
that's that's a big deal. That's probably not all the
kids in Gaza. There's about two million residents in Gaza.
That could be like literally like every child.

Speaker 1 (03:21):
And well there's only like two million then yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (03:25):
So that this is a huge you know, undertaking World
Health Organization. They're directly involved in it, right, and they're
the ones who've been pushing for this. So so what's
what's interesting about this is that this is going to
make everybody mad, okay, on both sides. So so thing
about this, well, I mean in terms of like those
who were you know, uh in Israel, you know watch

(03:47):
and more so so all the families who've been crying
out for a ceasefire all this time so that they
could get the remaining hostages out, they're going to be
happy about this because this this could be another step
toward getting more hostages. Right. Yeah, Those who are you know,
more on the side of we've got to elimentate Kamas,
you know, at any cost. Uh, they're not going to

(04:08):
like this. And I'm and I'm prophesying here, right, I
mean this, you know, we haven't seen the reactions yet,
but I just I guarantee it. You're gonna have people
you know, you know, upset, you know, on on both sides,
so or they or they have been people upset on
both sides. So should I read some more of this
because I found this really interesting. So as as the
fighting briefly halts, Israel claims it has largely collapsed the

(04:30):
Kamas Ratha Brigade, which is the group that's stationed down
by Egypt, so that's that's called the Rafa Crossing and
all those tunnels that go under ground between Egypt and
and Gaza. This is the first I've heard this, so
I love this. So so first of all, yeah, so
israel I guess they're saying they're they're finally they finally
have the upper hand on the Kamas Rafa Brigade. They're

(04:51):
like considered like the toughest fighters in Kamas, so they're
getting down to the end of this thing. But it
says that Israel Secure Cabinet also voted Thursday yesterday to
keep control. This is so smart, So glad they're going
to do this, keep control of this strategic Philadelphi corridor
between Gaza and Egypt to shut down the smuggling of weapons, money, drugs,

(05:15):
and people. So from day one when Israel pulled out
back in two thousand and five, they left Egypt and
control of that particular border. And what do you think,
I mean, of course, like everything under the sun is
going through and you know you picture like you know
these guys with you know, donkeys and they load up
you know these these you know, these these guns on
the donkeys and they sneak over the board. No, there

(05:35):
are these huge underground tunnels you.

Speaker 1 (05:37):
Could drive vehicles through, not vehicles.

Speaker 2 (05:40):
And it's not canned. They have been driving vehicles, dozens
of semi trucks. I mean a huge it's gigantic, it's
it's a huge infrastructure, right, and of course you know
tons of weapons are getting in and money from Iran,
and that that that one border crossing between Egypt and Gaza.
That's what's been uh perpetuating this this whole situation. All

(06:03):
the rockets are you know coming in through there, right,
all the good rockets, I should say. So so so
this this will be a very good move if if
Israel sticks to their guns and controls that crossing. So yeah,
just just keep watching this mentioned the northern warn has Belah,
you know put Hesbla, you know up in a you know, yeah,

(06:25):
we know that's a mess. You know. I'm here, I'm
hearing from our friend in Bay Route every day.

Speaker 3 (06:29):
And he's he's still doing Okay.

Speaker 2 (06:33):
He's I'm I'm picking up if I could get this,
make this personal, but he's I'm picking up on depression. Yeah,
because they can't work, and I don't know what they're
doing for food. We've helped him a little bit. We
sent a little bit of money over there to help
him and his family. But has Beala they control all
southern Bay Route and uh and and I think on

(06:53):
our last show just two weeks ago, we read an
article about how I think it was here how Hesbalah
after the last assassination by Israel in downtown by the Babiru,
they just you know, take out a building, right of course, Kezbla.
They're they're stupid, but they're not stupid enough to stay
where they were. So now they've spread into the other
parts of Baby.

Speaker 3 (07:14):
We did cover that.

Speaker 2 (07:14):
Yeah, so these are like nay, it's next door neighbors
now and and but Israel's not going to hesitate to
if they can target one of the top Hesbolag guys
in Beirut, They're they're going to target them no matter
where they are. I mean, it Israel, serious, man, you
don't mess with Israel. Everything they've been through the last
two thousand years and the Holocaust and and they they

(07:36):
are refusing to submit to genocide period.

Speaker 1 (07:40):
Kind of can't blame right, Yeah, really, well, this last
sentence here, it's interesting that they immediately expand the northern
war against Hezbolah in Lebanon, so sixty thousand residents north
of the Galilee can safely return to their homes.

Speaker 2 (08:00):
Right, So, I didn't realize that many Israelis had evacuated
the northern town.

Speaker 3 (08:04):
Thousand people. I mean, yeah, that's that's a whole you know,
major city.

Speaker 2 (08:09):
Yeah, and the town's up there on pretty big, like
Matula is kind of the big one up there, and uh,
and that that was that's maybe I'm just guessing thirty
thousand people something like that. So, and I know all
the residents haven't left up there, but I think a
lot of the you know, smarter ones are the ones
with kids, like let's you know.

Speaker 3 (08:25):
Get out, let's get out of here. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (08:27):
But just this last week. I think it's a few
days ago, but Israel, the IDF actually did a major
preemptive attack against Hezbolah. So they hit a bunch of
targets in southern Lebanon. And this this was in response
to their intelligence. They realized that Hezbolah was actually building
up and preparing to do a full scale thing like

(08:48):
Commasted back in October seventh. And this time Israel picked
up on it and they took out the whole works,
like everything these guys you know, were you know, putting together.
And so by doing that, they've probably avoided for now
a larger scale altercation, you know, war with with you
know has blow. Where's all this going? This is the

(09:11):
time story because eventually Israel is not going to be
able to stave it off completely and and Iran's never
going to give up Kamas Hasla, the hooties are never
going to give up and uh and eventually we know
where this is going, you know, the war of armaged,
the anti Christ all that stuff.

Speaker 1 (09:30):
So well, Iran still hasn't you know, taken their revenge
and people haven't doing air quotes it on the top. Again,
they haven't retaliated against Israel since they you know, this
is it's been like almost two weeks now.

Speaker 2 (09:51):
Right, Yeah, the latest round of assassinations by Israel and
and uh and its been longer than that because we
were talked last show, we talked about it. So it's
been at least three weeks, i'd say. And yeah, when
they when they assassinated Ismail Hania, the head of Kamas
in Tehran.

Speaker 3 (10:08):
Yeah, in Tehran.

Speaker 2 (10:09):
Yeah, huge insult to Iran. This is after Iran had
fired three hundred and Israel shot down all of them
except for one. Israel plus the US plus Saudi Arabia
plus Jordan. So Iran really has egg on its face
right now. And that's why they haven't retaliated, Bill, That's why,
because they're just thinking, oh my gosh, if we try
to retain Israel.

Speaker 4 (10:30):
And on top of that, our fleet's over there.

Speaker 5 (10:32):
Yeah, aircraft carriers are going over there, Abraham and the
group that went through you know, nuclear submarine, I mean yeah, yeah,
they you know, they're they're like hedging their bet.

Speaker 2 (10:45):
Yes, yeah. So so why hasn't Iran retaliated Because they're scared. Well,
and there's another angle on this too, the leadership in
Iran The only reason that Israel has not started to
assass need them. I'm just going to say it on
the air. Who cares? Right, The only reason they haven't
started tossassinating them is in order to avoid a full

(11:06):
scale war with Iran. But the mule is in Tehran.
They're thinking, Man, they just took out ismail Hani. I
mean probably planted the bomb there two months earlier. I mean,
you know, remote control. So so I think they're scared
personally for their own personal lives, and they should be. Yeah,
but guess what we're war and this isn't just any war,
this is the End Times war. Yeah, I mean, come on.

Speaker 1 (11:29):
Well, I heard a report I think it was yesterday
or maybe the day before about Iran getting closer and
closer and building up their stockpile of almost their uranium
is almost to the point to where they can get weaponized.
You know, they're they're building up that stockpile and they're

(11:51):
not letting people come in and inspect it and stuff.

Speaker 2 (11:53):
So yeah, the International Atomic Energy Agency, right, Yeah, who's who,
by law is supposed to be. There's still they don't
want to now Iran.

Speaker 4 (12:05):
Iran is still backed by China, right.

Speaker 2 (12:08):
They are they're they're well, they're they're there alley of China,
particular Russia. Yes, so yeah, you're a hundred percent right,
And I got so. So China is interesting. China doesn't
actually show up in biblical prophecy. Scholars think that it's
mentioned one time in the entire Bible, but it's more
like just like kind of a Proverbs kind of thing. Right,

(12:29):
I can't remember Ezech what you know, what the reference is,
but it's not eschatology. But Russia is hundred percent and Iran,
of course hundred percent.

Speaker 4 (12:37):
Does that relate to Magog? And those are the ones
that always get people confused that.

Speaker 2 (12:43):
Mago is Moscow etymology on that, on that name, and
Gog is actually name the name of a person. Okay,
so it's Gog of Magog, so hundred percent, Yeah, that's
that's the Gog.

Speaker 4 (12:56):
There's the connection, all right?

Speaker 2 (12:58):
Yeah, well, and it shows up more than that. But
h So, throughout biblical prophecy, we see that Iran is
the main backer of the anti Christ, the main belligerent
against Israel in Theion Times War which we're in now. Uh,
and Russia is all over the place backing Iran. So
and come on, this stuff was written thousands of years
ago and it's and we're like seeing it on the

(13:19):
on the daily news. Yeahah, you can't make this step up.
I mean, anyone who doubts that we're in the times,
all I can say is, come on right, wake up.

Speaker 1 (13:30):
Yeah, that's the phone number eight hundred seven two one
ninety three one three one eight hundred seven two one
ninety three thirteen. And when we come back, it's free
trib proops in the Book of Revelation.

Speaker 3 (13:41):
Yeah, back to that, back to our topic.

Speaker 1 (13:44):
Yeah, one eight hundred seven two one nine three one
three Big Daddy Weave would let it begin? Is up
next on your Celebration Radio network. Good Friday morning, Caleb
and John with Kine singing somebody like Me on your
Celebration radio work. Well, it is sixteen minutes to the
top of the hour. This is bill the phone number

(14:04):
eight hundred and seven two one nine three one three
one eight hundred seven two one ninety three thirteen to
get in that favorite or if you have a prayer request,
or if you'd like to talk to Pastor Ryan, John
and Terry and I we would love to talk to
you as well. So Pastor Ryan, we uh left off
last time we were in the Book of Revelation, and

(14:25):
we're gonna go back yep to kind of like give
a synapsis of what we discussed last time.

Speaker 2 (14:32):
So yeah, so I think we're into a really fun
topic now. I think everybody's going to really enjoy this.
So I know I am so uh.

Speaker 3 (14:40):
So always do I always do.

Speaker 2 (14:42):
So last show, we we introduced kind of the concept
here that that in Revelation chapter four versus one and two,
which is really the beginning of the of the you know,
actual narrative portion of the Book of Revelation, right, Uh,
it's the very beginning of the story. So, so John
gets the apostle, John on the Isle of pat Most
two thousand years ago, gets called up into into heaven

(15:03):
where he has shown this prophecy, which which we know
is the Book of Revelation, right, and what the what
what the argument is this particular argument in favor of
this idea of like a pre tribulation, you know, rapture.
And I want to say this right up front, we
were not trying to be like argumentative or controversy, just
trying to learn, just talking about the intime's here, right, So,
so what The argument is that that symbolic of the

(15:25):
church being caught up, you know, raptured to heaven before
the Great Tribulation. We're in the end of Christ because
because you know, that's that's that's what the symbolizes here.
So so so I want to start out, we want
to start up by saying, you know, does it say
that No, you know, is John the first person to
be called up to heaven? No, Like Paul talked about,
you know that he he says, someone he knows or whatever,

(15:47):
we think it was him was caught up to the
third Heaven. That's that's the realm where God is, right.

Speaker 1 (15:52):
So, and Paul actually used that term third Heaven. Yeah, yeah,
when he's talking about that experience. Yeah, and he was,
you know, caught up. So you know, it's it's just
like when Paul was caught up. Well, that wasn't symbolic
of the rapture you know either, Right, But it's fine.
I mean, I'm okay with suggesting, Hey, that's symbolic. But
the crux of this argument is that in this and

(16:13):
you'll see this like in Tim Lay's books, et cetera,
the crux of the argument is, you know, the proof
of this is that the Church is never mentioned again
throughout the entire narrative of the Book of Revelation, you know,
you know, the story of the Great Tribulation, the anti Christ,
and so this what we want to look at, I mean,
I mean, so is that true? Is the Church never
mentioned again? We don't see the word church. But as

(16:35):
we talked about last show, how many different ways can
you refer to the church, Christians, the Body of Christ,
the saints, the elect There's all kinds of terms besides
the word church. So so that brings us to Revelation
chapter seven. So so the other thing about about John
being you know, called up to heaven or cut up
to heaven in chapter four is that that is before

(16:58):
the chronology the story of the times begins. But that
story actually begins with the with the with the scroll
with the seventh Seals that only Jesus can open, and
that scroll is it's God's decree of judgment on this world.
So it's not until the seventh Seal is broken and
the broken in turn one, two, three, four, five, sixty
seven that the Great Tribulation begins.

Speaker 2 (17:20):
So so just that that chronology that is suggested, you
know what chi'n being caught up. It's it's just off, Okay.
So so that then that's arguing that the rapture happens
like like decades or centuries before the Great Tribulation begins.

Speaker 4 (17:35):
Right.

Speaker 2 (17:36):
So so Revelation chapter five, Revelation chapter six, this is
when the seals of this scroll are being broken, right
just before the seventh seal is broken. Okay, And right
now I think we're somewhere between the fifth and sixth seals.
By the way, the next thing to really watch for
is the sixth seal. We're getting so close to all this, right,
But Revelation chapter seven is right before the seventh seals,

(17:59):
right before the Great Tree begins. The Great Tribulation begins
in Revelation chapter eight. So with that, Okay, Terry, where
are we at?

Speaker 4 (18:07):
Okay?

Speaker 6 (18:07):
This is Revelation in chapter seven, verses one through eight.
After this, I saw four angels standing at the four
corners of the Earth, holding back the four winds of
the Earth, that no wind might blow on earth or sea,
or against any tree. Then I saw another angel ascending
from the rising of the sun with the seal of
the Living God, and he called with a loud voice

(18:29):
to the four angels who had been given power to
harm earth, and see saying, do not harm the earth,
or the sea or the trees until we have sealed
the servants of our God on their foreheads. And I
heard the number of the seal. One hundred and forty
four thousand sealed from every tribe of the sons of Israel.
Twelve thousand for the tribe of Judah, Reuben, Goad, Asher, Naphtali, Manassa, Simeon, Levi, Issachar, Zebulun, Joseph,

(18:59):
and Benjamin.

Speaker 4 (19:01):
We're all sealed.

Speaker 2 (19:01):
Excellent. There's a lot going on here. And I got
to say that this passage gets me very excited because again,
we are on the cusp of this, We're on the
brink of this, this this actual event, you know, taking place.
We're very close to this time. So so so I
kind of want to look at this. I see Bill
looking at the clock.

Speaker 4 (19:20):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (19:21):
I know that Terry before we like dig into this,
I know that Terry wanted to share something with Ezekiel.
Do you want to do you want to let her
do that now?

Speaker 3 (19:27):
Or okay?

Speaker 4 (19:28):
Okay.

Speaker 6 (19:28):
This is from Ezekiel nine. It starts at verse four
and the Lord said to him, pass through the city
through Jerusalem, and put a mark on the foreheads of
the men who sigh and groan over all the abominations
that are committed in it. And he said to the others,
he said in my hearing, pass through the city after
him and strike your eyes shall not spare, and you

(19:49):
shall show no pity. Kill old men outright, young men
and maidens, little children and women, but touch no one
on whom is the mark.

Speaker 2 (19:58):
Excellent, excellent reference. He so, so, so what terry, just
Reverend Ezekiel, that that shows us that this, this event
that's going to happen Revelation chapter seven, the very near
future is not unprecedented. We see this in the book
of Ezekiel and and God. So God's bringing a plague
against the people, but he sends an angel first to
seal certain people, the righteous, on their foreheads. And then

(20:20):
it says, so when the plague comes through that you
know that's going to hit all the end righteous. But
those who have the seal on the foret Now it's
not a literal like visible. See it's literal, but it's
not visible. This is spiritual seal on their foreheads. So yeah,
excellent reference.

Speaker 7 (20:34):
Good.

Speaker 1 (20:35):
And we've seen that also in Egypt when the ten
plagues excellent one and the Angel of Death went through
and the children of Israel had to, you know, mark
their posts and and they're lintel with the blood of
the Lamb, that blood that was sealing them, protecting them
as well.

Speaker 3 (20:52):
So the angel route.

Speaker 2 (20:54):
You know, flew over and would literally see like okay,
you know these guys are sealed on their door. They're
sealed on the door, and then would pass over. Right,
that's the passover story. Right, Well, good job you guys.
I like the reference.

Speaker 6 (21:05):
And the only way you can get sealed is if
you accept Jesus Christ as your Lord and savior.

Speaker 2 (21:10):
Yeah, yeah, which is which is not this seal that
we're talking about, but let's we'll talk about that when
we come back. But yeah, that's right, Terry exactly.

Speaker 1 (21:18):
One eight hundred seven two one nine three one three
eight hundred seven two one ninety three thirteen. Up next,
it's the Newsboys and Heaven on Earth on your Celebration
Radio network. That's my King. That's CC Winans on your
Celebration Radio network.

Speaker 3 (21:33):
This is Bill.

Speaker 1 (21:33):
The phone number again eight hundred seven to one nine
three one three one eight hundred seven two one ninety
three thirteen again to get in that favorite of prayer
request store to talk with Pastor Ryan John.

Speaker 3 (21:43):
Terry and I.

Speaker 1 (21:45):
So we are discussing Revelation chapter seven, one three eight,
and then we went into uh Ezekiel's and uh Terry
brought up an incredible point about the sealed forehead and uh,
the angel death you know I brought up as well,
you know, yeah, story, so let's continue with that. I

(22:07):
believe you wanted to mention something else as well.

Speaker 2 (22:09):
So so yeah, so I I love what you brought up, Terry,
what you brought up, Bill John, We're still waiting for
something to get you yeah, you know. Yeah. But but
what that what that demonstrates for, is that what we
read in Revelation chapter seven. It sounds weird, you know,
just before all this stuff happened, God is going to happen.
God's going to send this angel around the earth to

(22:30):
cel his people on their foreheads, right, and it sounds weird,
but it's not unprecedented. There's absolute biblical precedence for this.
So so this is this is something that God does.

Speaker 4 (22:39):
So so let me let me throw a wrench in that.
Oh here we go, these are these are sealed people, right.
But then when people look at this, they say, well,
that's the one hundred and forty four thousand Jews that
are left here after the this is this is that's
going to throw a wrench they want. Even in the
Old even in the Old Testament, it.

Speaker 2 (22:55):
Was absolutely okay, and it's not right. It's not right.

Speaker 4 (22:59):
So that's the kind.

Speaker 2 (23:00):
Yeah, and we're going to kind of prove this out
listen and in our audience. It's for everybody to decide
for themselves. So getting the word, be filled with the
Holy Spirit, pray about you know, God will reveal to you.

Speaker 4 (23:08):
Right.

Speaker 2 (23:09):
But yeah, this is the argument, is that the one
hundred and forty four thousand that that well, it's one
hundred and forty four thousand Jewish males who are virgins
and they never told a lie and all this weird
stuff right right, And just on its face it sounds
word plus. Even the number feels a little symbolic, don't
you think one hundred and forty four thousand, it's such
a such a such a strange number. It's not you know.

(23:33):
So and yeah, we're going to get into all that.
But but this idea of being sealed on her forehead.
So let's let's talk about that first. So, so, Terry
made a very critically important point. She's she's kind of
our evangelist on our on our show here right, that
that you you don't qualify for this unless you are
born again? One hundred percent true of course. Right, well,

(23:53):
actually no, I got to take that back, come to
think of it. Okay, interesting Ranch here right, speaking of
John just said about you know this is this is Jews. Yeah,
so so long story short, we're going to prove this out.
But this with our radio show we got just be
right boom boom boom, So one hundred and forty four thousand,
we're going to prove it out. But it actually is
describing Christians and Jews. So it's all of God's covenant

(24:16):
people in the end time story. Okay, so the Jews
are still in covenant with God. Did they reject Christ
two thousand years ago as a people end mass?

Speaker 7 (24:24):
Right?

Speaker 4 (24:25):
Yes?

Speaker 2 (24:25):
They did? So are they born again today? No, they're not.
But the Bible is very clear Old Testament and knew
that they will be when Jesus comes back, They're going
to look on him whom they peers been and mourn
Dan chapter nine, verse twenty four. They're gonna they're going
to anoint the most holy, you know, at the very
end of that seventieth week. That's a seven year great tribulation.

(24:47):
Paul and Romans, chapters nine, ten eleven. In the end,
all Jews will be saved. Okay, So really, when God?
This is interesting? Hello, When God, when this angel is
going to go around in our near future here and
seal all the all of God's Covenant people, Christians and
Jews on their foreheads. Not everyone is saved. So if
you're if you're if you're listening right now, and you're
a full Orthodox Jew, and you're you're an active participant

(25:10):
in the Old Covenant, you'll be sealed. Okay. But I'm
guessing that most of our listeners are not Orthodox Jews.
So if you're not, then what Terry said one hundred
percent applies. You've got to be born again, right, that
said this seal is not salvation, it's not being born again.
What I mean by that, the four of us sitting
here in this studio, we're all born again, Okay, we're

(25:31):
all saved, right, we don't have the seal on our foreheads.
Because this is a future event. Okay, we will be
sealed because we're born again. So just just to kind
of make that distinction. So so, so why do I
say that this this passage we just read in Revelations
chapter seven, that this is right before the seven year
Great Tribulation begins.

Speaker 3 (25:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (25:53):
See see this, That's why I want to throw this
at you. Right. So there's there's two very clear answers
to this. Right, so that the first thing, Terry reads
versus one one through three again please.

Speaker 6 (26:07):
Of seven mm hm. After this, I saw four angels
standing at the four corners of the Earth, holding back
the four winds of the Earth, that no wind might
blow on earth or see or in against any tree.
Then I saw another angel ascending from the rising of
the sun with the seal of the Living God. And
he called with a loud voice to the four angels

(26:28):
who have been given power to harm earth and see, saying,
do not harm the earth or the sea or the
trees until we have sealed the servants of our God
on their foreheads.

Speaker 2 (26:39):
Okay, so who is it in this passage who's going
to harm the earth and the sea. Angels of the Lord,
Angels of the Lord is God himself is sending these
angels too, right, so reminiscent of the Passover exactly exactly.
And we did that a while back on the show
show the correlation between the seven trumpets and the seven
Bowld judgments in Revelation compared to the ten plagues in

(27:02):
the Exodus story. And they line up, you know, almost precisely, right,
I mean, I mean, obviously that's the type and shadow,
but it's God who does it. So, so make no mistake,
it is God himself who will begin the Great tribulation.
This is house described, is that these these four rangels
are are standing at the four corners of holding back
these natural forces that God is just about ready to

(27:23):
unleash upon the earth. We can't do it yet, we
can't start the Great Tribulation until first God's people Christians
and Jews are sealed on their foreheads. For what purpose, Well, Terry,
just she already let the catither back. You did too
with the Passover story. The purpose is to supernaturally protect
us from what God is about to send. Well, God's
about to send right right, Okay, So that's the first

(27:44):
thing that we we know this is right before. What's
the second thing?

Speaker 1 (27:48):
We'll get to that in just a little bit, okay, Cliffhanger,
all right one seven one nine three one three eight
hundred seven two one ninety three thirteen. Jason krab Up
next with good Morning Mercy on your Celebration Radio Network.
I don't know about you, but I'm thankful for God's mercy.

Speaker 2 (28:06):
Yes.

Speaker 1 (28:06):
Eight hundred and seven to one nine three one three.
That is Brandon Lake with Miracle Child on your Celebration
Radio Network. Good Friday morning. It is nineteen minutes to
the top of the hour. This really has flown by
this morning like it normally does.

Speaker 2 (28:20):
What you always add.

Speaker 1 (28:21):
Yeah, Pastor, Ryan, John and Terry are in the studio
with me this morning, and we've been discussing diet and
food and oh.

Speaker 3 (28:29):
Wait, yeah that was that was off, that was off
the air.

Speaker 2 (28:32):
Yeah, snickers bars, yeah yeah. So back to the end
of the world.

Speaker 3 (28:36):
Yeah, which we'll want those snickers.

Speaker 2 (28:40):
Yeah yeah. It starts talk pilely now will start tuned.
So so, audience, we're discussing Revelation chapter seven versus one
through eight. If you want to open up your bibles
or phones and follow along. But so so again, so
so last segment. You know you know, why do I
say that this event that you know, got sending his

(29:00):
angel seal his people old Covenant and new just before
the Great Triblation starts. We looked at this imagery, you know,
the angels holding back the the you know, these these
natural forces that God's about ready to unleash upon the earth.
That's going to because which is why he sends the
Angel to seal his servants. So uh So the second
reason that we know that this is right before the

(29:20):
Great Tribulation starts is again back to that concept of
the of the scroll. So that's introduced in Revelation chapter five,
a couple chapters earlier, right very beginning of the prophecy,
like the story of the end Times, and and there's
a scroll with seven seals that only Jesus is worthy
to open, and he opens them one by one. Now,

(29:41):
the first four seals are the four horsemen of the Apocalypse,
also known as right and I argue that reposit that,
uh the four horsemen are already rioting. That's not part
of the Great Tribulation, that's part of the of the
Scroll's not until the seven seal is broken, the scroll
is unfurled. That's God's decree of judgment. That's when he

(30:02):
releases his He proclaims his judgment and releases his what's
the word wrath he said before? Yeah, and Bill hit
the nail on the head, right, And then people say, well, yeah,
but we're not a point of God's wrath. That's the
point of the seal. That's why we get sealed in
important because we are not appointed to God's wrath. So
an example of this, so, how does the Great Tribulation start?

(30:23):
The seven seals broken the scrolls open Revelation chapter eight.
Right after the ceiling event takes place, the first trumpet
is blown, followed by the second, third, fourth, Right, So
the seven trumpets constitute the first half of the seven
year Great Tribulation, and then finally the seven Bowld Judgments,
which is like the full wrath of God. Right, those

(30:43):
take place toward the end of the seven year Great Tribulation,
toward the end of the antichrist reign, like kind of
during his reign. Right, So this like, okay, you know,
God's like I've had it.

Speaker 3 (30:53):
You know, you're going to.

Speaker 2 (30:54):
Get you know, my full wreath. But his people are
supernaturally protected from his wrath, just like those who were
sealed in the book Phytikil, like up just like the
Israelites in Ghoshen, like.

Speaker 1 (31:04):
Bill brought up right, just like Noah in the Ark.

Speaker 2 (31:07):
Noah in the Arc, just like uh, you know a
lot in his family, you know.

Speaker 3 (31:14):
Yeah, Daniel and the lions.

Speaker 2 (31:16):
There you go another one.

Speaker 3 (31:18):
Yeah, stories are there, you just got to put them together.

Speaker 2 (31:21):
Yeah, And and it brings up an interesting point about this,
this concept of ceiling that that John brought up during a.

Speaker 4 (31:28):
Yeah, so I was, I was thinking about that. And
you know, in my younger years, you always think that
you're sealed right, so nothing can happen to me. And
that's so you think you're completely protective from everything. Would Yeah,
so you are in relation to God and his wrath.
But in the same sense, you're sealed for eternity to

(31:48):
be with God forever, which doesn't mean that people are
things that happen here on earth aren't going to affect you,
so you can still have so such as such an
important point to bring up this juncture and art discussion,
that that that that we're sealed right before the Great
Tribution begins, which makes us completely immune an exempt from
whatever God sends his plagues. But like John saying exact,

(32:11):
very important point. That does not mean that we're immune
from from what the world brings. So God's got his contribution,
Satan's got his contribution to that period.

Speaker 1 (32:20):
And Jesus told his disciples that we would have tribulation
and be persecuted for his namesake and and be killed.

Speaker 7 (32:28):
He killed.

Speaker 4 (32:29):
Yeah, all the apostles were. They are all killed except
for John. You know. Well he was to boil him. Yeah,
he was boiled and oil, but nothing happened. So they
threw him out the patmost.

Speaker 2 (32:37):
Yeah, I mean the early Christians thrown to the gladiators
and the lines and all that. Yeah, today you know,
in the Middle East age. I mean, come on, so
so so anyway, so Bill, let's look at a quick
example for our listeners of what this ceiling accomplishes. So, so,
the Great Tribulation begins in Revelation chapter eight with the

(32:58):
first trump and then finally we get to the fifth trumpet,
so we're well into the tribulation period. And the fifth
trumpet is the plague of locusts from.

Speaker 1 (33:08):
The bottomless pit, and it says this, Then the fifth
angel sounded, and I saw a star falling from heaven
to the earth to him, was given the key to
the bottomless pit. And he opened the bottomless pit, and
smoke arose out of the pit, like the smoke of
a great furnace. So the sun and the air were
darkened because of the smoke of the pit. Then out

(33:30):
of the smoke locusts came up upon or upon the earth,
and them was given power to them, as the scorpions
of the earth have power. They were commanded not to
harm the grass of the earth, or any green thing,
or any tree, but only those men who did not

(33:52):
have the seal of God on their foreheads.

Speaker 2 (33:56):
Yes, and you can actually stop right there. I was
gonna have you reading, but it just goes into more
detail about what these locusts do. First, okay, so first
of all, this is the fifth trumpet. Remember the Great
Tribition starts at the first trumpet. This is sent by God.
It's a plague sent by God. It's Locus. God's done
this before. That was one of the plagues in Egypt,
wasn't it. The book Joel talks about the plague of

(34:16):
Locus right right, and and you know so many end
times guys hell lindsay, I remember late great planet with
they argue, well, this is this is symbol and I'm
okay with that. I mean, there was a lot of
symbolism in but this is it's not it's actual locus. Okay,
you want me to prove it, because like Hele Lindsay said, well,
these are helicopters. There are those special comes fro Russia.

Speaker 3 (34:35):
Right.

Speaker 2 (34:35):
Why would God have to command helicopters not to harm
grass or the leaves of trees?

Speaker 7 (34:42):
Right?

Speaker 2 (34:42):
Their locusts right? So well, they are just like the
fish that swallowed Jonah had to be specially modified to
carry out God's purpose. These locusts are specially modified to
carry God's pers But the but the point, the main
point we're honting in on here is that the locusts,
fifth trump bit, fifth plague, well into the Great Triblation period.

(35:03):
Whoever was sealed in Revelations chapters are is still on
earth because these locusts have to be instructed do not
harm anyone who has that seal on their foreheads. So
this is an example of how God's people, whoever the
one hundred and forty four thousand are, right, I say
it's Christians and Jews, But whoever they are, they are
supernaturally protected from all the wrath that God sends upon

(35:24):
the earth. We are not appointed at God's wrath. Yeah,
here we go. This is what that means. Doesn't mean
we're in heaven during this time we're on earth, but
we're supernaturally protected from a god's send. So does that
make sense?

Speaker 4 (35:36):
That makes total sense? Yes, it does.

Speaker 2 (35:38):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (35:39):
One eight hundred seventy nine three three one eight hundred
seven two one ninety three one three, And we get
one more break with these guys. We'll get to that
here in just a few minutes. Mikeah Tyler and Emerson
Day is up next with people like us on your
Celebration Radio Network. Good Friday morning, Good morning, your Celebration
Radio network.

Speaker 7 (36:00):
You know this, Bill, Yes, it is good morn Bill. Dwayne, Hi, Dwayne,
Dwayne Cliff. How are you all right?

Speaker 1 (36:07):
How are you?

Speaker 7 (36:08):
I'm grateful? I got a question for Ryan. Okay, Christians,
And then.

Speaker 3 (36:17):
Can you hold on for a second.

Speaker 1 (36:19):
He's heating up his coffee. Sure, so he's not in
He's not in the studio at the moment.

Speaker 7 (36:25):
Okay, Yeah, yeah, I was wondering about the ceiling. His
first four and verse in chapter seven names the people
who were sealed because the church age is already gone.

Speaker 4 (36:41):
Okay, Okay, that's a really good question. I hit him
with that a couple of times, so but he's got
a really good answer. So well, well he just got
back in the studio.

Speaker 2 (36:50):
We'll talk about me.

Speaker 4 (36:51):
Yes, we're talking about you. We're talking about one hundred
and forty four thousand. Yeah. And his question, who who's him? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (37:00):
Who are we talking to?

Speaker 4 (37:02):
Dwayne? Click? Yeah, Dwayne Clin.

Speaker 2 (37:05):
Oh from from where?

Speaker 7 (37:08):
From from?

Speaker 1 (37:09):
Oh?

Speaker 4 (37:09):
Aren't you?

Speaker 2 (37:10):
Aren't you Susan's brother?

Speaker 7 (37:12):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (37:13):
Yeah, you and I know each other used to come
to my class years ago. Do you remember I know you?

Speaker 7 (37:16):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (37:16):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (37:17):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (37:17):
How you doing, Dwayne?

Speaker 4 (37:18):
Yeah?

Speaker 7 (37:18):
A good? How are you great? So?

Speaker 2 (37:20):
What what's the question?

Speaker 4 (37:22):
Pop that question again?

Speaker 7 (37:23):
The question is you know, you're saying that Christians are sealed,
But in Revelation seven four, it talks about who was
sealed and because the church age has already gone, So.

Speaker 2 (37:38):
I would say the church like like, like, what, why
do you say the church age has already gone? That's
that's not that's not actually biblicult.

Speaker 7 (37:46):
Revelation chapter four, I'm here of the church and and
verse four in Revelations seven four named the seald and
I heard a number of them which were sealed, and
then we're sealed one hundred and forty four.

Speaker 2 (38:02):
Thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel. Yes, right, absolutely.

Speaker 7 (38:08):
My question is, how do you think that Christians are
stilled because they already had their chance before chapter four?

Speaker 2 (38:17):
Who already had their chance before chapter four? Christians or Jews?

Speaker 7 (38:21):
Yes, No, the Christians, because that's the church age and
the church age is gone.

Speaker 2 (38:26):
So that's that's been taught. Yeah, it's that's that's really
like a theory that's been taught. There's nothing in the
Bible that says the church age and this is when
the church age ended or will end. So that's like it.
That's like an interpretation. But what I'm saying is, no,
that's not true. The church age. Well, first of all,
there's no such thing as the church age. There's the Church,

(38:49):
and the Church is eternal. We don't have like an
expiration date and the Church.

Speaker 7 (38:57):
They're taken away for the Second test.

Speaker 2 (39:01):
Second, that's on these two. Paul says, don't be deceived.
The rapture will not happen until after the Antichrist rises
to power, which is halfway through the seven year Great Tribulation.
So if you go back and read second, that's only
chapter two. Paul literally says that. He says, he says,
don't be deceived. You know, if you think that the

(39:21):
second coming in raptures you know already happen, it can't
happen until after the abomination of desolation, which we all
agree happens halfway through the seven year Great Tribulation. So
so yeah, second that's on these two doesn't say pre
tribulation rapture best case scenario. If you don't factor in
any other scripture in the Bible, it's it's you know,

(39:44):
like after mid trip, Yeah, after mid so.

Speaker 7 (39:50):
Or what would you where do you stand pre tribe.

Speaker 2 (39:53):
Or post post tribulation rapture with that question? You know,
Jesus says in Matthew chapter twenty four verse you know,
twenty nine through thirty one one, he says, immediately after
the tribulation those days, and then he describes the second
coming in rapture and resurrection.

Speaker 7 (40:09):
Yeah, in chapter twenty four.

Speaker 2 (40:11):
Yes, exactly, so he describes.

Speaker 7 (40:14):
Has nothing to do with the rapture.

Speaker 2 (40:16):
Well, it says, or Rip says, I'll send he'll send
his angels to gather his eleg from the fore corners
of the earth. I don't know what that is if
it's not the rapture.

Speaker 7 (40:25):
Right chapter twenty four you're talking about.

Speaker 2 (40:27):
H Yeah, Matthew, Chapter twenty four, verses fifteen through thirty one,
that describes the chronology of the reign of the anti Christ.
So it starts off in verse fifteen. Therefore, when you
see the abomination of Desolation standing in the Holy Place,
well we know that that's halfway through the seven year
Great Tribulation. That's from Daniel nine twenty seven, right. Then

(40:48):
in verses twenty one and twenty two he coins the
term Great Tribulation. Then finally in verse one nine, he says,
immediately after the tribulation, what tribulation? The Great Tribulation? Right,
he just said it. Then he says, you'll see, you know,
you'll see the Sun of Man appear in the clouds,
the power and great glory. He'll send his angels to
gather his elect from from the farthest part of Earth

(41:09):
to the farthest part of Heaven. You got to you
got to cross reference with Mark chapter thirteen. But but yeah,
it's it's it couldn't be more clear. I mean, Jesus says,
after the Great tribulation they were in the ni Christ
then I'm going to come back and I'm going to
rapture my church.

Speaker 4 (41:27):
But back to his back to his original question.

Speaker 2 (41:29):
Yes, such a fair question.

Speaker 4 (41:32):
In Revelation seven, it only mentions the tribes of Judah, correct,
So all the tribes of Israel, all the tribes of Israel. Yeah,
so how can that possibly mean the Christians are sealed? That?

Speaker 2 (41:45):
That was his original and im and I'm telling I mean,
everybody listened, Dwayne, that's that is a spot on, completely
fair question. So and and I actually told the group
here before you called that that we have like one
segment left this morning, do.

Speaker 1 (41:59):
We Nope, the top of the hour?

Speaker 2 (42:04):
Okay, well this this be included. This will be included
on our podcast though, so we include all of our
phone calls. So, Dwayne, you're going to be on our
podcat cast, right, you won't be on the air this morning.
But but so, I guess I just have to say
it here then, So this is going to be my
cliffhanger for the next show. So in two weeks we're
going to do this again. Yes, this is an incredibly

(42:25):
fair question. You know, Revelation chapter seven, it doesn't say Christians.
It says one hundred and forty four thousand of all
the tribes of the children of Israel of Israel. Right,
So here's where we're going to go on the next show.
Why am I saying this includes Christians? It does include Israel,
does include Jews. So for that to be the case,

(42:47):
First of all, there's something symbolic about this. The number
one hundred and forty four thousand is not a literal number,
it's entirely symbolic. The enumeration of the twelve tribes here
is also symbolic, because these aren't the twelve tribes. It
looks like at first glance, but you're missing the tribe
of Dan, You're missing the tribe of Ephraim. Why do

(43:07):
we have a tribe of Joseph and Manassa? Right, So
obviously you know there's something symbolic happening here. That's all
fine in dandy, but you still can't like really say, well,
you know, how can you make an argument then that
the one hundred and forty four thousand includes Christians. That
comes in seven chapters later, in Revelation chapter fourteen, because

(43:29):
in Revelation chapter fourteen, which by the way, happens after
the Antichrist rises to power. That's in chapter chapter twelve, right,
the one hundred and forty four thousand are discussed again,
and we get a whole new set there of descriptors,
and every I mean, like what seven, eight, nine descriptors,

(43:51):
every single one of them is clearly referring to Christians.
So John's point with this is, look, there's this group
calling them one hundred and forty four thousand. It's all
of God's Covenant people, Old Covenant and New Covenant chapter
seven when they're introduced, here's their Jewish component. Later on
chapter fourteen when they're talked about again, Okay, now we're

(44:12):
going to emphasize their Christian component. And then there's a
lot of other you know, nuts and bolts that that's
you know, hints that that's what one hundred and forty
four thousand are. It's a symbolic number symbolizing both Christians
and Jews on Earth during the Great Tribulation. But you're
just gonna have to wait for two weeks and come
back for the next show and we'll talk about it.

Speaker 7 (44:35):
Yeah, I hear you. All the time.

Speaker 2 (44:37):
Oh good, awesome. Yeah, So yeah, in two weeks we'll
come back again, and hey, can you guys something you
remember Dwayne? I want to give you credit for this
great question. So our next show, I'm going to try
to remember Dwayne. Can I mention you on the air?
Oh yeah, that's fine, Okay, I'll just say yeah, at
the end of the last show, you know, Dwayne called
and had this great question. Cause again, totally fair question.

(44:59):
You know, if I can't into this challenge, then you know,
then then I then I take back everything. But but yeah,
Revelation chapter fourteen is really the key to seeing this.
This this clearly Christian component to this group.

Speaker 7 (45:12):
So okay, well, I'm not I'm not here to criticize
what you're saying. I'm just you know, this is a
question because we're millions of people will listen.

Speaker 2 (45:22):
Yeah, and you.

Speaker 7 (45:23):
Know people have our pre trip, post tribe, mid trib
all that. Yeah, how is how is the Saints going
to come back in the Second Coming if we don't
go up pre trib.

Speaker 2 (45:35):
Well, my father passed away last year. He's coming back
in the Second Coming. He'll be riding a horse alongside Jesus.
And because he's in heaven right now. So we all
have loved ones who were born again, who have passed on,
they're all up in heaven when Jesus comes back. The
Bible says, they're coming back with him. That's from you know,
the Book of Jude. Uh, that's that's in in Paul's writings,

(45:58):
right so, and that's that's the resurrection component.

Speaker 7 (46:03):
Yeah. So you're saying that we'll be here at the
second coming.

Speaker 2 (46:07):
Yeah, I mean, Paul Paul says that like the quintessential
rapture passage, and first that's only chapter four. Paul literally says, uh,
then we who are alive and remain shall be caught
up together with them in the clouds to meet the
Lord in the air. So literally, like the one passage
that everybody points to and says, yeah, that's the rapture,
whether your pre trib miitrib, posterrib whatever, right right there.

(46:30):
Paul says that when Jesus comes back, he's bringing he's
bringing the deceased saints with him, those who are asleep
in Christ as a way he phrases it, right, and
and he says that first they will receive their their
resurrected bodies and then those of us who are alive
and remain will be caught up in the air to
you know, meet them in the clouds. Right, and thus

(46:50):
we shall always be with Jesus. Therefore come from one
of these words. So so the way Paul describes it
is second Coming. Jesus brings back all that the spirit.
So the deceased saints with him in the clouds. As
soon as they get here, all of their dead bodies
are resurrected from the grades. They float up into the sky.

(47:11):
They rejoined with the spirits, and then those of us
who were still alive on the earth at that time,
then we get our turn. Then we go up also
and receive our immortal transformed bodies. So, and that's how
it's described in Matthew chapter twenty four, Mark chapter thirteen,
lou chapter twenty one, you know, Revelation chapter nineteen. It's

(47:36):
the second Coming. Is the resurrection happens first, immediately followed
by the rapture in a blink of an eye. Yeah,
I mean, we're transformed in the twink of an eye.
It's not like a process like that's First Corinthians chapter fifteen.
Instantly we receive those immortal bodies.

Speaker 4 (47:52):
I always look at it as when a prominent figure
like a king was coming to your village or your town.
As he approached, the town would all run out to
meet the king and then escort the king back into
the town. Right, It's the same type of concept that
Jesus is doing. So our king, King Jesus, is coming,

(48:13):
and as he appears in the clouds, we all go
out to meet him. We're raptured into our new bodies
and we go to meet him. And he's coming with
his cohorts of people, which are all the people who
died before us who are with him. So they're all
coming back to Earth. And we see him in the clouds,
we're resurrected to go with him, and then we all
come back with him to earth because we're not appointed

(48:34):
to live in heaven. We're appointed to be here.

Speaker 7 (48:36):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (48:37):
And then so I always say, and this is the
craziest thing for a pastor to say, but I'm never
going to die, and I'm and I'm never going to
live in heaven. I'm a pastor. And I say, that's okay, Yeah,
what I mean by that is that and I don't know,
I'm not prophesying, but I'm expecting to still be because
it's so close to still be alive on Earth when

(48:57):
Jesus comes back. So when he comes, I will never
have died. He shows up, I get raptured, never taste death.
And then and then I spend the rest of eternity
in my glorified body that's bibical here on Earth, that's biblical.
First the millennial reign and then years and then there's
a new Heaven, new.

Speaker 4 (49:15):
Earth, Earth, Earth on Earth. So you're still going to
have Heaven. You're going to be on Earth with Heaven.

Speaker 2 (49:21):
Well with exactly because the new Earth New Israel, which
which like John is saying, it's it's that's God's ultimate
plan is that is that this physical earth will become
an actual official extension of the Kingdom of God. That
that was God's plan from the beginning. Yeah. God didn't
create this earth as like a temporary stage for us
to act out this story on Uh. He created this

(49:41):
earth to be a permanent, eternal extension of his kingdom.
He put us here to be his his representatives of
that kingdom, his his children literal children here on the earth,
and we're going to rule and reign as kings and
priests with Jesus here viraternity. So I'm never going to
live as a spirit, I'm never gonna die, I'm never
going to live in heaven. I'm the weirdest pastor on

(50:03):
planet Earth. So you'll never hear any other pastor talk
like this. All biblical. So but hey, Dwayne again, thank
you bring up some super important points. And that was
my actual plan for a cliffhanger for the next show
is just that question, you know, you know, how can
you know? How can you say this includes Christians when
it clearly says the children of Israel and the names

(50:26):
these tribes. We'll talk about it, okay, next show, and.

Speaker 7 (50:31):
Then just another question. The Bible says, and I don't
have addresses, you know, but he says that the antiquest
won't be revealed until the restrainers taken out, which is
a revelation in chapter four, because you don't hear of
the church after chapter four.

Speaker 2 (50:54):
So so two things you're you're you're referring to. Second
that on these chapter two word says that the Antichrist
won't be revealed until he who is restraining or that
which is restraining is taken out of the way. So,
first of all. It doesn't say the Church is taken
to heaven. It says that whatever is restraining the Antichrist
is taken out of the way of Satan's plan so

(51:15):
that the Antichrist can be revealed. Every you know, they try,
you know, people try to argue, well, that's the Holy Spirit,
that's the Church being raptured. Well it's not. It doesn't
say that at all. Who the restrainer is is Michael,
the Archangel. We get that from Daniel chapter eleven, chapter ten,
chapter twelve. We get that from the Book of Jude.
We get that very clearly in Revelation chapter twelve. It

(51:37):
is literally he's named by name, the archangel Michael is
the one who restrains Satan and his armies and the heavenlys,
and he has to step back to allow all this
to happen. You know, here's the thing is that you know,
is anyone being, you know, born again during the Great Tribulation, you.

Speaker 7 (51:56):
Know, that's what one hundred and forty four thousand or four.

Speaker 2 (52:00):
So then how can then, how can the Holy Spirit
not be on earth? How can the Holy Spirit be
taken out of the earth before the hunt the everything? Yes,
I see what I mean so the Holy Spirit can't
be taken out of the earth before before the Antichrist
shows up, because the Holy Spirit's never taken out of
the Earth's he's here.

Speaker 7 (52:19):
Right, Well, he's here, He's everywhere, Hell everywhere.

Speaker 2 (52:23):
Yeah, and what what you what you just said about how.

Speaker 7 (52:26):
Christian ventiles we are the restrainer because the Jews do
not believe yet, and then the one hundred and forty
four thousand are there to witness to the Jews so
all will be saved, like you said earlier.

Speaker 2 (52:42):
Yeah, So what I'm hearing from you is all these
arguments that like Tim L. Haymaid and Grant Jeffrey and
Perry Stone one thousand percent not biblical. And I'm sorry
to be so blind, but but that's not what the
Bible says. The Bible says that it's Michael the Archangel
who is the restrainer. The Bible does not say that
the Church is not present on earth during the Great Rebulation.

(53:04):
So that argument Tim Hay came up with that, Oh well,
the word church doesn't show up again after chapter four
in Revelation. Gosh, that's true, it doesn't. But there's a
thousand other ways to refer to the Church. You could
say the body of Christ, you could say Christian Christ,
the Bride of Christ, you could say the Saints, you
could say the elect And there's all kinds of symbolic
ways that that that that that Christians are described in

(53:27):
the Book of Revelation on the Earth during the Great Tribulation,
during the rein of the anti Christ. So, and that's
actually what we're dressing right now on the on the show.
It's it's it's hard to follow, gets dried out because
of the format of our show. We're working on that. Yeah,
but that's the point that we're getting at here, is that, Look,
the Church is very much mentioned throughout the Book of

(53:48):
Revelation on Earth during the Great Tribulation, during the well,
you know, can I give you a little assignment. Go
read just Revelation chapter twelve, which is right in the
middle of the Great Tribulation. It's describing the reign of
the Antichrist. It describes what he does, and it literally
says that he that he tries to pursue Jews. First,

(54:09):
the earth swallows up his armies, so he gets really mad,
and then he goes after the offspring of Israel, those
who keep the testimony of Jesus Christ. Who is that?
That's it's Revelation chapter twelve. Yeah, just read the last
you know, say, like five verses of Revelation chapter twelve.
It literally says it, just like that. It says that

(54:33):
the Antichrist can't get to Jews, so it goes after Christians.
There's no other way to interpret it. So people try,
they try to twist it so it says something else.
I mean, I like to read the Bible for like
what it actually says, you know, So yeah, me too. Again,
not to be overly blunt, just you know, hey.

Speaker 7 (54:53):
I'm not going on what says or Perry Stone or
you know whoever. I'm going by what the words.

Speaker 2 (55:00):
Also, yeah, amen, I yeah, and I know I remember
that you spind my class, and I know you love
the love the word. But yeah, if you could do that,
just that one thing, just go read the last few
verses of Revelation chapter twelve, and so yeah, see what
you see what you see there, It literally says, though
you know that when after her offspring, her being Israel,
those who keep the testimony of Jesus Christ. If you

(55:23):
want to get the full context, read the whole that
whole chapter Revelation. Chapter twelve gets a little bit complex,
you know, but and that's that's describing the last half
of the seven year Great Tribulation. Just that one chapter
by itself was a little mini chronology of the entire
three and a half year reign of the Anti Christ.

(55:43):
So so you know, go take a look, you know, Dwayne,
call me later, go on these final days dot org
and you'll you'll find my phone number on there, give
me a call on my cell phone and and and
I'll go into more detail with you.

Speaker 4 (55:55):
So better, Yeah, take them to coffee. You'll never get Oh.

Speaker 2 (55:58):
Yeah, hey Dwaine, real quick, how's how's your sister? I know,
we have to get going here a bit.

Speaker 7 (56:03):
I don't know she Well, she moved up to Utah
with my brother.

Speaker 2 (56:07):
Oh okay, that's why I haven't seen her. Yeah.

Speaker 7 (56:09):
Yeah, so she's up there and she's doing well good,
a lot better than she's down here.

Speaker 2 (56:16):
So okay, well tell her I said hello, and you
and I taught and I miss her.

Speaker 7 (56:21):
So yeah, and keep her in your prayers if you would.

Speaker 3 (56:25):
Absolutely, Okay, so yeah we can do that.

Speaker 7 (56:27):
Yeah, yeah, thanks for asking about her. And but she's
just doing well good and oh. We The only thing
is she's up there in the middle of morment. I know.

Speaker 2 (56:38):
Yeah, Hey Dayne, we have another call coming in, but
I appreciate the call. Yeah, well we'll talk soon. Okay, Okay,
good blas by bye bye bye.

Speaker 1 (56:49):
Good morning, Your Celebration Radio Network.

Speaker 8 (56:52):
Good morning Bill.

Speaker 1 (56:53):
Hey Debbie, Hey, I wonder if we can go on
the air with you after this song. Okay, Well, I've
got the gang still in here. We were on a
phone call with Dwayne, so give me just a second.

Speaker 3 (57:06):
I'm miss Debbie.

Speaker 4 (57:07):
I Miss Debbie.

Speaker 3 (57:08):
I don't have time for you guys to say hi.

Speaker 2 (57:11):
Yeah, you can't say no to the boss.

Speaker 1 (57:12):
Bill. It is almost fifteen minutes after the hour on
your Celebration Radio Network. And again the gang is still
here because we were on the phone with Dwayne. And
thank you again, Dwayne for that phone call and those questions.
Really appreciate it. Ryan, and guys, I really appreciate you
being here. Sorry we didn't get to that last segment,

(57:33):
but yeah, I really appreciate you guys.

Speaker 4 (57:35):
Thanks for having the next show.

Speaker 2 (57:36):
Why don't we say the one hundred and forty four
thousand includes Christians. That's what we're gonna get into meantime.
Please support your Celebration Radio Network if you like this
show everything else on here. We know you do. So
how can they do that?

Speaker 1 (57:48):
Bill, Well, they can go to Share the lightnow dot
org and give online, or you can make a phone
call eight hundred and seven two one nine three one three.
You can also mail it to PO Box seven forty seven,
Lake Havasu City, Arizona, eight six four zero five.

Speaker 2 (58:01):
And why not quick little plug for these final days,
these final days dot org online. Go check us out. Yeah,
all kinds of cool stuff on there. That's the You
can get the links to the YouTube channel, the show podcast. Yeah,
and include the phone calls on the podcast, like the
one we just had with Dwayne. Yeah, yep so And.

Speaker 1 (58:19):
Speaking of phone calls, Yes, good morning your Celebration Radio Network. Hey,
good morning, Bill, Good morning Miss Debbie in Pine Top.

Speaker 8 (58:30):
Right now, and we're looking forward to broadcasting from Sholo
right out in front of Quality Home today. Sarah wants
to say Hi, Hey.

Speaker 2 (58:40):
Guys, Hey, good morning, good morning. Awesome.

Speaker 8 (58:47):
Yes, we're we're excited to be out here today and
broadcasting live in the community. And we're also going to
be just meeting up with some sponsors and those who
gifted the ministry and thank them for their faithful support.
And we are just looking forward to what the day
has in store. And hey, we're all so free this morning.

(59:08):
We don't have any set plans to meet with anybody.
So if you're listening today and you'd like to meet
up for a cup of coffee or maybe lunch, we
would love to do that.

Speaker 2 (59:19):
Okay, we're on our way.

Speaker 4 (59:20):
Yep.

Speaker 3 (59:21):
Yeah, it's only six hours.

Speaker 2 (59:25):
The most important health the weather up there.

Speaker 8 (59:28):
Oh it's beautiful. Yeah, we went for a little run
this morning and nice. It's just beautiful, nice and cool.

Speaker 2 (59:35):
Yeah, you're up in the mountains.

Speaker 4 (59:36):
Beautiful. Yeah, I'm jealous.

Speaker 2 (59:38):
Yeah, we're down here in the desert.

Speaker 4 (59:41):
You didn't call me and asked me to go with you.
I don't understand.

Speaker 2 (59:45):
Coffee.

Speaker 1 (59:48):
We haven't developed that thing called a transporter yet. Beam
us over there.

Speaker 2 (59:55):
Musk is working on that. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (59:58):
Well, thank you, guys.

Speaker 8 (59:59):
I want to say thank you for everyone who supports
the Ministry. You guys are a tremendous blessing. We could
not do things like this and be out and about
if it weren't for the support of people who who
give and that we can share the hope of Jesus
over the air, and we are so grateful. So again,
the invitation is out for you. If you'd like to

(01:00:21):
meet up with us. You're in the Pine Top, Soolo area.
Give us a call in the studio at eight hundred
seven two one nine three one three. All right, guys,
have a great day.

Speaker 2 (01:00:30):
You guys too, love you, have fun, Bye bye bye.

Speaker 1 (01:00:35):
Well again, thanks guys for being here. Appreciate you both,
all three of you, John and Terry are supposed to
be one.

Speaker 2 (01:00:42):
Yes, that's it, We're one, become one pleas Yeah that's difficult.

Speaker 3 (01:00:45):
So but no, really, I do love you guys. Thank
you for being here.

Speaker 1 (01:00:49):
In CC Wining's with I've Got Joy is coming up
next prayer in just a few minutes. If you have
that prayer request eight hundred and seven to one nine
three one three. Good morning, your Celebration Radio Network.

Speaker 8 (01:01:03):
Good morning, I have a question for you.

Speaker 7 (01:01:07):
I'm listening at work and I'm missing Pastor Ryan's last name.

Speaker 1 (01:01:12):
Oh, Pastor Ryan's last name is speakman.

Speaker 2 (01:01:16):
Just think of someone who talks a lot, Yes, speakman,
speak man. Speak The talking.

Speaker 7 (01:01:21):
Many great because I've wanted to go online and order
your book.

Speaker 2 (01:01:25):
So oh, I appreciate that. You know what, if you
just go to our website, which is These Final Days
dot org. Right on the main page, you'll see links
to the two books that are currently available on Amazon,
or of course, you go ride on Amazon and just
search for my name Ryan Speakman and yeah, part one
and Part two are available, and part three is Everybody

(01:01:45):
Together TM yeah, trademark prieze. Yeah, we're working hard to
get that done. So anyways, is These Final Days dot
com dot org, dot org dot org.

Speaker 7 (01:01:57):
Okay, great, thank you so much appreciated.

Speaker 8 (01:01:59):
They have a book, Thank you too.

Speaker 3 (01:02:01):
What's your name?

Speaker 1 (01:02:02):
Bye bye, Jebbie, Debbie, all right, Debbie, God bless you
you too, Bye bye bye, Mercy me and always only Jesus.
On your Celebration Radio Network, it is twenty nine minutes
after the hour. I want to thank you for allowing
us to be part of your Friday morning, and again
a reminder that Sarah and Debbie are in the White

(01:02:24):
Mountains at Pine Top right now. So if you'd like
to get together with them for maybe coffee or lunch,
give us a call at your Celebration Radio Network and
we'll arrange it. Eight hundred and seven to one nine
three one three. Heavenly Father, we thank you for this
new morning you've given us in the privilege we have
to begin it with you each and every day, And

(01:02:45):
as today continues to unfold for all of us, Lord,
give us your wisdom to.

Speaker 3 (01:02:50):
Handle any situation we encounter.

Speaker 1 (01:02:53):
Let our speech be seasoned with your grace and our
thoughts pleasing to you. We're so grateful to know that,
regardless of where this day do take us, you are
right there in the midst and there's no shortage of
good things in your presence. And in that presence, Lord,
I pray that the listeners feel your loving arms wrapping
around him. The strength and encouragement they may need to
face their day, a healing touch for their body, financial

(01:03:16):
provision for their needs, a deliverance from addictions and restoration
for relationships, and the strength and courage to tell them
about you, their neighbor, their coworker. Lord, just let their
testimonies shine, and in that we give you the glory

(01:03:37):
and praise, and help us to live with a mindset
on things above, to be heavenly and kingdomly minded at
all times, so that your light shines through our lives.
Into this dark world, and that the precious name of
Jesus is glorified.

Speaker 3 (01:03:51):
And in that name of Jesus we pray Amen