E103 Artistic Resistance: MC Gaza's Battle Against Genocide

In a raw conversation, we meet the Palestinian artist MC Gaza who has raised funds to get his family, including his mother and brother with Down Syndrome, out of Gaza to safety in Egypt. He shares his experience being inspired by legends such as Tupac to use rap as resistance against illegal occupation as well as his heartbreak over the way Israeli forces have destroyed every aspect of life in Gaza and the amount of innocent lives lost.

Episode Transcript

(00:01):
From Ubin Studios. You're listening toUnsugarcoated with Alia, bringing you interviews with
public figures and inspirational people speaking onself improvement with empowered themes, and I'm
your host, Ali Alaneus. Hello, everybody, Welcome again to another season
of Unsugarcoated with Alia. I hopethat this day finds you well wherever you

(00:24):
are. This is another profoundly urgentseason that we are producing yet again today
as we confront the harsh realities ofconflict and the devastation told that modern colonization
is taking on people's lives. Ofcourse, I'm speaking to what is happening

(00:44):
in Palestine, in Gaza, evenin southern Lebanon, but most critically obviously
Gaza has remained a crucial focus,a point, a place where as we
reflect on the events of ten toseven, a demark by Hamas's uprising against
Israel's brutal and illegal occupation, weare reminded of the stark truth that this

(01:08):
conflict, and I say this wordvery precariously continues to exact a devastating toll
on the people of Gaza and actuallypeople around the world who are connected,
whether it's through friendships, through relationshipsthrough their background. You know, I,
myself, my children are half Palestinian. We are here in California,

(01:29):
but we are hurting every day knowingthat we can't make the difference we want
to. In fact, for manyof us, our privilege is suffocating.
But let me not minimize and putmy pain in front of what people there
are currently experiencing. And for thepast nearly eight months, and many of
us would say for seventy six yearsbefore that, but especially for the last

(01:52):
eight months, we have been inundatedwith images of unspeakable suffering as the world
bears witness to the unfathomable who unfoldingin Gaza. From the safety of our
privileged positions, we have watched helplesslyas children literally pick up the pieces of
their shattered families and mothers mourn theloss of their entire families. The genocide

(02:15):
taking place in Gaza is a starkreminder of the atrocities committed against innocent civilians,
leaving no room for ambiguity about whothe true victims in this are.
Yet, even as we grapple withthe overwhelming pain and suffering, we are
confronted with the insidious propaganda and dehumanizationperpetrated by the Israelian at times Western media.

(02:37):
The cruel and heartless rhetoric employed bysome serves as a chilling echo of
past atrocities. It is incumbent uponus to reject the normalization of such violence
and stand in solidarity with the oppressed. In today's episode, we will confront
these uncomfortable truths head on, sheddinglight on the untold stories of ZiLs billience

(03:00):
and resistance in the face of unimaginableadversity. And my guest today is going
to give us their perspective, theirbackground, and we're truly honored to have
him. Ibrahim Reneme, also knownas mc gaza Ibrahim, is a multifaceted
Palestinian artist from Raza who has beena dedicated rapper for eighteen years. He

(03:21):
is a talented photographer, editor,director, writer and illustrator, utilizing artificial
intelligence in his creative process. Mcgaza's diverse talents are not just hobbies.
He professionally leverages them to serve hiscountry and advocate for its causes. He
aims to continue using his art tomake a positive impact on his community and

(03:44):
address the critical issues it faces.Join us as we speak to mc gaza
learn about his artistic endeavors and thepowerful way he uses creativity to contribute to
the Palestinian cause. Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome mci gaza. Hello,

(04:05):
Hello, Hello, my friend,how are you? Hey? I'm fine,
thank you, thank you so muchfor it's like a logic answer,
like like it's something we used tosay, but I'm not fine at all.
You know, I understand when yousay that. I want to I
want to clarify because being not onlyMuslim, being part of the the international

(04:30):
community for me, which includes theMiddle East, includes Lebanon, includes Palestine.
I know I've always been taught thatno matter what difficulties I face in
life, when somebody says how areyou, I say, alhamdolilla right,
it's but it's it doesn't always meanwe're okay. So I understand when you
say that, And is that kindof what you mean, like you're going

(04:51):
through the motions. Sure. Yeah, it's something hard to say these days,
especially one our people, our godsare suffering. It's even harder to
speak to anyone to see how thewhole world are living their lives while our

(05:13):
people are getting killed, getting murdered, daily like and every day it's getting
wars and wars and wars. ButI'm fine, as Arabs saying I'm fine.
I do know what you mean Ido today you're talking to us,

(05:34):
I believe from Egypt, right,yeah, yes, So tell me a
little bit about your early life andyour influences, your upbringing in Gaza,
and you know how we'll move intohow you became involved in the music and
art. First of all, Iborn in Algeria. We came to Guys

(05:58):
in nine ninety five with a palestinanauthority which my father was like a big
leader. And once we arrived toGaza, we lived our life next to
people in Gaza, not in agood way, like not in a not
a good life, but it wasit was normal at least it was normal

(06:27):
once some five once we get likewe stayed five years in Gaza, the
Intifada started. After that we started. Like I was a kid. I
lived many things, like I livedfive wars, I lived in father,

(06:50):
I lived like hundreds of actions.But this war was different. I didn't
live that this war. I didn'tlive in Gaza. In this war,
I was out in Turkey. Istarted my rap music in two thousand and
five. I produced more than twohundred songs, most of them for Palestine,

(07:16):
fifty video clips. I had toursaround like fifteen countries. But everything
we lived in this life is nothingto what our people lived this war.

(07:38):
I can't even think about what Ilived before this war. I can't even
think about what I produced, orwhat I what the art I made,
or what the music I made beforethis war. This word changed our life.
This word changed the whole or soI wish if we can focus on

(08:03):
what's going on in this war,not even on my art, not even
on my music. I think Ican describe my music or my art,
which I already have have it asa name. My name is Godza.
I see it is just a twoletters which make people know that I'm doing

(08:30):
crap music. But my name isgod So once I think about my name,
I found that I carried something sobig. Your art is incredibly important
right now when we talk about thehumanization, I'm aware. You know you
have a substantial platform that you've built, you have been taking all of this

(08:54):
time. You know, we'll talka little bit more about that art as
resistance. But what to you doesRaza represent it? Means my life.
You know, I lived my wholechildhood in Ghaza. I left, I
studied in Ghaza. I made morethan one hundred and fifty concerts in Gaza.

(09:22):
I know a hundred of maybe dozensof thousands of people, and I
met hundreds of thousands of people becauseI had a show in every place in
Gaza. Ah, it's Ghaza meansmore than myself. To me, I
cry for every stone we lost inGaza, not just for every soul we

(09:45):
are losing now. So Ghazam,I can't even describe what Gaza means to
me. It's it's something you can'tYou can feel, but you can't describe,
you can you can you can feel, but you can't touch. That's
it. What is your creative processif you don't mind me asking on how

(10:09):
you're using the art, especially inthis critical moment, to express the real
life or the realities of life.Rather in Gaza, you know, in
this moment I began, I beganthis, and since this war began,
I made two songs with ten rappersfrom ten countries around the world. But

(10:37):
after that, I felt that Ican't produce a song daily. But I
must, I must, I mustspeak about everything daily, So what should
I do. I must find somethingelse to produce. I must find something
else to to to to show people. So I found AI art as a

(11:07):
good start to do something else,something I can share two people daily or
maybe two or three times a day. Once I see any photo from Gaza,
I try to make it prettier orI try to share what we can't

(11:31):
share on social media because these dayswe are all getting censorship, we are
all getting like blocked. This ismy fourteen accounts. By the way,
I lost thirteen accounts before this account, so this is my fourteenth. I

(11:52):
photos helped me to share what peoplewant, what people feel there in Gaza.
It's all because I want to helpmy people in Gaza. That's it.
I'm doing anything these days just tohelp my people. I edit videos,
I made the AI artwork. II'm working on a new song these

(12:20):
days, it's all about Gaza.As I said from the first, it
has to be extremely challenging. Iknow that your artwork is extremely moving.
You are able to showcase the childrenthe Mother's day. I know, Rafa,
and it is interesting because even whenyou talk on people, we've lost

(12:43):
and we are not numbers. Absolutely, But I think that numbers is an
interesting point when we you know,because I've noticed that the numbers seem to
have kind of stopped growing since theend of last year, and I don't
know, well, I know whythat's happening, because if the real numbers
of the real amount of people thathave been lost already was to come out,

(13:07):
I think it would be substantially staggeringto people because it's believe me,
the number you heared as less thanfifty percent of the people we lost.
We still don't know how many peoplewe lost this world. No, I
agree with you, and it isan educated statement to say at least fifty

(13:31):
percent more simply because to your point, and I just want to echo that
for the audience, like you haveto understand. I mean, there are
some footage now just coming out oflike you say, East Gaza right where
they're just getting in there. Bodiesare decomposed everywhere. We know that they're
rebombing structures that were already bombed,who have bodies inside that they are incinerating.

(13:54):
And to a big degree, eventhough it makes people upset, this
is where you can draw a parallelto to you know, what happened during
fascist behavior in Europe, whether itwas Mussolini, Stalin, Hitler, Leopold
anyway, So just you know,and has made the bombs can make people
disappear like bones, like flesh,everything. He disappeared from this life from

(14:26):
this type of bombs. So wecan't know that until this finish. But
I wish it's it's less than howwe imagine. But I don't. I
don't think so, No, Iagree with you. It's a large number.
There's been interactions before where they've comeout with numbers about Hamas that have

(14:50):
been killed, but have no ideaor will not release the number. One
from Israeli representatives spoke people on howmany civilian lives have been lost, which
you know, just coincidentally are justkind of throwing this in there is why
to me, the human shields argumentis always has always been a point when
you say that Hamas are getting peopleas a human shield. Nobody can take

(15:15):
their families as a human child.Nobody can take his brother or his sister
or his family member as a humanchild. It's it's something I can't even
describe it. It's it's it's adumb thing to say that that we hamas
using us as a human shield becauseHamas people are our brothers and sisters,

(15:41):
and they are they are not aliens, they are the whole world are taking
us as a human shield against Israelbecause Israel are destroying the whole world,
not not just us. They arethey are not even respecting anything or any
rule or any even the Court.On the aspect of how people receive the

(16:07):
work that you are doing, kindof going back to that, like when,
how how do people as far asthe audience goes, both locally and
globally, how have they responded tothe work that you put out? Now?
How it, you know, attemptsto humanize the community, How it
attempts to show the pain. Whatare some of the responses you've gotten.
Once I started the rap music andGaza, it was something like strange and

(16:33):
the Gazan community to to do rapmusic. So I had many problems.
I had no audience at all inthe first Then I made it like grew
up day by day at the artcommunity in Gaza. We worked on it
so hard to to make people respectwhat we are doing because they never heard

(16:57):
about rap before. I was oneof the first generation who made rap music
in the whole are born, notjust in Gaza. So in the first
nobody was coming to our concerts untilwe get treat like thousands of people hearing

(17:18):
us. I had hundreds of thousandsof people knowing me in Gaza and outside
of Gaza. I had many chancesoutside of Gaza. And the siege which
is I made on Gaza like makeme not get all all these chances outside

(17:41):
of Gaza. But inside of Gazawe had. We had many problems,
and one of them was the Hama'sgovernment. They were canceling my concerts,
but you were hearing me like oneminute before defending them. I'm out of
Gaza because of Hamma government. Butwhen it's about Israel, we all against

(18:04):
it because they are killing all ofus. They don't care if you are
Fattia or you are Hamas, oryou are someone who don't even care about
politics. Even Ntenia two days orthree days ago he said, I will
not give it to Hamas or tooFatia. He don't want Palestinians in Gaza.

(18:27):
So when it's about Israel, weall against Israel. But when it's
about our community, I don't likeHamas. Maybe even Hamas members don't like
what they are doing as a government. So when we don't mix this,

(18:51):
we can find a solution. Tofollow up on something that you said,
because Hamas has been propped up bythe Israeli government, nobody has ever said
they're perfect, I would, youknow, definitely agree. I mean just
because you know, I do holdthe belief that I see Hamas as a
resistance. Period, I may notlike everything that they do as a resistance,
I know that they're you know,you're not talking about a society where

(19:15):
true free elections have happened, wheretruth, you know, and again you
also mentioned the siege. Raza itselfhas been under siege, meaning you know,
food is determined when it's getting inand out every checkpoint. It is
not a life. There are peoplethat have lived in Gaza that have never
even gotten on an airplane because theycan't move around the world freely as I

(19:36):
have the benefit of doing. Andmost most ninety eight percent of Gaza people
never went out of Gaza. Neveronce I'm outside. I studied the university.
Two years of my university in Egypt. I left Gaza to many places
before I born outside of Gaza.Once you meet people like Gazans who left

(20:00):
Gaza after this war, the worldis something different for them. They never
lived this life. It's so hardeven to feel what they are feeling right
because they've been restricted for so longand unable to experience life that it's like
a foreign to them to some degree. Now, I want to say this

(20:22):
because I want to make it clear. This does not mean that they're you
know, and I know you're notsaying this. I'm saying this more from
my audience. This does not meanthat the people within Gaza are not incredibly
intelligent, accustomed to, you know, a culture of life that inherently is
beautiful, loving food, arts.You know, I'm aware of that because

(20:45):
you know, I have family that'sPalestinian, so I know what that means.
But I'm aware that life under siegein what really people would consider the
largest concentration camp existing on the planet, that, yeah, they struggle when
they're now out of what they've knownor been forced to only know all their

(21:06):
life. I can imagine. Andwhen you talk about even rap is interesting
to me specifically. And I wantto say this to you because you know,
in America, hip hop has servedand rap has served as a form
of activism for you know, BlackAmerica being able to say their grievances right,
whether it's angry at the police system. You have Ice Cuban and n

(21:29):
w A who came out with thepolice right. So many many, many
many Americans. Like I was afan of the American rap music that that
was the real rap. When theblack people were making raph music against like
against being treated badly in the Americancommunity, against like what they are living,

(22:00):
it was a real rap music.Yeah, the critical issues so on
that. I mean, Look,daily life in Gaza has to be one
about struggles and resilience. From whatI know, we talked a little bit
about living under an ongoing genocide andoccupation. You've also had to help people

(22:21):
try to in your family try toescape Gaza since this and more impact on
how has that process been for you. Well, I left Turkey and came
to Cairo in the first of Februaryto get my family out of Gaza.
I got success to get to twentythree of my family out of Gaza.

(22:47):
I met a fundraising link and Iasked people to help me to get my
to evacuate my family from Gaza.First, I get my mother and my
downside on brother to Cairo. ThenI got four families of my brothers andncestors.

(23:08):
And I still have four families likefour brothers, ancestors and their families
in Gaza. By the way,I have nine brothers andcesters. This is
why we have a big family.We are forty five members and now we
are forty four. Only we lostmy nephew this war. He's fifteen years

(23:40):
old as I killed him. Murderedthem while he's helping people to get water.
They cut them for two pieces.And I'm sorry, I know that,

(24:02):
I know that that is very,very hard. I'm glad you were
able to get at I do rememberseeing you get your mother and your brother
out. You know, I havea grandson who has who is autistic,
and I can't help but think,you know, when you mentioned your brother
with down syndrome, I can't helpbut think of the suffering of these families,

(24:26):
the children. And I also knowit's very expensive to get people out,
and I kind of have to commentthat. I know you're talking to
us also from Egypt, and alot of people are always like you know,
I mean, people like to throwthis out. Well, if there's
nothing wrong with the Palestinians, whywon't Egypt take them? Why won't other
places take them? Well, onits face, first of all, that's
wrong because over the years, yes, I mean my ex husband Palestinian born

(24:48):
in Cairo, he was born therebefore they moved to the UAE and the
UAE and Jordan and Lubnan everywhere,they all have, you know, refugee
camps or groups and communities and something. I'm a Palestinian, I'm a Lebanese,
like the Palestinian who who were inLebanon and the Lebanese camps. Nobody

(25:11):
around the whole Arab board talk evena small paper to live with. They
gave us nothing. Arabs gave usnothing even to live like, no passports,
No the one hundred thousands of Palestinianwho's living and the Arab board got
nothing. So we don't want tolive to Egypt. We don't want to

(25:37):
come to Egypt. We want thewar to be stopped, we want to
stop the genocide. We don't wantto go anywhere. We want our Gaza.
That's it. Yeah, yes,I lost Gaza, but I regret
every second I left. I leftGaza. I regret every second I lost
my memories there. Now we havenothing in Gaza, that destroyed everything,

(25:59):
even the graves, yes, yes, people have no graves now to visit
right now, not even the historicalplaces or the or the universities. The
our our memories are just are notjust like human lives. Our memories are

(26:21):
and the and the walls and thestreets and everything in Gaza. They are
destroying the whole life there. Yes, they already destroyed more than ninety percent
of Gaza, and the whole worldare just watching they are. They are
making people think that boycotting is enough, right they are, And people start

(26:44):
saying, we are boycotting, sowe are doing our best. Our best,
Your best is not boycotting. Youcan do more and more and more.
They made people think that boycotting orblocking influencers or donating or doing these
type of things or marshing or buddhisting, it's not enough. I've always said

(27:07):
do what you can from where you'reat, but I would agree with you.
And it can be very frustrating towalk around in society and say,
recognize people do not do more thanthey can and should. And I say
this, and I do want tojust follow up on one point because because
again some of the things I say, are for the audience, Like even
the Egyptian point, Like a lotof people are not educated enough to know

(27:32):
that Egypt is the second highest recipientof foreign aid under Israel as a result
of a nineteen seventy three you know, outcome that benefited Egypt. So there's
reasons why Egypt would do things thathave nothing to do nor any reflection upon
the Palestinians themselves, and you know, with regard like I went to my

(27:55):
nephew's graduation last week. I havea he just graduated from high school,
and I couldn't do anything other thansit there and think about all the children
that will not get to graduate inPalestine, the parents that will not get
to cheer. I looked around atan entire arena and thought, how many
times could we fill up this stadiumwith the bodies of people who have been

(28:17):
taken. It is important that peoplerecognize this does involve us. We're paying
for it in America, whether Canadaor the UK or a lot of these
countries, our governments are funding them, they are enabling them, they are
complicit, and it's just pure fascism. It's just pure fascism to say,
oh, we get to kill allthese people because we think we have the

(28:38):
right to do so. That isexactly what made Hitler and Stalin and Mussolini
the wrong people. This is whatHitler made. What they are doing is
what Hitler made. This is whatthey are crying for the last one hundred
years for what Hitler does to them. And this is what they are doing

(29:02):
these days. Once I watch themon the news, they are speaking like
Natania or that military spoken, orany one of them, they are saying
something the whole world know already knewthat it's a lie. So to you,
it's very important then that the internationalcommunity show more support and do all

(29:26):
that they can. I think thatthe international solidarity will help, So to
you, that's very important. Whatother aspects you know, what is your
message to the world right now?And I know that you speak from a
place of a lot I can onlyimagine, to be quite honest, I

(29:47):
don't mean to say I know.I don't want to assume I know all
of your emotions at all. Thatfor me, that's very disrespectful. But
you know, with all that youare feeling and all that you are going
through right now, what is yourmessage to the world. I won't them
just to wake up, just towake up. No, what's going on

(30:08):
around this world. It's not aboutGaza only, It's about Sudan, It's
about Congo, It's about like allpeople who are suffering around the whole world.
Read if you cat yourself no more, don't listen to anyone till you

(30:29):
it's complicated. No, it's notcomplicated. It's it's not Ukraine or Russia
conflict. It's it's something anyone canunderstand. Seventh of October was only a
reaction about what we are living inPalestine. Many people keep telling me that

(30:55):
if Hamas don't fight Israel that day, Israel won't do anything to do No
Hamas. The last two years ofseventh of October, Hamas was doing nothing.
Even if Israel bombed Gaza, bombany other part of the Palestinian community.

(31:17):
Hamas was not like fighting in thelast two years. And they kept
fighting us. They kept killing us. They killed hundreds of Palestinian in Gaza
and in the West Bank. Theydon't care if you are Muslim, Christian
or anything. They don't They aremaking what Hitler made. They are the

(31:37):
new Nazis. Us like the Americanpeople are supporting Israel. While they have
nothing, no medicine, no freemedicine, no having nothing, while you
are paying everything for Israel. Sowait, what, like I said earlier,
our tax dollars, and we don'thave a lot of things here,
and we have homeless crisises and financialcrisis and education crisis, and yet you

(32:01):
know, here we are sending millionsand billions off to essentially fund and occupation.
I know that we still remain hopefulfor the future despite everything, because
this is what I know to betrue about both Lebanese and Palestinian. Extremely
resilient and you know, no matterthe destruction that comes our way, we

(32:22):
will pick up the pieces and moveforward as soon as we can. I
want you to know I do appreciateyou being here, you know, connecting
with me and sharing your voice andsharing your story. It means so much.
We'll definitely keep checking in with you. I want to say I appreciate
your time and you coming on andtalking and sharing your heart with us today.
Thank you and to the people athome, everything that we've discussed is

(32:47):
true, and it's actually multiple layersthat we can go into. People like
myself who are just genuinely trying tochampion humanity are being suppressed. So getting
out there and reporting us, beingaware, educating yourself, learning understanding.
This is modern colonization. And asI've said, if your version of heaven

(33:08):
requires that somebody else experience hell,then you're an opresser and there's just no
way that you know. And actually, something that he said reminded me.
Yes, two weeks before October seventh, Gaza experienced three days of missile bombings.

(33:29):
So you know, a lot ofwhile we say, yes, there
was this event on October seventh,I've heard Israeli officials say this was the
worst attack on Israeli land in theentire existence. Well that may be true,
but that does not mean that isthe worst attack on Palestinians in all
this time. In fact, there'sseveral there's countless times, there's countless massacres

(33:52):
and atrocities that have occurred. Soyou can't hold me to the standard of
October seventh and then deny everything beforeand since then and not hold it as
an entire part of the conversation.Please stay educated, Please be part of
this process from wherever you are at. Do what you can and if you

(34:13):
can, absolutely and you should domore. Thank you. So much for
being with us today. We'll seeyou on the next episode, and once
again, thank you for letting usbe unsugarcoated.