November 5, 2025 • 21 mins
Hosts Jim Connelly (@jimmyconnelly), Derek Schooley (@derekschooley), and Ed Trefzger (@EdTrefzger) look at sometimes controversial or overlooked topics in our midweek episode called Upon Further Review.
Topics include the disparities between top and bottom teams, surprising standouts like Wisconsin and Union, and the impact of new CHL eligibility rules on smaller programs. The hosts discuss how older, experienced players from CHL and U Sports are leveling the playing field and contributing to closer games and more frequent upsets.
Find all of our podcasts at USCHO.com/podcasts
Topics include the disparities between top and bottom teams, surprising standouts like Wisconsin and Union, and the impact of new CHL eligibility rules on smaller programs. The hosts discuss how older, experienced players from CHL and U Sports are leveling the playing field and contributing to closer games and more frequent upsets.
Find all of our podcasts at USCHO.com/podcasts
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
Uscho dot com.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Welcome to us c Cho upon further review for Wednesday,
November fifth, twenty twenty five. This episode is sponsored by
the NCAA Frozen four April ninth and eleventh in Las Vegas.
Visit NCAA dot com slash M Frozen four for tickets.
And Derek, we're going to let you go first with
(00:35):
the topic that you are interested in as we look
at what's going on in the different conferences, and.
Speaker 3 (00:42):
You know what, you gave a little freedom to pick
what we wanted to talk about this week, and you know,
other than buy and sell, it was something that I
was kind of thinking about that that I wanted to
go through and just was looking at records and I
was finding the tops and the bottom were really difference
in overall records, and some are really different comparatively to
(01:08):
their overall records.
Speaker 4 (01:09):
Are some are closer than others.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
And if you look at the overall records, and once
you once I kind of explain it, you guys can
kind of jump in. And we talked about this before,
but I think everybody will understand it.
Speaker 4 (01:21):
And I'll start with it a lot of cocky and
work my way to.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
Different segues rit Is at five and two, and these
are overall records. Merciers Is at h to nine. There's
a big difference in those two records. Then you go
to Tech five and three, Northern zero one, tech ECAC
Union five to one and one, Quinnipiac five two and one,
(01:45):
Saint Lawrence one six and one, RPI one and seven.
There's a lot of in the middles there, from the
tops to the bottom. Then you go to Hockey East
Northeastern five and one, and here's you got some big
names at the bottom. And then here's where you're going
to start seeing some major names at the bottom that
you don't expect. Northeastern at five and one, BU three
(02:10):
five and one, b C two four and one, and
once again we're going overall records, and these are this
one's the really interesting one in the NCAC Miami seven
and one to luth eight and two, Nebraska, Omaha four
and two, Saint Cloud's six and three, and at the
bottom you got Denver four to three and one, Arizona
(02:33):
State three and five, which is shocking, Michigan nine and one,
Penn State nine and one, Wisconsin six oho and two,
Michigan State five and one and that's we talked about
it on our Monday podcast. Their record non conference is
off the charts Minnesota two seven and one. So you've
(02:55):
got the tops that are just running away with things
in every conference, and you got the bottoms that are
really struggling. And if you could see, every conference has top,
top team and every conference seems to have a bottom team,
and there's a lot of in betweens. And I just
found that to be really interesting when you threw out
(03:17):
to come up with your own topics. I don't know
you guys, does that make sense to everybody?
Speaker 4 (03:21):
Yeah? It does.
Speaker 5 (03:23):
Schools And I'll tell you as I listened to you.
Speaker 1 (03:25):
Talk there, and I'll get into my points of what
surprised me so far in the season. But I guess
the bottom conferences that you kind of mentioned, there's let's
say Atlantic, let's say c C, CHACC, the teams that
you're talking about at the bottom, I have concerns that
they could get out of the bottom the other conferences,
(03:46):
particularly you know when we look at teams like Arizona
State at the bottom of the overall records NCC, the
bottom of the overall record in Hockey East.
Speaker 5 (03:56):
Being teams like BC and BU. These are teams that
I think can get out.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
You know, there are holes that have been dug that
are where you have teams that probably just don't have
the talent to get out. I'm not picking on anybody,
but you mentioned Northern Michigan and you mentioned mercy Hurst
at this point, they're both struggle. But I don't think
that we can say that Arizona State is that bad.
I'm concerned about them. I don't think we can say
(04:23):
that Minnesota is that bad. I'm concerned about them. BCBU
the same thing. So there's maybe more red flags earlier
in the season.
Speaker 5 (04:31):
Than we usually were.
Speaker 1 (04:32):
I went to the other side and kind of went
to the two teams that are really standing out to
me at this point that I didn't have on my
Bengo card going in. I wasn't sure that Wisconsin was
going to be good. And now six to zero and
two right out of the gate, they're getting really good performances.
And most importantly, I think for Wisconsin, the numbers in
net are really shaking out at this point. Daniel Howser
(04:55):
one point three to five goals against average, He has
a nine what he saved percentage at this point, and
then you know rookies. You just you look at freshman
goal scorers Blake Montgomery with four goals already. They're getting
a lot of production from Mary's that I hadn't personally considered.
And I'm not trying to say that other people weren't
(05:17):
considering Wisconsin a team that was strong.
Speaker 5 (05:19):
I know that Union had a pretty strong season last year.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
I didn't have them as a team that was going
to get right back up again. But Union, out of
the gate, they're playing really well. They got they picked
up a loss this weekend against the RP. I have
a bounced back with a win again, a goaltender in
Cameron Corpi one point five to six goals against average,
a save percentage in nine twenty four. It's just I
(05:44):
feel like the defenses of a couple of teams here,
Wisconsin and Union, they're really showing out right now. I
didn't put Miami in there because we've talked so much
about them. I think at this point anything Miami doesn't
isn't surprising us. But that's another team that really is
had a good start that we can't we can't overlook.
Speaker 2 (06:03):
Let me ask a question these teams now, Miami maybe
say Okay, what was the competition. But you look at
teams also like Minnesota Duluth that have taken a big
step forward from a tough season or two leading into it.
The question I have is how much does no matter
(06:23):
who you're playing, how much does that culture of winning
and feeling that success. How much does that carry you
into the rest of the season.
Speaker 3 (06:32):
Everybody wants to feel good about themselves. I think that's
the one thing. When you get a little bit of
juice and you feel good about your locker room, you
feel good throughout the week, and that carries on. I
think that that's the one thing that you can't replicate,
no matter what you can always say, I always I
come back in that we didn't. We had a three
(06:56):
lf on lead going to the third period against Agron
took it to us and we had to hold on
for dear life and we won four to three. And
the other night and I was not happy with how
we played in the third period. But I would rather
win ugly than lose pretty all the time, because you
(07:16):
don't win, you like you feel. No matter what you
can come in and say, we we played really well,
we feel good about how we're playing.
Speaker 4 (07:25):
The fact is a loss A loss a loss.
Speaker 3 (07:28):
And you could you you you want to feel good
about winning. I mean, what's the line of bull Durham.
I love winning. It's like better than losing. I mean,
that's what it comes down to. It's like the culture
just winning breeds winning, and that's that's what.
Speaker 4 (07:45):
That's what.
Speaker 3 (07:46):
No matter what your schedule is, you played the schedule
that you you you set up. And I joke when
we started with Michigan and Notre Dame as I got
to fire my schedule maker and unfortunately that was me
and uh you you you got to win your games.
And those teams that that that, you know, Miami, whether
(08:07):
their schedule was light or what, they had to win
their games.
Speaker 4 (08:09):
And then they just fired up and they kept winning.
Speaker 3 (08:12):
They split with Arizona State and that was good for them.
Speaker 4 (08:16):
They won their games. It's Aaron brings to mind.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
What more to come after this word from the n
c a A Frozen four.
Speaker 6 (08:27):
Glass. Today you were talking men's ice hockey. Open your textbooks,
joined thousands of other screaming fans for an in person experience.
Speaker 4 (08:35):
You have to see to believe.
Speaker 6 (08:37):
It's the n c a A Men's Frozen four April ninth
and eleventh in Las Vegas. Attendance is encouraged. Passion is
mandatory by your seats. Today at n c a A
dot com slash m Frozen four.
Speaker 5 (08:49):
How many teams are in the men's Frozen four? Please
leave me?
Speaker 2 (08:57):
It's Aaron brings to mind what first year head coach
at rit Matt Thomas said to me a couple of
weeks ago. They're not all Picasso's. Sometimes their finger painting.
Speaker 3 (09:07):
They out the same too. You don't remember them, and
you don't remember them in two years. You just remember
that you want.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
And that kind of leads into the topic I wanted
to bring up, and we'll set a little background on it.
You guys will remember this. I don't remember the name
of the place we were in. It was upstairs and
a big restaurant in Tampa in twenty twenty four where
we were doing our podcast and we're talking to all
the different league commissioners and it came time to talk
(09:36):
with CCHA Commissioner Don Lucia. One of the first things
that struck me, and of course he's commissioner of kind
of smaller programs, and he also came from two smaller
programs before he became head coach in Minnesota is how
much he advocated for those smaller teams. And he brought
(09:57):
up something that had started to be a rumbling, but
I don't think anybody took all that seriously at that point,
which was he was a big proponent of CHL eligibility
and there were a lot of people who were against
it at the time, and he said, I think it
would be a real help for smaller programs in the
(10:19):
smaller leagues. So he put that out there on the
table and then in a story that will be on
USCCHO I think later today or tomorrow. I had a
conversation with College Hockey Inc. Executive director Sean Hogan. He
had been with CHI for about five years doing education
(10:40):
and when Mike Snee moved on to a position with
Minnesota Wild, he was named the executive director in August
of twenty twenty four, and he spoke to a group
not long after he had that job and he said, yeah,
I think it's going to happen. It's probably going to
be about three years. November seventh was less than three
(11:02):
months after that, and it became a reality. So I
think the point that I'm going to make and It's
one that i've I think I've said on our podcast
and also in our TMQ column at US Echo. I
think we'll see kind of a few of these seventeen
eighteen year olds, you know, like McKenna or so forth,
(11:23):
who we're going to come in and make a big splash,
who are going to be the first round draft picks.
But I think the bulk of where CHL eligibility is
going to help teams is in depth. And when you
take those three hundred and twenty five, three hundred and
thirty players in there and add that depth, I think
you're seeing right now even in some of these splits
(11:44):
and upsets with top teams. I think you're seeing the
impact of that right away with players who've got some experience,
and something like ten percent of those players are coming
from U Sports where they had aged out had to
go to Canadian Universe, So you've got sophomores and juniors
who are coming in with some experience too. So I'm
(12:07):
going to make the case that Don Lucia was a
profit and was right, and he named what has happened,
which is make the smaller programs have more strength, and
I think that's why games are closer, and that's why
you see some upsets in there.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
You have to think that most importantly, it's made the
average age in college hockey a little bit older.
Speaker 5 (12:33):
And I think that.
Speaker 1 (12:34):
For teams that struggle to get and keep good players.
You know, some of the smaller programs, they're bringing in
players that are older, have an experience and have plenty
of talents. So I think the talent we've talked about
the talent pool, you know, continuing to increase and grow
(12:54):
this year. But I think the age too, is something
and you're finding way. You know, it was lu I
called a couple of weeks ago and we were talking
to Brendan Riley, their coach, and he has so many
new faces on his roster, tons of new players, but
he's one of the one of the oldest teams in
the country too.
Speaker 5 (13:14):
So even when we're calling gameser, sure you think about
this too.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
I just started to say this is a young team,
and you say, no, this is an experienced team. Because
the reality is is even teams with ten, twelve, fourteen
new faces, a lot of them have gotten older. Because
the COHL players came.
Speaker 5 (13:32):
In at an older age.
Speaker 1 (13:33):
I think that has had a huge part to do
with the leveling off of players is you have some
older talents.
Speaker 2 (13:41):
I may disagree with you a little bit before before
Derek hops in, because a lot of programs are getting
the eighteen nineteen year old commits twenty year old freshmen
out of places like the BHL and so forth. So
I think a lot of those teams getting the twenty
year old freshmen out of the out of the OHL
(14:03):
for example. Already we're getting some of the older players
as it is, and these smaller programs tended to have
the highest average age, so it may not be as
big an impact. But if you were maybe a program
that's had a lot of eighteen nineteen year olds, adding
a couple of those I think will make a difference.
Speaker 1 (14:23):
And I got I have to say that a twenty
year old coming from U Sports that it played in
the CHL is potentially a better talent player than some
of the BHL players. I'm not trying to pick leagues
against each other, but just you know, a tier two
player as opposed to somebody that played Major junior, I
(14:44):
think you I'd rather have the major junior player most times,
if you're talking about same age, same everything, I'd rather
have a player that went through the CHL as opposed
to one of the smaller Tier two leagues.
Speaker 3 (14:55):
Well, I mean I think, no matter what it is
you've got, it's got to be the right fit for
your program. I mean, you saw a kid leave already
the CHL and go back and everybody's making a big
deal of it in sand Sea.
Speaker 4 (15:06):
It didn't work.
Speaker 3 (15:07):
People leave the USHL, or leave the USHL, players leave
college to go back to the USHL. People leave the
all the time time. So it's not just this, it
just it wasn't a fit. I mean, so I reached
it in my garbage apout the line chart from the
other night.
Speaker 4 (15:26):
They haven't taken my garbage out yet today, thank god.
Speaker 3 (15:30):
From the Purple Leagals, they have seven players that played
in the CHL or U sport from last year to
this year. So what it does is the days of
seeing a line up like people said, well how people
called me and say how was Niagara on the weekend.
(15:51):
I couldn't tell you that half their players were because
you used to be able to watch them grow and
say I remember him when he's a freshman. Now he's
a junior, and she's getting better and better and better.
It's a new lineup. You've got to figure out who
they are. And with the transfer portal, with the CHL,
with the U Sport kids coming in, you've got to
figure out who the players are. You've got to figure
(16:13):
out where they are. And by that time the weekend's over,
you're like, oh, I like that guy in period six.
You remember that kid. Okay, we got to watch out
for this kid. Okay, Well you watch them play a
couple times on video and you're like, okay, well, now
you've got to do this, And next thing you know.
Speaker 4 (16:29):
They're they're they're taking a big step on the weekend.
It's still early in the year.
Speaker 3 (16:33):
They've got maybe four points in six games, and then
they've got two against you.
Speaker 4 (16:39):
They're like, okay, I got to watch this guy. We
have to match our deep pair up against this line.
Speaker 3 (16:43):
And I mean, so it's still ever evolving and you're
still trying to figure out how this is. We talked
about it being November. I think you're still going to
figure out how this is. And I think this is
just going to be a constant problem. Not a problem,
but this is going to be constant how things are
until it slows down.
Speaker 4 (17:03):
A little bit, you're going to start seeing the CHL be.
Speaker 3 (17:07):
More of a feeder than it's going to be on
the same part as the us HL.
Speaker 4 (17:11):
Right now. I think that's where it comes down to.
And uh, is it is it right? Is it wrong?
It's neither. It's just a new way.
Speaker 3 (17:19):
It's it's it's adapting. It's it's like it's like when
you're sitting right. Uh, it's like you're the old dude.
Hey remember when we were kids. So this was remember
when gas was fifty cents a gallon, And and there's
other people like I remember when gas was a dollar
a gallon. Ed's probably saying, hey, remember when gas was
twenty cents a gallon. But hey, remember when gas was
(17:45):
a nickel.
Speaker 1 (17:46):
I mean that's yeah, I mean yeah, remember those old days.
Speaker 4 (17:54):
I mean, I mean a new day.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
The point when we if we get years into this
cycle and you're now seeing more players recruited out of
the COCHL than say the NAHL, then you're gonna coaches
will know who those players are three years from now.
They just didn't have time to learn who all these
players were that came in.
Speaker 6 (18:17):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (18:17):
So there's there's just too many players that you have
never been seen.
Speaker 5 (18:21):
There's been scouted, never been looked at. We couldn't you.
Speaker 4 (18:24):
Watch them play?
Speaker 5 (18:25):
You couldn't.
Speaker 3 (18:25):
They got team that went to the they went to
the they were sixteen. You might have watched them play
at then you sixteen, then they went to Major Junior.
You forgot about him until that. You didn't see him play.
So now you finally start watching them again. Now you're
going to watch them play. So like you, you couldn't
watch them, so you didn't see them play, and now
you're gonna.
Speaker 5 (18:46):
Yeah, but this vacuum will end, this will lend, So.
Speaker 3 (18:50):
You're gonna start watching them play, and you'll you're like, hey,
I watched that kid when he was seventeen play for
the Oshawa Generals and now he's playing for Niagara.
Speaker 4 (19:00):
I mean, or now he's playing.
Speaker 3 (19:01):
For shacred Hard and I watched him play for Oshawa.
Then he played for the Regina Pats. I mean, that's
how it's going to be. It's just different. It's and
and to sit there and say we can't do it,
it's or I'm not going to do it because that's
not the way it is. It's the way it is.
Speaker 4 (19:18):
It's I mean.
Speaker 2 (19:21):
That's exactly what Sean Hogan was saying to me. He said,
we don't have two divergent paths anymore. You get kids
playing youth hockey, and then you get kids playing junior hockey,
whether it's the NAHL, US US, HL, BHL, OHL, whl
QM JHL, and then if they want to go to
(19:41):
the NHL, it's through the NCAA. That is going to
be the development path. Now, one path is what he says.
Speaker 4 (19:49):
Watched the kid on Sunday play he played. Two weeks ago.
Speaker 3 (19:52):
He played in the National Hockey League. He was playing
in the National Hockey League on Sunday, two weeks ago.
On Sunday, he was playing against the guy who was
going to play college talking next year.
Speaker 4 (20:00):
I mean, it's it's different.
Speaker 5 (20:03):
Just have to.
Speaker 3 (20:05):
You can't say I liked it the way it was,
because it's not the way anymore. I was like, it's
above net. He's making a lot more than above an
actual necessary expenses. Right now, he's already played four games
of the National Hockey weeks. If you can't he's not recruitable, yeah, right,
at least I don't think he is. Well, I guess, well,
we'll find out who knows it might be some move.
Speaker 5 (20:28):
It's been way on schools.
Speaker 4 (20:30):
I didn't go down and talk to him. He's not
coming to barber Morris. Well, we'll we'll see how this
all rolls out.
Speaker 2 (20:35):
But you're right, we're not going back to the way
things used to be, and we just got to go
along with it and enjoy the ride.
Speaker 4 (20:43):
By the way, you can five cents, five cents, five
cents a gallon.
Speaker 2 (20:47):
You're talking my grandfather who was born in nineteen oh nine,
by and five cent gus. Anyway, don't forget. You can
also watch these on YouTube. Go to YouTube dot com
slash us EHL to like and subscribe. This episode has
been sponsored by the NCAA Frozen four April ninth and
(21:07):
eleventh in Las Vegas. For tickets, visit NCAA dot com
slash m Frozen four for Jim Connolly, For Derek Scooley,
I'm ed Trevsker and this has been a pon further
review
Uscho dot com.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Welcome to us c Cho upon further review for Wednesday,
November fifth, twenty twenty five. This episode is sponsored by
the NCAA Frozen four April ninth and eleventh in Las Vegas.
Visit NCAA dot com slash M Frozen four for tickets.
And Derek, we're going to let you go first with
(00:35):
the topic that you are interested in as we look
at what's going on in the different conferences, and.
Speaker 3 (00:42):
You know what, you gave a little freedom to pick
what we wanted to talk about this week, and you know,
other than buy and sell, it was something that I
was kind of thinking about that that I wanted to
go through and just was looking at records and I
was finding the tops and the bottom were really difference
in overall records, and some are really different comparatively to
(01:08):
their overall records.
Speaker 4 (01:09):
Are some are closer than others.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
And if you look at the overall records, and once
you once I kind of explain it, you guys can
kind of jump in. And we talked about this before,
but I think everybody will understand it.
Speaker 4 (01:21):
And I'll start with it a lot of cocky and
work my way to.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
Different segues rit Is at five and two, and these
are overall records. Merciers Is at h to nine. There's
a big difference in those two records. Then you go
to Tech five and three, Northern zero one, tech ECAC
Union five to one and one, Quinnipiac five two and one,
(01:45):
Saint Lawrence one six and one, RPI one and seven.
There's a lot of in the middles there, from the
tops to the bottom. Then you go to Hockey East
Northeastern five and one, and here's you got some big
names at the bottom. And then here's where you're going
to start seeing some major names at the bottom that
you don't expect. Northeastern at five and one, BU three
(02:10):
five and one, b C two four and one, and
once again we're going overall records, and these are this
one's the really interesting one in the NCAC Miami seven
and one to luth eight and two, Nebraska, Omaha four
and two, Saint Cloud's six and three, and at the
bottom you got Denver four to three and one, Arizona
(02:33):
State three and five, which is shocking, Michigan nine and one,
Penn State nine and one, Wisconsin six oho and two,
Michigan State five and one and that's we talked about
it on our Monday podcast. Their record non conference is
off the charts Minnesota two seven and one. So you've
(02:55):
got the tops that are just running away with things
in every conference, and you got the bottoms that are
really struggling. And if you could see, every conference has top,
top team and every conference seems to have a bottom team,
and there's a lot of in betweens. And I just
found that to be really interesting when you threw out
(03:17):
to come up with your own topics. I don't know
you guys, does that make sense to everybody?
Speaker 4 (03:21):
Yeah? It does.
Speaker 5 (03:23):
Schools And I'll tell you as I listened to you.
Speaker 1 (03:25):
Talk there, and I'll get into my points of what
surprised me so far in the season. But I guess
the bottom conferences that you kind of mentioned, there's let's
say Atlantic, let's say c C, CHACC, the teams that
you're talking about at the bottom, I have concerns that
they could get out of the bottom the other conferences,
(03:46):
particularly you know when we look at teams like Arizona
State at the bottom of the overall records NCC, the
bottom of the overall record in Hockey East.
Speaker 5 (03:56):
Being teams like BC and BU. These are teams that
I think can get out.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
You know, there are holes that have been dug that
are where you have teams that probably just don't have
the talent to get out. I'm not picking on anybody,
but you mentioned Northern Michigan and you mentioned mercy Hurst
at this point, they're both struggle. But I don't think
that we can say that Arizona State is that bad.
I'm concerned about them. I don't think we can say
(04:23):
that Minnesota is that bad. I'm concerned about them. BCBU
the same thing. So there's maybe more red flags earlier
in the season.
Speaker 5 (04:31):
Than we usually were.
Speaker 1 (04:32):
I went to the other side and kind of went
to the two teams that are really standing out to
me at this point that I didn't have on my
Bengo card going in. I wasn't sure that Wisconsin was
going to be good. And now six to zero and
two right out of the gate, they're getting really good performances.
And most importantly, I think for Wisconsin, the numbers in
net are really shaking out at this point. Daniel Howser
(04:55):
one point three to five goals against average, He has
a nine what he saved percentage at this point, and
then you know rookies. You just you look at freshman
goal scorers Blake Montgomery with four goals already. They're getting
a lot of production from Mary's that I hadn't personally considered.
And I'm not trying to say that other people weren't
(05:17):
considering Wisconsin a team that was strong.
Speaker 5 (05:19):
I know that Union had a pretty strong season last year.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
I didn't have them as a team that was going
to get right back up again. But Union, out of
the gate, they're playing really well. They got they picked
up a loss this weekend against the RP. I have
a bounced back with a win again, a goaltender in
Cameron Corpi one point five to six goals against average,
a save percentage in nine twenty four. It's just I
(05:44):
feel like the defenses of a couple of teams here,
Wisconsin and Union, they're really showing out right now. I
didn't put Miami in there because we've talked so much
about them. I think at this point anything Miami doesn't
isn't surprising us. But that's another team that really is
had a good start that we can't we can't overlook.
Speaker 2 (06:03):
Let me ask a question these teams now, Miami maybe
say Okay, what was the competition. But you look at
teams also like Minnesota Duluth that have taken a big
step forward from a tough season or two leading into it.
The question I have is how much does no matter
(06:23):
who you're playing, how much does that culture of winning
and feeling that success. How much does that carry you
into the rest of the season.
Speaker 3 (06:32):
Everybody wants to feel good about themselves. I think that's
the one thing. When you get a little bit of
juice and you feel good about your locker room, you
feel good throughout the week, and that carries on. I
think that that's the one thing that you can't replicate,
no matter what you can always say, I always I
come back in that we didn't. We had a three
(06:56):
lf on lead going to the third period against Agron
took it to us and we had to hold on
for dear life and we won four to three. And
the other night and I was not happy with how
we played in the third period. But I would rather
win ugly than lose pretty all the time, because you
(07:16):
don't win, you like you feel. No matter what you
can come in and say, we we played really well,
we feel good about how we're playing.
Speaker 4 (07:25):
The fact is a loss A loss a loss.
Speaker 3 (07:28):
And you could you you you want to feel good
about winning. I mean, what's the line of bull Durham.
I love winning. It's like better than losing. I mean,
that's what it comes down to. It's like the culture
just winning breeds winning, and that's that's what.
Speaker 4 (07:45):
That's what.
Speaker 3 (07:46):
No matter what your schedule is, you played the schedule
that you you you set up. And I joke when
we started with Michigan and Notre Dame as I got
to fire my schedule maker and unfortunately that was me
and uh you you you got to win your games.
And those teams that that that, you know, Miami, whether
(08:07):
their schedule was light or what, they had to win
their games.
Speaker 4 (08:09):
And then they just fired up and they kept winning.
Speaker 3 (08:12):
They split with Arizona State and that was good for them.
Speaker 4 (08:16):
They won their games. It's Aaron brings to mind.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
What more to come after this word from the n
c a A Frozen four.
Speaker 6 (08:27):
Glass. Today you were talking men's ice hockey. Open your textbooks,
joined thousands of other screaming fans for an in person experience.
Speaker 4 (08:35):
You have to see to believe.
Speaker 6 (08:37):
It's the n c a A Men's Frozen four April ninth
and eleventh in Las Vegas. Attendance is encouraged. Passion is
mandatory by your seats. Today at n c a A
dot com slash m Frozen four.
Speaker 5 (08:49):
How many teams are in the men's Frozen four? Please
leave me?
Speaker 2 (08:57):
It's Aaron brings to mind what first year head coach
at rit Matt Thomas said to me a couple of
weeks ago. They're not all Picasso's. Sometimes their finger painting.
Speaker 3 (09:07):
They out the same too. You don't remember them, and
you don't remember them in two years. You just remember
that you want.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
And that kind of leads into the topic I wanted
to bring up, and we'll set a little background on it.
You guys will remember this. I don't remember the name
of the place we were in. It was upstairs and
a big restaurant in Tampa in twenty twenty four where
we were doing our podcast and we're talking to all
the different league commissioners and it came time to talk
(09:36):
with CCHA Commissioner Don Lucia. One of the first things
that struck me, and of course he's commissioner of kind
of smaller programs, and he also came from two smaller
programs before he became head coach in Minnesota is how
much he advocated for those smaller teams. And he brought
(09:57):
up something that had started to be a rumbling, but
I don't think anybody took all that seriously at that point,
which was he was a big proponent of CHL eligibility
and there were a lot of people who were against
it at the time, and he said, I think it
would be a real help for smaller programs in the
(10:19):
smaller leagues. So he put that out there on the
table and then in a story that will be on
USCCHO I think later today or tomorrow. I had a
conversation with College Hockey Inc. Executive director Sean Hogan. He
had been with CHI for about five years doing education
(10:40):
and when Mike Snee moved on to a position with
Minnesota Wild, he was named the executive director in August
of twenty twenty four, and he spoke to a group
not long after he had that job and he said, yeah,
I think it's going to happen. It's probably going to
be about three years. November seventh was less than three
(11:02):
months after that, and it became a reality. So I
think the point that I'm going to make and It's
one that i've I think I've said on our podcast
and also in our TMQ column at US Echo. I
think we'll see kind of a few of these seventeen
eighteen year olds, you know, like McKenna or so forth,
(11:23):
who we're going to come in and make a big splash,
who are going to be the first round draft picks.
But I think the bulk of where CHL eligibility is
going to help teams is in depth. And when you
take those three hundred and twenty five, three hundred and
thirty players in there and add that depth, I think
you're seeing right now even in some of these splits
(11:44):
and upsets with top teams. I think you're seeing the
impact of that right away with players who've got some experience,
and something like ten percent of those players are coming
from U Sports where they had aged out had to
go to Canadian Universe, So you've got sophomores and juniors
who are coming in with some experience too. So I'm
(12:07):
going to make the case that Don Lucia was a
profit and was right, and he named what has happened,
which is make the smaller programs have more strength, and
I think that's why games are closer, and that's why
you see some upsets in there.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
You have to think that most importantly, it's made the
average age in college hockey a little bit older.
Speaker 5 (12:33):
And I think that.
Speaker 1 (12:34):
For teams that struggle to get and keep good players.
You know, some of the smaller programs, they're bringing in
players that are older, have an experience and have plenty
of talents. So I think the talent we've talked about
the talent pool, you know, continuing to increase and grow
(12:54):
this year. But I think the age too, is something
and you're finding way. You know, it was lu I
called a couple of weeks ago and we were talking
to Brendan Riley, their coach, and he has so many
new faces on his roster, tons of new players, but
he's one of the one of the oldest teams in
the country too.
Speaker 5 (13:14):
So even when we're calling gameser, sure you think about
this too.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
I just started to say this is a young team,
and you say, no, this is an experienced team. Because
the reality is is even teams with ten, twelve, fourteen
new faces, a lot of them have gotten older. Because
the COHL players came.
Speaker 5 (13:32):
In at an older age.
Speaker 1 (13:33):
I think that has had a huge part to do
with the leveling off of players is you have some
older talents.
Speaker 2 (13:41):
I may disagree with you a little bit before before
Derek hops in, because a lot of programs are getting
the eighteen nineteen year old commits twenty year old freshmen
out of places like the BHL and so forth. So
I think a lot of those teams getting the twenty
year old freshmen out of the out of the OHL
(14:03):
for example. Already we're getting some of the older players
as it is, and these smaller programs tended to have
the highest average age, so it may not be as
big an impact. But if you were maybe a program
that's had a lot of eighteen nineteen year olds, adding
a couple of those I think will make a difference.
Speaker 1 (14:23):
And I got I have to say that a twenty
year old coming from U Sports that it played in
the CHL is potentially a better talent player than some
of the BHL players. I'm not trying to pick leagues
against each other, but just you know, a tier two
player as opposed to somebody that played Major junior, I
(14:44):
think you I'd rather have the major junior player most times,
if you're talking about same age, same everything, I'd rather
have a player that went through the CHL as opposed
to one of the smaller Tier two leagues.
Speaker 3 (14:55):
Well, I mean I think, no matter what it is
you've got, it's got to be the right fit for
your program. I mean, you saw a kid leave already
the CHL and go back and everybody's making a big
deal of it in sand Sea.
Speaker 4 (15:06):
It didn't work.
Speaker 3 (15:07):
People leave the USHL, or leave the USHL, players leave
college to go back to the USHL. People leave the
all the time time. So it's not just this, it
just it wasn't a fit. I mean, so I reached
it in my garbage apout the line chart from the
other night.
Speaker 4 (15:26):
They haven't taken my garbage out yet today, thank god.
Speaker 3 (15:30):
From the Purple Leagals, they have seven players that played
in the CHL or U sport from last year to
this year. So what it does is the days of
seeing a line up like people said, well how people
called me and say how was Niagara on the weekend.
(15:51):
I couldn't tell you that half their players were because
you used to be able to watch them grow and
say I remember him when he's a freshman. Now he's
a junior, and she's getting better and better and better.
It's a new lineup. You've got to figure out who
they are. And with the transfer portal, with the CHL,
with the U Sport kids coming in, you've got to
figure out who the players are. You've got to figure
(16:13):
out where they are. And by that time the weekend's over,
you're like, oh, I like that guy in period six.
You remember that kid. Okay, we got to watch out
for this kid. Okay, Well you watch them play a
couple times on video and you're like, okay, well, now
you've got to do this, And next thing you know.
Speaker 4 (16:29):
They're they're they're taking a big step on the weekend.
It's still early in the year.
Speaker 3 (16:33):
They've got maybe four points in six games, and then
they've got two against you.
Speaker 4 (16:39):
They're like, okay, I got to watch this guy. We
have to match our deep pair up against this line.
Speaker 3 (16:43):
And I mean, so it's still ever evolving and you're
still trying to figure out how this is. We talked
about it being November. I think you're still going to
figure out how this is. And I think this is
just going to be a constant problem. Not a problem,
but this is going to be constant how things are
until it slows down.
Speaker 4 (17:03):
A little bit, you're going to start seeing the CHL be.
Speaker 3 (17:07):
More of a feeder than it's going to be on
the same part as the us HL.
Speaker 4 (17:11):
Right now. I think that's where it comes down to.
And uh, is it is it right? Is it wrong?
It's neither. It's just a new way.
Speaker 3 (17:19):
It's it's it's adapting. It's it's like it's like when
you're sitting right. Uh, it's like you're the old dude.
Hey remember when we were kids. So this was remember
when gas was fifty cents a gallon, And and there's
other people like I remember when gas was a dollar
a gallon. Ed's probably saying, hey, remember when gas was
twenty cents a gallon. But hey, remember when gas was
(17:45):
a nickel.
Speaker 1 (17:46):
I mean that's yeah, I mean yeah, remember those old days.
Speaker 4 (17:54):
I mean, I mean a new day.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
The point when we if we get years into this
cycle and you're now seeing more players recruited out of
the COCHL than say the NAHL, then you're gonna coaches
will know who those players are three years from now.
They just didn't have time to learn who all these
players were that came in.
Speaker 6 (18:17):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (18:17):
So there's there's just too many players that you have
never been seen.
Speaker 5 (18:21):
There's been scouted, never been looked at. We couldn't you.
Speaker 4 (18:24):
Watch them play?
Speaker 5 (18:25):
You couldn't.
Speaker 3 (18:25):
They got team that went to the they went to
the they were sixteen. You might have watched them play
at then you sixteen, then they went to Major Junior.
You forgot about him until that. You didn't see him play.
So now you finally start watching them again. Now you're
going to watch them play. So like you, you couldn't
watch them, so you didn't see them play, and now
you're gonna.
Speaker 5 (18:46):
Yeah, but this vacuum will end, this will lend, So.
Speaker 3 (18:50):
You're gonna start watching them play, and you'll you're like, hey,
I watched that kid when he was seventeen play for
the Oshawa Generals and now he's playing for Niagara.
Speaker 4 (19:00):
I mean, or now he's playing.
Speaker 3 (19:01):
For shacred Hard and I watched him play for Oshawa.
Then he played for the Regina Pats. I mean, that's
how it's going to be. It's just different. It's and
and to sit there and say we can't do it,
it's or I'm not going to do it because that's
not the way it is. It's the way it is.
Speaker 4 (19:18):
It's I mean.
Speaker 2 (19:21):
That's exactly what Sean Hogan was saying to me. He said,
we don't have two divergent paths anymore. You get kids
playing youth hockey, and then you get kids playing junior hockey,
whether it's the NAHL, US US, HL, BHL, OHL, whl
QM JHL, and then if they want to go to
(19:41):
the NHL, it's through the NCAA. That is going to
be the development path. Now, one path is what he says.
Speaker 4 (19:49):
Watched the kid on Sunday play he played. Two weeks ago.
Speaker 3 (19:52):
He played in the National Hockey League. He was playing
in the National Hockey League on Sunday, two weeks ago.
On Sunday, he was playing against the guy who was
going to play college talking next year.
Speaker 4 (20:00):
I mean, it's it's different.
Speaker 5 (20:03):
Just have to.
Speaker 3 (20:05):
You can't say I liked it the way it was,
because it's not the way anymore. I was like, it's
above net. He's making a lot more than above an
actual necessary expenses. Right now, he's already played four games
of the National Hockey weeks. If you can't he's not recruitable, yeah, right,
at least I don't think he is. Well, I guess, well,
we'll find out who knows it might be some move.
Speaker 5 (20:28):
It's been way on schools.
Speaker 4 (20:30):
I didn't go down and talk to him. He's not
coming to barber Morris. Well, we'll we'll see how this
all rolls out.
Speaker 2 (20:35):
But you're right, we're not going back to the way
things used to be, and we just got to go
along with it and enjoy the ride.
Speaker 4 (20:43):
By the way, you can five cents, five cents, five
cents a gallon.
Speaker 2 (20:47):
You're talking my grandfather who was born in nineteen oh nine,
by and five cent gus. Anyway, don't forget. You can
also watch these on YouTube. Go to YouTube dot com
slash us EHL to like and subscribe. This episode has
been sponsored by the NCAA Frozen four April ninth and
(21:07):
eleventh in Las Vegas. For tickets, visit NCAA dot com
slash m Frozen four for Jim Connolly, For Derek Scooley,
I'm ed Trevsker and this has been a pon further
review
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