IMB E3: Art of The Lift - An Interview with Jeanette Andromeda

Art helps bring Victoria's world to life in a very special way. Today we take a peek inside the music box in an interview with Victoria’s Creative Director, Jeanette Andromeda!
Learn about the woman who creates Victoria's visual realm and get some insight into the importance of art, story, and how both intermingle in our world and Victoria's.

Episode Transcript

(00:04):
Blind Story Studios giving Story a voice. Treet Deep are you a Betty?
Do you like to Twitter? Andtweet? Come find this on Twitter at
Victoria's list tree tweet. Hello.This is Daniel Foytech and I welcome you

(00:36):
to episode three of Inside the MusicBox are behind the scene interviews with the
folks that make the show possible.Today's interview is with Janetta Andromeda, are
creative director. As creative director,she is primarily responsible for the visual aspect
of the show. That means theart, look, the fuel, the
vibe, everything that you get fromthe website to the cover images Janette is

(00:56):
involved in. So sit back,relax, and enjoy our discussion about art
and some of the challenges in makingart. We also talk about artists and
their responsibility to tell the truth asthey see it. So today my guest
is Janette Andromeda. Jeanette is oneof my favorite people on the planet,
and we're going to talk about arttoday. Already adventures, right, isn't

(01:21):
that? Isn't it your catchphrase?Or wasn't that your catchphrase at one point?
Already Adventures It was when I wasbeing properly protective on YouTube, which
I have not been in a while. To those who watched my YouTube channel,
I'm so sorry, but don't worry. I'm not dead. That's good
to know. Even if even ifyou have been bitten by ticks and infected

(01:46):
with lyme disease, who knows.We'll find out after a month is I
don't want to get to eggs amonth? Ah yeah, So it takes
about a month after you get bitby a tick to have any of the
I mean there's also starts of funthings that ticks can carry, so you
know, I'll get tested for abunch of them and see if I if
I want the tick lottery at all. So so, just so we don't

(02:12):
scare anybody. So I just gotby it, bitten by it to we
yesterday today? Uh like like twoweeks ago. Oh, two weeks ago.
Oh well this I thought this wasa new development. Oh no.
The new development was me looking atthe bites and being like, wow,
they're still there and they look kindof terrible. Maybe I should deal with
that. Maybe you maybe you'll havelike tick powers or spider powers or something.

(02:38):
Could be a spider spider powers wouldbe better. I've seen the tick
and he's hilarious. But I wouldn'twant his powers. He's nigh invulnerable.
Yeah, past oh, that mightbe helpful because I'm allergic to life,
so maybe being nigh invulnerable would bea benefit for me tremendous. So,

(03:01):
talking about arts, You've done artfor all kinds of projects for me.
You've done stuff for Victoria's Lyft,and you've done stuff for the Wicked Library,
and you did stuff for our booksand all kinds of stuff. So

(03:22):
you do you do? So whatare some of the things that inspire you
when you sit down to create apiece. I mean, I know that
I'm usually pretty loosey goosey with you. I give you some general ideas about
what I'm thinking most of the time. Sometimes I've been a little more specific,
but for the most part, Iusually just kind of throw general ideas
at you and let you run withit, because you're a lot better anything

(03:45):
that I tell you you're gonna docome up with something better anyway. So
I'm always curious, like where theinspiration comes from. Like, for instance,
as we're recording this, you're workingon art for the Wicked Library season
eleven, And I know the onlything I really threw at you was Season
of sci fi and you don't haveto spoil anything and tell me what you're

(04:08):
what you're doing. But how doyou how do you come up with inspiration
whenever someone gives you something vague likethat? Is that fun? I've always
thought it was fun to let youkind of pick, but I don't know,
maybe it's like I want more information. It kind of depends on the
project, Like I love the ArtisticLiberty project, like what you said to
me, where it's like I needsomething wiged library slash sci fi like cool.

(04:31):
When I first came up with theidea for the season art that you
will have before the new season comesup, just a couple of days,
folks, a couple of days.It actually came from I was in New
Mexico and I went into this littlesecondhand bookshop and I ended up um finding

(04:56):
a couple like nineteen seventies, youknow, like one cent reprints of early
fifties sci fi stories, and thespecific one that I was reading was The
Legion of Space is low key,just sexist the entire way through, but
hilarious to read. But it kindof came from that. And what's funny

(05:20):
about that particular little shop is itwas a day where I had. I
was wandering around after getting my septumpierced, because that's what you do.
It was like my first day afterthe fourteen day COVID quarantine, after traveling
to New Mexico, I was finallyable to go explore. So I got
my piercing done, went down thestreet, went into the store, found

(05:43):
these books, and specifically the Legionof Space, and then I ended up
in a long conversation about how thedudes who were running the store evaded the
draft and did lots and lots ofpsychedelics for quite a while. And I
ended up stuck in that conversation fora hot minute until this lady came in
rolling a suitcase, grumbling about howher daughters had betrayed her and sold all

(06:08):
of her books and she was tryingto find them. And I'm like,
yep, I'm gonna follow that ladyout by my daughters have betrayed me and
sold all that. As someone wholoves books, that sounds pretty awful,
you know what. Yeah, She'slike, they think I'm a hoarder,
but they don't understand these were likefirst edition books. I'm like, I'm
so sorry, Please tell me morebecause I really want to leave this conversation

(06:31):
about psychedelics right now. Um,and then I'm gonna hung around for the
conversation about psychedelics personally. But that'sjust me for a while. I think
that I'm a book hoarder. ButI think that's like I don't know if
you can call it hoarding if it'ssomething specific, like maybe if you just
like have books just to have them, it's hoarding. But like if you

(06:54):
actually read them or lend them topeople, or as she had said,
you know, their first editions,their collector items, they have some monetary
value. Um, I don't knowif that's hoarding. I think I think
I defined hoarding is like if youhave too many ballpoint pens that don't work
anymore, or a boxfull of bags, or a bag full of boxes,

(07:15):
or a boxful of burned out lightbulbs. Like to me, that's hoarding.
That's hoarding, whereas like a roomfull of books is called a library.
A library. Yes, so yeah, that she turned into an interesting
conversation. Walking down the street withher while she's rolling her suitcase and betching
about her her daughters, I kindof asked, what was what's up with

(07:39):
the suitcase was was the suitcase fullof books that she had found. Yes,
she was trying to like that washow she was storing the books that
she was buying back. Um,she was on a hunt to find,
like, not necessarily the copies thather daughters had sold, because she had
given up hope on that, butlike ones that she'd lost in the process

(08:01):
of her daughter's downsizing for her.Um. Interesting lady. I appreciated our
talk as we wandered down the street, and she told me about how her
son used to play the drums downin the corner and how his girl take
psychedelic car across the street. No, he wasn't doing psychedelics. He was
just, you know, a nonpsychedelic drummer. Okay, non psychedelic drummer.

(08:24):
Believe it or not. I knowthey exist. I'm sure there's lots
of very clean and sober drummers.Maybe my experience with rock music from the
sixties and seventies is that that's arare commodity. But you know, so
that's where the idea. So theidea is the lady, or the idea

(08:48):
is the books that you were becauseI like the idea of the lady being
the lady with the suitcase sounds likea fantastic cover. Maybe we should do
a joke cover for the Wicked Librarywith this woman that's rolling down the street,
you know, with a with apiece of luggage trying to find that
sounds that sounds like a great storyto me, you know, like especially

(09:09):
if the books have like some kindof power or something like that, like
maybe they're books of spells and she'slike, my daughters have no idea.
They just got rid of the necronomicon. They've unleashed chaos into the world by
selling. That's right. I hopeno, I hope nobody opens the books.
Oh yeah, they will swallow yoursoul. That gives some urgency to

(09:35):
her character. Like now she canbe like, you know, dressed oddly
and eccentric, with her hair allwild and everything because she's out there on
a quest to save the universe bygetting her books back. I love it.
That should be a Wicked Library episode. Someone might just have to write
it. Yeah, contense listeners,if you're an author um free game,

(10:01):
that's right. So for this scenario, you were you were inspired by pulp
covers from the fifties and sixties.Is that right, yep, um,
So I really wanted to do somethingkind of like classic sci fi horror,
and currently in its current state,there is a female astronaut who is about

(10:26):
to fire back at a giant monsterin space because she has her library card
and she's allowed to take the booksthat are clutched in one arm. That's
awesome. Yeah, So I kindof like, in my head, this
monster is like protecting a planet thatis a library, kind of like doctor

(10:48):
Huvianum. And she's gone in andlike grab some books and it's like those
are referenced section only, and she'slike, fun, I have my library
hard. That's the story that Iimagine is going on. Well I like
that. I like that there's athere's a story behind it. I think

(11:11):
the art is always more interesting whenyou know the actual story behind it.
So hopefully the bizarre story I cameup with comes across well. Otherwise,
I mean, at the very leastit's a lady with a library card loading
in space versus a monster and likealien thing. Yeah, I mean,
at least it'll be pretty. Imean, your stuff's always beautiful, so

(11:31):
thank you. So, I knowone of the things that I've I've commented
on before, and we've talked aboutbefore with your artwork, is the use
of lights in your work. Youhave a fascinating use of light. So
I'm curious kind of where that camefrom and maybe who your artistic influences are.

(11:52):
That is that something that you developedon your own. Is that something
that was inspired by the work ofany any specific or particular artist. Ah,
it actually came from when I workedin theater as a set designer.
I would always work very closely withthe lighting designers because light always brought everything
to life or killed it. Yes, the wrong color light will flatten out

(12:16):
your entire paint treatment, the wrongangle of light will make something that is
luscious look fake, or vice versa. And I would always pay very close
attention to what they were doing,the angles and the color and the contrast
so and how like they could takethis three dimensional object or flat painted thing

(12:37):
and make it and like heighten it. Oh yeah, I mean light is
so important in especially in theater.I mean, yes, I've seen some
productions where their professional productions and thelight is too bright and they just wash
everybody's face out. And I've alsoseen ones that were like the local community

(12:58):
theater and they had excellent lighting,you know. So it's really it's really
dependent upon how qualified, how goodyour your lighting person is. I mean,
you can have the best set andthe best makeup and costumes in the
world, but if the lighting isoff, it's it's a bad time.
Like it's so for people who don'tlike maybe go see live theater very often.

(13:20):
Imagine just going into the hospital,right, you have just flat,
flickery, unpleasant fluorescent lighting most ofthe time. Now imagine you're in your
favorite coffee shop. There's usually softerlight, and it's usually lower, and
it's just more gentle and it's morecomfortable. There's lots of different ways to

(13:41):
shape a reality just through light,And I think about that a lot when
I'm drawing. There's still a lotI can improve with my lighting in my
art. I'm constantly thinking about it, and I do find other artists to
pull inspiration from, especially artists whowork a lot in black and white or

(14:01):
inks like Alex murd I actually loveher stuff so much, and I look
at how she uses her her contrastto just really shape things in negative space,
and I find that very very inspired. Yeah, it's really cool.
She she does have a very deafhand, you know. I think some
of that comes from having a comicbook backgrounds type of thing, you know,

(14:24):
where she does a lot of comics, and when you're working with boxes,
you know, there's the use ofnegative space in those panels I think
is pretty important. Not that I'man expert on comic books, just as
a reader of and an admirer of. That's one of the things that I
always admire and find interesting is howthose boxes, how those panels are used.

(14:48):
Yeah, the flow of a comicpage can be a beautiful thing.
Yeah, yeah, I mean it'sit's storytelling. I mean we've had this
conversation obviously multiple times before about howimportant um storytelling is in everything that we
do, and especially for creatives,you know, whether it's writing or arts.
I mean, there's there's a lotthat you can do in arts that

(15:11):
is not something that you can doin the written word. What was the
old saying a picture is worth athousand words, So you know, there
are there are things that can comeacross with subtle facial expressions if you're you
know, doing characters and the angleof a head or the clothing that they're
wearing or you know, all thatstuff is just so it's fascinating to me

(15:35):
because it's something I can't really do, um, but it's it's just amazing
how much can be conveyed just bylooking at an image. You know.
One of my favorite things that you'vedone for me is the art work that
you did for the first von Hamlinstory where we had Victoria being led with
the other children by the piper.In fact, it's my desktop wallpaper and

(15:56):
I'm looking at it now. That'sa and uh yeah, I mean,
I know we went kind of wewent back and forth a couple of times
on like colors and things like that, but I mean, like when I
look at just the facial expressions onthe individual children and and you know,
the way that the light is used, and there's little dots of power,

(16:19):
energy, light whatever we want tocall them, that are surrounding him,
and just the vapid expression on someof the faces. And you know,
we talked about the clothing too,like how it should convey the fact that
these are children from multiple time periodsand that sort of thing, and it
just continues to be something like everytime I look at it, I see

(16:41):
something else. Oh that's awesome.Yeah, I got I got kind of
lost in that one when I wasmaking it, just in the trying to
live in that moment where you wereyou wrote in the story, just like
the description of the trees being aliveand how the entire or forrest had this

(17:02):
power to it. I wanted totry and try and capture just a little
bit of what you had described.I think there's still there's always more you
could do, you know, butI am pretty happy with the amount of
story that made it into that imagefrom what was written, because it was
just that whole series was so muchfun too, so it was nice to

(17:25):
like have just dig in and makesomething well more detailed than usual, you
know. It's I've always been likeI remember growing up getting I mean,
I was always I've always been avoracious reader and just getting books, reading
the stories and falling in love withthe story and the characters, and and
then like after reading the story,looking again at the cover and being like

(17:48):
the artist never read this book.That always annoyed the hell out of I
mean, I get it, Iunderstand why it's that way, but it's
just like it's very obvious whenever,like it's the artist's interpretation of the very
little information that they were they gleanedfrom the story, you know, yeah,
or they were just given like adescription and they made up the rest

(18:11):
or something. Yeah. I haven'tdone a whole lot of book covers yet,
but all of the books that havedone covers for I read first,
because there was no way I wasgoing to be one of those artists that
was like, yeah, I meanit was about a castle, right,
there's a lot of leeway there.What kind of castle? When is it

(18:33):
set? Is it a newcastle oran oldcastle? Is it really important that
that castle's on fire for the coverbecause it's like a pivotal point in the
story. I don't know, theseare all important things. I mean,
yeah, I mean at the veryleast, it always spoke to me that
they're well, not back then,but I mean as I've as I've started
to create things myself, and youknow, I've worked closely with you and

(18:55):
with Alex and with with other artists. Um, you know, not always
is to do people get a chanceto read everything. And I totally get
that, especially if you're a bookcover designer and that's kind of your thing
and you're doing multiple projects for multipleauthors. But I mean that's when the
collaborative description back and forth kind ofbecomes so important. And that's one of

(19:17):
the things I've always enjoyed with,you know, working with you and the
other artists that we've worked with forthe show, is is just the back
and forth, you know, likethe collaborative Okay, well this isn't quite
this and this is what I'm kindof looking for. I think that becomes
so important, especially whenever you know, like I said, you're in a
situation where maybe you don't have theopportunity to look at everything or read the

(19:41):
story for or the time because itdoes take time to read an entire novel.
Yeah, no one can expect acover designer to read every single book
project that I get it, youknow. I mean like, but as
a kid, grown up, Iwas like, this sucks because this doesn't
look anything like Bell Grith. Butanyway, when the cover art was made
by someone who either communicated really wellwith the author or actually knew the story,

(20:07):
yeah, which I think is whya lot of when you get reprints
of books, you get like abetter cover or something. Maybe the new
artist has read it, or youknow, they they figured out which points
the really resonated with the readers thatthey wanted to like Highlight. Yeah,

(20:27):
I mean, you know, it'snow that I'm older and now that I
kind of work with authors and artistsand everything. One of the things that
to me is always interesting is Ialmost feel like indie book cover art and
small press cover art is better thanthe stuff that's put out by the big
publishing houses. And I'm sure thatthere's exceptions to that whenever you're talking about

(20:48):
like I don't know, Stephen Kingor Dean Koon's or you know someone that's
a really big name. Um,but it's I guess it's because there seems
to be more of a collaborative efforts. I don't know, I'm probably just
making stuff up. That's just theway I feel, you know, like
I admire small press and indie artcovers better more than I do like the

(21:12):
stuff that the big publishing houses putout. And now I'll ever get published
by anybody. Nailed it. Goodjob. We've ostracized ourselves from an entire
like branch of reality. Just disagreewith me and you'll be fine. Just
let me take the fall. Ohyeah, Dan, why would you say

(21:33):
that? Do you see that buslet me let me see if I can
get under it. All right,cool, Thank you for taking that dad
for me. That's right, that'sright. So since we're ostracizing ourselves,
let's talk about politics, shall we? Oh God, no, bye.

(22:00):
I do want to talk about politics, but I want to talk about it
in a very abstract way. Andwhat I mean by that is there have
been a couple of times that TheWicked Library and Victorious Lift have gotten reviews
from people who were very hung upon the fact that some political ideas and

(22:22):
societal value ideas made their way intoepisodes, stories, production, that sort
of thing. And I've always kindof had this feeling that art is in
its very nature political because we arepart of a society, and as artists,

(22:48):
as part of a society, partof your job is to look at
society and report back what you find. So I mean, if I go
back to old Twilight Zone episodes andold episodes of Star Trek and even Next
Generate, I mean, we cantalk about a ton of examples of it,
but I mean, I'm a hugefan of Twilight Zone episodes, and

(23:08):
I think that those always had anunderlying current, and I think when you
look at even stuff that's any anythingthat's written, really you have to look
at the context of the time inwhich it was written, and I think
that certainly applies to art as well. So I guess my question is,

(23:29):
after setting it up that way sothat you don't have to fall on one
side of the spectrum, is whyis art important to society? And why
are societal values and politics an importantpart of art or are they not.
I definitely fall in the camps thatI think art is a vital part of

(23:55):
culture communicating what their values are.So the stories we read, the art
that's on the walls, all ofit, like really matters. The plays
that are written, the stories thatare on the radio, the music we
listen to, all of it.The best stuff has a reason, even

(24:18):
if the reason is I'm feeling this, let me try to convey this feeling.
Or I'm part of a revolution andI need to share that, or
I'm gay and I want to celebratethat. Like, it all needs a
voice, and art is a greatway to give voice to it. So
I definitely think I don't know ifthat really explains why why do we need

(24:41):
to manifest our thoughts and ideals andart? Well, I think as human
beings. It's an essential part ofhow our brains work. We need to
voice and give outlets to the thoughtsand ideals that we value. Otherwise we're
just kind of floating around in space, not feeling connected to anyone. I'd

(25:04):
agree with that. I mean,I think that that art is a vital
way. And when I say art, I'm not just talking about visual art.
I'm talking about any any type ofcreative endeavor. It's I think it's
vital that we challenge society and wechallenge long held views because I mean,
if we want to go back ahundred years, you know, um,

(25:26):
in some countries, being gay wasillegal in in the nineteenes until the nineteen
seventies, you couldn't be. AndI know this because we have a character
coming up in Victoria's Lift who worksfor the FBI and one of their mentors
works for the FBI, and theirmentor is a gay man, and it's

(25:48):
that's something you had to keep secret, like you couldn't tell anybody that shit
if you wanted to keep your job. And I think the only way that
that has changed is not only throughprotests, not only through the work of
you know, a lot of tirelesseffort, but also through the arts,
I mean comedy, you know,shows like Saturday Night Live, art,

(26:11):
pop culture, arts, music,books, movies, all these things that
are influenced. I think that's partof the job of an artist is to
say, here's an angle that youhaven't looked at before, and and maybe
you change somebody's mind and maybe slowlyit's you know, it slowly changes minds.

(26:33):
But that's our job, I think, is to even if it's just
to say, hey, I'm hereand this is who I am and this
is what I'm like, and you'regonna have to deal with it because I'm
not hiding it and I'm not goingaway. Important it absolutely is. I
mean I feel like cultures have risenand fallen and all that's left is the

(26:57):
art that they made some times,whether it's sculptures or stories or you know,
the I would argue architecture as aform of art as well, you
know, because it tells the storyof the people that that lived it,
that wanted it, that built it, what their values were. And yeah,

(27:19):
it is important to have those voicesbe heard. So where do you
find most of your inspiration? Allover? Which is a terrible answer.
It's a great answer. It's agreat I only ask that question because people
expect that question to be asked,like what inspires you. Um, it's
the same thing that inspires you tomake a certain dinner. It's the same

(27:41):
thing that inspires you to redo yourliving room. It's the same thing that
inspires you to take up a newhobby. It's it's it's it's um,
it's that, it's it's everything thatyou would come into contact with your within
your life. You know. It'sit's all those mediums that I was just
talking about and more. It couldbe a conversation. I mean when we

(28:02):
were talking at the beginning of this, we were talking about the lady rolling
her card around. That's a reallife events that occurred. And you know,
I mean to me, that's likethat's rich story fodder right there,
Just that one little description of thiswoman who lost all her books and is
rolling around a suitcase trying to findthem again, you know, And there's
so many directions you can go withthat story. You know, my head

(28:23):
automatically goes to, um, Okay, these are these are books that have
some sort of you know, power, and it's going to unleash unleash horrors
on the world if if we don'tget these books back, but somebody else
might just go the you know,the the very emotional connection to your past
type of thing, which is probablywhat it really is. But yeah,

(28:45):
but it could ways. But Ido. I find a lot of inspiration
in I guess, and a lotof it's in the people that I meet
and through them. It's like likefrom you. It was your podcast in
Victoria at the very beginning. Ifound your podcast at a very tumultuous and

(29:11):
pivotal point in my life and founda lot of inspiration there. M I,
oh gosh, I don't know.It pulls from everything. I read
a lot, I watched movies,I watch YouTube, but I listen to
podcasts. I listened to a lotof music lately. Music has been a
big part of things. Yeah,I don't know. And living you just

(29:34):
gotta go live life, Go experiencesomething, get lost in the desert and
try to not have Oh my god, that's a whole story. It's so
important, and I mean I thinkthat if you know, if anybody's listening
that wants to do arts, createthings in any medium, that's such an

(29:55):
important part of that. I mean, and I think that as we get
deep into creating things, and atleast for me, I want to do
it all, you know, It'slike I want to say yes to everything.
And when you do that, youcut out all your time for you
know, just kind of sitting andlooking at the clouds, or going out
and like you said, getting lostin the going on a trip and getting

(30:17):
lost somewhere, you know, goingout for a day without an agenda and
just letting things happen. Those thingsare so important to recharging the batteries and
to inspiring us. And if youdon't do those things, you eventually get
to the point where you're just like, I hate doing this. Well,
burnout's a real thing, very like, it's not an ego thing. It's

(30:41):
not like, oh you can't youcan't burn out if you if you're good
at it, you can burn outall over the place. I had one
particularly dramatic burnout in my life,and now know the warning signs when I'm
getting there, and I know howto how to get off life a little
bit when I need it now,which is good. That's very good.

(31:04):
Um. Back in the day,I well before I got into podcasting or
blogging or YouTube or any of it. Um. I did film. I
was a production designer for cheesy,cheesy sci fi and like Chiller Channel horror
movies. Um, it's good stuff, it's fun. Yeah. You know,

(31:26):
everybody likes bubblegum. You know youneed to eat a balance diet and
good nutrition, but every once ina while you want a cupcake. Yep.
And I made cupcakes man um.And I got very burnt out doing
it because I just pushed myself andpushed myself and would do like the sixteen
hour days without sleeping for days inbetween, and like, you know,

(31:48):
like I put my body through waymore than it should have. And I
took a long break from film thankfully, I you know, took a detour
into the world that I in now, which is podcasting and blogging and art
and just like focusing on my ownillustration and stuff. And actually recently I
started to get back into film andnow it's just like, oh wow,

(32:12):
I'm I can do this without likegiving up my own sense of identity.
This is great. I love this. Yeah. I mean I think a
big factor in this burnout stuff too, is like, especially when you're creating
stuff that I don't know, whenwe first try to get our stuff noticed.
We put a lot of time andeffort into it. Not the people

(32:32):
that are well established don't continue todo that, And not that that's not
important, but I think that partof it too, at least for me,
part of it was like nobody knows, well, not nobody, very
few people, very few listeners probablyknow the amount of work that goes into
the creation of something like the WickedLibrary or Victorious Left, I mean all

(32:59):
the different opponents, and some peopledo. I mean, some people know
very well the amount of work thatgoes into it and appreciate it. But
like there's just so much that youdo, and sometimes you're just like,
I'm doing all this stuff and nobodyever knows nobody's and nor should they.
I mean, it's not like you'resupposed to go, well, I do
this, and then I do this, and then I do this, and
then I do this. People justwant to listen to a story and have

(33:19):
a good time, right, Butpart of it for the creator is like,
man, I have to do allthis just to get this one thing
out there. So it's not justlike here's an audio file to listen to.
There's like a ton of stuff thatgoes on behind the scenes before you
get to the point where somebody canactually download it and listen to it,
and that can weigh on you wheneveryou're producing like four or five different shows.

(33:44):
Essentially, Yeah, I gotta bebetter at that. I completely understand.
That's part of why I just likeI had to take a break from
YouTube too, because it was justlike, there's too much going on in
my life right now, I gottaI gotta drop something for a minute.
So yeah, I mean, didyou see, um, did you see
the bow Burnham thing that he didfor Netflix? Oh my god, I

(34:06):
honestly could not watch the entire thingbecause I was so triggered. It's just
like it's it's beautiful, but atthe same I felt so like, I
mean, it's just it's just Idon't want to say it's a slog,
but like emotionally it's taxing to watchthat. And I think it's important,
you know, Like I think it'simportant that he shared that because I mean,

(34:29):
that's something that we we usually don'tdo that as creatives. We usually
don't just like pull down all thebarriers and say, Okay, here's all
the ship that goes into it,and like just the emotional turmoil the poor
guy was going through the entire time, and you know, just continuing to
try to find that inspiration. Imean, I'll be honest with you,
I've watched half of it. Imade it halfway through, and I'm like,

(34:50):
I need a break from this becauseit's hard to watch. Um.
I don't know if it's hard towatch for everyone or if it's just hard
to watch for someone who has gonethrough a lot of you know, like
it was created stuff. Yeah,and maybe a little bit of a mental
health crisis there. That's what Isaw in it. I saw Maybe that's

(35:12):
just me projecting, but you knowthat's what good art makes you do.
You see yourself in it? Right? Yeah? Yeah, I mean you
and I both had some some turmoil. I think everybody has had turmoil over
the last couple of years. ButI mean, you know, I mean
I recently went through and I'm stole. In the process of therapy. I
finally found a therapist that works forme, and um, you know,
I was diagnosed and tested for autismand I'm autistic, and it kind of

(35:38):
put everything into perspective because there's somuch of the stuff that I've been doing
all my life with masking and camouflagingto act neurotypical, that I wasn't even
realized, Like I didn't even realizethat I was doing it. I didn't
realize that not every I thought everybodydid this, and so it was very
eye opening to be like, no, not everybody struggles with these things,
Like people that like small talk atpart actually like small talk at parties.

(36:01):
And for me, it's just like, I want to leave immediately. I
understand that. It took me along time. And I'm I, you
know, I am neurotypical as faras I know, but like small talks
hard, dude. Even when youknow the people, you're like, hey,

(36:21):
so I have a drink in myhands, and hugh of them,
you become interesting. Though. IfI have enough of these, you become
interesting to me, and maybe Ibecome interesting to you. So cheers to
keep going. Oh no, Ithink I think most people struggle with small

(36:45):
talk. But yeah, it's that'sgotta be one of those things where you
realize, oh, that's that normal. Yeah. There were a lot of
things that I found that like Iwas doing that. I'm I thought,
you know, everybody had this scriptthese things out and plan these things out
and apparently not. Apparently most peoplecan go to the grocery store without feeling

(37:07):
like claustrophobic and overwhelmed by the lightsand the noise and people being too close
and all that fun stuff. OkNow you know why yea? Or just
accept it because it's just part ofhow your work. That's it. I
mean it, you know, it'sabsolutely is accepted because it makes things.

(37:30):
It takes a lot of pressure off, you know, Like I spend a
lot of time being angry at myselffor being angry in certain situations. And
now that I understand that it's notit's not like I don't want to say
it's not my fault, but it'snot. It's the way my brain works,
you know. So I mean,there's ways to work at and get
better, um, but it's notwhat I was doing. Um. You

(37:52):
know. So it takes the pressureoff to know that things are going to
frustrate me that don't frust frustrate mostpeople. And by taking that pressure off
of like I'm like, Okay,I understand that I'm angry, but I'm
not angry at myself for being angry. So that allows it to kind of
dissipate sooner. Otherwise it's just thisloop. Yeah, it's really hard to

(38:15):
explain, and I probably am makingabsolutely no sense, but this is my
brain. This is my brain onautism. I I do get it.
It's just I mean, like Iusually am one of the I'm a chill
person, high energy, and Ihate losing my temper like it is the

(38:36):
worst thing to me. I getmore angry at being angry than I do
at whatever pissed me off in thefirst place. So I kind of get
it. Yeah. Uh, it'snot a common moop for me, but
it is I understand being like good. Yeah, you know, I used
to say I was fueled by rage, and I don't think that's changed.

(38:59):
I'm just fueled by I'm constantly It'slike, it's like what Banner says in
in in the first Avengers movie,that's the thing. I'm always angry.
So that's for me. I'm alwaysangry. Oh well, I hope you
continue to find ways to find somejoy instead of just oh yeah. We're

(39:22):
gonna go ahead and take a quickbreak here, and when we come back,
we'll share more of our discussion onart and creating things. What for
you means being successful as an artist, Continuing to create things that speak to

(39:45):
yourself is really hard to do.And I think because like my life has
just been pure chaost a minute.Now, you've been on an important journey.
I have been on an important journeyfor those listening, Yes, I

(40:07):
got divorced. I went to NewMexico. I wandered around the desert for
a while. I discovered, youknow what, I think I'm gay,
and then I figured out, yeah, I'm a lot gay. And life's
been interesting. And during all ofthat, I've continued to paint and write

(40:30):
and use art as a way toprocess all of the stuff that's been going
on and the chaos and rediscovering myown identity and all that. It's been
vital, vitals the key word inthis conversation, I think, And despite

(40:51):
everything that's been going on, Ifeel like it would have been easy to
just be like, oh, Ijust I can't even touch a paint brush
right now. I can't even thinkabout trying to work on my stories or
any of it. Like it doesn'tmatter, you know. But I feel
like if people take the pressure offof trying to make art that is quote

(41:14):
good and just make art that speaksto yourself, you'll get a lot further
faster, because it is you're touchingthat thing that is vital, giving voice
to the things that need to bevoiced for your own soul. It's and
you know that sounds so like artiehoity toity, but it's true. Make

(41:35):
but speaks to you, and usuallyit ends up speaking other people too,
because they see themselves in the truthof what you're saying or painting or writing
or singing, etc. Yeah.No, honesty is so important in art,
and being open is so important inart, and being okay with that.
I mean, that's like the That'sone of the things that I think

(41:57):
a lot of new creators struggle withis revealing the ikey parts, the parts
that you don't necessarily feel comfortable witheverybody knowing. And I think that's what
you have to do because people respondto things that are honest and means something.
It's it's it's this constant thing thatI've always wondered, like you know,

(42:20):
like sometimes I'm sure you've had theexperience too, when you're drawing or
painting or you know, creating ina visual medium, Like something that I
do will touch me emotionally, youknow, so like I'll get emotional over
a particular scene or a particular pieceof dialogue or an exchange between a couple
of characters. And that's always thetricky part is like am I am I

(42:45):
emotional because this is good? Oram I emotional because I'm too close to
it and it means something to me? But it doesn't mean something to someone
else. And what I've kind ofconstantly been told by other creatives is,
yeah, if it touches you,it's going to touch somebody else because it's
open and it's honest. Yeah,I've definitely discovered the same thing as the

(43:07):
pieces that I make that are justdent art or just something for me to
just deal with something or celebrate something. Those are the things people are like
that or like I need to buythat, or I just I appreciate this
because or like I mean, youand I have both had this experience where

(43:30):
something we made made an actual,like tangible difference in someone's life, which
is crazy to realize that something youmade made an actual difference to somebody.
Holy cow, it's honestly that keepthat if nothing else other than might just
constant need to make things keeps memaking things is to just know that there's

(43:57):
someone out there who is writing becauseof the Ninth Story podcast. You know,
someone out there is drawing something becauseI shared a tutorial and they're like,
yeah, I can try that oror or the like. There's actually
people I know that have met andgotten married to each other because of a

(44:22):
piece of art that I made thatconnected them somehow. Like that's just mind
blowing that you can make an actlike a genuine difference in someone's life making
something so selfish. Yeah, No, it's it's it's it's that. Yeah,
that's that's the beautiful thing I meanabout collaborations that you know I've worked
on, is you know I seeother side projects develop where people begin to

(44:45):
work together that didn't work together before. And those connections that people make I
think are so important. Um andyes, I mean whenever you get feedback
from from somebody saying that you know, listening to something that you created,
or seeing something that you created,or reading something that you created, you
know helped them whenever they were down, or it got them through a tough

(45:07):
period, or you know, itmade a difference in the way that they
looked at the world. I meanmajor create. I mean like what we
would consider like the the the bigstars of creation, even those folks are
touched by I think it's part ofthe human experience. Like if you know

(45:28):
something that you did actually really trulymeant something to someone, we all want
to hear that, right, becausewe've had that experience ourselves where something we've
read, watched, herd looked atimpacted us and changed our perspective or changed
our day or got us through somethinghard. So that's that's part of the

(45:51):
creation process. That's beautiful is whensomething that you've done impact somebody's life in
a way that you're not expecting ittoo, yeah, or intending it to.
Really I don't think. I don'tthink any of us set out to
be like, well, this storyis going to save somebody's life someday,
and that would be really fucking arrogance, wit And it's like I'm gonna create.

(46:15):
I'm gonna create something that's gonna keepsomeone married, or I'm gonna create
something that's gonna tell someone you knowit's okay to go and seek out other
things. Um, yeah, youdo it for you, And if it
means I think that's the wrong wayto do things like this is gonna be
an important piece of work. Anytimesomeone starts a sentence with this is an

(46:39):
important piece of work, I'm like, no, it's not. That's right.
I will tell you whether it's importantor not. It's so um a
little more esoteric. Do you havelike certain routines that help you create They're

(46:59):
certain times of day or certain thingsthat you do that put you in the
right mindset to create or is itjust kind of sit down and whatever comes
comes. At one point I hadroutines. I'm not a point in my
life where I do not anymore.Lately, it's been wherever I can find

(47:22):
the time to make something, Imake it. So for example, this
past month, I was working onon set as an onset dresser, So
basically, I'm the person in theart department who shows up when they're filming
to move the furniture and stuff aroundso that it looks nice on camera,
which meant when they're filming, Ihad a lot of downtime. And because

(47:46):
I'm a crazy person, I havea full time job along and I was
working on that, and when Iwas done with my tasks for my day
job while on set doing that,on my phone. I was like,
cool, I will work on mybook. And I just brought my little
Bluetooth keyboard and my phone and Iworked on my book in the side because

(48:08):
that's when I had time. ButI do blame that work ethic on a
longstanding pattern, which is where myburnout comes from, because it's not a
healthy pattern. But I always tryto find time in my day to do

(48:28):
things that matter to me along withwhatever I'm working on. So I was
an artist at Mused Paint Bar andI taught classes and I would be so
just pumped from teaching those classes topeople like just regular people kids and like
grandma painting things together. Is likeI loved that job and I was so

(48:51):
just like jazzed up by the timeI get home that I would continue painting
just things for myself and I'm like, yeah, I want to make more
art. Like oh, good,funny how that works, isn't it?
Like the more you give, themore you get back. It's so true,
and like, I don't know,I just did, Like even working
on the film set, I wastrying to find time to work on my

(49:14):
own writing or when I'm doing stufffor my day job. I will in
you know, try to take likemy lunch break to work on some illustration
stuff or things like that. AndI find that making things for other people
usually makes me more motivated to makestuff for myself. If I'm not making

(49:36):
anything at all, it gets reallyeasy to get into a rut. It's
kind of like indercia. Once anobject was in motion, it continues to
be in motion. So I tryto always be that rolling stone, you
know. Yeah, so you can'tjust sit around and watch reruns of the
Office, I mean that doesn't helpyou. Ah No, I've gotten really

(49:58):
bad at just sitting still and watchingthings. Lately it's gotten better, but
I frequently need to be like doingsomething with my hands. So if I'm
watching reruns of the Office, Iam drawing something while I am watching the
reruns. Or there's literally a paintingnext to the TV in my living room

(50:20):
because whenever I just get like anxiousabout things, I'll just like start painting
on it and continue working on it. This painting has been going for like
over a year now because I keepbeing like, let me repaint this and
do that, and it's just likelittle things in between, you know.
You know what's funny that now youmentioned that, like there are how many
movies and TV shows have there beenwhere movies especially where like you watch the

(50:44):
author write a book as a montage, and like their books done in like
thirty minutes or half an hour oryou know, or the montage is like
over the space of a week,they've written an entire novel and dropped it
to the publisher. But every timeyou see, like an artist working on
a painting, it's like months andyears that they're working on this piece of

(51:06):
I get news for your friends.Writing is the same way it takes.
It takes just as long to writea good book. It takes just as
long to write a good story asit does to create anything else. Yeah,
and some things are fast and sometake forever, and it just you
know, you just have to workon it however works. Yeah, I

(51:29):
can't remember who it was that,my friend Cindy, who people who listen
to Victorious Lift will know because Cindyhas been involved in production for a long
time and has done voice over workand all kinds of stuff for the show,
story editing and whatnot. But anyway, we used to go to these
series of lectures here in Pittsburgh whereyou'd have authors that would come in and

(51:51):
talk about their their work, andone of the things that always stuck with
me there was I can't remember whoit was, honestly, but he was
talking about short story and he's like, you know, sometimes he can write
a short story over a weekend,and sometimes it takes him months. And
he said, you know, theones that take months tend to be the
ones that are more interesting because Icome to that story at different times,

(52:13):
you know, so like I'm indifferent moods and I'm almost kind of like
a different person each time I touchedthat story, so different parts of me
make it into that story. Andthat was kind of my experience with the
von Homlin story. I started thatin Germany years ago, and you know,
started working on it and toying withit, and it took quite a

(52:35):
while for me to get to thepoint where it was the story that I
wanted to tell. But yeah,it's it's it's interesting like when you work
on things over a period of time, sometimes you see things that you wouldn't
see if you just sat down anddid it in a rush. Absolutely,
I can think of so many thingswhere I mean I tend to as an

(53:00):
artist, like a visual artist.I crank things out. I do.
I make a lot of stuff,um, but there is definitely a difference
between the things that I just makeand then leave and the things that continue
to be work done over like achunk of time. Um. I definitely

(53:22):
try to give myself a project herethere that is like a labor of love
kind of thing that requires a littlebit more time. I like having something
that's like a pet project on theside. Yea, as I crank through
things like the maniac Um. Well, you know, there's a great example
of that. You you did.You did three paintings in the space of

(53:43):
whatever the length of the time wasfor our live show in Atlanta back in
twenty nineteen. I believe it was. Yeah. Um, Now, of
course you you practice those paintings quitea few times, so you know,
I think that kind of count islike it takes a while to get to
the point where you've done it somany times that it becomes almost like muscle

(54:04):
memory. Exactly what that was.I M it was so good. Someone
stole one of the paintings, stolemy favorite story. Oh, it's such
a good story. I love thatsomewhere there is a stolen painting of mine
on some like now probably graduated collegekids through all like dudes, I stole
that from a live show, LikeI'm sure he tells the story so much

(54:30):
more ethically than the reality was,which was he was probably drunk and was
like, oh my god, Ineed that painting, and then he went
up on stage, looked me inthe eyes, said sorry, and then
ran off like a Scooby Doo villain. That's funny. Oh it was good.

(54:51):
It was tremendous. But yeah,those paintings, Um, that was
muscle memory because I used to,like in high school, I would perform
a lot in theater and just inthe school theater and inquire actually as a
performer in a lot of ways.But I practice those paintings the same way

(55:12):
I would rehearse a play. Ifigured out how I wanted to paint it,
so I did an original, likemaster version of it, and then
I just practiced over and over andover again until I got the timing down
to match with the story itself.So there were certain points of each painting
that needed to show up at certainpoints of the story. So that like

(55:34):
with the I'm not going to rememberthe title of the story, but I
remember the title of the painting,which was The Lovers the face of the
Spirit. Evil spirit shows up whenthings start to get really dark, and
you know there's certain like movements thatget more frantic as the story, like
peaks. You know, all ofthat was rehearsed, so I painted each

(55:57):
of those paintings probably at least tentimes each, just to make sure i'd
have the timing and the story downso that it would be a performance.
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, soyou're you're talking about Christopher Long's story,
which I believe. And the finaltitle ended up being Freebees, which is

(56:19):
kind of funny because the painting wasa freebee for some it wash destinies,
very funny. Yeah, that wasthe That was the story about them,
the folks that got the tickets,the free tickets to go see a show,
and as they were watching the show, they were getting possessed and evil

(56:42):
things were happening. Yeah, isn'tthat crazy? Yes, that that painting,
It was The Magician. The Magicianwas the title of the painting.
Yeah, not the Lovers. TheLovers was the other one. Yeah,
because we did the dispart that gotstolen. Yeah, The Lovers, I
think was the one we did thatwas KB Goddard's story that was on Holy

(57:02):
Wedlock. That was it? Andthat was Was that the one that got
stolen or was it? I thoughtit was It was the first one,
right, Yeah, the magician theymagically stole the Freebees painting. That's that's
awesome. I don't know if Idon't know if I ever told Chris Long
that the uh well actually he knowsbecause he wrote the story that the title
of the story was Freebees. ButI don't think we ever talked about that.

(57:24):
Like, I know we talked recentlyabout he thought it was crazy that
a paint, you know, astory that he made or a story that
he wrote, was the painting thatgot stolen. But yeah, um,
of course he would know the nameis Freebes. He's the author. Stupid.
But did he make that connection.Probably he's a smart guy. He's

(57:45):
a smart dude. Yeah, I'msure he did. True, he saw
the irony. It's probably the firstthing he thought. He's like, well,
the title of the stories freebees.So I mean obviously maybe there maybe
maybe that's what inspired the person.Maybe they were reading the program and they're
like, well Freebees, all right, I'll go and take that painting.

(58:06):
That's crazy. I love it.That was wild. So let's let's um,
since we're since this is part ofthe Victoria's Left behind the Scenes inside
the Music Box series, UM,let's talk maybe a little bit about some
of the art that you've done forVictoria and for Victoria's Lift. Do you

(58:30):
have any that stick out to youas particular favorites that you remember doing?
Oh well, the first one,which one of your kids is your favorite?
Oh now, now keep in mind, I didn't say any particular ones
that stand out to you as favoriterits, not which one is your favorite,
but just like maybe like the noteven necessarily the final painting or the

(58:52):
story involved, but just like theexperience of creating one or one that when
you finished with its um or morethan one when you finished kind of spoke
to you and you're like, oh, you know that, that's that was
fun, that was good. Orso the one that jumps to mind is
not the one I'm the most proudof because it's the oldest. Okay,

(59:15):
so it's actually the like the fanart when I made of Victoria when you
and I first started talking on Twitter, and I was like, oh my
god, the creative this podcast,I listened to likes my art, and
I had like a hell of fangirl momentum. And then and then I
just made fan art of Victoria andsent it to you and you loved it,

(59:37):
and like I look back at thatpiece and I'm just like, oh,
I have grown so much as anartist, is how I should phrase
that, because every piece of artis valid and regardless of your journey.
Um, but I'm still I don'tknow. There was just like I put
so much effort into that one pieceof art, and like making the cool
lighting and like trying to draw Storia, and she, by the way,

(01:00:01):
I have drawn her so many timesand every day time she gives me a
hard time with it. Yeah,I don't know what it is about Victoria.
She's a sassy girl whenever I tryto draw her. You know,
It's it's funny because everybody, everybodythat writes her, not I wouldn't say
everybody, but most of the authorsthat have written her have had shared stories

(01:00:22):
with me about like weird things thathave happened or strange things that have happened
during the writing of the story.Or you know, Motiko, who's done
a lot of art for Victoria aswell, Steve Motico Um always had stories
about like hearing voices in the otherroom and you know, hearing a giggle
or something like that while he wasworking on stuff, and I'm like,

(01:00:42):
dude, you're probably exhausted, andhe's like, no, no, seriously,
she was in the other room.I swear to God, if he's
busy, she definitely makes herself known. She does. So what we'll do
is we'll make it. We'll makethat picture the cover art for this episode
so people can can see it's um. It's also the cover art for the

(01:01:05):
homage, which is a story thatMark Nixon wrote way back whenever I was
before Victoria's Lift was Victoria's Left BeforeVictoria's Lift was the Lift. It was
basically like a proof of concept typeof episode. We did two pilots,
one that I wrote that was morelike stuff that's going on in the building
and you know who Victoria is,and then we also did am So we

(01:01:28):
call those the core stories, andthen we also do the visitors stories,
which is like what Mark wrote thehomage where an author meets Victoria and kind
of steals some of his work fromsomebody else and and calls it an homage,
which Victoria tells him isn't quite thecase. But anyway, if you

(01:01:49):
go to Victoria's lift dot com andyou go to the pilots um which it's
under seasons, you go to pilotepisodes, you can see the full artwork.
But well, we'll go ahead andreuse that as the cover for this
episode as well, so people cancan see that. Um. I've definitely
grown as an artist. I'm moreproud of like the later art as far

(01:02:09):
as like skill and everything, butthat one still has a soft part and
a soft spot in my heart becauseit was just the start. You know,
well me too. I mean,it was the first time anybody had
ever done fan art of something thatI created, and especially something that was
important as important to me as Victoria. Um, I I got I cried

(01:02:30):
when I when I when I gotthe picture. I'm like that just it
touched me deeply that someone cared enoughabout something that I made or created to
spend the time to actually make herin visual form because I'm not an artist
and I kind of know what shelooked like, and um, but I

(01:02:51):
could never I could never do anythinglike that. So and it goes out
into the ether and it speaks tosomebody and then art continues to be made.
This is correct. Um, yeah, I mean art's beens always been
such a big part of the show. I mean for me especially, it's

(01:03:12):
just because everything kind of exists aseither audio or written form. To actually
see her and see the visitors orsee the cover art for each of the
seasons has always been so important tome. Um. Like the first season
we did, we had a tonof cover arts, right, we did

(01:03:34):
covers for pretty much everything, andand I think we continued that up through
season three maybe, um, andthen we started going to the single single
image per season, which I kindof like, you know, the we
still get a fresh image every season, and it kind of gives everything a

(01:03:54):
consistent feel, with the exception ofwhat season or you did, like two,
you did two versions of stuff,and you're like, well, we
can go one of these two ways. And I like them both so much.
I was like, just do themboth. I'll pay you for both,
and we'll alternate them between the two. I like that. Actually,

(01:04:15):
it was kind of cool to see, like, yeah, throughout the season.
I will tell you one of myfavorites remains the one you did for
the Lost Library, which is theone where it's a KB Goddard story about
a woman who is struggling with whetheror not she pursues her career, whether
she wants to be a writer orif she wants to follow I think we're

(01:04:39):
I think the story is set inthe Edwardian era, so it's right after
Victorian era and women were still supposedto get married and that was their job,
right, And Victoria kind of showsher through this the lost library,
her library and shows her you know, he there's all the books that that

(01:05:00):
you could have written that didn't getwritten, and it has for a long
time. I think about it alot, actually, all the books that
could have been written, right,you know, the stuff from from other
realms or you know, because peoplemade a different choice, they didn't get
written. Um. But the justthe image of the library and the lights

(01:05:26):
above the table, and you know, just little tiny Victoria holding this woman's
hand as she's leading her through thismassive library. Um, there's just something
about that image that always spoke tome. It's like, I think it's
because she's so small and petite andshe's just a little girl or so she
looks like, but she's actually justthis very powerful being entity whatever you want

(01:05:54):
to call her. Yeah, Ithat one definitely a favorite, that one.
It was fun to play with thecolor a lot and play with the
grandeur of the library versus that thattiny thus the almost almost insignificant humans walking

(01:06:18):
through it. And yet that's theheart feed of it, you know.
Yeah, Yeah, it's it's alwaysit's always fun to see different interpretations of
m Victoria. And you know rightnow, I mean you're you're you consistently
have done more art for Victoria's Liftthan anybody else, And obviously you know,

(01:06:39):
you're the creative director, So Imean the look and feel of the
website ultimately and everything else um istied to your vision. Yeah, which
I actually made an entire Pinterest boardjust for his Yeah, because I was
like, what is Victoria's Lift?And I spent days just adding stuff to

(01:07:03):
it, going deep into dark academiaPinterest boards and uh comics and and just
like different images with lighting that speaksto me about what I think would would
it would feel like inside the lift. UM. That just yeah, it's
it's quite the rabbit hole I wentdown. That's awesome. Well, I'm

(01:07:29):
curious about one other thing. Whenwe're talking while we're talking about your art.
There is one that um um,Abigail Larson did um. She she
did all the line art, andjust because she's tremendously busy, and anybody
who doesn't know who abigil Larson isor what her art is, you need
to go out and find her stuff, yes, and treat yourself to some

(01:07:50):
amazing artwork. Instagram is so good, right, so inspiring, so good.
But I was y enough to haveher say yes to do artwork for
me in season one, and Imean there was no budget for the show.
She was just kind enough to say, yeah, I'll do this one

(01:08:12):
for you. And it was forBroken, which is where Nicola Tesla is
repairing Victoria's music box. And becauseshe was so busy, she's just like,
I'm not going to have time tocolor this in time for the airing
of your episode. Is there somebodyelse that can color it? So I
sent it to you and you werelike, absolutely, I'd love to color

(01:08:32):
it. And I've always been curious, like, what is it like coloring
somebody else's line work. It's alittle intimidating, but it's also very fun
because I always enjoy the collaborative aspectof it. It's like, oh,

(01:08:54):
what do you think they would puthere? And but what do you think
the right colors would be for yourown style? And how do you blend
the two together? Like I wasnot I was not trying to copy Abigail's
uh, her way of working withcolors, because there's I just I'm not

(01:09:15):
that that quite that it's different.One is not better than the other.
It's just different approaches. Yeah,it's true. Um, I very much
admire the way she colors things.It's just so beautiful. But I definitely
have a different way of painting inphotoshop. Um, So it was a
little intimating because she's definitely an artist. I look up too, and I'm

(01:09:39):
like, oh my god, Igets a color your work, you know,
mild fangirl faint and you know,start working on it. But it
is very fun to kind of it'sa little bit like a coloring book,
but it's like different. I'm notdescribing this well, No, I think

(01:09:59):
you're going fine. I mean,like I'll tell you. I hesitated at
first because I'm like, is itgoing to be insulting if I asked somebody
else to color somebody else's work?And then I found out later that that's
like most of the time, that'show comics are done, and you know
that it's it's like a thing thatsomeone is a colorist and someone is a
line artist. Then I felt betterafter figuring that out. But I was
like, I don't I don't know. I mean, like, is it

(01:10:23):
insulting if I'm like, well,somebody else has done the line work,
can you just put color in it? But I mean, I guess it's
a totally different thing. I meanbecause I know when I looked at the
line art and I was so impressedwith it, I was like, well,
maybe I can just like throw agreen filter or something over top of
this, and and then whenever Iwas like, no, I'm gonna ask
Junette if she can do it,and you did the art and it's it

(01:10:45):
was a totally different image after allthe color was added. I mean,
I guess I shouldn't be shocked,but I was. I was like,
oh my god, this feels totallydifferent now. It was so much better.
Well, color is part of thestory. It's so true. And
I think one of the nice thingsas an artist kind of coloring someone else's

(01:11:11):
line work is you get that opportunityto very deeply study what the other artists
made. I've done it a coupleof times already, where I'll just color
in something that someone else has done. I've done a couple of videos on
my YouTube channel, which eventually Ido plan to post on again where but

(01:11:34):
there is one I did with ina collaboration with Josh b. And then
there's a Crampus collaboration I did wheresomeone sent me their line art and I
colored it or vice versa. Andit is It's fun because you get to
really just live inside of someone else'sart for however long you're coloring. It's

(01:11:55):
the same thing as a coloring book. It's just like, you know,
next level. I guess, right, No, Yeah, I totally get
it's I mean, you know,after after you did it and after we
talked, I mean, I wasglad that you had so much fun with
it. Um, But it's it'sI guess, it's a totally different experience
than doing everything yourself. Right,And we'll talk about one more one more

(01:12:19):
piece that this is one that kindof spoke to me. Have you,
um, have you heard the newproduction that we did for Pride month of
Why I Take the Lift by MarkNixon yeah, yeah. Um, so
the first the first go around.Um, I mean it was season one
of the show, and you know, there was no budget and I didn't
know any voice actors, and youknow, I was just getting started with

(01:12:42):
everything. So you know, Markwrote a beautiful story and I performed it.
Um, and did you know thenarration and everything, so performed it,
I guess is correct. Um.But you know, like years later,
that was one that always stuck withme as being kind of a very
special story and the artwork that youdid for it was very special as well.

(01:13:02):
And um, in fact, werecreated it in New York. You
and I. Um, there's justlike so much that's said in that image,
and it's there's not a high levelof detail to it. And I'll
let you speak to that part,but it's almost enhanced by the lack of
detail rather than suffering from lack ofdetail, Like there's I don't I don't

(01:13:27):
know how to explain it, butthere's like more to it, yes,
and just like the simple there's asimple action of her putting her hand on
his shoulder and um, you knowhim being very upset. You can tell
he's very upset, and she's justkind of resting her hand on it.
There's just there's so much in thatsimple gesture, in the way that it's

(01:13:48):
captured in the image. But thatstory always kind of spoke to me,
and I felt it was an importantstory. Um. And you know,
for Pride Month this year year,I took that story with Mark's permission,
and I cast David Alts as theas the performer. You know, we've
changed a couple of lines within thestory, but mostly left at the same.

(01:14:13):
Mark was concerned because he's like,you know, I've evolved. It's
like you were saying about you knowart. You know, I've evolved as
an author, and you know,I think I'm better than than that story
now. And but to me,it was it's like that story spoke to
the potential of what Mark was ableto do. It's just it's a I
think contrary to my my my statementearlier, that this is actually an important

(01:14:39):
story. And to me it alwaysfelt like it needed more than I was
able to give it at the time. So, you know, got David,
hired him to do the story,had Nico do a whole new score
for it. Um. We leftthe art pretty much the same. UM.
I think I just added a filterover top with the the rainbow colors,
because I didn't want to change theartwork itself, but you know,

(01:15:01):
I felt that that addition kind ofelevated it a little bit. But yeah,
so all that set up for basicallyme to ask you, like,
what what did that piece mean toyou? And you know, what was
the experience of creating it and whatwas the thinking of going to something more
stark than detailed, because a lotof the others, I mean, everything

(01:15:24):
else that you've ever done is verydetailed, and that one kind of stands
out as being more stark. Butfor me, it really works that way.
I think that one was heavily influencedby the story itself. Yeah,
I just remember this, like readingthat story and feeling that kind of sense

(01:15:47):
of emptiness and isolation, and thatwas really important to me when I was
drawing that piece, and that's whyit ended up so stark. It was
like what are It was almost likethis moment caught in like this misty haze,

(01:16:08):
like there was no reality except forthe pain at the center for that
character, which is why the artworkI attempted to do that same thing with
the art itself. It was almostlike you were seeing it through this thick
smoke or a thick fog, andit was just that moment of Hey,

(01:16:28):
you're not alone. That's what mattered. So it didn't need other details,
it didn't need the rest kind offilling it in because the focus was that
moment was the hand on the shoulder. It's okay, you're not in this
alone, you know. Yeah,her her appearing to him at just the
time whenever he needed somebody to kindof provide that comfort in that guidance.

(01:16:54):
That's awesome. I hope I explainedthat. Oh no, I do.
I think you did. Um,I do want to give you some time
to talk about your your movie projectand anything that you want to promote,
So go for it. Promoting wise, I don't know if I can talk
about the one I just worked on, but the one I'm about to work

(01:17:15):
on is called the Callback, andwe had a successful Steeden Spark campaign and
super excited because I started building theset with my girlfriend Alex the other weekend
and now we're this upcoming weekend gonnafinish building it and it's gonna be It's
it's just been a delight working withthis group of people and like getting I

(01:17:39):
mean getting the dirt under my fingernailsagain. It's it's refreshing, building in
three dimensions again and taking taking theskills that I've really been building as an
artist, an illustrator, back intoset design and feeling like I am a
completely different artist coming out of Idon't know the space of time that I've

(01:18:02):
been locked in a room thinking aboutmy life. I life is. You're
coming out of your cocoon. Youhad to go into a cocoon for to
make the changes. Ye, nowyou're a new butterfly. Oh, it
is so mild, mild detour.It's funny you bring up cocoons because I

(01:18:24):
have been seen lunar moths, likein in things all over the place,
like on tattooed on people, andlike symbolized and art and things like that.
I'm like, why am I sodrawn to the symbol right now?
And I looked it up and it'sactually a symbol of like new life and
rejuvenation and moving on to a newphase, of a metamorphosis kind of thing,

(01:18:46):
which is common in butterflies and stuff, but lunar moths in particular are
tied to the moon, and likeI'm a cancer and I'm a moon like
a water, So I don't knowthere's a whole lot going on anyway right
now, but I'm just like,yeah, it is a moment of like
RELI just opening my wings and feelinglike I am this new version of myself

(01:19:08):
and it's exciting. It's exciting tobe to feel like I've I've got the
mental space to write and to paintthe things that I want while actively starting
to pursue film again. And youknow, it's gonna be a little bit
while I rebalance, like how howam I keeping up with my online content
and like writing? And maybe I'llactually share my writing beyond my blog soon,

(01:19:31):
We'll see. But it's it's justI feel like there's I'm just at
this point of opportunity. Life islight and bright and beautiful, and I'm
excited about what's next. And Iguess the most recent next thing is going
to be the Callback film, doingthe set design and special effects for them,

(01:19:55):
and then I can't say what iscoming after that because it's not officially,
but it is very exciting. Yeah, and there I know, but
I'm not going to say, andmore art to come, and you know,
my little chaotic journey just continues onwards. That's tremendous. Where's the best

(01:20:18):
place for people to find that internetinteract with Janette? Ah, So the
places I am the most active rightnow are Instagram at Janette Andromeda or Twitter
at Janette and drama. Uh it'sit's Andromeda without the death because I wasn't
allowed enough symbols Twitter. That's awesome. If you get most of the way

(01:20:43):
through the name, you'll find itanyway, that's right, it'll come up.
Yeah, well thanks, Jeanette's.It's always a pleasure to speak with
you. I mean, we talkedjust the other day friendly wise, and
it's always a pleasure to talk toyou. I'm sure that it comes to
ruined the interview that your friend anda dear one at that, And it

(01:21:04):
always makes me feel better after Italk to you. I'm always happier after
I talk to you. You area ray of sunshine always in every way.
So yeah, that's it, We'redone. Yeah, it's everybody listening.
Thank you, and go make someart.