15 YRS AGO LIVECASTS: Keller & Powell & Mitchell talk Nexus angle, Raw GM, Summerslam, would Jericho work as face, Goldberg's WWE push, more

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
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Speaker 2 (01:05):
Now, PW Torch and Spreaker bring you the Wade Keller
Pro Wrestling Podcast.

Speaker 1 (01:15):
Today on the Way Keller Pro Wrestling Podcast, we're jumping
back fifteen years to another doubleheader of PW Torch Live casts,
and first up is the August second, twenty ten episode,
where James Caldwell hosted with Bruce Mitchell to discuss with
live callers that night's raw thoughts on the Nexus storyline
and how it could play out, where Triple H fit
into the picture, potential baby face turns from Chris Jericho

(01:37):
in Edge and when those might occur, whether Jericho would
renew his WWE contract, the role of WWE agents, notable
agents in WWE T and ampact ratings, some alarming demographic
numbers from early twenty ten to current Impact ratings, and more. Then,
in the August third episode, I was back hosting with
Jason Powell for what would eventually be the flag Shit

(02:00):
episode of our live cast, and we talked about the
pay per views coming up in August that month, SummerSlam
and Hardcore Justice. We also took calls throughout the show
and a variety of topics ranging from Chris Jericho's finisher
changing to Rock Missing being missing from the movie plug
the previous night, Percy Watson's gimmick remember Him Never Heard
of Him? Interesting Story, Goldberg's push, Eric Bischoff, Miz and Moore,

(02:22):
and then in the previously VP exclusive after show. We
talked about the Sean Davis upstart group that was making
ways about going national and signing big names Miz versus
Randy Orton on Raw, Brett Farv in an NFC preview,
and more. So, let's get to it again. These originally
live streamed fifteen years ago on August second and August third,
twenty ten, and they are today's Wade Keller Pro Wrestling

(02:43):
Podcast fifteen years ago flashback for Saturday, August ninth, twenty
twenty five.

Speaker 2 (02:51):
You are listening to the PW tors live cast. This
is pter b toorch Assistant editor James Caldwell hosting today
on Monday, August the second, and I'm joined by towards Calm.
It's Bruce Mitchell Brince. Are you going today?

Speaker 3 (03:05):
Doing well? You know, James, I been. You know, last
week I worked on one half of a column and
this week I did it even longer second part. Pretty
much spent all night doing it, and I haven't been able.
I had a chance to mention this, but it's dedicated
to you. It really is dedicated to James Cobwell. Yeah,
because I used to want to strangle you when you
would ask me, well, how would you fit here? We

(03:26):
got thirty seconds left to the show. How would you
fix TNA? This is how this is how I would
restart and set up a foundation for TNA to survive
and thrive and grow.

Speaker 2 (03:39):
So yeah, the TNA Manifesto, right.

Speaker 3 (03:43):
The TNA Manifesto I just finished Part two is part
two is longer than and better than part one. Well
it's longer, so we'll see about better. But it's dedicated
to you, James, because you every chance, because every time
you would you have something in your mind, you just
forget and go, well, Bruce, how would you think? What
would you do to fix t and A? And I'd
be like, I'm gonna kill him.

Speaker 2 (04:03):
I had to threaten you.

Speaker 3 (04:04):
I had to threaten your life two or three times
because you'd stopped doing that.

Speaker 2 (04:06):
But the answer, I planted that seed probably five years ago,
and it's finally blossomed into a nice two part column.

Speaker 3 (04:16):
You know. It's more like when you get that little
piece of dirt and your shoe and it turns into
a blister. But yeah, I see the metaphor.

Speaker 2 (04:24):
Uh, that's for people who aren't towards VIP members. That's
I would still in for a Wade teller in the
weekly Bruce Mitchell audio show from time to time. A
couple of years ago, I filled in earlier this year
once or twice, and inevitably we would get into a
TNA discussion and we would, uh, it would always seem

(04:45):
to be right after a bad episode of Impact, and
so that that was always seeming the timing, and so
it would always break down into well, bergus, I mean,
we throw our hands in the air, so what do
you do to fix TNA? And it's you know, bergus.
You just would get so frustrated. I mean, how much
time do we have?

Speaker 3 (05:01):
But we've got in a half left of the show. First,
how did you fixed to you tonight? Thanks A lot
times I think I think I.

Speaker 2 (05:08):
Slipped it in a roundtable after a pay per view
once too.

Speaker 3 (05:11):
Yeah. Usually always usually be like, let's cool if a
thirty minutes something I want to go to bed at
that was that was also there.

Speaker 2 (05:19):
Yeah, it was just inevitable that that's where I would
take it. But so either it's a a seeds being
planted or some dirt in the shoe, So one way
or the other. We got the column from Bruce George
vat Members is gonna reap part one of that the
TNA manifesto and last week's Torch newsletter, and in this
week's newsletter, which should be out for VFP members probably

(05:41):
Tuesday or Wednesday, you can reapart two of Bruce's column.
So good stuff there, Bruce. I'm glad I contributed.

Speaker 3 (05:48):
There, so well appreciate it.

Speaker 4 (05:50):
Sort uh.

Speaker 2 (05:52):
Of course, we're talking w b RAW later tonight. That's
gonna be a Takes show tonight, so we're gonna try
to boy discussing spoilers on the show today. A lot
of people calling in are probably listening not wanting to
have it spoiler for them right before Raw, so we're
gonna try to keep it general, even though a lot
of us kind of already know what happens on tonight's show.

(06:15):
But if you have a specific spoiler related question for
tonight for the Live cat today, go ahead and give
us a warning before just jumping right into it. Otherwise
we'll keep it kind of general. On Raw talking about SummerSlam,
what happened last week was likely to happen, which we
already note to happen on tonight show. Of course, KNA
as well a lot of talk with their ratings picture.

(06:36):
We have a big ratings report on Friday as well
as today on pter b Torch dot com Brits. What's
your impression of TNA's ratings on last Thursday? They did
at one point two two, ratiing their hyast in Sebruary.
We got a lot of demographic information from from this show,
and it painted the picture of a younger crown, not

(06:57):
an older crowd, not your ECW type crown watching that
shows a trending toward a younger crowd. What's your overall
pressure are those two sort of headlines come out of it,
being the sort of the pop in the rating and
the demographics.

Speaker 3 (07:12):
What the good news is it's better than the whatever
it was from one point one they drew last week.
The bad news is it saw you know that that
the slightly larger audience watched uh Tommy Dreamer have a
match with with Abyss in a hardcore style and I
can't imagine that. I mean, one of the one of
the things I thought was key to this con was
to talk in sentimental ways about all this and talk

(07:35):
about it but not show the action, because the fact
of the matter is Tommy Dreamer may be the worst
mane event wrestler in the business now, and you know,
and that stuff is just crap. I mean it's you
see that. You know, you're Leslie's fan in there's been
a rustling fay last few years of seeing that stuff
and went out of style, and so you want people

(07:56):
anticipating to be the sentimental by it. The other thing is,
whenever these ratings go from a one point one to
a one point zero to a one point two, that's
not that big a statistical jump, and it's not growing
and that and that stuff, particularly with the talent that
they have, it's still the same place. The talent that
they have on hand, they should be getting a lot

(08:18):
better rating than that. I mean, they really should be.
So it's a little bit of good news, but it's
it's no kind of trend yet, it's nothing. They have
never grown out of that one point two. I mean,
they had that one point four, which turned out to
be again an anomaly. They had, you know, the one
point five that one night they went out of the
curiosity rating. That one night that Hulk Cogin came back

(08:39):
for Monday nights, and you know, people sampled and they
went back to having the exact same thing they always had.
So that's how I take it. And it's not it's
not good news, it's not bad news. And the fact
that it's not it's not a real change. This company
is on borrowing time. The clock is ticking and I
just you know, and they it made me instead of

(09:01):
say this good news is a little bit less bad news.
If they double their if they double their byery with
this ECW pay per view, this nostalgic pay per view,
they still are running well below you know, well beloved,
breaking even on pay per views well beloved, So you know,
an embarrassing They're still doing embarrassing numbers, just not a

(09:21):
ambassing and who knows it may or may not do that.
So that's you know, I think, like I said, it's
better than it's better than following, but it ain't. But
it is anything great.

Speaker 2 (09:32):
And I'll throw this this information out there. And if
you look at where they are now compared to where
they were just in the d of the year, I mean,
like you said, is it's not I mean at one
point two would have been an okay number two years
ago when they were doing about a one point two
and trying to show the signs of growth. They're they're
back at where they were two years ago. Let me
throw this other information out there. On before they went

(09:55):
to Monday nights, at the beginning of the year, they
were averaging a one point zero among many eighteen to
forty nine. And that you know, that's Spikes, that's their demo.
Is that male audience. And they're doing a one point
oh one on Thursdays before before going to Mondays. Since
coming back from Mondays, they're doing a zero point seventy four.

(10:15):
That's a point two five drop. That's a quarter, about
a one fourth drop from what they were doing at
the beginning of the year on Thursdays. And you say,
barl time bers and that's that's a picture that Spike's
looking at, is that male demo. And when they're doing
a quarter of what I mean a quarter dropped from
what they were doing just at the beginning of this

(10:35):
year on Thursday nights, that's you know, that's not a
good picture if you if you're Spike and you're seeing,
do we want to keep this programming on our schedule?

Speaker 3 (10:43):
Yeah, exactly, No, that's true. I mean, that's I mean,
I don't know, I mean, there's you know, there's pressure
to get that to get that rating better. I mean
they're just out there, so you know, so that's that's
the truth. I mean, it's gonna take. It takes a lot,
and so I.

Speaker 1 (11:03):
Mean it's it.

Speaker 3 (11:04):
And then it's because they have just torn out the
foundation of any of their storytelling and they have disappointed
people for so long and running back to this, you know,
running back to a promotion that had a big influence
and really did. It had a big influence in the
in the mid nineties, but it ran out of that influence,
that influence that way the crested it went away, and

(11:26):
like I said, it's an illusion. You really don't want
to show. You really don't want to spend your time
showing showing fans what the action is going to look
like in twenty and.

Speaker 2 (11:35):
Ten, the way they did with that defining of the Right,
and you talked about that in the last cast the
lasting or the week before that. You know, that's that
you're you're trying to sell the idea, not the actual action,
and when you give away the action, it ruins the idea.

Speaker 1 (11:49):
You know.

Speaker 2 (11:50):
So it's amazing they booked that, but it's not surprising
because that's DNA's pattern is a giveaway matches on freeing
TV and not hype it, and it just fill waters
down that product. So we're gonna go ahead and get
with the phone number if you want to jump on
the live cast phone line. They are packed right now,
so I would recommend getting on right now if you

(12:11):
want to join the live cast today. The number to
call is six four six seven two one nine eight
two eight. We'll probably just take straight phone calls for
the next fifteen minutes with so many people on hold today,
so we'll try to limit it to about one question
and one follow up. So we're gonna go and get
the callers in and out to get as many people
on the show today. Let's go ahead and go to

(12:31):
our first caller today. It's from the sixt' five to
one area code sixty five one. Welcome to the show.
Please stay tournay where you're from.

Speaker 5 (12:39):
Thanks for taking my call. James to Mike from what Berry, Minnesota?

Speaker 6 (12:43):
How we doing today?

Speaker 2 (12:44):
And Mike, what do you have for us today?

Speaker 7 (12:47):
Nothing?

Speaker 5 (12:47):
Just wanted if say, Brucey doing a great job. You're
really in the zone right now between your black Lesnar
articles and your manifesto looking forward to reading part too
soon and hope you revisit the grading of the young
W you talent you kind of started at about six
weeks ago, and I think there's no more guys can
be grading out, but hey, Black Lesnari and ECW came along,

(13:09):
so it's more important. But my question tonight is I
haven't read the spoilers, but okay, how would how would
you uh continue pushing the dissension on Team Sena?

Speaker 2 (13:25):
First would how would you keep that storyline going from
last week's show?

Speaker 3 (13:29):
Well, I mean I think that I think they they
put the roots of it in pretty well. I mean,
you've got you know, you've got trouble between Ed and Jericho,
You've got trouble with Jericho and the rest of the crowd.
You've got got trouble with Sena's the point, you know
more soon in Our Truth. They let the groundwork for that,
so really just kind of putting fingers in that and
how the But the thing about it is, I think

(13:50):
John Cena needs to lead that team so that they're
together right before SummerSlam. In other words, they've gotted together.
Whatever it is that puts a lot of heat on
next to something that nexus does makes them kind of
drop some of this stuff because I don't think you
really want the good guy team, the team that you're

(14:10):
rooting for, looking like it's falling apart. I don't think
dismissed of that. I think it's like, you know, they
rally around the flag and then you pay to see
them kitt next with ass And of course I think
there's the thing with Summers plays. I think particularly the
first match for this Nexus group is Nexus has to
go over. But really you want, you know, you want
to see this team rallying together at at the end.

(14:32):
So I mean the soap opera will be there, but
also the the the feeling among fans that they'll get this,
they'll get this, they might get some payback that might
get some satisfaction by rooting for Team w a Team
Tree and us. So that that's what I say in
a general se So there's a lot of different little
ways to go because you've got you've got guys in
the Team Seena that can talk and can communicate and

(14:55):
know their characters real well and can play back and
forth off the show. I think Jeriko is really good
and I think that'll continue.

Speaker 1 (15:04):
You can support us on Patreon and get these shows
with ads and plugs, remove the weight Keller Prosing podcast,
Weight Keller Prosing post shows and the PW Torch daily
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(15:27):
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upgrade to other tiers and receive even more benefits through Patreon.

Speaker 2 (15:35):
Mike the question or follow up, Nope, thanks a lot,
all right, we appreciate the call. A good question there
on RAW and that that's gonna be an essential theme
of tonight's show is that they have the Tonight's show
and they have one more week of build up the
Summer Slams. So it's gonna be interesting to see how
that picture comes together, and we'll see a lot of that,
a lot of that Jericho and Sina interplay on Tonight's show, which,

(15:57):
like you said, Bruce, I think that was I think
Jericho is strong in the mic last week. Uh, And
I assume we're gonna get more of that on this
week's show with the promo or backstage segments or some
sort of video package. So let's go and grab another
phone call. Let's go to the four O two area code.
Four oh two. Welcome to the show. Please stach you
name where you're from?

Speaker 8 (16:18):
Hey, Jamaican versus the Real from Lincoln play real.

Speaker 2 (16:21):
It's been a weekend, so I lost her number in
my memory, But go ahead, what do you have for
a day?

Speaker 8 (16:28):
Well, James, First of all, is there any truth to
the rumor that you will be faith in Randy Ordan
or WrestleMania.

Speaker 3 (16:34):
No, there's no truth of that.

Speaker 2 (16:37):
Okay, No, I moved on from his little Twitter post.

Speaker 9 (16:40):
No, okay, I'm figured out.

Speaker 7 (16:44):
Check.

Speaker 2 (16:45):
Actually, my real question is, uh, you know, watching.

Speaker 8 (16:49):
Impact this past Thursday, there's a lot of involvement and
has been the last couple of weeks with the agents,
you know, with Al Stall and Pat Kenney and all
of them. My question is is it really a good
thing that they're bringing these guys on the area as
much as they are, with as little time they have
and as much wrestler as they really should be showing

(17:09):
airtime to. I Mean, it's like, really.

Speaker 1 (17:12):
What is the role of an agent.

Speaker 8 (17:13):
I mean, what is their job in the first place.

Speaker 2 (17:15):
Yeah, we just go ahead with that.

Speaker 3 (17:18):
Well, the role of you know, the role of the
agent is to coach, the coach the young wrestlers and
help them break down their matches, to get the strong
points the storylines over, to watch them and to critique
what they're doing and provide feedback to the office that
that's what they're there for. And also there to you know,
set a professional tone and to report any problems, to

(17:42):
manage that these guys have. You know, it's just a
matter of I don't know, it's it's a matter of
the storytelling philosophy. You think that everybody involved in wrestling
should be you know, on camera and has a unique
story to tell, and that that draws money, which is.

Speaker 10 (17:59):
What t and A.

Speaker 3 (18:00):
It's which as risso thinks because because since you can't
believe any of the matches, you know, he even suspendious
believe for any of the matches. Ever, then it's gotta
be the it's got to be the storyline. The soap
opera behind the scenes is fascinating. Then you give all
those guys things to do and and keep the comminess.

Speaker 11 (18:20):
And if it's just you.

Speaker 3 (18:22):
Use them every once in a while as your legends
to get beat up because they're there anyway, and they
can they can take them up, and they can leave
things around like those guys did in Nexus. Then you
know that's w b's philosophy. They don't they don't go
out of their way to look for that. But then
but then if they can get guys on TV, they
like getting on TV. It's good for their morale, good
for those those agents morale. And then you know the

(18:43):
place that you really see it is on these DVDs,
on these legacy DVDs, because if they have a choice
between a segment without an agent in it, because when
you look at the agency that w W has, they've
been part of the last twenty years of wrestling history.
Or you know, a guy can get a little pay
in a little ego boost, they will put the clips
in of the Richey Steamboat thing is the Ricky Steamboat

(19:07):
DVD is full of you know, arn Anderson. There's even
one word's just clear. There's not any more reason to
have this scept for Teddy Longs in the club. So
that's you know, that's kind of how how much stuff works.

Speaker 2 (19:21):
Real did genm of the question follow Nope, that's it.
Thanks guys, all right, I appreciate that.

Speaker 3 (19:27):
Called real.

Speaker 2 (19:29):
Let's go ahead and grab another phone call. Let's go
to the nine to one oh area code nine to
one oh. Welcome to the show. Please say your game
where you're from.

Speaker 3 (19:37):
Here's a Hannibal fiv an oj line.

Speaker 2 (19:39):
Hey, Annimal, what do you have for us today? Okay?

Speaker 6 (19:42):
Yes, okay, I was thinking of this right here, and
I kind of believe his soul or whatever, you know.
I think one of the main reasons why that Jeff
Jay you know, rather choose an egg division which is
a glorified cruise Wim goes to me or whatever, because
that Dad's making it easy for him to you know,
nobody and I take his spot because Dad does seem

(20:02):
like as well, but non threatening the title opposed to
having you know meh con tid that was a fret
to a private effect to the position.

Speaker 3 (20:10):
What's out take on that right there?

Speaker 2 (20:13):
So basically you're saying that Jared's not threatened by the
exhibsion titles. That is not going to your main point animals,
that's gonna yeah, it's kind of the story that's been
a round. I mean, that's that's been a theme in
TNA for a while. What what's your what's your taking
Animal's question there?

Speaker 3 (20:31):
Well, I mean Jeff Jared since he's made up with
Dixie Carter and Kurd Angle for dating or how whatever
you want to say he's been doing with Karen Angle,
with with Kurt Angle's ex wife or wife. Uh, He's
he doesn't have to worry him. He's going to get pushed.
He's going to you know, he's not getting the major
push where he was a hind offed be all the

(20:51):
promotion the way he was for that. But he's going
to be treated to something special and he doesn't really
have to worry about He's smart. He doesn't really have
to worry about what belt that he has. Now there's
you know, there are guys that you know in the
history of professional wrestling that you could give them a
belt and pay them less and they would be happy
to have that belt. I've heard rate of Syria, believe

(21:12):
it or not, is someone like that where you know
you can modify him for a while by giving him
giving him the World championship. And but the way those
belts switch around to TNA, I don't think that really matters.
I don't think that's a sign of anything. Because they
have such a little focus. They'll forget or change the
name of the belt, or take the title off, over
do an office change, and you know, you just don't

(21:34):
know from week to week where where those things are.
And the truth of the matter is the chosen one,
the favored ones are gonna stay favored, whether whether their
acts are working or not, because they there was a
time in w W where they were doing well, you
know where they were they were effective acts. So that's
you know, there's no real up and down, you know,
there's no real up and down with the promotion, with

(21:56):
exception that fave of this that this kind of benefited
somewhat from hul Koga and Eric Goodshoff coming.

Speaker 7 (22:02):
Ye.

Speaker 2 (22:03):
It is amazing to me how the Exhivision title is
pretty much disappeared the last three weeks or so of
Impact and AGAs style is renamed the you know, the
global title, the TV title, and no one really batts
and I and the way it's presented on TV, it's
it's amazing how they've in an rv D albody is
your world champion in TNA and you don't even see

(22:25):
him with the belt. He's not defending the belt until
the Impact Special. And obviously it's because of the ECW theme,
but the CW themes to Pay per view or is
gonna be Facing Blue with Dreamer or Taboo it's a streamer. No,
that's stream and Raven.

Speaker 3 (22:39):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (22:40):
Anyways, but it's amazing to me how TNA has watered
down the value of the titles. It's classic VENTURUSO philosophy.

Speaker 3 (22:48):
Uh, it's you know, it's not just and they've never
really they've never really built up their titles. I mean
they've had that switching back and forth stuff and WW
does it too, I mean compared to compared to the other,
to the older days. But it's just WD looks good
at comparison to comparison to two and nine right right.

Speaker 2 (23:08):
No, WV is definitely guilty of hot shouting this year.
Uh yeah, I mean it's a it's a problem. I mean,
that's that's that title belt should be a quest for
every wrestle related whether you're in the X division or
you're in the Adulay Division, you're in the Tag division,
that should be your quest, that should be your central focus.
And it's not uh, and just it waters down the

(23:31):
value that.

Speaker 3 (23:31):
Belt could have.

Speaker 2 (23:32):
But Hanimal, did you have any other question or follow
up on the Jared X Division topic?

Speaker 6 (23:38):
Okay, yeah, I don't, Yeah, but you know I'll call
about you know, previously before you know, whenever he you know,
wasn't power back.

Speaker 3 (23:44):
He lost the power.

Speaker 12 (23:45):
I know, he had to kind of control the out,
time out, you know, before the end.

Speaker 3 (23:48):
That's all I was trying to say, I got the
power now, right, I.

Speaker 2 (23:53):
Kind of know what you're saying. Back in you know,
mid two thousands, when the X Division was, you know,
semi hot for TNTNA has never really had a big platform,
but within that platform, next Division was pretty high and
they would always be second. You know, this the semi
main event behind Jeff Charon's latest n w A title.

Speaker 3 (24:10):
Fans whether it's well, you know what, good excuse me.
James was also worth mentioning that the X Division title,
back when Jarrett was in the you know, very much
in the mix of the world title either had it
or was about to get it. The X Division title
he looked at and the top guys there looked at it,
as you know, they paid lip service to the great

(24:30):
action of the extra vision, but that was for the
flip and floppers who would go five on five or
or you know, or ten guys to have to provide
a lot of the action that they they thought that
you know, their their promotion that the internet fans wanted,
and they decided it so that they so that those
guys could get in. So there was a lot of

(24:50):
great athletic action, but it really never would be where
it really never made somebody the champion. And then there
were times when they went and when they made it
pretty clear but the heavyweight, better known wrestlers that came
out of WWE could beat the could beat the high
flying ex Division Ruffles whoever they wanted. So the X
division was there to vide the spectacle, but really to

(25:12):
provide mid carn ash and the set up the many
invests that Jeff Jarrett was in and Jeff Jarrett's Jeff Jarrett,
you know, ruffles a Memphis Space w W w CW
ninety style and he he never thought that he'd fit
in with expission stuff, so that's why he wouldn't you know.
It was it was a belt that was beneath them.

Speaker 2 (25:30):
And for the style either, yeah, exactly, it definitely was
that was. I mean, that went on for about two
years in TNA. It was just sort of the the
ex division wrestlers and marketing toward that that certain TNA
hardcore internet based audience that made up the significant portion
of their audience because they didn't have much of an
audience at the time. Uh, And that was sort of

(25:51):
to to appease them and appeal to them and make
it seemed like they were looking out for the fans
all the while with Jared and Nash and and et cetera,
and the the attitude arabuddies that were on top, and
that that was just out to the infrastructure of the
time and still just getting use today for most parts.
So Animal, good call, We appreciate that. Let's go, I

(26:12):
didn't grab another phone call. Let's go to the five
to one eight aera code five one eight. Welcome to
the show. Appreciate you. Name away it from.

Speaker 13 (26:20):
And it's a David from New York.

Speaker 2 (26:22):
Hey, David, what do you have for us today?

Speaker 13 (26:24):
I just had more not than a question or request.
Because I've been a member of the website for about
five years now, and after I started getting into the
Mitchell Audio Show, I went back and I always wanted
to listen to the audio and him had waved it
on the Rise and Fall VCW disc but like the
file never worked. I was just wondering if if maybe

(26:45):
you guys could check the server, maybe somebody has it
on a CDR that you can send him the file
and like maybe put that in the new index section
send ccw's kind of the talk of everything going on
right now?

Speaker 2 (26:56):
Sure, no, I'll we'll make sure we take a look
at that and see what's going on.

Speaker 3 (27:00):
Wow, that's I believe boy Keller is in the chat
room even as we speak, so he should have heard that.

Speaker 13 (27:05):
But hopefully he like three years ago and he like
never like wrote me back or anything. But I'd really
like to hear that audio.

Speaker 3 (27:16):
You know, As I said, I think he's listening right now,
and so usually honestly he's pretty good about at turning
to these kind of things. So hopefully and and be right,
this was this was a very good time. This is
a very good time to do it. So we'll hear
from he'll, he'll, he'll respond to this. Yeah, David, what

(27:38):
you were.

Speaker 13 (27:38):
Saying, it's because I thought it was one of the
better wws like DVD's that like really told the story
over three hours. But I'd be interested because like you
guys always kind of you know, sometimes away point out
things that I might not notice, or some certain fact
stage things which I could see Paul Annon kind of
making him look like the good guy on the disc
and you know, thinks stories like that that I've never

(27:59):
heard that would be interesting to see. But I'll get off.
I just wanted to say I was a big fan
of the Bruce Mitchell Show and any free listeners should
sign up just to hear Bruce make a great analogy
between Mitswick man one of his quotes and him taking
a dump in his class. It was truly entertainment.

Speaker 3 (28:16):
O great chasing. We'll put that on you know, we'll
put that on the website. So that'll be the average
ausing for it, oh Man, David David.

Speaker 2 (28:26):
By the way, Wade says, email him back with the
date of the audio show, and no, we'll go repost
it right away. So instead I think put November two.

Speaker 13 (28:33):
Thousand and four.

Speaker 1 (28:34):
But I can, like, I don't.

Speaker 13 (28:35):
I don't even know how I can get way back
in the old pages anymore. I tried looking for it
the other day to get the date, but it's mid.

Speaker 14 (28:41):
November two thousand.

Speaker 10 (28:42):
And four and I don't know, okay, I was helping him.

Speaker 2 (28:45):
Yeah, will you wait, will get right on that. And
he also says that he's not in the chat room.
It's someone impersonating him. So it's uh, Bruce, Bruce, you
got that info.

Speaker 3 (28:55):
It shares pro wrestling torch right at the top of this.

Speaker 1 (28:58):
Well, that's me.

Speaker 2 (28:59):
That's me in there. Oh, that's shoot.

Speaker 3 (29:01):
Okay, I'll stop auble soon right never month. Should be
in the chat room though, but he but not the huckles.

Speaker 1 (29:10):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (29:12):
Anyways, David, we appreciate that. We'll get that audio file
up and it leads me right into a good plug
for towards VIP members. You can If you're not in
towards VIP member, you're missing out on tons of audio
recent past vintage audio. Just this weekend we had seven
different audio updates, including two from Bruce Mitchell The Bruce

(29:32):
Mitchell Audio Show every weekend as well as like the
caller David mentioned, we have plenty of audio from past
eras Wake Teller's vintage audio from the nineteen nineties on
KFE and radio, as well as you can access. Like
David said, the two thousand and four, two thousand and
five ECW related audio updates talking about the past ECW

(29:53):
sort of send off party, a pay review that WW
put together in two thousand and five. Lots of detailed
audio in that time period, so that's available as well
as in the Torch archives for VIP audio members. Do
I want to go and get that plug out there
if you want to find out how to sign up
for a VIP membership, Pwtorch dot com, slash go vip

(30:13):
and find out all that good info right there.

Speaker 15 (30:18):
Need an extra dose of positivity in your wrestling podcasts,
will come join me Alan fourrel Over in the Progress
Paradise at Pterwood Torch VIP as we mask on the
bright side of wrestling and focus on some of the
great matches and shows from around the world, be it
the US, Japan, Europe or Mexico. There's always a place

(30:38):
for wrestlings past in the Paradise too, and we've done
fun historical shows such as the We Love Liger series
celebrating the glorious career of Jusian thunder Lighter and Our
Eye was There When shows where our guests will join
me to talk about a classic bout that they were
in attendance for We love variety and you can expect
lots of it at the pro Rest Paradise. Detailed PW

(30:59):
Torch VIP subscription information on a list of all the
VIP benefits is available at pterwrew Torch VIP info dot com.
And yes, all vi P podcasts are compatible with popular
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stream them directly from our ad free VIP mobile site.
See you in the Paradise.

Speaker 2 (31:23):
You're listening to the PW Torch livecast, assays p TOW
Torch Assistant editor James Caldwell, posting today with Torch Columbus
Bruce Mitchell. We're gonna go ahead and roll through some
more calls. Let's go to the four one four area
code four one four. Welcome to the show, please station
m where you're from?

Speaker 4 (31:41):
Hey, what'll put me to? My name is THEO called
us from Milwaukee Lift Concert?

Speaker 2 (31:45):
Hey?

Speaker 4 (31:45):
What's going on?

Speaker 3 (31:45):
What do you have for.

Speaker 2 (31:47):
Good?

Speaker 16 (31:50):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (31:50):
I have a question man, about how long do you
think before they danna start working up the next you
know feeling they all story line first?

Speaker 2 (31:58):
What what what's your timetable? Or you're you know, what
kind of timeline do you anticipate for how long it's
next to the storyline is going to play out before
they kind of split off some of these guys.

Speaker 3 (32:09):
Well, one thing, they are having a little bit better
ratings off of it, and so it's it's it's got
the people's interests, it's got the heat with the crowd
that's there, and the house show, the House show fans
are responding to it.

Speaker 2 (32:23):
I also think, so that's part of it.

Speaker 3 (32:24):
So if it starts losing ratings power, if it's if
it starts losing heat with the crowd, then then that
can cut it shorter. The other thing is, you know,
it depends on how SummerSlam does. But all that being
being equal, I seek that it depends on who they
have in mind for the head of Nexus. Now go
ahead and say I say this every time. I think

(32:46):
the best person for that is way there. But having
said that, if it's Triple H, then Triple H that reveal.
They won't make that reveal until he's getting closer to
be ready to come back, and that might be November December.
So in that case, we might see this next this
thing really roll along for a while. I would suspect though,
that if they'll start airing down the next screep, because

(33:07):
I don't think all seven guys are going to become
you know, mainstream Raw participant or SmackDown because it's quite
so fast. In other words, Sina will start knocking some
of them off, and they'll start making some alliances with
some of the heels on Raw. But if it's not,
it's not Triple ah, they decide they changed their mind

(33:28):
and don't make a Triple A. It could go a
little bit shorter, but right now, they've taken their time
with this and they haven't exposed these guys, and they've
been very careful not to have them. I know tonight,
I don't know the spoilers that well. I mean, I
know tonight the way Barrett rustles, uh, but they really
have not let these guys have singles matches or tag matches,
and I think that's pretty smart. I mean, I think
you just need to kind of continue to do it.

(33:49):
I think the Summer Slam next tos ont a win
slump Summer Slam with you know, someone on the Sina
team screwing them over and then you know, then then
move on to a rematch. So that means, you know,
at least another few months. I think this is I
think they're happy with the way this was going, so
I think it's gonna go for the media future. If
it goes along, it's November December, it could have you know,

(34:10):
it could come out and kind of end up in
the fall too. So we'll just stood right cover everybody
that I cover everybody, So that's that can be right,
So what I.

Speaker 2 (34:21):
Believe you've covered every every possible possibility. Yes, first, I
was just gonna add on that, you know, with Monday
night football coming up, and I talked about this when
when it seemed like it was it was clear that
w D was going to make us a long term storyline.
After how much they've invests in it, I it became
obvious to me that they need to keep stretching this

(34:41):
out during Monday night football season and have just have
that that tangible sort of storyline that the audience knows
they're gonna see every single week. That's gonna be interesting,
it's gonna be intriguing. Different characters are gonna be involved,
and hopefully they'll find ways of all different people. So
that's not just the same. You know, John's versus the
nexus type deal every single week. But uh, you know,

(35:04):
I think this has so much potential to stretch out,
Like you said, veras until the Triple Ah is ready
to come back and whatever side or whatever involvement he
you know, they kind of given him for this angle.
I think it could be the calling card during one
inne football season, just to give him a little bit
of an edge and not just have you know, a
random show every week. But last year they got beat

(35:25):
up bad during Mondynet football season. They just didn't have
a hot storyline. They were coming off well, I mean
eight matches of Orton and Sena, it was just Orton Sina,
Orton Seena, Orton Seena and they had nothing after that.
So I think this will give them some a little
bit more drawn tower and they had last last year,
but they just got beat up every week. So I

(35:47):
hope this stretches out, Bruce. So that that's my that's
my answer to that, Uh color, Did you have any
other question or follow up on the next angle?

Speaker 16 (35:56):
Yeah, So yeah, I was just one of these think
Triple ation is probably they're probably gonna listen to where
the places finding the master amount of high because where
they go and if somebody think about it, you think
it's gonna be timpolates, maybe even thinks what about Zera
call or somebody you know.

Speaker 2 (36:12):
Yeah, I mean there's there's some you know. Just like
you said, you think Wade Merri should be the ultimate
mastermind behind what a simple way to fit in. You
think just if you had to give one one or
two specific ways involved.

Speaker 3 (36:25):
In well, a power grab for the company, you know,
a power grab that he wants that he's decided to
Sean Mike. You know, they had the storyline Seawn Michael's
really kind of let him down that he needs to
tough enough that he's going to he wants to see,
you know, tough goalies that he can ally himself with.
And I think if it's his character in a certain

(36:47):
way that the problem is though, will he dig for
everybody and they just become you know, they become the
way Legacy was Randy Orton, or much worse, the way
Spirit Squad was for the Generation Nuts back a few
years ago. Right.

Speaker 2 (37:03):
Yeah, that's the key, Like you said, it's not making
the Triple H Show if you're gonna get these guys
over as legitimate stars in the eyes of the audience.
And that's that's the key. If if it's all okay,
now Triple Wake is back and we don't care about
these other guys anymore, and then you're real in the
angle and you don't get well, he did.

Speaker 3 (37:21):
You know, he did do a good job with with
him with but because he believed in Batista and Randy Orton,
so it was he was the alpha male. He was
the primary guy and evolution above Batista, you know, Orton
and Rick Flair. But if he does, if it's him
Seamous and Wade there and maybe one more, I think

(37:42):
you could have. I think you'd have a pretty good group.
So I'm not I'm not the staring over that, but
I but you know, it depends on it really does
the penal triplation whereas the securities are at this point
in his career, and it also also still think it
just really should be the guys standing up from so
off and making this. Peters realized that they're fighters, not

(38:05):
either not perform performers, who are good corporate services. Who
will you know, who will wash cars for the for
management right exactly?

Speaker 2 (38:14):
And that's that that's something they you know, it's hard
to walk that fine line of incorporating them into the show.
Like you said, Bras before they had those their their
corporate T shirts and they had the big N on
their on the front. Now, so you know, it's a
fine line to walk, and you know they're okay of
right now. Uh, we'll see how it plays out going forward.
Big Paul there, We appreciate that. We're gonna continue on

(38:36):
with some more phone calls. If you want to jump
on the live cast in the last twenty five minutes
or so in the show, give us a call at
six four six seven two one nine eight two eight.
Let's go to the four one two area code four
one two. Welcome to the show. Please sitch you name,
know where you're from.

Speaker 17 (38:52):
Hey, guys, it's Shady Pittsburgh.

Speaker 2 (38:54):
How you guys been said Shane, What do you have
for us today?

Speaker 18 (38:57):
No?

Speaker 2 (38:58):
JD oh JD Shane, Dad, It's sound.

Speaker 17 (39:03):
It's been a lot of talk to you, guys. I
got a couple of things to ask you. First off,
you talked about n x T however, and I'm going
to give you my opinion. I think Michael mcgilli cutty
possibly could be one of the heavy fair techs could
win this thing. Along with Cabal. What do you guys think?

Speaker 2 (39:18):
Yeah, it brings what's your evaluation of the next season too?

Speaker 3 (39:20):
So far? Well, you know I talked about I talked
before the God with the glasses. I can't stand him
and uh yeah, I just dropped his name. Yeah, Percy Watson.
I'm trying to forget him. I can't stand him. So
I'm for him changing, changing completely before he comes up

(39:41):
and becomes before it becomes a regular on television, which
he is already. Uh, you know mcgilla cutty, any of
the legacy guys. You know, you know mcguilla cutty, Hannig,
h you know Husky Hairs for Tanda uh there there.
You know it's for Percy Watson all the way, Yes,
but it you know, and and Tavila I think would

(40:02):
really benefit from it. And Astley deserves that. He's the
best one. But I kind of would guess. I don't
think that's going to happen, So I kind of guess
McGillicuddy or either or there there. So I mean, I
don't know, we'll see. I'm not there's nobody that stands
out a ton with me. I like Husky Harris and
a lot for a lot of different reasons. I think

(40:24):
a tough guy that has a different body and a
different kind of attitude, it's something that they need. And
you know, Joe Balen has this in the chatterund but
Alex Riley has a good personality, I mean has it
has a different that plays well with with miss So
I don't know if this works up to it, but
but you know that one too.

Speaker 17 (40:46):
I got another question to ask you guys. I mean,
we've been hearing all the time that there's this anonymous GM.
Every week it seems like there's like different hints of
that GM. When are we going to see the GM
finally reveal his face and who do you think it'll be?

Speaker 2 (41:00):
Switching theory.

Speaker 3 (41:01):
Well, I'm gonna make it real short because we just
kind of talked about this, but I think it should
be way there because it needs to be. It really
should be a new guy in you know, in Nexus
that decided on his own that he had balls enough
to say I'm not a performer who's going to jump
rope for any management. I'm going to kick ass and
take names. And I think that would be the most

(41:22):
effective thing my guests is triple A stuff because you know.

Speaker 2 (41:27):
As or as the leader of Nexus or is that
kind of one of the same.

Speaker 3 (41:33):
Do you think? Yeah, I think I think it's one
of the sign.

Speaker 2 (41:37):
Okay, my theory, you know. I mean, they drop the hints,
they're trying to get you thinking one way, and then
they change it on you.

Speaker 1 (41:44):
You know, I don't know.

Speaker 2 (41:46):
To me, it seems like they're content kind of playing
this along along with the Nexus angle and continuing those
sort of simultaneously without really revealing either a mastermind for
Nexus or be separately uh the aunonymous Rods. So I
kind of stopped throwing out guesses. I mean, I like
Pat McNeil's theory is one of the best ones. That
they're kind of waiting for Batista to figure out that,

(42:09):
you know, he's not an mm A fighter and he'll
come back and they could kind of reinsert him in
that role after the whole deal with how he was
fired on TV by Brett Hard and and that angle
and how that played out. So I still I buy
that one as a potential theory, and they kind of
waiting for Batista perhaps to come back. I don't have
anything else, though, I Mean, it's sort of one of
those things where I've given up on theories. I'm just

(42:31):
kind of waiting to see how it plays out and
see gives any other more tangible clues.

Speaker 17 (42:37):
But uh, I think this one guy, you guys gotta
maybe consider possibly what about JBL? I mean, yeah, he
hasn't been in fressing in a long time, but you
think about it coming back as a heel GM he
could work.

Speaker 2 (42:50):
Yeah, First, what what's your take on where JBL might
fit in in today's wrestling environment, especially in WW.

Speaker 3 (42:57):
It's a repeat, but he's good at it and a
and it definitely could work. I just don't think that
he's at a place in his life where he's coming
back to wrestling. I think that he's he's one of
those guys. I really think that he's satisfied with his
wrestling career. He's done well monetarily, he married very well,
you know as far as that goes. And I think
he likes his life and I think he likes watching it.

(43:19):
But you know, he's not one of the ones that's
that wants to keep coming. So unless they make him
a deal and that you know that that's monetarily too
much to turn down, I'd be surprised. I mean, that's
a possibility. And he'd be good at it, but it
I'd be surprised.

Speaker 2 (43:35):
Yeah, he seems to be passed wrestling and that that
seems to me where his mentality is. Of course St.
Michael's always comes up and and he kind of jumped
on Twitter this weekend.

Speaker 3 (43:45):
And a lot to say.

Speaker 2 (43:46):
He said he's only watched one episode of A ROW
since he's retired, So let's it's a major swear that
has to rule him out as a mystery GM. But
that's another theory that's out there, Jade, any other question
to follow up?

Speaker 17 (43:58):
No, I mean you're pretty much I can nail us
on the head and I'm just good talking to you
guys out.

Speaker 2 (44:01):
Talk to you all right, good here forming Jad, appreciate it.
Let's go in and then let's go back to the
phone lines. Let's go to the nine to one four
area code ninety one four. Welcome to the show. Please
state you know where you're from.

Speaker 3 (44:15):
Steve from Florida. Hey Steve, what do you have for us?

Speaker 2 (44:17):
Said?

Speaker 3 (44:21):
Do you think it's at all possible that the SummerSlam
main event between n x T and Team WWE ends
with a sledge hammerschef?

Speaker 2 (44:33):
So basically, will triple ahs be involved. First, do you
think he do you think Triple As touches the Summer
Slam card.

Speaker 3 (44:40):
No, it's two soons. No, not the first time, not
the first time. And he's he's he's rehabbing an injury.
He's not ready to really come back. So I think
that if it is for him and and there's a
fledgehammer in somebody's future, I think that'll be several, you know,
a few matches down the line, and it really should
be a matches down the line. This one should be

(45:02):
you know, straight up seven on seven and the heels
go over of achieved to set up a rematches too soon?
You know. One of the problems in wrestling now is
they compress these storylines and they they skipped chapters and
it's just too soon to do that. There's plenty of
intrigue to go that they can explore before they get
to you know, revealing Triple Ah.

Speaker 2 (45:27):
Yeah, yeah, I agree with that, Bruce steven An either
question or follow.

Speaker 3 (45:33):
I actually do have another question.

Speaker 11 (45:35):
Do you think it's there?

Speaker 3 (45:37):
Do you think that it's all possible that.

Speaker 2 (45:39):
These angle would somehow possibly get Edge over as a
baby face? Bruce, what do you think Edge baby Face
Part two in twenty ten.

Speaker 3 (45:51):
It's a possibility. I doubt it though, because he just
came back. He was a babyface and the fans really
didn't take to it as much as they would have
life for him too. I mean, remember he turned heel
all the way after after WrestleMania. I hadn't been that
long since WrestleMania, so and I know that he's been
in wrestling long enough and smart enough to know that
that jumping back and forth stuff doesn't work, particularly doesn't

(46:15):
work that well, particularly jumping back and forth and becoming
a baby face again. So I can see him acting
in baby pace ways to help Team Sena and then
become you know, and then then turning back a little bit,
never quite going all the way. But I don't think
he's going to become I'd be very surprised to see
him go back, go back. He'll the one that they've
got to be tempted to do is Chris Jericho. Like

(46:37):
Chris Jericho is so good at that character that he plays,
and I think he knows that it's a good place
for him that I think he's going to resist that.
We'll see that.

Speaker 1 (46:48):
We're about to go to a commercial break. Why listen
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(47:10):
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Speaker 2 (47:21):
It's interesting you mentioned those two Jericho and Edge Bruce
because they they in two separate segments the last week's show.

Speaker 1 (47:27):
They tease.

Speaker 2 (47:30):
Maybe face turns, you know, not you know, we're gonna
turn this guy maybe face like Randy Orton. But you know,
Edge was sort of one of the sympathetic figures in
that NXT beat down, and in the second segment of
last week's show, and then Jericho was teaming with Sina
and get in some face pops from the crowd, there
was that sense of Okay, we've seen this guy play

(47:50):
heel long enough, we kind of like him. He's our
bad guy. It's almost sort of that Randy Orton baby
face turn. But you know, of course Jericho turns on
Sena and then they kind of go on for there.
But you know, Jericho at some point in his career, well,
I mean, let's say this, he's got to sign or
renewal with ww I mean his contracts come and do.

(48:11):
I mean, Bryce, have you heard any indications one way
or the other whether he's gonna resign. Have you you
get the sense that he is going to resign or
you know, is he kind to kind of move on
to doing the music thing. What's your impression of that?

Speaker 3 (48:23):
Well, you know, Chris Jericho, you know, didn't resign, stayed
away from wrestling for a year or two. He plays,
he's smart in how he plays and plays his cause
close to the vest. And I think that as long.
But I would say I think he's watched to wrestle
a little while longer. So I suspect he's gonna study
in w w A as long as T and A
is chaos. I think he'll talk to them as a

(48:46):
way to as negotiating leverage with WWE. But in the end,
I don't think he's gonna pull that trigger. And so,
like I said, unless something like Paul Haymon gets complete
control over yes from faith, you know he has from faith,
people are gonna be put into two you and I
that you know what they're doing. I think he's gonna stay.
The option is gonna be to retire or to take

(49:09):
one more run with w W. And I suspect you
he's gonna take one more one run with w W.

Speaker 2 (49:13):
A yeah, I suspect you will too. And in that regard,
I imagine, you know, a babyface term's got to be
down the road somewhere, perhaps even to close out his career,
and that might be you know, two years, he might
be a year, it might be two years. It's gonna
be three years, depends on how long he goes. But
they definitely teased it a little bit like maybe they

(49:34):
kind of tested the waters a little bit on Monday Show,
just to see how a crowd might react to the
idea of Jericho.

Speaker 1 (49:41):
In the baby face.

Speaker 2 (49:41):
And he's been such an integral part of w's programming
as a top heel for you know, two or three
years now. I mean, how much more can he do.
How many more thrombos can he do before they start
hearing him?

Speaker 3 (49:54):
You know? Verse Well, I mean if he's really disciplined
and being a heel, and and he seems to every
time that there's some sort of catchphrase or something that's
catching on, he takes it and cuts it out. And
you got to remember, this is a young audience, This
is a John Cena audience is really turning into and
so they're gonna take to him as they can still

(50:14):
kind of take to him as a heel.

Speaker 19 (50:16):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (50:17):
You know, I think there's some of what you're gonna
see if if somebody catches on as a heel or
a baby face as a baby face during this next
of storyline, they'll they might run with it, but you're
gonna see Edge and Sena and and and Seamus too
acting davy face ways to stand up for Team WWE.

(50:37):
And then they're gonna show their true colors a little
while longer. So because they can't act.

Speaker 2 (50:41):
Like complete heels.

Speaker 3 (50:42):
Of acting like complete heels, they wouldn't join the team
in the first place, right, So it's sort of like
there is is what you said before, there are heels
against these new you know, our bullies are gonna stand
up for us against the new the new neighborhood bullies.

Speaker 2 (50:57):
M h yeah, and that that's sort of the theme,
and that's what's I think that's what's created a lot
of intrigue, especially in the last week's show when Tina
and Jericho had that back and forth. It created some
interesting compelling TV it perhaps you know, the idea is
to get people to buy a SummerSlam, and I think
they're going to a fair enough job. You know, it's
it's not it's not blow away stuff. It's not innovative stuff.

(51:20):
It's just basic good stuff that works. So we'll see
how effect SummerSlam. They've got two more weeks of TV,
including tonight, so we'll see all it plays out. Kind
of about fifteen minutes or so left in the show,
we want to go ahead and get the number out too.
If you want to join the live cast and be
third in line right now, we have two more callers
that get to UH and then you can be third

(51:41):
in line if you want to jump on the call
lines right now. The number to call it's six four,
six seven to two one nine eight two eight.

Speaker 6 (51:48):
Steve.

Speaker 2 (51:48):
We appreciate that call. Let's go ahead and go to
the seven oh three area code. Seven oh three. Welcome
to the show. Please stay shaming while you're from.

Speaker 7 (51:57):
Hey, James A. Bruce is later from Atlanta.

Speaker 2 (51:59):
Hey, good hear from me.

Speaker 7 (52:00):
What do you have to say?

Speaker 17 (52:02):
Hey?

Speaker 7 (52:03):
Well, you know, I just sort of punched in, like, oh,
I'll just ask the question to see what comes to mind.
And I liked the reference to Jericho's sort of cutting
out anything that could make him popular. But one thing
that kind of came to mind from a few years
ago was when Armando Alejandro Estrada cut out saying his
middle name when he was getting a reaction, kind of

(52:23):
like the Rock where they'd repeat it. And I was
wondering what you guys thought of people trying to be
more traditional and cutting out anything that might get them
over as a face, for example, if they're supposed to
be a heel, or or whether you think he maybe
should have stuck stuck with that and gotten himself more over,

(52:44):
because it seemed like he cut out the legs of
his own character getting over when he decided to try
and play it more straight at a heel and not
get that face reaction.

Speaker 3 (52:55):
Well, I think, you know, I think of strata was
going to end up being and entertaining mid card babyface,
entertaining mid card heel. And what really killed him was
he was a good talker, but they decided that they
were gonna let him talk as much as they wanted
him to wrestle, as long as he was playing, you know,
as long as he's playing in a thirty figure GM
type or as long as he was playing some sort

(53:16):
of manager. Uh, he was really effective when he got
into the ring. He couldn't hang as a wrestler, and
that was that was kind of the beginning of the end.
And so when he really did what they the mistake
would have been. And I don't know it was a
big mistake or not, because I don't know whether he'd
have been a big star or not. And they have
plenty of mid carters. But the stake seats have been

(53:37):
that they didn't go with the with just the entertainment
part and do what they did with same teat up Morella,
which was just kind of go with it and let
people be entertained by it and play up, play up
that he's cute. You know, when he says that, he
kind of laughed, and you know, he says it in
a way that you want to chant along with him.
So it's not it's not made of it level level stuff.

(53:59):
And I made a level heat, but it's it's mid cards.
He he just sort of lost it. He lost his
way as soon as I had him, you know, as
soon as I had him doing that craft or he
was roughly for his career. He really was roughly for
his career, and he was losing.

Speaker 2 (54:12):
Yeah, And there was also a tame when he was
managing O Maga and you know that it sort of became,
you know, let's emphasized in Maga rather than Armando, and
and that that was also sort of the beginning of
the end for him. He was shipped to E C
W And like Bruce said, I mean all that, all
that kind of came to play where his career was
on the line every week, and and that sort of
interaction with with the Tiffany with the GM or whoever

(54:34):
was the GM at the time. But yeah, so I
mean he was in a tough spart and the male
managers are not utilized, emphasized and.

Speaker 7 (54:41):
Tired in this environment.

Speaker 2 (54:43):
It's it's about getting the talents over the male manager.
It showed sort of a long start, and he was
in a tough place. He couldn't really work in the
ring that well, and you know, you're a male manager,
so you have problems already there.

Speaker 3 (54:56):
So later yeah, I.

Speaker 7 (54:58):
Would have yeah, sure, well just I'll just say it,
but then move on to the next thing. I would
have thought, you know, like you said, James, you know
there was a big d emphasis on mail managers, that
he would try and keep that chant thing going as
long as you can, because obviously it is sort of
a mid card thing, but at least it's a reaction
and would you know, maybe open the door for something

(55:20):
else once, you know, maybe someone would give him another
opportunity to go higher. I guess the other question I
want to ask for you guys. You talked earlier about agents,
and I was just wondering, doesn't have to be in
depth or anything, but just a primer. What what are
some of the best agents in the business. Obviously Pat
Patterson is one. I was just wanted to know about
others that are that are have really contributed heavily.

Speaker 2 (55:44):
First it comes to mind, well.

Speaker 3 (55:46):
Michael Harries mentored the hardies and and really kind of
worked his way up farther than being you know, from
from an agent to being a rider on the credit
and being a real creative force there. So I think
he was. I think he was real helpful. Some of
the acts Arn Anderson lasts for a long time. I
mean they kind of these he's kind of a steady,

(56:08):
you know, you know, steady calming influence for backstage. I
know that Ricky Steboat has gotten has gotten praise. I
don't think he's going to be an agent anymore. He's
gonna work work with training people in Florida as soon
as he recovers from where it was that took him down.
And I know that he was praised for really working

(56:29):
with John Cena and helping John Cena burnish some of
the parts of his babyface acts. So those are some
that you know, those are some of the kind of
that kind of come to mind us also, you know,
it depends on if you look at the long term
ones in WWF. You look at some of the guys
that lasted a long time to Blackjack Lands, as the
Steven Parties, and those guys they were known for being
politically canty and for you know, staying straight with the

(56:53):
people in management who had power, and that's that's a
big part of the agent's job. I know that I
know that there's an agent, and I don't like I
say which of the two companies is in But dat
was told by his own wife, you know, stop speaking
up and saying when things are wrong, learn to play
the game with John. Laura and I just did and
say what they want to hear, because just keep this job.

(57:14):
Your your responsibility is to stay employed for our family,
if not to necessarily make the company better. So that's
part of that's part of your magor too. Unfortunately. Yeah,
you know, it's part of management and part of working
in any job where you've got bought you've got layers
over your office, and I'm afraid to say, you got to.

Speaker 2 (57:34):
Pick your battles. That's that's that's part of pretty much
any employment, especially you know, it's this this battle work
with battling over and oftentimes it's not. So that's just
sort of the environment that that that WW has created, uh,
pretty much every layer of that company but me, we

(57:55):
appreciate that call. Good call. Let's go ahead and get
some more phone calls in and last financial still know,
let's go to two to one oh area code two
one oh welcome to the show. Please thank you and
know where you're from.

Speaker 3 (58:06):
All right, this is Cameron from Austin, Texas.

Speaker 2 (58:09):
Awesome, my favorite other talent.

Speaker 3 (58:10):
What yeah for us?

Speaker 1 (58:11):
Say Cavin?

Speaker 3 (58:12):
Right, Okay, I should a question about raw maybe going
to three hours now.

Speaker 2 (58:17):
I'm just kidding my quick.

Speaker 3 (58:20):
I was about to start crying.

Speaker 2 (58:21):
Thanks than I had him over there.

Speaker 3 (58:23):
I'm just holding myself right.

Speaker 11 (58:27):
No, my question is about some of the guys on
n XT. It can be argued that two of the
most popular guys they've had on the first two seasons
are low Key and Danielson. My question was with you know,
those guys being smaller than most of the other guys
in the roster, along with them trying to push Evan Bourne,
do you see any kind of push towards like a
cruiserweight or light heavyweight division or do you think they're

(58:49):
going to kind of do what w c W did
with guys like Guerrero and Malenko and Ben Why getting
the United States title. That's kind of something in between
the cruiserweight and heavyweight belts.

Speaker 2 (59:00):
You know, It's one of those things where I'm not
a fan of of sort of reintroducing a division or
introducing a new division, if you're not gonna focus on it,
if you're not gonna make that a central focus, or
you're gonna devote fifteen minutes of TV time to that
division every single week and you're really gonna elevate that.
That's kind of my concern with the TV title in

(59:21):
TNA is are they going to dedicate time to getting
that belt and that quote unquote division over or is
it gonna make the X division title where it disappears
for a couple of months and they're trying to do
an angle after the fact. So, Ris, what's your take
on on Crafts incorporating some of these smaller guys into
a separate division, whether it's cruiseweight another Division US title,

(59:44):
what's your take on that.

Speaker 3 (59:46):
I don't think that's going to happen. The best that
thing that can happen for Cabal, for Loki is what's
been pitched and what Registerio would like to do, which
is to make him his rival, make him bart way
with Stereo and put a in a mask. And I
think that if that, if that took off, and then
to turn the babyface and let him be raised partner

(01:00:09):
and you could sell more mask you could sell more
of that kind of thing than we would see it
if we would see more masked wrestlers at a cruiserweight size.

Speaker 2 (01:00:17):
But I don't.

Speaker 3 (01:00:17):
I don't think you'll ever see them do that again.
I think that those guys are gonna have to be
able to do it. Ray has done with Ray has
been really great at doing which is kind of you know,
on the car and moving up down the card and
be looking legitimately against whatever size opponent that he has.
I mean, Ray's a very special, you know, very special

(01:00:37):
guy doing that. Danielson I think is going to you know,
Dannison would work with that too. But I think Dannison
when he gets his chance back in w W A,
and I suspect he will sooner rather than later. Uh,
it's gonna be based on his personality as a butt
butt ticker. And it's also gonna be they're gonna look
at him and go, well, the way they do it,
you know they do with that and Born he's great,

(01:00:58):
No he's too small. No he's great. No, he's small.
So you know that'll that's kind of where it does.

Speaker 2 (01:01:04):
And you know, like you said, Verus, it's I mean,
there's been a shift toward everyone wrestles that main event
style and that they don't really have that cruiseway division
where it's you know, I mean their matches. Obviously there's
there's main event style matches that are based on athleticism,
but the emphasis is pretty much all on main event

(01:01:25):
style ahead of athleticism across the board every single match Superstars, Raw, SmackDown,
it's it's that shift to main event style of work,
and so it's part of it.

Speaker 3 (01:01:37):
Well, I mean maybe Wars has has a level of
athleticism too. I don't think that's you know, I don't
think that's what it's. It's it's and I'm more I mean,
I think sometimes you do have to slow down that
the spectacle match going bang. The crowd, particularly this new
crowd can get lost in that or just or just
kind of or don't or cheers it because it looks

(01:01:58):
cool instead of cheers because they want this guy to
win and they want the other guy to lose. So,
I mean, I you know, I'm not I'm not necessarily there,
but I mean, if you've got two or three guys
who can wrestle a cool who are small, who could
wrestle a cool style that appeals to kids that can
fly around in a different way than everybody else. They'll

(01:02:19):
stand out and they'll you know, they'll do they'll they
might do better than having what you've seen in TNA,
which is five or ten guys who are all doing
it and nobody stands out. So I don't know, I don't.
I don't, I don't.

Speaker 7 (01:02:32):
I'm not.

Speaker 3 (01:02:33):
I'm not somebody who goes, OK, guys, they should have
a Cruiserway division, you know, unless they've got the people
that can really unless it's really over. To me, it's
like you need the pioneers to get the style over
and then you can grow it into a division, and
that's I think that's a better way to I think,
I mean, whatever sort of thing is a better way
to do them.

Speaker 2 (01:02:53):
Yeah, no, I mean there aren't you know, there aren't
eight ranging cereals out there who can help pull that off.
I mean, they're just they're not.

Speaker 3 (01:03:00):
There's not There's not one.

Speaker 2 (01:03:02):
You know, there's one. There's Ray, There's Evan. You know
that that's you know Evan. You know that they're pushing
him and yeah, I mean it's all start stop, but
they're on the way with him, and you know, they
just don't have that many, so devision camberon. We appreciate
that call. Good good question that we're gonna try to

(01:03:22):
squeeze in one more phone call from the four one
four oh four area code. Welcome to the show. Please
say you name and where you're from. Hey, this is
Elliots in Atlanta.

Speaker 7 (01:03:31):
I'll try to make a quick go for it.

Speaker 20 (01:03:34):
I've been telling gold Dust of all people on Twitter,
and he's been tweeting about how he's in the best
shape of the of his life and he's not going
to retire this one of the It's awesome that he's
he's been repeating seconds.

Speaker 2 (01:03:48):
Yeah, First, what's your take on gold Dust? He's obviously
in shape. He's in much better shape than he was
in tn A h gosh, it was he there two
or three years ago? What I mean, what's your take
on where he is right now?

Speaker 3 (01:03:59):
In WW?

Speaker 2 (01:04:00):
I mean, is he in the position said James?

Speaker 3 (01:04:04):
Let me say it. Let me say that. Okay, really
worth it. I think he's been a very good veteran
hand I mean, I think he's really improved.

Speaker 2 (01:04:12):
And shown something.

Speaker 3 (01:04:14):
Every time you see him. He does a very he
does a very good job and carrying guys and teaching
guys while still having a good performance. I'm glad to
see it. I think he's carved out a niche where
he was hanging out by a thread to having a
full time wrestling career, and I think he's re established himself.

Speaker 2 (01:04:30):
Yeah, I agree. I definitely agree with that. He's he's
a good guy to having your house shows and I
saw him working pretty good match Yea and Houston a
couple of weekends ago. So down the last five seconds
where I thank everyone for joining us day on the
live cast. Check out NBA Rock coverage starting now.

Speaker 21 (01:04:55):
In twenty twelve, NXT transitioned into the developmental system and
ultimately the brand you see today. On the Torch VIP
podcast NXT Eight Years Back, we'll be taking a weekly
look at this page.

Speaker 22 (01:05:08):
In NXT's early history. Join Kelly Wells and me Tom
Stout from PWT Talks NXT every Saturday as we go
eight years back to the day to track NXT's rising
talents and why they did or didn't work out, exclusively
for p W Torch VIP members.

Speaker 1 (01:05:26):
Lot Welcome to PW Borges LIVECAB. I am Pro Wrestling
Torch Newsletter editor and PW Torch Dot com editor Wade Keller,
and I'm joined today by Jason Powell of Pro Wrestling
Dot Net. Are you doing Jason great?

Speaker 7 (01:05:44):
How about you?

Speaker 1 (01:05:45):
I'm doing good. We were just talking about Brett Farbo
off the air. We should since we're both lifelong Viking
fans and lifelong Brett Farve paters. Until the last year,
you know, that is the headline story of the day
that we'll get out of the way, so nobody has
to wonder if we're going to talk about it. Do
you believe he's retired?

Speaker 7 (01:06:00):
Well, first of all, wait, I've never liked that man.
I've always hated his guts. Last year was no. Okay,
I'm lying, but I did. For like eighteen years I
hated man.

Speaker 1 (01:06:08):
But I know, I know very well for many a rants.

Speaker 7 (01:06:13):
Yeah, that's true, and for many of the you know,
one of the reasons I didn't like him for so
long was because of the drama. And I think this
is probably just more Brett far of drama, is my guess.
And I'll believe it when Week one rolls around and
he's not in the starting lineup. Until then, I mean,
I'm I'm believing a little bit more this year than
I did last year, because last year the announcement came

(01:06:34):
that he wasn't coming back, and it was like whatever
it was. It was only a few days later, I
think that the tickets went on sale and I rushed
out and bought my packer biking tickets. I knew he
was going to be there.

Speaker 22 (01:06:45):
This year.

Speaker 7 (01:06:45):
I'm not as confident, but I'm not you know, doom
in gloom mode right now and thinking that that it's
all over.

Speaker 1 (01:06:51):
Although the announcement did come after single game tickets went
on sale this time around, yes it did. Yeah, that
makes me think maybe it is legit because Ziggy just said, oh,
you know, the owner just said, can you wait to
hold off until after we sell all the tickets?

Speaker 7 (01:07:05):
Right? Yeah, I know it's a little suspect. This time around.

Speaker 1 (01:07:09):
He does have a legit, you know, a legit story
in that he had surgery. You know, he had the
ankle issue, and so you know, if if he won't
look like as much of a drama queen other than
the boy who cried Wolfe syndrome, if he does, you know,
a week before the season starts, say I just feel
really good, let's do this now. Hopefully he lets Tavaris
Jackson and say d Rosenfeld in on this little game

(01:07:30):
so that you know, one of the two of them
don't get their hopes up for probably probably Tavares, although
Sage is gonna be excited because Tavars, you know, has
a fifty to fifty chance of completely screwing up a
good team otherwise and he'd get his chance. So, you know,
you hate to see Far mess around with as around stuff.
But Jason, we're gonna we only got fifty eight minutes
left to talk about pro wrestling, and people are gonna

(01:07:50):
be inundated with Far stuff if they care elsewhere. So
let's dive in to discussing wrestling. Oh you know what,
one one quick sidebar because I will forget to do
this and I need to do this. MMA Torch Live Cast.
That is MMA for those of you who don't know,
since we're mixed Martial Arts, it's a pretty cool thing.
We have our sister website MMA Toorch dot com, which
I hope you're visiting on a daily basis, and the

(01:08:13):
live cast moves from Sunday to Tuesday starting tonight and
it starts at eight o'clock. It's blog Talk radio dot
com slash MMA Torch very easy. Go ahead and check
that out tonight at the ninety minute show starting at
eight pm Central, nine o'clock Eastern, I believe, so please
give that. If you're an MMA fan, please listen to

(01:08:34):
the show tonight in a couple hours here and call
in the show and talk about Sunday's big event, well
not so big event on versus the USC event, and
also the chills On and Anderson Soba fight, which I
am looking forward to coming up on pay per view
this Saturday. So loves to talk about tonight on the
MMA Torch Love Cast with Jamie Pennock and Matt Tolkey

(01:08:57):
hosting the show. I'm not sure if they've got a
special guest line for not I know Jamie was working
on it for tonight, so we'll see how that goes.

Speaker 7 (01:09:03):
Hey, before we get home with the calls, here, is
there a reason? Oh, there, it's popping up. I was
gonna say it's not showing up on the main page,
but I was able to access the show finally. So,
oh is the chatroom open?

Speaker 1 (01:09:15):
The chatroom is forty one people in it and counting.
So yeah, we're good.

Speaker 7 (01:09:20):
Phenomenal all right.

Speaker 1 (01:09:21):
They must have thought James called was those thing because
I actually had it up like, you know, three four
minutes before the show instead of three four minutes into
the show. Well, Jason sums up. It comes down on
last night's Rock.

Speaker 7 (01:09:33):
I like the show more than most people. I didn't
care for the week before. I mean, there were aspects
of it that was fine. I just felt they beat
us over to the head with the you know, the
dissension amongst the raw Guys team wrong guys. But last
night I thought that it was a good continuation. But
I guess my concern is that it made it entertained
me for two hours more than especially more than I

(01:09:55):
expected a pre tape show to do after I'd read
the spoilers, But it didn't we me anxiously awaiting Summer Slam.
I think the build towards Summer Slam from it's been
logical from a storytelling standpoint. But you know, we're like,
what twelve days away and they've only bothered to advertise
three matches so far officially. Yeah, and that's just bizarre

(01:10:17):
to me.

Speaker 1 (01:10:18):
Well, I mean, I think because of the elimination style match,
there's not going to be a lot of room for
a lot of other matches, and I think, you know,
WWE's policy I think has been to Their policy seems
to be, let's focus on the big, big matches and
keep people focused and then kind of fill in the undercard,

(01:10:39):
not at the last second, but not put as much
of a stress on it. This show is gonna it's
gonna make a break based on the elimination match and
the two worlds and the two you know, heavyweight title matches.
So I mean, I don't think it makes a big difference,
but I'm I'm among the people who likes to kind
of have a few weeks to think about the undercard
before it actually happens.

Speaker 16 (01:10:59):
You know.

Speaker 1 (01:10:59):
It's nice to see that develop and kind of have
it solidified exactly.

Speaker 7 (01:11:03):
Yeah, I mean that's my take on it too. And
I think, you know, there's some of the off brand
shows that if they don't get a bunch, if they
kind of throw it together at the last minute's a
little frustrating. But some are slaying, like expect more even
and I want that full line up in front of me.
I want to be able to, like you say, think
about it and start to look forward to some of
the matches, and it just seems odd to me if
there's only one round to go and only three matches advertising. Frankly,

(01:11:27):
one of those matches I expect to be okay Kane
and Mysterio. But it's not like I'm ordering the show
to see that match.

Speaker 1 (01:11:33):
Yeah, yeah, you know. I mean, I think some people
would order to see that match, but they're a different
type of fan than probably the typical person listening to
this show, because they're they're really invested in Ray as
a character, as a favorite of theirs, and they're they're
either buying into the storyline or just are young enough
to kind of believe and have that blurry line. And
Kane is just like kind of monster babyface to just

(01:11:55):
turn heel who has been cutting these scary promos. I mean,
I can see where it would a certain demographic, But obviously,
what you know, we're we're looking forward to seeing Ken
sham It's and Orton really pull off a pay per
view caliber heavyweight made event, and Orton look like he
fits as a lead babyface. I still haven't fully spelt

(01:12:15):
that fans. Even though fans are cheering him and they
like him, I don't know that they're embracing him as
this guy who could is seen it went down with
an injury, be their centerpiece, babyface headlining shows, and it's
very intangible. I can't put words to it, but just
doesn't seem like it's there yet.

Speaker 7 (01:12:29):
And I want to see him start talking about the
w W Championship. I know less is more with him,
but it would it killed them to come up with something.
And what they did last night with him was fine,
but make me feel like he wants to win the
championship and they just have they failed to do that
so far.

Speaker 1 (01:12:44):
Yeah, the chat rooms upset you, Jason, because you're complain
about Summerslim having announce three matches for T and A
is it's it's coming up this Sunday. They haven't announced anything.

Speaker 7 (01:12:53):
Hey, nobody, Nobody brought up tnain till now. I can
complain about that too, believe me.

Speaker 1 (01:12:58):
Yeah, well, let's let's shift to talk about that briefly
and then we'll dive into the phone calls. Ten Araco
Justice coming up Sunday. Last week, we had the angle
at the end finally where it wasn't about an ecw
all these wrs is coming out and singing karaoke together,
but there's actually gonna be a match among the former
ECW wrestlers, presumably because because of Raven turning on Dreamer.

(01:13:19):
Is that a strong enough angle? And do fans know
enough about I mean, obviously there's a lot of all
DCW fans, but did they do enough to develop that
storyline where anyone's even going to care that Raven DDT Dreamer?
What's your great on the hype from last Thursday show?

Speaker 7 (01:13:34):
Great on the hype? I would have to sit for
that particular match. I would have to give probably a
D D minus because you know, if you're a long
time ECW fan, then that means something to you. But
I don't I don't think it was strong enough that
it's really going to get you fired up to see
their last match.

Speaker 3 (01:13:50):
On this pay per view.

Speaker 7 (01:13:52):
And if you are a younger viewer, I can't imagine
that sold you on ordering the show more than anything
else they've done. It just it was kind of like, well,
we need to set up we need to do an
angle to set up this match, And there really wasn't
a whole lot of thought put into it, you know,
promo time that mattered for those guys. And yeah, I
mean it's pretty lackluster build in a lot of ways.

(01:14:13):
I think they're just kind of banking on people are
going to order it because it's an EACW reunion show,
even though officially they can't say it's an ECW reunion show.

Speaker 1 (01:14:21):
I think to a degree it might be smart strategy.
In one in you can make a case it's a
smart strategy. I'll put it that way, because the more
you announce the matches, the more you cement how what
the card's actually going to be. You know, at least
if they don't and it's just tune in and two,
what's gonna happen it's the ECW reunion, you don't get
this concrete example of how lousy the matches look on paper.

(01:14:44):
Although you would think by now at least they could
have done something with RBD and Scott and Lynn and
talked about the fact that they've got a great history
together and you know, it's tough to have a world
title match with no hype leading up to it, and
you know it's not oh, actually it's not a title
matches that they're doing non title because Lynn isn't a
top ten contender, So I forgive them that, But then
maybe they don't even want to point out that it's

(01:15:05):
not a world title match, so people look at it as,
you know, like an exhibition more than a big match.
I don't know, it's it's a tough situation, and I
wish they had two more weeks to promote this in
a way rather than just one to kind of let
things settle in. But that's two more weeks of setting
a lot of TNA wrestlers aside in order to push
gcw AJ styles. In an interview with the PWI Weekly Podcast,

(01:15:29):
had some pretty sharp things to say, harsh things to
say about TNA, saying they never should have moved to
Monday nights. He even spoke out against RBD getting the
world title. He said, for the life of me, I
couldn't figure out. I was very surprised they didn't want
me to lose that title after holding it for so long.
And to somebody who hasn't been in wrestling for over
a year and came from WWE to win the world
title so quickly, he should have been tired from wrestling

(01:15:49):
a match before that against Jeff Hardy. I was very
conflicted on that. It was like, I have no idea
what's going on here anymore. I don't know how to
put it in words, I was pissed off. I don't
want to say that, But at the same time, I
was very confused. Okay, I guess I'm not the star
that I thought I was here at TNA. I guess
I'm just a TNA guy. Pretty strong comments from Styles.
What's your thought A on Style speaking out so harshly

(01:16:12):
and too the content of what he said, Yeah.

Speaker 7 (01:16:15):
I mean that's Aja has certainly squawked behind the scenes,
but this is the first time I can really remember
him going after the company publicly. He usually minds his
p's and q's when he does interviews. I mean, it's
no surprise that he was upset about dropping the title,
because at the time, if you recalled, I remember reporting
that he was upset that he lost the title. He

(01:16:35):
was also upset that Rob didn't hook his leg on
the finish, but I didn't think it would he'd still
be holding a grudge at this point over and I
thought he kind of would have moved on by now.
I mean, there it's no secret that there's a lot
of frustration amongst the longtime TNA wrestlers to kind of
see themselves his homegrown talent. Not liking it when the

(01:16:57):
company goes gaga over income former WWE talent. Where do
you stand down that way? I know where Bischoff has
said things publicly that he really doesn't get into that.
You know, it's it's about making it a better show. Basically,
do you think they should have feel some obligation to
taking better care of those T and A originals? I

(01:17:18):
guess we can call him.

Speaker 1 (01:17:19):
I you know, I think I think to a degree,
T and A just needs to do what they think
will make the most money for the company and keep
them in survival mode. And I think there's a let's
say that he kind of have played this out under
two extremes in order to kind of maybe come to
a fair opinion on this. If E CW was an
incredible coup, let's say that this was everybody agreed this

(01:17:40):
was unbelievable. They were able to sign Tommy Dreamer. Wow,
they got Tommy Dreamer. Let's say that was a big deal.
And and he would bring people with him from WWETV
and then to get Stevie Richards and Raven to agree
to come back after vowing they were retired for good.
And I mean, let's let's make this the best case scenario,
let's say ECW is bigger than it actually was. TNA
wrestlers would be happy because even if it was a

(01:18:02):
one off deal, a one month thing, maybe a little
follow up, it would bring a lot of old fans
back and and and perhaps increase the audience going forward.
So if it was good for TNA in the long run,
I think it's worth a little step back for the
TNA talent in terms of exposure and even a pay
per view pay day to have ECW come in and
elevate them through their mere presence. Okay, there's the other extreme.

(01:18:23):
Tommy Dreamer's washed up. People don't really know who he is.
It's poorly booked, it's rushed. We don't believe anybody from
ninety six, ninety seven, nine eight and have any interest
in watching these guys now they're growing up with kids
that was a whole lifetime ago, or you know, whatever
rationalization that you would have that it's just completely worthless, Well,
then it would be a complete It would be completely

(01:18:44):
understandably frustrating, and TNA could even imagine the TNA originals
could think, well, we had, especially if they had some
momentum going and this just screeched it to a halt,
then that's that's a negative. And I wrote this in
my VIP blog, you know, I wrote the best case
scenario and the worst case scenario for this holy CW thing.
And and in terms of my blog is more grounded

(01:19:04):
in reality, not Tommy Dreamers, this huge coupe. It's a sign.
But but nevertheless, if to me, it's fall somewhere in
between those two extremes. So I am sympathetic to people's
opinion who say this is this is just not fair.
Let us let the teen A guys do what we do.
This is it makes it seem like, you know, we're
not that important, we're lesser stars than these HW people

(01:19:25):
who come in and just swoop, you know, just take
away all our TV time. I get that. But if
there is some life to ECW, and so far it
hasn't showed up in the ratings despite the ratings increase
last week, it just it just was in a demographic
that just wouldn't be attracted to ECW. The twelve to
seventeen mail crowd and everything else is flat. So we'll
see this week if if there actually is a bump,

(01:19:46):
but if it does increase the audience in retrospect, maybe
more people will then be exposed to AJ styles and
and and know that Team three D is around and
around every week, and they'll like Matt Morgan and Hernandez
and and so the beer money and the machine guns. Well,
if it leads to a sustained increase in ratings and
it was good, so a not to be wish you watching,
but I understand frustration, but I also would temper that

(01:20:09):
say it's not open and shut, that this won't necessarily
maybe lead to some long term growth or putting them
on the map for people who otherwise didn't give them
a chance. Anytime you're watching WWE Raw or SmackDown or
aw Dynamite in particular, send us an email if you've
got thoughts on the show or a topic you want
us to address, or a question for us. Wadkeller Podcast

(01:20:33):
at pwtorch dot com. Weadkeller Podcast at pewtorch dot com.
If there's anything else going on in pro wrestling that
you want us to address on our main podcast during
our mailbank segments, that same email applies Wadkeller Podcast at
pw torch dot com. We invite that interaction. Let us
know what you think of what we're saying, and let
us know what you want us to talk about and

(01:20:54):
ask us specific questions. Wadkeller Podcast at PW Torch dot com.

Speaker 7 (01:21:00):
Yeah, fair take. I guess one other thing to add
regarding AJ is he obviously wasn't happy to see his
longtime friend Chrisopher Daniels be let go. And then there's
also the issue with Samoa Joe, which I reported a
week ago on the members site, and you can check
out the story that I posted for the first time

(01:21:22):
the day on the all access version of Pro Wrestling
dot Net with Joe blowing up backstage. I'm getting emails
saying that now PW Insider dot com has followed up
on that story, and it's saying that Samoa Joe has
actually been suspended as a result of him blowing up backstage,
and AJ's tight with him also, you know, it's I

(01:21:44):
think that as probably some of his frustration probably stems
from some of those issues as well. I mean, there's
probably something that's going to blow over. Maybe it's a
this is his cry for attention that he hasn't been
getting from from TNA. I think he makes valid points,
but I just think overall, yet you do what's best
for the company. This is entertainment. It's not about who's

(01:22:07):
been here the longest. It's you know, it's it may
not seem fair, but yeah, that's the way the wrestling
industry works. It's not all about seniority, or you'd see
a guy like Kane is your way in months well.

Speaker 1 (01:22:18):
With a final comment and then we'll go to phone calls.
Final comment for me is I think the problem with
AJ's criticism and I'm going to play both sides on
this also because I do see two sides. The problem
with it is Tena wasn't popping big ratings. Ratings were down,
and he was a champion, and it's not like he
caught fires champion. And I think to a certain extent,
AJ has to understand he worked for a company that

(01:22:42):
if things aren't going well, they're going to change direction.
And they went with Joe for a long time. They
went with They pushed Jeff Jarrett endlessly and repeatedly, and
AJ got a knife long run and it didn't deliver ratings.
And so he has to accept that. Now to his defense,
and this is where I think he should speak out.
It's say you know I was booked horribly. I'm as
poorly one week, I'm feuding with Kaz. The next week,

(01:23:03):
We're best friends again without explanation. I'm I'm had my
strengths weren't pushed on television. I've been over like he
can complain about bad booking, but I don't think he
can say I was producing as champion and drawing ratings.
And that's where I think, you know, you go, Well,
we got a hold of Rob Van Dam and my argument,
and I've said it to you Jason on this show.
I think just go with RVD all the way if
you're able to sign him. I don't think it matters

(01:23:25):
how long he's been away from wrestling. What matters is
can he make a difference. And TNA decided he's a
guy we want to give the type of push to
that wwe really held back on giving him and see
if that pops a rating. It hasn't worked out. I'd
say it's not rvd's fault entirely, although he does seem
to be kind of, you know, half heartedly approaching his
job and not totally totally engaged in what he's doing

(01:23:47):
most weeks.

Speaker 7 (01:23:48):
I think that's Robin general though, isn't it. I mean,
it's pretty much been that way for you. Maybe I
had more passion for ECW, but I don't remember him
seeming yes striking me as being overly passionate throughout most
of his WWE roon, unless it was for that night
stand pay per view.

Speaker 3 (01:24:01):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:24:02):
Bruce Mitchell, by the way, is in the chat room
if you want to join about fifty eight people right
now chatting live about this show and other subjects, including
Bruce Mitchell and somebody claiming to be Mike today, who
I'm going to strongly assume is not Mike, say go
ahead and join. And Bob Barker, by the way, I
also assume is not Bob Barker. So, but Bruce Mitchell

(01:24:22):
I believe really is Bruce Mitchell based on what I've
seen him say so far. So go ahead and chime
in on the chat room if you are listening to
us on iTunes and you want to listen to us
live and be part of the chat room experience, and
also perhaps call into the show. We are on from
five thirty to six thirty Eastern Tuesday through Friday, every
day Tuesday through Friday, and on Monday's Ron in the
hour preceding Raw, so from eight from eight to nine

(01:24:46):
Eastern we're on on Monday nights. I rotate as hosts
with James Caldwell and we have a different co host
every day during the show. And if you're listening to
us live on Blocoks but you don't get to hear
our show all the time, you can subscribe through iTunes.
Just to a search for pw Torch in iTunes and
you'll see all of our great products, including our free
iPhone app, which Jason you You've also got a pro

(01:25:08):
Wrestling dot Net app, so if people are have iPhones,
be sure to check that out. I should also know,
because I know we're Both of our sites are also
mobile phone friendly. If you've got a smartphone and you've
got a web browser, just log onto pw torch dot
com or what's your site, Jason.

Speaker 7 (01:25:24):
Pro wrestling dot Net.

Speaker 1 (01:25:25):
That's right, that's right. It's so hard to remember. Log
on on your on your phone's web browser and it's
customized for your for your mobile phone, so you'll see
a really cool phone layout, so you don't have to
have an iPhone to get that same experience that iPhone
users get. And thank you Bob Barker in the chat
room for saying that both apps are amazing. All right,
it is time to go to the phone lines. If

(01:25:46):
you want to get in a line. Who got five
people on hold? You can be number six. The number
is six four, six, seven, two one nine, eight to eight.
Let's go to our first caller, aera code eight one four.
Thanks for calling. Please stay your name and where you're from?

Speaker 3 (01:25:59):
Hey guys for Pittsburgh.

Speaker 1 (01:26:00):
Hey rich what's on your mind today?

Speaker 3 (01:26:02):
A couple of things? If you don't want it's wil
since I've called. Have you had a chance listened to
the Eric Fishoff interview from last night? No?

Speaker 1 (01:26:10):
Did you, Jason?

Speaker 7 (01:26:11):
No? But I spoke to him today and.

Speaker 3 (01:26:18):
I don't know what's worth to me more guys looking
at him to an interview we're watching triplets bickfoot people.
I mean, he is ridiculous, and I think he even
referenced your way in the interview. I'm about did you
do an editorial about the comparison of UFC and Rustling
and how it draws? And that he definitely referenced that interview.

Speaker 1 (01:26:36):
I Bruce Mitchell, and I know when a Bruce Mitchell
audio show did a commentary on our v at the
audio show talking about how you know just joh dropping
Lee Ludicrius, it is for Eric Bishops to say that,
you know, pro wrestling MMA aren't even apples and oranges.
It's like apples And I don't know what he said, like,
you know.

Speaker 3 (01:26:54):
Apples and bricks, but yeah, apples. Then he also said
today that it's not an ACW reunion, just like it
wasn't an NWL reunion.

Speaker 7 (01:27:03):
With the band.

Speaker 3 (01:27:03):
I mean, I don't know, but it looks like the
nw DE band that looks like DCW. I mean, that
guy is a complete denial and the things you'll do
for a paycheck. But the other fun I wanted to
bank is if it was real as far as WWE goes,
if you're the miss, if you have money in the bank,
wouldn't you wait the rubble Mania and work your way
up the ladder throughout the year and they're a file
shot knowing you have the briefcase in the background and

(01:27:25):
you can use that recase of rubble Mania. He wouldn't
that be logical?

Speaker 7 (01:27:29):
I don't.

Speaker 1 (01:27:30):
I mean, it's it's one approach to take. But I
think another approach that's logical is when a champions beat
down and looks like you can roll in the ring,
have a bell ring and win your first world title.
That's how Edge did it. That's how And I'll see
if a lot of guys have have have taken the
shortcut and if you can get that championship around your
waist and the winning the money in the bank gives
you that sort of unfair advantage, but you earned it
by beating a bunch of other guys and climbing the ladder.

(01:27:52):
Take advantage of it. So I think if the guy's
down and in the ring, why not go into WrestleMania
as the defending champion having having one world title. So
I think the approach that they're taking with miss is legit. Jason,
how about you.

Speaker 7 (01:28:05):
Yeah, I'm okay with it. You know, I think the
one guy who actually said he was gonna wait till
WrestleMania was mister Kennedy at the time, and unfore, you know,
he had his issues and was unable to even hold
on to the briefcase state to give it back to Edge.
I mean it if you look at it from a
financial standpoint, yeah, that that would be the move to
make since you guarantee yourself a WrestleMania main event. But

(01:28:28):
you know they don't really play it up that way either.
So I think from a storyline standpoint, you just you know,
pick your spot, hit that title, and you hope that
you can still headline Wrestlemani and be that champion at
that time.

Speaker 3 (01:28:41):
See, I don't think they had the paces to wait
anyway on that, and there was just no idea just
if it was real. But I totally agree with you
guys just looking at the other side. And then I
have one more thing of you mind, go ahead, thanks
you more about the shadow of Is there any chance
maybe in the future you can get guts to kind
of like maybe you know at fer Our or maybe
other roughly personalities And then we get Rich Swilly on

(01:29:03):
for a day.

Speaker 1 (01:29:07):
Jason. Thanks, thanks for cover Rich Jason. Would Rich Strolling
be a good guest co host on a live cast
of some sort?

Speaker 4 (01:29:19):
Yeah?

Speaker 7 (01:29:19):
Yeah, you can feel free to average.

Speaker 1 (01:29:21):
Right right now. I mean the format of the show
that we've we've done purposefully, and you know when we
started this we didn't know is we really wanted to
be a news driven, topical, caller centric show. That doesn't
mean we'll never have have guests on obviously something that
I thought about. I think that we've had plenty of
I think the idea of having the Torch staff and

(01:29:42):
obviously Jason in the mix as analysts and having a
consistent theme to the show during a really newsworthy first
you know, six months of the year. July was a
little bit drier, you know than it had been, but
with the whole Monday Night war in the WrestleMania and
then and then you know, during the Monday Night massacre
or whatever the route, there was a lot to talk about.
So I kind of like having a place to go

(01:30:03):
where we can just talk current events and not have to,
you know, worry about booking guests and spending a lot
of time talking talking to guests or having guest costs.
But that's not to say that we won't rotate some
people in and out. But I kind of like the
mix that we have and that we get to hear
from certain voices, you know, once a week in our
guest co host rotation. I mean, we have a few

(01:30:23):
other people on the tour to who want to get
into the mix more often too, and we might have
some news as far as that goes, So you know,
I mean, it's it's it's certainly not not a creaty succession,
and and and shaking up the format and having some
people from within the industry as guest host is something
that you know that that we certainly can considered down
the line. All right, let's go back to the phone lines.

(01:30:43):
Thanks for that call, Rich, good questions and topics. Let's
go to now Erico. Nine one oh. Please state your
name and where you're from. Hold on here. The switchboard
is refreshing, which may have been the problem. Nine one
oh one more chance. Oh there it is, okay, nine
one oh he is.

Speaker 6 (01:31:00):
Now you go to Hannibal for Filled with Killer.

Speaker 3 (01:31:02):
How y'all do it good?

Speaker 2 (01:31:03):
Hannibal?

Speaker 1 (01:31:03):
Have pat if we missed you there? What's up?

Speaker 7 (01:31:05):
Okay?

Speaker 22 (01:31:06):
Yes?

Speaker 6 (01:31:06):
I One question I want to ask, though, is back
I think back in what two thousand and three when
Goldberg versus the Rock, you know, I wanted to how
and they hated that Max like that? That could have
been a class that get books so raggedy like that
though Gilberg and Waistay at that time, who also, I
mean the rogers By to sabotized that whole back back then?

Speaker 3 (01:31:26):
I don't know.

Speaker 6 (01:31:26):
I guess you though, Man, don't believe that nicking it
stars out of people that got created somewhere else.

Speaker 1 (01:31:33):
You think Goldberg should have been featured more in.

Speaker 3 (01:31:38):
A better way.

Speaker 6 (01:31:38):
Yes, I wonder how to get over somebody, how to Goldberg?
Will let somebody that go it out, because I feel like,
here'll weveil against the concept like that.

Speaker 1 (01:31:46):
You know, I've Hannibal, I've talked a lot about Goldberg.
I am, I am a critic of Goldberg, and not
to do a long rant on it. But Bill Goldberg
wasn't interested in being a w W a superstar, you know,
and and I and I say that term use ww's terminology.
He didn't want to go on the road full time
and dedicate himself to getting better and played by those rules.

(01:32:06):
Goldberg was was and and I'm not saying it didn't
work hard. What he did is is to accomplish what
he did and get as good as he was in
the ring is more than most people can do. But
it was a lot less than most people in wrestling
at his level had to go through. It was nothing
compared to Steve Boston, nothing compared to to Triple Ah
or Rick Flair. I mean and and so there was
some resentment against Goldberg, but part of the resentment was

(01:32:27):
Goldberg kind of Bruce's in the chat room going oh no,
But Goldberg did live a privileged existence and when he
went to WWE, and there's people who disagree with me
on this and thinks WW should have just blown up
the whole pay structure and blown up the whole the
whole everything in order to accommodate Golberg. But Goldberg had
a certain attitude that did rub people the wrong way,

(01:32:48):
and I just think history history shows that that was
the case. So I think the idea that WW is
going to go take Goldberg from WW when when he
was a very below average talker of very below average
worker with one formula that worked and he didn't really
grow out of it.

Speaker 3 (01:33:04):
I just don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:33:04):
WWE was ready to start putting their guys, putting him
over on their guys. Was there sabotage that cost WWE money. Yes,
I'm not saying they handled him perfectly. You know, putting
the wig on him in the first show and stuff
like that was pretty crazy. But I'd almost back and go, boy,
you know, Goldberg was just ready to be a big
breakout start for WWE. There were some politics that I

(01:33:25):
think were so much justified on WWE's part that caused
them to be somewhat hesitant to push him in the
same way that ww did. Jason, what's your take on
Goldberg Rock or just kind of that whole Goldberg chapter
of WWE.

Speaker 7 (01:33:37):
I guess I've always wondered, if WWE spent the money
to bring him in, why not push him in a
way that you know makes money. And if you don't
feel like that's the path to take, then why bring
him in at all?

Speaker 1 (01:33:49):
Yeah, I mean there's an argument for that. I think
that I think WW felt they could get a middle ground,
which is, we're gonna make some money off of this guy,
but not for a second, are we gonna treat a
guy who's talked about the wrestling in the st and
and thinks he's all that when he hasn't paid, you know,
has hasn't paid the hasn't dedicated himself to learning his
craft in a way where we don't have to just

(01:34:10):
walk through everything and worry about him hurting people and
worry about him him not dedicating himself to really getting
his promo found and that type of thing. I just, yeah,
I just I just look back, and I mean, it's
a whole thing about ww had. There's a reason ww
wan out of business. And Bruce has said he's really
upset right now in the in the chat room. But
Bruce has had his say on this.

Speaker 18 (01:34:36):
Are you a fan of AW looking to sit back,
relax and listen to some like minded podcasters who share
your passion.

Speaker 19 (01:34:43):
Do you want to be topped off the ledge after
a segment that has you wondering what the heck are
they thinking?

Speaker 18 (01:34:48):
Do you want to join a discussion on what AW
is doing right and what they could do to improve?
Then join me, Joel and me Greg for.

Speaker 19 (01:34:56):
The All Elite Conversation Club every Friday on the PW
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Speaker 1 (01:35:24):
All right, Hannibal, thanks for the call. Let's keep rolling calls.
I don't want uh, Bruce says, you're on point. By
the way, Jason, Yeah, all right, Eric code five O nine,
please state your name and where you're from.

Speaker 2 (01:35:38):
Hey, it's Jared and General Washington.

Speaker 1 (01:35:40):
If Jared, what's on your mind today?

Speaker 2 (01:35:42):
Well, actually have kind of a question for both of
you guys. That's probably the only thing that can answer it.
A few weeks ago, you guys had like a mystery.

Speaker 4 (01:35:48):
Caller calling at the last name of the show claim
he was a ww ryder.

Speaker 2 (01:35:51):
You guys are gonna follow up on that, Sathan.

Speaker 7 (01:35:54):
I did have one guy told me that he swears
he's heard the voice before. Buddy couldn't play who it was,
And that was about the extent of it. It just
sounded like I didn't even read what was written, but
I just know that after the show is over. In
the chat room, the regulars kind of felt like it
wasn't a Legit wasn't a legit person. He just didn't
know some of the things they thought he should know.

(01:36:16):
So I didn't really do a ton of investigating on it,
to be honest with.

Speaker 1 (01:36:18):
You, Yeah, I mean I honestly, Jared, I mean I
didn't care that much. There's been I know, Jason, how
many writers in the in the last eleven twelve years
and through one four left have there been in through
the doors through evolving doors to WWE, and for somebody
to show up and not know who we are, call
the show and then start lecturing us on things that
sound ten years out of date. I was just like, Okay,
you might be legit, you might not, but I'm not

(01:36:39):
going to mark out for some guy who had a
couple of copy in WWE and then calls up out
of touch and starts lecturing us without really knowing who
we are and what our background is. So it just
I didn't really care beyond you.

Speaker 7 (01:36:49):
You did extend to him if you wanted to email
you and I did, yeah, yeah, and I'm assuming you
didn't he didn't take that offer, cephel Yeah, and.

Speaker 1 (01:36:58):
If somebody in the chat room said that that was
Jamie Morris was the guy's name, but he wouldn't even
say his name. You know, it's like, I mean, if
you know, it just doesn't it just doesn't make sense.
So any yeah, go ahead, Jared, You've probably got more
than that.

Speaker 3 (01:37:12):
Yeah. I did think that was really awkward.

Speaker 2 (01:37:14):
Anyway. I guess my real question today is what do
you guys think of Natalia's performance last night.

Speaker 1 (01:37:18):
In the Divas match?

Speaker 10 (01:37:18):
I mean, speaking like three moves she kind of like
showed that she was like the best TVA.

Speaker 2 (01:37:22):
They have on the roster. I just can't believe she's
not put.

Speaker 7 (01:37:25):
It better than she is.

Speaker 1 (01:37:25):
They need to keep her out of the ring. I mean,
she's showing up all the other diva. She's showing what
it actually looks like to be an actual wrestler who
doesn't look like some model plucked out of a talent
agency who's told you're gonna have to do some calisthetics
and learn how to do cartwheels and elbows in the
corner like she actually, you know, it shows what a
division could be like if if you had a lot
more people like her, and a lot, you know, a
lot fewer people who are just there because of how

(01:37:46):
they look in the swimsuit.

Speaker 7 (01:37:47):
Yeah. I thought Natalia and Gail Kim last night did
more in that match than we've seen the usual suspect
divas do in a long time. So I actually can
give that a rare hit to a divas match, all right, anything.

Speaker 1 (01:38:02):
Else shared, No, that's the years of a good day.
Thanks a lot, cool, Thanks a lot, Appreciate your culture,
all right. The number is six four, six, seven, two,
one nine eight two eight that's six four, six seven eight.
You're listening to the PW Torch Live cast, and I
am Wade Teller, editor of the Progressing Torch newsletter and
PW torch dot Com, joined today by Jason Powell of

(01:38:25):
Pro Wrestling dot Net. Jason, go ahead and give a
plug for your membership site, because beyond the free website
and free app, if people are are interested in signing
up for your membership site, you've got some uh, some
some good features that they get once you go ahead
and get a plug and tell people how to sign up.

Speaker 7 (01:38:40):
Absolutely, there's a ton of audio over there. Got some
interviews coming up that I won't go into because the
one time I advertise somebody in advance that blew up
in my face. So we won't go down that road,
just just like I've learned that lesson too. Yeah, there
are some interviews in the works though, and uh, you
get the first look at news. The story making the
rounds today about Samoa Job going up backstage was actually

(01:39:01):
posted one week ago today in the dot net members section,
and I haven't seen it anywhere else since then until today.
So you also get the first look at the Randy
Orton news and what he was so upset about last
week and I'm raw. We get that up, I think
either late Monday night or sometime Tuesday, and so you
do get the first look at member exclusive news. And

(01:39:23):
the best part is you can sign up for as
little as five dollars and fifty cents per month if
you take the annual option. And all you have to
do is hop on over to pro Wrestling dot net
and you'll see the sign up area on the main page.
And while you're there, check out the conversation recap that
I posted today regarding a phone conversation I had this
morning with Eric Bischoff regarding the new TNA reaction show,

(01:39:45):
Hulkogan's Future, and a lot more.

Speaker 1 (01:39:47):
Cool it stuff. Big Yeah, definitely a big name to
be talking and giving some news items. Eric Bishop over
at prothonot net check that out. It's will time in
the chat room says, I'm a member of dot net
and it is awesome, the best news site on the net.
And Bruce Mitchell says, don't forget that big exclusive you
haven't released, Jason, he.

Speaker 7 (01:40:09):
Can release that one anytime. He watched you.

Speaker 1 (01:40:11):
I don't even know what's going on here. Bruce is
much more captious on the chat room than he is
on audio shows. I don't even know what that means.

Speaker 7 (01:40:19):
And for the through the shadow who asked, you can
sign up for as little as five dollars and fifty
cents a month if you take the annual option seven
dollars fifty cents if you want to go monthly.

Speaker 1 (01:40:28):
Sounds good. All right, let's go back to the phone
lines and go to ericode A for seven. Thanks for calling.
Please state your name and where you're from.

Speaker 10 (01:40:36):
Hey, guys, it's Eugenia from Chicago.

Speaker 1 (01:40:38):
Hey, Eugene, good hear for me. What's what's going to
mind today?

Speaker 10 (01:40:41):
Two guys, A real quick, A couple of Danny things.
First off, I read something on PW Tours I think
it was James Caudwell, and he was doing a little
He's talking about the TNA ratings from last week, and
basically he said that he thought of the main reason
why Impacts ratings went up was because there were more
twelve to seventeen year olds watching Jersey Shore that Thursday night.

Speaker 3 (01:40:59):
For their debut.

Speaker 10 (01:41:00):
Made no sense to me at all, because TNA's ratings
went up in the second hour, had the head against Jerseys.

Speaker 1 (01:41:05):
Or so I mean figure that you know this. This
actually came from a cable industry source we have who
pretty much for livings for the we can't get into
the company, but for the company worse, where he studies
ratings for a living, and he wrote us to correct
us when we were saying the rating went up maybe
ECW was taking hold. And he broke down the demographics

(01:41:26):
and he looks at these every day of the week
as part of his job, and he saw that the
only demographic where TNA increased was twelve to seventeen year
old males. That every other demographic was flat or down.
And his argument was looking at the ratings. There was
a huge spike in cable television that night in twelve
to seventeen year old males because a lot of people

(01:41:48):
came his idea with a lot of people were watching
cable because of Jersey's Sure and so they either watched
in larger numbers in the first hour and then some
of them may have stuck around in channel flip during
your is be sure, but the argument and you can
buy it or not buy it. But there's some statistical
evidence to this that when it's just sort of like

(01:42:09):
what happened with Ron Nitro. When more people are excited
to tune in and stay home and watch cable for
any reason, a lot of other shows in that key
demographic tend to benefit. And so it may have been
a case where people were flipping channel during commercial and
didn't worn't committed one hundred percent to watching the whole
show or the demographic. Because I only got the demo
ratings for the entirety of the show. Maybe they were

(01:42:30):
just a lot higher either right before right after Jersey Shore.
You said it was in the second hour, So that's
where that logic came from. Came from somebody who's got
a pretty sharp buy for that kind of thing, I think,
And at least gave his industry analyst expert analysis of
why it would be wrong to credit ECW for the
rating spike, because it's just it's common sense probably that

(01:42:54):
the key demo for ECW would not be twelve to
seventeen year old male. So at the very least, since
every other demo was flow, crediting EASTW would be wrong.
Why was the twelve seventy demo up? Well, that demo
was up for the entire evening overall, and the feeling
was Jersey Shore brought more people to their TV sets
because of it. You make a good common sense point too,
which is why they went head to head. Why would
they benefit? But you could say the same thing about

(01:43:15):
Ron Nitro back in the day. You know that their
peak ratings came at the same time, so at a
lot of kids who would have been doing something else
that night decided to watch cable and some of them
floated over to Impact. And I think that's kind of
it just seemed.

Speaker 10 (01:43:26):
Not because every I believe every quarter hour for the
second hour was higher than every quarter out of the
first hour going ahead to head with Jersey Shore. So
I mean, I get what you're saying.

Speaker 1 (01:43:34):
Yeah, I mean it seems I may have counterintuitive. I mean,
you bring up a Coo punt, It does seem a
little counterintuitive. I just think that the spike was so
great that there might have been enough left over to
even give TNA a boost in that demo, even up
against Jersey Shore.

Speaker 2 (01:43:46):
Right, Yeah, I think.

Speaker 10 (01:43:47):
Then one other thing running TNA, I guess you know,
the August fault is kind of like you know, they're
airing the matches that were supposed to air at Hard
Justice before they decide on the ECW thing. So if
that does a decent number, I mean, are there any
plans or are they looking into it all and doing
like you know, quarterly Clash with the Champion style shows
it all?

Speaker 1 (01:44:07):
You know on a regular basis, Jason, what have you
heard on that?

Speaker 7 (01:44:10):
I know it's been discussed. It's you know, anytime TNA
can get additional programming from Spike TV, they're going to
take it because that's additional money in the conference. But
I don't know this Spike TV is willing to go
forward with that idea, and I wouldn't be surprised if
some of it hinges on how well they can promote
this whole Evan show as they're calling it, the pay

(01:44:31):
per view Caliber Lineup special that they're going to do
in the usual time slot a week from Thursday. But
you know, I think TNA would love to have it,
and I just don't know that Spike's gonna really be
open to the idea of just giving them what they
want until the ratings really do make a dramatic improvement
on Thursday nights on a regular basis.

Speaker 10 (01:44:54):
Cool, that's all I got.

Speaker 1 (01:44:54):
Well, thanks all right, cool, Thank you to appreciate your
call that just since we brought up here. The lineup
for the wholef and Show Impact Special a week from
Thursday is Robbandam against Abyss for the TNA World title.
MotorCity machine Guns against Beer Money in the match that
would have been on pay per view, the best of
five match five, assuming there's a fifth match, Wink Wink
Kurt Angle against aj Styles number seven versus number six

(01:45:17):
on the Top ten Rankings, Knockouts Champion Madison Rain against
Angelina Love for the Knockouts title. Jeff Hardy has an
open challenge, Mister Anderson against Matt Morgan against the Pope
in a three way match, and then ink Ink against
Generation Me in a number one contenders match for the
TNA taking titles. Glad to see them actually having a
number one contenters match with the taking titles, giving that

(01:45:37):
match some meaning. It would be nice if Generation Me
had been on TV at all, you know, recently, getting
some TV time, that would justify them even being considered
a top four contender. But maybe they'll look good enough
in that match to justify it, or Inkank will win.
Most likely I think it would be I mean, I
think TNA would be smart. And we've talked about this, Jason,
cutting back the number of papers as they have and

(01:45:57):
giving Spike TV some quarterly specials they really build up
in place of the pay per view. You know, if
they went to quarterly as I would push for, or
you said, maybe every o the month is a heavy
middle ground. If they did that on the off months
they could do they could have a Spike TV special
and maybe pop a rating that would get enough AD
revenue that combined with presumably a boost in the buy

(01:46:20):
rate from not being on every single month, maybe it
would be a wash for TNA or even greater profit.
And it would make Spike haavy because the Spike TV's
in the situation how where they need their ratings score
up there they're struggling right now. Overall they're programming us
Gone Downhill, and there's some and TNA is getting some
blame for that for the lousy year that they've had
after the big chance they took early in the year.

(01:46:42):
And you know, with all due respect Derek Bischoffs, you know,
he was part of the He and Hulk Cogan and
obviously Dixie Carter and Vince Russeau and a lot of them,
do is their blame for blowing an opportunity with a
much bigger payroll, with a lot of lousy shows that
you know, a lot of us detailed week after week,
our frustrations and other than a one week reprieve here,
and a lot of those same mistakes are made over
and over and kind of a jaw dropping out of

(01:47:03):
touch matter. So I am all. I'm all for Spike
TV trying to find a way to get TNA to
encourage them to get their ratings up and for them
to have a more mutually beneficial relationship because Spike needs
TNA and TNA needs Spike, but TNA needs to have
their acts together to make it work.

Speaker 7 (01:47:23):
Yeah, and let's be honest, GNA needs Spike a lot
more than Spike needs TNA, and I think TNA would
love to reduce the number of pay per views. I
think it's just a case of them being contractually obligated,
and I've tried to find out how long that obligation
is and just haven't been successful. They don't want to
release that information.

Speaker 1 (01:47:43):
And I agree with you, TENA needs Spike more, but
Spike is not. I mean, Spike doesn't have a lot
of hits and when t is when TNA is clicking
demographically as they were late last year and they're down
this year. I mean, if if Eric Bischoff, if things
were flipped over, if the ratings that they were drawing
last fall versus the last six months were flipped, Eric

(01:48:05):
would be bragging about it, you know, because he knows
how he knows how important demographics are, and he can
break that down. And you know what comes across with
kind of a condescending tone. I think would all agree.
Eric would lecture us on how we'll look at this.
You know, this may be that, but if you really
break it down, Eric knows it's not good. Now, it's
not all Eric's fault. Eric's hardly the dominant voice in TNA,
and he may be as frustrated as anybody and just

(01:48:26):
being a good company person by not speaking out, as
maybe aj Styles did in that PWI Weekly interview. But nevertheless,
it's not It has not been a rating success on
any level for TNA, and Spike is feeling it in
terms of where they're ranked on cable networks and there's
pressure for them to there's pressure overall for Spike to
deliver better. It doesn't help that USC is down to

(01:48:48):
the USC rerun programming, the Unleashed shows and their specials.
They're not doing a lot either. USC got overexposed last
year and they paid a price this year also, so
what is it? There's some what's the show that's kind
of a hit? Not Wild Kingdom, there's some show that
they have, Oh, Deadliest Warrior. That's the best thing that
Spike has going right now outside of USC, and they

(01:49:10):
may develop more shows in that realm. And TNA is
actually going to fall, you know, kind of down on
their priority list because right now, and this is the
latest info, Impact has not appeared in the top fifty
in any demographic and Impact hasn't even made the top
fifty since their January special. So as another sign of
dire straits a TNA is And according to our cable

(01:49:32):
industry source, you don't have to wait for the way
Keller Prog Wrestling post show to find out what I
thought of Monday Night Raw and SmackDown. Each week, you
can check out my reports that are updated live throughout
Raw and SmackDown at pw toorch dot com. My written
report will tell you what's happening in detail in case

(01:49:54):
you missed the show and it will also analyze key
segments and give my random thoughts enquips on what I
am watching as it airs. So check it out every
Monday night and Tuesday night at pewtorch dot com. That
also applies to WWE pay per views. I cover those
live at pw torch dot com with a detailed written
report with star ratings, and of course you can find

(01:50:14):
other TV reports from other contributors to pw torch such
as nxt roh, Impact Wrestling, and more. Check it out
pw torch dot com your first stop for TV and
pay per view written reports.

Speaker 7 (01:50:36):
All right, let's well, I was just going to say,
you know, and when you see number, you know, information
like that where they're they're struggling, and you think at
some point maybe you'd point the finger blame it creative
more than they have. But yeah, just doesn't seem like
that's happening.

Speaker 1 (01:50:51):
I know in Jericho, even Chris Jericho spoke out. He
talked about, you know, there's so many bookers doing so
many of the same things. He was pretty outspoken to
in a way that I kind of wondered, what are
what are the w W booker's going to think? What
Jericho's saying that it just seems like it's the same
thing over and over again in WWE. Let me say
if I can find the quote right off here.

Speaker 7 (01:51:11):
I'm beginning to think christ Jericho really doesn't give it
damn because he knows that his contract is coming up,
and you know, I think he probably feels like he
has some leverage with WWE. Whether that's the case or not,
I'm guessing. And he thinks he's in a place where,
you know, he feels like they probably need him more
than he needs them, because he's got other outside ventures

(01:51:32):
that you know, maybe aren't going to pay as much,
but he can still make ends meet without any issues.

Speaker 1 (01:51:37):
Yeah, and he's talked to TNA before, and in the
Sean Davis group that is in the very formative stages
right now, is making some pretty big promises.

Speaker 19 (01:51:44):
You know.

Speaker 1 (01:51:44):
I think, well, I'll talk more about him when someone
catches the check from that promotion. But Greg and I'll
partly list into a plug for the Torch Newsletter this
week too, because I haven't done that yet. We just
put the p tw B Torch Newsletter online, issue one
and sixty two. Yes, we've been doing it every week,
dating back to the late eighties and and the cover
story column from Greg Parks takes a look at the

(01:52:09):
new national promotion that's on the horizon, that's that's getting
increasing buzz headed up by Sean Davis out of Florida,
with some uh some big backing from Milton Wilpon, who
is part of the family that owns the New York
Mets baseball team. I mean, this could turn out to
be nothing. It could turn out that they've got a
great TV partner just ready to you know, unroll and

(01:52:29):
spend millions and and make TNA number three almost overnight.
There's a we'll see, there's a lot lot less to
go there. But Greg Parks has his feature column detailing
that in this week's Progressing Torture Newsletter, which we just
put online. Also Part two of Bruce Mitchell's Marathon TNA Manifesto.
Part two of two, Part one ran last week. It's

(01:52:49):
a map that Bruce Mitchell has has drawn out for
te and A utilize what's available to them either that
they currently have or reasonably could probably attain and have
a chance of success. So it's not complaining about what's
TNA is doing wrong. It's saying here, here is what
Bruce thinks would work. From his years and years of
what decades of watching wrestling, studying the industry, studying the numbers,

(01:53:11):
objectively reading almost every book that's all there, from every
great booker and every great promoter, and obviously having a
lot of conversations with a lot of smart people in
the industry and outside of it for many years. He
sat down and wrote the TNA Manifesto. Lots of good
comments in the VIP member comment area on this column.
Somebody said we should keep it as a spotlight article
for six months, just so maybe TNA would read it

(01:53:32):
and implement some of some of his somewhat common sense.
I mean, it's not like there's some radical makeover. My
columns on TNA have been more here's a radical change
they can make with Bruce, it's all. I won't say
it's not radical, because for TNA it is. But it's
not like there's some one line catch idea of oh
pretend that you're USC or or do everyone wear masks,
Cause it's not gimmicky. It's just getting down to the

(01:53:52):
fundamentals of what Bruce thinks ultimately ultimately draws. So that's
a big feature in this week's Prossing Torture newsletter. As
I said, the PDF of that new letter and also
the text for the entire newsletter is online exclusively for
VIP members right now. Also the WW and TNA newswires
with my newsletter exclusive analysis of some of the biggest
stories of the week. Sean Radikin as a page over

(01:54:13):
a page of the top stories on the independent scene
for the week. Brian Hoops in the pdf has his
Nostalgia column, a full page of the latest to nostalgia,
Greg Gania's new career analysis comparing Nick Blockwinkle, Bob Ackland.

Speaker 7 (01:54:27):
And.

Speaker 1 (01:54:29):
Harley Race. There three champions around the same time in
around the nineteen eighty mark in pro wrestling, an update
from NWA fan Fest, and also the Baron Bondraskie documentary.
So Brian always picked up some cool stuff. He's very
plugged into the nostalgia scene and the week and Hits
and Misses with John Mazzera, the reports, my reports on

(01:54:51):
Raw and SmackDown. I'm slipping all over youre trying to
remember everything, so I don't leave anybody out. And page
two Buzz with Jason Powell with a lot of behind
the scenes news on on TNA's hardcore justice developments. So
all that and more in this week's PW torch dot
com or Poprosinc. Torch newsletter if you're interested in a
VIP membership, which includes a PDF of that newsletter every week,

(01:55:12):
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out PW torch dot com slash go vip for full

(01:55:35):
subscription information giving you details on what comes with the
membership and what the pricing is. That's PW torch dot
com slash go viip. If you want to get a
line on the phone banks, we only got a couple
of people on hold, so you can get right in.
The number is six four six seven to one nine
A two eight six four six seven to one ninety

(01:55:56):
eight twenty eight is the number. We've got twelve minute
left on the show. Let's go back to the phone
lines and thanks seven to one nine for holding. Please
stake your name and where you're from.

Speaker 2 (01:56:04):
It's Daniel from Colorado.

Speaker 1 (01:56:06):
Hey Daniel, what's on your mind today?

Speaker 7 (01:56:09):
Well?

Speaker 23 (01:56:10):
I was wondering about this interesting push toward the Great Colleague.

Speaker 9 (01:56:15):
I know it's because he's in the main.

Speaker 23 (01:56:18):
Event match, but do you think they're actually gonna do
something with him, asked SummerSlam, Or if this is just
a one time thing, and do you.

Speaker 8 (01:56:29):
Think it's a good deal?

Speaker 1 (01:56:31):
Jathan, what do you think?

Speaker 7 (01:56:32):
I don't know where they're going with that, but it's interesting.
I actually gave it a hit today. I don't I
can listen to anyone who says they don't want to
see calling in that match. I get it. But the
fact is he is in the match, and they've done
a good job over the last couple of weeks of
taking him from being just an all out comedy guy
who dances around might do the kiss cam thing and

(01:56:55):
gave him a compelling storyline where he's being recruited by
Next is so over, you know, two to three week period,
they've actually made me care more than I thought I
ever would about what's going on with Great Colleague.

Speaker 1 (01:57:08):
I'm a little less of a fan. I mean, I
understand Vince always likes to have somebody who's he likes
to have the kind of the freak show on hold
and great Collie comes across to somebody who's there strictly
for its size. I mean, he kind of looks like
he's wobbling on stilts as he watched to the Ring.
He doesn't have a lot of grace in the Ring.
I think they made him such a comedy figure it's
a little more difficult to take him seriously. They had
that TNA like one week breakup with Runge and Sing

(01:57:30):
and Colleigue, which is now seemingly forgotten about or or
or pushed off to the side. I mean, I don't.
I mean I'm not. It's not like the worst idea ever,
but it just it's hard for me to take him
seriously when I think people kind of see through him.
But it's part of Vince's formula, and it's I don't
think it's over I don't think it's booked big footing
or overshadow anything. It's it's not it's not like they're

(01:57:53):
giving him a monster push right now. He's just happens
to be in that main event and it's probably a
one off thing. It's I don't think they're gonna be
putting him in any pay per view world title matches anymore.
I think that you know, they did that several years back,
and I don't think he'll be going back there. Of
course I said that about Kine, but Glenn Jacobs is
a lot more polished of a worker than great colleague

(01:58:15):
Daniel anything else.

Speaker 4 (01:58:17):
Yeah, I also had a question about the.

Speaker 9 (01:58:21):
About the Hall of Fame the Hall of Fame this year.
I know there's been a lot of names running around,
like who's gonna headline it like Savage or Warrior, But
who do you think is gonna be coming in like
other names to to fill it out? Like do you

(01:58:41):
think Jim Duggan or even honky tonks Man?

Speaker 23 (01:58:44):
People like the one note.

Speaker 9 (01:58:46):
Gimmicks, but we're really over at their time. Do you
think they'll be given a chance?

Speaker 8 (01:58:52):
Jason?

Speaker 1 (01:58:52):
You want to take that?

Speaker 13 (01:58:53):
Sure?

Speaker 7 (01:58:54):
I think it's gonna have a WCW flavor because they're
in Atlanta and I gosh, I can't even remember, but
my guess is that this would be a year for
Ron Simmons just because he in a first African American
WCW heavyweight champion. I could definitely see them going with
Tullian arn this year, which I think would be great.
I'd love to see them induct the Midnight Express, but

(01:59:16):
the political situation, which with outspoken Jim Cortnett, might prevent
that from happening if stings contractually free. Jim Ross even
wrote about that today in his blog. So I do
think there's gonna be a heavy WCW flavor as far
as the headliner goes. Yeah, I mean, yeah, they're gonna
reach it. You know. It sounds like already reaching out
to Warrior again. Savage I've seen as believing. They seems

(01:59:40):
like they've made some progress in their relationship with him,
just because they did put out the DVD, and I
think the action figure thing is more of a ma
ATel thing than a WWE deal. But they I know
that the mindset is that they would love to have
the headliner, but if they can't get one, they feel
as though they've done a good enough job of estabis
pushing the Hall of Fame that if they have just

(02:00:02):
a solid class and then they can mix in a
couple of big name presenters a Steve Austin and Rock
you know, some of the guys we've seen lately. So
even if there's not a true headline recipient or inductee,
there can always be some big name presenters to kind
of make up for that.

Speaker 1 (02:00:19):
All right, Daniel, thanks for a call. Let's move on
to aera code seven to one eighth. You're on the
shelfy stage name and where you're from?

Speaker 3 (02:00:26):
Say?

Speaker 14 (02:00:26):
Are you doing the Soviet calling from the system?

Speaker 1 (02:00:29):
Hey, elliot, what's on your mind today?

Speaker 14 (02:00:33):
I had a question about I'm sure you don't feel
like you've talked about this stuff about Percy Watson. Yeah,
so it seems like there's a bit of a I guess,
a polarizing reaction to his gimmick as it were right now,
and I was wondering, Like, honestly, the first time I
saw him, I kind of was a little repulsed because

(02:00:56):
of his old stick with the I guess Chruce Mitchell
called it Eddie Murphy like sugar characters things. I kind
of felt like, But then it started getting a reaction
from some people. But I felt like the minute I
saw it, I was like, well, why is it that
when there's an African American wrestler he had to be
playing this kind of this dancing, pandering character and then

(02:01:18):
the reason I the more I thought about it, I
was like, well, what if he were an African American
would it get over? And I don't know that it would.
And then I think of Jid and things like that.
So I wanted to know if that's more if it's
an indictment on the wrestling audience that actually respond to this,
or if it's more the promoters who are pushing this.

Speaker 2 (02:01:39):
And before you go up and.

Speaker 24 (02:01:41):
Running, I just want to, Like, I looked at things
like Eddie Grow when he got to the V all
of a sudden, his accent became heavier, all of a sudden,
he spoke more essay, and it's as opposed to like
proper English, which she showed he could.

Speaker 3 (02:01:52):
Do for years in WCW. And then I think of
how like Booker T's speech changed a little also as
he got to THEE.

Speaker 14 (02:02:00):
So if you and Jason that that would be awesome cool.

Speaker 1 (02:02:05):
Thanks Elliott, A good question. I think part of what
we see with with I mean, I think Percy Watson's
trying to stand out and and I think he's there's
a natural charisma there that I that I think can
be redirected where I think if he can if he
can become a competent worker in the ring. Not not

(02:02:26):
anybody could pull off what he's doing. You can. You
can question the wisdom of what he's doing. He can
even question whether there's a racial racist element to even
having him do it. I would say, wwe by having
you know, uh Tarbor and Otonga and and even our
truth sons, the the that one, the one or two
weeks with that horrible, horrible skit that I still need

(02:02:48):
an answer for what they were doing with that. There's
enough other people. It's not like every single black person
who marches in that company ends up with some really demeaning,
questionably racist gimmick. I think I think he's first Watson
is trying to be something over the top, and Bruce
Mitchell says the Stephen Fetche character, But I think the
guy playing Percy Watson and what he puts into that character,

(02:03:12):
I'm I'm believe there's an upside to that. I don't
obviously think what he's exactly doing now is the main
event gimmick. But I haven't been overtly offended by it,
even if I kind of like to unseen a few times,
I've grown Jason, You're pretty Ricky by the way, was
the name of that art Truth thing, which was just ridiculous.

(02:03:33):
But Jason, where are you on on Percy Watson? And
and you know how how he's portrayed a week week?

Speaker 7 (02:03:39):
Yeah, I'm okay with it right now. I guess I've
been more annoyed by the by the stupid glasses than
anything else. I just I wish I knew what his
true personality was, and because I mean, you got every
once in a while you gotta actually take that into
the equations you and ask yourself, is this just him

(02:03:59):
or is he playing a character? And I just don't know.

Speaker 1 (02:04:03):
Yeah, Yeah, I mean he's He's a lightning rod right now.
And I think part of part of it, part of
his the goal is to get people talking about it.
I mean, I think the classes are meant to annoy you.
Obviously they're meant to annoy us. The question is do
they do they annoy us in a way that makes
us take him a lot less seriously as a performer
and distract from his money potential or is it the
kind of thing that makes you stand out when a

(02:04:25):
lot of these guys in the in the in the
NXT Rookie classes kind of blend in, and clearly we're
talking about him right now and not not others in
the NXT class, and and that's part of why he's
doing it. Anyway, we're not a few minutes here. Let's
try to get everybody, everybody on the show, who's on hold? Ellie,
thanks for call, Please call again. Let's go to Eric
Godes seven five to seven. Thanks the Complease state your

(02:04:46):
name and where you're from.

Speaker 4 (02:04:49):
Hello, this is Els.

Speaker 1 (02:04:50):
I'm sorry, didn't catch your name, Ed Sol, what's up?

Speaker 3 (02:04:56):
Yeah, I'm sorry.

Speaker 6 (02:04:57):
If you've already discussed this, I want to know your
opinion on I'm promoting the movie last Night a Row
and not missing in the rock.

Speaker 1 (02:05:06):
Jathon.

Speaker 7 (02:05:07):
Yeah, I don't know why they didn't. That's an odd
decision by w WEE and he probably an even honor
decision by whoever sent in the trailer for that movie
to not showcase him in that specifically for that rock crowd.
I thought Will Ferrell or Mark Wahlberg would at least
mention that he was in it. I don't know if
they were given some kind of heads up that they're

(02:05:28):
not supposed to or what the deal was, But yeah,
very very strange.

Speaker 1 (02:05:31):
Called by w w A they don't want Rock on
their TV show until he revealed himself as the Mysterytum.

Speaker 7 (02:05:37):
But is it going to do them and he favors
and I know you're being facetious with that way, but
is it gonna do them any favors with the relationship
with Dwayne Johnson to not at least acknowledge that he's
in this movie and kind of put it over in
a big way.

Speaker 1 (02:05:52):
Yeah, I don't know. You know, the only possibility is
they didn't want to take the wrestling heat away from
John Cena's movie premiere. Yeah.

Speaker 7 (02:05:58):
I suppose, yeah, you know, I mean, I mean, feel.

Speaker 1 (02:06:00):
Legitimate approach to take if you're within WWE and you've
got a lot more money on the line with Sena
and if Rock's not going to show up, but let's
not have Rock bigfoot Sena true. Yeah. Bruce Mitchell, for
whatever it's worth, says that said Wade speaking of big
footing Jason, why is Bruce Mitchell bigfooting us in the
in the chat room comment? What does he think he is?

Speaker 7 (02:06:19):
I think you're letting him by acknowledging him. I just
try to I just try to. Bruce Mitchell whenever it can.

Speaker 1 (02:06:24):
That is the irony. I'm complaining about it, and all
I have to do is ignore him. Thanks for the call,
and so let's uh, let's go to Ericode eight one four.
Please state your name and where you're from.

Speaker 13 (02:06:33):
Hi, this is Dominic from Pennsylvania.

Speaker 1 (02:06:35):
Hey, Dominic, what's up?

Speaker 6 (02:06:37):
Hey a whole lot.

Speaker 12 (02:06:37):
I just got a quick question about Chris Jericho. Actually,
I was always curious why did he switch to the
Walls of Jericho insteads the Lion Tamerer like Lionton was.
I don't know they had any if it was hurting
people or WU want to just steer away from that
kind of finishing move or something like that.

Speaker 3 (02:06:55):
I was just curious on that.

Speaker 7 (02:06:56):
I don't even how different is it you he's explaining this,
It's just the Lion chamber actually wrenches on the back more,
and there were a lot of bigger guys in WWE
who couldn't take the move, as well as the guys
he was working with in WCWL. The short version of that, Yeah,
that's a good answer, Okay, that works for me.

Speaker 3 (02:07:17):
Yeah.

Speaker 12 (02:07:17):
I was just always wondering about that because Wallon tamer
just looked a lot more intense and he kind of
changed it to the Boston Crab kind of deal, and
I was always wondering about that, but okay, thanks, that's all.

Speaker 1 (02:07:28):
I appreciate it. Thanks order for listening. A quick plug
in our final seconds here MMA Towards Live cast tonight
at eight o'clock. Be sure to check that out with
Jamie Pennock and Jason Powell of Pro Wrestling dot Net.
Thanks for joining me, Va, do you remember stay tuned?
We are going to the VP after show.

Speaker 25 (02:07:50):
Longing for some nostalgia or maybe you want to learn
some wrestling history, don't miss the Nineties Past cast every
Friday on the PW Towards Daly Cast Feed. Alex and
Patrick will transport you thirty years into the past by
taking you through the Torch issue from that very week.
Follow news from the WWF and WCW and all the

(02:08:10):
happenings from across the wrestling industry in real time as
The Torch reported it thirty years ago. That's the nineties
Pass cast every Friday for the PW Torch Daily Cast Feed.

Speaker 1 (02:08:41):
All right, Jason went out to the VP portion of
the after show. Has there been any update on Brett Parsons.
We've been on the show. That's what I need to
know right now.

Speaker 7 (02:08:51):
You know, good question, And at last check, no other
than a family member said, no decision has been made.
But we've been anonymous family members. We don't know if
that's like Brett's third cousin removed from you know, a
divorced family member of Brett's, or if it's like his
wife or Brett himself.

Speaker 3 (02:09:08):
Who knows.

Speaker 1 (02:09:09):
Yeah, well, we're not live. So by the time people actually, uh,
you know, actually listen to this, they'll know a lot
more than we do, and we'll look like we're way
out of touch. It's very true, all right.

Speaker 3 (02:09:21):
So here we are.

Speaker 1 (02:09:22):
We've got Impact coming up on Thursday in the big
show on Sunday? Are you looking forward to this and
do you think it's going to turn out to be?

Speaker 7 (02:09:29):
All right? I am oddly looking forward to it more
than a standard TNA pay per view, maybe for the
wrong reasons. There's just that curiosity factor with me that
how bad is it going to be?

Speaker 1 (02:09:45):
Yeah, you know, I mean, I'm.

Speaker 7 (02:09:46):
Certainly I'm trying to keep an open mind too, and
I'm hoping that they can come out and deliver a
good quality show. I just I'm skeptical. I think there's
gonna be certain guys who deliver on the show, and
then I think there's gonna be a lot of disappointment
and for people when they see just the physical shapes
and a lot of guys are in. And I haven't
seen the footage yet, but I'm told that your first

(02:10:08):
glimpse of that is gonna come on Thursday, with Sandman
looking much bigger than he did the last time people
saw him.

Speaker 1 (02:10:16):
Yeah, you know, I hope it goes well. I mean,
I hope it's a nice, a nice nostalgic reunion show
where people know what they can do and they wrestle
within their physical capabilities. You don't want this to be
the version of the band, you know, what the band
was to the nWo or the Outsiders. Now hardcore Justice becomes.

Speaker 3 (02:10:38):
Not not.

Speaker 1 (02:10:41):
It becomes sad, It becomes pathetic. Maybe is oversteking, but
you don't want it to be sad.

Speaker 19 (02:10:47):
And so.

Speaker 1 (02:10:49):
That's what I'm worried about, is I'm worried about latching
three hours and getting sad and thinking am I that
much older?

Speaker 7 (02:10:55):
Too?

Speaker 1 (02:10:55):
Am I that much?

Speaker 3 (02:10:56):
You know?

Speaker 1 (02:10:56):
And I know they've been through hell and back and
all that but it's just it's good to be I
think it could be rough. I mean, I think it
could be rough, it could be good, But I just,
I honestly don't personally have a lot of interest in
seeing Tommy Dreamer swinging cookie sheets. It just doesn't do
anything for me. That the pop of seeing that ended
in the late nineties, you know, and we're more than

(02:11:17):
ten years past that, and I just don't have nostalgia
for it for all kinds of reasons. So I don't know.
Do you think they're gonna parlay this Jason into something
where the EV two wrestlers stick around some of them
do in an angle where they earn their keep beyond
maybe Tommy Dreamer.

Speaker 7 (02:11:33):
Yes, I do, because I know from talking with Bischoff
today he did confirm that this isn't This is something
that he came up with, not the pay per view
but the EV two idea back in I think he
said March, And I mean we've talked about it before.
It was pitched to Paul Hayman as being a show
within a show, and Hayman would write it and then

(02:11:55):
it would spin off, hopefully if Spike would give it
to him into its own show. I don't know if
that's still the end game for this. I think you're
probably going to see TNA. I know it's been discussed.
I don't know if that they finalized anything, but I
know they've talked about doing select house shows, bringing it
back to, you know, bringing this crew back to certain

(02:12:17):
areas where ECW had a pretty rabbit following, and I
know they've booked the old ECW arena. I think it's
for a September show. I'm not positive on that, and
right now it lists The only former ECW talent that's
listed is Rob van Dam. But you know, as we
all know, that the card is subject to change on
that it hasn't been pitched to the talent yet. At

(02:12:41):
least the talent I've spoken with the former ECW guys
is there's going to be more to come. Most of
them are just looking at this as a good opportunity
to get their names back out there. Some of them,
you know, they know this is it. There's other guys
that want to see that, you know, want to get
their name out there, want to go out there and
have a really good performance and hope to get hook
up with TNA for more or and or in some cases,

(02:13:02):
if you know, if it doesn't work out with t
and a maybe hook up with that Florida group, I
think a lot of them have already committed to that
Florida group, we'll see if that gets off the ground,
and then others just you know, if neither one of
those happens, well maybe this will raise their stock a
little bit on the ND scene and you know, they'll
be able to get more bookings out of it.

Speaker 1 (02:13:20):
Yeah. I don't see any problem with an ECW rustler saying,
you know, let's I want to try this or I
want to you know, come back for this. I think
it makes sense for them because for all the reasons
you mentioned it can it can raise their stock. And
if TNA gives a job offer and is able to
kind of have two brands, I mean, if you know,
maybe Dixie's big surprise in her mind was brand split,
that TNA is going to have two brands and and

(02:13:42):
ultimately that's with or without Paul him and that's what
she was excited about. And that might be why, you know,
the word out of TNA is she was telling people
this is bigger than a booking change. It's bigger than
signing one wrestler and and hopefully it wasn't just she
was really excited to stand in the ring of Tommy
Dreamer and have Tommy compare you know, TNA to ECW.

Speaker 7 (02:14:00):
I'll keep in mind Tommy was the nice surprise, not
the big surprise.

Speaker 1 (02:14:03):
No, No, Tommy was a nice surprise of the pay
per view. The big surprise was Dixie Carter standing in
the ring with Tommy Dreamer.

Speaker 2 (02:14:10):
Yeah, she's pretty much.

Speaker 7 (02:14:11):
I think she's indicated that this is not the big surprise,
so I well, they really, you know, they're not even
you never see Dixie tweeting about this big surprise is
still the com or anything like that, So I don't
know what's going on there. I think, like anything, you know,
it goes back to what we were talking about earlier.
They would love to get additional programming on Spike and

(02:14:32):
get that programming fee, but you know, I just don't
know this Spike's going to be willing to play ball.

Speaker 3 (02:14:37):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:14:37):
Yeah, well we're talking about the uh this this new
promotion with a family member of the family that owns
the New York Mets. What where are you on this case?
I mean I've kind of intentionally not talked a lot
about it, just because you know, I've been through this
before with a lot of other groups in the you know,

(02:14:58):
twenty some years covering this. None of them have got
mounted too much. And the one lesson that you learn
early when you're reporting on wrestling is don't give a
lot of column space, a lot of a lot of
time to a promotion when they're just talking, or when
they're saying things that sound almost unbelievable, or when they
start saying, well, we're sending out false information to throw

(02:15:19):
people out, so you can't believe anything that that any
wrestler might say. I'm just like, let's see something concrete
tell me about you know, let's get a business plan,
Let's have a press conference, let's have a major signing
with a major wrestler who has money in the bank
that verifies something legiti is going on here. And I
just don't think we've reached that stage yet with this,

(02:15:40):
you know, with the Sean Davis Project as it's being called.
What's what's your take on it at.

Speaker 7 (02:15:44):
The stage, Yeah, I mean that's exactly it. You know,
seeing is believing. Once I start hearing it just sounds
too good to be true. If for the talent in
that they're going to give Vader reportedly two hundred and
fifty thousand dollars to open up your pan form when
they haven't even run a show in the stage or
anywhere else yet, and they're going to start paying a
lot of these wrestlers starting, I believe, in September October,

(02:16:06):
even though they don't plan on running their first show
until sometime early in twenty eleven. I mean, who does that?
And I mean that's where the red flags pop up.
It's there. Initially, there was a lot of talk that
it was a direct family member that was part of
the ownership group of the New York Mets, one of
the you know, the the major Willpon family members that
we hear about. Then it came out that no, it's

(02:16:28):
Milton Willpon and he's a cousin of that group. And
I just know from talking with people that are have
either agreed to terms with them or negotiating with them,
that you know, even the people who have signed the
deals are kind of taken the approach that well, you know,
I'll believe it when the first check clears if it
does fantastic, but I'm not going to count my chickens

(02:16:49):
until they had before they have.

Speaker 1 (02:16:51):
I have two words for all these guys signing bonus.

Speaker 7 (02:16:54):
Yeah, I have two words for him, John Collins.

Speaker 1 (02:16:58):
Yeah yeah, yeah, I uh yeah. I mean it would
be great if it if this they had real money
and that there was a real network that was behind them.
I mean, FX has gotten a little too highbrow. You know,
they're in kind of that TNT category now, TBS is comedy.
I don't know that they would do that get back

(02:17:20):
into the wrestling game. I don't know that there's a
major network out there. I mean, you can always get
on Fox Sports Net. You know, you can buy your
time there. That time is for sale because Fox Sports
Nets survives based on the local team contract for the
regional network. So the other time slots are available basically
to purchase. But they're not they're not. They're they're going
to be interrupted a lot, and it's a low network

(02:17:42):
and there's not a lot of really cross network programming
to get people to addicted to that time slot. So
I don't know, Jason, is there a TV network out
there that you think pro wrestling is a good fit
on that It hasn't, that hasn't landed yet. Other than
maybe Versus, but even that's a third tier network at
this point.

Speaker 7 (02:17:56):
Yeah, Versus still as a long way to go, as
the NHL is found out to Harkway, I guess G
four has been mentioned, not necessarily with this group, but
I know people in wrestling that have kind of thought
there may have been some in roads there potentially down
the road. Doesn't strike me as your natural home for wrestling,
but we see these networks rebrand themselves a lot of

(02:18:18):
right they would do something like that. I think the
one that jumps out at me Spike TV. I mean,
who's to say what the long term future of T
and A is.

Speaker 1 (02:18:26):
And I think they signed, I think they signed. I
think Kevin k Bret Tuda that it was a three
year deal.

Speaker 7 (02:18:35):
Yeah, it was, But I always wonder, you know, they
always sing the praises of the three year deal, but
as we've seen many times in many different areas, how
many outs are there in those contracts?

Speaker 1 (02:18:46):
Yeah, and Versus is on about twenty million fewer, has
twenty million, fewer subscribers, and Spike TV, which if But
I think wrestling is a good fit for Versus. I mean,
I think it's a legitimate alternate Hall home if if
Spike TV were to let go of TNA, but TNA
still wanted to be somewhere on the map. And I
think with a brand like TNA that has the type

(02:19:07):
of ratings TNA does, it's not they're not great ratings anymore.
They never were great, but they're not, you know, they're
borderline very good ratings for cable at this point, with
you know, a flide in the cable industry being alarming
because I think a lot I think I think also
cable in the cable industry looks at a show with
declining ratings that doesn't think it can ever turn around.
Because with most shows that's true, you know, most most dramas.

(02:19:28):
You know, that's why Damages were canceled. Critically acclaimed show,
great show in a lot of ways, but it's with
decreasing ratings, who's going to join that show in progress?
You know, how are you going to increase it?

Speaker 7 (02:19:38):
Fortunately it's been saved by direct TV.

Speaker 1 (02:19:40):
I know, I was so excited. I told Druce that
last week and he popped big time. He didn't know,
he didn't know it when I told him, so, Yeah,
direct TV saved it, and that's a you know that's
a good strategy for them. But it wrestling isn't a
show where when the ratings start going down, they don't
go back up. They're just it's constantly going up and
down based on not inevitable cycles, but competence and it
competence or motive, inspiration and complacency. There's a you know,

(02:20:04):
or or a big star coming around and then a
big star retiring. You know, a lot of things can
factor into that. But there's no reason to think that
that T and A ratings won't go up if they
started making some good moves.

Speaker 7 (02:20:16):
Wait, what about True TV? I just don't know much
about them, but I know that's kind of a network
on the rise, and Eric Bischoff's doing a lot of
business with them, was for you know, you know, pitching
pilots to them.

Speaker 1 (02:20:26):
They used to be court TV, and they switched to
True TV because nobody wanted to watch live courtroom. Live
live events in the courtroom after judge duty made him
a lot more exciting. Yeah, I mean that's where Jesse
Ventura was. Barry Bloom as a connection through there, I
guess because he's the the mega agent in pro wrestling
over the years, with a lot of the top names
mix Foley, Triple H, Sean Waltman, many other big names,

(02:20:49):
and so you know it's possible they'll be you know
that that that's he could be planned with True TV
and True TV is ratings hungry, so that might be
a network. Again, it would be one of those things
where they'd have to grow together because True TV isn't
alone going to give a pro wrestling promotion the type
of exposure they need to compete with WWE, but vice versa.
You know, unless it's w WE, no, no wrestling group

(02:21:12):
is really gonna prop up True TV. So they just
have to grow together and u and have a pretty
decent advertising budget literally to let people know that they
were on the air. Sure, all right, well yeah, we
both kind of agree it's wait and see on this project.
And I don't know, even with all the money in
the world that unless you have a really good concept

(02:21:33):
in mind, you know what what you're going to do
to uh, to draw interest, you know, in a wrestling
product with if you if you just start some derivative
version like we've seen before. What was the the iw A,
What was the group out of Florida that had Mister
Perfect and Hogan and Jimmy Hart.

Speaker 7 (02:21:53):
W or XWF.

Speaker 1 (02:21:54):
I believe that's it. Yeah, you know, And I mean
if it's something like that, I mean, seriously, who wants
to watch that?

Speaker 7 (02:22:00):
I don't know, right, No, I'm with you. I don't
want to see you just a you know, his stroll
down nostalgia Lane. I mean, we're getting enough of that
this weekend. At least that's a one time only thing.
Imagine watching that on a weekly basis.

Speaker 1 (02:22:10):
No, thanks, yeah, exactly, Thanks for downloading today's show. Take
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(02:22:31):
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Torch dot Com, slash Go VIP. Have you had a

(02:22:53):
chancey Luci liber Usa yet I do watch the debut episode? Yeah, well,
what'd you think?

Speaker 7 (02:23:01):
Not necessarily, you know, not bad it. I don't know.
It didn't jump out at me in a way that
I was hoping it would. It almost felt like I
was watching something that was taped elsewhere and they just
decided to throw their own commentary over it. Some of
the backstage vignettes were clever. I like, what you know,

(02:23:22):
some of the things they did there, But I just
I don't know, it didn't jump out in a big
way that made me think, Man, I can't wait to
see the next episode.

Speaker 1 (02:23:31):
Yeah, I'm kind of with you. I mean, that's kind
of summarized with my thoughts too. All right, let's wrap
up with your thoughts on them. The main event of
ROLL last night, miss against Randy Orton. Did Miss in
that match gain or lose stature even though he got pinned?
What did getting pinned cost him some stature? Or did
holding his own against in the ring with Orton and

(02:23:52):
looking like he belonged elevate him closer to that top tier?

Speaker 7 (02:23:56):
I don't think he gained a whole lot by it
because I didn't really feel like he I never felt
like Orton was at risk of really losing the match.
I mean, the only thing that really jumped out of
me was when Orton had him up for that second
rope DDT and Miss actually countered out of it. Yeah,
that was really the only point in that match that
just that did it for me. Otherwise you just kind
of felt like, you know, okay, we just you know,

(02:24:17):
when's the RKO coming.

Speaker 3 (02:24:19):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (02:24:19):
Yeah, I was a There were a couple of times
I thought I kind of got wrapped up and thought,
you know, maybe they'll have Seamous distract Orton in some way,
giving Mis a win, and Mis will just brag about it,
and then if ends up its champion, they can use
that down the line. MS can say I'm awesome, I
beat the Viper, I beat Randy Orton. I thought there's
a way they could go with that. And I thought

(02:24:40):
he held his own enough, you know, just to me,
Miss being in the ring and not getting squashed and
having like what Sina did where he's just like brushing
off his shoes on him and disrespecting him like that.
Mis is certainly at a different level now and the
fact that they do. You remember mis ever being in
the main event of Raw, the final segment match main event.

Speaker 7 (02:24:58):
I'm guessing he probably did at one time when he
was teaming with Jericho, but I'm not sure.

Speaker 1 (02:25:03):
Yeah, but even even you say a singles match as
opposed to tag team, that's a big moment in his career,
you know, I mean, Mike, Mike hasn't had that spotlight
on him before, and he had it, and I thought
he held his own well in the ring. I thought
it's part of the progress. It wasn't shooting him to
the top, but it's part of that journey that he's
on where they're testing the waters and seeing does he

(02:25:24):
look like he belongs and do fans by him in
that spot? And I thought he was a winner in
that respect. Orton is a megastar in today's WWE world,
and miss didn't look like he was there to just
be a jobber.

Speaker 7 (02:25:37):
Yeah, true, Yeah, I mean, I guess you had it
probably didn't help matters. It was a pre tape show
and I knew the outcome, you know, I guess I
probably wasn't paying as much attention as I naturally would
to other near falls in a live show like that.

Speaker 9 (02:25:52):
What did you think?

Speaker 7 (02:25:53):
One thing that jumped out him me last night about
Row was the Jericho and Seen a match. And I
don't know if this was by design, this was the
way they had it planned, or if they did this
in post production because it was a tape show. Why
did they feel the need to say that John Cena
was distracted, he was off his game. It almost came

(02:26:16):
across like Sina gave up more offense and we thought
he should, so we better protect him with this, And
I just thought it was completely unnecessary either way.

Speaker 1 (02:26:24):
Maybe they're not happy with Jericho and they're trying to
edit things to make him look like he's not real.
You know that Sena should have beat him more. Eaaly,
that's a good question that I don't have an answer.

Speaker 7 (02:26:35):
So you explained the finish of that match to me,
because I still don't get it. It was the attitude
goes for the attitude adjustment and before we even locks
it and Jericho starts tapping.

Speaker 1 (02:26:46):
Out, Oh yeah, I can explain that to you. Please
do Jericho, if he could win and lead the team,
was willing to try hard to win, but he didn't
care enough to be the leader of the team if
it meant being in a painful hold that he might
not be able to get out of, and he's like,
screw it. If I'm going to end up in this hold,

(02:27:06):
I've given my best shot, and Jay don't just give
me my best explanation for it. And I think it's
what they had in mind. The psychology of Jericho is
if I win, great, I lead the team, but I'm
not going to lose to SCENEA. I'm just gonna or
I'm not gonna like get hurt by seeing it in
this hold. I'm just going to bail out on the company.
I think it was meant to be kind of a
cowardly heal move on Jericho's part, where he's just being
a baby and he's like, I'm not even going to

(02:27:27):
try to fight my way out of this hold first chance,
first time that I seem like I'm at risk of
getting hurt, I'm going to tap out and just get
out of this and let Sina handle it, handle it
on his.

Speaker 7 (02:27:36):
Own, Okay, I mean I can I can buy that.
I guess didn't the if memory shirves. I think the
move was applied right by the Ropes, which I guess
kind of jump, I know, like just reach out and
grab the ropes if you don't want the hold on you.

Speaker 1 (02:27:49):
No, that's it's a good point. It does undercut my
guess of what the logic was. I mean, the announcers
kind of sold it like, you know what a coward
you know, Yeah, you know, he didn't he wasn't even
willing to put up a fight once things weren't going
his way, you know. I mean, I think it's it's
it's the kid who's like, I want to pitch. I
want to pitch, you know, when you're playing a pickup
game of baseball, and then when you know the umpire

(02:28:11):
calls three balls in a row, he just goes, screw it,
I'm going home.

Speaker 7 (02:28:14):
I think I actually did it on the softball field ones.

Speaker 1 (02:28:18):
I'm sure we all have to in some form or fashion.
Just quick note, raw ratings are in. They did a
three point two eight, lowest ratings since June twenty eighth,
but still real solid numbers because you know, runs up
to three three that's right in the range of the
three four three three three four three five range that
they've been doing. But it is down a little bit,
and I don't think there's a great explanation for it.

(02:28:39):
It might be the pre taped aspect of it. Maybe
they would have gone up as a certain percentage didn't
know what happened, although I still don't buy that. I
just think, even if you read what happened, if you're
if you're a type of fan who's gonna read about
what happens on the show, here's a type of fan
who wants to watch it happen in front of your
very own eyes and see, you know, hear the announcing
and see it all play out.

Speaker 7 (02:28:57):
But it was still some milk, because I know, mind
number of my traffic was down last night compared to
the usual Monday, and then even in the forum, where
we usually get a ton of people just discussing the show,
there wasn't nearly as many there either. So I kind
of wonder, you know, there's got to be some out
there that just say, you know what, I already know
the results doesn't look that good, and I can watch

(02:29:17):
something else.

Speaker 1 (02:29:18):
But I think it makes sense why people wouldn't be
going to a website to find out what happened when
they could have already read what happened last week. But
the people who go out of their way to watch
the show on any week. If they're the type of
one out of their way to read a spoiler, they're
even aware it was pre taped. I just think they're
the type of people who might skip going to the website,

(02:29:39):
but they're going to tune in to see it play out.
I think there's kind of that ratio if you're a
hard core enough fan, even though it's pretaped, even be
aware of it. Do you really want to miss a
great christierical promo? Do you really want to miss the
next development and watch it with your own ice play out?
So I just think it's minimal, you know, But I
think it makes more sense that website track would be

(02:30:00):
down because it's not really new breaking news, and so
what you got was the people who really you know
what we found out, Jason is a lot of people
don't care about your analysis. They just want to find
out what happened.

Speaker 7 (02:30:10):
But probably very true. Do we know why they tape
that show?

Speaker 3 (02:30:15):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (02:30:15):
Yeah, they were going overseas and so.

Speaker 7 (02:30:17):
The SmackDown crew did, but the raw crew was here
on Sunday still and you know, just following some of
the Twitter updates, it seems like the stars Lake, Orton
and I think Sina are still in the States.

Speaker 1 (02:30:30):
But don't they usually? Well did did the Rock cru
didn't go overseas at all?

Speaker 7 (02:30:34):
Not this weekend? They actually did house shows in the
United States. I sure I get some results.

Speaker 1 (02:30:38):
But did they go overseas early like several days ago,
or did they not travel at all?

Speaker 7 (02:30:43):
They were Gosh, I wish I could remember. It was
somewhere in the United States they were. I want to
see something on the East Coast Friday through Sunday, and
so I don't know if they headed out on Monday.
And even if so, well why not just take the
show on Sunday night.

Speaker 1 (02:30:57):
I'll I tried to rationalize them racle thing. It makes
sense of it. I'll try to make sense of it here.
If they're good, if they're not gonna if the SmackDown
Crew is gonna be overseas. The expense associated with bringing
the TV crew out is to do it just for
one edition of Raw is really expensive, and so this
gave them an opportunity to do a couple of long tapings. Yeah,

(02:31:19):
the SmackDown Crew is going overseas, they need a break afterwards,
because after overseas travel, you don't want people doing TV
and it gets a raw crew a chance to have
a breather and they save a lot. You know, it's
an excuse to save a lot on expenses and not
have the whole the whole TV crew drive just for
one taping.

Speaker 7 (02:31:35):
Yeah, mystery solved, That makes perfect sense.

Speaker 1 (02:31:37):
Cool O good? All right, well Jason, thanks, it's great
as always. Appreciate you joining me here on the VP
after show, and hello to all the dot net members
for listening.

Speaker 7 (02:31:46):
And you're quitt while you're ahead, aren't you?

Speaker 1 (02:31:49):
Yes, I am all right on any closing words, Jason.

Speaker 7 (02:31:55):
No other than I guess we'll see you in late August. Brett.

Speaker 1 (02:32:00):
Yeah, well, if Frett doesn't play, How does the NFC
stack up in your eyes?

Speaker 7 (02:32:05):
Divisionally? I think it's the Packers division to lose at
that point. I know the Bears fans are getting all
fired up, and it's like, you guys still have some
holes to fill. They'll they'll be improved, but I don't
see him really contending with Green Bay barring a major
injury or something. I mean, the Saints are going a
very tough division. I think watch out for the Falcons
this year. And I think the Niners are going to

(02:32:25):
be a team that has a soft schedule, that really
has a strong record that nobody takes seriously and then
it's going to surprise somebody in the playoffs. And the
East I think is just its usual crapshoot with the Giants, Eagles,
and Cowboys albeing you know, legit threats to come out
of there and make some noise in the playoffs.

Speaker 1 (02:32:44):
And yeah, I mean, looking in I think without Far,
is it fair to say the Saints and Vikings, followed
by the Packers and Cowboys were the top four in
the NFC if Far played.

Speaker 7 (02:32:57):
Yeah, who it was Saints, Miking, Cowboys and New Packers. Yeah,
I think so. And I do think like I say,
I think Atlanta and San fran are team to watch
this year. Good young teams at Dana was I think
nine and seven last year, even though they were missing
their quarterback for a few games, and I know Michael
Turner missed several games, and so to have that kind

(02:33:19):
of record in a tough division like that, that's pretty impressive.
That's a good young team on the rise that.

Speaker 1 (02:33:24):
Could be your six playoff teams. In other words, if
Far plays, if he doesn't play, it might still be
the sixth playoff teams, but with the Vikings at the
bottom not the top.

Speaker 7 (02:33:32):
Yeah. I get a little worried this year that with
the schedule being what it is, it statistically it does
not I think it's like the fourteenth toughest schedule league,
which doesn't sound all that bad, but when you really
look at the schedule that the Vikings and Packers have,
I do worry that it's going to be one of
those years where both teams are around ten and six,
eleven and five, and one of them might be on

(02:33:54):
the outside looking in. You know, whoever wins the division
goes and it might be a tough year for that
other team to qualify for the wildcard.

Speaker 1 (02:34:01):
Is Detroit gonna win more than one or two games?

Speaker 7 (02:34:04):
Yeah? Yeah, that's that's an improved team. And it feels
like I say it every year, but I think that
new coach has done a pretty nice job and they're
bringing in some some much better talent, and they're actually
getting some quality free agents rather than just guys that
you know, have no other options and yeah, what they
I'll sell out and take the money and then not care.

Speaker 1 (02:34:21):
Yeah, yeah, well good, It's it's August. So I feel
like it's okay to talk about football.

Speaker 7 (02:34:26):
You know, it's always okay to talk about football.

Speaker 1 (02:34:29):
Well, okay to talk about football with other people listening?

Speaker 7 (02:34:32):
True?

Speaker 1 (02:34:33):
All right on behalf of jacent Paul wake Keller signing off.

(02:34:53):
Invite you to email the show with feedback or questions
or comments. That email address is Wade Keller Podcast at
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Speaker 26 (02:35:16):
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