15 YRS AGO LIVECASTS: Summerslam predictions, Cena's "Career Moments," 7th Man Speculation, Hogan's ego, Swagger's push, Tyler Black in WWE

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
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Speaker 2 (01:05):
Now, PW Torch and Spreaker bring you the Wade Keller
Pro Wrestling Podcast.

Speaker 1 (01:15):
On today's Wade Keller Pro Wrestling Podcast, we jumped back
fifteen years to a doubleheader of our PW Torch live
casts from August eleventh and August twelfth, twenty ten. First
Up I was joined by Pat McNeil and we fielded
phone calls from all over the country for a full hour,
including a discussion on Jack Swager's push that was fifteen
years ago, the seventh Man on Team WWE at SummerSlam,

(01:39):
YT and A turned off viewers recently, what was the
point of champions Wrestling non title matches? Little history there,
Tyler Black's chances of success in WWE, of course you'd
go on to be seth Rollins, Hulk Hogan's ego, and more.
And then in the previously VIP exclusive after show, Pat
and I discussed our predictions for Summerslam's top matches and
John Cena's key memorable moments in his career up to

(02:01):
that point in twenty ten. And then the next day,
James Caldwell hosted with Bruce Mitchell, PWD Torch columnist, and
they talked about the hype for SummerSlam and what WWWE
did right on raw, whether people actually buy the pay
per view though, whether Brian Danielson could fix into the
fit into the Mix, the seventh man in the Team
WWE mix a potential baby Face turn for the Miz

(02:22):
down the Line, t and A's Big Night that night,
and the spoiler for rvd's T and A title picture,
a feud between the Horsemen and ECW, Tommy Dreamer keeping
Dixie Carter involved, Matt Ardi's world title aspiration tweets, the
difference between Seamus and Koslov, who have received strong pushes
on w in the last two years, and much more.
And then in the previously VP exclusive after show, they

(02:45):
discussed Bruce's trips to the NWA Legends FanFest of previous week.
He shared great stories on Mister Wrestling Too, Jim Ross,
Danny Hodge, Terry Funk, sid and Ollie Anderson, a Flair imitator,
where is she now? Fife and much more so. Again,
this is our fifteen years ago flashback for Monday, August eighteenth,

(03:05):
twenty twenty five.

Speaker 3 (03:06):
Here we go, look oh Radio.

Speaker 4 (03:23):
Welcome to PW Torch live cast. It is Wednesday, August eleventh,
two thousand and ten. I am Pro Wrestling Torch newsletter
editor and PW Torch dot Com editor Wade Keller, joined
today by Pat McNeil, columnist for Pro Wrestling Torch. Pat,
how are you doing today?

Speaker 2 (03:39):
I'm fine.

Speaker 5 (03:39):
Hello, are you people there? We go on the phone,
call us, call us.

Speaker 4 (03:43):
We want to take a lot of calls the number
six four, six, seven, two, one, nine, eight to eight.
We can continue talking about what we talked about on
yesterday's show, which is Raw and the final angles for
the top matches at SummerSlam. Also we can talk about
SummerSlam and the different ideas of what may happen with
that final spot on Team Sina. Will Brian Danielson show up,

(04:05):
will the mistake their spot sounds like great Collie is
out or will it remain empty to give the Heels
an unfair advantage. We can talk about that, and of
course we'll probably get a call or too on TNA
and follow up on their Hardcore Justice pay per view.
We will on Friday's show talk about what happens tomorrow
night on Impact. So join us for Friday's show because

(04:26):
Impact should be real interesting with the follow up on
the Hardcore Justice pay per view and the integration of
some EV two members into the TNA not know TNA
Roster's way to put it, but into the mix on
Impact in a full fledged feld with some TNA guys,
So that will be something we'll talk about on Friday.

(04:46):
Had a little dust up today with a fake Twitter
account for Holk Hogan that Eric Bischoff I believe in.
Both air Fishoff and Bubblah Love Sponge apparently thought it
was Hulks and endorsed it, and then Hogan ended up
saying he bishop were leaving TNA, and then it was
very shortly thereafter refuted as not a valid Twitter account,
and Dixie Carter even posted on it saying that it's

(05:08):
not real and it's crazy and all that kind of thing.

Speaker 6 (05:12):
We did.

Speaker 4 (05:12):
We didn't get the pat We didn't get the people
need to check their facts before they speak, because that
kind of got taken away from Eric and Dixie when
Eric and Bubba themselves seemed to buy into the Twitter account.

Speaker 5 (05:24):
And and our own James Caldwell actually checked the facts
before he posted the story about Hogan and Bishoff leaving. Although,
you know, although I can't blame anybody who ran with it,
because when hul Cogan's official Twitter, sanctioned by his two
best friends I know, is leaving TNA, you know you,
I mean you kind of would hope that that's that's legitimate.

Speaker 4 (05:43):
So yeah, I would think it's I would think Bubba
and Eric endorsing it would would be the confirmation that
you would have, you know, normally sought out to make
sure it was legit.

Speaker 5 (05:52):
So right, Also, if you've been following as we go along,
the person who creative def fate caulled Cogan account is
out claiming to be a t and a wrestler who
was upset with the uh upset with the way things
are going in the in the promotion. However, I think
anybody who lies about being hult Cogan can pretty easily
lie about being a TNA wrestler.

Speaker 4 (06:12):
So I think so too. And it's it's just not
a game that I want to spend a lot more
time on today. I mean, it's it's it's going to happen.
I mean, it's it's something you know, the Internet is
anonymous in a lot of ways, and people can can
play these games. But yeah, I don't think it was
a TNA wrestler who did it. He would admit that
it was a TNA wrestler who did it. So the
quote from Eric Bischoff is, I know you've heard rumors.

(06:36):
I'm sorry this from Hogan. I know you've heard the rumors.
Brothers and they are true. Eric, Oh, this is the
original post. Eric and I are leading Tis. I just
got out of the meetings now. It was really fun,
but it's time to move on. New leadership's coming in.
Thanks for hoping.

Speaker 5 (06:49):
You know, you know, the great part about the fake
Hulk Cogan Twitter posts way, is that I think all
of them contain the work brother in number.

Speaker 4 (06:57):
Yes, I know, I mean, you know, it's it's one
thing to have that as kind of a signature, annoying,
you know, this thing that he includes in all his talking.
But the idea that he would take time to add
that to his Twitter post is just it seems a
little a little over the top.

Speaker 2 (07:13):
But I don't know.

Speaker 4 (07:14):
We'll see when he actually goes on to Twitter officially,
we'll find out. It'll be fun to see how Hogan
does on Twitter compared to John Cena, for instance. Anyway, Yeah, yeah,
I won't be that well, yeah, you're always throwing water
on my fires, but all right, you're right, it won't be.
That's that's my job, Yes, it is. All right. Well,

(07:35):
let's go to the phone lines and see what is
on the minds of our listeners today and start with
Eric three, one four. Thanks for being first in line.
Say Trenaman, where you're from?

Speaker 7 (07:45):
Hey? Thanks shaking my calling guys. This is Scan from
Saint Louis.

Speaker 4 (07:48):
Hey, Dan, what's up today?

Speaker 5 (07:49):
Adam?

Speaker 8 (07:51):
Oh?

Speaker 7 (07:51):
Hey, what's this going? One of the things I was
gonna mention regarding and this is kind of happened a
little bit more recently, is speaking of last week on
you know, hardcore Justice. I don't really see why it
is that baby faces are that are the champions are
putting all you know, non title matches on. I just
I think it kind of undercuts them. Uh you know,
their their their reputation as a fighting champion, you know,

(08:14):
to not put the title on the line. I mean,
could you explain why it is that they wouldn't do that?
I mean, I guess I can see in you know,
hard Justices case that it might be because they don't
want to give away the results in the match before
it happens. But I'm just trying to think if there's
any other, you know, explanation I might be missing as
far as that.

Speaker 4 (08:30):
Uh, Pat, go ahead and take that if you can.

Speaker 5 (08:36):
Well that I'm gonna try. I think it's I think
because some you know, I think it's because some of
the people who write this don't think about it too hard, which, uh.

Speaker 4 (08:48):
Let me Pat, let me go back to Dan and
just Dan clarify what what magic you're talking about, because
I either missed the beginning of it or just im
not remembering what you're talking about.

Speaker 7 (08:56):
Sure, sorry about that. I kind of well, just to
give you a color a couple other examples of that happening.
You know, it seems like it's been kind of common
theme this year, you know, with Tyler Black. You know,
he was in a match a couple of weeks ago
with El Jinerica I think on TV, and he didn't
put the title on the line. I think at Buffalo
Stampede he didn't put the title on the line on
you know, against Steve Careno and he beat Steve Creno,

(09:16):
which you know, and even a couple weeks back when
they were at showing Kentucky, Tyler back Black. Excuse me,
Tyler Black beat Claudio Gastolian a non title match, And
I don't understand why you wouldn't put the title on
the line if you're gonna you're gonna beat the guy,
because you know, presumably if you put the title on
the line, it would you would make the title look
more valuable.

Speaker 4 (09:34):
I would think, okay, well that that a better perspective
for your question. That that helps. I think philosophically, there's
something to be said for having title matches be infrequent
and earned, and it's happened a lot in the past
where a champion would have non title matches. This is
an unprecedented over the decades in pro wrestling where the
idea is and and sometimes it's the heel who will say, well,

(09:57):
i'll wrestle you, but you have to earn a title shot.
You have and earned a shot at the title yet
and usually it's a heel move to do it, not
a baby face move. But as a promoter, I kind
of see merit in saying I mean, I'm on the
record saying that I think TNA should have four to
six title defenses per year, but I don't think the
champion should only wrestle for it's six times per year.
I think whoever the champion is needs to wrestle more

(10:18):
often in singles and tag matches, but I think title
matches should be something where at the end of the
year and WDW doesn't have to do this, they've got
their machine rolling, and you know, with you know, not
everything's going great, but things are going well enough. They
don't have to completely blow up their formula. But if
you're trying to find a way to stand out, especially
if you're TNA and you say, hey, we're gonna have
six title matches per year, four on pay per view.

(10:40):
If they did quarterly pay per views, which I think
they should do, and then they only had two other
title defenses, that would make those title defenses so much
more valuable because twelve months from now, you'd be able
to remember each and every one of them. And I
think by having fewer of them, it's kind of like inflation.
They all then mean more pat What do you think.

Speaker 5 (11:00):
Yeah, I think there's something to be suddled with that. Also,
I don't know how long. I mean the specific case
of roh Tyler. Black's a champion and he's leaving, so
he's you know, the belt's not going to be and
right now, the belt's not schedule to be put up
on either of the next set of next set of
house shows, which is Richmond or Charlotte. I mean, I
think I think that in that specification it might have

(11:22):
something to do with Black being on the way out
and they don't necessarily want to build him up anymore.
Although that doesn't only make sense either, So you got
to get.

Speaker 4 (11:31):
It works for the if you if you have a
strong promotional philosophy that you only do you know, four,
six or twelve title defense of a year, then then
then at least you've established that, and then there's a
reason and then you're champion who wrestles more often. It
just doesn't always put the title on the line. I mean,
it's not it's a terrible analogy. I'm prefacing it, but
I'll say it ahead of time. If the super Bowl

(11:54):
champions don't defend their super Bowl championship every week in
the NFL, Every sport and every structure has different setups,
and I think as long as you have an internal
logic to it, it works. Okay, Dan, any follow up?

Speaker 7 (12:08):
Yeah, I don't really have too much of a problem
with him doing it on like ROHTV tapings, But like
you know, I guess it's more of a problem like
a DVD taping. When you're doing something like that, you know,
where the it seems like that should be a little
bit more of a special event. But I mean, I
can understand what you're saying about, you know, less is
more kind of with the title, the classes, and one
other thing I was just gonna mention as a follow
up is you know, I thought it was a really
good question. Somebody mentioned, I believe Monday about how one

(12:30):
of the problems wrestling is doesn't feel realistic enough. Yeah,
just to kind of follow up on that, I think
one of the problems you see, and you know WW
and it's a little bit of a lesser extent today
is that, you know, it seems like too many wrestlers
only have one finisher, and I think that really kills
what you're trying to do when you have like a
few going on, because you know, if wrestler A beats
wrestler B with his finisher, you know, in this era

(12:52):
where you know, scouting and all that stuff is a
big deal in sports and stuff like that, and teams
scout one another, he would think that wrestler B would
go back and you know, a couple of months later,
what would idly scout out some sort of you know,
counter to that finisher. And you know, when a wrestler
gets beat with the same finisher multiple times in a fewed,
it's is it makes them kind.

Speaker 2 (13:09):
Of look foolish.

Speaker 7 (13:10):
I mean, if we're supposed to take these guys's world
class athletes, so I think that's undercuts what you're trying
to do as far as promotion.

Speaker 4 (13:16):
All right, Dan, thank you. I'll start with that. I
think the idea of a finisher and I mean, this
is the storyline reason for it is this is this
wrestler specialty move. They've mastered it. They've tried other ones
that didn't work as well for them, and given their strength,
their body type, their athleticism, their their their preference, they
think this when their opponent is on the verge of losing,

(13:38):
this is the move to go with. And you know
we've seen I mean, how many times have we seen
guys reverse or back out of finishing moves, you know,
like the pedigree triple H picks moments and matches where
guys can escape the pedigree, and it does kind of
play into that. And what the signal it sends is, well,
I got to weaken my opponent more so I can
do my specialty move. I mean, of course, you know,

(13:59):
the best comparison is UFC, and certain guys have styles
in which they win, you know, Miraco crocop was known
for his high round kick to the side of a
head that would knock people's head off. Randy Cotour, you
just ground and pound grinds out to win it with
a ground and pound, you know, I mean just Chuck
Lendel was a master of just throwing that CounterPunch, the

(14:20):
hook that would knock somebody out, down and out. So
I think if you look at it, there are parallels
to it. Sometimes, I think the more I think, not
just sometimes. The marketing of finishing moves is if I
wear you down enough, this move is unstoppable and you
can scout it, you can try to counter it, and
you might occasionally counter it. But this is how I'm
gonna win the majority of my matches.

Speaker 6 (14:39):
Now.

Speaker 4 (14:41):
The last point I'll make on this, though, is it
does become predictable. If the only way wrestlers win big
matches against other wrestlers at their level is with their finisher.
It takes away the drama from near falls when the
near fall comes after a move that isn't the finisher.
And so I would say, well, finishers are good for marketing.
It's good for for viewers to anticipate and look forward

(15:02):
and ads drama. Will this be the end they need
to shake it up? You know, somewhere between a third
of the time and half the time where in big
matches the wrestler wins through other means, whether it's a
roll up or a tap out, or just a secondary
move that they use.

Speaker 1 (15:17):
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Speaker 4 (15:49):
Pad.

Speaker 5 (15:49):
Any thoughts on finishers, Well, yeah, I think part of
it also stems, you know now in twenty ten. I mean,
you know, maybe in the NWA you saw or in
the away or or out in San Francisco. You saw
matches done a different way, but there is there is
a WWE main events style which goes back a while.
It's not you know, you don't. It's just based out

(16:10):
of the Northeast. You don't exactly have the fast paced action.
But you know, you build towards you build towards your finisher.
And I agree with you that you know it would
be effective if more often. Yeah, I mean maybe twenty
five to thirty percent more often. Yeah, it wasn't the
finisher and it was it was some other move, although
I you know, on the other hand, you can watch
stuff like Ring of Honor and Dragon Gate where guys

(16:31):
go twenty two minutes and hit each other with all
sorts of finishing moves and then the finish comes with
an inside cradle and you just want to throw something
at the TV.

Speaker 4 (16:39):
Yeah, that's that's, you know, meant to be sort of ironic.
But I think you can pull that out once every
eighteen months or nine months or something not not you know,
not as kind of the punchline to the joke over
and over and over again. All right, Dan, thanks for call,
appreciate it, good questions, good topics. If you want to
get in line on the phone banks. We've got five
people on hold right now. You can be number six.
The number is six four, six, seven to one, nine,

(17:02):
eight to eight Area code A six five. You're on
the live cast. Please state your name and where you're from.

Speaker 9 (17:08):
Hey, guys, Stephen from Tennessee has going on.

Speaker 4 (17:10):
Pellas We're doing good. What's up today?

Speaker 5 (17:13):
Actually?

Speaker 9 (17:14):
Hi, Now I have a few quick thanks with Jack
at the time for it. Well, thank you for mixing one.
I'm going to ask about taller Black, you know, going
to day to do he I kind of want to
act quickly. How do you all think you're gonna do.

Speaker 5 (17:30):
I'm I'm expecting him to be on NXT season three.
I think that's uh or season four. That's that's one
of the goals in hiring people. They they want a
you know, they want more wrestlers and developmental, especially if
this is going to go for another couple of seasons.
In fact, there's there's a story going around that they're
going to that maybe in season three we're going to

(17:51):
see some uh, some female wrestlers mixed in with the guys.

Speaker 4 (17:55):
I'd like that. I'd like I mean, I I think
he'll do fine. I mean being having a reputation that
he has, He's going to have a little bit of
an uphill battle, sort of like Brian Danielson did, sort
of like even Sampunk did. He can absolutely overcome it, obviously,
and and he's got a lot of a different kind
of experience than a lot of the people who normally

(18:16):
go through UH Florida Championship Wrestling do. But from a
from a standpoint of of NXT and trying to keep
the format going, I like that it's going to force WWE,
for one, to look outside of their normal routine, their
normal feeder system to add add to the mix. And
number two, it actually gives them a place to put

(18:38):
somebody on a faster track who can prove themselves through this.
I mean it's there's you know, tough Enough came first
and then the Ultimate Fighter came next, and NXT's kind
of a derivative of both of them a little bit.
And and with looking at the Ultimate Fighter, it started
off where a lot of top guys would go through there,
and now it's it's kind of looked at as a

(19:00):
wild more of a wild card position where you'll get
the headline a fight night if you if you win
the Ultimate Fighter Tournament the USC show on Spike TV.
But but it doesn't mean you're necessarily going to be
a championship caliber like the first group that came out.
I mean, that was an incredible line up in the
first two seasons, and so I think with NXT, the
key is is try to keep the quality up so

(19:20):
that the ratings don't drop even further. And Tyler Black
somebody you add to the mix, and he has enough
polish and perhaps enough grassroots fan following that that it
will actually add a little bit of energy and bring
in a different segment of the audience.

Speaker 5 (19:35):
Well, Tyler Black's weak point is on promos, and hopefully
you can get the right person to work with him
on that, because I mean he has he has a
style that you know, talking that doesn't exactly fit the
the WWE type promo, and I mean it's it's interesting
as to whether he can adapt. But I mean he's
twenty four, he is incredibly athletic, and I mean he's

(19:57):
obviously somebody, you know, he's obviously somebody want to take
a shot out to take a chance on if your
w W and ring him honor really is not in
the position to lose too many more of their top guys.
So I mean I look forward to seeing Tyler Black
Russell under his new NX TAM name, uh, Antonio.

Speaker 4 (20:13):
White anything else Stevens.

Speaker 5 (20:19):
Yeah, I kind of was wondering I.

Speaker 9 (20:21):
Haven't heard as many boots I'm seeing her lately. It
tends on what city Tea goes through. But uh, you know,
people complain a lot about like the super Cnut thing,
where like he can with staying get and beat on
by like four guys and make it come back and
take finish as mixed come back. Well, what kind of
comment is wasn't that kind of the same thing?

Speaker 6 (20:35):
You know that Hogan used to doma Hogan's Didnick?

Speaker 9 (20:38):
You know that he would take beatings and kick out
a finishers and all that stuff and make a records comeback.
So the question, if yet I think it's got to
deal more is like we see teenham Moore on TV
than we did Hogan, Because like Hoki, if you saw
on on TV, it's usually either a pay per view
or a cent at finger advance. So it was like
a big game we saw Hogan wrestle. I mean other
other times it was just you know, they was just promos.

Speaker 4 (20:57):
Tommy Dreamer made a career of it in ECW. I
anytime a wrestler takes a huge beat down and then
out of nowhere acts like he's one hundred percent, it
was almost like a bellatwin Switch place, where it's like,
where did that guy go? Who just got beat down?
I call it to Tommy Dreamer comeback. It's just it's
one of the most ridiculous things I've ever seen is
Tommy Dreamer's comebacks where he just brushes off everything. At
least Hulk Hogan goes through the kind of hulking up

(21:19):
an adrenaline rush that you know the crowd is giving him.
And I mean, I saw the beginning of Hogan developing
that style because I was based here in the Twin
Cities in Minnesota. When Hulk was refining that whole style
and I kind of know the origins and the roots
of it, I got to see it happen. And it
really was a case where it was just it wasn't
the first time anybody had done it. You know, if

(21:39):
Greg Gania was making a comeback and the crowd started
cheering and he was locked in the headlock, the crowd
cheers would give him that energy and he would stand
up and escape and go on a and rally on offense.
And I think with Hogan he took it to another level.
I think by the time people saw it on NBC
on Saturday and it's main event or you know, in
the late eighties and during the early WrestleMania years, it
had become a little more cartoonized than it had been

(22:00):
in the AWA, where it was a little more Sports Bay,
a little more it felt a little more authentic. It
was subtle, but I think Hogan kind of simplified it
even more and kind of dumbed it down a little bit,
like a lot of talented for their gimmicks in their
wrestling style and WBS in the late eighties. I think
with Sena, though, he has to take the context into accounts,
and I think he's found a semi successful hybrid taking

(22:22):
context into account. Hogan was part of an era where
things were just a lot more simple. I mean, everything
was dumbed down. There just there were fewer nuances. There
weren't main event matches anywhere near the level of what
John Cena puts forth with some of the top opponents
he's had over the years. So I think Sina has
to watch it. I know where you're coming from. I mean,
you can go too far and make it too cartoonish,

(22:45):
but I think it's accepted as pat you had mentioned
in the WWE style, It's accepted that a top babyface
has reserves and he feeds off of the fans cheers,
and so part of what works in wrestling and what
gets the uninvolved is giving them the feeling that they're
making a difference. I mean again, I was a kid
in the crowd when O Cogan did it, when Hokomene

(23:06):
was emerging in the A w A, when he's feeding
with Nick Bockwinkle and getting gang attacked by mister Saido
and doctor d David Schultzen. I mean it was it
was awesome as a kid to think my cheers were
helping him make the comeback. And and so I think
it's important to have that in your top baby face act.
And I think Stena finds a pretty good balance. He's
not always perfect with it, but I don't have a

(23:26):
huge problem with it.

Speaker 5 (23:27):
How about you, Pet, Yeah, I mean it's sort of
I mean, you can date it back to Bruno San
Martino if you want to. You know, another guy who
he didn't quite have the cartoonishall Cogan style, but he
he'd take a beating and then come back. That's not
exactly that part's not exactly new. And I mean, you
can look at another sport, you know what I mean.
When I was going to Clemson and going to Clemson

(23:48):
football games, there were eighty thousands of most SAMs, there's
a whole lot of us screaming. I mean, you're you're
you're screaming ensuring because you think, you know, you can.

Speaker 3 (23:55):
Make a difference.

Speaker 4 (23:56):
It didn't help the Vikings against the against the Falcons.
That's a metronome. Well, well, yeah, it didn't help the
North Stars win a Stanley Cup. But I was losing
my still feel the effects of how hard I was
yelling at those playoff games with the office and they
never won the Stanley Cup. I don't know. I just
don't think it works, pat because I'd be able really
loud at these sporting events and my team's never win.

Speaker 5 (24:18):
For the Yeah, well I've done to Washington Nationals game,
so I can understand that.

Speaker 4 (24:23):
Yeah. All right, hey, Stephen, thanks for you call. Really
good questions. Appreciate it. That's the type of questions that
make this the show that it is. Let's go to
aera code four A zero. Thanks for calling. Please state
your name and where you're from.

Speaker 9 (24:35):
Hey, ladam Patted Zafferan, How are you?

Speaker 4 (24:38):
What's going on?

Speaker 10 (24:40):
Hi?

Speaker 9 (24:41):
I have a question, may Pat? I have a quicktion
regarding them the ego of Hulk Covian back for the
day when he would show up to wh W and
they'd have his booking his plan for then I say,
that really doesn't work for me. You have a couple
of other examples that made it so big, and now
that he's in t and Am is hurt doing that

(25:01):
great and you know he's not the same person financially,
he's been humbled a bit.

Speaker 4 (25:09):
Go ahead, Yeah, I I think you know.

Speaker 5 (25:11):
Money, I mean, he's sort of the money and status
meant so much to Hogan at one point in his career,
and you know, now he doesn't have as much money
and a divorce and a and a huge lawsuit. We'll
do that to someone and you know he doesn't have
I mean, and then you know he's he's not you mean,
he can't be out there wrestling on pay for you
twelve months a year. He probably shouldn't even be wrestling

(25:33):
on pay per view once a year, and you know
he I mean he wanted creative control. He and Bishoff
wanted to create a control over TNA and and they
wanted Russo out and they didn't get it. Yeah, I
mean that these these have to hurt his ego. Of course,
you know, if your whole Cogan, you can't let it,
you can't let on that that that your feelings are
hurt by things like this stuff.

Speaker 4 (25:54):
Yeah, and I think very well, go ahead.

Speaker 9 (25:58):
During the wrestle me era or you know, when a
first starting, I was listening to you guys from the roundtables, which.

Speaker 5 (26:05):
Are often on how.

Speaker 9 (26:09):
The matches were short, and you were basically told by
Steamboat and Savage and all the good kerus below the
don't overshadow Hogan's match. Did did Hogan go up to
them and say, look, don't do this? Or was it
was it was his ego as bad as I had heard.

Speaker 5 (26:27):
Well, I mean it was more in the w C
w DA's where you got the direct order. You know,
we've got the direct order, Hey, don't over shadow Hogan's match.
But there's a certain evan flow to a wrestling card,
and when you put the card together. It's you know,
if if you're a wrestler with any experience, it should
be understood that you know that the the match on
top of the main event is a big deal and

(26:49):
you know you don't want for example, if if you're
if you're Ricky Steamboat and you're working a match, you know,
second on the card underneath Hulk Hogan and Big John Studd.
You know, Ricky sem Well knows he shouldn't do the
leg drap as a finisher in his match. It's more
it's more of a you know, it's more of a
it's more of a matter of respect or or if
or if frick players in your main event and you

(27:10):
know he's gonna bleed all over the place and you're
in an undercard match, you know you probably figured out
it's a good idea not not to juice and and.

Speaker 4 (27:18):
Yeah, no, And I I think part of it too
with Hogan. And I mean I've I've even got a
little taste of it, just one on one and in
the Torch Talk interview that I did with him, god
like eight years ago now give or take. But I
think I think the feeling that you get and even
from talking to other guys and asking about this over
the years. Is Hulk has a way of It's not

(27:40):
passive aggressive. I wish I knew the terminology for it.
But he would say to an agent, for instance, hey bro,
or hey hey brother, when uh, you know, we don't
want Steamboat burning out of the crowd, you know, be
sure that, be sure that you know you don't go
past eight minutes on that one. And and you know,
like he would, I'm not doing a good Hogan inmitation,
but there'd be a way for him to say it
where it'd sound like he was simply speaking on behalf

(28:02):
of the bet of the good of the company and
the good of the wrestling card. But the message was
clear he didn't want to be called out on it.
But what he was saying is I don't want to
be shown up. But he would say it in so
many words. It wasn't like I don't want Steamboat showing
me up today. Hogan doesn't work that way. Hogan's way
of working is like you know the famous line in
ww that doesn't work for me. But even in WWE

(28:23):
it was just more subtle. It was just you know,
tell one of the agents, hey, you know what's planned
for Steamboat and somebody say, oh, you know he's going
to do this or you know whatever undercard Matge talking
about British bulldogs might against Heart Foundation and uh and
he would just, you know, make one little comment. And
at that point, Hogan was the guy. I mean, everyone
wanted to be on the house shows that Hogan was on,
because the payoffs were bigger, because the crowds were bigger.
Everybody was walking on tiptoes around Hogan, walking on eggshells,

(28:46):
making sure that they didn't do anything wrong, so he
didn't have to exert like this huge egotistical uh force
in order to get his way. People just kind of
read between the lines on him and went out of
their way to make sure that you know, nothing was
done that that you know that that that he might
frown on a friend. Quick plug for you vi I

(29:06):
p members, be sure to check out the blog section
of the VIP blog section of PW Torch. You've got
three blogs up in the last week. In that in
the new revamped vi IP blog section, we have a
ton of VIP members posting blogs along with my daily
blog that I've been doing for over two weeks.

Speaker 9 (29:22):
Now, and you know, I am having an absolute blash
with it.

Speaker 3 (29:27):
I really am.

Speaker 9 (29:28):
It's it's such a great feature and.

Speaker 4 (29:31):
Reading and yeah, it's nice. Now the setup get you
get that reader feedback after your blog from you know,
other v I T members who are all kind of
reacting to what you're saying, adding to your thoughts, challenging
on points and that type of thing, which is what
I like about that.

Speaker 6 (29:44):
Sexually, it's great.

Speaker 9 (29:46):
And today's blog is on how Tommy seem to be
hurting today?

Speaker 4 (29:52):
Yep, I appreciate it.

Speaker 6 (29:54):
Guys.

Speaker 4 (29:54):
All right, I'm sure able to talk again. All right,
if you want to get through on the phone lines
here the numbers six seven two one nine eight two eight.
That's six four, six seven, nine two eight. We have
four people on hold. You can be system line and
I'm sure we'll get see on the show if you
call up right now.

Speaker 11 (30:12):
Need an extra dose of positivity in your wrestling podcasts,
will come join me Alan fourrel over in the Progress
Paradise at Peterbo Torch VIP as we mask on the
bright side of wrestling and focus on some of the
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(30:32):
for wrestlings past in the Paradise too, and we've done
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celebrating the glorious career of Jusian Thunderliger and our eye
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of it at the Prorest Paradise. Detailed PW of Torch

(30:54):
VIP subscription information and a list of all the VIP
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And yes, all vi P podcasts are compatible with popular
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stream them directly from our ad free VIP mobile site.
See you in the Paradise.

Speaker 4 (31:17):
Let's now go back to the phone banks to aera
code nine one zero. Please state your name and where
you're from. Yes, it is handle, but good Annimal. What's
your question today?

Speaker 6 (31:28):
Okay?

Speaker 2 (31:29):
Okay, the question today? Though?

Speaker 6 (31:30):
Okay?

Speaker 12 (31:31):
Is there any rumors of anything about CNA TV title
to be changed up, you know for the way to
the look how it.

Speaker 4 (31:38):
Is now to change the actual belt?

Speaker 2 (31:43):
Yes, because this was like a world tier, I would hope.

Speaker 4 (31:46):
So I haven't heard that either way, Pat of you.

Speaker 5 (31:49):
No, no, I haven't, but it sort of stands to
reason that it's gonna that it's gonna look different. Yeah,
I'm expecting that, although.

Speaker 4 (31:56):
Although they may change it to like the uh Northeast
Eastern States title next month. When a wrestler decides he
only wants to defend it in the Northeast and the
promotion just says, whatever you say, we'll do it. You know,
Booker t shows up with the title TNA. Instead of saying,
what are you doing, Karen Arona fake title said, oh,
I guess we'll start saying shing title defenses, even though
he just showed up with it. And then uh, Eric

(32:17):
Young said, oh, I'm going to change it to a
global title and I'm only going to defend it overseas,
which lasted, you know, a few weeks. And then and
then Rob Terry went to and AJ Style says, no,
I wanted to be a TV title. It's just it's
it's so ludicrous how they've handled this whole belt in
the first place, you know, in the first place. So
it wouldn't surprise me if they if they get it
to if they turned it into a TV title belt,
create a new belt in a week or two later

(32:38):
they came up with something new to call it, or
just decide to drop it. I mean that's kind of
consistency and logic they've applied to that belt so far.

Speaker 12 (32:46):
Okay, Yeah, because it seemed like you know that you
know from the based on a Spailers, you know, a
Z Styles wrestled twice, you though, honest thing. You know,
you know the de Tournament, you know with Cardengle recently.
But I felt like you should have put it bill
a lot with Tommy's ring where you know, if you
say that, don't defend it every week, like you say.

Speaker 4 (33:02):
That was good point, Hanible thanks to the call. I
think as far as the TV title goes, I really
would like to see a structure with it. I'd like
to see viewers told and TNA stick to it that
that belt's going to defend. It gonna be defended every
two weeks. It's a TV title. We're gonna defend it
every two weeks on TV. We're gonna have a number
one versus a Top contenders match one week, and then

(33:23):
the following week it'll be defended. The winner that match
will challenge the TV champion and just do that, so
there's twenty six defenses per year. Keep the belt defended
on TV, you know, pay per v. I guess it's fine.
I'd prefer to not do it. I prefer to keep
the world title on pay per view and the TV
title on just the basic cable shows. But whatever, I like.
I like a sense of structure other because that gives
it a reason for existing. It's a title that's defended

(33:44):
twenty six times you're on TV. That makes it a
TV title. If you say it's a TV title but
it's defended just scattered on a scattershot basis, really no
logic or schedule, and including pay per view on house
shows or even just also pay per view but not
house shows. What makes it stand out? What's its sense
for existing? I like that you have a TV title
being the a defending champions belt, a fighting champions belt.

(34:07):
Who asked to It's a new opponent every two weeks,
and it's it's considered a prestigious title because of how
often it's defended. And it doesn't go against what I
said earlier about the World title. I think world titles
should be protected and defended. Not that often, but I
think a TV title should have that structure where you
just know, oh, do I want to watch Impact tonight?
Oh I wonder who's going to be in the contender
match this week? Or oh yeah last week? You know

(34:29):
whoever won the contender's match. I want to see how
he does against styles. That's an interesting matchup. I think
that's one thing that can draw people. I don't think
TNA thinks that a wrestling match can draw people. With
the title and the intrigue of seeing two guys against
each other, they don't think that draws, unfortunately, but I do,
though I had.

Speaker 5 (34:46):
Let me be honest with you, La, you're in the
wrestling bubble. You know, people don't want to see you.
I mean, that's not you know, resting and wrestling's stake
and you know take and if you have a fake
sport you don't need to have. That's not sure, that's
you know, that's that's something that you Internet marks want
and all you want is wrestling on your wrestling shows.

Speaker 13 (35:05):
That's okay, I'm done.

Speaker 4 (35:07):
Sorry, Yes, thank you. Pat. All right, we're midway to
the show. You are listening to the PW Torch Live cast.
It is Wednesday, August eleventh, twenty ten. I'm Wade Keller,
editor of Progressing Torch Newsletter at PW torch dot com,
joined today by Progressing Torch columnist Pat McNeil. We just
put up yesterday the PDF version of the Progressing Torch Newsletter,

(35:27):
issue one and sixty three. We put them out once
a week. Do the mask we've got around for about
twenty three years, and the newsletter also was put up
in text format on the VIP website. We're offering subscriptions
at all times. VIP subscriptions you can go to PW
Torch dot com slash go VIP. That's PW torch dot

(35:48):
com slash go vip and get information on signing up.
Rates start at five dollars a month for a limited
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(36:10):
view roundtables and analysis, my weekly cover story and more.
That's pw torch dot com slash go VIP. We appreciate
those of you listening to this, supporting us and as
VIP members. Come on here, off in Pat and say
we really do deliver a lot for your monthly membership.
Lots of good stuff.

Speaker 5 (36:27):
Pat, you were going to say yes, now, now I
know you have a special offer for August. Now and
now in July, in case you haven't been listening. You know,
for a year subscription. You also got your free great
Park's car flag. So what's the offer for what's the
offer for August?

Speaker 4 (36:41):
With Pat? You were in charge this month? Okay, I
think it's a Linda mcmon bumper sticker.

Speaker 6 (36:47):
There you go.

Speaker 5 (36:48):
I can get a hand. I can get a whole
bunch of those.

Speaker 4 (36:51):
And we as speaking of annual memberships. While the full
VIP membership is ten dollars a month, we do have
an annual discount, so you can you can reduce that
quite a bit if you commit to a one year subscription.
VIP membership includes the newsletter PDF every week, the text
all the article in text format if you prefer that,
every week, the VIP blog that we're talking about earlier,

(37:11):
I write a blog pretty much every day now on
something in the news or something that crosses my desk.
I wrote a blog recently about the Progressing Illustrated five hundred,
the PWI five hundred. So sometimes I just choose OFFBET
topics that I really won't write about in the newsletter,
but it's kind of fun and casual and I interact
with readers afterwards, and we get a lot of comments
on a lot of the blogs, and I replied to

(37:33):
the reader comments. Plus the Wayetller Hotline, which is a
daily VIP usually news based update, often reviewing, also a
TV show such as Analysis of Raw. Usually I go
twenty twenty five minutes analyzing Raw the Night of Raw
with a hotline update. I've done that every day for
over one hundred days. It's been around for years and

(37:53):
it's been recorded more often than not on a daily basis.
Plus lots of other VIP audio. We put up over
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and hundreds of Progressing Torch news letter back issues dating
back to the late eighties. This is back issue Wednesday today,
so we'll be putting up another back issue from twenty
years ago, and a back issue from five years ago

(38:14):
and a back issue from five and a half years ago,
so three back euses every Wednesday with Hello, what pat
I said?

Speaker 6 (38:21):
All right? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (38:22):
Cool?

Speaker 4 (38:22):
And uh I didn't know what she said? And that'll
include some vintage torchtoks. We got some vintage torch talks
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free access to the main listening of Peter retorts, so
lots of good stuff. Hope you'll check it out. We
appreciate all of you who are subscribing. I am ready
to get back to the phone lines. We actually only

(38:43):
have two people on hold, no three people on hold.
I'm sorry right now, so you can be the fourth
six four, six, seven to one, nine to eight to
eight pad. Before we jump back into the phone banks,
we probably should let you do your event center update
for the weekend.

Speaker 5 (38:56):
Okay, well, I mean one of these weeks we'll come
up with some music.

Speaker 7 (38:59):
To put on.

Speaker 5 (39:00):
This's just making it right, gob all right, So let's
start with tomorrow night. I know everybody's excited about four
hours of well, thank you, that's that's good. But four
hours of wrestling tomorrow night, starting with WWE Superstars on
WGN with great matches such as Kelly Kelly versus Michelle
McCool and Cold Dustin YOCHI. Top two team you have

(39:20):
to take on the USSO Brothers follows my TNA Impact
on Spike TV. The Whole FM Show, a two out
of three falls match for the Tank Team titles in
CNA between the Motor City Machine gets in Tiered Money
and Pier Money and Rap Van Dam defending the tem
A title. I guess the fits in a board pull
of nails on a pulp match with Eric Sishuffer's referee

(39:41):
instead of Eric Fishoff on a pole full of nails
with a board as a referee, which I think would
be more interesting. Bob Friday Sevin W Snack on My
Network TV, you are two main events of Caine in
a non title match against Kobe Kinkson Andrew in Serio
in a non title match against cof. The Sigler Shows Thursday,
Friday and Saturday. They'll be in Mobile, Alabama and Saton

(40:03):
Rouge Louisiana and Tibodel, Louisiana, Maine of US all three nights.
A monstrous ball match between Jeff Party and Abyss with
Nick Foley's referee. Also, the battle between Ink Ink and
Team three D continues. Summer Slam is Sunday Waves. It
is a Saint Reviews they're holding in Los Angeles, California.
Your featured bouts are Shamous defending the w W title
against Brandy Orton, and a elimination match between Teams WWE

(40:27):
and the Nexus, which right now is the seven on
six handicap. Right I don't know how it will work out.
Contact Zone Wrestling has a big show Saturday at the
ECW Arena with something called a Hangled Web Jeff Matches,
Saddy Callahan and Joe Gacy take on DJ Hyden's Bed Excellent. Monday,
w W Ronaldy in Los Angeles. They'll be taping two
episodes fallout from SummerSlam. Tuesday, w W will presenting NXT

(40:51):
semi live from Bakersfield, California, a rare double elimination week.
On Wednesday, w W tapes a second leak of SmackDown
and a second League NXT in President on OHS TV
taps in Philadelphia. August twentieth and twenties, first headlined by
two Steel Cage matches. One on Friday, de Lyrics versus
Aston Ari's One on Saturday, Elle Jenerico and Coke Cabana

(41:11):
versus Kevin Stein and Steve Carino and of course Steve Ball.
Five takes place Saturday, September eleventh in Rahnway, New Jersey,
headlined by Mercedes Martinez versus Awesome Tong and Brian Daniels.
Brian Danielson versus Mononoi Sala back to your Way excellent.

Speaker 4 (41:27):
Thank you very much Pat McNeil for that Events Center update.
I feel like we are now ready to uh uh
for the whole week. I hope I can stop this
music there we go.

Speaker 5 (41:38):
That'd be nice.

Speaker 4 (41:40):
Well, I think it kind of paid you if you
felt like you had to keep up with the pace
of the music.

Speaker 5 (41:45):
So anyway, yeah, I sort of did.

Speaker 2 (41:49):
That is the uh.

Speaker 4 (41:50):
That is Bang Bang Esh by the way, UK group
very popular a few years ago in the underground brick
pop uh, I don't know what what what category feleader punk,
britpop punk, hybrid uh very big in the United Kingdom.
So go go check them out on iTunes a few
if you liked what you heard, and if you don't,
well to each of their own. All right, let's let's

(42:11):
go back to the phone lines and go to Eric
code five five nine. Thanks for all in the state
you name and where you're from.

Speaker 10 (42:18):
Hey, guys, just Steve from California.

Speaker 2 (42:20):
Steve.

Speaker 10 (42:23):
Actually, I wanted to clarify one thing real quick yesterday
when I had said that the w W should should
do what Chelse Cumming is doing and let the wrestlers
shoot an interview, and then you had to said, well
someone's not shooting. What I had meant was is, uh,
Dana White is not behind cell Son and giving him
his line.

Speaker 4 (42:45):
A boy, we're gonna sht that, Uh Steve, We're getting
tons of background noise with you. Are you Are you
gonna be out of that noise and attempt too.

Speaker 10 (42:55):
I'll be out of the noise right now.

Speaker 4 (42:56):
Cool. But yeah, yeah, no, you're right. I mean, Vince
Russo Scripts has scripted a lot of wording for wrestlers,
and Dana White wasn't. And Dana White isn't in that
isn't in the business of scripting promos for talent. However,
when chille Son and called Dana White that I want
to tattle Scott and I and I've earned it, I

(43:18):
think Dana White was certainly thinking, well, you know, chill
has probably maybe earned it. It's not the most obvious
number one contender, but man, he's a really good talker.
I think we can do some business. So I mean,
you know, but Chill Sonen definitely was coming up with
his own stuff. I mean, that's his personality, and I
don't think us he's ever going to get into the
business of having their fighters talking bullet points provided by

(43:42):
the rest, by the mm A promotion or the UFC promotion.
But at the same time, you know, there are I
think scripting promos for wrestlers should be done on a
case by case basis. There are some guys who need
that that guidance to get the message across. But I
think too often, and I think it's a big issue
with with bookers especially. I think it's been a problem
with in TNA. Is they want to the bookers in TNA,

(44:05):
their scriptwriters in TNA want to earn their teep by
making them seem totally inexpendable, and they end up pushing
themselves too much. They end up doing too much and
working way harder than they need to, to the point
where there's diminishing returns in a backlash. And I think
at times it's a disrespect for the wrestlers and what
they're able to do in the ring and the stories

(44:26):
they're able to tell in the ring, and just natural
and promptu interviews that they can give if you just
keep your hands off of them. I mean, it's just
there's been so many good promotions over the years. I
grew up with the AWA that was an interview territory.
World Class wasn't really an interview territory. I mean, scannerac
Bar and the Free Birds were good on promos, Chris
Adams and Gina were good, but it wasn't like the
whole show wasn't built around promos like the AWA was.

(44:47):
But the AWA, they didn't script out all the interviews.
It was just something where you've got, you know, people
kind of put their heads together and come up with
ideas on how to promote a match, and then the
wrestlers just do their thing. And I think the more
you trust wrestlers to do that, the more they more
often than not, they'll surprise the bookers by coming through
without without needing the crutch of being told exactly what
to say.

Speaker 5 (45:08):
Yeah, I think it should be reserved for the wrestlers
who need or want help with their promos, and those
people do exist, believe it or not.

Speaker 1 (45:16):
Yes, you can support us on Patreon and get these
shows with ads and plugs remove, the weight Keller Prosing podcast,
Weight Keller Prosing post shows and the PW Torch daily
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(45:40):
that's patreon dot com slash PW Torch VIP and you
can also upgrade to other tiers and receive even more
benefits through Patreon.

Speaker 4 (45:49):
All right, U, we'll put steedback on. Steve, are you
out of that background noise?

Speaker 10 (45:54):
I guess we're gonna Steve.

Speaker 4 (45:56):
We're gonna let you go just because that that is
really rough hearing you with all that noise in the back.
And we will now move to Eric code six five
to one. Please state your name and where you're from.

Speaker 6 (46:06):
The way.

Speaker 14 (46:07):
This is Mike from Woodberry, Minnesota.

Speaker 4 (46:09):
What's up? Thank you?

Speaker 14 (46:11):
That always a pleasure.

Speaker 2 (46:13):
Thanks, Yeah, Wade, you.

Speaker 14 (46:15):
And Jason had just a great show yesterday. That was
an awesome hour and the post show is great too.
And one of the points that you've been making is
talking about how Triple H has an eye for talent.
You and Bruce kind of talked about it a while
back on this show and brought it up again yesterday.
And I am, by no means a Triple H hater,

(46:37):
but I think you're giving him a little too much
credit for having an eye for Batista and Randy Jorton
and shame is. I mean, anybody can see little things
that maybe Triple HH saw in those three especially, But
does he have an eye for an Evant Bourne type
or Raymas Stereo type? But I don't think so. I

(46:57):
think he's got that bodybuilder thing, and I don't And
I'm not necessarily sure if he's running the show someday.
If this guy's like and Evan Bourde can barely get
a shot nowadays, what's it going to be like when
Triple H is running the show. I mean it's I
don't know. I think he's getting a little a riddle
too much credit. He deserves credit, he really.

Speaker 4 (47:18):
Does, but well, don't don't I guess don't go too
far in expanding on what I was saying, which is
just he hasn't associated himself with duds. He didn't pick
Hiden Reich or Kendall Suzuki or Mark Jindrak or Sean O'Hare,
like there's guys you look at, you go, you know
if you're John Laurnidis, and you know, because he was
responsible and he's definitely responsible for a lot of horrible

(47:40):
talent decisions, Triple H didn't associate with people who didn't
make it on the air. And granted there's only three,
I mean, you know, there's only really three guys he
associated with in any way where you go. That was
his guy, Those were his guys. But at least he
was somewhat selective and doesn't have a bunch of duds
on his schedule. So I would say my comment was
meant to focus in on that narrow of a situation.

(48:03):
I don't I don't know that he's pro or for
or against Devin Bourne and having that in the mix.
I'm just not familiar enough with his current opinion on
whether it's important to have that Joseph athleticism on the show.
Maybe maybe not, But if he got in control of
the company, I mean, he's a smart guy. It's not
to say he doesn't have some plause that would come out,
but he's a smart enough guy where he'd have to realize, Okay,

(48:24):
it's not just about me anymore. I'm fifty eight years old.
I'm not wrestling hopefully, and it's about finding the right
mix in this environment today. And you know, we'll be
in the twenty twenties by then and the world will
be different. So if that's when he's running the company,
I hope he's smart enough to to not just be
have the bodybuilding fetish that has kind of driven his

(48:44):
that has inspired him and driven his career.

Speaker 5 (48:48):
Pat any thoughts on the point, No, I think I
think you got it?

Speaker 6 (48:52):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (48:52):
Cool? Anything else, Mike, I do have a question.

Speaker 14 (48:56):
Maybe Pat could maybe elaborate more on this, Okay, but
it seems to me that WWE has gotten a little
bit back to basics with building some of these programs,
especially in Nextency and stuff, and a little bit of
it's orton Shamus stuff. I mean, I bout fell out
of my chair last week when when Seamus had a

(49:16):
metric gold Dust and before the match they had a
video package on their history in ECW last year. Then
Shamus kind of gets a glorified squash match and then
after the match he had a promo. I mean, basic booking.
I couldn't believe it. So do you think that WWE
not only are they driven to build up new stars

(49:37):
obviously right now, but do you think they're driven to
have more and especially involved with a PG product, but
more of a back to basic booking principles and ideas
because it's going to contrast so much better compared to
a TNA. And I know that it's a hard core
audience that's watching, not no pun intended watching kna's product,

(50:00):
But it just seems to me that some of the
booking decisions we've seen lately on ww television is very
old school.

Speaker 5 (50:09):
Yeah, well, Mike, I think what you're saying here is,
you know, the attitude there was sort of a response
to the fact that vincient man, what he was doing
wasn't working. And I think we're we're the point where
you know, they've made the move to PG. They were
obviously in a ruts several months ago. And when you're
what you're doing is not working and it keeps not working,

(50:32):
then it's time to make a change. It's it's not
like vincick Man proactively seeks major changes. It's just that something,
you know. It's just that when when things stopped going
the way he likes, it's time to it's time to
think outside the box. And if thinking outside the box
means you go back to basic wrestling booking, then obviously
I'm all for it.

Speaker 4 (50:51):
Cool Mike, anything else other than go twins.

Speaker 6 (50:54):
Yes, go twins, that's awesome.

Speaker 2 (50:56):
Thank you for that.

Speaker 14 (50:57):
Baking a call to day and if you can keep
me on hold, I appreciate.

Speaker 4 (51:00):
Yep, we'll put you on a hold. I put everybody
on hold, so people want to hang up, they can,
but I'm not hanging up on anybody once the call
is done. So everybody who is listening on the phone
and not on a computer, if you want to participate,
don't worry about being cut off. I can't speak for James,
so hopefully he does the same thing. All right, Let's uh,
let's go back to the phone lines. We only have
two people on hold, so if you want to get
a line the number six four six, seven eight. We're

(51:23):
doing a good job going through calls today and we
will go to seven eight six. Please state your name
and where you're from.

Speaker 3 (51:29):
Her were going as Johnny from Damas, Texas.

Speaker 4 (51:31):
Hey, Johnny get here from john.

Speaker 3 (51:34):
First though, would say we could just name the sea
title of the Disney World Airyweight title.

Speaker 13 (51:38):
And you know you could just do it at that.

Speaker 4 (51:40):
I don't think Universal Studios would like that. But that's
another thing.

Speaker 15 (51:43):
Oh sorry, I'm sorry for it.

Speaker 2 (51:44):
That's right.

Speaker 3 (51:45):
I mean I want to say one thing. I try
to get T and A a shot, Like I think
it was a week before the last I don't. I
don't watch TNAT. I'll try to give it a shot.

Speaker 5 (51:53):
I turn I tune the TV and the first thing
I see.

Speaker 3 (51:55):
Is a Cogan and Kevin Nash and Eric Bishop in
the ring can't draft and then the slow motion attack.

Speaker 6 (52:03):
I turned off.

Speaker 2 (52:04):
I got bored.

Speaker 3 (52:05):
I came back and the next thing I come back to, ie,
uh that have to hit the Orlando joining grinding on
a on uh hija Burkey, I forgot to do his name?

Speaker 6 (52:16):
Who wants to watch that?

Speaker 16 (52:17):
In regardless of what story?

Speaker 15 (52:19):
I mean, that turns people away.

Speaker 3 (52:20):
Because I mean I thought I got grind, you know, like.

Speaker 5 (52:23):
What the hell watching?

Speaker 2 (52:26):
No?

Speaker 5 (52:27):
I mean, I mean, you've got it, You've got it
backwards as Vince Russell has explained. People are bored when
they're watching the wrestling matches. They want to see all
all the hilarious high drinks and then ring attacks.

Speaker 4 (52:37):
And promos and and and here's the thing too, because
what Russell's gonna say as well, bro, I got access
to the minut Fi minute numbers, and I look at
those Minify minute numbers, and we don't do well when
the wrestling is on, but the ratings go up when
we stop wrestling, and it's it's it's a self fulfilling prophecy.
And that's the part that just Vince Russo doesn't get
is when Vince Russo books a wrestling promotion for years,

(52:58):
the only audience left are the people who don't like wrestling.
If you're watching TNA, you're not watching for the wrestling,
because if you are, you would have been driven away
by sampling the product week after week after week, exactly
what Johnny just said. You tune in and you see
a bunch of older guys standing around the ring talking
about something that nobody cares about anymore, and then you
see some weird, gimmicky thing with Orlando Jordan that just

(53:21):
is just makes you plug your nose and turn the channel.
You're of course you're not gonna have ratings go up
when the wrestling is on, because A you've turned those
people away and B you don't know how to promote
a sports like atmosphere for wrestling, where you build up
for day, for weeks and weeks the idea, and months
after month and year free year, you build up the
idea that what happens in the ring counts because when

(53:42):
they put the wrestlers in the ring, the matches last
three minutes and or or six minutes, and the announcers
spend most of the time talking about something else because
they're so free, you're going to turn the channel. It's
a self fulfilling prophecy the way Russo books. And therefore
the number the key isn't in just the in at
five minute numbers. There's so much more to it than that.

(54:02):
You can define what your audience likes and doesn't like
within reason, and I think you'll have more success having
a formula where the inering action is treated as a
huge deal. Yeah, all right, Johnny, any follow up?

Speaker 3 (54:18):
Yeah, one thing I think that that WW that Raw
show was great. I think the last angle was where
there's her phase off and that crowd increase.

Speaker 2 (54:27):
I think that place, I mean.

Speaker 13 (54:28):
That thing is the crowd made that that that moment.

Speaker 2 (54:31):
But I think that was just a great moment, you know.
I mean, I think WW is on a roll right now.

Speaker 4 (54:35):
I think we should we should have on the on
PW Torch. I should talk to James about this a
like a moment of the month where because it'd be
cool just to every month have like put up a poll,
you know, a voting poll on the on the site
and go all right, here's eight options, the eight top
moments of the month as nominated by readers, and then
at people vote, because it'd be cool at the end
of the year to just go and go. The moment

(54:56):
of the month of January was this February, was this March?
Was that it could be kind of neat just I
can see who was involved in it and what the
readers of the Torch are endorsing as the thing that
made them go. That's why I'm a fan. That's why
I spent two hours watching this, That's why I watch
every week. And that you're right, Johnny, that was a
moment that was one of those UH top top candidates

(55:17):
for a moment of the month, or you watch and
you just go things are clicking. That was a culmination
of a lot of things that came together for weeks
and for two hours, and they had the right crowd
and Sacramento who reacted in the way that you'd scripted
if you could script it, if you had hired cast
members as opposed to paying ticket holders, and do you know,

(55:37):
go ahead, pet and then we'll go back to Johnny.

Speaker 5 (55:39):
Okay, it's amazing that if you do if you do
a more or less straight wrestling show, you can have
elements of soap opera, and you can have elements of
you know, of storytelling that you know, and and it
just sort of flows naturally. You don't have to you
don't have to break things up and have a hula
hoop contest.

Speaker 4 (55:57):
Very good, Ah, Johnny, you're gonna.

Speaker 3 (55:58):
Say, yeah, I do want I'm already off topic now.
I just want to a guys. I was looking at
the go vi at the the part there was a
part that said something about just uh, just audio. Is
that all the audio for the month or just just
certain audios you.

Speaker 7 (56:11):
Give it for that?

Speaker 10 (56:12):
No?

Speaker 4 (56:14):
Yeah, the on peterbee torch dot com slash go VIP,
which is a page that you're on the audio only
the audio light option is there's a lot of audio,
but it's not all the audio. It's just the daily
Keller Hotline and the live casts with the after shows.
So for five dollars to get that, it does not
include though, the East Coast Audio Show, the Brian Hoops
at george Shire Nostalgia podcast, the Weekend Bruce Mitchell audio Show,

(56:36):
the post pay per view roundtables, or the Torch Talks
or the Sean Radikin audio showcases and other audio that
we feature, the the Torch Talk archives. None of that's included.
It's just the current Keller Hotline and UH and live
cast with VIP after show. So you get about you
get about fifty updates with that for the five dollars,
but you don't get the other half of the audio. Okay,

(56:58):
thank you so much, no problem. Yeah, So we offer
kind of an introductory for five dollars price for people
on a tight budget or people who they're just happy
to getting the live cast and the Keller Hotline and
that's plenty for them and it's enough to keep up on.
We have that introductory rate at five dollars a month,
but like I say, it's for ten dollars a month,
you not only get a lot more audio for all
those shows that I mentioned that aren't included on that,

(57:20):
but then also access to the VIP website, the VIP Forum,
the VIP blogs, all the back issues of the Torch,
all our archives of our audio shows, hundreds of installments
of our Torch talks and audio and text format.

Speaker 12 (57:31):
And and on and on and on.

Speaker 4 (57:34):
So obviously you got to wait a tont on more
for full VIP membership, but there is a little bit
of a man out there for people who are on
a tight budget or just want limited audio. All right,
back to the phone lines, let's keep rowing Erico nine
to one four. Please state your name and where you're from.
Bee from Florida, Vinnie from Florida. Oh, Steve, Sorry, we
I just picked up the last part of your name.

(57:55):
Hey Steve, what's going on? What's up today?

Speaker 6 (57:59):
Thank you, sir. I guess my question would revolve around Christian.
Do you see him possibly being the seventh man for
Team WWE with the edge connection?

Speaker 4 (58:12):
No, I go ahead, pack with your reasoning and then
I'll jump.

Speaker 5 (58:17):
I think that they're gonna want I think that Whoever,
the seventh person is gonna be somebody higher up on
the car. They've already you know, they've already shown repeatedly
that they're not really interested in Christians as a main
event wrestler unless the show he's main eventing is Superstars.

Speaker 4 (58:33):
Very very true. I agree they had a chance to
play off of the edge Christian relationship and turn that
into something, and they've chosen time and time again since
he came back not to go anywhere with it. Christian
is a guy who is a gatekeeper of sorts. He's
gonna occasionally beat, as he did a couple weeks, go
on SmackDown an emerging rising star, but mostly he's there

(58:55):
to have some good, solid TV matches against some some younger,
younger wrestlers and help them get better and if they
beat him, give them a credible win. And that's his role.
He's a role player. Now he's a utility guy, and
he's earning i'm sure solid money. I know he aspired
to do more. Going to TNA backfired a little bit
or certainly didn't help him. I think by design, Vince,

(59:17):
out of spite, decided not to give him any bigger
of a push than he got before he left as
a way to tell people, don't think you can go
hold the TNA world title for a while and then
come back to me and go, I'm a bigger star,
now you better push me. No matter how good his
matches and promos were in TNA, I think Vince was
going to hold it against him that he went somewhere else.
So not only that, it's really a raw angle, and

(59:38):
I don't think if that's one of many reasons that
I don't think they'll do it either is I don't
think they're going to do cross brand pollination on the storyline,
at least not at this point. That's something that they
can maybe do down the line. Well it's not Christian,
then who Brian Daniel, Bryan the Miz could. I mean,
there's a whole roster full of people on Rosside who

(01:00:00):
aren't necessarily booked for Summer Flame yet, and they may
go shorthanded. It may end up being that there isn't
anybody and they just fight six on seven and start
off at a disadvantage. But I mean, if you say
it's not Christian, then who I would say, If not Christian,
then there's twenty other guys ahead of him in line. Honestly,
I mean, I agree with you on the Edge connection
that that's a reason to talk about it. But I

(01:00:21):
think the more you talk it through and look at
how Christian is used and the fact that the edge
Christian thing isn't really a big deal to Vincent Man
or for that matter, even necessarily to add him edge
at this point, you know, yeah, I just don't see it.
I mean, something we'll talk. We should talk about it
in the next couple days on the Love Cast. You know,
who should that seventh man be? Because if they do

(01:00:42):
decide to do a seventh man, it'll be interesting, you
know what direction they go with that. I don't think
it'll be Triple Ah because he's not going to be
ready to come back yet. They kind of knocked out
the Heart Dynasty from contention. But honestly, I could see,
you know, Mark Henry got beat down, But I mean
he could end up being that guy, uh who comes in.

(01:01:04):
They could do a comedy angle and bring Santino out.
I don't know. Teddy Biassi was in the running at
one point. He wanted to do something like that, So.

Speaker 2 (01:01:11):
I don't know.

Speaker 4 (01:01:11):
Pat is there is there a top candidate on your
list right now, I'm.

Speaker 5 (01:01:15):
Leaning towards the Miz because you know it would Uh,
it's the biggest name that they've got to put in
that spot outside of outside of bringing back Shawn Michaels
a cripple h and uh you know I mean it.
I mean if they're going to have somebody screw over
the raw side and help the Nexus, somebody who's only
out for himself, then you think the music be part

(01:01:36):
of that.

Speaker 4 (01:01:37):
Steve, if you had your choice besides Christian, who would
you who would you pick?

Speaker 6 (01:01:43):
Uh, you know, besides Christian?

Speaker 4 (01:01:48):
Yeah, if if if it was.

Speaker 2 (01:01:51):
Up to me, I probably.

Speaker 4 (01:01:56):
This is like Hamley Feud where yeah, just when the
buzzer is about to ring and you're gonna have three strikes,
I've been born. Oh there you go. I like that.

Speaker 5 (01:02:07):
That could work.

Speaker 4 (01:02:07):
Yeah, that would work. Yeah, that's actually really good. I'm
glad we waited you. You got a good uh good option.
That's definitely throwing we're throwing into the mix of the possibility.
We're down to three minutes. We've got one person on hold,
so if you want to join the show, we might
be able to get to your call. The number six
four six seven nine eight two weight. We've got aera
code four eight four on hold. Please state your name
and where you're from.

Speaker 5 (01:02:28):
Yeah, this is Nick from Reading Pennsylvania.

Speaker 4 (01:02:31):
And Nick, what's on your mind today?

Speaker 6 (01:02:34):
Hey? Great, here are great being on the rotcast.

Speaker 4 (01:02:37):
Good heavy.

Speaker 5 (01:02:38):
I just had two really quick questions. The first and
then I'll just like hang up. But the first is,
all right, it's driving me nuts what they're doing with Swagger,
and just mainly because he seemed to have fallen out
of favor really quickly. Well, I guess saying falling out
of favor is kind of the wrong word, but I

(01:02:58):
just kind of wondered what you think they plan on
doing with Swagger, Like do you think they're probably gonna
like try building him back up by way of like
that MVP like losing streak type of push, or if
they're just going to put him on the back burner
until they really need like some more main events talent.

(01:03:19):
And then the second one is do you have any
updates on Ricky Steamboat because I haven't seen any of
it anywhere? And thanks a lot, and I'll be listening
to the podcast.

Speaker 4 (01:03:30):
Next one, Patty fo ANSWER's question is the reminder of
VIP members that we will be Pat and I will
be doing the VIP after show right after this, So
if you're listening to us Andy lay in the VIP section,
stay tuned. We'll cover a few other subjects that we
haven't covered here yet, or expand on some of these subjects.
Pat in the both subject of Steamboat and and do
you agree that Swagger's ninety push to slow down at

(01:03:52):
all or that he seems to be being.

Speaker 5 (01:03:53):
Very Yeah, they've backed up on Swagger. And why you
know they do this sometimes, you know, somebody will have
a hot first year and then w W will in
order to keep him from getting a big head, sort
of move him back down the card for a while.
I've heard that after Summer Slam Swagger is going to
be feuding with Matt Hardy for a while. So yeah,
it looks like they'll be putting him back down the card,
if that's right.

Speaker 4 (01:04:14):
Yeah, and then that if that happens, Pat, if he
feuds with Matt Hardy, I mean, I hope that's a case.
I hope that just having run out of of options
for Jack for a while and they want to give
him a decisive victory moving up the card to move
him back up the card when when he rotates back
into the main events, because he was really entertaining to watch.

Speaker 5 (01:04:35):
Yeah, I mean I think we'll be.

Speaker 4 (01:04:37):
Back, yep.

Speaker 5 (01:04:38):
And I haven't really heard anything new. I mean he's
you know, I heard he was out of the hospital.

Speaker 6 (01:04:45):
That he is.

Speaker 5 (01:04:46):
You know, he's not able to I mean, he's not
able to wrestle and he probably won't be ever and
he's on uh he's not allowed to lift things. Yeah,
there's gonna be a recovery process.

Speaker 4 (01:04:58):
Yeah, he'll probably be in the developmental territory ORRY scouting
for a while and not going on the road at
all the house shows and really cutting back a schedule
seven seven three five seconds to give us something to
talk about on the VIP after show.

Speaker 6 (01:05:09):
Go ten seconds.

Speaker 4 (01:05:13):
Now, Okay, nope, Well I tried. I tried. That was intimidating.
All right, Well, thanks for joining us until tomorrow. Wait
Tiller and we have to Tid McNeil signing off.

Speaker 3 (01:05:34):
Thank you for using blog talk radio. Goodbye.

Speaker 17 (01:05:42):
In twenty twelve, NXT transitioned into the developmental system and
ultimately the brand you see today on the Torch VIP
podcast NXT eight years back. We'll be taking a weekly
look at this page in NXT's early history.

Speaker 18 (01:05:57):
Join Kelly Wells and me Tom Stout from pa U
Talks Nxt every Saturday as we go eight years back
to the day to track NXT's rising talents and why
they did or didn't work out Exclusively for PW Torch
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Speaker 4 (01:06:13):
We are now officially in the VIP have to show
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(01:06:35):
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are hearing here as part of our array of seventy
five plus VIP exclusive audio shows every month pat what
are you expecting as you like politics? I like politics,

(01:06:59):
What are you expecting with Linda McMahon now getting the
official nomination in terms of the type of scrutiny WWE faces.
Is the media going to do a good job or
a poor job when it comes to what they decide
is relevant to Linda mcmon's campaign. And will they ask
good questions or will they be kind of the questions
where they don't know enough information and a very simple

(01:07:21):
answer is enough to knock them off the scent?

Speaker 5 (01:07:24):
I think you already. I think that's a leading question
you're on now. I think that I expect the media
to do a very poor job of covering for wrestling
any context of deep Blumenthal versus McMahon, not Connecticut Senate race.
I think this is going to be a nasty campaign because,
you know, it's obvious that the the two. Yeah, it's

(01:07:45):
obvious that McMahon tried the leak damaging information, well leak's
damaging information on Richard Blumenthal before winning the primary. And
I'm sure that the Bloomenthal campaign is saving up, you know,
the twenty years worth of dirt they have on on
Busin McMann and therefore by proxy on Linda McMahon. So,
you know, I'm not expecting this to be a pretty campaign.

(01:08:08):
And you know, Connecticut is close to New York and
that that's New York thinks it is the capital of
the universe, and perhaps even more so than it is.
And I'm expecting a lot of loud coverage, but not
a lot of accurate coverage.

Speaker 4 (01:08:22):
And it's really expensive. If Lenna McMahon truly paid or
spent the money that she spent on this campaign, which
they the Democrats, are saying was an astronomical amount of money,
it equals four hundred forty six dollars per vote. That's
how much he paid.

Speaker 5 (01:08:41):
And if I'm a Connecticut voter, I'd much rather just
get the check.

Speaker 2 (01:08:44):
And you know, as I know.

Speaker 4 (01:08:46):
Four hundred and forty six thousand dollars per vote to
get fifty two hundred and six votes, and it didn't
even get her more than fifty percent of the vote. Now,
I don't people sometimes dwell on that in politics and voting,
but I don't think it's that relevant y because it's
how many opponents you have, it's a.

Speaker 5 (01:09:01):
Three way ration. I don't think there's a run off
in Connecticut. So yeah, I mean, it's not that surprised
and shouldn't get to fifty percent, right.

Speaker 4 (01:09:06):
It's like people say that about Clinton too, Oh he
never got fifty percent. It's like, well, but he ran
against Ross Perrot and George W. Bush. I mean it
didn't it just you know, by definition, if you have
three or four or five highly funded candidates who are
getting a lot of commercials and TV time, that you're
not going to get fifty percent. But she did get
a bit. She had a twenty one percent victory over
Rob Simmons, and Shift, the third placer, only had twenty

(01:09:28):
three percent, so she more than doubled his number. I
mean it's a good showing. But for the amount of
money she spends, you know, maybe it's maybe it's a
slightly ominous sign, but who knows. I mean, everybody's going
to rally around her who's on the Republican side, and
everyone's going to rally around Bloominal. And the interesting thing is,
like you said, Patt, it's the New York market, and
she has to spend a lot of money from her

(01:09:48):
coffers in order to buy ads that are seen in
Connecticut because Connecticut shares the New York market. It's a
very expensive type of campaign to run. And you know,
if I'm a wrestler who sat around being told, oh,
we got to cut back on this, and you can't
do first class, and oh catering is this we don't
have enough for catering, and oh, drug testing is so expensive.
But she's got hundreds of millions of dollars to spend

(01:10:08):
on a campaign. You know, it's tough for her to say, well,
we had to cut back on drug testing because it
was too expensive when she's spending hundreds of millions of
dollars to run for Senate. It's it's one of many
things that she could get that that could end up,
you know, being a talking point with her. But in
the end, though, the thing that I'm already tired of
is the little snickering by the media that we can't
even talk about this because it's pro wrestling, and oh,

(01:10:32):
does she really have the resume having gone from that
crazy world to this, And it's like she ran a company.
You know, it doesn't matter what that company is selling.
That's that's a that's a resume item worth having. Now,
does it deserve scrutiny, absolutely, But the scrutiny. Shouldn't be
it shouldn't be shouldn't have the prejudice of, oh, it's
it's it's pro wrestling, you know, that shouldn't work against
her from the beginning, because her job was to balance

(01:10:54):
the books, and to manage the office staff, and to
manage licensing contracts and and uh and that type of thing.
I mean, the fact that the end product was a
male soap proper as she likes to call it over
and over again. I don't think should matter that much.

Speaker 5 (01:11:08):
No, I mean, there's you know, at the at the
end of the day, there are plenty there will be
plenty of reasons to vote for against Linda McMahon that
have nothing to do with her time running WWE.

Speaker 4 (01:11:20):
All right, well, moving on to a different subjects. We
talked about the Summer Slam Takes Team main event a
little bit in terms of who that seventh man might be.
I like Evan Borne as an option if it's not
the miz Or or Daniel Brian. What do you think
about the possibility of Daniel Brian being brought in for
for this big angle, in this big match as a
way to bring him back and have him you know what,

(01:11:41):
would he get a big pop if he was the
guy to walk out?

Speaker 6 (01:11:45):
I don't know.

Speaker 5 (01:11:46):
I mean I expect the people at Summer you know,
people of Summer Slam who spent a lot of money
to go to the show, or probably uh probably you know,
have a lot of h have a lot of knowledge
of WWE, and might even recogniz as Daniel Bryan or
Brian Danielson or whatever you want call him. I don't
think that's their plan. I think it's you know, I
think if if it was Daniel Bryan or Brian Danielson,

(01:12:10):
they'd be doing something to sort of get his name
back out there. And and they're not. And I mean
I I certainly hope he comes back to WWE.

Speaker 6 (01:12:19):
I don't see that.

Speaker 5 (01:12:19):
I don't think that they see him as a as
a as a mystery partner for for the main event
of their second biggest show.

Speaker 14 (01:12:24):
To hear.

Speaker 5 (01:12:26):
I mean it would I mean it would be nice.
I mean, he's a great wrestler. It would make make
the match more fun that I just I just don't
see it.

Speaker 4 (01:12:35):
I think if they did it, I would be applaud
them for not putting hints out there ahead of time, saying,
oh you know, you know, trying to throw his name
out there during n XT and throw show old clips
or have some you know blcoy about fone's exit, you know,
throw out his name. I'd like it because I think
it would be a huge surprise, you know, sort of
like Edge's early return at the Rumble or John Seene's
early return at the Rumble and that type of thing.

Speaker 5 (01:12:56):
Well, if it wouldn't be on the same level because
a lot of people see, you know, see Daniel Bryan
only for what he did on WWE television. So I mean,
unless you know, unless you studied, unless you studied the
first NXT attack like the Zucruiter tape, and remember that
he was the one who stood on Sino or choke
Justin Roberts, then you know it's it's going to be

(01:13:17):
a disappointment for a lot of people.

Speaker 4 (01:13:19):
Yeah, I agree. Why do you think the match is
going to go? We won't have a chance to talk
to you before the pay per view, so how do
you think that? What's give us a preview of your
online prediction of how you think it will actually be
booked or how you would book it.

Speaker 5 (01:13:34):
The thing that kills me is that during a seven
on seven elimination match, which you know, would would seem
like the wrong way to go at at the start
of a feud. You know, I would guess that the
booked you know, I mean, the elimination should be booked
somewhat evenly. The Nexus guy should probably cheat more than
the WWE guys, I would think, And then then it

(01:13:55):
will come down to one on one, you know, to
something two on two, and whoever is going to turn
or we're gonna turn heel on the w W side,
you know, turns heel on the on the other guy
that's left, and and that's your and that's your finish.

Speaker 4 (01:14:08):
I could see also the possibility of the uh shenanigans
leading up to the big match, where maybe Jericho gets
bought off, or Edge has second thoughts, or there's an attack,
and the numbers by the time the match takes place,
it's really only four on seven, and that would give
the storyline excuse for you know, Nexus winning, but they

(01:14:28):
had the odds in their favor yet again, and and
that leading to you know, whatever the next chapter is
in the in the feud. So I'm not even convinced
we're gonna see a seven on seven match at the
very start.

Speaker 2 (01:14:39):
Yeah, but I mean the.

Speaker 5 (01:14:40):
Problem with that is, what's your storyline excuse if you're
the w w E team for not having seven guys
out there, even if you're throwing out, you know, three
lower card guys as warm bodies, why would you go
into the fight seven on four when it could be
seven on seven. I mean, I understand what you're saying,
and it's and it's that's a good point. But yeah,
I mean you're you're trying to also, you're trying to
build up these guys a little bit, you know, and

(01:15:02):
having them win they win the big pay for you.
But it was seven on four that that really debally
doesn't do it. There's another possibility that you know, is
an offshoot of something he said that we haven't talked about,
which is the match does go and at seven on
seven and it comes down to the last couple of
guys and Daniel Brian does a run in for the
Nexus and helps them win.

Speaker 4 (01:15:21):
Ah. True, Yeah, that would be that would be quite
the twist. And Daniel Bryant certainly has the motivation to
rejoin the Nexus because even though they portrayed it as
you know, waye beary portrayed it as they got rid
of him. They could either conveniently forget that or say,

(01:15:41):
you know, they reconciled and and really, you know, he
thought thought more about it and realized management really screwed
him over. I did have a tough time, though, storyline wise,
making it totally logical, considering that the way that the
Nexus kind of blew them off that first week.

Speaker 5 (01:15:54):
Well that was I mean, yeah, but it's it's just
you know, that was our it was our plan all
along to bring him back at some point, and you know,
blah blah blah blah blah. I mean there, I mean, there.

Speaker 6 (01:16:03):
Are ways around that.

Speaker 5 (01:16:04):
And frankly, I you know, from from ww's task performance,
I don't think that they will care awful too much
that you know that that Brian Danielson's booked for an
Evolved show and two dragon Gate shows, you know, especially
if he's not going to be appearing on pay per
view or TV or anything like that.

Speaker 4 (01:16:22):
Let's let's let's just gears to uh to the Orton
Seamos match. Quick prediction on what you think will happen there.
I think it has a chance to be a really
good match. I think these two have something to prove
or and are in their prime. I think they'll want
to go out there and try to have a match
to your candidate if they're given that opportunity.

Speaker 5 (01:16:36):
I think so too. I don't know how close Randy
Orton is to one hundred percent, and I would guess that, yeah,
And you know, I mean if you if you talk
to WWE guys, you know they would they would point
out that really you're never a one hundred percent because
there's always some nagging ache or pain going on. But yeah,
I mean I could see this, you know, I could
see this being a lengthy match, and I could also

(01:16:57):
see I mean, with the way the rest the card
is looking, I can also see this being the A
title change and Orton wins, and Orton winning is the
feel good moment of the show because I don't see,
you know, I don't see too many other feel good moments.
Just if the WWE team.

Speaker 4 (01:17:12):
Is going to lose to the Nexus, yep, that is
a that is a heck of a point. Do we
have McNeil mailbank questions?

Speaker 5 (01:17:21):
Now we don't actually this week. It's it's quite disappointing.

Speaker 1 (01:17:30):
You don't have to wait for the way Keller Prog
Wrestling post show to find out what I thought of
Monday Night Raw and SmackDown. Each week, you can check
out my reports that are updated live throughout Raw and
SmackDown at pwtorch dot com. My written report will tell
you what's happening in detail in case you missed the show,
and it will also analyze key segments and give my
random thoughts quips on what I'm watching as it airs.

(01:17:52):
So check it out every Monday night and Tuesday night
at pewtorch dot com. That also applies to WWE pay
per view. I cover those live at pw torch dot
com with the detailed written report with star ratings, and
of course you can find other TV reports from other
contributors to PW torch such as n X, t R,
o H, Impact Wrestling and more. Check it out pw

(01:18:12):
torch dot com your first stop for TV and pay
per view written reports.

Speaker 5 (01:18:20):
Yeah, I'll see, that's what else can we What else
can we talk about?

Speaker 4 (01:18:31):
Well? I see, Uh there's a question posted today.

Speaker 5 (01:18:33):
Oh really, I didn't.

Speaker 4 (01:18:34):
I didn't see it, David.

Speaker 5 (01:18:36):
I haven't been on my computer for a couple of hours.

Speaker 4 (01:18:38):
So oh yeah, he just uh must have just gone up. Yeah,
he just actually just posted less than an hour ago. Well,
I'll question John John's comes from Dave Portivo. H Dave.
Thanks Dave for so many questions. Let me do this
so I don't forget. If you have a question that
you want UH to Pat McNeil and either me or
James to UH to answer on Wednesdays after the live

(01:18:58):
casts in the BP after show port of the show,
go to the Pat McNeil zone in the VIP forum,
which has been hoppin' lately and post a question in
the thread that Pat has stuck at the very top
and Pat will answer that along with the host of
the show. All right, here's a question, Pat Waite. John
Cena is undoubtedly the top star of this generation, and
he has been the lead star for considerable length of time,

(01:19:20):
and yet, unlike other top starts, he doesn't seem to
have a massive collection of timeless moments. Austin, Rock, Hogan,
and Flair have all had great moments and moments that
helps define their legacy. John Cena, on the other hand,
doesn't seem to have these moments, and even at Wressemania,
he seems to be playing second fiddle either to HBK
or as a third man in a triple threat. The
only match, the only moment I really associate with him
in a special way is if Sina wins we Riot

(01:19:41):
at One night Stand too. So for this generation of
WWE and Sena fans, what are his top five greatest
defining moments? Because I obviously don't have a clue, and
then he acknowledges we're in the scena araso, it's harder
to judge. But when watching Austin give mcmahoni beer bath,
or after having had one of his Resumania showdowns with
Brett Hard and The Rock, it was clear you just
saw something special. So I would have thought to be
able to identify at least a few of the scena moments.

Speaker 5 (01:20:01):
By now, Okay, let's see. I think number one, if
you're a Seena fan, would probably have to be him
beating Sean Michaels at WrestleMania twenty two. I think that's
got to be in there. That was That was a
hell of a match.

Speaker 6 (01:20:15):
Number two I.

Speaker 5 (01:20:15):
Think is gonna be uh. I think it's WrestleMania twenty
three in Detroit, where you know he's wrestling Triple H
in the main event and he makes Triple H tap out,
which Triple H doesn't do a lot of doesn't tap
out very often.

Speaker 12 (01:20:27):
So that's that was meant to.

Speaker 6 (01:20:29):
Be memorable, and I think it was.

Speaker 5 (01:20:32):
Let's see, I'm trying. I'm trying to think of another
great Scena matches.

Speaker 2 (01:20:36):
Uh.

Speaker 5 (01:20:37):
Yeah, probably his match in London on the London Raw
with Jean Michaels. That's that's got to be up there. Him,
you know, him doing the his sort of coming out
Mullet was doing the big, the big attitude Adjustment slam
on Big Show at WrestleMania twenty. So maybe that's number four.
And I don't know, I mean maybe maybe something in

(01:20:59):
the field with JB me, you know, like like him
drawing you like him drawing poopy on JPL's car.

Speaker 4 (01:21:05):
See that's the sad part, is I mean, I I
do remember that.

Speaker 5 (01:21:08):
Oh, I was going pretty well there for a while.

Speaker 4 (01:21:10):
You have to know you you were, and you're the
right person to ask.

Speaker 5 (01:21:13):
I, oh, to see which one was it? I I
think uh, I think his ladder match with Edge unforgiven.
And I'm trying to remember what year it was. It was,
Uh they had the match in Toronto though, I think
Sena is good thousand and five.

Speaker 4 (01:21:29):
I think Sena's run on Top, and I think Dave
has a Dave has a good point. I think the
Sena run on Top is gonna probably be more remembered
as a run as an era than certain moments, you know,
because I you know, and it's ironic Causeina was the
one who was talking about wrestlminga moments last year and
we're gonna have a moment. We just had a moment

(01:21:50):
and that type of thing. But to me, Sena is
just kind of a more steady, steady, reliable guy who
you know, he started off with, you know, doing the
eminem type thing and and being more of a rapper,
and then he had the Chain Gang, and he's kind
of evolved as a character. I mean, you listen to
his old music and his new music and it just
brings back memories of how different, you know, how different
his character was at the beginning, and now he's kind

(01:22:11):
of just settled into being the centerpiece guy. But to me,
the scene, it's not so much a moment, but the
idea with Seena is just he set himself up as
a character to always be fighting massive overwhelming odds and
not always winning. He often loses, and he gives those
promos where it just seems like he's down and out
and he really gets the fans worried and then he
makes that big comeback and gets to win. And I

(01:22:33):
mean it's not really a moment, it's just kind of
a characteristic or a trade that has worked. And you know,
he has defined himself as as the center, the centerpiece
guy in w WE for this whole era and it's
been a good run for WWE. So yeah, he might
not be a moment type of guy. And it might
in part be because he doesn't have you know, Steve

(01:22:54):
Austin had the Rock. Steve Austin had Brett Hart and
and and John just hasn't exact he had those legends
too to take on. He might have that moment on uh,
you know, in this feud with an Exus, there might
be you know, a moment. Maybe what happened on at
the end of Ron Monday is one of those moments.

Speaker 5 (01:23:13):
Well, I mean another way to look at it would
be okay, if I if I would if I would
have grie you on this way. You know, what what
are you what are the five greatest Rick Flair moments.
You know, Rick Flair is a guy that you know,
you don't think of one or two defining moments when
it comes to him. You've you've got to really, you know,
you've really got to go through the mental rollerbacks and
figure you out. He's done a lot of great things.

(01:23:33):
What's what's which one is warm? Which one stands out
more than any other one?

Speaker 4 (01:23:37):
And it depends too on how you experienced his career.
You know, different people, whether it's Rick Flair or John Cena,
You're gonna have different moments. I mean, for me, what
I saw Rick Flair, I didn't see. I didn't see
a lot in real time of Rick Flair. Uh before
the before the the mid to late eighties. You know,
I was a a W A G. I n w
F was in the Sarra territory. But when they when
the end of the U A started coming to the

(01:23:58):
Minnesota in the mid eighties and seeing him have a
great match, and I sat front row for a great
match with Rix Flair and Barry Wyndham when Wyndham was
in his prime, and seeing the match that I'd read
about in magazines for years up close from the front
row against Dusty Rhodes. And by the way, it wasn't
hard to get front row tickets unfortunately in Minnesota for
these shows, but I did, and so there were great

(01:24:20):
Rick Flair moments in person that experienced. I shot photos
ringside in Chicago for Rick Flair against Terry Funk. That
was phenomenal. That was great. But watching on television Rick
Lair against Kry Von Eric at Texas Stadium probably is
above them all because that was just such an incredible
thing for me as a fan who had read about
Rick Flair in the magazines but never got to see
him on TV given the technology and me not having

(01:24:40):
cable at that point, seeing him on the syndicated World
Class Show against Cary Van Eric was amazing. And so
I think probably some scene of fans would who are
you know, twenty years old or twenty three years old
right now who grew up a scene as their guy,
might be able to rattle them off those moments off
like I just did with Rick Flair, because they're personal
to them. But I don't think actively we have those

(01:25:01):
defining scene of moments that were above and beyond anything
else like Steve Austin had, you know, especially the two
he mentioned, you know, the big matches with the Rock
and the U and the Brett Heart double turn. Okay, well,
and then obviously the vinsic man stuff.

Speaker 5 (01:25:15):
Right, Okay, Well, let's let's have you Welson, you're the host.
Let's have you answer name or defining John Cena moments.

Speaker 4 (01:25:24):
I gave my cop on. I answer already, which is.
I think it's a string of it's it's it's a
string of him being on top and emerging. I mean,
I remember, I mean, I remember him the first time
he said the word chain gang and I thought, oh,
that's not gonna work. I remember seeing a gray paint
poopy and thinking, oh that's not that's bad, that's gonna
set him back. I mean, some of my Scena moments
are are our groaning moments where it's just like, oh man,

(01:25:46):
why was he? You know, why did they have him
do that? But no, i'd have to do like you.
I don't have the mentor rolodex to pick out the date.
But I guess if if I just looked at, you know,
a page of all of John Cena's big pay per
view matches, that would be enough of a jarring in
my memory to go, oh yeah, yeah, that was one.
You know, maybe the I didn't particularly like it, but
I think for some people the match with JBL where

(01:26:07):
they were brawling in the parking garage or whatever that
or the yeah you know that that might be a
moment for John cne I think Batista and seen at
SummerSlam in their first matches, I think that was a
big deal. But you know, part of it is it
got so stale, you know with Sina Triple h Orton
in the long viewed with edge that he had. It's
just at times it got a little repetitive where there

(01:26:28):
wasn't really that moment because it got watered down because
it seemed like they never stopped wrestling one another, And
I think that sometimes takes away having that defining moment
when it's one pay per view after another after another
after another with him wrestling one of the same three
or four or five guys.

Speaker 5 (01:26:42):
Right, Okay, is there anything? Is there another part of
that question?

Speaker 10 (01:26:46):
That was it?

Speaker 4 (01:26:47):
That was it?

Speaker 6 (01:26:48):
Good question?

Speaker 4 (01:26:49):
Yeah? It was so again, deposit your questions for the
Wednesday VFP after show with Pat McNeil in the Pat
McNeil's own in the VIP section and if you haven't
been visiting the forum lately, be sure to do that.
A lot more people are there on a regular basis.
Now that we've got the blog section up and running,
we've had a lot more people to sign up and
renew their activity in there, and we've got a lot
of people participating in the VIP blogs. A lot of

(01:27:09):
VIP readers have been posting them. The VP blog section
is one click away, just click on the VIP blog
link in the upper right corner of the main VIP
page or any really any VIP website page. And just
posted today a new blog from Bruce Mitchell. It's called
CNA's next big pay per view, Middle Atlantic Championship Wrestling.

Speaker 6 (01:27:33):
And so.

Speaker 5 (01:27:35):
You know, I was actually I was actually talking with
Bruce a few days ago, and and you know, and
Laandler's joking with him about this TNA show and I said,
you know that, I mean, that's why, Yeah, And I said, well,
that's why when the Monday I War started, WW put
on their the Mid Atlantic Reunion pay per vlier.

Speaker 4 (01:27:53):
Well, it's just as a easier. One of his matches
is sixty seven year old Ivan cole Off with Crusher
Kruschev and the Kida Koloff, who's n fit against Jimmy
Boogie Willgieman Valiant who's sixty eight years old. That would
be for his Middle Atlantic TV title. Speaking of TV titles,
and also fifty eight year old and fifty seven year
old Dennis Connery and Stan Lane. By the way, I
bet at Dennis Condry and Stan Lane stood next to
each other right now, people would think they could be

(01:28:15):
father and son. And there's only a one year difference
in Yeah, with forty nine year old Jim Cornett as
a manager against the Rock and Roll Express ages fifty
one and fifty three Robert and Ricky respectively, and sixty
one year old Rick Flair against forty seven year old
George South that's his main event. And Chris hr Krushchev
at fifty against Terry Taylor at fifty four, and some

(01:28:35):
other good ones in there, including his announcing team is
ring announcer and all that. So check that out in
the in the VIP blog section. Well, look your feedback,
and I invite everybody out there also to write your
own blog and get a following going. It might take
it might take a few months even, you know, to
just show every Tuesday. I'm going to post this or
every Friday and every Friday Monday, I'm gonna post a
blog or whatever. But if you stick with it, I
think you'll and you do some good stuff and promote

(01:28:58):
it around the forum, and I will do the same
thing in my VIP blog. Continue to draw attention to
blogs that gain followings, that are posted on a regular basis.
We can create I think a pretty cool, cool section
where you can have something that you post on a
message board that might not get a lot of people
to read it. In the VIP forum, you might get
more people to read it and it has some staying
power because it's part of that section.

Speaker 5 (01:29:18):
Well yeah, and then wait, even if they don't want to,
if you don't want to create their own blog, there
are plenty of plenty of blogs in there, and a
lot of them are actually good. So yeah, you know,
extra wrestling reading.

Speaker 4 (01:29:27):
Material, absolutely, and I think it's cool, you know, obviously,
Peter B. Torch, VIP members generally bring something to the table,
you know that that is unique to their experience as
a fan. You know, they might be really into watching vintage, vintage,
old wrestling footage, or they might have experienced something in
a certain region of the country that somebody else didn't.
They might really like reading wrestling books. They might be

(01:29:49):
who knows what your specialty is. Or if you just
have a real strong point of view on how wrestling
should be, you can bring those things to the table,
or you can just have you might just be a
good writer and you can just you know, write about
what's going on today and do so in a way
that gets the following.

Speaker 5 (01:30:01):
So, yeah, the forum is always an interesting place to
hang out.

Speaker 6 (01:30:06):
Yes, it is.

Speaker 4 (01:30:06):
Put it that way, yep, and I guess that is it. Pat,
thanks a lot, It's been a fun problem. Thanks everybody
for listening, and until next time on behalf of Pat McNeil.
This is Wade Keller signing.

Speaker 19 (01:30:18):
Up searching for more great pro wrestling talk, then join
me Jason Powell host them the three weekly Pro Wrestling
Boom Podcast. Each week he'll hear the latest news and
analysis from me and my team at pro Wrestling Dot Need,
along with other pro wrestling media members. Plus the Pro
Wrestling Boom Podcast features long form interviews with notable names

(01:30:39):
in the pro wrestling industry. Subscribe and iTunes, Stitcher, Downcast,
and all your favorite secondary apps, or visit us directly
at PW boom dot com. Once again, that's PW boom
dot com.

Speaker 2 (01:31:07):
You are listening to the PM Towards live cast and
that says p ME. Torch hassisted editor James Caldwell posting
today on All Fine Thursday afternoon, and I'm joined by
torch calingist Bruce Mitchell.

Speaker 15 (01:31:19):
Bruce, how are you doing today?

Speaker 6 (01:31:21):
Doing time? Doing good? The clock is ticking on me,
but so far, so good.

Speaker 2 (01:31:26):
So in terms of the school you're about to start.

Speaker 6 (01:31:30):
Yeah, but I spent you know, you spend a lot
of your days in your vacation actually at the school
doing stuff, and that's what I did today. But guess
it's it's coming to it. It's coming to an ends.
I know you're sad about that, James. I can tell.
I can tell what you feel for me. People that
are tea they always love them. They always want to

(01:31:50):
As you're going to a restaurant or something, the waitresses
face will light up. In school, I just started, would
you shut up, don't come to your work and bother you.

Speaker 2 (01:31:59):
It's like, yeah, but there goes in tip really yeah.

Speaker 6 (01:32:03):
Yeah, say things to make you depress me. That's not right.

Speaker 2 (01:32:10):
A lot to talk about. W b T and a
related raw on Monday NXT Tuesday the Fans Fest. We
get your thoughts on that during the show TNA tonight
with their big two hour pay per view quality show
followed by the Reaction Show. So what's going on? Because Bruce,
I want to ask you about a movie coming out tomorrow.

(01:32:32):
You sent me a link to the National Inquirer's review
of The Expendables movies. So I'm gonna ask you. Are
you going to see the movie starring Stone Cold and
Rainy Contour and Mickey Rourke and et cetera, et cetera.
Are you are you taking a pass for you're watching it?

Speaker 6 (01:32:47):
Well, you know, I might just see this movie. I'm
not the biggest movie guy in the world for several reasons.
And but but and I'm not. I've never watched Scester salone.
I thought Rocky was like, Okay, they can't find a
white got to be Muhammad Ali, so we'll make him
a movie about it and everybody will believe it. I
was a big Oli guy growing up, so I've never
liked the lot and I think actually he should be

(01:33:09):
playing villains. I mean, he's got that rubber face now
due to all the boatpoks and blasted surgery and the
ahgh and all that. But but anyway, this does if
it's if it's you know, a pot boiler, and there's
a lot of action in that, and they don't you know,
they don't mess up the formals too much. I might
actually go see this. This might be fun see him
and you know, see him and Stone Cold slung it out,

(01:33:30):
you know, and Salon always makes a big deal about
how stiff his fights are. So we'll see how it does.
But this, this looks like it could be fun. I
might just it.

Speaker 2 (01:33:39):
Yeah, I mean, it has so much hype behind it.

Speaker 4 (01:33:41):
It's got a lot of big names in it.

Speaker 2 (01:33:43):
It does look like one of those movies where you
kind of know what to expect, a lot of blow
up scenes and hite dialogue to be nice and perhaps
have the best dialogue when there is dialogue. But it's
Gonnam just throw all the stars and hope that people
come and see the stars. That's an intraction based movie
with a yeah, I.

Speaker 6 (01:34:03):
Mean, yeah, you know, this is one of those movies.
To James that it really is like a good wrestling cue.
It should be you know, you start off with get
the you know you get the team together, the bad
guy comes in, the team gets beat up, so the
Heaels win for a while, and then the Babyface is
much like what happened with Nexas and Team seen on

(01:34:23):
Monday Night, the baby Faces finally get their act together
and then they kick some ass. And that's what you
pay to sues. You pay to see you know, you
stay to see it resolve. And it said, it's a
simple formulast work for thousands of years and sometimes it's
not a lot of times modern for wrestling loses track
of it. But the movie movies, I don't think stallone's
gonna lose track of that. You know, those guys are

(01:34:44):
gonna take a beating, that someone's gonna be a trader
and all that kind of stuff, and then they're gonna
stand up together and take out whoever the big villain
is at the end. And that's that's pretty much how
pro wrestling should go, and it doesn't always, so if
it does do that way, that can be a satisfying
to watch and.

Speaker 2 (01:35:02):
As a good segue. Brus So, I wanted to ask
you about Monday's Raw, the final hype. You talked about
this two weeks ago in the live cast where you
thought that they would and they should kind of get
the group together and have that big I mean what
we saw at the end of Raw was that big, shaky,
hard camera, hot crowd, big pop reaction for those two

(01:35:22):
teams kind of coming together. Uh, Team w V et Nexus.
Where how do you see a play out of SummerSlam?
And do you think that Team CNT needs to add
a seventh member and you keep it six on seven?

Speaker 6 (01:35:35):
What's your your what's your prediction for the results of
that match? Yeah, I really like I'd like the last
several weeks because they've they've leaved in and out of
whether of making easing that that Jericho and Edge would
join up and who else would join and would I mean,
excuse we got something interesting out of the Great Colleague.
I mean they really did a good job with that

(01:35:56):
while Nexus was kept strong. And then at the end
they gave you the hope spot. They gave you that
you know in the end, Edge and Edge and Jericho
even our team w W E. So yeah, so I
loved Edge.

Speaker 2 (01:36:10):
I just thought Edge in.

Speaker 6 (01:36:12):
The ring doing his feet, doing his hands and kind
of jumping back and forth, like you can't wait to
fight these guys was a really cool visual. But as
far as your question about a seventh member, yeah, I
mean they set up a seventh member that would be
you know, that would be the Miss. My guess is
my educating guess is that based on just washing the television,

(01:36:35):
is that Mis does join Team Sena and then Screw's
Team Sena is the reason why Nexus beats Team Sena.
But I think that, like the stuff with the stuff
with Nes was really good too, and it kind of
elevated him. Oh, John Cena, you know a year he
didn't saying quite like this to the year ago. John
Cena was wiping his feet on the map of the

(01:36:55):
Miss and now he and Brett Hard had to come
to the Miss and ask for help. And I just
thought that was that was really well played and it
would be like and it would help Nis would get
a lot, Liz would get even more. Heatal heat on
despite Michael Cole acting like he's the world's biggest babyface
that he'd get even more heat on him if he
did that. And I really think, I mean, it can't.

(01:37:18):
You can't have Nexus lose in the first match. I mean,
this thing is hot, and you know, unless you're gonna
blow it all off. Now you can't do you know,
you can't do that. Nexus has to win the first
big showdown to keep this story going. And there's a
lot of places to go, but they've really done a
good job of leaving a central story in and out
and giving you ups and downs and times when you

(01:37:39):
just thought, oh, they're in real trouble and then Tom
you know, and waiting for that oat spot. And I
think that's you know, even though there's a code that
Rustling fans kind of understanding that the Babyface gets beaten
down right before the pay for You, he's gonna win
this match to pay for you. But this was more traditional,
This was more logical, which was finally the guys I
want to see get themselves together, gotten themselves together, and

(01:38:02):
now Nexus is gonna get what they what they have
deserved for weeks and weeks and weeks. That's a great psychology,
that's a great thing to do it and you've got
some guys that are really I think Jericho has been tremendous.
I mean I just really think that he Yeah, he's
picked it up in the last few weeks from that
thing where he was, you know, you know, getting jobs
out or tapped out every every every week or so,

(01:38:22):
and and kind of going through the and not going
through the motions but not really having much to chew on.
Now he has something to chew on, and I think
his stuff has been has been good, And there's a
lot of intrigue to do edge and do edgend Jericho
turned baby face again? Does one of them turned baby faces?
They both go back to heal? How does this all work?
And and and it keeps your mind off of who

(01:38:43):
the hell is gonna wrestle on the NExSS thigh. Yeah,
that's gonna be you know, that's gonna be fun.

Speaker 2 (01:38:48):
So and it kind of means when I followup Pushing Vers,
did they do enough to sell the actual painker view?

Speaker 6 (01:38:55):
Or they did it?

Speaker 2 (01:38:56):
I mean I thought they did a really good job
selling the contests. I don't know, I think quite sold
a painter. You see that this matchup, you know, it's
one of the things where you can almost tune in
on raw to find out and and and you know
maybe there's some you know like that let's say the
Minus turned.

Speaker 6 (01:39:11):
Heel or.

Speaker 2 (01:39:13):
But it turns on TEAMWDE and you you know, that's
a significant examp on the paint review, but it's you know,
you can almost find that on WRAW the next time.
I don't really feel like he mist something. So did
they sell to people?

Speaker 6 (01:39:25):
I just you know what, I just agree with you.
I think they they sold it just fine. I think that.
I mean, that's the way they sold that, better than
a lot of in the last several years. And you know,
they you know, and the thing is that not only
is there good wrestling hopefully, but and I think there
will be with with seven experienced people, will six inspiras
people one and then Brett Hard you know, running on

(01:39:47):
Tues on one side. And then you know, if they
they laugh the match, right, I mean they and I
think they will, it'll really be good. But I mean
I think they led you up to I want to
see this fight. I want to see this match. The
only way to see that is on pay now. Could
have Michael Cole said that with God forbid they say
stuff like that anymore where. The only way you can
see this is the only way you can see this

(01:40:08):
live is you know, order Summers plan. That's what they
ought to be saying, and they don't quite do it.
But no, I think they I think they led you
right up to it. Sure you can turn on Monday
Night Raw and figure out what it was. They're sure
you can go on the internet and and and do that.
But I think they did a good job, as they've
done it with anything lately of particularly since wressels you
know much better than heything says WrestleMania, of making you

(01:40:29):
want to see the fight itself.

Speaker 2 (01:40:32):
If you you fired out the next day.

Speaker 6 (01:40:34):
Well, on this turn, you don't see how it happens.
You don't see how it developed, and you don't see
how the match went, or whoever else does Turner doesn't
turn them. Whatever whatever developments they had, they and this
thing clearly has twist and turns and ups and downs
that they haven't written into something in a long time.
I think they must have sat down and really figured

(01:40:54):
this out back and forth, and it looks to me
like they've got you know, they got some input from
some of these guys too, as as to how to
play off, what what their characters and what they're doing,
because they really are bouncing back and forth off each other.
But no, I disagree with you, James. I think they
did a really I think they gave you a big
issue to sell SummerSlam off, and they didn't just say

(01:41:16):
it's Summer Slam, the big party of the summer. You know,
they kind of get the traditional buy they said, they
did say that, but but the big impetus was was
number one Nexus versus Team Sena and number two Randy Orton,
you know, going for the title against Seamous, and they
put some stipulations in there that should add in World
War two. And I'm not sure why Seamous gets to

(01:41:38):
pick us oo stipulation and why and why Randy Orton
doesn't get another title shot, But but they did it,
and and I think there's I think there's a lot there.

Speaker 2 (01:41:46):
I think they've got.

Speaker 6 (01:41:48):
They but I really think the Nexus and Team Senas
is by far the biggest deal here.

Speaker 2 (01:41:53):
I agree with that definitely. We're going takes some phone
calls that we posted a poll on he Towards dot
com on who should be the seventh member of Team
we when we kind of encourage people to come call
in if you want to discuss your your prediction or
your pick or your suggestion. So if you want to
join the phone lines and discuss your pick or the

(01:42:13):
other topic and the news six four, six, seven, nine,
eight to eight is the number to call LKS for
have our first caller today. This is from the four
one five hereia code four one five. Welcome to the show.
Please sit you in and know where you're from. Yeah,
it is not from San Francisco. Hey, Josha, we'll go
for us. Say well that much. Just about the Summuch

(01:42:36):
Slam pay.

Speaker 3 (01:42:37):
Per view, do you guys think that Nexus is really
ready for this really big main event because they're they're
clearly going to be like the whole show with the
seven on seven and it should be a you know,
at least a twenty five minute match to at least
thirty just with the eliminations and stuff. Do you think
they're gonna shorten the match just to get the guy

(01:43:00):
in and out because I don't think they're ready for
it like this. You know, they're in Los Angeles, and
by the way, the mis will be the guy because
it is Los Angeles and that's where Min says that
everybody know that Min is out there now. I think
they're kind of banking on the fact that, you know,
he's a well known TV star.

Speaker 2 (01:43:16):
From the real world garbage. So yeah, Brice, what's your
take on hopefully? Yeah, Bruce go ahead with that. What's
your take on sort of the natural length and where
the Nexus is ready? The individuals of.

Speaker 6 (01:43:27):
Nexus Reach aditionally does not choose people from where their
hometown is. It's not usually don't embarrassed people in their
hometown just because they get a kick out of that. Usually,
if it's a hometown thing, someone's gonna lose a match
or or or join the Kiss My Ask Club or
something some damn thing. But yeah, I think about twenty
minutes was how that I would guess was how it

(01:43:49):
would go. And you gotta remember, they lay out the
match ahead of time, and they put people in positions
where they're not gonna If you watch carefully, I think
you'll see Nexus is not going to be asked to
do a whole lot. But and the guys that are
really going to do a lot are going to be
on Team Seena. So I think they'll they'll say some

(01:44:10):
stuff for the end and and the safe and stuff
for the last match. Don't let the undercards, you know,
steal the you know, take away things they can do.
And then I don't say steal the show to take
away things they can do. And I think that you've
got you know, you've got Edge and John Cena, and
you've got you know, Chris Jericho and and our truth
is in the grace in the world. But he's he's experienced,

(01:44:32):
and Morrison's experience and miss experience and you know, Brett Hart.
You got to walk around.

Speaker 2 (01:44:36):
But I think they can.

Speaker 6 (01:44:37):
I think they can left something. I don't think this
is going to be, you know, the technical match of
the year anything like that. I don't think it needs
to be. I don't think they're gonna be shooting for that.
I think that, you know, as long as people, even
long as the Nexus guys are given things to do
that they've proven that they can do already, and the
way bare It holds his own and Skip Sheffield maybe
holds his own, that they'll be all right. I think that,

(01:44:58):
And that's going to be part of the int you know,
the interesting thing here, you want new acts. Some of
the new acts aren't gonna be you know, you don't
get new actions are completely polished. So that's gonna be
an interesting part of this too. But yeah, I think
I guess it goes about twenty minutes. I think it'll
be fine. I think, you know, as far as living
up to made of that w to be made of
US standards, and I think.

Speaker 2 (01:45:19):
You'll probably have a pretty hot, hot crowd behind it.
I assume the kind of cut help and that's true,
and that helps a lot.

Speaker 6 (01:45:26):
I mean that that can carry you through things, that
can carry you through things with basic stuff where you know,
you do your timing and you wait for that crowd
reaction and the crowds with you. You don't have to
over you know, you don't have to do over stump,
bumping over, you know, do six finishes in a row
and all that kind of stuff you can you can

(01:45:46):
you can play out your story in front of a crowd.
That's that's buying into what you're doing.

Speaker 1 (01:45:52):
Thanks for downloading today's show. Take it to the next
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(01:46:13):
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So go vip here in twenty twenty two and enjoy
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free listening experience. Pw torch dot com slash go vi ip.

Speaker 2 (01:46:32):
Exactly.

Speaker 6 (01:46:32):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:46:32):
I mean they don't have to pack this match full
of you know, they don't need Heath Slater and Dave
Otunga in there for five minutes at a time. They
can kind of get to those guys in and out,
limit their limit their touches. If you want to use
a sports analogy, you know, do the all Paul Hammon thing.
Accentuate the strength high de weaknesses, and I think it
will work. I think there's there's enough good wrestlers in

(01:46:56):
this match, enough smart wrestlers who know how.

Speaker 6 (01:46:58):
To play that crowd.

Speaker 2 (01:47:00):
Like we both said, I think it's gonna be a
hot crowd, so that makes it a lot easier. And
I'm kind of, you know, on the house show circus
they've been kind of practicing this match a little bit different,
uh only you know, the same players and some sort
of the same formula, and it's worked out pretty well
just based on crowd reactions, so I think, you know,
it's like Bruce said, it's not gonna be a technical masterpiece,
and I don't think anyone is expecting that. But I

(01:47:23):
think the match will be pretty strong. I think it'll
be a satisfying main.

Speaker 6 (01:47:26):
Event, borring a craft. You've been repeating me, now go on,
move it off.

Speaker 2 (01:47:33):
I'm adding to that point. I like action impact, Bruce.

Speaker 6 (01:47:37):
I'm reaction impact.

Speaker 2 (01:47:40):
Okay, that's the subway for later on us not going
any other question to follow us.

Speaker 3 (01:47:49):
What God, what did you guys think about the Matt
Hardy comments on his Twitter page? Did you think that
was for rail or is he k faving it? Because
he was talking about you know pretty much that he's
gonna don't worry everybody. He's gonna be at deav W Champion,
World Champion or whatever campaign. It is like, dude, get real.

Speaker 10 (01:48:08):
You know you know what.

Speaker 6 (01:48:09):
I saw that, and I know that I know I
knew he was gonna get criticized for it. And I
think I think Matt Hardy's got a big fat head
and a big ego, But I think that I think
you can forgive that in the sense of in a year,
what what should Matt Hardy be striving for him. Maybe
he won't get there, but he really should be striving
to be at the top of the cart. He really
should be striving to be the world champion. And now

(01:48:32):
he should be doing the things that will get that
might give him a better chance to get there, But
that doesn't bother me. Rustler should always say, whether it's
you know, whether they're talking about you know, behind the
curtain or they're talking in the storyline, they really should
be saying, I'm out here to win the world title.
I'm not here to be a main inventor. I'm out
here to make the big money. Because if they're not,
I don't want to I don't want to hear about

(01:48:53):
Matt Hardy going. Well, you know, I've had I've had
a pretty good career. I'm gonna coast in from right here.
I make good money because I'm a Hardy and I'm
gonna feel I'm gonna hit this mid level thing. They're
not really gonna give me a chance anyway, so I'm
just gonna, you know, do my job and not much
warn that. I don't want to hear that, even if
it's the truth, and I'm not saying it is I'd
rather I want to hear that the guy's at least
reaching for the stars. If he if he misses, fine,

(01:49:16):
at least he's reaching.

Speaker 2 (01:49:18):
I think the thing with Hardy though, is that he
says it so often and he kind of does it
in this I'm trying to rally my my little followers,
and people just kind of roll their eyes at it
because he says it so often and there's no result
behind it. Well, I mean that's that's as of the
storyline then, yeah, that's I mean, that's what you want
to say. I mean, Christian Christian MV Team, Matt Harney,
Dolf Ziegler, and Dream McIntyre should all be saying that

(01:49:40):
same thing. I think that's the thing what Hardy does.
That's just people roll their eyes because he says it
so often and it seems so empty most.

Speaker 6 (01:49:48):
Of the time. Yeah, I mean it is kind of
it is kind of. Well, there's the two things on
one of you were talking about. He has his own
followers and he's trying to rally the truths and yeah,
I mean, you do it too often and you can
disappoint people. But he's still because of that Hardy name
and because he's been there, you know, because he's been
there a long time, he still has a following, and

(01:50:10):
he's still there's enough of a candidate where he can say,
you know, he can say that. I mean, if I'm
trying to think of who's at the bottom of it,
you know, gold Duff said that, I'd be a little
and I think gold has been doing good work lately.
But Goldas said that, I kind of go, okay, But
Matt Hardy's right at the bottom of that. Well, it's
you know, it's possible.

Speaker 2 (01:50:29):
Right with the right story, the right opponent, the right
the right universe, then then yeah, I mean it is.

Speaker 6 (01:50:36):
Yeah. I mean, don't don't get me wrong, I'm not
endorsing it on but I'm just saying it's I saw that,
and I knew he was gonna get kind of real.
Actually I thought that i'd be having this discussion with
the editor. But yeah, I mean it was it would
you know? Yeah, well, it is a promotional you know,
anything you do on social networking or anything, those those

(01:50:57):
guys do, they're doing there promote themselves and they're promoting
w w A. They're small amount of so.

Speaker 3 (01:51:05):
Jovan any other question or follow up, Yeah, what do
you guys think of a triple be match like for
the uh but like the you know, middleweight or heavyweight
title like feature and uh, Matt Hardy, Drew McIntyre and
Christian just to you know, start off Summer Slam, because
that sound like a good match that could get the crowd,

(01:51:25):
you know, hyped up for the rest that's to come.

Speaker 2 (01:51:29):
I mean it's I'm not sure if this is so
much a spoiler, but I mean Kobe Kingston and Drew McIntyre, no,
don'd sigler, I'm sorry, are having their intercoming with title
match at Summer Slam. So I mean I prefer that
match to open up a singles match. I prefer that
as you're opening match at Summer Slam, brus And if

(01:51:49):
you get this card, what is your opening match and
and you see Christian and and Drew McIntyre and MVP
and that that group of guys on this card itself, I.

Speaker 6 (01:52:01):
Mean, I don't know. I mean, they've got soral options
to do that. They've got you know, they've got those
guys that are that can bring enough to an opening
match to brief from energy to the show. That's what
that's what that match is there for. So yeah, I could.
I can see that. I will say this, I I
want a more torm. In fact, I'm gonna write my
congressman or my surnitor. I may write Senator McMahon when
she gets I'm sick and tired of I am sick

(01:52:24):
and tired of of triple threat matches and the fatal
four ways and all that stuff. It and that last
fake review number shows it. It does.

Speaker 2 (01:52:35):
It does not work.

Speaker 6 (01:52:36):
It's it's the lazy bookers way out of out of
trying to figure out where to put people on the
card and not have and having to take some people off.
Cartis in it way to put extra stuff in there.
And you can't tell me that you know the three
the three wrestlers that the call or talked about, if
you put two of those wrestlers, you couldn't have a
better match and a more focused match, with more excitement

(01:52:57):
and more emotion between one guy gets one god in
the three way where one guy falls out of the
ring and the other guy comes back and we know
it doesn't count quite as much. I want, you know,
if they do a three way match, I want to
see what the way it worked originally back fifteen years
ago with with Paul Hayman and E. C W, which
was book do your booking so that three guys have

(01:53:19):
to have a match and you build up to it
for months and months and months, and you can't pick
a top contender because it's all even, and the only
fair way to do it is a three way match,
not just show these matches out there to do it.
And I know it's I know it's kind of a cliche.
I know it's kind of a troupe that people are
used to. Now, let's see a three way match, But
I just think I just think they're not effective. They're

(01:53:40):
non as effective as one on one match.

Speaker 2 (01:53:42):
So let's have an oil.

Speaker 6 (01:53:44):
Let's have a tag Let's have a tag team match.
God forbid that you team up two of those guys
against two other guys, and let's have a team match
so that that there's one team versus one team, and
you got your focus, you've got your things back and
forth between the two. So I just think they I
think it's a rut that I mean that it's sort
of why p and a booking you have another tournament

(01:54:06):
for their title you just fought. You know, it's lazy booking.
You fall into a rut. You go, okay, well this
will kill. This will kill several weeks with TV and
you know people and I love them, so everybody else
must love them or something or something. But it's like
shop it, don't do it anymore?

Speaker 2 (01:54:20):
Do something? Yeah, yeah, even even if it turns out
to be something with it they build toward you know,
let's say RVD versus whoever becomes the champion out of
this tournament deal. I mean, and there's so many different
ways to get that destination without having another tournament or

(01:54:41):
you know, the scripted champion of the title. It's just unnecessary.

Speaker 6 (01:54:43):
But you know, I mean, you know, there's a way
to like, you know, love Vandam. Why can't Love Vandam
get into a match with whoever they want it to
be their champion. You got a way to get him
in that match and have to defend the title and
lose the bell. How hard is that is? Anybody? Is
there one person who's gonna be disappointed at Rob van
Dam and stop watching Rob van Dam because he loses

(01:55:05):
the title.

Speaker 10 (01:55:05):
Maw No.

Speaker 6 (01:55:07):
But are there people that just go, oh, this is crap,
this makes no sense.

Speaker 2 (01:55:11):
And I guarantee you after they bring him.

Speaker 8 (01:55:14):
Back in that ambult.

Speaker 6 (01:55:15):
You know, he goes off to the ambulance, which.

Speaker 2 (01:55:16):
Makes no sense.

Speaker 6 (01:55:17):
Why would a guy get beaten up lose the title?
I mean, wouldn't you wait for him to come back?
Isn't that way it works in all sports unless he's
unless he's retired, which I don't think he is. But anyway,
when he comes back, watch, I guarantee you Rob van
Dam will not complain about losing the title, about getting

(01:55:38):
the title strip from him without anybody beating him in
the ring. They'll never even bring it up, and they'll
never make it. And Mike Today and Tass will never
make any reference to it because they'll be in whatever,
you know, whatever other three other three other new storylines
that I've started on that same show. But watch that,
I guarantee you watch. And they wonder why their belt's

(01:55:59):
not over there? I wonder Our people don't care because
they don't care.

Speaker 2 (01:56:03):
Robin Dane won't. Yeah, they moved to to us and
then they don't let anything kind of settle in. And
like you said, exactly my thought you were saying is
there'll be eight stories down the road when he comes back.
So Dathan's good call. We appreciate that. Let's go ahead
and get another phone call. Let's go to the ninety
five to four area code nine five four. Welcome to
the show. How please say you know where you're from?

Speaker 6 (01:56:25):
Hey, what's up? Guys?

Speaker 15 (01:56:26):
This is Fredo from Hollywood, Florida. How are you.

Speaker 2 (01:56:30):
Hollywood, Florida?

Speaker 3 (01:56:30):
Oh?

Speaker 2 (01:56:31):
No, doll Zigler, What do you have for us today?

Speaker 15 (01:56:34):
I see Dolf running on the beach from time to time. Uh,
here's here's what I got for.

Speaker 2 (01:56:39):
You, guys.

Speaker 15 (01:56:40):
I listen to podcasts all day and night, usually because
of my job. I haven't heard one person mention the
fact that Brian Danielson told be the.

Speaker 2 (01:56:49):
Seventh guy, Well, we have him in our poll on
pev Towards dot com. And it's uh, I mean, I
don't see it happening. Bruce, what's your h if you're put?
I mean again, say so said, what are the chances
of game it is gonna be in at seventh day?
I mean it's a possibility.

Speaker 6 (01:57:08):
I don't think. I mean I don't.

Speaker 2 (01:57:09):
I don't think they gave.

Speaker 6 (01:57:10):
Him a good reason to join team WWE.

Speaker 2 (01:57:14):
But I mean it's a possible. I mean it's a possibility.
It's that's a card I've.

Speaker 6 (01:57:18):
Played later on down the road. They don't need to
play that card.

Speaker 2 (01:57:20):
Yet, but they kept going.

Speaker 6 (01:57:22):
But it is, as the caller said, it is you know,
it's it's it's a card to play. But I said,
I think you played. I think that that's a development,
you know, a little while down the ways, and you know,
I would bet and I would bet it's not him.
And part of it is the campaign is getting into

(01:57:42):
high gear. And I think the campaign had something to
do with why, you know, he was too violent and
all that. So I think that maybe he waits to
come back a month or two more and the coast
is clear a little a little farther down the road.
But I think he's I mean, I think he's gonna
get this opportunity to come back, and I would suit
or whatever the lighter. I don't see a Sunday night,

(01:58:03):
but it is a possibility. Is we'll talk about.

Speaker 2 (01:58:07):
Yeah, i'd say Savid too.

Speaker 6 (01:58:09):
Go ahead.

Speaker 2 (01:58:09):
What was your follow up? Oh?

Speaker 15 (01:58:12):
No, I was just gonna say, I didn't realize you
guys had it on the poll. Have you guys gotten
any like results from the pole yet? Or am I am?
I kind of the only kind that thinks that or
I just kind of I just feel like now it's
all quieted down the you know, no one's talking about
him really and it would just you know how WW
loves the Swerves, so it would be like I think

(01:58:33):
it would get a huge pop.

Speaker 2 (01:58:34):
You know, actually I think T and A likes the
Swerve book in WWE. But uh, yeah, no, it's you know,
it would be a good surprise for a pay per view.
And right now the poll has we just put this
up about an hour ago, hour and a half and
Danielson have fifty seven percent of the vote. So the uh,
the Danielson fans are out in full forest on the
pole with triple ah to thirteen percent in the middle

(01:58:56):
of eleven so they're realistic. People are eleven percent and
then Daniels and fans a fifty seven. So that's where
the polar reason Whiles are on that. I mean, I
agree with Bruce. I mean it's something to play down
the road. I don't think you need to play it
on Sunday, so I definitely didn't. I definitely think he's
gonna come back. I just don't think right now that's
something to say it for later on any other question of.

Speaker 6 (01:59:18):
What what.

Speaker 15 (01:59:21):
Well, what are you Yeah, one more quick thing, what
do you guys think now?

Speaker 2 (01:59:24):
Like every you know, it's supposed to.

Speaker 15 (01:59:27):
Be Kane who put the Undertaker out, But ever since
the the Angle started three months ago, they basically, you know,
the consensus was it's going to turn out to be Kane,
and I can't remember a time where given three months
that it will actually turn out to be him. So

(01:59:47):
do you think that you have an alternate plan or
do you think that you know they're actually just going
to go through with it and not surprise.

Speaker 20 (01:59:53):
Anybody longing for some nostalgia or maybe you want to
learn some wrestling history, don't miss the Nineties Past cast
every Friday on the PW Torch Daily Cast Feed. Alex
and Patrick will transport you thirty years into the past

(02:00:13):
by taking you through the Torch issue from that very week.
Follow news from the WWF and WCW, and all the
happenings from across the wrestling industry in real time as
The Torch reported it thirty years ago. That's the Nineties
Pass cast every Friday on the PW Torch Daily Cast Feed.

Speaker 6 (02:00:39):
Brigus, what's your take, I'll tell you what I don't know.
If they've got an alternive plan, but they should not
have an alternate plan. Everything doesn't have to be a surprise.
We're talking about the Expendables. I bet at the end
the Expendables that Sylvester salone beats up whoever the villain
is and wins. What would be a surprise if the
loan got shot thirty minutes into the movie? Everything the

(02:01:01):
story is that, you know, the story is as you've watched,
is Kane losing his mind because he's torn between whatever
maniacal maniacal hatred cast him to attack his brother and
the guilty he feels. And that's been the story all along,
and so sometimes you just go with that and it
builds to a big grudge match down the line between

(02:01:23):
Undertaker and Kane, and it also sets up you know,
it sets up it sets up rayvens Steer to get
his title back when Undertaker makes a makes a thing.
So I mean, that's so that so that's how it works.
I mean, I don't know. I mean I think you
know you could do. But whatever whatever other alternatives you
have aren't going to be as good. I mean, they're

(02:01:45):
just not. They'll be they'll be surprising. But sometimes you
just go along with you got you have a strong story,
and you tell your story. Now, if you don't have
everything be a surprise, then when the surprises coming, you've
really warked them and built them into what you're doing.
Their bet they're they're you know, they're they're better. I mean,

(02:02:05):
they work better if you have So that's what happens
to you, Tona. Everything is a surprise because everything is
a surprise. Nothing is a surprise. I see that Jason
has pro rusling dot. Jason said he'd be happiest still
one we shot thirty months into the movie. I would
be too. But that's that's a whole other thing.

Speaker 2 (02:02:21):
They wouldn't hit the story. But yeah, it might get
a pop but uh uh no, good points there, Bruce.
We've we've hit the top of the hour and you're
listening to the P t B Torch Live Cast and
this is P to B Torch Assistant editor James Caldwell
joined by Torch columnist Bruce Mitchell. We're gonna join us
in the last half hour of the show talking w

(02:02:41):
E TNA lot's going on this week of Summer Slam,
as well as the Whole FM Show with Impact Tonight.
Remember to call is six four six, seventy two one
nine eight two eight. Let's go to the sixty five
to one Arian code sixty five one. Welcome to the show.
Please teach me where you're from. Hey, guys, this is
time from say well, hey Tom, what do you say?

Speaker 20 (02:03:05):
Uh?

Speaker 10 (02:03:05):
Not much.

Speaker 9 (02:03:06):
I was thinking of a way, you know, w W E.

Speaker 2 (02:03:08):
Sin's you know, all the online.

Speaker 8 (02:03:11):
You know, pay per view pirating stuff away. They could basic,
you know, really cut down on that with them charging
fifty five bucks to whatever now for their monthly pay
per views. I mean that's you know, I mean I
thought most of them. But if not, you know, there's
plenty of months where he'd like, well, I could, but
I just don't want to spend the money on it.

(02:03:31):
But if they were to do something where they stream
them online for like half price, do you think either
a that's even a realistic idea, or if it is
a realistic idea, would that cut down on it?

Speaker 2 (02:03:45):
But it's what's your take?

Speaker 6 (02:03:47):
Well, I mean, I think you'd have a lot of
people going to the computers and buying it for half price.
I guess I do agree with the caller though, that
I think that fifty five dollars price point is too high.
I mean, I think that the demand does not. I
I always think, you know, basic economics is you raise
the price when you have a strong demand. They have
a flat demand, and in fact, your last quarter show

(02:04:09):
they have a demand that's pretty darn terrible if they
have as a pay per view that's not been pushed
very well. I mean, it's you know, because one hundred
and fifty thousand buyers worldwide for Cowe means that there
means that they did less than one hundred thousand in
the United States, and so people are gonna look at
that fifty five dollars, you know, the softer bias. The

(02:04:30):
people that are always gonna buy are gonna get it.
But but the softer buyers are gonna go I'll skip
them off, or they'll go alot go, you know, I know,
I know it's stealing, but I've tried to be real
faithful and telling these rationalizations. And watch it on a stream.
And if you get used to watching it on the stream,
then you get used to getting your cable bill and

(02:04:52):
it's smaller than it is. We're all, you know, we're
all watching our pockets and all that, and that doesn't
mean we should be stealing from anybody. It's stealing from WWE.
But WWE raising that price is putting that idea in
people's minds, and I think it was I think it
was not a good time to raise the price. I
think this was the time to do the other thing
they did, which was provide fans with a strong story

(02:05:13):
and a strong motivation to actually get you know, to
actually get the shut But in fact that I would
think you'd want to maybe cut cut the price from
the fifty dollars to forty five or to forty dollars,
God forbid.

Speaker 2 (02:05:28):
Yeah, just to combat that, right and Wade, Wade Keller
and Jason sal had a really good discussion on this
and Tuesday's live cast and the VIP after show. So
if you're a VIP member and you missed that after show,
I really recommend that listen. And if you're not a
VIP member, you're crazy. And you can find out all
the info on a VIP membership to get the after
show that we have after every episode of live cast.

(02:05:51):
That info is at pbtorch dot com, sash go VIP time.
Did you give another question or follow up?

Speaker 7 (02:05:58):
So well?

Speaker 6 (02:05:58):
Later a minute are you saying that Jason and Wade
did a better job of going through the MS without
to this question than I did?

Speaker 2 (02:06:07):
You?

Speaker 6 (02:06:07):
Well, I'm you're just saying that they did a better job.
You were reculating that people listen to them, and I
just went through that. I don't know, I'm kind of
I'm kind of upset. But go on, go ahead, called
I'm fine.

Speaker 2 (02:06:17):
I'm trying to add value for the added value there
you go. Yeah, alright, Uh no, you did cover very well, Bruce.

Speaker 6 (02:06:26):
You did.

Speaker 2 (02:06:27):
I'm just saying, is add value? So, uh, Tom, but
what else do you what was your fallop or any
other question?

Speaker 6 (02:06:34):
Well, I just have a little bit of fault up.
I mean, I don't think that if they add the
online option, you know, I don't think too many people
are going to stop watching, you know, ordering the actual
pay per view itself, because well, would.

Speaker 8 (02:06:46):
You rather watching a seventeen inch monitor fifty and screen TV?

Speaker 6 (02:06:52):
I just think, excuse me, I'm coming to your house
fifty screen TV.

Speaker 8 (02:07:00):
Yeah, Well, if they do that, I mean, I mean,
I have the plug er. I can plug my computer
into my TV and watch you know it on that way.
But not many people have that, so I think the
people are string it would actually are more likely to
buy it. There the people who are already buying the
pay per view would just keep watching it on their TV. Yeah, yeah,

(02:07:23):
Bruce a reaction to that, to that aspect of it,
they might.

Speaker 6 (02:07:28):
I mean, you know, when when demands of softer your
your customers are not quite satisfied with price points or
that kind of thing you're gonna get, they're gonna start
looking at options, and some of them are gonna be
defindest options, and with today's technology, right, and.

Speaker 2 (02:07:43):
Then once you get that thing for free, then you're
not gonna be inclined to go back and have to
pay forty five or fifty five bucks for it, especially
if it's a you know, especially with a fatal four
way concept pay per view, which did terrible and everyone
predicted it would be terrible. It's you know, you will
order pay per you can see a four way man
you're probably gonna see on TV later on No, especially
if you especially if you've already ordered a pirated stream

(02:08:06):
and the month before the month before that. So that's
that's kind of the result that they and I mean
they forced it. I mean, they pushed the issue, raising
the price, and there's no reason to go out and
in order an illegal or to watch an illegal stream.
It's no justification. But they've sort of encouraged it, you know,
just just indirectly, they've encouraged it. Tom can call. We

(02:08:28):
appreciate that. Let's go on to another phone call. Let's
go to the nine to five area code nine oh five.
Welcome to the show. Please take your name and where
you're from.

Speaker 21 (02:08:38):
Hey guys, it's Jeff from up here in Canada.

Speaker 2 (02:08:41):
Is that Jeff? Was that your first name?

Speaker 6 (02:08:43):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (02:08:44):
Cool, Jeff? What do you have for us today?

Speaker 6 (02:08:46):
Actually?

Speaker 15 (02:08:47):
This is I have a couple questions.

Speaker 21 (02:08:48):
Let's is just follow up the last one last Colleo,
because I was gonna ask you about this anyway. But
on the WWE website, it I think gives you the
option to buy an online the stream of umbers.

Speaker 2 (02:09:02):
I think it's a full price if I remember correctly,
because I know it used to be discounted in college.
That's how I covered the pay per views. They had
to discounted online version. That's I would order that, and
then they raised it a full price. It's kind of like, well,
that might as well just watch it on TV. It
says it's forty four five, Is that yeah? I mean

(02:09:23):
that's a I mean the fifty five price is the
HD version, and then the forty five dollars the standard
TV standard pay per view price, and that's kind of
that's what they report anyway, that's the price they report
in their financials. So did you have a comment on
that or just he was bringing that point up. I

(02:09:44):
was just wondering that.

Speaker 21 (02:09:46):
I was actually just gonna ask if you know how
long they've been doing next. I just hadn't noticed that before.

Speaker 6 (02:09:50):
That's all.

Speaker 2 (02:09:52):
It's been about probably three or four years when they
changed it to probably about at the same time they
dropped the split brand. And if you go back to
you know, mid two thousands, they had the raw brand
pay per view, they had the SmackDown brand pay per view,
and then they combined it, and I believe at that
same time they made the online web stream the same

(02:10:13):
price as a pay per view stream. And you know,
I don't know if that killed off demand for the
website version, because I don't hear many, many, many people
at all ordering the online version. And they used to
throw in sort of you know, you get classic matchups,
but now you know, you could get that on a
DVD or classics on demand, So there isn't much added

(02:10:33):
value there, And I don't know if they'd kill off
demand for that either, So they don't separate web versus
pay per view buys on their financials, so I'm not
sure what kind of demand there is for that now, Okay, Yeah,
just my other question was kind of.

Speaker 21 (02:10:47):
A two perger as it relates to the seventh member
of the.

Speaker 4 (02:10:52):
Sure And.

Speaker 6 (02:10:55):
First of all, I was gonna.

Speaker 21 (02:10:56):
Ask you it seems like it would make sense for
to be miss because he one.

Speaker 6 (02:11:00):
Of the hottest stairs of Lamp.

Speaker 21 (02:11:02):
But if they don't use him, what else see him
having him do on the pay per view? And also,
as far as brain Hanholton goes, I believe he has
a bunch of indie bookings into late September. How would
that affect those or affect the possibility of him coming
back as he was to be the Sons guy.

Speaker 2 (02:11:23):
Yeah, that's go ahead with that.

Speaker 6 (02:11:26):
Well. I just think that if it was if it
was Danielson, that he's usually he's usually dependable about making
his dates and doing all those things, So I suspect
that that's another that's another sign that he's not coming
back and coming back that soon. I think that he
would want to work his dates. So he's pretty honorable.

Speaker 12 (02:11:42):
Stuff like that.

Speaker 6 (02:11:43):
So that's that's my guess. I mean, if they if
they decide, hey, you're coming, then I could also see
where he came someday and then worked, you know, work
some of the you know, work these dates off on
his way back. But Mike, like I said, I think
I think that's just another indication that somebody night not
the night of his return. And now now like you know,

(02:12:03):
watch Sunday night and see me me wrong. You could
take it out.

Speaker 2 (02:12:08):
And uh and the Miz Bruce. If the Miz isn't
that seventh man, Uh, does he have a you know,
do they put him in a sort of a bonus
match kind of have him lingering around with that brief
game when do you knew what the mis if he's
not in at seven on seven?

Speaker 6 (02:12:21):
Oh, you know, you play him off of you don't
have to have him rustle if he's not gonna be
in the other thing, and you could, but you play
him off of the skits with with Orton and seamless
that that that he's gonna pull the trigger on on
Orton he's gonna pull the trigger on Shameless. Who ever
wins the match. You can tease it and then someone
can stop him. I mean, you know, our truth stopped

(02:12:42):
it before, and our truth can be busy with with
what he's doing. But you know, I think it'll be
an indication that he's in the match if he's not
messing too much with Shameless and the orton. So if
he's not like talking about it before that, but he
may very well go, you know, hey, I'm gonna do it,
but I'm not because I'm want. I'm gonna use my
money in the bank. So I mean, that's what's good.

(02:13:03):
I mean, that's what I like about this is they've
really play off a lot of there's a lot of
sparks from different stories and from different personalities that really
been they've done a nice jobless.

Speaker 2 (02:13:14):
Yeah, I agreed on that. Let's go on to another
phone call. Let's go to seven to one to nine,
Area code seven one nine. Welcome to the show. Please
say to know where you're from. Daniel from Colorado. Hey, Daniel,
what he happens to say?

Speaker 6 (02:13:29):
I wanted to talk about, well, not really talk about the.

Speaker 3 (02:13:33):
Evolution of Seamus, but compare to him when he first
came out.

Speaker 2 (02:13:38):
And they gave him the monster push that they did.

Speaker 3 (02:13:41):
I'm happy that they did what they did with him,
but I was skeptical that they would do anything with
him because I had seen that kind of push before
with Vladimir Kaslov and uh kaslof They they gave him
the huge push and then he was beating the Undertaker,

(02:14:04):
and he was in the main event and looked like
they were going to have him against Ndertaker in wrestlemanim
right before WrestleMania, he just gets knocked down and you know,
by management or something, and it was it because he
couldn't talk or something.

Speaker 2 (02:14:21):
I think he couldn't talk that well and he I
didn't think he was that good in the ring. I mean,
he had probably one of the most boring matches with
Triple H in recent history. But there's what what what's
the difference between Kuslofs and Seamus. I mean, the caller
brings up a good point. They've had similar pushes. Why
is Seamus panned out and why didn't Why didn't Kuswelf
pan out?

Speaker 6 (02:14:41):
Seamus is a much better His athleticism is much better
suited to pro to work for wrestling. Thankslawss. It's just
tough off kind of a cloth. I mean, it happens.
I remember Brad Ringgins and and the AWA probably could
have stretched the body in wrestling, but he was working
with him. They said it was like working with some

(02:15:02):
mit mixer, and he was he was kind of a
dull guy to watch. So uh, that's I mean, that's
how you know, that's the way it goes. Sometimes they
gave they thought Kswow could be a killer, and they
tried it and it just didn't work. And that's and
he really wasn't good at the mid part. Either said,
that's why he's doing this. You know, his deadpan face
and voice, they used them in a comedy place, but

(02:15:22):
he just he just didn't pan out. And I think that,
you know, I think that's Chamus is much better, much
better talker, much better personality. Can really get across that
he's an ass kicker in this genre. So where Kaslov
really is an ass kicker. He just does it, but
he doesn't come across in WWE.

Speaker 1 (02:15:44):
Anytime you're watching w w E Raw or SmackDown or
AEW Dynamite in particular, send us an email if you've
got thoughts on the show or a topic you want
us to address or a question for us, Wade Kellor
Podcast at pwtorch dot com, Wade Kellor Podcast at Pete
double toorch dot com. If there's anything else going on
in pro wrestling that you want us to address on
our main podcast during our mailbank segments, that same email

(02:16:07):
applies Wade Keller Podcast at PW torch dot com. We
invite that interaction. Let us know what you think of
what we're saying, and let us know what you want
us to talk about and ask us specific questions. Wade
Keller Podcast at PW torch dot com.

Speaker 2 (02:16:23):
Do you know any other question or follow I do
agree with that about Koslos, but I also had a
question about Alexiley. So it looks like he's really on
the verge of being a really good heel.

Speaker 3 (02:16:36):
And no matter what happens to him on NXT, it
looks like it would be a smart thing to do
for them to keep him. But do you think that
he would be like really even bigger is if they
ever turned him face one day? Or would he like
get the monster push like Sina did, or would he

(02:16:57):
you know, fall flat like like Mornson or Edgecat.

Speaker 2 (02:17:03):
Yeah, where do you see where do you see Riley
sitting in short term and long term in WWEE You know,
I don't know.

Speaker 6 (02:17:09):
I can't see that far down the road. But to me,
he's got a good heel personality. You play off of that.
He needs more experience in the ring. He needs to
show that he can. You know that he can work
and wrestle in the ring. But the thing is you
build him as a strong heel and keep him as
a strong you know what they're doing with this When
this turns babyface, He's going to be a good babyface.

(02:17:31):
I mean, he really is, because they've they've really he's
hooped people into emotionally investing in not liking him. And
once you do that, then line between love and hate.
You can you can make that turn. But if you
do it too often, you do it too soon. You know,
if you do it back and forth, you can lose it.
But right now, to me, the key with als Rally

(02:17:51):
is just keep working what he's doing. And I agree
with the call. I can't imagine that he's going to
disappear off our televisions after the second.

Speaker 2 (02:18:00):
In the next two he has something. I mean, he's
got it intangible and it seems to grow every week
he's on NXT. It just he's got something. I mean,
i'd say put him on RAW. Uh you know, I
don't know if you put him in a program with
the Mis or have him in a standalone program, but
he's got something. And U say, you know, they could

(02:18:20):
even do a thing where they kind of eventually down
the road build toward Miz versus Riley and have that
miss baby face turn that there's no need to rush that.
I mean, that thing is that thing can cook for
a long time, kind of like Randy Orton and they
you know, they tried the Orton baby face turn and
oh five, we just have a flashback report on that
from the Summer Slam flashback series. It didn't work out,

(02:18:41):
so they went back to a heel run and yeah,
I mean he was a heel for four or five
years before they finally made that big baby face turn
that we're seeing now. So, uh, mives in Royley. I
think it could have a really good tag team program
to start and then eventually kind of split that off.
But yeah, Riley's got something, So I look forward to
seeing him on TV. He got after this NXC experiment, Danuel,

(02:19:03):
any other question or follow up?

Speaker 3 (02:19:05):
You know, what about Riley is a face? You think
he could go somewhere even as Johnsen around.

Speaker 2 (02:19:11):
I don't know, you know, it's hard to it's hard
to picture him as a face. He just has that
real cocky demeanor. Everything about him is heel right now,
So you know, it could be a thing where eventually
the audience kind of gets behind him and they just
turn him and there's no real reason for him. Attorney
just turns. That's down the road, right, I mean, Grice,

(02:19:31):
do you see anything about him that you can see
him being a babyface?

Speaker 6 (02:19:34):
You know, short term or long term? I'm sorry, I
got I got a little distracted. Which one about Riley?

Speaker 2 (02:19:45):
If he I mean, there's anything about him, say this
guy could be a babyface down we.

Speaker 6 (02:19:50):
Kind of kind of what we cover before that. If
he if he builds his strong heel character and then
really develops, he develops, you know, not that's just a
flat I'm the I'm the varsity bully type of guy.
Just really you know, really gets the little things done
in his heel character. Then you put him in the
right situation and you can turn and he'll be a real.

(02:20:14):
He'll be a good one. I mean you know that.
I mean, he'll be a good heel. You know, he'll
be a good babyface. But if you don't right now
or anytime soon, there's just no sense to it. That's
not let him. Let him develop what he's got a
natural aptitude for right now. Then strong, strong heels make
strong baby faces. But you've got to they've got to
wait and develop it. I mean, there's no hurry. There's

(02:20:35):
plenty of people that they've got in launch.

Speaker 2 (02:20:37):
So yeah, yeah, exactly, Daniel Good, Paul, We appreciate the
questions there. Let's go on into the seven o three
Erie code seven o three. Welcome to the show. Please
say you don't know where you're from.

Speaker 13 (02:20:51):
Uh, hey guys, Larry from Atlanta.

Speaker 2 (02:20:53):
Hey, Larry Good, hear from me? What do you have
for us today?

Speaker 6 (02:20:56):
Hey?

Speaker 13 (02:20:57):
Well, you know, I just I like being even a
calling early enough to sort of listen and just sort
of have something based on what you guys have been
talking about earlier.

Speaker 2 (02:21:06):
And I gotta say.

Speaker 13 (02:21:07):
Hear hearing Bruce rail on how they're totally gonna bot
this RVD vacancy of the TNA title. I just thought
that was hilarious because you can totally see it happening
where he comes back and he's not even at all
upset about the belt being stripped, which doesn't even make sense.

Speaker 6 (02:21:25):
Why can't they.

Speaker 13 (02:21:26):
Wait the thirty days like you're supposed to to strip
somebody of the title. It doesn't make any sense whatsoever. Anyway,
let me get to the question with that, because I
always seem to ask these questions about TNA where it
looks like they might have a good idea and I'm
wondering what you guys would.

Speaker 6 (02:21:43):
Think in order for them not to botch it.

Speaker 13 (02:21:46):
So basically, just explain sort of the fundamentals, how should
RVD come back, and like should it be mad at management?
Should you want to beat up I don't know, like
just all the all the fortune guys or whatever. I mean,
what's the right way to bring RVD back once he
is back in the picture? Birs go ahead and a
dress losing the belt? Sure, yeah, let's go ahead.

Speaker 6 (02:22:09):
You know what, I'd give him the damn belt back.
I mean that could be gone six months, He's getting wrong.
He can be gone like a week. Knowing them or
you know, they don't sell any injuries for very long.
So he'll be right back soon enough, So just give
him the belt back. I mean, you know, just just
go just yankin out of the guy whoever wins the
tournament's hands. I know he's back before the tournaments over.

(02:22:30):
In fact, I see him be being back and being
in the tournament, so I think you just go, look
he's back and didn't lose and and and you know what,
just they're doing a lot of stuff with Dixie Carter.
You know, Dixie Carter's in all these segnals because she's
the new Todd Gordon Tommy Dreamer did learn that that
con man trick.

Speaker 9 (02:22:51):
You have, you you know, you have the tournament.

Speaker 6 (02:22:53):
You have Rod Damn come out with his puffy dog
face and his eyes and and he looks, you know,
he sticks his bottom lipop and he goes, look, I
got beat up. Then I didn't lose this title. That
wasn't fair, that wasn't right. I went up heel to
Dixie Carter right now to do the right thing. And
Dixie Carter can come out and say, well, I'm all
about doing the right thing if they are over twenty one,
so I'll be glad to give you the title back.

(02:23:15):
And she demands in the crowd cheers, and she's happy
and we're all happy. So you know, that's what that's
If I was Tommy dreaming, that's the way i'd do it,
because you're working for an audience or one that you're
booking for an audience for one.

Speaker 2 (02:23:28):
Now, yeah, I mean, he gave me a special referee
for the tournament final and then you know, I mean
in second TNA, it's like, you know, thirty days you
know later, like you said, you know, doesn't he get
thirty days to medically heal from you know, have a
miraculous comeback and heal and defend the title? I mean

(02:23:48):
in TNA and thirty days is like one day, you know,
just the pacing of storyline. So you know, it's just amazing.
But did you have another question or follow up?

Speaker 6 (02:23:59):
No? No, you know, not really.

Speaker 13 (02:24:02):
I think it's just sort of like Wade says, you know,
very regularly, because they demonstrated all the time, which is
that they they just they see point A and point
B they don't care or maybe I'm sorry, point A
in point Z and they don't give a damn how
they get there and whether it makes helicous sense. So anyway,

(02:24:24):
I'm sorry, I just I thought that was hilarious.

Speaker 6 (02:24:27):
Bruce Teams, keep.

Speaker 2 (02:24:27):
Up the great work as usual. We apretty should the
Calledaria things for that. There's another big storyline that's going
to my assumption is that they kind of begin this
or at least plant the seeds at the end of
the night show is brick player in the Forcing group
feuding against the ECW group in Dixie. What's your what's

(02:24:48):
your take on that storyline progression and how you see
this kind of point out?

Speaker 6 (02:24:54):
Well, is that the the Tommy Drimer got WELLKW and
you know, Tommy Dreamers got more power, and the dad
keeps that he keeps the EV two thing alive, which
is going to be you know, EV two is gonna
be made up of people who are going to be
talking to Dixie about how smart Tommy Dreamer is and

(02:25:15):
how this is really something exciting and it's bringing new
you know, it's raising the bar, and it's changing t
and A for you know tn A forever and it's
a new day for TNA and blah blah blah blah blah.
And I would bet also that back in the day
what they were. You know, if you're gonna if you're
doing fantasy booking E c W versus the Four Horsemen,

(02:25:37):
even though fortune has a four in it and Rick
Flair is involved in and it ain't, you know, it's
too too long ago. It's not and I mean no
insult to the wrestlers that are in the in the group,
but it's not the full horse And so that's you know,
that's what you do. And you're like, oh, and work
with Rick Flair and and and you know, well, you

(02:25:58):
can't get Tully Blanch and Urnamers like he was like
Tommy Dream was, you know, and and Olie Anderson and
Barry Wyndham and JJ Dillon like Tommy Dream was watching
when he was how old he was. But you know,
you can get Rick Flair and AJ Styles and beer
money and and Kavariim and that that's the closest you
can get. And but the main thing is, you know,

(02:26:19):
and you also, I love the work. I see your headlines.
I love the word faction. Yeah, these two gangs fighting
it out, you know, so you know what you know,
I don't know. I don't see when when somebody tags
a garbage can here in Greensboro. I don't see them
saying well, you know, there's the faction tagging that gang.
It's always tagging that, tagging that that can it's always

(02:26:39):
a gang. So yeah, I mean that's you know, and
then and then you know, and the one thing about
doing the factions is you can you can book more
wrestlers and keep more people on your side and happier,
you know, whether the fans are happy or not. I mean,
maybe I'll get that one point two again, and then
we're off to the races. And I am convinced based

(02:26:59):
on on the last week or so and going to
fan Fest and kind of talking to people that just
the reaction of the wrestling fans around me that there
was interest in that nostalgia. You know, there wasn't there
was interest where they'll you know, they'll still have an
abysmal buy, right, but they'll be less of it'll be
less abysmal than their usual really a dismal buy, right.

(02:27:20):
So I mean I could see where he's gonna you know,
this is where the dreamer is gonna have his day.
And since he doesn't, you know, and since cinc reason,
I don't have to be worried about getting fired or
worried about any of that stuff. Here's a guy that's
gonna take some of the work off of him, and
you know, and it keeps someone to eat off of
him that he lives with. You know, the frustration of
people not recognize this genius every day.

Speaker 2 (02:27:44):
There you go, and I imagine this is going to
point out and I mean tna is you know, whether
they're delusional or they think they have something. This is
gonna stretch out for at least two more months and
perhaps further, and we'll see kind of how they play
it up.

Speaker 6 (02:28:01):
Well, I mean, one thing about it is it's going
to be a hangover too. It's gonna be you know,
this is hot shotting and you get that hangover and
that's coming, particularly when you know there's some of those
two guys that aren't very good even if for any
of this.

Speaker 2 (02:28:17):
Don't look good either, you know, don't look ev good,
you know, like I don't want to watch this guy
in my television.

Speaker 6 (02:28:23):
Kind of quality.

Speaker 2 (02:28:23):
Yeah, So well, you know, we'll see, we'll see how
it starts tonight. Uh, let's squeeze in two more phone
calls in the last five minutes of the show. Let's
go to the four oh two area code. Four oh
two welcome to the show. Please say you don't know
where you're from.

Speaker 16 (02:28:39):
Hey, guys, this is real from Link Nebraska.

Speaker 4 (02:28:42):
Oh, Reality, you.

Speaker 2 (02:28:43):
Played a trick on me. I'm to blame you. I
didn't didn't remember Ayther, But go ahead. What do you
have for us?

Speaker 16 (02:28:50):
You know, I'm a little bit behind on my podcast here,
so I'm not sure if it's been discussing that yet.
But what how much dock do you guys take?

Speaker 3 (02:28:57):
And possibly Brian Danielson making a return.

Speaker 2 (02:29:01):
At SummerSlam to be the seventh guy for Team seeing
that over Miss Well, we all to discussed this. We
think it's it's a thing to save, and I think
Bruce are kind of an agreement. You save that card
and you play it later on in the story. I
don't think they need to rush him back onto TV
kind of slowly introduced him back into WWE. So I

(02:29:24):
don't see it happening on Sunday, but I do see
it happening eventually, but it's not on Funday. So yeah, Reality,
another follow.

Speaker 16 (02:29:32):
Up for question, I guess the only other follow up
is that I really really enjoyed raw I mean, I
thought he did a great job just hyping everything kind
of everything Wade was saying, just they actually maybe want
to order the pay per view, So I actually think
I'm going to order SummerSlam this year. One thing that
I really liked about Rob that I thought was definitely different,

(02:29:52):
apart from the shaking camp, was the fact that they
actually let the women wrestle a match longer than a minute,
non title and on the ball on top of that,
do you think maybe they might be going in the
new direction with the women's division or is it just
kind of a shooting star.

Speaker 2 (02:30:10):
Well, you have that match and then you have the uh,
the one piece bathing student match, so it's like they're
mixed signals on the same show. But Bruce, what's your uh,
what's your take on the state of the women's division.

Speaker 6 (02:30:23):
On Rock You they're not changing the direction?

Speaker 2 (02:30:29):
Yeah, I mean, it's just when you when you have
that that sort of deal they had with Santino and Coswealf,
it's you know, it's you know, it is what it is.
It's kind of a filler deal and that's the way
they presented, and that's the way oftentimes I believe they
think it's just it's sort of a filler segments. Uh,
And I don't know if they have numbers to back

(02:30:49):
up their their thought that people don't want to see
actual women's wrestling. I don't know if that's supported by
evidence they have, but that seems to be the mentality.
And you know what, when you have the deal, it
calls up in Santino it kind of if you have
a little bit of false hope or some some additional hope. Uh,
if you're a fitt of the women's division, then you
kind of have that and it's like, oh, never mind. So, uh,

(02:31:12):
we have a good question there. We're in to squeeze
that one more phone call. Let's go to the three
two three area code three two three Welcome to the show.
Please staytion m where you're from?

Speaker 16 (02:31:24):
Two three?

Speaker 2 (02:31:28):
I guess three two three is not with us? So, uh, Bruce,
we're downed about the last minute or so of the show.
Uh TNA. Tonight you got the Big Car the Big
Best of five series finale. You have Matt Morgan and
mister Anderson in the pope and in three way you
have Jeff Party with the open challenge.

Speaker 6 (02:31:48):
Is this?

Speaker 2 (02:31:48):
Uh you know, what's kind of your feeling and what
we're gonna see on tonight's show and is this something
that you think is gonna lead to.

Speaker 13 (02:31:54):
A boots In Andrews in terms of the TV you're
rating this.

Speaker 6 (02:31:57):
Week as well as you know going forward, Well, I
suspect they get there one point two again and and
and I suspected it kind of wears off. They gotta
be careful about putting those two guys in the ring,
or at least the ones I saw Sunday night on
that pay review. No, I think it's going to be
you know, I think it's going to be t and I.

(02:32:20):
So I'll wait and see. Wait, I guess we'll be
talking about this weekend, but yeah, I'll wait and see
them tonight.

Speaker 2 (02:32:26):
Yeah, Bruce, you and Wade will be doing the Bruce
Mitchell Audio Show this weekend, so Torch v IP members
can stay tuned for that lot of v I P
audio up this week with the wait Keller Hotline. We
have a nostalgia audio with Brian Hoops though was just
posted this afternoon, and you can listen to Brian in
My In Me tomorrow. Tomorrow it's gonna be towards Live

(02:32:47):
Cats wrap up the week, So we want to thank
everyone for listening today and towards VAP members stick around
for the after show.

Speaker 3 (02:33:06):
Thank you for using blog talk radio.

Speaker 5 (02:33:08):
Goodbye.

Speaker 22 (02:33:15):
I'm Kelly Wells, host of PWT Talks NXT, the longest
running NXT podcast anywhere. Join me along with Nate Lindberg,
Bruce Lee, Hazelwood and special guests, live every Tuesday night,
just minutes after NXT, where we cover the good, the bad,
and the ugly on the way to becoming a star
in WWE. Check us out live on YouTube or stream

(02:33:36):
later wherever you get your podcasts.

Speaker 2 (02:33:45):
All right, Burris raw with the VIP after show. A
portion of the show they don't cover pretty much most
of the ww and TNA topics. So I want to
get to your serve your audio thoughts on the inw
Legends FanFest last weekend and Charlotte, you were there for
most of that and you kinda had some of some
news and notes. There are some reflections in your Mojo

(02:34:08):
Mitchell column and this Sex Towards newsletter talking about mister
Wrestling too. Just gotta give some of some of some
thoughts on that fan fest and and seeing him in
sort of the medical condition that he's in right now.
Just your overall thoughts on now on those situations.

Speaker 6 (02:34:24):
Well, sure something. You know, my thought goes up to
Johnny Walker and mister Rustling number two, who was a
quint essential Southern babyface of his time. I mean he
was really he was the guy who stood for writing
decency and and wearing wearing the white wearing the white mask,
and and stood up against the heels and was a
pretty fiery guy. Even though he was older. You know,

(02:34:47):
there would not be of mister Rustling too with the
day's and today's wrestling, even though he got a lot
of old rufflers. The old rufflers are all trying to show,
you know, including y Cilly, are all trying to show
how cool and young they are. And this guy was
this guy like he was straight ahead, I'm I don't
like the cheating, I don't like the people, and don't
touch my mask, and don't this person the mask? And

(02:35:10):
uh he was really you know, he was really good.
And then he could play off of that and get
even too grousey and turn and turn heel and was
a pretty effective heel. But he was you know, he
was a beloved you know, in the days of the territories,
you could be that in an area, and he was
the beloved hero of uh, you know, kind of the
father figure, good guy and Georgia Championship Wrestling to the

(02:35:31):
point where Miss Lillian Carter, who was a big wrestling fan,
Jimmy Carter's mother would go see him and go the
wrestling shows to see specifically mister Wrestling number two, and
he was there, and I would you know, they have
a banquet every year, and the banquet usually the Hall
of Hero's Banquet because it's you know, stars of stars
of yesteryear, but it's also pretty leg not pretty legendary,

(02:35:52):
legendary figures and professional wrestling, and the families are there
and people see each other who haven't seen each other
in many, many years, and so and then you know
the fans at least, you know, fans that were respectful
and worked out pretty well. And so, you know, my
table wasn't too far away from Mister Wrestling number two.

(02:36:14):
Is mister Wrestling Tim Woods who passed the name on
to mister Rustling number two in the big Promotional Battle
of Atlanta many years ago promotional Award in Atlanta, Georgia,
and his family was there and it was it was
really interesting. I've never seen you know, I've seen mister
wrestling too. With these things he's in. He's probably seventy
seven to seventy eight years old, and he wears the

(02:36:37):
mask and he's very much you know, kept to that,
and he was known for wearing the mask everywhere he went.
He would wait until he got it well away from
the arena to take his mask off, and a lot
of the rustles never saw him without it. And one
of the reasons why he was one of those guys
that looked younger with the mask and he took the
mask off. He was a ballheaded guy that looked every

(02:36:59):
you know, because he lived a hard life. It was
just he was just one of those times he looked
how old he was, and so it kind of helped
him with that. And so even walking around and fans
knew him and mid Atlantic he was not a huge deal.

Speaker 14 (02:37:11):
He was.

Speaker 6 (02:37:12):
He was he was recognized in the Star and all that,
but he was very much more George off of you know,
Channel seventeen, off of the superstation and PBS and w C,
w G or whatever it was whatever it was back then.
And so I was kind of watching him out of
the cornermye because he didn't wear the mask and and
like wow, and he went and accepted, and then he

(02:37:35):
just really striking kind of off to the corner while
everything else was going on. Tim Woods. His family left
except for his daughter, and his daughter stayed and and
you know, talked to wrestling too, and had her arm
around him and was you know, just kind of keeping
him company, keeping him entertained. I thought that was a
really nice thing to do. And it was really kind
of a touching thing. You get to see those if

(02:37:55):
you're he was irmin enough, you get to see those
little moments because it's the families too, and he's certainly,
you know, he certainly had earned that kind of respect.
So I was, you know, I was sadden to see that.
But I had a conversation with Mike Mouney. I'm Charleston
Post Courier. He's a friend of mine, and we were
kind of you kind of a look, and you go,
those guys from the seventies, the guys from the eighties.

Speaker 2 (02:38:18):
Like all of us.

Speaker 6 (02:38:18):
I mean, they're aging, but they're aging because they took
all those bumps and they did all that, They rode
their schedules. Their bodies are are going faster than than
say those of us who you know, who weren't professional
athlete too. You know, you know, they made they made
you know, they may take care of good, good care

(02:38:39):
of themselves, but you saw a lot of people that
are having new problems, hit problems and back problems, and
you know, it was really strike to me this year.
I've gone every year for the last four or five years,
and this was the year I really you know, had
that sense of mortality for these people. And we're all
getting older. So even those of you who listened to
this going, you know, Bruce is three times my age,

(02:38:59):
you're still getting older too, is but that that was
part of it, and it was it was you know,
it was interesting. It was we didn't quite have as
many people this year. I mean, it didn't have you know,
the one time only readion of the Full Horseman, and
they didn't have the first time Rick Flair making that
kind of you know, that kind of autograph appearance. And

(02:39:20):
this year they had Jim Ross, Jim Ross inducting Danny Hodge,
and that was, uh, that was a highlight. One of
the things that Danny Hodges, I mean, Danny Hodge, there's
an argument for Danny Hodge being America's greatest ever athlete.
I mean there's a real argument for that, because I
mean he was in when he was wrestling in the
n C Double A for Oklahoma, he was never taken

(02:39:43):
off his seat much less ever Beaten won the nc
Double A championship three times in a row. Would have
won the gold medal. But as Ross described, he was
wrestling a Bulgarian in the Olympics. He was wrestling in Bulgarian.
And this was when and I'm willing to remember something,
you know, when this kind of thing would happen. But
and it sort of happened in this, you know, in
World Cup soccer this year. But when you'd have the

(02:40:04):
shady he you know, Eastern European referees who would right,
who would call things against and said that, you know
that Hodge was dominating the guy in the gold medal round.
Was was dominating the Bulgarian and he couldn't do anything
with him, and he rolled his He soon placed him

(02:40:24):
and rolled him through. When he rolled them through, the
referee said that his shoulder.

Speaker 2 (02:40:29):
Touched the mat.

Speaker 6 (02:40:30):
He cast him the golden medal off of that. But
he like completely dominated the guy, and he compared it
to and I have a very good rep rememberance of
this in nineteen seventy two. Screw job. I mean the
great screwge I've ever had, screwed brat Harry. It wasn't
even closed. Was that I've ever seen was the Gold
Metal basketball game between the United States and the Soviet
Union in nineteen seventy two, where you know, the United

(02:40:51):
States walked over everybody in basketball every year, but they
had a hard time of the Russians and they had
it and they let the Russians take three, had three
chances at foul shots until they till they showed they
could win, they could hit the foul shots and win
the game, to the point where you may you may
see Chris Collins on NBC or Chris Collins le who

(02:41:15):
Doug Collins, Wasn't it Doug Collins. I'm thinking to Chris
Collinson Sonny played for Big as a coach for Drinks,
But Doug Collins. But everybody that was on that nineteen
seventy to Olympic team refused to take the silver medal.
And I remember washing on television and calling my buddy
in the middle of it, just being furious. I mean,
I've never seen anything like it, And to this day,
I've never seen anything like it. So, I mean Ross

(02:41:36):
made that comparison, but Danny Hodge holds that respect among
no matter how big the wrestlers are big stars, the
wrestlers are who they are, how much money they made
and all that. And Hodge worked in Oklahoma as the
nd OFV Junior Heavyweight champion when that was a big deal.
But there's something about Danny Hodge because I've never heard
anybody say that that, you know, whether it was you know, whoever,

(02:42:00):
whether Lu says or whoever it was, whether it's called
gotch that that anybody could stretch, could stretch Danny Hodge.
And so I mean when Ross was up there, and
the thing I didn't really know was that it was
right that was Ross's hometown, you know, Oklahoma hero as
a kid and the guy that got interested in watching

(02:42:21):
pro wrestling. Then when he got his first job as
in his early twenties working for Bill Watson, and what
was not at South Wrestling, the lead, the top guy,
the top tag team was Dan was Danny Hodge and
a baby say scanned our actbar and scanned Rackball was
a powerlifter at that point and one, you know, very

(02:42:41):
strong with the stronger people in the world. And he
went from having Danny Hodge be his hero to being
inspired and one to work in wrestling because of it,
to driving Danny Hodge and scanned our actbar around everywhere.
They went on the lawn trips in Oklahoma and in
that territory and that territory has the worst the worst
driving of any territory. And you know, he got to

(02:43:04):
know him Daring very well, and that was so that's
his guy, and he really was, you know, when Ross's inspired,
he really is good about you know, and he inspired
most of my prety professional guy and he really did
a nice job with putting him in. And the other
thing was kind of got to see this from a
few feet away. Jim Ross got to see Bob Caddle

(02:43:25):
for the first time in many years, and uh, you know,
really credits Bob Caddle as being the most underrated wrestling
announcer he's ever seen, and said that when when UWF
you know, Ross broken the deal for the Crockets to
buy UWS away from Bill Lost and Bill Wats retired
and got out of the wrestling business. And at that

(02:43:46):
point and and so he got put on you know,
Ross got put on the be on the B Show.
The A Show was Worldwide Wrestling, The B Show is
Intimated Pro Wrestling and Tony Shaving. David Crockett called Worldwide
the A Show and Bob Coddle. When Jim Ross called
the B Show and Ross and Coddle worked so well together,
he said a lot of it was because of Coddle.

(02:44:07):
You know, Coddle is a is a nice guy and
the real you know, in real life, he's got that
reputation and he's always somebody who kind of look to
see him. Two people to me, you look to see
her him and Olie Anderson and and Coddle is the
one at these FanFest is kind of the grandfather, you know,
the guy that everybody likes, that everybody knows that clearly

(02:44:28):
enjoys being there. And anyway, so they had not seen
each other since the early nineties, since when Ross left
left WCW, and so that was really kind of a
cool You see a lot of moments like that people
who were associated with each other, and you know, in
the wrestling business because the rustling business changes back and forth,

(02:44:48):
and then they don't see each other for thirty years,
and you know, the original Hollywood Blonde reunited Buddy Roberts
and Jerry Brown with her Oliver Humperdink because I believe
Brian who's talked about it, and I'm trying to figure
out how why Brian who's doing fantast stuff ahead of
me and I was there, But that's okay, you know,
actually Brian just needs to come and that's what that's

(02:45:10):
really what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 (02:45:11):
That's cool.

Speaker 6 (02:45:11):
I mean, that's that's good. Olver humperdig is very nice
and and was a good it was the talent of
dying and good managers. I'm glad he got him to
I'll be listening to that. So I'm glady got talked
about it. Yeah. So, I mean, you know, there's there's
a lot of those there's a lot of those moments.
There's also the moments when you meet people and you
haven't never before and you kind of get you know,

(02:45:33):
you kind of get disappointed because you know, sometimes it
may be a big moment for you, or maybe somebody
interested in meeting and they're not interested in meeting you,
or they are they're having a bad day or or
or they're they're not they're the more how can I
say this, colorful eccentric fans who who who bothered? Who
can bother them? Which, let me tell you this boy,

(02:45:56):
maybe you'll like this boy. I saw a part of
this happened last year. I really didn't know about about
the whole story about this until I saw the second
part of it this year. But there's a guy who
goes to FanFest every year and he goes. He's he's
got his suit on. You know, his his creases are
like sharp enough to cut cut tonatoes. I mean he's

(02:46:17):
he's got he's got his tie tied all the way up,
and he's got some Versachi shoes on, or one of
the hell shoes you've got on. I mean he's he's
styling and profiling. He calls himself, I mean, just takes
some nerve. He calls himself the new Nature Boys. He's
probably thirty years old. And what he's really guy going
for and where he stands out is he's got a mullet,

(02:46:40):
a very nice mullet, and you're just like, holy cramp.
And so so we kind of had noticed it, and
some of my friends were talking about it and they went, yeah,
that's the new Nature boy. I said, what do you mean,
that's a new nature boy. That's what he calls himself.
I said, does he work in he's around here something
He's like, No, I here wrestler. No, is he managed?

(02:47:03):
Is he like promoters?

Speaker 5 (02:47:04):
Do something? No?

Speaker 6 (02:47:05):
He calls himself the new Nature bol He says he's
going to be a big start. And I said, you
didn't say you missed it last year. I said, what
do you mean last year? So last year, after the
banquet was over, and I guess and looking back now
finding out that even though I was in the vicinity,
I didn't know. There was a big fight between Great
Price and Ric Flair over the extra time to flare

(02:47:26):
and the full Horseman spent spent like six hours, six
extra hours finding, you know, taking pictures of binding autographs
of all that stuff. So there was a big fight
over who owes what money and all that kind of stuff.
And but Flair, like you couldn't tell about how Flair
acted during the banquet, but he did, you know, he
threatened the walk and got some more money and still
thinks he's owed money. And High Spots is in the

(02:47:47):
middle of this, and you know they're they're going to
the lawsuit and Flair, Oh's you knows the money they
paid him out and there's some you know, some mess
and and Ricclaire doesn't look too good at it. But anyway,
so Flair's Claire's coming up the escalator from where the
banquet is and where the vendor rooms are. Last year,
it comes up with his wife and turns like he's

(02:48:08):
going to the bar. Some guys go to the bar
and hang out. Some people don't, and particularly on that
Friday night. And he turns and the new nature Boy
turns and looks at him, mean cuts a promo on
Rick Flair, telling him that I'm a new nature boy.
I'm I'm custom made from head to toe and.

Speaker 5 (02:48:24):
Blah blah blah blah blah blah blah.

Speaker 6 (02:48:26):
Blah blah a really loud voice.

Speaker 2 (02:48:28):
I heard him.

Speaker 6 (02:48:28):
I didn't know, That's what. I didn't know all of
it because I was kind of across the lay and lobby.
And Claire looks at him, looks at his wife and
turns around without a word and just walks out of
the hotel. And can't, you know, can't say I blame him.
So this guy's a new nature boy, and so he's like,
you know, he's like he's like networking and showing himself

(02:48:51):
at the FanFest and at the bar, and one of
the things he was doing I just thought was just,
i mean an extra classy kind of was he would
take his brush out at the bar and comb is
his mullet back, and you know, and I'm sitting there thinking,
you know, this is this is great. I mean, I'm
sure he's like having I'm sure he's having the time

(02:49:12):
of his life. And you know, you know, really thinking
at what's life like for this guy, you know, on
Tuesday morning at at ten o'clock when he's at whatever
job he has, or he's you know, or his mother's
telling him to go find a job or whatever the
hell of the situation is, or his you know, I mean,
it can't be that easy to wear that mullet all
the time. So because those things, they're not coming back.

(02:49:37):
So I mean that was like, but I just love
that he's a new nature boy and he's he's so
cocky that he doesn't he's not even bothering to like,
you know, learn to rustle or try to get hooked
up with some rustling promotion or or do something. He's
just he's going straight to the top. He's not bothering
with you know, the things that John Stena or you

(02:49:57):
know you know Undertaker or Rick Player or you know
the stars of wrestling in the past or the pros,
and happened to Randy Orton. He's just going, you know,
why buy of wrestling, just be the new nature. So
he doesn't have he's missing that. He's got naturally brown hair,
though he's missing the perox side. I'll say that, but
maybe that's notuff that he can if you really want

(02:50:18):
to admit to his character, you can work on that.

Speaker 1 (02:50:21):
So we're about to go to a commercial break. Why
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Speaker 6 (02:50:53):
Membership, but you get you know, you get some you
get some interesting character there. And it's it's people trouble
around the country. But it's also and and I've said
this before, it's cool to talk to people to read
the toys because with that exception, they're not nuts. I mean,
they're they're pretty intelligent, and they're they're they're pretty reasonable

(02:51:14):
people and they're fun that they're fun to me, So
that's that's nice. And but you know, you get you
get Jimmy Ryan, who who Motingham profiled in a Charleston
Posts that article one of his columns a little while ago,
and I met him. I've talked to him every year,
and he's quite secure. He goes all the way back

(02:51:36):
to the sixties, travels around and back in the days
of the territories. He just traveled the territories, and he
knew the wrestlers. He's driving places, and he would hitchhike
and and get put up at wrestler's houses and fans
houses and knew everybody and knew all the gossip. And
when you would go, I mean I remember him telling
me he has notebooks full of this stuff that are
pretty cool to look at him I mean he goes

(02:51:57):
way back. He goes way back to the sixties, and
you know they called them the encyclopedia, and the wrestlers,
like even in the strong k fine days, accepted him
because he knew what he was talking about and he
would and also you know, he would help he would
help him out in different things. To the one I
thought was really interesting was he would go down to
the newsstands in Charlotte. And this was in the days

(02:52:19):
way before. You wouldn't remember this, cald Well, this is
something I'd miss. The newsstands that I mean, Bonzan, Noble
and Borders has pretty good newstands, but newsstands where every magazine,
every newspaper from around the country, you know, major newspaper
from around the country, and every comic book and you know,
every and every other wing world I won't go out

(02:52:41):
go anymore, but yeah, I was like, you could find everything,
you know, you can find anything there. So he would
he would go get newspapers from around the country. Knew
what days they'd have wrestling results in them, and he
would track results. But he would also the wrestlers liked
that because they didn't know where their friends were and
they didn't know who was working where, and a lot
of times the newspapers were put in attendancy. It was

(02:53:03):
a way for them to find out where, you know,
which territory was hot, which territory needed to heal, which
territory needed a babyface, who was doing well, who wasn't,
And they could kind of keep up, and you know,
that was job opportunities for them, you know, where to
go because they russer's back in that time, they always
had their unless you were homesteady, unless you were Johnny
Weaver and George Becker and staying in the mid Atlantic territory,

(02:53:26):
unless you were Jackie Fargus sting in Nephis or Herndonia
in the crush or the Crushers staying in Minneapolis. Most
of the other Russlers cycled in and out, so you're
always looking to where's your next job, little bit, where
are you gonna be in six to eight months from now,
And so he really got to know some of that.
But it was also an era where you can't hitch
hide now and you can't just stay in somebody's house.

(02:53:47):
They're not gonna let you do that. And this you know,
kind of hippie thing where it was just like you know,
you just you know, you gave what you had and
accepted people and cheered your dope with He didn't say this,
but I'll say it chered your dope with them and
all that kind of you know, kind of moved on.
And so he was then saying it was say, funny,
this is a guy that like has it had a
long gray beard, and you know, he kind of stood

(02:54:08):
out whenever you saw him. And as soon as he
got got his name and picture in the newspaper and
on the left side, he caused the deer off. But
I had some fun with him because it was like
it's like I walked up and and somebody was saying,
you know, ay, Bruce House could go on or something,
and you know, and introduced me to a guy from
College Flower Alley and and I said, well, yeah, I'm

(02:54:30):
right for the torch, but I'm no Jimmy Ryan. And
so he kind of like perked up, and I went,
I don't get my name and I don't get my
name any article in the Charleton Post Cazette. So that
was that was cool. I mean, you got to see
things like Jim Dugan and Teddy BOSSI hanging out first
time in a while, Teddy BOSSI hanging out with you know,
eating breakfast, a scam parac bar and you know, just

(02:54:53):
people really, you know, really getting together. You know it
got I mean the one that kind of got me
that was pretty funny was we come things are pretty
fun sitting in the lobby, like one couch down from
Ole Anderson and that's where and he's he's shakier now
he has m MS. He has MS and he's you know,
it's kind of a highlight of the year. But he wasn't.
He was only there for one day this year. And

(02:55:13):
you know, and these guys are getting older and and
things took a toll on them. Here comes said this
is Here comes Sid Beauty walking up and he walks
and usually only if you sit and talk to him,
he does the talking. And we'll tell you how wrestling
is and who's what and Hywritt Flair sucks and and
you know, everything in the world and so and he

(02:55:36):
has an opinion about everything and about everything that he
does and and so but Sid walk up to him
and I just I couldn't hear what she was saying.
But Sid's standing there and just over talks him and
just kind of you know, like Wade does to me,
and so but it was worse and sins just and
and always just looking up at him and Sis just
tell him how it is. And I'm sitting there thinking,

(02:55:58):
you do realize said that only thought you were the worst,
I mean like you were horrible and you know it
was not shy. I was saying it back in the
day and Sid was horrible, and so that was that
was funny to see him and Sid Sim's got the
rubber mask face now, you know, the face that looks
like he is one of those rubber Halloween masks, even
though it's his own faith.

Speaker 4 (02:56:18):
He's big.

Speaker 6 (02:56:20):
Let's see that probably the best. And yeah, he he
had a good hump.

Speaker 2 (02:56:27):
Did he look in shape?

Speaker 6 (02:56:30):
He didn't look like he didn't look like he was
muscled out, but he looked he looked and I'd say
he looked in shape. He wasn't as big as you
as you'd expect. The two guys that looked to be
to be the best real shape were Brad Armstrong and
Bob Armstrong. Bob for his age and then Brad. I
mean they they said that Brad's these are real bad,

(02:56:50):
but his but he looked like a guy that worked,
that worked in the gym as a fitness instructor. And
part of his deal is he impressed you by how
what you know, what kind of shape he was. And
he was smaller, he wasn't you know, he wasn't as
muscle as he was in his heyday, but he was.
He was definitely a real good shape. And Mike Jackson,
I don't know if you know who Mike Jackson is,

(02:57:11):
but the Alabama Junior Headway Champion. He was a jobber
on Georgia Championship Wrestling and Mid Atlanta Championship Wrestling. And
Jim Crockett, I mean, and when it went when I
turned into w c W with Dusty Rhodes and all that,
and he's sixty years old. He was this little guy
who moved real well and he would always lose his match.
But I was smaller everybody, but he would like give

(02:57:32):
him a match. And he's sixty years old and in
real good shape, and he can actually feel kind of
perform the same way he did, so he was in
good shape. I saw something I thought I'd never see.
I'll say this at one of the weather tables. It
was actually our videos vendor table Jake Robers eating a

(02:57:52):
big ball of salad.

Speaker 16 (02:57:54):
That was.

Speaker 6 (02:57:56):
That was interesting. So that was so you know, you know,
that was I'll just say, I mean, people can figure
out what I'm talking about.

Speaker 12 (02:58:03):
So that was.

Speaker 6 (02:58:03):
That was interesting. Did had a big line I'm starting.
But the other one I was really interested. Walked in
and saw and there was I mean there was you know,
nicolau Volkoff and pors zooke cough and black Bart was
there and uh ch j Strambo, which I was just
like way chij Stromba the Wahoo mcdane, the fake Wahoo

(02:58:25):
McDaniel was down in the Atlantic or this area beyond me.
But like I said, there's a lot of there's a
lot of Northerners who come down, and a lot of
the wrestlers like or at least gender what. They're happy
to see him. He wasn't the most he wasn't the
most well liked agent in the history of the w
w E, but he was definitely there. But the one
that just kind of cracked me up, Daphne was there.

(02:58:45):
But the one that cracked me up was at the
high Spots table was Fefe the May You remember Fez
the may right, Yeah, for bir for the gold. Yeah, yeah,
for player the player for the girl. My brothers the
lay way had to think about it. But I just
like that was.

Speaker 2 (02:59:03):
That was like my brother and I that was like
our favorite segment on w SEV Saturday Night when we
were growing up. Okay, yeah, every.

Speaker 6 (02:59:14):
So you were old, that was I don't even gonna
talk to you, but anyway, when you were growing up,
that's beautiful. But anyway, but I mean I just kid about.
She was there for a few months. She was on
that show for you know, a matter of months, and
then never came back. And I just I can't imagine
you know what her real name is. It was like,
you know, hello, is this so and so? Yes, yes

(02:59:34):
it is. Did you play Fiefe the May back in
nineteen ninety ninety one on uh yeah, why do you ask?
Would you like to come down to Charlotte, North Carolina
and make you know whatever? They pay a few hundred bucks?
Do you still have the main outfit? Wow? Yes I do?
Are you kidding? When people paid to see that, They're like, yes,
yes they will, and yes they did. They paid to

(02:59:54):
get the picture taken with us. So that was Beefe
the Mad. I just didn't think that ever. See Fife
the maid again. So that was that was cute Kelly.

Speaker 2 (03:00:05):
Yeah, yeah, that's a very good words, you know.

Speaker 3 (03:00:07):
Yeah.

Speaker 6 (03:00:08):
Yeah, So Kelly Blanchard and Baby Doll, Baby Dolls with
her daughter. She's usually there. Baby Doll's daughter is pretty
nice girl. We'll see who else. Uh, this was this
one kind of I want to hear Brian Who's talk
about this and George Side talk about this. Terry Funk inducted,
inducted Billy Robinson, the Great Billy Robinson into the Hall

(03:00:30):
of Heros. I get the distinctive pressions that Billy Robinson
never really wrestled down here, that Terry Funk wanted to
do that. And Terry Funk clearly likes Billy Robinson a lot,
was really liked and respected him and liked him when
he came to the Amarilla Territory and lived with the
Funks and told him some funny stories about that. And
then Billy Robinson did his his such a speech and

(03:00:50):
talked about and talked about wrestling's history going all the
way back two thousand years before Christ and how the
person changed the I mean that's true. I mean the
the athlete of the first Olympic Games back in those
those in ancient times, the wrestler was proclaimed, you know,
the wrestler was the athlete among athletes. And he was

(03:01:13):
saying tous bill that day. There's a lot of great
wrestlers who nobody remembers because you know, from Britain and
from those kind of places. When he really talks about this,
but I do want to hear George Sire talk about
how you inducted Billy Robinson into the Hall of Heroes.
But Terry Funk did this without saying Terry Funk didn't
say this, and Billy Robinson says out saying the name

(03:01:36):
vern Gan or saying the letters A W A. I
was kind of struck by that. I was just like, wow,
that's that's pretty amazing. So, uh, the assassin, the assassin.
Did you know Nick Patrick's father, Jody Hamilton referee Nick
Patrick's father, Jody Hamilton put on his hood. I mean
Wrestling two didn't have his and inducted Wrestling one and

(03:01:58):
wrestling too, and Jody Hamilton and still and whatever. His
early seventies can still have that cadence. I mean he
was a great, villainous, evil, intense promo. I mean serious
and intelligent and all that and one of my favorite
promos ever and he still could do it. I mean,
it was that was that was pretty cool to see.
And he was one of those guys you can kind

(03:02:19):
of tell was not even at this point in front
of that crowd with the wrestlers and their families and
the fans and all that, not all that he was
careful about what he said. He did not if you
listened very carefully, he did not quite break ksee. So
that was, you know, and at that point in their
career is I can take it either way. That's okay.
I mean, that's you know, there's a way of saying

(03:02:41):
things without insulting, not insulting anybody's intelligence. And tell him
he did, I mean, he told the truth. At the
same time, it wasn't you know, it wasn't like I
hate you wrestling too. If I could have another chance,
I'd try to strangle you right now or anything like that.
And he never did promise like that that way anyway.
But yeah, that was that was interesting. Ch parts you
made all the chance. The big championship belt. God, that's

(03:03:04):
another thing you get to see, you know, pretty close up,
those those title belts and the replica. You know, now
there's expensive Roughs goes with the title belt, but people
like Dave Nolokan Mike, and that's pretty interesting, pretty cool,
cool to see. And I know that when your wife's
looking the other way, you're gonna spend a few hundred
bars gets you on, you know, gets you a belt
that you can look in the mirror out and playing

(03:03:25):
yourself champion. I can see it. No, no, I can
see it.

Speaker 2 (03:03:31):
I don't need a belt to validate myself.

Speaker 6 (03:03:33):
Okay, you're like Roddy Piper. I see, You're like Roddy Piper.
You don't need the you don't need the belt to
get out there. There definitely acts like that, but yeah,
we did.

Speaker 2 (03:03:48):
Was that Rick clairer imitated, did you have a belt
with him? I mean that that will kind of have
to completely get in the look the mulled well, the shades.

Speaker 10 (03:03:56):
The.

Speaker 2 (03:03:58):
Belt.

Speaker 6 (03:03:58):
I don't know, I get you had to shake. He
didn't have the belt. He didn't have a belt with him,
so I don't know, I don't know.

Speaker 2 (03:04:05):
I'm you know, we didn't want to look. He doesn't
want to look foolish, Jane.

Speaker 6 (03:04:10):
You know he did.

Speaker 2 (03:04:11):
He's trying to walk a fine line makes you're looking
like a mark and looking like an imitator, because if you.

Speaker 6 (03:04:17):
Have the belt and you're a mark, a complete or
a complete nut. So I mean I think you yeah,
you know, I think he's walked up. But I mean
when you're introducing yourself to people, not as Hi, my
name is so and so my name, I'm the new
nature boy. Uh okay, I need to be here. Yeah,

(03:04:37):
all right, Chris, great stories.

Speaker 2 (03:04:40):
Are you gonna be writing more about it?

Speaker 6 (03:04:41):
Or are you going to?

Speaker 2 (03:04:43):
I mean you kind of have your you know, he's
kind of your basic story on on mister Wrestling too.
Are you going to be writing more.

Speaker 6 (03:04:51):
Mike? We'll see.

Speaker 2 (03:04:52):
I don't know. I haven't just thought. We have an
audio somebody wants to transcribe into a column. There you go,
oh okay, well we'll leave it open to the floor.

Speaker 6 (03:05:02):
Make sure to get all the arms and someone does that.
Make sure you get all the arms and you knows
and they repeat that't that'll make for good reading.

Speaker 2 (03:05:11):
We'll we'll parse it down.

Speaker 6 (03:05:12):
Yeah, the.

Speaker 2 (03:05:15):
Bruce you and you and Wade will be doing the
Bruce Mitchell out of your show this weekend, so we'll
get more of your your insight on w t n
A and I'm sure some more FanFest stories as well,
and of course preview in summer Slams. So uh, any
any final thoughts before we wrap up today, Bruce, Now
let's go all right, I'm gonna grask some dinner before

(03:05:35):
Superstars and uh you and you and Waite will be
talking later on this weekend. So for Torch Palmness, Bruce Mitchell,
this is Torch Assistant editor James bond Walk.

Speaker 6 (03:05:45):
I know.

Speaker 1 (03:06:03):
Invite you to email the show with feedback or questions
or comments. That email address is Wadekeller Podcast at pwtorch
dot com. That's Wadekeller Podcast at PW torch dot com.
Also welcome your feedback on Twitter. Even follow us on
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That's at PW Torch and at the Wadekeller.

Speaker 19 (03:06:26):
Searching for more great pro wrestling talk, then join me
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(03:06:48):
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Thanks for listening to our podcast. Did you know we
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(03:07:18):
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