Halloween collab 2024

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
Well, hello everyone, and welcome to uh what Happens in
the Woods. I know it's a little weird not hearing
Jess talk first. I promise she's here.

Speaker 2 (00:34):
You can send he yes, I'm here. I am here.

Speaker 1 (00:39):
Also with us and as you guys know, this is
our annual folloween collab with Crimes and Closets. We have
Beth and Christie with us also Yello. Yeah, and of
course this is the collab with the Killer Bees. Yeah,
Beth and Bryce, this is a we're going to bring
you a couple stories. And if you haven't listened to

(01:02):
their podcast on Monday, we went with the occult or
crimes with occults or cult following. So I'm gonna let
Beth go first. Ladies first always, and I'll let you tell.
I'll let Beth tell us about her story. And of course,

(01:24):
as always, there are warnings. I don't know, Bet, what
what warnings do you have for us? Now?

Speaker 2 (01:31):
Oh?

Speaker 3 (01:31):
I have some more. I have some sexual assault warnings,
lots of triggers.

Speaker 4 (01:37):
All right, guys, see you later.

Speaker 3 (01:42):
There are miners involved in mine. I am so sorry.
That's not like you.

Speaker 2 (01:48):
I know, I feel like, how can you escape that? Though?
Sometimes with a cult you know, or the occult, Yeah, totally,
the ritualistic sacrifice, the virgin, you know, that kind of
thing that's in your head that you see in all
the movies.

Speaker 1 (02:05):
Yeah, I will tell you a struggle that I had,
and I'm sure you guys did too, but fitting my
case into like our small segment, like I honestly, I
don't know. My case could have been four hours long.
I'm not joking like we could have. I could have,
you know, dove right into it certain aspects. I literally

(02:28):
just cut out.

Speaker 3 (02:29):
But yeah, I think that shows you did your research.
I think that's not a bad thing. It just shows
that you are well informed in what you're speaking of,
which is how we should do like this.

Speaker 4 (02:43):
Well awesome, So then I wasn't.

Speaker 5 (02:46):
When mine went way over what we should have had
last on Monday.

Speaker 2 (02:49):
Anyway, you know what, We're good. We're good. We we
did what needed to be done, Christy, So it's a good.

Speaker 4 (02:58):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:58):
Right, If you guys haven't heard, go back and listen
on their feed Crimes and Closets for their Jess and
Christie's episode.

Speaker 3 (03:09):
Yeah, yeah, it's awesome.

Speaker 1 (03:11):
But more importantly, it's the killer Beezer up now. So
I'll let Beth.

Speaker 3 (03:16):
Take it away, Yes, let me buzz away really quick.
So we did. I think it was like a ritualistic
type cult situation that we were trying to go for right.
And so that's what and I have both in mind.
I actually heard about this cult while at Crime Con

(03:38):
and I didn't tell Christy that I was going to
do this one. She knows about it. She knows a
lot about it actually, because we were there in May
and we sat in on a live podcast recording. Mm hmm.
She's so excited, you know, talking about one of the investor. Yes,

(03:58):
it was one of the investigation that actually helped take
down this cult, which was so amazing. He saved dozens
of children and other people from sexual assaults and things.
And so she definitely knows what I'm talking about. She
knows who I'm talking about. So it's going to be

(04:19):
super interesting to dive in. And I loved. I loved
diving into this and I didn't tell her.

Speaker 1 (04:26):
I didn't know what it is.

Speaker 3 (04:27):
And it's not a little bit culty too, it's a
little bit gulty. I listened to a little bit Culty
for my research. Actually, I listened back to our episode
and I swear to God, we are heard screaming in
one part. It's me and you on the live video.
We were sitting in the front row. We were in

(04:48):
the front row, we were front and center, and you
can hear us one percent. It's us. So the name
of this cult is the Zion Society. Oh, I had
never heard of it. Christy had never heard of it,
and I am a little bit cult ty. So the
fact that I had not heard of it shook me
a little bit, and I said that to her. I
was like, I've never heard of this, and I am

(05:09):
moved by it because I know all the things about cults.
So I'm going to tell you about it. Do you
start out? I'm going to do tell starting out. July
of nineteen ninety one, a woman named Aaron walked into
a police department in Utah and said to a detective,

(05:33):
my name is Aaron Robertson and I am a member
of a cult that is sexually abusing children. Do you
have some time to speak with me? So, yes, yes
they did. This led to hours, hours of interviews and

(05:53):
weeks long investigation, a raid, and eventually prosecutions of twelve
cult members. Okay, so I'm going to tell you about
this cult. The Zion Society was located in Ogden, Utah,
which is a suburb of Salt Lake City. It is

(06:14):
considered a ritualistic cult with about one hundred members, including
over thirty children. They practiced extreme cleanliness, polygamy, lesbianism, and
ritualistic child sexual abuse.

Speaker 4 (06:31):
Extreme cleanliness, extreme cleanliness.

Speaker 3 (06:36):
Okay, I love that you picked that out of that list,
because that was quite a list.

Speaker 5 (06:43):
Well, it just seemed like the one that was kind
of like, wow, now we have a podcast about extreme cleanliness.

Speaker 1 (06:48):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (06:50):
So the leader of the cult was a man named
Arvin Shreeve. Arvin was married to a woman named Alice.
He had multiple children. He was a well sought after landscaper,
first ever cult leader who was a landscaper. He was

(07:14):
also very talented in cinematic things and technology, and he
was very charismatic. He had been excommunicated from the Church
of Latter day Saints and due to his deviant beliefs
and behaviors, they kicked him out. They were like, you

(07:35):
have no place here, but bye. He told his wife Alice,
that God had told him to experiment sexually with sex workers,
and he was arrested for solicitation.

Speaker 4 (07:47):
God often tells people to do that.

Speaker 3 (07:49):
Yeah, I mean not mine, but okay. So he was
arrested for this and the church was like, guys, Arvin,
you gotta go get it.

Speaker 1 (08:03):
You can't be in our club anymore.

Speaker 2 (08:05):
Yeah, can't sit here. They don't want attention brought to
the things that they do. That's the thing. Once you
start getting looked at, that's to go right.

Speaker 3 (08:15):
So he went on to create his own form of
religion because of his excommunication, Arvin started teaching like Bible
studies and spiritually mentoring people, and as his group grew,
he eventually claimed to be a prophet who received revelations
directly from God. He claimed that he had been chosen

(08:38):
to guide people into a perfect spiritual life and to
guide them how to be spiritually elite in God's eyes.
Arvin approved a few men in his group as he
grew it to for like certain purposes in the cult.
Like they would do security, they would be a bishop,

(08:59):
they would be attorney, and then he decided that these
men needed to take on multiple wives as well as himself.
Arvin would target families who were part of or who
had left the LDS faith and who were searching for
a new way of life or for spiritual growth. And

(09:22):
he would also target women who were single or recently divorced.
He would target struggling single mothers, women who were part
of like the low come, low income, or unhoused population,
drug addicts, exotic of dancers, sex workers, like women like that.

(09:43):
He would target them, approach them, I have a better
way of life. I can offer you things. He would
offer them financial security, housing, food and education for their children,
and acceptance. We're here for you. We have a group
of people who want to love on you and love

(10:05):
on your children. He purchased a total of fourteen homes
in an upscale neighborhood in the suburbs and that kind
of became his commune. The homes were set apart because
they were very elaborately landscaped.

Speaker 5 (10:26):
It totally reminds me of like the celebration like Celebration Florida,
where it's like perfect, everything's landscaped exactly the way everyone else.

Speaker 3 (10:38):
Well, yes, but in this he's doing it. Only fourteen
homes were elaborately landscaped. So the other ones were like, well,
they're not members of this group because they're home, you know,
they just have normal bushes. They don't have bridges and
let waterfalls.

Speaker 5 (10:56):
Oh I don't think I realized that there were other
houses in the neighborhood, Like I thought.

Speaker 3 (11:00):
Oh yeah, just then yeah, no, no, no, it's a
big neighborhood, like our neighborhood that we lived in. Here
your neighborhood. And they just purchased fourteen homes.

Speaker 2 (11:09):
So they weren't like grouped together. They're just dispersed.

Speaker 3 (11:14):
So for the most part, I would say probably like
eight or nine of them were grouped together, okay, but
then there were some that were like dispersed throughout the neighborhood.
So each house was used for a specific purpose. So
they had a security house, a medical house, a sewing
and beautification house, a women's dorm which housed arvins spiritual wives,

(11:42):
a home of inspiration which was used to recruit new
members and like entertain a children's dorm, a commune home,
a library, a bishop's home, a legal house. Like you
get it. It's like all of these different homes that
served a certain purpose.

Speaker 5 (12:03):
Do we us do we make the assumption that the child,
like the children's home is like all of the children
in that group lived in just one house.

Speaker 3 (12:11):
Yes, they're separately, yes, ma'am.

Speaker 1 (12:14):
You know what this reminds me of two is like
you ever seen like the Walking Dead, where like each
house in the in the whole compound was exactly like that.
They had one that was just for food, one just
for yes, like really end of world stuff.

Speaker 3 (12:28):
Yes, one hundred percent. It was exactly like that. And
they were all wired together in like an intricate security
system with like cameras and things like that, so they
all knew what was going on and each other's home. Wow. Right,
So new members of the group were expected to donate
all of their processions possessions to the group, so like

(12:51):
sell your cars, sell your furniture, sell all the things,
move in with us, and then all of the earnings
were to go to Arvin, the leader as a tithing.
They were encouraged to cut off ties with anything from
their worldly life in quotes, so like their families, their friends,
et cetera. Children were separated from their parents and sent

(13:15):
to live in the children's dormitory, and it was said
that they only saw their parents once or twice a year. Oh,
which is pretty remarkable if you think about because they
live in a cul.

Speaker 1 (13:25):
De sac, right, but like who's raising them?

Speaker 3 (13:30):
So they had a like appointed people.

Speaker 2 (13:32):
It's like a scientology does that too.

Speaker 3 (13:37):
Mm hmmm, yeah, I mean it just makes me think
of the Handmaids though, like that's all I'm like, yeah
all day long. So all the women and young girls
were so like you think of like a cult there
in like the like little house on the prairie things. Right,
So these women actually were encouraged to dress a little
bit provocatively. So all of the women and young girls

(14:01):
had to wear like tight fitting dresses and skirts and
high heels. Appearance was very important to them, so they
had to have perfect hair. They had to weigh themselves
every day so that they did not like weigh too much.
They had to all wear makeup and these like perfect dresses.

(14:26):
Their homes had to be immaculate, like super well decorated,
perfectly clean. Meanwhile, I wouldn't live in this cold no.
Arbon Like Colt leader was like a hot mess. He
was like disheveled, overweight, Baldang.

Speaker 1 (14:46):
It's always like that, not cute at all. And Colts
it's like do as I say, not as they do.

Speaker 2 (14:52):
Right.

Speaker 3 (14:54):
So the women or like we would call them sister wives,
right because I we all watch sisteris right. If you don't,
you're missing out. But anyway, so like the women who
were you know, were multiple wives, they were encouraged to
develop very close bonds within themselves and friendships in what

(15:17):
Arvin called the Sister Council. So Arvin actually replaced his
actual wife because remember he was married to Alice. So
he replaced her because she just like was not go along,
get along with a cult member named Carla, who became
his most trusted and loyal follower. And Carla actually started

(15:43):
a business within the cult in which the women would
sew and sell lingerie to exotic dancers, and it was
called Sweet Things. O.

Speaker 5 (15:57):
This is so fascinating, even though I know I've heard this,
so fascinating, I'm telling you right now, I can't get enough.

Speaker 3 (16:05):
It's horrific and awful and fascinating. And now that's God's.

Speaker 4 (16:09):
Work right there.

Speaker 2 (16:11):
Let tie into a church.

Speaker 3 (16:14):
Yeah, well, I'm going to get there. Actually I'm going
to get there. I'm going to tell you about all
that in a minute. Okay, So this is where things
get really dark, and here's your trigger for sexual child
sexual abuse. Okay. So Arvin believed in a god given
philosophy that he made up, in my opinion, called the

(16:37):
sexual way of life. So he taught that humans are
sexual beings and that you can elevate your sexual status
by harnessing your energy, sexual energy and sharing it with everyone,
including him. So he encouraged especially yeah, he encouraged the

(17:01):
women in the sister Council to be sexually intimate with
each other. Okay, so all of the so there's multiple men,
right him and multiple other men. Not many, there's not
many men, yeah, but there are some. And so then
there's just all these women and they were encouraged to

(17:24):
have sexual intimacy with each other, and they were taught
that if they could be sexually intimate with each other
and with him, then they would go to heaven.

Speaker 2 (17:40):
Okay.

Speaker 3 (17:41):
Unfortunately, this was not contained to just the adults in
the children's dormitory, which ranged from ages six to eighteen.
Uh uh years ago done, children were taught as a
part of their schooling about sexual acts, seduction, sensuality. Pornographic

(18:11):
material was used daily to teach these children about sexual
acts and things that they needed to be doing to
get to happen.

Speaker 2 (18:23):
What type of pornographic material are we talk in books,
we talk in magazines, videos, all of.

Speaker 3 (18:30):
The yes n'am in sexual devency. Deviancy was encouraged like right,
children were encouraged to engage in sexual acts with each other,
oh god, with their sister counsel, and in sexual acts
with other men in the group, of course, Arvin being

(18:55):
the main one.

Speaker 4 (18:56):
Hopefully not their own parents.

Speaker 3 (19:00):
Their parents are removed from them. Remember they were taken
away from their parents.

Speaker 4 (19:03):
Well, I didn't know if any of them were part
of his men group.

Speaker 3 (19:07):
Like, no, I don't know about the men, right, but moms. No,
So Arvin was himself. Actually he had somewhere around thirty
spiritual wives, as he called them, that raged ranged an
age from four years old to sixty five. Okay, hold on,

(19:33):
it's getting darker. It's a baby.

Speaker 4 (19:35):
That's a baby.

Speaker 3 (19:36):
Yeah, oh my god, things are going more sideways in
a minute, you Okay.

Speaker 2 (19:42):
Take a breath, take a drink.

Speaker 3 (19:45):
All right. Arvin invented a game in which he called
rape in the Dark.

Speaker 2 (19:53):
Oh it sounds so fun, I tell m HM.

Speaker 3 (19:57):
In this game, the children and some adult women would
all sit in a circle in a dark basement and
they would draw cards with sexual acts on them. One
of the cards would be labeled rape. Whoever drew the
rape card would pick a person in the group and

(20:21):
perform whatever sexual act with them that was on their card.

Speaker 6 (20:28):
Like, this is an illegal act and he making yes,
but he's game and he named it rape, right, Like,
I mean not that it's okay if you name it
something else.

Speaker 4 (20:42):
But you're like, what okay?

Speaker 3 (20:47):
So it is estimated that the thirty plus children that
were living in this cult were likely sexually abused or
exploited in some way at least once a day.

Speaker 2 (21:00):
Oh god, So.

Speaker 3 (21:02):
This wasn't like a fun Friday night thing. This was
like happening daily to these children. If they did not comply,
the children, they would be locked in a closet like
type thing. They would be deprived of food, deprived of light,
deprived of interaction from their peers whatever.

Speaker 1 (21:25):
So they're basically in isolated, like the whole in prison.

Speaker 2 (21:30):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (21:31):
So Carla, who was Arvin's right hand lady, right, she
was actually even known to traffic her own daughter to
men outside of the cult for money.

Speaker 2 (21:46):
Well, sure, I you no longer get off on just
doing it with little children for free. You gotta make
money from it too, somehow, So why not. Obviously don't care.

Speaker 3 (21:59):
So there were rumors that began circulating around the community
about this like weird group of neighbors who like went
freely from house to house, right because remember they live
in a cul de sac, they live in our neighborhood, essentially,
like ridiculous. Law enforcement was actually called to the commune
a few times when some of the fathers of these

(22:22):
children called for welfare checks. So like you think these
women took their children into this cult and like separated
themselves from family because they were single women, they were
divorced women, they were you know whatever, And so the
dads were like, hey, I haven't seen my kid in

(22:44):
eight months, and so they're calling for welfare checks and
they're bringing them into the community. And this happened like
kind of on a regular basis, and they were denied
access to their kids. But the wives always acted like
Stepford wives, like perfectly, we're super happy. We don't know
what they're talking about. Look how clean and well presented

(23:08):
we are. And the kids were trained to be super
well behaved and say they were happy, so nobody knew
that they were actually being abused. They were like literally
hiding in plane sight as like upscale community members with
how manicured lawns. How would they explain?

Speaker 5 (23:28):
But I guess maybe the police wouldn't be able to
get into the house that I was going to say,
How would they explain that these kids are all living
in one house, not with their people.

Speaker 3 (23:35):
They didn't know that that right, because.

Speaker 4 (23:37):
They weren't able to access them.

Speaker 3 (23:39):
Right, No, they just knock on the door, like, hey,
where's your kid? All my kids at school? The homeschool's
house over there, go visit it. The kids are great,
m h Like, no, nobody, I mean they knew, but
they couldn't, like you know, I mean there were rumors
and like things seem weird and sketchy, but what.

Speaker 5 (24:00):
Any solid evidence that they needed to like breach right
be like hello.

Speaker 3 (24:05):
Yeah, okay, So that is until Aarin. Remember our friend
Aarin who walked into the police station and told investigators
that she was a part of a cult who was
sexually abusing children. She was the catalyst for everything. So
this sparked a huge stakeout of the commune. So she

(24:27):
gave them so much information, like all of the information
about this house is this house, and this house is
this and here's the address for this, and this woman's
doing this, and this man's doing this. Whatever, here's how
we work our money. Here's how they're exploiting us. Here's
how they're abusing the children. This is what house is
taking place in. Huge So it was enough for them

(24:49):
to get arrest warrant or like search warrants for the
homes and an arrest warrant for Arvin. Oh well, so Aaron,
let me tell you about her just quickly, because she
was just like such a pivotal person. She was in
a very like unhealthy, toxic marriage, and she actually left
her husband while pregnant with her six year old daughter

(25:14):
to like reach out on her own become independent. She
got a job at a hair salon, but because the
pay was so bad, she like couldn't make ends meet.
She was struggling, Like she couldn't feed her kids. It
was such a hardship. And so she ended up meeting Carla,
who was Arvin's right hand by'all saw, and she offered

(25:39):
her like she was like, come meet my group of people, Like,
come meet my friends. We have a great opportunity for you.
We can offer you a place to stay, we can
offer you financial security. You know, all these things, and
so she did, and she ended up very quickly moving
into the commune with her daughter while pregnant. She gave

(26:01):
birth while she was pregnant. She became very slowly coerced,
so like it started out like we're giving you a
safe haven. We're going to provide you food, give you
a place, safe place to stay, a safe place for
you kids, education for your kids. And she admitted to

(26:21):
like she bought into all of it at first, and
then it was just like a situation where things just
slowly kept being brought up. And then there was like
the lesbian acts that were brought up, which was not
something that she was ever like interested in normally, but
it was just like what do I do? Like if

(26:43):
I don't do this, I don't have a home, yeah,
and they have my child and I'm pregnant and you
know what I mean. So it was just like such
a slow coercion and brainwashing, and so eventually she just
kind of bought into the entire thing and became a
part of it, and she did admit to participating in

(27:05):
like the abuse of children and like doing what they
were doing. But then at some point, for whatever reason,
she snapped out of it. The guilt became too much,
and so she fled and she decided to just turn
them all in, and so she walked into the police
station and was like, I don't care about myself, go
get these people, save these children, which was really brave

(27:29):
of her, Yeah, because the legal ramifications that she was
facing because she had criminal behavior, like she sexually abused children, Yeah,
and admitted to them and still was like, their lives
are worth it, and I don't care.

Speaker 2 (27:45):
Yeah, that's incredibly selfless.

Speaker 3 (27:49):
So brave, really truly so brave. So Aarin actually ended
up turning over photos and videos of child pornography and
assaults of children, which it was enough to get search
warrants for ten of the fourteen homes in the commune.
Two days later, on August second of nineteen ninety one,
a team of about seventy people raided the ten homes.

(28:12):
All of the children, I think there was like thirty
two in total, were taken in by Child Protective Services
and all of the occupants of the home were secured.
So like all of the adults with no injuries, they
didn't fight back. It wasn't like a violent thing. But
Arvin was nowhere. Shocking in the homes. Police found multiple guns,

(28:35):
weapons AMMO, all of which were hidden in the walls
or in secret compartments in the homes or in the floorboards.
They found multiple hiding spaces in the walls for people
to hide in. They found prescription medication totaling about fifty
thousand dollars, which they think was stolen from like hospitals

(28:59):
or urgent cares or clinics or whatever. They have no
idea how they obtained all this stuff. The children were
interviewed and they actually, this is really heartbreaking, Okay. They
spoke really openly about like the sexual acts and abuse
that they had sustained, because most of them had grown

(29:21):
up like this and they literally had no idea that
it was wrong, and so they were just like, yeah,
we have sex with our dad, oh god, yeah, we
do this with our moms and our mom's friends. Because
they didn't know that it was wrong and not normal

(29:42):
until later and someone told them this isn't normal, this
is not okay. They didn't identify as victims at all. Man,
those were so hard.

Speaker 5 (29:54):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (29:55):
Yeah. So three days after the raid, Arvin actually walked
into a police station about four hours away from Ogden,
where the commune was and turned himself in. On the
drive back to Ogden, he confessed everything to investigators. He
waved his white right to an attorney. He claimed that

(30:17):
all the sexual encounters with the children were consensual. Right, No, repeat,
that's all the sexual encounters with children were consensual.

Speaker 4 (30:27):
That's not even possible.

Speaker 3 (30:31):
He said they were all for spiritual purposes and not
for personal gratification. Lies. So he's so sick. He blamed
the children because he said that they were trying to
bond with him and they were being super seductive and
had risky behavior.

Speaker 2 (30:51):
I'm like, oh, they wouldn't know how to even do that.

Speaker 3 (30:55):
Well, they were taught to do that. They were taught
to do that. They were taught seduction, they were taught
to do risky behavior because you were a sick mother. Smashmush,
you can say that on their feet.

Speaker 2 (31:10):
The mother let it out, let it all out.

Speaker 3 (31:14):
That's not really good.

Speaker 2 (31:14):
Actually it's good.

Speaker 3 (31:18):
So Arvin who was sixty one by the way, he
was sixty one years so he looked like a grandpa.
Wait till I send you pictures. Just you wait.

Speaker 2 (31:27):
Can I make it like a dartboard or something?

Speaker 3 (31:31):
Please?

Speaker 4 (31:31):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (31:32):
I'm like literally over here.

Speaker 4 (31:33):
Stretching, like waiting to fight.

Speaker 1 (31:35):
This guy, like let me out of it. I'm sure
he got his dues and ye.

Speaker 2 (31:40):
Can't wait to hear what's up? Please give us good
news about this fucker.

Speaker 3 (31:44):
So I mean I do have good news. He confessed.
Well ish, he confessed to almost thirty counts of sexual
child abuse, which is great, okaye by Carla and the
other women also confessed, which they said Arvin asked them
to because he wanted to avoid the children from having

(32:06):
to testify in court. So noble, I actually do appreciate
because they are little children, but also like, it's too
late for you to do.

Speaker 4 (32:15):
Yeah, a little too late, dude, come on.

Speaker 2 (32:17):
Yeah right.

Speaker 3 (32:19):
So, in total, twelve people were charged with sexuals child
sexual abuse crimes. So we had Arvin, Carla, nine women,
and one man. And then they also ended up charging
two men outside of the cult because they solicited sex
from a minor. Because remember Carla trafficked her children, her

(32:40):
child and her daughter ended up remembering their names. Oh no, wow,
So she was brave and spoke yes. So Aaron was
given immunity. Aaron, our friend who came forward turned the
cult in. She was given immunity in exchange for her testimony,
I agree most of Yeah, uh, most of the children

(33:02):
were returned to their parents, which is a little upsetting. Yeah,
because a lot of so these parents claimed that they okay,
so they were a part of the Sister Council because
they were married to one man. Right, So as far
as like the lesbian acts, they admitted to being like

(33:23):
a part of that, but they denied knowing what was
happening with their children in the children's dormitory.

Speaker 1 (33:33):
Yeah, well a lot.

Speaker 2 (33:36):
Of maybe, I don't know, how would you prove it?

Speaker 5 (33:40):
Well that and I'm just wondering how many of them
were actually also like brainwashed when like.

Speaker 3 (33:46):
Well they all were brainwashed. And remember they are victims.

Speaker 4 (33:48):
They're also victims of this guy.

Speaker 3 (33:51):
And so yes, in a way, yes, yes, that's yes,
there's arguments all the way around, right, yep.

Speaker 4 (34:02):
Nothing I agree with them being getting their kids back.
I'm just saying, like there's a lot of things happening.

Speaker 3 (34:09):
Yes, okay, So Arvin and Carla, remember, yeah, the little
dynamic asshole do us. They did attempt to keep the
cult together from prison, oh god, but it eventually fell
apart in like a bunch of different separate ways. So

(34:29):
a lot of the people who were charged either took
a plea deal or will eventually found guilty. Most of
the women received about a one year sentence and then
they were released after that year, which so this is
you're talking the women who were a part of the

(34:52):
like rape in the dark kind of thing, the ones
who were in charge of the kids and teaching the
kids and abusing the kids, which is not enough, It's
not nice. So most of those women disappeared off the face,
but some of them did go on to join other

(35:12):
polygamous cults, which is why I'm like, well, don't bring
your don't give them their kids back there.

Speaker 2 (35:19):
Yeah, I know those women should not have received their
children back.

Speaker 3 (35:23):
Yeah. And I don't know the details about all that,
but whatever. So Carla was found guilty and she was
sentenced to fifteen years in prison. She was released after
nine and she apparently last day, I'm like, you know,
you know, I like to look people up because I
want to know where they are are, see if they're

(35:43):
gonna come after me. She is living somewhere with people
who are also were also a part of her sister counsel. Oh,
so other wives of Arvin birds of a feather.

Speaker 2 (35:58):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (35:58):
So Arvin pleaded guilty and he was sentenced to twenty
years to life in prison.

Speaker 1 (36:07):
On the life side, well.

Speaker 3 (36:09):
He died in prison too bad in two thousand and
nine after serving eighteen years. And he was seventy nine
years old.

Speaker 1 (36:16):
I was going to say, yeah, he was sixty one.

Speaker 3 (36:18):
Yeah, he was sixty one when he was arrested. He
was an old motherfucker.

Speaker 1 (36:22):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (36:23):
I just I just really liked that.

Speaker 2 (36:24):
I can say that for.

Speaker 4 (36:28):
I mean, you can put it on to just have
to label it exclusive.

Speaker 3 (36:35):
We say other words, but we don't say that word.
And I'm just like living my best life now. For yes,
I appreciate that killer me appreciate them. So in twenty twenty,
so just a few years ago, the victims actually came.
The victims of the Zion Society came together for the
first time in almost thirty years, and they ended up

(36:58):
meeting with the investigator, Mike King. So they explained how
difficult it was for them after the raid because they
were children, they were sent into foster care. They had
no education. Remember, because these were homeschool kids who were
only taught about porn essentially, and they were very socially stunted,

(37:19):
and they didn't receive the appropriate counseling because most of
them were returned to the brainwashed parents. Yeah, so they
were not capable of functioning in society. And they talked
about this battle and how difficult it had been for them.
So Mike King, investigator went to battle for them and

(37:40):
actually got them all free counseling thirty years later and
access to education opportunities so that they could get their
GEDs or get help obtaining scholarships and grants for continued
college education. Mike actually wrote a book which is called Deceived,

(38:02):
an Investigative Memoir of the Zion Society Cult, which I read,
and you guys, I will gift it to you and
you can give it away to your listeners if you like,
so you yep. And Mike is also the investigator that
Christie and I heard speak at Crime Con, which is
how I heard about this case. And he is awesome

(38:24):
and the episode is awesome, and I will definitely put
the link for you guys to share in your show notes.
He was lovely and it definitely intrigued me, and I
elbowed Christy and was like, oh, you know, I'm going
to learn more about this and she's like, I know
you will.

Speaker 5 (38:42):
It really was like a good guy, like he like
literally reminded me like of my dad, Like totally sweetest person.

Speaker 2 (38:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (38:50):
Yeah, and he's really dedicated his life. I mean this
happened in the nineties early nineties ninety one is when
it was debunked, and he has gone on to like
specialize in and like helping victims who have been you know,
cult abused, and he's just great, Like he's just an

(39:12):
actually cool dude who It was really neat to meet him,
and we met the people that are one of the
people that interviewed him, who was super awesome and Christy
and I really respect her a lot, Sarah Edmondson who
hosts this podcast that we saw the live show for
And anyway, it was just such a neat experience and
it intrigued me. This cult and I definitely wrote it down.

(39:35):
She knew I was going to get to it at
some point, whether it be a Patreon or whatever, and
so then when the cult thing came up, I was
like done, I got it.

Speaker 4 (39:43):
Am I remembering this wrong?

Speaker 2 (39:45):
Though?

Speaker 5 (39:45):
But didn't he say initially like he would see an
email from one of these kids and like not want
to open it at first because he did like afraid
of what might come of it.

Speaker 3 (39:57):
And yeah, so they started emailing him in twenty eighteen
and they said, listen, I am a victim of this
cult and I'm having memories and you were the lead investigator.
Can you help me piece them together? And he was like, no,
reach out to your social worker or somebody else, Like

(40:19):
he was like, I can't dig this up. This was
almost thirty years ago, Like, no, I've moved on. And
then he got another email and another email, and then
it was just like he decided that this was such
a huge part of so one hundred people's lives essentially,

(40:39):
and all of these people were reaching out to him,
and so then he met with them, he wrote a book,
he brought them all together, and then he fought for
them to get what they were owed by the State
of Utah four victims' rights advocacy and then he just
like his advocacy took off from there and he has

(41:01):
gone on I think to continue advocacy works since like
twenty twenty, Like he's going on podcasts, he's coming to
crime con he's impacted Christy and I like he's just great.

Speaker 1 (41:13):
I think that's that's amazing because not you know, he's
just one phase in it. But then he took on
a different role that nobody else actually tackled and the
advocacy of these victims who were just like, yeah, we
we put your guys, you know, we put them in jail.

Speaker 2 (41:34):
We took care of the bad guy later. Yeah, and
then yeah, like.

Speaker 3 (41:38):
We did our job. We could move on. We don't
need to do more. And I think that's kind of
where he was. And then he was like, wait a minute,
these guys are struggling and they didn't get what they
didn't get the support that they were deserved, and I
don't want that for them. And so he like even
he even said in the you that Christy and I

(42:00):
saw that he has so many pseudo daughters. Yeah, because
he has like just fallen in love with these women
and their stories and in you know, like the support
of them. He is so here for them and wants
the best for them. And it's just cool and the
book is great. You guys should read it. Yeah, some

(42:20):
find What Happens in the Woods on Instagram and they'll
give it away.

Speaker 5 (42:26):
They're listening to what happens in the word, right, now
I'll mail it to you.

Speaker 1 (42:31):
We'll plan on giving that away.

Speaker 2 (42:33):
Well, yeah, do a.

Speaker 3 (42:35):
Giveaway and yeah, cool, love that. It's a really good book,
so why not.

Speaker 2 (42:41):
Wow, that's great. I've never heard of that. I at first,
I was thinking you were going to talk about one
of the it was maybe during COVID, the a docu
series that came out about an LDS cult that was
in Utah. I thought that's what you were going for.

Speaker 3 (42:59):
No, this was in the nineteen ninety one is when
it was debunked. So it started in like the early eighties.

Speaker 2 (43:08):
God.

Speaker 3 (43:08):
Yeah, the Zion Society. Wow, I know, I've never heard
of it either. That's crazy, so very interesting.

Speaker 1 (43:19):
It's going to be hard to follow up.

Speaker 3 (43:21):
Oh you got this better?

Speaker 1 (43:27):
No, there's like yeah. I kept thinking like, oh, it's
going to get better. There's no way it could get worse.
And that's why, like I was just listening to you.

Speaker 2 (43:36):
Like, yeah, it always gets worse. Though, you know that
it always gets worse. We should know that by now.

Speaker 3 (43:44):
Crimes and Closets, guys, we tell no sweet stories.

Speaker 2 (43:50):
No, that's not true. That's not true. You guys have
all of your survivor stories that you've told badass people.

Speaker 3 (44:00):
Yes, well there's a lot of badass people in this
story too, I will say, yeah, lots of survivors, which
are awesome.

Speaker 1 (44:10):
That is awesome. I especially like the follow up with
with Mike King. Is there any chance will be on
the podcast?

Speaker 3 (44:18):
That would be amazing. We should have swarmed him at
the Crime Crime maybe yeah. Yeah, although Sarah, really, I
was gonna say, Sarah Edmondson, she's a big fan, like
we're big fans. But she knows us.

Speaker 4 (44:36):
She was writing with me on social media, like on
my dms like, oh well not mine?

Speaker 3 (44:43):
Was it con?

Speaker 5 (44:44):
I don't even remember which way it was, but anyway,
because I was telling her about my son's experience and
she was like what happened? Yeah, So that podcast is
called a little Bit cult Tea so if you guys
don't know about that, and she next, yeah she was
a part of the Next Sea and heard her husband
but it was branded and she was like a big lady,

(45:06):
the one that came out like big time about them.

Speaker 6 (45:09):
Right.

Speaker 3 (45:09):
So I will link the episode and from Crime Con
that we sat in that you can probably hear a
voice of screaming, I swear to god, I'm telling you
in the beginning. It is me and Christie one. I'm
not kidding, So I'll link I'll send you the link
for that so you can link it in the show
notes and people can listen.

Speaker 2 (45:27):
Yeah, everybody, make sure you check that out. Yeah wow, wow.
I don't know how you're gonna beat that. I don't
know how you're supposed to go behind that.

Speaker 1 (45:35):
And I paired mine down.

Speaker 3 (45:37):
So much, I think you're gonna do fine.

Speaker 1 (45:42):
All right, all right, here we go.

Speaker 3 (45:46):
I know, like brush that one off, all right.

Speaker 1 (45:51):
So I and you guys know, I chose mine very
very fast because I actually remember this one and it
was part of the Satanic panic and everything like that.
So I chose the Vampire Clan of Murray, Kentucky.

Speaker 3 (46:09):
Kentucky.

Speaker 1 (46:10):
Yeah, the weirdest place to start, but it actually happens
in Florida, because you know, we love Florida fuckery. So
today we're going to be looking at a case of
Rod Ferrell, a teen who became absolutely convinced he was
an actual vampire, and the horrific crime he committed not

(46:33):
long after drinking a New Disciples blood. So today we're
here to talk about the Vampire Clan murders.

Speaker 3 (46:41):
Wooer.

Speaker 4 (46:44):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (46:47):
So the leader or the founder of this clan, his
name was Roderick Justin Ferrell and he went by Rod Ferrell.
He was born March twenty eighth, nineteen. Rod never felt
like he fit into his hometown of Murray, Kentucky, Kentucky.

(47:08):
Just like any teenager who didn't fit in, he would
go to create on his own world to live in.
But when that fantasy meets reality, and we all know
what happens when fantasy meets reality, it usually comes crashing down.
And in this case, the harsh reality would change the
lives of five teens forever. Oh no. So. Murray, Kentucky

(47:32):
is a college town in the southwestern part of Kentucky
nearly It's near the Tennessee border, about two hours from Nashville.
It's a city proud in its history and its local
sports teams, and it's also the home of the Vampire Killers.

(47:53):
Roderick Roderick Frell grew up in Murray with his mom,
Sandra Gibbson, and who was only sixteen when she had him.
His dad was out of the picture and he only
showed up on certain occasions. Sandra, his mom, had many
relationships and over the years and even had a brief

(48:15):
second marriage, and then they moved around a lot, and
she was she had a lot of relationships, and I
don't it was talked about a lot that Sandra was.
Her parents were also ministers, and I kind of took

(48:39):
it out because it really takes a back seat. But
I also think it lends to the to the Rod's
feeling like he doesn't belong anywhere because he goes back
and forth between his mom and when she couldn't get
a job or work or she met a new man,
and like I'm not kidding, there were stories of him

(48:59):
at nine years old doing LSD and like drugs. Yeah,
dropping acid at nine years old, yeah, and and and
and doing all this. But it was alleged to that
Sandra did. Uh, that was an She was an exotic
dancer and she may have done some sex work too,

(49:20):
just to you know, get by on some things. So
she So Rod was actually introduced to the Dark Arts
by his own mother, and since it was just the
two of them, she she shared her love with the
Dark Arts with Rod, and so he got his introduction
that way, and that's where he became fascinated. The two

(49:43):
bonded over vampire movies and video games, and little did
she know just how deep Rod would take the obsession.

Speaker 2 (49:52):
When you say, dark arts, what are we talking about?
She walked around with sage dark. No, you know how
some people are then they can't even handle it? Or
was she like sacrificing chicken in the backyard.

Speaker 1 (50:08):
They can't handle the sage. That's because they're demons.

Speaker 2 (50:10):
Well, don't get me started. That's a whole separate podcast
right there.

Speaker 3 (50:16):
Just I'm here with you to start that podcast.

Speaker 2 (50:21):
You let me know, girl, Yes, the sisters. I like it.
There we go. We already got a name. Look, it's
blossoming right before.

Speaker 1 (50:32):
Mark you heard it here first. No, So she was
just very fascinated by, like I guess, the occult and
like she she dabbled in like what she thinks like
as you put it.

Speaker 2 (50:52):
Well, yeah, but it's that's the thing, like is she
is she causing harm or causing good? I guess that's
sound like I'm from the Wizard of Us right now?
Are you a good one?

Speaker 6 (51:03):
No?

Speaker 3 (51:04):
No, there's people out there that know.

Speaker 1 (51:07):
No, she just what we're talking. So another part. One
of her boyfriends was actually introduced Rod to the the
vampire Bible.

Speaker 2 (51:21):
Oh, okay, some actual like dark practices, OKAYT.

Speaker 3 (51:26):
Vampire, Well, yes, I will get to that.

Speaker 2 (51:30):
Also, LSD, guys, I mean LSD is this kid.

Speaker 1 (51:34):
I mean, starting at nine years old, he had done
a lot of hard drugs and that that leads to
a lot of things and his beliefs and his miskewed,
his misguidance and things like that.

Speaker 3 (51:45):
And his last name is feral yeah f e r.

Speaker 1 (51:50):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (51:50):
Oh well but it cannot be lost. No, his last
name was Peril right.

Speaker 1 (52:00):
No, yeah, she she introduced him to a lot of
these things that and and they shared it there. We
could do a whole hour on his mom.

Speaker 3 (52:13):
No, I don't want to know about her anymore. She
sounds terrible.

Speaker 1 (52:17):
We're gonna there are some things I have to mention
too about it.

Speaker 3 (52:20):
Okay, I'm okay with that.

Speaker 1 (52:22):
It's not I'm not going to get really into it,
but just some they were like I couldn't prove it,
like there were never actually proof of it. But there
are a lot of things that that nobody could prove.

Speaker 4 (52:34):
And it makes the story more interesting something.

Speaker 1 (52:37):
Yeah, it really does, so Rod, Like in your storybouth,
he grew up in the nineties, which I thought, was,
you know, a very fascinating time. Uh you know, they
had the Rodney King riots, the follow the Soviet Union,
but also the reunification of course, the O. J. Simpson trial,

(52:59):
and my favorite part, the birth of the Internet. Come on,
who doesn't love the birth of the Internet. The world
seemed to me, like I said, I love that, loved
that time. I thought it was amazing. But for Rod,
he thought it was chaotic and dark. And those were
his own words. So a young young Rod dug into

(53:21):
the darkness and he started experimenting, first with sex and drugs.
He started cutting himself, leaving his mom Sandra, feeling helpless,
like she you know, he started cutting himself and then
she just didn't know how to handle it, you know.
And he was even quoted as saying in one instance,
he said, he cut himself from gut to gullet. And

(53:41):
I'm sure it's not like a like a deep cut.
It was just his start of his fascination with blood
and vampirism. So like, I don't know, I don't know
why they called it dark, But even I liked Marilyn
Manton at the time, you know what I mean, I
don't really think that his he was dark, but that
was one of his Like in his interviews, he was like,

(54:02):
I was listening to music like Marilyn Manson and it
was very dark.

Speaker 4 (54:06):
It's an easy person to blame, really.

Speaker 1 (54:09):
Is, which is funny because like that dude is one
of the smartest people I've ever like in interviews, he's
done Marilyn Manson. So things slowly started taking a turn
for the worse, and I guess this is a trigger warning.
I should have started with that. But he ended up

(54:29):
killing some neighborhood cats and like he was caught and
he wasn't punished for it though, but we all know,
and we all know a lot of times Sarah killers
starting out they kill pets.

Speaker 3 (54:45):
Yeah, animal cruelty, yeah yes.

Speaker 1 (54:51):
But that's where it started to his infatuation with ritualistic
and blood, and this is where he became infatuated with vampire.
So he started to act the part. So he was
naturally slender. This kid, I mean, like if you think
of a goth kid, this is like what he is exactly.

(55:12):
He's slender. He had long, straight, dark hair, and he
was very pale like in all his pictures and without
makeup too, Like he was very pale. So when I
say he started the part, this is where he took
on and he became the vampire. So his alter ego

(55:36):
was named the Sago, and the Sago was a five
hundred year old vampire, and he actually tried to embrace
the lifestyle of being a vampire and being so young
as mind latched onto it and so deeply that he
got lost in his own world. Now, he started to

(55:57):
play a game called Vampire the Masquerade, and this is
just like a role playing game along with the same
lines as D and D. But you took on like
there were different clans in the Vampire game. And like
I said, I've never really I've heard of the game,
but I've never actually explored it.

Speaker 4 (56:18):
The vampire thing. You've heard of that one?

Speaker 1 (56:21):
Yeah, no, the Vampire the game called. The game is
called Vampire the Masquerade, and it's a role playing Yeah,
I've heard of that game because it came out at
the same time or just a little bit after D
and D. I mean, I played Dungeons and Dragons when
I was in junior high and I heard about Vampire
the Maskerade. And I remember those kids in my school

(56:43):
dressing like what we call now goth you know, the
long trench codes, the dark hair, the eyeliner, and they
would play.

Speaker 3 (56:51):
It, It's really my favorite look, now, is it really?

Speaker 2 (56:56):
I mean.

Speaker 3 (56:58):
I kind of have dark circles, cundermerise all the time,
and I keep my head down.

Speaker 1 (57:08):
So he started to embrace that lifestyle. Like I said,
he made that alter ego of Asago, but he started
believing it like he was Wassago. And the backstory for
his Wassago was he was a five hundred year old
vampire that was born in France and he lived five
hundred years ago and somehow he became reincarnated in a

(57:31):
boy from Kentucky and he he has all this explained away.

Speaker 4 (57:37):
But sin yeah, yeah, sounds sounds good.

Speaker 1 (57:43):
So he couldn't keep his interest in the dark arts
to himself, so he started telling.

Speaker 2 (57:51):
His friends he had friends.

Speaker 1 (57:53):
Yeah, he told three friends. He had three friends, Scott Anderson,
Dana Cooper, and Charity Kate. I don't know how to
say her Kessey, it's k e E s e E.
I just say Charity Casey. He would tell his friends
and after that that they then became his followers, Like
not just you know friends anymore, They actually followed him

(58:18):
and called him started calling him Visago.

Speaker 2 (58:21):
Some of the good friends. That's a good circle.

Speaker 1 (58:23):
Yeah, I mean he was I mean, like any cult leader.
He was very charismatic, like he could talk. A lot
of his interviews were very he was. He was smart, quick,
you know, with answers. And after they became his followers,
Dusk was born the vampire clan. They would each take

(58:46):
part in the initiation ritual. Of course, it took place
at the cemetery where they would drink each other's blood
and they called it crossing over. Now Rod's story was
he was sired, and that's what they called it, when
you turn, when a vampire turns a normal person, that
they would sire you. And he said he was sired

(59:07):
by a guy in England, a vampire in England, when
he went to go visit him. But there was never
any record of him actually having gone to England. So
their fantasy worlds would soon collide with the real world.
But we all know when that happens, it's never a

(59:27):
good thing, and oftentimes in the fantasy it comes crashing
down around you. See. The reality was that they lived
in the heart of rural Kentucky, right in the middle
of the nation's Bible belt and a place where a
conservative majority and a very religious population. So they all
planned to leave and head south to New Orleans. Now

(59:48):
why they picked New Orleans was because Rod said when
he left France, when Visago left France, he came to
New Orleans, to the quarter. So that's how that was chosen.

Speaker 2 (01:00:04):
I feel like he's just reliving Interview with the Vampire.

Speaker 1 (01:00:07):
That's really what it sounded like.

Speaker 2 (01:00:08):
I mean, honestly, I feel like he read Anne Rice.
She has all these wonderful vampire books, and he just
was like, this is my life now, and I am
I am this person.

Speaker 1 (01:00:21):
Yeah, yeah, it really does.

Speaker 2 (01:00:24):
It really does.

Speaker 5 (01:00:26):
Were those out then? Sorry, I don't know anything about this.
I mean I know the book.

Speaker 2 (01:00:29):
Well yeah, yeah, yeah, because what Interview with the Vampire
the movie came out. I graduated in ninety six, it
was around it has to have been around that time.
So the book was out for a lot longer before that. Yeah, okay,
nineteen ninety four, Yeah, that's when the book came out.

Speaker 3 (01:00:52):
No, that's the movie.

Speaker 6 (01:00:53):
The movie.

Speaker 1 (01:00:54):
The movie.

Speaker 2 (01:00:54):
Yeah, so the book was out way before that. Her
books have been out since the late eighties. I want
to say like a lot of her. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:01:05):
So in November of nineteen ninety six, Rod, Charity Scott,
and Dana left Murray, Kentucky and started driving south to Florida.
They drove south to Florida in order to pick up
a newcomer, and her name was Heather Wendorf. Heather and
Rod met in Eustas, Florida, a year prior when Rod

(01:01:30):
briefly moved there with his mother. Like I said, she
was everywhere, you know, she would move places to get
jobs or follow a boyfriend. And that's where that's where
they moved to Eustace and she met a man and
very briefly she moved down there and then they broke
up and she left back to Kentucky, and that's where

(01:01:52):
Rod met Heather. Heather allegedly told Rob that her dad
was mistreating her and her mom and was doing nothing
about it. Well, her dad was mistreating her and her
mom didn't do anything about it. So Rod sympathized with

(01:02:12):
her situation because he too had allegedly been abused by
his family members when he was young. So, like I said,
his grandparents were ministers and there was allegedly his grandfather
abused Rod and no sexually abused, but it was never proven.

(01:02:36):
Like I said, there was a lot of alleging, and
his sister alleged it too, Like Rod had an older
sister that wasn't really in the picture, but she alleged
it too. And then also his mom alleged that her
her dad had sexually abused her. But nothing, nothing could

(01:02:56):
be proven. So on his way to Eustace, Rod's car
began to break down. By the time they all got
to Eustace, it was totally like shot. This was just
you know, a small problem since Rod knew he knew
Heather's parents had a car and they had a Ford Explorer,

(01:03:20):
and he knew that they could just like they were.
His plan was they were just going to steal it
and then keep going on to New Orleans. So when
they arrived in Eustace, they met Heather down the road
from her house and brought her immediately you know where,
to the local cemetery, and they performed the initiation and

(01:03:43):
they crossed her over. Rod sired her into the vampire clan.
So once there they performed the ride of passage. He
Heather crossed over and was now officially a member of
the coven.

Speaker 2 (01:03:58):
Right first things first, that's right.

Speaker 1 (01:04:01):
So in order to continue on their way, Rod and
the coven needed a car. Heather offered up her parents
forward and said Rod could take the keys, which were
in her parents' bedroom. She even left the garage door
unlocked for easy access so that they could just get in. So,

(01:04:23):
of course, Rod being Rod, and it's just I wanted
to mention this first. But before arriving there, there were
reports that he did ten tabs of acid. Ten Yeah.
But see this is like he had been abusing drugs
for a long time and he never really stopped. Most
of the time he was on some form of drug

(01:04:46):
or you know, he did a lot of LSD.

Speaker 2 (01:04:51):
It's crazy.

Speaker 3 (01:04:52):
Yeah, I don't even know what that means. I mean
ten tabs. It is one abnormal for like a party.

Speaker 1 (01:05:02):
Yeah, so one tab you're gonna ride, ride for a
long time, and it's hallucinogenic and it could last up
to twelve hours. And I mean you are tripping like
what they say, you're tripping balls for a long time,
like you're going for a ride. Beth, No, like no, no, no,

(01:05:23):
but I mean like when you do when you do acid,
it it it's not just like you know, oh, we're
just gonna do it, like, no, you're there for twelve hours.

Speaker 3 (01:05:32):
And oh my gosh. Really yeah, yeah, it's he's just
doing it before it even runs out.

Speaker 1 (01:05:40):
Yeah, he just yeah, he's just dropping ten hits of acid.

Speaker 3 (01:05:44):
Oh my gosh, yeah alive.

Speaker 1 (01:05:47):
That's that was I was like. And he's only sixteen
at the time, and you're doing ten hits of acid.
I don't know many people that could even survive that.
And you know what's funny is like, and as a kid,
I would hear like, if you did more than twenty
hits of acid in your life, you would be considered
like insane, Like that's how bad it is for your brain.

Speaker 2 (01:06:11):
Wow.

Speaker 1 (01:06:13):
So Charity, Heather, and Dana drove Scott and Rod to
Heather's house and the two boys got out. They were
preparing to sneak in and steal the keys, but you know,
things never go as planned. So Rod and Scott entered
the home through the unlocked garage, and while in the
garage they were they basically came in with sticks. I

(01:06:40):
don't know why.

Speaker 2 (01:06:40):
They're probably in their head with all the acid. It
was the sword or something, right, Yeah, I'm just right, Yes.

Speaker 3 (01:06:49):
What happens in the woods. You get sticks, that's right,
the damp swords.

Speaker 2 (01:06:57):
I'm so confused. So this bitch unlocked the side door
for them to go in, when she could have just
gone into the her parents' bedroom and been like she
if she was caught, it would have been like, oh, sorry,
I needed something and I thought you had it in
here and walk out of the bedroom and it's all good.
She sends in two people that these people don't know

(01:07:20):
to invade their home on acid, like she really did. Yeah,
are these people dumb? I don't even in high school
I would have known that. Well come on now, yeah,
be cool, like, don't attract attention, don't just.

Speaker 1 (01:07:35):
You know, Rod was the leader. He's like, you know what,
we'll go in, We'll steal because yeah, I mean, if
they got caught, he said that they would just run,
you know what I mean. They were faster than her.
Just the whole interview was weird, like watching.

Speaker 2 (01:07:48):
Nobody's thinking here, nobody's thinking.

Speaker 1 (01:07:51):
So while in the garage, Rod actually thought, oh, I
got a stick in my hand. He's like, uh, maybe
I should pick up the crowbar. So he found the
crowbar in the in the garage and he brought it
in with him. Though. On November twenty fifth, nineteen ninety six,

(01:08:11):
around nine pm is when everything changed for Rod Ferrell
and his five followers. Heather Wendorf had left. She'd opened
her garage door so Rod and Scott could enter and
steal her parents' keys. This was so they could continue
their journey south to New Orleans, but things never go
as planned. The group of teens went into Heather's home

(01:08:33):
where Rod and Scott were prepared to steal Heather's parents car.
Rod and Scott made their way through Richard Wendorf and
Naomi Ruth Queen's home on the lookout for the keys.
So of course these geniuses had no idea where anything
was right, and so they're just roaming around this house

(01:08:55):
with nothing. They don't know where the hell they're going.

Speaker 2 (01:08:58):
And the girl bounced.

Speaker 1 (01:09:00):
Yeah, so they're waiting down the street, so Charity Heather.

Speaker 2 (01:09:07):
So the girls are waiting down the street.

Speaker 1 (01:09:08):
Yeah, they're waiting down the street with Scott's car. So Scott,
because they drove two cars. Yeah, so they're going down
the street and yeah, yeah, so they're waiting. All the
three girls are waiting outside down the street with Scott's car.
Rod and Scott are inside and they are fumbling through

(01:09:31):
the house looking for things, looking for the key. They're
trying to find the master bedroom to find the keys.
I know it's everywhere. So Richard Wendorf, Heather's dad, was
asleep on the couch, so they snuck around the house
looking for the parents bedroom so they could grab the
keys and run. But this was turning out to be
much more difficult than expected, and in his own words,

(01:09:52):
Rod said he was so frustrated he just snapped and
he lost full control of himself. In the interview, he
just said that he's like, I lost control. I was pissed.
I just snapped. Wendorf was asleep on the couch, and
Rod took his crowbar and hit Richard Wendorf until he
was dead. He hit him over and over until he

(01:10:15):
was dead. So he beat him in the head and
then he beat him in the chest because he saw
that he was still breathing. He then took the crowbar
and he stabbed him through the heart because he didn't
want him to get back up. So the plan was
Rod would take the father and Scott would take the

(01:10:36):
mother and take care of her. You know what I mean.
So when Scott saw this. In his interview, he said
that Scott was frozen. He goes, I just froze when
I saw Rod beat that man to death. He was
scared to death. He'd never seen anything like that, and
he'd never seen death like he never saw anyone killed

(01:11:00):
or murdered like that. I'm going to say I haven't either,
So Scott had never really even seen extreme violence. But
he was stunned. But the bloodbath inside the Windo off
Horn wasn't Windorf home wasn't over just yet. Just then,
Naomi Richard's wife walked into the room wearing a robe

(01:11:24):
and holding a cup of coffee. She had just gotten
out of the shower. That's when she saw her husband,
her husband's bloody body on the couch. In Rod's interview,
he was quoted as saying it was a real blur
at that time. She basically asked me, who are you?
And then when she saw the body, she froze. And

(01:11:48):
this was the weirdest part of the interview. He said.
I told her to run and get out of here,
or at least I thought I did. And instead, yeah,
and instead what she did I think most people would do.
She charged at him and threw the hot coffee in
his face. Yeah, So Rod takes Naomi down to the

(01:12:10):
ground and with the same crowbar that he used to
kill Richard Wendorf, he kills Naomi Ruth in the same
manner mikes so before leaving. So after that, Rod lights
a cigarette. He says this in his He lights a
cigarette and they're wondering now what to do. So they
knew it was him and they could put it together

(01:12:32):
because Rod actually went back to Richard and he burned
a V with a cigarette in his chest. And he
also put like dots around the V, five dots around
the V because to signify how many people were in
the vampire clan. And that's what he explained to them,
And you know, in his when I was watching this interview,

(01:12:52):
they're like, why did you burn the V He's like
he tried to deny it at first, and then he
was like, well, no, that's it's me. I'm Visaga, you know,
and they kind of laughed at him and they said, well,
what's the other markings? Meaning's like, because there's five of
us in the clan, so Rodden's yeah. Rod and Scott
eventually found the master bedroom. They stole a pearl necklace

(01:13:14):
and a large hunting knife, and they also, you know,
of course, found the car keys. They rushed out of
the home, drove off, and they went and picked up
the three ladies. Soon after Rod and Scott left Heather's
Heather's house, Heather's sister Jennifer came home to discover the
bloody bodies. Jennifer calls nine to one one to report

(01:13:37):
her parents dead and her fifteen year old sister Heather
is missing. Meanwhile, Rod, Scott, Heather, Charity, and Dana escape
and continue their journey to New Orleans. So to avoid detection,
they actually swapped the plates on Scott's car with the
Explorer and they heads south. That was their master plan, like,

(01:14:02):
let's just swap plates.

Speaker 2 (01:14:03):
I mean they were children also, Oh yeah, but they
were smart enough to think that, but not smart enough
for her to just go grab the car keys and go, yeah,
I they are children, because there's no logic there, I guess. Yeah,
you're right.

Speaker 1 (01:14:21):
There was lots of drugs involved.

Speaker 2 (01:14:23):
Yes, don't worried about it.

Speaker 1 (01:14:24):
The LSD, so yeah, like I don't know, like this
this speaks to it too, like if I was in trouble,
fight or flight mode, you know what I mean, Like
I would probably would have headed back to Kentucky, like
back to home. Yeah, but no, they were determined, bound
and determined to go to New Orleans m.

Speaker 3 (01:14:47):
Hm, because that's safe.

Speaker 1 (01:14:50):
Yeah. So however the trip isn't perfect of course. Can
you guys just take a guess, you know they were
pulled over? Can you can you guess how many times
they were pulled over?

Speaker 2 (01:15:06):
Oh my god? More than what.

Speaker 5 (01:15:08):
Well, I was just gonna say, I feel like we
have to like go big, go big, or go home
on this.

Speaker 4 (01:15:13):
I'm gonna say they're okay, I'm gonna go five.

Speaker 2 (01:15:19):
Seven. Christy got it five times.

Speaker 1 (01:15:23):
Five times. They were pulled over five times by police officers,
five separate times, and in his interview, Rod said, he goes, yeah,
we were pulled over five times, and they were looking
for the leader, you know, the leader, a psychopath, leader

(01:15:43):
of a klan, you know what I mean, Like he
was supposed to be this crazy guy. But he said
when they got pulled over that he just presented himself
as like a you know, respectable he he gave them
their respect, like he was like no officer, yes, officer,
you know what I mean. Like that's that's how he
that's how they way. So they were looking for some
crazy dude and he was just like, hey, y'all. They

(01:16:05):
just got the description of the car, so like you know,
they had the Ford Explorer. It didn't have the same place,
but they just pulled him over because it was a
Ford Explorer coming from the vicinity, you know, or the
direction the direction of that of the crime. Because they
put out an all points bulletin. So the teams opted

(01:16:27):
not to stay in New Orleans and they headed down
to Baton Rouge instead. That and I will say this,
this is where you could really tell that they were children.
It's because Rod knew of a video game place and
they all went to go play video games in Baton Rouge.
He really liked this arcade. I am not kidding. That
was in his interview. He's like, we ended up not

(01:16:49):
going to New Orleans when we went down to Baton
Rouge because there's a video game store that I really liked,
and like he really liked video games. So that's why
they ended up in Baton Rouge. But so this in
Baton Rouge, this is where it all started going south
for the for the clan, they were out of money,
and Charity decided. Charity Rod's girlfriend decided to call her

(01:17:12):
grandmother in South Dakota from a payphone to ask for money.
Because they were out of money and they didn't have
any they needed a place to stay, so Charity thought
her grandmother could help them. However, Charity's grandmother informed the
police about their whereabouts and helped them trick Rod and
the rest of the teens into going to a local

(01:17:33):
Howard Johnson hotel, where they were arrested by waiting law enforcement.
Because grandma, yes, grandma called and coordinated.

Speaker 3 (01:17:42):
It's like right off.

Speaker 1 (01:17:44):
Yeah, yeah, well she knew, so she coordinated with the
local Baton Rouge police to meet them at the hotel
because she's like, I'll pay for the room if you
just you know, meet, you know, go there, I'll have
it already paid for. So the four teams were held
at Baton Rouge jail for a week before being extradited

(01:18:04):
back to Florida, where they were initially booked into Lake
County Jail. They were later moved to a juvenile facility
in Ocalla. How you say that? Oc A la Okaala.
But meanwhile, at the police station, while they were waiting
their extradition. It was like the surveillance video the camera

(01:18:28):
showed Rod and Charity passionately making out in the holding cell,
like this is like their mindset. So romantic, yes, but
the events that had transpired just days and even hours
earlier didn't even seem to phase the couple. Rod's actions
and the arrest became a media sensation because they released

(01:18:49):
the video of them making out and so and also
the murders, so the cameras followed them everywhere, like when
they were being extradited back to Floyd. He became a
news sensation and they were just falling around trying to
get their footage, and it became a major news story.
And I do remember this back in the day. So

(01:19:14):
this is where Rod becomes noble, you know. And he
said he knew if any of them were caught, it
was the electric chair for them, because we all know
Florida doesn't fuck around, and you know, if you do
the crime, you're going to do the time. So he
kept the news focused on him. Rodnew if the media
was just there. Rod knew the media was just there

(01:19:34):
for the amusement and the air entertainment of all of this,
you know, the murders is bringing the people to their
news station. When he found out how sensational it was,
he was like inter he was like, Okay, they're looking
at me and not these other guys. They're not going

(01:19:54):
to look at his friends as monsters. They're going to
see him as the monster and that would help them out. So,
like I said, that whole scene reminded me of Ted Bundy,
when Ted Bundy was, you know, in front of the
cameras and he turns and he starts talking to the
cameras and he just starts talking to them. Just how
charismatic he was. Rod Ferrell was the same way. He

(01:20:17):
would look the cameras and he would tell everyone, you know,
oh this was you know, I'm the one who did this.
I'm he didn't want his friends to get caught.

Speaker 2 (01:20:26):
I mean, it's a little late. You shouldn't be killing people,
right if you don't want to get caught, right, points
for effort, that's right.

Speaker 1 (01:20:38):
It's the visago in him the French Royalty there. So
detectives honed in on Rod's four friends, trying to see
who knew what about Rod's plans to kill Naomi and
Richard Windorf. Heather insisted she didn't know anything about Rod's
plans to kill her parents and said she never wanted

(01:21:00):
them dead in the first place. Heather told investigators in
her interview, we flat out told him, don't even go
near my parents. Rod told Heather, I'm not gonna even
go near your parents. She told detectives that Rod asked
her not too long ago if she wanted her parents
dead or alive, and she told him straight out, I
want them alive. Heather apparently didn't even know her parents

(01:21:23):
were dead until they were on their way to New
Orleans after leaving Florida.

Speaker 2 (01:21:29):
Really sad.

Speaker 1 (01:21:30):
Yeah, So Heather maintained her innocence, but the other teens
were beginning to crack. Charity told detectives she knew Rod
planned on killing Richard and Naomi Wendorf, but tried telling
Rod and Scott not to go through with it. Dana
corroborated the story and Charity's interview. She corroborated the story

(01:21:52):
in Charity's interview with the police. In Dana's interview, Dana
said Rod was going to kill Heather's parents, and Dana
heard Rod say he was going to kill the parents,
and Scott just nodded. Like they were talking. Rod said
he was going to kill him, and Scott was in
the background just nodding his head and went with Rod.
Dana said that her and Charity tried to convince him

(01:22:15):
not to kill the parents, but Rod's only response was
there's no other way. So Scott Anderson in his interview,
he didn't hide his actions either. In his police interview,
he tells detectives he was going to assist Rod in
the murders of the Wendorfs. The plan was Rod was
going to go in after the father. He was going

(01:22:35):
to go after the mother, he tells detectives. After I
saw him make the first blow, he know he couldn't
do it, And in his interview he just he like
his tone changed so hard, like he was just like, yeah,
I saw it, and I couldn't do anything after that. So,
after the interviews were complete, the Vampire Cult had confessed
to the murders of Richard and Naomi Wendorf. Basically, they

(01:22:58):
just all confessed to it, so it was time to
face the charges. A grand jury decided not to charge
Heather Windorf, deciding she had no part in the planning
or the deaths of her parents. Dana Cooper and Charity
Casey both went to prison on charges of third degree murder, robbery,
robbery with a deadly weapon, and armed burglary. Charity was

(01:23:22):
released in two thousand and six and Dana was released
in twenty eleven.

Speaker 2 (01:23:28):
They never physically entered the home though, No, but they
you know, they didn't deny being part of the plan either, okay.

Speaker 1 (01:23:38):
But and also they were given like a deal. They
didn't get as much time if they like turned on row.

Speaker 3 (01:23:47):
They testified against the other guy.

Speaker 2 (01:23:49):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (01:23:51):
Scott Anderson pled guilty the first degree murder and was
sentenced to life in prison, but in twenty eighteen, a
judge lowered his sentenced to forty years. He'll get out
in twenty thirty two when he's fifty one years old.

Speaker 2 (01:24:04):
Oh no, I mean that's soon, it really is, and
that's not old.

Speaker 4 (01:24:10):
No, you don't.

Speaker 3 (01:24:13):
I don't like people that are going to be released
in my lifetime, right, it's not a gem.

Speaker 1 (01:24:19):
No. So Rod Ferrell's case went to trial and everyone
was like, oh, you're crazy dude, Like why would you
go to trial? I remember everyone, like all the legal
people were saying that. And it went to trial, and
he shocked the whole nation because he stood up and
he pleaded guilty to killing Richard and Naomi Windorf and

(01:24:41):
as well as arm burglary and robbery with a deadly weapon.
His thing was he hoped that the plea would prevent
him from getting the death penalty, and it did not.
Rod was sentenced to death. He was the youngest person
to ever be put on Floorida's death row, at the
age of eighteen. However, a Supreme Court decision that ruled

(01:25:08):
that any juvenile with the sentence with a life sentence
must be retried, so Rod would go back to court.
He had high hopes for himself and he believed he
could get out, he told Crime Maunch Daily in an
interview in twenty sixteen. And I'm like watching this, he's like,
I have high hopes. He's like, he said, I have

(01:25:30):
a house waiting for me, I have a woman, I
have a job waiting for me. I even have a
cat and a dog. M So there was a lady
in Texas that, like you know how they do, that
fell in love with Rod, and actually they got married
and so he yeah, yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:25:50):
Well she better hide those pets, right right.

Speaker 3 (01:25:54):
You've heard things Rod?

Speaker 1 (01:25:55):
Yes, So everyone can rest easy. The Wendor family included
because in April of twenty twenty, a judged re sentenced
Rod Ferrell to life in prison, calling he called the
former vampire teen killer irreparably, irreparably corrupt. Rod serves his

(01:26:21):
life sentence at the Marian Correction Institution, correctional institution, and
he's that's where he's serving out his life sentence. And
I can tell you I can safely report that he
is doing that there in the daylight, and he's not
being burned, you know, by the sunlight. He also hasn't

(01:26:41):
changed into a bat to try to escape.

Speaker 4 (01:26:45):
Are they not serving him garlic?

Speaker 1 (01:26:46):
No. He also hasn't beaten that. He hasn't bitten a
guard to like control his mind and take over the world.

Speaker 3 (01:26:53):
My lower.

Speaker 2 (01:26:56):
Okay, that's wow. Maybe the demon spelled from his body.
It was what was his name to Sago? Sagoago?

Speaker 1 (01:27:05):
I'm telling you I left so much detail out.

Speaker 3 (01:27:09):
Yeah, I believe you.

Speaker 1 (01:27:10):
Like there was a whole part about his grandparents. I
mean I could have dove into his mom alone, could
have been hours, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:27:19):
Yeah, I mean I do feel for that yeah, part
of him, but also no, no, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:27:27):
And also I mean, just like the whole dynamic. I
could have got onto the whole siring. There was like
a vampire other vampire clan war. It was yeah, there was.
It was crazy. It was crazy. Holy shit, it was
crazy like that. And then two clans, you know, they

(01:27:47):
they decided to do some you know, teaming up, and
they did other things. I was just like, what the
hell is all this?

Speaker 2 (01:27:56):
And like happening in Kentucky? Who knew? Yeah? Right right?

Speaker 1 (01:28:01):
And like I mean so Heather and Charity were both
dating Rod at the same time and one got pregnant,
and I mean, oh.

Speaker 2 (01:28:09):
Wow, you thought a lot.

Speaker 1 (01:28:10):
Yeah I did. Oh I didn't.

Speaker 4 (01:28:12):
Is there is there a documentary on this?

Speaker 1 (01:28:15):
Yeah? Oh, there's actually a movie that was made in
two thousand and two or two Twilight. No, it was
actually it was called I think it was. It was
called The Vampire Murders.

Speaker 3 (01:28:31):
M I mean, they really missed their time because I
feel like vampires became so trendy in like when the
Twilight era and the books and stuff came out, and
it's like they were just like a decade before.

Speaker 2 (01:28:46):
Yeah. Well I was telling them they.

Speaker 3 (01:28:48):
Had to go real dark and they could have been
real hot, right, yeah, but they had to go real
dark because they just like hit it as drugs.

Speaker 2 (01:28:55):
It was drugs.

Speaker 3 (01:28:56):
It was all the asset of it all.

Speaker 1 (01:28:59):
Oh yeah, and that was like the mom's many boyfriends
and her exploits. There was oh my gosh, there was
even a part where there was accusations like when Scott
or not Scott Rod and his mom were actually doing things. Yeah,

(01:29:21):
and I don't know why I didn't include it, but
after his trial and he pled guilty, she's she yelled
something in court like long lived a Sago or something like.
I know. It was the craziest shit.

Speaker 3 (01:29:34):
I was just like, Oh, so she bought into it too,
Like I said.

Speaker 1 (01:29:37):
She introduced him to like all this stuff and I,
oh my gosh, So I told Jessica I left. I
would include So Washington was actually a part of it
because the clans in Kentucky followed the Vampire Bible, which
was actually founded here just outside of Olympia, Washington and Lacey, Washington.

(01:30:00):
And it's an actual like cult, like and they had
a vampire. The Vampire Bible was here, but it's it's
nothing like you think. It was just like do good
things and you don't drink blood. But worship Satan and
all that. So it's the craziest thing.

Speaker 3 (01:30:22):
Man.

Speaker 1 (01:30:23):
I left a lot of details out, but like I said,
we could do a four hour podcast on that.

Speaker 2 (01:30:29):
Wow, maybe we're going to.

Speaker 5 (01:30:31):
Have to I know, you might have to like do
an extension, like hey guys.

Speaker 4 (01:30:36):
Remember yeah Halloween, We're going to keep on going.

Speaker 5 (01:30:39):
Wow.

Speaker 3 (01:30:40):
I have never ever ever heard of any of that. Ever.

Speaker 2 (01:30:43):
I told him it sounded like The Lost Boys. But now,
I mean, I feel like this dude's life is a movie.
Like it's such a Stephen King and Rice crossover. It's
like the crossover that you never knew you wanted to
happen between these literary, dark literary people.

Speaker 1 (01:31:06):
Oh my god, Yeah it was. There was so much
research and so many books there. The couple book. There
was a couple of books like one I read, one
I glanced through because it was, you know, very long,
but a lot of I got to see the interviews online.
Oh my gosh. That was a plethora in itself. Anyway.

Speaker 3 (01:31:29):
Well, yeah, like the court the court room stuff that
you said you watch sounds.

Speaker 1 (01:31:34):
Yeah, yeah, you know, just I think the most fascinating
part for me was like right after they got caught
and they were doing the interviews and that's where I
got most of the quotes from just of them just
like being defeated. You could see the exhaustion, you know
what I mean, them being on the run and then
finally being extra you know, Extra dieded back to Florida,

(01:31:55):
and they were just like so just exhausted, but like
you know, most of them their teens and they're like
laying on the table. But Rod was the only one
that was just like defiant. He was sitting upright all
the way to the end. Yeah, it was crazy. Body
language was awesome.

Speaker 3 (01:32:11):
But anyway, oh well, yeah, I'm glad I don't know them. Yeah, yeah,
glad I never went to high school with those.

Speaker 1 (01:32:23):
Oh man, anyway, I don't think mine even talks that
was way better than mine.

Speaker 3 (01:32:30):
But no, yours was so bananas in such a different way.

Speaker 2 (01:32:35):
I think you're speechless honestly, because I like, you kept
saying stuff and I'm like what what? Yeah?

Speaker 3 (01:32:42):
Where to interject? I was like wait, what what?

Speaker 2 (01:32:45):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (01:32:45):
What, We're just tell me more, tell me more, And
then like you can't formulate an opinion until you're just
like yeah, no, no, we're done with all of them.

Speaker 1 (01:32:56):
Yeah, you just you just have to stop me justice.

Speaker 3 (01:33:00):
I did great. Oh that was fantastic, so good. I
feel like there's so much more we need to know, right.

Speaker 4 (01:33:06):
That's why I was like, is there a documentary that
I can watch?

Speaker 3 (01:33:09):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:33:10):
Sure there are, I'm sure there is. I have heard
of this. I don't really remember any of it when
it was happening, but I have heard of it before.
I don't know. I was a good little church going girl.
We didn't we didn't delve into these things when I
was in high school, you know, but.

Speaker 3 (01:33:29):
I never heard of it for sure. I am here.

Speaker 2 (01:33:34):
Yeah, it's not too late. We're going to know all that.

Speaker 3 (01:33:37):
The Empire cult and the Zion Society.

Speaker 2 (01:33:42):
You guys brought it hard. Good wrap up to the Hewlana.

Speaker 3 (01:33:47):
Yeah, we're killers.

Speaker 2 (01:33:50):
And it is in a good way though.

Speaker 3 (01:33:52):
Not No, we don't murder people. No, we just kill
kill podcasting you killed on the money, that's right, Drop
a hot, drop a hot.

Speaker 1 (01:34:08):
All right. Well, if you guys haven't go check out
Crime and Closets their Halloween episode that drop Monday. And
until then.

Speaker 2 (01:34:22):
Yeah, I don't even know what to say. You guys
have blown my mind. Hey man, Happy Halloween and We
hope you're safe and stay out of the damn woods.
The woods hide in your closets. Bye bye bye, Thanks
for having me.

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