September 13, 2024 • 26 mins
In Which Murderer’s first official episode of Season 7, the gang covers TV Special Murders. Holly starts us off with the case of Jennifer Ann Mee, before Garry goes over the tale of Brynn Omdahl Hartman.
Listener Mel suggested this week’s topic - thanks so much!
This week there is TV series catchup with blatant spoilers, lovely listener messages which are butchered, hiccup cures are provided and there are too many N's.
Production, recording and post production completed by Holly who is spoiling every TV series ever made for Consulting Producer Craig until he agrees to edit for her.
Holly edited this week. All complaints should be sent directly to Garry while Consulting Producer Craig enjoys his Holly cancelling headphones avoiding any and all spoilers.
Big thank you to all our listeners for subscribing, leaving fantastic reviews and sending in great theme suggestions.
WE HAVE MERCH! www.whichmurderer.com - CLICK ON THE MERCHANDISE TAB FOR A LINK!
WARNING - Explicit language, content and themes (plus whatever else will cover us legally). All opinions stated are our own and case information was gathered from legitimate sources within the public realm.
Pre-recorded in Scotland
Listener Mel suggested this week’s topic - thanks so much!
This week there is TV series catchup with blatant spoilers, lovely listener messages which are butchered, hiccup cures are provided and there are too many N's.
Production, recording and post production completed by Holly who is spoiling every TV series ever made for Consulting Producer Craig until he agrees to edit for her.
Holly edited this week. All complaints should be sent directly to Garry while Consulting Producer Craig enjoys his Holly cancelling headphones avoiding any and all spoilers.
Big thank you to all our listeners for subscribing, leaving fantastic reviews and sending in great theme suggestions.
WE HAVE MERCH! www.whichmurderer.com - CLICK ON THE MERCHANDISE TAB FOR A LINK!
WARNING - Explicit language, content and themes (plus whatever else will cover us legally). All opinions stated are our own and case information was gathered from legitimate sources within the public realm.
Pre-recorded in Scotland
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:14):
The gown if you like, Hello Gary, Holy.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
It sounds so weird when you say it. Welcome back
to Which Murder everyone. This is the first official even
though we already had one episode of season seven, and
we are doing I'm just gonna get right into it
before we start chatting. We are doing. I'm so shut
it this part. What are we doing? Hold on TV
(00:46):
special murders And this was suggested by Melanie aka mel
from last season. And before I give you mail updates
or mail dates, we could call them. We got a
lovely message from nah Shit. She told me how to
pronounce her name and I just closed it. It's spelled Aoife,
(01:11):
but it's pronounced Etha. I think it's like an Irish name,
Gaelic Gallic. I don't know. Gallic and Gaelic are different, right, No?
Speaker 1 (01:22):
Same, all right?
Speaker 2 (01:23):
Anyway, she was talking about a case via Joe Rigel
or Regal and she seems quite passionate about this one,
so I think we might cover in a future episode.
But if not, go look it up. There's a show
on Discovery Plus apparently called Matriarch of Murder which goes
over the case. So yeah, check that out and thank
you EFA for your email. Let's see updates. So I
(01:46):
was away this weekend with the girls at the lodge.
Speaker 1 (01:48):
And I watched all the football that was available.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
Yes, which you might think is different because I was away,
but he does it anyway. It's absolutely nothing to do
with me. And yeah, mel is doing good. She had
a lovely time away with us, and there's nothing really
new to report. But she's as mental as ever. And yeah,
she sends her love and warm wishes and TV updates.
(02:17):
What are you.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
Watching Viking's Valhalla? I've actually just finished Is it the
second season? Yeah, so I guess wait six months for
the thought. I think the third season is getting made
just now, was it or maybe the second part of
this second season? I'm not sure.
Speaker 2 (02:37):
Oh, they do take season breaks, don't they. Yeah? I
thought you were watching the Two Towers thing or The
Towers or Power.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
Yeah, only had four episodes available, so I think you
need to wait for a few months for the rest
that came out. I'm not sure. Yeah, but I'll keep
you up with eating.
Speaker 2 (02:56):
Okay, thank you. Yes, I dipped out of that watching Spray.
What we're watching Dexter from beginning end? You were a
little devastated at one of the developments.
Speaker 1 (03:06):
Oh yeah, Beta being killed.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
Yeah. Oh sorry, spoiler. Okay, so but if you haven't
watched Exter by now it's your fault. Yeah, you had.
You had a hard time accepting Reida's.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Death, Yeah, because just you know, everything was going well
for him and that's the last thing that you would
think would happen.
Speaker 2 (03:21):
I know, and.
Speaker 1 (03:24):
Have a normal life. You know, they just they got
the house together at about that house and kids, and
that was settling in at school and you know, they
were just becoming a family, and then that happens.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
Well, when you play with serial killers, let's suck around
and find out when he fucked around and he found
out yep, yep, so helpful. Hint, don't fuck around with
serial killers. Oh, we had feedback on your voice. Everybody
said that you're like ASMR and that you have a
very soothing voice on the chatty place.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
Oki. Thank you. Yes, I'll try and.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
Keep it, maintain the standard.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
Yeah, okay, just I forget to an Elvis. I maybe
speak a wee bit fast, okay, you know, for fine
words that I can't pronounce properly that you know, some
a little bit nervous, and I'll just don't pick up
as aguolo.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
You've listened to Melani. We couldn't say anything, so you're
absolutely fine. Okay, I am going to get started. I
don't think we have any other updates, do we? No
nothing that. Oh I'm back at UNI. So I've registered
for two more courses and paid the first bit of
the tuition, which is hurting. But yeah, back at UNI.
(04:37):
That's all. There's nothing else. I've got nothing else. I'm
just tired always. Okay, I am going to talk about
somebody who maybe we don't know that well, but whatever.
Her name was Jennifer and me. She was born twentieth
of July nineteen ninety one. She was younger than all
(04:59):
of us in Saint Petersburg, Florida, and she lived with
her parents and four younger sisters, who she shared a
bedroom with, so five girls in one bedroom, no fun.
It was reported that around thirteen years old, she was
repeatedly raped for two years by two different men, and
(05:21):
by thirteen she started dealing drugs, including crack. Thirteen. I
wasn't doing anything at thirteen, let alone having a business
with crag. She suffered extreme abuse by her teenage boyfriend,
who reportedly caused her to have a miscarriage when he
punched her in the stomach. Hopefully he's dead now. She
(05:43):
was also diagnosed with Tourette syndrome, so she had a
whack of challenges in her life. On the twenty third
of January two thousand and seven, Jennifer began hiccupping and
just took a weird turn. They were relentless hiccups and painful,
and they cause chest pain, making her unable to sleep
(06:04):
and own. She could only eat soft foods, like if
you can imagine like hiccupping NonStop for ages, like every day,
all day hiccupping, that would be horrific.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
When I eat too much peanut butter, that's about how.
Speaker 2 (06:18):
Yeah, peanut butter does cause hiccups. What else does? It's
mostly peanut butter. Actually, yeah, that's when I get hiccups.
Sometimes if I eat a two new sandwich too fast,
I'll get hiccups as well. She fell into a depression,
as I think anyone would under that kind of circumstance,
and she was bullied at school, which she would probably
(06:39):
expect for somebody who hiccups all the time, and the
cute kids there accused her of faking the condition even
though she was depressed and like, couldn't sleep and stuff.
After telling her mother she was having thoughts of ending
her life, her mom contacted the media, desperate for any
help to stop her daughter's condition, stop the hiccups. Because
(07:00):
she had been to doctors, she'd been to everything, she
didn't nobody knew how to stop it. Nothing worked, so
she went to the media, supposedly to try and get
a cure from somebody out there. After the Tampa Bay
Times ran the story, it went viral. The Today Show
flew Jennifer and her mother to New York to speak
with medical experts on TV. So there's your TV special
(07:23):
tick who in the end offered absolutely no help. It
was just like a publicity thing to get ratings. Like
nothing they said was any different, and nothing helped. It
was noticed that she stopped hiccupping when speaking, so many
thought she was faking the hiccups. But I don't know.
I would need hiccups to figure out if I could speak,
(07:46):
because you can't speak quite a bit in that hiccup, right,
Maybe maybe she'd stop talking when she hadcrupped. I don't know.
Jennifer became known as Hiccup Girl. On social media. She
started enjoying the spotlight and the attention she was getting.
After five weeks of hiccups, she was supposedly cured by
(08:07):
a hypnotist. She went to hypnotherapy and was cured. That's
a like, I don't know anybody that age who could
keep that up for five weeks solid.
Speaker 1 (08:18):
I don't know why. When you were that age, it
was like a freight apparently that would could help you,
you know, kind of stop them. It's some sort of
shock or surprise, you know, instant fright apparently. But then
can I help you with the.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
It doesn't work with me. Getting frightened just makes me cry.
But if I hold my breath they go away. Yeah,
but you have to hold it till you can't breathe
anymore and literally.
Speaker 1 (08:43):
Go stop eating, stopping to stop being.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
I will never stop stop. So when the fame ended,
Jennifer was back on the streets selling drugs again and
dating an aspiring rapper named LaMonte Newton. She was also
secretly sleeping with his best friend, Laren Raefert, whom she
worked with, and she set up robbery victims by making
(09:08):
dates with them online and then he would rob them
so Jennifer was pretty messed up when she was nineteen.
In twenty ten, she spoke to twenty two year old
Shannon Griffin online and began the seduction slash robbery, and
Shannon was a boy, not a girl. After meeting up
with Shannon, Jennifer led him to the back of an
(09:29):
abandoned home where Lamont and Lauren were waiting. They had
a thirty eight caliber handgun which they used to rob
Shannon and then for some reason they shot him four times,
killing him. So this guy was hooking up online to
try and have sex with somebody and then got shot.
Police arrived at the home where all three of them lived.
(09:49):
That was only hours later, and they all admitted to
being involved. So they didn't even try and like hide it.
They were just like, yeah, we did that. Jennifer's lawyer
tried to get her a plea deal, but it didn't
seem to have worked, as in twenty thirteen, she was
found guilty of first degree murder and sentenced to life
in prison with no parole, even though she didn't pull
(10:12):
the trigger she set it up. Lauren and Lamont both
received the same sentences. Her sentence has been criticized as
unduly harsh because she didn't pull the trigger and claims
she didn't know that they were gonna kill him, which
is fair. But I think in that date there might
be that thing where if you're involved in a crime,
(10:32):
even if you don't pull the trigger, you're as guilty
as the people who pull the trigger. Yeah, but there
is a whole like justice for her kind of movement
in the area. A lot of people don't agree with
her life sentence.
Speaker 1 (10:47):
Yeah, age, I mean, she was nineteen quest I would think.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
I don't I don't know. She's certainly got a lot
of challenges that are kind of mitigating. But then again,
if she hadn't set that up, like I wouldn't have died.
I don't know. It's hard when they sentenced a nineteen
year old to be locked away for the rest of
their life, that's quite bad. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (11:10):
Yeah, but with the laws, and that's completely different over there.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
Oh yeah, the States, they don't fuck around. They either
go way too late or they go like you're gonna
die fifteen times. Like there's no ine between with the States.
Speaker 1 (11:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:23):
And I got this from Wikipedia and a New York
Post article by Larry Gueittine. I think that is what
those letters say or Gillen. It could be either, but
it was Larry and it was from the twentieth to
February twenty and sixteen.
Speaker 1 (11:40):
Awesome.
Speaker 2 (11:40):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (11:52):
Philip Edward Hartman born September twenty fourth, nineteen forty eight.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
Oh wait, I forgot to say We're back. We're back,
go ahead.
Speaker 1 (12:05):
Philip Edward Hartman born September twenty fourth, nineteen forty eight
was a Canadian born American comedian, act as, screenwriter, art
and graphic designer. Hartman was born in Brantford, Ontario, Canada,
and his family moved to the United States when he
was ten years old. After graduating from California State University
(12:30):
Northridge with a degree in graphic art, designed album covers
for bands including Poco and America.
Speaker 2 (12:40):
Oh America, I think I know a song about them.
I don't know what Polco is.
Speaker 1 (12:44):
I've never heard any of them. In nineteen seventy five,
Hartman joined the comedy group The Groundlands, where he helped
Paul Rubins develop his character Pee Wee Herman perf pee
Wee Aartman co wrote the filum Pee Wee's Big Adventure
(13:06):
and made you current appearances as Captain Carrol on Ruben's
show Peewee's Playhouse.
Speaker 2 (13:13):
Did you watch that?
Speaker 1 (13:14):
Did I say Carol correctly? The Carl Carl Carl.
Speaker 2 (13:21):
Scott people say it so weird.
Speaker 1 (13:23):
Yeah, that's one word that Scottish people find very difficult
to say, Carl, Carl Carl. In nineteen eighty six, Hartman
joined the NBC sketch comedy show Saturday Night Live, Oh
Ye as a cast member, and stayed for eight seasons
until nineteen ninety four. Nicknamed Glue for his ability to
(13:43):
hold the show together and helped other cast members, You
won a Primetime Emmy Award for his SNL work in
nineteen eighty nine. Also starred as Bill McNeil in the
sitcom News Radio Voiced Huts and Troy McClure and The Simpsons.
Speaker 2 (14:04):
I'm Troy McClure.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
Yeah, you remember me from such shows as and He
also appeared in supporting roles in the film's HouseGuest Sergeant Bilco, Jingle,
All the Way, and Small Soldiers. After two divorces, Hartman
married Brynn bomb Dahal in nineteen eighty seven. I hope
(14:27):
I've said that.
Speaker 2 (14:29):
Bryan.
Speaker 1 (14:31):
We had a discussion about this. Is it Brian, Is
it Bryn?
Speaker 2 (14:34):
I think it's Brinn.
Speaker 1 (14:35):
Drink it's brown, okay, with whom he had two children.
Their marriage was troubled due to Phil's busy work schedule
and Bryn's drug and alcohol abuse. In nineteen ninety eight,
while Phil was sleeping in his bed, Bryn shot and
killed him and later killed herself. In the week's following
(14:56):
his mother, Hartman was celebrated in a wave of tribu
Dan Sneerson of Entertainment Weekly I wrote Hartman was the
last person you'd expect to read about in lurid headlines
in your morning paper.
Speaker 2 (15:11):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:12):
A decidedly regular guy, loved by everyone he worked with.
He was post.
Speaker 2 (15:21):
Posthumously posthumously so after death.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
Yeah. Inducted into the Canada and Hollywood Walks of Fame
in twenty twelve and twenty fourteen, respectively.
Speaker 2 (15:32):
We have a Walk of Fame in Canada.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
It's probably about two feet.
Speaker 2 (15:40):
There's a lot of famous Canadians. Yeah, but they're mostly alive.
Speaker 1 (15:45):
They always seem to change the nationality.
Speaker 2 (15:48):
Yeah, that's for tax purposes, it's not in their heart.
Speaker 1 (15:51):
A bit of history. Phil Hartman was born with up
Edward Hartman with an extra n on the Hartman later
dropping it.
Speaker 2 (16:00):
It was just too many ends, just.
Speaker 1 (16:01):
Too many ends. He was the fourth of eight children,
back eight his mother Doris Margarette neee Wardell on seventeenth
of July nineteen nineteen and died April fifteen, two vision
and one, and Rupert Low Big Hartman on November eighth,
(16:25):
nineteen fourteen. Died April thirty, nineteen ninety eight. He sold
building materials. The family was Catholic.
Speaker 2 (16:33):
I was kind of saying, they've got to be Catholic
if I've got eight kids.
Speaker 1 (16:37):
Yeah, definitely. As a child, Hartman and found affection hard
to earn. I suppose I didn't get what I wanted
out of my family life, so I started seeking love
and attention elsewhere. Hartman was ten years old when his
family moved to the United States. They first lived in Lewiston, Maine,
(16:58):
then Meriden, Connecticut, and then on the West Coast, where
he attended west Chester High School and frequently acted as
a class clown.
Speaker 2 (17:08):
I can see that. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (17:10):
Yeah. After graduating, he studied art at Santa Monica City College,
dropping out in nineteen sixty nine to become a roadie
with a rock band. He returned to school in nineteen
seventy two to study graphic arts at California State University, Northridge.
(17:30):
He developed and operated his own graphic arts business, creating
more than forty album covers, as well as advertising and
the logo for the Crosby Stills in Nash.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
No Way, I Love Crosbie Stills and Nash.
Speaker 1 (17:45):
He made his first television appearance on the episode of
The Dating Game, where he won. On May twenty seventh,
nineteen ninety eight, Hartman's wife Brown, visited the Italian restaurant
book A The Beppo in Encino, California, with producer and
writer Christine Xander, who said she was in a good
(18:09):
frame of mind. They had drinks. After returning home, Brown
had a heated argument with Harmon, after which he went
to bed. She entered his bedroom sometime before three am,
and as he slept fatally shot him once between the eyes,
once in the throat, and once in the upper chest.
Speaker 2 (18:33):
So she went in a line like boom boom, boom oh.
Speaker 1 (18:38):
With a thirty eight caliber Smith and Weston Model fifteen revolver.
Hartman was forty nine years old. Brinn was taking zoloft,
had been drinking alcohol, and had recently used cocaine. Brynn
then drove to the home of her friend Ron Douglas,
(19:00):
confessed to the killing, but he didn't believe her. He
drove back to her house in separate cars, and she
called another friend and confessed a second time. A point,
seeing Hartman's body, Douglas called nine one one. At six
twenty am, police arrived and escotted Douglas and the Hartman's
(19:20):
two children from the premises, by which time Brown had
locked herself in the bedroom. Shortly afterward, she shot and
killed herself with a Faery caliber revolver. The police stated
Hartman's death was caused by a domestic discord between the couple.
A neighbor of the Hartmans told CNN reporter that the
(19:42):
couple had marital problems. Yeah, actor Steve Guttenberg. Steve said, yeah.
Said they had been a very happy couple and they
always had the appearance of being well balanced. Bryn's brother,
Gregory Omdal, build a wrongful death lawsuit in nineteen ninety
nine against both Pisa, the manufacturer of Zoloft, and his
(20:08):
sister's psychiatrist Or Falsowski, who had provided samples of the
antidepressant to bring is a later settled a lawsuit without
any admission of wrongdoing. Hartman's friend and from our SNL
colleague John Lovet's Adkhu's Hartman's News Radio Coast Andy Dick
(20:29):
of reintroducing Brinn to cocaine.
Speaker 2 (20:31):
So, Andy Dick has quite a bad reputation for memory. Yeah,
but I have to say, like how people take prescription
drugs unless, like the manufacturer isn't responsible for somebody abusing
drugs if they've got all the warnings on there about
what the side effects can be, it's up to the
doctors and the psychiatrists to really monitor that.
Speaker 1 (20:53):
I don't think that was regulated JET at the time.
I don't think. I think that's why it's settled, Okay,
outside the court and stuff.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
Yeah, I wonder how much she got.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
Yeah, Yeah, I could maybe look that up and have
that and for court you wouldn't know, No, you won't know.
It was plenty more I could have said about that.
But I know Phil Hartman from loads of things that
I've watched in the past, and especially so I married
an ex motherer did some some good lines in that.
(21:29):
He was brilliant. Yeah, but it's really sad till it
was someboday someone that good. So it's kind of so early,
I suppose, and he's prime.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
The kids were home as well, like that's horrible, Yeah,
and builth their parents die on the same day.
Speaker 1 (21:48):
I mean, apparently the main reason for or doing that
is because he held her back because she wanted a career,
you know and show business stuff, and he kept promising
that he would inta sertain and producers and directors and stuff,
and they would just laugh off whenever she brought it up.
And apparently that's you know, that kind of feeler or anger,
(22:10):
your anger, our rage and stuff over time.
Speaker 2 (22:13):
And maybe she wasn't very good and he didn't want
to embarrass her.
Speaker 1 (22:18):
Yeah, probably, I mean, maybe just don't let us sound
like a person that wouldn't help someone.
Speaker 2 (22:23):
You don't know what goes on behind closed doors, I suppose,
But yeah, it's a stupid way to die.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
There's not one person that said a bad thing about him,
so he's you know, I've got to go with the
people that know him best to.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
A certain degree. Yeah, I don't know what his two
x wives with thought of him, but yeah.
Speaker 1 (22:42):
I don't know. I don't know if he doesn't know
anything about that but I'm just from what I've read
and from his friends and stuff. Yeah, just means he's
very very likable. Guys.
Speaker 2 (22:52):
Such a shame? Is that? The end?
Speaker 1 (22:54):
The end?
Speaker 2 (22:55):
The end? Where'd you get it from?
Speaker 1 (22:58):
Most of it from Wikipedia summer from the Hollywood Reporter.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
Very good, Okay, we're back.
Speaker 1 (23:14):
Hello.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
Hello, it's raining, isn't it. I can hear it, I
can't see it.
Speaker 1 (23:18):
We need to clean more windows, I know, but yes, rain.
Speaker 2 (23:23):
Yes, it was glorious weather in Scotland, though this past
weekend it was very unseasonal, wonderful, rare, rare, you might say, rare. Right,
So how do we want to be killed? Do you
want a single shotgun to the head or do you
want to be shot four times and die? We picked
the exact same method of death. Didn't think that through.
Speaker 1 (23:44):
Well in my sleep, shot between the eyes because your
brain's not really fully connected. Yeah, so you feel it
with you?
Speaker 2 (23:56):
You probably? Well, no, you wouldn't feel it, and you
wouldn't feel the danger coming. No, Like if you're in
the backyard and all of a sudden you're there to
meet a girl and two guys come out with a gun,
you're going to be scary.
Speaker 1 (24:08):
Yeah, you know that something definitely going to happen, so
you've got that fear. Yeah, yeah, definitely go with the
being asleep and being shot.
Speaker 2 (24:17):
Okay, tweeny eyes, I think yeah. I don't know if
anybody can hear that, but our cat is screaming because
she's an old demented thing like Cleo. Right, so we
are going to go with getting shot in the head
in our sleep specifically. Thank you for listening everybody, and
go leave reviews. Go oh, we put stuff up on
(24:41):
the website has changed now, so go check out the website.
You can see a picture of Gary there. I don't
remember which one I put up, but there's one up
there of him. I think it's a good one. And yeah,
go check out all the changes. Keep your comments and
your suggestions coming in. Thank you for all of them.
The chat has been great to see on the chatty place,
(25:01):
and obviously we enjoy getting the mail in and we'll
be back next week.
Speaker 1 (25:06):
Thank you for listening.
Speaker 3 (25:08):
By Right Which Murderer is hosted by Speaker and is
recorded in a secret location in Scotland. You can find
us wherever you listen to your podcasts. Email us at
Which Murderer at gmail dot com or visit our website
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(25:29):
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The gown if you like, Hello Gary, Holy.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
It sounds so weird when you say it. Welcome back
to Which Murder everyone. This is the first official even
though we already had one episode of season seven, and
we are doing I'm just gonna get right into it
before we start chatting. We are doing. I'm so shut
it this part. What are we doing? Hold on TV
(00:46):
special murders And this was suggested by Melanie aka mel
from last season. And before I give you mail updates
or mail dates, we could call them. We got a
lovely message from nah Shit. She told me how to
pronounce her name and I just closed it. It's spelled Aoife,
(01:11):
but it's pronounced Etha. I think it's like an Irish name,
Gaelic Gallic. I don't know. Gallic and Gaelic are different, right, No?
Speaker 1 (01:22):
Same, all right?
Speaker 2 (01:23):
Anyway, she was talking about a case via Joe Rigel
or Regal and she seems quite passionate about this one,
so I think we might cover in a future episode.
But if not, go look it up. There's a show
on Discovery Plus apparently called Matriarch of Murder which goes
over the case. So yeah, check that out and thank
you EFA for your email. Let's see updates. So I
(01:46):
was away this weekend with the girls at the lodge.
Speaker 1 (01:48):
And I watched all the football that was available.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
Yes, which you might think is different because I was away,
but he does it anyway. It's absolutely nothing to do
with me. And yeah, mel is doing good. She had
a lovely time away with us, and there's nothing really
new to report. But she's as mental as ever. And yeah,
she sends her love and warm wishes and TV updates.
(02:17):
What are you.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
Watching Viking's Valhalla? I've actually just finished Is it the
second season? Yeah, so I guess wait six months for
the thought. I think the third season is getting made
just now, was it or maybe the second part of
this second season? I'm not sure.
Speaker 2 (02:37):
Oh, they do take season breaks, don't they. Yeah? I
thought you were watching the Two Towers thing or The
Towers or Power.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
Yeah, only had four episodes available, so I think you
need to wait for a few months for the rest
that came out. I'm not sure. Yeah, but I'll keep
you up with eating.
Speaker 2 (02:56):
Okay, thank you. Yes, I dipped out of that watching Spray.
What we're watching Dexter from beginning end? You were a
little devastated at one of the developments.
Speaker 1 (03:06):
Oh yeah, Beta being killed.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
Yeah. Oh sorry, spoiler. Okay, so but if you haven't
watched Exter by now it's your fault. Yeah, you had.
You had a hard time accepting Reida's.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Death, Yeah, because just you know, everything was going well
for him and that's the last thing that you would
think would happen.
Speaker 2 (03:21):
I know, and.
Speaker 1 (03:24):
Have a normal life. You know, they just they got
the house together at about that house and kids, and
that was settling in at school and you know, they
were just becoming a family, and then that happens.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
Well, when you play with serial killers, let's suck around
and find out when he fucked around and he found
out yep, yep, so helpful. Hint, don't fuck around with
serial killers. Oh, we had feedback on your voice. Everybody
said that you're like ASMR and that you have a
very soothing voice on the chatty place.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
Oki. Thank you. Yes, I'll try and.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
Keep it, maintain the standard.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
Yeah, okay, just I forget to an Elvis. I maybe
speak a wee bit fast, okay, you know, for fine
words that I can't pronounce properly that you know, some
a little bit nervous, and I'll just don't pick up
as aguolo.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
You've listened to Melani. We couldn't say anything, so you're
absolutely fine. Okay, I am going to get started. I
don't think we have any other updates, do we? No
nothing that. Oh I'm back at UNI. So I've registered
for two more courses and paid the first bit of
the tuition, which is hurting. But yeah, back at UNI.
(04:37):
That's all. There's nothing else. I've got nothing else. I'm
just tired always. Okay, I am going to talk about
somebody who maybe we don't know that well, but whatever.
Her name was Jennifer and me. She was born twentieth
of July nineteen ninety one. She was younger than all
(04:59):
of us in Saint Petersburg, Florida, and she lived with
her parents and four younger sisters, who she shared a
bedroom with, so five girls in one bedroom, no fun.
It was reported that around thirteen years old, she was
repeatedly raped for two years by two different men, and
(05:21):
by thirteen she started dealing drugs, including crack. Thirteen. I
wasn't doing anything at thirteen, let alone having a business
with crag. She suffered extreme abuse by her teenage boyfriend,
who reportedly caused her to have a miscarriage when he
punched her in the stomach. Hopefully he's dead now. She
(05:43):
was also diagnosed with Tourette syndrome, so she had a
whack of challenges in her life. On the twenty third
of January two thousand and seven, Jennifer began hiccupping and
just took a weird turn. They were relentless hiccups and painful,
and they cause chest pain, making her unable to sleep
(06:04):
and own. She could only eat soft foods, like if
you can imagine like hiccupping NonStop for ages, like every day,
all day hiccupping, that would be horrific.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
When I eat too much peanut butter, that's about how.
Speaker 2 (06:18):
Yeah, peanut butter does cause hiccups. What else does? It's
mostly peanut butter. Actually, yeah, that's when I get hiccups.
Sometimes if I eat a two new sandwich too fast,
I'll get hiccups as well. She fell into a depression,
as I think anyone would under that kind of circumstance,
and she was bullied at school, which she would probably
(06:39):
expect for somebody who hiccups all the time, and the
cute kids there accused her of faking the condition even
though she was depressed and like, couldn't sleep and stuff.
After telling her mother she was having thoughts of ending
her life, her mom contacted the media, desperate for any
help to stop her daughter's condition, stop the hiccups. Because
(07:00):
she had been to doctors, she'd been to everything, she
didn't nobody knew how to stop it. Nothing worked, so
she went to the media, supposedly to try and get
a cure from somebody out there. After the Tampa Bay
Times ran the story, it went viral. The Today Show
flew Jennifer and her mother to New York to speak
with medical experts on TV. So there's your TV special
(07:23):
tick who in the end offered absolutely no help. It
was just like a publicity thing to get ratings. Like
nothing they said was any different, and nothing helped. It
was noticed that she stopped hiccupping when speaking, so many
thought she was faking the hiccups. But I don't know.
I would need hiccups to figure out if I could speak,
(07:46):
because you can't speak quite a bit in that hiccup, right,
Maybe maybe she'd stop talking when she hadcrupped. I don't know.
Jennifer became known as Hiccup Girl. On social media. She
started enjoying the spotlight and the attention she was getting.
After five weeks of hiccups, she was supposedly cured by
(08:07):
a hypnotist. She went to hypnotherapy and was cured. That's
a like, I don't know anybody that age who could
keep that up for five weeks solid.
Speaker 1 (08:18):
I don't know why. When you were that age, it
was like a freight apparently that would could help you,
you know, kind of stop them. It's some sort of
shock or surprise, you know, instant fright apparently. But then
can I help you with the.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
It doesn't work with me. Getting frightened just makes me cry.
But if I hold my breath they go away. Yeah,
but you have to hold it till you can't breathe
anymore and literally.
Speaker 1 (08:43):
Go stop eating, stopping to stop being.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
I will never stop stop. So when the fame ended,
Jennifer was back on the streets selling drugs again and
dating an aspiring rapper named LaMonte Newton. She was also
secretly sleeping with his best friend, Laren Raefert, whom she
worked with, and she set up robbery victims by making
(09:08):
dates with them online and then he would rob them
so Jennifer was pretty messed up when she was nineteen.
In twenty ten, she spoke to twenty two year old
Shannon Griffin online and began the seduction slash robbery, and
Shannon was a boy, not a girl. After meeting up
with Shannon, Jennifer led him to the back of an
(09:29):
abandoned home where Lamont and Lauren were waiting. They had
a thirty eight caliber handgun which they used to rob
Shannon and then for some reason they shot him four times,
killing him. So this guy was hooking up online to
try and have sex with somebody and then got shot.
Police arrived at the home where all three of them lived.
(09:49):
That was only hours later, and they all admitted to
being involved. So they didn't even try and like hide it.
They were just like, yeah, we did that. Jennifer's lawyer
tried to get her a plea deal, but it didn't
seem to have worked, as in twenty thirteen, she was
found guilty of first degree murder and sentenced to life
in prison with no parole, even though she didn't pull
(10:12):
the trigger she set it up. Lauren and Lamont both
received the same sentences. Her sentence has been criticized as
unduly harsh because she didn't pull the trigger and claims
she didn't know that they were gonna kill him, which
is fair. But I think in that date there might
be that thing where if you're involved in a crime,
(10:32):
even if you don't pull the trigger, you're as guilty
as the people who pull the trigger. Yeah, but there
is a whole like justice for her kind of movement
in the area. A lot of people don't agree with
her life sentence.
Speaker 1 (10:47):
Yeah, age, I mean, she was nineteen quest I would think.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
I don't I don't know. She's certainly got a lot
of challenges that are kind of mitigating. But then again,
if she hadn't set that up, like I wouldn't have died.
I don't know. It's hard when they sentenced a nineteen
year old to be locked away for the rest of
their life, that's quite bad. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (11:10):
Yeah, but with the laws, and that's completely different over there.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
Oh yeah, the States, they don't fuck around. They either
go way too late or they go like you're gonna
die fifteen times. Like there's no ine between with the States.
Speaker 1 (11:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:23):
And I got this from Wikipedia and a New York
Post article by Larry Gueittine. I think that is what
those letters say or Gillen. It could be either, but
it was Larry and it was from the twentieth to
February twenty and sixteen.
Speaker 1 (11:40):
Awesome.
Speaker 2 (11:40):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (11:52):
Philip Edward Hartman born September twenty fourth, nineteen forty eight.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
Oh wait, I forgot to say We're back. We're back,
go ahead.
Speaker 1 (12:05):
Philip Edward Hartman born September twenty fourth, nineteen forty eight
was a Canadian born American comedian, act as, screenwriter, art
and graphic designer. Hartman was born in Brantford, Ontario, Canada,
and his family moved to the United States when he
was ten years old. After graduating from California State University
(12:30):
Northridge with a degree in graphic art, designed album covers
for bands including Poco and America.
Speaker 2 (12:40):
Oh America, I think I know a song about them.
I don't know what Polco is.
Speaker 1 (12:44):
I've never heard any of them. In nineteen seventy five,
Hartman joined the comedy group The Groundlands, where he helped
Paul Rubins develop his character Pee Wee Herman perf pee
Wee Aartman co wrote the filum Pee Wee's Big Adventure
(13:06):
and made you current appearances as Captain Carrol on Ruben's
show Peewee's Playhouse.
Speaker 2 (13:13):
Did you watch that?
Speaker 1 (13:14):
Did I say Carol correctly? The Carl Carl Carl.
Speaker 2 (13:21):
Scott people say it so weird.
Speaker 1 (13:23):
Yeah, that's one word that Scottish people find very difficult
to say, Carl, Carl Carl. In nineteen eighty six, Hartman
joined the NBC sketch comedy show Saturday Night Live, Oh
Ye as a cast member, and stayed for eight seasons
until nineteen ninety four. Nicknamed Glue for his ability to
(13:43):
hold the show together and helped other cast members, You
won a Primetime Emmy Award for his SNL work in
nineteen eighty nine. Also starred as Bill McNeil in the
sitcom News Radio Voiced Huts and Troy McClure and The Simpsons.
Speaker 2 (14:04):
I'm Troy McClure.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
Yeah, you remember me from such shows as and He
also appeared in supporting roles in the film's HouseGuest Sergeant Bilco, Jingle,
All the Way, and Small Soldiers. After two divorces, Hartman
married Brynn bomb Dahal in nineteen eighty seven. I hope
(14:27):
I've said that.
Speaker 2 (14:29):
Bryan.
Speaker 1 (14:31):
We had a discussion about this. Is it Brian, Is
it Bryn?
Speaker 2 (14:34):
I think it's Brinn.
Speaker 1 (14:35):
Drink it's brown, okay, with whom he had two children.
Their marriage was troubled due to Phil's busy work schedule
and Bryn's drug and alcohol abuse. In nineteen ninety eight,
while Phil was sleeping in his bed, Bryn shot and
killed him and later killed herself. In the week's following
(14:56):
his mother, Hartman was celebrated in a wave of tribu
Dan Sneerson of Entertainment Weekly I wrote Hartman was the
last person you'd expect to read about in lurid headlines
in your morning paper.
Speaker 2 (15:11):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:12):
A decidedly regular guy, loved by everyone he worked with.
He was post.
Speaker 2 (15:21):
Posthumously posthumously so after death.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
Yeah. Inducted into the Canada and Hollywood Walks of Fame
in twenty twelve and twenty fourteen, respectively.
Speaker 2 (15:32):
We have a Walk of Fame in Canada.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
It's probably about two feet.
Speaker 2 (15:40):
There's a lot of famous Canadians. Yeah, but they're mostly alive.
Speaker 1 (15:45):
They always seem to change the nationality.
Speaker 2 (15:48):
Yeah, that's for tax purposes, it's not in their heart.
Speaker 1 (15:51):
A bit of history. Phil Hartman was born with up
Edward Hartman with an extra n on the Hartman later
dropping it.
Speaker 2 (16:00):
It was just too many ends, just.
Speaker 1 (16:01):
Too many ends. He was the fourth of eight children,
back eight his mother Doris Margarette neee Wardell on seventeenth
of July nineteen nineteen and died April fifteen, two vision
and one, and Rupert Low Big Hartman on November eighth,
(16:25):
nineteen fourteen. Died April thirty, nineteen ninety eight. He sold
building materials. The family was Catholic.
Speaker 2 (16:33):
I was kind of saying, they've got to be Catholic
if I've got eight kids.
Speaker 1 (16:37):
Yeah, definitely. As a child, Hartman and found affection hard
to earn. I suppose I didn't get what I wanted
out of my family life, so I started seeking love
and attention elsewhere. Hartman was ten years old when his
family moved to the United States. They first lived in Lewiston, Maine,
(16:58):
then Meriden, Connecticut, and then on the West Coast, where
he attended west Chester High School and frequently acted as
a class clown.
Speaker 2 (17:08):
I can see that. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (17:10):
Yeah. After graduating, he studied art at Santa Monica City College,
dropping out in nineteen sixty nine to become a roadie
with a rock band. He returned to school in nineteen
seventy two to study graphic arts at California State University, Northridge.
(17:30):
He developed and operated his own graphic arts business, creating
more than forty album covers, as well as advertising and
the logo for the Crosby Stills in Nash.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
No Way, I Love Crosbie Stills and Nash.
Speaker 1 (17:45):
He made his first television appearance on the episode of
The Dating Game, where he won. On May twenty seventh,
nineteen ninety eight, Hartman's wife Brown, visited the Italian restaurant
book A The Beppo in Encino, California, with producer and
writer Christine Xander, who said she was in a good
(18:09):
frame of mind. They had drinks. After returning home, Brown
had a heated argument with Harmon, after which he went
to bed. She entered his bedroom sometime before three am,
and as he slept fatally shot him once between the eyes,
once in the throat, and once in the upper chest.
Speaker 2 (18:33):
So she went in a line like boom boom, boom oh.
Speaker 1 (18:38):
With a thirty eight caliber Smith and Weston Model fifteen revolver.
Hartman was forty nine years old. Brinn was taking zoloft,
had been drinking alcohol, and had recently used cocaine. Brynn
then drove to the home of her friend Ron Douglas,
(19:00):
confessed to the killing, but he didn't believe her. He
drove back to her house in separate cars, and she
called another friend and confessed a second time. A point,
seeing Hartman's body, Douglas called nine one one. At six
twenty am, police arrived and escotted Douglas and the Hartman's
(19:20):
two children from the premises, by which time Brown had
locked herself in the bedroom. Shortly afterward, she shot and
killed herself with a Faery caliber revolver. The police stated
Hartman's death was caused by a domestic discord between the couple.
A neighbor of the Hartmans told CNN reporter that the
(19:42):
couple had marital problems. Yeah, actor Steve Guttenberg. Steve said, yeah.
Said they had been a very happy couple and they
always had the appearance of being well balanced. Bryn's brother,
Gregory Omdal, build a wrongful death lawsuit in nineteen ninety
nine against both Pisa, the manufacturer of Zoloft, and his
(20:08):
sister's psychiatrist Or Falsowski, who had provided samples of the
antidepressant to bring is a later settled a lawsuit without
any admission of wrongdoing. Hartman's friend and from our SNL
colleague John Lovet's Adkhu's Hartman's News Radio Coast Andy Dick
(20:29):
of reintroducing Brinn to cocaine.
Speaker 2 (20:31):
So, Andy Dick has quite a bad reputation for memory. Yeah,
but I have to say, like how people take prescription
drugs unless, like the manufacturer isn't responsible for somebody abusing
drugs if they've got all the warnings on there about
what the side effects can be, it's up to the
doctors and the psychiatrists to really monitor that.
Speaker 1 (20:53):
I don't think that was regulated JET at the time.
I don't think. I think that's why it's settled, Okay,
outside the court and stuff.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
Yeah, I wonder how much she got.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
Yeah, Yeah, I could maybe look that up and have
that and for court you wouldn't know, No, you won't know.
It was plenty more I could have said about that.
But I know Phil Hartman from loads of things that
I've watched in the past, and especially so I married
an ex motherer did some some good lines in that.
(21:29):
He was brilliant. Yeah, but it's really sad till it
was someboday someone that good. So it's kind of so early,
I suppose, and he's prime.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
The kids were home as well, like that's horrible, Yeah,
and builth their parents die on the same day.
Speaker 1 (21:48):
I mean, apparently the main reason for or doing that
is because he held her back because she wanted a career,
you know and show business stuff, and he kept promising
that he would inta sertain and producers and directors and stuff,
and they would just laugh off whenever she brought it up.
And apparently that's you know, that kind of feeler or anger,
(22:10):
your anger, our rage and stuff over time.
Speaker 2 (22:13):
And maybe she wasn't very good and he didn't want
to embarrass her.
Speaker 1 (22:18):
Yeah, probably, I mean, maybe just don't let us sound
like a person that wouldn't help someone.
Speaker 2 (22:23):
You don't know what goes on behind closed doors, I suppose,
But yeah, it's a stupid way to die.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
There's not one person that said a bad thing about him,
so he's you know, I've got to go with the
people that know him best to.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
A certain degree. Yeah, I don't know what his two
x wives with thought of him, but yeah.
Speaker 1 (22:42):
I don't know. I don't know if he doesn't know
anything about that but I'm just from what I've read
and from his friends and stuff. Yeah, just means he's
very very likable. Guys.
Speaker 2 (22:52):
Such a shame? Is that? The end?
Speaker 1 (22:54):
The end?
Speaker 2 (22:55):
The end? Where'd you get it from?
Speaker 1 (22:58):
Most of it from Wikipedia summer from the Hollywood Reporter.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
Very good, Okay, we're back.
Speaker 1 (23:14):
Hello.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
Hello, it's raining, isn't it. I can hear it, I
can't see it.
Speaker 1 (23:18):
We need to clean more windows, I know, but yes, rain.
Speaker 2 (23:23):
Yes, it was glorious weather in Scotland, though this past
weekend it was very unseasonal, wonderful, rare, rare, you might say, rare. Right,
So how do we want to be killed? Do you
want a single shotgun to the head or do you
want to be shot four times and die? We picked
the exact same method of death. Didn't think that through.
Speaker 1 (23:44):
Well in my sleep, shot between the eyes because your
brain's not really fully connected. Yeah, so you feel it
with you?
Speaker 2 (23:56):
You probably? Well, no, you wouldn't feel it, and you
wouldn't feel the danger coming. No, Like if you're in
the backyard and all of a sudden you're there to
meet a girl and two guys come out with a gun,
you're going to be scary.
Speaker 1 (24:08):
Yeah, you know that something definitely going to happen, so
you've got that fear. Yeah, yeah, definitely go with the
being asleep and being shot.
Speaker 2 (24:17):
Okay, tweeny eyes, I think yeah. I don't know if
anybody can hear that, but our cat is screaming because
she's an old demented thing like Cleo. Right, so we
are going to go with getting shot in the head
in our sleep specifically. Thank you for listening everybody, and
go leave reviews. Go oh, we put stuff up on
(24:41):
the website has changed now, so go check out the website.
You can see a picture of Gary there. I don't
remember which one I put up, but there's one up
there of him. I think it's a good one. And yeah,
go check out all the changes. Keep your comments and
your suggestions coming in. Thank you for all of them.
The chat has been great to see on the chatty place,
(25:01):
and obviously we enjoy getting the mail in and we'll
be back next week.
Speaker 1 (25:06):
Thank you for listening.
Speaker 3 (25:08):
By Right Which Murderer is hosted by Speaker and is
recorded in a secret location in Scotland. You can find
us wherever you listen to your podcasts. Email us at
Which Murderer at gmail dot com or visit our website
at which murderer dot com. We are also on Instagram,
Reddit and Twitter. Just look for the app which Murderer
(25:29):
account or hashtag. You can join the debate on our
Facebook page and group interacting with our listeners or the
which Murderer team. Our theme music is Kill Me Again
by Blue Bend, where artwork was produced by Wild Creations
at fiver dot com
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