October 4, 2023 • 18 mins
George Noory and author Allen Greenfield discuss his research into the mysterious Black Lodge, a dark secret society that may be working behind the scenes to control the world and bring about nuclear war.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Now here's a highlight from Coast to Coast AM on iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
And welcome back to Coast to Coast George Nori with you.
Alan Greenfield has been interested in the occult UFOs, strange
animal sightings, paranormal experiences, phenomena like the Shadow People and
the Real Men in Black for most of his life.
He's been an active investigator since the early nineteen sixties
has traveled the world in search of the truth. He
(00:25):
wrote with all of Phillips the book Secrets of the
Real Black Lodge revealed Alan, welcome back to the program.
It's been a while.
Speaker 3 (00:32):
Uh yeah, but you know I've been on with you
five previous times, so I hope I have something new
to say that I certainly have a new book.
Speaker 4 (00:42):
Out, and you sure do.
Speaker 3 (00:44):
Yeah. Can I give you a little background on how
I came to get involved with this particular book.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
Well, I was going to ask you this question, give
us a little background on how you got involved in
this particular book.
Speaker 3 (00:57):
Well, for the psycond friends, that works, So maybe I
just read your mind. I wrote Secret Cipher the Euphonauts
a long time ago, and it was always intended to
be a trilogy. Well, the second book, let's just say
(01:18):
one of the darker magical organizations caused me a lot
of trouble. So the second volume was ten years later,
and both have done very well. When they're out of print,
they fetch fantastic prices, which is not something that comes
(01:40):
to me because I don't get you know, used books
don't have royalties, but at least not for me. But
I was going to do the third book of the
trilogy on the Secret Chiefs of the Third Order, which
essentially are the what they call in the East the
(02:00):
Body South Post or the good Angels or beings who
started out as human beings and who have ascended to
an exalted level so that they're not in any sense
corporeal anymore like me and me, but but who try
(02:22):
to aide humanity to attain to ascend to a higher level.
There is another group, however, unfortunately uh is always Yen
and is always yang, right. I was listening to your
Last Hour boy, Yeah, uh an astronomers certainly. UH foresaw
(02:46):
a lot of the darkness that's going on now. And
the reason I didn't write the book about the Secret Chiefs,
but rather, in consultation with my publisher, Olive who may
be on later this evening morning, whatever it is. At
the moment where you are, I realized that we live
(03:09):
in foreboding dark times, and I wanted to I really
believe that knowledge is power, and I wanted to speak
to the darker side of the occult. And that's why
the book certainly references the secret chiefs, but the high
(03:33):
level Adepts who have chosen, for lack of a better term,
the dark side of the force. Pardon me, George Lucas
need to be exposed because they were talked about in
theosophical circles and in the Chroleian circles a lot up
(03:54):
until A Brown nineteen twenty, and then it stopped being
a subject that was discussed in occult circles. I will
lead to the imagination as to why it stopped being.
All I know is I brought up the subject and
was told, well, hi, initiatives don't discuss this. So that
(04:14):
for me was you know, father, I thought, well, I
better specialize in this. So I've accumulated a lot of information,
and my publisher has accumulated a great deal as well,
and we synthesized it what I was concerned about. Though
oddly enough, was not my own fate. I mean, I'm,
you know, not over the hill, but I'm on the
(04:37):
hill and I can see where it's down. So I
don't really worry about that. Because they wanted to get me,
they would have gotten me long ago. But when my
first book, and it was, as it happens, my first
book with a real publisher, Secret Cipher, The Youth Nauts.
Speaker 4 (05:01):
And that came out in eighteen twenty eighteen.
Speaker 3 (05:04):
Well that's the current edition all of Phillips. My current publisher,
has been kind enough to reissue every single one of
my books, except one, which I begged him not to reissue,
partly because it's was co authored with someone I'm no
(05:27):
longer affiliated with. But they're all in print. But the
original edition goes back oh twenty years. Wow, heavily revised.
But you won't be seeing anything from a luminant press
anymore because shortly after the book was published, the publisher
died under mysterious circumstances. At least two of the writers
(05:51):
in his immediate entourage. You may know of Jim Keith
under mysterious circumstances, very mysterious circumstances, and there were a
number of unexplained depths, mostly of euthologists. But Jim was
(06:13):
you know, he had one foot in the militia universe
and the other foot in eufology, and he did books
on both subjects. And he made the mistake of going
to Burning Man way back. Yeah, sprained an ankle and
was dead the next day.
Speaker 4 (06:30):
From a sprained ankle.
Speaker 3 (06:32):
That's right, you know, well weird. The publisher Ron Bonds,
to whom this new book is dedicated, he went to
dinner with his wife at a Mexican restaurant here in
Atlanta and took dramatically sick and was dead before morning.
(06:57):
Now the infrace is his wife was eating the same
you know, food, and she didn't get sick, and neither
did anyone else in the restaurant, So it was a
targeted thing. Furthermore, let's assume, you know, someone gets ill
in a restaurant. You assume that it's some kind of
food poisoning.
Speaker 4 (07:16):
Absolutely that doesn't kill you that quickly.
Speaker 3 (07:19):
That that was the union syndrome, the same thing that
has happened to certain enemies of mister Putin that fall
out of windows a lot or planes, planes or yeah,
all sorts of ways to die. That are novel. He
(07:41):
seems to have a high repertoire. He must have seen
the movie I'van the Terrible sixteen Times and the Path
of the Poisoner. But we'll pass on him. It's pretty
dark times, and I wanted to inform people everything that
I know about the Black Lodge. Now, they never call
(08:03):
themselves the Black Lodge. Of course, they will lie through
their teeth. Their interest is actually in enslaving or destroying
the human race. You can call them fallen angels, you
can call them demons, you can use any terminology you want.
Speaker 4 (08:23):
Was this a place, though, Allen, that they would meet at.
Speaker 3 (08:28):
That's an interesting question that I don't really have an
answer for. They are the actual members of the Black
Lodge are ascended masters, just like the Secret Chiefs. So
they are not corporeal beings. They can manifest as corporeal
beings if they choose to, but they are on a
(08:53):
higher vibration, we'll say. But their minions, people that they
employ or they use or whatever. They gather here and there,
but not in any one fixed location. And they use
and this is part part of the reason that I
(09:15):
wrote the original book The Secret Cipher, That they use
a similar code to the one that that I decoded,
expecting it to change, which it hasn't. And in using
(09:36):
that particular code or cipher, I have become aware that
it's the perfect instrument for having great secrecy when you're
transmitting information from one one person to another. So when
they meet, they meet in small groups, and it's usually
(09:59):
built as something else, you know, a convention for the
people who are interested in angelology or demonology or whatever.
And then they disperse, and it's never all of them
at once, but they're they're worldwide, and their intention is
to either cause a nuclear conflagration which brings us back
(10:24):
to Nostrodamus and others, or to simply enslave the human
race in some way, mostly a by trickery. They don't
come out. And if this sounds like what was being
talked about the Antichrist and so forth, it is certainly
(10:45):
of the same milieu. If it's not exactly the same.
Speaker 2 (10:48):
Thing, well, since you bring up the Antichrist, what I
have discovered here and you know about this, is that
the Black Lodge of these evil magicians were featured in
a book called moon Child in nineteen twenty three, novel
by the occultist Alistair Crawley, and in that novel, the
Black Lodge was vying for the unborn child that they
(11:10):
thought was the Antichrist.
Speaker 4 (11:12):
How evil can you get?
Speaker 3 (11:15):
That's very evil? And that was when I mentioned after
World War One they stopped talking about this moon child,
which is discussed in some detail in Secrets of the
Black Lodge. Revealed the title. We we went back and
(11:35):
forth over what the title should be. So I keep
missing because there's some word missing from it. I say,
you know, it's the book on the Black Lodge by
Greenfield and Phillips, and y'all need to buy it because
it's it's it's different, it's dark, but it offers some
(11:56):
solutions to And again I say, knowledge, power and ignorance
is not bliss at all.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Can you tell us a little bit about the rogue
former FBI agent Wyndham Earl.
Speaker 4 (12:11):
Do you know much about him?
Speaker 3 (12:15):
Not too much. I mean, I'm familiar with the case,
but that's more on Olaf's side of things than mine.
We sort of each had our specialty in doing the
input for the book, and mine was, predictably enough, the
magical stuff, the occult stuff, and the UFO stuff, and
(12:37):
it overlaps. I mean I found definite overlapping. For example,
in re examining the famous, although never before now well understood,
Maury Islan case from nineteen forty seven, which is the
first modern case document in any way that the men
(12:59):
in black appear in. Also a couple of murders. It
seems to follow the black lawge around. But so that's
something that I talked about in a way that I
don't believe anyone else has ever discussed it, and that's
because I was privy to certain information about it that
(13:22):
I had never had occasion to share before. And I
don't try to go negative, but I thought that it
was time to, you know, talk about the real consequences
of investigation. I did want to say this. My great
fear in bringing out this book was not for me
(13:46):
and certainly not for the readers. It was for my publisher,
because based on what happened to Ron Bond's and Illuminat Press,
which both ceased to exist at least in you know,
in this dimension, I was concerned about my publisher, and
indeed he had horrendous things, mostly of a very personal nature,
(14:10):
happened to him during the course of the year that
we wrestled with putting this book together. So it was
a I don't know, I've never counted. I imagine I
have twelve published books in print, and I've never had
this kind of resistance and problems before.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
Interesting, Well, he's going to join us in a few minutes, Allen,
You're going to stay with us for the rest of
the show, of course, but all of it. He'll join
us after the break to talk about some of the
things that have happened to him. Is this group, the
Black Lodge members, is it still in existence? Has it
been passed down from father to son for example.
Speaker 3 (14:54):
Well, not father to son, but from initiate to initiate.
In other words, it doesn't run in families biological families,
but it does run in a certain level of initiation
where one either goes forward that becomes a secret chief,
(15:17):
or goes on to some higher state of being, some
other vibration altogether, or because some really don't want to
go any higher because it involves I don't know, ego
surrender or whatever. I mean, I'm not at that level,
so I can't judge. They choose to stay at the
(15:40):
relatively high level that they're at. But to make sure
that no one else ascends to that level. You even
see that in some of the occult organizations that are
hierarchically oriented, which is to say, they like to see
(16:02):
people in an inferior position, but they resent anyone who
might have the ability to surpass them, and they will
do anything from distracting or using the various means that
they have. Some of them around on the Internet, and
(16:23):
you would you know about them. Some of them are
trans channeled things like Ashtar, which is a Babylonian demon.
I don't know anybody would credit, you know, peace and
love coming from a Babylonian demon with any any kind
of credibility, But there are a lot of people who
(16:46):
follow that and they have just chosen. Like I said,
the dark Side. The only mentioned after Moonschild that there
has been other than a single article I did, which
this is like twenty years ago. It got shouted down
(17:06):
by the occult community. We don't talk about that stuff anymore.
Who was is? Maybe is the right way to put it.
David Lynch's The Twin Peaks, which talks very really about
the Black Lodge, and I am very interested in He
gets a autographed Deluge copy. I understand from the publisher,
(17:32):
and I'll be interested in his reaction to this, because
clearly he has inside information. He's known as a enthusiastic
transcendental meditation person and that's not my deal. But you know, potentially,
if you work with any given system, it probably can
(17:55):
be very enlightening. And that being the case, I think
that maybe David Lynch will have something to say about this.
Certainly a lot of his fans have gravitated towards this book.
I knew it would sell well if it ever got out,
but I wasn't sure that, you know, yet another publisher
(18:19):
would bite the dust or his family or something, and
I kind of warned him in advance that might be
the case. But thank god, he's still with us, and
so are his immediate entourage, and I hope it remains
that way.
Speaker 1 (18:36):
Listen to more Coast to Coast AM every weeknight at
one am Eastern, and go to Coast to coastam dot
com for more
Now here's a highlight from Coast to Coast AM on iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
And welcome back to Coast to Coast George Nori with you.
Alan Greenfield has been interested in the occult UFOs, strange
animal sightings, paranormal experiences, phenomena like the Shadow People and
the Real Men in Black for most of his life.
He's been an active investigator since the early nineteen sixties
has traveled the world in search of the truth. He
(00:25):
wrote with all of Phillips the book Secrets of the
Real Black Lodge revealed Alan, welcome back to the program.
It's been a while.
Speaker 3 (00:32):
Uh yeah, but you know I've been on with you
five previous times, so I hope I have something new
to say that I certainly have a new book.
Speaker 4 (00:42):
Out, and you sure do.
Speaker 3 (00:44):
Yeah. Can I give you a little background on how
I came to get involved with this particular book.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
Well, I was going to ask you this question, give
us a little background on how you got involved in
this particular book.
Speaker 3 (00:57):
Well, for the psycond friends, that works, So maybe I
just read your mind. I wrote Secret Cipher the Euphonauts
a long time ago, and it was always intended to
be a trilogy. Well, the second book, let's just say
(01:18):
one of the darker magical organizations caused me a lot
of trouble. So the second volume was ten years later,
and both have done very well. When they're out of print,
they fetch fantastic prices, which is not something that comes
(01:40):
to me because I don't get you know, used books
don't have royalties, but at least not for me. But
I was going to do the third book of the
trilogy on the Secret Chiefs of the Third Order, which
essentially are the what they call in the East the
(02:00):
Body South Post or the good Angels or beings who
started out as human beings and who have ascended to
an exalted level so that they're not in any sense
corporeal anymore like me and me, but but who try
(02:22):
to aide humanity to attain to ascend to a higher level.
There is another group, however, unfortunately uh is always Yen
and is always yang, right. I was listening to your
Last Hour boy, Yeah, uh an astronomers certainly. UH foresaw
(02:46):
a lot of the darkness that's going on now. And
the reason I didn't write the book about the Secret Chiefs,
but rather, in consultation with my publisher, Olive who may
be on later this evening morning, whatever it is. At
the moment where you are, I realized that we live
(03:09):
in foreboding dark times, and I wanted to I really
believe that knowledge is power, and I wanted to speak
to the darker side of the occult. And that's why
the book certainly references the secret chiefs, but the high
(03:33):
level Adepts who have chosen, for lack of a better term,
the dark side of the force. Pardon me, George Lucas
need to be exposed because they were talked about in
theosophical circles and in the Chroleian circles a lot up
(03:54):
until A Brown nineteen twenty, and then it stopped being
a subject that was discussed in occult circles. I will
lead to the imagination as to why it stopped being.
All I know is I brought up the subject and
was told, well, hi, initiatives don't discuss this. So that
(04:14):
for me was you know, father, I thought, well, I
better specialize in this. So I've accumulated a lot of information,
and my publisher has accumulated a great deal as well,
and we synthesized it what I was concerned about. Though
oddly enough, was not my own fate. I mean, I'm,
you know, not over the hill, but I'm on the
(04:37):
hill and I can see where it's down. So I
don't really worry about that. Because they wanted to get me,
they would have gotten me long ago. But when my
first book, and it was, as it happens, my first
book with a real publisher, Secret Cipher, The Youth Nauts.
Speaker 4 (05:01):
And that came out in eighteen twenty eighteen.
Speaker 3 (05:04):
Well that's the current edition all of Phillips. My current publisher,
has been kind enough to reissue every single one of
my books, except one, which I begged him not to reissue,
partly because it's was co authored with someone I'm no
(05:27):
longer affiliated with. But they're all in print. But the
original edition goes back oh twenty years. Wow, heavily revised.
But you won't be seeing anything from a luminant press
anymore because shortly after the book was published, the publisher
died under mysterious circumstances. At least two of the writers
(05:51):
in his immediate entourage. You may know of Jim Keith
under mysterious circumstances, very mysterious circumstances, and there were a
number of unexplained depths, mostly of euthologists. But Jim was
(06:13):
you know, he had one foot in the militia universe
and the other foot in eufology, and he did books
on both subjects. And he made the mistake of going
to Burning Man way back. Yeah, sprained an ankle and
was dead the next day.
Speaker 4 (06:30):
From a sprained ankle.
Speaker 3 (06:32):
That's right, you know, well weird. The publisher Ron Bonds,
to whom this new book is dedicated, he went to
dinner with his wife at a Mexican restaurant here in
Atlanta and took dramatically sick and was dead before morning.
(06:57):
Now the infrace is his wife was eating the same
you know, food, and she didn't get sick, and neither
did anyone else in the restaurant, So it was a
targeted thing. Furthermore, let's assume, you know, someone gets ill
in a restaurant. You assume that it's some kind of
food poisoning.
Speaker 4 (07:16):
Absolutely that doesn't kill you that quickly.
Speaker 3 (07:19):
That that was the union syndrome, the same thing that
has happened to certain enemies of mister Putin that fall
out of windows a lot or planes, planes or yeah,
all sorts of ways to die. That are novel. He
(07:41):
seems to have a high repertoire. He must have seen
the movie I'van the Terrible sixteen Times and the Path
of the Poisoner. But we'll pass on him. It's pretty
dark times, and I wanted to inform people everything that
I know about the Black Lodge. Now, they never call
(08:03):
themselves the Black Lodge. Of course, they will lie through
their teeth. Their interest is actually in enslaving or destroying
the human race. You can call them fallen angels, you
can call them demons, you can use any terminology you want.
Speaker 4 (08:23):
Was this a place, though, Allen, that they would meet at.
Speaker 3 (08:28):
That's an interesting question that I don't really have an
answer for. They are the actual members of the Black
Lodge are ascended masters, just like the Secret Chiefs. So
they are not corporeal beings. They can manifest as corporeal
beings if they choose to, but they are on a
(08:53):
higher vibration, we'll say. But their minions, people that they
employ or they use or whatever. They gather here and there,
but not in any one fixed location. And they use
and this is part part of the reason that I
(09:15):
wrote the original book The Secret Cipher, That they use
a similar code to the one that that I decoded,
expecting it to change, which it hasn't. And in using
(09:36):
that particular code or cipher, I have become aware that
it's the perfect instrument for having great secrecy when you're
transmitting information from one one person to another. So when
they meet, they meet in small groups, and it's usually
(09:59):
built as something else, you know, a convention for the
people who are interested in angelology or demonology or whatever.
And then they disperse, and it's never all of them
at once, but they're they're worldwide, and their intention is
to either cause a nuclear conflagration which brings us back
(10:24):
to Nostrodamus and others, or to simply enslave the human
race in some way, mostly a by trickery. They don't
come out. And if this sounds like what was being
talked about the Antichrist and so forth, it is certainly
(10:45):
of the same milieu. If it's not exactly the same.
Speaker 2 (10:48):
Thing, well, since you bring up the Antichrist, what I
have discovered here and you know about this, is that
the Black Lodge of these evil magicians were featured in
a book called moon Child in nineteen twenty three, novel
by the occultist Alistair Crawley, and in that novel, the
Black Lodge was vying for the unborn child that they
(11:10):
thought was the Antichrist.
Speaker 4 (11:12):
How evil can you get?
Speaker 3 (11:15):
That's very evil? And that was when I mentioned after
World War One they stopped talking about this moon child,
which is discussed in some detail in Secrets of the
Black Lodge. Revealed the title. We we went back and
(11:35):
forth over what the title should be. So I keep
missing because there's some word missing from it. I say,
you know, it's the book on the Black Lodge by
Greenfield and Phillips, and y'all need to buy it because
it's it's it's different, it's dark, but it offers some
(11:56):
solutions to And again I say, knowledge, power and ignorance
is not bliss at all.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Can you tell us a little bit about the rogue
former FBI agent Wyndham Earl.
Speaker 4 (12:11):
Do you know much about him?
Speaker 3 (12:15):
Not too much. I mean, I'm familiar with the case,
but that's more on Olaf's side of things than mine.
We sort of each had our specialty in doing the
input for the book, and mine was, predictably enough, the
magical stuff, the occult stuff, and the UFO stuff, and
(12:37):
it overlaps. I mean I found definite overlapping. For example,
in re examining the famous, although never before now well understood,
Maury Islan case from nineteen forty seven, which is the
first modern case document in any way that the men
(12:59):
in black appear in. Also a couple of murders. It
seems to follow the black lawge around. But so that's
something that I talked about in a way that I
don't believe anyone else has ever discussed it, and that's
because I was privy to certain information about it that
(13:22):
I had never had occasion to share before. And I
don't try to go negative, but I thought that it
was time to, you know, talk about the real consequences
of investigation. I did want to say this. My great
fear in bringing out this book was not for me
(13:46):
and certainly not for the readers. It was for my publisher,
because based on what happened to Ron Bond's and Illuminat Press,
which both ceased to exist at least in you know,
in this dimension, I was concerned about my publisher, and
indeed he had horrendous things, mostly of a very personal nature,
(14:10):
happened to him during the course of the year that
we wrestled with putting this book together. So it was
a I don't know, I've never counted. I imagine I
have twelve published books in print, and I've never had
this kind of resistance and problems before.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
Interesting, Well, he's going to join us in a few minutes, Allen,
You're going to stay with us for the rest of
the show, of course, but all of it. He'll join
us after the break to talk about some of the
things that have happened to him. Is this group, the
Black Lodge members, is it still in existence? Has it
been passed down from father to son for example.
Speaker 3 (14:54):
Well, not father to son, but from initiate to initiate.
In other words, it doesn't run in families biological families,
but it does run in a certain level of initiation
where one either goes forward that becomes a secret chief,
(15:17):
or goes on to some higher state of being, some
other vibration altogether, or because some really don't want to
go any higher because it involves I don't know, ego
surrender or whatever. I mean, I'm not at that level,
so I can't judge. They choose to stay at the
(15:40):
relatively high level that they're at. But to make sure
that no one else ascends to that level. You even
see that in some of the occult organizations that are
hierarchically oriented, which is to say, they like to see
(16:02):
people in an inferior position, but they resent anyone who
might have the ability to surpass them, and they will
do anything from distracting or using the various means that
they have. Some of them around on the Internet, and
(16:23):
you would you know about them. Some of them are
trans channeled things like Ashtar, which is a Babylonian demon.
I don't know anybody would credit, you know, peace and
love coming from a Babylonian demon with any any kind
of credibility, But there are a lot of people who
(16:46):
follow that and they have just chosen. Like I said,
the dark Side. The only mentioned after Moonschild that there
has been other than a single article I did, which
this is like twenty years ago. It got shouted down
(17:06):
by the occult community. We don't talk about that stuff anymore.
Who was is? Maybe is the right way to put it.
David Lynch's The Twin Peaks, which talks very really about
the Black Lodge, and I am very interested in He
gets a autographed Deluge copy. I understand from the publisher,
(17:32):
and I'll be interested in his reaction to this, because
clearly he has inside information. He's known as a enthusiastic
transcendental meditation person and that's not my deal. But you know, potentially,
if you work with any given system, it probably can
(17:55):
be very enlightening. And that being the case, I think
that maybe David Lynch will have something to say about this.
Certainly a lot of his fans have gravitated towards this book.
I knew it would sell well if it ever got out,
but I wasn't sure that, you know, yet another publisher
(18:19):
would bite the dust or his family or something, and
I kind of warned him in advance that might be
the case. But thank god, he's still with us, and
so are his immediate entourage, and I hope it remains
that way.
Speaker 1 (18:36):
Listen to more Coast to Coast AM every weeknight at
one am Eastern, and go to Coast to coastam dot
com for more
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Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.