The Modern Pain Podcast

Most chronic pain care ignores one of the most powerful drivers of symptoms: our emotions.

In this episode, I sit down with Dr. Mark Lumley, a leading researcher in Emotional Awareness and Expression Therapy (EAET), to explore how unprocessed emotions, trauma, and life stressors can directly influence pain — and what to do about it.

We break down:
-The differences and overlaps between EAET and Pain Reprocessin...

Are you tired of surface-level solutions in pain care? In this episode, Mark Kargela pulls back the curtain on the massive gap in pain programming and why our current clinical education models are failing both patients and providers.

Mark introduces the Pain Practice OS—a structured, mentored, and market-ready program to help clinicians finally deliver meaningful, psychologically informed care.

Whether you’re a ph...

As AI continues to evolve and integrate into more areas of healthcare, many clinicians are asking: will we be replaced? In this episode, Mark Kargela and Ben Whybrow have a frank conversation about how AI is affecting clinical work, what it can (and can’t) do well, and why the human elements of care—empathy, presence, collaboration—remain irreplaceable.

You’ll hear how we’re using AI tools like ChatGPT in our content creat...

Many patients are doing something about their pain—but they’re still not living the life they want.


In this episode of The Modern Pain Podcast, Dr. Mark Kargela breaks down how to help patients zoom out and reflect on whether their care is truly moving them toward what matters most—or just keeping them stuck in a cycle of appointments and short-term relief.


You’ll learn:

✅ Why “the m...

Are you battling self-doubt and endless distractions that keep you from creating something that matters? You’re not alone.

In this episode of the Modern Pain Podcast, I share how I spent six months fighting my own inner critic and finally took action on a project I deeply care about.

We’ll talk about:
✅ Why even experienced clinicians feel like imposters sometimes
✅ The small, practical steps that helped m...

Pain Practice OS Waiting List 

Matt Erb returns to the show for an insightful and wide-ranging conversation on the future of physical therapy. We cover the limitations of the biopsychosocial model, practical mindbody strategies, billing within the system, trauma-informed care, and how clinicians can advocate for real change—both in their practice and the communities they serve.

📃 Article - Advancing Physiotherapy in Mental Heal...

In this episode, I sit down with Ben Whybrow, a pain specialist physio in the UK and new community manager for Modern Pain Care, to discuss the critical role of communication in modern healthcare. We break down why the traditional, paternalistic approach to patient interaction falls short and explore how guided discovery can lead to better outcomes for people in pain. If you’re a clinician looking to improve your communication skil...

In this episode, I sit down with Cameron Faller, co-founder of the Institute of Contextual Health, to discuss the future of healthcare. We explore the challenges of traditional, siloed care models and why a more interconnected, person-centered approach is essential for better patient outcomes. Cameron shares insights on process-based care, complexity science, the role of EMRs, and the potential for AI to revolutionize the patient e...

In today’s episode, we tackle one of the biggest tensions modern clinicians face:

How do you keep your schedule full and patients engaged without fear-mongering or overselling?

I share how to reframe “sales” from manipulation to alignment, why selling your services is an ethical obligation, and how to transition from just treating pain to guiding patients toward long-term health and resilience.

If you’ve ...

What if more treatment isn’t the answer?

In this episode, we explore Creative Hopelessness—an ACT-based exercise that helps patients with persistent pain reflect on the real impact of their symptom management strategies.

You’ll learn how to guide patients to see their patterns, validate their efforts, and gently open the door to a new, values-based direction.

👇 Download the FREE clinician guide to walk t...

🎙️ Have you ever treated someone with what seemed like a typical MSK problem—but the pain just didn’t add up? Burning, zinging, unpredictable symptoms? In this episode, Mark Kargela breaks down the clinical presentation of neuropathic pain, how to screen for it confidently, and 4 common mistakes that lead to missed diagnoses.

✅ Learn how to distinguish neuropathic from nociceptive and nociplastic pain
✅ Use simple too...

🎙️ Is whiplash just a musculoskeletal issue—or are we missing something bigger?

In this episode, we talk with Dr. Annina Schmid and Dr. Joel Fundaun—two of the world’s leading researchers on nerve involvement in whiplash. They reveal the surprising evidence from recent studies showing that many patients with Grade II whiplash have signs of neuropathic pain, nerve inflammation, and sensory loss—and they share simple ways f...

🎙️ In this episode of The Modern Pain Podcast, Mark Kargela chats with Tom Walters, DPT—founder of Rehab Science, educator, and digital health innovator.

Tom shares how he transitioned from a traditional orthopedic physical therapist to building a global online brand helping millions through coaching, education, and his bestselling book. We dive into:

✅ Why coaching and education may be more impactful than hands-...

🚨 In this episode of The Modern Pain Podcast, Mark Kargela interviews Sandy Hilton, a pioneering physical therapist and expert in pelvic health and pain care. 🚨

Sandy shares her fascinating journey from treating loggers in Oregon to leading change in pelvic health and pain management globally. We discuss why pain care is falling behind, the massive issues with the modified Oswestry assessment, and why treating pain with pain ...

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Amy's First Episode 

✅ Ever battled with chronic pain or long COVID symptoms? Discover Amy Eicher's remarkable journey from being dismissed and misdiagnosed to becoming her own best advocate. In this episode of the Modern Pain Podcast, Amy shares her personal story of dealing with chronic pain, understanding long COVID, and navigating the intricacies of the healthcare system. Ex...

In this episode of the Modern Pain Podcast, host Mark Kargela challenges clinicians to rethink their approach to pain treatment. He discusses how the pursuit of certainty can lead practitioners to rely too heavily on specific tools, neglecting the complexity and individual nature of pain. Using the parable of the blind men and the elephant, he illustrates the pitfalls of mistaking partial perspectives for the whole truth. Mark advo...

In this episode of the Modern Pain Podcast, host Mark Kargela discusses the evolution of pain treatment from a solely biomechanical model to a more holistic biopsychosocial approach. Initially rooted in biomechanics, Mark shares his journey of realizing the limitations of this model and the rise of psychologically informed care. He emphasizes the importance of integrating both biomechanics and psychological strategies for effective...

In this episode of the Modern Pain Podcast, join Mark Kargela as he discusses the challenges in pain care and the gaps in clinician education. Discover how to provide psychologically informed care and learn about a new comprehensive community-based program designed to empower clinicians as pain management leaders. Mark shares insights on the need for a paradigm shift from quick fixes to lasting, meaningful change and invites you to...

In this episode of the Modern Pain Podcast, host Mark Kargela sits down with Jim Stark, an insightful and experienced physical therapist with over 30 years in the field. Jim discusses the limitations of our current 'illness care system' and shares his journey of integrating holistic and spiritual approaches into physical therapy, focusing on chronic and persistent pain. Learn about the importance of being authentic, the c...