October 31, 2012 • 32 mins
Ever reach out to the spirit world with an ouija board? Or stare into a dark mirror for Bloody Mary? Perhaps peer-assisted levitation was more your style. In this episode, Robert and Julie bust through the fantasy of these paranormal parlor tricks and examine the underlying science.
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Speaker 1 (00:03):
Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind from how Stuff
Works dot com. Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind.
My name is Robert lamp and I'm Julie Douglas. In
today's episode, we would like you to take you to
a slumber party. All right, So go back to your roots,
go back to your your childhood memories if you have them,
(00:24):
of a slumber party, you know, dressing your long pajamas,
huddle around the floor and and start thinking long and
hard about the occult in the supernatural world and who
you are going to pick to put their hand in
a bowl of water when they fall asleep. Oh yeah, yeah,
that old trick. I have heard that one. Or there's
(00:46):
the putting the food cream in the hand or the
shaving cream in the hand, and then tickle the nose
and then and then want wont even cream on the head?
The the amusing thing. When we were talking about this
episode and getting things together for you have some legitimate
slumber party memories and some anecdotes about horsing grounds with
a lot of this stuff. But I don't think I
ever did any of this stuff. I can only think
(01:08):
of a like a few like a handful of slumber
party type things that I went to. And I don't
even think we call it. You call them slumber parties
necessarily if it's little boys, I feel like they were
just like sleepovers or something. And and I think we
just basically played a lot of video games. And I
remember once, uh, the kid whose house it was, he
(01:29):
was grounded because he ran through the house naked, and
like that was the extent of the excitement. All right, Well,
I don't want to get off on a tangent already
before we've started the podcast, because obviously we're gonna cover
some of these slumber party hijinks of our youth and
talk about the science behind them of what seemed like
it could be possible or not possible. But I wanted
to point that out, the gender difference. I wonder if
(01:51):
the obsession with the occult has something to do with UM. Well,
not I'm not saying all kids girls are witches the
inherent evil of of the male set exactly, That's what
I meant to say. But I wonder if that has
some sort of root in um interest in this, because
there was a sort of, if you look at it,
at least historically, a power in invocating things and looking
(02:14):
towards the dark arts well for power as opposed to
actually having a lot of power in your life, and
I'm thinking's sixteen hundred years. Yeah. Well, one thing that
definitely comes to mind is that a lot of these
games kind of remind us of ice breakers, and they
are they're they're forcing people to interact with each other.
It's more of a communal, open experience, and by and large,
(02:36):
it seems like females are often more inclined to that
than the males when they're in their individual groups. For instance,
when I think of j Ju Saana, which is here
in Atlanta, this koree in Sanna that a lot of
people go to, and it's really cool, but they divide
you into into sexes for part of it. There's the
men sauna and the women sauna, and so I only
(02:56):
know what goes on in the men sana obviously, so
I'll my wife it's like, well, what's it like in
the in the women's son and it's like, well, there's
a lot of talking. There's a lot of women within
their own group talking without each other, and then you
may meet other women that are in the that side
of the sauna, whereas on the men's side, it's completely different.
It's just like a bunch of naked dudes staring at
the at the tiles. You know, there's not really any
(03:18):
talking going on. And granted that's a little different than
a childhood slumber party. But but but I can see where.
I mean, guys are just gonna they're not gonna be
as as open to say, doing light as a finger.
Stiff as a board. Well, I don't know. I think
that next time you go that you should bring Auji
board in with you to the sauna and see if
(03:38):
you can strike up some conversations. Yeah, yeah, maybe so,
maybe so. Yeah. Alright, so you have mentioned, uh, let
his feather stiff as board, which is something known as
party levitation. Yes, this was apparently made famous by the
film The Craft, which I think I saw, but I
only remember that actress Faruza Bach was in it and
(03:58):
she's all Gothian. You know that. That's my full experience
with that film. Well, here's a setup. Okay, you've got
your sleepover, and this is a a sleepover staple, by
the way, party levitation. So imagine four nine pound girls
who are all arranged around their friend and she's laying
on her back on the floor, okay, And they all
(04:20):
get just one finger, each finger from each chant under her.
And then they are going to lift up this nine
pound girl just using their index fingers. So inevit believe
they try. They're like, all right, let's lift her using
our fingers. And nothing happens. Right, It's just a bunch
of people lifting up on their fingers, tickling the person
a little bit, and it's it's hilarious, but nothing happens. Yeah,
(04:42):
and then someone says, hey, let's let's hearken back to
our Wiccan ancestors and and uh repeat a chant that
may give us the power, supernatural power, supernatural strength to
lift her. And so they chant four times, as though
they are now a coven of witches casting their spell.
And they chant light as a feather stiff as a board.
(05:04):
Light is a feather stiff as a board, Light as
a feather stiff as a board. And on the fourth one,
miraculously they levitate their friend. Well, they don't quite levitate her,
but they lily in the proper environment, with the proper expectations,
can certainly seem like an amazing levitation experience. And that's
(05:24):
the one of the key things to realize here. First
of all, visualized experience. Never we've touched on this before,
but never discount the power of a little ritual and
a thing because it can It changes your perception about
what is happening, in your expectations about what will happen. Likewise,
concerted effort light is a finger stiff in the board
is kind of a on account of three type of deal.
(05:46):
On account of three, we're all going to do this
at once, as opposed to girls randomly moving their fingers
up and down and not picking someone up off the
off the floor. Yeah, you're right, you're synchronizing with that,
which is really important. We've talked about that too in
terms of a sort of ritual that you do as
a group, because you're also synchronizing the neurons that are
firing in your brain. Yeah, whether you're getting geared up
(06:07):
to run through a run, to walk across some hot coals,
or you're in church singing hymn. Yeah. And Dr Carl
krislin Nikki of Australia's ABC Science has said that that's
really important, this this chanting, this ritualized portion of it
and sinking up. But not only that, as you say,
the memory of it, because he's saying that if you
look at any clip on YouTube, you will see that
(06:31):
what is happening is that um, once they sink up
and once they do the chanting, that yes and d
they do lift their friend, but it's really only a
couple of inches. And the friends about the fall and
it's not quite the success that they think it is
in their minds when when they're talking about it in
the clips, they're like, whoa, we actually really lifted for
a very high. Yeah, but you're ten years old, you're
(06:52):
full of sugar, it's late at night. The perception is
gonna be a little different, right, And I have to
say to you that when I did it and sleepover
before that, when I take out that memory and I
examine it, I did think that, you know, I was
really lifting my friend very high. Were you yourself levitated
or were you one of the levitator? I was one
of the levitators because I really, like, you know, I
(07:12):
was obsessed with the occult at that age, by the way,
and not just the occult, like I would spend my
weekends trying to hypnotize myself and I had books on it,
and so these we were huge mysteries to me, and
I put a lot of effort into it. So if
someone was gonna be you know, levitated, I was going
to be in that group to help them with the power.
We'll see, and this is we'll discuss this a little
more in a minute, but I feel like I was.
(07:33):
I was always fascinated with the occult as well, um,
you know, and I would buy like I had a
copy of that the fake Necronomicon. I had a copy
of the the Satanic Bible. I mean, you know, in
anything like that. That was just kind of you know, who,
this is spooky and kind of you know, like I
would get into it. But then I was always reluctant
to cross a certain line. I was maybe not terrified,
(07:55):
but I was reluctant to cross that line where something
might actually happen. See, I would have gone like Willow
Evil Willow instantly. I was a big participant in that. Um.
I want to also mentioned that doctor chrisal Nikki talks
about the third and last factor being the strength in
our fingers and that we just underestimate them. Yeah, I
(08:18):
mean it looks like nothing. And certainly if you haven't
had the broken finger, you've seen someone who has and
you get that in your mind instantly. I mean, you're
there are so many opportunities to to damage your digits
in the course of the day, so you're you're very
conscious of that. But in reality, they're they're pretty rugged
and there they can hold a lot of strength. I mean,
there are examples of famous strong men who were able
(08:39):
to do some amazing feats with just a finger or two. Uh.
There was a Louis Sear, the old time French Canadian strongman,
who could allegedly lift five hundred and fifty three pounds
with a single finger. He'd uses his right middle, by
the way, and um. Then there was an American strongman
by the name of Warren Lincoln Travis and uh he
(09:01):
allegedly lifted five hundred sixty pounds on its fiftieth birthday
with a single finger. I'm not sure which one it was.
I love to imagine that both of them had magnificently
curled mustaches. Yes, when I was recently I started looking
through some of these pictures of these guys, and you know,
there's a lot of cool facial hair, a lot of
those old timey what do you call it, like a
wrestler wears single. It sounds right, sounds Occasionally old timey
(09:26):
nude photo would pop up every I think it was
maybe Louis here, the French Canadian guy. I was like, oh,
that's a little much Louie. Thanks Loe, But yeah, go
look some of those little guys up if you get
a chance. It's it's pretty amusing. But I think the
really cool things that are going on here is again memory,
which we've talked about it. We've talked about this. There's
(09:47):
reserve of strength in our bodies. Yes, that we can
you know, hit the potential sometimes and not even realize
and not realizing thinking we're more fragile than we are,
which is something we saw with with walking on hot coals.
We talked about you see the coals, you see fire,
You think, no way am I gonna walk on that.
If I walk on that, I'm going to burn. But
as we discussed in that episode, if things are under
(10:07):
the right conditions, it's very doable. And this is something
that's very doable, and you've got the group psychology element
to it as well. Um. Another good staple of a
slumber party is of course the wegi board. Yes, with
one of the most mysterious spellings of of of all time.
Of course, that is O, U, I J A. I
think there's only a handful of people on earth who
(10:29):
remember that in any given moment um. Anytime I search
for it, I'm like typing in all sorts of weird
combinations of letters. But this is, of course, a board
looks more or less like a like a board game board. Right. Uh,
you unfolded and you have has a number of letters
spread out across it, and some numbers and a yes
and a no, and maybe and U. It actually was
(10:55):
a board game that came into vogue around ninety at
least in the United's dates. And it was a parlor
game and it was sold in novelty shops. Yeah, and
there are other models of it that existed before it
actually became the Luigi board. That goes back to mid
nineteenth century talking boards. The kind of use the same
principle those were using. Now to make this work, you
(11:19):
need a little device. It kind of looks like a
computer mouse. Uh. This is called a plane jet. It
is a three legged little object with a hole in
the middle or a pointer. Now on some of these older,
the older traditions who would also put a pencil there
and everyone would put their fingers or one person who
is in charge of the seance would put their fingers
on it, and then the spirit would guide the pencil
(11:41):
to draw out each individual letter. But the thing is
that takes forever, so the talking board comes apart because
someone eventually loses their cool in the seance. The like,
just write some letters on a board. What are you
trying to say? Already? I know the time is limitless
in the spirit world, but we have places to be,
So just get some letters on a board and let's
roll with this thing. I'm getting charged by the minute.
(12:02):
Most of everyone out there. Imagine a Sinawegi board and
this is what happens. You have a number of people
gather around this board. Everyone puts their fingers on the
plane schet and then you speak to the spirit world.
You're like, oh, spirits of old, tell me what's the
name of my future boyfriend? That kind of thing. You know,
whatever your your questions are, you can ask the spirit
(12:24):
of anything. Every anything is fair game. And where is
my pony? Where is my pony? And then it will
begin to move. Nobody's touching it. Everyone's like, are you
touching it. No, I'm not. I mean everyone's touching it,
but no one's supposed to be moving it. And everyone
starts accusing everyone else. Are you moving at? No, I'm
not moving at Oh, my goodness is moving on its own.
Spirit is moving it. And then the the pointer will
(12:44):
move from one letter to another, or from a yes
two or to a yes or no, depending on what
kind of question you asked. And it really does when
you're at that age I think too, or even when
you're older, and perhaps there's other substances involved. Um, you
do really sort of feel like it is moving, and
so of course that's the parlor game trick to it all. Um,
(13:05):
what is actually going on is something called the idiometer effect.
And these are small muscle movements that we generate unconsciously. Yeah.
The term was coined by William B. Carpenter in eighteen
fifty two, and he was explaining another pseudo of scientific
slash occultist thing, which is the movement of rods and
(13:26):
pendulums by dowsers, dowsing rods of which you used to
find water and the like. And so he looked at
this and he realized, all right, well, these people are
observing some sort of phenomenon. Uh, something's going on, but
it's not discovering where water is by using a stick. Well,
there is a new scientists article called wig Board Help
Scientists Probe this subconscious And in it they are talking
(13:48):
to psychologists Helene Gushu and she says that this idiomotor
action is present in our day all the time, we
just don't realize it. Yes, it's just a part of
everyday life. But this is an experiment focuses in on
something that we don't usually look at and then applies
a level of ritual and expectation to it. Yeah, and
she says, like, take driving your car along a familiar
(14:10):
route that you do every morning, and then you arrive,
you park your car, and you have this feeling like
how did I get here? Have you ever done that?
And she says that this inner zombie is part of
this whole idiometer effect, that we're doing all of this subconsciously,
you're not even really realizing it. And so what she
did is she wanted to test this idea and she
(14:31):
had her team and work with one person with her
finger on a plan chet at a time. Okay, So
she realized though that the idiometer effect is really maximized
with Weiji board if you believe you are not responsible
for any movements. And this is brilliant what she does here. Yeah,
so she so what she does, she says, okay, well,
now this person needs to feel like they're in a
(14:52):
group situation or with another person. And so what she
did is she she told them they would be using
the board with a partner, and then the subject was
then blindfolded and then what they didn't know is that
they're so called partner removed their hands from the planchet
when the experiment began, so they think other people are
touching it, but they're not really, they're really going solo
with these answers yes. And she said the technique worked
(15:14):
at least was something like twenty one out of twenty
seven times with the volunteers tested. And she said the plant,
the planchett does not move randomly around the board and
moves to yes or no for these twenty one out
of seven, and it moves seems to move almost magically
to them, and none of them felt responsible for the movement,
even though of course they were doing it. And in fact,
(15:35):
some subjects suspected that their partner was really an actor
that they thought the actor was deliberately moving the planchet,
and they never suspected that they themselves were the ones
that were doing it. It's also important to know that
in experiments, if you turn the board upside down after
the individual was blindfolded or the individuals are blindfolded, the
spirit will not adjust to the new positioning of the board,
(15:58):
which seems really inflexible in case anyone who was out
there was like, was still on the fence about whether
or not this was a ghost talking. But the amazing
thing about all of this is that, and I think
it's the case with all the things that we're talking
about in this particular episode, is that on one level,
there's that childhood fantasy, occultist level of intrigue about it,
like something amazing is happening here. Well, then when you
(16:20):
look behind the scenes and you look at the actual science,
there's still something amazing happening here. At risk of overstating
it a little bit, you're not getting in touch with
an unknowable spirit from from beyond our perception. You're getting
in touch with the subconscious, which is kind of an
unknowable spirit from beyond our perception. To quote Sigmund Freud,
(16:41):
the conscious mind may be compared to a fountain playing
in the sun and falling back into the great subterranean
pool of subconsciousness from which it rises. So in that deep, black,
murky ocean of the the underbraining sea, with the luigiboard,
we're kind of getting in touch with the monsters that
lived there. So what I want to know is is, uh,
(17:03):
do you think psychologists will begin using the Wegi board
in their sessions? Oh, I don't know. It might have
a certain stigma to it. It might, but I do
think it's interesting because it is unearthing some things. And
I was thinking about my own experience as a child
with weg board, and I remember that we were talking
to a spirit named Seth through doesn't that sound like
(17:25):
you know Seth? And someone said what does Julie dream about?
And then it went to or it spelled out A
bombs which was something and that I used to dream
about this a nightmare that had a reoccurring nightmare about
Adam bombs. So you know, obviously I was moving it,
but I didn't know consciously that I was spelling out
(17:46):
A bombs that it really bothered me that much. That's
pretty cool. I I myself have I don't think I've
ever used to wegi board. Maybe in the week ahead
we will correct this and we'll videotape it and put
it on the web side. We'll see. But yeah, I
never used one. My mom had one and was apparently
a fan of the device, but then she went off
(18:07):
to college and when she came back, he was gone.
And and she attributed this. Uh, I mean maybe not seriously,
but she used just she would mention like, oh, I
think it advantished, And then later on she realized, oh wait,
my she's she's realized that my grandmother had gotten rid
of it. Because I don't think she relay liked it.
You know, because because some people get up in arms
about the Luigi board, some people were a little leary.
(18:28):
Some people see it is, if not harmless in and
of itself, they see it as a gateway to other
occultist things. And uh, and if you read a lot
of chick tracks, you may think that it is just
straight up talking to the devil. Yeah, but if you
want to take a little bit power out of that,
play the game, you know, and get an unbiased person
to stand there and actually see the letters that are
(18:49):
spelled up, because this is another thing that they say, Yeah,
go in, go into it if you want, I mean,
by all means, going to it and have some fun
with Auigi board and talk about spirits and all, but
also go into it and think about the mysteries you're
about to examine with the human mind. Yeah. Yeah, blindfold yourselves,
get an unbiased person to stand there and to actually
see what the letters are. And I will tell you
(19:11):
that most times gobbledygook is going to come out of that.
And it's a good example of how really it is
the unconscious mind that's guiding this process. All Right, we're
gonna take a quick break and when we come back,
we're gonna talk to somebody by the name of Bloody
and Mary. Alright, we're back, and you mentioned Bloody Mary. Yes,
(19:33):
now this one I definitely remember. The rules of this
are pretty simple. You can do this on your own
or certainly at a slumber party. The ideas you go
into the bathroom lights out, all right, or the very
least dim lights. Generally they say lights out, but there's
probably gonna be some light in there be a candle
or candle in hand, or just light under the doors.
Just be dramatic about it. Candle in hand, alright, light out,
(19:57):
candle in hand, going too the bathroom, stare into the
a room, and then you say the name Bloody Mary
three times, five times, six times, seven times. It it depends,
it varies. The recipe is not really set in stone,
but any rate, by saying in a number of times,
you invoke this incantation and a mysterious, blood faced woman
(20:18):
will appear in the mirror before you. She will reach
out and she will scratch your face off. So yeah,
this is definitely an example of a situation where I
was reluctant to cross the line of the occult. You know,
I think about it all the time when I'm seeing
a dark bathroom and noticing the mirror in there. But
I guess at hard. I'm thinking, all right, if it
if it doesn't work, if a woman does not appear
(20:41):
in the mirror and attack me, then it's just all
for nothing. But but what if she does? You know,
where's the wind there? All right, it worked and now
I have no face? Right? Or what if she grabbed
you and take you into her death portal with her?
That could happen too, And of course one of the
things involved here is that we're talking about a mirror,
and mirrors have long had this association with magic and
(21:04):
the unknown, because at a very basic level, you look
into a mirror and there you see yourself with a
little inversion going on to sort of mess with you.
And if it's not a perfect mirror, and certainly for
the longest mirrors were largely imperfect in certain ways, you
get a distorted view of what the world is like.
(21:25):
And so there's a long, long history of mirrors being
used in occultist or a religious ceremonies, even their numerous
examples of magic mirrors. There was Combustion's mirror, which warned
of approaching ill fortune. There was Lows mirror, which reflected
the mind and its thoughts. There was Merlin's magic mirror
that informed the King of plots, treasons and invasions. There
(21:48):
was Reynard's Wonderful Mirror, which showed conditions one mile away,
which I think it's kind of a limited design there,
and then Vulcan's mirror showed the past, president future, and
of course Harry Potter there was a magic mirror, and
there it shows you Harry Potter's parents, I believe well,
and then wicked rituals too. Apparently, UM, young women who
(22:08):
are trying to figure out who their husband would be.
Again we're talking back in the old day, would take
a mirror and a candle, walk backwards, ask the mirror,
and sometimes it was thought that the mirror would reveal
who the husband, who their husband would be, or sometimes
it was bloody Mary, who would appear. Now have you
done this? Have you? I've not done blady for whatever reason,
(22:29):
I just never never have done it. But I do
think it's interesting. Today's Um, you know, right after this,
I'm going to go into your office bathroom and I'm
going to do bloodyrror. I don't care who's in this stall.
But I do think it's interesting because again you've got
the incantation part of it, the ritual part of it.
But let's talk about what's actually going on, because I
(22:50):
think that is really cool, right, because there's another example
of the fantasy. The fiction. The supernatural aspect of it
is interesting, but when you you strip that away and
you get down to the science, it's equally creepy and
weird and amazing because here's the thing. People do see
things in the mirror. But again, it points to this
idea that we can't always trust what we see and
what our eyes can put together. For us UM at
(23:12):
the University of Urbino, researcher Giovanni Baputo had fifty participants
look in the mirror for ten minutes in a dimly
lit room and describe what they saw. Now, none of
these people were knew what they were there for, so
they had no preconceived notions of bloody marry Um. Alright,
what they saw is fascinating. It is fascinating, And this
(23:32):
was published in the Journal of Perception. Two thirds of
participants saw said that they saw huge deformations of their
own face. Okay, nearly half of the participants even reported
seeing fantastical or monstrous beings. A few participants reported seeing
faces of parents, ancestors, and strangers, including women and children.
(23:53):
And all the participants saw someone or something in the
mirror other than themselves. Saw an archetype in the mirror.
They saw an old woman, or they saw a child,
or a portrait of an ancestor kind of a thing,
you know. So, yeah, everyone's staring into this mirror, and
if you stare long enough, you see something else. You
see the face becomes something else. To you. And that's because,
(24:15):
according to computer you've got basic visual distortions affecting the
space specific interpretation system part of your brain. So when
your brain is faced with a lot of stimulation, only
some of it is considered relevant. So as it continues
to look and look and look at the reflection of
your face, then is trying to make sense of what
(24:36):
what's really important here? There are a lot of different details,
Like I find myself doing this when I look people,
when I actually look people in the eyes while they're talking,
like I'll start, you know, because there's sort of a
quick visual reference, like I'm looking around the room and
I'm like, all right, there's Julie. There's not that kind
of thing. But then if you really look at somebody,
then you start getting all this additional information, you know,
and you start thinking about like, oh, well, let's see
(24:57):
there's the shape of their nose, there's the shape of
their eyebrows. And then indeed, if you stare them long enough, um,
with a nice uncomfortable stare, then they start to look
a little weird, you know. Well, and this is called
the truck slur effect because your brain watch like zoom
in on an area and then the race the rest
of the space will actually fade away. And you've probably
seen examples of this before online. Usually it's like a
(25:21):
a ring of purple dots, and then you're supposed to
stare at the one dot that goes around around in
a circle. And then what happens is the purple fades
and then there's the yellow dot becomes more pronounced again.
It's your brain trying to figure out what's important, fading
in and fading out. Yeah, And also, I mean there's
a certain amount of your brain just sort of chewing
on itself there too. If you stare at anything long enough,
(25:42):
you're just gonna eventually kind of unsee it and see
different things. I think if anytime you stared up into
the clouds, or if you've been in say a boring
meeting or something, and you just stare at a particular
detail in the room, you start noticing more and more
new things about it. You start in making new interpretations
about it, seeing a face where there's not a face,
seeing if you're looking at the sky, you know, singing
(26:04):
a dinosaur writing a tricycle where there's not a dinosaur
writing a tricycle. You know, I was thinking too, about
you know, when you're when you're actually doing this in
the mirror and the trucul effect is occurring that how
weird is it that a slice of your forehead and
cheek are then subed int for your eye, because that's
really what your brain is doing with that um So
of course you would come away with this idea that
there was something monstrous that you saw something in the
(26:26):
mirror and it had to do with something that was
paranormal or the dark arts. Yeah, and throw into that
if you're if you're using the candle in this particular environment,
then you also have a light source that is flickering.
That's so that's altering a little bit, and it's distorting
the edges the lines in the face that you're perceiving.
So changes in lighting are also going to contribute to
(26:49):
this strange image of yourself that quickly becomes something other
than yourself. Now, you're right, it is complicating the matter,
and especially when we talked about reduction in the last
podcast about the science of han at houses and how
your bring really has to sort of recalibrate according to
the lighting available. So of course that's going to distort
things further. And again mirrors are just kind of weird
(27:10):
and creepy. I can't help but think of this without
the reminded of some of the writings of your hey
los Borges, who of course, is a poet who was
fascinated by mazes and mirrors, and there's a great little
line from his poem Mirrors that says, I see them
as infinite elemental executors of an ancient pact to multiply
the world, like the act of the getting sleepless, bringing
(27:32):
doom the crystal spies on us. If within the four
walls of a bedroom a mirror stairs, I am no
longer alone. There is someone there in the dawn reflections
mutely stages show I like that. I like this idea
to you that you know, ultimately we we feel this
sense that we're unknowable to ourselves. And so if you're
staring in the mirror, that's representing this unknown quantity. Yeah,
(27:55):
it ties in nicely with the Uiji board, I think,
you know, reaching out and touching bass with the subconscious
and coming to terms with the hidden self. All right, psychologists,
we have another one for you, Bloody Mary. Try it
out in your practice, Yes, tell her, we think so
there you have its slumber party goers, some science behind
the slumber party anticks you used to try out, also
(28:17):
some new emma for your next slumber party. So it's
it's really gonna be great to hear from listeners on
this because I know you guys and gals have tried
these before, so be sure to let us know about
your own experiences levitating your friends, uh, your own experiences
trying to summon dark, bloody specters from the mirror, and
of course your communications with the with the spirit world
(28:41):
a k a. You're subconscious. We'd love to hear about that.
So let's call over the robot and we'll see if
we have any listener mail. Alright, our listener, Monique Rite
sentences Hi, Julie and Robert. In two separate podcasts, you
talked about that in neighborhoods that are bad, people were
more likely to walk past a person in need than
in a cleaner naighborhood. There is a criminal justice theory
(29:02):
similar to this phenomena. It's called the broken windows theory,
thought up by Wilson and Kelling. In essence, the theory
states that in neighborhoods that are unkempt, there is a
silent signal to wrongdoers that since people do not care
about the neighborhoods, they also won't care about committing petty crimes,
which is a silent signal for wrongdoers to commit more
serious crimes. There's an interesting experiment that was done surrounding
(29:25):
this by Dr Zimbardo of the Stanford Prison Experiment fame.
He left a car in a bad neighborhood with the
hood up, signaling that no one cared about it. It
took a few short days for the car to be dismantled.
Thanks again for your great podcast, Manique, very interesting, and
we also heard from Scott Scott right since says Julian,
Robert just wanted you to to know how much your
podcast helped me out during a really rough point in
(29:46):
my life. I have a panic disorder. Diagnosing it beyond
that is pretty difficult that I have been working on
for the past six years. Unfortunately, driving, especially on the highway,
was a pretty major trigger, and having a panic attack
while driving is pretty no buno. But there's the Spanish
no buono that's no business, no good, huh. At one point,
(30:07):
listening to music would get me through reasonably well, but
I got to the point where music was no longer
engaging my intention enough to keep my mind off of panicking.
That's where your podcast came in. I wasn't even sure
what a podcast actually was, being a bit of an
anti Apple guy myself, until there was a free podcast
app on Amazon's Android market. One day last year, I
found your podcast while browsing listenings in that app and
(30:29):
opened it up. Uh and opened up the new world
of being able to drive more or less without panicking.
I have since learned, after six years of having problems
functioning like a normal human, that my vitamin D level
was extremely low. I started taking supplements in January and
haven't had an attack since, which is pretty remarkable. I
think since then I have envisioned a podcast about anxiety,
(30:50):
panic attacks, and what happens in the body and mind.
From what I can tell, there is very little research
on the link between vitamin D levels and panic and
some individuals, but I'm cynical enough to believe that it
is because vitamin D can't be patented. I'd love to
hear what you guys find out about it. Once again,
I can't thank you both enough. You really made my
life a lot more bearable your fan, avid listener and
research intern hopeful Scott, So there you go. That's awesome. Yeah,
(31:15):
I was just thinking those are two very good podcasts.
Panic Attacks would be very interesting to look into. And
also vitamins. Um, we talked about vitamin A and the
lack of vitamin A being attributed to night blindness, so um,
certainly when those levels are off it can affect things.
So so yeah, Scott, glad that we were able to
help him some small way, and glad that you've been
able to really tackle that that problem. Indeed. Yeah, So, hey,
(31:39):
the rest of you get in touch with us. Let
us know. Any past episodes are up for grabs. Don't
worry about contacting us about an older episode. You have
some cool feedback on and certainly if you want to
talk to us about Bloody Mary or whatnot, we're always
game for that. You can find us on Facebook and
Tumbler where we are stuff to blow your mind, and
you can also find us on Twitter where we tweet
under the handle blow the Mind, And you can always
(32:00):
drop us a line at Blow the Mind at Discovery
dot com and Happy Halloween for more on this and
thousands of other topics. Is It how stuff works dot
Com m HM,
Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind from how Stuff
Works dot com. Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind.
My name is Robert lamp and I'm Julie Douglas. In
today's episode, we would like you to take you to
a slumber party. All right, So go back to your roots,
go back to your your childhood memories if you have them,
(00:24):
of a slumber party, you know, dressing your long pajamas,
huddle around the floor and and start thinking long and
hard about the occult in the supernatural world and who
you are going to pick to put their hand in
a bowl of water when they fall asleep. Oh yeah, yeah,
that old trick. I have heard that one. Or there's
(00:46):
the putting the food cream in the hand or the
shaving cream in the hand, and then tickle the nose
and then and then want wont even cream on the head?
The the amusing thing. When we were talking about this
episode and getting things together for you have some legitimate
slumber party memories and some anecdotes about horsing grounds with
a lot of this stuff. But I don't think I
ever did any of this stuff. I can only think
(01:08):
of a like a few like a handful of slumber
party type things that I went to. And I don't
even think we call it. You call them slumber parties
necessarily if it's little boys, I feel like they were
just like sleepovers or something. And and I think we
just basically played a lot of video games. And I
remember once, uh, the kid whose house it was, he
(01:29):
was grounded because he ran through the house naked, and
like that was the extent of the excitement. All right, Well,
I don't want to get off on a tangent already
before we've started the podcast, because obviously we're gonna cover
some of these slumber party hijinks of our youth and
talk about the science behind them of what seemed like
it could be possible or not possible. But I wanted
to point that out, the gender difference. I wonder if
(01:51):
the obsession with the occult has something to do with UM. Well,
not I'm not saying all kids girls are witches the
inherent evil of of the male set exactly, That's what
I meant to say. But I wonder if that has
some sort of root in um interest in this, because
there was a sort of, if you look at it,
at least historically, a power in invocating things and looking
(02:14):
towards the dark arts well for power as opposed to
actually having a lot of power in your life, and
I'm thinking's sixteen hundred years. Yeah. Well, one thing that
definitely comes to mind is that a lot of these
games kind of remind us of ice breakers, and they
are they're they're forcing people to interact with each other.
It's more of a communal, open experience, and by and large,
(02:36):
it seems like females are often more inclined to that
than the males when they're in their individual groups. For instance,
when I think of j Ju Saana, which is here
in Atlanta, this koree in Sanna that a lot of
people go to, and it's really cool, but they divide
you into into sexes for part of it. There's the
men sauna and the women sauna, and so I only
(02:56):
know what goes on in the men sana obviously, so
I'll my wife it's like, well, what's it like in
the in the women's son and it's like, well, there's
a lot of talking. There's a lot of women within
their own group talking without each other, and then you
may meet other women that are in the that side
of the sauna, whereas on the men's side, it's completely different.
It's just like a bunch of naked dudes staring at
the at the tiles. You know, there's not really any
(03:18):
talking going on. And granted that's a little different than
a childhood slumber party. But but but I can see where.
I mean, guys are just gonna they're not gonna be
as as open to say, doing light as a finger.
Stiff as a board. Well, I don't know. I think
that next time you go that you should bring Auji
board in with you to the sauna and see if
(03:38):
you can strike up some conversations. Yeah, yeah, maybe so,
maybe so. Yeah. Alright, so you have mentioned, uh, let
his feather stiff as board, which is something known as
party levitation. Yes, this was apparently made famous by the
film The Craft, which I think I saw, but I
only remember that actress Faruza Bach was in it and
(03:58):
she's all Gothian. You know that. That's my full experience
with that film. Well, here's a setup. Okay, you've got
your sleepover, and this is a a sleepover staple, by
the way, party levitation. So imagine four nine pound girls
who are all arranged around their friend and she's laying
on her back on the floor, okay, And they all
(04:20):
get just one finger, each finger from each chant under her.
And then they are going to lift up this nine
pound girl just using their index fingers. So inevit believe
they try. They're like, all right, let's lift her using
our fingers. And nothing happens. Right, It's just a bunch
of people lifting up on their fingers, tickling the person
a little bit, and it's it's hilarious, but nothing happens. Yeah,
(04:42):
and then someone says, hey, let's let's hearken back to
our Wiccan ancestors and and uh repeat a chant that
may give us the power, supernatural power, supernatural strength to
lift her. And so they chant four times, as though
they are now a coven of witches casting their spell.
And they chant light as a feather stiff as a board.
(05:04):
Light is a feather stiff as a board, Light as
a feather stiff as a board. And on the fourth one,
miraculously they levitate their friend. Well, they don't quite levitate her,
but they lily in the proper environment, with the proper expectations,
can certainly seem like an amazing levitation experience. And that's
(05:24):
the one of the key things to realize here. First
of all, visualized experience. Never we've touched on this before,
but never discount the power of a little ritual and
a thing because it can It changes your perception about
what is happening, in your expectations about what will happen. Likewise,
concerted effort light is a finger stiff in the board
is kind of a on account of three type of deal.
(05:46):
On account of three, we're all going to do this
at once, as opposed to girls randomly moving their fingers
up and down and not picking someone up off the
off the floor. Yeah, you're right, you're synchronizing with that,
which is really important. We've talked about that too in
terms of a sort of ritual that you do as
a group, because you're also synchronizing the neurons that are
firing in your brain. Yeah, whether you're getting geared up
(06:07):
to run through a run, to walk across some hot coals,
or you're in church singing hymn. Yeah. And Dr Carl
krislin Nikki of Australia's ABC Science has said that that's
really important, this this chanting, this ritualized portion of it
and sinking up. But not only that, as you say,
the memory of it, because he's saying that if you
look at any clip on YouTube, you will see that
(06:31):
what is happening is that um, once they sink up
and once they do the chanting, that yes and d
they do lift their friend, but it's really only a
couple of inches. And the friends about the fall and
it's not quite the success that they think it is
in their minds when when they're talking about it in
the clips, they're like, whoa, we actually really lifted for
a very high. Yeah, but you're ten years old, you're
(06:52):
full of sugar, it's late at night. The perception is
gonna be a little different, right, And I have to
say to you that when I did it and sleepover
before that, when I take out that memory and I
examine it, I did think that, you know, I was
really lifting my friend very high. Were you yourself levitated
or were you one of the levitator? I was one
of the levitators because I really, like, you know, I
(07:12):
was obsessed with the occult at that age, by the way,
and not just the occult, like I would spend my
weekends trying to hypnotize myself and I had books on it,
and so these we were huge mysteries to me, and
I put a lot of effort into it. So if
someone was gonna be you know, levitated, I was going
to be in that group to help them with the power.
We'll see, and this is we'll discuss this a little
more in a minute, but I feel like I was.
(07:33):
I was always fascinated with the occult as well, um,
you know, and I would buy like I had a
copy of that the fake Necronomicon. I had a copy
of the the Satanic Bible. I mean, you know, in
anything like that. That was just kind of you know, who,
this is spooky and kind of you know, like I
would get into it. But then I was always reluctant
to cross a certain line. I was maybe not terrified,
(07:55):
but I was reluctant to cross that line where something
might actually happen. See, I would have gone like Willow
Evil Willow instantly. I was a big participant in that. Um.
I want to also mentioned that doctor chrisal Nikki talks
about the third and last factor being the strength in
our fingers and that we just underestimate them. Yeah, I
(08:18):
mean it looks like nothing. And certainly if you haven't
had the broken finger, you've seen someone who has and
you get that in your mind instantly. I mean, you're
there are so many opportunities to to damage your digits
in the course of the day, so you're you're very
conscious of that. But in reality, they're they're pretty rugged
and there they can hold a lot of strength. I mean,
there are examples of famous strong men who were able
(08:39):
to do some amazing feats with just a finger or two. Uh.
There was a Louis Sear, the old time French Canadian strongman,
who could allegedly lift five hundred and fifty three pounds
with a single finger. He'd uses his right middle, by
the way, and um. Then there was an American strongman
by the name of Warren Lincoln Travis and uh he
(09:01):
allegedly lifted five hundred sixty pounds on its fiftieth birthday
with a single finger. I'm not sure which one it was.
I love to imagine that both of them had magnificently
curled mustaches. Yes, when I was recently I started looking
through some of these pictures of these guys, and you know,
there's a lot of cool facial hair, a lot of
those old timey what do you call it, like a
wrestler wears single. It sounds right, sounds Occasionally old timey
(09:26):
nude photo would pop up every I think it was
maybe Louis here, the French Canadian guy. I was like, oh,
that's a little much Louie. Thanks Loe, But yeah, go
look some of those little guys up if you get
a chance. It's it's pretty amusing. But I think the
really cool things that are going on here is again memory,
which we've talked about it. We've talked about this. There's
(09:47):
reserve of strength in our bodies. Yes, that we can
you know, hit the potential sometimes and not even realize
and not realizing thinking we're more fragile than we are,
which is something we saw with with walking on hot coals.
We talked about you see the coals, you see fire,
You think, no way am I gonna walk on that.
If I walk on that, I'm going to burn. But
as we discussed in that episode, if things are under
(10:07):
the right conditions, it's very doable. And this is something
that's very doable, and you've got the group psychology element
to it as well. Um. Another good staple of a
slumber party is of course the wegi board. Yes, with
one of the most mysterious spellings of of of all time.
Of course, that is O, U, I J A. I
think there's only a handful of people on earth who
(10:29):
remember that in any given moment um. Anytime I search
for it, I'm like typing in all sorts of weird
combinations of letters. But this is, of course, a board
looks more or less like a like a board game board. Right. Uh,
you unfolded and you have has a number of letters
spread out across it, and some numbers and a yes
and a no, and maybe and U. It actually was
(10:55):
a board game that came into vogue around ninety at
least in the United's dates. And it was a parlor
game and it was sold in novelty shops. Yeah, and
there are other models of it that existed before it
actually became the Luigi board. That goes back to mid
nineteenth century talking boards. The kind of use the same
principle those were using. Now to make this work, you
(11:19):
need a little device. It kind of looks like a
computer mouse. Uh. This is called a plane jet. It
is a three legged little object with a hole in
the middle or a pointer. Now on some of these older,
the older traditions who would also put a pencil there
and everyone would put their fingers or one person who
is in charge of the seance would put their fingers
on it, and then the spirit would guide the pencil
(11:41):
to draw out each individual letter. But the thing is
that takes forever, so the talking board comes apart because
someone eventually loses their cool in the seance. The like,
just write some letters on a board. What are you
trying to say? Already? I know the time is limitless
in the spirit world, but we have places to be,
So just get some letters on a board and let's
roll with this thing. I'm getting charged by the minute.
(12:02):
Most of everyone out there. Imagine a Sinawegi board and
this is what happens. You have a number of people
gather around this board. Everyone puts their fingers on the
plane schet and then you speak to the spirit world.
You're like, oh, spirits of old, tell me what's the
name of my future boyfriend? That kind of thing. You know,
whatever your your questions are, you can ask the spirit
(12:24):
of anything. Every anything is fair game. And where is
my pony? Where is my pony? And then it will
begin to move. Nobody's touching it. Everyone's like, are you
touching it. No, I'm not. I mean everyone's touching it,
but no one's supposed to be moving it. And everyone
starts accusing everyone else. Are you moving at? No, I'm
not moving at Oh, my goodness is moving on its own.
Spirit is moving it. And then the the pointer will
(12:44):
move from one letter to another, or from a yes
two or to a yes or no, depending on what
kind of question you asked. And it really does when
you're at that age I think too, or even when
you're older, and perhaps there's other substances involved. Um, you
do really sort of feel like it is moving, and
so of course that's the parlor game trick to it all. Um,
(13:05):
what is actually going on is something called the idiometer effect.
And these are small muscle movements that we generate unconsciously. Yeah.
The term was coined by William B. Carpenter in eighteen
fifty two, and he was explaining another pseudo of scientific
slash occultist thing, which is the movement of rods and
(13:26):
pendulums by dowsers, dowsing rods of which you used to
find water and the like. And so he looked at
this and he realized, all right, well, these people are
observing some sort of phenomenon. Uh, something's going on, but
it's not discovering where water is by using a stick. Well,
there is a new scientists article called wig Board Help
Scientists Probe this subconscious And in it they are talking
(13:48):
to psychologists Helene Gushu and she says that this idiomotor
action is present in our day all the time, we
just don't realize it. Yes, it's just a part of
everyday life. But this is an experiment focuses in on
something that we don't usually look at and then applies
a level of ritual and expectation to it. Yeah, and
she says, like, take driving your car along a familiar
(14:10):
route that you do every morning, and then you arrive,
you park your car, and you have this feeling like
how did I get here? Have you ever done that?
And she says that this inner zombie is part of
this whole idiometer effect, that we're doing all of this subconsciously,
you're not even really realizing it. And so what she
did is she wanted to test this idea and she
(14:31):
had her team and work with one person with her
finger on a plan chet at a time. Okay, So
she realized though that the idiometer effect is really maximized
with Weiji board if you believe you are not responsible
for any movements. And this is brilliant what she does here. Yeah,
so she so what she does, she says, okay, well,
now this person needs to feel like they're in a
(14:52):
group situation or with another person. And so what she
did is she she told them they would be using
the board with a partner, and then the subject was
then blindfolded and then what they didn't know is that
they're so called partner removed their hands from the planchet
when the experiment began, so they think other people are
touching it, but they're not really, they're really going solo
with these answers yes. And she said the technique worked
(15:14):
at least was something like twenty one out of twenty
seven times with the volunteers tested. And she said the plant,
the planchett does not move randomly around the board and
moves to yes or no for these twenty one out
of seven, and it moves seems to move almost magically
to them, and none of them felt responsible for the movement,
even though of course they were doing it. And in fact,
(15:35):
some subjects suspected that their partner was really an actor
that they thought the actor was deliberately moving the planchet,
and they never suspected that they themselves were the ones
that were doing it. It's also important to know that
in experiments, if you turn the board upside down after
the individual was blindfolded or the individuals are blindfolded, the
spirit will not adjust to the new positioning of the board,
(15:58):
which seems really inflexible in case anyone who was out
there was like, was still on the fence about whether
or not this was a ghost talking. But the amazing
thing about all of this is that, and I think
it's the case with all the things that we're talking
about in this particular episode, is that on one level,
there's that childhood fantasy, occultist level of intrigue about it,
like something amazing is happening here. Well, then when you
(16:20):
look behind the scenes and you look at the actual science,
there's still something amazing happening here. At risk of overstating
it a little bit, you're not getting in touch with
an unknowable spirit from from beyond our perception. You're getting
in touch with the subconscious, which is kind of an
unknowable spirit from beyond our perception. To quote Sigmund Freud,
(16:41):
the conscious mind may be compared to a fountain playing
in the sun and falling back into the great subterranean
pool of subconsciousness from which it rises. So in that deep, black,
murky ocean of the the underbraining sea, with the luigiboard,
we're kind of getting in touch with the monsters that
lived there. So what I want to know is is, uh,
(17:03):
do you think psychologists will begin using the Wegi board
in their sessions? Oh, I don't know. It might have
a certain stigma to it. It might, but I do
think it's interesting because it is unearthing some things. And
I was thinking about my own experience as a child
with weg board, and I remember that we were talking
to a spirit named Seth through doesn't that sound like
(17:25):
you know Seth? And someone said what does Julie dream about?
And then it went to or it spelled out A
bombs which was something and that I used to dream
about this a nightmare that had a reoccurring nightmare about
Adam bombs. So you know, obviously I was moving it,
but I didn't know consciously that I was spelling out
(17:46):
A bombs that it really bothered me that much. That's
pretty cool. I I myself have I don't think I've
ever used to wegi board. Maybe in the week ahead
we will correct this and we'll videotape it and put
it on the web side. We'll see. But yeah, I
never used one. My mom had one and was apparently
a fan of the device, but then she went off
(18:07):
to college and when she came back, he was gone.
And and she attributed this. Uh, I mean maybe not seriously,
but she used just she would mention like, oh, I
think it advantished, And then later on she realized, oh wait,
my she's she's realized that my grandmother had gotten rid
of it. Because I don't think she relay liked it.
You know, because because some people get up in arms
about the Luigi board, some people were a little leary.
(18:28):
Some people see it is, if not harmless in and
of itself, they see it as a gateway to other
occultist things. And uh, and if you read a lot
of chick tracks, you may think that it is just
straight up talking to the devil. Yeah, but if you
want to take a little bit power out of that,
play the game, you know, and get an unbiased person
to stand there and actually see the letters that are
(18:49):
spelled up, because this is another thing that they say, Yeah,
go in, go into it if you want, I mean,
by all means, going to it and have some fun
with Auigi board and talk about spirits and all, but
also go into it and think about the mysteries you're
about to examine with the human mind. Yeah. Yeah, blindfold yourselves,
get an unbiased person to stand there and to actually
see what the letters are. And I will tell you
(19:11):
that most times gobbledygook is going to come out of that.
And it's a good example of how really it is
the unconscious mind that's guiding this process. All Right, we're
gonna take a quick break and when we come back,
we're gonna talk to somebody by the name of Bloody
and Mary. Alright, we're back, and you mentioned Bloody Mary. Yes,
(19:33):
now this one I definitely remember. The rules of this
are pretty simple. You can do this on your own
or certainly at a slumber party. The ideas you go
into the bathroom lights out, all right, or the very
least dim lights. Generally they say lights out, but there's
probably gonna be some light in there be a candle
or candle in hand, or just light under the doors.
Just be dramatic about it. Candle in hand, alright, light out,
(19:57):
candle in hand, going too the bathroom, stare into the
a room, and then you say the name Bloody Mary
three times, five times, six times, seven times. It it depends,
it varies. The recipe is not really set in stone,
but any rate, by saying in a number of times,
you invoke this incantation and a mysterious, blood faced woman
(20:18):
will appear in the mirror before you. She will reach
out and she will scratch your face off. So yeah,
this is definitely an example of a situation where I
was reluctant to cross the line of the occult. You know,
I think about it all the time when I'm seeing
a dark bathroom and noticing the mirror in there. But
I guess at hard. I'm thinking, all right, if it
if it doesn't work, if a woman does not appear
(20:41):
in the mirror and attack me, then it's just all
for nothing. But but what if she does? You know,
where's the wind there? All right, it worked and now
I have no face? Right? Or what if she grabbed
you and take you into her death portal with her?
That could happen too, And of course one of the
things involved here is that we're talking about a mirror,
and mirrors have long had this association with magic and
(21:04):
the unknown, because at a very basic level, you look
into a mirror and there you see yourself with a
little inversion going on to sort of mess with you.
And if it's not a perfect mirror, and certainly for
the longest mirrors were largely imperfect in certain ways, you
get a distorted view of what the world is like.
(21:25):
And so there's a long, long history of mirrors being
used in occultist or a religious ceremonies, even their numerous
examples of magic mirrors. There was Combustion's mirror, which warned
of approaching ill fortune. There was Lows mirror, which reflected
the mind and its thoughts. There was Merlin's magic mirror
that informed the King of plots, treasons and invasions. There
(21:48):
was Reynard's Wonderful Mirror, which showed conditions one mile away,
which I think it's kind of a limited design there,
and then Vulcan's mirror showed the past, president future, and
of course Harry Potter there was a magic mirror, and
there it shows you Harry Potter's parents, I believe well,
and then wicked rituals too. Apparently, UM, young women who
(22:08):
are trying to figure out who their husband would be.
Again we're talking back in the old day, would take
a mirror and a candle, walk backwards, ask the mirror,
and sometimes it was thought that the mirror would reveal
who the husband, who their husband would be, or sometimes
it was bloody Mary, who would appear. Now have you
done this? Have you? I've not done blady for whatever reason,
(22:29):
I just never never have done it. But I do
think it's interesting. Today's Um, you know, right after this,
I'm going to go into your office bathroom and I'm
going to do bloodyrror. I don't care who's in this stall.
But I do think it's interesting because again you've got
the incantation part of it, the ritual part of it.
But let's talk about what's actually going on, because I
(22:50):
think that is really cool, right, because there's another example
of the fantasy. The fiction. The supernatural aspect of it
is interesting, but when you you strip that away and
you get down to the science, it's equally creepy and
weird and amazing because here's the thing. People do see
things in the mirror. But again, it points to this
idea that we can't always trust what we see and
what our eyes can put together. For us UM at
(23:12):
the University of Urbino, researcher Giovanni Baputo had fifty participants
look in the mirror for ten minutes in a dimly
lit room and describe what they saw. Now, none of
these people were knew what they were there for, so
they had no preconceived notions of bloody marry Um. Alright,
what they saw is fascinating. It is fascinating, And this
(23:32):
was published in the Journal of Perception. Two thirds of
participants saw said that they saw huge deformations of their
own face. Okay, nearly half of the participants even reported
seeing fantastical or monstrous beings. A few participants reported seeing
faces of parents, ancestors, and strangers, including women and children.
(23:53):
And all the participants saw someone or something in the
mirror other than themselves. Saw an archetype in the mirror.
They saw an old woman, or they saw a child,
or a portrait of an ancestor kind of a thing,
you know. So, yeah, everyone's staring into this mirror, and
if you stare long enough, you see something else. You
see the face becomes something else. To you. And that's because,
(24:15):
according to computer you've got basic visual distortions affecting the
space specific interpretation system part of your brain. So when
your brain is faced with a lot of stimulation, only
some of it is considered relevant. So as it continues
to look and look and look at the reflection of
your face, then is trying to make sense of what
(24:36):
what's really important here? There are a lot of different details,
Like I find myself doing this when I look people,
when I actually look people in the eyes while they're talking,
like I'll start, you know, because there's sort of a
quick visual reference, like I'm looking around the room and
I'm like, all right, there's Julie. There's not that kind
of thing. But then if you really look at somebody,
then you start getting all this additional information, you know,
and you start thinking about like, oh, well, let's see
(24:57):
there's the shape of their nose, there's the shape of
their eyebrows. And then indeed, if you stare them long enough, um,
with a nice uncomfortable stare, then they start to look
a little weird, you know. Well, and this is called
the truck slur effect because your brain watch like zoom
in on an area and then the race the rest
of the space will actually fade away. And you've probably
seen examples of this before online. Usually it's like a
(25:21):
a ring of purple dots, and then you're supposed to
stare at the one dot that goes around around in
a circle. And then what happens is the purple fades
and then there's the yellow dot becomes more pronounced again.
It's your brain trying to figure out what's important, fading
in and fading out. Yeah, And also, I mean there's
a certain amount of your brain just sort of chewing
on itself there too. If you stare at anything long enough,
(25:42):
you're just gonna eventually kind of unsee it and see
different things. I think if anytime you stared up into
the clouds, or if you've been in say a boring
meeting or something, and you just stare at a particular
detail in the room, you start noticing more and more
new things about it. You start in making new interpretations
about it, seeing a face where there's not a face,
seeing if you're looking at the sky, you know, singing
(26:04):
a dinosaur writing a tricycle where there's not a dinosaur
writing a tricycle. You know, I was thinking too, about
you know, when you're when you're actually doing this in
the mirror and the trucul effect is occurring that how
weird is it that a slice of your forehead and
cheek are then subed int for your eye, because that's
really what your brain is doing with that um So
of course you would come away with this idea that
there was something monstrous that you saw something in the
(26:26):
mirror and it had to do with something that was
paranormal or the dark arts. Yeah, and throw into that
if you're if you're using the candle in this particular environment,
then you also have a light source that is flickering.
That's so that's altering a little bit, and it's distorting
the edges the lines in the face that you're perceiving.
So changes in lighting are also going to contribute to
(26:49):
this strange image of yourself that quickly becomes something other
than yourself. Now, you're right, it is complicating the matter,
and especially when we talked about reduction in the last
podcast about the science of han at houses and how
your bring really has to sort of recalibrate according to
the lighting available. So of course that's going to distort
things further. And again mirrors are just kind of weird
(27:10):
and creepy. I can't help but think of this without
the reminded of some of the writings of your hey
los Borges, who of course, is a poet who was
fascinated by mazes and mirrors, and there's a great little
line from his poem Mirrors that says, I see them
as infinite elemental executors of an ancient pact to multiply
the world, like the act of the getting sleepless, bringing
(27:32):
doom the crystal spies on us. If within the four
walls of a bedroom a mirror stairs, I am no
longer alone. There is someone there in the dawn reflections
mutely stages show I like that. I like this idea
to you that you know, ultimately we we feel this
sense that we're unknowable to ourselves. And so if you're
staring in the mirror, that's representing this unknown quantity. Yeah,
(27:55):
it ties in nicely with the Uiji board, I think,
you know, reaching out and touching bass with the subconscious
and coming to terms with the hidden self. All right, psychologists,
we have another one for you, Bloody Mary. Try it
out in your practice, Yes, tell her, we think so
there you have its slumber party goers, some science behind
the slumber party anticks you used to try out, also
(28:17):
some new emma for your next slumber party. So it's
it's really gonna be great to hear from listeners on
this because I know you guys and gals have tried
these before, so be sure to let us know about
your own experiences levitating your friends, uh, your own experiences
trying to summon dark, bloody specters from the mirror, and
of course your communications with the with the spirit world
(28:41):
a k a. You're subconscious. We'd love to hear about that.
So let's call over the robot and we'll see if
we have any listener mail. Alright, our listener, Monique Rite
sentences Hi, Julie and Robert. In two separate podcasts, you
talked about that in neighborhoods that are bad, people were
more likely to walk past a person in need than
in a cleaner naighborhood. There is a criminal justice theory
(29:02):
similar to this phenomena. It's called the broken windows theory,
thought up by Wilson and Kelling. In essence, the theory
states that in neighborhoods that are unkempt, there is a
silent signal to wrongdoers that since people do not care
about the neighborhoods, they also won't care about committing petty crimes,
which is a silent signal for wrongdoers to commit more
serious crimes. There's an interesting experiment that was done surrounding
(29:25):
this by Dr Zimbardo of the Stanford Prison Experiment fame.
He left a car in a bad neighborhood with the
hood up, signaling that no one cared about it. It
took a few short days for the car to be dismantled.
Thanks again for your great podcast, Manique, very interesting, and
we also heard from Scott Scott right since says Julian,
Robert just wanted you to to know how much your
podcast helped me out during a really rough point in
(29:46):
my life. I have a panic disorder. Diagnosing it beyond
that is pretty difficult that I have been working on
for the past six years. Unfortunately, driving, especially on the highway,
was a pretty major trigger, and having a panic attack
while driving is pretty no buno. But there's the Spanish
no buono that's no business, no good, huh. At one point,
(30:07):
listening to music would get me through reasonably well, but
I got to the point where music was no longer
engaging my intention enough to keep my mind off of panicking.
That's where your podcast came in. I wasn't even sure
what a podcast actually was, being a bit of an
anti Apple guy myself, until there was a free podcast
app on Amazon's Android market. One day last year, I
found your podcast while browsing listenings in that app and
(30:29):
opened it up. Uh and opened up the new world
of being able to drive more or less without panicking.
I have since learned, after six years of having problems
functioning like a normal human, that my vitamin D level
was extremely low. I started taking supplements in January and
haven't had an attack since, which is pretty remarkable. I
think since then I have envisioned a podcast about anxiety,
(30:50):
panic attacks, and what happens in the body and mind.
From what I can tell, there is very little research
on the link between vitamin D levels and panic and
some individuals, but I'm cynical enough to believe that it
is because vitamin D can't be patented. I'd love to
hear what you guys find out about it. Once again,
I can't thank you both enough. You really made my
life a lot more bearable your fan, avid listener and
research intern hopeful Scott, So there you go. That's awesome. Yeah,
(31:15):
I was just thinking those are two very good podcasts.
Panic Attacks would be very interesting to look into. And
also vitamins. Um, we talked about vitamin A and the
lack of vitamin A being attributed to night blindness, so um,
certainly when those levels are off it can affect things.
So so yeah, Scott, glad that we were able to
help him some small way, and glad that you've been
able to really tackle that that problem. Indeed. Yeah, So, hey,
(31:39):
the rest of you get in touch with us. Let
us know. Any past episodes are up for grabs. Don't
worry about contacting us about an older episode. You have
some cool feedback on and certainly if you want to
talk to us about Bloody Mary or whatnot, we're always
game for that. You can find us on Facebook and
Tumbler where we are stuff to blow your mind, and
you can also find us on Twitter where we tweet
under the handle blow the Mind, And you can always
(32:00):
drop us a line at Blow the Mind at Discovery
dot com and Happy Halloween for more on this and
thousands of other topics. Is It how stuff works dot
Com m HM,
Stuff To Blow Your Mind News
Hosts And Creators
Robert Lamb
Joe McCormick
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