Tom Brady, Mike McCarthy, Joe Judge, and the Lakers

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to
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(00:27):
you may be and however you may be listening. We're
live in Los Angeles AT's iHeartRadio, Fox Sports Rudio and
FS one. Joy Taylor is joining me. We have Joe Thomas,
the great left tackle of the Cleveland Brown stops by today,
Nick Wright, Peter Schrager stops by today. We are act
good prep this morning. A lot of topics. Joy Taylor
is joining me. Joy, how are you? I'm great. There's

(00:48):
so much going on, so much come much. Letting the
NBA do a lot in the NBA as well. Get
to the Lakers in a few minutes. Um, let me
just say this. Football is the sport we watch America.
We like a lot of things. We love football. We
bet on football, we watch football, we go to football games.
We're into football as a country. We really are in

(01:10):
the ratings are four or five, six, seven times greater
than everything else out there, four times better than even
college football. And we love that too. So when you're
really emotional about something like football, like a family, sometimes
you need to take a deep breath, add context, add perspective,
because all of us, myself certainly included, we can get

(01:31):
too far down the hole, too into the tunnel, and
not give things perspective. And I've been saying with Tom Brady,
I think it's fifty fifty if he stays in this morning.
I really feel like it's eighty twenty ninety TENI staying
in New England, not just because of the Instagram post
he released yesterday that came out and said lesson after

(01:52):
a few days of reflection, I'm grateful and humbled by
our team. I can't yet ready to go back at it,
he says. In life and football, failures inevitable. You don't
always win. I've got more to prove. So on his Instagram,
Tom is acknowledging I'm not retiring. I'm coming back, so
put that to bed. I do think it's a perfect

(02:13):
time for him, but he doesn't think it's a perfect
time for him, So what I think doesn't matter. The
question becomes what does Tom do? And let me just
throw this out. We do this a lot, and I'm
guilty of it. I try not to be, but I
think the public is really guilty of it. We always
bury dynasties about a year early. Everybody wants to bury Alabama. Well,

(02:36):
they just had the number two recruiting class in the country.
They just landed the first or second best quarterback, and
outside of Florida in the SEC next year, nobody comes
close to stacking up with what they return. Alabama is
going to be in the playoff next year. Right now,
Van clems in her favorite and only Florida in the SEC,
I think can match up. LSU loses a lot of people. Okay,

(02:57):
we want to bury New England that we do this
with dynasties, but let's look at New England. Let's take
a deep breath now the season's over. We love football,
we get emotional. We bet it. They lose, they win.
They were twelve and four. They're the best coach in
the league. They have the best offensive line coach in
the league. Matters for quarterbacks. Their division is still below
average compared to other divisions. They get their fullback James Devlin,

(03:22):
their kicker Gronkowski, and their center David Andrews back. Those
will all help scoring. Nikkil Harry's in their second year
as a wide receiver takes a long time. Mohammed Sanu
comes back, probably for another year. And let's be honest,
best wide receiver draft ever. What they really missed this year?
They didn't miss defense. It was number one in the NFL.

(03:42):
The special teams weren't a problem. That was great. What
they didn't have as weapons And it's the best wide
receiver draft class ever. Aj Green's a free agent, Amari
Cooper's a free agent. Robbie Anderson of the Jets a
deep threat as a free agent. You don't have to
even bring up Obj or Ab. There's all sorts of
free agent wide receivers out there, all sorts of them.
And you know we do this. We tend to bury

(04:04):
things before they're dead. I'll give you an example. Friends,
Frasier and Seinfeld are still the most watched thing on
all these Netflix, Hulu, Amazon Prime subscription services. They're all
fighting over Frasier, They're all frighting over Seinfeld Hulu. They're
all you know NBC, give us Frasier back, give us
Friends back, give us Seinfeld. They're still all fighting over

(04:28):
this stuff. I know it's not cool to say A
watch Seinfeld. I know it's not cool to say I
watch Friends. That's what people are comfortable with, So we
tend to bury dynasties. In New England is still the
smartest team in the AFC. They appear to be. They
still have the best at several things. They get three
key components back offensively, and I think they're fine. And

(04:49):
this morning, here's what I know. I don't have anything
in common with Tom Brady except this. I like habit.
I love habit. I'm a RepA heetitive guy. I can
go to mock drafts all day, the same one. And
this is what I know about Brady. Bratty loves habit,
he loves process, he loves repetition. That's the only thing

(05:12):
we have in common. And let me tell you, I've
moved cross country three times. It disrupts that. It disrupts it.
LaVar Arrington came on this show and said, and when
you move all those little things that you love, exactly
where you park and exactly the free way you take,
and it takes you nine minutes and you go to

(05:33):
pizza and get your coffee and then it's four minutes
from there. Brady loves that. I love that and moving.
I've done it three times. It's a pain in the butt.
LaVar Arrington talked about that for Brady. Will he be
willing to give that up? There's so many different things
that will play a part after you've been in a

(05:53):
place for twenty years. Think about how his locker is
set up, think about who had duels, the small minute
details of what he eats in the morning, what he
eats in the noontime, What are his snacks, How does
he like his socks, What type of spikes does he like?
Where I sit in the meeting rooms. There are so

(06:14):
many things just within the football aspect of it. This morning,
context take a deep breath. Tom Brady went to Instagram
and I'm going on radio and TV. I think it's
eighty twenty. He's a Patriot. I didn't a couple days ago.

(06:35):
That's what football does to us. I think eighty twenties
back in New England's very good. Next year, right, let's
go to this. Mike McCarthy, new coach to the Dallas
Cowboys former coach Aaron Rodgers. Brett Favrom the Packers is
going to hold a press conference today after our show.
It's when our show ends. It'll be right after that,
about fifteen minutes after that. And there was a story
yesterday that one of the reasons that Jerry Jones hired

(06:58):
Mike McCarthy is because Jerry Jones felt we played him
ten times. He went seven and three against us, and
we always thought we had better players. And that's not
a bad reason to hire somebody. I mean, there's a
reason that people are hiring New England gms and New
England assistants and New England coordinators. You know, Miami's like, well,
if you can't beat him to join them, we'll hire

(07:20):
Brian Flores. There's a reason Josh McDaniels and Nick Cazario,
you know in New England, probably take over the Cleveland Browns.
It's not a terrible reason to hire somebody. You go
up against him and they beat you with less talent,
or at least the perception is you've got more talent,
they've got less talent, and they keep beating you. So
that I don't have a problem with that. But here's
The funny thing when Mike McCarthy and I'm divorced. So

(07:43):
when Mike McCarthy and Aaron Rodgers got a divorce, people
love the judge a divorce. In the first month, I'm
gonna go to the gym and get my abs. I
won the divorce, and that's not how divorces go. Are
we sure Aaron Rodgers he's gonna win this divorce? Aaron
Rodgers plays Seattle and Russell Wilson this weekend, the best

(08:04):
road team in the league, and Mike McCarthy takes over
an incredibly talented offensive roster. In Dallas, he never had
an offensive line like that. He never had a running
back like Zeke He never he never had an owner.
In Green Bay, He's got an aspirational, driven owner, the
best offensive line he's had, the best running back he's had,

(08:26):
and a very capable quarterback and a team that would
Jason Garrett won the division. We do this in divorces.
Go to the gym. I'm gonna look great. Russell Westbrook,
Kevin Durant, Oh Westbrook was the man for about six months,
MVP triple double. Five years later we roll our eyes

(08:47):
at Westbrook never won a playoff series. He's a stat monster,
having his worst shooting year of his career. No, I
mean he's now shooting thirty six percent. That's the worst
of you roll your eyes at Westbrook. Kobe and Shack.
Shack won that divorce. First couple of years, got a

(09:08):
title in Miami. Five six years later, Kobe's got multiple titles.
Kobe's winning an oscar, Kobe's very refined. His business has
never been stronger. Kobe won Farv and the Packers, oh
far you know, a little scrappy with the Jets. But
he goes to Minnesota for a couple of years and
they every time they played Green Bay, they knocked the

(09:29):
live and you know what out of him, he gets
to the NFC champion Jet and then six seven years
later it was the right move. Aaron Rodgers won a
Super Bowl and Aaron Rodgers was really talented. And Aaron
Rodgers this year won the division. And Farve's down somewhere
talking about football, and Aaron's got another five six years
left and he's fantastic. Be very careful about the divorce,

(09:55):
and let's be honest about it. When McCarthy got fired,
it was outdated, dinahs or this guy is he takes
over he's an offensive coach. He never had anything like
that in Green Bay. He didn't have an owner. He
kept complaining to Ted Thompson, give me some players. Well players,

(10:15):
free agents don't want to play in Green Bay. You
know where free agents do want to play in a
state with no state tax. For an owner that tends
to overpay. Jerry Jones, that's a nice thing to have.
He now has an owner who will overpay, pay early,
and by the way, in a state where players love,
players love, professional athletes love Texas, they love Houston, they

(10:37):
love Dallas, they like San Antonio. No state tax. Great
place to go free agents. Dallas is oh as competitive. Basically,
Dallas turns down players for free agency. So be very
careful on this. I think the first the first little year.
But we did look at stats. Yesterday we talked about

(10:58):
the stats of Aaron Rodgers. Since Mikecarthy's left yards down
per game, third down conversions down, second half adjustment points down.
He didn't elevate the records better because the Bears and
the Lions imploded and because they gave him a defense.
But it's not like the Packers and Aaron Rodgers elevated
to a new galaxy. They still only have one super

(11:20):
Bowl in the last decade, and Mike was part of it,
and it may be their last one. Great stuff today,
Nick writes. Coming up this hour, Peter Schreger. Next hour,
Joe Thomas, obviously an all timer for the Cleveland Browns.
They're looking for a coach. Only a job opening left,
so they get the best choice GM and coach Brown's
getting now the best choice of everything left and they're

(11:40):
still good people out there. Coming up next, though, Anthony
Davis gets hurt. The story behind the story why he
turned down the Lakers offer and what it all means
will wrap a ball on it. That is coming up next.
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and noon Easter nine am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio

(12:00):
FS one and the iHeartRadio app. Colden flu season, nasty
nasty symptoms come up now. The weather's bad stuff. He knows.
Top of the list. Vick Sinex nasal spray works within seconds,
last twelve hours, nothing works faster. Vic Sinex nasal spray
use as directed. Nick write in ten minutes, Peter Schrager Toppa.
Next hour, Joe Thomas Chris Haynes today as well. Stanford Route.

(12:21):
We got a lot of stuff going on. Joy Taylor
with the Herdline News in a couple of minutes. I
get people when you live in Los Angeles and I
go to the car wash, where I go to the
grocery store, do those kind of things people come up?
You know. I had a couple of people yesterday, what
do you doing? Blah blah blah. One of the things
they asked me about is why aren't you talking a
lot about the Lakers? Well, what do you think about
the Lakers? And I said, everything I needed to be

(12:42):
confirmed about the Lakers was confirmed in like six games.
Anthony Davis and Lebron and Danny Green, the three key
components for postseason success are playing beautifully together. I needed
to see that. It happened fast. Anthony Davis is always
dealing with nagging injuries, wood he for the first time
in his career, be willing to play through them. He has,

(13:03):
by the way, his MRI has cleaned. This morning. We
just got note of that. Anthony Davis yesterday declined the
Lakers max extension offer. It doesn't mean anything. He's not
leaving Los Angeles it's been perfect. He's averaging twenty eight
a game, ten rebounds, almost three blocks, a three assists.
It's been terrific. He got hurt last night. He's going
to travel with a team. He's fine. He is banged

(13:24):
up a lot, his shoulder, his back. You know, he's
one of those guys to knock on him in the
NBA from the people I trust, one of the smartest
guys in the NBA. When he was out there talking
to teams said, the knock on him in the league
is for a twenty five twenty six year old. He
gets banged up a lot. You can't dispute that. The
second thing was he doesn't love playing through injuries. Some

(13:44):
guys do, some guys do not. Kawhi doesn't want to.
Anthony Davis didn't in New Orleans, but he has this year,
played through a lot of days. He didn't feel great.
Lebron's pushing him, Lebron's hardening him. He's trying to create
a sort of playoff medal, which nobody is healthy by
the playoffs. Everybody's sore after the playoffs except James Harden,

(14:07):
who I don't know doesn't get hurt, plays every game
and just parties all night and comes back the next
day and drops forty four. He's an outlier. But I
don't think this team was built for January. I think
they were built for June. I think they're older. I
do believe they need to cash in this year because
the Clippers have more good young players. I think they'll

(14:27):
age better. Golden State's gonna have a number one pick
Steph Clay Draymond and a ton of room cap space
for the Greek freak or a big free agent. So
I do think this season is a cash in season.
Lebron's gonna be going into what his eighteenth year, Danny
Green is old, and Anthony Davis is breakable. But that
is my opinion on the Lakers. Everything I needed to

(14:50):
know for the regular season was confirmed in two weeks. A.
D and Lebron play great together. Ad is for the
first time in his career, willing to play through Naggie injuries.
Danny Green seems to work perfectly with both. I do
worry that if they trade Kyle Kuzma at the deadline,
there's a lot of rumors about that, they get even older.
I think they need to get a little younger so

(15:12):
they can take some nights off in the regular season.
Kuzma's value maybe in the regular season, not in the postseason.
Or he's not going to get a lot of touches
in May and June, but he needs a lot of
touches now. So Lebron and a d and Danny Green
and older players can rest a little. But Anthony didn't
sign the contract extension. It doesn't mean anything. He's traveling

(15:32):
with the team. That means something to me. That means
he's again this year, willing to play hurt and that
was always the knock on him. Joy with the news
no no turns. This is the herdline news. So Patria's
offensive coordinator, Josh McDaniels is obviously it's hop candidate for
the Brown's head coaching job. The next head coach in

(15:54):
Cleveland could also have a Satan GM, obviously, since John
Dorsey has moved on and McDaniels already has some ideas
if he gets the job. Mary kay Cabott is reporting
that McDaniels has three recommendations for GM. One top choice
would be Nick Kissario, who's been the Patriots director of
player personnels. It's two thousand and eight, and he would
also recommend either Scott Pioli or Dave Ziegler, who have

(16:16):
also both worked with McDaniels. So they have the choice now.
I mean every there weren't as many openings joy as
previous years. There weren't we usually have about seven. There
weren't as many openings. They now have the best choice
of everything out there, and there appears to be some
pretty solid choices. But you and I both believe they
got to give a five or six year contract here. Well,

(16:36):
the bar has been raised for what the contracts are
going to be with the Matt Rules situation. Since that
seven year deal. It just just disrupted everything when it
comes to contracts. So it's not like it's just not
will be unprecedented. If I was a coach going to
the grounds and I wasn't a first time head coach
who probably doesn't have as much negotiating power, I would

(16:57):
absolutely well Matt Rules the first time NFL head coach.
So maybe not. You have to ask for more years
off here with the Browns you demanded say time out. Hey,
I'm in a good spot already, and b you have
shown no ability to be patient. I want seven years
like Matt Rule. I don't think that's unrealistic at all.
I don't see how anyone goes to the Browns without
a deal like that now that Matt Rule has that

(17:18):
that deal having gone to the Panthers without any NFL
head coaching experience, right, it doesn't make any sense. And
the Panthers have been are not a dysfunctional organization, so
that that has to happen if here at the Browns.
It does kind of feel like this is just trending
in Josh McDaniels. Yes, DIRECTION totally agree. There's more stories
about Josh McDaniels than anyone else. Again, I don't I

(17:40):
don't love that, but I also am willing to give
him the benefit of the doubt. That it failed in
Denver and whatever happened with Indianapolis, who knows. Don't love
that situation, but he may have learned from previous mistakes,
and he does love Baker. I always say Josh McDaniels
is the College. He's the NFL version of Lane Kiffin.
IQ is high. The EQ sometimes is debatable. He rubs

(18:03):
a lot of people the wrong way. Can be a little,
uh you know, a little a little off putting for
some people, but both by the way, Lane was a
rock star. Lane got fired, Lane got humbled, Lane came
back and now look at Lane. Now he's now he
is the talking point in the South outside of Nick Saban.
So just because you fail in life, a lot of

(18:24):
people you know you can't now you fail in life
and Cleveland gives your job. I don't love the idea
that he's gonna now in Lamar Jackson's division and Mike
Tomlin's division own it. But we killed the yes. But
also the Indianapolis situation kind of is it's like a
little extra thing on top of situation. So it's not

(18:44):
like he just failed in Denver. There's something to that,
but it does look like it's trending towards Josh Mixaniels.
So the Ravens at a bye last week and many
of their key players rested week seventeen after locking up
the top seed in the AFC, but the players are
apparently not worried about being rusty. Lamar Jackson said he's
good to go, and Thomas just the importance of practice
this week. One player missing from practice yesterday was running

(19:05):
back mark Ingram after straining his calf in week sixteen.
John Harbaugh wouldn't comment on his status for Saturday's game.
I do think that that is something to pay attention.
By the way, calf injury. I had a calf injury.
Calf injuries are the worst. Did you have a calf injury?
They lastingly, Yes, they last forever. They don't. They're not
that painful. You think, here's the problem with calf injury.

(19:26):
It doesn't hurt that much. You're like, it's a little tight,
it's just nagging, and you re injure it over there.
They're They're very tricky. Calf injuries are not that painful
for most people. So you go out and you play.
From my case, I went and lifted and played tennis.
It feels great. Bob snapped it, So it just it's
one of those things where they stay with you for

(19:47):
a long time. I don't. I mean, I still believe
the Ravens are gonna win, whether mark Ingram is out
there or not. But I just think it's right. It
will affect, you know, probably where you put money on
this game. But he was fourteenth in the NFL and
rushing guards year in fourth the NFL with fifteen rushing
touchdowns and tied the franchise single season record He's a
big part of their offense obviously, aside from Lamar Jackson.

(20:08):
Also emotionally, Ingram's great. Yes, he's really one of those
big energy leader, been there one big games. He's a
total leader. It's a huge factor for that. Finally, Mike
McArthur McCarthy will officially be introduced as the Cowboys head
coach today. As you mentioned earlier, he's expected to keep
the team's young offensive coordinator Kellen Moore. He will poor
at least stay with the Cowboys for a second season.

(20:31):
More led the Cowboys to a league best four hundred
and thirty one point five yards per game and twenty
seven point one points per game, which was sixth in
the NFL. It's kind of it's interesting to read the numbers,
I know, surrounding Kelen Moore's offense because when dynamic look
at the Cowboys, it doesn't really feel like they're putting

(20:52):
up those kind of numbers. A lot of garbage time numbers.
In fairness, they had a lot of garbage time numbers. Yeah.
I mean Dak Press got the season in the NFL
and passing yards and fourth and passing touchdowns right, and
he had three thousand eight hundred and eighty five passing guards,
which is fifteenth in the NFL. I don't know, I
just I don't know. It just kind of feels a

(21:13):
little bit like a Jones family requests. I have nothing
of no information to verify the watchfair. It does feel
like we're not telling you to retain him, but it
would make it made the Jones family very happy if
you retained him. It does feel a little bit like that.
And Macarthy's also reportedly bringing in Mike Nolan as a
defensive coordinator. Now, some people don't love that. And John

(21:36):
Fassel is a special team squad, Dad, I love Fassel's
are great special teams. I don't hate the idea of
keeping Kellen Moore. It doesn't. My eyes tell me something
differently than the numbers you are telling you. And like
you said, some of the garbage time. But he's also young,
he's not stubborn. Young coaches get better, you know, if

(21:57):
he was sixty eight years old, Kellen, and I saw
the things I saw this year. When you're thirty one,
I'm like, okay, he's humbled. Yeah, it's okay. It's okay
to develop a little bit in your first year. I mean,
we did a little deep dive about you know how
he struggled against veteran defensive coordinators. You have to learn,
and he's learning on the job. I don't I don't
hate it. It's just I just I want to see

(22:18):
how it goes this year. Totally fairly comesable done giving
him another year. Yeah, that's good with it. Joey Taylor
with the news. Well, that's the news, and thanks for
stopping by the herd Line. There's a lot of things
going on. I've got some thoughts on Joe judges hiring.
I want to do that in about ten minutes. But first,
my buddy host of First Things First via the Coward
Global Satellite Network, sponsor by Mercedes Ben's the Best or Nothing,

(22:41):
Nick Wright. So I said yesterday, I love the way
Jeter retired and John Elway retired and Kobe and it's
one team and you get you're one of the all
time greats, and it's neat, and Tony Gonzalez you wrap
a bone, you're still capable. Elway won a Super Bowl MVP.
It would be just so neat and tidy for Tom
Brady to retire. Okay, he told us last night he's

(23:03):
not retiring. But it's funny, Nick, Football's the sport we
bet both of us do, and you get emotional to it,
and so and a Brady's emotional. So Brady takes a
deep breath, comes out with an Instagram and says, Okay,
further reflection, I'm gonna play again. And I was sitting
there driving to work this morning, and I'm thinking, further reflection,
they still have the best offensive line coach. They were

(23:24):
twelve and four. They have the best coach to get
their kicker back to fullback, back their center back. Could
I not argue, Nick, the Patriots are the best place
for a guy that loves repetition Tom Brady, Well, I
think in theory they might be, but they have he
I think clearly would ideally like to stay in New England.

(23:45):
I don't think that's ever changed. But New England keeps
flirting with the idea that they don't want him to stay.
And at some point the disrespect becomes too much. You
tried to bring in my replacement four or five years ago.
I had to go above your head, Belichick to get
him shipped out of here. I then the three years

(24:06):
leading into this year had the greatest comeback in Super
Bowl history in twenty sixteen, won a League MVP in
twenty seventeen and through for five Hondy in the Super Bowl.
Won another Super Bowl in twenty eighteen while beating the
league MVP on the road in the conference championship game
in comeback fashion. And you wouldn't give me an extension.
You said, nope, We're gonna play it year to year. Tom.

(24:29):
I said, I want to play till I'm forty five.
You won't even give me an extension till I'm forty three.
And then this year goes as poorly as it does,
and he says, sees Drew Brees as Michael Thomas and
Russell Wilson as the rookie wide receiver, maybe they should
have drafted and Patrick Mahomes as all these other weapons,
And all of a sudden, the Los Angeles Chargers look
pretty good. And you start to wonder if the Patriots,

(24:52):
if Belichick would even fight that hard to keep him,
because with or without a forty three year old Tom Brady,
the pay Triot era, the Patriot dynasty is over. I
feel like Belichick knows it, and I wonder if he
has opened the door just enough for Brady to walk
through it and become your next door neighbor, your palatial
Manhattan beach to stay. I would love that. Of course.

(25:16):
Let me throw this out with Joe Judge. I thought
it was a panic move. But let me let me
just say this, Sean McVay, I didn't know who he
was when he got hired at thirty. I didn't know
who John Gruden was when the Raiders gave him a job.
Mike Tomlin was thirty four. Young guys. If you go
look at many of the great coaches, they got hired
in their thirties. Belichick was thirty eight in Cleveland and grumpy. Okay,

(25:39):
so Joe Judge is thirty eight, and Belichick kept giving
him more and more stuff to do because he spotted
very early. This guy is special. Are guys like me
overreacting to Joe Judge because yesterday I said panic move,
not qualified other better candidates? Did I overreact yesterday? I
don't know that you overreacted. I had two reactions to

(26:02):
the Joe Judge higher. One is I actually liked the
idea of special teams coordinators getting head coaching jobs. I
would prefer you have been a head coach at some
point somewhere along the way, maybe a little more seasoned.
But I've heard from enough players who played for John
Harball who said they liked the way he was able
to look at the entirety of the team, not focused

(26:24):
just on one side of the ball, and I think
it actually could be an asset. And nobody, if you
remove the missfield goals part of it, nobody had better
special teams than the Patriots. So I'm happy for Joe Judge.
He learned from saving, he learned from Belichick. I am
not here to say that is the wrong hire. But
the other thread to this is one a lot of

(26:45):
people have discussed in it can't be ignored in a
league that is over sixty percent black, it is an
abomination that we have three black head coaches. It is
the same statistical probability if you woke up tomorrow in
a quarter of the National Hockey League's coaches were black,
you would say, well, that's a little curious development. But
when it's white people in the majority of it, we

(27:06):
don't have the same reaction. I'm not alleging racism and
not alleging a systemic issue to try to keep people
out of jobs, but the league has clearly gone towards young,
offensive minded, typically innovators. Yet Eric be Enemy continually gets
passed over when the two people who had his job
prior to him, Peterson and Nage, immediately get head coaching

(27:28):
jobs all of a sudden, Andy Reid calling the plays
isn't an issue for those guys, It is an issue
for the enemy. Byron Leftwich helped Jamis Winston throw for
over five thousand yards. No one mentions his name. Leslie
Frasier made the playoffs with Christian Ponder. Christian Ponder then
as one down year, he's gone and he's relegated to

(27:52):
being a defensive coordinator for a damn good Buffalo Bills team,
and no one brings him up. But we're gonna recycle
Jim Schwartz again. Really, so, I don't know how to
solve this. I'm not gonna act like I have the fix,
but and I feel badly that Joe Judge all of
a sudden became the face of it. That ain't his fault.
Good for him forgetting the job, But the league's got

(28:13):
to figure out and the teams have to figure out
why they are so they have no problem trusting black
people to play for them and to be positional coaches
for them. But there seems to be a very clear
glass ceiling, and it's a major issue that now seems
to be getting worse rather than getting better. By the way,

(28:34):
we agreed with you on that yesterday, there's sort of
indisputable evidence that certain guys need opportunities and they're not
getting him. And Schwartz is a great example who was
a disaster in Detroit, an utter disaster and by the
way of struggling in Philadelphia to get along with the
head coach. Let me stake away to this. You have
a relationship. Aaron Rodgers loves you for some unknown reason.

(28:55):
He just He and I do not connect. There's no
symbiotic relationship there. You guys connect what evs little jealous.
Not going to get into it, but I will say this.
We judge divorces based on the first week you go
to the gym, you get your abs. We judge divorces.
You know Kobe Shack, Oh Shack won. About five years
later Kobe won it. Westbrook kd We loved Westbrook winning

(29:18):
all the awards, and five years later Westbrook's kind of
a mess in the playoffs. Let me say this one
year McCarthy and Aaron Rodgers. If Aaron loses to Seattle
and McCarthy takes over easily the most talented team he's
ever had in Dallas, where they have an owner, they
land free agents, They've got terrific young talent. He's never

(29:42):
had a back like that. Is it possible than three
or four years we're looking back and saying, maybe Aaron's
difficult and maybe McCarthy was saddled with a guy who's
hard to coach, and McCarthy wins this divorce. It's not impossible.
It's not the craziest theory of yours I've heard this month,

(30:03):
but the month is young, and so however, I don't
think it's fair to say anyone was saddled with Aaron Rodgers.
And I am very curious to see how Mike McCarthy
works when all of a sudden he isn't coaching one
of the two most talented quarterbacks ever. He has gone

(30:24):
far to Rogers. Like you said, you're sponsored, I just
heard it sponsored by Mercedes Benz. If you're driving nothing
but has five hundreds and then you get a really
nice Accura, even if it's a good car, it doesn't
quite get up the way you're used to on the Highway.
So I'm curious how McCarthy's offense works with Dak. As
far as Aaron Rodgers was the more important part of this,

(30:45):
this is an incredibly critical game for him. Yeah, he
has that He's only had a buy three times in
his whole career. Brady had thirteen of them. He's only
had three. The first year with a buy, they were
fifteen and one he was League in b P and
they get annihilated by Tom Goughlin's purple face and the Giants.
His next time with a bye, that is the epic

(31:07):
comeback by the Seahawks in the NFC Championship game that
some people say was the fracturing point between McCarthy and
Rodgers all the way back in twenty fourteen. If they
don't take advantage of not only having a bye this year,
but avoiding the Saints who might have been better than them,
then you start to wonder, is Aaron Rodgers talent going

(31:30):
to be used as an arrow that has slung towards
him Allah Wilt Chamberlain. People talk about Wilt and how
dominant he was, almost as a sling because he didn't
win enough. So I'm not saying Rodgers got to win
the Super Bowl this year. But you can't go one
and done when you have a Seattle team that's been
overachieving their talent level coming to Lambeaux here this weekend.

(31:54):
You know what, I was going to ask another question,
and I don't even know. I've only got a minute left.
I'll just ask you this. I'm not as high on
Josh McDaniels as everybody else. I think he's Lane Kiffin
in the pros high IQ debatable EQ. I think he
can be rigid. I think he's got and I like Lane.
I text Lane all the time. I think he's a
very good coach, but he's dug some holes for himself.

(32:15):
I don't know if Josh and that ego and that
impatience is gonna work with Baker. I really don't. I
think he's gonna get the job. So just way in
for a minute. Is he the magic of licks her
that solves the Browns nightmares? All right? I know he
said we don't have a lot of times, and I apologize.
I gotta do this. I gotta once again bend over
and pick up the name you just dropped. Oh, you

(32:37):
text with Lane Kiffin all the time? Big Oh, sorry
about that, Colin Cowhard now aunt Listen McDaniels, I wouldn't.
I wouldn't hire a guy who renagged on the Colts
the way he did. But everyone seems to be over that.
That butt me like, everyone seems to be like that
was ancient history, that was twenty four months ago. No

(32:57):
one cares anymore, So I've got to move past it.
I do think it's possible he learned from his mistakes
in Denver, and I do think what he has learned
from Belichick, as far as teaching the team to not
allow any outside noise, is exactly what the Browns need.

(33:17):
And as far as the recycled head coaches who are
available to me, he would be near the top of
the list. But I do have similar EQ questions as
you do, and I don't know that we know those
have been solved. It's just that Belichick doesn't let his
assistance talk, so we don't have any expose. No, honestly,

(33:38):
they're not allowed, so we don't have any exposure to
whether or not he has matured. And before I go,
I missed your birthday Monday, So a happy belated birthday,
and they always say the question always is what do
you get the person who has everything? And so my
response was nothing, And so I'll just say happy birthday,
but sincerely nothing. Nick Right one of the best guys

(34:01):
I know. Thanks buddy, keep kicking. Butte Olays makes me laugh.
He makes a good point. Has he matured? Who knows?
He doesn't talk? I don't know. Coming up next Baltimore
is Carolina in twenty fifteen. But why I never bought
Carolina and cam and why I do by Baltimore potentially
becoming a ten year dynasty. That's coming up. Be sure

(34:24):
to catch live editions of The Herd weekdayson noon Easter
ninety em Pacific. Casper is the most loved and trust
and sleep company Casper dot Com. The code heard hundred
dollars toward the purchase of the mattress. Terms and conditions
apply Casper dot Com sleeping him every night. It's great.
So this weekend Lamar Jackson hosts and the Ravens John Harbaut,
they host the Tennessee Titans. I think Baltimore wins. I

(34:46):
think they went at convincingly. Mike Vrabel was asked about
how do you stop Lamar Jackson, and he had this
funny response other than try to tie his shoelaces together.
I mean, not many people have had success. You know,
we'll have to prepare and try to get our players
as ready as possible to defend not only him, but
for mark Ingram and the Edwards. It's impressive what they've done.

(35:08):
Let me just say this, Deshaun Watson had five game
winning come from behind wins this year. He trailed more
than he led this year. I think it's an amazing feat.
It's harder to play quarterback when you trail. I'm not
saying Deshawn's better than Lamar, but Lamar hasn't trailed a
lot this year. The way to beat Baltimore, and I mean,

(35:31):
at this point it's about all I've got. Get a
lead and cross your fingers, force him to play from behind.
You'll scale off. You know, they'll have to peel off
some of their running plays and they become perhaps a
little more predictable. Kansas City is two and oh against Baltimore.
In one of their games, they got a twenty three
six lead Baltimore had to throw. They had more success.

(35:54):
The Chargers beat him once when they got a twelve
nothing lead twenty to three. At one point they had
to peel off, did the Ravens. Some of their running
plays became a little more one dimensional, you know, inevitably,
what really makes Baltimore go is they're great at running,
and great at the quarterback running, and great at passing

(36:14):
and great at long ball passing. They do everything well.
What you hope to do is, if you get the
coin flip, do not defer it. Take it. Use every
trick play, every scripted play, get a lead, cross your fingers,
and hold on for dear life. They're doing so many
things at a high level right now. If you could
scale off, peel back some of their run options as

(36:37):
the clock expires late first half, forced them to throw,
that may help. It's not like it's a solution, but
it's the only thing I can think of because they're
not losing much and I do see a little bit
of a thread there, and I do think playing behind
always impresses me. It's Deshaun Watson trailed more than he
led this year. That's really impressive. To make the playoffs

(37:00):
and win a playoff game with that stat that's hard
to do. I've said before this Baltimore team really reminds
me of the Carolina twenty fifteen team. A lot of energy,
veteran coach, a unique quarterback talent. The league is kind
of bail and water on trying to figure out how

(37:22):
the hell to play it in the middle of a year.
It's like, how do we stop Cam? But there's a
difference here, and I got a lot of hate mail.
I never bought into Cam. Doesn't mean he can't be great,
but he was needy and moody and inconsistent. I didn't
think he was always coachable. His mechanics got worse over time,
and he wasn't very accurate. I never bought I think

(37:45):
teams ultimately become the personality of their quarterback. New England
is efficient and hard working. New England is resourceful. That's Brady.
Brady gets every ounce out of his talent. Carolina, to me,
was inconsistent. So is Cam. Lamar's different. I can see

(38:09):
them becoming a fifteen year dynasty. First of all, he's
gonna get hurt. Everybody tells me, well, can I see
him get hurt once? Before you say that he never
got hurt in college. You had a spray and ankle
mister one game in college, Anthony Davis, if you tell
me Joe lmbad, you know they get hurt a lot,
all right, I've got several examples. I'd like to see
Lamar get hurt before you tell me he's gonna get hurt,
because I don't see him getting hurt. And I've seen

(38:31):
him get whacked about fifteen times this year. But here's
why I buy in the Lamar. And I never bought
in the Cam. And everybody loved Cam's arm and Cam's
bigger and stronger and the best red zone quarterback running ever,
but I never I never liked Cam's traits. I love
Lamar's traits. His mechanics are better, Like I didn't like

(38:52):
his mechanics in college. Oh they're better and they're more consistent,
and they're getting better. So he's more coachable. He's got
a chip on his shoulder. Cam in college wanted to
be a star. Lamar wants to win football games. Lamar's
like I mean literally, he don't want to talk. He's
not into all that stuff. He's totally into football. He's
totally coachable. His mechanics are getting better. He puts himself

(39:13):
in harm's way. But He's incredibly humble. When I look
at all these quarterbacks, you guys are falling in love
with arms. I'm falling in love with traits. I don't
like Baker Mayfield's traits. I don't like Johnny Manziel's traits.
I didn't like Jay Cutler's traits. Jamis Winston in college
stealing krablegs. I don't like your traits. Your size is fine,

(39:34):
like Lamar's traits. Those are Dynasty traits. I'm coachable, I
got a chip on my shoulder. My mechanics get better.
Brady's been working on mechanics in the offseason. Who go
down to Costa Rica with his wife? He's working on mechanics.
He's obsessed with it. He's obsessed with film. Russell Wilson
not the perfect size, is not the greatest arm. He
has great traits, driven, chip on his shoulder, resourceful. So

(40:00):
it's funny they This team really does remind me of
the Carolina Panthers. And I don't think it means they'll
lose in the Super Bowl. I don't. I would probably
give them a Super Bowl win unless they play the
Niners again, And I don't know. I'll wait till I
see it. But I think this thing lasts. I think
it's durable. I think it's gonna get better. I don't
think Lamar cares about being a star. I think he

(40:21):
wants to win games. I think he's humble and I
and this, to me, this Baltimore thing has fifteen years
on it. It feels like it's gonna last a long time.
I never felt that with Carolina, never felt it. So
it's exciting. I think they're gonna win this weekend. I
don't think there's a way to stop it. I think
there's a way to force Baltimore to scale off some

(40:43):
of their running plays if you lead late half, late
third quarter. But they're fun to watch. I like watching them,
and if they're the next Dynasty, I'm good with it.
All the things I love about football, all the traits
and habits. Baltimore's got all of them. I'm totally in.
Never was on Carolina Oldly Am Here, Our two, next
one More Heard. The Herd streams twenty four hours a day,

(41:05):
seven days a week within the iHeartRadio app. Search Herd
to listen live or on demand whenever you like. Ah
Here we Go on a Wednesday, live in Los Angeles,
This is the herd wherever you may be in however
you may be listening. iHeartRadio, Fox Sports Radio, and FS one.
Joy Taylor is joining me in less than fifteen minutes.

(41:26):
Peter Schreger from New York, the very latest on the
Cleveland Brown situation. Shreigs has as many sources as anybody.
We're so lucky here. We've got Jay Glazer and Peter Schreger.
They break a lot of stories, so he'll give us
all sorts of stuff under fifteen minutes. Great to have
him in. And Joy is joining me. How are you, Joy,
I'm doing great. So yesterday when Joe Judge got hired,

(41:49):
you know, and happened right before the show, my takeaway
as good. God, this feels like a panic move. Take
a deep breath. I come in the next day, read everything.
And one of the things to remember about Dave Gettlman,
who I don't think is my cup of tea, but
he did get Daniel Jones. I thought it was a reach,
and Daniel Jones looked very good this year. He looked
very good, So I'm wrong. He's right on that he

(42:10):
did a very good job. It's only fair to credit
him for getting on Daniel Jones because we all kind
of rolled our eyes. He also worked with Ron Rivera
down in Caroline and helped build a Super Bowl roster.
So Getleman knows personnel. I think he's bad at a microphone.
He can be clunky in old school, which I'm not
a huge fan of, but not all old as bad.
Vic Fangio at Denver had a pretty good year. He

(42:30):
actually did that should have won more games. They were
in a lot of them. So let me just say
this about Joe Judge. He's known the knock on Pat Shermer.
And I was told this by a source that's as
good as any source you can have with the Giants.
It's a player. Pat Shermer had no presence. Smart guy,
no presence. Joe Judge has a presence. Walked into Gettleman,
blew him away with his presence. So it's a pendulum

(42:52):
swing higher. You have a guy with no presence, he fails.
He's smart with no presence. Joe Judge walks in, doesn't
have the experience you think, then blows your way verbally,
blows you away with his presence. Guy was a quarterback
in high school. He's dealt with Belichick and say, but
then he go, wow, does that mean it'll work? No?
But remember Gettleman hired Ron Rivera. Ron Rivera's the ultimate

(43:12):
presence guy. Ron is a big, physical, alpha male. He
walks into a room. Rivera is not known as one
of the great schemers. He's a presence guy walks into
the room and players are afraid of him. Right. He's
a big man. It's like Jack del Rio. He's a
big dude. He's Anthony Lenno the Chargers. He's got a presence.
Guys respect guys. Big, strong, can use volume, can intimidate.

(43:35):
And so Joe Judge has some of this. But here's
the other thing I've seen in my life because I
got a lot of perspective on this, that almost there
are exceptions. There are late bloomers, but most people who
are exceptional you spot very early. Andre Agassi at nine
years old. His dad had him play really good adults,

(43:57):
not pro players, but adults at nine years old beat him.
Bryce Harper at sixteen, hit a high school baseball five
hundred feet lebron at fifteen. Tiger Woods signed with IMG
privately at eleven years old. They agreed to a deal
privately at eleven years old. He was on Mike Douglas
when he was four, The Mike Douglas Show. Eddie Murphy

(44:20):
got to Saturday Night Live at nineteen years old. Steven
Spielberg released Jaws in his twenties, Bill Gates and Mark
Zuckerberg by twenty three were richer than anybody listening to
this show. Exceptional people separate early, and you can spot him.

(44:42):
Joe Judge is in his thirties. It's very possible Gettleman
saw what Saban did and what Belichick did. Belichick kept
giving him more and more and more and more assignments.
He gave him the special teams the last five years.
The reason he gave him the wide receiver coach this
year because he wanted to give him enough to be
impressive to get a job. That's what Andy Reid does.

(45:04):
He'll give his coaches more play calling, more exposure for
the team so they get interviewed for jobs like Matt
Nage and according to sources this morning, it's being documented
that Belichick loved him and kept giving him more and
gave him the wide receiver job so that he could
get interviews for a head coach. He walked into the
Giants and blew everybody away. Just think about this, though,

(45:27):
many of the legends. Sean mcfay Sean McVeigh, who was
also a quarterback in high school, got a job at
thirty years old in Los Angeles the Los Angeles NFL team.
Kyle Shanahan at thirty seven years old, Mike Tomlin and
Bill Kuer of the Steelers not even thirty five yet.

(45:52):
John Gruden had been offensive coordinator for a couple of
bad Eagle teams. Got a head coaching job in Oakland
at thirty four. Al Dave spotted him. Mike Shanahan, You
didn't know who he was thirty five. John Madden in
an era that the NFL was a good old boy
network thirty two years old. That is unbelievable. Don Shula

(46:15):
maybe the best coach in the seventies in the league
thirty three, and Belichick at thirty eight. Exceptional people you
spot him. Tim Legler told me one time he's a
former NBA guy in a broadcaster. He walked into a
gym in Philadelphia and all these NBA guys were planning,
and he goes, who is that. I've been in the

(46:38):
league twelve years. They said his name is Kobe Bryant.
He's a he's a junior in high school. And Legler went,
oh my, oh, junior in high school, just sixteen turning
seventeen coaching. There's no late bloomers in tech, in comedy,
in Hollywood. You look around, you can spot him early.

(47:00):
Maybe Joe Judge walks into a room. Saban elevated him,
Belichick elevated him, Dave Gettlman blown away by him. Maybe
I'm wrong. We'll see. Still feels a little panicky. Matt
rule is my choice, but we'll see. I want to
talk about the Cleveland Browns, of course I do. That's
what I do for now a living. Everybody's got their coach,
and everybody's got their GM, except the Cleveland Browns. And

(47:23):
it appears, according to sources, we'll ask Peter Schreeger about
this in less than ten minutes. Nick Casario, who's the
patriots de facto GM, and Josh McDaniels are the leader
in the clubhouse. Chat o'sha is on the market, another Patriot.
He could be the OC, I would guess. So now
let me just say this. It sounds good, right. A
lot of this New England stuff hasn't worked. Atlanta their

(47:46):
GM is a former Patriot, Thomas Demotrough, and so is
the assistant GM. And they are the most maddening inconsistent
team in the NFL. Houston's got a bunch of patriots,
and is anybody more inconsistent? Detroit has a coach that's
a patriot and a GM that's a patriot, and the
Lions once again stink. Kansas City had patriot Scott Pioli

(48:07):
and Romeo Crennell and Andy Reid had to come in
and clean it up. And Cleveland's had Eric Mangini and
Romeo Crenell and that didn't work either. Tennessee. You can't
count Rabel, he never coached under Belichick. They do have
a former patriot as GM. They didn't get worse, but
they didn't get better once again, Tennessee. Michael is nine

(48:29):
and seven. Cleveland's issues, to me really aren't head coach
going forward. They're really not general manager Cleveland as an
owner and a quarterback issue. They're both incredibly impulsive and
impulsive does not win in this league. Patience sleeping on it,

(48:56):
taking a deep breath on it like Tom Brady did
in his instagram. The Browns owner is impulsive and Baker Mayfield,
though talented, is absurdly impulsive, So the coach doesn't matter
unless the owner improves, and McDaniels is not going to
survive if Baker doesn't improve. Regardless of who you put in,

(49:20):
no impulsive owners are winning super Bowls and no impulsive
quarterbacks are either. That's the issue. Both are clearly correctable.
Baker still a young man, Jimmy Haslam certainly smart. He
could become more patient. Maybe that's his new Year's resolution.
But we pay so much attention to Cleveland running through

(49:42):
coaches and gms. That is not their issue today. The
owners got to sign this new coach to a seven
year deal and back off, and the quarterback needs to
grow up. That is the issue. Coming up next, Peter
Schreger all sorts of good stuff around the corner. Be
sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays in

(50:03):
noon eastern nine am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio FS
one and the iHeartRadio app. Sunday, Russell Wilson leads the
Seahawks into Lambeau for a showdown against Aaron Rodgers and
the Packers and the NFC Divisional rounds. It all starts
at six eastern on Fox and the Fox Sports. I
feel like the whole season for Seattle has been a gift.

(50:23):
I didn't think they'd be here. I mean, they're in
a division with Kyler Murray was better than we thought.
The Niners are better than we thought, the Rams are
still capable, and here Seattle. I mean, it's just it's
just they if they win this game, like we should
just really make an exception. Put Russell Wilson and Pete
Carroll in the Hall of Fame while they're coaching and playing,

(50:45):
because Green Bay should win this game. They're healthy, they're
at home, they're rested. By the way. The Herd brought
to you by discover dot com, slash cash back Match,
Discover Match and all the cash back you earn at
the end of your first year, no limit. All right,
we got all sorts of stuff. I lean on Peter Schreger.
He does a Sunday show with me. He also is
one of the hosts of Good Morning Football in the
NFL network via the Coward Global Satellite Network, live from

(51:08):
New York. Peter Schreger, Fox NFL Reporter. All right, this
is what you do for a living. This is what
I lean on. You on Joe Judge, I said, I
read a bunch of stuff this morning. He's verbal, he's
got a presence. He blew away gettleman. I know Belichick
liked him. You did intel, I said yesterday it felt
like a panic move, but you did some intel. What
are you hearing on Joe Judge that he comes from

(51:28):
a great pedigree and as a leader of men, I
want to give some splashy hot take that this was
a rush tire or they should have gone a different direction.
But after talking over the last twenty four hours, Joe
Judge had an incredible interview over the week and over
the weekend, and then they did their research and it's
Belichick and it's Sabin and at the bottom at the
end of the day, giants are looking at it and

(51:49):
they said, Okay, here are all our different options for
meeting with all these different guys. This guy's got five
championship rings in ten years, and Belichick and Sabin from
the Mountaintops were recommending him. Two people to take a look.
And Belichick this year not only give him that wide
receiver's role, but start opening him up to the media
a little bit more. He was being groomed as one
of these leaders of men. Now here's the key thing. Colin.

(52:11):
He's not an x as and o's guy. He doesn't
do hey third quarter, Daniel Jones, third and twelve. He's
not McVeigh, Kyle Shanahan in the ear of the quarterback.
He is a CEO. The key is going to be
who he brings in as his offensive coordinator, who he
brings in as his defensive coordinator, and also what kind
of culture he's building. Because Pat Shermer is a good
offensive coach, he's also a good man. I'm told that

(52:31):
Joe Judge, even though he's thirty eight years old. This
is going to be a team that is going to
practice hard. There will be some live tackling in practice,
and there will be a new culture in New York,
one that might be a little bit more tough guy
than finesse offense. Yeah, that was the knock gun. Shermer
not a ton of presence. He was a good play caller,
but didn't have that and the team got couldn't get

(52:53):
big tough yard or make big tough stops. Let's go
to Matt Rule. He's been a turnaround guy, a little
bit more more of a schematic guy than just a
presence guy, always supposed to be a great motivational speaker.
Now I thought everything I read he was going to
be the Giants coach. Carolina snags him explain please, yeah,
this is out of a Hollywood script, and you'll love

(53:13):
this more than anyone Collins. So, David Tepper's the owner
of the Carolina Panthers. Not only was he a former
minority owner of the Steelers, he's also maybe one of
the richest men in the world. And he also built
one of the most successful hedge funds from the ground
up at what he did at Appaloosa on Wall Street.
If you know Wall Street folks, they talk about Temper
as a closer, a guy who just gets things done

(53:35):
and has a vision ahead of the game. So Tepper
walks in there knowing he's going to interview Matt Rule
before the Giants, and everyone's thinking Rule has all these
connections to New York and the Giants, and Temper basically
did one of those moves where he's like, ABC always
be closing, You're not getting out of here. And what
he told Matt Rule was, I've already rebuilt the entire
business side of this building over twelve months, I've cleaned

(53:57):
up a lot there and it's a blank slate. I
want you do build from the ground up, and I'm
gonna give you that opportunity to do so. I will
also give you all of the resources, both for you
personally and for this program that you ever will need.
Tepper came in there and said, look, I used to
work with the Steelers. I'm a Western Pennsylvania guy, and
we had three coaches from nineteen seventy on, Chuck Noll,

(54:20):
Bill Kaller, and Mike Tomlin. That's what I want to
build here, and stability is the key word. You start
thinking about all the money you can make, you can
build it on your ground up and you can really
build the old culture. Then you look at the giants
and I'm not saying Rule was way in one or
the other, but there's Mara, there's Tiss, there's Gettleman, there's
Kevin Abrams, There's all this stuff that this is a

(54:40):
blank slate in Carolina and a blank check from David Tepper.
He never left his living room. He got the deal done.
Amazing closing job by Tepper, got the guy he wanted,
and Matt Rule is going to be the Carolina Panthers
head coach. I'll tell you this, he's gonna do. His
press conference is welcoming press conference today. I think NFL
fans are be very impressed with what they see. He's
interviewed for two other jobs, the Jets and the Colts,

(55:01):
and I've had leadership in brass from both those teams.
Tell me he blew them away for those gigs. Matt
Rule is going to be a guy to watch, not
only at the podium, but with what he builds in Carolina. Okay,
so Mike McCarthy gets the cowboy jobs, stayed the night
with Jerry. He had to say something that Jerry liked
to hear, because I don't think any of us thought
he was the lead candidate. Lincoln Riley didn't even get
the He didn't even get you know, interviewed. So is

(55:23):
it did he say something about, you know, Jerry Dak?
I mean, what was the sauce that got McCarthy for
Jerry to say, stay the night at my house, We
got to meet for breakfast and talk again. Sounds like
a great situation if you're Mike McCarthy. Here's the deal.
Jason Garrett was gone regardless Jason Garrett is this Princeton academic,

(55:44):
this aeradite guy who can do it all and is
really well respected and loved in that building. If you
bring in Lincoln Riley or you bring in Urban Meyer,
you're basically saying, Okay, guys, here's what we can offer you.
Mike McCarthy came in there and Colin from everyone I
speak to, was like, I just want to coach ball.
I want to coach football, and I am focused on football,
and I've taken the past year to not only look

(56:04):
at what maybe went wrong at the end of the
Green Bay era, but what I can do to get better.
This guy, I talked about it on the Fox NFL
kickoff show We Do. They built a bunker in his house.
He would have Frank Signetti Junior, and he would have
Jim Hazlitt come over and on Mondays they would watch
the entire league, not just the broadcast copy. They'd go
through the all twenty two and watch all of these

(56:25):
different teams and use analytics, Yes, analytics. Mike McCarthy, who's
this Western Pennsylvania former tollbooth guy, would come in and say,
let's look at the analytics. Let's embrace it. He sold
this to Jerry Jones and said, basically, I just want
to coach football. And I watched all these quarterbacks. There's
a lot to like about Dak Prescott. I think I
can get the best out of him. This was a
football hire through and through. Jerry Jones is very happy

(56:48):
with having a football guy and Mike McCarthy and also
bringing in what he's going to have. And already they've
hired the special teams coach from the Rams, John Fossil,
who's very well respected known as Bones and Jet, and
his defense of coordinator. We don't. Mike Nolan we know
as a football man as well. So this is going
back to basics Cowboys football. Let's get us back to greatness. Okay,
Cleveland's the last team. They got the pick of the

(57:10):
letter here. I've said before, I know Josh McDaniels is smart,
he's better than Freddie Kitchens. But until this owner's less impulsive,
and until Baker's less impulsive, I don't care who coaches.
I really don't. If the owner is this impatient, it'll
never work, and if Baker's this impulsive, it'll never work.
So I think those two things are key. But they're
gonna hire somebody here, I would guess that is offensive minded.

(57:33):
That's my gut with Baker. You got to save your
number one pick? Or am I wrong? Is Josh McDaniel
the leader in the clubhouse today? I don't think we're
having an answer to the Browns coaching job until early
next week. I'll tell you why. Josh McDaniels does an
interview till Friday, and the day before him to me
is a very interesting interview. Kevin Stefanski and Amy. You're
not going to hear a bunch out of on every show,

(57:54):
but Kevin Stefanski is the offensive coordinator of the Minnesota Vikings.
Last year, Stefanski came in there and wowed the Browns,
absolutely blew them away, using analytics, forward thinking and spoke
to Paul de Podesta, who is one of the chief
strategy guys in that room, and spoke very clearly with him.
John Dorsey pushed hard and got Freddy Kitchens the job. Well.

(58:15):
De Podesta really liked Stevanski. He's gonna meet Thursday McDaniels
on Friday. Little note on McDaniels. The year that Baker
was the number one overall pick, there was a lot
of talk about how much the Patriots brass liked Baker Mayfield,
and knowing that Brady's days might be done at some point,
do we move up in the draft and try to
take a swing at Baker if he slips. He didn't slip.

(58:36):
But when you think offense in New England, Josh McDaniels
was one of those guys, and if he was interested
in Baker Mayfield, then I'm sure he's interested. Now. Two
more names, really quickly. Robert Slow the defensive coordinator, very
impressive out of San Francisco. He's a name you're hearing.
And Jim Schwartz is interviewing with the Cleveland Browns today.
He's got history with the Browns. Also a guy defense,

(58:57):
all business, no joking around. Let's be the best and
most discipline team on Sunday. That might work more than
the loudest team all offseason. By the way I said
this earlier, I got a lot of heat. I think
the Ravens remind me a lot of the Carolina Panthers
in twenty fifteen, where there's this unique quarterback the league's
baling water on how to face him. They've got a
ton of energy, a lot of young players in a

(59:18):
belief system. They're playing at home, and I think Baltimore
is a really special team. I don't think you can
stop Lamar. I think you can, you know, hopefully get
ahead on him, force him to maybe run less. But
I'll tell you I never bought into Carolina and Cam
because I didn't like Cam's habits. I thought he was
sometimes unfocused. I didn't like his mechanics. I thought he
was hard to coach. I didn't think he was always humble,

(59:39):
and frankly, even in his MVP year, he completed fifty
nine percent of his throws. Lamar's a better thrower, deep, intermediate, short.
I think he's humble. I think he's all about football.
I think the next dynasty could be staring us right
in the face in Baltimore, and I'm all in on it.
I like it. What if people around the league say
to you about Lamar and the Ravens going forward, how

(01:00:02):
this team is so unique, and that they were the
outliers this year and they were completely zigging when everyone
was zagging. You know, over the offseason they built an
offense around Lamar Jackson's talents. Now, Cam Newton was in
that Mike Shula offense. He got a lot of draw plays.
He did some things with his legs. This team they
run with a fullback and three tight ends in their

(01:00:23):
core offense. Sometimes they put six offensive linemen out. So
everything Lamar's doing a lot of that is just how
great Lamar is in the open field and how well
he can pass. The other part of it is they
built a team and an offense around his skill set.
You will never see a team block like they block
for Lamar Jackson in Baltimore. Watch it on Saturday Night.
A lot of times Andrew's boyle Anne hayden Hurst are

(01:00:45):
all in the field the same time, and a lot
of times they're blocking for him. And they've got a
fullback in Patrick Ricard. Not a lot of these teams
use fullbacks. They use the fullback. He's out there just
about every play number forty two he blocks for Lamar Jackson.
So it's not just Lamar, it's a philosophy. It's a
culture and a team that completely bought in to what
they're doing. In twenty twenty m beyond I love this.

(01:01:07):
I think Lamar Jackson's here to stay. And guess what
if no one's been able to hit him and knock
him down in seventeen weeks. I don't see it happening
in the playoffs either. Yeah. Never got hurt at Louisville.
Either missed one game because a sprayinged ankle. I sprained
my ankle walk into the set this morning, so he
can't tell me he's his injury prone Shreig's great seeing you, buddy.
Happy birthday, Colin. You're the best dude, all right. You
know the everything about Cam and Lamar. Cam was such

(01:01:30):
a beaute through such a beautiful football. I mean it
was so I mean, god, he's just so big a
statue ask. We always thought great thrower of the football,
not really Lamar because he kind of flips it and
he's got a weird motion. We're like, I don't know
about a thrower. He's a much better thrower of the football.
This was always my knock on Kaepernick. Kaepernick through they
had no breaking pitch. Kaepernick would throw a screen pass
one hundred and nineteen miles an hour. A lot of quarterbacks.

(01:01:53):
I was talking to Jimmy Johnson about this with Troy Aikman.
He goes, Troy was accurate. Troy through so many balls
is great, he said, But Troy was never great at
that little flag pattern where you got to go over
a corner or a linebacker and he goes. So we
faced the Giants one year and we knew the coverage
and literally I told Troy, you're gonna have to make

(01:02:14):
that throw. But nine times he goes. It's all we
worked on. So as great as Troy was, quarterbacks can
make some throws and struggle with others. Even Troy, but
who I view as big, strong, perfect, one of the
eight best quarterbacks in my life, great leadership skills. But
Jimmy said, there were throws, you know, the lof throw
over a linebacker he goes. That was never Troy strength,

(01:02:36):
arm strength, accuracy. When you watched Lamar, he's got a
beautiful touch, I never felt I've never felt Cam as
a great touch. He's got a howitzer, he's got a can,
and he can throw a strawberry through a battleship. But
I never feel like Cam can give you the soft
and give you the touch. I mean, that's the first

(01:02:57):
thing that jumped out to me when I watched Lamar
last year. It's like, listen, he can deliver that little
seam rainbow. He's great at it. He is I mean
that you can't get past it. Man. He is accurate,
it is instinctive. He had kind of funky mechanics I
thought out of college, but he's cleaned most of those up.

(01:03:17):
He's getting better as a thrower. Joey Taylor with a
news no, no turn on the news. This is the
herd Line News sponsored by Mercedes Bets the Best or Nothing.
So Mike Raybol is preparing his team to take on
the dynamic Ravens offense that you were just talking about
this Saturday. Lamar Jackson has led their electrifying rushing attack,

(01:03:41):
and Raybol had a pretty funny response when he was
asked how to stop him other than try to tie
his shoelaces together. I mean, not many people have had success.
You know. We'll have to prepare and try to get
our players as ready as possible to defend not only him,
but for mark Ingram and then Edwards. It's impressive what
they've done. Now the Titans rushing game is nothing to

(01:04:04):
shy away from either. Dereck Henry was unbelievable and unstoppable
against the Patriots and very poer carries for one hundred
and eighty two yards and touchdown. Five point four yards
per care. How much does he wake because he is
a house he looks like he weighs two hundred and
forty pounds. Any Derreck Henry's one of those guys if
he gets to the second line, joy cornerbacks are like,

(01:04:25):
I'm not sure two hundred and forty seven pounds. Yeah,
I'm sorry, but he wrote. I mean when you watch
Derrick Henry, you can see joy when he gets through
the first line. Yeah, it's and it's safeties in corners
like they're all looking around like I wouldn't want to
be in that position. New but Lamar Jackson and mark
Ingram have been incredible all season. The mark Ingram thing

(01:04:46):
is kind of interesting though, because he does have a
lingering calf injury. Harbaugh is not given a full report
on him yet. You're probably not going to find out
until Saturday. Something can pay attention to. But the Ravens
are nine and a half point favorites against the Titans.
You like the ray scoring the backs that I like
the Niners. I like the Ravens. I like the Chiefs
to win convincingly. Seattle Green Bay. I just I'm done

(01:05:10):
betting against Seattle. I have no idea. I just stay
I wouldn't bet that game. I think Kansas City in Baltimore,
I don't think you. I think their defense is right now,
are as good as their offenses. I think Kansas City's
defense something happened about week twelve. It is big boy football.
I don't think that the Ravens are going to have
any rust person. Yeah, but I do think that was

(01:05:31):
a huge, obviously huge win for the Titans last week.
It was great for the or the city. It was
a great franchise win. So I'm always a little weary
of those big emotional wins like the Vikings. What happens
the next week? Right Like? Are you going to be
able to get up that way again to a far
superior situations? The Pats brought up We said this this morning.

(01:05:52):
If you go look at franchises that have a huge
franchise win, they come back the next week if they
have to go on the road, and it's never the
same team, Like, I don't think that is such a bit.
Did you see Clay Travis after they want I don't
think he slept for four days. When you have a
franchise win, right like, it is hard to go back
on the road. I've seen it in college, like you

(01:06:14):
have the biggest win in the history of your program,
in a week later you can't beat the you know,
crappy team down the road. No that said that these
are pros, But I'm just I'm going to be very
interested to see how the Ravens start, because, like you
said earlier, there's not really a way to beat the Ravens.
But the people that have beat the Ravens have done
so by getting a lead. That's your best shot. So

(01:06:35):
I'm interested to see how this game starts. So Tom
Brady posted to Instagram today that he plans to keep
playing football in twenty twenty. But where is still the question. Well,
his former teammate Drew Bledsoe got a new start with
the Bills after being traded by the Patriots, and he
thinks that is the kind of challenge that Brady might
just need. This is where it might be kind of
intriguing for you know, for Tommy. All of a sudden,

(01:06:57):
you feel like a rookie again. You know, you're in
a brand new organization, a new situation, new coach, and
new teammates. And it was kind of inspiring, honestly to
it to take on a new challenge in Buffalo. You know,
different organizations do it different ways. But but you know,
maybe maybe interesting for him to go take on a
new challenge. Gosh, a different perspective, No, I think listen
and Drew is I loved a place I was at

(01:07:20):
for twelve years. It is energizing. It's a lot of work,
but it's it really energizes you. You're you're just trying,
You're meeting new people, you're doing new stuff. There's a
new pressure challenges. Yeah, I mean it's I can I
still don't feel deep down. Tommy loves being a patriot.
He really loves being this franchises corner. I think he does.

(01:07:41):
But every time that I think there is this undying
loyalty that someone has anybody in any business and evaporates.
They sometimes just go ahead and surprise you. And I
also think that we've gotten a little more of a
glimpse into Brady's personality and you know, his his personal
life over the past couple of years, He's opened up

(01:08:02):
a lot, you know, Tom versus time and you know,
we know about some of the issues, if you will,
that have gone on over the years with I mean,
obviously Jimmy Garoppolo is a big situation. So I don't know.
I just I personally feel like he's leaving, and this
is kind of part of why, Like I think that
he wants to win a championship without Bill Belichick. And

(01:08:22):
I don't think it's anything about loyalty. Like, I don't
think you can ever question Brady's loyalty to no. I
mean he's taking pay cuts, He's all about the organization.
Like how much money has he left on the table?
One undrellion dollars? Yeah, I know many people that are
that loyal, not a lot at all. Finally, receiving the
NBA conference finalists in the playoffs has been discussed as
part of a proposal to reshape the league calendar. The

(01:08:45):
plan would have the top four teams seated according to
regular season record, not separated by conference, in effort to
get the best matchup in the finals, but now that
change is reportedly being tabled after concerns from NBA owners
because teams on the hosts are worried about increased travel,
which could lead to competitive disadvantages and a loss of
traditional conference rivalries. Can I have one opinion on this?

(01:09:10):
Here's what we know in the world that we live
in now, joy with Netflix and Hulu, where there's a
lot of good options at night. Now that if you're
not what I would call an urgent sport like World Cup, Olympics, NFL,
Tiger Woods, Sunday at the Masters, a big fight, those
are urgent. So the Netflix world is not going to
penetrate that. We still love our sports when they matter,

(01:09:33):
but sports played at night and I can go to
my wife. I just binge watched seven episodes of Servant
on Apple TV. The minute the football season ended. I
felt like I owed my wife Binge watching for a
couple of nights. I still say the NBA the product's fine.
Sixty eight regular season, first round of the playoffs, get

(01:09:54):
it down to three games. March Madness. College basketball is
not close in quality to the NBA. It's not even close.
It's that's a different sport. But March Madness rate because
of urgency. It's you can you create all these ideas,
but just give me fewer NBA games forcing me to
have to watch because each one's more meaningful. Because I'm

(01:10:17):
telling you, the quality of the NBA is great. The
kids are wonderful. No bad guys in the league. Yeah,
you're preaching everything that you're saying is the truth. It's
I mean, I do think that there's a factor of
there are no villains this year. The story is dramatic,
and that is a big part of the NBA conversation.
It's just a part of the culture of the NBA.

(01:10:38):
But yes, create urgent, many options for entertainment now, more
than ever in the history of time. Not even mentioned
your phone, Like there's a million different distractions that you have.
It has to be more urgent. There is no brands
creative play in mid season tournament thing that's going to
fix this, and players aren't going to buy into that anyway.

(01:11:01):
Nobody wants to play a meaningless tournament in the middle
of the season. But what if you start in the season,
make the games matter more and your playoff series until
you get to the conference finals, make them three or two.
I mean, god, the Lakers could lose their first two
games to a team and eight seats. It does the
issue though, like you're going to be giving up ticket sales.
The NBA's up. I'm with you. It's you can't. You

(01:11:25):
can't put the greed over the long term macro situation.
That's what it is. It's not one single thing. The
NFL has all these young, great, exciting quarterbacks. It's all
these amazing storylines. Like, there's a lot of factors in it,
but it all comes down to what you said, which
is urgency. Yeah, football, college and pro is not going down.
The World Cup's not going down. Tiger Woods and a

(01:11:46):
big tournament's not going down. Why because you've got to
get to a TV and see it. It It matters. NBA
shortened season, shorten playoffs because I just went to an
NBA game in Utah. It was so much fun. Everyone
is great. There's so much. My family's like, how much
fun was tonight? It was great. Every game is entertaining,
kids are the players are great guys. It's it's a
wonderful product. Alright, joy with the news. Well that's the news,

(01:12:12):
and thanks for stopping by. Certainly I took that a
whole segment over. I was just I got to get
this off my chest. I've been talking about this in
meetings for two weeks, right though. It is. Yeah, this Netflix, Amazon, Prime,
Apple TV World at night, I'm a guy. I gotta
give my wife some binge watching. So you make the
games count and I don't go to Netflix. I go

(01:12:33):
to the sport, Tiger Woods and the Masters. I'm not
going to subscription TV. I'm watching, you know, the US
Open or the Masters. With that, you gotta create urgency
because that Netflix world is crushing non urgent sports. Baseball
regular season, college basketball, regular season, hockey regular season. Just
go and watch Narco's season seven. All right. Stanford Route

(01:12:57):
former chief dB next to Herd. Be sure to catch
live editions of The Herd week dayson NOUN eastern nine
am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio FS one and the
iHeart Radio app. Stanford Route, former NFL dB seven years
in Oakland, played for Kansas City in Houston. Two drafted
by the Raiders who are moving to Las Vegas. Let's
start with this. Stand for Joe Judge to the Giants.

(01:13:19):
Nobody knows who he is. You're a former player. He's
gonna walk into the room. He's young, nobody knows who
he is. How do you think it plays? Man? That
takes me back to two thousand and seven when we
hire Lane Kiffin as a head coach. And I remember
he came over from USC. I believe he was the
receiver's coach and everybody on the team that had no

(01:13:41):
affiliation with University of Southern California had no idea who
he was. And so the main thing is that when
you're coming into an organization, obviously as a young head coach,
you have to make sure that you're authentic. You have
to make sure that you're transparent because us as players,
we can see it when you're trying to be something
you're not. We already know that. Okay, the owner hired you,
so really you're just kind of like a puppet for him.

(01:14:04):
So in a lot of ways, if he's gonna win
that locker room, he's got to make sure that he
is authentic whoever he is. And nobody in America knows
that except the New England Patriots players. Whoever he is,
he's got to be that guy. Otherwise players are gonna
be able to easily sniff that out. Okay, Similarly, here's
another young guy who has experienced it, failed in Josh McDaniels.

(01:14:27):
So how do the players. Let's say Josh McDaniels gets
the Cleveland job, so he failed in Denver. You know,
nobody thinks he's running the team. Belichick is do you
think he would work in Cleveland, knowing that he's what
a player buy into. He's failed and we know Belichick
and Brady run the show. And not to mention, he
built on the Indianapolis coach I thought was a weird hour.

(01:14:51):
I think that he's gonna have to make sure to
go in there and be able to relate to those players.
He's gonna have to be able to relate to Baker Mayfield,
Odell Beckham, jous Landry Miles, Garrett David and Joe who.
He's gonna have to be able to relate to these
new age players because I remember when he signed on
as the head coach for Denver, he immediately wanted to
trade for Matt Castle, and that was much to the

(01:15:13):
ire of a Jay Cutler. They got off on the
wrong foot right away. He also loved Tebow, yes exactly.
He drafted Tim Tebow in the first round, so I
don't love his eye for quarterback. And by the way,
he passed on Andrew Locke, yes exactly. So I think
that he's gonna have to make sure that he relates
to these players, otherwise they're gonna go ahead. They're just
gonna bail on him from jump. Yeah, Stanford rout is

(01:15:36):
joining us. I want to talk about a couple of
these games. Minnesota has this wildly emotional win in New Orleans,
and now they go and San Francisco is all healthy
and sitting there waiting go to your career. Think about
the one or two emotional wins short week on the road.

(01:15:57):
Can you overcome that it? Sometimes teams are different five
days later. I think that they can overcome it because
they have a really good coaching Zimmer. I think that
obviously he's been around this league for so many years,
he's gonna know how to reign them men. He's gonna
know how to make sure to not put too much
on them this week at practice because he knows that
they already came off an emotional victory, like you just said,

(01:16:18):
against the New Orleans Saints, and now they're going into
a buzz saw out there in San Francisco. I think
that if Minnesota is able to get after the quarterback,
they're able to get after Garoppolo. They did against Drew
Brees a before some turnovers, the fumble, the interception right
before the half, the breeze should not have thrown. I
do believe the Vikings have a puncher's chance at taking
down the forty nine is because when you look at

(01:16:39):
San Francisco over the last several weeks to end the season,
you have they're winning games, but they're one of them
very close, they're one of them very ugly. You see
the loss against the Arizona Cardinals, I'm sorry, the Atlanta
Falcons a few weeks right before the season ended. That
actually shows it. You know what, this team, they can
be beaten and they are vulnerable in certain areas. Let's

(01:17:00):
go to the Titans again, a franchise changing win for Tennessee. Yes,
all right, here we go to rest at Baltimore. Do
you give them a puncher's chance. I give them a
puncher's chance because of Derrick Henry, because of that run game.
If they're able to control the clock, maybe go ahead,
get a turnover early, be able to swing field position

(01:17:22):
in the punt kicking game, things like that. I do
believe they have a shot, but I believe that they're
gonna have to make sure. Like Vrabel said that the
Baltimore Ravens are playing from behind. To me, that's the game, yes,
because then you're putting Baltimore one dimensional. Now they can't
just go ahead and lean on the run game. Lamar's
got to get back there. He's got to throw it
on first, second, and third down rather be just running

(01:17:45):
on first and second down. On third down, it's maybe
third and four. That way, he can go ahead, just
scramble if the windows are closed. So I do believe
that there's a recipe. There's a formula to beat the
Baltimore Ravens, but you're gonna have to make sure that
you stick to it all the way to the nth degree.
Kansas City a team and an organization you respect sitting

(01:18:06):
there waiting they get now the Texans who are talented,
but goofy hard to get your arms around the mistake prone.
It's flag football at times to win the game. Kansas
City's defense played great in the last month. Why what happened? Honestly,
I couldn't tell you. Steve Spagnola obviously we know that

(01:18:28):
he's won Super Bowl, so obviously going back to his
days with the New York Giants, so he obviously has
the experience. And I'm just guessing they probably Kansas City
finally started coming together. They had some new players. Honestly,
get Darren Matthew, Frank Clark and Clark coming over, So
I think that they're finally jelling together, becoming more cohesive.
Does it Stanford take go back to your career. I've

(01:18:50):
had players talk about this. Even if you're talented, a
defense is at its best when you're not thinking. How
long did it take you to adapt a new defensive system?
Oh wow? It would take usually probably the latter part
of the season just to adapt to a new defense
because just like to your point, you gotta stop thinking.
You got to just be able to react. And when

(01:19:11):
it's something brand new, you're thinking out there. So if
you're somebody who runs let's say a four three forty, well,
if you're thinking, you're gonna run more likely a four
or five or four or six because you're not able
to actually play fast because you don't trust it all
the way. Just like offensive coordinator with the new quarterback,
he's got to actually be able to understand the offense
where he knows like the back of his hand. Otherwise

(01:19:33):
he's gonna be out there thinking. And that's why I
think that Kent City is finally coming together. And then
more importantly, I think that they're trusting each other because
so much on defense is if I'm the corner, I
gotta trust it my safety has me over the top,
because if he doesn't and I don't trust it, I'm
gonna play more so for the deep ball rather than
underneath because I don't trust in my safety is gonna

(01:19:53):
be there and vice versa. Okay, finally I'm done doubt
in Seattle. They are an unbelievable bull road team, and
I think a lot of it's just you got a
veteran coach and a superstar quarterback. I don't remember a
team that is this good on the road. I think
they're seventeen and four in their last twenty one games
in the Eastern time zone. Your thoughts about it facing

(01:20:15):
arrested Green Bay team, oh Man, Because Seattle has Russell Wilson,
because they have a Pete Carrol, I give them a
great amount of confidence in actually going to the frozen
tundra up there Lambo Field, because, believe me, that's a
tough place to play. I played there twice in my
career in December, not in January, but it's a tough

(01:20:35):
place to play, Like like like, why just just the
sheer cold? Yeah, it's the cold obviously both times that
I went to go play Green Bay. They had a
Hall of Fame quarterback and Aaron Rodgers and before that
was Brett Farve. So that doesn't make things any easier.
But because Seattle, much like I believe with Deshaun Watson
with the Houston Texans, Russell Wilson is able to win

(01:20:56):
games and make place in You really don't even know why,
you just know that he's good and he seems to
always make the right play. He seems to always make
the right decision. And whenever you have a guy like
that on your team to be able to be without
who's a precise Carson Penny. And now you're back to
Marshawn Lynch, not beast mode, Marshawn Lynch, an older Marshawn

(01:21:19):
Lynch who can still get it done, but not the
same player that he once was. And when you just
see the amount of injuries being without Dwayne Brown, they're
gonna have tackle and still being able to get it done,
that right there just speaks to the greatness of a
Russell Wilson being able to put the team on his
back and take them to victory. Yeah, Stanford Route former
NFL dB A lot of years with the Raiders who

(01:21:41):
are of course moving to Vegas. We appreciate that folks
go to M drive froman dot com the codas heard,
get your twenty percent off your first month. Walgreen's right,
it has it too, Stanford. Great seeing you Joe Thomas,
who's gonna be a first ballot Hall of Famer, Next
hour or the Herd. Be sure to catch live editions
of The Herd week dayson noon Easter nine a m.
Pacific and Flue season here. Check it out. Top of

(01:22:02):
the less vic Sinex nasal spray works within seconds, works
up to twelve hours. Vic Sinex nasal spray use as director.
Joe Thomas eleven years in the NFL, ten times an
All Pro at left tackle. He's a first ballot Hall
of Famer. That's going to happen very soon. He's also
on the NFL Network The Tomahawk Show by Uninterrupted with
Andrew Hawkins. Super smart guy and he loves him some Cleveland.

(01:22:25):
I thought he was a perfect guy today because although
he was remarkable and stable, he was often surrounded by
the chaos which has come to sort of define Cleveland.
And as I said earlier, until the owner becomes less
impulsive and the quarterback grows up. I don't think you
can solve the current Cleveland situation now. I do think
Baker is young and could grow up. And I do

(01:22:46):
think Jimmy Haslum is smart and may get more patient.
But I think there's an impulsiveness between the owner and
the quarterback that right now is holding the franchise back
regardless of who the coach is. And with that via
the Coward Global Satellite Network, Joe Thomas, the All Pro,
Let's start with this. You had a lot of different coaches,
you know, and I understand the let's go to New England.

(01:23:08):
They're they're the gold standard. Let's pull some New England
stuff over. But that stuff didn't work in Cleveland. So
let's go back to the Mangini and the Romeo Crennell.
They brought some New England in. Why did it not work? Joe? Well,
the first thing that happens, why it didn't work was
because we didn't have as much talent as we needed
to be able to succeed. But when I think back

(01:23:30):
to Eric Mangini specifically, the one thing that I think
he could have done better as a head coaches, he
tried to just replicate the things that worked in New England.
And you see that so often with the Bill Belichick disciples.
You need to become your own person. And I think
that's why most guys that have success as head coaches
have worked for a lot of different head coaches before
they got their opportunity to be a head coach, so

(01:23:51):
that you have this broad base of experience to pull
from when you become a head coach. Because when you're
sitting there as a coordinator as an assistant, you're thinking, Wow,
I really like the things that my head coach does
in this situation, or maybe I don't love the things
that he does in this other situation. When I get
the opportunity, this is how I'm gonna be, So then
you find out how I become the best version of myself.

(01:24:11):
Whereas Eric Manginie and some of the other guys that
haven't had success coming from the Belichick system, all they
know is Belichick. So what do they do. They just
try to become Belichick. Now let's talk about Josh McDaniels.
Now he did go to Denver, but he could be abrasive.
I mean, let's be honest, he didn't have a great
eye for quarterback talent. He loved Tebow and he I

(01:24:34):
think if I recall, he wasn't into Cutler at all,
who actually is very talented. So my question is there
is I said earlier, Joe, there's a little Lane Kiffin
where I get big IQ. But sometimes you can question
eq the emotional ability to connect with young men. Does
Josh McDaniel does that fit in Cleveland? Well, I think

(01:24:56):
he fits on a lot of different levels. But I
think you all right with the emotional side of things.
To be able to connect with a bunch of twenty two,
twenty three, twenty five year olds in the modern NFL,
which is skewed younger right now, you have to have
that emotional like you and understand that these guys do
have emotions. They are growing up, they are trying to
learn how to mature, and so while on one hand
you want to be discipline and tough and abrasive is

(01:25:18):
not always a bad thing because a lot of times
it does raise the pressure and gets the most out
of players. You can't just have the New England mantra
of let's totally remove emotion from the equation whatsoever and
just focus on the minutia of what my job is,
because it doesn't always play with everybody, especially when you're
trying to build that winning culture. And so for me,
the big question if I sat down with Josh McDaniels

(01:25:39):
is what did you learn from your first time as
a head coach in Denver? Because it didn't work out?
You try to just replicate Bill Belichick. How have even
though what you did is after you left Denver gone
back and work for Bill Belichick, how have you learned anything?
And how are you going to be a better head coach,
a better version of yourself? And how do you become
your own person as a head coach rather than just
trying to replicate what your tour was. Yeah, I know

(01:26:01):
I'm not particularly beloved in Cleveland, and I didn't like
the Freddy kitchens Hire. I was not a fan of
Dorsey and Baker wears me out. But I do think
Baker's impulsiveness can be corrected. I don't think he's a
lost cause. But I do think whoever is there is
going to have a real short leash. They're not gonna

(01:26:23):
you know, I don't think Kevin Stefan's geared Josh McDaniels
is gonna sit through nonsense for two years. Is some
of my criticism on Baker Fair that he just needs
to grow up. This is a big boy job. Well,
I think one of the reasons they're looking at the
guys that they're looking at right now to be head
coaches because they understand that right now, Baker is your franchise.
He's your franchise quarterback. He's got tons of talent, but

(01:26:45):
he does need somebody to be able to come in there,
to instill some discipline, to instill some professionalism, because as
a quarterback, you are the face of the franchise. So
what you say and do is a reflection not only
on yourself, but all of your teammates and the entire franchise.
And when you're in a city that's as crazed for
football as Cleveland is, you're a reflection of the whole city.
So maybe what you said at Oklahoma or what you

(01:27:07):
used to say and get away with is okay, it
was funny. But now that you are in this situation
that you're sitting in this throne, the expectations have changed,
and bringing in a guy like a Josh McDaniels or
Kevin Stefanski or Robert Salo or some of these other names.
They're gonna come in and instill that discipline. They're going
to be tough. Baker might not like him all the time,
but after going through the Freddie Kitchens experience, which was, hey,

(01:27:29):
let's hire Baker's buddy, we've seen that to get the
most out of Baker, you got to put pressure on him.
You got to put him in difficult situations. You might
not always be best friends, but that's what he needs
because he's a competitive person that has a chip on
his shoulder and he performs at his best when people
count him out and they give him difficult situations that
he has to handle and has to grow from. Yeah,
Pete Carolola says that what you say as an assistant

(01:27:52):
coach and what you say when you're the head coach,
it will, it will, It will create different waves. And
the same thing goes for quarterback. You can say things
as a wide receiver, nobody cares you say it. As
a quarterback, it's on the you know, it's the lead
headline of the Cleveland Playing Dealer. I also want to
ask you about Mike McCarthy to Dallas. So again, you've
had a lot of coaching experience. The thing I worry

(01:28:15):
about Mike McCarthy is his coaching DNA. At his core,
he didn't develop great running games. He was never thirteen years,
never top ten in Russia attempts. Can coaches change? Can
Mike change? What have you seen in your over decade
in the NFL? I appreciate how you put it. You

(01:28:36):
said I had a lot of coaching experience, rather than
you got five coaches fired. But no, I think the
reason Mike McCarthy got fired in Green Bay was because
his offenses got stale. Right, he was always relying on
the matchups in the passing game, and it worked for
a long time, and so when things are working, you're
more likely not to change. And so having that year off,

(01:28:57):
I think he must have been very persuasive with Jerry
Jones and how the understand look, I had a chance
to step away, and a lot of times you have
to remove yourself from a situation before you're able to
honestly and openly evaluate the job that you did and
what are the things that you can do better the
next time? And so by all accounts, Mike McCarthy had
some time away, he was able to study how the

(01:29:18):
NFL has evolved since he first took over in Green Bay,
and he's going to be a better version of himself.
And I think the report is today that Kellen Moore
is going to be his offensive coordinator. He's going to
see things differently. He's going to have different concepts. And
as long as those guys are able to form a
good partnership, that could bring out the best in both
of them to be able to give Dak Prescott in
the Dallas offense the best version of two really good

(01:29:40):
offensive minds that could really take that team to the
next level. Listen, you'a's good a left tackle. You and
Walter Jones and Jonathan Ogden. As we have seen in
twenty years in the NFL, you played at a high level,
but then you decided it and you by the way
you played ten three hundred and sixty three straight snaps.
You could have kept playing, but you were able to go. Listen,
nice clean package, seacrest out. I'm done, and you're very

(01:30:04):
happy with it, and you've done a great job. I
want you to take me into the mind of Tom Brady,
who has this aspirational, willful, relentless pursuit and love of football.
So we know he's going to play again. He went
to his Instagram. But let me ask you this, it's different.
You and Tom play at a different level. Take me

(01:30:25):
to what he could be thinking about leaving New England
and changing the legacy. Did you ever think about leaving Cleveland?
Does it matter? What goes through the mind of a
great football player? When you have everything, You got your money,
you've got your career. The leaving part, well, that's always
the hardest question for any athlete. And the longer you're around,

(01:30:45):
the longer you play in the NFL, the more it
becomes a part of you. It becomes the threads in
your fabric of who you are. You identify as a
quarterback or as a left tackle, and saying that I
want to become somebody else, which is what happens when
you retire. It's really hard and it's always hard to
know when the right time is. For me, I had
a really bad knee. I've got a bad left knee.

(01:31:06):
So I could feel myself getting to the level where
I couldn't practice anymore, and I knew it was starting
to affect how I could play on the field. And
so for me, I never wanted to be the guy
that people had to make excuses for on the field.
As a left tackle, it's my job to keep my
quarterback from being sawn in half on every single play.
And so I knew that I needed to be at
my best, and if I couldn't be at my best,

(01:31:27):
I was putting other people in danger. I never wanted
people to make excuses and say, well, he used to
be a great player, but now he's just old and
beat up and he's hanging on and well he might
be better than what we can get out there, but
he's just not the same guy. I didn't want to
do that. And so the question for Tom is how
long is he willing to stretch it out? Because we
know that he can be one of the best sixty
four quarterbacks in the NFL for probably a lot longer

(01:31:49):
than five years, because he still has the ability for
the most part. And it's not about ability. Can he
be one of those sixty four guys that can be
in the two deep in the NFL. It's about at
what level do I want to say this is not
acceptable anymore? And I need to walk away because I
will say this. Peyton Manning, he stretched it out. He
won a Super Bowl, at the end of his career
in Denver, but people still remember those balls floating in

(01:32:12):
the air, the flutter had passes, and how he needed
a great team around him to kind of carry him
to win the Super Bowl, And I think that hurt
his legacy a little bit. The conversation was always who
was better Brady or Manning, And until the end of
Manning's career it was really close. But we remember how
he finished in Denver and how he didn't have it

(01:32:33):
the way he used to. And you wonder, if I'm
Tom Brady, do I want to tarnish my legacy by
trying to hang on and go somewhere else, or am
I happy with all the things that I've done? And
I'm ready to maybe say, Okay, it's either time to
walk away as in New England, walk out when I
still feel like I'm playing at my best, or do
I want to hang on and try to do it
again in Cleveland? Yeah? Well yeah, Hey, by the way,

(01:32:55):
gut feeling thirty seconds here, who's the next coach of
the Brown? What's your gut feel? What are you hearing?
So I'm hearing that there's a few names they really like.
But I just have this feeling that McDaniels is that
guy that they really like that they think personality wise,
he fits with what Baker needs, which is that tough discipline,
smart approach, that professionalism, and he brings experience, which I

(01:33:17):
think for the HASMS was something after having Freddy Kitchens.
They want. They want a guy that's sat in that seat,
that understands what it was like being a head coach
and they can see those icebergs ahead, whereas when you're
in your first time there's a lot of things that
you don't even know that you don't know. Yeah, that's
a great point. He's hit a few of those. Joe Thomas,
good to seeing you, but thank you so much. And
by the way, it's on the NFL network. You can
follow him on Twitter at Joe Thomas seventy three. Thanks Budd,

(01:33:40):
Thanks for having me on Colin. You bet weather can
be unpredictable on the wall road. Go to Michelin and
Durance XD Silicon Wiper blades, real world proven extreme weather
performer two times longer than other blades, available only at Walmart.
Michelin Joey Taylor with the news. Turn on the news.
This is the herd Line News well, as he just mentioned,

(01:34:01):
Patriots offensive coordinator Josh McDaniels is a top candidate for
the Brown's head coaching job, and next head coach in
Cleveland could also have a say in the GM, and
McDaniels has some ideas if he gets the job. Mary
kay Cabot is supporting McDaniels has three recommendations for the GM.
One top choice would be Nick Kisserio, who's been the
Patriots director of player personnels it's two thousand and eight.

(01:34:22):
And he would also recommend either Scott Pioli or Dave Ziegler,
who have both also worked with McDaniels. Nick Cassio's contract
with the Patriots expired up the twenty nineteen season, so
he's available a lot. They got a lot of those
expiring contracts in New England, don't they, though they do
a lot of them. Coaches play Matt Slater, the Dante

(01:34:46):
Scarnecki is post seventy. It's very interesting. Maybe it's time
for a reboot. I do think that this is looking
more and more like it's it's looking like it's trending
towards Josh McDaniels. Obviously, there's a lot that could happen,
and a lot of been surprises kind of have popped
up throughout this open the openings at the coaching positions

(01:35:07):
in the NFL that we've had. Obviously Matt Rule with
a seven year contract, and now Joe Judge or the Giant,
So one of the other names that's out there could
end up getting this job, but it's McDaniels seems to
be the drumbeat here. I think we're kind of both
on the same page. With McDaniels, I don't really know
what to expect with him. I don't know what to
expect with anyone at the Browns, but we've seen a

(01:35:28):
little bit with McDaniels, and it's not all been greats.
Sometimes the answer is let me watch it for a while.
The thing with the Browns is I don't want to
watch it anymore. Like if it's not if it's not
trending in a positive direction, I really don't have a
lot of more energy toward to put towards. Okay, now
they're they're I mean, obviously they're going to basically be

(01:35:49):
rebuilding a culture, like if they're starting over again, they
have all the pieces in place. Obviously, they have the
quarterback they have Odell, they have Driver's Landry, they have
Nick Chubbs. So it's not like they don't have the players,
so you're not rebuilt in that sense. But they have
no culture, they have no direction, they have no GM,
they have no head coach. So they are starting all
the way over from the top down, aside from the
owners obviously, So what are we watching. We're gonna We're

(01:36:12):
gonna sit back and see if John Josh mctinels is
really that guy. Well, it's it's funny. When I used
to cover boxing more, you know, there's the old saying
styles make fights. So sometimes like I knew Connor McGregor
could not beat Mayweather, like I knew that. But there
are a lot of times I'll watch a fight and
I'm like, like, like Thurman Pachio. After about two rounds,
I'm like, oh, oh, Pakio is just completely manipulating the ring.

(01:36:33):
He's landing four punches to Thurman's one. With Josh McDaniels,
I'm like, can I watch it for a year? Their
schedule won't be as tough, and we know he's better
than Freddie Kitchens, so that tells me they're gonna win
more than six games, but Baltimore could be still be great,
big Ben comes back, and Cincinnati may get Joe Burrow
or two. So it's one of those. If they got

(01:36:54):
Josh McDaniels, I'm absolutely sure two things. The schedule can't
be any tougher, and it's better than Freddie Kitchen that
I know, right, So that's head of six. But what
we don't know is if they're gonna give Josh McDaniels
more than a year and a half. Because it's Cleveland.
They have to, I mean serious at this point, it's
really do they You would think you take it out. No,

(01:37:14):
you would think, but don't. What evidence do we have
to support that? Billionaires have to have some level of
self awareness. He's a billionaire, Jimmy has them is a billionaire.
You just don't fall into that. It's like he earned it.
It wasn't like given to him. You've got to have
some self awareness from business. I mean, you are one

(01:37:35):
of the greatest sports broadcast of all time. Certainly considerate
by a makeup company. Does that make you an excellent
makeup artist? Well? Or hire excellent makeup artists to run
that company and make those decisions your first I think
many would argue with your first statement. Secondly, I would
not would know what I'm doing. I would hire you
and say tell me about makeup. Yeah, I wouldn't be

(01:37:57):
the best hire, and I would tell you to hire
someone who knows a little bit more about it. So
the Ravens had a bye last week and many of
their key players rested week seventeen after locking up the
top seed in the AFC, but the players are not
worried about being rusty. Lamar Jackson said he's good to
go and Earl Thomas, it's just the importance of practice
this week. One player missing from practice though yesterday, was
running back mark Ingram. He strained his calf in week sixteen.

(01:38:20):
John Harbor would not comment on his status for Saturday's game.
We likely won't find out until way later in the week.
If mark Ingram is going to be one hundred percent
for this game, they're gonna win. You just know they're
gonna win. Yes, I do feel like the Ravens are
gonna win, but I think that how healthy mark Ingram is.
I'll make you a deal. Remember the Clemson game. I
bet a lot of money. You know, how did I

(01:38:40):
ever say how much I bet you? Didn't say to
the public. I know how much you bet. There's a lot.
I will bet all of it on Baltimore this weekend
because I've still never spent my money. And the points, ye,
Baltimore wins by over nine and a half. I'm gonna
take my Clemson winnings. That's how good I feel about
balt More and there, and I'm gonna take it of winning.

(01:39:02):
So I'm gonna take it. And this is this is
not a small amount of money. You know how much it.
I know, and I don't bet gigant. I've bet one
hundred bucks on football games. I went even the way
Derek Henry ran last You cannot win the biggest game
in your franchise in ten years. I mean I tend
to agree with you. And then and then short week it,
you know, because Baltimore's had two weeks. I think Baltimore

(01:39:24):
is gonna blow him out, blow him out. I think
so too. I am really interested to see how this
game starts, though. Okay, and if I win this bet,
I'll have so much money I'll buy presents for people. Okay, Twoey,
you got to get that Houston Texans team straightened out.
You may not get one. I hold you responsible for

(01:39:44):
best that TV. Did he ever give you that TV?
I do have the TV. I bought him a TV.
Yeah that was a long time ago. Yeah. Yeah. Finally.
Mike McCarthy will be officially introduced as a Cowboys head
coach today, and he's expected to keep the team's a
young offensive coordinator, Kellen Moore. I want to watch that
press He will stay with the Cowboys for second season? Yes,
I it will, Yes. I want to see what does

(01:40:07):
he look like in a Cowboy Garret? Yeah, I'm really
excited for that. That's an interesting press conference, and I
really like this higher. I'm not as terrified of it
as everyone else's I think, But I also think it
just depends on if Jerry Jones. Let's McCarthy do what
he does, which is coach football. Yeah and everything. We
were just tink there's time for you know what with Dallas.
I'm not anti Jason Garrett. I'm just I want a

(01:40:29):
new vote. I want a new story. It's very similar
to why Mike McCarthy left Green Bay. Sometimes things just
get stale. Yeah, I just want I want a new vote.
I want a new story with the Cowboys, Like if
it felt Garrett felt like it's repetitive. I'm seeing Garrett
Dack like, like, give me a new guy, give me
a new voice. Are you okay with them keeping Kellen Moore?
You know, I'm think I need to see a little
more from Kelly. Kellen Moore looked a little over as

(01:40:51):
skis to me against veteran defensive coordinators. Young people get better.
I mean when I first took goolay on, he was
giving me hockey scores. That's all giving. Now occasionally covers
the NFL. He's grown a lot joy with the news.
Well that's the news, and thanks for stopping by. Chris Haynes. Stop.
We haven't talk NBA a lot because the NFL season

(01:41:13):
has been so great, but there's a lot of NBA topics.
Number One, Anthony Davis gets hurt MRI this morning. It's clean.
We'll talk to Chris Haynes about some NBA stuff. I
still think the Kawhi Leonard won't plan back to backers
is strange. But the Lakers can't get past the Clippers.
I think Utah sitting there waiting in the wings watch
out trading deadline for the Utah Jazz. Talking about all
that stuff, coming up next. Be sure to catch live

(01:41:35):
editions of The Herd weekdays and noon Easter nine am
Pacific on Fox Sports Radio FS one and the iHeart
Radio app. Want to hear something amazing? Discover matches all
the cash back you earn into the first year automatically,
no limit. Go to Discover dot com slash cash back match.
Chris Haynes been covering the NBA. Used to cover the
Warriors and then the Calves and now he's an insider,

(01:41:55):
senior NBA insider for Yahoo Sports. We bring him on
all the time. Look at he's got those vi Brent colors.
Look at that? Did you look like you're covering the NBA?
My man? And how about the Lakers? Anthony Davis hurt,
MRI is clean, He's going on the road. So here's
something I heard behind the scenes. Maybe you can confirm this.
Anthony gets minor injuries, but Lebron and the fellas have

(01:42:19):
been pushing them this year to play through them because
they're trying to build up that playoff toughness where nobody's healthy,
and Lebron is really liked that. Anthony has played through
a lot of nagging injuries this year. I haven't heard that.
It wouldn't surprise me though, Um, that was some of
the concerns that people had, you know, and trading for
Anthony Davis. Yes, it was his durability. You know, he

(01:42:41):
would you know, he would, he would get banged in
the elbow, take a few games off in New Orleans
and this game. Up to this point, he's only missed
a belief three games this season, and he's been dealing
with a shoulder issue the whole season, the whole season,
and so there might be some validity to that. Colin
m changing that whole perception, and we see like you know,
last night, you know, they were they were a little
ticked off, they were pissed, you know, they felt like

(01:43:03):
the Knicks were abusing Oh the Casey p Fowl's brutal Yeah,
that was pretty bad. That was pretty bad. But uh no,
I can definitely see that collar. You know. It's it's
really interesting about there's a difference between great player and
makes the team better. Kyrie is a great talent, nobody
disputes that, but Boston's better this year without him, and

(01:43:25):
Brooklyn is kind of not as good as we thought
they would be with him. At this point. What is
Kyrie Irving, Well, he's injury prone. He's a great individual talent.
I can make an argument he can be hard to
play with around the league. When you talk to people
about Kyrie, where do they land now? I think it

(01:43:48):
really hasn't changed. I think we land on KYRIEU as
being just one of the potent offensive weapons we have
in this game. When he's on and healthy. He's right
there with James Harden as some of the most you know,
instoppable players to guard out there, just with the individual
one on one skills. With all that being said, how
Harden never gets hurt, He never gets hurt. Yes, I'm

(01:44:08):
talking clearly just strictly on his offense. But with all
that being said, up to this point, the only way
to mac truly maximize Kyrie Irving's gifts is you have
to have a great team surrounded around him to do
all the dirty things. And he's not gonna He hasn't
shown up to this point that he makes players better.
But like Lebron, Lebron did all of that work, and

(01:44:30):
then they had other defensive weapons out there to do
that thing, and then you let Kyrie Orvan to give
him the ball down score. Yes, no, I think I
think that's fair as long as you identify he's more
robbing than Batman. Listen, we're gonna put you on a
wing and they're gonna be days we ask you take
the quarter over. Yeah, but don't ask him to be
a stopper. Don't ask him to be That's not who
he is. Not everybody can be the president. I will say,

(01:44:52):
I think I think it's too young. He's too young
of a player to just limit him to be in
robbing right now. I think he has Batman tend to
seize that tie. But it's just up to this point,
maturity level or whatever it is. Maybe he just hasn't
gotten to that point. Luca Dante is a remarkable player.

(01:45:13):
He's also incredibly young. Could I make the argument he's
the best twenty year old the league's ever had. He's
a baby. He can't legally drink in fifty states twenty.
He's twenty years old. Chris, Yes, Look the numbers he's

(01:45:33):
putting up is fantastic. Could you make an argument you
can mention him in the argument. I would say this, Chris,
his offensive game is more developed than Lebron. He's maybe
not as good as Lebron. But offensively, Chris, he is
elite at twenty today. He is. But the style of
play and how you're able to play the game, you

(01:45:54):
have to take that in consideration as well. I still
would throw Magic Johnson in and Lebron James up there.
It's the top two. Magic was nineteen. Yeah, yeah, leading
the two. Are you surprised how good Luca is? Oh?
Hell yeah? Can I say that? Yeah? Okay, yeah, yeah,
even if you even if you couldn't too late, Chris, No,
I mean I didn't see this. He is twenty eight

(01:46:15):
a game for the rest for another fifteen years if
he wants to be. If you look at the way
he plays, you know, he doesn't overpower you with physicalness.
He doesn't have the lightning quick step, and so you
just look at his frame and just look at the
way he moves and was like, how is he getting
this done? He's just so crafty. He plays angles well.
He knows how to create a shot. The step back

(01:46:35):
is you know, it's like James harten Is, it's unguardable.
You can't get to it. And he's six six seven
six eight listen. I grew up with George Gervan. George
couldn't jump George was It was literally one hundred and
seventy five pounds. There are dudes in this sport. Chris,
you see him at the Why Yeah, they score? Luca,
Alex English. I grew up with Alex English. Couldn't couldn't

(01:46:56):
jump above my phone? I mean couldn't. Alex English was
twenty four a night, kikey vand away. Yeah. Yeah, So
some guys just play the angles, know their body. I'm
gonna take your word for it because all those guys
are before before my time. Alex English in the seventies,
it was twenty six to nine in Denver. He was great. Um, okay,
so when we look it's funny about this. I'm like

(01:47:19):
everybody else, I want to see Zion. But here's what's interesting.
The pelicanserbate they're treading water without Zion. So a is
he gonna play? And are you surprised? They're Okay, They're
They're not that far out of the ape spot He's
gonna play. I am surprised of what New Orleances is doing,
but I'm surprised at the Western Conference in general. Usually
the Western Conference is the power Conference, but if you

(01:47:41):
look at the overall standings were compared to the East
of the West. East is East is better this year,
and that's why New Orleans is being able to stay
in the hunt. Portland as a team that's fallen off
and they're still in the hunt. For that, they're struggling.
They need their they're too Damian Lillard dependent. I agree
with you one. I went and watch them play in Utah.
If he doesn't get hot for about a five minute stretch,

(01:48:01):
they get blown out by fifteen. They have to make
a move. But to your point about New Orleans, like
Zion is going to be back and they're gonna be
in contention for most of the You know, Alvin Gentry
done a great job. But brandon Ingram, you gotta give
him props too. He's held down the fort all right,
give me your top five guys in the league right
now because he's a spot college. Let's go. I want
to see him now today. Best players. Okay, who's your

(01:48:22):
number one? I'm no, no, no, no, no no no.
I'm not giving the number one. You're not doing that
to me. I'm gonna give you five college okay, but
it seems like the first guy comes first. I'm gonna
give you I'm gonna give you Lebron. Yeah, I'm gonna
give you Kauai. This is no order. I'm gonna give
you James Harden, I'm gonna give you Yannasontha Cooper, and
I'm gonna give you I'm missing one more hardened Yannis Kawa,

(01:48:45):
Anthony Dave Hasty, Davis. Yeah. I don't have a problem
with any of that. I totally in there. No, not yet, no, no.
These are the five best players, by the way, they
all have something. I think Kawhi and Leonard is the
best two way player, James is the best ISO player.
Yannis is the most impactful defensive player. Shout out though,
I'll tell us somebody. Rudy Gobert gets no love in

(01:49:06):
this league. Let me tell you something. Thank you, Rudy Goberty.
Every time NBA always has an underrated player. I go
to watch a Jazz game and I remember I text
to my buddies, forget the eighteen points, forget the four
blocks and the eleven rebounds. He literally changes every other
shot down the floor. When the shot clocks running out

(01:49:27):
for the Jazz, they just throw it up and he
either dunks it, tips it, keeps it alive, um No,
I think your top five is right. Everybody there offers something. Colin,
thank you for mentioning the Rudy Gobert because I get
into an ongoing argument with Gary Payton, who doesn't think
he's that good defensively saying he wouldn't have made it,
he wouldn't have played it well in his day and time.
Respect Rudy Gobert. He deserves some respect, and he deserves

(01:49:49):
to make the All Stars. Okay, if if we acknowledge
Lake kersch Clipper's best two teams in the league, I
think that who's your three? Milwaukee? All right, it's fair.
Who's your four? Boston maybe all right? And I don't know.
If I buy Boston, there's a gap. I think it
goes too great. Milwaukee very good and well. I want
to see what Utah does at the trade deadline. They

(01:50:11):
could use another athlete on the perimeter. Jordan Clarkson helps
a little. Chris Hayes FS one Yahoo Sports, see you tomorrow,
speak for yourself. Next, it's the Herd

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