On today's episode, Jason kicks things off with a quick thought on the Milwaukee Bucks win over the Brooklyn Nets. The Nets really wanted to win this one (Kevin Durant and Kyrie Irving both played about 40 minutes) but for the second game in a row Brooklyn had no answer for Giannis Antetokounmpo. Will the return of James Harden suddenly solve the flaws that the Bucks exposed? Doubt it. Later, Jason explains why the recent play by the Washington Wizards and Minnesota Timberwolves could mean that both Bradley Beal and Karl-Anthony Towns stay put this summer. So if Beal and KAT are off the board, who are the next big names that could be on the move? Keep an eye on Damian Lillard and Kawhi Leonard. Just sayin'. Plus, ESPN senior NFL reporter Jeremy Fowler swings by to discuss why he feels like the only way this Aaron Rodgers saga gets resolved in Green Bay is if the Packers give him a massive new contract, how much of a role Packers CEO Mark Murphy has had both in the drafting of Jordan Love and the empowerment of GM Brian Gutekunst, how Rodgers' retirement threat differs from the Andrew Luck situation in Indianapolis a few years ago, why historically great quarterbacks - like Joe Montana, Peyton Manning and Tom Brady - tend to end their careers in different uniforms, why he's optimistic about Urban Meyer's transition to the NFL, what went wrong for Johnny Manziel in Cleveland back in the day, why a small majority of NFL decision makers had BYU's Zach Wilson ranked ahead of Clemson's Trevor Lawrence before the Draft, and much more!
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Straight Fire with Jason McIntyre. What's up party, people at
(02:34):
your boy? Jason McIntire Straight Fire for Wednesday May fifth.
Hope everybody had a joyous May fourth. You got the
Star Wars jokes out of your system. Then last night
you watch a little NBA action, which we'll get too shortly.
But I got to tease our guest today, NFL reporter
Jeremy Fowler from ESPN. He's kind of risen in the ranks.
(02:58):
I guess he's like one of their top NFL reporters now.
I mean I've known him for a while. He's pretty
meteoric rise from you know, like a team reporter to
a national reporter. He covers everything, and this is a
guy who covered Brett Favin Minnesota, Johnny football in Cleveland,
Ben Roethlisberger in Pittsburgh. I mean, he's got stories about
all of him. It's good stuff. I think you're gonna
(03:20):
like what he has to say about the Packers. I'm
just gonna say this, Andrew Luck retired early from the Colts,
and the Colts didn't make him payback twenty four million dollars.
That is a topic that we talk about because we
remember Aaron Rodgers. If he goes through with this retirement thing,
everybody thinks it's a bluff. He would have to potentially
(03:43):
owe the team in the neighborhood of forty mill That's
a lot more than Andrew Luck. Now consider Andrew Luck's,
you know, twenty four million dollar parachute payment thank you
for your service and leading us to the playoffs a
bunch of times. Aaron Rodgers has done much more than
that in Green Bay. But a contentious ending could color that.
(04:03):
It's a good topic. I think you're gonna like this
with Jeremy Fowler really quickly. Off the top, I want
to just touch on a couple NBA items. First of all,
this news that Lebron is going to miss both big
games this week, the Thursday night game against the paper
Clips and then the Friday night game against the Blazers
not ideal. Not ideal for the Lakers' chances of avoiding
(04:25):
that playing game. That being said, I think some bigger
things happen in the league. Now. Again, there's about five
or six games, maybe seven for some teams left in
the season, and I don't want to put too much
emphasis on games that happen late. If you listen to
yesterday's pod. You know this, We've been through this. Lebron
and his teams sometimes fade late. They don't really care.
(04:46):
They're disinterested the playoffs matter, Okay, Bucks Nets was an
interesting game and result, folks, Just so you know, the
Brooklyn Nets tried really, really hard to win that game.
They want the number one seed. If you are, the
top three teams in the East by far are the Sixers,
(05:08):
the Nets, and the Bucks. Two of those will have
to meet in the second round. Whoever gets the number
one seed likely faces like Miami slash New York in
the second round. That is a significantly easier matchup than
going tote toe with the Nets or Bucks. Okay, So
if the Sixers get that number one seed, and they're
now up one and a half games thanks to the
(05:29):
Nets loss in Milwaukee, and the Nets tried hard, Listen,
Katie played forty minutes, scored thirty two points. Kyrie Irving
played thirty nine minutes, scored thirty eight points. It was
pretty clear that that bench. Remember how Bruce Brown had
delivered and Nick Claxton had delivered, and they've had guys
(05:50):
show out. Landry Shambi, by the way, was awful one
for eight. Just a bad game from him. But just
remember add James Harden to that tree. They're not gonna
be going to deep into the bench here when you
get to the big playoff games. This what this felt
like a playoff game. The Bucks come out on top.
I mean they just had too much offense. Janis got
(06:11):
whatever he wanted. I mean he scored thirty six on
thirty shots. He was pretty good from the line ten
at twelve, which is uncharacteristic for him. But when Drew
Holiday is going to go twenty three, ten and eight,
Dante de Vincenzo ten points, fifteen rebounds, and then Chris
Middleton twenty three points. Bucks look, folks, Bucks look really good.
(06:32):
With Brent Forbes is coming off the bench with fourteen points,
this is a Bucks team. I'm not going overboard. PJ.
Tucker is still getting worked in the mix. Bucks look good.
And for the first time and really in two years,
the Bucks kind of come into this as a bit
of an underdog. If you remember the last two years
they were favored to beat the Raptors. They led that
(06:54):
series two nothing, then gagged it away to Kauai. Then
last year they kind of sputtered going in the bubble
and then they got stomped out by the Heat in
the second round when there were a big expectations, the
Bucks collapsed. Not a lot of expectations this year because
everybody's talking about the Nets and then there's you know,
the Joel Embiid fanboys out there. So big result, bad
(07:15):
one for the Nets, and again they don't have James Harden.
James Harden changes things significantly, But I'm just watching a
little of that game. I do wonder how much does
he change things? Are we saying Kyrie Irving is taking
not twenty five shots but eighteen? What's the bench rotation
look like? I'm just curious, like, can you play KD.
(07:35):
Harden and Kyrie forty in a pivotal Game five and
a pivotal Game six, pivotal Game seven? I don't know.
There's still there's just a lot of unanswered questions about
the Bucks heading into the postseason. So not a good
result for them for the Nets. The Bucks again, impressive
win for Milwaukee. I quickly want to go over to
Scott Brooks and the Wizards. We haven't done a ton
(07:57):
on Russell Westbrook. There is a lot of people out
there who constantly are telling me, Jay, you got to
give Russell Westbrook his his flowers. Come on, give it
to him, give it to him. Come on, He's been incredible.
True story, Russell Westbrook has been fantastic. I mean, he's
putting up monster numbers. They have a big one tonight
against the Bucks. The Wizards are in the playoffs. I'm
(08:18):
spinning it forward. I'm not saying do the Wizards have
a chance to pull it up set? I don't really
care if they could go from the ten to the seven.
I don't care about that. It's irrelevant. The big story. Guys,
think about it this way. The two biggest names you've
been hearing disgruntled star to head to form a trio
with somebody or Bradley Beale and Carl Anthony Towns. Bradley
(08:40):
Beale early in the season was so bitter with the Whiz.
There was a there was a game he had buried
his hands, his head in his hands on the sideline,
was just devastated, not speaking. There were defensive assignments where
he would just stand there and he was he was disinterested,
he was unhappy, and it was like, all right, where's
Bradley Beale gonna go, He's the big story next offseason.
(09:01):
And now Russell Westbrook is saved the day, and Russell
Westbrook all of a sudden playing out of his mind.
Rui Hachimura one of my favorite names in the NBA. Like,
they're playing well. I think it's safe to say they're
gonna be a playoff team, and Bradley Beale is going
to be removed from the offseason equation of who's the star,
who's gonna win out? Now the Knicks have played well
(09:24):
to the point where you expect someone to say, I
want to go play with Thibodeau and Randall in New York.
New York's happening again. There's a number four seed, Like
there's a vibe there. It's a vibe, as they say
on Instagram. But I wonder about Karl Anthony Towns. The
Wolves have climbed out of the basement, and D'Angelo Russell's
finally healthy, Anthony Edwards showing out, he made the Rookie
(09:45):
of the Year thing interesting. Lamela Ball was a runaway winner,
got hurt, Anthony Edwards just kept getting buckets, and you're like, oh,
this is kind of an interesting deal. Now they're not
making the playoffs. That's definitely not happening. They are twenty
and four, but showing signs of improvement. Kind of nice
(10:05):
and can they leap frog? Okay, see Cleveland Orlando in
that race too. If they lose the pick, they give
it to Golden State instead of it being four or five,
it's like eight or nine, which would not really help
Golden State. And you know, Minnesota is the pick in
the top three, they keep it. You know, I think
(10:29):
there's a case where Carling Anthony town says, you know what,
I think I'm gonna stay. And now you're looking at
an NBA offseason, the first in a long ass time, folks,
where there's gonna be no player movement. I will give
you a sleeper name. I'm just gonna put it out there.
I'm not saying he wants out, because he's all along
said I don't want out. Damian Lillard, my guy. You know,
(10:52):
I'm a Damian Lillard fan. He spoke to Chris Haynes recently,
and Damian Lillard and Chris Haynes had like a sit down,
and Lillard was not thrilled at like the direction. And
you don't want to read too much into it, but
it was curious timing because it came at a point
where Portland's still fighting for a playoff spot. And I
(11:16):
mean Lillard wasn't briefly an MVP candidate. I don't know.
It almost felt like Damian Little was not happy they
went to the conference finals two years ago. They got
swept by Golden State, but come on, it was the
Juggernaut Warriors. I don't think Dame's gonna ask out. But
(11:38):
at the same time, I don't know that trading CJ.
McCollum is going to affects what they need. What would
they need? Well, I thought they had a wing in
Robert Cummington. Clearly not the case. So I don't know.
I mean on the NBA front, like you need a
star to one out to drive the NBA offseason cycle. Otherwise,
free agency is kind of irrelevant now. The only other name,
(12:01):
and again Dame is a massive reach because he has
always said he don't want to go anywhere. Should be
all say I'm cool in Washington, let's do this, and
Karl Anthony town says we're building something in Mini. The
other guy has to be Kawhi Leonard, and I have
floated Kawhi Leonard and the Phoenix Suns. A couple of
times in the off season. I got laughed at. That's fine.
(12:21):
I don't know. I don't mind going out on a limb.
It's worked for me throughout my career in sports media.
It's gotten me to where I am. I'm fine going
out on a limb, saying Kawhi could be that guy.
Let's watch the Clippers in the playoffs. They have Rondo?
Is he the solution? Just before we get to Jeremy
Fowler real quick? I can't wait to see how Reggie Jackson,
(12:43):
who's played well in the last two months since Patrick
Beverly has been hurt. I can't wait to see what
happens in a playoff series when Reggie Jackson, who's again
played very well for this team look good, is banished
to the bench and getting like ten minutes because they
have pet Bev and Rondo. Reggie Jackson famously and OKC
was chirping because he couldn't get minutes behind Westbrook and
(13:03):
he's like, I'm as good as Russ. I need to
be out there. They just shift his ass out of town.
Clippers long way to go for those guys in the West,
all right, Without further ado let's get to Jeremy Fowler
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and the AD Council. Jason likes to think he knows
everything when it comes to sports. I know what sports
stands want, But for everything he doesn't. He knows a
(15:17):
guy who does. Let's just say I know a guy
who knows a guy who knows another guy. All right,
let's welcome into straight fire. A guy I've known. She's
probably fifteen years because he's covered the NFL, covered college
football at its best. Urban Meyer in Florida. Jeremy Fowler
from ESPN Jeremy how are you, man, I'm good, Jason.
(15:37):
Thanks for having me. I think the last time I
saw you was at the Combine once upon a time.
I yes, indeed combined back when I was going there
to try to figure out any fun interesting nuggets, and
that's when I really started to dig into the mock drafts. Personally.
I love the draft, Jeremy. I don't know from from
your perspective, it's probably a little tougher, right, you gotta
actually cover it and do a lot of stuff. Yeah,
I thought the draft was great this year though, like, yeah,
(15:58):
I'm still interested in the draft. That's three days, you know, gone.
I think the No Combine almost added an extra layer
to it. And then because nobody really knew how it
was going to shake out and what San Frame was
doing for about a month and you know, you're trying
to piece it all together. It was crazy. I mean,
and even these teams, like up until the last day,
we're waiting on medical information on a guy they might
(16:19):
draft in the first round. It was a complete chaos
with no Combine, like they were getting all these results
really late in the process, even some top guys. So
it was it was interesting for sure. I'm just curious.
How did you handle it from a coverage? Was everything
from your house where you are in Connecticut or where
you've bouncing around to pro days and stuff like that.
So yeah, pro days are great. I did go to
(16:40):
Florida's Pro day because I was doing I was doing
some Kyle Pitts. I did a story and Kyle Pitts
and Kadarius Tony. So I went down there and that
was cool, and that was pretty much like it was
as loose as I had seen from a like back
to normal perspective, Like there were hundreds of scouts and
people like all in the you'll hanging out and stuff.
(17:01):
So it really didn't feel like one big precaution, you know,
it's kind of just um, it felt like normal a
little bit. And so yeah, the I didn't hit. That
was the only pro day I went to. So I
did everything from home. You know, I got the basement
set up, and uh, you just you make your calls
and you go on air and try to talk about
the draft. So yeah, hey, let's start. You mentioned Kadarius Tony,
(17:22):
So this is one thing that I kind of have considered,
um when doing these mock drafts and how like my
Jets playing in New York, cold weathertown. The winds pick
up in the winter. You need to eat like tough guys.
And I'm not gonna knock Sam Darnold, but warm weather
California kid. Okay, you just mentioned Kadarius Tony. Now I
(17:43):
believe the Giants traded back and scooped him up, right, Yeah,
so they trade back. The Nine Spouts of Chicago got twenty.
And now you yourself are a guy from Florida and
you are now living up north in Connecticut. I'm just curious.
You're obviously you're not playing football, you're doing media stuff,
but is there something to that, you know like that?
(18:03):
And I'm not trying to generalize soft California kids, but
I've been out here now about five years, and I'm
gonna say it's very easy, and it's soft. I mean
it is. It's like the weather, like, there's so many options,
and you know, I play a bunch of pickup basketball,
and not that that's a correlation to the NFL, but
it's a little softer out Like there is just this
(18:23):
idea like Kadarius Tony is a fast guy from the
Florida Gators, right, how is he gonna mix with New York.
I'm just any thoughts on that. Yeah, it's gonna test
your toughness for sure, But there's an intrigue with that too,
Like when you first go into the cold, you're like, oh,
I can do this and this is gonna be different
and fun, and then it where you know, wears on
you after a while. But I think early on a
kid like that, though he's from Mobile, Alabama, he's you
(18:46):
know that that could be a tough area. He's pretty
hard and so to speak, and you know, he's one
of those really tough football guys that loves contacts, So
I think he's actually gonna like it. You know. Zach
Wilson's another one, right, coming from California. Used to throwing
the ball around a BYU and you know you've got
a clean pocket, and you know, it's a different mentality.
Right now there's turf turf fields, So maybe that helps
(19:08):
a guy like Tony too. You maintain your speed in
the cold, And I think some guys do like it.
It's more about the makeup than it is where you're from. Yeah,
you know, the perfect example is Aaron Rodgers. Of course,
California kid goes to Green Bay where it's freezing and
he's utterly dominant. But you've done a lot of reporting
on this. The situation now is, I guess, like the
(19:30):
biggest story in the NFL probably for the next three months,
Like Deshaun Watson for a minute was and now Rogers
with his alleged edict saying it's me or the GM.
I don't know where are you reporting wise on this?
And then just your thoughts on Rogers. Yeah, this is
the story is going to dominate until there's clarity, and
there might not be clarity for a while. You know.
(19:51):
I talked to some people around the league, some execs
who think that the Packers will dig in here and
just wait him out and then hey, if you don't
show up, we'll find you and play Jordan Love. They
are there's the think that that the Packers already making
some plans behind the scenes. Maybe they get a backup
quarterback here fairly soon. Because they only have Jordan Love
and Aaron Rodgers on the roster, they could maybe try
to get you know, an older veteran mentor for Love
(20:13):
started out there, maybe maybe start to apply some pressure there.
The only way this saves I think, just after asking around,
is that Rogers just gets a completely new contract that
they sort a cave and give him a massive deal
which ends the Jordan Love experiment. But I don't think
they want to do that. They like the flexibility right
now of the They can have a double take, right
(20:34):
they can. They can double did Rogers contract they can
get out of in twenty two and then they still
have Jordan Love waiting and Rogers knows they have that
flexibility and doesn't like it, so he's applying major pressure.
So okay, So you keep saying they, Is they good
to Kunst who I probably keep butchering his name? Or
is they Mark Murphy? Is Murphy who is the big
boss that I guess the guy who hired the GM.
(20:56):
Do we know what sight he's on here? Because you know,
they already had the Brett Farve situation blow up in
their face. That was extremely ugly. You actually covered far
of in Minnesota. Yeah, but do they want to like
test Aaron Rod stop? Let me stop? Is there an
example of a superstar quarterback, a top ten quarterback all
time ever getting fined by his team for holding out?
(21:20):
That's a good question. I can't imagine that it's going
to get that ugly, like you don't want to be that.
Like how much money has Aaron Rodgers made everybody in
the Green Bay Packers organization. Well, we're in a different
era now right where you don't just wait out players
until August in September, you trained them now right like that,
because fans are too smart. You gotta get the draft
(21:40):
capital and so you know you can't just risk losing
him for nothing or having them retires. So you gotta
get something for Aaron Rodgers. You can get multiple first
round picks, you can get players. I think Deshaun Watson
maybe would have been the first because Houston was so
dug in that you know they were maybe waiting, willing
to wait that out and start finding them when you
didn't show up, because now with the new CBA, if
you're a veteran on a second contract, they can start
(22:02):
taking your money. And Nick Kissario was that. I think
he had that rep as a new GM to be
able to try to set that limit. Now I think
that Houston's moving on. I mean it's pretty obvious. They
draft Davids Mills, they got Tyrod Taylor. I think they're
ready to roll with those two guys and wait till
Deshaun Watson's cases is cleared up and then maybe make
a move there. So, but I think he could have
(22:22):
been the one to show up and get fine or
if he stayed away. But it's you're right, there's not
much precedent for especially now. You try to get the
assets best you can, and so Mark Murphy's trying to
play both sides. I think, you know, I would be
shocked if he goes and says, Okay, I'm gonna fire
my GM to make Aaron Rodgers happy. I just I
don't see that move for a place that traditional. You know,
(22:46):
they're not a new age team. They stayed pretty steady
and how you know they're They're very measured and how
they act. They're kind of like the Steelers, right, They're
not gonna make brash moves necessarily. So I just don't
see that. So, you know, unless they can bridge the
gap with a contract, I don't know. There's a lot
of a lot of promising to be done right now.
It's just a matter of if Rogers wants to come back.
But you know, Green Bay's a small town, right, It's
not like New York City where if you're the GM
(23:08):
and you try to run off Eli Manning. You can
try to hide, right, and that, by the way, blew
up in their face as well. Is there a scenario
where the GM you know, maybe gets reassigned in the
front office or Murphy just says, I'm sorry, we want
to placate our quarterback who's a superstar, who's a legend,
and we want to keep him, and sorry, Gudkins, I'm
(23:29):
overruling you. Okay. Can that happen? It's possible. But we
have to remember too that the Jordan Love pick had
to be signed off by somebody, and that's somebody is
Mark Murphy. So it goes to the top. So they
were probably all on lockstep. And I think, you know,
I can't speak for Matt let Flora, but I think
and he wanted he came to Green Bay to coach
Aaron Rodgers. I think he likes Jordan Love and look,
(23:51):
we know Rogers is. I think it's pretty well documented
he's not the easiest guy, yes, to coach and to
play for, to manage. I think that's become pretty clear.
So there's probably some people in the ability that like
the idea of Jordan Love right now, Make no mistake,
they want Rodgers back. They made that clear. But you
know this is Jordan Love is a Murphy call, and
now it's a call at the mark, at the Martin
(24:13):
Murphy level, whether they move on or they keep Rogers.
I do wonder we saw Andrew Luck shockingly retire. It
seems like the Colts by all accounts, were blindsided. But
then they did not make him pay back the twenty
four million. I mean, Aaron Rodgers apparently would have to
pay back forty million if he retired early. Let me
(24:34):
ask you, Jeremy Rogers seems to be going through I
don't midlife crisis is a bit strong, but up and
started hosting Jeopardy, okay, and then he goes and gets
engaged to you know this actress? Yeah, and I don't know.
It almost feels like is he in that I'm in
a transition mode. Hey, you know what, I'm gonna try Jeopardy.
(24:54):
I've got to have a life after football. I'm gonna
I'm getting engaged. You know, I don't need this drama
from the Packers. You guys can have Darren, you can
have Jordan Love. I'm gonna go do my thing. Can
you see that happening? Oh? See Andrew Luck was such
a unique situation because he had so many injuries and plus,
like you mentioned, you know, he's these franchise quarterbacks make
(25:14):
a lot of money for their team. So the Colts knew,
and Jim Mersey knew the owner that Andrew Luck had
made them some money. They had done well, they made
the playoffs, So hey, let's just let him keep the
signing bonus that the check we wrote a few years ago.
So the Packers could maybe do that to make the
problem go away, so to speak. But I think they'd
rather trade him if he wants to keep playing. Yeah,
(25:35):
I mean, if if he went and did the Jeopardy
full time, he got that gig, it sounds like he
would seriously consider it. He seems really into it. He
seems really engaged. So if you get offered that job,
you don't take any contact, you make ten million a
year or whatever it is, that would be a paid
decrease for him. But you know, certainly I could see
it the Packers. I don't know, that's a lot of
(25:55):
money to just let him keep for just a couple
of years. I mean, we saw it. Alvin Johnson and Detroit,
Now that was a little ugly. He had a couple
of years left on his deal, they made a payback
some of the signing bonus, and it's been very tenuous
even since then, so they're just starting to now reconcile.
This would be even uglier because they already have friction
and then they asked for more money. That would be
(26:17):
you might be onto something. Maybe they wouldn't ask for
that money. I'm curious, did you happen to know a
ballpark on the Calvin Johnson number, because I've had forgotten
that one. I think it was only a few million left,
but it's like, you know that that signing bonus pro rate.
So whatever deal he had done, it was a six
years deal and he had some left on it, but
it was it might have only been like a million
or two. I don't think it was a massive number,
but it's like, come on, really, I produced for you.
(26:38):
I'm a Hall of Fame guy, and you're gonna ask
me to stay back like money that you probably don't need.
But in this case, that's a big signing bonus. Plus
they just gave him a six point eight million dollars
roster bonus, So there are a lot of dynamics here.
In play where if he walked away. You know, it's
convenient for him to say I want to walk away
because it applies pressure on them now and that's part
of his leverage. Covered a bunch of good quarterbacks in
(27:01):
the NFL. Ben Roethlisberger, Aaron Rodgers, Brett Varv. I'm just curious.
You know, Roethlisberger's near the end. And in this offseason,
I thought Pittsburgh, you know, they didn't they didn't have
a plan B. They didn't make a move really in
free agency. I'm not counting Haskins. Um, where are you on,
big Big Ben? Do you think? I mean, is this
it for him? His twantson? Probably? So he's thirty nine, Yeah,
(27:25):
and he's got I mean, you know, when you take
a five million dollar salary cut, I don't care how
you slice it. Um, even if he's helping the team,
which is good on him to do that, but like
you know, that's always a bad sign. That's always a
sign of declining play. If he had a monster year,
they wouldn't have asked him to do that. Um. So
you know, he goes from nineteen million to fourteen million.
(27:46):
It's a pay cut. It is what it is. So
you have to think that as declining play. Anytime a
guy takes one, it's it's near the end um. You know.
That said, they felt like he could still do enough
if they could get him more of a running game.
They feel like, okay, maybe we have something for one
more year. Catch lighting in a bottle, maybe we'd get
in the playoffs. Makes some noise and then you reassess.
But you know, I think they're thinking in twenty twenty
(28:08):
two they can then they can not necessarily blow it up,
but look harder at quarterback options. But this is another
franchise they're not. They're like the Packers. They're they're very conventional.
You know. They got Dwayne Haskins, which Mike Tomlin always
liked his talent. I think they said, hey, lets let's
get him in our building for a year. Maybe we
can sort of rejuvenate him a little bit. And knowing
the talents there, and they signed Mason Rudolph to a
(28:29):
contract extension. People would debate whether he's the answer now,
but they do still like him. They had a high
grade on him in the draft. They think, hey, maybe
in twenty two at least have him under contract. He
could start a few games. As a one year Bridge guy.
I'm wondering, Jeremy, why I just started thinking about this,
Why are ending so ugly at quarterback? I mean, listen,
in the NBA, it happens, you know. I tell people
(28:49):
like Patrick Ewing didn't end up with the Knicks at
the end of his career, Elijah One ended up with
the Raptors. Like this kind of thing happens sometimes. But
in the NFL, like, it's just weird when you see
Joe Montana in a Chiefs jersey. You know, Peyton played
a few years in Denver, Um, tom Brady and Tampa,
but between four I can't see Roethlisberger playing anywhere else.
He he looks shot at the end of the season.
(29:11):
In the playoff game, he was bad. Um. I don't know.
It just I can't imagine Aaron Rodgers putting on a
Denver Broncos jersey. That just is a tough one for me.
I know. It's it goes down to, like all these players,
or most of them, you know, they feel like they
can still do it for more time, whether they can
or not. Tom Brady could, some others could not, And
(29:31):
so when you can, it gets ugly and you get
forced out. Um. Yeah, I mean I trying to think
of Rodgers in any other Jersey. Uh, and Denver's really
the only place that makes sense. Yeah, the Raiders. Apparently
the Raiders. Some reporter claimed that there was interest. I don't.
Rogers doesn't seem like a Vegas guy. Him and Gruden
seem like oil and water, like or oil and oil.
(29:54):
I don't don't. Never makes a ton of sense, it
really does. Yeah, they got a new GM that that's
really well respected. They got a ton and these collaboratives,
which Rogers obviously wants, a ton of weapons, three good receivers,
good defense. Like, it makes a lot of sense. And
I think I think Rogers would take pride in trying
to beat Mahomes every year and like, you know, being
in that same division. But yeah, it just it's these teams.
(30:17):
It's calculated, you know, it's all about the money in
the performance, and if a player, however grade he's been,
doesn't match that, it rarely ends well unless you just
kind of ride into a Super Bowl sunset, which Peyton
Manning and John Elway did, but not very many have.
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(31:00):
tune in and we're live here outside the Perez family home,
just waiting for them. And there they go, almost on time.
This morning, Mom is coming out the front door strong
with a double arm kid carry. Looks like Dad has
the bags. Daughter is bringing up the rear. Oh but
the diaper bag wasn't closed. Diapers and toys are everywhere. Ooh,
(31:22):
but Mom has just nailed the perfect car seat buckle
for the toddler. And now the eldest daughter, who looks
to be about nine or ten, has secured herself in
the booster seat. Dad zips the bag clothes and they're off. Ah,
but looks like Mom doesn't realize her coffee cup is
still on the roof of the car and there it goes. Ah.
(31:42):
That's a shame that mug was a fan favorite. Don't
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Brought to you by the United States Forest Service and
the AD Council. Fox Sports Radio has the best sports
talk lineup in the nation. Catch all of our shows
at foxsports Radio dot com and within the iHeartRadio app
search FSR to listen live. Urban Meyer is back in
back coach again. He's in the NFL, and I don't
(32:49):
want to say the media gave him a pass at
Ohio State. But I feel like, and I don't want
to give you too much credit, Jarry, but when he
was at Florida, I feel like you and other reporters
kind of held his feet to the fire back when
the Gators had a bunch of off field stuff. Um,
I'm curious how you think urban Meyer will transition to
the NFL. So it's that's interesting because I what's it.
(33:15):
What I think Urban might actually show and reveal more
than he has or has been given credit for, honestly,
is the football acumen. I do think he's wired like
a Bill Belichick or Kyle Shanahan. I'm not saying he's
at their schematic level, but he might be pretty close.
Like he knows all twenty two positions exactly, every nuance
of how they should step, where they should be. You know,
(33:36):
how the left guard should shade on a run blocking player.
He's really pretty brilliant with that step. So I think
he might actually show a little bit where he didn't
get a lot of credit because it's like the spread
offense and oh, you just have a bunch of five
star guys at Ohio State and you can you can
maul people. But he's actually pretty good at that stuff.
So I think he could scheme his way into some wins. Um.
But you know the problem is there, you know. I
(33:58):
mean they're they're pretty short on talent. He saw in
the draft. They just had to get whatever they could
at every position. I mean, like, you know, corner, safety, linebacker,
Like the whole defense is pretty pretty thin. So if
it doesn't go well early on, and plus we don't
know how he's gonna handle losing because he's never had
to lose, and when he does lose, he's shown maybe
he hasn't handled it the best at Florida with with
you know, retiring and coming back and retiring again. Yeah,
(34:21):
so that's the question is, you know, how how long
can he sustain it? What's the shelf life for an
urban Meyer era? Is it five years? Um? That seems
to be you know kind of the case, five or
six years. So yeah, Jim Harball like right kind of yeah,
I mean that's been the MS. So but I think
schematically he'd actually be pretty good. Um. I think he
understands like I gotta be hands off, Like I can't
(34:43):
be mister intensity all the time. Like I think he
gets that. Um, But you know, you're if you're taking
a running back in the first round, saying Travis Easken
is gonna be a third down back, Like I'm trying
to figure out what his plan is or if he's
naive or if he actually has a master plan. We
don't understand yet. Maybe he was just saying that to
play Kate though undrafted kid Robinson who had a really
good year. Although I think, well, I'm bullish on the Jacks.
(35:07):
I guess Jeremy my question. Like in Columbus he was,
you know, the biggest deal in Ohio. If he talked
about a presidential race, like people would react. He's kind
of hidden in Jacksonville. It's kind of not a big
NFL market. You could argue it's the smallest they have
to play every year they're in London. Um is will
he be kind of protected being in one of those
(35:27):
small markets in kind of a bad division, yes? Or
will the spotlight of Trevor Lawrence, who you know should
be an incredible NFL player or will that just bring
a lot of attention regardless of the market. I think
you're absolutely protected. I mean Dave called, well, the GM
lasted a long time. I don't remember the exact years,
but they had a lot of losing seasons. He did
some good things and made some you know, some good
(35:47):
trades and got some good players. They had that one
playoff year where they almost got to the super Bowl,
but Doug Marone Dave called ball lasted longer in Jacksonville.
They would have been New York with that same scenario
with the games they lost. So I do think the
leashes long her. I do think you can hide a
little bit there just because of the market. It's clearly
at number thirty two, thirty one or thirty two as
far as interest, and so you know, that can kind
(36:08):
of help you a little bit. So I think I
think he probably welcomes that at this point, knowing that
if you win games, people will care, and if you
lose games, like you know, you can at least work
your way through it a little bit until I want
to quickly go to Cleveland. So you did get to
cover the Johnny Manziel experience. First of all, did you
have to move to Cleveland for that? What was that like?
(36:28):
And then you know, second of all, like, um, you know,
I guess I like the Browns a lot like you're rationally,
So I think you can make an argument. They have
argued with the second best roster in the AFC. That's
how stacked they are. I'm sure Ravens fans would disagree,
but I just, I guess talk about Cleveland where they
were with you and Manziel and then where they are now. Yeah.
(36:49):
So I was in Minnesota covering the Vikings and I
moved to Cleveland in twenty fourteen to cover the Browns. No. No,
I was in Chicago in between there doing college football.
But then I moved to Cleveland. So Johnny's first year,
and they were they were like seven and four with
Brian Hoyer and like Andrew Hawkins and like all those guys,
Jordan Cameron at tight end, like they were just somehow
winning games. And then it just all fell apart and
(37:12):
they put Johnny in and he was just woefully unprepared,
like and then the stories they were pouring out of
there like it was just every worst case scenario of
Manzille amplified by ten, Like it was just a complete
mess of just how you know, his life was in disarray,
and so it was. It was interesting. I only covered
that team for a year and then ESPN movie to
the Steelers and then I eventually moved to Pittsburgh, but
(37:35):
it was, Yeah, it was a different times. It's a
very like they were still trying to figure it out.
You had a new owner who was you and Jimmy
Haslm who was kind of all over the place and
just throwing darts on the wall trying to figure it out.
Now they have figured it out, but at the time,
you know, you had I remember over here on is
one of the funniest lines I heard, and it told
me like, this is probably a bad sign in Cleveland.
(37:55):
As they beat the Bengals to go I think six
and four, so they were on top of the AFC
the first time in a long time. And then I
heard some executives coming out of the locker room afterward
and they were high five and hugging each other, and
then one of them goes, We're going to Vegas, baby,
really loud, all media around, and I'm like, you know what,
these guys are just not like the football culture is
(38:17):
just not that executive still in the NFL Jeremy, uh no,
at least one of them is not. But uh like
they just you know what I mean, Like the stereotypes
of Cleveland were like, yeah, they're just not ready. They're
gonna fumble this, and they did. That's what happened. But um,
now it's way different, and you're right, they're they're absolutely loaded. Um.
I mean I think they have like ten new starters
(38:39):
on defense, or ten guys who could start or had
started last year on their defense between injury and free
agency and the draft, or you know, like capable starters
in the draft. So there. I mean, the pressure is
gonna be on defensive coordinator Joe Woods to get it done.
He wanted help. He didn't have a lot of it
last year. Now he does. Yeah. Um, I'm just curious
if memory serves Johnny Football like didn't show up at
(39:00):
a Saturday practice. They couldn't find him. It turns out
he had like a raging KEG party. Do you do
you remember covering that? Covering that, yes, So I don't
know exactly what the party was. I don't recall that, um,
but I know, like security had to go to his
house and find him and and then when they did,
you know he was he didn't play. I think you
know he was. He was on He was out for
that game anyways, because he had gotten hurt like a
(39:22):
hamstring that's right. He's missing the final game, but they
essentially had to suspend him and then they you know,
it wasn't good. But were there a lot of guys
on the team hanging with him at the at the part?
I mean, was it based on culture issue some but
like he hung out with Josh Gordon some um and
then you obviously Josh had his problems, but they've u
and then so yeah, I think some teammates hung out
(39:43):
with him here there. I mean, he was very well light.
He just he just wasn't ready at that to work,
you know what I mean, like you just showed up
and didn't do the plays and stuff like that. And
I guess I should wrap up asking about another guy
who um is kind of you know, small ish white
quarterback who looked very I don't want to say immature,
but just looked young at the draft. And that's Zach
(40:05):
Wilson of my Jets. I will say, you watch the
highlight reel and Zach Wilson looks like he's making the place,
and you read, oh, he's got the quick twitch stuff
of Mahomes And there's a if you squint, you can
see a little Aaron Rodgers and I just I don't know.
I'm so excited and optimistic because we haven't had a
franchise quarterback with the Jets and forever, but I don't know, like,
(40:27):
where are you on, Zach Wilson? What are you hearing? So,
I mean, you know, it's funny and this is a
small majority, but I didn't talk to enough people around
the league that thought, like, if the hype around Trevor
Lawrence hadn't built for three years, then Zach Wilson might
actually make a compelling case for number one, like among
a small majority, like maybe ten to fifteen percent. But
(40:49):
I've talked to a few enough respective people who are like,
I think you at least make it interesting, Like if
I was picking number one, I would at least think
about it because it's the it's like the maybe it's
just the Aaron Rodgers bias. Everybody wants that the wild
throws and all the off platform throws and all that,
but he really is highly highly skilled at that to
the point where teams are like, man, you could really
create with this guy. It's like Steph or what you know,
(41:10):
when you think of like the creativity of the game
and what you can do and making plays on the
run and all that. So Trevor's the total Trevor's the
total package. He's a better prospect. But Zach ceiling because
of that. You know, now granted he was teams are
concerned that, like, Okay, the bodywork is small, he didn't
play anybody, and he's thrown and he's got an ocean
of a pocket. It's not even a pocket. It's like
(41:31):
just it's got nobody around him and he can just
make the throw cleanly. So you know, how does he
react to that? We don't know, like how does he
handle pressure? All those things? But I mean, I think
it became really clear very early on in the draft
process that he would be number two. Like, it wasn't
It wasn't like something that the team had to debate.
Everybody just knew Zach was the second best. Yeah, it's weird.
(41:52):
Like Aaron Rodgers, you think back to his time at Cal,
you know, two year starter, put up monster numbers, was
no doubt an awesome, awesome talent, But like Zach, Wilson
didn't go into last season as the definite starter at
b YUI to like win the job because the previous
years he had been hurt, like what's your confidence level
in a guy who has shown it again for one
(42:13):
year in a COVID year. I mean, I don't want
to say there's a little Zach Levine to borrow an
NBA name, like Zach Levine. Look has looked incredible this year,
but like half the league is hurt, you know, like
that's just an awkward year in the NBA. What if
this is just a weird year in college football? Because
Jeremy be honest, like, had anybody mentioned the name Zach
Wilson to you before last college football season? Yeah, not
(42:35):
until I remember like hearing from a few agents that
were like study quarterbacks, like you go to watch out
for this kid, but it was more like underground at
that point. It wasn't really Yeah, he definitely was not
known before the game one of the season, like it
was sort you kind of had to search him out.
But then like the moment he started throwing the ball
and they had a few Thursday night games or whatever,
it was like they had just enough nationally televised action
(42:56):
where you get to see him live and the US
grew really fast after that. Um, you know, but and
I think teams knew about him that you're right, it
was like the shoulder injury, and you know, there's some
questions and you know, and I think the COVID season
helped him, right, Like there, Yeah, it was a weird
year and there weren't probably enough storylines that there normally
(43:18):
wouldn't be with some of the pageantry schools. So it's like, Okay,
who's this kid? And he got more played and maybe
he would have. Yeah, it's weird. I looked at the
twenty twenty two draft. I'm not going to try to
bore you with who's good. Um, it's all a projection.
But everybody wants to find the Zach Wilson, the Kyler Murray,
the Joe Burrow, the guy who comes out of nowhere
(43:40):
has a monster year and becomes like an early pick.
But let's be kind of honest and too. I mean,
but it's not like Burrow won much in his first year.
He looked pretty good. But like it's it's one thing
to do it in college, but then to do it
in the NFL. Like we see the turnover, like Whence gone,
golf gone, Like I don't know, is this maybe this
is the new cycle? You know, teams make a run
(44:01):
with the quarterback but when it comes time to pay him,
we're gonna start to cycle over. Let's build around the
rookie quarterback. Yeah, that's been talked about by a number
of teams, Like do we start to draft a guy
every three years even if we have a star? Right,
Like let's say Josh Allen's probably a bad example because
I think he's like becoming a top guy. But let's
say the Bills said, Okay, well, you know we can't
pay that guy and still feel a competitive team under
(44:23):
the salary cap constraints, So let's just draft another guy,
no matter how will Alan played. Now, I think Buffalo
is going to pay him and he's the guy, but
teams are at leased talking about that model. Now, Um,
like Russell Wilson and Seattle. You know, they've had their problems.
You know, Russell wants more help and he's getting it
this offseason. They've tried, you know, and I think they're
(44:44):
in a better place. But I think Seattle was like,
how much can we do with this contract? You know,
it's it's a big number. I think all you know,
Kirk Cousins is a forty five million dollars cap hit
in twenty Now, the dead salary cap money is the
same amount, so maybe it's a wash if you move on,
but like, yeah, these are the numbers are so outrageous.
(45:06):
And at the at the CBA last year when they're
negotiating that the I know the NFL wanted a sort
of like a max slot, kind of like in the NBA.
They talked about him like, you know, you could set
aside cap for one player, which would basically be a
quarterback rule, right because all the quarterbacks were the highest paid. Yes,
and the players wouldn't go for it for obvious reasons,
(45:28):
you know, they don't want to sort of a competitive imbalance.
But that was the league was trying to get in
front of that. And now that they have ten more
years of ballooning quarterback money, but the cap is sort
of what it is, and you're trying to manage and
sign ten other stars, like they're wondering did we just
keep drafting rookies? Like that's definitely a conversation point. I'll
get you out of here on this. I did have
(45:49):
someone in the league. When I kept saying I would
never pay Dak forty mil. I would never pay him
forty mil. Someone texted me like, Jay the cap is
going to be going up, like this is going to
be the new normal. In three years, Dak's deal is
not going to look bad. The CAP's gonna keep going up.
And I was a little surprised that people think it's
gonna keep going up in perpetuity, that oh, CAP's gonna
(46:10):
go up twenty mil and then thirty mil. Like can
this be? Can this continue to happen in the league?
Maybe it's not an issue. I don't know. Yeah, I
mean the forecasts are big, for sure, So it's difficult
right now. It's supposed to be easier three years from now.
And that's why Dak wanted a four year deal, and
he wouldn't do five years. Even the year before when
they were negotiating, he wouldn't do that because he saw this,
you know, kind of windfall coming. He wants to do
(46:31):
the four years and then get back on it and
get a new deal at fifty million a year or
whatever it's gonna be. It's gonna be crazy, But those
numbers are gonna keep going up too, so it's still
gonna be a challenge for some of these teams now,
Like I know, teams like to hide behind the salary
cap has this big problem and they can usually get
around it anyways, but there is still a question of
like how many stars can you pay right now? Right?
Like yeah, and seven maybe like seven veterans on what
(46:55):
are the Ramacs of eight million or more? Rams have
like four? Three or four? Like yeah, I mean Stafford Ramsey,
Aaron Donald. Maybe it's just three Leonard Floyd. Um, oh
that's right, Leonard Floyd. Yeah, I guess if you're right,
you could you can try that strategy. I like how
the Rams are getting creative right though. They're trying something
that nobody else is trying. Like I give them points
(47:16):
for that. Yeah, no first round picks in like twenty
eight years or whatever it is. It feels like yeah.
I mean I actually joked a less neat about that
because I was like, man, you guys are getting a
mansion for your draft party. You don't even have a
first round pick, like, you know, it's kind of a
it shows that they're independent, you know what I mean?
Like I kind of like that, And he said, yeah,
we're not trying to We respect everybody does their job.
(47:37):
We don't have all the answers. We're just trying some
new stuff that we think's gonna work. We're gonna try
to hit on our day two picks and hit on
her homegrown talent and pay the stars and then you know,
if we don't have first round picks as a result,
that's okay. Yeah, they got the kid two two at well,
um real tiny guy, but McVeigh will probably scheme him
up like Tyreek Hill or something. Right, they got him
and de Sean now I mean they got two. I
(47:59):
forgot about him. Yeah, it got speed. Yeah, that's what
they needed to They needed burners. And they have Matt
Stafford with the cannon right just unloading down if he
can get protection. So all right, Jeremy Fowler ESPN, great
stuff is always Jeremy, thanks a lot for the time
and keep up the good work. Yeah, Jason YouTube man,
appreciate you having me. If you love to be remembered
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Straight Fire with Jason McIntyre. What's up party, people at
(02:34):
your boy? Jason McIntire Straight Fire for Wednesday May fifth.
Hope everybody had a joyous May fourth. You got the
Star Wars jokes out of your system. Then last night
you watch a little NBA action, which we'll get too shortly.
But I got to tease our guest today, NFL reporter
Jeremy Fowler from ESPN. He's kind of risen in the ranks.
(02:58):
I guess he's like one of their top NFL reporters now.
I mean I've known him for a while. He's pretty
meteoric rise from you know, like a team reporter to
a national reporter. He covers everything, and this is a
guy who covered Brett Favin Minnesota, Johnny football in Cleveland,
Ben Roethlisberger in Pittsburgh. I mean, he's got stories about
all of him. It's good stuff. I think you're gonna
(03:20):
like what he has to say about the Packers. I'm
just gonna say this, Andrew Luck retired early from the Colts,
and the Colts didn't make him payback twenty four million dollars.
That is a topic that we talk about because we
remember Aaron Rodgers. If he goes through with this retirement thing,
everybody thinks it's a bluff. He would have to potentially
(03:43):
owe the team in the neighborhood of forty mill That's
a lot more than Andrew Luck. Now consider Andrew Luck's,
you know, twenty four million dollar parachute payment thank you
for your service and leading us to the playoffs a
bunch of times. Aaron Rodgers has done much more than
that in Green Bay. But a contentious ending could color that.
(04:03):
It's a good topic. I think you're gonna like this
with Jeremy Fowler really quickly. Off the top, I want
to just touch on a couple NBA items. First of all,
this news that Lebron is going to miss both big
games this week, the Thursday night game against the paper
Clips and then the Friday night game against the Blazers
not ideal. Not ideal for the Lakers' chances of avoiding
(04:25):
that playing game. That being said, I think some bigger
things happen in the league. Now. Again, there's about five
or six games, maybe seven for some teams left in
the season, and I don't want to put too much
emphasis on games that happen late. If you listen to
yesterday's pod. You know this, We've been through this. Lebron
and his teams sometimes fade late. They don't really care.
(04:46):
They're disinterested the playoffs matter, Okay, Bucks Nets was an
interesting game and result, folks, Just so you know, the
Brooklyn Nets tried really, really hard to win that game.
They want the number one seed. If you are, the
top three teams in the East by far are the Sixers,
(05:08):
the Nets, and the Bucks. Two of those will have
to meet in the second round. Whoever gets the number
one seed likely faces like Miami slash New York in
the second round. That is a significantly easier matchup than
going tote toe with the Nets or Bucks. Okay, So
if the Sixers get that number one seed, and they're
now up one and a half games thanks to the
(05:29):
Nets loss in Milwaukee, and the Nets tried hard, Listen,
Katie played forty minutes, scored thirty two points. Kyrie Irving
played thirty nine minutes, scored thirty eight points. It was
pretty clear that that bench. Remember how Bruce Brown had
delivered and Nick Claxton had delivered, and they've had guys
(05:50):
show out. Landry Shambi, by the way, was awful one
for eight. Just a bad game from him. But just
remember add James Harden to that tree. They're not gonna
be going to deep into the bench here when you
get to the big playoff games. This what this felt
like a playoff game. The Bucks come out on top.
I mean they just had too much offense. Janis got
(06:11):
whatever he wanted. I mean he scored thirty six on
thirty shots. He was pretty good from the line ten
at twelve, which is uncharacteristic for him. But when Drew
Holiday is going to go twenty three, ten and eight,
Dante de Vincenzo ten points, fifteen rebounds, and then Chris
Middleton twenty three points. Bucks look, folks, Bucks look really good.
(06:32):
With Brent Forbes is coming off the bench with fourteen points,
this is a Bucks team. I'm not going overboard. PJ.
Tucker is still getting worked in the mix. Bucks look good.
And for the first time and really in two years,
the Bucks kind of come into this as a bit
of an underdog. If you remember the last two years
they were favored to beat the Raptors. They led that
(06:54):
series two nothing, then gagged it away to Kauai. Then
last year they kind of sputtered going in the bubble
and then they got stomped out by the Heat in
the second round when there were a big expectations, the
Bucks collapsed. Not a lot of expectations this year because
everybody's talking about the Nets and then there's you know,
the Joel Embiid fanboys out there. So big result, bad
(07:15):
one for the Nets, and again they don't have James Harden.
James Harden changes things significantly, But I'm just watching a
little of that game. I do wonder how much does
he change things? Are we saying Kyrie Irving is taking
not twenty five shots but eighteen? What's the bench rotation
look like? I'm just curious, like, can you play KD.
(07:35):
Harden and Kyrie forty in a pivotal Game five and
a pivotal Game six, pivotal Game seven? I don't know.
There's still there's just a lot of unanswered questions about
the Bucks heading into the postseason. So not a good
result for them for the Nets. The Bucks again, impressive
win for Milwaukee. I quickly want to go over to
Scott Brooks and the Wizards. We haven't done a ton
(07:57):
on Russell Westbrook. There is a lot of people out
there who constantly are telling me, Jay, you got to
give Russell Westbrook his his flowers. Come on, give it
to him, give it to him. Come on, He's been incredible.
True story, Russell Westbrook has been fantastic. I mean, he's
putting up monster numbers. They have a big one tonight
against the Bucks. The Wizards are in the playoffs. I'm
(08:18):
spinning it forward. I'm not saying do the Wizards have
a chance to pull it up set? I don't really
care if they could go from the ten to the seven.
I don't care about that. It's irrelevant. The big story. Guys,
think about it this way. The two biggest names you've
been hearing disgruntled star to head to form a trio
with somebody or Bradley Beale and Carl Anthony Towns. Bradley
(08:40):
Beale early in the season was so bitter with the Whiz.
There was a there was a game he had buried
his hands, his head in his hands on the sideline,
was just devastated, not speaking. There were defensive assignments where
he would just stand there and he was he was disinterested,
he was unhappy, and it was like, all right, where's
Bradley Beale gonna go, He's the big story next offseason.
(09:01):
And now Russell Westbrook is saved the day, and Russell
Westbrook all of a sudden playing out of his mind.
Rui Hachimura one of my favorite names in the NBA. Like,
they're playing well. I think it's safe to say they're
gonna be a playoff team, and Bradley Beale is going
to be removed from the offseason equation of who's the star,
who's gonna win out? Now the Knicks have played well
(09:24):
to the point where you expect someone to say, I
want to go play with Thibodeau and Randall in New York.
New York's happening again. There's a number four seed, Like
there's a vibe there. It's a vibe, as they say
on Instagram. But I wonder about Karl Anthony Towns. The
Wolves have climbed out of the basement, and D'Angelo Russell's
finally healthy, Anthony Edwards showing out, he made the Rookie
(09:45):
of the Year thing interesting. Lamela Ball was a runaway winner,
got hurt, Anthony Edwards just kept getting buckets, and you're like, oh,
this is kind of an interesting deal. Now they're not
making the playoffs. That's definitely not happening. They are twenty
and four, but showing signs of improvement. Kind of nice
(10:05):
and can they leap frog? Okay, see Cleveland Orlando in
that race too. If they lose the pick, they give
it to Golden State instead of it being four or five,
it's like eight or nine, which would not really help
Golden State. And you know, Minnesota is the pick in
the top three, they keep it. You know, I think
(10:29):
there's a case where Carling Anthony town says, you know what,
I think I'm gonna stay. And now you're looking at
an NBA offseason, the first in a long ass time, folks,
where there's gonna be no player movement. I will give
you a sleeper name. I'm just gonna put it out there.
I'm not saying he wants out, because he's all along
said I don't want out. Damian Lillard, my guy. You know,
(10:52):
I'm a Damian Lillard fan. He spoke to Chris Haynes recently,
and Damian Lillard and Chris Haynes had like a sit down,
and Lillard was not thrilled at like the direction. And
you don't want to read too much into it, but
it was curious timing because it came at a point
where Portland's still fighting for a playoff spot. And I
(11:16):
mean Lillard wasn't briefly an MVP candidate. I don't know.
It almost felt like Damian Little was not happy they
went to the conference finals two years ago. They got
swept by Golden State, but come on, it was the
Juggernaut Warriors. I don't think Dame's gonna ask out. But
(11:38):
at the same time, I don't know that trading CJ.
McCollum is going to affects what they need. What would
they need? Well, I thought they had a wing in
Robert Cummington. Clearly not the case. So I don't know.
I mean on the NBA front, like you need a
star to one out to drive the NBA offseason cycle. Otherwise,
free agency is kind of irrelevant now. The only other name,
(12:01):
and again Dame is a massive reach because he has
always said he don't want to go anywhere. Should be
all say I'm cool in Washington, let's do this, and
Karl Anthony town says we're building something in Mini. The
other guy has to be Kawhi Leonard, and I have
floated Kawhi Leonard and the Phoenix Suns. A couple of
times in the off season. I got laughed at. That's fine.
(12:21):
I don't know. I don't mind going out on a limb.
It's worked for me throughout my career in sports media.
It's gotten me to where I am. I'm fine going
out on a limb, saying Kawhi could be that guy.
Let's watch the Clippers in the playoffs. They have Rondo?
Is he the solution? Just before we get to Jeremy
Fowler real quick? I can't wait to see how Reggie Jackson,
(12:43):
who's played well in the last two months since Patrick
Beverly has been hurt. I can't wait to see what
happens in a playoff series when Reggie Jackson, who's again
played very well for this team look good, is banished
to the bench and getting like ten minutes because they
have pet Bev and Rondo. Reggie Jackson famously and OKC
was chirping because he couldn't get minutes behind Westbrook and
(13:03):
he's like, I'm as good as Russ. I need to
be out there. They just shift his ass out of town.
Clippers long way to go for those guys in the West,
all right, Without further ado let's get to Jeremy Fowler
of ESPN. Look, we're all adults here, and I know
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and the AD Council. Jason likes to think he knows
everything when it comes to sports. I know what sports
stands want, But for everything he doesn't. He knows a
(15:17):
guy who does. Let's just say I know a guy
who knows a guy who knows another guy. All right,
let's welcome into straight fire. A guy I've known. She's
probably fifteen years because he's covered the NFL, covered college
football at its best. Urban Meyer in Florida. Jeremy Fowler
from ESPN Jeremy how are you, man, I'm good, Jason.
(15:37):
Thanks for having me. I think the last time I
saw you was at the Combine once upon a time.
I yes, indeed combined back when I was going there
to try to figure out any fun interesting nuggets, and
that's when I really started to dig into the mock drafts. Personally.
I love the draft, Jeremy. I don't know from from
your perspective, it's probably a little tougher, right, you gotta
actually cover it and do a lot of stuff. Yeah,
I thought the draft was great this year though, like, yeah,
(15:58):
I'm still interested in the draft. That's three days, you know, gone.
I think the No Combine almost added an extra layer
to it. And then because nobody really knew how it
was going to shake out and what San Frame was
doing for about a month and you know, you're trying
to piece it all together. It was crazy. I mean,
and even these teams, like up until the last day,
we're waiting on medical information on a guy they might
(16:19):
draft in the first round. It was a complete chaos
with no Combine, like they were getting all these results
really late in the process, even some top guys. So
it was it was interesting for sure. I'm just curious.
How did you handle it from a coverage? Was everything
from your house where you are in Connecticut or where
you've bouncing around to pro days and stuff like that.
So yeah, pro days are great. I did go to
(16:40):
Florida's Pro day because I was doing I was doing
some Kyle Pitts. I did a story and Kyle Pitts
and Kadarius Tony. So I went down there and that
was cool, and that was pretty much like it was
as loose as I had seen from a like back
to normal perspective, Like there were hundreds of scouts and
people like all in the you'll hanging out and stuff.
(17:01):
So it really didn't feel like one big precaution, you know,
it's kind of just um, it felt like normal a
little bit. And so yeah, the I didn't hit. That
was the only pro day I went to. So I
did everything from home. You know, I got the basement
set up, and uh, you just you make your calls
and you go on air and try to talk about
the draft. So yeah, hey, let's start. You mentioned Kadarius Tony,
(17:22):
So this is one thing that I kind of have considered,
um when doing these mock drafts and how like my
Jets playing in New York, cold weathertown. The winds pick
up in the winter. You need to eat like tough guys.
And I'm not gonna knock Sam Darnold, but warm weather
California kid. Okay, you just mentioned Kadarius Tony. Now I
(17:43):
believe the Giants traded back and scooped him up, right, Yeah,
so they trade back. The Nine Spouts of Chicago got twenty.
And now you yourself are a guy from Florida and
you are now living up north in Connecticut. I'm just curious.
You're obviously you're not playing football, you're doing media stuff,
but is there something to that, you know like that?
(18:03):
And I'm not trying to generalize soft California kids, but
I've been out here now about five years, and I'm
gonna say it's very easy, and it's soft. I mean
it is. It's like the weather, like, there's so many options,
and you know, I play a bunch of pickup basketball,
and not that that's a correlation to the NFL, but
it's a little softer out Like there is just this
(18:23):
idea like Kadarius Tony is a fast guy from the
Florida Gators, right, how is he gonna mix with New York.
I'm just any thoughts on that. Yeah, it's gonna test
your toughness for sure, But there's an intrigue with that too,
Like when you first go into the cold, you're like, oh,
I can do this and this is gonna be different
and fun, and then it where you know, wears on
you after a while. But I think early on a
kid like that, though he's from Mobile, Alabama, he's you
(18:46):
know that that could be a tough area. He's pretty
hard and so to speak, and you know, he's one
of those really tough football guys that loves contacts, So
I think he's actually gonna like it. You know. Zach
Wilson's another one, right, coming from California. Used to throwing
the ball around a BYU and you know you've got
a clean pocket, and you know, it's a different mentality.
Right now there's turf turf fields, So maybe that helps
(19:08):
a guy like Tony too. You maintain your speed in
the cold, And I think some guys do like it.
It's more about the makeup than it is where you're from. Yeah,
you know, the perfect example is Aaron Rodgers. Of course,
California kid goes to Green Bay where it's freezing and
he's utterly dominant. But you've done a lot of reporting
on this. The situation now is, I guess, like the
(19:30):
biggest story in the NFL probably for the next three months,
Like Deshaun Watson for a minute was and now Rogers
with his alleged edict saying it's me or the GM.
I don't know where are you reporting wise on this?
And then just your thoughts on Rogers. Yeah, this is
the story is going to dominate until there's clarity, and
there might not be clarity for a while. You know.
(19:51):
I talked to some people around the league, some execs
who think that the Packers will dig in here and
just wait him out and then hey, if you don't
show up, we'll find you and play Jordan Love. They
are there's the think that that the Packers already making
some plans behind the scenes. Maybe they get a backup
quarterback here fairly soon. Because they only have Jordan Love
and Aaron Rodgers on the roster, they could maybe try
to get you know, an older veteran mentor for Love
(20:13):
started out there, maybe maybe start to apply some pressure there.
The only way this saves I think, just after asking around,
is that Rogers just gets a completely new contract that
they sort a cave and give him a massive deal
which ends the Jordan Love experiment. But I don't think
they want to do that. They like the flexibility right
now of the They can have a double take, right
(20:34):
they can. They can double did Rogers contract they can
get out of in twenty two and then they still
have Jordan Love waiting and Rogers knows they have that
flexibility and doesn't like it, so he's applying major pressure.
So okay, So you keep saying they, Is they good
to Kunst who I probably keep butchering his name? Or
is they Mark Murphy? Is Murphy who is the big
boss that I guess the guy who hired the GM.
(20:56):
Do we know what sight he's on here? Because you know,
they already had the Brett Farve situation blow up in
their face. That was extremely ugly. You actually covered far
of in Minnesota. Yeah, but do they want to like
test Aaron Rod stop? Let me stop? Is there an
example of a superstar quarterback, a top ten quarterback all
time ever getting fined by his team for holding out?
(21:20):
That's a good question. I can't imagine that it's going
to get that ugly, like you don't want to be that.
Like how much money has Aaron Rodgers made everybody in
the Green Bay Packers organization. Well, we're in a different
era now right where you don't just wait out players
until August in September, you trained them now right like that,
because fans are too smart. You gotta get the draft
(21:40):
capital and so you know you can't just risk losing
him for nothing or having them retires. So you gotta
get something for Aaron Rodgers. You can get multiple first
round picks, you can get players. I think Deshaun Watson
maybe would have been the first because Houston was so
dug in that you know they were maybe waiting, willing
to wait that out and start finding them when you
didn't show up, because now with the new CBA, if
you're a veteran on a second contract, they can start
(22:02):
taking your money. And Nick Kissario was that. I think
he had that rep as a new GM to be
able to try to set that limit. Now I think
that Houston's moving on. I mean it's pretty obvious. They
draft Davids Mills, they got Tyrod Taylor. I think they're
ready to roll with those two guys and wait till
Deshaun Watson's cases is cleared up and then maybe make
a move there. So, but I think he could have
(22:22):
been the one to show up and get fine or
if he stayed away. But it's you're right, there's not
much precedent for especially now. You try to get the
assets best you can, and so Mark Murphy's trying to
play both sides. I think, you know, I would be
shocked if he goes and says, Okay, I'm gonna fire
my GM to make Aaron Rodgers happy. I just I
don't see that move for a place that traditional. You know,
(22:46):
they're not a new age team. They stayed pretty steady
and how you know they're They're very measured and how
they act. They're kind of like the Steelers, right, They're
not gonna make brash moves necessarily. So I just don't
see that. So, you know, unless they can bridge the
gap with a contract, I don't know. There's a lot
of a lot of promising to be done right now.
It's just a matter of if Rogers wants to come back.
But you know, Green Bay's a small town, right, It's
not like New York City where if you're the GM
(23:08):
and you try to run off Eli Manning. You can
try to hide, right, and that, by the way, blew
up in their face as well. Is there a scenario
where the GM you know, maybe gets reassigned in the
front office or Murphy just says, I'm sorry, we want
to placate our quarterback who's a superstar, who's a legend,
and we want to keep him, and sorry, Gudkins, I'm
(23:29):
overruling you. Okay. Can that happen? It's possible. But we
have to remember too that the Jordan Love pick had
to be signed off by somebody, and that's somebody is
Mark Murphy. So it goes to the top. So they
were probably all on lockstep. And I think, you know,
I can't speak for Matt let Flora, but I think
and he wanted he came to Green Bay to coach
Aaron Rodgers. I think he likes Jordan Love and look,
(23:51):
we know Rogers is. I think it's pretty well documented
he's not the easiest guy, yes, to coach and to
play for, to manage. I think that's become pretty clear.
So there's probably some people in the ability that like
the idea of Jordan Love right now, Make no mistake,
they want Rodgers back. They made that clear. But you
know this is Jordan Love is a Murphy call, and
now it's a call at the mark, at the Martin
(24:13):
Murphy level, whether they move on or they keep Rogers.
I do wonder we saw Andrew Luck shockingly retire. It
seems like the Colts by all accounts, were blindsided. But
then they did not make him pay back the twenty
four million. I mean, Aaron Rodgers apparently would have to
pay back forty million if he retired early. Let me
(24:34):
ask you, Jeremy Rogers seems to be going through I
don't midlife crisis is a bit strong, but up and
started hosting Jeopardy, okay, and then he goes and gets
engaged to you know this actress? Yeah, and I don't know.
It almost feels like is he in that I'm in
a transition mode. Hey, you know what, I'm gonna try Jeopardy.
(24:54):
I've got to have a life after football. I'm gonna
I'm getting engaged. You know, I don't need this drama
from the Packers. You guys can have Darren, you can
have Jordan Love. I'm gonna go do my thing. Can
you see that happening? Oh? See Andrew Luck was such
a unique situation because he had so many injuries and plus,
like you mentioned, you know, he's these franchise quarterbacks make
(25:14):
a lot of money for their team. So the Colts knew,
and Jim Mersey knew the owner that Andrew Luck had
made them some money. They had done well, they made
the playoffs, So hey, let's just let him keep the
signing bonus that the check we wrote a few years ago.
So the Packers could maybe do that to make the
problem go away, so to speak. But I think they'd
rather trade him if he wants to keep playing. Yeah,
(25:35):
I mean, if if he went and did the Jeopardy
full time, he got that gig, it sounds like he
would seriously consider it. He seems really into it. He
seems really engaged. So if you get offered that job,
you don't take any contact, you make ten million a
year or whatever it is, that would be a paid
decrease for him. But you know, certainly I could see
it the Packers. I don't know, that's a lot of
(25:55):
money to just let him keep for just a couple
of years. I mean, we saw it. Alvin Johnson and Detroit,
Now that was a little ugly. He had a couple
of years left on his deal, they made a payback
some of the signing bonus, and it's been very tenuous
even since then, so they're just starting to now reconcile.
This would be even uglier because they already have friction
and then they asked for more money. That would be
(26:17):
you might be onto something. Maybe they wouldn't ask for
that money. I'm curious, did you happen to know a
ballpark on the Calvin Johnson number, because I've had forgotten
that one. I think it was only a few million left,
but it's like, you know that that signing bonus pro rate.
So whatever deal he had done, it was a six
years deal and he had some left on it, but
it was it might have only been like a million
or two. I don't think it was a massive number,
but it's like, come on, really, I produced for you.
(26:38):
I'm a Hall of Fame guy, and you're gonna ask
me to stay back like money that you probably don't need.
But in this case, that's a big signing bonus. Plus
they just gave him a six point eight million dollars
roster bonus, So there are a lot of dynamics here.
In play where if he walked away. You know, it's
convenient for him to say I want to walk away
because it applies pressure on them now and that's part
of his leverage. Covered a bunch of good quarterbacks in
(27:01):
the NFL. Ben Roethlisberger, Aaron Rodgers, Brett Varv. I'm just curious.
You know, Roethlisberger's near the end. And in this offseason,
I thought Pittsburgh, you know, they didn't they didn't have
a plan B. They didn't make a move really in
free agency. I'm not counting Haskins. Um, where are you on,
big Big Ben? Do you think? I mean, is this
it for him? His twantson? Probably? So he's thirty nine, Yeah,
(27:25):
and he's got I mean, you know, when you take
a five million dollar salary cut, I don't care how
you slice it. Um, even if he's helping the team,
which is good on him to do that, but like
you know, that's always a bad sign. That's always a
sign of declining play. If he had a monster year,
they wouldn't have asked him to do that. Um. So
you know, he goes from nineteen million to fourteen million.
(27:46):
It's a pay cut. It is what it is. So
you have to think that as declining play. Anytime a
guy takes one, it's it's near the end um. You know.
That said, they felt like he could still do enough
if they could get him more of a running game.
They feel like, okay, maybe we have something for one
more year. Catch lighting in a bottle, maybe we'd get
in the playoffs. Makes some noise and then you reassess.
But you know, I think they're thinking in twenty twenty
(28:08):
two they can then they can not necessarily blow it up,
but look harder at quarterback options. But this is another
franchise they're not. They're like the Packers. They're they're very conventional.
You know. They got Dwayne Haskins, which Mike Tomlin always
liked his talent. I think they said, hey, lets let's
get him in our building for a year. Maybe we
can sort of rejuvenate him a little bit. And knowing
the talents there, and they signed Mason Rudolph to a
(28:29):
contract extension. People would debate whether he's the answer now,
but they do still like him. They had a high
grade on him in the draft. They think, hey, maybe
in twenty two at least have him under contract. He
could start a few games. As a one year Bridge guy.
I'm wondering, Jeremy, why I just started thinking about this,
Why are ending so ugly at quarterback? I mean, listen,
in the NBA, it happens, you know. I tell people
(28:49):
like Patrick Ewing didn't end up with the Knicks at
the end of his career, Elijah One ended up with
the Raptors. Like this kind of thing happens sometimes. But
in the NFL, like, it's just weird when you see
Joe Montana in a Chiefs jersey. You know, Peyton played
a few years in Denver, Um, tom Brady and Tampa,
but between four I can't see Roethlisberger playing anywhere else.
He he looks shot at the end of the season.
(29:11):
In the playoff game, he was bad. Um. I don't know.
It just I can't imagine Aaron Rodgers putting on a
Denver Broncos jersey. That just is a tough one for me.
I know. It's it goes down to, like all these players,
or most of them, you know, they feel like they
can still do it for more time, whether they can
or not. Tom Brady could, some others could not, And
(29:31):
so when you can, it gets ugly and you get
forced out. Um. Yeah, I mean I trying to think
of Rodgers in any other Jersey. Uh, and Denver's really
the only place that makes sense. Yeah, the Raiders. Apparently
the Raiders. Some reporter claimed that there was interest. I don't.
Rogers doesn't seem like a Vegas guy. Him and Gruden
seem like oil and water, like or oil and oil.
(29:54):
I don't don't. Never makes a ton of sense, it
really does. Yeah, they got a new GM that that's
really well respected. They got a ton and these collaboratives,
which Rogers obviously wants, a ton of weapons, three good receivers,
good defense. Like, it makes a lot of sense. And
I think I think Rogers would take pride in trying
to beat Mahomes every year and like, you know, being
in that same division. But yeah, it just it's these teams.
(30:17):
It's calculated, you know, it's all about the money in
the performance, and if a player, however grade he's been,
doesn't match that, it rarely ends well unless you just
kind of ride into a Super Bowl sunset, which Peyton
Manning and John Elway did, but not very many have.
If you love to be remembered as the person who
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hundred flowers dot com for exclusive offers and great values.
To order today, visit one hundred flowers dot com slash
tune in. That's one eight hundred flowers dot com slash
(31:00):
tune in and we're live here outside the Perez family home,
just waiting for them. And there they go, almost on time.
This morning, Mom is coming out the front door strong
with a double arm kid carry. Looks like Dad has
the bags. Daughter is bringing up the rear. Oh but
the diaper bag wasn't closed. Diapers and toys are everywhere. Ooh,
(31:22):
but Mom has just nailed the perfect car seat buckle
for the toddler. And now the eldest daughter, who looks
to be about nine or ten, has secured herself in
the booster seat. Dad zips the bag clothes and they're off. Ah,
but looks like Mom doesn't realize her coffee cup is
still on the roof of the car and there it goes. Ah.
(31:42):
That's a shame that mug was a fan favorite. Don't
sweat the small stuff, just nail the big stuff, like
making sure your kids are buckle correctly in the right
seat for their agent's eyes. Learn more at NHTSA dot gov.
Slash the Right Seat. Visits NHTSA dot gov. Slash the
Right Seat, brought to you by NITZA and the AD Council.
What grows in the forest trees, Sure no one else
(32:05):
grows in the forest. Our imagination, our sense of wonder,
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The forest is closer than you think. Find a forest
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(32:27):
Brought to you by the United States Forest Service and
the AD Council. Fox Sports Radio has the best sports
talk lineup in the nation. Catch all of our shows
at foxsports Radio dot com and within the iHeartRadio app
search FSR to listen live. Urban Meyer is back in
back coach again. He's in the NFL, and I don't
(32:49):
want to say the media gave him a pass at
Ohio State. But I feel like, and I don't want
to give you too much credit, Jarry, but when he
was at Florida, I feel like you and other reporters
kind of held his feet to the fire back when
the Gators had a bunch of off field stuff. Um,
I'm curious how you think urban Meyer will transition to
the NFL. So it's that's interesting because I what's it.
(33:15):
What I think Urban might actually show and reveal more
than he has or has been given credit for, honestly,
is the football acumen. I do think he's wired like
a Bill Belichick or Kyle Shanahan. I'm not saying he's
at their schematic level, but he might be pretty close.
Like he knows all twenty two positions exactly, every nuance
of how they should step, where they should be. You know,
(33:36):
how the left guard should shade on a run blocking player.
He's really pretty brilliant with that step. So I think
he might actually show a little bit where he didn't
get a lot of credit because it's like the spread
offense and oh, you just have a bunch of five
star guys at Ohio State and you can you can
maul people. But he's actually pretty good at that stuff.
So I think he could scheme his way into some wins. Um.
But you know the problem is there, you know. I
(33:58):
mean they're they're pretty short on talent. He saw in
the draft. They just had to get whatever they could
at every position. I mean, like, you know, corner, safety, linebacker,
Like the whole defense is pretty pretty thin. So if
it doesn't go well early on, and plus we don't
know how he's gonna handle losing because he's never had
to lose, and when he does lose, he's shown maybe
he hasn't handled it the best at Florida with with
you know, retiring and coming back and retiring again. Yeah,
(34:21):
so that's the question is, you know, how how long
can he sustain it? What's the shelf life for an
urban Meyer era? Is it five years? Um? That seems
to be you know kind of the case, five or
six years. So yeah, Jim Harball like right kind of yeah,
I mean that's been the MS. So but I think
schematically he'd actually be pretty good. Um. I think he
understands like I gotta be hands off, Like I can't
(34:43):
be mister intensity all the time. Like I think he
gets that. Um, But you know, you're if you're taking
a running back in the first round, saying Travis Easken
is gonna be a third down back, Like I'm trying
to figure out what his plan is or if he's
naive or if he actually has a master plan. We
don't understand yet. Maybe he was just saying that to
play Kate though undrafted kid Robinson who had a really
good year. Although I think, well, I'm bullish on the Jacks.
(35:07):
I guess Jeremy my question. Like in Columbus he was,
you know, the biggest deal in Ohio. If he talked
about a presidential race, like people would react. He's kind
of hidden in Jacksonville. It's kind of not a big
NFL market. You could argue it's the smallest they have
to play every year they're in London. Um is will
he be kind of protected being in one of those
(35:27):
small markets in kind of a bad division, yes? Or
will the spotlight of Trevor Lawrence, who you know should
be an incredible NFL player or will that just bring
a lot of attention regardless of the market. I think
you're absolutely protected. I mean Dave called, well, the GM
lasted a long time. I don't remember the exact years,
but they had a lot of losing seasons. He did
some good things and made some you know, some good
(35:47):
trades and got some good players. They had that one
playoff year where they almost got to the super Bowl,
but Doug Marone Dave called ball lasted longer in Jacksonville.
They would have been New York with that same scenario
with the games they lost. So I do think the
leashes long her. I do think you can hide a
little bit there just because of the market. It's clearly
at number thirty two, thirty one or thirty two as
far as interest, and so you know, that can kind
(36:08):
of help you a little bit. So I think I
think he probably welcomes that at this point, knowing that
if you win games, people will care, and if you
lose games, like you know, you can at least work
your way through it a little bit until I want
to quickly go to Cleveland. So you did get to
cover the Johnny Manziel experience. First of all, did you
have to move to Cleveland for that? What was that like?
(36:28):
And then you know, second of all, like, um, you know,
I guess I like the Browns a lot like you're rationally,
So I think you can make an argument. They have
argued with the second best roster in the AFC. That's
how stacked they are. I'm sure Ravens fans would disagree,
but I just, I guess talk about Cleveland where they
were with you and Manziel and then where they are now. Yeah.
(36:49):
So I was in Minnesota covering the Vikings and I
moved to Cleveland in twenty fourteen to cover the Browns. No. No,
I was in Chicago in between there doing college football.
But then I moved to Cleveland. So Johnny's first year,
and they were they were like seven and four with
Brian Hoyer and like Andrew Hawkins and like all those guys,
Jordan Cameron at tight end, like they were just somehow
winning games. And then it just all fell apart and
(37:12):
they put Johnny in and he was just woefully unprepared,
like and then the stories they were pouring out of
there like it was just every worst case scenario of
Manzille amplified by ten, Like it was just a complete
mess of just how you know, his life was in disarray,
and so it was. It was interesting. I only covered
that team for a year and then ESPN movie to
the Steelers and then I eventually moved to Pittsburgh, but
(37:35):
it was, Yeah, it was a different times. It's a
very like they were still trying to figure it out.
You had a new owner who was you and Jimmy
Haslm who was kind of all over the place and
just throwing darts on the wall trying to figure it out.
Now they have figured it out, but at the time,
you know, you had I remember over here on is
one of the funniest lines I heard, and it told
me like, this is probably a bad sign in Cleveland.
(37:55):
As they beat the Bengals to go I think six
and four, so they were on top of the AFC
the first time in a long time. And then I
heard some executives coming out of the locker room afterward
and they were high five and hugging each other, and
then one of them goes, We're going to Vegas, baby,
really loud, all media around, and I'm like, you know what,
these guys are just not like the football culture is
(38:17):
just not that executive still in the NFL Jeremy, uh no,
at least one of them is not. But uh like
they just you know what I mean, Like the stereotypes
of Cleveland were like, yeah, they're just not ready. They're
gonna fumble this, and they did. That's what happened. But um,
now it's way different, and you're right, they're they're absolutely loaded. Um.
I mean I think they have like ten new starters
(38:39):
on defense, or ten guys who could start or had
started last year on their defense between injury and free
agency and the draft, or you know, like capable starters
in the draft. So there. I mean, the pressure is
gonna be on defensive coordinator Joe Woods to get it done.
He wanted help. He didn't have a lot of it
last year. Now he does. Yeah. Um, I'm just curious
if memory serves Johnny Football like didn't show up at
(39:00):
a Saturday practice. They couldn't find him. It turns out
he had like a raging KEG party. Do you do
you remember covering that? Covering that, yes, So I don't
know exactly what the party was. I don't recall that, um,
but I know, like security had to go to his
house and find him and and then when they did,
you know he was he didn't play. I think you
know he was. He was on He was out for
that game anyways, because he had gotten hurt like a
(39:22):
hamstring that's right. He's missing the final game, but they
essentially had to suspend him and then they you know,
it wasn't good. But were there a lot of guys
on the team hanging with him at the at the part?
I mean, was it based on culture issue some but
like he hung out with Josh Gordon some um and
then you obviously Josh had his problems, but they've u
and then so yeah, I think some teammates hung out
(39:43):
with him here there. I mean, he was very well light.
He just he just wasn't ready at that to work,
you know what I mean, like you just showed up
and didn't do the plays and stuff like that. And
I guess I should wrap up asking about another guy
who um is kind of you know, small ish white
quarterback who looked very I don't want to say immature,
but just looked young at the draft. And that's Zach
(40:05):
Wilson of my Jets. I will say, you watch the
highlight reel and Zach Wilson looks like he's making the place,
and you read, oh, he's got the quick twitch stuff
of Mahomes And there's a if you squint, you can
see a little Aaron Rodgers and I just I don't know.
I'm so excited and optimistic because we haven't had a
franchise quarterback with the Jets and forever, but I don't know, like,
(40:27):
where are you on, Zach Wilson? What are you hearing? So,
I mean, you know, it's funny and this is a
small majority, but I didn't talk to enough people around
the league that thought, like, if the hype around Trevor
Lawrence hadn't built for three years, then Zach Wilson might
actually make a compelling case for number one, like among
a small majority, like maybe ten to fifteen percent. But
(40:49):
I've talked to a few enough respective people who are like,
I think you at least make it interesting, Like if
I was picking number one, I would at least think
about it because it's the it's like the maybe it's
just the Aaron Rodgers bias. Everybody wants that the wild
throws and all the off platform throws and all that,
but he really is highly highly skilled at that to
the point where teams are like, man, you could really
create with this guy. It's like Steph or what you know,
(41:10):
when you think of like the creativity of the game
and what you can do and making plays on the
run and all that. So Trevor's the total Trevor's the
total package. He's a better prospect. But Zach ceiling because
of that. You know, now granted he was teams are
concerned that, like, Okay, the bodywork is small, he didn't
play anybody, and he's thrown and he's got an ocean
of a pocket. It's not even a pocket. It's like
(41:31):
just it's got nobody around him and he can just
make the throw cleanly. So you know, how does he
react to that? We don't know, like how does he
handle pressure? All those things? But I mean, I think
it became really clear very early on in the draft
process that he would be number two. Like, it wasn't
It wasn't like something that the team had to debate.
Everybody just knew Zach was the second best. Yeah, it's weird.
(41:52):
Like Aaron Rodgers, you think back to his time at Cal,
you know, two year starter, put up monster numbers, was
no doubt an awesome, awesome talent, But like Zach, Wilson
didn't go into last season as the definite starter at
b YUI to like win the job because the previous
years he had been hurt, like what's your confidence level
in a guy who has shown it again for one
(42:13):
year in a COVID year. I mean, I don't want
to say there's a little Zach Levine to borrow an
NBA name, like Zach Levine. Look has looked incredible this year,
but like half the league is hurt, you know, like
that's just an awkward year in the NBA. What if
this is just a weird year in college football? Because
Jeremy be honest, like, had anybody mentioned the name Zach
Wilson to you before last college football season? Yeah, not
(42:35):
until I remember like hearing from a few agents that
were like study quarterbacks, like you go to watch out
for this kid, but it was more like underground at
that point. It wasn't really Yeah, he definitely was not
known before the game one of the season, like it
was sort you kind of had to search him out.
But then like the moment he started throwing the ball
and they had a few Thursday night games or whatever,
it was like they had just enough nationally televised action
(42:56):
where you get to see him live and the US
grew really fast after that. Um, you know, but and
I think teams knew about him that you're right, it
was like the shoulder injury, and you know, there's some
questions and you know, and I think the COVID season
helped him, right, Like there, Yeah, it was a weird
year and there weren't probably enough storylines that there normally
(43:18):
wouldn't be with some of the pageantry schools. So it's like, Okay,
who's this kid? And he got more played and maybe
he would have. Yeah, it's weird. I looked at the
twenty twenty two draft. I'm not going to try to
bore you with who's good. Um, it's all a projection.
But everybody wants to find the Zach Wilson, the Kyler Murray,
the Joe Burrow, the guy who comes out of nowhere
(43:40):
has a monster year and becomes like an early pick.
But let's be kind of honest and too. I mean,
but it's not like Burrow won much in his first year.
He looked pretty good. But like it's it's one thing
to do it in college, but then to do it
in the NFL. Like we see the turnover, like Whence gone,
golf gone, Like I don't know, is this maybe this
is the new cycle? You know, teams make a run
(44:01):
with the quarterback but when it comes time to pay him,
we're gonna start to cycle over. Let's build around the
rookie quarterback. Yeah, that's been talked about by a number
of teams, Like do we start to draft a guy
every three years even if we have a star? Right,
Like let's say Josh Allen's probably a bad example because
I think he's like becoming a top guy. But let's
say the Bills said, Okay, well, you know we can't
pay that guy and still feel a competitive team under
(44:23):
the salary cap constraints, So let's just draft another guy,
no matter how will Alan played. Now, I think Buffalo
is going to pay him and he's the guy, but
teams are at leased talking about that model. Now, Um,
like Russell Wilson and Seattle. You know, they've had their problems.
You know, Russell wants more help and he's getting it
this offseason. They've tried, you know, and I think they're
(44:44):
in a better place. But I think Seattle was like,
how much can we do with this contract? You know,
it's it's a big number. I think all you know,
Kirk Cousins is a forty five million dollars cap hit
in twenty Now, the dead salary cap money is the
same amount, so maybe it's a wash if you move on,
but like, yeah, these are the numbers are so outrageous.
(45:06):
And at the at the CBA last year when they're
negotiating that the I know the NFL wanted a sort
of like a max slot, kind of like in the NBA.
They talked about him like, you know, you could set
aside cap for one player, which would basically be a
quarterback rule, right because all the quarterbacks were the highest paid. Yes,
and the players wouldn't go for it for obvious reasons,
(45:28):
you know, they don't want to sort of a competitive imbalance.
But that was the league was trying to get in
front of that. And now that they have ten more
years of ballooning quarterback money, but the cap is sort
of what it is, and you're trying to manage and
sign ten other stars, like they're wondering did we just
keep drafting rookies? Like that's definitely a conversation point. I'll
get you out of here on this. I did have
(45:49):
someone in the league. When I kept saying I would
never pay Dak forty mil. I would never pay him
forty mil. Someone texted me like, Jay the cap is
going to be going up, like this is going to
be the new normal. In three years, Dak's deal is
not going to look bad. The CAP's gonna keep going up.
And I was a little surprised that people think it's
gonna keep going up in perpetuity, that oh, CAP's gonna
(46:10):
go up twenty mil and then thirty mil. Like can
this be? Can this continue to happen in the league?
Maybe it's not an issue. I don't know. Yeah, I
mean the forecasts are big, for sure, So it's difficult
right now. It's supposed to be easier three years from now.
And that's why Dak wanted a four year deal, and
he wouldn't do five years. Even the year before when
they were negotiating, he wouldn't do that because he saw this,
you know, kind of windfall coming. He wants to do
(46:31):
the four years and then get back on it and
get a new deal at fifty million a year or
whatever it's gonna be. It's gonna be crazy, But those
numbers are gonna keep going up too, so it's still
gonna be a challenge for some of these teams now,
Like I know, teams like to hide behind the salary
cap has this big problem and they can usually get
around it anyways, but there is still a question of
like how many stars can you pay right now? Right?
Like yeah, and seven maybe like seven veterans on what
(46:55):
are the Ramacs of eight million or more? Rams have
like four? Three or four? Like yeah, I mean Stafford Ramsey,
Aaron Donald. Maybe it's just three Leonard Floyd. Um, oh
that's right, Leonard Floyd. Yeah, I guess if you're right,
you could you can try that strategy. I like how
the Rams are getting creative right though. They're trying something
that nobody else is trying. Like I give them points
(47:16):
for that. Yeah, no first round picks in like twenty
eight years or whatever it is. It feels like yeah.
I mean I actually joked a less neat about that
because I was like, man, you guys are getting a
mansion for your draft party. You don't even have a
first round pick, like, you know, it's kind of a
it shows that they're independent, you know what I mean?
Like I kind of like that, And he said, yeah,
we're not trying to We respect everybody does their job.
(47:37):
We don't have all the answers. We're just trying some
new stuff that we think's gonna work. We're gonna try
to hit on our day two picks and hit on
her homegrown talent and pay the stars and then you know,
if we don't have first round picks as a result,
that's okay. Yeah, they got the kid two two at well,
um real tiny guy, but McVeigh will probably scheme him
up like Tyreek Hill or something. Right, they got him
and de Sean now I mean they got two. I
(47:59):
forgot about him. Yeah, it got speed. Yeah, that's what
they needed to They needed burners. And they have Matt
Stafford with the cannon right just unloading down if he
can get protection. So all right, Jeremy Fowler ESPN, great
stuff is always Jeremy, thanks a lot for the time
and keep up the good work. Yeah, Jason YouTube man,
appreciate you having me. If you love to be remembered
as the person who gives the best birthday gifts, I'm
(48:20):
here to tell you that one eight hundred flowers dot
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