All Episodes

October 9, 2024 54 mins

John dives into the news of the day that the Jets have fired Robert Saleh. He discusses what role Aaron Rodgers may have played in this firing, who could be the next coach for the Jets, and what it means for any potential Davante Adams trade.

Later, John answers your questions in this episode's mailbag segment.

6:19 - Saleh gets fired

17:08 - Will Adams end up in NY

29:06 - Mailbag

31:04 - Should Wilson start in Pittsburgh

31:45 - Do the Bengals have any hope of the playoffs

34:58 - Who should call the Netflix game

37:50 - Should the Browns stick with Watson

Follow John on Twitter, Instagram and YouTube for the latest. Check out Gametime - the fastest growing ticketing app in the US, and the official ticketing app of 3 & Out and GoLow -  for tickets to all of your favorite NFL, NBA, NHL, NCAA teams. Concert and comedy show tickets, too. Go to Gametime now to create an account, download the app and use code JOHN for $20 off your first purchase. #Volume #Herd

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Mark as Played
Transcript

Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
The volume. The roller coaster of an NFL season is
moving right along, and it promises to be a month
full of tricks, treats, and of course, touchdowns. At DraftKings
Sportsbook and official sports betting partner of the NFL, is
the number one place to bet touchdowns. Running it from
the one or an eighty yard bomb. We don't care

(00:23):
how they score touchdowns. We want to bet on them.
DraftKings hurt us and is delivering Ready to place your
first bet. Try betting on something simple like a player
to score a touchdown. Go to DraftKings Sportsbook app and
make your pick. Here's a reason for new customers to
do a touchdown dance of their own. Bet five bucks
to get two hundred in bonus bets. Instantly score big

(00:44):
with DraftKings Sportsbook, the number one place to bet touchdowns.
Download the DraftKings Sportsbook app and use the code John.
That's code John for new customers to get two hundred
in bonus bets when you bet just five bucks only
on Draftkicks.

Speaker 2 (00:58):
Gambling Problem hundred Gambler in New York call eight seven
seven eight hope and Y or text hope and Y
four six seven three six nine In Connecticut. Help is
available for problem gambling call eight eight eight seven eight
nine seven seven seven seven or visit CCPG dot org.
Please play responsibly on behalf of Boothill, Casino and Resorting
Kansas twenty one and over. Agent eligibility varies by jurisdiction.
Void in New Hampshire, Oregon. In Ontario, bonus bets ekspire

(01:21):
one hundred and sixty eight hours after issueance. For additional
terms and responsible gaming resources, see DKNG dot co slash
ft ball NFL Plus premium offer available only to new
and former NFL Plus subscribers. Additional NFL Plus premium terms
at NFL dot com slash terms.

Speaker 1 (01:45):
What is going on? Everybody? John Middlecoff three in out podcast.
Here here's the plan today. We were going to do
a big, big mailback, and then Bob Solad got fired.
So I recorded a react video on Tuesday, like ten
or eleven in the morning. I thought, you know what,

(02:06):
We'll just keep this recording. We'll put it in the podcast.
I'll also do a little segment for the mail bag,
but the mail bag will only be about thirty minutes,
so I'll do more mail bags, probably from Nashville. I
got a hop on a bird here in about an
hour and I haven't really packed. So it's some opinions
on the solid situation. A lot going on there, and

(02:27):
then a little mail bag at John middlecoff is the Instagram.
Fire in those dms. So we did a podcast yesterday
reacting to the Chiefs game. We're now five and oh
and they just never lose Saints and shambles and some
other stuff on that podcast as well. No cough on
campus today, just because I'm just running low on time talk.

(02:50):
We'll do a big one next week after going to
this game and all these big games this weekend, but
this will just be Jets reaction, Rogers, Sala, Hackett, DeVante,
the Packers in a mailbag, So subscribe to the podcast
if you listen on Collins Feet. I appreciate everyone that
has firing those dms. At John middlecoff is the Instagram.

(03:10):
We have YouTube channel all of our contents up there
as well, and yeah we're rocking and rolling. So we'll
podcast key firing from Broadway. We'll all see if I
can find the goalpost from the Alabama Vanderbilt game, which
I think they threw in the river. Maybe they've plucked
it out maybe they've just left it there. I hope
they did, because I would love to see it. But

(03:31):
before we dive in to Robert Sala, you guys want
a pair of tickets baseball game, football game, college or
pro concerts? Last night, Taylor Swift, she's there having a
good time. Turns out the dude that makes a pick
his brothers, her dance or all these connections. Live music
jamming around, maybe a comedy show anyone that's on Instagram.

(03:53):
It's NonStop. Comedians flown at you, are thrown at you
in the algorithm makes you laugh. Well, if you want
to go see one of them live, do it because
you take the guests work out of buying tickets with
game Time. Download the game Time app, Create an account
and use the code Jahn for twenty dollars off your
first purchase terms apply again. Create an account and redeem
the code John for twenty dollars off. Download the game

(04:14):
Time app today, last minute tickets, lowest prices guaranteed. Okay,
the story of the day. Robert Sola gets fired, And
I think before we dive deep in any angle here, objectively,
he was a really really bad head coach, nice guy
people like him. Was a good coordinator for the forty

(04:34):
nine ers, but as a head coach of the New
York Jets, wins and losses speak for themselves. He's twenty
and thirty six, and when you watch him, you constantly
ask yourself, what is he doing now? I was thinking
about it this morning, that certain guys, younger coaches, get

(04:55):
their opportunity and become a CEO head coach. And we've
pushed back on it over the years. A lot of
you guys say you're so anti CEO coaches. Look at Tomlin,
look at John Harball. Well yeah, look at them. They
went to stable, well run, winning organizations. We have a
long history. If you become the head coach for the

(05:18):
Pittsburgh Steelers, which only three guys have done over the
last like sixty years, you're gonna win. What about the
Baltimore Ravens. Well, John Harbaugh turns out he comes from
football royalty when it comes to coaching, as Jack Harball
produced to elite coaches, and he got to go work
for I don't know, Ozzie Newsom. He inherited a team

(05:41):
with Ed Reed ray lewis not a bad spot. Robert
Sala went to a place that at a first time
general manager, an owner who most people that have been
around him, that have worked around him, that just know
about the Jets think it's an awful owner in the
National Football League. Doesn't mean he doesn't have money, doesn't

(06:04):
mean that he won't fun certain things, but in terms
of like clearly pretty impulsive and when you work for him,
more than likely you're not gonna win. Because I think
there's a pretty consistent theme in the NFL that Robert
Sala if he was going to have success as a
head coach, he could not have overcome this situation. You
cannot overcome poor ownership. Stefanski tried and eventually had bit

(06:29):
him in the ass because now that contract really kicks in.
Godspeed Kevin. Now Robert you know, did not even make
it to this money night football game. Don't totally blame him,
like this wasn't gonna work. It simply was never gonna work.
And I was thinking about the GM. The reason that
Aaron Rodgers was on the team is because they had

(06:50):
the number two overall pick once upon a time, and
they've drafted over the last three or four years a
lot of really good players. They've been pretty good at personnel,
but they whiffed on Zach Wilson. Now, if you wanted
to argue, well, who else should they have picked? Trey Lance.
He's even worse than Zack Wilson, justin fields that wouldn't

(07:10):
have worked with the Jets. Mac Jones career backup. Yeah,
the options weren't good, but he's paid to know that
and he's paid to not screw that up. So, yeah,
Robert Salah has been bad. But they are in this
situation because Joe Douglass essentially had to go to the
blackjack table with all the money he had and choose
to put it on black or red to save this situation.

(07:35):
That's what he attempted to do because the Zach Wilson,
the quarterback situation for the team, blew up in his face.
And because of this weird situation of Aaron Rodgers and
the Packers him getting kind of butt hurt that they
brought in Jordan Love even though they paid him a
bunch of money and I'm acting weird. And then he
finally wants a trade. It's like, yeah, he's available, but

(07:57):
he's also thirty nine years old. In the last year
that he played for the Packers didn't go that well,
and the previous year, one of the best teammates he's
ever had in terms of a player, said like, I
need to get out of here because I don't think
this guy's going to be around anymore in DeVante Adams.
So it was kind of getting weird. So you were
banking on Aaron Rodgers to essentially save your reputation and

(08:20):
save your coach's job because you were headed toward disaster.
And when you put whatever amount of money, if it's
all the money you have on black or red, yeah
it could hit and it could double your money. If
you got one hundred thousand dollars to go buy put
for a down payment on a home, you could walk
right into casino put it on red. If that thing hits,

(08:41):
you got two hundred k. But if that thing misses,
you got nothing. And it turns out the risk with
this player given what you have surrounding him in terms
of Robert Salah. And then when you get Aaron Rodgers,
he forces you to hire a specific offensive coordinator. It's
always going to come up the opposite color. And this

(09:03):
was attempting to put a band aid on a bullet hole.
And Aaron Rodgers at thirty nine forty years old is
simply not good enough to cover this up. Think about
Tom Brady, the most recent all time great quarterback who
changed teams, and he was a little older than Aaron. Now,
Unlike Aaron, his game wasn't predicated on moving around. But

(09:24):
he got to go to Tampa who you could argue
had not been well, they had not made the playoffs
in like a decade. But he did inherit some random
Tampa Bay coach. He got Bruce Arians, a guy who'd
proven to be pretty damn good. Well, Bruce is an
offensive guy, so what's pretty important for an offensive coordinator?
Just like Robert Salad the opposite side of the ball,

(09:46):
he's a defensive coordinator. Hire someone because you're gonna have
nothing to do with that side of the ball. Who's
Bruce Arians? Boy Todd Bowles. So when Tom Brady signed
that contract in Tampa Bay, obviously he was viewed as
the savior, just like Aaron Rodgers, but he was inheriting,
like the Jets, good players, but a really really good

(10:07):
coaching staff. Aaron Rodgers did not. Aaron Rodgers inherited a
head coach and Robert Salad that you never say never,
but is not going to be a head coach for
the foreseeable future, and no team, college or pro will
ever dream. And if they did wake up from that dream,
it would be considered a nightmare of making Nathaniel Hacket

(10:30):
their offensive coordinator. And this isn't personal, Like I don't
know the guy. Hell, I wanted to root for him,
bald guy UC Davis, like that's where he went to school,
It's where I grew up. But you just he's just terrible.
He is not good at his job. And that listen,
He's not alone. There are a lot of football coaches
in the NFL and in college who are stealing because

(10:51):
these jobs pay so much money, and most of them
are glorified pe teachers. They wouldn't sniff and job making
a quarter of what these guys, of course a tenth.
Nathaniel Hackett's probably making one point five two million dollars
to be the off endive coordinated with the New York Jets.

(11:12):
It's like he's fucking golful at his job. So in
no other spot in the private sector could you be
that bad at your job, make that much money and
hold a position. But the one thing Nathaniel Hackett is
going for him is that the quarterback fights him. That's
the reason. That's his job security. So if in the
next couple of days he's gone, it's clear the quarterback

(11:32):
turned on him, Like the quarterback turned on Robert Solow,
I don't totally buy him. Robert Sala was completely over
his head. Every time Robert Solo went to the podium,
he found himself a foot in his mouth. And listen,
I talked for a living. I enjoy coaches that will
say some shit. It makes my job easier. But I
also understand when Belichick or Andy Reid goes up to

(11:54):
the podium and says nothing. What do they benefit from
for saying things? Belichick said it the other day, like, listen,
we're obviously thinking one thing, But in what world would
it benefit me, my team, my players, the coaching staff
to go up there and say it's a cadence issue,

(12:15):
especially when you know Cadence is one of Aaron Rodgers
bread and butter. It's such a BP fastball to go.
You know what, We're gonna have to take a look
at this. We'll meet and talk about it the next
couple of days and work on into practice. We feel
pretty comfortable that we'll be able to get it figure out.
And he could have do he could do that all
the time, but he never chose to do that. He

(12:36):
always would say, Oh, he's in Egypt. Oh this is
going on, Zach Wilson, Ah, this is happening. And he
always felt that he was stepping in it. And why
does that happen because a guy is not ready for
the job, and we have all been put in position
I would imagine in jobs we weren't quite ready for.

(12:57):
That's part of life. I mean, that's part of moving
on up in the world. But when you get put
into a position where you're the boss, like you're not
middle management, you don't have a couple of people answering
to you, like the entire organization is looking at you,
and you are unprepared and you don't know how to
handle it. You got no shot and you definitely got
no shot when you're with an organization as dysfunctional and

(13:22):
as you know, losing and failure is now interwoven within
the Jets. It's part of the culture. Like they also
play in New York where there's some other teams, the Yankees,
who I was watching the game last night, might lose
the Royals. They easily could, and then it'll be like
Aaron Boon, they can never win. True, they're not winning
in the playoffs, but I do think there's some merit

(13:43):
to what Billy Bean said a long time ago, like
baseball's kind of random. My shit doesn't always work in
the playoffs. Like I know this. I watch the Yankees.
They're in the fucking playoffs every year. They're pretty good.
They kind of know what they're doing. Are they gonna
beat the Royals? Who knows it's baseball? Are they gonna
win the next round against the Guardians? I don't know.
I mean, does they have a couple bad pitching outings?
Does Judges back go cold for three weeks? But I

(14:06):
feel pretty comfortable as a whole the Yankees are gonna
be fine. I have zero faith that the Jets are
gonna be fine, Absolutely none, And like if ol Brick
gives them a little life, they'll probably lose against the Bills.
Who they hire, like who's coming in here? You know?
Will they hire William Belichick? He clearly despises this organization.

(14:28):
I don't think there's any amount of money they could
pay him to get him to accept this job. But
like this Ultimately, if we look at the last couple
of years from Zach Wilson to the trade with the
with the Packers, like this moment this morning, this is
the Jets. This is who this franchise is. They are

(14:49):
much much closer to the Raiders than they are the Ravens,
the Chiefs, or the Bills. I mean, let's just call
a spade or spade that their owner is just a
more wealthy East Coast version of the Raiders. And speaking
of the Raiders, Davante Adams, who like Aaron Rodgers, I think,
has to look back and go you know what. Obviously,

(15:12):
Green Bay, I've never been there, kind of middle of
nowhere relative to a lot of these NFL cities, Uh,
not the number one place most people, whether you have money,
but especially if you're making millions of dollars, would more
than likely choose to live. But one thing is not
really disputable at this point. The Packers, since the early nineties,

(15:33):
it's currently twenty twenty four, almost twenty twenty five, win
like literally every single year they matter, They have winning
records and they go to the playoffs. Here's what they
know what they're doing. And both those guys were pretty lucky.
Aaron Rodgers from cal JC Guy and DeVante Adams of

(15:56):
Fresno State Non Power five program got drafted to the
Green Bay Packers and went on to become stars. Now
they deserve a lot of credit. You don't become a
star without having the drive, having the talent, having the
work ethic. But they all benefited from the organization always

(16:17):
consistent good gms, from Ron Wolf to Ted Thompson and
now Goudikins to having a pretty good idea. Over the
last twenty years, who to hire a coach, they've had
two Mike McCarthy, Matt Lafleur, and both those guys. Whether
it's ego, whether it's boredom, whether it's I don't know,
they didn't tell me wanted it out. Do you think

(16:41):
a couple of years later they regret their decision, and
who knows, maybe the Packers would have moved on from both. Yeah,
we don't think you're worth it. We're trading it, we're
shorting you. They definitely might have done that to Aaron,
but I think they would have figured out a way
if Davante would have been more inclined to stay and
one chose to go to the jail, and the other
chose to go to the Raiders. The Raiders already fired

(17:05):
a coach while DeVante was there. He currently has a
weird situation going on with his new head coach, which,
like Robert Sala, feels a little over his head, has
requested a trade. Who knows what the fuck's going on there.
Aaron Rodgers has gone to the Jets, got onto multiple
spats with his head coach, who now is no longer there.

(17:28):
I think it's a good example. Those guys were like
born into first class relative to the NFL. It doesn't
get much better than the backers. It's a very very
short list. And who drafts you in the NFL changes
your life, it really does. Like if over the last
five years you got drafted by the Kansas City Chiefs,

(17:50):
think how different your football career would have been if
you would have got drafted by the Jags or the
Browns or the Jets or the Raiders. You don't control that.
And I think both those guys had been the league
a long time and they probably started complaining about things

(18:12):
that weren't even there. And I think today and I
would imagine they're not really doing it because you know what,
they don't care. They moved on, they've remarried, and their
happiest shit living on a golf course in a gated community.
So do I think Gudakins and Lafleur are smiling, puffing
their chest out. Probably not. There might have been a

(18:34):
moment where Lafour walked or Gudikins walked in each other's office,
shut the door and gave each other a fist pound
because we got this right. We're winners. This place wins
and listen. It's pretty impressive because at the moment both
things happened. Definitely DeVante Aaron, you could have made the

(18:54):
argument because he was older, but still they went all
in on Jordan Love, a guy who had literally barely
play from Utah State. And it works. You know why,
because everything usually works in Green Bay. And when you
go to the Jets, or when you go to the Raiders,
or when you go to some of these teams, like
who is shocked that the Browns are currently one and four?
Is anyone honestly? Oh, they're so talented. Yeah, they're paying

(19:17):
two hundred and thirty million dollars to a guy that
can't play. And if they cut them tomorrow, there is
not a team in the NFL. Not a team in
the NFL who would sign him for the veteran minimum.
He's the most toxic player in the league. No one
would touch him because of on and off the field.
Can't play dead in a Western on the field and

(19:38):
off the field is a walking nightmare. But yeah, so
the Browns, that's usually what happens. Happens all the time.
It will happen again. It's part of their DNA. So
today represents a lot of different things. I said it
when I went to the combine, like you feel it
walking around, like, yeah, this these teams have no shot.

(20:02):
They're gonna lose, And the same teams lose over and
over and over again. Whether it's the owner, whether it's
the owner never knowing who to hire, whether it's the
constant instability. Obviously there are a lot of variables. But
when you are a player and you get the opportunity
to go to these good teams and these well run

(20:23):
organizations and they want to keep you, you should never
leave because your career that this is not most of
our jobs. If I can talk and my brain works,
I can do this till the day they bury me.
To a lot of people right, especially now with white
collar office jobs, like you can work a long time
in football, I mean the average lifees fans like three

(20:46):
and a half four years. Aaron Rodgers' career playing whatever
almost twenty is a complete outlier. Hew Davante is a
second round pick, is shattering the odds. Probably play fifteen
years in the NFL. And they both looked at the
Green Bay Packers where they were winning and said, I

(21:07):
want out. So I feel zero sympathy for their situations
because they signed up to go to bad situations and
Rogers and both of them had huge influence on like
I want Nathaniel Hackett, I think Antonio Pierce should stay.
It's like, this is not how football works. You know,
if football is much closer to like you don't tell

(21:31):
the coach what to do, he tells you what to do.
It in good organizations, it succeeds now obviously as you
build more rapport, they listen to you. But it's not like,
you know, John Harbaugh's going to Lamar Jackson and Kyle
Hamilton on a daily basis to get the breakdown of
their thoughts for or the organizational philosophical beliefs. Right, and

(21:55):
Aaron really wanted to do that because Green Bay didn't
need his opinions and they were probably a little tired
of him. And the Jets would take it. Why they
were desperate. Put it all on, put it all on red,
and then it comes up black and everyone's looking around.
Everyone's looking around. I said it when the beginning of
the season for them to have the same odds as
the Bills. Josh Allen, they remove one of his legs?

(22:20):
Did Sean McDermott and Brandon Bean retire? In what world
is that team gonna beat that team? And the answer
is they're not. And we'll get to see it on
Monday night where I would expect the Bills to beat
the shit out of them. Why because the Jets think
they're just not very good. And we saw the Patriot

(22:42):
game and listen, sometimes it does this and I'm guilty
of this too, these standalone games. You get excited, you
watch like Aaron looks good and it turns out the
Pats are beyond awful. Then he played two real teams
and he looked, honestly, he looked more like a fifty
year old than a forty year old. Looked terrible, and
his days of being a high end player are over.

(23:03):
That's what happens to old players. This isn't like what
we're seeing out of Tom Brady or Lebron James. There
are outliers, but outliers are that for a reason. They
don't represent other people. They're out by themselves. And Aaron Rodgers,
you know what, it looks like. He falls into the
category of Peyton Manning, Drew Brees, Ben Roethlisberger, Philip Rivers.

(23:26):
At the end, it's just Matt Ryan usually, end's kind
of ugly, end's kind of weird. Doesn't end that smooth.
And you'd be like, well, John Peyton Manning won a
Super Bowl. Yeah, I was at the game. He can
barely throw a twenty yards listen, his arm fell off right,
but they won because of the defense. And C. J.
Anderson played pretty well. And Peyton still out of mine,
but he couldn't throw. It's weird, like Aaron can still throw,

(23:49):
not quite as strong as he used to. He can
still move, but definitely not as quick as he could.
And I think sometimes when you have these huge ego
superstars that make a lot of money, they got of
a lot of opinions and they go to these dysfunctional places.
Sometimes it guess worse like sometimes they make it worse.

(24:11):
And I think there's something to be said about the
two guys the Packers set packing. They just they just
want a playoff game. Usually gonna beat the Niners. Probably
be a playoff team again this year. Already won a
couple games with Malik Willis pretty easily. It's like, yeah,
just just doing Packer things. Probably just cruise to ten
eleven wins, wild card. Might might not win the division,

(24:31):
but we'll be the sixth seed. You know, Jets will
be drafting seventh because that's usually Raiders be drafting sixth.
We'll draft twenty third and you know, have a decent
chance to win a playoff game, play the whoever the
I was gonna say forty nine, but we got a
long way to go before that happens. So yeah, I

(24:52):
mean today was I guess the overall theme of the
day predictable. Okay, let's bang out a little mail bag
at John Middlecoff is the Instagram fire in those dms?

(25:12):
Get your question answered here on the show. We have
a lot going on obviously with the old Sala have
to immediately fire this question after the solid news should
the Niners bring back Sala as their DC. Look, I
guess it's not realistic for the Niners to demote fire
their new DC after five games, but I'm extremely envious

(25:37):
the Chiefs getting to hold onto spags. Nobody's gonna hire
sla as the new head coach anytime soon, and the
Niners are currently in a spot whether their DC gets
fired or hired away thoughts. I would do it in rbat. Listen,
what's the statement in business like be quick to fire,

(25:57):
be quick to make changes when you know obviously at
the highest level. I'm not talking about just like fire
the fucking maid because he didn't take out the trash.
I'm talking about in a situation where you hope the
DC would be good enough, but he might not be
just higher Sola. Now, does Salis still want to do that?
He got a lot of money. He hasn't been an

(26:20):
Devensive coordinator in a while, right, It's a lot more work.
Ulbrick has been doing the heavy lifting. But if he'd
be down, I'd bring him back tomorrow. I'd fire that
or to demote the guy again. This is this is
big business. Guys are making millions. You ain't worried about feelings.
It would be a little herky jerky, but a little

(26:40):
desperate right now, from what I see, I don't expect
it to happen, but if it did, like I have
no problem with it. You know this isn't like, well,
you just gave him an opportunity. Yeah, these opportunities pay
two to three million dollars a year, and what our
expectations to compete for Super Bowls? And right now we
can't stop Matt Stafford and Kyler Murray. So you get
demoted and we bring back Robert solid which are star players.

(27:01):
Nick Bosa and more importantly, Fred Warner love love the show.
Do you think the Steelers offense would be better or
worse if Wilson was under center? Seems like Pitt should
be doing so much more. I don't think they'd be
any better. He's a dink and dunk guy, you know,
the one thing justin Fields gives you as a more
explosive player. But he's not as consistent on the dinking

(27:24):
and dunking, which Russell Wilson is kind of mastered, I
would say over the last couple of years. But if
you're a Steeler fan, do you want to watch Russell Wilson,
see the guy the last couple of years, at least
with Justin feels there is a possibility at any moment
something great could happen. Both guys are really flawed. I
would take my chances with Fields over Russell Wilson. What
would be my take? Is there any hope for the

(27:47):
Bengals to make the playoffs? Win the next few and
somewhere around nine to seven or is it already over?
You have no chance at the playoffs win? Your defense
is that bad? Just none? You know, if you played
Deshaun Watson seventeen straight games, yeah you'd be in good shape.
But a defense who looks that bad? And now we

(28:11):
have some, you know evidence, watching them against Washington, watching
them obviously against the Ravens, even a couple of weeks
ago against Andy Dalton. It's got why like Andy Dolton
and and the Panthers against the Bears, Well, turns out
the Bears defense good and the Bengals is not. So
I think you're looking at this thing getting away from
them pretty fast. If you can't win a game at

(28:33):
home when your quarterback's that good, I can't take you seriously.
He was, He was brilliant. Your offense was brilliant. You
have to win that game. You have to win that game.
Even John Harbaugh was like, I would watch this press conference.
He's like, man, you know, we're down about ten points
three different times in the fourth quarter, and our guys

(28:54):
were just pulling plays out of you know where. You
just can't lose that game. You lose that game. I
just can't take you here. And to me, the Bengals
are not a playoff team. Been listening for a few
years now. I'm curious on your thoughts regarding the dominance
of the Chiefs run defense. I watch virtually every NFL
game and haven't seen such a dominant defensive unit like

(29:15):
this in a very long time. I saw a stat
where all the top running backs they faced are averaging
about two point two yards per carry. Just in their
eleven game win streak. They've completely shut down all the
premiere backs King, Henry Kamara, Cook, McCaffrey, and Robinson to
name a few. Well, this might be incorrect, and maybe

(29:37):
if I was sitting with Spags and I said this,
he would pushback against this. One thing they have going
for him is they have corners who can cover. So
when you have corners who can cover, you can cheat,
and you can have your safeties cheat closer to the

(29:57):
line of scrimmage. They obviously Nick is a fly around linebacker,
and they have really good defensive linemen. So when you
can get penetration and your linebackers and your safeties can
cheat in the run game because you feel confident on
your outside dbs covering guys in man demand situations, it's
a huge curve ball. Most people cannot do that because

(30:20):
they don't trust their dbs. And the other thing he
is as a play caller is an incredible blitzer. So
when you blitz and it feels like his blitz calls
like he's the Andy of blitz calls. What Andy is
the offense I play calling and getting it right. He

(30:41):
is that to defensive play calling that you get a
lot of guys in the defensive backfield, and you get
a lot of guys that I would say just are
able to have tackles for losses because you're penetrating the backfield.
You're not just relying on your defensive lineman. You've talked
about who Netflix should hire for the Christmas game. After

(31:02):
the Ravens Bengals game, I think they should call Kevin Harlan.
He is so electric and deserves to call some primetime games,
wouldn't you agree? Yeah, I mean he's he's awesome. I mean,
he's obviously great at the NBA. He's great. If you're
ever in the car on a Monday night, he usually
calls or I haven't heard it. I'm usually not in
the car anymore. But over the I would say. When

(31:24):
I lived in the Bay Area, I'd often be in
the car doing like local TV stuff driving home. He
would call games for Westwood One. It was radio. But
he's he was working then with Boomer Siasin or Kurt Warner.
But he's excellent. So yeah, I mean, I wouldn't shock
me at all. He's It's going to be difficult because
you know, will these guys that already have a full

(31:46):
slate want to do it now? Money talk shit walks,
So if you're gonna pay him, I don't know whatever.
These guys make the equivalent of fifty grand a game.
If you're willing to quadruple that for one game, is
it worth it to be away from your family? I
like I said, I think that's why Tom Brady turned
it down. Now play by play guys. They're just that

(32:09):
they would never give up games, so if they ever
get offered him, they usually take him. I would imagine
he would take the game if offered. A huge fan
of the pod, been listening for the last two years.
I feel like after a couple miss deep shots very
early in the game, they just completely took the ball
out of Fields's hands. There was definitely an effort to
get him going by running him, but I feel like

(32:30):
the play calls were extremely safe and mostly as the
game went on. I know Dallas has a bad run defense,
but it became extremely predictable. Do you think this is
a sign that they're going to go back to Russell,
even though Justin has played pretty well. I think if
you go to Russell Wilson, you're insane, you really are. Now.
I get Tomlin older coach in the sense of been

(32:54):
on the team for a while. Maybe he's inclined to
like look at Russell Wilson and hope that he could
strike a little bit of that magic where Fields. I mean,
the best he's ever played is literally here, and it's
not that great. It's not like they're scoring that many points.
I don't pretend to believe that one hundred percent Fields
is just never going to relinquish that spot because old

(33:17):
school coaches get kind of weird sometimes with younger players
when they got a veteran player that what's the worst
case scenario? They start Russell a game, what's just you
can never go back to? Sure you can justin You're
back in the game two weeks later, the way it works,
So I think everything is on the table. I would
just keep writing justin fields out. But I do get

(33:37):
from Tomlin's perspective or not scoring points, like what the
hell is going on? Though? I don't think they would
really score that many more points if Russell Wilson's in
the game. It's not really I think look at the
way he's played the last couple of years. Congrats on
the engagement. My question is this, as a lifelong Browns fan,
I was hopeful about our team being able to overcome

(33:57):
the woes of Deshaun Watson, but so far it hasn't
played out. Do you think it's a bad idea for
the Browns to just stick with them all year and
get a higher draft pick than to change at quarterback
with Deshaun's cap situation. A rookie quarterback contract could help
offset his cap space and also give us the ability
to move on from from this disastrous player on our team.

(34:22):
I think the best case scenario, if you're a Browns
fan right now, would just be to have Deshaun Watson
play every game and lose every game and end up
with a top two or three pick and just hopefully
you're able to reset the franchise. But I do believe
this Shador Sanders would refuse to play for you given
this situation. I think if cam Ward has an I mean,

(34:45):
if I was representing cam we would refuse to play
for the Browns. If I was quinn yours representation, that
is a hard no. So I do think this situation
the problem is it makes everything weird, it really does.
It just creates chaos, And if I'm a Browns fan,

(35:06):
I'm really really mad at my owner because it's one
thing I get why the GM and the head coach
were interested into Sean Watson. He was not coming there
until Mulgeta took advantage of him and charged him two
hundred thirty million dollars. And that's why he's on the team.
And he's objectively one of the worst players we've ever
seen over the course early on in this season, in

(35:28):
moments last year. It's that bad. It really is. Can't
throw from into the pocket, no speed to scramble, arm
looks crappy, body language all time awful. When you see
his eyes, when they go to his face, you know
sometimes like in a movie, if you're watching, like a
dark movie, they're like, I looked in his eyes. He

(35:50):
just looked dead. He was just he was gone. You know,
it's like one of those moments where he's just it's
just over. Like you just look in those eyes, it
just looks just looks dead. And if you think about it,
I was thinking about this the other day. This contract
obviously was a lot of money to Deshaun Watson, but

(36:10):
he was already really rich. He was a top fifteen pick,
which meant he got some money, not like game changing money,
but millions of dollars. And then he signed a contract
extension with the Texans I think one hundred plus million
dollar contract extension, so he was super rich. So it's

(36:31):
this money. Obviously he has added more money to his
bank account. But if he wanted to eat at the
nice steakhouse, if he wanted to buy two g wagons.
If he wanted to buy a second home, he already
had the cash to do that. I can't imagine. I
don't know if there's karma for the situations with the
massuses that there can't be a worst situation to be

(36:52):
a human being. Like if you're Deshaun Watts, like life
has to suck. Everyone's looking at you weird. Everyone thinks
you so because you do. No chance your teammates really
like you. Because even if I first met to Sean
as a teammate a couple of years ago, it's like
a nice guy got along with him, even if that
was my interaction after a while, we're all human beings,

(37:14):
So put it into normal humans. Let's just say you're
working a job. You're thirty years old, you've been at
the company for a little while. You're doing well. You're
making a hundred grand with bonuses, and you hit some
you know, make a couple of sales here and there.
You get up to like one to fifty. You're financially well.
You live in a place where that that goes a
long way. Then you got a dude who is in

(37:36):
a more important position, who makes let's just pick for
arguments sake five million dollars. You're like, listen, I met
the guy who's nice, but this guy makes so much
more money than me. And then after a while you go,
I think I'm more valuable than this guy. I'm not
even saying you have to be a quarterback to you
could be a guard, you could be a dB, you
can be a tight end. You start thinking they're paying

(37:58):
this guy sticks million dollars to suck this bad and
he makes like the uniform I aware look awful because
of everything he created. Like, after a while, you're gonna
start resenting it. We're just we're all human beings. And
a lot of it in the private sector comes back
to cash, and we kind of compare ourselves to other people,

(38:20):
especially those we work with. What you're paying him how much?
And I'm way better, I'm more valuable, and he's bad
at his job and no one likes him. To me,
it starts to snowball, and that's how could you be
a player on the Browns if you're just a solid player.
And I'm just gonna pick a number. Let's just say
you making four million dollars, which obviously to society is

(38:43):
a boat low of money. Your top one percent of
one percenter, but relative to the locker room, you don't.
You're not even close to the highest paid, right. They
got a lot of high paid guys on that team,
but the highest paid guy on that team makes the
The gap between you and him is really really wide.
It's like, you know, like, I'm gonna be a good

(39:05):
teammate because that's what I'm taught in football, like be
a good guy. Don't make it about yourself, it's about
we dot I. And after a while though, you're just like, no,
this is this, ain't this Ain't it so to me?
They're gonna have a mutiny inside that, like we can't
keep doing this. Also, the livelihood of most of these

(39:26):
players not named like Miles Garrett, You're kind of always
fighting for your job every single year. In the NFL,
there aren't Scholarships don't really exist for the overwhelming majority
of players. It's good ones too, uh. Fellow cal Pauly
alum Go Mustangs. Question for the bag, how do you

(39:50):
evaluate a talent like cam Ward. I'm not a huge
into college football, but I watched the Cow Miami game
and couldn't help but think that his backyard football style
as of now might not translate as a scout, how
do you evaluate the hero ball? Well, Cayleb Williams was
the number one hero ball maybe guy of all time,

(40:13):
and as of last week, you know he's made huge strives,
the best game as a pro. So, when you're in
the NFL, unless you know it's Nick Sabin or Sark
or Lane Kiffen or some of these guys, the coach
is kind of irrelevant and usually you go, yeah, he's
not that good. We wouldn't hire him. We got Andy Reid,

(40:34):
we got Sean mcvah, Kyle Shanian, We'll get the guy right.
And that's how you kind of look at it as
a scout, and you go, was he accurate? Does he
have good arm strength? Do you feel comfortable with him
making all the throws? How is he the line of scrimmage?
What's his control? Is he making the checks? Is? Does
he understand? Is he comfortable running your offense against zone

(40:56):
and man against the difference coverages? What's he like against
the blitz? We are factoring all these things in and
more than likely, depending on the program, you're gonna go, yeah,
the coach is probably average. You know, we're decent or
maybe below, but you go, my guy's good, and if
my guy's comfortable with his attributes, we can get the
hero ball thing away. And obviously it can be a

(41:19):
detriment to cam Ward, but it can also be a positive.
Like I've said this about Anthony Richardson, I said this
about Josh Allen, I said this about Trey Lance. I
have no problem ever with Now the problem with Trey
Lance he doesn't have the physical skills even not even
remotely close to Anthony Richardson and Josh Allen. Like his
downfall isn't just he's not good, it's like his physical

(41:40):
attributes or average. Obviously cam Wards are not. Shador has
some Uh. I can speak to Shador. I've watched him
much more closely than cam. I don't know. I'd have
to look who Cam's offensive coordinator is. But for example Shador,
it's like, well, he's always playing hero ball. Yeah, his
offensive coordinator is Pat Schrmer, who I wouldn't hire to

(42:03):
be my tight end coach in the NFL. Who calls
four and five wide. Now, maybe Dion's from making him
do it, but when his offensive line camp block, he's
running for his life. Yet I watched the door in
big spots. Pretty calm and collected and can make big spots.
Same thing with Camp, even if sometimes they're partly responsible
for putting themselves there. So to me, these two quarterbacks

(42:24):
like like George's guy, Carson back. If you just watch him,
he plays much more naturally in the construct of the
offense three five step drop, hitch release. But I watch him,
I guess, go, I don't think he's that good. Like, well,
he lost his tight end, he lost his wide receiver.
He he can give me all the excuses you want. I'm

(42:44):
just watching him the eye tests and go. Yeah, I'm
not saying he's a scrub. I'm not saying he won't
get drafted, But you couldn't pay me to draft that
guy in the top two rounds. Well, I see the
other guys. Yeah, they might fail, Cam and Shador. You
never know. It's the NFL's a draft. We see crazy
things happen all the time. But I'm taking a chance

(43:06):
with that talent. So assuming and from everything I've heard,
cam Ward great guy, people love him, been a huge time,
big time leader on Miami. So to me, cam Ward
has a very very good chance even with the quote
unquote hero ball to be the number one overall pick.

(43:27):
I mean shit, Look, Bryce Young, who's a five to
nine hundred and seventy eight pound guy, went number one overall.
Kyler Murray had some hero ball to him. It's like,
that's talent is a big discrepancy. If you get the
right talent with the coach Patrick Mahomes Monday Night Football,
you're like a couple three sixties. He's like an Allen
Iverson juke move. Now it works, so it looks cool,

(43:49):
but sometimes it doesn't. Like that's what I want. I mean,
I want a little bit of a playmaker. There just
aren't that many. Like Peyton Manning like runs it perfectly, one,
two out, three, four out. If it goes to his
own the man, we move down. It's like, yeah, that's
all that stuff sounds great in theory, but like, eventually,

(44:09):
what happens when the guard gets smoked by Chris Jones
Derek Carr screwed? Well, if that's Kyler Murray, like, yeah,
might be screwed. Also, the play might be alive. I'm

(44:30):
curious to know your thoughts on Niko Lola Malay Oliva.
I think I screwed that up. But the Tennessee quarterback.
It is abundantly clear that Hypel and the coaching staff
don't trust him at all. They run the ball on
third and long with regularity and generally seem to try
to keep the ball out of his hands as much
as they can. He also, at least to my untrained eye,

(44:53):
struggles with accuracy on most throws, regardless if he's in
the pocket or not. I understand he only in a
six start, but sometimes the coaching staff and their decision
making can be telling well as a young As a
young player, you have to give the coaching staff a
reason to trust you, right So until you earn my trust,

(45:16):
these offensive coaches are not gonna put it on your back.
So let's use examples of guys recently drafted high CJ. Stroud,
Caleb Williams, Jayden Daniels. Last year with Brian Kelly, I'm
just listening Bo Nicks and Michael Pennix, with their respected staffs,

(45:36):
they were so good, so fast. Well, obviously a couple
of them different paths, but I just meant like with
their offense, Bo Nicks was good right away for Oregon.
Michael Penix was good right away for Washington. Jayden Daniels
had a year playing for Brian Kelly. Obviously, Caleb had
been with Lincoln the whole time. Those guys trusted him fast,
and they responded and they made big time plays through
some touchdowns. Nico who I kind of put all my

(45:58):
chips on the table of and I got to be
very careful about doing this because I did the same
thing with Jackson Norld. It's one thing to do with
an NFL player. I'd never watch these guys play besides
some YouTube highlights of their high school so who knows,
and playing college quarterback going from modern day or wherever
you come from high school in Texas, the gap is

(46:18):
way wider than playing at Oregon or USC or Texas
than going to the NFL, which is obviously a wide gap,
but at least in those games you're playing in front
of seventy eighty ninety thousand people against in your biggest
games a ton of other NFL players. In high school,
for the most part, you're not playing against that many

(46:41):
Power five Division IE players on a given game, maybe,
but the totality of your high school career that you're
playing a lot of John Middlecoffs. There's nothing wrong with that.
I almost said tried hard, but I wouldn't consider myself
a try hard guy. Bad shape and small. I think
they had high hopes and early on it was like
with Damn and then obviously against Oklahoma, who is excellent

(47:05):
a defense. The Arkansas game full disclosure, I was boozing
hard and I was at the DraftKings sports book and
watching a ton of games and wasn't super locked in
on that one. I think by the time we got home,
we watched the end of it, and I remember he
ran out of bounce to end the game. So you
could argue it's not only I don't trust him with

(47:26):
the accuracy. If I'm the coaching staff, do I trust
his football IQ right now? Because that's a play that
just cannot happen. It's unacceptable. You can't run out of bounds.
It's like guys that you know do that on fourth down,
or don't throw it to the sticks. It's like guys,
there are certain contexts of the sport of football that

(47:48):
it's just if this happens, it's you can't catch the
ball out of bounce. So if you throw the ball
out of bounds, it's impossible to get caught. If it
is no time left, and you're scrambling around and you
are down. If you go out of bounds, the game ends.
And from a coaching scouting perspective, it doesn't get any

(48:09):
dumber than that. And there's you could say, Hey, you've
got to coach these situations. You gotta be put in
these situations. You're a young player. A lot going on
on the road Arkansas is actually sneaky, not bad. There
are a lot of different variables, but eventually, like I
have to rely. One thing I think you've noticed this
whole time with Andy and Mahomes is Andy was very

(48:30):
very confident and comfortable early on with Mahomes just as
an instinctive player, Like you know what, I trust your instincts.
Doesn't mean you're not gonna fail sometimes or get it wrong,
but I trust your instincts. And I think the best
players are all very very instinctive players. That you're not

(48:51):
born knowing this stuff. But I definitely think it gets
developed early on in your athletic career, whether it's in
like pee wee football, high school football, just playing with
your front you just develop these instincts, maybe even a
little in college, but like for the most part, once
you give the NFL like you got instincts or you don't,
and sometimes early on in college you can still develop

(49:12):
them because, like you said, it's only a six start,
but that is an area that must be developed as
this kid's going to be a star, because Oklahoma did
the thing with Jackson Norlan were like, yeah, he's just
not he doesn't know this is not gonna work, and
we don't have time for him just to like hopefully
develop instincts on the fly, because right now his instincts
are destroying us. And when you get an instinctive player

(49:35):
that knows what they're doing, and you could argue that
Bo Nicks and Michael Pennix had got to develop those
at Indiana and at Auburn, so by the time, and
maybe that's fair. It's why actually the transfer portal has
served a lot of guys well because they've got to
fail and then they get to their new place and
they're ready to succeed. But Tennessee, at one point in time,

(49:58):
it's like, God, is their defensive line good enough, they're
offensive pieces, we know their coach is pretty good, and
then this guy feels a little overwhelmed, which like Jackson
Arnold and him you go, Wow, he's an eighteen nineteen
year old guy with like championship expect It's pretty difficult
in the sec where it's just insane. It's like the

(50:20):
New York Jets level fervor. So I wouldn't write the
guy off, but I think it shows how difficult this is.
And I'm thinking I had a few. But I remember
sitting on my couch because we had gotten back from
the sports book and watching him run out of bounce.

(50:40):
It's like, what what? Oh is that? Why don't the
Jets wind on this? Hire Belichick? I think they would
love to. I think Woody Johnson would hire him yesterday,
he'd hire him tomorrow, and he'd hire him at the
end of the season. I think there are certain things
that are non negotiables, and we all have them in life.

(51:04):
I think the older you get, you have less and
less of them. You realize, as you've just experienced different things,
you kind of never say never. You never know how
things are gonna end up personally in relationships with business.
That's why you know. You learn early on you're taught
this and it really as you age you realize the
power of it, Like don't burn bridges, be careful, treat

(51:25):
people well personally and professionally. Belichick hates these fucking guys.
And one thing as I've gotten older, like if you
ask me, like who do you hate? Honestly, I try
not to hate anybody unless you wronged my family, my dog,
or my future wife or my unborn children. Like, I

(51:47):
don't have the energy to hate you if you screwed
me financially and the number was big enough that that
could go there. I have been screwed financially before, but
looking back, the number or didn't derail my life. Matt.
Originally I don't care, but I could get to a
point where obviously the hate would come out and I

(52:08):
would hate you forever probably, but it would take a lot.
And I'd say most people I associate with I would
fall somewhat under that umbrella, Like it takes a lot.
Belichick is not one of those humans. And however, that
situation played out when he quit on them with parcels
and got traded to the Obviously they played each other

(52:31):
for however two and a half decades. I just can't
see him doing it now. Listen, we all have a
product or what's going on? Well, what if he has
no other job offers. What if the Jets are his
only job offer, then I think we would learn does
he want to break this record, does he want to
still coach, or does he kind of indifferent. I saw

(52:51):
a picture going viral of him with his new girlfriend.
He wearing the Taylor Swift sweatshirt. Maybe doesn't care because
it's not out of the reund possibility that's his only offer.
I would imagine he has more, but who knows. Seventy two,
seventy three years old. I think Jets would hire him
in a heartbeat, definitely at the end of the season,
if he'd be willing to do it, because that would
be a huge win for Woody Johnson. He'd get a

(53:13):
ton of credit, get to play the Patriots, get Bill
Belichick to break that record as a New York Jet
in theory, but I don't think it's gonna happen, and
I think it's because of Bill. If Bill has options,
one would not take it. If Bill didn't have options,
I still think he would think long and hard about like, yeah,
maybe my career is just over and I'll just do

(53:34):
this YouTube and McAfee and Peyton manning shit for the
next four or five years. And just kind of kick
it and just enjoy life. I got six rings as
a head coach, two more as an assistant. Like what
else can I accomplish? He could break the record, But
do I want break the record one day when I'm dead,
have the picture of me in a Jets hoodie. I

(53:56):
don't think he would. I don't. I mean, this is
a this is an Northeast. There's a guy that holds grudges.
There's a guy that holds grudges, so I would. I
don't know exactly. We've never really got to the bottom.
I've never read a great explanation. Obviously, there are a
lot of variables here, but like a specific instance, I'm
pretty sure Woody johnson' n even on the team at

(54:17):
the time, But I would bet against Bill Belichick ever
being the New York Jets head coach. The volume
Advertise With Us

Hosts And Creators

Colin Cowherd

Colin Cowherd

Jason McIntyre

Jason McIntyre

Music, radio and podcasts, all free. Listen online or download the iHeart App.

Connect

© 2024 iHeartMedia, Inc.