Hour 2 - Right / Wrong

Colin tells you where he was Right and where he was Wrong, thoughts on George Pickens ripping the Steelers after they traded him to Dallas, and Matt Hasselbeck joins the show. 

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to
catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio in
noon to three Eastern nine am to noone Pacific. Find
your local station for The Herd at Fox Sportsradio dot com,
or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app
by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR. Thanks for listening
to the Herd podcast. It is a Monday live in

(00:22):
Los Angeles. It's the Herd. Wherever you may be and
however you may be listening. Thanks for making us part
of your day. Nice to be in today. Jmac. The
NBA Ping Pong Ball Draft lottery tonight. Very exciting, very
exciting weather.

Speaker 2 (00:37):
It was so amazing out of here all weekend. I
forgot to ask you get your sun little suns out, guns.

Speaker 1 (00:41):
Out for you.

Speaker 3 (00:41):
No beach.

Speaker 1 (00:42):
I worked out, had a great time, Sadhu. Watched a
lot of NBA stuff, a lot a bad NBA basketable yesterday,
went and had a beer with a buddy.

Speaker 2 (00:52):
That Celtics Knicks game Saturday was unwatchable, kind of watchable.

Speaker 1 (00:56):
To be honest with you, why if I had, you know,
I think Boston's gonna win this.

Speaker 4 (00:59):
Ser well, not as the Knicks win tonight. If the
Knicks win tonight, I think they got a great chance
to win the series as well, nickl.

Speaker 1 (01:06):
If the Knicks win tonight, they're gonna win the series.

Speaker 2 (01:08):
By the way, Celtics have led every game by twenty
second of the seven games this year.

Speaker 4 (01:12):
That's not great.

Speaker 1 (01:13):
It's their formula, all right, it's a Monday right wrong
as oh was plenty of both. Here we go where
Colin was right, Jannis, according to Shams, is going to
explore the best fits outside of Milwaukee. We've been saying
this for the last year to year and a half.
You got a trophy, you don't control your first picks.
You're not close to being in Indiana, a Cleveland, a Boston,

(01:37):
an ok C. And you're not close to being a
San Antonio in Houston. Potentially after the draft lottery tonight,
it's time to reboot. And according to Shams, that's what
Milwaukee and Yanni's plan to do. Where Colin was raw,
If you'd have told me the Knicks would beat Boston
both times in Boston, I'd have said you're crazy. If

(01:58):
it had told me Boston was lead by twenty in
both games or more and still lose. I'd to say impossible,
but the impossible happen. Hard to explain. What I watched
in Boston is the Knicks currently lead two to one.
Again very clearly, one roster has eight guys who can shoot, pass,

(02:19):
and handle the ball. New York is not that roster.
But if they win tonight, Boston's in big trouble. Where
Colin was right, I said teams didn't want to draft
Shanor Sanders once he got out of the first round
because they didn't want to Tim Tebow's circus. And sure enough,
even though he was the second quarterback taken by the
Cleveland Browns. What were the questions about from the Cleveland

(02:43):
media at camp?

Speaker 5 (02:46):
This will probably fall in deaf ears, but don't look
too much into it. There's plenty of reps. There's a
lot of time between now and September, so we'll have
a plan. But it's an all encompassing evaluation. It's not
something that it's just based on the the practice reps.

Speaker 1 (03:00):
There's a lot that goes into first questions, why is
Shadu or not getting the starting reps? You knew it
was coming. It's t bow two point zero. Where Colin
was raw Derek Carr retired. I listen. I always liked him.
A four time All Pro during the bad al Pro

(03:20):
bowler during the Al Davis Kruddy years, which is hard
to do. He was a life preserver for a terribly
run franchise. Third season in the league, he was third
in the MVP vote, second round rout of Fresno State.
I liked him a lot, but there's not much you
can do. The Raiders were a mess when he was there.
And then Dennis Allen is not a head coach, He's
more of a coordinator. I thought he was going to

(03:41):
have a Philip Rivers career where you didn't maybe watch
a ton of them in college, but you're going to
look at the end of his career and there'd be
some Hall of Fame votes. And he retired yesterday and
it never transpired. Where Colin was right. Well, The Athletic
is reporting that NFL teams laughed at the Cowboys for
giving up a third round pick for George Pickens, the

(04:02):
very talented but an incredibly vollied a wide receiver. And
as we said, when Mike Tomlin moves off a drama
filled offensive playmaker, they do not recover. I can give
you about seven examples. This is also Jerry Jones once again.

(04:22):
As the NFL front offices have gotten younger and shrewder,
the Cowboys are giving away draft picks like skittles. The Cowboys,
to me have one of the weaker rosters overall in
the league. Where Colin was wrong Julius Randall. Where did
this come from? I always kind of liked him, but

(04:42):
his assist totals have gone through the roof. He has
led Julius Randall has led the tea Wolves and assists
and by the way, with New York, they wanted him
to be a one pre Jalen Brunton, and that's not
what he is. But I never saw him as a two.
I saw him as a three. He was great against
the Lakers, been excellent in this series. He had a
triple double Saturday, And we just got to be honest.

(05:04):
Here is it late developing? No, it's probably this staff
Chris Finch has assembled knows how to use him. I
don't think he's a better player. I think he is
used more efficiently in Minnesota. And good for Julius Randall.
Where Colin was right, I did not buy the odds
makers who had OKC at minus eight hundred to bury

(05:27):
the Nuggets. I said this is gonna be a six
or seven game series. Jokich is the best player in
the world, and even though I love okc's roster construct
and depth, I would take the Nuggets starting five if
he gave me a quarter to play for the championship. Again,
OKC is built to win the entire thing, and maybe
Denver with no bench isn't. But it was disrespectful the

(05:50):
odds had this thing being a four or five game series,
and I'm sorry. Denver's got three great playoff veterans who
have been a lot of these close, big games where
Colin was right. Well, the Steelers enter twenty twenty five
as the only team in the league without their top quarterback,
running back, wide receiver, and left tackle from last year.

(06:13):
I have said this for years. They don't take offense seriously.
Once again third year in a row. They are among
the league leaders in defensive spending. I'll get to this later,
but they become opposite of the Rams with an offensive coach,
an offensive spending, and no drama. But it is remarkable

(06:35):
there's only one team in this league quarterback, running back,
wide receiver, left tackle, gone, gone, gone gone in an
offensive league. I like Mike Tomlin, respect the Rooneyes, but
they just feel out of touch for twenty twenty five
NFL football. Where Colin was right, Where Colin was wrong
with that Matt Hasselbeck, eighteen years in the league is
now joining us. Yeah, it's interesting. I mean, I don't

(07:00):
think this is embellishing. Pickens is a young player. He's talented,
but everybody knows in the league. Everybody knew Des Bryant
was a little emotional or Stefan Dicks. There's players that
come with a reputation. If you were quite, if you're
Dak and you know pickens reputation. If Mike Tomlin moves
off him a very tolerant guy, there's probably something there.

(07:22):
How would you address it? Would you communicate with him early?
What do you do knowing you're bringing somebody into locker
room that comes with a personality and probably some some demands.

Speaker 6 (07:39):
You're a little grugby on a Monday, Colin. I'm listening
to you, man, now listen. I think you kill him
with kindness. It's a clean slate. You give everybody a chance.
At least that's what I did. You know We signed
guys all the time that maybe had a checkered pass
on their previous team, and then it's a clean slate,
like I'm going to give you a chance to lose
my respect, I guess is how I would think of it.

(08:00):
When we got Marshawn Lynch to our team, Pete Carroll
did a good job.

Speaker 3 (08:03):
We killed him with kindness. He basically basically got run
out of Buffalo.

Speaker 6 (08:07):
We killed him with kindness. We told him what the
standard was at our place. We didn't have a lot
of rules. We had three rules, but they mattered. Those
three mattered. We weren't gonna have ten rules.

Speaker 3 (08:16):
We had three of them, and that's what we care about.

Speaker 6 (08:19):
And he got on board, and he was a great teammate,
Like he was incredible the entire time that I was
teammates with him. And and then I would even say
beyond So I think if your dak get a you
get a wide receiver.

Speaker 3 (08:28):
Wide receivers can be a little bit.

Speaker 6 (08:30):
Of high maintenance comes with the talent level. There's a
lot of talent at wide receiver. George Pickens in this
case has a ton of talent, huge upside. You give it,
You give him a chance because ultimately, the chemistry between
quarterback and a playmaker like that. I mean, that's you
could win or lose two or three games just on
that alone.

Speaker 1 (08:48):
You know. I I look at the Cowboys Eagles is
the first game of the year, and my take is
the NFL said, we don't know how good Dallas was
going to be, so we're gonna get them right up
front and get a Cowboy game early. We don't know
by week eight what they look like. Philadelph we were
talking about this is that when you plan a Super Bowl,

(09:09):
everybody wants to get paid. Philadelphia is going to happen.
They moved off some players, but this is a big
and there's some ego in this organization, which I'm totally
comfortable with. When you are the first game a couple
of years ago, Lions beat the Chiefs at Arrowhead. When
you've won a Super Bowl or been in a Super Bowl,
you're the high profile team is off. Is an off
season different? Does it feel a little different when you've

(09:31):
been in the Super Bowl? Yeah?

Speaker 4 (09:33):
Absolutely.

Speaker 6 (09:34):
I mean, first of all, I'm surprised by this Week
one matchup. I'm not sure if you are divisional Cowboys,
I mean the Cowboys will right. Well, anytime you don't
need the Cowboys week one, you could throw the Chargers
at the Bengals or somebody up there.

Speaker 3 (09:47):
But no, the off season is very different.

Speaker 6 (09:49):
And I remember, you know, even my rookie year, I
came into the Green Bay Packers, they were coming off
of their you know, two super bowls in a row.
I remember when we were coming off of our super
Bowl in Seattle.

Speaker 3 (09:59):
Mike co Longrin was the head coach.

Speaker 6 (10:00):
The talking points are different, the coaching points are different.
You know, basically, you got to come back down the mountain.
You know, the whole season you're talking about climbing a mountain.
It's twenty games, it's climbing a mountain. You don't just
like start fresh. You got to come back down off
that high. And I think that's a hard part. You know,
sometimes there's a little bit of fat cat syndrome. You know,

(10:20):
you're on the banquet tour and on the you know,
vacation tour.

Speaker 3 (10:24):
You forget what got you there.

Speaker 6 (10:25):
But then other times it's in free agency, guys leave,
coaches leave, everyone gets promoted, and your team isn't quite
the same team. And so no matter who you are,
I think you got to realize last year is last year,
and you better buckle your chin strap and come to
play in twenty twenty five because you your Week one opponent.
I mean, you got to target on your back for everybody,

(10:46):
but especially that Week one opponent.

Speaker 1 (10:48):
I swear this is not a Shador Sanders question, but
both the Saints now with Derek Carr's retirement, and the
Browns have an open quarterback competition. You don't get a
lot of those in the NFL, like you just don't.
Were you ever part of an open quarterback or at
least you went in and there were spots open, And
how do you divvy up snaps and how does it work?

(11:11):
Because you don't get many of it. That's a college issue,
that's not a pro issue.

Speaker 7 (11:16):
Yeah.

Speaker 6 (11:16):
Well, listen, every situation is a little bit different, and
I always viewed it as it was an open competition.
I mean, going back to that rookie year, I remember
Mike Hombren saying to our team, the Green Bay Packers,
he said, listen, I don't care how much you make
where you were drafted. The best players are going to play.
Then he said, now, granted I expect Reggie White to
be our starting defensive end. I expect Brett fav to
be our starting quarterback, but the best players will play.

(11:39):
I think the great organizations have the confidence to do that.
Thinking back to Seattle and Pete Carroll maybe his third
year there, they were paying a ton of money to
a bunch of other quarterbacks, and they had the courage
to start Russell Wilson, a rookie third rounder. They played
the best player. That's unusual. People don't usually do that.
So the reps are usually divvied up how they expected

(12:02):
to go, how they wanted to go, where's their money invested?
And so for a late round pick, it's tough. Like,
if I'm being honest, you're there's gonna be on rare occasions.
Are you even getting snaps with the first strinth center,
like not in a live situation, And so there's going
to be all these things. You're gonna basically have to
make it the most of every single opportunity. And I

(12:25):
always found it it was a lot easier when it
was clearly defined, not necessarily to the public, but it
was clearly defined inside the building, inside that quarterback room.
Here's what you're actually competing for, Here's what's open to
you and you know it's those are uncomfortable conversations, but
I think it's best when those conversations are out on
the table there and they're actually had.

Speaker 1 (12:46):
Okay, So you have to have at least four to
five new playoff teams on an annual basis. Now, I
did very well last year in the AFC because I
took the best quarterback in every division. I think the
AFC it was almost like during the Payton Brady years.
I got two right. So in the AFC, my predictions
are Josh Allen, Lamar Jackson, C J. Stroud. That feels

(13:09):
like an easy one. I am going Year two of
Harball has always been the year at Pops. By the way,
I think Brabel's excellent, Burrow and Mahomes make the playoffs.
Let's pick apart my AFC playoff prediction. Anything you don't like.

Speaker 6 (13:25):
Listen, I love the Patriots, but that you're asking a lot.
I think you're asking a lot there. I think the
Bengals were very, very close to being a playoff.

Speaker 3 (13:32):
Team, So I'm down with you.

Speaker 4 (13:34):
I can get.

Speaker 3 (13:34):
Behind that one.

Speaker 6 (13:35):
But I'd be surprised to see the Patriots over the Dolphins.

Speaker 3 (13:39):
Right there.

Speaker 6 (13:40):
No one's a bigger Mike Rabel fan than me. I
love Drake may I think they're a year away though,
and I think they might actually be okay with that.
But I think Miami. I would slide Miami in there.
And that Texans division that's the other one, you know.
I just I don't know that could go any either way.
I played in that division for multiple teams, and I
wouldn't be surprised to see Indianapolis be a lot better

(14:04):
uh this year, if they can get the quarterback play
a little bit better. Other than that, I like your
I like your your your list here, and I want
to be surprised if this was the year that Lamar
Jackson and the Ravens uh make it to the super Bowl.

Speaker 1 (14:15):
Okay, we go to the NFC, which was harder for me,
especially the NFC North. Listen again, I'm gonna go with
Jalen Hurts, Jared Goff, Baker Mayfield, Matt Stafford with a
great defense. I'm kind of rolling the dice on Seattle.
I do think their roster and coach are excellent. I
love their GM. I thought two years in a row
they've nailed the draft. You're laughing, and I bet you're

(14:37):
laughing at my Bears.

Speaker 4 (14:38):
Right, can you be a homer and you're not even.

Speaker 1 (14:42):
In Chicago yet?

Speaker 3 (14:43):
I mean, what the heck man?

Speaker 6 (14:45):
I mean either, you love o line play, I mean,
because they've done a great job of exulstring their I
love what Ryan poles a little bit.

Speaker 3 (14:52):
I love what they're doing. But no, a wild card team.

Speaker 6 (14:55):
No, Listen, you said it right, you you meant last
time you made the picks based on the quarterbacks. It's
always good quarterback play in the playoffs. I mean, it's
pretty much that's the deal. Go back to last year.
I would think the Steelers may maybe the exception because
they didn't have great quarterback play at the end of
the year, but they had good quarterback play during this season,
and I just I think that's a huge question mark.

(15:17):
I think that's a gamble. I'm calling you out as
a homer there. Sorry, those are the facts. I wouldn't
sleep on the Vikings. You know, it's a huge unknown, right,
But I.

Speaker 3 (15:27):
Guess I don't know.

Speaker 6 (15:29):
I think the Vikings have so much confidence that it's
giving me confidence. And you know, like you just said
about coming we were talking about the super Bowl, coming
back down the mountain.

Speaker 3 (15:38):
That NFC East, there's always a new winner.

Speaker 6 (15:40):
It feels like, don't count out the Washington Commanders as
a team that can win that division. And I'm probably
just saying that because I love their quarterbacks so much,
and now I'm probably biased, but.

Speaker 3 (15:52):
I would, I would kind of.

Speaker 6 (15:53):
I would say all that, and then the other team
you don't have in there that Usually it's hard to
go worse to first, but I think San Francisco could
be in that. In that NFC West, I think that's
anybody's division as well.

Speaker 1 (16:03):
Finally, I want to wrap it up so the staff's
given me crap I said. When Derek Carr came into
the league and made four Pro Bowls with the dysfunctional Raiders,
I'm like, this guy can play. I watched him at
Fresno State. He was third in MVP voting early in
his career. But I here's where I thought he had
a chance to be a Philip Rivers, where we'd be
giving some Hall of Fame votes at the end. But

(16:25):
the difference is Philip Rivers had more function around him,
and I look at Derek Carr and we all know
that rookies need the right landing spot. I mean bow
Nick's Sean Payton. It probably doesn't look like that if
he goes to Matt Eberflus not picking on him, but
a defensive coach. I always thought Derek Carr and then
he went with Dennis Allen, and I'm like, I'm going

(16:46):
to be wrong on this. It just didn't work. Do
you think Derek Carr like a Sam Darnold had he
gone to a great, functional offensive coach. Am I overstating it?
Or is he a classic? He never got a fair
shot in this league?

Speaker 6 (17:01):
No, Listen, I think I think his teammates would say
he's a Hall of Fame teammate, and I think he was.
I think he was cooking with some of the offensive
coaches that he had. You know, I don't know have
the years in front of me, but I feel like
the John Gruden kind of that offense that he was in.

Speaker 3 (17:16):
Listen, when I think of Derek Carr, I think of
one thing. It just comes. I can't get it out
of my head. How he left the Raiders.

Speaker 1 (17:24):
It bothered me.

Speaker 6 (17:25):
It bothered me big time, Like he got benched and
then they told him don't don't.

Speaker 3 (17:29):
Even come to the building.

Speaker 6 (17:30):
And the coaching staff that did that It bothered me
because in my mind, I was like, Derek Carr is
going to be a raider way longer than you're going
to be a raider, And that bothered me. And I
really I feel like I watched him grow up as
a leader. I saw the way he handled when there
was the tragedy with the wide receiver who ended up
going to jail. He handled the terrible situation with the
head coach, you know, all all these kinds of things

(17:52):
like I just you know, it's unfortunate. Sometimes your body
can't do for you what your brain and your heart
want to do. And it sounds like that's a similar
case for him. But I enjoyed watching him play. And
I was never teammates with him. I don't know him,
but I think when I hear his teammates talk about him,
I understand what kind of teammate he was.

Speaker 1 (18:11):
Matt hasselback, Great, seeing you on a Monday, my friend
as always.

Speaker 3 (18:14):
All right, smile more Kyle calling on.

Speaker 1 (18:18):
I'm heading to the Midwest. I feel just great. Okay,
So I'm a bit of a Chicago homer. Hey, I said,
I was hoping Cooper Flag went to Houston or San
Antonio because I do think that changes. Can you imagine tonight.
I'm just telling you, if san Antonio wins the lottery,
they're going to have the back to back rookie, a
point guard, a big now a wing.

Speaker 4 (18:39):
They've won enough of these damn things. They don't need
another one. You got Wendy, you got David Robinson, you
got Tim Duncan. What why would we give you imagine
another one?

Speaker 1 (18:47):
Can you imagine being OKC that you've done a brilliant job.
Sam Presty has done a brilliant job. You found Harden
and you got Kadi in Westbrook, and you get to
a final and you never win it. And now how
Staff sold and Lebron's old and you are poised and
the Spurs get wembyan one, draft Castling the next, and

(19:09):
Cooper flag in the next, and you never win a title.
I mean they have been Oklahoma City has been so
well run and so smartly constructed. If you're an OKC fan,
it doesn't matter if Houston wins it don't we don't
trust Houston necessarily. If san Antonio wins this hit And
by the way, I've always said san Antonio, no state tax,

(19:30):
they'll go get some good free agents. If san Antonio Hilla.

Speaker 2 (19:34):
They've gotten so many free agents, so many people want
to move to San Antonio.

Speaker 1 (19:38):
Very nice, beautiful, you river lost beautiful.

Speaker 4 (19:41):
Wait, what's next to you? Texas? You're gonna set him out?
By Jill Rogan in Austin.

Speaker 1 (19:45):
What's going on?

Speaker 2 (19:45):
Like?

Speaker 1 (19:46):
Come on the very good life?

Speaker 2 (19:47):
San Antonio does not need any more number one fix?
You know what does the Nation's capital, which is under
fire by Gross Washington. You know, I watched on the DC.

Speaker 1 (19:56):
I watched the documentary. I'm not even gonna get into it.
How frustrating it was to watch. I watched a documentary.
It's called Shooting Guards. It's the Gilbert Arenas story with
his teammates. Oh, it's it's it's unbelievable that an organization
would be so dysfunctional that they would allow that to happen.
There's like thirteen warning signs and the organization couldn't figure

(20:18):
it out. Well, that's why I cannot. I cannot root
for the Wizards. Sometimes you turn an eye when you
got a superstar Arenas? What hey, you want a fun fact?

Speaker 2 (20:26):
You know? I like to wear NBA jerseys just for fun.
The first jersey I bought ever was Gilbert Arenas when
he was in Washington and I was. I would wear
it around the New York City subways going to Mensley games.
If you'd be like Wizards, what are your Wizards? It
was a great talking point. I love Gilbert Arenas man,
that guy was really good. And then the gun in City.

Speaker 1 (20:45):
It's a fascinating, but it was impossible to watch that
and root for the Wizards just I mean, the what
they allowed on the team plane and in the locker
room was maddening. I don't even listen. It's obviously you
have to be culpable of your player. They made bad decisions,
but sometimes parents slash. That's the thing about the NBA.

(21:06):
These kids come into the NBA eighteen nineteen years old.
I mean they grow up in Louisiana, then they go
to New York or LA. Those kids need help, they
need guidance, they need support. If eighteen years old, you
would have shipped me off to play basketball in New
Orleans if I had bad guidance, Don't forget.

Speaker 4 (21:24):
The millions of dollars dripping out of your pockets.

Speaker 2 (21:26):
Okay, Yeah, some Kwame Brown stories floating around about howm
Michael Jordan treated him after they took him.

Speaker 4 (21:32):
Number one overall.

Speaker 2 (21:32):
Go read that about Michael Jordan, guy who punched his teammate,
and go see how he treated Kwame Brown in DC.

Speaker 4 (21:38):
I kill the guy.

Speaker 1 (21:39):
I cannot root for Charlotte or the Wizards. I can
root for the Pelicans a little because they've done some
smart things. Oh really, what name one brand? Anthony Davis?
The brandon Ingram thing wasn't bad. You've got some players.
I can root for the Pelicans. I can root for
almost everybody on this list.

Speaker 4 (21:54):
What's wrong with the Hornets?

Speaker 2 (21:55):
Do you not remember the Hive and Alonzo morning Eloy Donson?

Speaker 1 (21:59):
I don't. Starter jackets, yeah, because they were super cool
when I was a kid. Remember the starter jacket, the
teal and purple or whatever. I don't nobody cool wre
them maybe now in Portland wherever you look.

Speaker 2 (22:12):
Come on, those things were the jam trust me, they
were awesome for like eight minutes in the nineties, and so.

Speaker 1 (22:19):
That therefore you're rooting for that.

Speaker 4 (22:20):
That was my childhood, you know, Come on.

Speaker 1 (22:23):
You need some therapy. You got to get on the couch.
I don't think your child was as redeemable as you
keep telling us just heard.

Speaker 8 (22:32):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
in Noone eastern nine am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio
FS one and the iHeartRadio App.

Speaker 9 (22:41):
Hey, Steve Covino and I'm Rich David and together We're
Covino and Rich on Fox Sports Radio.

Speaker 1 (22:47):
You could catch us.

Speaker 9 (22:47):
Weekdays from five to seven pm Eastern two to four
Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and of course the iHeartRadio App.

Speaker 1 (22:54):
Why should you listen to Covino and Rich.

Speaker 9 (22:56):
We talk about everything life, sports, relationships, what's going on
in the world.

Speaker 1 (23:00):
We have a lot of fun talking about the stories
behind the stories in the world of sports and pop culture,
stories that well, other shows don't seem to have the
time to discuss.

Speaker 9 (23:08):
And the fact that we've been friends for the last
twenty years and still work together. I mean that says something, right.
So check us out. We like to get you involved too,
take your phone calls, chop it up. As they say,
I'd say, the most interactive show on Fox Sports Radio,
maybe the most interactive show on planetar. Be sure to
check out Cavino and Rich live on Fox Sports Radio
and the iHeartRadio App from five to seven pm Eastern

(23:29):
two to four Pacific and if you miss any of
the live show, just search Kovin on Rich wherever you
get your podcasts, and of course on social media that's
Covino and Rich.

Speaker 1 (23:38):
Lottery. I think it's fascinating. It is one of my
people for years and years always said, oh I love
the home run derby means nothing has no impact on anything.
I can go watch that at the park. You can
watch tonight. If San Antonio or Houston win that puppy
or Utah Utah, san Antonio or Houston win that draft lottery,

(24:00):
it's going to change things in this league. Jannis will
probably be headed to one of those organizations. And I
was saying, I watched the documentary this weekend called Shooting Guards,
and I'm not saying the players aren't culpable Javaris Critenden
or Gilbert Arenas. I'm not saying that. But in the NBA,
because players enter the league at such an early age

(24:22):
that I root for draft picks to go to better organizations.
I don't care. In the NFL, because you spent four
years in college. A lot of guys coming to the
NFL they've got a fiance or they're married. You know,
they've been on a college campus for four years. And
by the way, just on average, most kids that get
drafted in the NFL. I mean, there's some red flags obviously,

(24:44):
but by and large, players know they have very short careers.
They put their money away. In the NBA, you know,
you don't get hurt as much as football players come
in kind of Lucy goosey. If they don't have the
right guidance, they're you know not. It's just not built.
The NBA is not built to avoid busts. The NFL

(25:06):
does everything they can to avoid busts. They get three
and four years of tape, the players are older. It's
still hard because you know, you have so many injuries
in the NBA, you're guessing you're getting eighteen year olds.
So we have a draft lottery tonight with and this
only happens about once every four years, that you get
a player that everybody knows is going to be a star.

(25:27):
He may not be a whimby, but you may be
getting Jason Tatum and he's only eighteen. He could have
twelve to fourteen great years. So I would like to
see what I consider smart people. When at Utah, Ryan
Smith and Danny Ainge really bright guys. Darryl Morey of
the seventy six ers, although that organization drives me nuts,

(25:49):
I think san Antonio and Houston would be fascinating. Spurs
going to have a couple of chances at it. God,
if they win that thing tonight, I've just telling you
you're okay. C You've done everything right for about a decade.
If san Antonio is that tonight, what a gut punch

(26:09):
to the thunder.

Speaker 8 (26:10):
J Mack with a news no, no, this is the
headline news.

Speaker 2 (26:17):
Well, speaking of the thunder, they got lucky last night
because Jokis ran out of gas.

Speaker 1 (26:21):
Colin.

Speaker 2 (26:21):
He is having a brutal last few games in this series.
Once again, could not throw in the ocean yesterday seven
of twenty two.

Speaker 4 (26:28):
Colin thirty three percent.

Speaker 2 (26:30):
He's been going downhill since that amazing Game one performance.

Speaker 4 (26:34):
Uh, and now we're tied at to in the series. Afterward,
here's Jokis talking about his struggles.

Speaker 7 (26:40):
It's a little bit of everything, you know. They're playing
really good defense on me. They're really into my body, hands,
the physical. I think I missed like two three open
looks tonight. So it's a little bit of everything, you know.
They're shrinking the bone, they're shrinking the floor from me.
They're having guy behind defense there. So it's a bit

(27:01):
of everything, you know. So it's course, but it's part.

Speaker 5 (27:08):
Of the game.

Speaker 1 (27:09):
Yeah, I don't think you can blame you Oki. Okac
is one of the few teams in the league that
gives him problems. They got a lot of dudes.

Speaker 2 (27:19):
It's less about him being a problem. He's struggling, no doubt.
Well he's tired, man, but he never struggled. Seventh, seventh
game in thirteen days for them, plus overtime.

Speaker 1 (27:27):
I thought. I thought Charles Barkley was right. I thought
the scheduling was unfair to have a late Friday game
than an early Sunday for a much older team.

Speaker 4 (27:36):
I learned it out with eight points, right, No.

Speaker 1 (27:38):
I mean I thought it was unfair. They look completely flat.
But let's give oka see credit. They've got a number one,
a number two, a great coach. We've got the two
home grown. Wait, you don't, oh, I think I like him.
He's ideally a three. He can be a two. Go
you don't think you got to be a two on
a championship.

Speaker 4 (27:54):
Let me just finish out with Denver real quick. Your
man Russell Westbrook, who you love to like make excuse it.

Speaker 2 (28:00):
He was minus twenty in twenty seven minutes yesterday two
of twelve shooting fouled out. He was a disaster well
because he was trying to do too much. They have
no bet g was to fight with them.

Speaker 1 (28:09):
Let me defend Westbrook because the team was out of gas.
Westbrook saw it and went, Okay, I'm gonna go full board.
I think Westbrook saw and felt and this is an
older team, big bodies. They were shot.

Speaker 2 (28:23):
I get that, but like Westbrook was terrible. They have
no bench and you can't foul out. But I don't
know how they win this series at this point.

Speaker 1 (28:30):
No, they're not.

Speaker 4 (28:30):
No Yukis could be herculean in the next game.

Speaker 2 (28:33):
And go for forty and twenty the next game, but
they have only one day off, so next game would
be tomorrow.

Speaker 1 (28:37):
They're gonna get housed.

Speaker 2 (28:38):
Tomorrow, they might get housed, and then they come back
to Denver, maybe winning.

Speaker 4 (28:41):
Force game seven. I don't know. The weird thing is
I watch OKC. I don't think they're a great team.

Speaker 1 (28:46):
Colling, do you I think they're really really I think
they're like a little bit like a young Boston, two
years away from Boston where they've got like eight.

Speaker 2 (28:54):
Guys one one eight after SGA, there is no home
grins a very getting.

Speaker 4 (29:00):
Bodied by everybody else.

Speaker 1 (29:01):
He's getting bodied by Aaron Gordon. Aaron Gordon is in
one of the top six or seven athletes in the league.

Speaker 4 (29:08):
You know, I want.

Speaker 2 (29:09):
To send a note to Cheholmgreen. I go to Costco
and get those protein shakes. Yeah, they're great after you
work out. Give Cheholgan like five of them.

Speaker 4 (29:15):
Any hands got a game?

Speaker 1 (29:16):
Wait, he's a can. He's like twel is he twenty two,
twenty three years old? Come on again, twenty pounds, dude,
I'm telling you right now. Aaron Gordon is a top
six athlete in the league. Ben Carroll is one of
the great athletes. I think he's so you're putting him.
I think this is a tough assignment for homegrown. I
think he's terrific. He's a good player. I like him,
good young player.

Speaker 2 (29:36):
But pump the right now, all right, First size, he's feisty.
He's feisty. Yeah, let's go to my guy, Austin Reeves. Okay, listen,
he had a rough series against a minnisote Okay, we'll
all admit that he was not spectacular.

Speaker 4 (29:49):
He's outplayed by Anthony Edwards. He's a face of league.

Speaker 2 (29:52):
Well, you know, Bill Plashki, a sports right out here
for the La Times. This big beats about why the
Lakers should trade Austin Reeves for a rim running big
man this summer. This is complete nonsense. I'm sorry, Colin.

Speaker 4 (30:06):
This is I like Plaski's had a lot of good pieces.
This is garbage.

Speaker 8 (30:09):
You know.

Speaker 2 (30:10):
This is the Lakers through eighty two games with the
number three seed in the West, largely because Austin Reeves
was spectacular when they were missing Anthony Davis. You cannot
trade Austin Reads for like.

Speaker 4 (30:20):
A rim running big man.

Speaker 1 (30:22):
No, not it you. First of all, the Lakers value him,
so they wouldn't just do it for a rim running
big man. They would do it for a couple of pieces.
But the reality is, because his salary isn't massive, it's
all got to work. I think you, because you're a
Laker guy, do not understand how far away they are. Go.

(30:44):
Look and again, if Houston or San Antonio went or
Utah win and I the Lakers might as well lower
their season ticket price.

Speaker 4 (30:54):
Oh what are you doing?

Speaker 1 (30:57):
I'm just because okay.

Speaker 4 (31:00):
Over real quick, Anthony, Sorry not Anthony Reeves.

Speaker 2 (31:03):
Austin Reeves this year twenty points per game, four rebounds,
five assists.

Speaker 4 (31:07):
I mean, he's a borderline All Star.

Speaker 2 (31:09):
You don't trade him for like Clint Cappella or one
of these rim running bigs.

Speaker 4 (31:12):
Don't do that.

Speaker 2 (31:13):
That would be foolish. Polinka pushes the right buttons. I
think he's gonna stand down on Austin Reaves. You and
I disagree. Now here we go. This is just breaking
in the NFL. In the last hour, boy, Trey Hendrickson
has ticked off Colin, the Bengals pass rusher, their leader
in sacks. One of the great players on that team said,
there has been no communication between my camp and the

(31:34):
organization post draft. The offers prior to the draft did
not reflect the vision we shared and were promised last
offseason if I continue to play at a high level.
This is Trey Hendrickson talking about the cheap Bengals. You
have banged on them for at least two years now
about this phony organization.

Speaker 4 (31:54):
I'm just telling you it.

Speaker 2 (31:56):
Is a major whiff of fraudulents in Cincinnati, and they're
gonna botch this Hendrickson thing badly.

Speaker 1 (32:01):
Well, it's an offensive league. I my belief is, if
you're gonna pay anybody on the defensive side, pay for
a great pass rusher or disruptor. So you pay for
Chris Jones, you pay for Max Crosby, you pay for
Trey Hendrickson. So I would not pay for a number
two wide receiver. I would pay for Burrow Jamar Chase,

(32:23):
Trey Hendrickson, and eventually a left tack.

Speaker 4 (32:26):
So what are they doing telling him, oh, hey, you
keep playing.

Speaker 2 (32:28):
Well, hey, who've got the most sacks in the league
in the last two years. Look look it up, guys,
And they're like, well, we can't we can't splurge by
the way they went and drafted his potential replacement, the
kid out.

Speaker 4 (32:37):
Of A and M who had a.

Speaker 2 (32:38):
Whopping four and a half sacks in his college career,
not one game in his career.

Speaker 4 (32:42):
He's out holding outcome. He's like, wait, I don't want
this contract.

Speaker 2 (32:47):
It's getting ugly, and Cincinnati, a certain producer on the show,
is very upset.

Speaker 1 (32:52):
The good news for Cincinnati is Cleveland's a mess in
Pittsburgh doesn't have a quarterback. I mean they're lucky Cincinnati.
I'm I'm picking him as a playoff team simply because
offensive coach, great weapons Joe Burrow, and they'll eventually, I think,
sign him.

Speaker 2 (33:06):
If Joe Burrow gets hurt again this year, can we
call him Glass Joe once again.

Speaker 1 (33:09):
Let's not there's no reason to predict an injury. Let's
hope he doesn't get hurt. J McK with the news.

Speaker 4 (33:17):
Well, that's the news, and thanks for stopping that the line.

Speaker 1 (33:21):
Dickens, the former Steeler is ripping the Steelers. That's next.

Speaker 8 (33:25):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and noonon Easter not a Empacific.

Speaker 1 (33:30):
So there's a difference between being cheap and just having
some financial realities that don't play in your favor. So
George Pickens is the talented wide receiver that left Pittsburgh
and they traded him for a third round pick to
go to Dallas. So Cincinnati's owner is cheap. Pittsburgh will
pay their stars. They paid Big Ben, they paid a

(33:53):
hinz Ward, Harrison, TJ. Watt. Pittsburgh's not cheap, but it was.
I was there this morning thinking about Major League Baseball standings,
where you know, all your league leaders have a lot
of money. I think in the NFL, and I've talked
to my couple friends, you think everybody's got the same money.

(34:13):
The Rams, who have maybe the richest owner in the sport,
Stan Cronke, the Rooneyes are the second poorest owners in
the sport. And the Rams have become the model of
the league with the Chiefs and the Steelers feel outdated.
They're literally opposite franchises. We put this on the screen.

(34:34):
The Rams and the Steelers are polar opposites. The Rams
have a young offensive coach, Steelers old defensive coach. The
Rams have an elite veteran quarterback, the Steelers have mediocre
young quarterbacks. Rams spend their money on offense, Steelers on defense.
One has no interest in head cases. They don't draft them,
They take them off their board. The Steelers draft and

(34:55):
try to develop dysfunction before moving off them. The Rams
have eight playoff wins in years, the Steelers have none.
So the Steelers, in my opinion, don't spend their money wisely.
That said, they have taken care of a Minka Fitzpatrick
at TJ. Watt. They've taken care of They just spend
too much money on defense, not enough on offense. Their

(35:15):
tone deaf. But another reality is the Rams now are
going and everybody goes well. And the Steelers they never
have a losing record. What are your standards? I'm sorry.
The Rams are now They've got plans for a ten
billion dollar headquarters. They're going to make Woodland Hills Beverly Hills.

(35:38):
It is unbelievable the plans the Rams have, The Steelers,
the Ruinees, they don't have that money. So where do
you think free agents want to go? So Pittsburgh's doesn't
even have the best stadium in its hometown, PNC Park
with a Baseball Pirates play is the gym. So this
is the difference where you think all these NFL owners,
the Rams are building something that will be so far

(36:00):
ahead of the league because they have a rich owner
and they can pay you know, like again, the Steelers
pay Tomlin fifteen million, sixteen million bucks. I don't think
the Steelers are cheap. I think Cincinnati's cheap. I think
the Raiders, you know, until they got some money infused
into the organization about three years ago, they were cheap.
But I think the reality of what Pittsburgh has become

(36:21):
is There is a gap in this league, not just
in quarterbacks and coaches. There is a gap financially in
this league. And Pittsburgh's staring at it is that you know,
in the off season when you got to write those checks,
you got to have money in the bank. And the
Roonies are old school owners. So and by the way,
the City Pirates are an embarrassment. Penguins haven't made the

(36:43):
playoffs in several years, the Steelers no playoff wins in
eight years. I don't think it's all ownership. The fans
love the teams. I don't think there's a lot of money.
And I think what's happening in sports and you're seeing this,
You're seeing this everywhere in society, that gap. Even Rob
Man last time he was on my show, was just

(37:03):
exhausted when I asked him about the gap between the
Dodgers and everywhere else. I mean, the Yankees were always
making more money than even the Red Sox or the
Dodgers or the Giants. The gap now between the Dodgers
lineup and the Rockies. The Rockies are a Triple A
Baseball team. The Dodgers are an all star team in
the Big so I think in football We don't talk

(37:24):
about this enough. Arizona financially is not in the same
ballpark as the Rams. The Steelers aren't. Now you can
be Green Bay and you don't have an owner. Now.
Green Bay, unlike Pittsburgh, has always leaned offensive coach and
taking care of the quarterback. So I think the Packers
or are the model of what a small market franchise

(37:46):
should be. Mark Murphy, very good front office, don't have
a meddling owner, don't have a ton of extra money,
don't attract free agents, but draft and develop well and
are always ahead of the league at quarterback. So you know,
some of it is the Steelers aren't spending their money wisely.

(38:07):
More on that Steeler Pickens trade to Dallas. Mark Caboli,
a very smart reporter in Pittsburgh. Significant locker room guys
for all you cowboy fans got fed up with Pickens.
Antics quickly turned off by him. So veteran players were

(38:28):
not into Pickens who got shipped to Dallas. Some felt,
says Mark Caboli, it would be counterproductive to keep him around.
They felt the locker room could turn toxic, so he
was bad and getting worse. Not many teams were interested
in trading for George Pickens, making it difficult for the
Steelers to get market value. Yet the Cowboys gave up

(38:50):
a third. They pray could have got him for a
fourth or a fifth. Not many were broken up with
the organization that Pickens got traded. So that's what Dallas
is getting. So again, I'll give Pittsburgh credit for this.
They're always pretty good and they do move off dysfunction.

(39:12):
Why they drafted I don't know. Here's Matt Hasselback earlier
on Dak Prescott now inheriting a player that comes with
baggage from Pittsburgh.

Speaker 3 (39:21):
If you're Dak, you get a you get a wide receiver.

Speaker 6 (39:23):
Wide receivers can be a little bit of high maintenance
comes with the talent level. There's a lot of talent
at wide receiver. George Pickens in this case has a
ton of talent, huge upside. You give it, You give
him a chance because ultimately, the chemistry between quarterback and
a playmaker like that. I mean, that's you could win
or lose two or three games just on that alone.

Speaker 1 (39:44):
Yeah, well, I have him finishing third ahead of Cleveland.
J Mac Wednesday is so Tonight's the NBA Draft lottery
I love it. Yeah, Tomorrow Tuesday, you're going to see
all sorts of leaks coming out on the NFL schedule.
They'll start east and they'll move west. They'll be leaks everywhere.
Expect certain organizations. The Giants have always leaked. Certain organizations

(40:07):
leak it to get some pub.

Speaker 2 (40:09):
Yeah, there's some stuff starting to float around, but we're
gonna wait for confirmation because people are wrong.

Speaker 4 (40:15):
We know this. Right about the schedule.

Speaker 2 (40:20):
There's a team that you and I have been disagreeing
on for a while, and I'm just telling you right now, Colin.

Speaker 4 (40:24):
When you look at the opponents, it's a cakewalk.

Speaker 2 (40:28):
Once they signed brock Perty, you will change your tune
on the Niners once the schedule comes out. I promise
you that you're down on the Niners. You don't have
them winning ten games or sniffing ten games.

Speaker 1 (40:37):
Well, they're gonna go zero to two against the Rams
and mcvahan Stafford much better defense.

Speaker 2 (40:43):
If you go back like five years, I think they're
like seventy percent wins against them.

Speaker 4 (40:46):
But whatever, I think the.

Speaker 2 (40:48):
Niners are gonna be the team you're gonna flip on
here this week. That would be my biggest guess and
I think if you're looking for number two, the Bears,
who you love, that schedule is daunting.

Speaker 4 (40:58):
Okay, especially on the road. Keep an eye on the Bears.

Speaker 1 (41:02):
So what's interesting is you're giving the Niners credit despite
the fact that many believe the Rams are a super
Bowl team and that Seattle in Arizona had two of
the best three drafts. Yet you're tough on Chicago because
their divisions so hard. What's Minnesota ever won? What's Detroit
ever team? I mean, they were the best. The last

(41:24):
time I watched Detroit play, they got smoked at home
by Washington.

Speaker 4 (41:27):
Who's got the better coach, Minnesota or Chicago? Obviously Minnesota.

Speaker 1 (41:32):
Let's take a deep breath. One he's never been a
head coach. Well, let's just let's give him a shot.
Let's be a little positive.

Speaker 4 (41:38):
Okay, you have a beck.

Speaker 1 (41:39):
Said I was being grumpy earlier today, I'm being positive.

Speaker 4 (41:42):
He's right, you were being a little angry.

Speaker 2 (41:44):
Let me ask you this, who do you have more
faith in next year? JJ McCarthy or Caleb Williams.

Speaker 1 (41:50):
Caleb Williams why he's a better player. Actually, he threw
the ball down the field in college and had to
carry a terrible offensive line and a limited roster.

Speaker 2 (42:00):
I didn't say who's better at backyard football? I said
NFL football.

Speaker 1 (42:03):
No. Caleb Williams every year to at USC in Chicago
battle lines, running for his life. What did the Bears
fix the old line? JJ McCarthy has thrown over thirty
times once in Michigan. I have no idea if he's good.
They've never asked him to win games. They asked him
not to lose him. I mean so, I mean again,

(42:25):
it's hard. Caleb Williams. Ben Johnson, to his credit, said
I don't know if this guy can play, but we're
gonna give him a fighting chance. Drew dominant center Joe Tooney.
Apparently this Boston College tackle ish.

Speaker 4 (42:41):
He looks dominant already.

Speaker 1 (42:42):
He has been dominant in the three day rookie again May,
and he looks dominant against out you know last week.
I'm just saying, keep your eye on Chicago.

Speaker 4 (42:52):
The Hower action there.

Speaker 1 (42:53):
Do not believe a journalism, is how I see it.