May 12, 2025 • 33 mins
Colin explains why he hopes the San Antonio Spurs win tonight's NBA Draft Lottery, more thoughts on Giannis being open to exploring his options outside of Milwaukee, a quick look at tonight's Celtics - Knicks game, and Rachel Nichols stops by.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to The Herd Podcast. Be sure to
catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio in
noon to three eastern nine am to noon Pacific. Find
your local station for The Herd at Fox Sports Radio
dot com, or stream us live every day on the
iHeartRadio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR. Thanks
for listening to The Herd podcast. Kind of a must
(00:21):
watch if you're a sportscaster, a shooting guards. It's the
uh Javaris Critinton story, who was initially a Laker ye,
and then it's Gilbert Listen. Players are culpable for their
own mistakes. You cannot root for the Wizards as an organization.
After watching that, I was so it is.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
So ridicious, the same I'm organization any games.
Speaker 3 (00:44):
I mean, they just are it.
Speaker 1 (00:45):
So what was allowed? It's it's fascinating, like on planes.
It's happened on planes. Okay, Rachel Nichols joining us, Okay,
So tonight. One of my favorite non games of the
year is the NBA Draft lottery. Like a couple of
(01:05):
years ago, we had Wemby. This happens about every fourth
year we get a Lebron or we get a Wemby.
So Cooper Flag, who is only eighteen. But you know
the comp and I think it's an accurate one is
you're getting Jason Tatum but a little more aggressive like
Kyle Play. So Utah has acknowledged they would consider Danny
Inge if they won moving Cooper Flag. I would not,
(01:31):
but they are and Danny Ainge is shrewd.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
Danny Aheer said he would trade his own grandmother, so
I assume he would trade Cooper Flag.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
So here's my Utah wins it. Are they the front
runner to Land Yannis?
Speaker 2 (01:44):
So if I'm Milwaukee, I am not doing a straight
up trade for Cooper Flag and Yannis right because the
Milwaukee Bucks don't have a first round draft pick till
twenty thirty one, that is six years.
Speaker 1 (01:57):
From now, don't control any of their first for five years.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
If you get a Cooper Flag or some other really
outrageous young talent but no picks back including that, if
it's a straight up trade, that's no good for you
because you won't have young talent to put around him.
You've got older guys on bad contracts. By the way,
you can become an unrestricted free agent in the NBA
after seven years and six years is when they would
get their first first round draft picks, so he'd be
(02:21):
out of there.
Speaker 3 (02:21):
So that's not worth it. If you talk and put together.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
A package with Cooper Flag with some other young talent
with draft picks that interest the Milwaukee Bucks, sure they'll
have a conversation for sure. The other one to watch
with the draft lottery is Houston, because Houston has been
a front runner for whoever the best free agent on
the market is. Right, We've talked about Kevin Durant, We've
talked about Devin Booker, we've talked about Jannis. Trump's them
(02:45):
all right, So if Jannis does become available, the advantages
you're trading him to the West, which is great, right,
And the Milwaukee Bucks have learned their lesson with Drewe Holliday.
You do not want the guy you just traded in
your own conference.
Speaker 3 (02:57):
Right.
Speaker 2 (02:59):
They've got young talent they can come and really good
young talent they can come to Milwaukee, and they have
all kinds of draft picks. And certainly if with the
Phoenix pick, which they're in the lottery for tonight, they
luck out with Cooper Flaggerant, even anyone in really the
top three or four. Because these are great players, they
(03:20):
then become even more.
Speaker 3 (03:21):
Of a front right.
Speaker 1 (03:22):
I said, the most fascinating part is this, so we
know Kyle Shanahan has had great teams, arguably for about
a four year stretch, the best roster, no trophy, great
Sacramento King trades teams way back when no trophy. So
my take is, Yiannis, you got a trophy twelve years.
(03:42):
Great fun. Here's the team to keep your eye on.
So we think Sam Presty is brilliant. They had Westbrook,
k D and Harden. They now have home gren SGA
and an unbelievable roster. Yet, if San Antonio wins the
lottery tonight Wemby this year's rookie of the Year, the
(04:03):
point guard from Yukon, Stephen Castle and Cooper Flag. Yeah,
and my take is, what a nightmare for okc oh I.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
Mean, look, if Oklahoma City or the Spurs win this
draft lottery, can you imagine Oklahoma City obviously threw their
other picks because their own pick is not going to
be in the lottery.
Speaker 3 (04:26):
But it's just crazy to me have.
Speaker 1 (04:31):
The best rookie three straight years.
Speaker 3 (04:33):
Yeah, it's crazy to me.
Speaker 2 (04:34):
And by the way, the thunder to your point, they
have all these picks, they if they want to, are
going to be a contender for Yannis because the picks
that they have aren't just their own picks.
Speaker 3 (04:46):
They've grabbed picks from all around the league.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
So you're really not betting against Yannis to fail if
you're making that trade near Milwaukee. Because they've got this pick,
they've got this team's pick, they've got that team's pick.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
You don't have to worry about it.
Speaker 4 (04:59):
You know.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
I said this with the Warriors. They're not there yet,
but Steph will be thirty eight next year. They made
the move for Butler because they wanted to squeeze every
last win out of Steph. Kind of their Jeter untradable player,
their l Way. Yeah, and there's very few of those,
but Jeter Lway kind of feel like Steph can't trade him.
(05:23):
And so I'm sitting there thinking, you don't want the
Kobe Tour the last three years, which was unserious basketball.
You don't want to be the Bucks where you grab, grab, grab,
and you wake up and you're like, we're a first
round exit team. I look at the Warriors. They don't
have their GPS system. When Steph doesn't play and he's
thirty eight. He's running a mile and a three quarters
to two miles every big game. Oksee Houston, all these
(05:51):
San Antonio. You look up and you go, guys, we're
gonna bring this back, couldn't. I argue Kuminga doesn't work
with Steph. If they get extinguished here very quickly by Minnesota,
my guess without Steph they will What do you do
going forward? Great coach Steph in great culture is not
going forward? You're at best fourth in the West.
Speaker 2 (06:14):
Well, if there is a silver lining to the Steph
Curry injury, which by the way, obviously the Warriors would
rather not have, it's that Jonathan Kaminga has gotten to
play more and show what value he brings. Because really
the issue is it's not that he can't play with Steph.
It's that he can't play with Steph and Jimmy. There's
not room for him when there's those two other guys
are on the floor. Now that Steff's off the floor,
(06:36):
it's him and Jimmy and they can play well together.
And also Kuminga had a great game right even in
the loss. So the silver lining if they do lose
this series and Steph can't come back is. Now you
have a much more tradable asset in Jonathan Kuminga than
you did even a week and a half ago, right,
because in the first round it was like, Eh, he's
not even good enough to make the rotation, right, what
(06:57):
kind of asset is he?
Speaker 3 (06:58):
Nobody's gonna want him.
Speaker 2 (07:00):
It's like, oh, okay, it really was just scheme, and
therefore he's an asset. I don't think either way this
is going to be similar to the Kobe situation or
the Yannis situation, because on both of those teams, you
really had one elite guy. Right on this team, you
have Steph, you have Draymond, you have Jimmy. Now, they're
all aging, I get that, but those are all kinds
(07:21):
of players. They can make a difference in the game
the way the guys on Kobe's team couldn't, the way
the guys on Nanisis team can't this year. And I
don't know when Steph heard that they were making the
Jimmy trade. His quote to Draymond.
Speaker 3 (07:35):
Was, this is it. This is our last ride.
Speaker 2 (07:38):
Ye And I think they all know it and they
believe it, and they think that with this group they
can really make an impact and maybe get the finals again.
And by the way it looked like it, you know,
toward the end of the season, in the early.
Speaker 3 (07:49):
In the playoffs.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
So the Celtics season may very well come down to
tonight the way they won and blowout fashion. Generally speaking,
the Zigzag theory on the road, New York will be
ready to roll tonight. And there has been a question
Boston from Danny Ains to Brad Stevens. They are proactive,
(08:12):
not reactive, and they're not moving Tatum. But if they
lose to the Knicks, there is a sense that they
can look up and go, listen, we don't want to
be Milwaukee and Denver. We've got Tatum, we've got new
owners may want to shed. I mean, their salary now
is like five hundred million if they just signed their
first round pick. I mean, Rachel to me, if the
(08:35):
Knicks win tonight and I think it's a three or
four point game, jaymck can find the spread on that,
I think they're going to make an aggressive move. Could
they not make a Yannis package.
Speaker 2 (08:47):
I'm not sure they could with their picks another situation.
And again, if I am the Bucks, I would not
trade him.
Speaker 3 (08:52):
With in the conference.
Speaker 2 (08:54):
Again, Drew Holliday. By the way, can you imagine what
the Celtics. Can you imagine if they also gave him
Jannis oh greyjown Is Andrew. I don't do that happening, however,
I do think Look, this is a half a billion
dollar pay roll with all of the luxury tax and
second Apron and eighth Apron and all of that that
the Celtics are going to have to play under new
(09:14):
ownership to your point, and look, if they go back
and win another finals and I still think they're the favorite,
even down to one in this series, it's going to
be hard to break that team up.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
Of course, two titles in a row, we'll tweak it
a little.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
I think you've got to pay those guys and just
bite the bullet and try to keep winning. But if
it's a second round exit, it kind of gives you
an excuse, if your ownership or if you're the front office,
to say, well, clearly this isn't quite.
Speaker 3 (09:38):
Working the way it was before.
Speaker 2 (09:40):
Now we can kind of mess with the roster a
little bit and certainly cut payroll.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
And we'll just have to see if that happens.
Speaker 2 (09:47):
I still think the Celtics are going to come out
of this series, and I think they have a really
good chance.
Speaker 3 (09:52):
To win the title. That's no disrespect to New York.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
I mean, I think it'd be great for the League
to have the New York Knicks advance. It has been
a very long time, and I just think the excitement
in the garden we've seen it, I mean, it's just
incredible totally. And unlike some other New York's Knicks teams
or big market teams where people around the country, you know,
they hate the Yankees, that kind of thing, this Knicks
(10:15):
team is so scrappy and fun and young.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
The perfect for New York.
Speaker 3 (10:19):
A lot of people.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
Around the country who would say hate the Yankees will
still really get behind and like watching this New York
Knicks team. So if they win, and I agree with you,
tonight is just pivotal. I mean, I think it's a
must win for the Knicks certainly, right Who knows, but
the Celtics point differential throughout the season, they were sixteen
points ahead on average, and the games they played the
(10:42):
next not only did they win four to nothing in
this season series, they won by an average of sixteen points.
And in each of these games they've been up to
twenty points.
Speaker 1 (10:51):
No, we've talked about this. The nnba's willingness to swallow
the whistle and let games be physical has absolutely benefited
the next og, the body types in the county. The
NBA is allowing less skilled teams to body up and
push you around. That's why I thought Denver would give okay,
see some problems because they're big veterans physical. So Yo
(11:15):
Kitch is great. They have no bench and you know,
I think a lot of people look at Denver. I
do and certainly thought three years ago, could they be
the Spurs? It's see their duncan. But then they didn't
keep people they you know, you look at the Michael
Porter contract. Now they paid one too many people and
Yo Kitch looks gassed.
Speaker 3 (11:37):
Oh he looks exhausted.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
It's this. Didn't they draft a big and he got hurt.
Speaker 2 (11:43):
Look the thing with the Yo Kitch is he had
to push them through the end of the season. Remember
the sixty point games that this, that that just to
keep them out of the plate, right, there was such
a scramble for seating in the West. He had to
give it his all every night and carry this team.
Now they played I think seven games in the last
thirteen days.
Speaker 3 (12:03):
I mean, that is asking too much of him. Especially.
I know they're used to playing at altitude.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
It's their altitude, but it's still altitude early, right, And
I just think that the Thunder are deeper certainly. I mean,
they won that game yesterday because of their bench. And
they're the youngest team in the NBA. Let's not forget that.
If you look at teams across the league and you say, okay,
on one day's rest, when there's only one day between games,
(12:30):
who is the best? Not only are the Thunder the best,
they're the best by about seventeen points.
Speaker 3 (12:36):
I mean, it's crazy.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
Where the Nuggets when they have one day of rest,
they're better than their opponents by about three points. So
you just look at this schedule, you look at what
Yokich's had to do. This is the problem with having
a rotation that's only six guys. And by the way,
the sixth guy is Russell Westbrook. You know, I keep
saying to you, it's a box of chocolates with rest,
you never know what you're going to get. Well, yesterday
(12:58):
was like when you get one of those like gross
orange cream chocolates or something.
Speaker 1 (13:01):
Everybody likes them. Not good, not good, So let's put
up the NBA Draft lottery. Tonight, I said, I'm kind
of rooting just for historical relevance for San Antonio to
win it. Yeah, Wemby, why do I keep forgetting their
point guard of Stephen Castle, the Castle's great Stephen Castle,
and then get Cooper Flagg. Yeah. I think that's unprecedented
(13:25):
to get the best player out of three straight classes,
So that's fascinating. I'm also rooting for Utah because I
think having spent a lot of time there, great facility,
great GM, super smart owner, great economy, they fill it.
It's almost collegiate feeling. I think that'd be great if
he was there. When you look at this, is there
something that intrigues you tonight, Well.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
Look, I'm from Washington, DC, right, and I can tell
you that the Wizards, Slash Bullets, slash whatever have not
made it to the third round of the playoffs, not
not won a title or made it to the finals.
They have not made it to the third round of
the playoffs for forty six years.
Speaker 3 (14:03):
So to me, obviously this is.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
Colored by me being a native, but I think that
would be a great fit for him, for a lot
of reasons.
Speaker 3 (14:11):
It's an international city.
Speaker 2 (14:13):
If you look at the sort of teams, look at
the cities that on top of the lottery, Washington, d C.
Certainly is the most sort of cosmopolitan of a lot
of those places. The fit with the Wizard's young players
that they've been tearing down and doing this rebuild would
actually be excellent and you would see him making an
impact right away. And I just think that when you
(14:33):
talk about East versus West, and you talk about, yes,
the Spurs by the way, they've gotten lucky in the
draft lottery before, thank you Tim Duncan.
Speaker 1 (14:41):
That would great.
Speaker 2 (14:42):
I mean, all of these big players, Kevin Durant, all
of the big players, even Zion Williamson. Right since the
Lebron draft, I can't think of a player who was
sort of a surefire we know he's going to be
a success in the NBA that hasn't gone west. So
just for balance, I think it would be nice to
have an East and Conference team win.
Speaker 3 (15:02):
The lottery tonight. And again I'm written for my hometown team.
Speaker 1 (15:05):
Have you watched that documentary though I have.
Speaker 2 (15:07):
Look, I was there for it, and I'm very you know,
I've covered Guild for a long time and know him
very well. I get it, but it's just it's a
different team now, all right.
Speaker 3 (15:16):
I'm just saying they're hard to root for after watching that.
I mean, there was, by the way, go back.
Speaker 2 (15:21):
There's a lot of franchises around the NBA that were
permitting a lot of things.
Speaker 5 (15:26):
Oh, I know back in the day.
Speaker 1 (15:29):
It's incredible that the team, the league, they were trying
to hide all of it from the media.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
Look the Detroit Pistons at the height of their powers
right when they were in Eastern Conference Finals after Eastern
Conference Finals. After Eastern Conference Finals. I used to cover
that team pretty regularly, and I'd walk in the same
door at the Price facility every day and suddenly there
was a sign that says no weapons allowed in this building.
And it happened overnight, And I just said to the
security guard, before.
Speaker 3 (15:57):
There's a sign, there's usually a problem. He's like, oh, yeah,
there was a problem.
Speaker 2 (16:01):
So it happened in a hundred places at that time.
Speaker 4 (16:05):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (16:05):
Rachel Nichols, great, Senia as always.
Speaker 3 (16:07):
Great to see you guys.
Speaker 6 (16:08):
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Speaker 1 (16:47):
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with the news.
Speaker 6 (17:20):
This is the herd line.
Speaker 1 (17:21):
Are you nervous next tonight or you nervous J Man, No,
I'm feeling good.
Speaker 5 (17:24):
By the way, you want to get the line on.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
That one, I would say Celtics minus three, way.
Speaker 5 (17:31):
Off, Celtics minus six.
Speaker 1 (17:32):
Oh, I'm taking New York. I'm taking the six.
Speaker 5 (17:35):
What was the other one you asked Rachel? The line?
Was it Minnesota at Golden State?
Speaker 1 (17:38):
Minnesota Golden Is that tonight tonight? Yeah? Okay, that's in.
Speaker 3 (17:42):
That's just that's in San Francisco.
Speaker 1 (17:46):
I would say Minnesota minus.
Speaker 5 (17:51):
Three minus five.
Speaker 1 (17:53):
I like Minnesota tonight and I like the next I
like the nixt to cover in Minnesota to win outright.
Speaker 2 (18:00):
By the way, if the Knicks could get it within
five in the last five minutes, they will have the advantage.
Speaker 3 (18:05):
They have the best bozer well.
Speaker 1 (18:07):
And all the pressure is gonna be on often because
they're the heavy favorite in the series.
Speaker 5 (18:10):
But the Knicks have been down twenty in every single game.
That's not great news. We want, yeah that ideal? All right,
Let's go to the Timberwolves.
Speaker 9 (18:18):
They escape Game three against the Wounded Warriors. Anthony Davis
dropped twenty eight at thirty six in the second half.
He was really motivated, he said, after getting jumped on
by Jonathan Kuminga, who had a hell of a game
at did have a big time poster in the third
quarter on Kevon Looney and again will Anthony Edwards attacks
the rip. Nobody can stop him. He's with that body
(18:39):
and the strength of the hops.
Speaker 5 (18:41):
He's an animal. I think Minnesota Winston.
Speaker 1 (18:45):
I come, I do too. I think I think Minnesota.
I think at this point there's I don't think Stepp
comes back. I don't think it's worth the risk Hamstring's
arrest injury. And I think Ann's playing with a confidence
he didn't have a year ago. Julius Randall is clearly
in this system working Go Bears the rim protector, and
(19:08):
I think the staff is great.
Speaker 9 (19:09):
Okay, we like Steve Kerr. I'm just gonna say he
does feel like he's kind.
Speaker 5 (19:13):
Of lost right now.
Speaker 9 (19:15):
He started in game to Quentin Post played the big
guy for three minutes.
Speaker 1 (19:20):
Okay.
Speaker 9 (19:21):
Kuminga now playing thirty minutes after being benched. Ye Moses
Moody can't get any minutes in Game three like, I
don't know what Kurge doing started Tray Jackson Davis, he's
just grasping at straws.
Speaker 5 (19:32):
If you look at the.
Speaker 9 (19:32):
Rotations and it's just not working, and it's tough when
you lose Curry, it does feel over for Golden State.
Let's stick with the NBA. The Miami Heat obviously are
in a big spot. They lose Jimmy Butler, they get
smashed against the Calves. I mean they were down like
thirty in multiple games.
Speaker 5 (19:49):
A lot of rumors like in.
Speaker 9 (19:50):
Miami to Kevin Durant, pat Riley acknowledged there are changes
coming to the Heat.
Speaker 10 (19:57):
Well, I think we do have to make changes. There's
there's no There has to be some change. And so
until you change the way you go about doing the
things that you do to win, if you don't win,
you have to go about making changes to make sure
that you can win. It's a process. But I'm not
(20:17):
gonna deal with a long process. Nor his ownership.
Speaker 9 (20:22):
Sounds like he's aiming high. I don't see how they
get in the honest root six. They don't have any
but Tyler hero No, you give away bam, you got nothing.
Speaker 5 (20:29):
By the way, I.
Speaker 9 (20:29):
Got to do a heated debate with the producers about
Tyler Hero and his trade.
Speaker 5 (20:33):
Dune, I'm curious, do you think he's a two or three? One?
Speaker 4 (20:37):
Three?
Speaker 5 (20:39):
This is gonna be tough, but just let it marinate.
Speaker 9 (20:41):
Would you rather take in a trade because the salaries
are similar, Jalen Green, who's twenty three, or Tyler Hero,
who's twenty five.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
I would take Tyler Herro because he has defined offensive game.
Jalen Green's an athlete, doesn't know what he is in
the half court. Tyler Hero is literally bigned. He's a
better Austin Reeves and now now he's not a physical
defend me Taer Hero, Well, you, Austin Reeds is not
exactly Dennis Rodman.
Speaker 5 (21:04):
Austin Reeves is a better defender.
Speaker 9 (21:06):
Listen, heat are gonna be interesting because they have Bam.
Speaker 5 (21:09):
Do you just knuk it and start over?
Speaker 1 (21:11):
I would start over. This team is Listen. Jimmy Butler
got you know a couple of finals that was over
I mean over delivering for the quality of the roster. Yeah,
the Duncan, Robinson Hero Butler teams had no business being
in the finals. That was past and roster.
Speaker 9 (21:29):
Can usually they're interesting. I don't see a path to
interesting for them. Honestly, I would start over.
Speaker 5 (21:35):
Yeah, Easier said than done.
Speaker 9 (21:36):
Final story, Colin is to the NFL rookie mini cams
got underway this weekend, and of course cam Ward was
cooking for Tennessee. Interestingly, he's not getting the pub that
shedur is online.
Speaker 5 (21:48):
As you saw that.
Speaker 9 (21:50):
Reports indicate that Brian Shudy Callahan is implementing some of
the stuff from the Miami Hurricanes playbook where cam Ward thrives.
Speaker 5 (21:59):
I love that.
Speaker 9 (22:00):
Yeah, and there's a bunch of quotes here from some
of the young guys about how good cam Ward has been.
Speaker 1 (22:05):
Great leader, gets the ball out quick. Let me tell
you something about cam Ward. No star recruit Washington State
to Miami. I don't think Miami had that good at players,
and they won some games. All this three day rookie
camp stuff is a nonsense because you're you're watching all
these players against scrubbs. But cam Ward. There were about
two players that I watched. Can I watch this all
(22:26):
yesterday as I'm watching NBA, I'm watching all these you know,
these rookie camps. Cam Ward looks good. He does d
that ball comes flying out of his hand. He is definitive,
he is decisive. We know he can move. Cam Ward's gonna.
Cam Ward is going to threaten to win that division.
Watch Tennessee. I don't He was impressive. And again, I
(22:48):
know what it is. I'm not going crazy on this stuff.
He looks the part.
Speaker 9 (22:51):
Do you remember last year Caleb went one and had
all the height and quietly Jane Daniels was amazing. It
was not like all these Jane Daniels highlight reels that
we're seeing.
Speaker 1 (23:01):
He was better.
Speaker 5 (23:02):
All we're seeing all weekend is should do he is
doing this? Should do her?
Speaker 9 (23:05):
Oh he's staying late after practice. Meanwhile, cam Wore riding quietly.
I think cam Wore could have a Jaden Daniels type.
Speaker 5 (23:11):
Maybe not that good.
Speaker 1 (23:12):
So they went from thirty ninth in offense to number
one with cam Wore. Am I an yeah, And by
the way, there's a lot of good offenses in college football,
like Ohio State thirty ninth to one. And I'm telling you,
just watching all this, I know it's camp stuff. I
get it. You can just see you can just see
(23:32):
guys that like it's just quick. It works. So Jade
and Daniels stuff. Jaden Daniels. Remember last year at camp
and nobody ever says this about rookie quarterbacks Like Kingsbury's like, yeah,
this is gonna work. Dan Quinn is like he's spectacular.
You're like, he's a rookie. Don't say that. The camp
he was blowing people away. Now cam Ward is not.
(23:55):
I don't think that won't be that effective.
Speaker 5 (23:57):
I'm not gonna put up those He's.
Speaker 1 (23:59):
Tennessee got themse all. It's a winner. This kid's gonna
this kid is gonna win games.
Speaker 9 (24:03):
I do like how our guys shove this in because
we did a lot of Chaduur, you know, a four
string quarterback for the Browns. But cam Ward is destroy
If you're betting, and I don't love futures, bet this
early rookie of the year, cam Woard getting my money.
Speaker 1 (24:17):
I agree. J Mack with the news, Well that's the news,
and thanks for stopping by the herd Line News. Good
stuff today. Matt Hasselbeck, Rachel Nichols, NBA Draft lottery, tonight
schedule release. It'll start trickling out tomorrow. We'll have games
(24:37):
tomorrow trickling out. It's the heart.
Speaker 6 (24:39):
Be sure to catch live editions of the Herd weekdays
at noon easternn a EM Pacific.
Speaker 1 (24:44):
All right, so this weekend there was a bunch of
these mini camp Shadeur Sanders got a lot of publicity,
a lot of public and since we were fed all
this video, it is our broadcasting responsibility to show Shadoor
Sanders practicing. U you got a lot more video of this.
I think I thought he was underdrafted. I think he's
(25:04):
closer to a top second round pick or a middle
first you know, if the Giants would have taken him,
I think there's worst picks. I'm not a Jackson Dark believer.
Could be wrong, obviously, but uh, here's shider over the
weekend on transitioning to the NFL.
Speaker 4 (25:19):
Of course, it's day by day.
Speaker 11 (25:20):
I just find something I want to perfect and just
perfect it to the best of my abilities.
Speaker 4 (25:25):
And and that's how I really focus.
Speaker 11 (25:27):
On and just being there, just being a leader, being
a great teammate, doing what I need to do whenever
it is. So I'm just thankful for opportunity.
Speaker 4 (25:36):
Uh. Things could have been a lot worse.
Speaker 11 (25:39):
But I'm here smiling in front of you all at
this facility right now, and my job here isn't to
prove people wrong, like I prove myself right. That's that's
that's and I and I fully self belief, you know,
and uh what.
Speaker 4 (25:52):
With those people say that that's just the opinion for.
Speaker 1 (25:55):
The record, J Mac, isn't that likable? And that come
off pretty likable. I didn't love his legendary room and
some of his actions in college, but I thought he
came across pretty likely.
Speaker 5 (26:06):
He said and did.
Speaker 9 (26:07):
All the right things at Mini Caamp, the three day Minichamp, right,
that's undeniable.
Speaker 5 (26:10):
The problem is the media is focused on him.
Speaker 9 (26:14):
There's like no Dylan Gabriel highlights and Stefanski you showed earlier,
he's like almost pained to be asked why.
Speaker 4 (26:22):
You know.
Speaker 1 (26:23):
I think there is a belief that they took Dylan
Gabriel in the third round because their takeaway is we
don't we don't want to get I mean, so the
Browns sent you a message. They traded down out of
the number two pick, and they did that because they
didn't like this quarterback class. Well, so I was supposed
to believe in the third round they loved Dylan Gabriel.
(26:45):
Like I thought Dylan Gabriel was overdrafted to me, he's
a fifth round pick, should do her at worst as
a middle second. But my point is if you really
think of what Cleveland did. Okay, they told you we
don't love the quarterback class, that's including Shadeur because they
passed it him multiple times. They took Gabriel as a listen,
(27:08):
we're going to overdraft him. It's pretty obvious. My buddy
John Middlecoff said they didn't want to get into the
Chaduur stuff. And then by the fifth round, the owner
who pushed for Johnny Manziel, Baker Mayfield and Deshaun Watson says,
let's go get him because this is what this is
what the owner does. So the Browns also traded a
fifth round pick for Kenny Pickett this year, So I mean,
(27:30):
it's just a quarterback. They are of the classic low
sports self esteem franchise.
Speaker 9 (27:35):
So you and I have run businesses, and you know
that there is a fine line between like promoting right.
They can make a lot of money off Scheduur, Sanders,
the Brookly, the Browns kid.
Speaker 5 (27:45):
Let's put out videos.
Speaker 9 (27:46):
We could sell ads around them, easy to make money,
but do you want that distraction?
Speaker 5 (27:52):
It's not the Bill Belichick level distraction in North Carolina
right now.
Speaker 9 (27:55):
But you have to admit, like a fifth round quarterback
soaking up all the energy in the room is.
Speaker 5 (28:00):
A bit of a distraction.
Speaker 1 (28:00):
Listen, he's not even your start. I've said this before.
I wouldn't bring in Colin Kaepernick, Tim Tebow, Cam Newton,
Johnny Manziel as backups. I wouldn't bring in Baker mate. Well, no,
I would bring in Baker now. Although he's not a backup,
he's a starter. You do not want your backup to
be a celebrity. That's why Bill Belichick and the media
tries to make this stuff into politics or something else.
(28:23):
Bill Belichick, the minute they decided after camp, Remember Cam
had the year in New England and Belichick liked him solid.
He was a solid quarterback. The minute they said, okay,
we're gonna get back the job, they moved off of Cam,
even though he would have been the best backup in
the league. He's get him out, okay. Tim Tebow won
a playoff game. The minute that Jets thing with a
tire fire, nobody wanted him as a backup. Johnny Manziel,
(28:46):
you're telling me Johnny Manziel's not a backup nobody wanted
him as a backup, should do her because if his
dad's you know, running point on this quarterback situation. And
basically at the Super Bowl week telling the six or
seven teams that would potentially draft him, we're not playing
for a lot of you. So that turned a lot
of owners and gms off, so to me, Cleveland's Andrew
(29:11):
Berry go watch his reaction during the draft. They were
trying to get out of the Chador Sanders world. I mean,
did they need another quarterback? They had Flacco, Kenny Pickett,
Deshaun Watson, and Dylan Gabriel. They had four quarterbacks. The
last thing they needed in the fifth ront was another quarterback.
That's an owner move. They can deny it forever. So
I think they'll do the best with it, and I
(29:33):
think Stefanski's excellent, But I think it's it is. I
think it's a little bit of a tough situation for
Shador Sanders because I don't think privately they wanted this.
Speaker 9 (29:42):
It feels like every time Stefanski goes to the podium,
he's got a mentally be prepared for a ton of
Shador Sanders questions. I don't know if we can roll
the video, but he looked pained being asked, why isn't
Schador getting number one?
Speaker 5 (29:54):
Set Like, why isn't he getting more action? It's just
it's a tough spot to put your coach in.
Speaker 1 (29:58):
Man, here's Matt haw back earlier on Shaudeur fighting four
other quarterbacks for snabs. So the reps are usually divvied
up how they expected to go, how.
Speaker 5 (30:10):
They wanted to go, where's their money invested?
Speaker 2 (30:13):
And I always found it it was a lot easier
when it was clearly defined, not necessarily to the public,
but it was clearly defined inside the building, inside that
quarterback room.
Speaker 5 (30:23):
Here's what you're actually competing for. Here's what's open to you.
Speaker 1 (30:27):
Yeah, and I I so my bet is Flacco wins
the job and Shadeur eventually becomes the number two. Shadur
is better than Kenny Pickett and better than Dylan Gabriel.
Speaker 9 (30:39):
So hold Schaduur was a better prospect than Dylan Gabriel's.
But for what Stefanski wants, is he better than Dylan Gabriel?
Speaker 1 (30:49):
Those are two different Quessan Gabriel look tiny in college, tiny,
Shadoor Sanders I never looked at his size in college.
Speaker 9 (30:58):
He does that matter in the Kevin Stefanski offense. You
and I don't know that answer. Can we get Sefanski
on the show?
Speaker 1 (31:04):
I got nothing against Dylan Gabriel. I I just I
didn't see it.
Speaker 5 (31:08):
Ever, What do you mean he was like a Heisman condemned.
Speaker 1 (31:11):
He looks smaller.
Speaker 5 (31:12):
Look what do you have against small quarterbacks?
Speaker 6 (31:14):
Brough?
Speaker 5 (31:14):
It perty Dylan Gabriel, What do you have against them?
Speaker 1 (31:17):
You were all over Bryce Young because the other that
yours had his helmet didn't fit. Well that look at this,
Look at the video. This is nothing against him. This
is a professional league. Watch the video on Dylan Gabriel.
You notice his side.
Speaker 9 (31:29):
Did you see there's a video of him once he
leaves the podium. There's like a Brown staffer who goes,
I'm taller than him. He's mouthing it, and it's on video,
and I'm sure that Brown's are like, dude, can.
Speaker 1 (31:38):
You don't Dylan Gabriel looks noticeably smaller than Tua who
looks small in the NFL.
Speaker 9 (31:44):
Brice Younger or Dylan Gabriel, who's bigger. I think Gabriel
is bigger.
Speaker 1 (31:48):
Well, Bryce Young's a much better player, much better, much
better pro quarterback pro prospect.
Speaker 5 (31:55):
But we'll see.
Speaker 1 (31:57):
This is not a knock on him. But we've said
this before. I remember there was a guy that played
at Ohio State, Troy Smith. Remember Troy Smith was a
good college quarterback. I remember taking I watching him when
he first Jimmy Clausen did this do I forget where
it was the first series. I'm like, no, I'm talking
to work And I remember Jimmy Clawson at Notre Dame
went to the NFL, and it just shoulders size. I'm like, no,
(32:18):
this is not gonna work. Bryce Young is borderline. Like
You're like, I'm not sure, but he's so gifted. Bryce
is so talented.
Speaker 9 (32:27):
It's just I can't you know these big stepping quarterbacks
like Ryan Leith brought Off Sweiler, so many big gus
jam Marcus Russell, Like, oh they flopped too.
Speaker 5 (32:36):
Big guys flop that quarterback as well.
Speaker 1 (32:38):
But most of your greats Peyton, Bradshaw, Aikman, big Ben Brady,
most of your greats are big men. They're six three
and Holmes. No, Mahomes is six two but plays big.
You've never once thought about his size. Tua is supposed
to be six to one. All I can do is
look at his size. Mahomes is six one and a
half six to two. I never think about it. Some
guys play bigger. Zach Wilson the same size height is Mahomes.
(33:02):
Every time I watch Dac Wilston, I think he needs
more size. Just what it looks like to me. All right,
good stuff knocked another one out tonight. It's gonna be tasty.
Thanks for listening to The Herd Podcast. Be sure to
catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio in
noon to three eastern nine am to noon Pacific. Find
your local station for The Herd at Fox Sports Radio
dot com, or stream us live every day on the
iHeartRadio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR. Thanks
for listening to The Herd podcast. Kind of a must
(00:21):
watch if you're a sportscaster, a shooting guards. It's the
uh Javaris Critinton story, who was initially a Laker ye,
and then it's Gilbert Listen. Players are culpable for their
own mistakes. You cannot root for the Wizards as an organization.
After watching that, I was so it is.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
So ridicious, the same I'm organization any games.
Speaker 3 (00:44):
I mean, they just are it.
Speaker 1 (00:45):
So what was allowed? It's it's fascinating, like on planes.
It's happened on planes. Okay, Rachel Nichols joining us, Okay,
So tonight. One of my favorite non games of the
year is the NBA Draft lottery. Like a couple of
(01:05):
years ago, we had Wemby. This happens about every fourth
year we get a Lebron or we get a Wemby.
So Cooper Flag, who is only eighteen. But you know
the comp and I think it's an accurate one is
you're getting Jason Tatum but a little more aggressive like
Kyle Play. So Utah has acknowledged they would consider Danny
Inge if they won moving Cooper Flag. I would not,
(01:31):
but they are and Danny Ainge is shrewd.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
Danny Aheer said he would trade his own grandmother, so
I assume he would trade Cooper Flag.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
So here's my Utah wins it. Are they the front
runner to Land Yannis?
Speaker 2 (01:44):
So if I'm Milwaukee, I am not doing a straight
up trade for Cooper Flag and Yannis right because the
Milwaukee Bucks don't have a first round draft pick till
twenty thirty one, that is six years.
Speaker 1 (01:57):
From now, don't control any of their first for five years.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
If you get a Cooper Flag or some other really
outrageous young talent but no picks back including that, if
it's a straight up trade, that's no good for you
because you won't have young talent to put around him.
You've got older guys on bad contracts. By the way,
you can become an unrestricted free agent in the NBA
after seven years and six years is when they would
get their first first round draft picks, so he'd be
(02:21):
out of there.
Speaker 3 (02:21):
So that's not worth it. If you talk and put together.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
A package with Cooper Flag with some other young talent
with draft picks that interest the Milwaukee Bucks, sure they'll
have a conversation for sure. The other one to watch
with the draft lottery is Houston, because Houston has been
a front runner for whoever the best free agent on
the market is. Right, We've talked about Kevin Durant, We've
talked about Devin Booker, we've talked about Jannis. Trump's them
(02:45):
all right, So if Jannis does become available, the advantages
you're trading him to the West, which is great, right,
And the Milwaukee Bucks have learned their lesson with Drewe Holliday.
You do not want the guy you just traded in
your own conference.
Speaker 3 (02:57):
Right.
Speaker 2 (02:59):
They've got young talent they can come and really good
young talent they can come to Milwaukee, and they have
all kinds of draft picks. And certainly if with the
Phoenix pick, which they're in the lottery for tonight, they
luck out with Cooper Flaggerant, even anyone in really the
top three or four. Because these are great players, they
(03:20):
then become even more.
Speaker 3 (03:21):
Of a front right.
Speaker 1 (03:22):
I said, the most fascinating part is this, so we
know Kyle Shanahan has had great teams, arguably for about
a four year stretch, the best roster, no trophy, great
Sacramento King trades teams way back when no trophy. So
my take is, Yiannis, you got a trophy twelve years.
(03:42):
Great fun. Here's the team to keep your eye on.
So we think Sam Presty is brilliant. They had Westbrook,
k D and Harden. They now have home gren SGA
and an unbelievable roster. Yet, if San Antonio wins the
lottery tonight Wemby this year's rookie of the Year, the
(04:03):
point guard from Yukon, Stephen Castle and Cooper Flag. Yeah,
and my take is, what a nightmare for okc oh I.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
Mean, look, if Oklahoma City or the Spurs win this
draft lottery, can you imagine Oklahoma City obviously threw their
other picks because their own pick is not going to
be in the lottery.
Speaker 3 (04:26):
But it's just crazy to me have.
Speaker 1 (04:31):
The best rookie three straight years.
Speaker 3 (04:33):
Yeah, it's crazy to me.
Speaker 2 (04:34):
And by the way, the thunder to your point, they
have all these picks, they if they want to, are
going to be a contender for Yannis because the picks
that they have aren't just their own picks.
Speaker 3 (04:46):
They've grabbed picks from all around the league.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
So you're really not betting against Yannis to fail if
you're making that trade near Milwaukee. Because they've got this pick,
they've got this team's pick, they've got that team's pick.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
You don't have to worry about it.
Speaker 4 (04:59):
You know.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
I said this with the Warriors. They're not there yet,
but Steph will be thirty eight next year. They made
the move for Butler because they wanted to squeeze every
last win out of Steph. Kind of their Jeter untradable player,
their l Way. Yeah, and there's very few of those,
but Jeter Lway kind of feel like Steph can't trade him.
(05:23):
And so I'm sitting there thinking, you don't want the
Kobe Tour the last three years, which was unserious basketball.
You don't want to be the Bucks where you grab, grab, grab,
and you wake up and you're like, we're a first
round exit team. I look at the Warriors. They don't
have their GPS system. When Steph doesn't play and he's
thirty eight. He's running a mile and a three quarters
to two miles every big game. Oksee Houston, all these
(05:51):
San Antonio. You look up and you go, guys, we're
gonna bring this back, couldn't. I argue Kuminga doesn't work
with Steph. If they get extinguished here very quickly by Minnesota,
my guess without Steph they will What do you do
going forward? Great coach Steph in great culture is not
going forward? You're at best fourth in the West.
Speaker 2 (06:14):
Well, if there is a silver lining to the Steph
Curry injury, which by the way, obviously the Warriors would
rather not have, it's that Jonathan Kaminga has gotten to
play more and show what value he brings. Because really
the issue is it's not that he can't play with Steph.
It's that he can't play with Steph and Jimmy. There's
not room for him when there's those two other guys
are on the floor. Now that Steff's off the floor,
(06:36):
it's him and Jimmy and they can play well together.
And also Kuminga had a great game right even in
the loss. So the silver lining if they do lose
this series and Steph can't come back is. Now you
have a much more tradable asset in Jonathan Kuminga than
you did even a week and a half ago, right,
because in the first round it was like, Eh, he's
not even good enough to make the rotation, right, what
(06:57):
kind of asset is he?
Speaker 3 (06:58):
Nobody's gonna want him.
Speaker 2 (07:00):
It's like, oh, okay, it really was just scheme, and
therefore he's an asset. I don't think either way this
is going to be similar to the Kobe situation or
the Yannis situation, because on both of those teams, you
really had one elite guy. Right on this team, you
have Steph, you have Draymond, you have Jimmy. Now, they're
all aging, I get that, but those are all kinds
(07:21):
of players. They can make a difference in the game
the way the guys on Kobe's team couldn't, the way
the guys on Nanisis team can't this year. And I
don't know when Steph heard that they were making the
Jimmy trade. His quote to Draymond.
Speaker 3 (07:35):
Was, this is it. This is our last ride.
Speaker 2 (07:38):
Ye And I think they all know it and they
believe it, and they think that with this group they
can really make an impact and maybe get the finals again.
And by the way it looked like it, you know,
toward the end of the season, in the early.
Speaker 3 (07:49):
In the playoffs.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
So the Celtics season may very well come down to
tonight the way they won and blowout fashion. Generally speaking,
the Zigzag theory on the road, New York will be
ready to roll tonight. And there has been a question
Boston from Danny Ains to Brad Stevens. They are proactive,
(08:12):
not reactive, and they're not moving Tatum. But if they
lose to the Knicks, there is a sense that they
can look up and go, listen, we don't want to
be Milwaukee and Denver. We've got Tatum, we've got new
owners may want to shed. I mean, their salary now
is like five hundred million if they just signed their
first round pick. I mean, Rachel to me, if the
(08:35):
Knicks win tonight and I think it's a three or
four point game, jaymck can find the spread on that,
I think they're going to make an aggressive move. Could
they not make a Yannis package.
Speaker 2 (08:47):
I'm not sure they could with their picks another situation.
And again, if I am the Bucks, I would not
trade him.
Speaker 3 (08:52):
With in the conference.
Speaker 2 (08:54):
Again, Drew Holliday. By the way, can you imagine what
the Celtics. Can you imagine if they also gave him
Jannis oh greyjown Is Andrew. I don't do that happening, however,
I do think Look, this is a half a billion
dollar pay roll with all of the luxury tax and
second Apron and eighth Apron and all of that that
the Celtics are going to have to play under new
(09:14):
ownership to your point, and look, if they go back
and win another finals and I still think they're the favorite,
even down to one in this series, it's going to
be hard to break that team up.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
Of course, two titles in a row, we'll tweak it
a little.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
I think you've got to pay those guys and just
bite the bullet and try to keep winning. But if
it's a second round exit, it kind of gives you
an excuse, if your ownership or if you're the front office,
to say, well, clearly this isn't quite.
Speaker 3 (09:38):
Working the way it was before.
Speaker 2 (09:40):
Now we can kind of mess with the roster a
little bit and certainly cut payroll.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
And we'll just have to see if that happens.
Speaker 2 (09:47):
I still think the Celtics are going to come out
of this series, and I think they have a really
good chance.
Speaker 3 (09:52):
To win the title. That's no disrespect to New York.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
I mean, I think it'd be great for the League
to have the New York Knicks advance. It has been
a very long time, and I just think the excitement
in the garden we've seen it, I mean, it's just
incredible totally. And unlike some other New York's Knicks teams
or big market teams where people around the country, you know,
they hate the Yankees, that kind of thing, this Knicks
(10:15):
team is so scrappy and fun and young.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
The perfect for New York.
Speaker 3 (10:19):
A lot of people.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
Around the country who would say hate the Yankees will
still really get behind and like watching this New York
Knicks team. So if they win, and I agree with you,
tonight is just pivotal. I mean, I think it's a
must win for the Knicks certainly, right Who knows, but
the Celtics point differential throughout the season, they were sixteen
points ahead on average, and the games they played the
(10:42):
next not only did they win four to nothing in
this season series, they won by an average of sixteen points.
And in each of these games they've been up to
twenty points.
Speaker 1 (10:51):
No, we've talked about this. The nnba's willingness to swallow
the whistle and let games be physical has absolutely benefited
the next og, the body types in the county. The
NBA is allowing less skilled teams to body up and
push you around. That's why I thought Denver would give okay,
see some problems because they're big veterans physical. So Yo
(11:15):
Kitch is great. They have no bench and you know,
I think a lot of people look at Denver. I
do and certainly thought three years ago, could they be
the Spurs? It's see their duncan. But then they didn't
keep people they you know, you look at the Michael
Porter contract. Now they paid one too many people and
Yo Kitch looks gassed.
Speaker 3 (11:37):
Oh he looks exhausted.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
It's this. Didn't they draft a big and he got hurt.
Speaker 2 (11:43):
Look the thing with the Yo Kitch is he had
to push them through the end of the season. Remember
the sixty point games that this, that that just to
keep them out of the plate, right, there was such
a scramble for seating in the West. He had to
give it his all every night and carry this team.
Now they played I think seven games in the last
thirteen days.
Speaker 3 (12:03):
I mean, that is asking too much of him. Especially.
I know they're used to playing at altitude.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
It's their altitude, but it's still altitude early, right, And
I just think that the Thunder are deeper certainly. I mean,
they won that game yesterday because of their bench. And
they're the youngest team in the NBA. Let's not forget that.
If you look at teams across the league and you say, okay,
on one day's rest, when there's only one day between games,
(12:30):
who is the best? Not only are the Thunder the best,
they're the best by about seventeen points.
Speaker 3 (12:36):
I mean, it's crazy.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
Where the Nuggets when they have one day of rest,
they're better than their opponents by about three points. So
you just look at this schedule, you look at what
Yokich's had to do. This is the problem with having
a rotation that's only six guys. And by the way,
the sixth guy is Russell Westbrook. You know, I keep
saying to you, it's a box of chocolates with rest,
you never know what you're going to get. Well, yesterday
(12:58):
was like when you get one of those like gross
orange cream chocolates or something.
Speaker 1 (13:01):
Everybody likes them. Not good, not good, So let's put
up the NBA Draft lottery. Tonight, I said, I'm kind
of rooting just for historical relevance for San Antonio to
win it. Yeah, Wemby, why do I keep forgetting their
point guard of Stephen Castle, the Castle's great Stephen Castle,
and then get Cooper Flagg. Yeah. I think that's unprecedented
(13:25):
to get the best player out of three straight classes,
So that's fascinating. I'm also rooting for Utah because I
think having spent a lot of time there, great facility,
great GM, super smart owner, great economy, they fill it.
It's almost collegiate feeling. I think that'd be great if
he was there. When you look at this, is there
something that intrigues you tonight, Well.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
Look, I'm from Washington, DC, right, and I can tell
you that the Wizards, Slash Bullets, slash whatever have not
made it to the third round of the playoffs, not
not won a title or made it to the finals.
They have not made it to the third round of
the playoffs for forty six years.
Speaker 3 (14:03):
So to me, obviously this is.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
Colored by me being a native, but I think that
would be a great fit for him, for a lot
of reasons.
Speaker 3 (14:11):
It's an international city.
Speaker 2 (14:13):
If you look at the sort of teams, look at
the cities that on top of the lottery, Washington, d C.
Certainly is the most sort of cosmopolitan of a lot
of those places. The fit with the Wizard's young players
that they've been tearing down and doing this rebuild would
actually be excellent and you would see him making an
impact right away. And I just think that when you
(14:33):
talk about East versus West, and you talk about, yes,
the Spurs by the way, they've gotten lucky in the
draft lottery before, thank you Tim Duncan.
Speaker 1 (14:41):
That would great.
Speaker 2 (14:42):
I mean, all of these big players, Kevin Durant, all
of the big players, even Zion Williamson. Right since the
Lebron draft, I can't think of a player who was
sort of a surefire we know he's going to be
a success in the NBA that hasn't gone west. So
just for balance, I think it would be nice to
have an East and Conference team win.
Speaker 3 (15:02):
The lottery tonight. And again I'm written for my hometown team.
Speaker 1 (15:05):
Have you watched that documentary though I have.
Speaker 2 (15:07):
Look, I was there for it, and I'm very you know,
I've covered Guild for a long time and know him
very well. I get it, but it's just it's a
different team now, all right.
Speaker 3 (15:16):
I'm just saying they're hard to root for after watching that.
I mean, there was, by the way, go back.
Speaker 2 (15:21):
There's a lot of franchises around the NBA that were
permitting a lot of things.
Speaker 5 (15:26):
Oh, I know back in the day.
Speaker 1 (15:29):
It's incredible that the team, the league, they were trying
to hide all of it from the media.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
Look the Detroit Pistons at the height of their powers
right when they were in Eastern Conference Finals after Eastern
Conference Finals. After Eastern Conference Finals. I used to cover
that team pretty regularly, and I'd walk in the same
door at the Price facility every day and suddenly there
was a sign that says no weapons allowed in this building.
And it happened overnight, And I just said to the
security guard, before.
Speaker 3 (15:57):
There's a sign, there's usually a problem. He's like, oh, yeah,
there was a problem.
Speaker 2 (16:01):
So it happened in a hundred places at that time.
Speaker 4 (16:05):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (16:05):
Rachel Nichols, great, Senia as always.
Speaker 3 (16:07):
Great to see you guys.
Speaker 6 (16:08):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
at noon eastern nine am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio
FS one and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 7 (16:17):
Hey, Steve Covino and I'm Rich David and together we're
Covino and Rich on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 8 (16:22):
You could catch us weekdays from five to seven pm
Eastern two to four Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and
of course the iHeartRadio App.
Speaker 4 (16:29):
Why should you listen to Covino and Rich.
Speaker 8 (16:31):
We talk about everything life, sports, relationships, what's going on
in the world.
Speaker 7 (16:35):
We have a lot of fun talking about the stories
behind the stories in the world of sports and pop culture,
stories that well, other shows don't seem to have the
time to discuss.
Speaker 8 (16:44):
And the fact that we've been friends for the last
twenty years and still work together.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
I mean that says something.
Speaker 4 (16:48):
Right, So check us out.
Speaker 7 (16:50):
We like to get you involved too, take your phone calls,
chop it up.
Speaker 1 (16:54):
As they say, I'd say.
Speaker 8 (16:55):
The most interactive show on Fox Sports Radio, maybe the
most interactive show on planetar.
Speaker 7 (16:59):
Be sure to check out out Cavino and Rich live
on Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app from five
to seven pm Eastern, two to four Pacific, And if
you miss any of the live show, just search Covino
and Rich wherever you get your podcast, and of course
on social media. That's Covino and rich uh J Mack
with the news.
Speaker 6 (17:20):
This is the herd line.
Speaker 1 (17:21):
Are you nervous next tonight or you nervous J Man, No,
I'm feeling good.
Speaker 5 (17:24):
By the way, you want to get the line on.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
That one, I would say Celtics minus three, way.
Speaker 5 (17:31):
Off, Celtics minus six.
Speaker 1 (17:32):
Oh, I'm taking New York. I'm taking the six.
Speaker 5 (17:35):
What was the other one you asked Rachel? The line?
Was it Minnesota at Golden State?
Speaker 1 (17:38):
Minnesota Golden Is that tonight tonight? Yeah? Okay, that's in.
Speaker 3 (17:42):
That's just that's in San Francisco.
Speaker 1 (17:46):
I would say Minnesota minus.
Speaker 5 (17:51):
Three minus five.
Speaker 1 (17:53):
I like Minnesota tonight and I like the next I
like the nixt to cover in Minnesota to win outright.
Speaker 2 (18:00):
By the way, if the Knicks could get it within
five in the last five minutes, they will have the advantage.
Speaker 3 (18:05):
They have the best bozer well.
Speaker 1 (18:07):
And all the pressure is gonna be on often because
they're the heavy favorite in the series.
Speaker 5 (18:10):
But the Knicks have been down twenty in every single game.
That's not great news. We want, yeah that ideal? All right,
Let's go to the Timberwolves.
Speaker 9 (18:18):
They escape Game three against the Wounded Warriors. Anthony Davis
dropped twenty eight at thirty six in the second half.
He was really motivated, he said, after getting jumped on
by Jonathan Kuminga, who had a hell of a game
at did have a big time poster in the third
quarter on Kevon Looney and again will Anthony Edwards attacks
the rip. Nobody can stop him. He's with that body
(18:39):
and the strength of the hops.
Speaker 5 (18:41):
He's an animal. I think Minnesota Winston.
Speaker 1 (18:45):
I come, I do too. I think I think Minnesota.
I think at this point there's I don't think Stepp
comes back. I don't think it's worth the risk Hamstring's
arrest injury. And I think Ann's playing with a confidence
he didn't have a year ago. Julius Randall is clearly
in this system working Go Bears the rim protector, and
(19:08):
I think the staff is great.
Speaker 9 (19:09):
Okay, we like Steve Kerr. I'm just gonna say he
does feel like he's kind.
Speaker 5 (19:13):
Of lost right now.
Speaker 9 (19:15):
He started in game to Quentin Post played the big
guy for three minutes.
Speaker 1 (19:20):
Okay.
Speaker 9 (19:21):
Kuminga now playing thirty minutes after being benched. Ye Moses
Moody can't get any minutes in Game three like, I
don't know what Kurge doing started Tray Jackson Davis, he's
just grasping at straws.
Speaker 5 (19:32):
If you look at the.
Speaker 9 (19:32):
Rotations and it's just not working, and it's tough when
you lose Curry, it does feel over for Golden State.
Let's stick with the NBA. The Miami Heat obviously are
in a big spot. They lose Jimmy Butler, they get
smashed against the Calves. I mean they were down like
thirty in multiple games.
Speaker 5 (19:49):
A lot of rumors like in.
Speaker 9 (19:50):
Miami to Kevin Durant, pat Riley acknowledged there are changes
coming to the Heat.
Speaker 10 (19:57):
Well, I think we do have to make changes. There's
there's no There has to be some change. And so
until you change the way you go about doing the
things that you do to win, if you don't win,
you have to go about making changes to make sure
that you can win. It's a process. But I'm not
(20:17):
gonna deal with a long process. Nor his ownership.
Speaker 9 (20:22):
Sounds like he's aiming high. I don't see how they
get in the honest root six. They don't have any
but Tyler hero No, you give away bam, you got nothing.
Speaker 5 (20:29):
By the way, I.
Speaker 9 (20:29):
Got to do a heated debate with the producers about
Tyler Hero and his trade.
Speaker 5 (20:33):
Dune, I'm curious, do you think he's a two or three? One?
Speaker 4 (20:37):
Three?
Speaker 5 (20:39):
This is gonna be tough, but just let it marinate.
Speaker 9 (20:41):
Would you rather take in a trade because the salaries
are similar, Jalen Green, who's twenty three, or Tyler Hero,
who's twenty five.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
I would take Tyler Herro because he has defined offensive game.
Jalen Green's an athlete, doesn't know what he is in
the half court. Tyler Hero is literally bigned. He's a
better Austin Reeves and now now he's not a physical
defend me Taer Hero, Well, you, Austin Reeds is not
exactly Dennis Rodman.
Speaker 5 (21:04):
Austin Reeves is a better defender.
Speaker 9 (21:06):
Listen, heat are gonna be interesting because they have Bam.
Speaker 5 (21:09):
Do you just knuk it and start over?
Speaker 1 (21:11):
I would start over. This team is Listen. Jimmy Butler
got you know a couple of finals that was over
I mean over delivering for the quality of the roster. Yeah,
the Duncan, Robinson Hero Butler teams had no business being
in the finals. That was past and roster.
Speaker 9 (21:29):
Can usually they're interesting. I don't see a path to
interesting for them. Honestly, I would start over.
Speaker 5 (21:35):
Yeah, Easier said than done.
Speaker 9 (21:36):
Final story, Colin is to the NFL rookie mini cams
got underway this weekend, and of course cam Ward was
cooking for Tennessee. Interestingly, he's not getting the pub that
shedur is online.
Speaker 5 (21:48):
As you saw that.
Speaker 9 (21:50):
Reports indicate that Brian Shudy Callahan is implementing some of
the stuff from the Miami Hurricanes playbook where cam Ward thrives.
Speaker 5 (21:59):
I love that.
Speaker 9 (22:00):
Yeah, and there's a bunch of quotes here from some
of the young guys about how good cam Ward has been.
Speaker 1 (22:05):
Great leader, gets the ball out quick. Let me tell
you something about cam Ward. No star recruit Washington State
to Miami. I don't think Miami had that good at players,
and they won some games. All this three day rookie
camp stuff is a nonsense because you're you're watching all
these players against scrubbs. But cam Ward. There were about
two players that I watched. Can I watch this all
(22:26):
yesterday as I'm watching NBA, I'm watching all these you know,
these rookie camps. Cam Ward looks good. He does d
that ball comes flying out of his hand. He is definitive,
he is decisive. We know he can move. Cam Ward's gonna.
Cam Ward is going to threaten to win that division.
Watch Tennessee. I don't He was impressive. And again, I
(22:48):
know what it is. I'm not going crazy on this stuff.
He looks the part.
Speaker 9 (22:51):
Do you remember last year Caleb went one and had
all the height and quietly Jane Daniels was amazing. It
was not like all these Jane Daniels highlight reels that
we're seeing.
Speaker 1 (23:01):
He was better.
Speaker 5 (23:02):
All we're seeing all weekend is should do he is
doing this? Should do her?
Speaker 9 (23:05):
Oh he's staying late after practice. Meanwhile, cam Wore riding quietly.
I think cam Wore could have a Jaden Daniels type.
Speaker 5 (23:11):
Maybe not that good.
Speaker 1 (23:12):
So they went from thirty ninth in offense to number
one with cam Wore. Am I an yeah, And by
the way, there's a lot of good offenses in college football,
like Ohio State thirty ninth to one. And I'm telling you,
just watching all this, I know it's camp stuff. I
get it. You can just see you can just see
(23:32):
guys that like it's just quick. It works. So Jade
and Daniels stuff. Jaden Daniels. Remember last year at camp
and nobody ever says this about rookie quarterbacks Like Kingsbury's like, yeah,
this is gonna work. Dan Quinn is like he's spectacular.
You're like, he's a rookie. Don't say that. The camp
he was blowing people away. Now cam Ward is not.
(23:55):
I don't think that won't be that effective.
Speaker 5 (23:57):
I'm not gonna put up those He's.
Speaker 1 (23:59):
Tennessee got themse all. It's a winner. This kid's gonna
this kid is gonna win games.
Speaker 9 (24:03):
I do like how our guys shove this in because
we did a lot of Chaduur, you know, a four
string quarterback for the Browns. But cam Ward is destroy
If you're betting, and I don't love futures, bet this
early rookie of the year, cam Woard getting my money.
Speaker 1 (24:17):
I agree. J Mack with the news, Well that's the news,
and thanks for stopping by the herd Line News. Good
stuff today. Matt Hasselbeck, Rachel Nichols, NBA Draft lottery, tonight
schedule release. It'll start trickling out tomorrow. We'll have games
(24:37):
tomorrow trickling out. It's the heart.
Speaker 6 (24:39):
Be sure to catch live editions of the Herd weekdays
at noon easternn a EM Pacific.
Speaker 1 (24:44):
All right, so this weekend there was a bunch of
these mini camp Shadeur Sanders got a lot of publicity,
a lot of public and since we were fed all
this video, it is our broadcasting responsibility to show Shadoor
Sanders practicing. U you got a lot more video of this.
I think I thought he was underdrafted. I think he's
(25:04):
closer to a top second round pick or a middle
first you know, if the Giants would have taken him,
I think there's worst picks. I'm not a Jackson Dark believer.
Could be wrong, obviously, but uh, here's shider over the
weekend on transitioning to the NFL.
Speaker 4 (25:19):
Of course, it's day by day.
Speaker 11 (25:20):
I just find something I want to perfect and just
perfect it to the best of my abilities.
Speaker 4 (25:25):
And and that's how I really focus.
Speaker 11 (25:27):
On and just being there, just being a leader, being
a great teammate, doing what I need to do whenever
it is. So I'm just thankful for opportunity.
Speaker 4 (25:36):
Uh. Things could have been a lot worse.
Speaker 11 (25:39):
But I'm here smiling in front of you all at
this facility right now, and my job here isn't to
prove people wrong, like I prove myself right. That's that's
that's and I and I fully self belief, you know,
and uh what.
Speaker 4 (25:52):
With those people say that that's just the opinion for.
Speaker 1 (25:55):
The record, J Mac, isn't that likable? And that come
off pretty likable. I didn't love his legendary room and
some of his actions in college, but I thought he
came across pretty likely.
Speaker 5 (26:06):
He said and did.
Speaker 9 (26:07):
All the right things at Mini Caamp, the three day Minichamp, right,
that's undeniable.
Speaker 5 (26:10):
The problem is the media is focused on him.
Speaker 9 (26:14):
There's like no Dylan Gabriel highlights and Stefanski you showed earlier,
he's like almost pained to be asked why.
Speaker 4 (26:22):
You know.
Speaker 1 (26:23):
I think there is a belief that they took Dylan
Gabriel in the third round because their takeaway is we
don't we don't want to get I mean, so the
Browns sent you a message. They traded down out of
the number two pick, and they did that because they
didn't like this quarterback class. Well, so I was supposed
to believe in the third round they loved Dylan Gabriel.
(26:45):
Like I thought Dylan Gabriel was overdrafted to me, he's
a fifth round pick, should do her at worst as
a middle second. But my point is if you really
think of what Cleveland did. Okay, they told you we
don't love the quarterback class, that's including Shadeur because they
passed it him multiple times. They took Gabriel as a listen,
(27:08):
we're going to overdraft him. It's pretty obvious. My buddy
John Middlecoff said they didn't want to get into the
Chaduur stuff. And then by the fifth round, the owner
who pushed for Johnny Manziel, Baker Mayfield and Deshaun Watson says,
let's go get him because this is what this is
what the owner does. So the Browns also traded a
fifth round pick for Kenny Pickett this year, So I mean,
(27:30):
it's just a quarterback. They are of the classic low
sports self esteem franchise.
Speaker 9 (27:35):
So you and I have run businesses, and you know
that there is a fine line between like promoting right.
They can make a lot of money off Scheduur, Sanders,
the Brookly, the Browns kid.
Speaker 5 (27:45):
Let's put out videos.
Speaker 9 (27:46):
We could sell ads around them, easy to make money,
but do you want that distraction?
Speaker 5 (27:52):
It's not the Bill Belichick level distraction in North Carolina
right now.
Speaker 9 (27:55):
But you have to admit, like a fifth round quarterback
soaking up all the energy in the room is.
Speaker 5 (28:00):
A bit of a distraction.
Speaker 1 (28:00):
Listen, he's not even your start. I've said this before.
I wouldn't bring in Colin Kaepernick, Tim Tebow, Cam Newton,
Johnny Manziel as backups. I wouldn't bring in Baker mate. Well, no,
I would bring in Baker now. Although he's not a backup,
he's a starter. You do not want your backup to
be a celebrity. That's why Bill Belichick and the media
tries to make this stuff into politics or something else.
(28:23):
Bill Belichick, the minute they decided after camp, Remember Cam
had the year in New England and Belichick liked him solid.
He was a solid quarterback. The minute they said, okay,
we're gonna get back the job, they moved off of Cam,
even though he would have been the best backup in
the league. He's get him out, okay. Tim Tebow won
a playoff game. The minute that Jets thing with a
tire fire, nobody wanted him as a backup. Johnny Manziel,
(28:46):
you're telling me Johnny Manziel's not a backup nobody wanted
him as a backup, should do her because if his
dad's you know, running point on this quarterback situation. And
basically at the Super Bowl week telling the six or
seven teams that would potentially draft him, we're not playing
for a lot of you. So that turned a lot
of owners and gms off, so to me, Cleveland's Andrew
(29:11):
Berry go watch his reaction during the draft. They were
trying to get out of the Chador Sanders world. I mean,
did they need another quarterback? They had Flacco, Kenny Pickett,
Deshaun Watson, and Dylan Gabriel. They had four quarterbacks. The
last thing they needed in the fifth ront was another quarterback.
That's an owner move. They can deny it forever. So
I think they'll do the best with it, and I
(29:33):
think Stefanski's excellent, But I think it's it is. I
think it's a little bit of a tough situation for
Shador Sanders because I don't think privately they wanted this.
Speaker 9 (29:42):
It feels like every time Stefanski goes to the podium,
he's got a mentally be prepared for a ton of
Shador Sanders questions. I don't know if we can roll
the video, but he looked pained being asked, why isn't
Schador getting number one?
Speaker 5 (29:54):
Set Like, why isn't he getting more action? It's just
it's a tough spot to put your coach in.
Speaker 1 (29:58):
Man, here's Matt haw back earlier on Shaudeur fighting four
other quarterbacks for snabs. So the reps are usually divvied
up how they expected to go, how.
Speaker 5 (30:10):
They wanted to go, where's their money invested?
Speaker 2 (30:13):
And I always found it it was a lot easier
when it was clearly defined, not necessarily to the public,
but it was clearly defined inside the building, inside that
quarterback room.
Speaker 5 (30:23):
Here's what you're actually competing for. Here's what's open to you.
Speaker 1 (30:27):
Yeah, and I I so my bet is Flacco wins
the job and Shadeur eventually becomes the number two. Shadur
is better than Kenny Pickett and better than Dylan Gabriel.
Speaker 9 (30:39):
So hold Schaduur was a better prospect than Dylan Gabriel's.
But for what Stefanski wants, is he better than Dylan Gabriel?
Speaker 1 (30:49):
Those are two different Quessan Gabriel look tiny in college, tiny,
Shadoor Sanders I never looked at his size in college.
Speaker 9 (30:58):
He does that matter in the Kevin Stefanski offense. You
and I don't know that answer. Can we get Sefanski
on the show?
Speaker 1 (31:04):
I got nothing against Dylan Gabriel. I I just I
didn't see it.
Speaker 5 (31:08):
Ever, What do you mean he was like a Heisman condemned.
Speaker 1 (31:11):
He looks smaller.
Speaker 5 (31:12):
Look what do you have against small quarterbacks?
Speaker 6 (31:14):
Brough?
Speaker 5 (31:14):
It perty Dylan Gabriel, What do you have against them?
Speaker 1 (31:17):
You were all over Bryce Young because the other that
yours had his helmet didn't fit. Well that look at this,
Look at the video. This is nothing against him. This
is a professional league. Watch the video on Dylan Gabriel.
You notice his side.
Speaker 9 (31:29):
Did you see there's a video of him once he
leaves the podium. There's like a Brown staffer who goes,
I'm taller than him. He's mouthing it, and it's on video,
and I'm sure that Brown's are like, dude, can.
Speaker 1 (31:38):
You don't Dylan Gabriel looks noticeably smaller than Tua who
looks small in the NFL.
Speaker 9 (31:44):
Brice Younger or Dylan Gabriel, who's bigger. I think Gabriel
is bigger.
Speaker 1 (31:48):
Well, Bryce Young's a much better player, much better, much
better pro quarterback pro prospect.
Speaker 5 (31:55):
But we'll see.
Speaker 1 (31:57):
This is not a knock on him. But we've said
this before. I remember there was a guy that played
at Ohio State, Troy Smith. Remember Troy Smith was a
good college quarterback. I remember taking I watching him when
he first Jimmy Clausen did this do I forget where
it was the first series. I'm like, no, I'm talking
to work And I remember Jimmy Clawson at Notre Dame
went to the NFL, and it just shoulders size. I'm like, no,
(32:18):
this is not gonna work. Bryce Young is borderline. Like
You're like, I'm not sure, but he's so gifted. Bryce
is so talented.
Speaker 9 (32:27):
It's just I can't you know these big stepping quarterbacks
like Ryan Leith brought Off Sweiler, so many big gus
jam Marcus Russell, Like, oh they flopped too.
Speaker 5 (32:36):
Big guys flop that quarterback as well.
Speaker 1 (32:38):
But most of your greats Peyton, Bradshaw, Aikman, big Ben Brady,
most of your greats are big men. They're six three
and Holmes. No, Mahomes is six two but plays big.
You've never once thought about his size. Tua is supposed
to be six to one. All I can do is
look at his size. Mahomes is six one and a
half six to two. I never think about it. Some
guys play bigger. Zach Wilson the same size height is Mahomes.
(33:02):
Every time I watch Dac Wilston, I think he needs
more size. Just what it looks like to me. All right,
good stuff knocked another one out tonight. It's gonna be tasty.
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Colin Cowherd
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