May 13, 2024 • 43 mins
More reactions from the NBA playoff weekend action. Chris Broussard stops by to discuss the rising superstar in Anthony Edwards and the fallout from the Knicks blowout loss to the Pacers. Is Denver now in control of the series over the Timberwolves?
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to
catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio in
noon to three eastern nine am to noon Pacific. Find
your local station for The Herd at Fox Sports Radio
dot com, or stream us live every day on the
iHeartRadio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 3 (00:28):
All right, our number three, you know, Jmack.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
I moved all weekend, and I gotta tell you when
you're moving to a nice, nice little place, a little
nicer put in a good move. I didn't have to
do any barbells throw around. I just moved boxes all weekend.
It's I slept like a baby last night, felt great.
Got a little better view just around the corner. Put
me in a better mood.
Speaker 4 (00:51):
I know where you're at. I dropped you off last week.
I'm gonna keep mentioning. That's to say you remember it,
so I will remember the sederlate generosity, the general in
our relationship. I shaid, say you mentioned sleep, Colin. You
know I dumped Starbucks. I'm not doing coffee anymoight.
Speaker 3 (01:06):
That's right.
Speaker 4 (01:06):
Weeks and I noticed my sleep has been incredible, and
I guess all the sugar that they pumped into my drinking.
Speaker 1 (01:13):
But you don't have coffee. You have one of these
mocha something frappuccino things. We're not gonna yeah, but you can.
That's that's not even your ear off the reservation. Well
that stuff, that stuff's not even Yeah, should put a
Surgeon General warning on some of that stuff.
Speaker 4 (01:27):
But it's getting close to summer, you know, tank top time,
So I got to cut down on the sugar. Hit
the weights hard. It's a big lifting week, huge men's
league game Thursday. I'm back, baby, I can't wait.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
Well, I appreciate the updates. Well we all thought, well
I did. I thought Denver was cooked. You watched those
first two games in Denver. They got smoked. Series was over.
But it's amazing what three days off in between games
last week can do.
Speaker 3 (01:51):
Big boost for the Nuggets.
Speaker 1 (01:54):
Minnesota this year was a great defensive team, top of
the leak, great defensive team, and in the first two
games in Denver, Nuggets lethargic were not ready for the
physicality and the intensity and the relentlessness of the Tea Wolves.
The underdogs came in, threw a big punch and knocked
Denver down. But then they got three days off, full days,
(02:18):
and they heard for three days from guys like us,
people like us, how bad they are, They're cooked, they're terrible,
and that stuff you always find out later.
Speaker 5 (02:27):
You know.
Speaker 1 (02:27):
Coaches, you know, they edded up clips and they show
the team in a reel over and over and over.
Denver rebooted. They're the more talented offensive team, much more
offensive skill. You know, between Joker and Gordon and Porter
and Murray, all those guys could drop thirty on any night.
They rebooted and they turned a defensive series into a
(02:48):
who's more skilled series, dusted themselves off, went to the corner,
got a little advice, and the series now looks like
a mismatch. It went from defensive of intensity in the
first two games to offensive skill and outside of Ant,
Minnesota really can't match up. They were not a great
offensive team this year. Ant has become a great offensive player.
(03:12):
Karl Anthony Towns terrible yesterday, has been hit and missing
his career though he's very gifted. But there was nothing
inherently wrong with Denver when they were down two, it
just looked like they weren't ready to play and couldn't
match up physically, the length of the te wolves, the aggressiveness,
but they had the same coach. It's not an old
roster falling apart. They didn't have any key injuries. They
(03:34):
just weren't quite ready for the series. And again it
shows how valuable coaching is. You go back to that
Warriors Celtics final. After three games, the Warriors look cooked. Okay,
Steve Kerr, heart of a champion fly cross country, a
lot of time together, make some tweaks, and from that
point forward, Warriors going to Boston, win the game, win
(03:57):
the series. It totally flipped the series. So Denver this
year oh and ten when they score under one hundred points,
so they just had to figure out they may not
be as good defensively as Minnesota.
Speaker 3 (04:11):
They had to get the offense right.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
They needed several days off, practice, film work. They're all
in ten when they score under one hundred, so they
had to get the offense cooking. And that's most notably
the joker who has been in the last two games unbelievable.
Gordon goes ten for his first ten yesterday. So we
(04:33):
knew Minnesota is the better team in this series defensively,
but we also knew offensively. Denver's got four offensive players,
all capable, all in their prime. It just didn't look
like they were ready for the wrestling match in the
first two games in Denver. So they got up from
the mat and the coach said, sometimes champions get rattled,
(04:54):
they never quit.
Speaker 6 (04:55):
I think when we were leaving Denver, a lot of people,
I don't think in Denver, but a lot of peop
people were. You know, understanda'll be so sand, a series
is over, and you know to come up here and
even it up on the road. We've played good basketball
and we know that they're going to come out very spirited,
just like Anthony Edwards did tonight.
Speaker 3 (05:13):
We knew he was going to do that.
Speaker 6 (05:14):
Hopefully we can use that momentum of winning too in
a row and you to go back in and try
to go up three to two.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
Really good coaching. We saw it with Steve Kerr and
the Warriors. The defensive team won the wrestling match for
the first two. The last two games in Minnesota did
not even look like the first two games in the series.
The t Wolves, by the way, equally well coached. So
what does it flip back to now that they moved
to Mile High I don't know. My guess is though
(05:42):
throughout the history of the league, defensive led teams can
win a lot of games, but it's an offensive skill league,
and Denver now looks like they're in control. So the
Knicks got pasted. First of all, I mean, they're missing
all sorts of players. But there is something to be
said that hustle is important, toughness, intensity, they really really matter,
(06:04):
and the Knicks have a lot of that. But those
minutes add up, and we kept saying, when's the damn
gonna break? Like how long can you be led by
a dominant ball, dominant point guard who's playing virtually all
the minutes? How long can Josh Hart play with this
much heart and produce double his career averages? Like at
(06:26):
some point, when is it end? And that was yesterday.
That game was never competitive, So listen, I don't even
think Nick fans think they're a great team. They're a
great story and they have a lot of heart, but again,
you need talent and skill. The Eastern Conference is bad.
This is about as bad as it's ever been. And
(06:46):
then you add on the fact that players like Dame
and Yannis were hurt and they scraped and clawed their
way to a couple of wins. But again, when your
scoring comes, almost all of the key points come from
a ball dominant point guard. I've seen it with Damon Portland.
I've seen it with Westbrook teams. I've seen it with
hardened teams. The Warriors were different with Steph. It wasn't
(07:09):
about Steph being ball dominant. That was never the issue.
It was about ball movement, off ball movement. That's where
Steph's a legend, along with his shooting, and so the
Warriors never got into that ball dominant stuff. It was
always about moving the pieces. Draymond Green could have the ball,
he could be the catalyst. So it didn't wear down
(07:30):
Steph Curry. There were other scores. There was Klaye Thompson.
You know, at one point that was a weird thing.
So that was all I would go out away that.
In the last year or two, it's become too much
about staff.
Speaker 3 (07:41):
So I don't know Warriors. I don't know what to
make of them.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
So Brunson was averaging thirty five a game in the playoffs.
Number one used to Drake, you just kept asking how
long it's not being a hater to say, yeah, this
thing doesn't feel like it's sustainable. That's being realistic.
Speaker 3 (07:56):
Now.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
The good news for the Knicks, they're really good news
because this wasn't the case for the last two decades.
They look really well run. They actually have a culture,
like a Miami Heat culture. They have a Villanova culture.
They play hard. They've got to be very careful when
they go to get the next star that they don't
give up too many pieces. Can you keep Og, You'll
(08:17):
keep Brunson, but could you keep Josh Hard. You're gonna
have to give something up to get another high end player.
They'll move off Randall, maybe Mitchell Robinson. Maybe they'll get
different size. But in the end, they look well run.
They've got a culture, and maybe they beat Indianapolis, maybe
they beat the Pacers. But working really hard matters a lot.
(08:40):
You can work as a comedian all day writing jokes.
At some point you have to get on the stage
and be funny. You can work really really hard as
a basketball team. At some point, skill and talent takes over.
And the Knicks don't have a ton of it. But
they're well run, they've got a culture, they fight like hell.
They're fun to watch, they're easy to root for. And
maybe they win the series, but they're six and zero
(09:02):
when they win the rebounding battle and they're all and
four when they don't. So that's a pretty good indication. Resilience, toughness,
working hard is sort of their thing.
Speaker 3 (09:11):
Jalen Brunson. After an ugly.
Speaker 7 (09:12):
Loss, I mean, we can talk about fresh legs, and
we can give us all the pity that we want. Yeah,
we're short handed, but that doesn't matter right now. Be
had what we have and we need to go forward
with that. So there is no there is no we're
short handed. There is no excuse. There's no excuse whatsoever.
(09:33):
Now if we lose, we lose.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
And on the other coast hearing interesting things texts today
on JJ Reddick and the Lakers. Interesting things got to
start somewhere. We want to Duke be in the league broadcast.
I mean Steve Kerr, gool look at Steve Kerr's career player,
very funny, talented broadcaster, front office, legendary coach Jason Kidd.
(10:01):
Didn't he go from playing to coaching first? One didn't
work well? Now it works well. So I mean, JJ
Reddick's not going to go to the G League. Like
in a lot of these guys that have no interest
coaching in college. College basketball and pro basketball don't even
feel like the same sport. College football in the NFL
there's a lot of similarities schemes, coaching staffs, but NBA
(10:22):
in college just don't feel like they're the same thing.
Speaker 3 (10:25):
So where else is JJ Reddick?
Speaker 1 (10:27):
He could go to a bench, but the money he
makes now with all the podcasting and broadcasting, they're not
gonna sit on the bench. You're not going to give
that up. So how do you get JJ Reddick has
to be a head coach? He has options, He's got
some leverage, Like he doesn't need the job. The Lakers
need a coach? Like, are you going to bring in
another Darvin Ham? You say to yourself, well, what's his experience?
What was Darvin Ham's experience? So I mean to me,
(10:50):
you had a coach that won a title, Vogel, and
they got tired of that, right they went it title?
Speaker 3 (10:56):
It got tired of.
Speaker 1 (10:56):
That, So let's bring in the new guy, not the
old guy. I think got tired of that. Maybe it's
a fresh set of eyes and a friend of Lebron
and somebody's doing a podcast with But we're hearing stuff.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and Noone Easter non a Empacific on Fox Sports Radio
FS one and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 8 (11:16):
Hey, it's Ben, host of The Fifth Hour with Ben Maller.
Would mean a lot to have you join us on
our weekly auditory journey. You're asking what in God's name
is the Fifth Hour? I'll tell you it's a spin
off of it Ben Mather Show A could hit overnights
on FSR.
Speaker 3 (11:30):
Why should you listen?
Speaker 8 (11:32):
Picture if you will a world will we chat with
captains of industry in media, sports and more every week
explore some amazing facts about human nature and more.
Speaker 3 (11:40):
Listen to The Fifth Hour with Ben.
Speaker 8 (11:42):
Matherer on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast or wherever you
get your podcasts.
Speaker 3 (11:45):
A lot of things going on.
Speaker 1 (11:46):
First things first, after our show, let's check out Chris
Brussard Brew joining us.
Speaker 4 (11:54):
Live Boy.
Speaker 1 (11:56):
Nick's going to be on one today. He's gotten all
fired up on that today. One of the things that
Nick right and I sort of agree with. I'm more
pro Celtics than he is. Maybe I'm more anti Tatum
than he is. But you start looking around and generally
Brew you can identify very early kind of the next
(12:19):
face of the league or a different level superstar. Even
though Jordan wasn't winning, he was working everybody. The practices,
that the ferocity, that the points production, and I look
at Wemby, and I look at Jokic, and I look
at Ant and I feel like there's more excitement about
Ant already than there is about Tatum. And I said
(12:39):
this the other day to somebody, I said, there's a
certain mentality with Tatum. I don't know, it doesn't feel
like a Kobe or an Ant or an MJ. It
just doesn't feel like even a Dwayne Wade. Where are
you now on top?
Speaker 3 (12:54):
Yeah?
Speaker 9 (12:55):
Yeah, it's interesting what you say it, because it's he.
I you know, his idol was Kobe Bryant.
Speaker 10 (13:02):
He mimicked a lot of Kobe's game, but he doesn't
have that kind of killer.
Speaker 9 (13:09):
Instinct that seems at Kobe.
Speaker 10 (13:10):
I don't want to say he's not a competitor, because
he certainly is, and he's had some huge playoff moments,
you know, with their backs against the wall for the Celtics,
but he there's something that seems to be lacking.
Speaker 9 (13:25):
And I think that I.
Speaker 10 (13:27):
Would put him even though I look, he was on
my first team All NBA, he was on my MVP ballot,
he was fourth on my MVP ballot. But I think
he is a tier a notch below the absolute superstars
of MBI, Jannie Jokic and now Anthony Edwards.
Speaker 9 (13:49):
You're absolutely right. There is more buzz.
Speaker 10 (13:52):
And excitement about Edwards, and it's kind of like you
just know it when you see it, Colin, Like you said,
Jordan was getting bounced in the first round of the playoffs,
but everybody knew.
Speaker 9 (14:01):
He was a superstar.
Speaker 10 (14:02):
He had sneakers, he had commercials at that point, and
it's similar with Anthony Edwards. Maybe Tatum can change it
if they somehow got over the hump and won it
this year. I don't see them doing that, but yeah,
Edwards has surpassed and let's face it, before the off
the court problems, John Morant had passed Jason Tatum as
(14:27):
a young, you know, kind of up and coming face
of the league.
Speaker 1 (14:30):
So you're close to the Knicks, and I look at
the Knicks and yesterday was kind of inevitable. They're all
banged up, they're very I mean, Josh Hart was giving
you double his career numbers, so I don't know what
transpires rest of the way. Starting tomorrow in New York,
the crowd will be backed, it'll be fun, and they
get Game.
Speaker 3 (14:47):
Seven at home.
Speaker 1 (14:49):
But it's gonna be interesting to me because I don't
think they're a championship team. But I do think for
the last two to three years they've been very patient
and well run. I hear a story today Kevin Durant
didn't even talk to Vogel. That was the story out here.
They didn't get along. And I think to myself, I
don't know, maybe this is the same question, but if
(15:10):
they had to make a move in New York.
Speaker 3 (15:12):
Is it seismic is it subtle?
Speaker 1 (15:15):
Because clearly the culture Brunson, the toughness, that's all there.
Speaker 3 (15:22):
They got to get another guy. Where do you think
they go?
Speaker 10 (15:28):
Yeah, they absolutely need to get another guy. And the
danger for the Knicks, Colin is thinking that they've arrived.
I Atlanta made it to the Conference finals a few
years ago behind their young hot shot point guard Trey Young, right, who,
let's face it, has had a better career than Jalen
Brunson's to this point. And we see that the Hawks
aren't anywhere near championship contention, so you can't.
Speaker 9 (15:52):
You know, Portland a few years ago was in the.
Speaker 10 (15:55):
East Western Conference finals, but wasn't really close to being
a championship team.
Speaker 9 (16:00):
And that's where the Knicks are.
Speaker 10 (16:01):
So they better be careful not to rest on their laurels.
Speaker 9 (16:05):
They're only going.
Speaker 10 (16:07):
To have a legitimate chance to get into the conference
finals because Milwaukee and Philadelphia are so We're so banged
up and injured, and their stars were injured, so they
need to make a big move.
Speaker 9 (16:20):
I wouldn't move.
Speaker 10 (16:21):
I wouldn't be careless, but I also wouldn't be overly cautious, because.
Speaker 9 (16:26):
You can build and build and build and.
Speaker 10 (16:29):
Be careful and well we saving for the future and
never get there. Okay, New York is starving for a championship.
It's been fifty one years, Colin, and outside of the
Patrick Ewing era, there have been very few years where
they actually have really been like a legitimate contender. I
(16:49):
covered them the last time they went to the finals
in nineteen ninety nine with Latrelle's pretty well Alan Houston.
They weren't really one of the ultra elite teams in
the league.
Speaker 9 (17:01):
They had a great run through the.
Speaker 10 (17:02):
East that year and got to the finals, but they
never came close, really that close again. And so the
Knicks thing, I think they should go for something big
if it's out there.
Speaker 9 (17:13):
And you mentioned Kevin Durant.
Speaker 10 (17:15):
Look, Phoenix doesn't want to trade him, but where's Phoenix going.
Speaker 9 (17:19):
This is championship or bus for.
Speaker 10 (17:21):
The Suns, all right, Let's not lower the expectations now
that it's obvious they're not getting to a championship. With
Kevin Durant, Devin Booker and Bradley Beial, it is championship
or bust. And if I were them, I would be
open to trading Durant, seeing what I could get for him,
what type of draft picks, what type of young players
(17:44):
to fit around Devin Booker, and I would start building
around Booker because they're not gonna win a championship as
currently constructed, So why are you even keeping Durant unless
you just want to sell tickets and be a show
and be relevant. But I would if I'm the Knicks,
I look for some big But outside of a Durant move,
I mean, Paul George, you know, there are other things
(18:05):
they can try, but I think a.
Speaker 9 (18:08):
Durant move is what I would go for I.
Speaker 10 (18:10):
Know it's a long shot, but that would be right
at the top of my list.
Speaker 1 (18:13):
So Denver Minnesota interesting series, very physical. It was a
defensive series for the first two games, has now pivoted
to more of an offensive skills series that plays right
into Denver's wheelhouse. I mean again, Gordon yesterday takes he
was the best player they had. Murray can give you thirty,
Jokich takes over a games, Porter gets hot, hitting threes.
(18:34):
All of these guys can take over a half of
a game offensively, even though Gordon's viewed more as a
defensive player.
Speaker 3 (18:41):
But it is interesting.
Speaker 1 (18:43):
One of my takeaways of this series now that Denver
feels like it's too too but it has control is
Karl Anthony Towns was a no show yesterday, and I'm like,
eventually Jordan had to get a Pippin' Kobe had to
get like a shack or a Gasol. And this team
feels very lobsided, ant scores and you cross your fingers
(19:05):
on Carl Anthony Towns and that's just not good. That's
not getting through Denver. That may not getting through a Boston.
So when I look at Minnesota currently constructed, I love
the roster.
Speaker 3 (19:15):
But I do.
Speaker 1 (19:16):
Wonder because you've been watching this for a long time,
Karl Anthony Towns has always had the same reputation. Super talented,
little emotional, could get hot and cold, you can't depend
on him, but wildly talented.
Speaker 3 (19:30):
I kind of feel like watching.
Speaker 1 (19:31):
Him yesterday, I'm like, I can see them just saying,
but we got to get more consistency, a more consistent personality.
We got to get ant his pippin Or am I hyperbolic?
Do you think they just bring this crew back?
Speaker 10 (19:48):
Well, look, let's see what happens over these next few games.
Obviously Denver is in control now I pig Minnesota in seven.
I'm sticking with the Tea Wolves. This is what happens
in a seven game, right. There's times you think this
team's gonna win it. Times you think that team's gonna
win it. But let's see what happens over these next
few games. But I have to admit objectively, Denver now
(20:10):
is in control. They have home court advantage, they've stolen
the momentum, all of that.
Speaker 9 (20:15):
But there are two key players in this series. I
see Kyle.
Speaker 10 (20:19):
Everybody obviously Jokic and Edwards mean a ton, right, but
for the most part, you know you're going to get.
Speaker 9 (20:25):
Top notch performances from those two. Aaron Gordon is big
because you said he's hitting threes. Last two games, he's
five to six from three, and.
Speaker 10 (20:34):
What that does is that that it takes away from
Gobart's ability to protect the rim when kat Or nas
Reed is guarding Jokic and so it draws him away
from the basket. So that's been huge. Let's see if
Gordon can keep that up. But the two keys Jamal
Murray for the Nuggets, right, he struggled in the first
(20:55):
two games.
Speaker 9 (20:56):
I gotta give him credit.
Speaker 10 (20:57):
He was facing controversy as he should have been, and
he was, you know, had played poorly in the first
two games, not to mention the CAF injury. Comes out
in games three and four and it's terrific, and they
played good defense on him a lot of times, and
he just hit that turnaround, fade away mid range jumper
all night.
Speaker 9 (21:17):
Shot it well from three as well. He's huge.
Speaker 10 (21:20):
Can he keep this up or does he go back
to kind of struggling the way he has throughout.
Speaker 9 (21:25):
Most of the playoffs.
Speaker 10 (21:27):
If that happens, they're gonna have a tough time winning.
On the other side, his cat As you said, he
averaged twenty three points a game, shot about sixty four
percent from the floor in the first two games, no
shows in the next two, and game three only took
seven shots. So you are absolutely right about his lack
of consistency. But he let's see what he does. He
(21:49):
is ultra talented. He's a good two. Remember, he accepts
being like he's accepted that Edwards is the guy, which
is there's a that's a value there. But yeah, if
I could get something much better for him, I'd be
open to it if they lose this series.
Speaker 9 (22:06):
But I'm not shopping him. I'm like, oh, I gotta
get rid of him.
Speaker 10 (22:10):
I might need to find maybe a more consistent number
three because after those two, who's definitely giving me buckets
on that team? And go Beart struggles around the rim
unfortunately for.
Speaker 3 (22:22):
The Wolves now that that's actually a good place.
Speaker 1 (22:25):
But it's funny, like I've liked Carl Anthony Towns forever,
but he also disappears since he got into the league.
He has these stretches, and I do feel like Pippin
was limited offensively, but I got the exact same performance
from him. Virtually every night. So to me, that inconsistency
with Carl Anthony Towns would drive me nuts. But to
your point, he does accept being a two and not
(22:48):
every great player that gets bucking tippin' in.
Speaker 9 (22:51):
That's the key.
Speaker 1 (22:54):
Yeah, good seeing you Brew? Alright, yeah yeah, it's what
would you do if you ran it? Because the construction
of them is wereal to good. A big that defense,
a big that scores, Aunt the star, Mike Conley, guy
off the bench, high energy wing defense, like the construct
of Minnesota is great. But could you say, okay, instead
(23:14):
of Aunt, let's get another long offensive player that's more
consistent because he's no showed.
Speaker 4 (23:22):
Is a great topic I touched on on my podcast.
I wonder if Karl Anthony Towns has shades of Kevin Love.
Remember Kevin Love in Minnesota was the number one. They
didn't win any games, no playoffs, put up like twenty
five and fifteen. Okay, Kevin Love not a number one,
not really a two. He was a great three. He
Lebron and Kyrie Irving.
Speaker 1 (23:42):
See I would argue that he and Bosh are ones,
but smart enough to acknowledge. I mean, Bosh was doing
twenty five a night in Toronto AND's like, hey, I.
Speaker 3 (23:52):
Want to win titles.
Speaker 1 (23:53):
I don't want to lose in the first roelaf So
Chris is like, I'll be a three. Kevin Love was
like a rebounding terror in Kevin's like, all be a three.
I think they're ones, but very few guys. You can
get a guy occasionally to go to a two Anthony
Davis with Lebron in the history of the league. To
ask a one to go to a three, you have
(24:13):
to have guaranteed title.
Speaker 11 (24:14):
But it shows that you're smart and willing to understand.
Speaker 1 (24:18):
Chris Bosh Kevin Love. Yeah, I mean Chris Bosh Kevin Love.
They were going to end up Hall of Fame first
ballot stat guys. But both were like win games.
Speaker 9 (24:27):
Okay.
Speaker 4 (24:27):
Andrew Wiggins in Minnesota, what was he He was no, no, no,
he was a number one overall pick.
Speaker 1 (24:31):
Yeah, but he was a dissip. Kevin Love was never
a disappointment. He was a he was a monster. But
there were later thirty eight games. I don't think they
ever got to the playoffs in Love, well, I mean
a D is a one talent wise, probably personality more
tree round. Kevin Love in his prime was better than
Wiggins and his prime not even close. I mean Kevin
wasn't Kevin Love averaging twenty five and eleven? I think
(24:54):
he's twenty five and like fourteen. Yeah, I mean so
the Wiggins first year in the league, where were like
he should be better.
Speaker 3 (25:00):
Kevin Love was like star.
Speaker 1 (25:02):
But if he was your one, Kevin identified, hey, we're
not gonna win championships.
Speaker 3 (25:07):
I'm probably best served with a superstar.
Speaker 4 (25:09):
Okay, so what it could? Could Karl Anthony Towns be
a two UNO title winner or a three under title winner,
which is better?
Speaker 1 (25:14):
Probably a three. He's probably a three. Now again we've
said this Clay Thompson. When you when he in his prime,
when he was your third, that's an all time team.
Well wait, who was the two? Well it was Stephen Durant.
Speaker 4 (25:28):
Oh, Stephan Durrat.
Speaker 3 (25:28):
Okay, when they I mean you could win with him
as your two.
Speaker 1 (25:31):
But when he was the three, that's when you have
to decide, is this the best team of all times?
Speaker 4 (25:36):
Came over? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (25:37):
I mean when when if you go back to Jordan,
the one, pipp and the two, you know, when you've
got coup coach the best euro at the time is
averaging eighteen nineteen, he's your third scoring option. It's like, Okay,
then I got Kerr over here, and then I've got
Ron Harper was literally like the fifth sco Okay, that's
that's your best. Ron Harper was a twenty fourth.
Speaker 11 (25:58):
Dennis Rodman was I think on that.
Speaker 1 (25:59):
Yeah, But I mean if Karl Anthony Towns is your three,
that's a great team.
Speaker 3 (26:05):
That's the best year be a three.
Speaker 1 (26:07):
I mean think right now, Michael Porter, like on certain nights,
is they're four in Denver? Yeah, Okay, that's that's like
when Manu Ginobili was you're off the bench for San Antonio.
Speaker 3 (26:20):
Okay, now you're talking an all time team.
Speaker 4 (26:22):
I'm pretty sure Michael Porter was two of four shooting
last night and they smoked Minnesota for the record.
Speaker 1 (26:28):
Michael Porter stepped back. Gordon was on fire, Yoki. Michael
Porter understood. It's like, hey, this is not my night.
Gordon was on fire. When Gordon scores, they're virtually unbeatable.
Speaker 4 (26:38):
Listen. I don't know how you make it happen, but
Minnesota somehow getting Towns to Phoenix, where Towns could be
the three behind Booker and Durant is what do they
get well, that's the problem. It's tough to move Beal.
I wouldn't want Durant with Ant. I just let let's
let Anne. They went at it in the playoffs, so
I know a lot of people want to say that's
a perfect.
Speaker 3 (26:57):
Fit for Kevin Durant.
Speaker 4 (26:59):
Losing to the Warrior. Is the going to the Warriors,
losing to Aunt then going to Minnesota.
Speaker 3 (27:04):
Jamy Mack with a news.
Speaker 4 (27:07):
No, no turn on the news, This is the herd
line news. That's sort with Sean Payton, year two with
the Denver Broncos brought this up. Yeah, they kick off
rookie mini camp with their new quarterback bo Next he's
alread impressing. Sean Payton, who had this to say about
the twelfth overall pick.
Speaker 3 (27:24):
It's almost like watching a good golfer.
Speaker 5 (27:26):
You know. Sometimes when you watch his game, there's a
patience to how he plays the ball comes out and
I don't want to use the term boring, that's that's
not the right term. But yeah, got pretty good decisions
and with each play, the efficiency and how he's operating
all of that. The only thing I can think about
that I was a little bit surprised is when we
(27:47):
went to work him out privately and stood around him.
He was bigger than I expected, you know, but nothing
in the last two days he's doing well.
Speaker 3 (27:58):
Yeah, I think he fits.
Speaker 11 (28:00):
Did you see their over undertow title like the lowest
in the leader.
Speaker 1 (28:03):
I didn't get it. So again, this was one that
I did not. I would bet the over, but it
was so low. At five and a half, Vegas is hedging.
They're basically saying we don't think bo Nicks can play,
and I don't get it. He had sixty one college starts.
I watched him a ton. I watched them as a
freshman at Auburn beat Justin Herbert and Oregon a good
Oregon team.
Speaker 3 (28:24):
I don't you know.
Speaker 1 (28:24):
Again, this is this is the difference between college and pro.
I watch him and his ceiling may be lower, But
I think week one you will look at bow Nicks
with Peyton system and go, oh, that's a franchise quarterback.
Speaker 4 (28:36):
No, maybe if they play the Raiders. But I think
the problem here is when you, like you said, you
see five and a half and you're like, what am
I missing.
Speaker 1 (28:43):
And you need to then go back and go their
The defense was terrible and they didn't have enough draft
picks to totally supplant what they had. Their linebackers are
pretty active. They needed an edge rush they didn't last year.
They have one great corner, so they won't be great defensively,
but I do think offensively they'll be a really nice
football team.
Speaker 11 (29:04):
It's five and a half. Stuff to vision is brutal.
Speaker 4 (29:06):
We know the Charges are gonna be better. We know
the Chiefs are gonna be very good. I'm looking at
Pro Football Focus. You call up to the Denver Broncos
lineup and you're like, there's not a lot of talent
at all.
Speaker 1 (29:15):
On Well, Courtland Sutton mimes, Sean Payton's brain, good left tackle, Actually, their.
Speaker 3 (29:22):
O lines good. Oh line's good.
Speaker 1 (29:24):
Running back better than serviceable Mims and is very good
at cornerback. Yeah, mems in Courtland Sutton are nice. They
have nice tight ends, they have capable tight ends.
Speaker 4 (29:32):
I don't a lot of nice.
Speaker 1 (29:34):
Well again, I know the AFC's harder. I just don't
buy this is a five and twelve team.
Speaker 4 (29:41):
Yeah, that's like you want to set your friend up
with a girl. Oh she hot, she's nice. No, I'm
not that interesting. You just said a lot of nice
to Denver Broncos.
Speaker 3 (29:49):
Your wife's nice. What's wrong? And she's super nice? Okay?
Well no, I mean she's super.
Speaker 11 (29:54):
Nice for them being set up on like a blind dab.
Speaker 1 (29:56):
Well, you you're knocking nice. If I stay an NFL
team nice, that's not a five win team. Five win
team in the NFL is a tire fire. The Denver,
I mean, what matters in the NFL O line as
a unit O line. There's his top ten. It was
rage seven head coach. Well, you're top five there, okay.
So if bo Nicks is as Sean says, he just
(30:21):
runs it like a golf throw. I have two receivers.
I like a tight end that's capable. To me, it's
a pass rush. They have to figure out a way
to generate.
Speaker 3 (30:30):
A pass rush.
Speaker 1 (30:30):
But five and twelve, five and twelve are teams that
aren't even fun to watch on television. I think you're
down playing nice.
Speaker 3 (30:40):
Nice is nice? How's that car?
Speaker 1 (30:42):
So?
Speaker 11 (30:44):
Where's nice? In terms of solid.
Speaker 1 (30:47):
Nice is eight to nine wins? And I think Denver
is now, Okay, bet the.
Speaker 4 (30:50):
Over, then go ahead, you're gonna burn lights some money
on fire, go for it. Eight to nine. I mean
I need some more work on this team before. I
totally hammer them. We like Peyton, but yeah, I'm not
I'm not seeing it yet. Next story over the NBA
the Hawks, How about this colin I know, I don't
don't know what the NBA was doing putting the draft
lottery on Mother's Day. I totally miss this, But the
Hawks had the tenth best odds for the top pick
(31:13):
and won the draft lottery for the first time in
franchise history, which is weird.
Speaker 3 (31:18):
All these years in the league and it's the first
time they won first time ever.
Speaker 11 (31:21):
The Wizard, Rockets, and Spurs round out the top four
with the Pistons. This is brutal.
Speaker 3 (31:25):
Second year in a row.
Speaker 11 (31:26):
The Pistons had the worst record and they.
Speaker 1 (31:28):
Have draft isn't very good great, So having the fifth
pick is not a huge gap from having the first
or second.
Speaker 3 (31:34):
Well, there's no Wemby here, Lebron.
Speaker 4 (31:37):
Remember the Honest Draft, it was like, oh.
Speaker 3 (31:39):
Well he was thirteenth, wasn't he?
Speaker 7 (31:40):
It was?
Speaker 4 (31:40):
It was considered a weak draft.
Speaker 11 (31:42):
Yeah, but is the all time player already?
Speaker 1 (31:44):
If you go to the Honest Draft, the best players
were in the teams. So yeah, the kid Alex Saar
is supposed to be the one that's the one I
keep seeing video of.
Speaker 11 (31:52):
Yeah, he's he's very good.
Speaker 1 (31:53):
I like, no, no, no, I keep seeing I keep seeing
the second one, the second French kid.
Speaker 4 (31:57):
Yeah, we're not going to try to pronounce his name.
He's a The french Men are taken over Wemby. And
now these two.
Speaker 11 (32:01):
I'll just say this, Rob Dillingham.
Speaker 4 (32:03):
We've seen the history of Kentucky players under Kyla PARTI
kind of held back, Jamal Murray, held back, Devin Booker,
held back at Kentucky. They weren't superstars. They come to
the league in pop I would say, keep an eye
on Dillingham from Kentucky. He is explosive and nice and
he just couldn't really get going.
Speaker 11 (32:18):
Here's the interesting thing, Collin, the.
Speaker 4 (32:20):
Team with the worst record the last six years has
not gotten the number one pick.
Speaker 1 (32:25):
Well, that's why the system works. That's what they tried
to prevent tanking and getting it. So the system the
NBA created is working perfectly.
Speaker 3 (32:36):
So don't tank.
Speaker 1 (32:37):
It doesn't guarantee squad and in a bad draft, by
the seventh pick, you could be out of dudes.
Speaker 4 (32:43):
So the league has done two big things recently. We
don't want tanking. We want to outlaw that because you're
not going to be benefited when it comes draft lottery.
And number two is the load management. They're pushing back
against it. You saw that. This is all has to
do with the TV deals coming up, right, They're trying
to clean it up.
Speaker 11 (32:57):
We're not a tanking league. I'm pro tanking, Colin.
Speaker 4 (33:01):
I don't know about you. I think tanking is smart.
NBA is doing something to kind of. But if you're
in the NFL and you are headed toward a top
pick and you see Shadore Sanders and the kid Beck
from a wellking.
Speaker 3 (33:13):
To get more ping pong balls, I want to get
more ping pong.
Speaker 4 (33:16):
Balls if I can get the top pick. I want
to tank and get the top pick. But it's not
working in the NBA.
Speaker 3 (33:21):
Now, I didn't watch this, did you want? You didn't
watch it was doing Mother's Days. I had no idea.
It was on the internet.
Speaker 4 (33:26):
I don't know what NBA was thinking.
Speaker 3 (33:27):
This or did they even do ping pong balls anymore?
Speaker 4 (33:30):
They did?
Speaker 3 (33:30):
They did okay finals what they did the last time
I watched it.
Speaker 11 (33:33):
Yeah. Final story Lebron's son, Bronnie James.
Speaker 4 (33:37):
A lot of speculation while he stay in college or
head to the pro pros. Will Sham's reports that Bronni
has been medically clear to play in the NBA and
is expected to stay in the draft. He's going to
take part in the Combines five on five scrimmages beginning Tuesday.
I'm kind of excited for these, and as until May
twenty ninth to officially decide whether to stay in the
draft or return to school. Lakers hold on to their
(34:01):
seventeenth pick and the fifty fifth pick. Can't imagine they'd
go Bronni at seventeen, but fifty five is interesting. Now
here's the official height and weight measure I'm sorry, height
measurement for Bronnie at the Combine six foot one and
a half inches, So he's not six four as they
were trying to say he was a USC.
Speaker 3 (34:22):
Well, you can't play six one. He can only play point.
That's it. You better learn to handle the ball.
Speaker 1 (34:29):
A little late to start. I mean, everybody talks about
him as a two.
Speaker 11 (34:33):
He does have a good wing span for a six
to one guy six seven and a quarter.
Speaker 3 (34:36):
But that's you can't be You're not an off guard.
Speaker 4 (34:38):
He can be that. Patrick Beverley without the crazy, really
good defender, hit a three, hit some shots, energy guy
off the bench. He's not even Alex Caruso size six
one and a half. It's not a huge, it's not big.
So shooting guard is a tough sell. But you know
what he's gonna be the NBA. It's a good athlete
and he's lebron soon.
Speaker 1 (34:58):
So I mean, listen, in my lifetime, I have seen
all through the coaching ranks, you know, father sons like
it's it's I'm okay with it. I know it gets
So it says USC has Brawny listed it's six to
four on their website. And so you're telling me what
(35:19):
that measurement was.
Speaker 3 (35:20):
Yours was what.
Speaker 4 (35:22):
Six one and a half. So you know these colleges
all embellish. I mean he's not six four six one
and a half at the combine he was measured official.
Speaker 3 (35:31):
Jmack with the News.
Speaker 2 (35:32):
Well that's the news, and thanks for stopping by the
herd line news.
Speaker 3 (35:38):
He is athletic though, right we acknowledge that. Oh, hyper athletic.
Speaker 4 (35:41):
I mean he's a run and jump guy, catch ally ups,
come off the bench and be like an energy guy.
Speaker 1 (35:48):
Yeah, it's it's it's okay. Energy smart, you makes a
lot of money. Hit threes that fits on them.
Speaker 4 (35:55):
Okay. Mario Chalmers is not like a huge guy. He
was like a starting point guard for the Heat when
they want the with the heatles.
Speaker 1 (36:01):
Yeah, and he drove Lebron crazy brawny, won't drive Cray.
Speaker 2 (36:06):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and noon Easter not a Empacific.
Speaker 1 (36:11):
Good comp, bad comp comp? Good comp, bad comp. You
give me the player in the comp, J mckin, I'll
tell you as everybody's comparent aunt to MJ earlier today,
jokic Bird. Paul Pierce said, that's what they are. Good comp,
bad comp. Here we go, Now this is good.
Speaker 4 (36:30):
I don't I honestly don't know who came up with these,
but these are good. Is Michael Jordan a good or
bad comp for Anthony Enter?
Speaker 3 (36:35):
Same size?
Speaker 1 (36:36):
I mean aunts a little thicker MJ little taller, good
mid range games, very fast start to their career, clearly
right out of the gate. They play with an aggressiveness,
a vertical explosion that nobody else, no league does.
Speaker 4 (36:52):
Okay. Is Paul Pierce a good or bad comp for
Jason Tatum.
Speaker 3 (36:57):
A bad comp.
Speaker 1 (36:58):
I think Paul did didn't have playoff success until later
in his career. I think he's a much more aggressive player.
Tatum's probably viewed as a better defensive player, I think,
But I think Paul just had a different mentality and
a different little more dog So I don't think it's
a great.
Speaker 4 (37:15):
Comp's Larry Bird a gooder bad comfort Nikola Yoki?
Speaker 1 (37:20):
Yes, they played at their own speed, brilliant passers, great shooters,
uniquely great passers and shooters for their size and their era,
not always aesthetically beautiful, but really clever, and the ability
for their position to be the best shooter kind of
in that, I mean that was the best shooting forward
(37:42):
I'd ever seen. With Larry Bird, Jokis is the best
perimeter shooting big I've ever seen.
Speaker 4 (37:48):
Yeah, I don't hate that. I hadn't really thought I
was thinking more a big guy, But I don't hate that.
Speaker 11 (37:52):
Is Steve Nash a gooder bad comfort comfort.
Speaker 3 (37:55):
Jamal Murray Bad.
Speaker 1 (37:57):
Nash could score, but was a great distributor. Murray's a
shooting guard, not even.
Speaker 4 (38:02):
Claying, not a good one. Guys. Is Magic Johnson a
gooder bad comp for Luca Dante.
Speaker 1 (38:06):
Again, I know Luke is a scorer, Magic was a
distributor that could score.
Speaker 3 (38:11):
I don't feel that's even close.
Speaker 11 (38:13):
There's some good ones coming up.
Speaker 9 (38:14):
Don't worry.
Speaker 4 (38:15):
Is Allan Iverson a good or bad comp for Kyrie Irving.
Speaker 1 (38:18):
I think there's enough similarities, some off court distractions, laying
for four different teams, like other World League ball talent,
ball skills like could do things we'd never seen before.
I mean some of Iverson's twitchy quickness was crossed up
Jordan and Kyrie for his size, is as good a
finisher as I have ever seen in pro basketball.
Speaker 4 (38:41):
The problem is Iverson took a team to the finals,
Kyrie as the number one couldn't get to playoffs.
Speaker 1 (38:47):
Well, I think the league guy, the league's got a
lot more talent than Houston. Nobody wants to hear that,
but there's way more talent in the NBA than there
was an Iverson's league. I mean, you could have you
could have guards on the floor that couldn't shoot. You
could have three guys on the floor that could shoot.
Speaker 3 (39:03):
Can't do that.
Speaker 4 (39:04):
By the way, we're going to talk about Kyrie Irving's
defense at some point. He's been amazing in these playoffs
of defense. Is Tony Parker a gooder bad comp for
Jalen Grunfeld.
Speaker 1 (39:13):
I think actually yeah, both really hard working, fierce defenders,
guys that may be a little overlooked early in their career,
excellent leaders. The ability to score from the mid range.
Both have really strong mid range games. That's not a
bad comp.
Speaker 3 (39:32):
I don't mind that.
Speaker 4 (39:33):
I like it.
Speaker 1 (39:33):
They both both can move, both have speed and excellent
finish players.
Speaker 11 (39:39):
Yeah, it's Dwayne Wade a good or bad.
Speaker 4 (39:40):
Comp for Donovan Mitchell.
Speaker 3 (39:42):
I think it's a bad comp.
Speaker 1 (39:43):
I think Mitchell is a better outside three ball, perimeter shooter.
D Wade's game was so unique, like I never thought
he had a great shooting touch, but he scored at
the rim. D Wade played bigger than any six to
four guy in league history. He played huge. Donovan Mitchell
(40:03):
is more your prototypical get me the ball. I can
work from the perimeter and score, and he's a great
shooter when he's hot.
Speaker 4 (40:09):
Is Chris Bosh a gooder bad comp for Chet home Grip?
Speaker 1 (40:13):
Yeah, they're stretch bigs can hit the three. I mean
it's funny. They're both you to sort of finesse talented
finesse Bigs. That may have been a bad rep years ago.
But Chris Bosh is a guy that if he broke
into the league today arguably would be more appreciated. He
was kind of unique at the time. It was like,
(40:34):
you know, now it's all center faces the basket. Bosh
could do that years ago. So I think if Bosh
came into the league today, he would be more appreciated.
Speaker 4 (40:44):
And you got to get bonus points for the comparing
a black player to a white player, which is not
seen enough. That's a great job. I did not see
them when coming down. Finally, is Jason Kidd a gooder
bad comp for Tyrese Halliburton.
Speaker 1 (40:55):
I don't think it's a great comp So Jason couldn't
shoot a three until the end of his career. He
was also Jason Kidd made All Defensive Team eight or
nine times. Halliburton's not that level of defender. Better's early
shooter in his career. I ever tell you I saw
Jason Kidd in high school. I was in Las Vegas
(41:16):
at a high school basketball tournament, which I'm not sure
it still exists. I'm sure it does. It was a
huge high school tournament and it was the best players.
I remember a kid from New York City, Felipe Lopez,
who never ended up went to Saint John's, who was never.
Speaker 4 (41:30):
Didn't pan out, he was in the NBA.
Speaker 1 (41:33):
But I remember Jason Kidd was there and he was
a talk of the tournament, and.
Speaker 3 (41:37):
He was such a different player.
Speaker 1 (41:38):
Usually with young guards, you talk about their scoring, and
he was all about the passing and playmaking. And so
I can remember where I was sitting Jason Kidd made
a full court bounce pass or a three quarter court
bounce pass, and all the college coaches in the crowd
was ooh, in aw. But I can remember Jason Kidden
(41:58):
high school. I've been around Las Vegas.
Speaker 4 (42:01):
His nickname was Asen Kid because he didn't have a jumper.
No Jay, No, that's kind of hard to develop one. Yeah,
late in his career, by the way, a lot of guys,
a lot of guys do. He was like a Magic
Johnson type player. That's that's totally dominating. That was his
comp It was a smaller Magic Johnson's not a great shooter,
but he's a man. If you remember, Magic had like
a set show he did. Kid is like a top
(42:21):
eight point guard in the history of the basketball. That's
how good he was.
Speaker 3 (42:25):
Higher than that.
Speaker 1 (42:26):
If Magic's won, you could start arguing Jason Kidd by two,
Steph Steph Curry too, Okay, then Isaiah Thomas kid Well.
Speaker 4 (42:35):
Kids in the four or five range. I mean, listen,
Steve Nash want two MVP awards. We could say what
we want, Nash one two MVPs. He's got to be
in the discussion. I had a kid.
Speaker 3 (42:45):
Nash I think was a They're both great, Yeah, different,
both great.
Speaker 11 (42:51):
I mean, it's like, I don't know if I want
to make a call here.
Speaker 1 (42:54):
Nash is really all time best player in the league
for two years. Yeah, he was a player on a
couple of different teams.
Speaker 4 (43:01):
Yeah,
Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to
catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio in
noon to three eastern nine am to noon Pacific. Find
your local station for The Herd at Fox Sports Radio
dot com, or stream us live every day on the
iHeartRadio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 3 (00:28):
All right, our number three, you know, Jmack.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
I moved all weekend, and I gotta tell you when
you're moving to a nice, nice little place, a little
nicer put in a good move. I didn't have to
do any barbells throw around. I just moved boxes all weekend.
It's I slept like a baby last night, felt great.
Got a little better view just around the corner. Put
me in a better mood.
Speaker 4 (00:51):
I know where you're at. I dropped you off last week.
I'm gonna keep mentioning. That's to say you remember it,
so I will remember the sederlate generosity, the general in
our relationship. I shaid, say you mentioned sleep, Colin. You
know I dumped Starbucks. I'm not doing coffee anymoight.
Speaker 3 (01:06):
That's right.
Speaker 4 (01:06):
Weeks and I noticed my sleep has been incredible, and
I guess all the sugar that they pumped into my drinking.
Speaker 1 (01:13):
But you don't have coffee. You have one of these
mocha something frappuccino things. We're not gonna yeah, but you can.
That's that's not even your ear off the reservation. Well
that stuff, that stuff's not even Yeah, should put a
Surgeon General warning on some of that stuff.
Speaker 4 (01:27):
But it's getting close to summer, you know, tank top time,
So I got to cut down on the sugar. Hit
the weights hard. It's a big lifting week, huge men's
league game Thursday. I'm back, baby, I can't wait.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
Well, I appreciate the updates. Well we all thought, well
I did. I thought Denver was cooked. You watched those
first two games in Denver. They got smoked. Series was over.
But it's amazing what three days off in between games
last week can do.
Speaker 3 (01:51):
Big boost for the Nuggets.
Speaker 1 (01:54):
Minnesota this year was a great defensive team, top of
the leak, great defensive team, and in the first two
games in Denver, Nuggets lethargic were not ready for the
physicality and the intensity and the relentlessness of the Tea Wolves.
The underdogs came in, threw a big punch and knocked
Denver down. But then they got three days off, full days,
(02:18):
and they heard for three days from guys like us,
people like us, how bad they are, They're cooked, they're terrible,
and that stuff you always find out later.
Speaker 5 (02:27):
You know.
Speaker 1 (02:27):
Coaches, you know, they edded up clips and they show
the team in a reel over and over and over.
Denver rebooted. They're the more talented offensive team, much more
offensive skill. You know, between Joker and Gordon and Porter
and Murray, all those guys could drop thirty on any night.
They rebooted and they turned a defensive series into a
(02:48):
who's more skilled series, dusted themselves off, went to the corner,
got a little advice, and the series now looks like
a mismatch. It went from defensive of intensity in the
first two games to offensive skill and outside of Ant,
Minnesota really can't match up. They were not a great
offensive team this year. Ant has become a great offensive player.
(03:12):
Karl Anthony Towns terrible yesterday, has been hit and missing
his career though he's very gifted. But there was nothing
inherently wrong with Denver when they were down two, it
just looked like they weren't ready to play and couldn't
match up physically, the length of the te wolves, the aggressiveness,
but they had the same coach. It's not an old
roster falling apart. They didn't have any key injuries. They
(03:34):
just weren't quite ready for the series. And again it
shows how valuable coaching is. You go back to that
Warriors Celtics final. After three games, the Warriors look cooked. Okay,
Steve Kerr, heart of a champion fly cross country, a
lot of time together, make some tweaks, and from that
point forward, Warriors going to Boston, win the game, win
(03:57):
the series. It totally flipped the series. So Denver this
year oh and ten when they score under one hundred points,
so they just had to figure out they may not
be as good defensively as Minnesota.
Speaker 3 (04:11):
They had to get the offense right.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
They needed several days off, practice, film work. They're all
in ten when they score under one hundred, so they
had to get the offense cooking. And that's most notably
the joker who has been in the last two games unbelievable.
Gordon goes ten for his first ten yesterday. So we
(04:33):
knew Minnesota is the better team in this series defensively,
but we also knew offensively. Denver's got four offensive players,
all capable, all in their prime. It just didn't look
like they were ready for the wrestling match in the
first two games in Denver. So they got up from
the mat and the coach said, sometimes champions get rattled,
(04:54):
they never quit.
Speaker 6 (04:55):
I think when we were leaving Denver, a lot of people,
I don't think in Denver, but a lot of peop
people were. You know, understanda'll be so sand, a series
is over, and you know to come up here and
even it up on the road. We've played good basketball
and we know that they're going to come out very spirited,
just like Anthony Edwards did tonight.
Speaker 3 (05:13):
We knew he was going to do that.
Speaker 6 (05:14):
Hopefully we can use that momentum of winning too in
a row and you to go back in and try
to go up three to two.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
Really good coaching. We saw it with Steve Kerr and
the Warriors. The defensive team won the wrestling match for
the first two. The last two games in Minnesota did
not even look like the first two games in the series.
The t Wolves, by the way, equally well coached. So
what does it flip back to now that they moved
to Mile High I don't know. My guess is though
(05:42):
throughout the history of the league, defensive led teams can
win a lot of games, but it's an offensive skill league,
and Denver now looks like they're in control. So the
Knicks got pasted. First of all, I mean, they're missing
all sorts of players. But there is something to be
said that hustle is important, toughness, intensity, they really really matter,
(06:04):
and the Knicks have a lot of that. But those
minutes add up, and we kept saying, when's the damn
gonna break? Like how long can you be led by
a dominant ball, dominant point guard who's playing virtually all
the minutes? How long can Josh Hart play with this
much heart and produce double his career averages? Like at
(06:26):
some point, when is it end? And that was yesterday.
That game was never competitive, So listen, I don't even
think Nick fans think they're a great team. They're a
great story and they have a lot of heart, but again,
you need talent and skill. The Eastern Conference is bad.
This is about as bad as it's ever been. And
(06:46):
then you add on the fact that players like Dame
and Yannis were hurt and they scraped and clawed their
way to a couple of wins. But again, when your
scoring comes, almost all of the key points come from
a ball dominant point guard. I've seen it with Damon Portland.
I've seen it with Westbrook teams. I've seen it with
hardened teams. The Warriors were different with Steph. It wasn't
(07:09):
about Steph being ball dominant. That was never the issue.
It was about ball movement, off ball movement. That's where
Steph's a legend, along with his shooting, and so the
Warriors never got into that ball dominant stuff. It was
always about moving the pieces. Draymond Green could have the ball,
he could be the catalyst. So it didn't wear down
(07:30):
Steph Curry. There were other scores. There was Klaye Thompson.
You know, at one point that was a weird thing.
So that was all I would go out away that.
In the last year or two, it's become too much
about staff.
Speaker 3 (07:41):
So I don't know Warriors. I don't know what to
make of them.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
So Brunson was averaging thirty five a game in the playoffs.
Number one used to Drake, you just kept asking how
long it's not being a hater to say, yeah, this
thing doesn't feel like it's sustainable. That's being realistic.
Speaker 3 (07:56):
Now.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
The good news for the Knicks, they're really good news
because this wasn't the case for the last two decades.
They look really well run. They actually have a culture,
like a Miami Heat culture. They have a Villanova culture.
They play hard. They've got to be very careful when
they go to get the next star that they don't
give up too many pieces. Can you keep Og, You'll
(08:17):
keep Brunson, but could you keep Josh Hard. You're gonna
have to give something up to get another high end player.
They'll move off Randall, maybe Mitchell Robinson. Maybe they'll get
different size. But in the end, they look well run.
They've got a culture, and maybe they beat Indianapolis, maybe
they beat the Pacers. But working really hard matters a lot.
(08:40):
You can work as a comedian all day writing jokes.
At some point you have to get on the stage
and be funny. You can work really really hard as
a basketball team. At some point, skill and talent takes over.
And the Knicks don't have a ton of it. But
they're well run, they've got a culture, they fight like hell.
They're fun to watch, they're easy to root for. And
maybe they win the series, but they're six and zero
(09:02):
when they win the rebounding battle and they're all and
four when they don't. So that's a pretty good indication. Resilience, toughness,
working hard is sort of their thing.
Speaker 3 (09:11):
Jalen Brunson. After an ugly.
Speaker 7 (09:12):
Loss, I mean, we can talk about fresh legs, and
we can give us all the pity that we want. Yeah,
we're short handed, but that doesn't matter right now. Be
had what we have and we need to go forward
with that. So there is no there is no we're
short handed. There is no excuse. There's no excuse whatsoever.
(09:33):
Now if we lose, we lose.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
And on the other coast hearing interesting things texts today
on JJ Reddick and the Lakers. Interesting things got to
start somewhere. We want to Duke be in the league broadcast.
I mean Steve Kerr, gool look at Steve Kerr's career player,
very funny, talented broadcaster, front office, legendary coach Jason Kidd.
(10:01):
Didn't he go from playing to coaching first? One didn't
work well? Now it works well. So I mean, JJ
Reddick's not going to go to the G League. Like
in a lot of these guys that have no interest
coaching in college. College basketball and pro basketball don't even
feel like the same sport. College football in the NFL
there's a lot of similarities schemes, coaching staffs, but NBA
(10:22):
in college just don't feel like they're the same thing.
Speaker 3 (10:25):
So where else is JJ Reddick?
Speaker 1 (10:27):
He could go to a bench, but the money he
makes now with all the podcasting and broadcasting, they're not
gonna sit on the bench. You're not going to give
that up. So how do you get JJ Reddick has
to be a head coach? He has options, He's got
some leverage, Like he doesn't need the job. The Lakers
need a coach? Like, are you going to bring in
another Darvin Ham? You say to yourself, well, what's his experience?
What was Darvin Ham's experience? So I mean to me,
(10:50):
you had a coach that won a title, Vogel, and
they got tired of that, right they went it title?
Speaker 3 (10:56):
It got tired of.
Speaker 1 (10:56):
That, So let's bring in the new guy, not the
old guy. I think got tired of that. Maybe it's
a fresh set of eyes and a friend of Lebron
and somebody's doing a podcast with But we're hearing stuff.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and Noone Easter non a Empacific on Fox Sports Radio
FS one and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 8 (11:16):
Hey, it's Ben, host of The Fifth Hour with Ben Maller.
Would mean a lot to have you join us on
our weekly auditory journey. You're asking what in God's name
is the Fifth Hour? I'll tell you it's a spin
off of it Ben Mather Show A could hit overnights
on FSR.
Speaker 3 (11:30):
Why should you listen?
Speaker 8 (11:32):
Picture if you will a world will we chat with
captains of industry in media, sports and more every week
explore some amazing facts about human nature and more.
Speaker 3 (11:40):
Listen to The Fifth Hour with Ben.
Speaker 8 (11:42):
Matherer on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast or wherever you
get your podcasts.
Speaker 3 (11:45):
A lot of things going on.
Speaker 1 (11:46):
First things first, after our show, let's check out Chris
Brussard Brew joining us.
Speaker 4 (11:54):
Live Boy.
Speaker 1 (11:56):
Nick's going to be on one today. He's gotten all
fired up on that today. One of the things that
Nick right and I sort of agree with. I'm more
pro Celtics than he is. Maybe I'm more anti Tatum
than he is. But you start looking around and generally
Brew you can identify very early kind of the next
(12:19):
face of the league or a different level superstar. Even
though Jordan wasn't winning, he was working everybody. The practices,
that the ferocity, that the points production, and I look
at Wemby, and I look at Jokic, and I look
at Ant and I feel like there's more excitement about
Ant already than there is about Tatum. And I said
(12:39):
this the other day to somebody, I said, there's a
certain mentality with Tatum. I don't know, it doesn't feel
like a Kobe or an Ant or an MJ. It
just doesn't feel like even a Dwayne Wade. Where are
you now on top?
Speaker 3 (12:54):
Yeah?
Speaker 9 (12:55):
Yeah, it's interesting what you say it, because it's he.
I you know, his idol was Kobe Bryant.
Speaker 10 (13:02):
He mimicked a lot of Kobe's game, but he doesn't
have that kind of killer.
Speaker 9 (13:09):
Instinct that seems at Kobe.
Speaker 10 (13:10):
I don't want to say he's not a competitor, because
he certainly is, and he's had some huge playoff moments,
you know, with their backs against the wall for the Celtics,
but he there's something that seems to be lacking.
Speaker 9 (13:25):
And I think that I.
Speaker 10 (13:27):
Would put him even though I look, he was on
my first team All NBA, he was on my MVP ballot,
he was fourth on my MVP ballot. But I think
he is a tier a notch below the absolute superstars
of MBI, Jannie Jokic and now Anthony Edwards.
Speaker 9 (13:49):
You're absolutely right. There is more buzz.
Speaker 10 (13:52):
And excitement about Edwards, and it's kind of like you
just know it when you see it, Colin, Like you said,
Jordan was getting bounced in the first round of the playoffs,
but everybody knew.
Speaker 9 (14:01):
He was a superstar.
Speaker 10 (14:02):
He had sneakers, he had commercials at that point, and
it's similar with Anthony Edwards. Maybe Tatum can change it
if they somehow got over the hump and won it
this year. I don't see them doing that, but yeah,
Edwards has surpassed and let's face it, before the off
the court problems, John Morant had passed Jason Tatum as
(14:27):
a young, you know, kind of up and coming face
of the league.
Speaker 1 (14:30):
So you're close to the Knicks, and I look at
the Knicks and yesterday was kind of inevitable. They're all
banged up, they're very I mean, Josh Hart was giving
you double his career numbers, so I don't know what
transpires rest of the way. Starting tomorrow in New York,
the crowd will be backed, it'll be fun, and they
get Game.
Speaker 3 (14:47):
Seven at home.
Speaker 1 (14:49):
But it's gonna be interesting to me because I don't
think they're a championship team. But I do think for
the last two to three years they've been very patient
and well run. I hear a story today Kevin Durant
didn't even talk to Vogel. That was the story out here.
They didn't get along. And I think to myself, I
don't know, maybe this is the same question, but if
(15:10):
they had to make a move in New York.
Speaker 3 (15:12):
Is it seismic is it subtle?
Speaker 1 (15:15):
Because clearly the culture Brunson, the toughness, that's all there.
Speaker 3 (15:22):
They got to get another guy. Where do you think
they go?
Speaker 10 (15:28):
Yeah, they absolutely need to get another guy. And the
danger for the Knicks, Colin is thinking that they've arrived.
I Atlanta made it to the Conference finals a few
years ago behind their young hot shot point guard Trey Young, right, who,
let's face it, has had a better career than Jalen
Brunson's to this point. And we see that the Hawks
aren't anywhere near championship contention, so you can't.
Speaker 9 (15:52):
You know, Portland a few years ago was in the.
Speaker 10 (15:55):
East Western Conference finals, but wasn't really close to being
a championship team.
Speaker 9 (16:00):
And that's where the Knicks are.
Speaker 10 (16:01):
So they better be careful not to rest on their laurels.
Speaker 9 (16:05):
They're only going.
Speaker 10 (16:07):
To have a legitimate chance to get into the conference
finals because Milwaukee and Philadelphia are so We're so banged
up and injured, and their stars were injured, so they
need to make a big move.
Speaker 9 (16:20):
I wouldn't move.
Speaker 10 (16:21):
I wouldn't be careless, but I also wouldn't be overly cautious, because.
Speaker 9 (16:26):
You can build and build and build and.
Speaker 10 (16:29):
Be careful and well we saving for the future and
never get there. Okay, New York is starving for a championship.
It's been fifty one years, Colin, and outside of the
Patrick Ewing era, there have been very few years where
they actually have really been like a legitimate contender. I
(16:49):
covered them the last time they went to the finals
in nineteen ninety nine with Latrelle's pretty well Alan Houston.
They weren't really one of the ultra elite teams in
the league.
Speaker 9 (17:01):
They had a great run through the.
Speaker 10 (17:02):
East that year and got to the finals, but they
never came close, really that close again. And so the
Knicks thing, I think they should go for something big
if it's out there.
Speaker 9 (17:13):
And you mentioned Kevin Durant.
Speaker 10 (17:15):
Look, Phoenix doesn't want to trade him, but where's Phoenix going.
Speaker 9 (17:19):
This is championship or bus for.
Speaker 10 (17:21):
The Suns, all right, Let's not lower the expectations now
that it's obvious they're not getting to a championship. With
Kevin Durant, Devin Booker and Bradley Beial, it is championship
or bust. And if I were them, I would be
open to trading Durant, seeing what I could get for him,
what type of draft picks, what type of young players
(17:44):
to fit around Devin Booker, and I would start building
around Booker because they're not gonna win a championship as
currently constructed, So why are you even keeping Durant unless
you just want to sell tickets and be a show
and be relevant. But I would if I'm the Knicks,
I look for some big But outside of a Durant move,
I mean, Paul George, you know, there are other things
(18:05):
they can try, but I think a.
Speaker 9 (18:08):
Durant move is what I would go for I.
Speaker 10 (18:10):
Know it's a long shot, but that would be right
at the top of my list.
Speaker 1 (18:13):
So Denver Minnesota interesting series, very physical. It was a
defensive series for the first two games, has now pivoted
to more of an offensive skills series that plays right
into Denver's wheelhouse. I mean again, Gordon yesterday takes he
was the best player they had. Murray can give you thirty,
Jokich takes over a games, Porter gets hot, hitting threes.
(18:34):
All of these guys can take over a half of
a game offensively, even though Gordon's viewed more as a
defensive player.
Speaker 3 (18:41):
But it is interesting.
Speaker 1 (18:43):
One of my takeaways of this series now that Denver
feels like it's too too but it has control is
Karl Anthony Towns was a no show yesterday, and I'm like,
eventually Jordan had to get a Pippin' Kobe had to
get like a shack or a Gasol. And this team
feels very lobsided, ant scores and you cross your fingers
(19:05):
on Carl Anthony Towns and that's just not good. That's
not getting through Denver. That may not getting through a Boston.
So when I look at Minnesota currently constructed, I love
the roster.
Speaker 3 (19:15):
But I do.
Speaker 1 (19:16):
Wonder because you've been watching this for a long time,
Karl Anthony Towns has always had the same reputation. Super talented,
little emotional, could get hot and cold, you can't depend
on him, but wildly talented.
Speaker 3 (19:30):
I kind of feel like watching.
Speaker 1 (19:31):
Him yesterday, I'm like, I can see them just saying,
but we got to get more consistency, a more consistent personality.
We got to get ant his pippin Or am I hyperbolic?
Do you think they just bring this crew back?
Speaker 10 (19:48):
Well, look, let's see what happens over these next few games.
Obviously Denver is in control now I pig Minnesota in seven.
I'm sticking with the Tea Wolves. This is what happens
in a seven game, right. There's times you think this
team's gonna win it. Times you think that team's gonna
win it. But let's see what happens over these next
few games. But I have to admit objectively, Denver now
(20:10):
is in control. They have home court advantage, they've stolen
the momentum, all of that.
Speaker 9 (20:15):
But there are two key players in this series. I
see Kyle.
Speaker 10 (20:19):
Everybody obviously Jokic and Edwards mean a ton, right, but
for the most part, you know you're going to get.
Speaker 9 (20:25):
Top notch performances from those two. Aaron Gordon is big
because you said he's hitting threes. Last two games, he's
five to six from three, and.
Speaker 10 (20:34):
What that does is that that it takes away from
Gobart's ability to protect the rim when kat Or nas
Reed is guarding Jokic and so it draws him away
from the basket. So that's been huge. Let's see if
Gordon can keep that up. But the two keys Jamal
Murray for the Nuggets, right, he struggled in the first
(20:55):
two games.
Speaker 9 (20:56):
I gotta give him credit.
Speaker 10 (20:57):
He was facing controversy as he should have been, and
he was, you know, had played poorly in the first
two games, not to mention the CAF injury. Comes out
in games three and four and it's terrific, and they
played good defense on him a lot of times, and
he just hit that turnaround, fade away mid range jumper
all night.
Speaker 9 (21:17):
Shot it well from three as well. He's huge.
Speaker 10 (21:20):
Can he keep this up or does he go back
to kind of struggling the way he has throughout.
Speaker 9 (21:25):
Most of the playoffs.
Speaker 10 (21:27):
If that happens, they're gonna have a tough time winning.
On the other side, his cat As you said, he
averaged twenty three points a game, shot about sixty four
percent from the floor in the first two games, no
shows in the next two, and game three only took
seven shots. So you are absolutely right about his lack
of consistency. But he let's see what he does. He
(21:49):
is ultra talented. He's a good two. Remember, he accepts
being like he's accepted that Edwards is the guy, which
is there's a that's a value there. But yeah, if
I could get something much better for him, I'd be
open to it if they lose this series.
Speaker 9 (22:06):
But I'm not shopping him. I'm like, oh, I gotta
get rid of him.
Speaker 10 (22:10):
I might need to find maybe a more consistent number
three because after those two, who's definitely giving me buckets
on that team? And go Beart struggles around the rim
unfortunately for.
Speaker 3 (22:22):
The Wolves now that that's actually a good place.
Speaker 1 (22:25):
But it's funny, like I've liked Carl Anthony Towns forever,
but he also disappears since he got into the league.
He has these stretches, and I do feel like Pippin
was limited offensively, but I got the exact same performance
from him. Virtually every night. So to me, that inconsistency
with Carl Anthony Towns would drive me nuts. But to
your point, he does accept being a two and not
(22:48):
every great player that gets bucking tippin' in.
Speaker 9 (22:51):
That's the key.
Speaker 1 (22:54):
Yeah, good seeing you Brew? Alright, yeah yeah, it's what
would you do if you ran it? Because the construction
of them is wereal to good. A big that defense,
a big that scores, Aunt the star, Mike Conley, guy
off the bench, high energy wing defense, like the construct
of Minnesota is great. But could you say, okay, instead
(23:14):
of Aunt, let's get another long offensive player that's more
consistent because he's no showed.
Speaker 4 (23:22):
Is a great topic I touched on on my podcast.
I wonder if Karl Anthony Towns has shades of Kevin Love.
Remember Kevin Love in Minnesota was the number one. They
didn't win any games, no playoffs, put up like twenty
five and fifteen. Okay, Kevin Love not a number one,
not really a two. He was a great three. He
Lebron and Kyrie Irving.
Speaker 1 (23:42):
See I would argue that he and Bosh are ones,
but smart enough to acknowledge. I mean, Bosh was doing
twenty five a night in Toronto AND's like, hey, I.
Speaker 3 (23:52):
Want to win titles.
Speaker 1 (23:53):
I don't want to lose in the first roelaf So
Chris is like, I'll be a three. Kevin Love was
like a rebounding terror in Kevin's like, all be a three.
I think they're ones, but very few guys. You can
get a guy occasionally to go to a two Anthony
Davis with Lebron in the history of the league. To
ask a one to go to a three, you have
(24:13):
to have guaranteed title.
Speaker 11 (24:14):
But it shows that you're smart and willing to understand.
Speaker 1 (24:18):
Chris Bosh Kevin Love. Yeah, I mean Chris Bosh Kevin Love.
They were going to end up Hall of Fame first
ballot stat guys. But both were like win games.
Speaker 9 (24:27):
Okay.
Speaker 4 (24:27):
Andrew Wiggins in Minnesota, what was he He was no, no, no,
he was a number one overall pick.
Speaker 1 (24:31):
Yeah, but he was a dissip. Kevin Love was never
a disappointment. He was a he was a monster. But
there were later thirty eight games. I don't think they
ever got to the playoffs in Love, well, I mean
a D is a one talent wise, probably personality more
tree round. Kevin Love in his prime was better than
Wiggins and his prime not even close. I mean Kevin
wasn't Kevin Love averaging twenty five and eleven? I think
(24:54):
he's twenty five and like fourteen. Yeah, I mean so
the Wiggins first year in the league, where were like
he should be better.
Speaker 3 (25:00):
Kevin Love was like star.
Speaker 1 (25:02):
But if he was your one, Kevin identified, hey, we're
not gonna win championships.
Speaker 3 (25:07):
I'm probably best served with a superstar.
Speaker 4 (25:09):
Okay, so what it could? Could Karl Anthony Towns be
a two UNO title winner or a three under title winner,
which is better?
Speaker 1 (25:14):
Probably a three. He's probably a three. Now again we've
said this Clay Thompson. When you when he in his prime,
when he was your third, that's an all time team.
Well wait, who was the two? Well it was Stephen Durant.
Speaker 4 (25:28):
Oh, Stephan Durrat.
Speaker 3 (25:28):
Okay, when they I mean you could win with him
as your two.
Speaker 1 (25:31):
But when he was the three, that's when you have
to decide, is this the best team of all times?
Speaker 4 (25:36):
Came over? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (25:37):
I mean when when if you go back to Jordan,
the one, pipp and the two, you know, when you've
got coup coach the best euro at the time is
averaging eighteen nineteen, he's your third scoring option. It's like, Okay,
then I got Kerr over here, and then I've got
Ron Harper was literally like the fifth sco Okay, that's
that's your best. Ron Harper was a twenty fourth.
Speaker 11 (25:58):
Dennis Rodman was I think on that.
Speaker 1 (25:59):
Yeah, But I mean if Karl Anthony Towns is your three,
that's a great team.
Speaker 3 (26:05):
That's the best year be a three.
Speaker 1 (26:07):
I mean think right now, Michael Porter, like on certain nights,
is they're four in Denver? Yeah, Okay, that's that's like
when Manu Ginobili was you're off the bench for San Antonio.
Speaker 3 (26:20):
Okay, now you're talking an all time team.
Speaker 4 (26:22):
I'm pretty sure Michael Porter was two of four shooting
last night and they smoked Minnesota for the record.
Speaker 1 (26:28):
Michael Porter stepped back. Gordon was on fire, Yoki. Michael
Porter understood. It's like, hey, this is not my night.
Gordon was on fire. When Gordon scores, they're virtually unbeatable.
Speaker 4 (26:38):
Listen. I don't know how you make it happen, but
Minnesota somehow getting Towns to Phoenix, where Towns could be
the three behind Booker and Durant is what do they
get well, that's the problem. It's tough to move Beal.
I wouldn't want Durant with Ant. I just let let's
let Anne. They went at it in the playoffs, so
I know a lot of people want to say that's
a perfect.
Speaker 3 (26:57):
Fit for Kevin Durant.
Speaker 4 (26:59):
Losing to the Warrior. Is the going to the Warriors,
losing to Aunt then going to Minnesota.
Speaker 3 (27:04):
Jamy Mack with a news.
Speaker 4 (27:07):
No, no turn on the news, This is the herd
line news. That's sort with Sean Payton, year two with
the Denver Broncos brought this up. Yeah, they kick off
rookie mini camp with their new quarterback bo Next he's
alread impressing. Sean Payton, who had this to say about
the twelfth overall pick.
Speaker 3 (27:24):
It's almost like watching a good golfer.
Speaker 5 (27:26):
You know. Sometimes when you watch his game, there's a
patience to how he plays the ball comes out and
I don't want to use the term boring, that's that's
not the right term. But yeah, got pretty good decisions
and with each play, the efficiency and how he's operating
all of that. The only thing I can think about
that I was a little bit surprised is when we
(27:47):
went to work him out privately and stood around him.
He was bigger than I expected, you know, but nothing
in the last two days he's doing well.
Speaker 3 (27:58):
Yeah, I think he fits.
Speaker 11 (28:00):
Did you see their over undertow title like the lowest
in the leader.
Speaker 1 (28:03):
I didn't get it. So again, this was one that
I did not. I would bet the over, but it
was so low. At five and a half, Vegas is hedging.
They're basically saying we don't think bo Nicks can play,
and I don't get it. He had sixty one college starts.
I watched him a ton. I watched them as a
freshman at Auburn beat Justin Herbert and Oregon a good
Oregon team.
Speaker 3 (28:24):
I don't you know.
Speaker 1 (28:24):
Again, this is this is the difference between college and pro.
I watch him and his ceiling may be lower, But
I think week one you will look at bow Nicks
with Peyton system and go, oh, that's a franchise quarterback.
Speaker 4 (28:36):
No, maybe if they play the Raiders. But I think
the problem here is when you, like you said, you
see five and a half and you're like, what am
I missing.
Speaker 1 (28:43):
And you need to then go back and go their
The defense was terrible and they didn't have enough draft
picks to totally supplant what they had. Their linebackers are
pretty active. They needed an edge rush they didn't last year.
They have one great corner, so they won't be great defensively,
but I do think offensively they'll be a really nice
football team.
Speaker 11 (29:04):
It's five and a half. Stuff to vision is brutal.
Speaker 4 (29:06):
We know the Charges are gonna be better. We know
the Chiefs are gonna be very good. I'm looking at
Pro Football Focus. You call up to the Denver Broncos
lineup and you're like, there's not a lot of talent
at all.
Speaker 1 (29:15):
On Well, Courtland Sutton mimes, Sean Payton's brain, good left tackle, Actually, their.
Speaker 3 (29:22):
O lines good. Oh line's good.
Speaker 1 (29:24):
Running back better than serviceable Mims and is very good
at cornerback. Yeah, mems in Courtland Sutton are nice. They
have nice tight ends, they have capable tight ends.
Speaker 4 (29:32):
I don't a lot of nice.
Speaker 1 (29:34):
Well again, I know the AFC's harder. I just don't
buy this is a five and twelve team.
Speaker 4 (29:41):
Yeah, that's like you want to set your friend up
with a girl. Oh she hot, she's nice. No, I'm
not that interesting. You just said a lot of nice
to Denver Broncos.
Speaker 3 (29:49):
Your wife's nice. What's wrong? And she's super nice? Okay?
Well no, I mean she's super.
Speaker 11 (29:54):
Nice for them being set up on like a blind dab.
Speaker 1 (29:56):
Well, you you're knocking nice. If I stay an NFL
team nice, that's not a five win team. Five win
team in the NFL is a tire fire. The Denver,
I mean, what matters in the NFL O line as
a unit O line. There's his top ten. It was
rage seven head coach. Well, you're top five there, okay.
So if bo Nicks is as Sean says, he just
(30:21):
runs it like a golf throw. I have two receivers.
I like a tight end that's capable. To me, it's
a pass rush. They have to figure out a way
to generate.
Speaker 3 (30:30):
A pass rush.
Speaker 1 (30:30):
But five and twelve, five and twelve are teams that
aren't even fun to watch on television. I think you're
down playing nice.
Speaker 3 (30:40):
Nice is nice? How's that car?
Speaker 1 (30:42):
So?
Speaker 11 (30:44):
Where's nice? In terms of solid.
Speaker 1 (30:47):
Nice is eight to nine wins? And I think Denver
is now, Okay, bet the.
Speaker 4 (30:50):
Over, then go ahead, you're gonna burn lights some money
on fire, go for it. Eight to nine. I mean
I need some more work on this team before. I
totally hammer them. We like Peyton, but yeah, I'm not
I'm not seeing it yet. Next story over the NBA
the Hawks, How about this colin I know, I don't
don't know what the NBA was doing putting the draft
lottery on Mother's Day. I totally miss this, But the
Hawks had the tenth best odds for the top pick
(31:13):
and won the draft lottery for the first time in
franchise history, which is weird.
Speaker 3 (31:18):
All these years in the league and it's the first
time they won first time ever.
Speaker 11 (31:21):
The Wizard, Rockets, and Spurs round out the top four
with the Pistons. This is brutal.
Speaker 3 (31:25):
Second year in a row.
Speaker 11 (31:26):
The Pistons had the worst record and they.
Speaker 1 (31:28):
Have draft isn't very good great, So having the fifth
pick is not a huge gap from having the first
or second.
Speaker 3 (31:34):
Well, there's no Wemby here, Lebron.
Speaker 4 (31:37):
Remember the Honest Draft, it was like, oh.
Speaker 3 (31:39):
Well he was thirteenth, wasn't he?
Speaker 7 (31:40):
It was?
Speaker 4 (31:40):
It was considered a weak draft.
Speaker 11 (31:42):
Yeah, but is the all time player already?
Speaker 1 (31:44):
If you go to the Honest Draft, the best players
were in the teams. So yeah, the kid Alex Saar
is supposed to be the one that's the one I
keep seeing video of.
Speaker 11 (31:52):
Yeah, he's he's very good.
Speaker 1 (31:53):
I like, no, no, no, I keep seeing I keep seeing
the second one, the second French kid.
Speaker 4 (31:57):
Yeah, we're not going to try to pronounce his name.
He's a The french Men are taken over Wemby. And
now these two.
Speaker 11 (32:01):
I'll just say this, Rob Dillingham.
Speaker 4 (32:03):
We've seen the history of Kentucky players under Kyla PARTI
kind of held back, Jamal Murray, held back, Devin Booker,
held back at Kentucky. They weren't superstars. They come to
the league in pop I would say, keep an eye
on Dillingham from Kentucky. He is explosive and nice and
he just couldn't really get going.
Speaker 11 (32:18):
Here's the interesting thing, Collin, the.
Speaker 4 (32:20):
Team with the worst record the last six years has
not gotten the number one pick.
Speaker 1 (32:25):
Well, that's why the system works. That's what they tried
to prevent tanking and getting it. So the system the
NBA created is working perfectly.
Speaker 3 (32:36):
So don't tank.
Speaker 1 (32:37):
It doesn't guarantee squad and in a bad draft, by
the seventh pick, you could be out of dudes.
Speaker 4 (32:43):
So the league has done two big things recently. We
don't want tanking. We want to outlaw that because you're
not going to be benefited when it comes draft lottery.
And number two is the load management. They're pushing back
against it. You saw that. This is all has to
do with the TV deals coming up, right, They're trying
to clean it up.
Speaker 11 (32:57):
We're not a tanking league. I'm pro tanking, Colin.
Speaker 4 (33:01):
I don't know about you. I think tanking is smart.
NBA is doing something to kind of. But if you're
in the NFL and you are headed toward a top
pick and you see Shadore Sanders and the kid Beck
from a wellking.
Speaker 3 (33:13):
To get more ping pong balls, I want to get
more ping pong.
Speaker 4 (33:16):
Balls if I can get the top pick. I want
to tank and get the top pick. But it's not
working in the NBA.
Speaker 3 (33:21):
Now, I didn't watch this, did you want? You didn't
watch it was doing Mother's Days. I had no idea.
It was on the internet.
Speaker 4 (33:26):
I don't know what NBA was thinking.
Speaker 3 (33:27):
This or did they even do ping pong balls anymore?
Speaker 4 (33:30):
They did?
Speaker 3 (33:30):
They did okay finals what they did the last time
I watched it.
Speaker 11 (33:33):
Yeah. Final story Lebron's son, Bronnie James.
Speaker 4 (33:37):
A lot of speculation while he stay in college or
head to the pro pros. Will Sham's reports that Bronni
has been medically clear to play in the NBA and
is expected to stay in the draft. He's going to
take part in the Combines five on five scrimmages beginning Tuesday.
I'm kind of excited for these, and as until May
twenty ninth to officially decide whether to stay in the
draft or return to school. Lakers hold on to their
(34:01):
seventeenth pick and the fifty fifth pick. Can't imagine they'd
go Bronni at seventeen, but fifty five is interesting. Now
here's the official height and weight measure I'm sorry, height
measurement for Bronnie at the Combine six foot one and
a half inches, So he's not six four as they
were trying to say he was a USC.
Speaker 3 (34:22):
Well, you can't play six one. He can only play point.
That's it. You better learn to handle the ball.
Speaker 1 (34:29):
A little late to start. I mean, everybody talks about
him as a two.
Speaker 11 (34:33):
He does have a good wing span for a six
to one guy six seven and a quarter.
Speaker 3 (34:36):
But that's you can't be You're not an off guard.
Speaker 4 (34:38):
He can be that. Patrick Beverley without the crazy, really
good defender, hit a three, hit some shots, energy guy
off the bench. He's not even Alex Caruso size six
one and a half. It's not a huge, it's not big.
So shooting guard is a tough sell. But you know
what he's gonna be the NBA. It's a good athlete
and he's lebron soon.
Speaker 1 (34:58):
So I mean, listen, in my lifetime, I have seen
all through the coaching ranks, you know, father sons like
it's it's I'm okay with it. I know it gets
So it says USC has Brawny listed it's six to
four on their website. And so you're telling me what
(35:19):
that measurement was.
Speaker 3 (35:20):
Yours was what.
Speaker 4 (35:22):
Six one and a half. So you know these colleges
all embellish. I mean he's not six four six one
and a half at the combine he was measured official.
Speaker 3 (35:31):
Jmack with the News.
Speaker 2 (35:32):
Well that's the news, and thanks for stopping by the
herd line news.
Speaker 3 (35:38):
He is athletic though, right we acknowledge that. Oh, hyper athletic.
Speaker 4 (35:41):
I mean he's a run and jump guy, catch ally ups,
come off the bench and be like an energy guy.
Speaker 1 (35:48):
Yeah, it's it's it's okay. Energy smart, you makes a
lot of money. Hit threes that fits on them.
Speaker 4 (35:55):
Okay. Mario Chalmers is not like a huge guy. He
was like a starting point guard for the Heat when
they want the with the heatles.
Speaker 1 (36:01):
Yeah, and he drove Lebron crazy brawny, won't drive Cray.
Speaker 2 (36:06):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and noon Easter not a Empacific.
Speaker 1 (36:11):
Good comp, bad comp comp? Good comp, bad comp. You
give me the player in the comp, J mckin, I'll
tell you as everybody's comparent aunt to MJ earlier today,
jokic Bird. Paul Pierce said, that's what they are. Good comp,
bad comp. Here we go, Now this is good.
Speaker 4 (36:30):
I don't I honestly don't know who came up with these,
but these are good. Is Michael Jordan a good or
bad comp for Anthony Enter?
Speaker 3 (36:35):
Same size?
Speaker 1 (36:36):
I mean aunts a little thicker MJ little taller, good
mid range games, very fast start to their career, clearly
right out of the gate. They play with an aggressiveness,
a vertical explosion that nobody else, no league does.
Speaker 4 (36:52):
Okay. Is Paul Pierce a good or bad comp for
Jason Tatum.
Speaker 3 (36:57):
A bad comp.
Speaker 1 (36:58):
I think Paul did didn't have playoff success until later
in his career. I think he's a much more aggressive player.
Tatum's probably viewed as a better defensive player, I think,
But I think Paul just had a different mentality and
a different little more dog So I don't think it's
a great.
Speaker 4 (37:15):
Comp's Larry Bird a gooder bad comfort Nikola Yoki?
Speaker 1 (37:20):
Yes, they played at their own speed, brilliant passers, great shooters,
uniquely great passers and shooters for their size and their era,
not always aesthetically beautiful, but really clever, and the ability
for their position to be the best shooter kind of
in that, I mean that was the best shooting forward
(37:42):
I'd ever seen. With Larry Bird, Jokis is the best
perimeter shooting big I've ever seen.
Speaker 4 (37:48):
Yeah, I don't hate that. I hadn't really thought I
was thinking more a big guy, But I don't hate that.
Speaker 11 (37:52):
Is Steve Nash a gooder bad comfort comfort.
Speaker 3 (37:55):
Jamal Murray Bad.
Speaker 1 (37:57):
Nash could score, but was a great distributor. Murray's a
shooting guard, not even.
Speaker 4 (38:02):
Claying, not a good one. Guys. Is Magic Johnson a
gooder bad comp for Luca Dante.
Speaker 1 (38:06):
Again, I know Luke is a scorer, Magic was a
distributor that could score.
Speaker 3 (38:11):
I don't feel that's even close.
Speaker 11 (38:13):
There's some good ones coming up.
Speaker 9 (38:14):
Don't worry.
Speaker 4 (38:15):
Is Allan Iverson a good or bad comp for Kyrie Irving.
Speaker 1 (38:18):
I think there's enough similarities, some off court distractions, laying
for four different teams, like other World League ball talent,
ball skills like could do things we'd never seen before.
I mean some of Iverson's twitchy quickness was crossed up
Jordan and Kyrie for his size, is as good a
finisher as I have ever seen in pro basketball.
Speaker 4 (38:41):
The problem is Iverson took a team to the finals,
Kyrie as the number one couldn't get to playoffs.
Speaker 1 (38:47):
Well, I think the league guy, the league's got a
lot more talent than Houston. Nobody wants to hear that,
but there's way more talent in the NBA than there
was an Iverson's league. I mean, you could have you
could have guards on the floor that couldn't shoot. You
could have three guys on the floor that could shoot.
Speaker 3 (39:03):
Can't do that.
Speaker 4 (39:04):
By the way, we're going to talk about Kyrie Irving's
defense at some point. He's been amazing in these playoffs
of defense. Is Tony Parker a gooder bad comp for
Jalen Grunfeld.
Speaker 1 (39:13):
I think actually yeah, both really hard working, fierce defenders,
guys that may be a little overlooked early in their career,
excellent leaders. The ability to score from the mid range.
Both have really strong mid range games. That's not a
bad comp.
Speaker 3 (39:32):
I don't mind that.
Speaker 4 (39:33):
I like it.
Speaker 1 (39:33):
They both both can move, both have speed and excellent
finish players.
Speaker 11 (39:39):
Yeah, it's Dwayne Wade a good or bad.
Speaker 4 (39:40):
Comp for Donovan Mitchell.
Speaker 3 (39:42):
I think it's a bad comp.
Speaker 1 (39:43):
I think Mitchell is a better outside three ball, perimeter shooter.
D Wade's game was so unique, like I never thought
he had a great shooting touch, but he scored at
the rim. D Wade played bigger than any six to
four guy in league history. He played huge. Donovan Mitchell
(40:03):
is more your prototypical get me the ball. I can
work from the perimeter and score, and he's a great
shooter when he's hot.
Speaker 4 (40:09):
Is Chris Bosh a gooder bad comp for Chet home Grip?
Speaker 1 (40:13):
Yeah, they're stretch bigs can hit the three. I mean
it's funny. They're both you to sort of finesse talented
finesse Bigs. That may have been a bad rep years ago.
But Chris Bosh is a guy that if he broke
into the league today arguably would be more appreciated. He
was kind of unique at the time. It was like,
(40:34):
you know, now it's all center faces the basket. Bosh
could do that years ago. So I think if Bosh
came into the league today, he would be more appreciated.
Speaker 4 (40:44):
And you got to get bonus points for the comparing
a black player to a white player, which is not
seen enough. That's a great job. I did not see
them when coming down. Finally, is Jason Kidd a gooder
bad comp for Tyrese Halliburton.
Speaker 1 (40:55):
I don't think it's a great comp So Jason couldn't
shoot a three until the end of his career. He
was also Jason Kidd made All Defensive Team eight or
nine times. Halliburton's not that level of defender. Better's early
shooter in his career. I ever tell you I saw
Jason Kidd in high school. I was in Las Vegas
(41:16):
at a high school basketball tournament, which I'm not sure
it still exists. I'm sure it does. It was a
huge high school tournament and it was the best players.
I remember a kid from New York City, Felipe Lopez,
who never ended up went to Saint John's, who was never.
Speaker 4 (41:30):
Didn't pan out, he was in the NBA.
Speaker 1 (41:33):
But I remember Jason Kidd was there and he was
a talk of the tournament, and.
Speaker 3 (41:37):
He was such a different player.
Speaker 1 (41:38):
Usually with young guards, you talk about their scoring, and
he was all about the passing and playmaking. And so
I can remember where I was sitting Jason Kidd made
a full court bounce pass or a three quarter court
bounce pass, and all the college coaches in the crowd
was ooh, in aw. But I can remember Jason Kidden
(41:58):
high school. I've been around Las Vegas.
Speaker 4 (42:01):
His nickname was Asen Kid because he didn't have a jumper.
No Jay, No, that's kind of hard to develop one. Yeah,
late in his career, by the way, a lot of guys,
a lot of guys do. He was like a Magic
Johnson type player. That's that's totally dominating. That was his
comp It was a smaller Magic Johnson's not a great shooter,
but he's a man. If you remember, Magic had like
a set show he did. Kid is like a top
(42:21):
eight point guard in the history of the basketball. That's
how good he was.
Speaker 3 (42:25):
Higher than that.
Speaker 1 (42:26):
If Magic's won, you could start arguing Jason Kidd by two,
Steph Steph Curry too, Okay, then Isaiah Thomas kid Well.
Speaker 4 (42:35):
Kids in the four or five range. I mean, listen,
Steve Nash want two MVP awards. We could say what
we want, Nash one two MVPs. He's got to be
in the discussion. I had a kid.
Speaker 3 (42:45):
Nash I think was a They're both great, Yeah, different,
both great.
Speaker 11 (42:51):
I mean, it's like, I don't know if I want
to make a call here.
Speaker 1 (42:54):
Nash is really all time best player in the league
for two years. Yeah, he was a player on a
couple of different teams.
Speaker 4 (43:01):
Yeah,
Popular Podcasts
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
The Nikki Glaser Podcast
Every week comedian and infamous roaster Nikki Glaser provides a fun, fast-paced, and brutally honest look into current pop-culture and her own personal life.