July 30, 2024 • 32 mins
What should be the expectations of Caleb Williams this season?
Thoughts on Tua Tagovailoa's big deal and if he can improve in cold weather
What to make of the QB competition between Justin Fields and Russell Wilson
Guest: Eric Mangini
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to
catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio and
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Speaker 2 (00:21):
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
Two in Cleveland. Now Fox Sports NFL Analyst three rings
with the patriotic Mangenius joining us live from New York.
Let's start with the Jets, because we are in New York.
I've said this before. We've gone from twenty eight padded
practices to sixteen with the new CBA, and I've never
talked more offensive lines in the last five years because
there's so many bad ones and there's so few great ones,
(00:47):
and so sixteen padded practices when you've got musical chairs
and new guys isn't a lot. Yesterday, the Jets offense
was a mess. Go back to your years with the
Jets and the Browns. First couple of days of camp.
What do you make when you have just an absolute stinker?
Speaker 3 (01:04):
Yeah, I look back at my notes and after my
first year at the Jets because we had a pretty
bad practice early in training camp, and so I would
keep notes on an Express Excel spreadsheet, you know, throughout
the course of the season and the next season, go
back and I look at it, and we had another
stinker early in practice. It's part of the early process
(01:25):
of camp. And what happens is you start to get
a little bit fatigued. The defense is putting in more
pressure packages, more blitzes, more looks disguising, So the communication
has to ramp up. And when you've got a new
offensive line, they haven't worked together. You're subbing guys in
and out. You're getting to know each other, and now
(01:46):
you're getting volume after volume of challenges from the defensive side.
That leads the guys jumping offside. It leads the ball
on the ground, some sloppiness that's really frustrating, but not
abnormal for the early of practice.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
Yeah. The you know, you sort of look at Caleb
Williams and I like him. My knock on him was
at times in college he could be moody. I saw
that at Oregon State. He was very emotional in moody,
which isn't the worst thing in the world if you
care about something. My second thing was sometimes there was
(02:23):
a little ad lib component where I felt like he
was just there was open stuff and he was out
of structure. And now Yesterday's talking about I don't believe
in pressure, and I'm like, hid boy, good boy, what
are your early you're shaking your head, what are your
early opinions on what you see in here?
Speaker 4 (02:41):
With Caleb?
Speaker 3 (02:43):
I look, just because you're drafting number one doesn't make
you any more experience than any other rookie. And you
don't have to have profound thoughts on every aspect of sports.
You're you're going through this process and you're learning like
everybody else. And and I that's my fear with with
Caleb as well, is he made so many of those
wild plays in general, but then he made a bunch
(03:04):
of wild plays while he was outside of the pocket,
when he was extending plays, when he was making something happen,
which is great, but you have to understand that these
guys now are faster, They close faster than they did
in college, They anticipate better than they did in college,
and they hit harder than they did in college. So
every time you're extending plays, you're putting yourself at risk.
(03:28):
And if you're hurt, you can't help the team at all.
So every play doesn't have to be a highlight play.
He's got to make sure that he's not doing too
much in order for him to be able to do
the things that he wants to do. And I feel
like we have this discussion a lot, especially with mobile quarterbacks.
They need to know how to slide, they need to
know how to throw the ball away and live to
(03:51):
fight another day. And guys, especially high draft picks, they
want to just make plays, always make plays, and it's
too risky at times.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
So you can have when you go to camp, you
can have two corners fighting it out for the slot corner,
or you can have, you know, two kickers fighting it out.
You kind of want to know your quarterback. If you
go into camp and you're not sure, it's not great.
So I've said the Pittsburgh thing. There's two components here.
Number One, Listen, I'm just going off what I read
(04:21):
and see. Russell's not exactly a unifier of a locker room,
whereas justin Fields to the very end in Chicago was
loved by the players. One of them's rich, one of
them's Stewed is a little inauthentic. One of them is young,
one of the guys not paid much and by the way, bigger, faster,
(04:42):
and more athletic in his prime. And I say to myself,
you can't lie to players, and I bet you Justin
Field's a hell of a practice player. Now, I'm not
denying Russell's better today as a quarterback, but I'm saying
to myself, when Russell gets hurt and dinged and here
comes Justin taking first team snaps for two days, feels
like you get to a two game losing streak in
(05:03):
week four and five, and that locker room is not
gonna sit back when they like Justin Moore, Am I
reaching here? Can you sense some of that potentially happening?
Speaker 5 (05:14):
No, I don't think you're reaching at all.
Speaker 3 (05:16):
And what I love about this situation in Pittsburgh is
they got both those.
Speaker 5 (05:20):
Guys for what Joe Flacco costs.
Speaker 3 (05:23):
Yeah, okay, so you've got two guys who've been talented,
who have had different levels of success, but success and
can contribute things stylistically very differently, but can contribute in
a meaningful way. My argument would be that you should
have a package and play them both. There is no
reason not to take advantage of Justin Field's skill set
(05:45):
if he's not the starter. And Russell Wilson can bring
a bunch of stuff to the table if he's not
the starter. And I understand the argument if you don't
have a quarter you know, if you have multiple quarterbacks,
then you don't have any quarterback. That's true in a
normal situation. But they to use both guys put so
much pressure on a defense. You have to prepare for
(06:07):
each guy's skill set. You only have a limited time
in practice. It can be easy for Pittsburgh and hard
on their opponents, and you can get the benefit and
the upside of both players. It's it's not traditional, it's
not convincible. But but there's been wildcad quarterbacks. There's been
this this pattern historically. I'm saying, use it even more
(06:29):
than small packes. Use it in big doses.
Speaker 1 (06:32):
All right, So the players vote in the top one hundred. Now,
I believe that an owner should own a gmsy GM,
a coach, a coach, and a player should play. But
star players. Sometimes Aaron Rodgers may say I want this
guy that guy Brady says, get me, Dronk, I get
it all right, whatever, But but I generally think it's
hard enough to be a great coach. You know, it's hard.
Andy Reid pretty much says Brett Veach, you do it.
Speaker 4 (06:55):
I'm not.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
I'll give you my opinion, but you know, I look
at brock Party. Players voted him players as the twenty
eighth best player in the league, above Golf Stafford, Herbert
love Burrow, Aaron Rodgers. What do you make I won't
(07:16):
even have an opinion. What do you make of that?
Speaker 3 (07:21):
I when it came out, I actually thought this was
a very positive thing for brock Party in the sense
that you're right, GM should be the GM coach, would
be the coach right on down the line. But the
fact that his peers feel this highly about him, these
are guys that played against them, These are guys that
played with them, These are guys that watched them on
(07:42):
tape when they were getting you know, it could be
getting ready for someone else, so they've seen him, and
for them to have that level of respect to place
them above the guys that you listed to me, is significant.
And I don't I can't say definitively where brock Party is.
And there's the arg that he's a function of the
of the head coach, the players that are around him,
(08:04):
and and the organization. I don't think really knows where
brock Purty is either. But when when your peers feel
that strongly about you, that that's pretty good praise.
Speaker 5 (08:14):
That's pretty high praise.
Speaker 1 (08:17):
I J McK and I got pushed back yesterday. You
were more four to two than I was.
Speaker 6 (08:23):
J mack.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
But my take was he's the only high paid quarterback
with an asterisk, which is, yeah, you can't play him
in cold, windy weather. Well, welcome to the AFC in January.
In February, the average AFC Championship game in the last
five years has been played in thirty three degrees and win.
And so I would forget the injuries. I would just
struy if he played in the NFC, Detroit's good, San Francisco, LA.
(08:48):
You know, there's a lot of teams that are good
that could play inside. But in the AFS, I mean
fifty degrees in under coach, he's not even a backups,
that's not a that's below t bow.
Speaker 3 (09:03):
Well, well, that's that's one component of it, so so
and and that's that's real. The injury issue is real,
and it's hard to take that out of the mix,
but he had he had the anti Jordan Love season
last year. So they're ten and one against teams that
that aren't in the playoffs. They're one and six against
teams that are in the playoffs. They lose three out
(09:23):
of their last five games. I think it's only the
fourth time in NFL history where a team had a
three game lead to win the division with five games
ago and have ended up losing the division. And then
in his last three games he throws five picks. He's
got a seventy quarterback rating and two sixties quarterback rating
in the sixties and and it's it's exactly the opposite
of the trajectory of Jordan Love. So that's a concern too.
(09:46):
It's it's the cold weather, it's the injuries. And then
last year down the stretch, it it was not it
wasn't only not very good, it was bad down the stretch.
And then you add in the mirage of what the
season was. When you're ten and one against non playoff
teams and you're one in six against playoff teams, that's
not that's not what you think of for a big
(10:09):
contract extension.
Speaker 1 (10:10):
Yeah, I mean, I think the standard in Green Bay
as Super Bowls. I think the standard in Miami is
non chaos because for twenty years they watched the Patriots
dominate it and now the last four they've watched the
Bills dominated and what they want to be is viable.
So I think Steven Ross maybe looks at that, and
I mean, am I nuts here? The standards are different
(10:30):
in the NFL. I think Miami looks at it and thinks,
we had Brady and we have Allen. Can we be
a wildcard team? Can we be fun to watch? I mean,
that's it feels like that's what they're betting on, which
is there won't be They won't be in chaos at
quarterback see.
Speaker 5 (10:45):
But I don't think so.
Speaker 3 (10:46):
I think Steven Ross wants to He's tired of looking
at the Patriots when he's tired of looking at the
Bills win. And they've done things to try to get
it right. They go out and make a giant move
with Tyreek Hill and and and between the draft picks
and the money they've poured money into that offense, they
go in at OBJ this offseason. It's not like they
(11:07):
haven't made moves to try to take the division over
and look they should have. They should have by all accounts,
won the division last season. I think, if anything, Steven
Ross will do whatever it takes for them for them
to win the super Bowl.
Speaker 5 (11:21):
They just can't quite find the right formula.
Speaker 1 (11:24):
Eric Mangini, Good Seniors, always.
Speaker 5 (11:26):
Coach Great San New College.
Speaker 2 (11:29):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and noon eastern nine am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio
FS one and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 1 (11:38):
All Right, J Mack with the news, No, no turn
on the news.
Speaker 2 (11:44):
This is the Herd Line News.
Speaker 7 (11:47):
You know, some of the smart producers here know where
your bad is buttered.
Speaker 4 (11:51):
And that's Kyler Murray Collin.
Speaker 1 (11:53):
You love this guy.
Speaker 7 (11:54):
And when the Cardinals drafted him in twenty nineteen, they
thought he was their ticket to the super Bowl. He
has not quite delivered for the organization yet zero playoff wins,
but Kyler says he feels the urgency now more than ever.
Speaker 6 (12:07):
I'm not used to losing, you know, So, I mean,
I know it's it sounds cliche. It's been five years,
it's going on to six, so I haven't won yet.
So yeah, uh, since urgency is definitely there. Since urg's
definitely there. Oh you never know, you know, when the
games can be taken away from you. Uh, you never
know how long you're gonna be playing.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
So my goal is to be the best.
Speaker 7 (12:27):
And that's yeah.
Speaker 6 (12:28):
Since I was four years old, that's my dream was
to be a quarterback. The NFL went Super Bowls and
that's you know, that's why I try to do every
single days.
Speaker 8 (12:35):
Mm hm.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
So what I'm hearing from Kyler Murray, that's good. The
commitment to focus career quarterback record. I know, record doesn't matter.
Twenty eight thirty six and.
Speaker 4 (12:48):
One, eight games under five hundred.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
Well he has noways had the greatest support. Oh here
we go.
Speaker 7 (12:54):
So we're gonna blame now Cliff Kingsbury, the offensive line,
the scope position.
Speaker 1 (12:58):
Was just gonna blame everybody except Kyler Marie. Right, Well,
I want to you know, I think I have I
can see this. It's being a special very quickly. Like
you either like a guy or you don't. You like
Brock pretty like Kyler Marie. He that playoff loss, that
was like the beginning of the end.
Speaker 4 (13:16):
And then you know we talked about I heard so.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
Maybe I'm a little more loyal than you.
Speaker 4 (13:21):
Loyalty.
Speaker 1 (13:22):
You bailed on you bail on people faster than I do.
Speaker 7 (13:25):
Well, you kind of got to, didn't you tell me, like, Hey,
something's not working. You gotta you gotta bail Isn't that
your Your motto.
Speaker 1 (13:32):
Sometimes is not what it applies to Kyler. Listen, it's
a big year for it. We got a Marvin Harrison,
you're two again and no, I think I think if
you go back to look how they played last year,
they're pretty feisty. At the end of the year, they
were pretty feisty. I think Harrison is a win. I
think Kyler's committed. I thought they had a pretty good draft.
Speaker 7 (13:52):
I think they're you want to, you know, back it up,
say it with your chest, maybe put some money on it,
or maybe a meal.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
Let's not get in die.
Speaker 7 (14:00):
Yeah, you don't feel that great about Kyler and the Cardinals?
Speaker 4 (14:02):
All right? Next up?
Speaker 1 (14:03):
Yes, here we go. Finally a good quarterback Jalen hurts.
Speaker 4 (14:06):
He's done.
Speaker 7 (14:07):
His third offensive coordinator in three years, Kellen Moore joining
the staff. Obviously, rough end to last year. Remember they
started ten to one then kind of just tanked and
playoff loss in Tampa was embarrassing. Anyways, Philly is aiming
to start things off on a high note, and Moore
had rave reviews from what he's seen about his quarterbacks
so far.
Speaker 8 (14:27):
Jail has been really smooth. The first couple of days,
it's been excellent. Just his operation. You can just tell
he's in command.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
He's in control. He's on an excellent job.
Speaker 8 (14:35):
At the line of scrimmage with the little nuances, little
adjustments that he has to his disposal.
Speaker 2 (14:40):
And so, you know, it's been really good.
Speaker 4 (14:42):
I think, you know his.
Speaker 8 (14:43):
Experience over the course of the last few years, all
the things that he's been able to accomplish. We want
to build on those things. And so when there's a
comfort level with a certain concept or scheme, we want
to make sure we emphasize that those are the fun
conversations we get to have because we're continuing to build
this thing each and every day.
Speaker 7 (15:00):
Mentioned Kyler's quarterback record, I'll mention Jalen Hurts thirty four
and seventeen.
Speaker 1 (15:04):
It's got a lot of games over five. Better organization,
yeah yeah, better owner by far, better o line, better owner,
better skilled people, less chaos. You know what I expect
my franchise quarterbacks to do overcome all that, and I
haven't seen it from Kyler. Yet, I haven't you gotta
ad Jalen Hurt's a better quarterbacks?
Speaker 6 (15:25):
Right?
Speaker 4 (15:25):
Come on?
Speaker 1 (15:26):
I think I think they're both really super talented. I
like jalen intangibles better than Kyler. I like Kayer's Kyler's
game a little more than Jalen Hurts.
Speaker 7 (15:36):
I know you say don't read the comments, right? Is
that one of your lines? Never read the comments?
Speaker 1 (15:40):
I don't get into that.
Speaker 7 (15:40):
So when we did our quarterback draft for west On Social,
you should read some of the comments. What I dominated
that draft, I mean when Jalen Hurts was such.
Speaker 1 (15:50):
A steal and I think we're low on him.
Speaker 7 (15:53):
Colin, I'm gonna I'm getting close to saying the Eagles are.
Speaker 4 (15:57):
My new pick to come out of the NFC.
Speaker 7 (16:00):
Like the more you read about this team and what
they have coming back that Lions kicker injury, that's significant
to be careful Dale Hurts and the Eagles on the
come up. Final story is team USA face South Sudan
and an exhibition game. Remember before the Olympics, and one
by one now they faith Tomorrow. I believe it's early
(16:20):
after the show. I think after our show perfect, the
US refuses to overlook their opponent a second time, and
now Steph Curry is saying they have appropriate fear and
know they can't sleep walk through any game.
Speaker 1 (16:33):
Adding to that.
Speaker 7 (16:35):
Steve Kerr has said Jason Tatum will definitely play in
this game, which I think is a little silly, and
they should.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
Probably peel that bandage off quickly.
Speaker 7 (16:42):
Just make him the sixth man, get him in early,
get through that storyline.
Speaker 1 (16:46):
And then rock South Sudan.
Speaker 7 (16:47):
I don't know if I'm willing to bet on this game,
but I kind of sort of feel.
Speaker 4 (16:52):
Like the US gets big payback here.
Speaker 5 (16:54):
Once say.
Speaker 1 (16:56):
Yeah, I love I'll tell you these highlights. It's on
and ad are rolling. It must make Laker fans WinCE
a little if you're thinking to yourself, little, how can
we not win a playoff game?
Speaker 5 (17:09):
Oh?
Speaker 4 (17:09):
It's different? Can I had this?
Speaker 5 (17:11):
Listen?
Speaker 1 (17:12):
I know he's my guy. Have you watched Curry closely
in the Olympics. He hasn't played well, hasn't been amazing well.
And the other thing is it's almost like the three
point line is too close for him. It's almost in
his head. Well, that's the thing. When they said the
three point lines closer, Curry's going to dominate and like
he hasn't. But I'll point this out.
Speaker 7 (17:27):
If you watch when they're on defense, the other teams
are hunting Curry every single possession. They're calling bring him over,
bring them over, and the US is doing smart stuff.
Will We'll switch the defenders so Curry doesn't have to go,
but they're coming after him. And it's a physical It's
a much more physical game in the international.
Speaker 1 (17:44):
No, And I'm not saying it's impacted. It's not necessarily
built for his game. It's more built for Lebron's game.
And by the way, it's built for Lebron's game in
Anthony Davis's game, and they're both great. I mean, this
is a FOBA is much more physical. Anthony Davis and
Lebron are big, strong, physical players. Well, Kevin Durant also physical.
(18:06):
He's a great score. Yeah, he scores in every level
high school, AAU, college, Pro, Olympic.
Speaker 5 (18:12):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
And listen, to be clear, I'm not bashing Curry. I'm
not saying he's struggling.
Speaker 4 (18:15):
He's just not playing.
Speaker 7 (18:16):
Amazing and other world lyague we have been yet we watched.
Speaker 1 (18:20):
I've said this before. If you watch the COPA tournament,
the United States men's national team has a lot of
players playing in Europe, we become kind of European Stylistically,
COPA is much more punch in the mouth soccer, the
field shorter, not as wide. I didn't think Copa's really
built for our players. Now as we've gotten more skilled
(18:40):
and more you know, more skilled, and space is more
valuable to us now. I didn't think copas the dimensions
of a field matter. If you don't think the Yankees
that short right field Porch or Fenway and left teams
build for the environment. So it's this, This is a
tinier core. I think it's a little in Steph's Curry's head,
(19:02):
and the physicality is really not built for Curry. J
Mack with the news.
Speaker 2 (19:10):
Well, that's the news and thanks for stopping by. It's
the Herd Line News.
Speaker 1 (19:14):
Mike Krzyzewski stopped by earlier to talk about Wemby and Lebron.
He's a three time gold medal winning Olympic basketball head coach,
A little coach k next live in La, It's the Hurt.
Speaker 2 (19:27):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and noone Easter not a em Pacific.
Speaker 9 (19:34):
Hey, I'm Doug Gottlieb. The podcast is called All Ball.
We usually talk all basketball all the time, but it's
more about the stories about what made these people love
their sport and all the interesting interactions along the way.
We talked to coaches, we talked to players, We tell
you stories.
Speaker 2 (19:51):
You download it, you listen to it.
Speaker 4 (19:53):
I think you like it.
Speaker 9 (19:54):
Listen to All Ball with Doug Gottlieb on the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts, or you get your podcast.
Speaker 1 (20:02):
So South Sudan gave Team USA a scared Jmack last
time they met in an exhibition. South Sudan out played
the Americans and you know at the end it was
your typical NBA stars taking over and slipping past South Sudan. Uh,
(20:23):
this will be an interesting match because Jason Tatum didn't
play and our teams went over Serbia which was really
close early and then we pulled away. So you know,
I had coach Kon earlier who won three Golds with
Team USA, and I said, how do you not you
look down the bench. It's not like at Duke where
(20:44):
it's a freshman or it's you know, a guy that's
really like eight in the rotation. You look down the
bench and it's Devin Booker and Jason Tatum, And how
do you not look down the bench and think, oh,
he's a star. He plays forty two minutes a night
in the NBA as an All Star, and I can't
get him in the game. And I asked coach came about,
how do you manage that?
Speaker 10 (21:06):
When we met as a team and developed standards of
how we were going to live together, and we were
bonded by the fact that we wanted to win the
gold and really the only question that will be asked
of a player we can say I played in the
Olympics in twenty twenty four. They're going to ask did
(21:26):
you win. They're not going to ask how much you played,
how much you scored? Did you win? And so I
asked each of the guys to give me their word,
to pledge that they would do anything that was needed
less minutes, more minutes not playing playing to win the
gold medal. And they all did. And we tried to
(21:49):
come up with a rotation of probably nine guys and
maybe ten and who started and to give some level
of continuity. And then a key thing in the real
close games was to have a closing unit in the
last six minutes or so that we're accustomed to playing
(22:11):
with one another. That would be somewhat different from the starters. Yeah,
and I tried to use that throughout and I never
really I didn't worry about the playing time of players
because they shouldn't be worried about it. They should only
be worried about one thing, and that's winning. And I
(22:34):
think this team has that mentality. And I can tell
you that the five teams I coached, all those guys
were terrific in handling that you can't worry about. You
cannot worry about playing time. You be worried about defending
the three and not committing too many team files that
give them free throws. And if we do those two things,
(22:57):
then we're going to win.
Speaker 1 (22:58):
Yeah. I think NBA players for a variety of reasons. Sometimes,
of all the athletes in America, they often speak more
often on social causes. You know, a lot of fans
don't like that. NFL players Kaepernick was an outlier generally, don't.
Baseball players don't that often in recent memory, But you know,
basketball players do. Our pro basketball players have opinions on politics.
(23:20):
Lebron certainly, and coaches Kerr and Popovich certainly, and so
for a variety of reasons. Sometimes NBA players aren't quite
as likable as other pro athletes. But I do think
it speaks very well of the players that these guys,
Lebron James does not have to play in the Olympics, money, fame,
legacy titles. It has no REASONA but Kevin Durant didn't
(23:43):
have to play this thing. Steph doesn't have to play
this thing. These guys are taking time away from their families,
time away. I mean it's Steph Curry, Katy and Lebron
have dealt with injuries. So for our superstar athlete and
our basketball players are the richest of our athletes because
they get longer deals, their cbas is stronger. They have
(24:04):
seven figures, eight figures on shoe apparel Instagram. There are
international soccer stars, international soccer stars and basketball stars are
the highest paid. Usually football guys are starting to make
more money. But I think it speaks highly you think
about Lebron James, who Shryzhevsky knows very very well, and
(24:25):
we talked about earlier sort of his relationship with Lebron,
and here he is thirty nine years old, still with
an insane commitment to the Olympics in basketball.
Speaker 10 (24:37):
I noticed them when I started coaching him, how smart
he was. Yeah, you're you're a little bit shocked that
the athleticism and just this amazing athlete that's there. And
then you add intelligence, then you add a command voice,
(25:00):
then you add leadership, and then you add something that
a lot of people don't have, and that's the will
to prepare to win. Everyone wants to win, not everyone
will pay the price every day every year to be
at their best before practice. I mean, he's the same
(25:24):
guy helping him for two decades. You know, he stretches
for over a half hour, and he preps his body
and while he's prepping his bodies, prepping his mind and
he's just so damn prepared. He and Kobe were the
(25:45):
two guys I thought, we're just above everyone in preparation, physical, mental,
you name it. And when they were on the court
at a practice or in a game, they wanted to
be the best all the time, all the time, and
(26:06):
they paid the price for it. And yeah, we for
anyone who knocks Lebron in any way, they're just crazy. Like,
you know, we're not going to see anybody like him.
He's one of a kind. Just what he's doing in
the Olympics, his verve, his demeanor, his attitude. I mean,
(26:29):
he helps his team by how he looks, not just
how he plays. I want to play with a guy
who looks like him, because there's hardly anybody who looks
like that. I mean facially, not just body wise. His
the face of a champion. This guy has that face
(26:50):
of a champion.
Speaker 1 (26:51):
You know, I was thinking about this. If you go
to the greatest players of all time, you think, you
go to a gym, you watch good basketball games, you
watch college is Most of the great quarterbacks played similarly.
Drop back, sit in the pocket six fourish two twenty five,
(27:14):
two thirty, throw the ball, same kind of motion. Same
In baseball, Joe Morgan was unique. He had kind of
a different tick to his swings most baseball batters. You
put him in a silhouette, you couldn't really tell the
difference that much unless you were a dihired baseball fan.
But it is interesting in basketball how many of the
great players played differently. Starts with Kareem he had his
(27:37):
own shot, nobody ever duplicated it. And then one of
the next great players was Magic, a six nine and
a half guard. Nobody had ever played like that. And
then there was Michael Jordan, and though Kobe was similar,
we'd never seen a player that was that relentless, the
greatest mid range player, high flying he We've never seen
(28:00):
a player like that. I'll argue that Larry Bird. Now
you think you've seen When Larry Bird came out and
was the best shooter in the league and arguably the
best passer in the league at six ' nine as
a forward, I'd never seen a player like Larry Bird.
So Larry Bird was. Now Lebron's a better version of Bird.
Six ' nine, handles the ball, passes, shoots, and then
(28:22):
you go into shack. There's never been anybody that big,
that powerful, that had run and then Lebron. Lebron's the
greatest Swiss army knife in the history of the league.
He can play literally every position. Magic's about the only
other guy that could play virtually every position. Steph Curry
see used to get benched if you took shots like that.
(28:45):
So you look in the NBA how often the truly
unique players and then you say, well, who's next. I've
seen players like ant When you watch Wemby play that
is that is never been duplicated. So it's one sport
where if you look at our all time great players,
(29:08):
like it's a list of about ten. Their games are transformative, transcendent.
They don't even look like other people's games. Now, there's
been other players that are very unique. I grew up
with George Gervin, who would do eleven foot finger roles,
great score, not an all time great player. Doctor J's
swooping dunks. Nobody played like Doctor J. I think those
(29:30):
are very those are really good players. I don't know
if Doctor J is the top twelve fifteen of all time,
but it just when I watch Wemby in the highlights today,
that's what all time stuff is. It not only breaks
through in production but in aesthetics. Also coached Kay touched
on something I thought was interesting, JJ Reddick. Now the
(29:52):
criticism of JJ, well, he's never coached before. He's kind
of duke arrogant. I like him. I think it'll work.
Here was coach k on one of his all time
favorite players.
Speaker 10 (30:02):
Now with the Lakers, I don't pay any attention to
because you know, we're dominated by social media, So who
is making the criticism? You know where you know the
opinions are good, But where's the opinion coming from, you know,
and what's the source for mej JJ is amazingly competitive
(30:25):
and is prepared as well as any player that I
coached at Duke. He's smart, he's confident, and he understands
the game, and having fifteen years of being a pro,
he has empathy for the guy trying to make it
when he's trying to make it, who makes it, and
for the veteran who is still trying to trying to
(30:49):
make it. He was never a superstar in the NBA,
but he was certainly a superstar and the National Player
of the Year when he played in college, So I
think has empathy for what a roster would look like.
He certainly understands the pro game, and he desperately wants
to be a coach, and I think he surrounded himself
(31:12):
up to now. I don't know his entire staff with
some veteran coaches, which will that will help him, But
I I love him. I think he's terrific and I
think he can relate to his players at the best level.
Speaker 1 (31:34):
How do you think the Lakers do? Watching Lebron an
ad at the Olympics, you just look at it, and
you're like, are they the two best players we have
right now?
Speaker 7 (31:42):
And oh, by the way, Rui Hachimura had a monster
game today against France before getting ejected. I need to
go over the ejection could have been home cooking for France,
but much more at an amazing game he couldn't miss.
And I'm just telling you, like I know, the popular
narrative is all Lakers, come on, they're not that good.
There may be a play in team. They got six
(32:03):
or seven really really good players. Can they fill out
the rest of the roster and win? You know, Brownie's
going to take a spot obviously near the end of
the bench. The young kid out of Tennessee Dalton connect
should be a factor.
Speaker 4 (32:16):
I think Lakers are a top six team in the West, well.
Speaker 1 (32:19):
Top six team in the West. But they're not the Celtics.
Speaker 4 (32:23):
You admit that, No, they're not the Celtics.
Speaker 1 (32:25):
Keep your eye in Indiana. I like Indiana, so I
think New York and Indiana, or if you have to.
Speaker 7 (32:31):
Guess the West regular season, Okay, C's gonna win a
lot of games.
Speaker 1 (32:34):
I would just say we're over that. We're we're over
criticizing Denver. I think Okay, see in Denver, Minnesota, and
Dallas Dallas, and then Lakers will be Kyrie Luca thing.
I'll watch it start to regress little this year see
tomorrow
Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to
catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio and
noon to three Eastern nine am to noone Pacific. Find
your local station for The Herd at Fox Sports Radio
dot com, or stream us live every day on the
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Speaker 2 (00:21):
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
Two in Cleveland. Now Fox Sports NFL Analyst three rings
with the patriotic Mangenius joining us live from New York.
Let's start with the Jets, because we are in New York.
I've said this before. We've gone from twenty eight padded
practices to sixteen with the new CBA, and I've never
talked more offensive lines in the last five years because
there's so many bad ones and there's so few great ones,
(00:47):
and so sixteen padded practices when you've got musical chairs
and new guys isn't a lot. Yesterday, the Jets offense
was a mess. Go back to your years with the
Jets and the Browns. First couple of days of camp.
What do you make when you have just an absolute stinker?
Speaker 3 (01:04):
Yeah, I look back at my notes and after my
first year at the Jets because we had a pretty
bad practice early in training camp, and so I would
keep notes on an Express Excel spreadsheet, you know, throughout
the course of the season and the next season, go
back and I look at it, and we had another
stinker early in practice. It's part of the early process
(01:25):
of camp. And what happens is you start to get
a little bit fatigued. The defense is putting in more
pressure packages, more blitzes, more looks disguising, So the communication
has to ramp up. And when you've got a new
offensive line, they haven't worked together. You're subbing guys in
and out. You're getting to know each other, and now
(01:46):
you're getting volume after volume of challenges from the defensive side.
That leads the guys jumping offside. It leads the ball
on the ground, some sloppiness that's really frustrating, but not
abnormal for the early of practice.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
Yeah. The you know, you sort of look at Caleb
Williams and I like him. My knock on him was
at times in college he could be moody. I saw
that at Oregon State. He was very emotional in moody,
which isn't the worst thing in the world if you
care about something. My second thing was sometimes there was
(02:23):
a little ad lib component where I felt like he
was just there was open stuff and he was out
of structure. And now Yesterday's talking about I don't believe
in pressure, and I'm like, hid boy, good boy, what
are your early you're shaking your head, what are your
early opinions on what you see in here?
Speaker 4 (02:41):
With Caleb?
Speaker 3 (02:43):
I look, just because you're drafting number one doesn't make
you any more experience than any other rookie. And you
don't have to have profound thoughts on every aspect of sports.
You're you're going through this process and you're learning like
everybody else. And and I that's my fear with with
Caleb as well, is he made so many of those
wild plays in general, but then he made a bunch
(03:04):
of wild plays while he was outside of the pocket,
when he was extending plays, when he was making something happen,
which is great, but you have to understand that these
guys now are faster, They close faster than they did
in college, They anticipate better than they did in college,
and they hit harder than they did in college. So
every time you're extending plays, you're putting yourself at risk.
(03:28):
And if you're hurt, you can't help the team at all.
So every play doesn't have to be a highlight play.
He's got to make sure that he's not doing too
much in order for him to be able to do
the things that he wants to do. And I feel
like we have this discussion a lot, especially with mobile quarterbacks.
They need to know how to slide, they need to
know how to throw the ball away and live to
(03:51):
fight another day. And guys, especially high draft picks, they
want to just make plays, always make plays, and it's
too risky at times.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
So you can have when you go to camp, you
can have two corners fighting it out for the slot corner,
or you can have, you know, two kickers fighting it out.
You kind of want to know your quarterback. If you
go into camp and you're not sure, it's not great.
So I've said the Pittsburgh thing. There's two components here.
Number One, Listen, I'm just going off what I read
(04:21):
and see. Russell's not exactly a unifier of a locker room,
whereas justin Fields to the very end in Chicago was
loved by the players. One of them's rich, one of
them's Stewed is a little inauthentic. One of them is young,
one of the guys not paid much and by the way, bigger, faster,
(04:42):
and more athletic in his prime. And I say to myself,
you can't lie to players, and I bet you Justin
Field's a hell of a practice player. Now, I'm not
denying Russell's better today as a quarterback, but I'm saying
to myself, when Russell gets hurt and dinged and here
comes Justin taking first team snaps for two days, feels
like you get to a two game losing streak in
(05:03):
week four and five, and that locker room is not
gonna sit back when they like Justin Moore, Am I
reaching here? Can you sense some of that potentially happening?
Speaker 5 (05:14):
No, I don't think you're reaching at all.
Speaker 3 (05:16):
And what I love about this situation in Pittsburgh is
they got both those.
Speaker 5 (05:20):
Guys for what Joe Flacco costs.
Speaker 3 (05:23):
Yeah, okay, so you've got two guys who've been talented,
who have had different levels of success, but success and
can contribute things stylistically very differently, but can contribute in
a meaningful way. My argument would be that you should
have a package and play them both. There is no
reason not to take advantage of Justin Field's skill set
(05:45):
if he's not the starter. And Russell Wilson can bring
a bunch of stuff to the table if he's not
the starter. And I understand the argument if you don't
have a quarter you know, if you have multiple quarterbacks,
then you don't have any quarterback. That's true in a
normal situation. But they to use both guys put so
much pressure on a defense. You have to prepare for
(06:07):
each guy's skill set. You only have a limited time
in practice. It can be easy for Pittsburgh and hard
on their opponents, and you can get the benefit and
the upside of both players. It's it's not traditional, it's
not convincible. But but there's been wildcad quarterbacks. There's been
this this pattern historically. I'm saying, use it even more
(06:29):
than small packes. Use it in big doses.
Speaker 1 (06:32):
All right, So the players vote in the top one hundred. Now,
I believe that an owner should own a gmsy GM,
a coach, a coach, and a player should play. But
star players. Sometimes Aaron Rodgers may say I want this
guy that guy Brady says, get me, Dronk, I get
it all right, whatever, But but I generally think it's
hard enough to be a great coach. You know, it's hard.
Andy Reid pretty much says Brett Veach, you do it.
Speaker 4 (06:55):
I'm not.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
I'll give you my opinion, but you know, I look
at brock Party. Players voted him players as the twenty
eighth best player in the league, above Golf Stafford, Herbert
love Burrow, Aaron Rodgers. What do you make I won't
(07:16):
even have an opinion. What do you make of that?
Speaker 3 (07:21):
I when it came out, I actually thought this was
a very positive thing for brock Party in the sense
that you're right, GM should be the GM coach, would
be the coach right on down the line. But the
fact that his peers feel this highly about him, these
are guys that played against them, These are guys that
played with them, These are guys that watched them on
(07:42):
tape when they were getting you know, it could be
getting ready for someone else, so they've seen him, and
for them to have that level of respect to place
them above the guys that you listed to me, is significant.
And I don't I can't say definitively where brock Party is.
And there's the arg that he's a function of the
of the head coach, the players that are around him,
(08:04):
and and the organization. I don't think really knows where
brock Purty is either. But when when your peers feel
that strongly about you, that that's pretty good praise.
Speaker 5 (08:14):
That's pretty high praise.
Speaker 1 (08:17):
I J McK and I got pushed back yesterday. You
were more four to two than I was.
Speaker 6 (08:23):
J mack.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
But my take was he's the only high paid quarterback
with an asterisk, which is, yeah, you can't play him
in cold, windy weather. Well, welcome to the AFC in January.
In February, the average AFC Championship game in the last
five years has been played in thirty three degrees and win.
And so I would forget the injuries. I would just
struy if he played in the NFC, Detroit's good, San Francisco, LA.
(08:48):
You know, there's a lot of teams that are good
that could play inside. But in the AFS, I mean
fifty degrees in under coach, he's not even a backups,
that's not a that's below t bow.
Speaker 3 (09:03):
Well, well, that's that's one component of it, so so
and and that's that's real. The injury issue is real,
and it's hard to take that out of the mix,
but he had he had the anti Jordan Love season
last year. So they're ten and one against teams that
that aren't in the playoffs. They're one and six against
teams that are in the playoffs. They lose three out
(09:23):
of their last five games. I think it's only the
fourth time in NFL history where a team had a
three game lead to win the division with five games
ago and have ended up losing the division. And then
in his last three games he throws five picks. He's
got a seventy quarterback rating and two sixties quarterback rating
in the sixties and and it's it's exactly the opposite
of the trajectory of Jordan Love. So that's a concern too.
(09:46):
It's it's the cold weather, it's the injuries. And then
last year down the stretch, it it was not it
wasn't only not very good, it was bad down the stretch.
And then you add in the mirage of what the
season was. When you're ten and one against non playoff
teams and you're one in six against playoff teams, that's
not that's not what you think of for a big
(10:09):
contract extension.
Speaker 1 (10:10):
Yeah, I mean, I think the standard in Green Bay
as Super Bowls. I think the standard in Miami is
non chaos because for twenty years they watched the Patriots
dominate it and now the last four they've watched the
Bills dominated and what they want to be is viable.
So I think Steven Ross maybe looks at that, and
I mean, am I nuts here? The standards are different
(10:30):
in the NFL. I think Miami looks at it and thinks,
we had Brady and we have Allen. Can we be
a wildcard team? Can we be fun to watch? I mean,
that's it feels like that's what they're betting on, which
is there won't be They won't be in chaos at
quarterback see.
Speaker 5 (10:45):
But I don't think so.
Speaker 3 (10:46):
I think Steven Ross wants to He's tired of looking
at the Patriots when he's tired of looking at the
Bills win. And they've done things to try to get
it right. They go out and make a giant move
with Tyreek Hill and and and between the draft picks
and the money they've poured money into that offense, they
go in at OBJ this offseason. It's not like they
(11:07):
haven't made moves to try to take the division over
and look they should have. They should have by all accounts,
won the division last season. I think, if anything, Steven
Ross will do whatever it takes for them for them
to win the super Bowl.
Speaker 5 (11:21):
They just can't quite find the right formula.
Speaker 1 (11:24):
Eric Mangini, Good Seniors, always.
Speaker 5 (11:26):
Coach Great San New College.
Speaker 2 (11:29):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and noon eastern nine am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio
FS one and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 1 (11:38):
All Right, J Mack with the news, No, no turn
on the news.
Speaker 2 (11:44):
This is the Herd Line News.
Speaker 7 (11:47):
You know, some of the smart producers here know where
your bad is buttered.
Speaker 4 (11:51):
And that's Kyler Murray Collin.
Speaker 1 (11:53):
You love this guy.
Speaker 7 (11:54):
And when the Cardinals drafted him in twenty nineteen, they
thought he was their ticket to the super Bowl. He
has not quite delivered for the organization yet zero playoff wins,
but Kyler says he feels the urgency now more than ever.
Speaker 6 (12:07):
I'm not used to losing, you know, So, I mean,
I know it's it sounds cliche. It's been five years,
it's going on to six, so I haven't won yet.
So yeah, uh, since urgency is definitely there. Since urg's
definitely there. Oh you never know, you know, when the
games can be taken away from you. Uh, you never
know how long you're gonna be playing.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
So my goal is to be the best.
Speaker 7 (12:27):
And that's yeah.
Speaker 6 (12:28):
Since I was four years old, that's my dream was
to be a quarterback. The NFL went Super Bowls and
that's you know, that's why I try to do every
single days.
Speaker 8 (12:35):
Mm hm.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
So what I'm hearing from Kyler Murray, that's good. The
commitment to focus career quarterback record. I know, record doesn't matter.
Twenty eight thirty six and.
Speaker 4 (12:48):
One, eight games under five hundred.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
Well he has noways had the greatest support. Oh here
we go.
Speaker 7 (12:54):
So we're gonna blame now Cliff Kingsbury, the offensive line,
the scope position.
Speaker 1 (12:58):
Was just gonna blame everybody except Kyler Marie. Right, Well,
I want to you know, I think I have I
can see this. It's being a special very quickly. Like
you either like a guy or you don't. You like
Brock pretty like Kyler Marie. He that playoff loss, that
was like the beginning of the end.
Speaker 4 (13:16):
And then you know we talked about I heard so.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
Maybe I'm a little more loyal than you.
Speaker 4 (13:21):
Loyalty.
Speaker 1 (13:22):
You bailed on you bail on people faster than I do.
Speaker 7 (13:25):
Well, you kind of got to, didn't you tell me, like, Hey,
something's not working. You gotta you gotta bail Isn't that
your Your motto.
Speaker 1 (13:32):
Sometimes is not what it applies to Kyler. Listen, it's
a big year for it. We got a Marvin Harrison,
you're two again and no, I think I think if
you go back to look how they played last year,
they're pretty feisty. At the end of the year, they
were pretty feisty. I think Harrison is a win. I
think Kyler's committed. I thought they had a pretty good draft.
Speaker 7 (13:52):
I think they're you want to, you know, back it up,
say it with your chest, maybe put some money on it,
or maybe a meal.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
Let's not get in die.
Speaker 7 (14:00):
Yeah, you don't feel that great about Kyler and the Cardinals?
Speaker 4 (14:02):
All right? Next up?
Speaker 1 (14:03):
Yes, here we go. Finally a good quarterback Jalen hurts.
Speaker 4 (14:06):
He's done.
Speaker 7 (14:07):
His third offensive coordinator in three years, Kellen Moore joining
the staff. Obviously, rough end to last year. Remember they
started ten to one then kind of just tanked and
playoff loss in Tampa was embarrassing. Anyways, Philly is aiming
to start things off on a high note, and Moore
had rave reviews from what he's seen about his quarterbacks
so far.
Speaker 8 (14:27):
Jail has been really smooth. The first couple of days,
it's been excellent. Just his operation. You can just tell
he's in command.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
He's in control. He's on an excellent job.
Speaker 8 (14:35):
At the line of scrimmage with the little nuances, little
adjustments that he has to his disposal.
Speaker 2 (14:40):
And so, you know, it's been really good.
Speaker 4 (14:42):
I think, you know his.
Speaker 8 (14:43):
Experience over the course of the last few years, all
the things that he's been able to accomplish. We want
to build on those things. And so when there's a
comfort level with a certain concept or scheme, we want
to make sure we emphasize that those are the fun
conversations we get to have because we're continuing to build
this thing each and every day.
Speaker 7 (15:00):
Mentioned Kyler's quarterback record, I'll mention Jalen Hurts thirty four
and seventeen.
Speaker 1 (15:04):
It's got a lot of games over five. Better organization,
yeah yeah, better owner by far, better o line, better owner,
better skilled people, less chaos. You know what I expect
my franchise quarterbacks to do overcome all that, and I
haven't seen it from Kyler. Yet, I haven't you gotta
ad Jalen Hurt's a better quarterbacks?
Speaker 6 (15:25):
Right?
Speaker 4 (15:25):
Come on?
Speaker 1 (15:26):
I think I think they're both really super talented. I
like jalen intangibles better than Kyler. I like Kayer's Kyler's
game a little more than Jalen Hurts.
Speaker 7 (15:36):
I know you say don't read the comments, right? Is
that one of your lines? Never read the comments?
Speaker 1 (15:40):
I don't get into that.
Speaker 7 (15:40):
So when we did our quarterback draft for west On Social,
you should read some of the comments. What I dominated
that draft, I mean when Jalen Hurts was such.
Speaker 1 (15:50):
A steal and I think we're low on him.
Speaker 7 (15:53):
Colin, I'm gonna I'm getting close to saying the Eagles are.
Speaker 4 (15:57):
My new pick to come out of the NFC.
Speaker 7 (16:00):
Like the more you read about this team and what
they have coming back that Lions kicker injury, that's significant
to be careful Dale Hurts and the Eagles on the
come up. Final story is team USA face South Sudan
and an exhibition game. Remember before the Olympics, and one
by one now they faith Tomorrow. I believe it's early
(16:20):
after the show. I think after our show perfect, the
US refuses to overlook their opponent a second time, and
now Steph Curry is saying they have appropriate fear and
know they can't sleep walk through any game.
Speaker 1 (16:33):
Adding to that.
Speaker 7 (16:35):
Steve Kerr has said Jason Tatum will definitely play in
this game, which I think is a little silly, and
they should.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
Probably peel that bandage off quickly.
Speaker 7 (16:42):
Just make him the sixth man, get him in early,
get through that storyline.
Speaker 1 (16:46):
And then rock South Sudan.
Speaker 7 (16:47):
I don't know if I'm willing to bet on this game,
but I kind of sort of feel.
Speaker 4 (16:52):
Like the US gets big payback here.
Speaker 5 (16:54):
Once say.
Speaker 1 (16:56):
Yeah, I love I'll tell you these highlights. It's on
and ad are rolling. It must make Laker fans WinCE
a little if you're thinking to yourself, little, how can
we not win a playoff game?
Speaker 5 (17:09):
Oh?
Speaker 4 (17:09):
It's different? Can I had this?
Speaker 5 (17:11):
Listen?
Speaker 1 (17:12):
I know he's my guy. Have you watched Curry closely
in the Olympics. He hasn't played well, hasn't been amazing well.
And the other thing is it's almost like the three
point line is too close for him. It's almost in
his head. Well, that's the thing. When they said the
three point lines closer, Curry's going to dominate and like
he hasn't. But I'll point this out.
Speaker 7 (17:27):
If you watch when they're on defense, the other teams
are hunting Curry every single possession. They're calling bring him over,
bring them over, and the US is doing smart stuff.
Will We'll switch the defenders so Curry doesn't have to go,
but they're coming after him. And it's a physical It's
a much more physical game in the international.
Speaker 1 (17:44):
No, And I'm not saying it's impacted. It's not necessarily
built for his game. It's more built for Lebron's game.
And by the way, it's built for Lebron's game in
Anthony Davis's game, and they're both great. I mean, this
is a FOBA is much more physical. Anthony Davis and
Lebron are big, strong, physical players. Well, Kevin Durant also physical.
(18:06):
He's a great score. Yeah, he scores in every level
high school, AAU, college, Pro, Olympic.
Speaker 5 (18:12):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
And listen, to be clear, I'm not bashing Curry. I'm
not saying he's struggling.
Speaker 4 (18:15):
He's just not playing.
Speaker 7 (18:16):
Amazing and other world lyague we have been yet we watched.
Speaker 1 (18:20):
I've said this before. If you watch the COPA tournament,
the United States men's national team has a lot of
players playing in Europe, we become kind of European Stylistically,
COPA is much more punch in the mouth soccer, the
field shorter, not as wide. I didn't think Copa's really
built for our players. Now as we've gotten more skilled
(18:40):
and more you know, more skilled, and space is more
valuable to us now. I didn't think copas the dimensions
of a field matter. If you don't think the Yankees
that short right field Porch or Fenway and left teams
build for the environment. So it's this, This is a
tinier core. I think it's a little in Steph's Curry's head,
(19:02):
and the physicality is really not built for Curry. J
Mack with the news.
Speaker 2 (19:10):
Well, that's the news and thanks for stopping by. It's
the Herd Line News.
Speaker 1 (19:14):
Mike Krzyzewski stopped by earlier to talk about Wemby and Lebron.
He's a three time gold medal winning Olympic basketball head coach,
A little coach k next live in La, It's the Hurt.
Speaker 2 (19:27):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and noone Easter not a em Pacific.
Speaker 9 (19:34):
Hey, I'm Doug Gottlieb. The podcast is called All Ball.
We usually talk all basketball all the time, but it's
more about the stories about what made these people love
their sport and all the interesting interactions along the way.
We talked to coaches, we talked to players, We tell
you stories.
Speaker 2 (19:51):
You download it, you listen to it.
Speaker 4 (19:53):
I think you like it.
Speaker 9 (19:54):
Listen to All Ball with Doug Gottlieb on the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts, or you get your podcast.
Speaker 1 (20:02):
So South Sudan gave Team USA a scared Jmack last
time they met in an exhibition. South Sudan out played
the Americans and you know at the end it was
your typical NBA stars taking over and slipping past South Sudan. Uh,
(20:23):
this will be an interesting match because Jason Tatum didn't
play and our teams went over Serbia which was really
close early and then we pulled away. So you know,
I had coach Kon earlier who won three Golds with
Team USA, and I said, how do you not you
look down the bench. It's not like at Duke where
(20:44):
it's a freshman or it's you know, a guy that's
really like eight in the rotation. You look down the
bench and it's Devin Booker and Jason Tatum, And how
do you not look down the bench and think, oh,
he's a star. He plays forty two minutes a night
in the NBA as an All Star, and I can't
get him in the game. And I asked coach came about,
how do you manage that?
Speaker 10 (21:06):
When we met as a team and developed standards of
how we were going to live together, and we were
bonded by the fact that we wanted to win the
gold and really the only question that will be asked
of a player we can say I played in the
Olympics in twenty twenty four. They're going to ask did
(21:26):
you win. They're not going to ask how much you played,
how much you scored? Did you win? And so I
asked each of the guys to give me their word,
to pledge that they would do anything that was needed
less minutes, more minutes not playing playing to win the
gold medal. And they all did. And we tried to
(21:49):
come up with a rotation of probably nine guys and
maybe ten and who started and to give some level
of continuity. And then a key thing in the real
close games was to have a closing unit in the
last six minutes or so that we're accustomed to playing
(22:11):
with one another. That would be somewhat different from the starters. Yeah,
and I tried to use that throughout and I never
really I didn't worry about the playing time of players
because they shouldn't be worried about it. They should only
be worried about one thing, and that's winning. And I
(22:34):
think this team has that mentality. And I can tell
you that the five teams I coached, all those guys
were terrific in handling that you can't worry about. You
cannot worry about playing time. You be worried about defending
the three and not committing too many team files that
give them free throws. And if we do those two things,
(22:57):
then we're going to win.
Speaker 1 (22:58):
Yeah. I think NBA players for a variety of reasons. Sometimes,
of all the athletes in America, they often speak more
often on social causes. You know, a lot of fans
don't like that. NFL players Kaepernick was an outlier generally, don't.
Baseball players don't that often in recent memory, But you know,
basketball players do. Our pro basketball players have opinions on politics.
(23:20):
Lebron certainly, and coaches Kerr and Popovich certainly, and so
for a variety of reasons. Sometimes NBA players aren't quite
as likable as other pro athletes. But I do think
it speaks very well of the players that these guys,
Lebron James does not have to play in the Olympics, money, fame,
legacy titles. It has no REASONA but Kevin Durant didn't
(23:43):
have to play this thing. Steph doesn't have to play
this thing. These guys are taking time away from their families,
time away. I mean it's Steph Curry, Katy and Lebron
have dealt with injuries. So for our superstar athlete and
our basketball players are the richest of our athletes because
they get longer deals, their cbas is stronger. They have
(24:04):
seven figures, eight figures on shoe apparel Instagram. There are
international soccer stars, international soccer stars and basketball stars are
the highest paid. Usually football guys are starting to make
more money. But I think it speaks highly you think
about Lebron James, who Shryzhevsky knows very very well, and
(24:25):
we talked about earlier sort of his relationship with Lebron,
and here he is thirty nine years old, still with
an insane commitment to the Olympics in basketball.
Speaker 10 (24:37):
I noticed them when I started coaching him, how smart
he was. Yeah, you're you're a little bit shocked that
the athleticism and just this amazing athlete that's there. And
then you add intelligence, then you add a command voice,
(25:00):
then you add leadership, and then you add something that
a lot of people don't have, and that's the will
to prepare to win. Everyone wants to win, not everyone
will pay the price every day every year to be
at their best before practice. I mean, he's the same
(25:24):
guy helping him for two decades. You know, he stretches
for over a half hour, and he preps his body
and while he's prepping his bodies, prepping his mind and
he's just so damn prepared. He and Kobe were the
(25:45):
two guys I thought, we're just above everyone in preparation, physical, mental,
you name it. And when they were on the court
at a practice or in a game, they wanted to
be the best all the time, all the time, and
(26:06):
they paid the price for it. And yeah, we for
anyone who knocks Lebron in any way, they're just crazy. Like,
you know, we're not going to see anybody like him.
He's one of a kind. Just what he's doing in
the Olympics, his verve, his demeanor, his attitude. I mean,
(26:29):
he helps his team by how he looks, not just
how he plays. I want to play with a guy
who looks like him, because there's hardly anybody who looks
like that. I mean facially, not just body wise. His
the face of a champion. This guy has that face
(26:50):
of a champion.
Speaker 1 (26:51):
You know, I was thinking about this. If you go
to the greatest players of all time, you think, you
go to a gym, you watch good basketball games, you
watch college is Most of the great quarterbacks played similarly.
Drop back, sit in the pocket six fourish two twenty five,
(27:14):
two thirty, throw the ball, same kind of motion. Same
In baseball, Joe Morgan was unique. He had kind of
a different tick to his swings most baseball batters. You
put him in a silhouette, you couldn't really tell the
difference that much unless you were a dihired baseball fan.
But it is interesting in basketball how many of the
great players played differently. Starts with Kareem he had his
(27:37):
own shot, nobody ever duplicated it. And then one of
the next great players was Magic, a six nine and
a half guard. Nobody had ever played like that. And
then there was Michael Jordan, and though Kobe was similar,
we'd never seen a player that was that relentless, the
greatest mid range player, high flying he We've never seen
(28:00):
a player like that. I'll argue that Larry Bird. Now
you think you've seen When Larry Bird came out and
was the best shooter in the league and arguably the
best passer in the league at six ' nine as
a forward, I'd never seen a player like Larry Bird.
So Larry Bird was. Now Lebron's a better version of Bird.
Six ' nine, handles the ball, passes, shoots, and then
(28:22):
you go into shack. There's never been anybody that big,
that powerful, that had run and then Lebron. Lebron's the
greatest Swiss army knife in the history of the league.
He can play literally every position. Magic's about the only
other guy that could play virtually every position. Steph Curry
see used to get benched if you took shots like that.
(28:45):
So you look in the NBA how often the truly
unique players and then you say, well, who's next. I've
seen players like ant When you watch Wemby play that
is that is never been duplicated. So it's one sport
where if you look at our all time great players,
(29:08):
like it's a list of about ten. Their games are transformative, transcendent.
They don't even look like other people's games. Now, there's
been other players that are very unique. I grew up
with George Gervin, who would do eleven foot finger roles,
great score, not an all time great player. Doctor J's
swooping dunks. Nobody played like Doctor J. I think those
(29:30):
are very those are really good players. I don't know
if Doctor J is the top twelve fifteen of all time,
but it just when I watch Wemby in the highlights today,
that's what all time stuff is. It not only breaks
through in production but in aesthetics. Also coached Kay touched
on something I thought was interesting, JJ Reddick. Now the
(29:52):
criticism of JJ, well, he's never coached before. He's kind
of duke arrogant. I like him. I think it'll work.
Here was coach k on one of his all time
favorite players.
Speaker 10 (30:02):
Now with the Lakers, I don't pay any attention to
because you know, we're dominated by social media, So who
is making the criticism? You know where you know the
opinions are good, But where's the opinion coming from, you know,
and what's the source for mej JJ is amazingly competitive
(30:25):
and is prepared as well as any player that I
coached at Duke. He's smart, he's confident, and he understands
the game, and having fifteen years of being a pro,
he has empathy for the guy trying to make it
when he's trying to make it, who makes it, and
for the veteran who is still trying to trying to
(30:49):
make it. He was never a superstar in the NBA,
but he was certainly a superstar and the National Player
of the Year when he played in college, So I
think has empathy for what a roster would look like.
He certainly understands the pro game, and he desperately wants
to be a coach, and I think he surrounded himself
(31:12):
up to now. I don't know his entire staff with
some veteran coaches, which will that will help him, But
I I love him. I think he's terrific and I
think he can relate to his players at the best level.
Speaker 1 (31:34):
How do you think the Lakers do? Watching Lebron an
ad at the Olympics, you just look at it, and
you're like, are they the two best players we have
right now?
Speaker 7 (31:42):
And oh, by the way, Rui Hachimura had a monster
game today against France before getting ejected. I need to
go over the ejection could have been home cooking for France,
but much more at an amazing game he couldn't miss.
And I'm just telling you, like I know, the popular
narrative is all Lakers, come on, they're not that good.
There may be a play in team. They got six
(32:03):
or seven really really good players. Can they fill out
the rest of the roster and win? You know, Brownie's
going to take a spot obviously near the end of
the bench. The young kid out of Tennessee Dalton connect
should be a factor.
Speaker 4 (32:16):
I think Lakers are a top six team in the West, well.
Speaker 1 (32:19):
Top six team in the West. But they're not the Celtics.
Speaker 4 (32:23):
You admit that, No, they're not the Celtics.
Speaker 1 (32:25):
Keep your eye in Indiana. I like Indiana, so I
think New York and Indiana, or if you have to.
Speaker 7 (32:31):
Guess the West regular season, Okay, C's gonna win a
lot of games.
Speaker 1 (32:34):
I would just say we're over that. We're we're over
criticizing Denver. I think Okay, see in Denver, Minnesota, and
Dallas Dallas, and then Lakers will be Kyrie Luca thing.
I'll watch it start to regress little this year see
tomorrow
Hosts And Creators
Colin Cowherd
Jason McIntyre
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