June 28, 2025 • 32 mins
Kelvin Washington and a slew of various co-hosts tell us if it's fair to call Shai Gilgeous-Alexander and the Oklahoma City Thunder are a 'boring' champion, debate whether it's fair to say that people will remember Tyrese Haliburton's playoff run more favorably than OKC actually winning the title, share their thoughts on LeBron James calling for the NBA to institute a criteria for the NBA MVP award, and debate whether it's fair to suggest that the Dallas Mavericks can be both 'win-now' and 'win-later' during the Cooper Flagg era.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to the best of the Odd Couple podcasts.
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Speaker 2 (00:19):
You're listening to the best of the Odd.
Speaker 3 (00:21):
Couple, Martin.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
When we had the NBA Finals, which you jumped in
a couple of times, overall, you were excited about this
from just a sports fan, from a basketball fan. You
weren't one of those blah blah NBA Finals, who's watching this?
Speaker 3 (00:37):
You were in? Yeah, to me, shocking turn of events.
Speaker 4 (00:41):
Guy who decided to try to make a living talking
about sports exact, actually excited to watch games. I know
that that is seemingly rare across society these days, more
and more increasingly so. But yeah, I was locked in.
I was interested the NBA playoffs. They're fun, that's it.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
And I'm more like you, I will admit, and I've
said this several times in the show. It is strange, Martin.
In my however, many years living, you know how it goes.
Oh man, this series is crazy. I can't believe he
took that shot. Why would they do this? Oh, they
got to get swept. I didn't get any kind of
text like that with this series. There is the strangest
thing is normally the polar opposite, right, this guys that
I can't believe y'all think he's nice.
Speaker 3 (01:22):
He's not nice, he's you get all that kind of stuff,
And I don't know if it's just because they're a
social group of fun guys, nice guys hard to hate
on no real like.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
Eat both teams, Like who's the guy you hate? Like
for instance, Celtics Lakers, you might have hated KG or
Paul Paul Pierce is weak. I can't believe man Kobe
over there's something in there. This one was like, even
if you're going for the Pacers, you to hate the Thunder.
If you were going for the Thunder, you almost like
the Celtics series. It wasn't a lot of a lot
of that.
Speaker 3 (01:51):
We're getting into a dangerous territory already.
Speaker 4 (01:53):
I want to start just by staying congratulations through Yoklahoma
City Thunder for winning the NBA.
Speaker 3 (01:59):
Fun. Yes, that's a big thing.
Speaker 4 (02:00):
Shake Gildis, Alexander just chopped topped off one of the
most statistically historic years in terms of the hardware taking
and points scored and sold and so forth, that we'll
see an NBA history Ottao, I feel like we're seeing
new NBA history made every shiven a week day, just
about right. If you don't like the weather, you know,
if you don't like the record, the same, same kind
of deal. But uh, but no, and okay, see how
(02:23):
they're set up for the future.
Speaker 3 (02:25):
We'll talk about that. I'm sure down the line.
Speaker 4 (02:27):
In terms of this series today, you know, congratulations to them.
I'm sure everybody in Oklahoma City is very excited and
very happy. And the fans of them across the nation
if they you know, if they exist.
Speaker 3 (02:39):
But also the.
Speaker 4 (02:40):
Fans of them are in Canada. Well in Canada, they
got a lot of them. They didn't followed SGA and
lou Dorton so on.
Speaker 3 (02:47):
Uh.
Speaker 4 (02:47):
The reason why you didn't get a lot of those
texts is because this team is.
Speaker 3 (02:51):
Boring, absolutely in a good way. There's no good way
to be boring. To me.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
Well, what I mean is, if I'm the owner, I'm
don't have to I don't have to worry about player
X getting that four in the morning, call yo, well
you know he's down. He got arrested for I don't
have to worry about raking up to a tweet that
who's on the TV right now? SGA and j Doub
going at I can't stand you, man, You you don't
pass the ball like. They're boring in the sense of
you and you know you've been in your weight bag,
weight training bag and all that getting in the gym.
(03:19):
They're boring in a sense of consistency. They show up,
they work hard, they're united, they're familiar, their their teammates,
they love each other.
Speaker 3 (03:26):
You get through you have forty tonight. Well instead of
just you, all eight nine, ten guys are behind you
doing the press conference as well. So that's what I mean.
And boring in a good way, and that they're the model.
Speaker 1 (03:36):
Of consistency, sportsmanship, team work, and you're just like, well
that's great, but sometimes you want some juice behind that
or something.
Speaker 4 (03:43):
So I mean, it's the that's the thing. I think
all the things that you just said about them are
also true of just about every team that wins a
lot of games.
Speaker 3 (03:54):
They like, play really hard, they'll work together.
Speaker 4 (03:57):
Just think think about the teams in the East, like
right now, the Indiana Pacers is true for them.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
That's what made these two teams almost identical. But we
get different teams, but you get some too. If it
was the Knicks, then I don't know what's up with Cat?
Why Cat ain't playing in a minute? Why is he
sitting in the four? You know, you get a little
little something in there, Jalen Bronson. He's hogging too much?
Speaker 3 (04:17):
Are they?
Speaker 1 (04:17):
You could have some stuff in there. This team with
the kumbaya on that Kumbaya was one hundred, which again,
if I'm the owner, that's a great thing.
Speaker 4 (04:25):
And I'm not saying again everyone in Oklahoma City should
feel great about this.
Speaker 3 (04:29):
This is not a knock to them.
Speaker 4 (04:31):
I was talking about me as a consumer of the
Finals because generally the way this was pitted, this is
David and Goliath. Right, This was the biggest potential favorite
and NBA Finals history. We haven't seen this since twenty
eleven or oh two thousand and one, right, and the
two series that we remember vividly because of the way
(04:53):
either David had his moment in Game one like Alan
Iverson did to step over Toronto Loo, which then the
the rest of the years was so nondescript, and that
is the only thing, Like, no one forgets that the
Lakers won that championship.
Speaker 3 (05:07):
There's just no highlights from me. You can't name one thing.
Do you know what? I'm getting a hold in his
chest from Shack But.
Speaker 4 (05:14):
I mean, but no one did. I'm not saying nobody.
But you're not equating that. And the reason why you
equate that is because that was Allen Iverson's seminal moment
at the biggest stage of his career, right, that was
his primary moment. But then the twenty eleven team you
were are finals. You remember that because the the king fell, right,
the king fell to Lebron and had all the I
(05:37):
mean spawned. Honestly, fifteen years of takes from that one
m beat was one that one set of games.
Speaker 3 (05:45):
Here the goliath is boring.
Speaker 4 (05:50):
That's the problem, like Lebron, that that team Miami, Like
we were super into Miami and Lebron and invested in
that future Kobe and Shaq, even though that finals itself
was not the most interesting. Right, the moment that you
remember is Alan Iverson stepping over, and that maybe the
moment that you remember from this finals is Tyres Haliburton
(06:10):
hitting that shot in Game one, But you were invested
in what Kobe and Shaq were doing. When I watch
Shake Gildess Alexander and Chad Holmgren and Jalen Williams, they
are spursy and in a way that I cannot say
is complimentary. It is just like it is a byproduct
of what happens. Like everything he said is right in
(06:32):
the consistency and so on, even though if you like
drill down to some of the numbers, how consistent can
they are they when you look at their shooting percentage
and so on, Right, you're more consistency in terms of
being stoic in personality, And so I get that.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
You know what that also was?
Speaker 4 (06:45):
It was boring then too, And they won five championships
in fifteen years as one of the best runs in
NBA history, and nobody outside of San Antonio talks about
it unless you're old at the barbershop and you say,
and all, so, Tim Duncan really had it like that,
And they agreed.
Speaker 3 (07:00):
Tim Duncan had it like that. He had.
Speaker 4 (07:02):
But those are not the teams that we look back
fondly as the teams that we remember as the most
fun are great teams.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
Which is why I said rob g is my witness.
Can I get a witness? Robger? You know this? I
said this prior to the finals.
Speaker 1 (07:17):
I said that the person who will remember the most
throughout this postseason win loser draw was going to be
Tyrese Haliburton, And I said he was going to be
the most memorable person from this playoffs because of a
multitude of things. And then once we got into the finals,
it only added to why I believe I'm right. Tyrese
(07:39):
Haliburton came into this playoffs run as the most overrated player, right,
That's what his peers picked him as. And again, by
the way, that slightly, that slightly was overrated because only
fourteen people of one hundred and some, but fourteen people
is the most, so he becomes mister overrated. And also
part of that was because they started off slow and
we weren't thinking about them. And there were other storylines
(07:59):
in the like the Pistons all of a sudden being
good and all of a sudden, what's wrong with the Bucks?
And man the Celtic can they repeat against? So there
are other storylines. So the Pacers and they weren't doing it.
Although January first on they were the second best team
behind the Thunder.
Speaker 3 (08:15):
So then we get into postseason, he's mister overrated. What
does he do?
Speaker 1 (08:18):
He knocks off the Bucks. He knocks them off a
couple of game winners. Nice plays, good games. Bam, Pops
is walling. Pop's getting into it with Giannis as they
close out that series. So now Halliburton have to get
on the podium. Your dad was tripping a little bit.
Dad was overreacting, you know. So now he's again, He's
becoming the topic of conversation. Dang, he can't be over ready.
He just knocked out Jannis and them. Oh, and he's
(08:39):
you know, got the issues. Who pops Pops is cool?
Kick Pops out, man, Let Pops live. We're debating it.
We're having conversations even on this show. Then he goes
into the next series and the number one seed in
the East, Cleveland. This is about to be their year.
Finally we did it without Lebron and nope, you got Halliburton.
They come back multiple times down fifteen. He has another
couple of clutch games, hitting big shots were like, man,
this dude, how can we overrated? He might be underrated?
(09:02):
Then they go up against the Knicks. We already know
what happened, big comeback, fourteen, down fourteen, boom and he
hits the shot, does the choke again.
Speaker 3 (09:10):
Halliburton is the star of this.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
Now we get into the finals, Martin, and he hits
the game winner game one allah, as you mentioned Alan Iverson,
and so they are down forty eight of forty seven
and fifty what six seconds or whatever it was, nine
second point three whatever remaining, hits that game winner, and
then throughout he's injured, but he's playing good game, bad game.
We're still talking about him. We care he didn't show up,
(09:33):
he only had. He was zero for four in game five.
We have all these conversations, and finally it was a
Shakespearean ending to his season. Should he play? Shouldn't he plays?
Game six plays well, they win, They get into seven.
He starts off hot. You saw it three or four three,
You're thinking, oh, shoot, is he really about to pull
this off? Bam the Achilles pops and to me, for
everything I just mentioned, he's the star of this, even
(09:55):
in a loss like we're gonna remember that Halliburton run
oh the thunder, Whereas I said, man, anytime I stopping
the barber shop.
Speaker 3 (10:05):
Five years ten year twin. Remember that Halliburton run BRU
was out there.
Speaker 1 (10:09):
That was a crazy, crazy playoff run, and I just
think he ended up. I said this, you know what
two and a half three weeks ago, and to me
it ended that way. Even though SGA gets to win
as the MVP and the Thunder get to win and
get their title, I still think Hallibert ended up just
stealing all the headlines and the juice and the storylines
from this postseason and with you, as you mentioned, even
though congrats to the Thunder.
Speaker 4 (10:30):
I think that you have I think two things have
to happen for your thing to be all the way true. Okay,
the first or one thing has to not happen. Okase,
he can't go back and win multiple titles, because if
they if they go back and win multiple titles, the
way that a lot of people who have the same
govern me have been saying all day, then this will
(10:52):
get erased to the history of this. It will be
chapter one of a book in NBA history, right, So
it won't be the memories of Halliburton. We'll see those
shots every playoff, but it won't be like it'll be
like the way that you show those uh.
Speaker 3 (11:07):
Montages and commercials.
Speaker 4 (11:08):
Right, we'll remember like the moment, but it won't be
in the context, won't be there because it'll be what
is it, the birth of the juggernaut. Maybe maybe that's
the memory of it also too. The thing that has
to happen, absolutely has to happen, is Tyre's Halliburton has
to play at a high level again.
Speaker 3 (11:24):
And I'm not saying that he won't.
Speaker 4 (11:25):
I don't think that's an unlikely scenario, but I do
think that it is likely are more likely than not
that the Pacers have it.
Speaker 3 (11:35):
It's really hard to get to the the NBA.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
Final, especially nowadays with all these he keeps flopping every year.
It right like you have a juggernaut, Lakers, Warriors, We're
going every year. We all knew it from the beginning
of the season.
Speaker 4 (11:45):
We talk about seven unique champions in the last seven years.
Look at the final four of the that's also a
lot of the unusual suspects. It's hard to get back
to this spot. So I think without more playoff experience,
I wonder how much you know he becomes a the
reason iverson We know that moment because he's a Hall
(12:07):
of Famer, right, Like, that's why it lasts. There's a
ton of guys with a ton of playoff moments that
are kind of just lost to the story of others
along the way.
Speaker 1 (12:18):
The only I hear what you're saying. I agree with
the first point, But I do believe he did so much.
If he had a shot, two shots, or a comeback
or one or two. He had comebacks. He had game winner,
literal game winner at the buzzers. I mean, he had everything.
I think people.
Speaker 4 (12:34):
Remember it, like people remember like remember that Kember run,
do you know? But I wonder how many people remember
how it ended. I think it'll be more of a
Reggie Miller choke. Ironically, enough pacers meeting will always remember that. Finally,
that's for sure.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in
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Speaker 3 (12:59):
Hi, this is Jay.
Speaker 5 (13:00):
I'm the producer of the Paula and Tony Fusco Show.
Usually in these promos they asked you to listen to
the show. I'm here to ask you please don't listen
to the show. The hosts are two absolute morons who
have the dumbest takes on sports magicable. Don't listen to
the show so it can get cancels.
Speaker 3 (13:16):
Get him, that fool. Listen to the Tony Fusco Show
on the iHeart Radio app or wherever you get your podcast.
He's still moving well.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
Somebody who clearly changed the case for a lot of
team three of them.
Speaker 3 (13:33):
In fact, he went and won a championship for that.
Speaker 1 (13:35):
Lebron and he had a lot to say about he
has MVP four MVPs and how the conversation with Steve
national mindu podcast about what is the help me out,
what's the criteria?
Speaker 3 (13:45):
What are we doing? What is an MVP. Here's what
Bron had to say.
Speaker 6 (13:47):
It's changes. It's like, okay, it's always it the is
it the best player? You know? Is it the is
it the player that had the best season with his team,
you know, maybe that's offensive player of the year, you know,
or is it the just simply the best player in
the league, like statistically was the best player of the league,
(14:10):
you know, no matter you know, obviously you're not gonna
have a guy in there that's like, doesn't the team
didn't come close to making the playoffs, well obviously, because
if that's the case, then he's not the best player,
you know, but it's not the most valuable then. But
if it's I don't know, it's just it's just changes.
It changes too much.
Speaker 4 (14:30):
I completely agree, and it is something that as somebody
who has worked.
Speaker 3 (14:35):
In the national media since twenty fifteen.
Speaker 4 (14:38):
I feel like I sometimes get gas lit by what
the conversation is on a yearly basis over how we
define who the most valuable player in the NBA is.
Because when I broke into the national media, I was
told that averaging a triple double for the five sheet
was what made you the MVP and the reason why.
Speaker 3 (14:57):
They said, well, Kevin Durant left and that.
Speaker 4 (14:59):
Was the most narrative based MVP and like in modern
MVP history. And then I felt like we went further down,
like that was like the apex of narrative MVP. And
then as a result we swung back and was like,
now we gotta get stats MVP, and we reached the
apex of stats MVP. When Jokic is averaging a million
different advanced stats and he's like, well, if you look
(15:21):
at his PR and his raptor and his war and
his you know, wins about all of this other stuff
is you know, ops, he's killing it right, I'm like,
all right, right, exactly like when you look at all
of that, he's the best.
Speaker 3 (15:33):
Player to like, well, I look at his team or
the four seat. You know what I'm saying, what are
we doing here? I cannot like and and look, Lebron.
Speaker 4 (15:43):
I'm with you when you write I'm with you when
you write the offensive Player of the of the year
in the NBA? Is it needs to be instituted so badly?
I ask you this. Let's say the postseason from game one,
Round one. I know that feels like eight years ago now,
but around one game one to Game seven of the
(16:06):
of the NBA Finals, say that was its own season,
who would you say was the MVP of that season
the MVP of this postseason? You can pick two or three.
I still think it's that Sga. You still think it's Thatga.
Speaker 1 (16:23):
It was a boring We talked about it yesterday, but
dude was putting up thirty on the level that only
Michael Jordan's done. So, I mean, he was balling out
of control. If you asked me who was the most
exciting and just what a wild ride Tyre's helliburn. But
at the end of the day, he had way too
many games.
Speaker 4 (16:38):
Oh that he had fourteen, but the amount of game
winning shots that he hit in that playoffs with the
idea that he's the guy who is the straw that
stirs the drink, which I kind of, you know, hand up,
my bad, I thought a little overblown.
Speaker 3 (16:54):
Then I watched without it. I was like, oh, okay, no
kind of cutting. This is legit, this is real.
Speaker 4 (17:01):
And because it's really hard to quantify the absence of
turning of like the absence of something missing Tyreek Heliburton
not turning the ball over something, it's hard to see,
you know what you see all those pick six is like, Oh,
that's what they were talking about. This is what the
this is what the whole thing is. To me, Sga
would have been the offensive player of the year on
(17:24):
this team, which to me, didn't shoot well from the floor.
Speaker 3 (17:27):
Their key was the defense.
Speaker 4 (17:29):
Their key was all of that right, and Shade was
not nearly the best defender on the floor competes on
the defensive end, but he is benefiting off of the
wing defenders that they have out there, the rim protections
that they have getting out there making stuff happen. On
the offensive end, I would have had him be the
Offensive Player of the Year in this stretch in the
regular season MVPEAT to me would have been Jokic.
Speaker 3 (17:50):
Now, the thing is they would give Jokic four MVPs. Well,
some of these other ones should have been Offensive Player
of the Year awards. That's my point. I get what
you're saying, so but to me.
Speaker 4 (18:00):
The most valuable player is not necessarily the guy who's
always scoring the most points on the best team. And
I think we end up it just like you said,
narrative changes all the time. Offensive player would be who's
the best score right now? And I think that's just
a much cleaner way to define it. And I think
we mix up who's the best scorer and who's the MVP.
(18:21):
To me, it's two far for me one.
Speaker 1 (18:25):
I think the issue is when we universally know the
best player is filling the blank, that person needs a
flat out be the MVP. And what I mean by
that is there was an eight to nine ten year
period with Lebron James. You can maybe even go more.
I might be selling them short. Was the best player
in the NBA period everybody know you woke up Lebron
James best player.
Speaker 3 (18:44):
From probably nineteen eighty seven, eighty eight to nineteen ninety eight,
except for a couple of years, Michael Jordan's the best
player in the NBA.
Speaker 1 (18:53):
So the idea that we then turn around and play
and say, ooh, will Karl Malone, well, Charles Barkley, well,
ooh remember that year?
Speaker 3 (18:59):
Oh Derek, it's cute what the bulls are doing?
Speaker 1 (19:01):
Yeah, he's and he got demolished in the playoffs, and
you saw he looked much. He looked less than going
up against a motivated Lebron who was like, let me
show y'all how he's not that guy in comparison to me.
The point is we do that too often, in my opinion,
where we all know who the best player is, we
all whatever you want to call it, best player, MVP,
that person is it, and historically we have not given
(19:23):
it to him. And I think a part of that
is leads to why I think we'll never have a criteria,
because I think people enjoy the idea subconsciously, subliminally in
the back.
Speaker 3 (19:32):
Of their mind Martin, that they can go, well, let's
just give it to somebody else.
Speaker 1 (19:36):
Because otherwise they know, for a ten year perio, you
probably gave it to Michael Jordan. For an eight to
ten year per you would have gave it to Lebron.
There's a period where maybe for five years you just
gave it to Peyton Manning, like dude, he's justin' nobody.
Like Peyton Manning, you might have just gave it to him.
So therefore, I think people subconsciously don't even know that
they do want this because it leads for the fodder.
It leads for the conversation, It leads for the sports
(19:58):
debates and the barbersh on radio and on TV.
Speaker 3 (20:02):
No is it Yokis? No? Is it Shaye?
Speaker 6 (20:04):
No?
Speaker 3 (20:04):
Is it Lebron?
Speaker 2 (20:05):
No?
Speaker 3 (20:05):
Is it Kobe? Is it?
Speaker 4 (20:06):
No?
Speaker 3 (20:06):
Is it? Uh? Uh? This person of this person? Is
it Payton?
Speaker 1 (20:10):
Or is it you know, ladanele and Thomason? And I
think it leads to that because of the vagueness of it.
I think we ultimately want it, We just don't know
that we want it. Otherwise I think people will be bored.
Handed it to Michael Jordan for a decade, handed it
to Lebron handed, and Peyton Manning handed. Whatever the sport
is handing it to that guy for five to six
year period, and I think subconsciously we like that. We
(20:33):
like the debate, the fight. No, I mean, I like,
is it about the best player on the best team. No,
it's guy James Harden is doing stuff we've never seen,
thirty five games and leading the league in assists and points.
And I think we enjoy that more than we actually
know that we do, because I don't think our human
nature wants to just give it to And this is
why I sat here for what two months, give or take,
(20:55):
yelling at Rob Lamar Jackson is not gonna win the MVP.
Look at his numbers. I said, I know you're right.
Rob g is my witness, and so of the listeners.
I said, people are tired of giving it to him. Yes,
the numbers are great, Yes they're better than the last season.
Guess what they're gonna say, it's Chush Allen's time. Well,
(21:16):
he's the first note when they are the All Pro
comes out only one time in hard forred years. Is
All Pro get it wrong? I said, well this could
be in a union. They can happen again and Josh
Allen wins it. My point was human nature gets fatigued
of things. It's you can't, it's you have to be
so self aware to not do that. And you know
(21:36):
it is argument always like to be well, Barry Bonds
won it all those times, and ROS said yes.
Speaker 3 (21:40):
Because they have two leagues. If they had one, I
guarantee you Barry Bonds would not have won it over
and over.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
It's easy, all right, Well he's the best off area.
Somebody mix it up. On the other side. If there
was just one MLB MVP, Barry Bonds would not have
won it. I think it was, what five times in
a row, whatever it was, because they would have gotten
bored with somebody else. Well, all he's doing is hitting
home run. They would have found some human nature reason
to do that. So I think we don't want it
to be that simplistic. So therefore we have different options.
(22:07):
We have different people because sometimes in sports there's somebody
who's just that good for that period where we'd have
to just keep handing it to.
Speaker 3 (22:14):
Him or her every year.
Speaker 4 (22:16):
Well, speaking of handing it out, Dallas Mavericks nine time
All Star Kyrie Irving declined his forty three million dollar
player option and is signing a three year, one hundred
and nineteen million dollar contract with the Dallas Mavericks with
a player option. At twenty twenty seven, Kyrie lerving congratulations
on a torn acl in your thirties with a player
(22:41):
option to go ahead and get well. He had forty
three coming, So he's a quick math by me bag
eighty more over the next two years, and you get
to choose whether or not you want that forty in
year three.
Speaker 3 (22:55):
Hey, I'm about to start wearing long fur hearings. Ear
he wears is salute to his agent his mother.
Speaker 2 (23:03):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Odd Couple
with Rob Parker and kelvin Washington weekdays at seven pm
Eastern four pm Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and the
iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 1 (23:15):
Nico Harrison, who's running the basketball operations over there, had
this to say about Cooper Flag.
Speaker 7 (23:22):
I think it's two things. I think it's win now.
It's also win in the future. And we don't know
when eventually it's going to be Cooper's team. We don't
know when that when that transition will happen. So I
think it's win now and then set yourself up to
win in the future as well.
Speaker 3 (23:39):
Well.
Speaker 1 (23:40):
You mister fan of the MAVs mass fan. He's talking
about you could win now when in the future, win tomorrow,
win ten, just a lot of winning in the coming
hold up, is what I have to say to all
of that. Oh here we go now, all right on paper? Yes,
I like what I see. Okay, you talked about it,
Kyrie Irvan still playing at a high level.
Speaker 3 (24:01):
Anthony Davis playing at a really high level as well.
Speaker 1 (24:04):
You got Lively, you got Gaffert, you got you got
other Clay. You gotta watch the piece of PJ. Washington.
By the way, I just PJ. Washington. I mentioned it
the other day. Every four years we get a guy
whoever becomes man, if we could just get a h
it was Rudy Gay for years. Man, we were Rudy
Gay away. It was Tobias Harris. To me, PJ. Washington's
(24:24):
become that new guy. You're like, Man, if we could
just get like a like a PJ. Washington for those
teams that are right there, you know, just we need
another guy who get that, like the Knicks forensic for instance.
Speaker 3 (24:34):
Yep, Man, if we just had like a PJ. Washington,
he's gonna be that new thing guy for me.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
But with that being said, man, Carrie, listen, I liked
what I see on paper, but this was my issue
with the initial trade of Luca. It wasn't just that
you traded Luca, although that was hard to get past, man,
that's crazy. It was that you traded him and your
whole point was, I don't know, it could be a
catastrophic injury coming he didn't take care of his body.
But so you got a guy who's six years older
(25:01):
in Ad, who is proving to be injured a lot
in his career, and then you paired him with and
off injured Kyrie. So that was what you didn't pair
him with Michael Bridges, iron man, who hasn't missed a
game in his NBA career. You paired him with injured Kyrie,
and then what happened Game one with Ad and it
(25:22):
was so exciting too, but he was injured.
Speaker 3 (25:25):
But he gets injured.
Speaker 1 (25:26):
So this is where I'm apprehensive, is that you gotta
wait all the way to what you can say, optimistically
March with Kyrie coming back April.
Speaker 3 (25:36):
I think could be back before that, but okay, but
let's say it everywhere.
Speaker 1 (25:39):
I'll even grant you that February he goes to a
voodoo doctor and they put something on his knee. He's
back February, but he gotta he has to work back
in his shape. Okay, roll all that time, you're banking
on Anthony Davis not being injured so that your team
is in a good position, you know, and the standings.
I don't know if that's gonna be the case. So
now I got an old Clayton Thompson who's off injured.
(26:01):
Now Kyrie a d with a rookie, and I'm like,
on paper, I get it, but that's asking for a
lot for all those guys to hold up and hold
up at the same time. Okay, he's back, Wait, hold on,
now you get back. All right, now, we got to
be best already to roll come April and May. I
just don't know if they're going to be built for that.
I like it on paper, but I'm skeptical of the
(26:21):
injury report. Yeah, come the late spring. Yeah, but that's
every team. No, No, Listen.
Speaker 8 (26:27):
What you're saying though, is if something happens, and yes,
we've seen it happen, so it's not like it can't happen.
But that's every team. You have to have luck, you
have to have health, throughout the season. And so if
you don't have those things, nobody's a contender.
Speaker 3 (26:41):
Right.
Speaker 8 (26:41):
So all we have right now is that hypothetical of
what we see on paper, right like man man man, like,
all these things add up in the stack up right.
Boston coming into this year, we thought they were a
prohibited favorite, right like they are. They were injuries derailed them.
It wasn't a team that beat them, it was injuries.
Speaker 3 (27:01):
Right.
Speaker 8 (27:01):
So that's always the case when you look at the
same and you talk about Nico saying this is a
win now, this is a win in the future as well.
This window with this group is gonna be short. So Cooper,
if he gets all that he needs to get done
in these couple of these first to two, I would
say two years with this unit that they have and
it doesn't work out the way hypothetic hypothetically it could
(27:24):
or couldn't. They still have a core with Cooper, Flag,
d Live Gafford, PJ. Washington or will attract other people.
And don't forget they're also right now going after another
point guard that can be a stop gap until Kyrie
gets back. That's a starter that should be a start
in his lead. That type of that type of person.
(27:44):
So this same is still good. Now I win a championship,
that's just that's far fetch. We don't know what that
looks like until we see all of them together. But
right now I'm loving it. Man, I'm not mad at it.
Speaker 3 (27:54):
I like it. On paper.
Speaker 1 (27:56):
It is again hypothetical. We'll have to wait and see. Uh,
but I don't know about the win now. I'm not
as high on the win. Now, there's some other teams
that I can feel like I've had, like how many?
By the way, rob g was that Eddie House who
had the Mavericks going to the Western Conference final yesterday?
Speaker 3 (28:11):
Yes, there you go, I said, excuse me, Eddie.
Speaker 8 (28:15):
Yeah, and rashand Phillis, by the way, or both of
them both both did dang.
Speaker 3 (28:20):
I know Eddie Eddie fools stories that he think they
could make a run. Rashad said the.
Speaker 1 (28:26):
Right because I said Houston and he about laughed me off. No, no,
Houston can make him round. He laughed laughed off because
he said, you don't think Kevin Durant is the piece,
And I'm like, well, it's not that he is not.
Speaker 3 (28:36):
He has to be their savior, dude.
Speaker 1 (28:37):
They got am and Thompson gonna be leaps and bounds
better sengoon down low, Fred Van Vls.
Speaker 8 (28:43):
If you missed this guy, we're gonna we're gonna have
a problem. Keep going. Yeah, Jabari Smith Jacks's my guy. Yeah,
him paired with Kevin Durant and learning the tricks of
the trade.
Speaker 3 (28:53):
Oh, I'm excited to see him.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
Well, yeah, I was too too, Yoda Rashan Phillis was
laughing at all. I'm like, I thought Kevin Durant fit
perfectly over there, and he soon Yeah. So, but again,
Cooper Flagg there now is in the wrong pick. And
also I like to that he doesn't he's not just
a man. All I can do is shoot because he
can fit right in, and they can say, all right,
(29:17):
eight is going to be down low.
Speaker 3 (29:18):
He's going to do his things, And that actually is
kind of scary.
Speaker 1 (29:21):
If Anthony Davis is engaged, healthy and active defensively, which
he usually is, yes, and then you pair him with
Cooper who gets to roam and kind of roll and
be a secondary defender. Guy gets by somebody, He's coming
for the block, passing lanes with that athleticism. Speak man,
I like that. I will I will admit that is
kind of scary. You mentioned with Lively, and that's don't
(29:41):
go down there trying to score. I'm telling you that
front line. I'll give you that frontline defensively is kind
of scary. But I like that he night in the
night out and you know what reminds me of and
the only reason I didn't bring him up because he
wasn't a number one pick when you brought Tim Duncan.
It reminds me of Kawhi. I think they got him
at eleven and he gets to just come in, be
(30:02):
under Tony Parker, Ginobili, ducking all these guys, be one
of the guys. And then you like, oh, this guy's
really really good defensively Okay, he's athletic getting out on
the break, okay, oh mid range, kind of coming around
a little bit. Yeah, And you look up and you're like, man,
he's a finals MVP of that twenty fourteen team. Shout
out to that, shout out to Steve Balmer. I don't
(30:24):
know he did that. Steve Mamber did that. So I
like that he can just kind of fit in and float.
What do you need from tonight?
Speaker 4 (30:30):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (30:31):
You just need eight points twelve rebounds.
Speaker 1 (30:32):
Three blocks got you okay, so now you needed me
to go and a lot of points in fast break,
you know who also liking it to offensively speaking, Pascal Siakama,
that you don't have to say call plays.
Speaker 3 (30:43):
I can get it in transition. I can get it
just you know, put some putbacks.
Speaker 1 (30:47):
I can get it in a little mid range here
there early on, Pascal, where we can make saying, I
don't know, he's kind of good. I don't know what
he does great, but he's just good. And I see
that where you at on and what he can actually
bring immediately.
Speaker 8 (31:01):
And I was gonna I was gonna ask you that too,
But for me, it's he's gonna score fourteen just off effort.
So I would see him early on, I mean this
year probably in that sixteen to eighteen range, and I
don't I.
Speaker 1 (31:14):
Might even go lower to your thirteen four. But because
I don't need like I might necessarily need it.
Speaker 8 (31:18):
Yeah, I just say that, because he's gonna play hard
right Like again, I don't think they will run a
lot of plays. But the thing I do see with them,
I know they want to push the pace a little
bit more than they have in the past. Obviously with
Luca gone, they want to push it. I can see
him playing that point forward position right, and the ball
can be in his hands a lot more. He can
make a lot of plays too, And with that, with
(31:39):
all the lob threats that he has in Dallas, now
you're going to have to make decisions. And he's a
really good lob throws because we saw that with them
half his team round to everybody right tomorrow watching those guys.
But man, listen, I think he's going to average around
like in that sixteen to eighteen range, and I think
he's going to be obviously Rookie of the Year. But
I mean that's going to be competition there because all
the guys are in and worse situations
Thanks for listening to the best of the Odd Couple podcasts.
Be sure to check us out live every weekday from
four to seven pm Pacific seven to ten pm Eastern
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Speaker 2 (00:19):
You're listening to the best of the Odd.
Speaker 3 (00:21):
Couple, Martin.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
When we had the NBA Finals, which you jumped in
a couple of times, overall, you were excited about this
from just a sports fan, from a basketball fan. You
weren't one of those blah blah NBA Finals, who's watching this?
Speaker 3 (00:37):
You were in? Yeah, to me, shocking turn of events.
Speaker 4 (00:41):
Guy who decided to try to make a living talking
about sports exact, actually excited to watch games. I know
that that is seemingly rare across society these days, more
and more increasingly so. But yeah, I was locked in.
I was interested the NBA playoffs. They're fun, that's it.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
And I'm more like you, I will admit, and I've
said this several times in the show. It is strange, Martin.
In my however, many years living, you know how it goes.
Oh man, this series is crazy. I can't believe he
took that shot. Why would they do this? Oh, they
got to get swept. I didn't get any kind of
text like that with this series. There is the strangest
thing is normally the polar opposite, right, this guys that
I can't believe y'all think he's nice.
Speaker 3 (01:22):
He's not nice, he's you get all that kind of stuff,
And I don't know if it's just because they're a
social group of fun guys, nice guys hard to hate
on no real like.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
Eat both teams, Like who's the guy you hate? Like
for instance, Celtics Lakers, you might have hated KG or
Paul Paul Pierce is weak. I can't believe man Kobe
over there's something in there. This one was like, even
if you're going for the Pacers, you to hate the Thunder.
If you were going for the Thunder, you almost like
the Celtics series. It wasn't a lot of a lot
of that.
Speaker 3 (01:51):
We're getting into a dangerous territory already.
Speaker 4 (01:53):
I want to start just by staying congratulations through Yoklahoma
City Thunder for winning the NBA.
Speaker 3 (01:59):
Fun. Yes, that's a big thing.
Speaker 4 (02:00):
Shake Gildis, Alexander just chopped topped off one of the
most statistically historic years in terms of the hardware taking
and points scored and sold and so forth, that we'll
see an NBA history Ottao, I feel like we're seeing
new NBA history made every shiven a week day, just
about right. If you don't like the weather, you know,
if you don't like the record, the same, same kind
of deal. But uh, but no, and okay, see how
(02:23):
they're set up for the future.
Speaker 3 (02:25):
We'll talk about that. I'm sure down the line.
Speaker 4 (02:27):
In terms of this series today, you know, congratulations to them.
I'm sure everybody in Oklahoma City is very excited and
very happy. And the fans of them across the nation
if they you know, if they exist.
Speaker 3 (02:39):
But also the.
Speaker 4 (02:40):
Fans of them are in Canada. Well in Canada, they
got a lot of them. They didn't followed SGA and
lou Dorton so on.
Speaker 3 (02:47):
Uh.
Speaker 4 (02:47):
The reason why you didn't get a lot of those
texts is because this team is.
Speaker 3 (02:51):
Boring, absolutely in a good way. There's no good way
to be boring. To me.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
Well, what I mean is, if I'm the owner, I'm
don't have to I don't have to worry about player
X getting that four in the morning, call yo, well
you know he's down. He got arrested for I don't
have to worry about raking up to a tweet that
who's on the TV right now? SGA and j Doub
going at I can't stand you, man, You you don't
pass the ball like. They're boring in the sense of
you and you know you've been in your weight bag,
weight training bag and all that getting in the gym.
(03:19):
They're boring in a sense of consistency. They show up,
they work hard, they're united, they're familiar, their their teammates,
they love each other.
Speaker 3 (03:26):
You get through you have forty tonight. Well instead of
just you, all eight nine, ten guys are behind you
doing the press conference as well. So that's what I mean.
And boring in a good way, and that they're the model.
Speaker 1 (03:36):
Of consistency, sportsmanship, team work, and you're just like, well
that's great, but sometimes you want some juice behind that
or something.
Speaker 4 (03:43):
So I mean, it's the that's the thing. I think
all the things that you just said about them are
also true of just about every team that wins a
lot of games.
Speaker 3 (03:54):
They like, play really hard, they'll work together.
Speaker 4 (03:57):
Just think think about the teams in the East, like
right now, the Indiana Pacers is true for them.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
That's what made these two teams almost identical. But we
get different teams, but you get some too. If it
was the Knicks, then I don't know what's up with Cat?
Why Cat ain't playing in a minute? Why is he
sitting in the four? You know, you get a little
little something in there, Jalen Bronson. He's hogging too much?
Speaker 3 (04:17):
Are they?
Speaker 1 (04:17):
You could have some stuff in there. This team with
the kumbaya on that Kumbaya was one hundred, which again,
if I'm the owner, that's a great thing.
Speaker 4 (04:25):
And I'm not saying again everyone in Oklahoma City should
feel great about this.
Speaker 3 (04:29):
This is not a knock to them.
Speaker 4 (04:31):
I was talking about me as a consumer of the
Finals because generally the way this was pitted, this is
David and Goliath. Right, This was the biggest potential favorite
and NBA Finals history. We haven't seen this since twenty
eleven or oh two thousand and one, right, and the
two series that we remember vividly because of the way
(04:53):
either David had his moment in Game one like Alan
Iverson did to step over Toronto Loo, which then the
the rest of the years was so nondescript, and that
is the only thing, Like, no one forgets that the
Lakers won that championship.
Speaker 3 (05:07):
There's just no highlights from me. You can't name one thing.
Do you know what? I'm getting a hold in his
chest from Shack But.
Speaker 4 (05:14):
I mean, but no one did. I'm not saying nobody.
But you're not equating that. And the reason why you
equate that is because that was Allen Iverson's seminal moment
at the biggest stage of his career, right, that was
his primary moment. But then the twenty eleven team you
were are finals. You remember that because the the king fell, right,
the king fell to Lebron and had all the I
(05:37):
mean spawned. Honestly, fifteen years of takes from that one
m beat was one that one set of games.
Speaker 3 (05:45):
Here the goliath is boring.
Speaker 4 (05:50):
That's the problem, like Lebron, that that team Miami, Like
we were super into Miami and Lebron and invested in
that future Kobe and Shaq, even though that finals itself
was not the most interesting. Right, the moment that you
remember is Alan Iverson stepping over, and that maybe the
moment that you remember from this finals is Tyres Haliburton
(06:10):
hitting that shot in Game one, But you were invested
in what Kobe and Shaq were doing. When I watch
Shake Gildess Alexander and Chad Holmgren and Jalen Williams, they
are spursy and in a way that I cannot say
is complimentary. It is just like it is a byproduct
of what happens. Like everything he said is right in
(06:32):
the consistency and so on, even though if you like
drill down to some of the numbers, how consistent can
they are they when you look at their shooting percentage
and so on, Right, you're more consistency in terms of
being stoic in personality, And so I get that.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
You know what that also was?
Speaker 4 (06:45):
It was boring then too, And they won five championships
in fifteen years as one of the best runs in
NBA history, and nobody outside of San Antonio talks about
it unless you're old at the barbershop and you say,
and all, so, Tim Duncan really had it like that,
And they agreed.
Speaker 3 (07:00):
Tim Duncan had it like that. He had.
Speaker 4 (07:02):
But those are not the teams that we look back
fondly as the teams that we remember as the most
fun are great teams.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
Which is why I said rob g is my witness.
Can I get a witness? Robger? You know this? I
said this prior to the finals.
Speaker 1 (07:17):
I said that the person who will remember the most
throughout this postseason win loser draw was going to be
Tyrese Haliburton, And I said he was going to be
the most memorable person from this playoffs because of a
multitude of things. And then once we got into the finals,
it only added to why I believe I'm right. Tyrese
(07:39):
Haliburton came into this playoffs run as the most overrated player, right,
That's what his peers picked him as. And again, by
the way, that slightly, that slightly was overrated because only
fourteen people of one hundred and some, but fourteen people
is the most, so he becomes mister overrated. And also
part of that was because they started off slow and
we weren't thinking about them. And there were other storylines
(07:59):
in the like the Pistons all of a sudden being
good and all of a sudden, what's wrong with the Bucks?
And man the Celtic can they repeat against? So there
are other storylines. So the Pacers and they weren't doing it.
Although January first on they were the second best team
behind the Thunder.
Speaker 3 (08:15):
So then we get into postseason, he's mister overrated. What
does he do?
Speaker 1 (08:18):
He knocks off the Bucks. He knocks them off a
couple of game winners. Nice plays, good games. Bam, Pops
is walling. Pop's getting into it with Giannis as they
close out that series. So now Halliburton have to get
on the podium. Your dad was tripping a little bit.
Dad was overreacting, you know. So now he's again, He's
becoming the topic of conversation. Dang, he can't be over ready.
He just knocked out Jannis and them. Oh, and he's
(08:39):
you know, got the issues. Who pops Pops is cool?
Kick Pops out, man, Let Pops live. We're debating it.
We're having conversations even on this show. Then he goes
into the next series and the number one seed in
the East, Cleveland. This is about to be their year.
Finally we did it without Lebron and nope, you got Halliburton.
They come back multiple times down fifteen. He has another
couple of clutch games, hitting big shots were like, man,
this dude, how can we overrated? He might be underrated?
(09:02):
Then they go up against the Knicks. We already know
what happened, big comeback, fourteen, down fourteen, boom and he
hits the shot, does the choke again.
Speaker 3 (09:10):
Halliburton is the star of this.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
Now we get into the finals, Martin, and he hits
the game winner game one allah, as you mentioned Alan Iverson,
and so they are down forty eight of forty seven
and fifty what six seconds or whatever it was, nine
second point three whatever remaining, hits that game winner, and
then throughout he's injured, but he's playing good game, bad game.
We're still talking about him. We care he didn't show up,
(09:33):
he only had. He was zero for four in game five.
We have all these conversations, and finally it was a
Shakespearean ending to his season. Should he play? Shouldn't he plays?
Game six plays well, they win, They get into seven.
He starts off hot. You saw it three or four three,
You're thinking, oh, shoot, is he really about to pull
this off? Bam the Achilles pops and to me, for
everything I just mentioned, he's the star of this, even
(09:55):
in a loss like we're gonna remember that Halliburton run
oh the thunder, Whereas I said, man, anytime I stopping
the barber shop.
Speaker 3 (10:05):
Five years ten year twin. Remember that Halliburton run BRU
was out there.
Speaker 1 (10:09):
That was a crazy, crazy playoff run, and I just
think he ended up. I said this, you know what
two and a half three weeks ago, and to me
it ended that way. Even though SGA gets to win
as the MVP and the Thunder get to win and
get their title, I still think Hallibert ended up just
stealing all the headlines and the juice and the storylines
from this postseason and with you, as you mentioned, even
though congrats to the Thunder.
Speaker 4 (10:30):
I think that you have I think two things have
to happen for your thing to be all the way true. Okay,
the first or one thing has to not happen. Okase,
he can't go back and win multiple titles, because if
they if they go back and win multiple titles, the
way that a lot of people who have the same
govern me have been saying all day, then this will
(10:52):
get erased to the history of this. It will be
chapter one of a book in NBA history, right, So
it won't be the memories of Halliburton. We'll see those
shots every playoff, but it won't be like it'll be
like the way that you show those uh.
Speaker 3 (11:07):
Montages and commercials.
Speaker 4 (11:08):
Right, we'll remember like the moment, but it won't be
in the context, won't be there because it'll be what
is it, the birth of the juggernaut. Maybe maybe that's
the memory of it also too. The thing that has
to happen, absolutely has to happen, is Tyre's Halliburton has
to play at a high level again.
Speaker 3 (11:24):
And I'm not saying that he won't.
Speaker 4 (11:25):
I don't think that's an unlikely scenario, but I do
think that it is likely are more likely than not
that the Pacers have it.
Speaker 3 (11:35):
It's really hard to get to the the NBA.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
Final, especially nowadays with all these he keeps flopping every year.
It right like you have a juggernaut, Lakers, Warriors, We're
going every year. We all knew it from the beginning
of the season.
Speaker 4 (11:45):
We talk about seven unique champions in the last seven years.
Look at the final four of the that's also a
lot of the unusual suspects. It's hard to get back
to this spot. So I think without more playoff experience,
I wonder how much you know he becomes a the
reason iverson We know that moment because he's a Hall
(12:07):
of Famer, right, Like, that's why it lasts. There's a
ton of guys with a ton of playoff moments that
are kind of just lost to the story of others
along the way.
Speaker 1 (12:18):
The only I hear what you're saying. I agree with
the first point, But I do believe he did so much.
If he had a shot, two shots, or a comeback
or one or two. He had comebacks. He had game winner,
literal game winner at the buzzers. I mean, he had everything.
I think people.
Speaker 4 (12:34):
Remember it, like people remember like remember that Kember run,
do you know? But I wonder how many people remember
how it ended. I think it'll be more of a
Reggie Miller choke. Ironically, enough pacers meeting will always remember that. Finally,
that's for sure.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in
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Speaker 3 (12:59):
Hi, this is Jay.
Speaker 5 (13:00):
I'm the producer of the Paula and Tony Fusco Show.
Usually in these promos they asked you to listen to
the show. I'm here to ask you please don't listen
to the show. The hosts are two absolute morons who
have the dumbest takes on sports magicable. Don't listen to
the show so it can get cancels.
Speaker 3 (13:16):
Get him, that fool. Listen to the Tony Fusco Show
on the iHeart Radio app or wherever you get your podcast.
He's still moving well.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
Somebody who clearly changed the case for a lot of
team three of them.
Speaker 3 (13:33):
In fact, he went and won a championship for that.
Speaker 1 (13:35):
Lebron and he had a lot to say about he
has MVP four MVPs and how the conversation with Steve
national mindu podcast about what is the help me out,
what's the criteria?
Speaker 3 (13:45):
What are we doing? What is an MVP. Here's what
Bron had to say.
Speaker 6 (13:47):
It's changes. It's like, okay, it's always it the is
it the best player? You know? Is it the is
it the player that had the best season with his team,
you know, maybe that's offensive player of the year, you know,
or is it the just simply the best player in
the league, like statistically was the best player of the league,
(14:10):
you know, no matter you know, obviously you're not gonna
have a guy in there that's like, doesn't the team
didn't come close to making the playoffs, well obviously, because
if that's the case, then he's not the best player,
you know, but it's not the most valuable then. But
if it's I don't know, it's just it's just changes.
It changes too much.
Speaker 4 (14:30):
I completely agree, and it is something that as somebody
who has worked.
Speaker 3 (14:35):
In the national media since twenty fifteen.
Speaker 4 (14:38):
I feel like I sometimes get gas lit by what
the conversation is on a yearly basis over how we
define who the most valuable player in the NBA is.
Because when I broke into the national media, I was
told that averaging a triple double for the five sheet
was what made you the MVP and the reason why.
Speaker 3 (14:57):
They said, well, Kevin Durant left and that.
Speaker 4 (14:59):
Was the most narrative based MVP and like in modern
MVP history. And then I felt like we went further down,
like that was like the apex of narrative MVP. And
then as a result we swung back and was like,
now we gotta get stats MVP, and we reached the
apex of stats MVP. When Jokic is averaging a million
different advanced stats and he's like, well, if you look
(15:21):
at his PR and his raptor and his war and
his you know, wins about all of this other stuff
is you know, ops, he's killing it right, I'm like,
all right, right, exactly like when you look at all
of that, he's the best.
Speaker 3 (15:33):
Player to like, well, I look at his team or
the four seat. You know what I'm saying, what are
we doing here? I cannot like and and look, Lebron.
Speaker 4 (15:43):
I'm with you when you write I'm with you when
you write the offensive Player of the of the year
in the NBA? Is it needs to be instituted so badly?
I ask you this. Let's say the postseason from game one,
Round one. I know that feels like eight years ago now,
but around one game one to Game seven of the
(16:06):
of the NBA Finals, say that was its own season,
who would you say was the MVP of that season
the MVP of this postseason? You can pick two or three.
I still think it's that Sga. You still think it's Thatga.
Speaker 1 (16:23):
It was a boring We talked about it yesterday, but
dude was putting up thirty on the level that only
Michael Jordan's done. So, I mean, he was balling out
of control. If you asked me who was the most
exciting and just what a wild ride Tyre's helliburn. But
at the end of the day, he had way too
many games.
Speaker 4 (16:38):
Oh that he had fourteen, but the amount of game
winning shots that he hit in that playoffs with the
idea that he's the guy who is the straw that
stirs the drink, which I kind of, you know, hand up,
my bad, I thought a little overblown.
Speaker 3 (16:54):
Then I watched without it. I was like, oh, okay, no
kind of cutting. This is legit, this is real.
Speaker 4 (17:01):
And because it's really hard to quantify the absence of
turning of like the absence of something missing Tyreek Heliburton
not turning the ball over something, it's hard to see,
you know what you see all those pick six is like, Oh,
that's what they were talking about. This is what the
this is what the whole thing is. To me, Sga
would have been the offensive player of the year on
(17:24):
this team, which to me, didn't shoot well from the floor.
Speaker 3 (17:27):
Their key was the defense.
Speaker 4 (17:29):
Their key was all of that right, and Shade was
not nearly the best defender on the floor competes on
the defensive end, but he is benefiting off of the
wing defenders that they have out there, the rim protections
that they have getting out there making stuff happen. On
the offensive end, I would have had him be the
Offensive Player of the Year in this stretch in the
regular season MVPEAT to me would have been Jokic.
Speaker 3 (17:50):
Now, the thing is they would give Jokic four MVPs. Well,
some of these other ones should have been Offensive Player
of the Year awards. That's my point. I get what
you're saying, so but to me.
Speaker 4 (18:00):
The most valuable player is not necessarily the guy who's
always scoring the most points on the best team. And
I think we end up it just like you said,
narrative changes all the time. Offensive player would be who's
the best score right now? And I think that's just
a much cleaner way to define it. And I think
we mix up who's the best scorer and who's the MVP.
(18:21):
To me, it's two far for me one.
Speaker 1 (18:25):
I think the issue is when we universally know the
best player is filling the blank, that person needs a
flat out be the MVP. And what I mean by
that is there was an eight to nine ten year
period with Lebron James. You can maybe even go more.
I might be selling them short. Was the best player
in the NBA period everybody know you woke up Lebron
James best player.
Speaker 3 (18:44):
From probably nineteen eighty seven, eighty eight to nineteen ninety eight,
except for a couple of years, Michael Jordan's the best
player in the NBA.
Speaker 1 (18:53):
So the idea that we then turn around and play
and say, ooh, will Karl Malone, well, Charles Barkley, well,
ooh remember that year?
Speaker 3 (18:59):
Oh Derek, it's cute what the bulls are doing?
Speaker 1 (19:01):
Yeah, he's and he got demolished in the playoffs, and
you saw he looked much. He looked less than going
up against a motivated Lebron who was like, let me
show y'all how he's not that guy in comparison to me.
The point is we do that too often, in my opinion,
where we all know who the best player is, we
all whatever you want to call it, best player, MVP,
that person is it, and historically we have not given
(19:23):
it to him. And I think a part of that
is leads to why I think we'll never have a criteria,
because I think people enjoy the idea subconsciously, subliminally in
the back.
Speaker 3 (19:32):
Of their mind Martin, that they can go, well, let's
just give it to somebody else.
Speaker 1 (19:36):
Because otherwise they know, for a ten year perio, you
probably gave it to Michael Jordan. For an eight to
ten year per you would have gave it to Lebron.
There's a period where maybe for five years you just
gave it to Peyton Manning, like dude, he's justin' nobody.
Like Peyton Manning, you might have just gave it to him.
So therefore, I think people subconsciously don't even know that
they do want this because it leads for the fodder.
It leads for the conversation, It leads for the sports
(19:58):
debates and the barbersh on radio and on TV.
Speaker 3 (20:02):
No is it Yokis? No? Is it Shaye?
Speaker 6 (20:04):
No?
Speaker 3 (20:04):
Is it Lebron?
Speaker 2 (20:05):
No?
Speaker 3 (20:05):
Is it Kobe? Is it?
Speaker 4 (20:06):
No?
Speaker 3 (20:06):
Is it? Uh? Uh? This person of this person? Is
it Payton?
Speaker 1 (20:10):
Or is it you know, ladanele and Thomason? And I
think it leads to that because of the vagueness of it.
I think we ultimately want it, We just don't know
that we want it. Otherwise I think people will be bored.
Handed it to Michael Jordan for a decade, handed it
to Lebron handed, and Peyton Manning handed. Whatever the sport
is handing it to that guy for five to six
year period, and I think subconsciously we like that. We
(20:33):
like the debate, the fight. No, I mean, I like,
is it about the best player on the best team. No,
it's guy James Harden is doing stuff we've never seen,
thirty five games and leading the league in assists and points.
And I think we enjoy that more than we actually
know that we do, because I don't think our human
nature wants to just give it to And this is
why I sat here for what two months, give or take,
(20:55):
yelling at Rob Lamar Jackson is not gonna win the MVP.
Look at his numbers. I said, I know you're right.
Rob g is my witness, and so of the listeners.
I said, people are tired of giving it to him. Yes,
the numbers are great, Yes they're better than the last season.
Guess what they're gonna say, it's Chush Allen's time. Well,
(21:16):
he's the first note when they are the All Pro
comes out only one time in hard forred years. Is
All Pro get it wrong? I said, well this could
be in a union. They can happen again and Josh
Allen wins it. My point was human nature gets fatigued
of things. It's you can't, it's you have to be
so self aware to not do that. And you know
(21:36):
it is argument always like to be well, Barry Bonds
won it all those times, and ROS said yes.
Speaker 3 (21:40):
Because they have two leagues. If they had one, I
guarantee you Barry Bonds would not have won it over
and over.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
It's easy, all right, Well he's the best off area.
Somebody mix it up. On the other side. If there
was just one MLB MVP, Barry Bonds would not have
won it. I think it was, what five times in
a row, whatever it was, because they would have gotten
bored with somebody else. Well, all he's doing is hitting
home run. They would have found some human nature reason
to do that. So I think we don't want it
to be that simplistic. So therefore we have different options.
(22:07):
We have different people because sometimes in sports there's somebody
who's just that good for that period where we'd have
to just keep handing it to.
Speaker 3 (22:14):
Him or her every year.
Speaker 4 (22:16):
Well, speaking of handing it out, Dallas Mavericks nine time
All Star Kyrie Irving declined his forty three million dollar
player option and is signing a three year, one hundred
and nineteen million dollar contract with the Dallas Mavericks with
a player option. At twenty twenty seven, Kyrie lerving congratulations
on a torn acl in your thirties with a player
(22:41):
option to go ahead and get well. He had forty
three coming, So he's a quick math by me bag
eighty more over the next two years, and you get
to choose whether or not you want that forty in
year three.
Speaker 3 (22:55):
Hey, I'm about to start wearing long fur hearings. Ear
he wears is salute to his agent his mother.
Speaker 2 (23:03):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Odd Couple
with Rob Parker and kelvin Washington weekdays at seven pm
Eastern four pm Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and the
iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 1 (23:15):
Nico Harrison, who's running the basketball operations over there, had
this to say about Cooper Flag.
Speaker 7 (23:22):
I think it's two things. I think it's win now.
It's also win in the future. And we don't know
when eventually it's going to be Cooper's team. We don't
know when that when that transition will happen. So I
think it's win now and then set yourself up to
win in the future as well.
Speaker 3 (23:39):
Well.
Speaker 1 (23:40):
You mister fan of the MAVs mass fan. He's talking
about you could win now when in the future, win tomorrow,
win ten, just a lot of winning in the coming
hold up, is what I have to say to all
of that. Oh here we go now, all right on paper? Yes,
I like what I see. Okay, you talked about it,
Kyrie Irvan still playing at a high level.
Speaker 3 (24:01):
Anthony Davis playing at a really high level as well.
Speaker 1 (24:04):
You got Lively, you got Gaffert, you got you got
other Clay. You gotta watch the piece of PJ. Washington.
By the way, I just PJ. Washington. I mentioned it
the other day. Every four years we get a guy
whoever becomes man, if we could just get a h
it was Rudy Gay for years. Man, we were Rudy
Gay away. It was Tobias Harris. To me, PJ. Washington's
(24:24):
become that new guy. You're like, Man, if we could
just get like a like a PJ. Washington for those
teams that are right there, you know, just we need
another guy who get that, like the Knicks forensic for instance.
Speaker 3 (24:34):
Yep, Man, if we just had like a PJ. Washington,
he's gonna be that new thing guy for me.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
But with that being said, man, Carrie, listen, I liked
what I see on paper, but this was my issue
with the initial trade of Luca. It wasn't just that
you traded Luca, although that was hard to get past, man,
that's crazy. It was that you traded him and your
whole point was, I don't know, it could be a
catastrophic injury coming he didn't take care of his body.
But so you got a guy who's six years older
(25:01):
in Ad, who is proving to be injured a lot
in his career, and then you paired him with and
off injured Kyrie. So that was what you didn't pair
him with Michael Bridges, iron man, who hasn't missed a
game in his NBA career. You paired him with injured Kyrie,
and then what happened Game one with Ad and it
(25:22):
was so exciting too, but he was injured.
Speaker 3 (25:25):
But he gets injured.
Speaker 1 (25:26):
So this is where I'm apprehensive, is that you gotta
wait all the way to what you can say, optimistically
March with Kyrie coming back April.
Speaker 3 (25:36):
I think could be back before that, but okay, but
let's say it everywhere.
Speaker 1 (25:39):
I'll even grant you that February he goes to a
voodoo doctor and they put something on his knee. He's
back February, but he gotta he has to work back
in his shape. Okay, roll all that time, you're banking
on Anthony Davis not being injured so that your team
is in a good position, you know, and the standings.
I don't know if that's gonna be the case. So
now I got an old Clayton Thompson who's off injured.
(26:01):
Now Kyrie a d with a rookie, and I'm like,
on paper, I get it, but that's asking for a
lot for all those guys to hold up and hold
up at the same time. Okay, he's back, Wait, hold on,
now you get back. All right, now, we got to
be best already to roll come April and May. I
just don't know if they're going to be built for that.
I like it on paper, but I'm skeptical of the
(26:21):
injury report. Yeah, come the late spring. Yeah, but that's
every team. No, No, Listen.
Speaker 8 (26:27):
What you're saying though, is if something happens, and yes,
we've seen it happen, so it's not like it can't happen.
But that's every team. You have to have luck, you
have to have health, throughout the season. And so if
you don't have those things, nobody's a contender.
Speaker 3 (26:41):
Right.
Speaker 8 (26:41):
So all we have right now is that hypothetical of
what we see on paper, right like man man man, like,
all these things add up in the stack up right.
Boston coming into this year, we thought they were a
prohibited favorite, right like they are. They were injuries derailed them.
It wasn't a team that beat them, it was injuries.
Speaker 3 (27:01):
Right.
Speaker 8 (27:01):
So that's always the case when you look at the
same and you talk about Nico saying this is a
win now, this is a win in the future as well.
This window with this group is gonna be short. So Cooper,
if he gets all that he needs to get done
in these couple of these first to two, I would
say two years with this unit that they have and
it doesn't work out the way hypothetic hypothetically it could
(27:24):
or couldn't. They still have a core with Cooper, Flag,
d Live Gafford, PJ. Washington or will attract other people.
And don't forget they're also right now going after another
point guard that can be a stop gap until Kyrie
gets back. That's a starter that should be a start
in his lead. That type of that type of person.
(27:44):
So this same is still good. Now I win a championship,
that's just that's far fetch. We don't know what that
looks like until we see all of them together. But
right now I'm loving it. Man, I'm not mad at it.
Speaker 3 (27:54):
I like it. On paper.
Speaker 1 (27:56):
It is again hypothetical. We'll have to wait and see. Uh,
but I don't know about the win now. I'm not
as high on the win. Now, there's some other teams
that I can feel like I've had, like how many?
By the way, rob g was that Eddie House who
had the Mavericks going to the Western Conference final yesterday?
Speaker 3 (28:11):
Yes, there you go, I said, excuse me, Eddie.
Speaker 8 (28:15):
Yeah, and rashand Phillis, by the way, or both of
them both both did dang.
Speaker 3 (28:20):
I know Eddie Eddie fools stories that he think they
could make a run. Rashad said the.
Speaker 1 (28:26):
Right because I said Houston and he about laughed me off. No, no,
Houston can make him round. He laughed laughed off because
he said, you don't think Kevin Durant is the piece,
And I'm like, well, it's not that he is not.
Speaker 3 (28:36):
He has to be their savior, dude.
Speaker 1 (28:37):
They got am and Thompson gonna be leaps and bounds
better sengoon down low, Fred Van Vls.
Speaker 8 (28:43):
If you missed this guy, we're gonna we're gonna have
a problem. Keep going. Yeah, Jabari Smith Jacks's my guy. Yeah,
him paired with Kevin Durant and learning the tricks of
the trade.
Speaker 3 (28:53):
Oh, I'm excited to see him.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
Well, yeah, I was too too, Yoda Rashan Phillis was
laughing at all. I'm like, I thought Kevin Durant fit
perfectly over there, and he soon Yeah. So, but again,
Cooper Flagg there now is in the wrong pick. And
also I like to that he doesn't he's not just
a man. All I can do is shoot because he
can fit right in, and they can say, all right,
(29:17):
eight is going to be down low.
Speaker 3 (29:18):
He's going to do his things, And that actually is
kind of scary.
Speaker 1 (29:21):
If Anthony Davis is engaged, healthy and active defensively, which
he usually is, yes, and then you pair him with
Cooper who gets to roam and kind of roll and
be a secondary defender. Guy gets by somebody, He's coming
for the block, passing lanes with that athleticism. Speak man,
I like that. I will I will admit that is
kind of scary. You mentioned with Lively, and that's don't
(29:41):
go down there trying to score. I'm telling you that
front line. I'll give you that frontline defensively is kind
of scary. But I like that he night in the
night out and you know what reminds me of and
the only reason I didn't bring him up because he
wasn't a number one pick when you brought Tim Duncan.
It reminds me of Kawhi. I think they got him
at eleven and he gets to just come in, be
(30:02):
under Tony Parker, Ginobili, ducking all these guys, be one
of the guys. And then you like, oh, this guy's
really really good defensively Okay, he's athletic getting out on
the break, okay, oh mid range, kind of coming around
a little bit. Yeah, And you look up and you're like, man,
he's a finals MVP of that twenty fourteen team. Shout
out to that, shout out to Steve Balmer. I don't
(30:24):
know he did that. Steve Mamber did that. So I
like that he can just kind of fit in and float.
What do you need from tonight?
Speaker 4 (30:30):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (30:31):
You just need eight points twelve rebounds.
Speaker 1 (30:32):
Three blocks got you okay, so now you needed me
to go and a lot of points in fast break,
you know who also liking it to offensively speaking, Pascal Siakama,
that you don't have to say call plays.
Speaker 3 (30:43):
I can get it in transition. I can get it
just you know, put some putbacks.
Speaker 1 (30:47):
I can get it in a little mid range here
there early on, Pascal, where we can make saying, I
don't know, he's kind of good. I don't know what
he does great, but he's just good. And I see
that where you at on and what he can actually
bring immediately.
Speaker 8 (31:01):
And I was gonna I was gonna ask you that too,
But for me, it's he's gonna score fourteen just off effort.
So I would see him early on, I mean this
year probably in that sixteen to eighteen range, and I
don't I.
Speaker 1 (31:14):
Might even go lower to your thirteen four. But because
I don't need like I might necessarily need it.
Speaker 8 (31:18):
Yeah, I just say that, because he's gonna play hard
right Like again, I don't think they will run a
lot of plays. But the thing I do see with them,
I know they want to push the pace a little
bit more than they have in the past. Obviously with
Luca gone, they want to push it. I can see
him playing that point forward position right, and the ball
can be in his hands a lot more. He can
make a lot of plays too, And with that, with
(31:39):
all the lob threats that he has in Dallas, now
you're going to have to make decisions. And he's a
really good lob throws because we saw that with them
half his team round to everybody right tomorrow watching those guys.
But man, listen, I think he's going to average around
like in that sixteen to eighteen range, and I think
he's going to be obviously Rookie of the Year. But
I mean that's going to be competition there because all
the guys are in and worse situations
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kelvin washington
Rob Parker
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