Unlock the secrets of trust and communication in the digital age with PR expert Justin Goldstein. Learn how cohesive brand messaging across channels breaks silos to enhance recruitment, public policy support, and sales. Justin emphasizes trust's critical role in marketing, advocating for clear communication and early collaboration between departments to create seamless PR and marketing strategies.
Discover how media relations align with business goals. Justin addresses challenges like inconsistent social media narratives and highlights building strong reporter relationships. He also explores leveraging LinkedIn and podcasts to amplify your brand, underscoring the patience required for effective PR.
In crisis scenarios, reputation management is vital. Justin discusses proactive vs. reactive strategies and using storytelling to shape a positive brand image. He shares how PR drives growth through persuasive messaging, strategic storytelling, and consistent client communication.
Maximize your media efforts with the right budget and infrastructure, ensuring your marketing assets deliver optimal results. Gain insights into boosting lead generation and client acquisition through strategic content distribution. This discussion reveals how PR can be a transformative tool for business success.
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Guest Contact Information:
- https://www.linkedin.com/in/goldsteinjustin/
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The Unknown Secrets of Internet Marketing podcast is a podcast hosted by Internet marketing expert Matthew Bertram. The show provides insights and advice on digital marketing, SEO, and online business.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Howdy.
Welcome back to the UnknownSecrets of Internet Marketing.
I am your host, matt Bertram.
As some of you noticed, you'remaybe looking for the podcast I
have changed the podcast cover.
I am working on the intro.
For those of you that watch onYouTube but be looking for our
new cover and just recognizethat, I am going to try to push
(00:36):
that out there and advertise it.
But since Chris is no longerhosting the show, I thought it
was time to put together alittle bit of a brand refresh.
So just please look for that,check that out.
And today, as we've beentalking about PR, I found
another great guest that cantalk really about comms and PR
(01:00):
strategy and how it fits intothe bigger picture.
I know a lot of you know thatI've written the Build your
Brand Mania book.
That was my first book aboutfive years ago talking about how
to build that know, like andtrust online, and so I continued
with that theme.
I wanted to introduce y'all toJustin Goldstein.
Speaker 1 (01:22):
How are you doing?
Speaker 2 (01:23):
Justin, All right.
So Justin, with PR 73, hasworked with some awesome
companies like Uber, ARP,General Motors.
He's been mentioned in Ad AgeForbes PR Week.
He's really an expert on PRstrategy and also how that fits
(01:43):
into the bigger flywheel mix,and so I wanted to bring Justin
on to kind of talk through someof that and share some of his
expertise.
So, Justin, welcome to the show.
Thanks so much for having me.
Now, Justin, just to kind ofcredentialize yourself a little
bit more.
I think I did that, but ifthere's anything else you would
like to add and kind of sharewith you in the audience your
(02:04):
origin story, that would be.
That would be awesome, just tokind of hear how you came to be
where you're at.
Speaker 1 (02:10):
Sure, yeah Well, thanks so much for having me,
matthew, and you know I've beenin the communication space I
think PR and marketing for over10 years now.
You know I started at a smallagency, went to a midsize firm
and then I launched PR73, whichformally is known as Press
Record Communication.
So if you Google my name,you'll probably see my name
associated with the old firmname.
(02:31):
But yeah, we've been at it fora little over five years now, as
you mentioned, working withsome really cool clients like
ARP, the Consumer Product SafetyCommission, the New York Public
Library, american BarAssociation some really big
names and some smaller names too, but ultimately having a lot of
fun doing it and lookingforward to what the future holds
(02:51):
too.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
Well, awesome.
Well, I think to like kind ofkick off this conversation,
whether you're a small business,owner, enterprise, startup, you
know a lot of we're talking toa lot of PE companies or even
venture capital.
We're talking to a lot of PEcompanies or even venture
capital when you're starting outand no one knows who you are or
(03:21):
who your brand is, or maybethey do know who you are, but
you're trying to change thatmessaging.
Establishing trust is soimportant with your audience and
your right target persona, andso I was hoping we could just
kind of create some definitionsaround how to look at trust in
general, how to establish trustin the online space today 100%,
you know.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
I think trust is ultimately the critical
component of what is going toallow any online practitioner to
get customers and clients,because if people don't believe
in the product that you'reputting out and the person that
you are as a professional,they're not going to choose you.
And there's a lot of differentaspects of trust.
I mean we found in our ownindustry, in a research report
(03:54):
that we launched earlier thisyear, that trust is actually a
really big issue across thecommunication space right now,
where you know teams don'tnecessarily it's of course, not
for every organization, butteams don't necessarily, of
course, not for everyorganization but teams don't
necessarily trust each otherinternally as well as the
message that's being sent outexternally by the companies that
they work for, and so I thinkthat, in order to show success,
(04:18):
not only from a businessperspective, in terms of
generating revenue, but alsocareer trajectory, it's really
important to have the trust ofyour colleagues, your key
audiences, internally andexternally, and looking to move
the ball forward from there.
Speaker 2 (04:32):
I was on a panel discussion last night and we
were talking about themillennial generation and how to
communicate those messages tothe middle body of people that
are looking for it and how tocommunicate it down on
organization.
And you're, you're absolutelyright, Um, in in a number of
previous discussions I've had,comms don't always talk to each
other.
And they're, they're, they'reworking, um, not in concert, but
(04:55):
but in a silo, and it's reallyabout breaking down those silos.
Uh, and really what?
What is the goal of thecommunications you're trying to
do?
Whether it be recruiting,whether it be internal
communication to get everybodyin a big organization on the
same page, whether it bechanging public policy or
influencing public policy, aswe're in an election cycle, or
(05:16):
to sell, there's different goalsof what these organizations or
teams are doing.
These organizations or teamsare doing, and a lot of times
they don't talk, but there'sreally a way to harmonize the
brand message where it resonatesacross multiple channels.
Speaker 1 (05:34):
Yeah, 100%, and I really like the point you made
about silos.
I think it speaks to a largerissue in organizations generally
, when they do have a creativepartner, whether it be PR
marketing, is that the PRmarketing work that's being done
doesn't necessarily gettransmitted to all stakeholders
in the organization anddifferent departments,
(05:56):
especially at the beginning whenthe project starts.
And so what often happens isthe creative partner will bring
a recommendation to theorganization and their point
person will understand it.
Even their direct team or theirboss might understand it, but
other departments that have toenact the actual work don't
necessarily trust it becausethey don't know who the outside
entity is.
(06:16):
They barely know who theinternal person is as the point
person for the organization, andso I think the more those silos
are broken down, the morethere's an opportunity for that
communication and connectivityto happen and for that trust to
be built up.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
Yeah, so.
So when you're you're seeingthis in a lot of different
organizations that that you'redealing with, I mean, when
you're approaching organizationand you're you're coming on,
they've recognized they need aproblem or there's a message out
there that needs to becommunicated a little bit
differently or positioned, andyou're looking at like, okay,
what does this media landscapelook like?
(06:52):
I mean, are you doing like aindustry, like surveying or
audit of what's going on, or howis this message going to be
received?
Is there some testing that'smaybe happening, sample testing,
before you're pushing outmessages globally in some cases,
(07:13):
right, how does that whenyou're approaching a client, or
how should a client, eveninternally, look at it if
they're trying to addresssomething like this?
Speaker 1 (07:24):
Yeah.
So I think there's a few stepsto take.
There's probably more that Ican think of, but I think
initially, some things that arepretty commonplace is to your
point.
One is to take a look at thelandscape of your audiences,
internal and external, dependingon who you're looking to reach
with your message, and gettingan understanding of what those
(07:44):
demographics want and need andwho is involved in those
demographics.
So anything down to their agerange, their education level,
but then going to theirexpertise and buying habits,
whatever it might be.
So that's step one.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
Step two is you definitely want to look at what
your competitors are doing.
Speaker 1 (08:01):
So getting an understanding of what their
messaging is really helps to, Ithink you know, align with what
you're doing as well.
So that one you don'tnecessarily want to copy them,
but you can at least let itinfluence the kind of messaging
development that you yourselfare doing internally.
And then, three, I think it'salso understanding what are the
long-term objectives of theorganization that you're working
(08:24):
with.
So you know, you might have abrilliant messaging or message
point in mind and it might matchwhat the audience wants, but if
it's not satisfying the overallorganizational goal, there's
got to be a better match there.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
Man, you know that makes me think back to, like,
social media, content planning,Like, and I know that that's
something part of the flywheelthat we'll get into it.
But a lot of times when we'refirst working with maybe some
small business clients, theythey'll just post random stuff
on their on their business page,right.
(08:57):
That is not tied into a broadermessage, right?
And so there's a lot ofeducation that comes in on how
to approach communicating thismessage part of a broader story,
helping people kind of getthose insights and see what's
happening.
And so when you think about,like, content strategy or
(09:18):
mastering media relations, howdo you look at that?
I mean, I know it's aboutfeeding the algorithm and you
got to warm up some of theseaccounts and these messages and
topical authorities.
And this also plays into SEO,which which I talk about a lot.
I'm just curious, what is yourangle when you, when you, come
at that?
Speaker 1 (09:37):
It's an interesting question.
You know, I think contentdevelopment and media relations
can collaborate, but they couldalso be separate in terms of the
masters that they're serving.
So when you look at contentdevelopment, that's a little bit
more of an own channel, as youknow, and I'm sure your
listeners know as well whereyou're trying to drive
engagement with the audience tosay, simply visit your website,
(09:59):
your social channels, whateverit might be, channels, whatever
it might be, whereas mediarelations can certainly feed
into that.
But you're also trying toconnect with a reporter and give
them what they need for theirstory, which might not
necessarily match what thecontent is looking to achieve in
terms of the channel engagement.
So it's kind of balancing thegoals there and understanding
(10:20):
that sometimes you have tosacrifice one for the other,
especially, I would say, more soon the media relations front.
You know we've definitely hadmultiple instances with clients
where they have a fantasticpiece of content.
It doesn't necessarily resonatewith a reporter.
The reporter wants to talkabout something else and it
definitely benefits their brandto do so and will help with
their overall branding in thelongterm.
(10:40):
But sometimes they can't seepast that initial content
request and it not goinganywhere and feeling a little
bit rejected because of that.
So you got to kind of coachthem through it and show them
you know the forest through thetrees and what the value is in
terms of again sacrificing onefor the other.
Speaker 2 (10:58):
So to just expand on that a little bit more, when you
think about media relations,right, those reporters have a
goal they're trying to hit, or ablogger's trying to hit a
certain amount of numbers, orthey have a story they're trying
to reach.
This is actually the same.
When you think about differentsocial media platforms A lot of
people don't know this.
(11:18):
Linkedin actually has a contentcalendar of things that they're
trying to promote and thingsthat they'll highlight and even
boost in the algorithm.
If you line up with that.
That happens with podcasts too,like different seasonal things
that come out.
If you can align that, you cansubmit these things to get a
greater visibility.
And so, really, if you're likesaying, hey, it's about
(11:39):
establishing rapport, right,cause also people do business
with people they know I cantrust, and so if they know your
company, they know what you do,you have this kind of working
rapport with them, there's agreater chance that they'll
think about you for a quote orpicking something up.
And so establishing mediarelations or like who you're
going to be contacting, whereit's just not a cold call,
(12:01):
basically right, you're likesending a pitch and it's a cold
call is really, I think, prettyimportant.
And then also asking them whatdo they need?
And then look at your broaderstrategy and figure out what
content you have that fits inthat right, and then if there's
something you want to highlightas you build that relationship,
they may say, hey, there mightbe an opportunity to highlight
(12:22):
this down the road, right, andso, um, I think that like, okay,
you can send a press release,of course, and you can get your
message out there and you cansee what pickups happen.
And if you write a really uh,good, good article that helps
them write their story, thatthat's helpful.
But if you're really trying toget placements and move it
forward, you can't look at it as, like this, one independent
(12:44):
thing.
You have to zoom out and lookat it as a broader media
relationship strategy as well asa content strategy, where
you're planning it out for along haul and maybe you try to
insert those things.
I mean, can you tell me?
Like, when I look at it, Ithink like, okay, if you want to
get your message out there,okay, you're going to do
advertising.
You're going to advertise.
You can say whatever you wantto say to whoever you want to
(13:06):
say it on whatever platform.
But like social media as wellas um like press or or, uh you
know, media.
It's more about getting thatvisibility on a third party
platform or from a third partyperson to, to see it in a way,
and and and that is not justyour goals, right, that, that's
(13:28):
your goals and their goals.
And so how do you, how do youstructure that, I like?
I mean, when a company comes toyou with like, hey, we want to
do this, how do you like lay outthat roadmap for them?
Or?
Or look at it in a broadercontext, cause sometimes you
don't get that quick winimmediately, right, you can't
just run an ad and boom, you gotit out there.
It's a different-, yeah 100%,100%.
Speaker 1 (13:50):
So I think you brought up a really good point,
a couple of really good points.
One is which that you have tounderstand, going into it, that
you're not necessarily going toget an immediate win tomorrow,
and that also PR in general isthere more so as a business
support than a make or break.
So you know.
Again, when we're talking aboutmedia coverage, for example,
(14:10):
media coverage is a fantasticpiece of content for what I call
the social proof flywheel.
I don't know if that'strademarked or not, so don't
quote me on it being mine, butjust using it as an example.
Now you know it's a fantasticpiece for that right, because
ultimately you can use that inyour outbound DM campaigns for
LinkedIn, let's say yournewsletters even your marketing,
(14:30):
your paid marketing, and so itall builds up for the longer
term objective of building yourbusiness.
But it's not necessarily goingto make or break it in 30 days,
let's say so.
That's part one, you know.
Part two is also understandingthat PR isn't just writing press
releases.
Some people have thatmisconception that if you write
and distribute, say, five to 10press releases, a year.
(14:53):
You're going to get a ton of SEO, you're going to get all these
new business inquiries, andultimately it doesn't work that
way.
A lot of times press releasesare hit or miss, especially on
the wire services.
You might get a reporterrequest, you might get a new
business lead from it, butultimately it's there is more of
a proof document that you knowwhat you're saying is official,
and and so I look at the pressrelease as more of a supporting
(15:17):
asset.
Right?
So when you go to reporters,when you go to prospects, you
can share it as a proof point,but it's not meant to solicit or
generate inbound leads of anykind, in my opinion.
Speaker 2 (15:28):
So just random question is all good press, is
all press, good press?
Like if you get bad press, isall good press?
Bad press because you have theattention and you can spin it or
how you how do?
You approach that.
Speaker 1 (15:41):
Two pronged answer to that, um, I would say one is
it's how good you are at PR onyour own, um, and also if you
have an agency helping you.
I personally don't believe thatall good, all press, is good
press.
Um, you know, there are somepeople where bad press fits into
the brand that they're tryingto build, in a sense, because
they're trying to be like ananti hero or something like that
(16:03):
, but for most people I wouldn'tadvise it.
You know you really want to tryto generate press that's, of
course, productive and positiveand, you know, try to avoid the
negative press situations andnot get into a situation where
mentally, you know, you feellike you have free freedom to do
whatever you want, especiallyif you work for another
organization right, or even yourfamily right, like you're
(16:26):
always representing somebodyelse unless you're truly, you
know, out of your own, single nokids, no significant other, no
family whatsoever, which youknow, hopefully, is not the case
for most people.
You're always representingsomebody else and so, yes,
perhaps there are instanceswhere the negative press doesn't
impact you personally in termsof your day to day, for you but
(16:47):
it can impact your loved onesand those around you, and so,
yeah, I would say, stay awayfrom that.
Speaker 2 (16:52):
Good point, so okay.
So say you're in a crisismanagement situation.
How do you know that you're ina crisis management situation,
right, if someone's thinking outthere like something bad's
going on right now?
I don't really know what to doabout it.
Tell me about, like, what thatsituation might look like where
you're saying, hey, I might needto get in touch with a
representative and then, two,how should you approach it?
(17:13):
Or, like, how do you start theprocess of saying, okay, we got
a bunch of bad press, we need todo something about it.
What are those steps?
To start kind of putting outthe fire, if you will.
Speaker 1 (17:25):
Yeah, absolutely so.
I think there's two ways tomeasure that One is getting an
understanding of is the pressdamaging your brand for the
longterm and how big of a dealis this, knowing your business
and your internal team?
So it's funny because I had afamily friend that called up
asking for help for somethingcrisis related earlier this week
(17:46):
, or maybe it was last week.
I was tracking the time thesedays and after talking through
it with him, we kind of realizedthat in the moment it feels
like something really bad, butin a week from now, if it's not
appearing on Google, let's sayif it's not easily findable, is
it something that's really goingto impact you?
Where you have to spend themoney on crisis PR, because
(18:07):
crisis PR is expensive, you know, because the crisis PR teams
that are out there are workinglong hours, they're putting a
lot of man and woman power intothe work that's being done, and
so it's a lot of money and a lotof budget.
So you have to really assesswhether this is something that's
going to be a long term problemor just stings for the day and
(18:30):
then it goes away.
You know, I think it's alwayssuggested that if you feel an
inkling of there being apotential situation.
It's always good to talk to acrisis expert just to make sure
that you're on the same page andlike, pay that fee to.
You know, have that 30 to 60minute conversation just to make
sure and if both parties feellike there's something worth
activating on, then make adecision.
But yeah, I would say, at thevery least, if there's even a
(18:52):
chance that it might besomething bigger, you definitely
want to try to speak to anexpert to make sure that it
isn't or it is and you have todo something about it.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
And that leads into the conversation about maybe
reputation management right, solike maybe put in money in the
social bank and having yourbrand represented a certain way
before you need it to be.
And also, really, when I lookat reputation management, I'm
looking at gaining reviews,making sure that when people
search for you, when they'rekind of peeling the onion back,
(19:24):
like looking into your brand,they see good things.
Right, and that takes a littlebit of crafting as far as
getting getting out the goodstories early, because many
times people only share thenegative and so sometimes you
have to draw out that positive.
How would you approachreputation management from a PR
standpoint?
Speaker 1 (19:45):
It's a very detailed process so it's kind of hard to,
you know, boil it down into a30, 60 second response.
But what I would say is thatthe first thing we want to do
and I mentioned this just aminute ago is to have that
initial call to really gothrough what the situation is,
what the potential impact of thebusiness is, who are the
(20:06):
audiences that are going in thereal estate sector?
And she had a couple of teamsleave her and we went through
that whole process of what doesthat mean for your business that
(20:27):
the teams are leaving.
Was there any bad blood?
What are the factors that weneed to know in terms of the
brand impact and the businessimpact?
And so, going through thosequestions, it's really important
to do that and alsounderstanding again this goes
back to what I was sayingearlier about how big of a deal
this is, how proactive andreactive you want to be about
(20:48):
this, right?
So an example of beingproactive is do you want to go
to the press and say something,or is it better not to do that
because you might shine a lighton something you don't
necessarily want to shine thatlight on, so reactive would be.
Let's prepare a couple ofstatements one for the founders
or founder of a company to have,and then the other statement
for the broader team to have toanswer any questions for clients
(21:09):
, prospects, press, whatever itmight be.
So this way you're ready to gobut you're reacting to it versus
proactively bringing attentionto it.
So it all kind of depends onthe situation, but I think the
key there is being prepared andhaving you know reference
documents ready to go in casesomething does pop up, and
that's the very least that youshould probably do.
Speaker 2 (21:32):
I love that.
I think that that's a greatactionable step having a
preparation document of what tosay if you are contacted or if
the word gets out there.
Because social media is sopowerful today and it shapes a
lot of people's perceptions andthe algorithm just wants
engagement right.
So you know, things can getcarried away pretty quickly
(21:56):
online and can kind of take itin a direction, and you should
be prepared in case those sortof things happen.
So I want to switch gears alittle bit because I think that
something that would be reallyvaluable for a lot of people
that listen are probablythinking okay, I have a business
and this is all good, and maybethis doesn't affect me.
(22:17):
Maybe some people are like thisis affecting me, this is really
helpful.
But a lot of people are like,okay, I want to win new business
, I want to manage my clients ina one-to-many situation.
How can PR help me do that ifI'm trying to decide where all
my resources are going to go?
How should I be doing PR andwhat are some like maybe proven
(22:37):
steps to win those long-termclients or to get that social
proof that you need that sort ofthing?
Speaker 1 (22:42):
Yeah, there are a couple of quick ways that I
would recommend.
So one is definitely hiring ateam or expert to help craft
your messaging, because thatmessaging can bleed into the
sales messaging that you'reactually using to generate leads
.
The second I would say is mediacoverage is a fan and I think I
mentioned this earlier in theinterview is a fantastic asset
for not only top of funnel butmiddle of funnel, meaning that
(23:08):
you know, oftentimes when we'retrying to generate business, we
have some somewhat blandmessages because we're strapped
for time.
We don't have a lot of time toput into, like writing a really
unique message, which everyone,including myself, always tries
to do better about.
But, like, once you have apiece of media coverage, it
makes your life so much easierbecause then you can go to that
prospect and say hey, so-and-sogreat to connect on LinkedIn.
(23:29):
Wanted to flag this piece ofcoverage.
I got in the Wall StreetJournal talking about XYZ, which
I know relates to what you'redoing, thought you'd enjoy it.
Let's connect.
So, right there you're having,you're providing social proof
and you're also um showcasingthat you have expertise in the
space and that helps to startthe conversation.
The middle of the conversationor middle of the funnel part of
it is okay.
You've had a couple ofconversations.
(23:50):
Now you need something back toengage the prospect with, to
keep them in your funnel andkeep them engaged.
And that's where media coveragecomes in.
You share that piece of mediacoverage in an email and say hey
, so-and-so, hope all's well.
Since we last chatted, Iactually got featured in the
Wall Street Journal since thentalking about this.
Thought you'd enjoy it, wantedto send it over in case it's
helpful.
(24:10):
Can we connect next week and Ican walk you through how I got
this piece of coverage and whatit means for you.
That's a way to keep themengaged.
So those are two really quickways to do it.
There's definitely more, but Ithink in the short term, when
you're first getting started,those are probably the easiest
ways that you can do it.
Speaker 2 (24:25):
Yeah, I think that when you're well, when you have
that piece of content, itbecomes a sales so okay.
So going back to Google, right,so Google, how they look at
everything is through aframework called EAT expertise,
authority and trust right.
And so anytime that you can getthat authority from a third
(24:47):
party to give you kind of thatinterview that I did about for
the media, when you'reconnecting with the media, if
(25:07):
there's experiential knowledgeor statistics or anything that
is not publicly available thatyou can share in that press
release or share with the mediarelated to whatever they're
trying to do, is really quitepowerful.
And so you got to get thatmedia coverage right to be able
(25:27):
to use the media coverage.
So it's like a little bit of aI guess, a chicken and the egg,
but really hitting on thatauthority.
If other people can say itAgain, I think awards, winning
awards, are part of like a PRopportunity, like I don't think
a lot of people think about that, you know, I mean the BBB is a
local award or like for us,american Marketing Association.
(25:49):
There's a lot of differentorganizations that do it, but
but being involved in thoseorganizations and winning those
awards give you that kind ofcredibility Right, just like you
can say, hey, check out thisarticle, you can say, hey, check
out this award I won.
Right Now I think that certainorganizations and sometimes I've
heard back from people, well,they just give that award to
everyone Well, that organizationmight need some PR to
(26:11):
credentialize a little bitbetter the stringency of how
they're offering it.
Or like I'm on the subcommitteefor the BBB, like you know, how
is the BBB different as all therise of these online review
sites come into place and andand how do they work with
different organizations andcompanies?
So I think a lot of it's aboutpositioning yourself.
(26:33):
I mean, can you tell me maybean example for a client of
something you did where itturned into closing a deal so
people could maybe relate itback to their business of like,
hey, I could do that similarkind of thing it's not just in
the ether, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (26:49):
So we've had clients where they're on the hook and
they've gone a little silent,either because they're trying to
figure out whether what we'reproposing is doable, if they
have the budget for it, whatevermight be.
And so I there's definitelybeen instances where I've even
shared podcast interviews,whether it be the full interview
or a clip, and said you know,or have my team say hey, so, and
(27:10):
so you know, justin was just onthis podcast talking about
again this topic that uminvolves, you know, marketing
development and wheremarketing's headed in the next
five years.
Thought you'd find it ofinterest, would love to connect,
and that person might respondand say thanks so much for
sending this.
I've been meaning to reach backout.
Can we schedule a time and thenyou carry it forward from there
?
So I don't think there's everbeen a piece of media coverage
(27:32):
that's like sealed the deal andbrought it over the finish line.
It's more so propelled it, inthe sense that it's propelled
the actual conversations toactually happen, to get it over
the finish line, which is stillreally valuable.
Speaker 2 (27:48):
Yeah, you need to help salespeople along the way,
kind of move it forward.
I can tell you, the biggest winthat I've had that I can most
recently think about and this isreally when you think about
like funding rounds and stufflike that for startups had a
client that was actually goinginto another round and they
(28:08):
didn't want to have a down round.
They weren't showing likematerial progress of what they
were doing.
And they came to me and we werelike what are some ideas that
we can do to generate some valuefor the brand, to show some
real progress?
And I actually knew some peopleover at the Dynamos, which is a
soccer team here in Houstonthat actually went over to the
(28:31):
Texans and so we were able toget some conversations going
with the Texans to establishourselves as an official going
with the Texans, to establishourself as a official partner
with the Texans for kind of a, athree year period that we were
able to do some press and andpush some stuff out there and we
generated I think it was like alittle bit under a million
dollars in press value rightWithin three weeks.
(28:55):
And so that was like it was areally fun project and it was
exciting, but it was almost kindof in that crisis state of like
we need to do something.
What can we do?
What have we built?
What assets do we haveavailable?
So I would encourage everyoneout there Everybody has a unique
selling proposition and hassomething that they've done
that's unique from other peopleand figuring out and working
(29:17):
with the strategist to figureout what that might look like is
is super powerful.
I think I mean, tell me alittle bit about, like, client
relationship management.
Like I mean, certainly you knowit helps you close the deal.
It continues to kind of checkthe box.
There's no red flags.
They find good stuff about you.
But, like, how do youspecifically use it to manage,
(29:40):
maybe, client relations for whatmay with the bigger
organization?
Speaker 1 (29:44):
Yeah, I don't.
I don't think the media coveragehelps with client management as
much as just having anunderstanding of messaging to
make the client feel confidentin the work that you're doing
and also be able to have tougherconversations with clients,
right.
And so having that expertise andhow to craft a message, how to
(30:08):
make it persuasive while beingethical, of course, how to have
that message in form, reallyhelps to build the relationships
.
I mean the media coveragecertainly helps, but I think
it's more about that.
Plus, you know, as PRpractitioners most PR
practitioners, I find, areworking with the media and so by
(30:29):
having conversations daily, itjust warms you up to be able to
talk more and feel morecomfortable having conversations
in the first place, especiallywhen you're new to the business.
So, yeah, I think it's just anatural skill set of building
messages and havingconversations that helps, more
so than the media coverageitself that you could share as a
sort of win for the firm.
I mean it definitely helps theclient to feel like they're
(30:51):
working with a cool firm.
That's legit, that's getting alot of press, that's always
great, but ultimately it comesdown to the messaging around the
results that you're providing.
Speaker 2 (31:00):
So it's like a culture to decide whether or not
you should be doing it, likeinternally, you've got to decide
do we want to have a mediarelation component or not?
So if you're a business and youdon't, or a nonprofit, or your
startup or whatever, how do youmake that decision on whether or
not you should engage somebodyor you should develop
(31:22):
relationships on the media front?
And and maybe people arethinking, well, you know, I
don't need that right now, orwhatever you know, how are you
making that decision-makingprocess?
Or how should people look at?
Speaker 1 (31:35):
that the first thing that comes to mind is, of course
, budget, and I hate to say itbecause I want people to spend
money with us, but it is truethat you want to make sure you
have budget, of course, to spend, because if you feel like
you're always stretched too thinon that end, it's never going
(31:56):
to be a pleasurable experienceand I think it puts more
pressure on the campaign than,honestly, is warranted.
So if you have the budget,that's definitely a great
checkmark there, you know.
I think the second thing too,which is probably more critical,
is to make sure you have theinfrastructure to put everything
to use, and I've talked aboutthis before, where it's like you
know you could have a PR firm,you could have an internal PR
(32:19):
person, whatever it might be,that's doing the work.
But if you don't have aninfrastructure and process in
place to make use of the work,to build the business and
generate engagement, it canalmost be pointless.
You know, we had a client, avery good client of ours, come
to us the other day andbasically say you guys do an
amazing work, but I'm just notseeing organic business from it,
not seeing organic businessfrom it, and we had to have that
(32:43):
conversation which we honestlyhad before, which is media
coverage, is not a silver bulletto generate business.
It's to support your efforts toget the business.
And so, understanding that mediaPR well, I would say more so.
Media, specifically is thinkingpast the placement itself and
how you can make use of itproactively is where, if you can
do that, that's where you'regoing to see success.
And if you're a founder, thatcould mean doing it yourself, or
(33:06):
it can mean having a small teaminternally, whether it's a
marketing team or even just youknow those that don't have any
marketing experience just youknow coming up with social posts
that are better than nothing,but at least you're posting the
media coverage, you're sendingit on your, in your newsletters,
whatever it is just at leasthaving a small team that can
help with that.
Or, if you're capable of doingit on your own, doing it
(33:27):
yourself, if you can do that,then I would definitely consider
hiring a team, because thenyou'll feel more like you're
using what they're doing.
Speaker 2 (33:36):
I think that that brings up a good point that kind
of brings this full circle inmy head of repurposing content
and and having theinfrastructure that, once you uh
get the press coverage or oryou get the placements that
you're looking for, how to reusethose in the sales process with
the client processcommunicating that information.
(33:57):
Uh, I was actually on a calltoday, okay, uh, with a client
that's trying to promote, uh, acertain um uh event that they
have and they had a videographercreate a bunch of short videos
for them.
Then they turn that shortvideos into a long video, okay,
and then they had hired us to dosome paid ads and they had not
(34:22):
even posted any of those shortsor that video on their social
media yet at all.
So, like you can create a bunchof assets but if you don't use
them and if the teams are nottalking and this is a lot of
organizations there and it's awaste.
And if you think about even onsocial media, uh, each post is
(34:42):
roughly four hours, like youguys got about a four hour life,
unless you're doing somethingelse with it.
If you're spending a lot ofmoney to create that content,
you want to be able to reusethat content and repurpose that
content and find, find a placefor it and, and I think a lot of
times, um, people are notthinking through that, right?
And I think hiring aorganization to help you with
(35:04):
that strategy and have thatinfrastructure in place to
syndicate it out, to get theword out there across the
different channels, is reallyquite important.
I mean, justin, tell me, likein your mind what would be like
a unknown secret of internetmarketing as it relates to PR.
Speaker 1 (35:27):
That's a good question.
Can we skip that one?
Speaker 2 (35:32):
We can totally skip that one.
Speaker 1 (35:33):
Okay, I'm not sure I have an answer on that yet.
Speaker 2 (35:36):
Okay, well, justin, if someone is thinking that they
need to be getting in touchwith you, and they're trying to
find someone to talk to.
That's done it.
Done it for a long time, workedwith some big companies.
They know they'll be in goodhands.
To make sure their message iswell, justin, how is the best
(35:56):
way for people to kind of reachout to you or to find out more
about PR73?
Speaker 1 (36:02):
Yeah, no, absolutely.
Um, so first I would say, visitwwwpr73.com.
That's our website.
You can also reach me directlyat Justin J U S T I N at PR
73.com.
We also have our main emailinfo at PR 73.com and, um, yeah,
or me an email info at PR73.com, and yeah you can catch us
(36:25):
there and we'd love to chat.
Speaker 2 (36:26):
Awesome.
Is there anything else that wehaven't talked about that you
think might be a good thing toshare, or to leave somebody with
actionable steps or takeawaysas it relates to PR?
Speaker 1 (36:36):
No, I think you covered it.
Speaker 2 (36:37):
Awesome.
Well, everybody, thanks so muchfor hanging out.
Until the next time.
My name is Matt Bertram.
Bye, bye for now.
Howdy.
Welcome back to the UnknownSecrets of Internet Marketing.
I am your host, matt Bertram.
As some of you noticed, you'remaybe looking for the podcast I
have changed the podcast cover.
I am working on the intro.
For those of you that watch onYouTube but be looking for our
new cover and just recognizethat, I am going to try to push
(00:36):
that out there and advertise it.
But since Chris is no longerhosting the show, I thought it
was time to put together alittle bit of a brand refresh.
So just please look for that,check that out.
And today, as we've beentalking about PR, I found
another great guest that cantalk really about comms and PR
(01:00):
strategy and how it fits intothe bigger picture.
I know a lot of you know thatI've written the Build your
Brand Mania book.
That was my first book aboutfive years ago talking about how
to build that know, like andtrust online, and so I continued
with that theme.
I wanted to introduce y'all toJustin Goldstein.
Speaker 1 (01:22):
How are you doing?
Speaker 2 (01:23):
Justin, All right.
So Justin, with PR 73, hasworked with some awesome
companies like Uber, ARP,General Motors.
He's been mentioned in Ad AgeForbes PR Week.
He's really an expert on PRstrategy and also how that fits
(01:43):
into the bigger flywheel mix,and so I wanted to bring Justin
on to kind of talk through someof that and share some of his
expertise.
So, Justin, welcome to the show.
Thanks so much for having me.
Now, Justin, just to kind ofcredentialize yourself a little
bit more.
I think I did that, but ifthere's anything else you would
like to add and kind of sharewith you in the audience your
(02:04):
origin story, that would be.
That would be awesome, just tokind of hear how you came to be
where you're at.
Speaker 1 (02:10):
Sure, yeah Well, thanks so much for having me,
matthew, and you know I've beenin the communication space I
think PR and marketing for over10 years now.
You know I started at a smallagency, went to a midsize firm
and then I launched PR73, whichformally is known as Press
Record Communication.
So if you Google my name,you'll probably see my name
associated with the old firmname.
(02:31):
But yeah, we've been at it fora little over five years now, as
you mentioned, working withsome really cool clients like
ARP, the Consumer Product SafetyCommission, the New York Public
Library, american BarAssociation some really big
names and some smaller names too, but ultimately having a lot of
fun doing it and lookingforward to what the future holds
(02:51):
too.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
Well, awesome.
Well, I think to like kind ofkick off this conversation,
whether you're a small business,owner, enterprise, startup, you
know a lot of we're talking toa lot of PE companies or even
venture capital.
We're talking to a lot of PEcompanies or even venture
capital when you're starting outand no one knows who you are or
(03:21):
who your brand is, or maybethey do know who you are, but
you're trying to change thatmessaging.
Establishing trust is soimportant with your audience and
your right target persona, andso I was hoping we could just
kind of create some definitionsaround how to look at trust in
general, how to establish trustin the online space today 100%,
you know.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
I think trust is ultimately the critical
component of what is going toallow any online practitioner to
get customers and clients,because if people don't believe
in the product that you'reputting out and the person that
you are as a professional,they're not going to choose you.
And there's a lot of differentaspects of trust.
I mean we found in our ownindustry, in a research report
(03:54):
that we launched earlier thisyear, that trust is actually a
really big issue across thecommunication space right now,
where you know teams don'tnecessarily it's of course, not
for every organization, butteams don't necessarily, of
course, not for everyorganization but teams don't
necessarily trust each otherinternally as well as the
message that's being sent outexternally by the companies that
they work for, and so I thinkthat, in order to show success,
(04:18):
not only from a businessperspective, in terms of
generating revenue, but alsocareer trajectory, it's really
important to have the trust ofyour colleagues, your key
audiences, internally andexternally, and looking to move
the ball forward from there.
Speaker 2 (04:32):
I was on a panel discussion last night and we
were talking about themillennial generation and how to
communicate those messages tothe middle body of people that
are looking for it and how tocommunicate it down on
organization.
And you're, you're absolutelyright, Um, in in a number of
previous discussions I've had,comms don't always talk to each
other.
And they're, they're, they'reworking, um, not in concert, but
(04:55):
but in a silo, and it's reallyabout breaking down those silos.
Uh, and really what?
What is the goal of thecommunications you're trying to
do?
Whether it be recruiting,whether it be internal
communication to get everybodyin a big organization on the
same page, whether it bechanging public policy or
influencing public policy, aswe're in an election cycle, or
(05:16):
to sell, there's different goalsof what these organizations or
teams are doing.
These organizations or teamsare doing, and a lot of times
they don't talk, but there'sreally a way to harmonize the
brand message where it resonatesacross multiple channels.
Speaker 1 (05:34):
Yeah, 100%, and I really like the point you made
about silos.
I think it speaks to a largerissue in organizations generally
, when they do have a creativepartner, whether it be PR
marketing, is that the PRmarketing work that's being done
doesn't necessarily gettransmitted to all stakeholders
in the organization anddifferent departments,
(05:56):
especially at the beginning whenthe project starts.
And so what often happens isthe creative partner will bring
a recommendation to theorganization and their point
person will understand it.
Even their direct team or theirboss might understand it, but
other departments that have toenact the actual work don't
necessarily trust it becausethey don't know who the outside
entity is.
(06:16):
They barely know who theinternal person is as the point
person for the organization, andso I think the more those silos
are broken down, the morethere's an opportunity for that
communication and connectivityto happen and for that trust to
be built up.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
Yeah, so.
So when you're you're seeingthis in a lot of different
organizations that that you'redealing with, I mean, when
you're approaching organizationand you're you're coming on,
they've recognized they need aproblem or there's a message out
there that needs to becommunicated a little bit
differently or positioned, andyou're looking at like, okay,
what does this media landscapelook like?
(06:52):
I mean, are you doing like aindustry, like surveying or
audit of what's going on, or howis this message going to be
received?
Is there some testing that'smaybe happening, sample testing,
before you're pushing outmessages globally in some cases,
(07:13):
right, how does that whenyou're approaching a client, or
how should a client, eveninternally, look at it if
they're trying to addresssomething like this?
Speaker 1 (07:24):
Yeah.
So I think there's a few stepsto take.
There's probably more that Ican think of, but I think
initially, some things that arepretty commonplace is to your
point.
One is to take a look at thelandscape of your audiences,
internal and external, dependingon who you're looking to reach
with your message, and gettingan understanding of what those
(07:44):
demographics want and need andwho is involved in those
demographics.
So anything down to their agerange, their education level,
but then going to theirexpertise and buying habits,
whatever it might be.
So that's step one.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
Step two is you definitely want to look at what
your competitors are doing.
Speaker 1 (08:01):
So getting an understanding of what their
messaging is really helps to, Ithink you know, align with what
you're doing as well.
So that one you don'tnecessarily want to copy them,
but you can at least let itinfluence the kind of messaging
development that you yourselfare doing internally.
And then, three, I think it'salso understanding what are the
long-term objectives of theorganization that you're working
(08:24):
with.
So you know, you might have abrilliant messaging or message
point in mind and it might matchwhat the audience wants, but if
it's not satisfying the overallorganizational goal, there's
got to be a better match there.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
Man, you know that makes me think back to, like,
social media, content planning,Like, and I know that that's
something part of the flywheelthat we'll get into it.
But a lot of times when we'refirst working with maybe some
small business clients, theythey'll just post random stuff
on their on their business page,right.
(08:57):
That is not tied into a broadermessage, right?
And so there's a lot ofeducation that comes in on how
to approach communicating thismessage part of a broader story,
helping people kind of getthose insights and see what's
happening.
And so when you think about,like, content strategy or
(09:18):
mastering media relations, howdo you look at that?
I mean, I know it's aboutfeeding the algorithm and you
got to warm up some of theseaccounts and these messages and
topical authorities.
And this also plays into SEO,which which I talk about a lot.
I'm just curious, what is yourangle when you, when you, come
at that?
Speaker 1 (09:37):
It's an interesting question.
You know, I think contentdevelopment and media relations
can collaborate, but they couldalso be separate in terms of the
masters that they're serving.
So when you look at contentdevelopment, that's a little bit
more of an own channel, as youknow, and I'm sure your
listeners know as well whereyou're trying to drive
engagement with the audience tosay, simply visit your website,
(09:59):
your social channels, whateverit might be, channels, whatever
it might be, whereas mediarelations can certainly feed
into that.
But you're also trying toconnect with a reporter and give
them what they need for theirstory, which might not
necessarily match what thecontent is looking to achieve in
terms of the channel engagement.
So it's kind of balancing thegoals there and understanding
(10:20):
that sometimes you have tosacrifice one for the other,
especially, I would say, more soon the media relations front.
You know we've definitely hadmultiple instances with clients
where they have a fantasticpiece of content.
It doesn't necessarily resonatewith a reporter.
The reporter wants to talkabout something else and it
definitely benefits their brandto do so and will help with
their overall branding in thelongterm.
(10:40):
But sometimes they can't seepast that initial content
request and it not goinganywhere and feeling a little
bit rejected because of that.
So you got to kind of coachthem through it and show them
you know the forest through thetrees and what the value is in
terms of again sacrificing onefor the other.
Speaker 2 (10:58):
So to just expand on that a little bit more, when you
think about media relations,right, those reporters have a
goal they're trying to hit, or ablogger's trying to hit a
certain amount of numbers, orthey have a story they're trying
to reach.
This is actually the same.
When you think about differentsocial media platforms A lot of
people don't know this.
(11:18):
Linkedin actually has a contentcalendar of things that they're
trying to promote and thingsthat they'll highlight and even
boost in the algorithm.
If you line up with that.
That happens with podcasts too,like different seasonal things
that come out.
If you can align that, you cansubmit these things to get a
greater visibility.
And so, really, if you're likesaying, hey, it's about
(11:39):
establishing rapport, right,cause also people do business
with people they know I cantrust, and so if they know your
company, they know what you do,you have this kind of working
rapport with them, there's agreater chance that they'll
think about you for a quote orpicking something up.
And so establishing mediarelations or like who you're
going to be contacting, whereit's just not a cold call,
(12:01):
basically right, you're likesending a pitch and it's a cold
call is really, I think, prettyimportant.
And then also asking them whatdo they need?
And then look at your broaderstrategy and figure out what
content you have that fits inthat right, and then if there's
something you want to highlightas you build that relationship,
they may say, hey, there mightbe an opportunity to highlight
(12:22):
this down the road, right, andso, um, I think that like, okay,
you can send a press release,of course, and you can get your
message out there and you cansee what pickups happen.
And if you write a really uh,good, good article that helps
them write their story, thatthat's helpful.
But if you're really trying toget placements and move it
forward, you can't look at it as, like this, one independent
(12:44):
thing.
You have to zoom out and lookat it as a broader media
relationship strategy as well asa content strategy, where
you're planning it out for along haul and maybe you try to
insert those things.
I mean, can you tell me?
Like, when I look at it, Ithink like, okay, if you want to
get your message out there,okay, you're going to do
advertising.
You're going to advertise.
You can say whatever you wantto say to whoever you want to
(13:06):
say it on whatever platform.
But like social media as wellas um like press or or, uh you
know, media.
It's more about getting thatvisibility on a third party
platform or from a third partyperson to, to see it in a way,
and and and that is not justyour goals, right, that, that's
(13:28):
your goals and their goals.
And so how do you, how do youstructure that, I like?
I mean, when a company comes toyou with like, hey, we want to
do this, how do you like lay outthat roadmap for them?
Or?
Or look at it in a broadercontext, cause sometimes you
don't get that quick winimmediately, right, you can't
just run an ad and boom, you gotit out there.
It's a different-, yeah 100%,100%.
Speaker 1 (13:50):
So I think you brought up a really good point,
a couple of really good points.
One is which that you have tounderstand, going into it, that
you're not necessarily going toget an immediate win tomorrow,
and that also PR in general isthere more so as a business
support than a make or break.
So you know.
Again, when we're talking aboutmedia coverage, for example,
(14:10):
media coverage is a fantasticpiece of content for what I call
the social proof flywheel.
I don't know if that'strademarked or not, so don't
quote me on it being mine, butjust using it as an example.
Now you know it's a fantasticpiece for that right, because
ultimately you can use that inyour outbound DM campaigns for
LinkedIn, let's say yournewsletters even your marketing,
(14:30):
your paid marketing, and so itall builds up for the longer
term objective of building yourbusiness.
But it's not necessarily goingto make or break it in 30 days,
let's say so.
That's part one, you know.
Part two is also understandingthat PR isn't just writing press
releases.
Some people have thatmisconception that if you write
and distribute, say, five to 10press releases, a year.
(14:53):
You're going to get a ton of SEO, you're going to get all these
new business inquiries, andultimately it doesn't work that
way.
A lot of times press releasesare hit or miss, especially on
the wire services.
You might get a reporterrequest, you might get a new
business lead from it, butultimately it's there is more of
a proof document that you knowwhat you're saying is official,
and and so I look at the pressrelease as more of a supporting
(15:17):
asset.
Right?
So when you go to reporters,when you go to prospects, you
can share it as a proof point,but it's not meant to solicit or
generate inbound leads of anykind, in my opinion.
Speaker 2 (15:28):
So just random question is all good press, is
all press, good press?
Like if you get bad press, isall good press?
Bad press because you have theattention and you can spin it or
how you how do?
You approach that.
Speaker 1 (15:41):
Two pronged answer to that, um, I would say one is
it's how good you are at PR onyour own, um, and also if you
have an agency helping you.
I personally don't believe thatall good, all press, is good
press.
Um, you know, there are somepeople where bad press fits into
the brand that they're tryingto build, in a sense, because
they're trying to be like ananti hero or something like that
(16:03):
, but for most people I wouldn'tadvise it.
You know you really want to tryto generate press that's, of
course, productive and positiveand, you know, try to avoid the
negative press situations andnot get into a situation where
mentally, you know, you feellike you have free freedom to do
whatever you want, especiallyif you work for another
organization right, or even yourfamily right, like you're
(16:26):
always representing somebodyelse unless you're truly, you
know, out of your own, single nokids, no significant other, no
family whatsoever, which youknow, hopefully, is not the case
for most people.
You're always representingsomebody else and so, yes,
perhaps there are instanceswhere the negative press doesn't
impact you personally in termsof your day to day, for you but
(16:47):
it can impact your loved onesand those around you, and so,
yeah, I would say, stay awayfrom that.
Speaker 2 (16:52):
Good point, so okay.
So say you're in a crisismanagement situation.
How do you know that you're ina crisis management situation,
right, if someone's thinking outthere like something bad's
going on right now?
I don't really know what to doabout it.
Tell me about, like, what thatsituation might look like where
you're saying, hey, I might needto get in touch with a
representative and then, two,how should you approach it?
(17:13):
Or, like, how do you start theprocess of saying, okay, we got
a bunch of bad press, we need todo something about it.
What are those steps?
To start kind of putting outthe fire, if you will.
Speaker 1 (17:25):
Yeah, absolutely so.
I think there's two ways tomeasure that One is getting an
understanding of is the pressdamaging your brand for the
longterm and how big of a dealis this, knowing your business
and your internal team?
So it's funny because I had afamily friend that called up
asking for help for somethingcrisis related earlier this week
(17:46):
, or maybe it was last week.
I was tracking the time thesedays and after talking through
it with him, we kind of realizedthat in the moment it feels
like something really bad, butin a week from now, if it's not
appearing on Google, let's sayif it's not easily findable, is
it something that's really goingto impact you?
Where you have to spend themoney on crisis PR, because
(18:07):
crisis PR is expensive, you know, because the crisis PR teams
that are out there are workinglong hours, they're putting a
lot of man and woman power intothe work that's being done, and
so it's a lot of money and a lotof budget.
So you have to really assesswhether this is something that's
going to be a long term problemor just stings for the day and
(18:30):
then it goes away.
You know, I think it's alwayssuggested that if you feel an
inkling of there being apotential situation.
It's always good to talk to acrisis expert just to make sure
that you're on the same page andlike, pay that fee to.
You know, have that 30 to 60minute conversation just to make
sure and if both parties feellike there's something worth
activating on, then make adecision.
But yeah, I would say, at thevery least, if there's even a
(18:52):
chance that it might besomething bigger, you definitely
want to try to speak to anexpert to make sure that it
isn't or it is and you have todo something about it.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
And that leads into the conversation about maybe
reputation management right, solike maybe put in money in the
social bank and having yourbrand represented a certain way
before you need it to be.
And also, really, when I lookat reputation management, I'm
looking at gaining reviews,making sure that when people
search for you, when they'rekind of peeling the onion back,
(19:24):
like looking into your brand,they see good things.
Right, and that takes a littlebit of crafting as far as
getting getting out the goodstories early, because many
times people only share thenegative and so sometimes you
have to draw out that positive.
How would you approachreputation management from a PR
standpoint?
Speaker 1 (19:45):
It's a very detailed process so it's kind of hard to,
you know, boil it down into a30, 60 second response.
But what I would say is thatthe first thing we want to do
and I mentioned this just aminute ago is to have that
initial call to really gothrough what the situation is,
what the potential impact of thebusiness is, who are the
(20:06):
audiences that are going in thereal estate sector?
And she had a couple of teamsleave her and we went through
that whole process of what doesthat mean for your business that
(20:27):
the teams are leaving.
Was there any bad blood?
What are the factors that weneed to know in terms of the
brand impact and the businessimpact?
And so, going through thosequestions, it's really important
to do that and alsounderstanding again this goes
back to what I was sayingearlier about how big of a deal
this is, how proactive andreactive you want to be about
(20:48):
this, right?
So an example of beingproactive is do you want to go
to the press and say something,or is it better not to do that
because you might shine a lighton something you don't
necessarily want to shine thatlight on, so reactive would be.
Let's prepare a couple ofstatements one for the founders
or founder of a company to have,and then the other statement
for the broader team to have toanswer any questions for clients
(21:09):
, prospects, press, whatever itmight be.
So this way you're ready to gobut you're reacting to it versus
proactively bringing attentionto it.
So it all kind of depends onthe situation, but I think the
key there is being prepared andhaving you know reference
documents ready to go in casesomething does pop up, and
that's the very least that youshould probably do.
Speaker 2 (21:32):
I love that.
I think that that's a greatactionable step having a
preparation document of what tosay if you are contacted or if
the word gets out there.
Because social media is sopowerful today and it shapes a
lot of people's perceptions andthe algorithm just wants
engagement right.
So you know, things can getcarried away pretty quickly
(21:56):
online and can kind of take itin a direction, and you should
be prepared in case those sortof things happen.
So I want to switch gears alittle bit because I think that
something that would be reallyvaluable for a lot of people
that listen are probablythinking okay, I have a business
and this is all good, and maybethis doesn't affect me.
(22:17):
Maybe some people are like thisis affecting me, this is really
helpful.
But a lot of people are like,okay, I want to win new business
, I want to manage my clients ina one-to-many situation.
How can PR help me do that ifI'm trying to decide where all
my resources are going to go?
How should I be doing PR andwhat are some like maybe proven
(22:37):
steps to win those long-termclients or to get that social
proof that you need that sort ofthing?
Speaker 1 (22:42):
Yeah, there are a couple of quick ways that I
would recommend.
So one is definitely hiring ateam or expert to help craft
your messaging, because thatmessaging can bleed into the
sales messaging that you'reactually using to generate leads
.
The second I would say is mediacoverage is a fan and I think I
mentioned this earlier in theinterview is a fantastic asset
for not only top of funnel butmiddle of funnel, meaning that
(23:08):
you know, oftentimes when we'retrying to generate business, we
have some somewhat blandmessages because we're strapped
for time.
We don't have a lot of time toput into, like writing a really
unique message, which everyone,including myself, always tries
to do better about.
But, like, once you have apiece of media coverage, it
makes your life so much easierbecause then you can go to that
prospect and say hey, so-and-sogreat to connect on LinkedIn.
(23:29):
Wanted to flag this piece ofcoverage.
I got in the Wall StreetJournal talking about XYZ, which
I know relates to what you'redoing, thought you'd enjoy it.
Let's connect.
So, right there you're having,you're providing social proof
and you're also um showcasingthat you have expertise in the
space and that helps to startthe conversation.
The middle of the conversationor middle of the funnel part of
it is okay.
You've had a couple ofconversations.
(23:50):
Now you need something back toengage the prospect with, to
keep them in your funnel andkeep them engaged.
And that's where media coveragecomes in.
You share that piece of mediacoverage in an email and say hey
, so-and-so, hope all's well.
Since we last chatted, Iactually got featured in the
Wall Street Journal since thentalking about this.
Thought you'd enjoy it, wantedto send it over in case it's
helpful.
(24:10):
Can we connect next week and Ican walk you through how I got
this piece of coverage and whatit means for you.
That's a way to keep themengaged.
So those are two really quickways to do it.
There's definitely more, but Ithink in the short term, when
you're first getting started,those are probably the easiest
ways that you can do it.
Speaker 2 (24:25):
Yeah, I think that when you're well, when you have
that piece of content, itbecomes a sales so okay.
So going back to Google, right,so Google, how they look at
everything is through aframework called EAT expertise,
authority and trust right.
And so anytime that you can getthat authority from a third
(24:47):
party to give you kind of thatinterview that I did about for
the media, when you'reconnecting with the media, if
(25:07):
there's experiential knowledgeor statistics or anything that
is not publicly available thatyou can share in that press
release or share with the mediarelated to whatever they're
trying to do, is really quitepowerful.
And so you got to get thatmedia coverage right to be able
(25:27):
to use the media coverage.
So it's like a little bit of aI guess, a chicken and the egg,
but really hitting on thatauthority.
If other people can say itAgain, I think awards, winning
awards, are part of like a PRopportunity, like I don't think
a lot of people think about that, you know, I mean the BBB is a
local award or like for us,american Marketing Association.
(25:49):
There's a lot of differentorganizations that do it, but
but being involved in thoseorganizations and winning those
awards give you that kind ofcredibility Right, just like you
can say, hey, check out thisarticle, you can say, hey, check
out this award I won.
Right Now I think that certainorganizations and sometimes I've
heard back from people, well,they just give that award to
everyone Well, that organizationmight need some PR to
(26:11):
credentialize a little bitbetter the stringency of how
they're offering it.
Or like I'm on the subcommitteefor the BBB, like you know, how
is the BBB different as all therise of these online review
sites come into place and andand how do they work with
different organizations andcompanies?
So I think a lot of it's aboutpositioning yourself.
(26:33):
I mean, can you tell me maybean example for a client of
something you did where itturned into closing a deal so
people could maybe relate itback to their business of like,
hey, I could do that similarkind of thing it's not just in
the ether, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (26:49):
So we've had clients where they're on the hook and
they've gone a little silent,either because they're trying to
figure out whether what we'reproposing is doable, if they
have the budget for it, whatevermight be.
And so I there's definitelybeen instances where I've even
shared podcast interviews,whether it be the full interview
or a clip, and said you know,or have my team say hey, so, and
(27:10):
so you know, justin was just onthis podcast talking about
again this topic that uminvolves, you know, marketing
development and wheremarketing's headed in the next
five years.
Thought you'd find it ofinterest, would love to connect,
and that person might respondand say thanks so much for
sending this.
I've been meaning to reach backout.
Can we schedule a time and thenyou carry it forward from there
?
So I don't think there's everbeen a piece of media coverage
(27:32):
that's like sealed the deal andbrought it over the finish line.
It's more so propelled it, inthe sense that it's propelled
the actual conversations toactually happen, to get it over
the finish line, which is stillreally valuable.
Speaker 2 (27:48):
Yeah, you need to help salespeople along the way,
kind of move it forward.
I can tell you, the biggest winthat I've had that I can most
recently think about and this isreally when you think about
like funding rounds and stufflike that for startups had a
client that was actually goinginto another round and they
(28:08):
didn't want to have a down round.
They weren't showing likematerial progress of what they
were doing.
And they came to me and we werelike what are some ideas that
we can do to generate some valuefor the brand, to show some
real progress?
And I actually knew some peopleover at the Dynamos, which is a
soccer team here in Houstonthat actually went over to the
(28:31):
Texans and so we were able toget some conversations going
with the Texans to establishourselves as an official going
with the Texans, to establishourself as a official partner
with the Texans for kind of a, athree year period that we were
able to do some press and andpush some stuff out there and we
generated I think it was like alittle bit under a million
dollars in press value rightWithin three weeks.
(28:55):
And so that was like it was areally fun project and it was
exciting, but it was almost kindof in that crisis state of like
we need to do something.
What can we do?
What have we built?
What assets do we haveavailable?
So I would encourage everyoneout there Everybody has a unique
selling proposition and hassomething that they've done
that's unique from other peopleand figuring out and working
(29:17):
with the strategist to figureout what that might look like is
is super powerful.
I think I mean, tell me alittle bit about, like, client
relationship management.
Like I mean, certainly you knowit helps you close the deal.
It continues to kind of checkthe box.
There's no red flags.
They find good stuff about you.
But, like, how do youspecifically use it to manage,
(29:40):
maybe, client relations for whatmay with the bigger
organization?
Speaker 1 (29:44):
Yeah, I don't.
I don't think the media coveragehelps with client management as
much as just having anunderstanding of messaging to
make the client feel confidentin the work that you're doing
and also be able to have tougherconversations with clients,
right.
And so having that expertise andhow to craft a message, how to
(30:08):
make it persuasive while beingethical, of course, how to have
that message in form, reallyhelps to build the relationships
.
I mean the media coveragecertainly helps, but I think
it's more about that.
Plus, you know, as PRpractitioners most PR
practitioners, I find, areworking with the media and so by
(30:29):
having conversations daily, itjust warms you up to be able to
talk more and feel morecomfortable having conversations
in the first place, especiallywhen you're new to the business.
So, yeah, I think it's just anatural skill set of building
messages and havingconversations that helps, more
so than the media coverageitself that you could share as a
sort of win for the firm.
I mean it definitely helps theclient to feel like they're
(30:51):
working with a cool firm.
That's legit, that's getting alot of press, that's always
great, but ultimately it comesdown to the messaging around the
results that you're providing.
Speaker 2 (31:00):
So it's like a culture to decide whether or not
you should be doing it, likeinternally, you've got to decide
do we want to have a mediarelation component or not?
So if you're a business and youdon't, or a nonprofit, or your
startup or whatever, how do youmake that decision on whether or
not you should engage somebodyor you should develop
(31:22):
relationships on the media front?
And and maybe people arethinking, well, you know, I
don't need that right now, orwhatever you know, how are you
making that decision-makingprocess?
Or how should people look at?
Speaker 1 (31:35):
that the first thing that comes to mind is, of course
, budget, and I hate to say itbecause I want people to spend
money with us, but it is truethat you want to make sure you
have budget, of course, to spend, because if you feel like
you're always stretched too thinon that end, it's never going
(31:56):
to be a pleasurable experienceand I think it puts more
pressure on the campaign than,honestly, is warranted.
So if you have the budget,that's definitely a great
checkmark there, you know.
I think the second thing too,which is probably more critical,
is to make sure you have theinfrastructure to put everything
to use, and I've talked aboutthis before, where it's like you
know you could have a PR firm,you could have an internal PR
(32:19):
person, whatever it might be,that's doing the work.
But if you don't have aninfrastructure and process in
place to make use of the work,to build the business and
generate engagement, it canalmost be pointless.
You know, we had a client, avery good client of ours, come
to us the other day andbasically say you guys do an
amazing work, but I'm just notseeing organic business from it,
not seeing organic businessfrom it, and we had to have that
(32:43):
conversation which we honestlyhad before, which is media
coverage, is not a silver bulletto generate business.
It's to support your efforts toget the business.
And so, understanding that mediaPR well, I would say more so.
Media, specifically is thinkingpast the placement itself and
how you can make use of itproactively is where, if you can
do that, that's where you'regoing to see success.
And if you're a founder, thatcould mean doing it yourself, or
(33:06):
it can mean having a small teaminternally, whether it's a
marketing team or even just youknow those that don't have any
marketing experience just youknow coming up with social posts
that are better than nothing,but at least you're posting the
media coverage, you're sendingit on your, in your newsletters,
whatever it is just at leasthaving a small team that can
help with that.
Or, if you're capable of doingit on your own, doing it
(33:27):
yourself, if you can do that,then I would definitely consider
hiring a team, because thenyou'll feel more like you're
using what they're doing.
Speaker 2 (33:36):
I think that that brings up a good point that kind
of brings this full circle inmy head of repurposing content
and and having theinfrastructure that, once you uh
get the press coverage or oryou get the placements that
you're looking for, how to reusethose in the sales process with
the client processcommunicating that information.
(33:57):
Uh, I was actually on a calltoday, okay, uh, with a client
that's trying to promote, uh, acertain um uh event that they
have and they had a videographercreate a bunch of short videos
for them.
Then they turn that shortvideos into a long video, okay,
and then they had hired us to dosome paid ads and they had not
(34:22):
even posted any of those shortsor that video on their social
media yet at all.
So, like you can create a bunchof assets but if you don't use
them and if the teams are nottalking and this is a lot of
organizations there and it's awaste.
And if you think about even onsocial media, uh, each post is
(34:42):
roughly four hours, like youguys got about a four hour life,
unless you're doing somethingelse with it.
If you're spending a lot ofmoney to create that content,
you want to be able to reusethat content and repurpose that
content and find, find a placefor it and, and I think a lot of
times, um, people are notthinking through that, right?
And I think hiring aorganization to help you with
(35:04):
that strategy and have thatinfrastructure in place to
syndicate it out, to get theword out there across the
different channels, is reallyquite important.
I mean, justin, tell me, likein your mind what would be like
a unknown secret of internetmarketing as it relates to PR.
Speaker 1 (35:27):
That's a good question.
Can we skip that one?
Speaker 2 (35:32):
We can totally skip that one.
Speaker 1 (35:33):
Okay, I'm not sure I have an answer on that yet.
Speaker 2 (35:36):
Okay, well, justin, if someone is thinking that they
need to be getting in touchwith you, and they're trying to
find someone to talk to.
That's done it.
Done it for a long time, workedwith some big companies.
They know they'll be in goodhands.
To make sure their message iswell, justin, how is the best
(35:56):
way for people to kind of reachout to you or to find out more
about PR73?
Speaker 1 (36:02):
Yeah, no, absolutely.
Um, so first I would say, visitwwwpr73.com.
That's our website.
You can also reach me directlyat Justin J U S T I N at PR
73.com.
We also have our main emailinfo at PR 73.com and, um, yeah,
or me an email info at PR73.com, and yeah you can catch us
(36:25):
there and we'd love to chat.
Speaker 2 (36:26):
Awesome.
Is there anything else that wehaven't talked about that you
think might be a good thing toshare, or to leave somebody with
actionable steps or takeawaysas it relates to PR?
Speaker 1 (36:36):
No, I think you covered it.
Speaker 2 (36:37):
Awesome.
Well, everybody, thanks so muchfor hanging out.
Until the next time.
My name is Matt Bertram.
Bye, bye for now.
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