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September 1, 2024 104 mins

Kanoa Lloyd is one of New Zealand’s top broadcasters and became a household name from co-hosting the Project on primetime TV for seven years.

She first made her name in children’s TV, before working on radio at Mai FM and was also a weather presenter for Newshub.

In this episode we talk about her path from Squirt and Sticky TV to Three News, integrating Te Reo Māori into the weather and all the hate that came along with it, why she quit Mai FM, the blowup of the Project and the stress and burnout that accompanied it, her best and worst moments on live TV, the future of media, parenthood, what she's doing now – and all the best stories in between.

This was such a fun chat. Kanoa is warm, personable and authentic and there were a ton of laughs in this one mixed in with some really thoughtful periods of introspection.

You'll love this one.

We're also super stoked to have Kanoa on the books of B2B Speakers, so if you’d like her to share her story at your function or event, flick us a message by going to B2Bspeakers.co.nz. Also check out our epic lineup of former guests available for hire too.

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Transcript

Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
This is an iHeartRadio New Zealant podcast.

Speaker 2 (00:16):
Women. On this episode, between two Beers, we talked to
kana A Lloyd. Kanaha is one of New Zealand's top
broadcasters and became a household name from co hosting The
Project on Primetime TV for seven years. She first made
her name in children's TV before working on radio at MYFM,

(00:40):
and was also a weather presenter for news Hub. In
this episode, we talk about a path from Squirt and
Sticky TV to three News, integrating Terreo Mouldi into the
weather and all the hate that came along with it,
why she quit MYFM, the blow up of the project
and the stress and burnout that accompanied it, her best
and worst moments on live TV, the future of media parenthood,

(01:01):
what she's doing now, and all the best stories in between.
This was such a fun Chatka is warm, personable and
authentic and there were a ton of laughs in this
one mixed in with some really thoughtful periods of introspection.
You'll love this one. We're also super stoked with kanor
on the books of B to B speakers, So if
you'd like her to share her story at your function
or event or m see the event flick us a

(01:23):
message by going to B two B speakers dot co
dot z. Also check out our epic lineup of former
guests available for hire two. This episode is brought to
you by tab Download the new app today and get
your bet on. Listen on iHeart or where you get
your podcasts from, or watch the video on.

Speaker 3 (01:40):
YouTube Enjoy.

Speaker 2 (01:44):
Cana Alloyd, Welcome to Between two vs.

Speaker 1 (01:47):
Thank you.

Speaker 4 (01:48):
Oh shit, I'm so bad at talking. I already interrupted you.

Speaker 2 (01:51):
Ah that We've got a hell of a time ahead
of us.

Speaker 5 (01:57):
We are so excited to.

Speaker 2 (01:58):
Have you in with us for a yarn today. I
had to laugh when I was texting you to come
on the show and you said yes straight away, but
then you said you also blanked Jesse Mulligan when he
asked if you'd help with research for his EP and
I wondered, that was my first question, is why the
contrasting replies?

Speaker 4 (02:15):
Did he say yes to you?

Speaker 5 (02:16):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (02:18):
That's so nice. I know, I'm so mean. I think
Jesse's episode, by the way, was such a cool conversation
that you guys had, But it was earlier on at
the start of this year, the project had just been
canceled like a couple of months before, and I like,
was just I didn't know what I was about, and

(02:38):
the idea of talking to some broadcasting people and using
that part of my brain. I was just like, that's
an outrageous request. Like I love you so much and
I've got so much great stuff to say about you,
but I will not be doing that today.

Speaker 5 (02:52):
Sorry.

Speaker 3 (02:53):
And I like that. Yeah, firm reason and firm rationale.
It's strong and even better that you said yues to
us straight away.

Speaker 5 (03:00):
That is great.

Speaker 2 (03:00):
Yeah, but you're in a good place now.

Speaker 4 (03:03):
Yeah, I am, thank you. I think it's been you know,
it's been a hell of a year. It's quite I've
said to people before that watching what has happened with
the media here in Altador and then also overseas, it's
a little bit like, you know, like when the project
the cancelation was announced, it felt a bit like my

(03:24):
school classroom had burned down overnight or something, you know,
like this fundamental place that was really important to me
and sort of the panic and the sadness and stuff
that comes with that. But I was like, we'll be sweet.
I guess we'll be doing classes from the hall, and
then the whole school went down. That's what it was

(03:45):
sort of like this year just watching this thing that
I've grown up with, Like I've always sort of worshiped
the news, worship tally been a huge media nerd, and
just to see it kind of fall to pieces and
even the grown ups, like the people in charge are
going shit, we don't know what to do. It's been

(04:05):
quite Yeah, it's been quite confronting. But I think I've
I've spent a lot of time on myself this year,
which has probably been a bit overdue. So shifting my
focus away from that world and just kind of going
like what have I got here? What can I manage

(04:26):
in front of me? Has actually been amazing.

Speaker 2 (04:30):
Is it a bit like leaving high school when you've
got this close group of mates that you're spending every
day with and you're probably in all the chat groups
and everything's firing, and then slowly, month after month of
the months and years, it's kind of you know, you
drift apart a little bit, or you're still quite connected
to that crew.

Speaker 4 (04:45):
Oh no, I mean I think what it's a bit
like maybe I say it's a bit like when you
become a parent. You know, the friends who show up
for you and actually stick around and actually bring the
lasagna and actually answer your two am text message of panic,
like they really, they're like the cream that rises to
the top. And I think, you know, just by the
nature of the work that we were doing, there was

(05:07):
dozens and dozens and dozens of people involved, and they've
got their whole own rich lives to kind of be
getting on with. But those like those day ones, those
super tight homies like wheh, yeah, we're still in touch
for sure.

Speaker 3 (05:19):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (05:19):
In fact, I've got dinner with Jesse and Jeremy Corbett.
I think next week.

Speaker 3 (05:24):
Have you done a dinner with Jesse when he's reviewing, Yes.

Speaker 4 (05:30):
I have, and I don't really enjoy it. You would
think that the offer of free food, free wine going
to these amazing restaurants in Auckland would be like a
nice offer. But he's so weird when he's I know
you've told you that, but it's like, you know, like

(05:51):
I don't know, he sits weird. He's reading the menu
with this like he's like he's studying for an exam.
And then I get really self conscious because I actually
really like food. I really like cooking, like it's a
big personal passion of mine. I've not too into a career,
and so I'm sort of like I want to say that,
like the seasoning of this is amazing, But then is

(06:12):
he going to think that I'm trying to like get
in there, you know? So then I'm sitting there like, whoa,
look at that picture behind you. Not that I'm commenting
on the day courts. Obviously that's your job. I don't
care whatever. Yeah, it's just a very strange experience. So
we do try and book and like times to hang
out when neither of us is working.

Speaker 3 (06:30):
Is it a noticeable switch though, like a like a
casual catch up dinner versus a review Jesse dinner. Can
you switch the personalities off when he's in a restaurant?

Speaker 5 (06:38):
I think so, I.

Speaker 3 (06:39):
Don't know why I said restaurant.

Speaker 4 (06:45):
He does. And I think with Jesse, like he he's
physically quite different. He can be so relaxed and he
will lounge around and burial dog. But I think the
Jesse that you know has built such an incredible career.
It's quite like he's got a good posture, he's got
a focus rode myself as well, So yeah, you can

(07:13):
you can tell the difference.

Speaker 2 (07:14):
Do you clock people realizing it's Jesse and like sort
of upping their game when when you're out hard out, yeap.

Speaker 4 (07:20):
Hard out, and it's kind of it's kind of nice.
It's like when you know, it's a similar feeling to
when your brother or your sister or someone like that
does something cold, like I feel kind of proud for him.
I'm like, yeah, that's right, he's going to write about
your shit.

Speaker 5 (07:37):
Love it.

Speaker 2 (07:38):
We've got some strong connections with other recent guests we've
had on, and we actually wanted to start with Jason Gunn,
who we had on very recently. What a Guy had
us both in tears in that episode. I didn't see
what's coming, just no, just crept up on us a
But his storytelling is like second to none, unreal. But
you auditioned for him right at what now and you

(08:00):
never on what Now? But he can you. What was
your experience with Jason.

Speaker 4 (08:03):
Gunn, oh Man, I mean, I was I worship that man.
I just you know, I think that is actually the
beautiful thing about children's television is that it's a huge
responsibility when you're in that role as the presenter, because
you're going into people's homes. They believe in you. They

(08:24):
trust you, they're listening to what you say, so you've
got to be very careful with your words. And I
had that relationship with Jason Gun like he was my mate.
I remember being in I lived in Bannockburn in Central
Otago for a little while and filling out the self
address stamped envelope to the son of a Gun show

(08:46):
And when I got the reply and it had Jay's
signature on the bottom and a badge with him and
Thingy's face, like I could not believe it. I was like,
Jason and Thingy know where Bannockburn is, where about seven
people live, and they and they knew how to get
me this badge, Like that was such a treasure And

(09:06):
I actually still have that badge somewhere stashed away. So yeah,
I think I was about eighteen. I was already doing
another kid's TV show called Squirt. I was doing another
TV show called Squirt, which was based in Dunedin and
I found out that what Now were auditioning for new

(09:28):
hosts and this was in the Tarmati coffee era. I
thought he was pretty cool, so I think I yeah,
I got flown from Dunedin to christ Church, which for
eighteen year old me was like mind blowing, got picked
up from the airport by a nice lady, got driven
to the studios, and yeah, I mean it was like

(09:50):
walking into Hallowed Ground. Even though I kind of had
a bit of Tally experience because I knew the set
and the people so well already, I just was like
going to Disneyland for me. Tarmity sort of showed us
the ropes, took us around, set us up, and I
was feeling pretty cool. And then Jason Gunn came boyinging in.

Speaker 3 (10:11):
He does.

Speaker 4 (10:14):
Just still to this day, like, how dare he? I don't.
I've never talked to him about his diet or exercise,
but it must be amazing.

Speaker 5 (10:21):
It's not.

Speaker 3 (10:22):
Actually, if you listen to the episode, he's a KFC fan,
a fiend for KFC. Yeah, and he also like I
think he clocked the McDonald's VIP card from Young Entertainers.
Go back and listen to that episode. It's a good one.

Speaker 4 (10:35):
Oh man, I so well, and I'm going to brow
down with him over a backet a chicken. Yeah, he
comes boinging in, and I think it was after lunch,
so maybe he had just had too much KFC or something.
I was expecting this man that I knew from the tally,
and he just sprawled out in the bleachers where the
studio audience set lay down, and well, he proceeded to

(10:57):
say a lot of funny sweet.

Speaker 5 (10:58):
Words really offend. Yeah, offran a so off brand.

Speaker 4 (11:03):
But for me, you know, I mateen, I'm a teenager.
I'm like, I'm starting to drink alcohol. I'm like swearing
with my friends. And I actually thought this is amazing,
Like he's still got the same energy, he's got the
same smile. He knows what he's talking about, but he's
fucking saying fun Yeah, and so you know, it didn't.
I think I can't remember what happened. I didn't get

(11:25):
the role, but it was kind of this another another
great slice to this pie where I was like, man,
the people making TV are the most interesting, charismatic group
of people, and Jas was right at the top of
that list.

Speaker 2 (11:43):
Yeah, do you still did you keep a relationship with
him when you moved it away from.

Speaker 4 (11:48):
No, No, I didn't. I actually didn't have anything to
do with him until he started coming and being a
guest on the project. And again I was just like,
oh my god, a couple of us that he needs
to Jason Guard.

Speaker 5 (12:00):
Did he remember you from way back when?

Speaker 3 (12:02):
Uh?

Speaker 5 (12:03):
You know what.

Speaker 4 (12:03):
The thing about Jason is that he's like, he's of
this generation of being a professional entertainer, and so I
think he's got the skill. There's a handful of other
people that have the skill. If he doesn't know what
you're talking about, he will pretend like he does and
he'll have a little story and he might I think
he remembered that my so, my husband, Mikey Carpenter was

(12:27):
part of the what Now team before he and I
ever met, and so he'd made the connection about Mikey.
So you know you by the end of it, you're like,
I don't care if you remember or not, because you're
just charmed me.

Speaker 2 (12:39):
Yeah, that's such a good description. And so we met
him at this conference we were speaking at and he
was emc and just boinging, like just the man appeared
and I was like, holy shit, just a ray of
good energy and vibes. Such good chat. Go listen to
it after this one. But the other guest we've got
a connection with is Dave Latelly, and we had him

(12:59):
in at the start of the year, and that is
a man on a mission. Holy shit. He has got
so much going on and he's so driven. But you
were working with him recently sort of behind the camera.
Why did that project appeal to you?

Speaker 4 (13:12):
Oh? Man, I think I don't know if you guys
ever get this, but sometimes I think, God, I should
be doing ten thousand times more, you know. And I
really wrestle with that thought because it's like, well, they
do what I can and it's got to be sustainable,
and you know, I can't save the world. But Dave

(13:34):
doesn't have those thoughts. It's like, I will save the
world if it kills me. And so I mean, I
don't have that. I don't have that same energy. But
I think we really align in terms of our morals
and our values and recognizing need and knowing that it
is shit that our people are struggling so much. And

(13:56):
so when I thought about him and what he was doing,
I was like, look, I don't have much, but I
can I can help you out with this project for
this amount of time. Yeah, I think it's kind of
like for me, it was like, you know, if you
see someone rattling a donation bucket and you think, oh god,
I've only got a few backs of cash on me.
I don't have one hundred dollar note. It's better to

(14:18):
put the few backs in than no backs, right, So
that was kind of my thinking with that decision to
work with Dave, was like, look, I don't have heaps,
but I'll do what I can because anything that sort
of helps you do what you're doing as a worthwhile investment,
I think.

Speaker 3 (14:33):
And we'll talk a lot about the project as we
go through the episode, but it's a very different kind
of storytelling, right because with the project it was quite whizbang,
lots of different topics every night, whereas Dave's is more
longer form documentary style. Is that something that appealed to
you is getting all the detail of a story out
into the world.

Speaker 4 (14:52):
Yeah, yeah, I mean it was such an incredible privilege. So,
I mean Dave and the team behind him, so I knew, right, No,
they're not dead. I know the production team who have
made this TV series with them quite well. I've known
them for a long time, and they sort of chose

(15:13):
to do a couple of episodes, one on gangs in
New Zealand and one on obesity in New Zealand and
so my job as a researcher was to kind of
nail down people and see if they would one share
their story with me in the first instance, to consider

(15:34):
telling that story on a TV show, which is like
a terrifying prospect I think for a lot of people.
And yeah, it was a lovely I feel really privileged.
It was a lovely process to go through. And I mean,
there are a lot of people that I felt like
I really grew a connection with and I was excited

(15:54):
for New Zealand to hear their stories, but who ultimately
made the decision not to be part of the project.
But I don't feel like I mean, the production might
feel differently because they're the ones actually at the end
of the day that are responsible forgetting the thing on air.
But I don't feel like it was wasted time. Like
I think any time that you can give to someone

(16:15):
respectfully and thoughtfully listening to what they've got to say,
and especially when they're talking about heavy, heavy stuff like
oh I got into a gang because of this, or
my relationship to photo is an addiction that I don't
know how to beat. The act of listening is so
it's really generous, I think, And yeah, I mean, I

(16:37):
don't know if these people will remember me, but I'll
definitely remember the people that I met in that process
for sure. Yeah.

Speaker 5 (16:42):
Yeah, that's so cool.

Speaker 2 (16:44):
Your life now, I mean, obviously this is finished filming
and the project finished a while ago.

Speaker 5 (16:49):
What does it look like? What's what's the day to day?

Speaker 2 (16:51):
I know you've got some projects that you perhaps can't
talk about coming up, but what well, I mean I.

Speaker 4 (16:56):
Can tell you that I'm start. So I have always
been a person that liked having a job, and I
mean a job as an I knew where I was
going to, I knew who my boss was. I knew
the best place to pack my car or like what
bus stop to get off. And that's sort of what
I loved about the project. It was like our little
bubble and I you know, I knew the team, I

(17:18):
knew what people had for lunch, Like I liked the
familiarity of it. Now what I'm doing is like, I
guess I got to come up with my own shit,
and that's a bit scary for me, but I'm you know,
I think I'm as ready as I've ever been. So yeah,

(17:39):
just going through this process of like I mean, you
guys know, like what does it mean to have a
good idea? Take that from good idea to something that
you can pitch to people then like all that, how
do we get money for this? So yeah, I'm kind
of going through that process on a couple of things
at the moment and it's exciting and terrifying and who

(18:01):
knows if it will pay dividends, but god, I'm learning
so much just going through these motions.

Speaker 6 (18:08):
We'll be right back after this short break.

Speaker 2 (18:14):
We are going to move into a section which I
have called meet Karnawa. Oh yeah, and so we spoke
to Mikey Carpenter and prep for this and a bunch
of your other friends and family, and I'm going to
I've got a bit of a less we want to
go through them. He actually said she might hate me
for this one, which is just like the best thing,

(18:36):
but I want to start. The first one is can
you tell us about your relationship with cricket.

Speaker 4 (18:43):
I thought cricket was really dumb and really boring. My
uncles and my granddad, my pop it would watch test
cricket and I didn't. I was like, what are you
looking at? Nothing's happening every time I walk into the
lounge that you're looking at the same thing. I don't
get it. And plus I was like a little bit

(19:05):
of a hunk at school. Like I thought it was
just because I was no good at sports, but I
was like too cool for sports, right, And then I
met Mikey, and I just what I fell in love
with first was how genuinely passionately he loved cricket. Like
I still didn't understand it, but I find it really

(19:26):
thrilling when someone has an obsession, and I love what
it sees about them that they've dedicated so much of
their energy to something like that. So here's this guy
who's obsessed with it, who was convinced he would have
been a black cat maybe if things had gone a
different way. I'm probably describing every like forty five year old.

Speaker 5 (19:46):
Man right now.

Speaker 4 (19:51):
And yeah, so over time, I mean he kind of
you know, he drip fed me, get he took me
to the gateway drag of a T twenty match and
I was there, Yeah, right, And like, what's not thrilling
about that? Then? I don't know, well I can't I
can't remember the exact pathway, but I know that he
was like just about fainted when he came home one

(20:12):
day and I'd finished work early and I was laying
on the couch drinking a beer watching the Test, and
he was like, I'm going to marry you.

Speaker 5 (20:23):
That was a detail.

Speaker 2 (20:24):
He added, you were in your undies, He's I came
home and she was watching test cricket and her undies
and I just I could not believe it.

Speaker 5 (20:32):
That's true, That's all true. True.

Speaker 3 (20:34):
The other one, and this was corroborated by your sister
Ruby as well, was that you know the words to
almost every song ever, and Mikey, Mikey. Mikey's footnote was
that you can freestyle.

Speaker 4 (20:48):
Oh god, I mean I do know a lot of
words to a lot of songs, but I don't know
that I know them until I start singing them. Yes,
So it's quite an exciting time to be in the
car if you're listening to like Maripam or the Hits
or something, because some random nineties like thing will come
up and it turns out, yep, I know every single word.

Speaker 3 (21:09):
Is it your Sweet Spots at the nineties early two
thousand sort of pop?

Speaker 4 (21:13):
Yeah, yeah, one hundred percent, but a bit of rat.
But to be honest, like I don't really beg myself
past anything like more complicated than Colio paradise. So just
Colio like Will Smith, which are quite embarrassing things.

Speaker 5 (21:28):
Not at all.

Speaker 4 (21:28):
Why would you embarrassed, because if you're actually inter rep.

Speaker 3 (21:31):
Yeah, yeah, millenniumium bangs, there's a lot of memories there.

Speaker 5 (21:38):
He made music for a generation.

Speaker 2 (21:40):
You you were gonna start rapping chain and see if
you could jump down.

Speaker 3 (21:43):
Don't try, and don't try, and me, I'm not I'm
not going to do that.

Speaker 4 (21:46):
I am going to do of the shadow of I
did a look at a very real large.

Speaker 3 (21:52):
Oh my god, karaoke go to She didn't stop that. Yeah,
that's going to make a great little social clip, by
the way, throwing it together from the Christmas Yeah, that's yeah,
Gangs is paradise. But I have heard very very good
drunken love.

Speaker 4 (22:09):
No, not a good drunken love. I don't know. Have
you guys heard of a lady called Beyonce who so, yeah,
she's quite good at singing, and it's quite insane what
she does with her voice. And so while I might
know what it's supposed to sound like, it does not
sound like that when it comes out.

Speaker 3 (22:30):
I heard it was very very very good.

Speaker 4 (22:33):
Yeah, and then I tried to do the jay Z
part as well. That's funny. That was actually a MYFM
challenge that Nixon and Nate set me that I had
to learn every word to that and like perform it
with one thousand percent energy. And that might be the
reason I quit my FEM.

Speaker 5 (22:48):
I can't.

Speaker 3 (22:48):
I can't quite remember, so that I remember you got
forced almost a twerking I did on stage.

Speaker 4 (22:53):
I did, I had to talk and there were I
think it was one of the MYFM like big birthday parties,
maybe the twenty fifth or twentieth or something like that.
And they held it at the power station in Auckland,
which is quite a big you like a lot of
people can fit in the air, and people that were
in the audience were like all blacks warriors and they
were like yeah, and Kara was going to work on stage,

(23:15):
and it was yeah, it might it might have been that.

Speaker 5 (23:18):
That might have been the straw that like were you there?

Speaker 4 (23:22):
Did you look at no?

Speaker 3 (23:23):
No? No, no no no. Well it was recorded I
watched afterwards, but I had a car, I had a
Japanese import, so I only could get eighty eight point
six here in Auckland. But I remember hearing it, I
remember following it and that you could. I could hear
the real trepidation in your voice as it got close
and close, like you really genuinely didn't well, I'm assuming

(23:43):
you genuinely didn't want. Your body language tells me you
definitely didn't. You definitely didn't want to do it, right,
I didn't.

Speaker 4 (23:49):
I'm sitting here with my arms crossed. I really I
really didn't like it was. I don't know, yeah, I mean,
I I don't know how to like talk about all
of this without just like talking about it. But I
think I was in radio at a time where like
that particular radio station just didn't know what it wanted

(24:10):
to be. I think they're amazing now, like they've got
an incredible identity and a huge crew of people, but
at that time they were just trying to be Brown
the Edge and Brown the Edge and the JJ and
dorm Era. So that mean like tits out stunts like
and I just that's not what I thought I was

(24:31):
signing up for. And it was very male dominated. And
there were quite a few times where I was in
the room and I was like, Eh, I'm the only
girl on here, and there's like six dudes all going.

Speaker 5 (24:44):
No, no, it'll be funny it'll be funny.

Speaker 4 (24:47):
And you know, I don't think that their motivation was
to make me feel like the odd one out. In fact,
I know it wasn't. They were like, we've got to
do the best we can and like, you know, bring
in the advertising dollars, all the same shit things to
come out exactly, all the same motivations that we still
have now. I think they've just got a lot smarter
about how they do it. And so, yeah, I genuinely

(25:07):
didn't want to t work, but I also didn't want
to let the team down. And so yet, like I did,
I found it really humiliating, and there's quite a lot
of like there's a lot of stuff in there. Like
I grew up in Dunedin quite separated from like my
Maldy family, and not to say that like Maldi's are

(25:28):
the same as Yeah, like I felt separated from cool
culture and brown culture and you know, thousands of miles
away from American culture. So to end up on a
hip hop and R and B station doing something that
is you know, like twerking is like a you know,
that's a black women's thing. It's not my thing. And

(25:50):
I felt like a real square peg in a round hole. Anyway,
there was just layers and layers and layers of actual
humiliation that I was that I was dealing with. But
I also knew that I had to be funny and
I had to be a good team member, and so
I did it. Then I quit.

Speaker 5 (26:07):
Yeah, well for what well I could.

Speaker 3 (26:08):
I could as a listener, I could hear the just
I don't want to do that, and it was Yeah,
it was a weird thing to see it go all
the way through.

Speaker 4 (26:17):
Yeah. Yeah, And it's interesting because you know, I think
part of part of your job, as you know, when
you're broadcasting, is to like not let the audience feel
that stuff. You want them to feel safe and secure
and like they're hanging out with mates and like they
know you. And yeah, but it obviously was getting to

(26:39):
a point where it was like, I can't keep pretending
that I'm all good with all of this stuff. Yeah,
and I think they and then I left and they
took off.

Speaker 2 (26:47):
So we are going to speak a lot about the warm, carrying,
empathetic side of your personality, but I'm just going to
contrast that with a little perty suggesting there might be
an element of road rage as well.

Speaker 4 (27:03):
Was there my sister yeah, I think that's quite a
New Zealand thing. Actually, where we are, you know, we
make room for people on the footpath, we say hello
and like thanks, bus driver. We're anywhere where people can
see us. We're all lovely. But then we get into

(27:24):
our little bubble in our car and it gets gnarly, man,
and I think.

Speaker 3 (27:29):
Singing away to the songs, you didn't realize.

Speaker 4 (27:32):
Exactly I've got some three doors down to sing, get
out of my way, and yeah I do. I just,
I mean, I want to take this opportunity. If you've
ever seen my metal finger out of the driver's side
window before, I'm really sorry. I'm really sorry. I'm just

(27:52):
I'm really sorry. Sometimes it just goes up there and
I have to pull it back down with my other hand,
and then that creates real drama because I've got no
hands on the steering wheel. It's just it's not it's
not something i'm proud of, but it is something I'm
working on.

Speaker 3 (28:05):
Are you proud of you? And talent at Frisbee?

Speaker 5 (28:07):
Though?

Speaker 4 (28:07):
Oh yes, yeah, I am, without a doubt, no two
ways about that, Because like I said, I'm not a
sport person. I was not coordinated, I am not coordinated.
But for some weird reason, me and frisbee we just vibe.
We vibe. I can throw long, I can throw accurate,

(28:28):
I can catch. I think it's because it goes quite
slow too. Gives me time.

Speaker 5 (28:32):
Have you done frisbee golf? No?

Speaker 4 (28:33):
And people keep asking. I mean I've seed up like
kind of pretend frisbee golf, like just at friends' houses
and stuff, But no, I've never been done the one
in Queenstown or anything.

Speaker 5 (28:42):
Well there's one out at wood Hill. Oh yeah, and
I was terrible.

Speaker 3 (28:46):
Organized a little, but it's a lot harder than you see.
Then I thought it would be frisbee golf. So I
was actually terrible at it. And I think I'm quite
a good frisbee proponent.

Speaker 4 (29:03):
Maybe that's why I'm like, I don't I want to
just kid myself that I would nail it, so I
just won't try. Yeah, yeah, that's a healthy attitude.

Speaker 3 (29:11):
Yeah, totally, totally.

Speaker 2 (29:13):
I've got one more on our list of met Karna.
And did you cry when you met Hans Zimmer?

Speaker 5 (29:20):
It did? Because is it Lion King?

Speaker 4 (29:23):
Yeah? So Hans Zimmer is like this amazing composer. If
you don't know, he has scored so many movies. He's
famous for inception. He kind of invented that bomb, which
has like since then, I can't remember what yet. Inception
was like let's say twenty ten. Since then, that sound

(29:45):
that he kind of created, you'll like, now that I've
told you about it, you'll notice it in every single
thriller or drama or whatever. It's like, that's really intense.
But he'd also scored heaps and heaps of movies, including
The Lion King. And I got the chance to sit
down and interview him. And you know, when you prep
for an interview like a I have, like you guys,

(30:06):
like a list of questions and I'm like, oh, I
hope we'll get to but like the best things that
you talk about kind of end up being off the
page or off you off your plan. And I just
sat down in front of him, and I was feeling
really nervous, and I did the first thing I said
to him was like, of all the men I've known
in my life, you're the one that's made me cry
the most. And that was it. We were away because

(30:28):
he was like, thank you so much for saying that,
but it was true. It was like, you know, you
don't cry at the Lion King without the score of
the Lion King.

Speaker 3 (30:36):
I'm thinking about that scene.

Speaker 4 (30:37):
Yeah, I know, you can't not think about that every time.
I will fast forward that scene for my until she
is twenty five.

Speaker 3 (30:43):
Yeah, you got your kids into the Lion King?

Speaker 5 (30:46):
Yeah, they like it?

Speaker 4 (30:48):
Do they watch the real kind of the new one?

Speaker 5 (30:50):
The old one?

Speaker 2 (30:51):
Yeah?

Speaker 5 (30:51):
That's the way.

Speaker 2 (30:52):
Yeah, that's so many different versions, now, are there?

Speaker 5 (30:56):
You're on Netflix?

Speaker 2 (30:57):
Keen to go right back to the start, okay, And
there's a few things about your childhood. We're keen to
sort of touch on. One of the things. I'd that
you were in like twenty different houses before you were sixteen,
like quite a transient sort of childhood, and I was
wondering if you could just reflect on how you think
of it in relationship with mum and dad.

Speaker 4 (31:19):
Yeah. I mean, I don't think anyone that like stuff
is all good all the time ends up living in
twenty houses before they're sixteen.

Speaker 2 (31:27):
You know.

Speaker 4 (31:28):
Some of those were state houses, some of them were
short term rentals at times, like my mom and my
sister and I lived with my grandparents for a while.
So yeah, I think the first it would be fair
to say that, like the start of my life was
pretty pretty turbulent, and my folks both had to work

(31:53):
really hard to kind of work really hard to give
us what they gave us. My mom made the decision,
I think when I was about six, to retrain as
a nerve and like to this day what she did
to get her nurse and qualification, get my sister and

(32:16):
I to school on time. Her and my dad were
separated when I was quite young, and so to get
me and my sister back and forth for like weekends
there and every second weekend, you know, kind of nonsense
custody arrangements and stuff and come out on top qualified
as like mind blowing to me. I can barely function

(32:36):
with one child, and the fact that she did that,
like you know, we've talked about it now that I'm
an adult, and she would like put us to bed
at seven o'clock, get the stuff out for us to
make our school lunches in the morning, and then like
sit down and do her study until like two three
in the morning and then wake up and get us
to school. And so yeah, I feel like that kind

(32:59):
of represents quite a turning point. Like once she sort
of started on that career path. We moved and to
a place in Middleton Road and Dunedin and yeah, that
was kind of our home base for the next ten
fifteen years or so, I think.

Speaker 5 (33:18):
So.

Speaker 2 (33:19):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (33:19):
I guess the flip side of that though, as well,
is that it would have taught you resilience, adaptability. Like
again with the adult lens on it, what are some
of the big lessons that you learned from that period
of time.

Speaker 4 (33:33):
Well, I think it's like, I mean, I think it
has taught me a lot of compassion and understanding. I
think if you don't, you know, you don't live through
those experiences yourself. I'm just thinking, like where I live,
there's quite a lot of king older housing around me
now and more developments going up, and I look at
that and I think, thank gosh, like those people are

(33:55):
going to have a safe, warm place to live. And
I know from my own experience what can grow out
of there or not. Like I'm also not saying like
just because you live in kind older housing that that
needs to be you're jumping off point and you need
to turn your life around. Everyone deserves to have healthy,
secure housing. But I know, you know, if you don't

(34:16):
know what goes in there. You probably just think, oh, gangs,
our crime or whatever, second class citizens. And I know
that because I've heard people talk like that about the
developments as well. So I think, you know, I appreciate
that that I know the reality of what that kind
of life is. And yeah, you would think it would

(34:40):
teach me good habits, like not hanging on to too
much stuff. But I do think I'm a bit of
a borderline hoarder as an adult. Like I'm like, no,
I definitely need twenty nine peers of the same kind
of sock and like, yeah, I have a like artfully
cluttered house, just a lot of things. I like stuff.

Speaker 3 (35:03):
This is a really interesting point because I feel like,
so my mum grew up in the eyel and the Solomons,
in very few possessions, and I think, now, well, when
I look at her house now, like there are the
keepsakes kept for forty fifty years, and I think it
harks back to a childhood where maybe she didn't have
a lot, she didn't have a lot of things, So
your connection to stuff is way more important totally.

Speaker 4 (35:27):
I think, yeah, objects can hold a lot of power,
and I think it's also influenced by the fact that
like my mum and my dad and pretty much everyone
in my family except for me a really amazing artist,
or crafters of one kinder of another, one kind of another,
and so like something might just look like a wooden

(35:49):
spoon to somebody, but I know that my dad made
it out of a piece of like recycled demoo that
he found at a boat house when I was ten. Like,
I have relationships to all these things and memories that
kind of live in these things that you know, I
like to have around me. But other people might just
be like, why is that.

Speaker 2 (36:06):
There moving houses so much? I imagine you moved to
schools a lot as well, did you. Did you have
any stability across that period?

Speaker 4 (36:17):
Yeah, I don't think school was as Gnali like I
did have. Well, I had three primary schools and then
with that change that I was talking about, like mum
starts nursing and so I had one intermedia and one
high school and like that was all good, But yeah,
I don't. I mean, I was just quite a hard

(36:37):
out nerd. I just wanted the teachers to like me
and think I was a good girl, and so it
didn't really you know, it didn't really matter who it
was just so long as they said good work, Kanawa,
I was happy.

Speaker 3 (36:48):
What's your definition of a nerd? Because I feel like
I was quite a nerd at school as well, But
everybody kind of has a different interpretation of what that meant.

Speaker 4 (36:55):
Oh yeah, So I mean I wish I was like
a cool nerd that was really into Star Wars or something.

Speaker 5 (37:01):
I wasn't.

Speaker 4 (37:01):
Yeah, But more like, I just I loved books. I
loved the consistency and like predictability of school. I loved
the rules. I loved knowing what the rules were, even
if the other kids didn't. But yeah, I think books

(37:21):
and reading and information were probably my first passion. I
just yeah, I remember, like I think my last couple
of years of primary school, I had a really amazing
primary school teacher and she would bring me books from
her own personal collection at home to give to me
because I was just chilling through what we had in
our little library and just thinking that it was the

(37:43):
most wonderful gift, and like, yeah, ms Moya gives me
her own special books like Heaven Heaven for me.

Speaker 5 (37:50):
Were you not going kid? Uh?

Speaker 4 (37:52):
Yeah, I definitely was. I was always quite chatty, and
probably that's what got me into trouble. The most was
like talking myself into trouble and then trying to quickly
took my way back out of it.

Speaker 6 (38:03):
We'll be right back after this short break.

Speaker 2 (38:09):
But you also talked yourself onto TV, right we do
in movie reviews for squirt? Is that how you first
got it in? And what's that like at high school?

Speaker 5 (38:17):
Like?

Speaker 2 (38:17):
Are you getting recognition for that amongst your peers.

Speaker 4 (38:20):
I can't really remember what my peers thought at the time,
but I thought I was shit.

Speaker 3 (38:25):
Hot lying anyone really really cool that was doing something
at our school.

Speaker 4 (38:31):
Yeah, And it was also like the most thrilling part
to me was not the work. I loved the work.
I loved going into the TV studio, and I loved
being paid for I found out about the audition of
my high school drama class, and the idea that I
could then also make some money being a show off
was like awesome. But the best part about it was

(38:53):
that the host at the time, Matt Gibb, would drive
Ian Taylor's Audi TT to my all girls high school
park outside the gates and wait for me so he
could whizz me back to the studio so I could
record my length and I'd be like, yeah, I just
gotta I just gotta go with macib here. Yeah, oh sorry,
is I said an audi?

Speaker 2 (39:15):
Shame?

Speaker 3 (39:15):
Let me just get into that.

Speaker 4 (39:17):
Okay, it's really tiny and I'm enormous, but here we are.
So yeah, it was. It was thrilling times.

Speaker 2 (39:23):
Did you have much to do with Syrien? And we
had him on as a guest, Sarien Taylor.

Speaker 4 (39:27):
Oh yeah, I mean he was sort of like this
like Dumbledore figure at offs or something.

Speaker 5 (39:32):
You know.

Speaker 4 (39:34):
It was I knew that it was his place that
I was working in, and I definitely saw him and
he would, you know, obviously say hello to me. But
he was quite mysterious to me and a little bit terrifying.
And it's been actually wonderful too.

Speaker 3 (39:48):
You know.

Speaker 4 (39:49):
I think he has a lot of good things to
say about a lot of things, and so to kind
of appreciate his work as an adult, I'm like, oh cool,
I'm glad, I'm glad I spent some time working with him.

Speaker 3 (39:59):
Was it I'm getting into the weeds here? But was
it green screen? And they added in turtle?

Speaker 4 (40:04):
Please? This is my kind of weeds.

Speaker 3 (40:06):
I love the turtle.

Speaker 5 (40:07):
Was it a dolphin?

Speaker 4 (40:08):
It was a penguin. Yes, and there was a fash
that lived in a kind of tank and it was
it was no turtle embarrassing.

Speaker 3 (40:20):
It just kind of was like, yeah, I was I
was already at UNI. I was beyond that. I was
beyond it by that stage. But yeah, but you were
green screen.

Speaker 4 (40:28):
Yeah, which at that time was just mind blowing technology.
And as you know, like Taylor made and c and
they developed all the America's cup graphics and I think
a lot of that work was starting to go on
while we were making this little kids TV show, like
and that stuff was just like they were living in
the future in space as far as I was concerned.
But so the sort of basic form of this technology

(40:49):
that we made the show on like how cool. And now,
I don't know, still, if you're scrolling social media, you
see behind the scenes of people doing green green screen stuff.
I never had to wear the weird suit with the
balls on it or anything, but I just got to
wear normal clothes. I just I know, But yeah, I
mean it was. Yeah, it was a really cool, exciting

(41:10):
place to be.

Speaker 3 (41:11):
And I guess that's the foundations for like some of
the storytelling skills that you get, right because if you're
having to act or interact with something that's not actually there.
You start to build those skills which will set you
up for the future.

Speaker 4 (41:24):
I mean, thank you for saying that, but I don't
want you to overstay that. It was literally like, thanks Spike,
and now I'm going to talk about this movie. It's
nice and if you want to watch it, you.

Speaker 3 (41:37):
Can sometimes be.

Speaker 5 (41:42):
Good. Thank you.

Speaker 2 (41:43):
Yeah, it's very Someone's finally called them on the yeah.

Speaker 3 (41:48):
Episodes and someone's fine twenty questions and I've got.

Speaker 4 (41:54):
I mean, you're making me look cool, but I just
don't want to give in you one of the impression
that I'm like cooler than I am.

Speaker 3 (42:00):
I still think, Yeah, I mean sixteen seventeen eighteen on
TV pretty.

Speaker 4 (42:06):
Cool, pretty cool, pretty damn cool.

Speaker 2 (42:09):
So you finish high school, you go to UNI for
a year, and then you drop out, you do massage
therapy for a year, you get a.

Speaker 5 (42:16):
Job in a library, and then you link back up.

Speaker 4 (42:19):
Think that was actually might a teen. I quit Might
a ten to go work on the tally. I was like, yeah,
so that was beforehand.

Speaker 2 (42:26):
In those years, did you always think that you wanted
to get back into TV? Were you in TV the
whole time.

Speaker 5 (42:32):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (42:33):
I mean I think at that time, I was probably
trying to talk myself out of wanting to be on TV,
like it seemed like I'd had this great high school job. Yeah, like, oh,
I guess I should go to university because that's what
you're supposed to do. But just a whole bunch of things.

(42:54):
I found out later that I got galangular fever in
that first year.

Speaker 5 (42:58):
I think disease.

Speaker 3 (42:59):
Yeah, sorry, cut the shit, call it.

Speaker 5 (43:07):
Tell it what it really is, a kissing disease.

Speaker 4 (43:09):
So they call it, and I was pashing my face.

Speaker 3 (43:12):
Well, you were the take your place in the world
goth girl. I the recruitment campaign for a Tiger university.

Speaker 4 (43:18):
I was also got to Pesh guy. When he realized
that that was me. He was like, oh my god,
I love you. And I was like, okay, Pash, And
that is probably how I got glandula fever.

Speaker 5 (43:27):
That's how it happens.

Speaker 4 (43:28):
Yeah, But I didn't realize that like that, as I
didn't realize I had it at the time. I honestly
just thought that I was really tired. I thought I
was probably getting really depressed, although I don't even know
if I really had the name depression for it. I was, Yeah,
I was a shambles, really, and I thought that was

(43:48):
because I just wasn't smart enough to cut it at
university and I wasn't doing square anymore. As I talk
about it now, I'm like, oh, this is weird. This
is like maybe similar to the year that I'm having
at the moment. But anyway, I yeah, I just I
didn't know what I wanted to do or what I
was capable of, and so I think I probably talked

(44:09):
myself out of television. Going back into media, I was
just like, nah, that's like I've had my time now.
I was lucky to have it that. You know, don't
get up yourself, Karnaa, that's too You can't actually make
a career out of.

Speaker 5 (44:24):
That, you idiot.

Speaker 4 (44:27):
And so yeah, it is really funny the parallels with
with then and now. What I decided to do was
to go and study message therapy because I just needed
something practical to do with my hands and to put
my focus into. And now I'm in the middle of

(44:48):
training to be a yoga teacher, which is very like
parallel with that message therapy training.

Speaker 5 (44:54):
These are like therapy sessions.

Speaker 4 (45:01):
You guys will see me the invoice afterwards.

Speaker 3 (45:03):
You'll text us in a couple of weeks, I'm going, wow.

Speaker 4 (45:07):
Okay, So I think I did, and my heart of hearts,
I really did always want to be part of the Telly,
but there definitely been times in my life where I
talked myself out of it because I thought, well, don't
be stupid, you can't do that.

Speaker 5 (45:20):
Yeah, but you do.

Speaker 2 (45:21):
You moved to Auckland for the job at Sticky TV
twenty twenty nine to twenty fourteen. And is it okay
to state now that this period, so by twenty three
you're directed written episode set dressing carrying cables. Is this
where you really developed some of your storytelling abilities?

Speaker 4 (45:39):
I think you can say that I won't call you
out on that.

Speaker 3 (45:43):
We go at the bottom of the same paragraph, I've
just read that book before the other.

Speaker 4 (45:50):
You and yeah, one hundred percent. And that was the
way the executive producer ran that show, like you don't
get to be in front of the camera if you
don't know what everybody else is doing. She always used
to say, you got to have some back to your front,
and I was like.

Speaker 3 (46:05):
Oh, shut up, not see me on my effect.

Speaker 4 (46:09):
She annoyed, She annoyed, me she would say that, but
I am really really grateful that that's how we rolled.
I think you have to when you're in that sort
of environment because the resources are stretch really thin, so
everybody just has to do everything. But I also think that,
you know, I don't think I would have made the
moves that I did from kids TV to like music

(46:32):
TV and radio to news if I didn't have their
understanding that I did start building then of how the
sausage gets made and gaining skills that I could go
maybe I could sort of transfer that into this new
scary space.

Speaker 3 (46:48):
Because so was it a planned assent to where you
you ended up or was it by the accident?

Speaker 4 (46:55):
What person lays out back, I'm going to start talking
to a pretend penguin, and then at the end of this,
I'm going to talk to Mike McRoberts.

Speaker 5 (47:04):
You're crushing dreams here. I do not with a weather yeah,
little weather.

Speaker 4 (47:10):
Yeah, with the weather intermission for a moment. No, I
had no plan. But I also, like, I think I've
had some some incredible luck and probably like allowed myself
to just kind of dream just the appropriate amount at
each step, to be brave enough to take a risk

(47:32):
and like, you know, like going from radio to weather,
you know what a stupid no, who does that? I mean,
I guess maybe Mike Puto he that went from radio
into into doing weather. But at that time there definitely
wasn't you know, it wasn't an obvious move. But I
got just brave enough and just silly enough to jump

(47:55):
in and try it and it worked out.

Speaker 2 (47:57):
Did you know anything about weather before you got.

Speaker 5 (47:59):
Into the weather? Obviously?

Speaker 3 (48:01):
Why are you asking me?

Speaker 5 (48:02):
You've got the green screen training?

Speaker 3 (48:04):
Do you fall a green screen train circle?

Speaker 5 (48:08):
Now?

Speaker 1 (48:08):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (48:09):
Yeah, yeah, you've got a competitive advantage over other people.

Speaker 4 (48:12):
Absolutely. I think that they must have seen that on
my CV and she's got it. No, I didn't. But
you know, it's like in the same way that I say,
like I fell in love with Mikey's obsession with cricket,
Like I think you can kind of teach yourself to
to see the good in almost anything. And so once

(48:34):
I started doing weather, I was like I was on
it and it was like my party trick to tell
people like what, you know, what the weather was going
to be tomorrow, or like what the system was going
to do, Because once you're focused on it, you're focused
on it and you find you find the good in it.
But it was quite a you know, it was quite
a lonely job. You're just one person emailing the met
Service and putting graphics in.

Speaker 3 (48:55):
Like it's not where was all the hour on this journey?
Had he he finished a long time before?

Speaker 4 (49:01):
I think maybe I think he was like pre Yeah.

Speaker 3 (49:04):
I mean, I don't know my TV three whether staff
all that well, but I know he was kind of
around that. He kind of revolutionized the game because he
was a meteorologist. I'm pretty sure.

Speaker 4 (49:13):
Yeah, I think he was.

Speaker 3 (49:15):
I think, as I've said that out loud and someone's
going to hammer me, he wasn't.

Speaker 4 (49:18):
And I don't know enough to correct you. I feel like,
so to conclude, I know heats about whether and all
the people that have ever presented it, thank you so much.

Speaker 2 (49:29):
The weather it's like four minutes, right, is it?

Speaker 5 (49:32):
Or is it auto cue?

Speaker 3 (49:33):
Are you off the but you that's a good question, yeah,
a question.

Speaker 4 (49:40):
Yes, But you script it yourself. So you walk into
the into the newsroom, You've got an email in your
inbox from met Service with just like the kind of
numbers and places, and then you get to turn it
into something that people would actually want to watch on
the TV. And so that's when I was like, you're
just writing like Auckland to higher fourteen love I've seeven

(50:04):
And that's when I decided to just keep myself slightly
more interested. And right now we're heading to Tarmaki, Makoto,
where it's going to be fourteen in the afternoon, but
take a coat in the morning. And yeah, that turned
out to be an enormous political statement.

Speaker 5 (50:23):
Yeah, hell yeah.

Speaker 2 (50:24):
What was the timeline on that? When you started using
Malti names?

Speaker 4 (50:28):
It was pretty quick and I would say, like, I mean,
I hadn't done any Marti studies or anything since probably
for about seven years. I did a Teata del Marti
when I think I was about twent ty, and like,
really those place names and stuff, like, to be honest,
sometimes I was gurgling them. I don't think I knew
that Hamilton was Kitty Kitty Door until I looked it up.

(50:51):
But it just seemed like, you know, I was like
John Campbell's a groovy guy and they say killed a
good evening here on the news, so like it just
seemed like it would fit and be fine, and it
was in the room, like I don't think anybody was
like you doing, but that same inbox where you got
the email from the met service saying here's your data

(51:14):
for the day was also I could also see and yeah,
I've learned my lesson now, but I could also see
the emails that were coming in from the public, and
some of them were just crazy, like crazy. Well, I
could this insight into people's psyche and I think it
was sort of you know, pre this era that we're
in now where Facebook and Twitter and stuff have just

(51:36):
become a cesspit of like human shit, and you know,
it was pre COVID, pre conspiracy, but I think I
was what I was seeing was like this direct route
into really sad, nasty, little people's minds. It was something
fun to do to email the TV three email address
and say, you know what, I don't think that lady

(51:57):
should be saying marry things. We speak English and New
Zealand and I mean, I literally can't remember anymore. I've
emotionally moved on. But at the time, shit, it hurt
to read.

Speaker 3 (52:08):
Who would normally filter those messages? Would they just be
like was it an accident?

Speaker 4 (52:12):
That to me, it wasn't really an accident. It was
like it's a newsroom, right, like everybody should know what's
going on. They've got thick skins, It's like, and probably
the majority of people would have been too busy to
do that, but I was fucking bored because I was
just running the way, and so it was like I
could just I could just see it there. And and
those in boxes, you know, like people send tips into them,

(52:35):
like they do, they do serve a function, but I
wasn't reading those ones. I was just reading the nasty ones.
And you know, I'd like to say that we've moved on,
but like I know, for instance, led any Kupitter, who's
like this incredible journalist who wears a morcal Cohi, Like,
I've seen the kind of comments that she gets on
social media, and it's, you know, it's those same sort

(52:57):
of people. It's it's bleak.

Speaker 2 (53:00):
Was that was the volume consistent throughout your whole time
doing the weather or is that just like a short
burst when you started?

Speaker 4 (53:10):
It might have just been a short burst when I started.
I mean, it's sort of hard for me to remember
now because like my lasting memory of that time was
then I was like, oh my god, what have I done?

Speaker 5 (53:21):
Well?

Speaker 4 (53:21):
First of all, I got called into my boss's office
because I sent a tweet about it saying New Zealand
is racist, something to that effect, and then that got
picked up by an R and Z journalist who wrote
something about it, and then Mark Jennings, my boss at
the time, called me into his office and you know,

(53:41):
I'm the girl that just wants to unpress the teacher
and wants them to say good job and like thanks
for knowing all the rules and following them at all times.
And I was just like, I just want the floor
to open up. I'm going to get fired. He's going
to yell at me. And his attitude was very much like, well,
good on you, love what you've done, Like, good on
you for doing it in the first place, bloody great

(54:02):
priest for us. People are going to be talking about this,
and I was like, what what do you mean wanted
to go away? I'm sorry I said it. I'm sorry
I said what I was actually thinking.

Speaker 5 (54:11):
And it did.

Speaker 4 (54:11):
It kind of ended up, you know. I remember for
people talking about it on the morning news show at
the time and the papers and getting my friend who
was a teacher at an intermediate school in Dunedin like
messaging me being like the kids are all talking about you,
saying like AUTI port on the TV and like it's
amazing and it means heaps to them, And yeah, that's

(54:34):
kind of my lasting memory of that time is that
people were like, excuse me, we can say what we want,
and now look at the broadcasting landscape, like everyone's just like, no, actually,
shut up, racists, we've got this. Leave us alone. Let
us say what we want how we want.

Speaker 5 (54:48):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (54:48):
I was going to comment on that, how looking back
it seemed so radical and now it's every like, do
you feel like we're in a good place now with
the sort of inner sip integration of Maldi into mainstream TV?

Speaker 4 (55:02):
From my perspective, I think so. I'm sure there's probably
always going to be people who know a lot more
about the or and you know, a much much smarter
than me, who will see places that it can grow
and change. But like, I feel pretty lucky that I
can sort of kick back and know that my Maudi
daughter has got so many resources and so many voices

(55:25):
and so many different places to go to to hear
her feel and so like for me, that's I'm like sweet,
And also maybe I don't need to feel so guilty
about my lack of language development because everyone else has
got It's fine.

Speaker 3 (55:42):
You know that throwaway line of you you just got
to develop a thick skin and get on with it.

Speaker 4 (55:45):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (55:47):
You don't actually get any training to do that, though, either,
do you when you go into like a broadcast or
a public space or like because it stings me when
we get stuff on our comments every now and again,
I'm like, oh fuck, that sucks. Yeah, but the volume
that you were getting is completely different, and that I
guess the volume consistently since what twenty fourteen until you
on the project twenty three, I imagine would be quite a

(56:09):
swell of stuff that you take on.

Speaker 4 (56:12):
Yeah, and look, I mean I have. Yeah, I'd love
to say that I've just got a thick skin, but
I've just learned more coping mechanisms. It's not nice and
it does I think for me anyway. And I feel
like there are others like me. There are some that
work in news and media who are just incredible robots,

(56:36):
and they're just like there to save the world, and
so comments and stuff don't get to them. They do
get to me. And I have really had to build
up a lot of skills to you know, not let
it affect me. So now I think if something like
that happened, I'll just be like, oh Jesus, I'm turning
my phone off for three days and I'll just wait
for it to be over. But at the time I

(56:57):
didn't know to do that, and I also didn't you know.
I think my logical brain was probably like, oh, well,
they're just sad people don't worry about what they think.
But in my heart, like I was like, ouch, ouch, ouch,
I just want people to like me, Like why don't
they like me? So yeah, but I mean I'm very

(57:18):
barely on social media anymore. That's been another nice thing
about this year is not feeling like I actually have
to go on social media and you know, and I've
just figured out how to name it and talk about
it with people like my husband and my sister and
I see a talk therapist regularly too, and like if
something like that comes out, it's a perfect place to

(57:41):
kind of just go does this actually matter? Like how
am I feeling about this?

Speaker 3 (57:47):
So yeah, I've never heard that term a talk therapist.

Speaker 4 (57:50):
Oh yeah, oh that's because I'm in like she's a psychotherapist.
But now that I'm in yoga world, there's like body therapists,
you know, so talk therapy is kind of like what
it says on the tin, and then body therapy is
like a whole world that goes from like a little
bit woo all the way to like fall on wizards

(58:10):
and witches and weirdos. It's very interesting.

Speaker 2 (58:14):
So twenty seventeen they announced a new show, The project
is coming in. You've been Weather for four years. Do
you start hearing whispers? How does that process where you
start hearing that they're looking for a new presenter and
you go an audition for the role or do you
get shoulder tapped?

Speaker 5 (58:30):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (58:30):
I think I think there was definitely whispers. And I
had quite a lovely mentor in the newsroom at the time,
Richard Sutherland. I remember him saying he thought that I
should go along and have a go at this, and
I just sort of sat there and told him all

(58:51):
the reasons why I shouldn't and all the other people
that should do it instead, and He's like, I'm just
going to stop you there. I've talked to those other
people that you're saying should do the job, and none
of them mentioned you, like you need to not worry
about what they're up to and just focus on yourself
and you know, give it a crack. And I'm so

(59:11):
glad I did, because yeah, I mean, that's just had
just been us. See I'm losing my words. I'm really
glad that I went to that audition and that I
had that chapter in my life. It was life changing.

Speaker 2 (59:26):
I've got lots of questions about it. That first night,
hour before two hours with a day before going live,
huge audience.

Speaker 5 (59:36):
What do you like, oh man?

Speaker 4 (59:38):
A mess? Like a complete mess. I think I had
to take the attitude of, look, it's just TV. Of
course I want it to be good, but if it's shit,
then it's shit. And I kind of think it's shit anyway.
So then it had just proven me right, do you
know what I mean? I'm going to think it sucks
before you think it sucks, so get away. But I

(01:00:00):
remember the moment that I knew that this was going
to be pretty special, which is when our first story,
which was about meth. It was our first story, and
our first night played it out, had a serious chat
about how meth is bad, cool, revolutionary, and then we
threw to the funny story that was coming after it,

(01:00:22):
and there was some sort of disasters technological failing, and
that first myth story rolled again, and I wish I
could remember what Jesse Mulligan said when it cut back
to us really quickly, but he just like soared in
on this live moment says something hilarious. The audience laughs,
it's all okay, And I just thought, God, I want

(01:00:42):
to be sitting next to you for a really long time,
like this is amazing, This live feeling is amazing. I
don't care that there was a huge technical mistake because
I feel like I'm in safe hands and I'm kind
of glad that it happened.

Speaker 3 (01:00:55):
He does seem like a very safe pair of hands. Yeah,
But he, in speaking to him, said that you adjusted
to that live environment almost seamlessly as well in terms
of use your turn AUTOQ words being out of sync,
and he could see it coming and you would just
if it, I could see, God, come on, man, rather

(01:01:16):
you got it. You would easily be able to be
able to adjust. But was it a rough adjustment to
like live auto Q stuff.

Speaker 4 (01:01:25):
No, I mean I was doing live on the weather,
so I think I quite quickly, Oh, this is going
to be a weird sidebar. Have you guys heard that
thing about like some people can picture. It's like a
neurological thing. Like if I say, picture a green apple,
what are you picturing, Grannie Smith? Grannie Smith, Like, can

(01:01:46):
you tell me anything else about it?

Speaker 5 (01:01:47):
It's in a fruit ball?

Speaker 3 (01:01:48):
Okay, fruit ball's yellow, red and blue?

Speaker 5 (01:01:50):
Oh by itself?

Speaker 4 (01:01:51):
Okay, yeah, what about you?

Speaker 5 (01:01:53):
Just a green apple?

Speaker 4 (01:01:54):
Yeah? Tell me more? Is there anything else?

Speaker 2 (01:01:56):
That's just clear? There's no stem as just a green apple, okay.

Speaker 4 (01:02:00):
Just a pure green apple. So when I think of
a green apple, I cannot see a picture. Oh like
I'm I'm like, yeah, I know that it's a green apple,
but that's just the vibe that's there. And people, when
I tell them that thing, that's really terrifying because they've
got exactly like you, the fruit bowl, They've got like
a bead of morning jew on it. And that's really

(01:02:22):
confusing to me. It might sound like a bit of
a failing of my stupid brain, but what it means
is like if I'm reading an AUTOQ, I can just
see the shape of a word and I know immediately
what it is. I can just like, yeah, like look
at one thing once and it's like there's more room
in my brain to think at the same time as

(01:02:43):
I'm reading. Sorry, that was a really weird green Apple sidebar,
But I think just the way my brain is built,
like I was built for reading an auto Q in
a live situation, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:02:56):
When you're doing live TV five nights a week, like
if we've got a big interview or a live gig
or something, you're kind of on edge all day before.

Speaker 5 (01:03:03):
It, like do you how do you deal with that?
How do you unwind? Or were you No?

Speaker 4 (01:03:11):
I think I definitely didn't deal with it well at
all for a while there. It wasn't just the energy
and stamina you need and the like the adrenaline and
then recovering from that high, but it was also like
things just really took off for me personally. It was like,
you know, going to the supermarket and ladies being like, oh,

(01:03:32):
I loved what you did on the show last night.
Social media blah blah blah, but people being like, Hey,
could you please sell my like new lipstick that I've invented,
Hey do you want this free dress? Like looking back
at this, especially that first year and maybe the second year,
like it was just crazy the input that I was
getting and it wasn't sustainable and so at times I

(01:03:55):
don't think I did cope, Like I was just charging
and just running on adrenaline. And I think it was
maybe year three, certainly by year four I made the
decision to kind of go so berish because I realized

(01:04:16):
that I was kind of getting home from that seven
thirty finish like on a massive high, and I would
just be in the car thinking, God, I need to
have a wine. I can't wait. Like once I've done that,
I'll be able to tune out. And so, like, I've
never actually really talked about this because I I guess
at that time I maybe felt a bit ashamed that

(01:04:36):
I couldn't like control my relationship with alcohol, and so
I kind of wanted to keep it a secret. But
now there's so many people that talk about this that
I'm like, oh, yeah, hell yeah, yeah, no, it's good.
It's good to not drink.

Speaker 3 (01:04:47):
Sometimes all the time, in my case, all the.

Speaker 4 (01:04:50):
Time exactly for me. I think I don't know if
it's just because I'm a bit of a control freak,
but like, I like, alcohol's never completely off the table
for me, Like you can't tell me that an after
lunch beer and a whole on a hot day is
not a house foot like that is a thing of

(01:05:10):
pure beauty to me.

Speaker 5 (01:05:12):
But that's a great scene picture.

Speaker 4 (01:05:16):
But like, up until that point, that one beer would
have been the start of my day of drinking. You know,
I'd have a beer then and then i'd like maybe
have a cocktail at four o'clock and then like wine
with dinner. And I just didn't think about that. I
had no you know, I wasn't examining that relationship at all.
And now I'm like, let me enjoy that one beer

(01:05:38):
because I'm on holiday, I don't have work to do,
I don't have anywhere else to be. I know that
it's Mikey's turn to get up with Nico in the morning,
and then that can be it. So I mean, I'll
go for months and not not drink anything because I
don't have occasion two. But then yeah, every once in
a while, I'm like, give me.

Speaker 2 (01:05:56):
That first year or two that you're talking about. Like,
I guess you normalize what your new life looks like
and you're the face of TV and you're everyone recognizes
you when you go out, But is there wrap around
support from other people that have walked in those shoes
to help you figure that out.

Speaker 4 (01:06:14):
I don't think intentionally like there's certainly no hey, this
is really mental do you need some help department. But
I think, you know, naturally, the people that are in
that industry kind of end up, I mean, you have
to have a certain degree of empathy and kind of

(01:06:36):
awesomeness I think, to end up being a journalist. So
you know, like people like Sam Hayes and Mike McRoberts
and stuff, they you know, I consider them friends, and
at different times they've you know, kind of provided me
with support about different things, and you know, like it
was sort of lovely when like Melissa Change Green started

(01:06:57):
on AM Show and she was sort of going through
the same process with Ryan Bridge of like oh, we're
starting this new show, and I was like, wow, let
me tell you what I remember that crazy time a
few years ago. So I think, you know, your colleagues
do kind of do their best to be that support
to you. But also, I mean it's part of me

(01:07:19):
that's also like that shouldn't be your job, because you
guys have got to do the most important job ever. Yeah,
So it's just a matter. It's just a lot of
trial and error of figuring it out and making mistakes.

Speaker 2 (01:07:33):
We'll be right back after this short break. You mentioned
your colleagues, and I'm going to bring in one of them.
So we went to Jesse Mulligan to ask for a
few bits and pieces, and he said, and it could
be a controversial one.

Speaker 5 (01:07:49):
We'll see how we get on.

Speaker 2 (01:07:51):
Jesse writes, She's obviously quite attractive, and I think she's
had a lot of people having crushes on her. And
for that reason, she's got absolutely no patience for flirtation
or any double entendres or anyone being a little bit sexy.
Sexy just fucking hates it. She cuts people off. But
then surprisingly sometimes we'll get a guest or someone who

(01:08:13):
she's kind of into, usually a very large man, and
she turned into a bit of a giggling idiot. And
she knows this because we've talked about it numerous times.
But she doesn't really know how to flirt, maybe due
to a lack of practice, And so she just turns
the volume of her voice up about eighty percent and
swears a lot and says all these really weird things
that sound like they haven't really come from her mouth.

Speaker 5 (01:08:35):
So that's kind of funny to watch.

Speaker 4 (01:08:37):
God, God, he's such an annoyingly good writer, like screw you,
Jesse Mulligan. Yes, all those things are true. I there's
a lot, there's a lot funa. I mean, first of all,

(01:08:57):
I'm finding it really fun. I'm like, has someone had
a crush on me before? That's like very confusing to me. Cool,
but yes, no, he's right. I don't have much tolerance,
and I wonder if it's because of that, like that
my FM time where I was like, it was just
like the boys, the boys, You've got to be one

(01:09:18):
of the boys. And so by the time I got
to the project, I was like, no, you can be
boys away from me. I don't want anything. Kind of
like we're smarter than that. People come on like get
it together, like pointless swearing. I love and will accept
at all times, but pointless kind of horny, baudy jokes,
no thank you.

Speaker 3 (01:09:37):
And then Channing Tatum walks in the room.

Speaker 2 (01:09:41):
That was from Mikey actually memorable interview with Channing Tatum.

Speaker 4 (01:09:45):
That was that was a zoom that I did from
my bedroom with Channing Tatum. But yeah, the voice that
Jesse is talking about as one hundred percent of real thing,
Like I think that one of the One of the
ones that comes to mind was like Dan Carter came
into the Project Studio and like, I mean, he's Dan Kardik.

Speaker 3 (01:10:05):
You know, you're in a huge It would be weird
if you didn't.

Speaker 4 (01:10:07):
Have a crush on Daring Harder and I'd be like, oh, I.

Speaker 5 (01:10:11):
Don't know how you going. It would be weird if
you put a Steve Hanson.

Speaker 4 (01:10:18):
And then and then like, just don't trip over the
sup bro, you don't mention to be fellow before the two.

Speaker 5 (01:10:26):
It's a real thing.

Speaker 4 (01:10:28):
Yeah, I can't. I can't deny it. I can't control it. Yeah,
it's awful. It's truly awful. And it's really lucky that
I'm married to a man that just doesn't care. And
I don't you know, I don't feel.

Speaker 5 (01:10:42):
Like I need to talk to Michael.

Speaker 4 (01:10:45):
We just we just love each other and have to
deal with it.

Speaker 3 (01:10:49):
When you see a name like that on the call
sheet or coming up, do you did it? Used to
kind of be like, oh, God, here we go. I'm
gonna Hanson's going to come out again in the voice
and I'm gonna no.

Speaker 4 (01:11:00):
Because Jesse and Jeremy would them be like, oh, everybody,
get ready for some weird swearing. Get ready for Kanawa's
weird man boys.

Speaker 5 (01:11:08):
Are you gonna be Okay? Yeah?

Speaker 4 (01:11:11):
What a what a joy? Well, that's that's the best
thing about having friends and colleagues like that is I
just see you so clearly and laugh at you so
loudly for it.

Speaker 2 (01:11:22):
So we also spoke to Patty Gower. Oh yes, and
he said, I want to see if you can work
out what he's talking about. You have to ask her
about something something. It was the greatest day I was
there with her, and it was the funniest thing I've
ever seen. I fill in the blanks.

Speaker 4 (01:11:36):
I know. I'm thinking of it so many times.

Speaker 5 (01:11:38):
I'm like, coumbox, do you know.

Speaker 4 (01:11:47):
A woman has painted me a memory hand painted like
with beautiful calligraphy, letting, lettering, a memorial plate that in
gold and like a sea of pink Roses says comebox.
So I will keep that for the rest of my life.
I'm really grateful to her. She's very clever.

Speaker 3 (01:12:06):
In your defense, there was a lot of cream before
what was.

Speaker 5 (01:12:10):
So for those that don't know what what was?

Speaker 4 (01:12:13):
Okay, let me see if I can say this too properly.
Cabrie Roses announce I've got my eyes closed and really
concentrating that some of New Zealand's favorite chocolates were making
a comeback to the chocolate box, right, That's all it was.

(01:12:35):
They were making They were they were reappearing in the
box of chocolates, and.

Speaker 3 (01:12:38):
It was peppermint cream, orange cream.

Speaker 4 (01:12:42):
Strawberry Yeah, true strawberry.

Speaker 3 (01:12:45):
You're right, charge whoever.

Speaker 4 (01:12:48):
Scubermant cream strawberry cream, orange cream and making a combox.
And then I tried to correct myself and just even
more loudly. It was like the Steve Hanson voice, even
more loudly and clearly sorry, combox. And that was it.
It was over.

Speaker 3 (01:13:08):
And then the captain guy Williams to try and steady
the ship. That was that was my favorite bit of
what a disaster?

Speaker 4 (01:13:13):
And he just when why are you looking at me?

Speaker 5 (01:13:15):
I can't fix this.

Speaker 3 (01:13:17):
I can't put the toothpaste back in? Was that the
biggest was that? The was that one of the bigger
bloopers and you're six years fronting the project.

Speaker 4 (01:13:28):
I think it probably was. Yeah, I can't think of
a better one than that.

Speaker 3 (01:13:34):
No, Fox on Air Live, No.

Speaker 4 (01:13:36):
No, I think it took about it took about a
year and eighteen eighteen months maybe before we got our
first fuck on live TV, and again Jesse Mulligan sweeped
in to fix it up. It was a guest. It
wasn't me.

Speaker 5 (01:13:47):
Yeah, I know.

Speaker 4 (01:13:48):
I've got a real like separate brain when I'm in charge,
like in the presenting seat, I've got a really different brain.

Speaker 3 (01:13:56):
Do you switch persona like live and five for three
two and then you're like in a comebox.

Speaker 4 (01:14:03):
I do do have brains, you know. Wonderful friends so
were producers on the project. So I worked with them
really closely for years. And the other day Gwen, who
was an amazing producer that I worked with, was telling
me about how she'd sit in the control room sometimes
and I would be like slumped on my phone looking
like a prawn, like face is gone, I don't know,

(01:14:26):
and probably like watching pimple popping videos on my phone,
and then you would get there like coming to us
in ten, I put my phone down five and I'd
sit up straight and then three two one and hey,
I'm back. But I don't think that's like I had
a different persona. It's like when you're like just in
that environment for so long, you need to find the

(01:14:48):
little spaces to hide and to like take a little
breather and then come back. But no, I think from
starting out in kids TV, I'm like, if the camera's on,
there's no swears.

Speaker 3 (01:14:58):
What's the percentage of like having to research a topic
versus just flying off the cuff as to whatever happened
in the studio.

Speaker 4 (01:15:08):
I think it's sort of changed for every story, and
our style and our preference kind of changed over the years.
Like there was always always beautifully produced and written packages
that we had that were all made by producers, unless
we were like out in the field, you know, interviewing

(01:15:28):
someone in real time or you know, like reporting live
from news things. The majority of those like videos that
played were made by a really talented team, and then
what happened on the desk was more or less off
the cuff. But we knew how the show was going
to go, so you know, like you know that I'm
going to be here, you knew, you knew kind of

(01:15:52):
what the beats were and what you had room for,
and our poor, ever long suffering executive producer John Bridges
could see us coming mile away. Please don't talk for
this one, please, We've got to go to the break,
we've got to go to the air. Just don't say
not the whole shit. And it was usually Petty Gower
who was the one that was not listening to and
saying shut up.

Speaker 2 (01:16:09):
What do you remember about big events like the christ
Church terror attacks?

Speaker 5 (01:16:13):
Like you catch.

Speaker 2 (01:16:14):
Window that, does everyone get there early? You do a
special show? Like is it treated differently?

Speaker 4 (01:16:19):
Yeah? Yeah, I mean that time was a really I
mean it kind of changed New Zealand. Obviously. I think
New Zealand's perception of itself is you know, a super
a super safe place where everyone's happy and everybody's treated
the same. And for me personally, like in my career,

(01:16:43):
that was a real turning point. I remember watching watching
the news. We had this feed that came on and
only you know, it wasn't like normal TV, but if
they were sending out live news that would switch on.
In the makeup room, I was sitting in the makeup
chair getting my makeup done and it was on mute,
and I remember me and the makeup artist like trying

(01:17:04):
to understand why it was live and what was happening.
And they knew out in the office because they've got
comes to all of that stuff. But we were just
sort of in this little bubble and then understanding the
atrocity that was unfolding. Yeah, it was such a such
a mind blowing day.

Speaker 3 (01:17:25):
And then.

Speaker 4 (01:17:27):
Yeah, spinning that I think it was a Friday, and
then spending that weekend coming in especially as a team,
and going while we are not prepared for anything like this,
like what do we what do we do? And I
put my hand up and said I want to go
down I think we need to be on the ground,

(01:17:49):
like And that was sort of from a like we
can't be asking news reporters who are already there, who
are like meeting people and the worst time of their
life to then also just grab a quick package for
the project and could they do a live interview for
us afterwards. So I think I was sort of like
thinking with a work brain on, like no, no, no, no,

(01:18:11):
we need to get down there, and then going down
there the next day, and yeah, it was. I mean,
I think probably one of the more notable kind of
parts of my career, just because I'd never worked through

(01:18:32):
or lived through a national crisis like that. And yeah,
I don't even know what to tell you about that time.

Speaker 5 (01:18:40):
I just like.

Speaker 4 (01:18:43):
I've made some huge fuck ups trying to get people
to do interviews with us. There was an amazing team
of people.

Speaker 3 (01:18:50):
There was a.

Speaker 4 (01:18:52):
We at the project at the time, had a Hijabi woman,
a Muslim woman who she just worked super super hard,
and she ended up connecting with a woman who'd lost
her her husband, and her son to the attack. And
that's a that's an interview and a person that I'll
remember for the rest of my life. Like I just yeah,

(01:19:15):
I couldn't believe that she invited us into her home
and talk to us, but yeah, it was. It was
a crazy time and like a very steep learning curve
for me personally. But I'm so I'm so grateful that
I got to meet her and to be there for
that time.

Speaker 2 (01:19:33):
Yeah, I can see you still carry carry it with you.

Speaker 4 (01:19:36):
Well, I just like I just I'm sort of like
struggling because it's a weird thing to talk about something
that's happening to other people in the context of yourself.
But like, I also want to acknowledge like what a
big moment it was for me personally without like losing
sight of the fact that I had nothing to do

(01:19:57):
with it. So I think that's kind of what I'm
wrestling with because I'm just like I can so clearly
remember like just the panic and the fear and all
of that stuff, Like that's so like close in my memory,
and just like what was going on for other people.

Speaker 2 (01:20:13):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, you've spoken, You've articulated that really well.
But no, it speaks to your self awareness of yeah,
exactly what you just said. I want to bring Jesse
back in. And it's kind of Lenda kind of line
us up sort of towards the end of the project.

Speaker 5 (01:20:31):
But he writes.

Speaker 2 (01:20:33):
If she comes across a problem, she immediately feels obligated
to solve it, which is not a problem I have whatsoever.
If I see a problem, if I see someone with
a problem, I'm like, well, good luck with that. But
she really burdens herself with looking after everyone in her orbit,
and sometimes even people who aren't in her orbit, which
is both a great quality and of course a massive
burden to bear. At the project, if there was a

(01:20:55):
makeup artist who wasn't getting paid enough, if there was
a producer who was waiting too long for their scripts
to be subbed, Kanawa really felt it, and she'd like, well,
this must be solved. She's a really popular character and
part of the reason is that she really does give
her time and attention to people, to everyone, She really
takes that seriously and doesn't do it for strategic purposes.
She just really likes people. She told me the other

(01:21:17):
day that her favorite thing about doing stories in the
field was just hanging around with camera people and shooting
the shit. And for me, that's the.

Speaker 5 (01:21:24):
Worst Perth stories. It's a totally different.

Speaker 2 (01:21:27):
Way of looking at the world. Does that sound right?

Speaker 4 (01:21:34):
The Jesse one definitely sounds right, And you know what,
like he actually he taught me a lot. There was
definitely a time there in those first couple of busy
years where I did kind of go what would Jesse do?
And I through literally asking him and then later Korby
like how do you say no? Thank you very much

(01:21:55):
for this opportunity. Was really a skill I had to learn,
and that those two had down because they had had
much longer and more full careers than I had up
to that point, and they weren't I guess they were
just more confident in themselves and weren't afraid to like
piss people off, and they didn't piss people off. It
turns out you can say no and people don't hate you. Yeah, yeah,

(01:22:18):
it's hard, but it's true. So that definitely, Yeah, Jess
is definitely like that. And I, you know, I guess
I did, I do. I did see things as injustices.
Sometimes I thought, you know, we're meant to be in
this week. You know, you can't make a show that
big without every part of the team being in good

(01:22:42):
health and having what they need to like do their jobs. Well,
you don't get a good show of everything from the
start of the day isn't humming along. And so I did.
I gave a massive shit about it. And I do
remember being like, it's don't get me started on here.
And makeup artists not being paid enough. It's the worst
crime in our industry. They are Again, you never notice

(01:23:07):
a good makeup artist work, but you always notice that
when someone looks a bit like munted, and like if
that was a camera operator or a sound operator or whatever,
they'd be making so much more money. And so yeah,
that did. It Still to this day passes me off
that women's work isn't valued the same. And so yeah,
I went around and said some annoying things to bosses sometimes.

Speaker 2 (01:23:29):
Yeah, but that checking up on other people is like
a superpower, but maybe on the other side you don't
end up looking after yourself quite as well, and only
if you're open to it. Can you tell us about
what happens sort of towards the end of the project, Yeah, yeah, totally.

Speaker 5 (01:23:48):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:23:48):
No, So I am probably about halfway through twenty twenty three.
I remember saying to Corby. I was like, can you
have a heart attack on your right side? You know,
famously it's your left And he was like no, And
we were going to ear in about an hour, I think,

(01:24:12):
and I was like, shit, okay, this is weird. Like
I go, I'll just take some panatole, and yeah, I
just like the whole show. I was just I think
I basically didn't move like I was so so sore.
And then anyway, it turns out, well, nobody really knows
what happened. They think it was maybe a gallstone or

(01:24:35):
maybe some like this is gross, but you know, you
can eat it this out if you want, but or
something with my pancreas. They just don't really know. But
I was in hospital for ages and the worst pain
of my life, and yeah, I think that was just
my body's way of being like, yo, this isn't working.
What you're doing is not sustainable. You need to slow down.

(01:24:59):
You need to stop going to the bakery and eating
little pieces of cake as a treat for yourself because
you've been awake all night with the baby and up
since five point thirty and you've got to get into
the studio.

Speaker 5 (01:25:12):
Like that's not.

Speaker 4 (01:25:13):
That's not a little treat. That's ruining your life. And
so yeah, I just realized that I, yeah, I wasn't.
I was not managing all of the things, which is
a shit thing to realize when you're like a real
type a person and just wanted to get it all right.

(01:25:34):
But I decided that I would go down to four
days a week instead of five. And that was kind
of awesome for two reasons. Like one, it meant that
like people like the incredible Kate Roger were gonna get
that Friday show and you know, like do awesome the
awesome work that she did. And then I was going

(01:25:54):
to get a day that was just about me and
my daughter and my family. And yeah, it was pretty
sweet for the like I think it was like it
lasted for about a month or two months, and then
we got the cancelation years and I was like, hey,
could I have my Friday's back. I need all the
money I can get it.

Speaker 3 (01:26:14):
I'll cut you a little bit of slack here because
I also feel, and I said this to Stephen and
the build up to this episode, like when you objectively
look at you the last ten years of stuff that
you've done, it's a massively high output, but also massively
emotionally taxing, like the public shit that you had to

(01:26:34):
go through and absorb, the events that happened in our country,
that you're going on live TV and addressing the fact
that you are a brown face on TV, and feeling
like maybe you, in the role of the show, have
to be the voice for the marginalized or the voice
on the side. You start a family, you have this

(01:26:58):
really public but really complex, it seems journey with Tao
Mari Like, fuck, man, that's a lot of shit too
to stack up on one another.

Speaker 5 (01:27:08):
And I found it. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:27:11):
I was like, fuck, we're going to talk about a
lot of the stuff. And I was like, fuck, we're
going to heap some of that stuff back on you again.
And maybe it's a good thing that you can unpack
it and you can reflect on and realize, like fucking hell, man,
you've you're an incredible person, Like seriously to do all
that stuff in the public eye, A lot of that
shit is very hard to deal with privately, but you

(01:27:32):
did it with so much grace and dignity that a
lot of people take a lot of strength out of that.
So yeah, I don't know what the whole message of
that monologue was other than like, fuck, man, you can
afford to take some time to yourself and rebuild and
look back on the amazing stuff that you've done.

Speaker 4 (01:27:50):
Thank you. It was the point of that to make
me feel a bit cheering.

Speaker 5 (01:27:53):
No, not at all, not at all.

Speaker 3 (01:27:54):
It was just it was eating it was eating away
at me because yeah, I just felt like it's something
that needed to be said.

Speaker 4 (01:28:01):
Oh well, I'm really I'm really really grateful to like
have my work reflected back at me like that. And yeah,
I think maybe at the start of this year I
would have been like, oh what even man, shut up,
it doesn't matter what are you talking about. But like, yeah,
I have given myself a lot of space and like

(01:28:21):
focused on my health quite a lot. And yeah, I
realized that, like I can redefine what success means for
me now, Like it's not fronting a seven PM show.
It's not having seven jobs at once and you know,
sitting on a great big pile of savings. Like it's

(01:28:46):
being healthy and available for my daughter, keeping myself alive,
and like having relationships with people in my work that
you fill me up, you know, like, yeah, that's kind
of all I want to do now. So it's go

(01:29:06):
that I've done all that other stuff that you said,
because now I can just do that easy stuff.

Speaker 6 (01:29:11):
We'll be right back after this short break.

Speaker 2 (01:29:17):
She's point about being like the face and the voice
of the marginalized, Like now that you've got a bit
of distance from that, looking back at it, I can't
imagine you would understand that the weight of what you
were doing at the time.

Speaker 5 (01:29:31):
But do you now do you?

Speaker 4 (01:29:33):
Oh, it's such a funny thing. Yeah, can't alloyd voice
of the margins.

Speaker 5 (01:29:41):
But I think I don't know.

Speaker 4 (01:29:46):
I think from being like a bit of a show off,
a bit of a loud mouse, and wanting to do
a good job. When I was sat down with isshoes
about I don't know, like housing, like I just couldn't
help it be like this isn't fear, Yeah, this is dumb.

(01:30:08):
Whatever politician it was of the moment that was being dumb.
That's nonsense, what they're talking. Because I sort of had
the sense of, like, if I don't do this now,
I might never get the opportunity to do it again.
And no one else is saying it. I mean, I'm
sitting on the panel with like all Parkyard dudes. That
was very often the case, or you know, like people

(01:30:29):
that have come from completely different backgrounds to me, and
I think, yeah, it was never like I was never
like I got to save these people. But I just
I also didn't have any shame or concern about just
saying what I thought because I don't know. I just
had to.

Speaker 3 (01:30:50):
And unfortunately not a lot of other people do. So
when you do start speaking, you become that target.

Speaker 4 (01:30:57):
Yeah maybe I don't know. I think I don't know.
I don't want to be like, yeah, I'm the only
one who gives.

Speaker 3 (01:31:03):
Well, yeah, sorry, I'll wrap some contexts around it, because
I sometimes feel that weight of being oh, I've got
to say something about it now, because that's my role,
because that's the brain eye. Yeah, that's like how I
that's how that's my role in society. It's funny when
you said that, when you said, say, like you feel

(01:31:24):
like you've got to say yes to everything. It's like
I feel that all the time because if I say no,
it's like no, you're you're you're a bad one.

Speaker 4 (01:31:31):
Yeah, yeah, you're.

Speaker 3 (01:31:33):
A bad one that doesn't want to do this thing.
So you're like, oh, yeah, fuck, I'll do it. Yeah
I'll do it. Yeah, I'll do that thing. I'll do that,
of course I will. And like the ship that you
take upon yourself because you don't want to be like
everybody else and like these fucking tropes and narratives that
bounce around in your own head.

Speaker 4 (01:31:49):
Yeah, it's exhausting, Yes, exhausting. And I think I also
like particularly I mean like my mum's Pakia. I think
she's sort of like a perfect example of that superwoman.
But I think a lot of Maudi women like a
high like high flying Maudy woman, like I know that's
sitting on boards and like meetings at their mudd eye

(01:32:11):
and like helping out at their kudda or their core hunger,
and like it makes me shrivel, like I feel tired
thinking about what some of the women I know do
because it's I think it's that same kind of thing
of like I can and so I have to, and
sometimes it does take like a bit of a mini
crisis for people to go, oh, maybe I could do

(01:32:34):
fifty percent less. But yeah, I think that is a
burden that a lot of our people kind of do carry.

Speaker 2 (01:32:39):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, Do you remember where you were when
you got the call or the first wind that the
project was shutting down.

Speaker 4 (01:32:48):
I just walked out of a massage, which is the
most like I'm on TV thing ever. And it was
weird because I had a phone call. I'd missed a
phone call from Sarah Bristow, who was head of news
at the time, and then a straight after I had
missed one from Ali Ventura, who was out I'll execute
a producer of the show, and I was like, and

(01:33:10):
then I was doing this like quick calculation of which
one I should ring back first, and yeah, basically it
was like, you need to get on the zoom call
in five minutes time, and we were told the news
about five minutes before the rest of the team. And

(01:33:31):
so once I hung up that call, I just drove
into the office because I was in Avondale, like out
where I live, and just yeah, just got in the car,
carried on driving went into the project office, and I
could I could tell straight away, like what part of
the meeting I'd walked into, because everyone just burst into tests.

Speaker 1 (01:33:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:33:49):
Yeah, it was a really sad day and quite a
weird day, Like I think, Yeah, looking back at that time,
we were given the opportunity to not go on air
that night, that they'd lined up some other programming if
we didn't want to go on, and I don't know,
like like I heard that and I was like, that's amazing,

(01:34:13):
Like I think that's an incredibly generous thing to do
and a real understanding of like what the nature of
this news is that you're giving this team. Yeah, there's
no way we're going on. And not because of me,
not because I was like, oh I'm gonna cry on TV,
like I've done that a million times, as it wasn't,
But I was more just thinking about my colleagues of like,

(01:34:36):
the news is going to break at the end of
this meeting and then they're going to be calling out
trying to get talent to be on the show and
spend half that time going oh, no, is the show canceled?
Oh shit, I'm so sorry, when they're just like yeah, yeah,
But like I'm just trying to keep it together. Could
you just tell me if you're here available for this interview?
And I just thought, yeah, who cares, Like, honestly, who cares.

(01:34:56):
It's just TV, just and I think I said that
in the room at the time, like this, shit, it's
just a TV show. Go home and be with your family.
We can go down the pub and like sit there
and give each other a cuddle and just hang out
and absorb this. But you know, like I don't think
we should go on, and I like I might have been.
I think some people really strongly disagreed. They were like, no,

(01:35:17):
we're going to go and do the best show we've
ever done in our lives tonight. And I get that too,
Like if that had been the consensus, I would have
gone and made the best TV show of our lives
that night. But I don't know. I was just like, nap,
we're not doing.

Speaker 3 (01:35:33):
Presumably it would have always had a lifespan. There would
have been a time where your time with the project
came to a natural conclusion, had you started to think
about life beyond the project.

Speaker 4 (01:35:44):
I had, but I hated thinking about it because I
was like, well, hang on a minute, So I've got
literally the best job in TV. And I don't say
that as like, you know, it was like I wasn't
doing a morning show, I wasn't doing a night show.
I wasn't doing a weekend show. I've done all of
those things before, like the best hours, the best friends,

(01:36:04):
the best team, like kind of there were almost no
decks in that team at the project, and that's not
true for lots of workplaces, you know, like you're always
navigating personalities and stuff like what the hell could I
want to do that's better than this? And I think
so much of my focus was on like money. I
was making so much money compared to where I'd come from,

(01:36:28):
and like I was just like, you can't, You're not
allowed to. You don't walk away from that, like that's stupid,
which I think is probably how I got myself into
the situation with my health, because I just felt really
stuck of like there's no other alternative that makes any sense,
but having that decision made for me and going away

(01:36:50):
and just sort of reframing, I'm like, I don't think
it's actually possible, but if I could make a living
as a yoga teacher right now, I would. I did
look up how much a yoga teacher makes, and I
don't think i'd be able to pay our bills. But
you know, I've been another nice string to have to
my boat.

Speaker 6 (01:37:05):
YEA.

Speaker 3 (01:37:05):
Combined there with a mess such therapy, I'll be.

Speaker 4 (01:37:10):
Making dozens and dozens of dollars.

Speaker 2 (01:37:14):
We had Jesse and I think a few weeks before
the announcement, and he he sort of projected the future
of TV and saying, you know, we're the last generation
of TV presenters, and it ended up sort of happening.
You know, those clips went pretty hard and the after
the news totally the project. But sorry, Yeah, but do

(01:37:35):
you have thoughts about like what the future of media
looks like or TV or.

Speaker 5 (01:37:42):
You think things are going.

Speaker 4 (01:37:44):
I mean, I wish I did, I wish I had,
like I wish I knew what the answer is, because
I would love nothing more than to be like, don't worry, guys,
come with me. I've figured out what we're going to
do now to you know, to all my friends that
are looking for work in the industry. But I think,
you know, my thinking now is sort of and it's

(01:38:05):
a lot to do with the conversations I have with
my husband Mikey who works and take your TV as well.
Like people are always gonna We've always told stories, We've
always like shared parts of ourselves and you know, use techno,
the technology we have to shine a light on things
like there just isn't a world in which that's going

(01:38:27):
to go away completely. And it's very very you know,
it's kind of mind bending what's going on. I think
maybe the mediums will change, but people telling stories and
some of them being good at telling stories, and you know,
like needing to have people who specialize in that is

(01:38:48):
just always I can't go away. So I don't know.
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:38:53):
We've hitched our wagon to storytelling, so I hope it doesn't.
And this has been a brilliant story. But there's one
more chapter that I want to talk about, which is motherhood.

Speaker 4 (01:39:02):
I've heard of it.

Speaker 5 (01:39:03):
Nika three three years of.

Speaker 4 (01:39:05):
Yeah, she is, she's going to turn three on the weekend.

Speaker 5 (01:39:07):
Oh three on the weekend.

Speaker 4 (01:39:08):
She's waking up every morning at the moment, is it
my day for my party today? I'm no girl?

Speaker 5 (01:39:14):
Yeah? And how's it changed you? Oh?

Speaker 4 (01:39:17):
In every way? And I like, even as I say that,
I'm like a little bit annoyed at myself because like
every person that like wasn't gonna I mean, I wasn't
even sure that I, like would have kids. Like we
were like cool, if it happens, if it doesn't, no
big deal. But when I do become a mom, I'm
going to be a cool mom. And it turns out

(01:39:39):
you just yeah, it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter what
you plan beforehand. It just kind of it is what
it is. But like I mean, like for me, physically,
I changed, Like I had a really difficult pregnancy, a
difficult birth, and like I just I really felt like
I had no idea physically who I was anymore. That

(01:40:00):
was quite full on. But it didn't really matter because
I also just had like the best person in the
entire world just just lives at my house now, just
like she was always.

Speaker 5 (01:40:12):
Around and you're always around at seven o'clock.

Speaker 4 (01:40:14):
Now, oh man, that's crazy. Like I definitely in the
first month or so, I think she was just sort
of waiting for it to go back to normal, for
me to not be there anymore, and like, yeah, it
really took quite a while of us getting into this
new routine of like I'm home for dinner, I'm home
for bath time, I'm home for bedtime, just to be like,

(01:40:35):
I remember how I didn't used to do those things,
like that's mental why yeah, so it's it's really lovely,
but it also means that I'm around for her to
annoy me a lot more now, So you know, pigs
and troughs.

Speaker 3 (01:40:51):
Is there a world in which you ever get back
in front of the camera or do you think in
the immediate short strong I don't want to.

Speaker 4 (01:41:00):
Leave you with the impression that because I'm kind of
I don't know, I'm definitely in a state of change
and I I am sort of focusing on, you know,
other things. I don't want to leave you with the
impression that I don't love what I've done for a
job for most of my life, because I do. But
I think it's just about broadening my base in a

(01:41:23):
really unstable, uncertain environment, you know, rather than just kind
of shutting down for business. Let me just like spread
out a little bit, plant some routes here and there,
and give myself that sort of strong foundation to build
off for what it becomes next.

Speaker 2 (01:41:40):
You remember we talked at the start before we went on, like, oh,
I don't know if I'm going to have.

Speaker 5 (01:41:44):
Anything to talk about it.

Speaker 2 (01:41:45):
And it's been like I don't know how long we've beencording,
but it's been so good. It's been an absolute ethic.
So yeah, I'm just gonna sort of land the plane.
I think I'm going to tche up for a big
outro and now it's got.

Speaker 5 (01:41:56):
The one coming of paper.

Speaker 2 (01:41:58):
Thanks so much for coming and sharing your life and
story with us. It's been so good. Yeah, it's been
a right.

Speaker 3 (01:42:06):
Yeah, I've Once I finished my research yesterday, I was
really excited to mostly for what I said before, for
the opportunity to sort of eyeball you and say it's
just an amazing, amazing body of work that you've put
together up until now. But also I see some similarities

(01:42:26):
in terms of like that stuff takes a toll, and
I really understand why you didn't want to talk to
us at the start of the year. But I also
understand now, as you're sharpening your storytelling lens, why maybe
this sort of experience is important as.

Speaker 5 (01:42:41):
Well to.

Speaker 3 (01:42:43):
Help build that skill set, which you've already had an
amazing foundation for anyway, But it's great to I think
one share your story with maybe a different audience a
slightly different audience that we might provide as well. And
I really look forward to whatever the next steps are
in this journey of yours. So thank you very much
for being so open with the highs, the lows and
everything in between.

Speaker 4 (01:43:03):
Yeah, thank you both. I'm going to say my thank you, know,
which is just thanks for the work that you guys
are doing. I think it's it's like I said earlier,
it's an incredible thing to give people your actual proper
listening ears and the normalizing you do of like, yeah,
we've all got feelings and we've all got highs and
lows is like just more of that and all the time. Please,

(01:43:25):
So thank you both.

Speaker 2 (01:43:27):
Just kind of hey, guys, quick one from me before
you go. We're so stoked to tell you about b
to Be Speakers, which is our business that brings the
guests you here on between two beers to your event
as EMC's or speakers. You can choose from well known
champions like Kanua, Matt Heath, Karen Reed, Raylian Castle, leehar
Zeon Armstrong and Haley Holt to Kiwi legends like Dave Would,

(01:43:48):
Dave Letelli, Amir Motu, Chelsea Lane, and a whole lot more.
If you've been blown away by any of the stories
you've heard here, you can now share that inspiration with
those you work with, or you might just want a
funny bugger for yourwards night. No matter what you need,
be to Be can help you out, and we're adding
new guests each week. We're really excited about this, so
come check us out at Be Too, speakers dot co
dot inzid and let our guests make your night.
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