January 16, 2025 • 12 mins
Rocket Lab founder Sir Peter Beck is trying not to compare himself too much to his mega-wealthy rivals.
Jeff Bezos' Blue Origins has successfully launched its first rocket into orbit overnight, while Elon Musk's SpaceX has been launching a pair of landers towards the moon.
Rocket Lab, meanwhile, has been launching a second Varda Pioneer Spacecraft into orbit.
Beck told Tim Beveridge he's never had the capital of his two main competitors, owned by the two wealthiest people on the planet, and he probably never will.
He says the lack of money has forced Rocket Lab to innovate, which has become its strength.
In other space developments, India has docked two spacecraft for the first time, while stranded NASA astronaut Suni Williams has made her first spacewalk on the ISS.
She and her colleague Butch Wilmore aren't expected back on Earth until late March at the earliest.
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Speaker 1 (00:09):
You're listening to a podcast from Newstalk ZEDB. Follow this
and our wide range of podcasts now on iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Well, it's about time we heard from Rocket Lab, isn't it?
The Auckland aerospace company that has had a big year
last year. Only recently, the company broke through a glass
ceiling by launching two rockets into space in a twenty
four hour period from different hemispheres. It helped put us
in the world stage, meaning the United States States now
has another launch company that's capable of conducting launches in
(00:38):
twenty four hours. And Rocket Labs CEO Peter Beck joins me, Now,
good morning morning. So well, let's start off with the
big stuff. I mean, it seems all big stuff. The
launch of two rockets from different hemispheres in twenty four hours.
How big was that for you you guys at rocket Lab.
Speaker 3 (00:59):
Well, it's something that we've always wanted to do. In fact, truthfully,
we want to do it simultaneously. But we certainly set
a world record on that one. Anyway. You know, it's
hard to launch two rockets at once, you know, or
back to back, but to do it from two different hemispheres,
I guess you know that that's a little bit of
a flex of the team because you know, having having
(01:20):
two launch two complete launch pads, two complete launch sites.
You know, it was it was a good milestone be
looking for for.
Speaker 2 (01:26):
People who are listening. I mean, obviously it's it's pretty
high for loot and stuff. In terms of technology and
coordination and just the science of it would be beyond
my understanding, I imagine. But in a simple way, what
sort of what kinds of skills and work goes into
making that event happen?
Speaker 3 (01:42):
Yeah, I think I think people see a rocket launch
and it would be very easy to kind of, you know,
miss all of the planning and stuff that goes into
that prior to that launch. No, typically it takes somewhere
between six months and a year, you know, of preparation
for a launch, whether you know the customer is obtaining
licenses and building their satellite, and and then you know
(02:04):
on launch to itself. You know, we have airspace closures,
marine space closures, we have to worry about space weather,
We have to interface with NASA with you for the
International Space Station, and a whole bunch of operators. So
we don't have any conjunctions on orbit or you know,
bump into people in orbit, and then you know, it's
a whole lot of licensing and regulatory stuff, so it's tremendous.
(02:26):
Each each rocket launch is really like an orchestrated event.
It's like a wedding, if you will. And you know,
it's it's easy when you're launching them frequently, it's easy,
easy to forget. But and the team's got really efficient
at it. But it's still you know, it's still a
big day.
Speaker 2 (02:42):
Did did one have anything to do with the other?
From a was one rocket launch related to the other
and anything apart from the time and the fact you
wanted to try and get them as close together as possible.
Speaker 3 (02:53):
No, not at all.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
So it just separate missions.
Speaker 3 (02:56):
Completely, separate missions.
Speaker 2 (02:57):
Yeah, what came Look, if we go back a little bit,
maybe a little way, what came first with you? Was it?
Was it your fascination with space or was it a fast,
fast nation with rockets and technology or a little bit
of both.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
But of both. So you know, I'm an engineer and
a mcgeek, and I love space. So if you mix
those two things together in a pot, you end up
with a guy who liked to build rockets because you know,
rockets from an engineering perspective, are really the peak of aerospace.
They're the hardest thing you can imagine to do and
the coolest, So so always a bit of both.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
How many of your skills are self taught?
Speaker 3 (03:39):
Well, a lot, I guess, but I mean it depends
how you define self taught, because yep, it's true. I
don't have a university degree, but you know, university in
a lot of ways teachers you how to learn. And
and you know, we see it with young graduates here
that they come with a good base. But you can
talk to any of them that come here and they've
(04:00):
learned more in a year at Rocket Lab and they've
learned in their entire academic career. So so I guess,
you know, it's a different way of learning. And you know,
self taught, I guess in the early years, yep, just
read books and just made it happen. But but you know,
as as as you as you kind of grow and
(04:21):
you have other interactions with other people and whatnot, then
then yeah, it's all just learning.
Speaker 2 (04:26):
Well, you were forging your own path in New Zealand obviously,
so I guess I was just curious as to obviously
know without the formal education, how you sort of learned
your key lessons that got you on the journey to
where you are now.
Speaker 3 (04:40):
Yeah. Well, I mean, look, I'd always wanted to work
in the space industry, and truth be known, the plan
was to go and work for NASA, as all young
kids would imagine to right, and you know, I went
into a tool and die making trade to start with.
The plan was always to go to university, but I went.
I did that trade because I needed the hand skills
to build the rockets because there was no courses to
(05:01):
go and there's no there's no you know, there was
no university degree in anything that I was interested in.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
The Bachelor of Rocket Science.
Speaker 3 (05:08):
Yeah, yeah's apart from engineering of course. So so you know,
I was building rockets and I needed the hand skills
to you know, to build more and learn more and
and and that that's kind of just the you know,
the way it started. And they just continually got larger
and larger. And then it wasn't until I actually I
was working for Industrial Research at the time and we
(05:30):
didn't see old d SAO or Callahan innovation. I think
it's cool now, and you know, I went on this
rocket pilgrimage to the United States and you visited a
whole bunch of Nasser facilities and and and whatnot, and
sites as well as commercial space companies, and it became
really really clear that you know, me working FINASA had
(05:51):
a probability of approximately zero because you know, firstly, I'm
a foreign national to your point, with no university degree.
Had had a great cv of rocket engines and rock
on bits that I built. But it's very, very difficult
for a foreign national to go and work in the
space industry in the United States because the space industry
is all due use, meaning that it's it can be
(06:12):
used for peace and it can be used for defense.
So it's very very difficult to the foreign national at
the best of times to get in there, let alone
one that came from a country with no heritage of
space and no degree. So the only logical and practical
thing left to do was just just to come back
to New Zealand and start rocket Lab.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
Peter, did you ever have moments where you go, oh,
that was a bit dangerous.
Speaker 3 (06:36):
Not not tremendously. So you know, if you have a
good understanding of the energy the you're working with, then
then you know you have a healthy respect for it.
I think I think if you, you know, if you
don't have a good understanding of how much energy you're
trying to harness, then it would be very easy to
be a bit cavalier. But no, I mean I always, always.
Speaker 2 (06:56):
You know, always had a disciplined approach to the science,
ardre Per.
Speaker 3 (07:00):
I mean even today, my job is I'm employed to
take big risks and then mitigate them until they don't happen.
And that is that is the definition of a rocket CEO.
Speaker 2 (07:10):
Yeah, okay, you've described If I've seen some descriptions of
your your own superpowers, if we can use that word,
three things popped out. I think micromanaging, workoholism, and paranoia.
Speaker 3 (07:23):
Uh, which on sound great? Do they? I wish I
never said that now, because.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
No, I think that if people can can understand how
you'd probably need a bit of that to get where
you've got. Which one wouldn't you be without?
Speaker 3 (07:35):
Well, I mean I could do it, that would do
without the paranoia. That would make life much more enjoyable.
But I honestly, look, in this game, there is there
is there is there is no kind of second chance,
like it either works or it's it's everybody knows that
it didn't work so so so you just you just
have to be you know that that kind of fastidious
(07:57):
around evening. Everything you build and nobody achieves greatness at
eight to five. Nobody you look at all the great
if you look at all the great companies in the
world and all the great achievements of the world, they
didn't do it working eight to five Monday to Friday.
Do you feel that's just what it takes.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
Do you feel you work hard or is it just
because you love doing what you're doing. Before you know it,
you know, the sun's going down, you're into the night
and you're still going and you're loving it.
Speaker 3 (08:20):
Yeah. Look, some days definitely feels like work. And I
think you know that that can be said but for everybody.
But but no, I mean I'm having a blast, and
I certainly you know it doesn't. It doesn't doesn't feel
like we're to me that you know that. Yeah, I
think I think the days go very very quickly.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Well, of course, now rocket Lab is you know, valued
in the billions, and the bigger your organization gets. My
thoughts would be that the micromanaging would be one that
you would it would be harder to hang on to
that one because the organization just gets bigger and bigger.
How do you handle that side of you all?
Speaker 3 (08:52):
So I guess the micro imagining is is more more.
I guess a better better representation of that is down
in the weeds, so when needed, So if there is,
if there's a particular problem, you know, some people's management
style is I've got people for that and they'd sort
it out. My management style is if I think I
can be useful, I'm down there and down there as
(09:14):
deep as a wrench. So that's probably what I mean.
More about micromanaging is you know there is no offices
at Rocket Lab, so that that kind of management style
I just I just don't subscribe to.
Speaker 2 (09:28):
Where do you sit in competition with space X? And
I guess there's a secondary part to that question is
do you actually care about that competition or do you
just do your own things, set your own goals?
Speaker 3 (09:40):
Well it's it's hard to miss, that's for sure, but
but no, Look, we have our own path. And you
know the big difference with us, I guess is that
we've never had in probably never will that the capital
reserves of our two biggest competitors happened to be the
too wealthiest people on the planet. So you know, we
have a saying at Rocket Lab it's actually Ernest Rutherford saying,
(10:01):
and we have no money, so we have to think.
And what what that means is it forces you into
into really innovative solutions and way different kind of ways
of doing things. And I think if you look at
our electron rocket or a number of our kind of
satellites and whatnot, they don't look like normal people satellites do.
And that's because you know, we're really forced to innovate
(10:22):
and that's been a key strength and it set us
apart from everybody else.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
How do you feel about the tall poppy syndrome in
New Zealand? You have made a mark some of that
a while ago. But I guess what are your reflections
on our culture and that, because I would have liked
to think we've grown up a bit on that.
Speaker 3 (10:37):
Oh man, you're gonna hate my answer on this one.
Speaker 2 (10:38):
Oh I might love it.
Speaker 3 (10:40):
Well, no, I doubt you will. So Actually, if you
talk to talk to Joe Blow on the street, it
doesn't exist. I honestly believe tall poppy exists in the
construct of New Zealand media. I really do like honestly
most I've never come across somebody like on the street
or just a general public who is nothing but proud
(11:03):
and supportive.
Speaker 2 (11:04):
But no, I love that ant sir. I'm all for
the man in the street. And I think often the
media get caught up in its own little bubble and
you know, the story rights itself.
Speaker 3 (11:14):
So honestly, yeah, I look, that's been my experience.
Speaker 2 (11:17):
Yeah. Hey, so what next for Rocket Labor? What's on
the cards for twenty twenty five?
Speaker 3 (11:23):
Oh?
Speaker 2 (11:23):
Huge year.
Speaker 3 (11:24):
I mean this year is a huge year. I mean,
if you look at the growth of the company is
enormous and just the scale we're able to achieve this year,
but next year is even bigger. I mean, you know,
our big rocket, Neutron goes on the pad. To put
that into context, the current rocket we have list lifts
three hundred and twenty kilograms to low Earth orbit. Neutron
lifts thirteen thousand kilograms to low Earth orbit. So is
(11:47):
a big rocket. So that goes on the pad next
year and flies for the first time. And we've got
a number of really big space systems projects, you know,
satellites and things that are that are you coming to
fruish and next year as well? And look we'll continue
to grow and expand and bite off bigger and bigger things,
but next year is a big one.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Oh. Absolutely well, it's inspiring stuff. Oh gosh, thank you
so much for your time chatting to us today and
all the best for those grand plans for twenty twenty five.
Speaker 3 (12:14):
Thanks very much, don't.
Speaker 2 (12:15):
Chairs gosh, that was fascinating. I love that. If you've
got someone in your family who's a young person, who's
a self starter, who wants to listen to a role model,
direct them to our website to listen to that interview. Fascinating.
That's Peter Beck.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
For more from News Talk sed B, listen live on
air or online, and keep our shows with you wherever
you go with our podcast on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to a podcast from Newstalk ZEDB. Follow this
and our wide range of podcasts now on iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Well, it's about time we heard from Rocket Lab, isn't it?
The Auckland aerospace company that has had a big year
last year. Only recently, the company broke through a glass
ceiling by launching two rockets into space in a twenty
four hour period from different hemispheres. It helped put us
in the world stage, meaning the United States States now
has another launch company that's capable of conducting launches in
(00:38):
twenty four hours. And Rocket Labs CEO Peter Beck joins me, Now,
good morning morning. So well, let's start off with the
big stuff. I mean, it seems all big stuff. The
launch of two rockets from different hemispheres in twenty four hours.
How big was that for you you guys at rocket Lab.
Speaker 3 (00:59):
Well, it's something that we've always wanted to do. In fact, truthfully,
we want to do it simultaneously. But we certainly set
a world record on that one. Anyway. You know, it's
hard to launch two rockets at once, you know, or
back to back, but to do it from two different hemispheres,
I guess you know that that's a little bit of
a flex of the team because you know, having having
(01:20):
two launch two complete launch pads, two complete launch sites.
You know, it was it was a good milestone be
looking for for.
Speaker 2 (01:26):
People who are listening. I mean, obviously it's it's pretty
high for loot and stuff. In terms of technology and
coordination and just the science of it would be beyond
my understanding, I imagine. But in a simple way, what
sort of what kinds of skills and work goes into
making that event happen?
Speaker 3 (01:42):
Yeah, I think I think people see a rocket launch
and it would be very easy to kind of, you know,
miss all of the planning and stuff that goes into
that prior to that launch. No, typically it takes somewhere
between six months and a year, you know, of preparation
for a launch, whether you know the customer is obtaining
licenses and building their satellite, and and then you know
(02:04):
on launch to itself. You know, we have airspace closures,
marine space closures, we have to worry about space weather,
We have to interface with NASA with you for the
International Space Station, and a whole bunch of operators. So
we don't have any conjunctions on orbit or you know,
bump into people in orbit, and then you know, it's
a whole lot of licensing and regulatory stuff, so it's tremendous.
(02:26):
Each each rocket launch is really like an orchestrated event.
It's like a wedding, if you will. And you know,
it's it's easy when you're launching them frequently, it's easy,
easy to forget. But and the team's got really efficient
at it. But it's still you know, it's still a
big day.
Speaker 2 (02:42):
Did did one have anything to do with the other?
From a was one rocket launch related to the other
and anything apart from the time and the fact you
wanted to try and get them as close together as possible.
Speaker 3 (02:53):
No, not at all.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
So it just separate missions.
Speaker 3 (02:56):
Completely, separate missions.
Speaker 2 (02:57):
Yeah, what came Look, if we go back a little bit,
maybe a little way, what came first with you? Was it?
Was it your fascination with space or was it a fast,
fast nation with rockets and technology or a little bit
of both.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
But of both. So you know, I'm an engineer and
a mcgeek, and I love space. So if you mix
those two things together in a pot, you end up
with a guy who liked to build rockets because you know,
rockets from an engineering perspective, are really the peak of aerospace.
They're the hardest thing you can imagine to do and
the coolest, So so always a bit of both.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
How many of your skills are self taught?
Speaker 3 (03:39):
Well, a lot, I guess, but I mean it depends
how you define self taught, because yep, it's true. I
don't have a university degree, but you know, university in
a lot of ways teachers you how to learn. And
and you know, we see it with young graduates here
that they come with a good base. But you can
talk to any of them that come here and they've
(04:00):
learned more in a year at Rocket Lab and they've
learned in their entire academic career. So so I guess,
you know, it's a different way of learning. And you know,
self taught, I guess in the early years, yep, just
read books and just made it happen. But but you know,
as as as you as you kind of grow and
(04:21):
you have other interactions with other people and whatnot, then
then yeah, it's all just learning.
Speaker 2 (04:26):
Well, you were forging your own path in New Zealand obviously,
so I guess I was just curious as to obviously
know without the formal education, how you sort of learned
your key lessons that got you on the journey to
where you are now.
Speaker 3 (04:40):
Yeah. Well, I mean, look, I'd always wanted to work
in the space industry, and truth be known, the plan
was to go and work for NASA, as all young
kids would imagine to right, and you know, I went
into a tool and die making trade to start with.
The plan was always to go to university, but I went.
I did that trade because I needed the hand skills
to build the rockets because there was no courses to
(05:01):
go and there's no there's no you know, there was
no university degree in anything that I was interested in.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
The Bachelor of Rocket Science.
Speaker 3 (05:08):
Yeah, yeah's apart from engineering of course. So so you know,
I was building rockets and I needed the hand skills
to you know, to build more and learn more and
and and that that's kind of just the you know,
the way it started. And they just continually got larger
and larger. And then it wasn't until I actually I
was working for Industrial Research at the time and we
(05:30):
didn't see old d SAO or Callahan innovation. I think
it's cool now, and you know, I went on this
rocket pilgrimage to the United States and you visited a
whole bunch of Nasser facilities and and and whatnot, and
sites as well as commercial space companies, and it became
really really clear that you know, me working FINASA had
(05:51):
a probability of approximately zero because you know, firstly, I'm
a foreign national to your point, with no university degree.
Had had a great cv of rocket engines and rock
on bits that I built. But it's very, very difficult
for a foreign national to go and work in the
space industry in the United States because the space industry
is all due use, meaning that it's it can be
(06:12):
used for peace and it can be used for defense.
So it's very very difficult to the foreign national at
the best of times to get in there, let alone
one that came from a country with no heritage of
space and no degree. So the only logical and practical
thing left to do was just just to come back
to New Zealand and start rocket Lab.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
Peter, did you ever have moments where you go, oh,
that was a bit dangerous.
Speaker 3 (06:36):
Not not tremendously. So you know, if you have a
good understanding of the energy the you're working with, then
then you know you have a healthy respect for it.
I think I think if you, you know, if you
don't have a good understanding of how much energy you're
trying to harness, then it would be very easy to
be a bit cavalier. But no, I mean I always, always.
Speaker 2 (06:56):
You know, always had a disciplined approach to the science,
ardre Per.
Speaker 3 (07:00):
I mean even today, my job is I'm employed to
take big risks and then mitigate them until they don't happen.
And that is that is the definition of a rocket CEO.
Speaker 2 (07:10):
Yeah, okay, you've described If I've seen some descriptions of
your your own superpowers, if we can use that word,
three things popped out. I think micromanaging, workoholism, and paranoia.
Speaker 3 (07:23):
Uh, which on sound great? Do they? I wish I
never said that now, because.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
No, I think that if people can can understand how
you'd probably need a bit of that to get where
you've got. Which one wouldn't you be without?
Speaker 3 (07:35):
Well, I mean I could do it, that would do
without the paranoia. That would make life much more enjoyable.
But I honestly, look, in this game, there is there
is there is there is no kind of second chance,
like it either works or it's it's everybody knows that
it didn't work so so so you just you just
have to be you know that that kind of fastidious
(07:57):
around evening. Everything you build and nobody achieves greatness at
eight to five. Nobody you look at all the great
if you look at all the great companies in the
world and all the great achievements of the world, they
didn't do it working eight to five Monday to Friday.
Do you feel that's just what it takes.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
Do you feel you work hard or is it just
because you love doing what you're doing. Before you know it,
you know, the sun's going down, you're into the night
and you're still going and you're loving it.
Speaker 3 (08:20):
Yeah. Look, some days definitely feels like work. And I
think you know that that can be said but for everybody.
But but no, I mean I'm having a blast, and
I certainly you know it doesn't. It doesn't doesn't feel
like we're to me that you know that. Yeah, I
think I think the days go very very quickly.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Well, of course, now rocket Lab is you know, valued
in the billions, and the bigger your organization gets. My
thoughts would be that the micromanaging would be one that
you would it would be harder to hang on to
that one because the organization just gets bigger and bigger.
How do you handle that side of you all?
Speaker 3 (08:52):
So I guess the micro imagining is is more more.
I guess a better better representation of that is down
in the weeds, so when needed, So if there is,
if there's a particular problem, you know, some people's management
style is I've got people for that and they'd sort
it out. My management style is if I think I
can be useful, I'm down there and down there as
(09:14):
deep as a wrench. So that's probably what I mean.
More about micromanaging is you know there is no offices
at Rocket Lab, so that that kind of management style
I just I just don't subscribe to.
Speaker 2 (09:28):
Where do you sit in competition with space X? And
I guess there's a secondary part to that question is
do you actually care about that competition or do you
just do your own things, set your own goals?
Speaker 3 (09:40):
Well it's it's hard to miss, that's for sure, but
but no, Look, we have our own path. And you
know the big difference with us, I guess is that
we've never had in probably never will that the capital
reserves of our two biggest competitors happened to be the
too wealthiest people on the planet. So you know, we
have a saying at Rocket Lab it's actually Ernest Rutherford saying,
(10:01):
and we have no money, so we have to think.
And what what that means is it forces you into
into really innovative solutions and way different kind of ways
of doing things. And I think if you look at
our electron rocket or a number of our kind of
satellites and whatnot, they don't look like normal people satellites do.
And that's because you know, we're really forced to innovate
(10:22):
and that's been a key strength and it set us
apart from everybody else.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
How do you feel about the tall poppy syndrome in
New Zealand? You have made a mark some of that
a while ago. But I guess what are your reflections
on our culture and that, because I would have liked
to think we've grown up a bit on that.
Speaker 3 (10:37):
Oh man, you're gonna hate my answer on this one.
Speaker 2 (10:38):
Oh I might love it.
Speaker 3 (10:40):
Well, no, I doubt you will. So Actually, if you
talk to talk to Joe Blow on the street, it
doesn't exist. I honestly believe tall poppy exists in the
construct of New Zealand media. I really do like honestly
most I've never come across somebody like on the street
or just a general public who is nothing but proud
(11:03):
and supportive.
Speaker 2 (11:04):
But no, I love that ant sir. I'm all for
the man in the street. And I think often the
media get caught up in its own little bubble and
you know, the story rights itself.
Speaker 3 (11:14):
So honestly, yeah, I look, that's been my experience.
Speaker 2 (11:17):
Yeah. Hey, so what next for Rocket Labor? What's on
the cards for twenty twenty five?
Speaker 3 (11:23):
Oh?
Speaker 2 (11:23):
Huge year.
Speaker 3 (11:24):
I mean this year is a huge year. I mean,
if you look at the growth of the company is
enormous and just the scale we're able to achieve this year,
but next year is even bigger. I mean, you know,
our big rocket, Neutron goes on the pad. To put
that into context, the current rocket we have list lifts
three hundred and twenty kilograms to low Earth orbit. Neutron
lifts thirteen thousand kilograms to low Earth orbit. So is
(11:47):
a big rocket. So that goes on the pad next
year and flies for the first time. And we've got
a number of really big space systems projects, you know,
satellites and things that are that are you coming to
fruish and next year as well? And look we'll continue
to grow and expand and bite off bigger and bigger things,
but next year is a big one.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Oh. Absolutely well, it's inspiring stuff. Oh gosh, thank you
so much for your time chatting to us today and
all the best for those grand plans for twenty twenty five.
Speaker 3 (12:14):
Thanks very much, don't.
Speaker 2 (12:15):
Chairs gosh, that was fascinating. I love that. If you've
got someone in your family who's a young person, who's
a self starter, who wants to listen to a role model,
direct them to our website to listen to that interview. Fascinating.
That's Peter Beck.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
For more from News Talk sed B, listen live on
air or online, and keep our shows with you wherever
you go with our podcast on iHeartRadio.
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