August 10, 2025 • 24 mins
David Squire (MMus (Hons), PGDipMus, BMus, DipTchg) is one of New Zealand’s leading choral conductors and Music Director of the New Zealand Youth Choir. Under his direction, the choir has toured internationally to high acclaim, with standout performances at Notre-Dame in Paris, Walt Disney Concert Hall in LA, and major wins at the International Festival of Academic Choirs in the Czech Republic.
With over 25 years in secondary music education, David has led award-winning choirs and orchestras, including Rangitoto College’s The Fundamentals and Westlake College's Symphony Orchestra. His ensembles have earned national and international recognition, including platinum and gold awards, and top placements at festivals in Vienna and Wales.
David is a founding member of the NZ Association of Choral Directors and a respected conductor, adjudicator, and educator. He’s led national workshops, conducted at the Rugby World Cup, and toured with George Benson. In 2011, he received a New Zealander of the Year Local Heroes Medal for his contribution to music education.
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Speaker 1 (00:09):
You're listening to a podcast from News Talk SEDB. Follow
this and our wide range of podcasts now on iHeartRadio,
Real Conversation, Real Connection, It's Real Life with John Cowan
on News Talks EDB.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Good day, Welcome to real life. There is a theory
that ancient humans sang before they learned to use language.
It's something so basic to our humanity and it cuts
straight to our emotions. We crave music. I spoke to
a chorister once who said he had rather sing than eat,
and so we can envy my guest tonight because he
(00:54):
spent his whole life immersed in music. Conductor and music
educator David Squire's welcome, David Kyoda. How are you, John,
I'm well, Thank you, and David. You've coming to the
end of a fifteen year stint as director of a
New Zealand youth choir, ending on a very high note crowned.
(01:15):
Your choir has been crowned Choir of the World at
the Klangothlin International a Stepford. So congratulations, thank you very much.
So what are your best memories of that event?
Speaker 3 (01:29):
Well, flank Laughlin's a very special place, I mean the
Welsh of course, they are incredibly passionate about their singing,
and the festival's been going since nineteen forty seven, so
it's got a massive history and a huge legacy of
some amazing performers. The Choir of the World trophy is
(01:51):
known as the Pavarotti Trophy for obvious reasons. Pavarotti first
sang there when he was a very young boy in
his father's choir, and the person who presented us the
trophy was Nicolatta Mantovani, who is Pavarotti's widow, so she
came especially just to present that trophy, which was really special.
(02:13):
There were so many memorable moments from Wales that it's
hard to pinpoint one. It was my second trip there.
I was there with a choir from Kristen's School in
twenty thirteen, and that year it was also incredibly hot.
Wales is not really designed for temperatures in the thirties
(02:34):
and so we were all sweltering and it was just
a really amazing place to be.
Speaker 4 (02:43):
It's such a beautiful.
Speaker 3 (02:44):
Town, reminds me quite a lot of parts of New Zealand,
and the whole place is full of music choirs and
singers from all over the world, so it's a really
wonderful place to be.
Speaker 2 (02:57):
Let's listen to a bit of Ayaterro, which was specially
commissioned for the New Zealand Youth Quair, So tell us
(03:32):
a bit about that peace, David Well.
Speaker 3 (03:34):
Altro is the first wayata arringer, so the first action
song that the New Zealand Youth Choir has ever commissioned
especially for the choir. So we've been performing wyata which
have been gifted to the choir for the last thirty years.
Most of those have come from Tefanuki so the famous
Weki Fano that run out the Waka Huya and Mana
(03:56):
Huya who have been national champions at much teny many
times before. But all of those wayata up till this
point have first been performed by that kappa and then
gifted to the choir perform. So this one was written
especially for the choir by tweeden Aweki, who is the
granddaughter of bub and Nanwehi who ran Tewakahuya back in
(04:19):
the nineties. And the thing I really love about this
piece is that I asked the singers, the singer leadership
group to come up with a theme for what they
wanted The way outa to be about, and their major
theme was kW Takitanga or unity. They really wanted something
(04:41):
that would be relevant to every single New Zealander and
so tweeting it I took this on board. She really
loved the whole idea a bit and she went away
and came up with this beautiful way outa that celebrates
the one thing that binds us all and that's the land.
So basically it's a big celebration of the fenwa of
(05:02):
New Zealand as a country, mentions all the different place names,
talks about things like going home and smelling the smells
of home and the experience of going back to a
place that is you're two doing away way your place
to stand. And so it's an incredibly special piece and
the choir really loved singing it.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
I believe they had to sort of come up to
speed pretty quickly on this song too.
Speaker 4 (05:25):
Oh yes they did. So I last saw the choir.
Speaker 3 (05:29):
One of the things about New Zealand youth choirs, we
only meet about three times a year, so we didn't
finalize our arrangements with twitting it until probably October. And
the last time I saw the choir before this year
was in early September, so I didn't get the chance
to really work with her until the choir had already
(05:51):
gone on a hiatus, and so tweeting wrote the way
out her. She then did some action videos where she
did the videos for the men and then the actions
for the women. And we got one of the choir
members to trans gribed the piece into sheep music form
and then we sent it all to the singers in
(06:13):
early December and we said to them, sorry, guys, you
have to memorize this entire thing so that when we
meet in February and Tina turns up to polish it,
all she's doing is polishing. There's no learning. You have
to know the whole thing. And she came for one
day and that day was the fourth of February. Two
(06:35):
days later we were singing performing it for the first
time at Waitangi. So incredible pressure on the singers. There's
nothing like, you know, turning up at the birthplace in
New Zealand and performing away out adding it for the
first time in front of all these Malori kind of
looking at you, going you better get this right.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
Top pressure belt that went on to squeeze out of
performance out of them. That won the Choir of the
World So and it wasn't the only trophy and prize
you won on that tour. You won the Grand Prix
of Nation title at a competition where people were expected
to present cultural items. But the I don't know is
(07:16):
the Stepford in Wales that would be more traditional choral music.
So I'm just wondering how did that go down? How
did a Maori wyata with actions and go down in
that audience. Did they recognize it as being what it
was and resonate with it?
Speaker 3 (07:36):
Yes, I think I think they did. I mean the
Choir of the World recital, you basically have ten minutes
of singing time, and so some choirs did four pieces,
some only did two. We managed to squeeze in three, and.
Speaker 4 (07:54):
So we did.
Speaker 3 (07:55):
We started with a Baroque piece by a cousin of
Johann Sebastian Bach, based on some this is my Joy
that I put my trust in the Lord and so
in German, and then we went into the Battle of
Jericho and then finished with The Way out Us. So
we essentially had some Germans and Malian, some English, and
(08:16):
I think that that was probably one of the reasons
why we won the Choir of the World. I think
that we had some variety of programming and also real
flexibility amongst the singers to be able to move from
one style to another with integrity. That's something we put
a lot of pride in. If we're going to sing
in German, we have to do it so the Germans
(08:37):
are proud of us. If we're going to sing in Maori,
we have to do it so Mari are proud of us.
If we sing spiritual, we have to do it so
that African Americans are proud of us because that's their talinga.
Speaker 2 (08:47):
So there is a respect for the music.
Speaker 3 (08:49):
Absolutely, and I think that that the Welsh because the
other big passion apart from singing is rugby. They have
seen the hakka many times before. They have a strong
appreciation and love for New Zealand, and I think it
was very very well received. People seem to absolutely love
the fact that we were there bringing Maori Wayauta to Wales.
(09:12):
It was understood and very much respected.
Speaker 2 (09:17):
You played in a tent, and I believe it was
roasting hot that you played another venus as well. Some
of them are a lot fancy of an a tent.
What's the best venues that you can recall playing in.
Speaker 3 (09:29):
Oh yeah, So the tour, it's one of those things
wherein New zeal On Youth Choir Tour is that we're
away for about two.
Speaker 4 (09:37):
And a half weeks.
Speaker 3 (09:38):
But in that time we were in four different countries.
Speaker 4 (09:42):
And you've basically got to eke the most.
Speaker 3 (09:45):
At as you can out of the itinery. So probably
the nicest acoustics that we performed in Audhus Cathedral in
northern Denmark was really beautiful. It was nice to be
able to perform in a big, spacious acoustic, sacred acoustic
that we just don't really have in New Zealand except
now for perhaps Saint Paul's and Wellington would be the
(10:05):
closest to that.
Speaker 4 (10:08):
And then the other venue.
Speaker 3 (10:10):
That we were incredibly fortunate we didn't think we would
be able to perform there was We had a day
in York and we went to the Minster to York
Minster and did a tour and as we arrived one
of the guides said, now, look, I've just been looking
you up on YouTube. I see you won the choir
of the World. I want you to sing this piece
(10:30):
and he handed us a piece of paper with Kawayata
Kiyamara written on it and I was like, oh, you
Sespe could probably do that, but we've been told we're
not allowed to sing. He said, oh no, I'm telling
you you can. So he took us into the chapter
house just off to the side of Yorkminster and we
all just gathered by accident on purpose at the same
(10:51):
time and sang Kawayata Kia Maria to the tourists who
were fortunate enough to be there at the time, and
the singers were weeping. It was just the most beautiful
acoustic and so those were probably the two most special
acoustics that we performed in.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
If you've just joined us, my guest tonight is David Squire,
who is coming to the conclusion of a fascinating chapter
in his life, leading the New Zealand Youth Choir for
fifteen years. We'll be talking more about some of the
awards he's won, including a very strange award that he
was given. We'll be talking about that in a minute.
Speaker 1 (11:26):
Intelligent interviews with interesting people. It's real life on news talks.
It be.
Speaker 2 (11:49):
Welcome back to real life. I'm John Cown. I'm talking
with David Squire, who's a music educator and the conductor,
and he's been leading all sorts of choirs and orchestras
for years, just concluding fifteen years with the Youth Choir
of New Zealand. Just come back from an incredibly successful
tour in Europe where the New Zealand Youth Choir won
the Choir of the World competition, and that was one
(12:12):
of the pieces they've played in the competition, and it's
the Battle of Jericho and it's is it odd that
we sing Afro American spirituals?
Speaker 3 (12:22):
David, I don't think it's odd in that we are
exploring a range of music from around the world, and
we talked before about how it's really important that we're
respectful to the traditions of the people who own that music.
Speaker 4 (12:38):
And because we have.
Speaker 3 (12:42):
Deep appreciation for wyata in New Zealand that is essentially
tanga like treasures of the Maori people, we're very responsible
for ensuring that provenance is acknowledged for the people who
own that music, and also that we sing it with
a sincerity and an understanding of the meanings behind it.
(13:07):
And I feel like the same way about African American
spiritual So this particular cycle of the choir we did
get to work with Roll o' dilworth, who is an
African American choral director and spiritual expert, when he was
out in New Zealand in twenty twenty three. So he
worked with the choir, helped them understand some of the
(13:27):
stylistic conventions behind the piece, and conducted them in a
performance of it while he was here, which was great.
Speaker 2 (13:35):
You talked about the choir being in tears singing a
song in York, and music has that capacity to just
touch and move and everything. What do you find the
most I guess transcendent most. I guess the most moving
music for you personally? What gets you?
Speaker 4 (13:55):
I think.
Speaker 3 (13:57):
I'm a big lover of poetry as well as music,
so I love that synthesis of meaningful words with composer
has taken a text that's particularly meaningful and has said
it in such a way that you hear all the
rhetorical gesture behind the singing and it elevates you in
(14:20):
a way that words by themselves can't do. So there's
all sorts of moments for me, I mean, John Sebastian
Bach for me is probably the well not probably is
the pinnacle of sacred music because there's just such an
innate understanding of harmony and a deep connection to music
(14:45):
from his point of view that was shaped by his
faith as a devout Lutheran. And there are moments, even
with a choir, when you're dealing with a choir that
doesn't necessarily have people who actually believe what it is
that they're singing, we do have a motive pathways that
(15:06):
we can bring them to an understanding of what the
composer was wanting. And the moments for me that are
the most magical is when the singers are really comfortable
with the music and then it's come off the page
and something amazing happens in the room where everybody just
(15:26):
all of a sudden comes together and you walk off
the stage and you're like, what happened. Then there's no
real description for it. It could be in any piece,
but yeah, for me, a lot of those sacred works
are the ones where I get a sense of that.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
I was talking to a member of the youth choir
who was saying that this phrase of the music coming
off the page is one that you inspire your singers with.
It's not just singing a bunch of notes on a line.
It comes off the page, and it takes on a life,
it takes on a meaning, it has almoth a spiritual
life in its own.
Speaker 4 (16:02):
Absolutely, I mean we talk.
Speaker 3 (16:04):
The worst criticism that I can give to them is
that they are producing bms beautiful, meaningless sound, and to me,
there's no excuse for that. They have to have integrity
in what they do, and I think if you watch
the video from Wales of the Choir of the World performance,
(16:26):
for me, one of the biggest reasons why they won
the Choir of the World was that they had connection
with the audience for what it was that they were singing.
They were moving the audience.
Speaker 2 (16:38):
I think the audience saw that they resonated with that
and they know where it came from. And that's why
you personally won an award of being the most inspirational conductor.
You get these ideas across and somehow into your that
it's not just vocal cords making noises, it's hearts communicating
with hearts.
Speaker 4 (16:58):
That's absolutely true.
Speaker 2 (16:59):
Well done and congratulations on that.
Speaker 4 (17:01):
Thank you so much.
Speaker 3 (17:02):
I think for an audience in particular, I mean, I
love listening to orchestras all sorts of different kinds of music,
but there's something about singing that because in theory, even
the people who say they are tone deaf and can't sing,
they probably can. It still has meaning for them because
they it's something that's come to me. Oh, there is
(17:26):
totally John, There's something that comes from that human perspective,
and it's an expression of humanity being able to sing,
but still with that connection to the divine of you know,
whatever that might be for any listeners out there, but
there is that real connection to It's something that's incredibly
(17:48):
intangible but very heartfelt and it does dig right into
the core of people. I always think about a cuttinger,
you know, when you're being welcomed on to a marai
and a queer will be calling out, and the moment
that starts, it's like it just grips your heart and
(18:09):
you go, oh okay, I'd feel astrong. The emotions all
rise to the surface because that the voice is so
incredibly powerful that extolling emotions and people.
Speaker 2 (18:25):
Another award that you won, I don't know if you recall,
was at the Sheldonian Theater in Oxford, and that was
a special award given to you for performing Kiwi Pop
Bangers on your guitar backstage. Un't aware that you're being
heard very clearly in the auditorium.
Speaker 3 (18:45):
I'd forgotten about that. I was wondering what you're going
to say then for a minute. Oh, yes, we were backstage.
Speaker 2 (18:50):
And you've been dabbed in there.
Speaker 4 (18:53):
Of course, yeah, I have been dobbed in.
Speaker 3 (18:56):
We have an award on New Zealand Youth Choir tour
is called Mister Silly, or when it was a when
we were on a cruise ship in twenty nineteen we
did it the South Pacific Cruise was actually Captain Silly,
and the award is having to wear clothing of some
(19:16):
kind that is embarrassing to wear and you have to
wear it for twenty four hours unless you're actually performing
on stage. So I did win Mister Silly for starting
a Dave Dobbins sing along downstairs at the Sheldonian. That
is true.
Speaker 2 (19:32):
Look, one of the things that I've spoken now to
a couple of people in your Youth Choir and they
just love being on tour and they appreciate so much
about you. They appreciate the fact that every one of
them feels seen. Even though there's fifty people in front
of you, each one of them feel seen and acknowledged
(19:54):
and understood. And they also appreciate your dad jokes, the
fact that you'll add something into the repertoire that the
Stravinski at the end, or something which they've never ever
heard of or seen, and you're telling them they're going
to be singing it on stage. But of course it's easy.
I was supposed to do dad jokes when you actually
have a literal dad of one of the singers.
Speaker 3 (20:13):
Yes, that's true. Yes, and he doesn't roll his eyes.
It's normal the other ones that roll their eyes.
Speaker 2 (20:22):
Referring to the fact that you had your own son,
the son in the choir, and that must have been
an interesting dynamic.
Speaker 4 (20:28):
It's really special having him there.
Speaker 2 (20:30):
And also quite quite a privileged too.
Speaker 4 (20:32):
Yeah, it was, It really was.
Speaker 1 (20:35):
You know.
Speaker 3 (20:36):
My boys have both grown up with me taking the
youth choir for almost as long as they can remember. William,
who's now twenty and was in the choir, was only
five when I got the job, and so pretty much
as long as he can remember, I've been taking the
youth choir. He's been to lots of concerts, heard lots
(20:56):
of singers, and had lots of experiences. And I'm just
thrilled that both the boys have ended up in my
choirs at Westlake Boys. They were both in my my
boys choir called Voicemail and William came on this trip.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
A great name for a choir, by the way, it is.
Speaker 3 (21:16):
A lot of the big thing choirs that the lower
voice choirs seem to have dad joke pun names and
Voicemail it is a good one. But it was great
to have him there. It was really special to have
him on that trip.
Speaker 2 (21:32):
David, going forwards, this is the end of a chapter
for you. The youth choir is coming to an end.
I know you've got other choirs that you're working with,
but any big plans that you can announce yet or
is it? Or is it You're still going to have
to sit down and scratch your head to work out
what's happening next.
Speaker 3 (21:48):
Yeah, I've come back into festival season, so it's been
quite a hard landing. I've got the KBB Music Festival
next week with my orchestra and then the big sing
Finale with my choirs from Kristen and Voicemail and Wesley
Boys in about three weeks time, so it's busy, busy.
Speaker 4 (22:08):
By about mid.
Speaker 3 (22:09):
September, I'll be able to have a sort of a
bit of time to contemplate what comes next. But the
youth choir is not a small commitment. It particularly involves
a lot of emailing and meetings and communication between courses.
If we had more time actually singing, it would be great.
Speaker 2 (22:28):
So this is going to open up quite a gap
in your life.
Speaker 3 (22:31):
Yeah, well, yeah, we'll give me a bit of a
chance to contemplate what might come next. But there's a
few opportunities there, and I'll just look and have a
think about what might be best for the next phase.
But yeah, these fifteen years have been incredibly special and
I've loved every moment of it.
Speaker 2 (22:48):
Well, David, you've been so successful in these different ventures.
I'm absolutely confident we'll be hearing of you in some
new venture. Maybe it'll be an extension of your Do
Be Do Well, a venture to stimulates people's well being
and health through music. Might be more promotion of Pacific
(23:08):
Maori music. I know that's been big on your agenda.
So I wish you all the best for whatever the
future holds for you, And we'll go out on the
piece of German music that you mentioned. You also sang
at the Stckford. What is the piece of music that
you sang again? It was a bath peace, wasn't it.
Speaker 3 (23:27):
Yes, it was Johann Ludwich Bark so one of Johann
Sebastian Bark's cousins. And it's dust estminor Freuda. This is
my joy that I put my trust.
Speaker 4 (23:35):
In the Lord.
Speaker 2 (23:36):
Thank you so much, David, and I wish you all
the best. This is real life. I'm John Cown. I'll
be speaking with David Squire who's now finishing with the
Youth Choir. Look forward to being back with you again
next Sunday nights.
Speaker 1 (24:22):
For more from News Talk st B, listen live on
air or online, and keep our shows with you wherever
you go with our podcasts on iHeartRadio
You're listening to a podcast from News Talk SEDB. Follow
this and our wide range of podcasts now on iHeartRadio,
Real Conversation, Real Connection, It's Real Life with John Cowan
on News Talks EDB.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Good day, Welcome to real life. There is a theory
that ancient humans sang before they learned to use language.
It's something so basic to our humanity and it cuts
straight to our emotions. We crave music. I spoke to
a chorister once who said he had rather sing than eat,
and so we can envy my guest tonight because he
(00:54):
spent his whole life immersed in music. Conductor and music
educator David Squire's welcome, David Kyoda. How are you, John,
I'm well, Thank you, and David. You've coming to the
end of a fifteen year stint as director of a
New Zealand youth choir, ending on a very high note crowned.
(01:15):
Your choir has been crowned Choir of the World at
the Klangothlin International a Stepford. So congratulations, thank you very much.
So what are your best memories of that event?
Speaker 3 (01:29):
Well, flank Laughlin's a very special place, I mean the
Welsh of course, they are incredibly passionate about their singing,
and the festival's been going since nineteen forty seven, so
it's got a massive history and a huge legacy of
some amazing performers. The Choir of the World trophy is
(01:51):
known as the Pavarotti Trophy for obvious reasons. Pavarotti first
sang there when he was a very young boy in
his father's choir, and the person who presented us the
trophy was Nicolatta Mantovani, who is Pavarotti's widow, so she
came especially just to present that trophy, which was really special.
(02:13):
There were so many memorable moments from Wales that it's
hard to pinpoint one. It was my second trip there.
I was there with a choir from Kristen's School in
twenty thirteen, and that year it was also incredibly hot.
Wales is not really designed for temperatures in the thirties
(02:34):
and so we were all sweltering and it was just
a really amazing place to be.
Speaker 4 (02:43):
It's such a beautiful.
Speaker 3 (02:44):
Town, reminds me quite a lot of parts of New Zealand,
and the whole place is full of music choirs and
singers from all over the world, so it's a really
wonderful place to be.
Speaker 2 (02:57):
Let's listen to a bit of Ayaterro, which was specially
commissioned for the New Zealand Youth Quair, So tell us
(03:32):
a bit about that peace, David Well.
Speaker 3 (03:34):
Altro is the first wayata arringer, so the first action
song that the New Zealand Youth Choir has ever commissioned
especially for the choir. So we've been performing wyata which
have been gifted to the choir for the last thirty years.
Most of those have come from Tefanuki so the famous
Weki Fano that run out the Waka Huya and Mana
(03:56):
Huya who have been national champions at much teny many
times before. But all of those wayata up till this
point have first been performed by that kappa and then
gifted to the choir perform. So this one was written
especially for the choir by tweeden Aweki, who is the
granddaughter of bub and Nanwehi who ran Tewakahuya back in
(04:19):
the nineties. And the thing I really love about this
piece is that I asked the singers, the singer leadership
group to come up with a theme for what they
wanted The way outa to be about, and their major
theme was kW Takitanga or unity. They really wanted something
(04:41):
that would be relevant to every single New Zealander and
so tweeting it I took this on board. She really
loved the whole idea a bit and she went away
and came up with this beautiful way outa that celebrates
the one thing that binds us all and that's the land.
So basically it's a big celebration of the fenwa of
(05:02):
New Zealand as a country, mentions all the different place names,
talks about things like going home and smelling the smells
of home and the experience of going back to a
place that is you're two doing away way your place
to stand. And so it's an incredibly special piece and
the choir really loved singing it.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
I believe they had to sort of come up to
speed pretty quickly on this song too.
Speaker 4 (05:25):
Oh yes they did. So I last saw the choir.
Speaker 3 (05:29):
One of the things about New Zealand youth choirs, we
only meet about three times a year, so we didn't
finalize our arrangements with twitting it until probably October. And
the last time I saw the choir before this year
was in early September, so I didn't get the chance
to really work with her until the choir had already
(05:51):
gone on a hiatus, and so tweeting wrote the way
out her. She then did some action videos where she
did the videos for the men and then the actions
for the women. And we got one of the choir
members to trans gribed the piece into sheep music form
and then we sent it all to the singers in
(06:13):
early December and we said to them, sorry, guys, you
have to memorize this entire thing so that when we
meet in February and Tina turns up to polish it,
all she's doing is polishing. There's no learning. You have
to know the whole thing. And she came for one
day and that day was the fourth of February. Two
(06:35):
days later we were singing performing it for the first
time at Waitangi. So incredible pressure on the singers. There's
nothing like, you know, turning up at the birthplace in
New Zealand and performing away out adding it for the
first time in front of all these Malori kind of
looking at you, going you better get this right.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
Top pressure belt that went on to squeeze out of
performance out of them. That won the Choir of the
World So and it wasn't the only trophy and prize
you won on that tour. You won the Grand Prix
of Nation title at a competition where people were expected
to present cultural items. But the I don't know is
(07:16):
the Stepford in Wales that would be more traditional choral music.
So I'm just wondering how did that go down? How
did a Maori wyata with actions and go down in
that audience. Did they recognize it as being what it
was and resonate with it?
Speaker 3 (07:36):
Yes, I think I think they did. I mean the
Choir of the World recital, you basically have ten minutes
of singing time, and so some choirs did four pieces,
some only did two. We managed to squeeze in three, and.
Speaker 4 (07:54):
So we did.
Speaker 3 (07:55):
We started with a Baroque piece by a cousin of
Johann Sebastian Bach, based on some this is my Joy
that I put my trust in the Lord and so
in German, and then we went into the Battle of
Jericho and then finished with The Way out Us. So
we essentially had some Germans and Malian, some English, and
(08:16):
I think that that was probably one of the reasons
why we won the Choir of the World. I think
that we had some variety of programming and also real
flexibility amongst the singers to be able to move from
one style to another with integrity. That's something we put
a lot of pride in. If we're going to sing
in German, we have to do it so the Germans
(08:37):
are proud of us. If we're going to sing in Maori,
we have to do it so Mari are proud of us.
If we sing spiritual, we have to do it so
that African Americans are proud of us because that's their talinga.
Speaker 2 (08:47):
So there is a respect for the music.
Speaker 3 (08:49):
Absolutely, and I think that that the Welsh because the
other big passion apart from singing is rugby. They have
seen the hakka many times before. They have a strong
appreciation and love for New Zealand, and I think it
was very very well received. People seem to absolutely love
the fact that we were there bringing Maori Wayauta to Wales.
(09:12):
It was understood and very much respected.
Speaker 2 (09:17):
You played in a tent, and I believe it was
roasting hot that you played another venus as well. Some
of them are a lot fancy of an a tent.
What's the best venues that you can recall playing in.
Speaker 3 (09:29):
Oh yeah, So the tour, it's one of those things
wherein New zeal On Youth Choir Tour is that we're
away for about two.
Speaker 4 (09:37):
And a half weeks.
Speaker 3 (09:38):
But in that time we were in four different countries.
Speaker 4 (09:42):
And you've basically got to eke the most.
Speaker 3 (09:45):
At as you can out of the itinery. So probably
the nicest acoustics that we performed in Audhus Cathedral in
northern Denmark was really beautiful. It was nice to be
able to perform in a big, spacious acoustic, sacred acoustic
that we just don't really have in New Zealand except
now for perhaps Saint Paul's and Wellington would be the
(10:05):
closest to that.
Speaker 4 (10:08):
And then the other venue.
Speaker 3 (10:10):
That we were incredibly fortunate we didn't think we would
be able to perform there was We had a day
in York and we went to the Minster to York
Minster and did a tour and as we arrived one
of the guides said, now, look, I've just been looking
you up on YouTube. I see you won the choir
of the World. I want you to sing this piece
(10:30):
and he handed us a piece of paper with Kawayata
Kiyamara written on it and I was like, oh, you
Sespe could probably do that, but we've been told we're
not allowed to sing. He said, oh no, I'm telling
you you can. So he took us into the chapter
house just off to the side of Yorkminster and we
all just gathered by accident on purpose at the same
(10:51):
time and sang Kawayata Kia Maria to the tourists who
were fortunate enough to be there at the time, and
the singers were weeping. It was just the most beautiful
acoustic and so those were probably the two most special
acoustics that we performed in.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
If you've just joined us, my guest tonight is David Squire,
who is coming to the conclusion of a fascinating chapter
in his life, leading the New Zealand Youth Choir for
fifteen years. We'll be talking more about some of the
awards he's won, including a very strange award that he
was given. We'll be talking about that in a minute.
Speaker 1 (11:26):
Intelligent interviews with interesting people. It's real life on news talks.
It be.
Speaker 2 (11:49):
Welcome back to real life. I'm John Cown. I'm talking
with David Squire, who's a music educator and the conductor,
and he's been leading all sorts of choirs and orchestras
for years, just concluding fifteen years with the Youth Choir
of New Zealand. Just come back from an incredibly successful
tour in Europe where the New Zealand Youth Choir won
the Choir of the World competition, and that was one
(12:12):
of the pieces they've played in the competition, and it's
the Battle of Jericho and it's is it odd that
we sing Afro American spirituals?
Speaker 3 (12:22):
David, I don't think it's odd in that we are
exploring a range of music from around the world, and
we talked before about how it's really important that we're
respectful to the traditions of the people who own that music.
Speaker 4 (12:38):
And because we have.
Speaker 3 (12:42):
Deep appreciation for wyata in New Zealand that is essentially
tanga like treasures of the Maori people, we're very responsible
for ensuring that provenance is acknowledged for the people who
own that music, and also that we sing it with
a sincerity and an understanding of the meanings behind it.
(13:07):
And I feel like the same way about African American
spiritual So this particular cycle of the choir we did
get to work with Roll o' dilworth, who is an
African American choral director and spiritual expert, when he was
out in New Zealand in twenty twenty three. So he
worked with the choir, helped them understand some of the
(13:27):
stylistic conventions behind the piece, and conducted them in a
performance of it while he was here, which was great.
Speaker 2 (13:35):
You talked about the choir being in tears singing a
song in York, and music has that capacity to just
touch and move and everything. What do you find the
most I guess transcendent most. I guess the most moving
music for you personally? What gets you?
Speaker 4 (13:55):
I think.
Speaker 3 (13:57):
I'm a big lover of poetry as well as music,
so I love that synthesis of meaningful words with composer
has taken a text that's particularly meaningful and has said
it in such a way that you hear all the
rhetorical gesture behind the singing and it elevates you in
(14:20):
a way that words by themselves can't do. So there's
all sorts of moments for me, I mean, John Sebastian
Bach for me is probably the well not probably is
the pinnacle of sacred music because there's just such an
innate understanding of harmony and a deep connection to music
(14:45):
from his point of view that was shaped by his
faith as a devout Lutheran. And there are moments, even
with a choir, when you're dealing with a choir that
doesn't necessarily have people who actually believe what it is
that they're singing, we do have a motive pathways that
(15:06):
we can bring them to an understanding of what the
composer was wanting. And the moments for me that are
the most magical is when the singers are really comfortable
with the music and then it's come off the page
and something amazing happens in the room where everybody just
(15:26):
all of a sudden comes together and you walk off
the stage and you're like, what happened. Then there's no
real description for it. It could be in any piece,
but yeah, for me, a lot of those sacred works
are the ones where I get a sense of that.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
I was talking to a member of the youth choir
who was saying that this phrase of the music coming
off the page is one that you inspire your singers with.
It's not just singing a bunch of notes on a line.
It comes off the page, and it takes on a life,
it takes on a meaning, it has almoth a spiritual
life in its own.
Speaker 4 (16:02):
Absolutely, I mean we talk.
Speaker 3 (16:04):
The worst criticism that I can give to them is
that they are producing bms beautiful, meaningless sound, and to me,
there's no excuse for that. They have to have integrity
in what they do, and I think if you watch
the video from Wales of the Choir of the World performance,
(16:26):
for me, one of the biggest reasons why they won
the Choir of the World was that they had connection
with the audience for what it was that they were singing.
They were moving the audience.
Speaker 2 (16:38):
I think the audience saw that they resonated with that
and they know where it came from. And that's why
you personally won an award of being the most inspirational conductor.
You get these ideas across and somehow into your that
it's not just vocal cords making noises, it's hearts communicating
with hearts.
Speaker 4 (16:58):
That's absolutely true.
Speaker 2 (16:59):
Well done and congratulations on that.
Speaker 4 (17:01):
Thank you so much.
Speaker 3 (17:02):
I think for an audience in particular, I mean, I
love listening to orchestras all sorts of different kinds of music,
but there's something about singing that because in theory, even
the people who say they are tone deaf and can't sing,
they probably can. It still has meaning for them because
they it's something that's come to me. Oh, there is
(17:26):
totally John, There's something that comes from that human perspective,
and it's an expression of humanity being able to sing,
but still with that connection to the divine of you know,
whatever that might be for any listeners out there, but
there is that real connection to It's something that's incredibly
(17:48):
intangible but very heartfelt and it does dig right into
the core of people. I always think about a cuttinger,
you know, when you're being welcomed on to a marai
and a queer will be calling out, and the moment
that starts, it's like it just grips your heart and
(18:09):
you go, oh okay, I'd feel astrong. The emotions all
rise to the surface because that the voice is so
incredibly powerful that extolling emotions and people.
Speaker 2 (18:25):
Another award that you won, I don't know if you recall,
was at the Sheldonian Theater in Oxford, and that was
a special award given to you for performing Kiwi Pop
Bangers on your guitar backstage. Un't aware that you're being
heard very clearly in the auditorium.
Speaker 3 (18:45):
I'd forgotten about that. I was wondering what you're going
to say then for a minute. Oh, yes, we were backstage.
Speaker 2 (18:50):
And you've been dabbed in there.
Speaker 4 (18:53):
Of course, yeah, I have been dobbed in.
Speaker 3 (18:56):
We have an award on New Zealand Youth Choir tour
is called Mister Silly, or when it was a when
we were on a cruise ship in twenty nineteen we
did it the South Pacific Cruise was actually Captain Silly,
and the award is having to wear clothing of some
(19:16):
kind that is embarrassing to wear and you have to
wear it for twenty four hours unless you're actually performing
on stage. So I did win Mister Silly for starting
a Dave Dobbins sing along downstairs at the Sheldonian. That
is true.
Speaker 2 (19:32):
Look, one of the things that I've spoken now to
a couple of people in your Youth Choir and they
just love being on tour and they appreciate so much
about you. They appreciate the fact that every one of
them feels seen. Even though there's fifty people in front
of you, each one of them feel seen and acknowledged
(19:54):
and understood. And they also appreciate your dad jokes, the
fact that you'll add something into the repertoire that the
Stravinski at the end, or something which they've never ever
heard of or seen, and you're telling them they're going
to be singing it on stage. But of course it's easy.
I was supposed to do dad jokes when you actually
have a literal dad of one of the singers.
Speaker 3 (20:13):
Yes, that's true. Yes, and he doesn't roll his eyes.
It's normal the other ones that roll their eyes.
Speaker 2 (20:22):
Referring to the fact that you had your own son,
the son in the choir, and that must have been
an interesting dynamic.
Speaker 4 (20:28):
It's really special having him there.
Speaker 2 (20:30):
And also quite quite a privileged too.
Speaker 4 (20:32):
Yeah, it was, It really was.
Speaker 1 (20:35):
You know.
Speaker 3 (20:36):
My boys have both grown up with me taking the
youth choir for almost as long as they can remember. William,
who's now twenty and was in the choir, was only
five when I got the job, and so pretty much
as long as he can remember, I've been taking the
youth choir. He's been to lots of concerts, heard lots
(20:56):
of singers, and had lots of experiences. And I'm just
thrilled that both the boys have ended up in my
choirs at Westlake Boys. They were both in my my
boys choir called Voicemail and William came on this trip.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
A great name for a choir, by the way, it is.
Speaker 3 (21:16):
A lot of the big thing choirs that the lower
voice choirs seem to have dad joke pun names and
Voicemail it is a good one. But it was great
to have him there. It was really special to have
him on that trip.
Speaker 2 (21:32):
David, going forwards, this is the end of a chapter
for you. The youth choir is coming to an end.
I know you've got other choirs that you're working with,
but any big plans that you can announce yet or
is it? Or is it You're still going to have
to sit down and scratch your head to work out
what's happening next.
Speaker 3 (21:48):
Yeah, I've come back into festival season, so it's been
quite a hard landing. I've got the KBB Music Festival
next week with my orchestra and then the big sing
Finale with my choirs from Kristen and Voicemail and Wesley
Boys in about three weeks time, so it's busy, busy.
Speaker 4 (22:08):
By about mid.
Speaker 3 (22:09):
September, I'll be able to have a sort of a
bit of time to contemplate what comes next. But the
youth choir is not a small commitment. It particularly involves
a lot of emailing and meetings and communication between courses.
If we had more time actually singing, it would be great.
Speaker 2 (22:28):
So this is going to open up quite a gap
in your life.
Speaker 3 (22:31):
Yeah, well, yeah, we'll give me a bit of a
chance to contemplate what might come next. But there's a
few opportunities there, and I'll just look and have a
think about what might be best for the next phase.
But yeah, these fifteen years have been incredibly special and
I've loved every moment of it.
Speaker 2 (22:48):
Well, David, you've been so successful in these different ventures.
I'm absolutely confident we'll be hearing of you in some
new venture. Maybe it'll be an extension of your Do
Be Do Well, a venture to stimulates people's well being
and health through music. Might be more promotion of Pacific
(23:08):
Maori music. I know that's been big on your agenda.
So I wish you all the best for whatever the
future holds for you, And we'll go out on the
piece of German music that you mentioned. You also sang
at the Stckford. What is the piece of music that
you sang again? It was a bath peace, wasn't it.
Speaker 3 (23:27):
Yes, it was Johann Ludwich Bark so one of Johann
Sebastian Bark's cousins. And it's dust estminor Freuda. This is
my joy that I put my trust.
Speaker 4 (23:35):
In the Lord.
Speaker 2 (23:36):
Thank you so much, David, and I wish you all
the best. This is real life. I'm John Cown. I'll
be speaking with David Squire who's now finishing with the
Youth Choir. Look forward to being back with you again
next Sunday nights.
Speaker 1 (24:22):
For more from News Talk st B, listen live on
air or online, and keep our shows with you wherever
you go with our podcasts on iHeartRadio
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