February 7, 2025 • 41 mins
D'Arcy Waldegrave returned to wrap this week's sporting news, On today's agenda:
Sports Insider Trevor McKewen on the four players who opted out of Fantasy Super Rugby
Talkback - How much power should players have over things like whether they can be used for Fantasy Super Rugby?
An exclusive interview with Tohu Harris on his retirement from the Warriors
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Sports Talk podcast with Darcy Waldegrave
from News Talk ZEDB.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Good evening and welcome to Sports Talk. I'm Darcy order
Gave on a Friday night, seven minutes after seven. It
is seventh of February twenty twenty five. Coming up on
this evenings show myself yourself, a couple of guests in
the form of at Trevor mcewn, former CEO of the Warriors.
(00:59):
Former everything that guy has done so much I've even
lost count currently writes the Sports Inside of the Media,
Inside of the sport Thing Insider in New Zealand hero A.
We're going to talk about Caleb Clark in his decision
to not engage in Super Rugby Fantasy, which has just
been released today. What that says about the landscape, What
(01:24):
that says about players' ability to opt out of promotions.
It's getting thicker on the ground now, how long does
it last? And I think it should be praised. We'll
talk to Trevor about that, about the change in the
landscape of the situation that. We'll take your calls as
well on one hundred eighty ten eighty and then later
(01:46):
on in the piece, Oliver Yarn Tauhu Harris. He's the
epic Warriors former skipper that had to retire on medical grounds.
Speaker 3 (01:56):
He retired.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
What's he doing? What's he done? What happens next? We'll
find out all of that and more even to captain
see what the former captain himself, Paul Harris to join
us and I don't know about half an hour's time
as we have a yack. That's our plan. But before
we engage in our plan, what don't we try a
(02:21):
bit of this sport today and sport today we go again.
They want for a second in z based in ourl
team has spread from down South up to Auckland. Sent
to Fred Arkoy thinks Auckland can actually handle a second
in our old team one next to the already here
(02:44):
but hardly successful Warriors.
Speaker 4 (02:51):
Hmm.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
Seem to have a small issue there with the audio
not entirely sure why yeah, suffice to say Fred Akoy
thinks it's going to be fine because the population is
the population is good and it should be enough to
be able to cover off all the fun and games
(03:14):
with that.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Well.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
Sydney he reckons that they've got many, many, many NRL teams.
But the big issue here is that Sydney's flight five
and a half billion big, but Auckland isn't here we go.
Speaker 5 (03:28):
You look at Sydney, how many teams all in the
same city. I don't think it's a problem, and I
think it makes it even more exciting for Auckland is
that they have the ability to be supporting two teams.
Speaker 2 (03:42):
Yeah, population different story. Tom Walsh, the putter of shots,
is ready to roll again. He's looking toward the la
Olympics and.
Speaker 6 (03:51):
Further, I've got no doubt that my body can stand
up to the next four years of throwing and maybe
even longer if I still have a love for it.
So yeah, I'm definitely not done and my body is
in a real good spot to throw better.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
Even going forward. And he's returning competition this weekend and
Auckland after his Olympic groin injury. The AK leg of
the sail GP didn't go to plan for the locals.
But Blackfoil skipper Pete Berling isn't hitting the panic button.
Of course he wouldn't. Supercar't right.
Speaker 7 (04:22):
It definitely motivates us to keep pushing super hard. Yeah,
missing your home finals never never a fun thing, but
you know, to be honest, we we're pretty happy with
the damage limitation that the team managed to do on
that that Sunday to still get the fourth.
Speaker 2 (04:35):
And Sydney leg of sol GP stunts tomorrow. And Zoe
Sadowski Senate has carried on with a ridiculous couple of
weeks on her tray. She won gold again today in
the World Cup, adding to the big air gold, well
with the slopestyle gold that you're on Monday, and of
course last week's ex game slope style gold. Ridiculously. She
(04:57):
was pleased today with their scoring early after the conditions deteriorated. Yeah, definitely,
especially with the win.
Speaker 7 (05:05):
So yeah, to put those us too done, kind of
playing tactics almost but yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
And that's sport today twelve and it's after seven. Riva
mckewan to join us and now, writes Sports Insider for
New Zealand Herald, former CEO of the Warriors. As we
discuss Caleb Clark and three others, he's not alone deciding
to opt out of this Super Rugby Fantasy competition, which
(05:34):
was launched today. It presents a number of questions around
the rights, the IP rights of athletes now and in
the future, the control they have or haven't got Trevor
joins us. Now, good evening, Good evening, I'm very good.
Interesting tale today coming out in the heir with a
(05:55):
launch of Super Rugby Fantasy, something that's been I think
a long time coming. It's turned up. We all jumped
on our computers and I say we all, I mean
you know me and to try and find our best team.
No Caleb Clark. And it turns out Caleb Clark and
three other players have chosen to opt out of being
(06:16):
in Super Rugby Fantasy, which strikes me is odd. But
the more I think about it, the more I think, well,
players choice in this day and age. Look, you've been
a CEO. You look what haven't you done. I can't
even start with this, but Tresa, this whole thing about
players IP players engaging in various competitions, especially ones that
(06:37):
are linked to gambling or fast food or alcohol or banks.
In Sunny Bill's case, this is a very difficult and
forever changing space, isn't it?
Speaker 4 (06:50):
It is and it can be quite complex to Darcy.
I mean, for the benefit of your listeners, what ordinarily happens,
and pretty much professional sport around the world and these
types of competitions like Super Rugby, NFL, NBA, you name it. Effectively,
you have a merging of what could be described as
(07:14):
property rights the player themselves. So in this case, say
Caleb Clark, owns their own individual likeness in terms of
who they are. And the way that these commercial contracts
work is that the player agrees to hand over his
individual likeness or her individual likeness IP if you like.
That's being combined with the sports bodies IP in this case,
(07:37):
the super right, it's the it's the Super rugby competition,
name the logos, the colors, the teams, all those types
of things. The merger of those two properties is what
creates the value for a sponsor, whether it's a betting company,
fast food company, whatever it might be. And that's generally
being the model what we've seen in recent years. And
(08:00):
the other people may have a view that this is
a good development. The view it's the negative development. But
what we are seeing, and probably sunny Bill started it
when you mentioned him earlier. Some of your listeners may
recall that sunny Bill would not wear the B and
Z logo on his Blues uniform playing uniform when he
was when he was playing at the Blues and that
(08:21):
was because he objected to the banking system effectively. Now whether.
Speaker 6 (08:30):
You know a.
Speaker 4 (08:30):
Precident was created then or not to move point, but
obviously he was given permission to opt out of that. Now,
I think this on the face of it, without knowing
not having spoken to neither was having spoken to Caleb
Clark or anything like that, It would seem that this
appears to be, along with the other players perhaps are
almost a conscientious objective objection to you know, I guess
(08:56):
you can call fantasy games gambling, and some people have
a strong view about about sports betting and things like that.
So it would seem that these players have said, look,
we don't really want to be a part of this
because with our personal values. Now at that point, the
sports body probably has two choices. They can either enforce
(09:18):
it and say, well, you signed a contract and hand
it over your likeness to us, you have to do this,
or as increasingly the point that with athletes gaining greater
power and greater autonomy, they've simply said, look, okay, that's reasonable,
will exempt you from this. And I think given that
(09:39):
I don't know Caleb myself from Darcy, but I know
he's a committed church goer, his dad or Ronnie has
been a committed Christian whole life. I would, without trying
to jump a shadow, suggest that it is probably an
objection to betting, and probably my personal point of view
(09:59):
far enough. I'm not a scam on myself. I'm not
against it, but I've just sent the past month in
Australia Darty and you cannot turn on any sport on
TV here without being inundated with sporting odds, and if
you're not interested it gets a bit grating. So you know,
maybe that's where Caleb Clark is at.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
It's a movable feast, isn't it, Because then you sign
over your your rights, your r IP if you will,
You're not to know what's coming up in the future.
And things happened so fast in this day and age
where the player is even aware that this concept of
fantasy rugby was going to be presented to them, they
(10:41):
got an opportunity to opt out. Plainly they did, because
you don't know what's coming up in the future, So
it doesn't it have to be a constant negotiation process.
Speaker 4 (10:50):
Well, it seems to be moving towards that. Whereas I
would say, if you wound the clock back perhaps five years,
you would probably have more bullish administrators saying, don't care.
You know you signed over your rights to ask you
getting paid X amount per year. It's not just a
playing the sport or rugby in this case, you've also
we also need you to front up the sponsor promotions
(11:11):
and we can't have you picking and choosing. That I
think was the viewpoint, but it's now changing and I
think correctly that the players are having more say on
you know, whatever it might be, but it is it
is a bit of a Pandora's box that we're opening here, Darcy,
because you know people can object to fast food, so
(11:32):
you know, I don't want to be part of KFC.
Have been a long time sponsor of Super Rugby. Does
that mean okay, I'm not available for any KFC ads
A funny bill with banking. I mean, I think just
about you could go almost through every player and find
at least one particular hot button that they are uncomfortable with.
(11:52):
So it's a matter here. I think you know, whether
whether it's been a Blues decision you can opt out,
whether it's been a Super a New Zealand Rugby decision,
because they hold the contracts or whether it's been a
Super Rugby competition thing. I don't know. I mean, if
an Australian feels the same Australian player feels the same way,
are they able to have opt out of it too.
I haven't seen any headlines about that over here. Well
(12:15):
I've been here the past month. But it's a very
complicated subject. You know, some people will be saying, you know,
what's what's on about? It's just a fantasy competition. But
you know some people have strong views starting and they
have the view that, you know, you start in fantasy competitions,
you end up spending money gambling, and we know that,
(12:36):
you know, the Christian faith has a strong viewpoint on that.
And again, as I mentioned, Caleb again not trying to
jump the shadow would appear to have to object to
to what this gain is about and what it might
lead to, and that's that's his prerogative. I think equally,
it's potentially the sports bodies prerogative to say, well there
(12:57):
has to be an impact for that, because you can't
top you, you can't just choose like that. But whether
that will ever be made public, I don't know, but yeah,
I think they possibly could have plug put of it too, Darcy.
I mean you've they've got people inquisitive, people like you
saying what's going on here? Listener? Is probably the same
thing I wanted to put Caleb Clark and my team.
(13:20):
He would have earned me a lot of points. Why
is he not there? Probably the competition, oh the fans
and explanation on this one, Well.
Speaker 2 (13:28):
It's been said by Super Rugby Pacific that we're delighted,
we're thrilled. They said that so many players have opted in,
so plainly you can opt in or choose to opt
out four players and said no, we don't want to
do it. So yeah, front footing would have been a
nice idea, but they've gone. But I suppose the bigger
thing here for me, Trevor is we're joined by trivia
(13:51):
McEuen media inside a former Warriors CEO, and the list
goes on and on. We haven't got enough time to
do it, but Trevor, the tab. I can go down
to the tab tomorrow and I bought money on Caleb
Clark to be the first try scorer in the first
Super Ugord begain to the Blues and there's nothing he
can do about it. That's a bit off kilter, isn't it.
How's that solved?
Speaker 4 (14:13):
Yes, that's the complication around this particular issue and regarding betting.
It's what does make the betting companies a little bit
different from your fast food sponsor, your jersey sponsor, your
bank or whatever, is that there is another layer to it,
and let's face it, Darcy is a very profitable layer.
(14:34):
As we know. If you're a national sporting organization in
New Zealand and Darcy goes down to the TA B
tomorrow and puts a bet on on, say the All Blacks,
the New Zealand reupt union gets a cut of that,
and it can they can stack up to be quite
substantial numbers at one stage with the because the New
(14:54):
Zealand Basketball gets all in betting on NBA games, they
get a cut of that. At one stage that was
their biggest revenue stream. They made more money out of
betting on the NBA than anything else they did. So
for some sports it's it's a lifeline. So I would
suspect that some of them will be quite nervous about
(15:15):
this development. As you say, it clearly is an opt in,
opt out decision. Whether we're only ever going to see
you know a handful of players objecting or whether this
is something that might grow in its in its scope
and its numbers. Is it's going to be interesting to watch,
but so also it's going to be the attitude of
(15:38):
the sports bodies. But you are correct in the sense
that Caleb Clark can't stop anybody going down and putting
a bed on him to be first try square.
Speaker 2 (15:45):
I suppose he's controlling his controllables and for that I'll
applaud him and I'm sure most people will as well.
Hey Trevor, thanks so much for your time. As to McEwan,
now we're out, we got to go. Look forward to
catching up sooner rather than later.
Speaker 5 (15:59):
Look after yourself, absolutely, Darty.
Speaker 1 (16:05):
We've got the break down on Sports Talk callight hundred,
News Talk.
Speaker 2 (16:13):
Seven twenty three, Sports Talk here on News Talk ZB
seventh and twenty twenty five. Trevor mckew And he's not
the media insider got carried away. That's that's Shane Curry.
He's a sports insider. There's a lot of pieces in
New Zealand Herald around what's going on at the ins
and the outs and the ups and the downs and
the vagaries of sports. That's why I called him about
(16:35):
the subject. I'm fascinated that somebody who would object to
being in a fantasy game, or in Sunny Bill's case,
back in the game, object to having his image attached
to that of Banks. There's a lot of people who
(16:58):
are and we don't know the specific cases. With Caleb Clark,
he's not said that. He just said it's a personal
decision and maybe more will leak out. So as Trevor
was saying, we don't want to eat too much on him.
But when you look at a decision and people are
against gaming, they don't want to do it, well, doesn't
(17:20):
matter because we can go to the taarbe tomorrow and
bet on them. It looks like moving into the future,
athletes are going to have more and more control over
their IP as they realize they're bigger and bigger in
the game and the game won't survive without them. But
there is a tipping point there cart horse Tail Dog,
(17:50):
and there comes a stage in an athlete's life where
they do become bigger than the game and they can
make those calls. But it's a delicate decision from the
organizations that administer the sports to hands too much control
troll over to the athletes. Because the athletes come and
the athletes go, the sport will stay long beyond their
(18:14):
shelf life. Personally, I admire Caleb Clark they sticking to
us guns whatever guns they were, and the other three
players and said, look, you know, thanks, but no things.
I don't want a part of this. So good on
them because it's their name, it's their likeness. But you
(18:40):
may completely disagree with that because the other side says, wow,
you're signed on the line, you're get and paid big money.
If your pay master says jump, you say how high?
And that's when I talk about the balance. Where do
you sit on this? Around players having control of their
(19:03):
own image, players who object to something out of a
family belief, a personal belief, something that doesn't sit comfortably
with them as a human saying no, you cannot use me,
you can't use my face, you can't use my name.
Where do you stand on that? I'd say, all control
(19:26):
to the athletes, but with the asterisk if they get
too much control who runs the game, and that to
me is alarming. You can't let the athletes run it
all right? Our eight hundred eighty ten eighty love your
thoughts on this. I don't think there is a line anywhere,
and I think it develops and it evolves as time
(19:49):
goes on. And you've got to be very fleet footed
to be able to work these issues through as they arise.
And that's the players and the agents and the organizations themselves.
Tricky times. Twenty seven minutes after seven, look on that
news talk.
Speaker 3 (20:07):
Z B.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
Taho Harris joins the program retiring Warriors skipper a medical retirement.
The what's the wise, the hows, the wears, it's all
coming out. When to who joins us?
Speaker 6 (20:21):
Here?
Speaker 2 (20:22):
On news Talks Eb. Seven, twenty seven. They sell flowers. Ah,
here's a bit of advice. I'm a flower buyer of wayback.
I love to buy flowers. Years and years and years
and years ago I was told by a woman never
buy flowers to apologize for something, because that casts a
(20:47):
shadow over the beauty of flowers. And if someone turns
up with flowers on the doorstep, you immediately think what
have you done now? And it takes away you cannot
un what's the word, You can't unsee flowers that don't
come from a place of love. So right from that moment,
(21:09):
I never ever ever bought flowers as an apology. Only
buy flowers as a there's a mark of love and
respect and joy right anyway, just to I share it
with you after hearing that song, and trust me it works.
And how the naughty boys that they going? What am
I supposed to buy?
Speaker 3 (21:28):
Then?
Speaker 5 (21:28):
Was?
Speaker 4 (21:28):
I know?
Speaker 2 (21:29):
Try not being bad? Seven point thirty one. Let's gid
the phones now, players who issue their rights or their
their capability of organizations to use their IP saying no,
that doesn't stand for what I stand for. You can't
do it. Is this good? It's bad? It's some different.
(21:50):
I'd love your thoughts, so eight hundred and eighty ten
eighty Hello Tony.
Speaker 8 (21:54):
Okay mate, I'm going back to the flowers and things.
It is Valentine's Day coming up, you know, well Valentine's lay.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
It's okay, I mean, that's their one outlie. But really
you wander up with flowers, and if you're always buying
them when you make mistake, what does that say about flowers?
Speaker 3 (22:08):
Right?
Speaker 2 (22:08):
It's just a fairy. I was just sharing.
Speaker 8 (22:11):
Can I give you some advice, Darcy? Yeah, flowers, fresh
flowers on the first time are beautiful. They always smell nice,
they look good, They make you look good as well.
Speaker 2 (22:25):
I'm an habitual flower by it, by flowers and give
them to strangers in the street because I think they're
so joyous. Anyway, let's move on to the subject at hand,
because some of the listeners a game. It's the sports,
so I want to talk about floral arrangements.
Speaker 8 (22:38):
Yeah, but you brought it up.
Speaker 4 (22:39):
My man.
Speaker 2 (22:40):
I know, I know, I know.
Speaker 8 (22:41):
All right, moving forward, right, all right, all right, that's cool,
that's cool. Can we can we just saw right quickly?
Just just a quick note. What do you think about
Adazonia and his last I know you've probably done that,
but what I haven't heard it. What do you think?
Speaker 2 (22:54):
Look, the first round was fantastic, he looked really really good.
I thought, well, here was one for the ages. And
then he got punched in the face and all finished
and he took an absolute cracker of a stripe from memory,
it was a right hand. It just flushed him and
turned him right around. He possibly should have spent longer
after the ipoke to recover. I don't know if that
(23:15):
was a good move to come back as quick as he.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
Did, but he did.
Speaker 8 (23:20):
Okay well in Parker coming up soon? Do you reckon
he's going to do it.
Speaker 2 (23:25):
Yeah, I do the difference in me.
Speaker 8 (23:27):
You've always been a fan of Parker.
Speaker 2 (23:29):
I am a fan of Parker. I've known him for
a very long time. I met him when he first
came out to this years and years ago. But I
think what we've seen Tony in the development of Joe,
since he's had this new trainer, new nutritionist on board,
we've seen a very different shaped Parker. We've seen a
very measured Joe Parker and one who's the ability to
(23:51):
stick to a fight plan and see that plan through
to the end. This is a much more pure, smarter boxer,
and I like what I've seen from him. I think
he's showing great control. I'd do Boi as an absolute weapon,
but I think he might be a bit Frank Bruno,
like big old heavy arms, take a long Frank Bruno.
(24:12):
I'm just saying because of the weight of the arms
of Frank Bruno, I mean, after about the six or
seventh round, he couldn't hold the bloody things up. He could?
Speaker 8 (24:20):
He could? He could? He could anyway anyway. Anyway, Okay,
So back to so the whole sorted to segue. Because
I love boxing, is my main passion. But when you
mentioned about the players not having control about things, I
thought about John Lowan and his his his beautiful wife
and the kids, and how they sometimes have a adverse
(24:44):
reaction to the way things go for them, and the
Lowo name. And what I just thought, is that something
you've considered when when the conversation came into tonight, No.
Speaker 2 (24:54):
When you saw that, I thought absolutely, Because this is
an argument that's been developing, and I think it's been
gaining pace over the last few years, and it needs
to be addressed. Where are your rights? Do you have any?
Do you sign them more the way? Should you be
expected to sign them the way? Does it actually make
a palpable difference to your life whether you do it
or not, Because there are some things out of your control,
(25:14):
and one of them can.
Speaker 8 (25:15):
Worms can worms to us. Because if we can go
back to boxing again, we can look at cases like
David tour who had that Parkery situation. You remember the one, well,
I remember the one We'll do it in Parkery.
Speaker 2 (25:30):
No, No, I don't, all right, beat So I thought
you talking about an opponent.
Speaker 8 (25:35):
Was no, no, no, sorry, So just because this relates
to it, because it's it's important because there was some
sculptagerie with management and the handling of his affairs and
the handling of his money, and like it can go
deep when you start bringing up things like this. But
I think the essential is you need good management if
(25:56):
you're going to be a top athlete. Is it would
that be fair?
Speaker 2 (26:00):
Yeah? Absolutely? And there are a number of agencies around
that are trusted and respected and you've got to give
faith because it's as you said, it's can of worms.
It's a Bob White mess inside of glass canister.
Speaker 8 (26:12):
It's it doesn't have to be d I mean you
said you said there are good teams. I mean in
New Zealand? Are there? Because since you're we are in
New Zealand and yours, this is the subject you bring up.
Are they good management teams in New Zealand?
Speaker 5 (26:27):
A yeah.
Speaker 2 (26:28):
I think that Halo Management do a fantastic job. And
they've got former athletes that work with them and for
them as player agents. You've got Bruce Sharrick and Craig
Innis hugely respected, I mean around for thirty something odd
years and they've got the trust in the ear of
(26:48):
athletes and of major associations. I suppose you've got to
look at the smaller ones that fly by nights and go,
what what have you got? Where can I build that trust?
Because athletes is all about.
Speaker 8 (27:01):
Interrupt they probably said, stay in there laying those those
the new ones. I mean, you've named some very top companies,
which which is nice, which is name dropping, but the
whole subject. I think what what I read into what
you were saying originally is that you need good management
and you need to have some skills if if you're
(27:23):
not I'm I read wrong, but if you're not going
to be a top athlete, have something backing, some backing,
maybe some education, maybe some degrees or something like that.
But if you haven't, you could get taken advantage of
quite easily. Have I read that right way?
Speaker 2 (27:38):
And that's exactly what's happened, especially in fight sports. You
used to happen all the time. Yeah, the amount of fighters
that suddenly turn around they've got nothing, and they've made
millions and millions of dollars.
Speaker 8 (27:48):
I've seen it many times. I see my time. Yeah. Yeah,
And where we go with the conversations and are going
to We're.
Speaker 2 (27:56):
Going to wind the conversation up because we're running out
of time. Tony and I've got a tall who Harris
to interview shortly, so Tony, thanks for muchling, Thank you
very much, interesting conversations. What I love about this program,
I Darcy, it to be nothing to do with gambling.
It'd be more to do with his religion and using
(28:17):
his image, something like that. I've got a Christian made
wouldn't let his kids watch Harry Potter because their demons
in it, And that could very well be it. But
the bigger question here is that if and we don't
know what the decision was, but surely gambling is the
root of a lot of evil and a lot of
(28:38):
issues for people. Yet as a player, you can be
gambling on the tab can you actually control that? Is
that right and just? And I'll leave you this one here, Tanaka,
please Darcy, SERGEI give the kupoo out about the running
of the sixty nine Grand Prix Thista, wishing the driver's
(29:02):
speed and safety to make you, Sir a nakiat Noah,
yours sincerely, my tew years on. It's at the Beautiful
Highlands Park. It's on Sunday. It's one of the only
races that can be called a Grand Prix outside of
Formula One. That in macaw is. It's been around so
long as the final round of the five round Castro
(29:24):
Tour to Formula Regional Oceania Championship, and we will have
Nikita Johnson, the second place run of the American on
the show on the All Sports Breakfast tomorrow to talk
about it. Thanks for your request, Mathu, you look after
yourself to have to for three Sports talk here on
(29:52):
New Stalks there b on a Friday night. I'm Darcy Autograph.
Thanks for joining us. Let's have a yarn with Tahou Harris,
former Warriors skipper, former key we epic character, amazing player
has had to pull the pin on his career. It
(30:15):
gurns us now to talk about why, how and what next?
Good evening to who made?
Speaker 3 (30:24):
How's it going?
Speaker 2 (30:24):
That's going very very well? I suppose the big questions
how's it going with you? You had to retire from the
game that you love with repeated injuries. Now you sat down,
you're not doing pre season. That's got to be of
a relief, surely.
Speaker 3 (30:38):
Well, yeah, my rest is certainly appreciating it and being
able to spend this time with the family has been
really nice. It's yeah, the club have been amazing. They've
allowed me the time to spend with family and before
any commitments they need you to do.
Speaker 2 (30:58):
So what is your relationship now with the club? You're
plainly not playing. Are you still under contract? You still
have a role within the Warriors.
Speaker 3 (31:06):
Yes, I'm still under contract for this year. As part
of the medical retirement, I've I'm still contracted for this
year and obligated to to fill any obligations that are
needed from the club. So yeah, just waiting to see
how that looks. But you know, they've been amazing. They've
(31:29):
allowed me the time to sort of get settled, spend
time with family before the I guess the busy part
of the year starts.
Speaker 2 (31:38):
So in that role, you have a rough idea about
what you would actually like to achieve and put back
to the club. We know how much you love the
worries and being involved. Thoughts around what how you must
be what might be best utilized Tom.
Speaker 3 (31:52):
No, I've got no idea, to be honest. That's up
to like cam and Webbe to figure out. I think
there's a Yeah, there's probably a balance that they need
to figure out on how to sort of integrate me
in whatever area. So yeah, just waiting to hear from them,
but making them most of the time that I do
(32:12):
have with family, which.
Speaker 2 (32:14):
Is very different from normal pre seasons too. The family
must be scratching the head, going who is this old
guy with a beard? What's he doing at our house?
Speaker 3 (32:22):
Yeah, it's very different this time of the year. Obviously,
with the game being today, I would have been away.
So yeah, it's very different to what we're used to do.
But I'm really enjoying it, and my body is appreciating it,
my rest is appreciating it. So yeah, it's still going
to be an adjustment, but it's you know, it's I
(32:43):
guess because it all happened a while ago now that
we've come to terms with it and now we're sort
of just making the most of the time I have
with them.
Speaker 2 (32:52):
Before you made that call, how many people who did
you talk to around actually committing to retirement, because I'd
suggest it would have been an extraordinarily difficult thing to do.
Speaker 3 (33:04):
Well, it's it's a bit different to sort of retiring normally.
So this sort of got taken out of my hands
a little bit because it's a medical retirement. It was
through the doctor and he deemed it. I guess a
detriment to my health in the long term if I
(33:25):
continue to play and continue to try and manage my
way through the pain and through games. It was a
bit too risky for my long term health in terms
of my rest. So yeah, so that the decision sort
of got taken out of my hands. And so yeah,
it wasn't a situation where sort of talking to a
whole lot of people, getting their opinions and on a
(33:48):
decision I had to make. It. It was a decision
that was wasn't mine.
Speaker 2 (33:53):
How did that come about? Did you sit down with
a doctor at the end of the season saying this
is still hurting, or do they come to you and go,
we think we might better medically retire you. How did
that process evolve?
Speaker 3 (34:05):
Well, that that happened pretty fast. So we had surgery
in the middle of last year and with the full
intent of making full recovery and playing the season, playing
a few more seasons beyond this year, and so came
back to preseason training and the rest of my body.
I was feeling really fit and strong, and it was
(34:27):
just trying to manage this rest daily and trying to
get through each and every day, and it just wasn't
recovering how we were hoping, and that sort of eventually
led to and this is during constant communication with the
medical staff on how it's going, how we can sort
of strengthen it, all those different things, and it all
(34:49):
came to a head around the Christmas break where, yeah,
the dock, the season was coming up very fast and
it wasn't a position that I guess the doc seemed
it's safe for me to try and play live games
with it and continue to push it out training to
try and get it right.
Speaker 2 (35:11):
You said you've had time to come to peace with
the decision that was pushed on you to retire. You
get your entire life at Hidio. Now I told who
I'm presuming you would have thought a little bit about it.
You've got commitments this year to the Warriors, but beyond that,
a man who's been involved. Gee, I remember when you
first got picked for the key is at the expense
of sunny Bill Williams and he came back and you
(35:34):
were out. You've been doing this a long long time,
So to consider your future, what else is Tool Harris
capable of doing? What next? What are you going to do?
Speaker 3 (35:44):
Well, that's that's sort of because I'm contracted this year
and I've got commitments with the club, but I've still
still got quite a bit of time to figure that out.
So yeah, it's all sort of constantly communicating with my
wife and trying to figure that out and how that
how that could look. But yeah, first foremost I've got
(36:05):
to make sure my family's right and that I'm fulfilling
those my commitments to the club and whatever they need.
So it's still waiting to hear how that looks.
Speaker 2 (36:16):
Like a complete professional. So who's going to be the
new captain?
Speaker 3 (36:19):
Tell who?
Speaker 2 (36:19):
No one's going to tell us. You've got a rough fight.
Who do you like? Who do you think's got the
ear of the players? And what's the most important thing
for the new captain? What's the biggest consideration do you think?
Speaker 3 (36:31):
To be honest, I've got no idea who it's going
to be. But like the club's in an outstanding position,
they've got a number of different options and it's I
guess it all comes down to what where we think
the team needs. You've got Roger Dare who has captained
the club and he leads by example, but whether he
wants the job or no, I'm not sure, But then
(36:52):
you've got guys like Fish coming in who's led his country,
who's had the highest, the most amount of success someone
can have in this in this profession. You know Mitch
Barnett who led team for the second half of last year,
and and you've got a wealth of experience through there
like Dylan Walker, Kirk Cape, well all these all these
(37:16):
guys like they've got a number of different options. Yeah,
it all comes down to what webe thinks the team needs.
And yeah, so that's that's sort of above my pay
grade anyway. So yeah, I'm waiting to find out too.
Speaker 2 (37:34):
Yeah, you're glad you're not making that decision. Just a
word on the captains. What's the most important part of
being a captain from what you know from your experience
in their role. Primarily, what does a captain have to do?
Not just win the toss?
Speaker 3 (37:48):
I think first, like for a captain, first and foremost,
his performance has got to be to a high standard
and consistent, so that so that when when he does speak,
he doesn't have to speak much. But when when he
does speak, people listen because they see the work they
put in, the standards they hold themselves to, and and
(38:10):
that they're performing at the highest level, so I think
I think that's always got to come first, is the
place performance. So yeah, I think you're looking for someone
who can perform under pressure and can do it week
and week out, and that's and that's right from Monday
through to Sunday, every day of the week. They've got
(38:31):
to be consistent.
Speaker 2 (38:32):
And finally, Tahu and always a pleasure. Thanks very much
for joining us here on news Talk. There be pre
season tonight up against the Sharks. An explosive game. No Art, Yes,
unfortunately can a wee bit of an injury. But from
what you've seen so far, how do you like this
this new look Warrior's side. What do you smile about.
Speaker 3 (38:52):
I'm really excited, like obviously with the new combinations with
Fish coming in, excited to use the halves run out together.
But I think the thing that I want to see most,
I guess is guys like Jacob demitric Ali, those guys
who have had some any in our experience and they're
(39:16):
some of the most talented guys in the team. But
I want to see them take the next step because
I think if they can sort of perform week in
week out to their capabilities the whole team's performance is
just going to go up another level. So I'm excited
to see what they do. And they've had really good preseasons,
outstanding preseason, so hopefully they can take that out on
(39:39):
the field, take that form to the field.
Speaker 5 (39:41):
And on that.
Speaker 2 (39:42):
We'll let you get on with Seemi retirement. Looking forward
to hearing what your new role is and I'm sure
you are as well. It's that we can continue our chats.
Really appreciate your time, toll who thinks for that? Thanks,
it's seven minutes away from eight. That's to who Harris,
that's what happened, That's what's going to happen. And Yeah,
(40:03):
really excited about the younger guys, and I hope they
can provide a this news talk, TV and sports. It's
ten minutes away from apes because I already so good
(40:24):
or too far? Agave another issue sports talk for your entertainment.
I hope you've enjoyed it. Great to hear from Tahou Harris.
What a lot of lovely man, fearsome player. They're gonna
miss him, no doubt. He will still be floating around
(40:45):
Mounts Smart getting up to some no good or good.
Hopefully we can chat to them again and smell such
Thank you very much for producing the program, thanks to
the texts, thanks to the callers, and of course thanks
to all of those who took the time to listen
without your ears. There's no point in doing this. I'm
Darcy water Grave. Got a cracking weekend started off with
(41:07):
a bit of sport. Join me tomorrow the All Sport
Breakfast from seven to nine a m.
Speaker 3 (41:14):
Is.
Speaker 2 (41:14):
We're gonna hit the ground running of the flames at
our feet and prepare you for another epic weekend of sport.
This is News Talks ed b Marke slash up next.
Speaker 1 (41:36):
For more from Sports Talk. Listen live to News Talks
It'd be from seven pm weekdays, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to the Sports Talk podcast with Darcy Waldegrave
from News Talk ZEDB.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Good evening and welcome to Sports Talk. I'm Darcy order
Gave on a Friday night, seven minutes after seven. It
is seventh of February twenty twenty five. Coming up on
this evenings show myself yourself, a couple of guests in
the form of at Trevor mcewn, former CEO of the Warriors.
(00:59):
Former everything that guy has done so much I've even
lost count currently writes the Sports Inside of the Media,
Inside of the sport Thing Insider in New Zealand hero A.
We're going to talk about Caleb Clark in his decision
to not engage in Super Rugby Fantasy, which has just
been released today. What that says about the landscape, What
(01:24):
that says about players' ability to opt out of promotions.
It's getting thicker on the ground now, how long does
it last? And I think it should be praised. We'll
talk to Trevor about that, about the change in the
landscape of the situation that. We'll take your calls as
well on one hundred eighty ten eighty and then later
(01:46):
on in the piece, Oliver Yarn Tauhu Harris. He's the
epic Warriors former skipper that had to retire on medical grounds.
Speaker 3 (01:56):
He retired.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
What's he doing? What's he done? What happens next? We'll
find out all of that and more even to captain
see what the former captain himself, Paul Harris to join
us and I don't know about half an hour's time
as we have a yack. That's our plan. But before
we engage in our plan, what don't we try a
(02:21):
bit of this sport today and sport today we go again.
They want for a second in z based in ourl
team has spread from down South up to Auckland. Sent
to Fred Arkoy thinks Auckland can actually handle a second
in our old team one next to the already here
(02:44):
but hardly successful Warriors.
Speaker 4 (02:51):
Hmm.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
Seem to have a small issue there with the audio
not entirely sure why yeah, suffice to say Fred Akoy
thinks it's going to be fine because the population is
the population is good and it should be enough to
be able to cover off all the fun and games
(03:14):
with that.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Well.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
Sydney he reckons that they've got many, many, many NRL teams.
But the big issue here is that Sydney's flight five
and a half billion big, but Auckland isn't here we go.
Speaker 5 (03:28):
You look at Sydney, how many teams all in the
same city. I don't think it's a problem, and I
think it makes it even more exciting for Auckland is
that they have the ability to be supporting two teams.
Speaker 2 (03:42):
Yeah, population different story. Tom Walsh, the putter of shots,
is ready to roll again. He's looking toward the la
Olympics and.
Speaker 6 (03:51):
Further, I've got no doubt that my body can stand
up to the next four years of throwing and maybe
even longer if I still have a love for it.
So yeah, I'm definitely not done and my body is
in a real good spot to throw better.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
Even going forward. And he's returning competition this weekend and
Auckland after his Olympic groin injury. The AK leg of
the sail GP didn't go to plan for the locals.
But Blackfoil skipper Pete Berling isn't hitting the panic button.
Of course he wouldn't. Supercar't right.
Speaker 7 (04:22):
It definitely motivates us to keep pushing super hard. Yeah,
missing your home finals never never a fun thing, but
you know, to be honest, we we're pretty happy with
the damage limitation that the team managed to do on
that that Sunday to still get the fourth.
Speaker 2 (04:35):
And Sydney leg of sol GP stunts tomorrow. And Zoe
Sadowski Senate has carried on with a ridiculous couple of
weeks on her tray. She won gold again today in
the World Cup, adding to the big air gold, well
with the slopestyle gold that you're on Monday, and of
course last week's ex game slope style gold. Ridiculously. She
(04:57):
was pleased today with their scoring early after the conditions deteriorated. Yeah, definitely,
especially with the win.
Speaker 7 (05:05):
So yeah, to put those us too done, kind of
playing tactics almost but yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
And that's sport today twelve and it's after seven. Riva
mckewan to join us and now, writes Sports Insider for
New Zealand Herald, former CEO of the Warriors. As we
discuss Caleb Clark and three others, he's not alone deciding
to opt out of this Super Rugby Fantasy competition, which
(05:34):
was launched today. It presents a number of questions around
the rights, the IP rights of athletes now and in
the future, the control they have or haven't got Trevor
joins us. Now, good evening, Good evening, I'm very good.
Interesting tale today coming out in the heir with a
(05:55):
launch of Super Rugby Fantasy, something that's been I think
a long time coming. It's turned up. We all jumped
on our computers and I say we all, I mean
you know me and to try and find our best team.
No Caleb Clark. And it turns out Caleb Clark and
three other players have chosen to opt out of being
(06:16):
in Super Rugby Fantasy, which strikes me is odd. But
the more I think about it, the more I think, well,
players choice in this day and age. Look, you've been
a CEO. You look what haven't you done. I can't
even start with this, but Tresa, this whole thing about
players IP players engaging in various competitions, especially ones that
(06:37):
are linked to gambling or fast food or alcohol or banks.
In Sunny Bill's case, this is a very difficult and
forever changing space, isn't it?
Speaker 4 (06:50):
It is and it can be quite complex to Darcy.
I mean, for the benefit of your listeners, what ordinarily happens,
and pretty much professional sport around the world and these
types of competitions like Super Rugby, NFL, NBA, you name it. Effectively,
you have a merging of what could be described as
(07:14):
property rights the player themselves. So in this case, say
Caleb Clark, owns their own individual likeness in terms of
who they are. And the way that these commercial contracts
work is that the player agrees to hand over his
individual likeness or her individual likeness IP if you like.
That's being combined with the sports bodies IP in this case,
(07:37):
the super right, it's the it's the Super rugby competition,
name the logos, the colors, the teams, all those types
of things. The merger of those two properties is what
creates the value for a sponsor, whether it's a betting company,
fast food company, whatever it might be. And that's generally
being the model what we've seen in recent years. And
(08:00):
the other people may have a view that this is
a good development. The view it's the negative development. But
what we are seeing, and probably sunny Bill started it
when you mentioned him earlier. Some of your listeners may
recall that sunny Bill would not wear the B and
Z logo on his Blues uniform playing uniform when he
was when he was playing at the Blues and that
(08:21):
was because he objected to the banking system effectively. Now whether.
Speaker 6 (08:30):
You know a.
Speaker 4 (08:30):
Precident was created then or not to move point, but
obviously he was given permission to opt out of that. Now,
I think this on the face of it, without knowing
not having spoken to neither was having spoken to Caleb
Clark or anything like that, It would seem that this
appears to be, along with the other players perhaps are
almost a conscientious objective objection to you know, I guess
(08:56):
you can call fantasy games gambling, and some people have
a strong view about about sports betting and things like that.
So it would seem that these players have said, look,
we don't really want to be a part of this
because with our personal values. Now at that point, the
sports body probably has two choices. They can either enforce
(09:18):
it and say, well, you signed a contract and hand
it over your likeness to us, you have to do this,
or as increasingly the point that with athletes gaining greater
power and greater autonomy, they've simply said, look, okay, that's reasonable,
will exempt you from this. And I think given that
(09:39):
I don't know Caleb myself from Darcy, but I know
he's a committed church goer, his dad or Ronnie has
been a committed Christian whole life. I would, without trying
to jump a shadow, suggest that it is probably an
objection to betting, and probably my personal point of view
(09:59):
far enough. I'm not a scam on myself. I'm not
against it, but I've just sent the past month in
Australia Darty and you cannot turn on any sport on
TV here without being inundated with sporting odds, and if
you're not interested it gets a bit grating. So you know,
maybe that's where Caleb Clark is at.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
It's a movable feast, isn't it, Because then you sign
over your your rights, your r IP if you will,
You're not to know what's coming up in the future.
And things happened so fast in this day and age
where the player is even aware that this concept of
fantasy rugby was going to be presented to them, they
(10:41):
got an opportunity to opt out. Plainly they did, because
you don't know what's coming up in the future, So
it doesn't it have to be a constant negotiation process.
Speaker 4 (10:50):
Well, it seems to be moving towards that. Whereas I
would say, if you wound the clock back perhaps five years,
you would probably have more bullish administrators saying, don't care.
You know you signed over your rights to ask you
getting paid X amount per year. It's not just a
playing the sport or rugby in this case, you've also
we also need you to front up the sponsor promotions
(11:11):
and we can't have you picking and choosing. That I
think was the viewpoint, but it's now changing and I
think correctly that the players are having more say on
you know, whatever it might be, but it is it
is a bit of a Pandora's box that we're opening here, Darcy,
because you know people can object to fast food, so
(11:32):
you know, I don't want to be part of KFC.
Have been a long time sponsor of Super Rugby. Does
that mean okay, I'm not available for any KFC ads
A funny bill with banking. I mean, I think just
about you could go almost through every player and find
at least one particular hot button that they are uncomfortable with.
(11:52):
So it's a matter here. I think you know, whether
whether it's been a Blues decision you can opt out,
whether it's been a Super a New Zealand Rugby decision,
because they hold the contracts or whether it's been a
Super Rugby competition thing. I don't know. I mean, if
an Australian feels the same Australian player feels the same way,
are they able to have opt out of it too.
I haven't seen any headlines about that over here. Well
(12:15):
I've been here the past month. But it's a very
complicated subject. You know, some people will be saying, you know,
what's what's on about? It's just a fantasy competition. But
you know some people have strong views starting and they
have the view that, you know, you start in fantasy competitions,
you end up spending money gambling, and we know that,
(12:36):
you know, the Christian faith has a strong viewpoint on that.
And again, as I mentioned, Caleb again not trying to
jump the shadow would appear to have to object to
to what this gain is about and what it might
lead to, and that's that's his prerogative. I think equally,
it's potentially the sports bodies prerogative to say, well there
(12:57):
has to be an impact for that, because you can't
top you, you can't just choose like that. But whether
that will ever be made public, I don't know, but yeah,
I think they possibly could have plug put of it too, Darcy.
I mean you've they've got people inquisitive, people like you
saying what's going on here? Listener? Is probably the same
thing I wanted to put Caleb Clark and my team.
(13:20):
He would have earned me a lot of points. Why
is he not there? Probably the competition, oh the fans
and explanation on this one, Well.
Speaker 2 (13:28):
It's been said by Super Rugby Pacific that we're delighted,
we're thrilled. They said that so many players have opted in,
so plainly you can opt in or choose to opt
out four players and said no, we don't want to
do it. So yeah, front footing would have been a
nice idea, but they've gone. But I suppose the bigger
thing here for me, Trevor is we're joined by trivia
(13:51):
McEuen media inside a former Warriors CEO, and the list
goes on and on. We haven't got enough time to
do it, but Trevor, the tab. I can go down
to the tab tomorrow and I bought money on Caleb
Clark to be the first try scorer in the first
Super Ugord begain to the Blues and there's nothing he
can do about it. That's a bit off kilter, isn't it.
How's that solved?
Speaker 4 (14:13):
Yes, that's the complication around this particular issue and regarding betting.
It's what does make the betting companies a little bit
different from your fast food sponsor, your jersey sponsor, your
bank or whatever, is that there is another layer to it,
and let's face it, Darcy is a very profitable layer.
(14:34):
As we know. If you're a national sporting organization in
New Zealand and Darcy goes down to the TA B
tomorrow and puts a bet on on, say the All Blacks,
the New Zealand reupt union gets a cut of that,
and it can they can stack up to be quite
substantial numbers at one stage with the because the New
(14:54):
Zealand Basketball gets all in betting on NBA games, they
get a cut of that. At one stage that was
their biggest revenue stream. They made more money out of
betting on the NBA than anything else they did. So
for some sports it's it's a lifeline. So I would
suspect that some of them will be quite nervous about
(15:15):
this development. As you say, it clearly is an opt in,
opt out decision. Whether we're only ever going to see
you know a handful of players objecting or whether this
is something that might grow in its in its scope
and its numbers. Is it's going to be interesting to watch,
but so also it's going to be the attitude of
(15:38):
the sports bodies. But you are correct in the sense
that Caleb Clark can't stop anybody going down and putting
a bed on him to be first try square.
Speaker 2 (15:45):
I suppose he's controlling his controllables and for that I'll
applaud him and I'm sure most people will as well.
Hey Trevor, thanks so much for your time. As to McEwan,
now we're out, we got to go. Look forward to
catching up sooner rather than later.
Speaker 5 (15:59):
Look after yourself, absolutely, Darty.
Speaker 1 (16:05):
We've got the break down on Sports Talk callight hundred,
News Talk.
Speaker 2 (16:13):
Seven twenty three, Sports Talk here on News Talk ZB
seventh and twenty twenty five. Trevor mckew And he's not
the media insider got carried away. That's that's Shane Curry.
He's a sports insider. There's a lot of pieces in
New Zealand Herald around what's going on at the ins
and the outs and the ups and the downs and
the vagaries of sports. That's why I called him about
(16:35):
the subject. I'm fascinated that somebody who would object to
being in a fantasy game, or in Sunny Bill's case,
back in the game, object to having his image attached
to that of Banks. There's a lot of people who
(16:58):
are and we don't know the specific cases. With Caleb Clark,
he's not said that. He just said it's a personal
decision and maybe more will leak out. So as Trevor
was saying, we don't want to eat too much on him.
But when you look at a decision and people are
against gaming, they don't want to do it, well, doesn't
(17:20):
matter because we can go to the taarbe tomorrow and
bet on them. It looks like moving into the future,
athletes are going to have more and more control over
their IP as they realize they're bigger and bigger in
the game and the game won't survive without them. But
there is a tipping point there cart horse Tail Dog,
(17:50):
and there comes a stage in an athlete's life where
they do become bigger than the game and they can
make those calls. But it's a delicate decision from the
organizations that administer the sports to hands too much control
troll over to the athletes. Because the athletes come and
the athletes go, the sport will stay long beyond their
(18:14):
shelf life. Personally, I admire Caleb Clark they sticking to
us guns whatever guns they were, and the other three
players and said, look, you know, thanks, but no things.
I don't want a part of this. So good on
them because it's their name, it's their likeness. But you
(18:40):
may completely disagree with that because the other side says, wow,
you're signed on the line, you're get and paid big money.
If your pay master says jump, you say how high?
And that's when I talk about the balance. Where do
you sit on this? Around players having control of their
(19:03):
own image, players who object to something out of a
family belief, a personal belief, something that doesn't sit comfortably
with them as a human saying no, you cannot use me,
you can't use my face, you can't use my name.
Where do you stand on that? I'd say, all control
(19:26):
to the athletes, but with the asterisk if they get
too much control who runs the game, and that to
me is alarming. You can't let the athletes run it
all right? Our eight hundred eighty ten eighty love your
thoughts on this. I don't think there is a line anywhere,
and I think it develops and it evolves as time
(19:49):
goes on. And you've got to be very fleet footed
to be able to work these issues through as they arise.
And that's the players and the agents and the organizations themselves.
Tricky times. Twenty seven minutes after seven, look on that
news talk.
Speaker 3 (20:07):
Z B.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
Taho Harris joins the program retiring Warriors skipper a medical retirement.
The what's the wise, the hows, the wears, it's all
coming out. When to who joins us?
Speaker 6 (20:21):
Here?
Speaker 2 (20:22):
On news Talks Eb. Seven, twenty seven. They sell flowers. Ah,
here's a bit of advice. I'm a flower buyer of wayback.
I love to buy flowers. Years and years and years
and years ago I was told by a woman never
buy flowers to apologize for something, because that casts a
(20:47):
shadow over the beauty of flowers. And if someone turns
up with flowers on the doorstep, you immediately think what
have you done now? And it takes away you cannot
un what's the word, You can't unsee flowers that don't
come from a place of love. So right from that moment,
(21:09):
I never ever ever bought flowers as an apology. Only
buy flowers as a there's a mark of love and
respect and joy right anyway, just to I share it
with you after hearing that song, and trust me it works.
And how the naughty boys that they going? What am
I supposed to buy?
Speaker 3 (21:28):
Then?
Speaker 5 (21:28):
Was?
Speaker 4 (21:28):
I know?
Speaker 2 (21:29):
Try not being bad? Seven point thirty one. Let's gid
the phones now, players who issue their rights or their
their capability of organizations to use their IP saying no,
that doesn't stand for what I stand for. You can't
do it. Is this good? It's bad? It's some different.
(21:50):
I'd love your thoughts, so eight hundred and eighty ten
eighty Hello Tony.
Speaker 8 (21:54):
Okay mate, I'm going back to the flowers and things.
It is Valentine's Day coming up, you know, well Valentine's lay.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
It's okay, I mean, that's their one outlie. But really
you wander up with flowers, and if you're always buying
them when you make mistake, what does that say about flowers?
Speaker 3 (22:08):
Right?
Speaker 2 (22:08):
It's just a fairy. I was just sharing.
Speaker 8 (22:11):
Can I give you some advice, Darcy? Yeah, flowers, fresh
flowers on the first time are beautiful. They always smell nice,
they look good, They make you look good as well.
Speaker 2 (22:25):
I'm an habitual flower by it, by flowers and give
them to strangers in the street because I think they're
so joyous. Anyway, let's move on to the subject at hand,
because some of the listeners a game. It's the sports,
so I want to talk about floral arrangements.
Speaker 8 (22:38):
Yeah, but you brought it up.
Speaker 4 (22:39):
My man.
Speaker 2 (22:40):
I know, I know, I know.
Speaker 8 (22:41):
All right, moving forward, right, all right, all right, that's cool,
that's cool. Can we can we just saw right quickly?
Just just a quick note. What do you think about
Adazonia and his last I know you've probably done that,
but what I haven't heard it. What do you think?
Speaker 2 (22:54):
Look, the first round was fantastic, he looked really really good.
I thought, well, here was one for the ages. And
then he got punched in the face and all finished
and he took an absolute cracker of a stripe from memory,
it was a right hand. It just flushed him and
turned him right around. He possibly should have spent longer
after the ipoke to recover. I don't know if that
(23:15):
was a good move to come back as quick as he.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
Did, but he did.
Speaker 8 (23:20):
Okay well in Parker coming up soon? Do you reckon
he's going to do it.
Speaker 2 (23:25):
Yeah, I do the difference in me.
Speaker 8 (23:27):
You've always been a fan of Parker.
Speaker 2 (23:29):
I am a fan of Parker. I've known him for
a very long time. I met him when he first
came out to this years and years ago. But I
think what we've seen Tony in the development of Joe,
since he's had this new trainer, new nutritionist on board,
we've seen a very different shaped Parker. We've seen a
very measured Joe Parker and one who's the ability to
(23:51):
stick to a fight plan and see that plan through
to the end. This is a much more pure, smarter boxer,
and I like what I've seen from him. I think
he's showing great control. I'd do Boi as an absolute weapon,
but I think he might be a bit Frank Bruno,
like big old heavy arms, take a long Frank Bruno.
(24:12):
I'm just saying because of the weight of the arms
of Frank Bruno, I mean, after about the six or
seventh round, he couldn't hold the bloody things up. He could?
Speaker 8 (24:20):
He could? He could? He could anyway anyway. Anyway, Okay,
So back to so the whole sorted to segue. Because
I love boxing, is my main passion. But when you
mentioned about the players not having control about things, I
thought about John Lowan and his his his beautiful wife
and the kids, and how they sometimes have a adverse
(24:44):
reaction to the way things go for them, and the
Lowo name. And what I just thought, is that something
you've considered when when the conversation came into tonight, No.
Speaker 2 (24:54):
When you saw that, I thought absolutely, Because this is
an argument that's been developing, and I think it's been
gaining pace over the last few years, and it needs
to be addressed. Where are your rights? Do you have any?
Do you sign them more the way? Should you be
expected to sign them the way? Does it actually make
a palpable difference to your life whether you do it
or not, Because there are some things out of your control,
(25:14):
and one of them can.
Speaker 8 (25:15):
Worms can worms to us. Because if we can go
back to boxing again, we can look at cases like
David tour who had that Parkery situation. You remember the one, well,
I remember the one We'll do it in Parkery.
Speaker 2 (25:30):
No, No, I don't, all right, beat So I thought
you talking about an opponent.
Speaker 8 (25:35):
Was no, no, no, sorry, So just because this relates
to it, because it's it's important because there was some
sculptagerie with management and the handling of his affairs and
the handling of his money, and like it can go
deep when you start bringing up things like this. But
I think the essential is you need good management if
(25:56):
you're going to be a top athlete. Is it would
that be fair?
Speaker 2 (26:00):
Yeah? Absolutely? And there are a number of agencies around
that are trusted and respected and you've got to give
faith because it's as you said, it's can of worms.
It's a Bob White mess inside of glass canister.
Speaker 8 (26:12):
It's it doesn't have to be d I mean you
said you said there are good teams. I mean in
New Zealand? Are there? Because since you're we are in
New Zealand and yours, this is the subject you bring up.
Are they good management teams in New Zealand?
Speaker 5 (26:27):
A yeah.
Speaker 2 (26:28):
I think that Halo Management do a fantastic job. And
they've got former athletes that work with them and for
them as player agents. You've got Bruce Sharrick and Craig
Innis hugely respected, I mean around for thirty something odd
years and they've got the trust in the ear of
(26:48):
athletes and of major associations. I suppose you've got to
look at the smaller ones that fly by nights and go,
what what have you got? Where can I build that trust?
Because athletes is all about.
Speaker 8 (27:01):
Interrupt they probably said, stay in there laying those those
the new ones. I mean, you've named some very top companies,
which which is nice, which is name dropping, but the
whole subject. I think what what I read into what
you were saying originally is that you need good management
and you need to have some skills if if you're
(27:23):
not I'm I read wrong, but if you're not going
to be a top athlete, have something backing, some backing,
maybe some education, maybe some degrees or something like that.
But if you haven't, you could get taken advantage of
quite easily. Have I read that right way?
Speaker 2 (27:38):
And that's exactly what's happened, especially in fight sports. You
used to happen all the time. Yeah, the amount of fighters
that suddenly turn around they've got nothing, and they've made
millions and millions of dollars.
Speaker 8 (27:48):
I've seen it many times. I see my time. Yeah. Yeah,
And where we go with the conversations and are going
to We're.
Speaker 2 (27:56):
Going to wind the conversation up because we're running out
of time. Tony and I've got a tall who Harris
to interview shortly, so Tony, thanks for muchling, Thank you
very much, interesting conversations. What I love about this program,
I Darcy, it to be nothing to do with gambling.
It'd be more to do with his religion and using
(28:17):
his image, something like that. I've got a Christian made
wouldn't let his kids watch Harry Potter because their demons
in it, And that could very well be it. But
the bigger question here is that if and we don't
know what the decision was, but surely gambling is the
root of a lot of evil and a lot of
(28:38):
issues for people. Yet as a player, you can be
gambling on the tab can you actually control that? Is
that right and just? And I'll leave you this one here, Tanaka,
please Darcy, SERGEI give the kupoo out about the running
of the sixty nine Grand Prix Thista, wishing the driver's
(29:02):
speed and safety to make you, Sir a nakiat Noah,
yours sincerely, my tew years on. It's at the Beautiful
Highlands Park. It's on Sunday. It's one of the only
races that can be called a Grand Prix outside of
Formula One. That in macaw is. It's been around so
long as the final round of the five round Castro
(29:24):
Tour to Formula Regional Oceania Championship, and we will have
Nikita Johnson, the second place run of the American on
the show on the All Sports Breakfast tomorrow to talk
about it. Thanks for your request, Mathu, you look after
yourself to have to for three Sports talk here on
(29:52):
New Stalks there b on a Friday night. I'm Darcy Autograph.
Thanks for joining us. Let's have a yarn with Tahou Harris,
former Warriors skipper, former key we epic character, amazing player
has had to pull the pin on his career. It
(30:15):
gurns us now to talk about why, how and what next?
Good evening to who made?
Speaker 3 (30:24):
How's it going?
Speaker 2 (30:24):
That's going very very well? I suppose the big questions
how's it going with you? You had to retire from the
game that you love with repeated injuries. Now you sat down,
you're not doing pre season. That's got to be of
a relief, surely.
Speaker 3 (30:38):
Well, yeah, my rest is certainly appreciating it and being
able to spend this time with the family has been
really nice. It's yeah, the club have been amazing. They've
allowed me the time to spend with family and before
any commitments they need you to do.
Speaker 2 (30:58):
So what is your relationship now with the club? You're
plainly not playing. Are you still under contract? You still
have a role within the Warriors.
Speaker 3 (31:06):
Yes, I'm still under contract for this year. As part
of the medical retirement, I've I'm still contracted for this
year and obligated to to fill any obligations that are
needed from the club. So yeah, just waiting to see
how that looks. But you know, they've been amazing. They've
(31:29):
allowed me the time to sort of get settled, spend
time with family before the I guess the busy part
of the year starts.
Speaker 2 (31:38):
So in that role, you have a rough idea about
what you would actually like to achieve and put back
to the club. We know how much you love the
worries and being involved. Thoughts around what how you must
be what might be best utilized Tom.
Speaker 3 (31:52):
No, I've got no idea, to be honest. That's up
to like cam and Webbe to figure out. I think
there's a Yeah, there's probably a balance that they need
to figure out on how to sort of integrate me
in whatever area. So yeah, just waiting to hear from them,
but making them most of the time that I do
(32:12):
have with family, which.
Speaker 2 (32:14):
Is very different from normal pre seasons too. The family
must be scratching the head, going who is this old
guy with a beard? What's he doing at our house?
Speaker 3 (32:22):
Yeah, it's very different this time of the year. Obviously,
with the game being today, I would have been away.
So yeah, it's very different to what we're used to do.
But I'm really enjoying it, and my body is appreciating it,
my rest is appreciating it. So yeah, it's still going
to be an adjustment, but it's you know, it's I
(32:43):
guess because it all happened a while ago now that
we've come to terms with it and now we're sort
of just making the most of the time I have
with them.
Speaker 2 (32:52):
Before you made that call, how many people who did
you talk to around actually committing to retirement, because I'd
suggest it would have been an extraordinarily difficult thing to do.
Speaker 3 (33:04):
Well, it's it's a bit different to sort of retiring normally.
So this sort of got taken out of my hands
a little bit because it's a medical retirement. It was
through the doctor and he deemed it. I guess a
detriment to my health in the long term if I
(33:25):
continue to play and continue to try and manage my
way through the pain and through games. It was a
bit too risky for my long term health in terms
of my rest. So yeah, so that the decision sort
of got taken out of my hands. And so yeah,
it wasn't a situation where sort of talking to a
whole lot of people, getting their opinions and on a
(33:48):
decision I had to make. It. It was a decision
that was wasn't mine.
Speaker 2 (33:53):
How did that come about? Did you sit down with
a doctor at the end of the season saying this
is still hurting, or do they come to you and go,
we think we might better medically retire you. How did
that process evolve?
Speaker 3 (34:05):
Well, that that happened pretty fast. So we had surgery
in the middle of last year and with the full
intent of making full recovery and playing the season, playing
a few more seasons beyond this year, and so came
back to preseason training and the rest of my body.
I was feeling really fit and strong, and it was
(34:27):
just trying to manage this rest daily and trying to
get through each and every day, and it just wasn't
recovering how we were hoping, and that sort of eventually
led to and this is during constant communication with the
medical staff on how it's going, how we can sort
of strengthen it, all those different things, and it all
(34:49):
came to a head around the Christmas break where, yeah,
the dock, the season was coming up very fast and
it wasn't a position that I guess the doc seemed
it's safe for me to try and play live games
with it and continue to push it out training to
try and get it right.
Speaker 2 (35:11):
You said you've had time to come to peace with
the decision that was pushed on you to retire. You
get your entire life at Hidio. Now I told who
I'm presuming you would have thought a little bit about it.
You've got commitments this year to the Warriors, but beyond that,
a man who's been involved. Gee, I remember when you
first got picked for the key is at the expense
of sunny Bill Williams and he came back and you
(35:34):
were out. You've been doing this a long long time,
So to consider your future, what else is Tool Harris
capable of doing? What next? What are you going to do?
Speaker 3 (35:44):
Well, that's that's sort of because I'm contracted this year
and I've got commitments with the club, but I've still
still got quite a bit of time to figure that out.
So yeah, it's all sort of constantly communicating with my
wife and trying to figure that out and how that
how that could look. But yeah, first foremost I've got
(36:05):
to make sure my family's right and that I'm fulfilling
those my commitments to the club and whatever they need.
So it's still waiting to hear how that looks.
Speaker 2 (36:16):
Like a complete professional. So who's going to be the
new captain?
Speaker 3 (36:19):
Tell who?
Speaker 2 (36:19):
No one's going to tell us. You've got a rough fight.
Who do you like? Who do you think's got the
ear of the players? And what's the most important thing
for the new captain? What's the biggest consideration do you think?
Speaker 3 (36:31):
To be honest, I've got no idea who it's going
to be. But like the club's in an outstanding position,
they've got a number of different options and it's I
guess it all comes down to what where we think
the team needs. You've got Roger Dare who has captained
the club and he leads by example, but whether he
wants the job or no, I'm not sure, But then
(36:52):
you've got guys like Fish coming in who's led his country,
who's had the highest, the most amount of success someone
can have in this in this profession. You know Mitch
Barnett who led team for the second half of last year,
and and you've got a wealth of experience through there
like Dylan Walker, Kirk Cape, well all these all these
(37:16):
guys like they've got a number of different options. Yeah,
it all comes down to what webe thinks the team needs.
And yeah, so that's that's sort of above my pay
grade anyway. So yeah, I'm waiting to find out too.
Speaker 2 (37:34):
Yeah, you're glad you're not making that decision. Just a
word on the captains. What's the most important part of
being a captain from what you know from your experience
in their role. Primarily, what does a captain have to do?
Not just win the toss?
Speaker 3 (37:48):
I think first, like for a captain, first and foremost,
his performance has got to be to a high standard
and consistent, so that so that when when he does speak,
he doesn't have to speak much. But when when he
does speak, people listen because they see the work they
put in, the standards they hold themselves to, and and
(38:10):
that they're performing at the highest level, so I think
I think that's always got to come first, is the
place performance. So yeah, I think you're looking for someone
who can perform under pressure and can do it week
and week out, and that's and that's right from Monday
through to Sunday, every day of the week. They've got
(38:31):
to be consistent.
Speaker 2 (38:32):
And finally, Tahu and always a pleasure. Thanks very much
for joining us here on news Talk. There be pre
season tonight up against the Sharks. An explosive game. No Art, Yes,
unfortunately can a wee bit of an injury. But from
what you've seen so far, how do you like this
this new look Warrior's side. What do you smile about.
Speaker 3 (38:52):
I'm really excited, like obviously with the new combinations with
Fish coming in, excited to use the halves run out together.
But I think the thing that I want to see most,
I guess is guys like Jacob demitric Ali, those guys
who have had some any in our experience and they're
(39:16):
some of the most talented guys in the team. But
I want to see them take the next step because
I think if they can sort of perform week in
week out to their capabilities the whole team's performance is
just going to go up another level. So I'm excited
to see what they do. And they've had really good preseasons,
outstanding preseason, so hopefully they can take that out on
(39:39):
the field, take that form to the field.
Speaker 5 (39:41):
And on that.
Speaker 2 (39:42):
We'll let you get on with Seemi retirement. Looking forward
to hearing what your new role is and I'm sure
you are as well. It's that we can continue our chats.
Really appreciate your time, toll who thinks for that? Thanks,
it's seven minutes away from eight. That's to who Harris,
that's what happened, That's what's going to happen. And Yeah,
(40:03):
really excited about the younger guys, and I hope they
can provide a this news talk, TV and sports. It's
ten minutes away from apes because I already so good
(40:24):
or too far? Agave another issue sports talk for your entertainment.
I hope you've enjoyed it. Great to hear from Tahou Harris.
What a lot of lovely man, fearsome player. They're gonna
miss him, no doubt. He will still be floating around
(40:45):
Mounts Smart getting up to some no good or good.
Hopefully we can chat to them again and smell such
Thank you very much for producing the program, thanks to
the texts, thanks to the callers, and of course thanks
to all of those who took the time to listen
without your ears. There's no point in doing this. I'm
Darcy water Grave. Got a cracking weekend started off with
(41:07):
a bit of sport. Join me tomorrow the All Sport
Breakfast from seven to nine a m.
Speaker 3 (41:14):
Is.
Speaker 2 (41:14):
We're gonna hit the ground running of the flames at
our feet and prepare you for another epic weekend of sport.
This is News Talks ed b Marke slash up next.
Speaker 1 (41:36):
For more from Sports Talk. Listen live to News Talks
It'd be from seven pm weekdays, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio.
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