February 13, 2025 • 7 mins
Former Blackcaps Coach Mike Hesson joined D'Arcy Waldegrave to discuss the Blackcaps upcoming tri-series final against Pakistan.
LISTEN ABOVE
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Sports Talk podcast with Darcy Waldegrave
from news Talk zed BE eight.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Marcus Lash marks last night's coming up after the news
package at eight o'clock.
Speaker 3 (00:16):
From now till then, though, we'll talk about of cricket.
Former black Caps head.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Coach Mike Kessen joins us now as we look toward
the final of the Trice Series.
Speaker 3 (00:25):
As Pakistan take on New Zealand. Mike's with us now.
Welcome mate, Yeah, good evening, Darcy. How are you.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
I'm very good looking forward to the champions Trophy and
as a bit of a plates holder, we've got the
final of that tri series coming up tomorrow night as
the black Caps take on yet again Pakistan. It's going
to be a repeat dose when they turn up over
here as well. And after what Pakistan did with South
Africa yesterday, it.
Speaker 3 (00:54):
Could be a run fest. It was seven hundred plus
runs mate, in forty nine overs.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (00:59):
I mean, you know, having spent a lot of time
in Pakistan over there last sort of twelve months or so,
the wickets are flat January February when they're at their
flattest because they're all fresh. So I would expect the
whole world of the Champions Trophy or particularly the match
is held in Pakistan will be high scoring.
Speaker 3 (01:16):
No doubt about that.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
So this is not a slur on the bowling attacks
of any side we've seen so far. They're just very
flat decks that that's good to know. How do you
combat that with the ball?
Speaker 4 (01:28):
Well, you've got to take wickets and you've got to
find ways of taking wickets. So I mean they're, you know,
t twenty games sides are making two fifty over there,
so you know you would expect well over three hundred.
And as I said, if you don't take wickets, it's
very hard to defend. So yeah, you've got to try
and swing the ball up front, and from a spin
bowling point of view, it's all about changing angles and
(01:50):
trying to set some funky fields to create some wicket
taking opportunities. Otherwise, Yeah, it can be pretty tough to contain.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
It sounds custom made for the new skipper, Mitch Santner.
He's got a tricky mind when it comes to setting
fields and we know what he can do with the ball.
Speaker 3 (02:07):
A lot on him to lead from the front, Yeah,
without doubt.
Speaker 4 (02:10):
I mean he has you know he has with white
ball for years now for New Zealand, so there's no
I don't expect it will be any different, you know
between Mitch and Michael Bracehoo, who's you know, got better
and better with the ball over the last you know,
since he's come back from injury. They'll be asked to
do a big role and I'm sure it will be
about containing but as I said, it will be about
trying to take those middle over wickets. It can't all
(02:32):
be relied on Matt Henry just to do it up front,
so you know, the spinners and the likes of overall
and seers are going to have to play their part
as well.
Speaker 2 (02:40):
Looked pretty fearsome when I saw him first up he
went for a couple, but he looked again like he's
got that inherent aggression and that late steeple bounce as well.
Difficult enough on these decks or he's just serving things
up on a plate.
Speaker 4 (02:56):
I think Karachi in particular, it can be quite steep bounce,
so I mean that will be He'll be really useful there.
I mean once again that game against Pakistan. You know
Pakistan players dote you really like the steep bounce, so
I think.
Speaker 3 (03:08):
O'Rourke will certainly have a role to play there.
Speaker 4 (03:11):
Obviously, the South Africans are a little bit more used
to playing that, and even Bretski talked about how challenging
O'Rourke was in the previous match. So yeah, I think
O'Rourke will play a big role, as I said, particularly
against the subcontinent sides, which is actually the whole of
the Champions Trophy. You know, paul A is New Zealand
and three subcontinent teams, so he will play a big role.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
Yeah. I was going to mention that that seems slightly loaded,
doesn't it. But I suppose if you've got to win
the Champions Trophy and the beauty of an understandable format
like this, you just got to keep winning, don't you.
Speaker 3 (03:44):
Yeah, look you do.
Speaker 4 (03:45):
I mean the first game against Pakistan in Karachi, which is,
you know, funnily enough, a repeat to the final here
is pretty much going to dictate New Zealand's future.
Speaker 3 (03:54):
Really.
Speaker 4 (03:55):
I mean they should be they should be Bangladesh and
Raa Pindi and a run fest up there against India
in Dubai will be a challenge, not as much of
a challenge as it was, you know, without bomb Rabie there,
but but a challenge, no doubt, you know, so that
one game against Pakistan will be critical. Yeah, I think
we pretty much know whether we're going to be involved
(04:16):
in the semi finals after that match.
Speaker 3 (04:18):
I would suggest what happens with Tom Latham.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
He's under the pump right now, consecutive ducks, three on
the bounce so far he's got the gloves.
Speaker 3 (04:27):
I doubt I'll give it to Conway or Phillips. How
long does he last? What would you do in.
Speaker 2 (04:33):
This situation with the lack of form he finds himself.
Speaker 4 (04:37):
Look, I mean betting in the middle over is an ODI.
Cricket is challenging and can happen at any stage. I
mean Tom's you know, three ducks in a row, he'll
be here.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
We got it.
Speaker 4 (04:45):
He's got out three different ways. So it's not like
as a there's a pattern to his dismissals. And he's
one of our better players of spin. So it's not
like we've got another.
Speaker 3 (04:54):
Middle order player ready to take over.
Speaker 4 (04:57):
I mean Chapman potentially, but you know Conway is you know,
is a is a push as a keeper in T
twenty cricket let alone, thinking he's going to do it
in Odie Ice. So Tom Nathan will be there for
the rest of the Champions Trophy and rightfully so. And
I think he's still you know, if New Zealand are
going to win the Champions Trophy, Tom's going to have
to do a great job through the middle against spin.
Speaker 3 (05:18):
So yeah, I.
Speaker 4 (05:20):
Wouldn't be too worried about it at the moment. Obviously
it's a chance to review it again. At the end
of the Champions Trophy.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
It looked a characters like Glenn Phillips, a lot of
pressure on him. I suppose to tweaker we but to
assault the leather with his willow.
Speaker 3 (05:34):
He's in form right now? Is the time right, do
you think for him?
Speaker 2 (05:37):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (05:37):
Look, I think so.
Speaker 4 (05:38):
I mean he hadn't scored an eight eight hundred before
this tournament. You know, he scored fifty runs in the
last four overs himself, so we know that he can
be destructive. And New Zealand has always, you know, been
searching for that that real finisher that you know, the
likes of the West and he's often have you know,
players that can be really destructive in the last five
(05:59):
to ten overs and between Michael Brace will you know
Satner and Glenn Phillips.
Speaker 3 (06:04):
You've got three players there who can take.
Speaker 4 (06:06):
The game by the scruff of the neck. So and
Phillips is certainly the most dominant of those. But look,
he's in great touch. He looked confident and took down
Shahenshaha Fredi for twenty five in the last over, which
is is a pretty tough feat. So clearly he's pretty
confident in his own game.
Speaker 2 (06:22):
And as far as the Bottoing line up, Mike Keessing
goes and we'll let you go shortly. You're happy enough
with the attack, they're going to have him mention the
spinners and how key is going to be for the
you've got a rot, You've got Henry ben Sears comfortable
enough with that?
Speaker 4 (06:36):
Yeah, I don't think they've got any other options. I mean,
they picked ben Sears to be that middle over enforcer.
Speaker 3 (06:41):
He's he's perfect for that role. You know, he's got speed.
As long as he stays.
Speaker 4 (06:45):
On the park, he can create a bit of reverse
swinging if that's on offer, especially you know maybe in
a week to ten days time when there's a couple
of years wickets out there. He's a guy who can
you know, attack new batters with a bit of pace
and bowls a skiddy bouncer. So you know, I think
the attacks as good as it's got at the moment. Obviously,
(07:07):
with a couple of injuries heading into the tournament, that's
pretty much the three seamers they've gotten, and Phillip says,
your sixth bowler.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
There you go, dun and dusted. Looking forward to Friday night,
how no sleep. Saturday morning show is going to be awful, but.
Speaker 1 (07:20):
So be it.
Speaker 2 (07:20):
I'm an addict, as I'm sure you are as well.
Mike Heston forman is Helling coach. Thanks very much for
your time, Pleasure Darcy.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
For more from sports Talk, listen live to News Talks
it'd be from seven pm weekdays, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to the Sports Talk podcast with Darcy Waldegrave
from news Talk zed BE eight.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Marcus Lash marks last night's coming up after the news
package at eight o'clock.
Speaker 3 (00:16):
From now till then, though, we'll talk about of cricket.
Former black Caps head.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Coach Mike Kessen joins us now as we look toward
the final of the Trice Series.
Speaker 3 (00:25):
As Pakistan take on New Zealand. Mike's with us now.
Welcome mate, Yeah, good evening, Darcy. How are you.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
I'm very good looking forward to the champions Trophy and
as a bit of a plates holder, we've got the
final of that tri series coming up tomorrow night as
the black Caps take on yet again Pakistan. It's going
to be a repeat dose when they turn up over
here as well. And after what Pakistan did with South
Africa yesterday, it.
Speaker 3 (00:54):
Could be a run fest. It was seven hundred plus
runs mate, in forty nine overs.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (00:59):
I mean, you know, having spent a lot of time
in Pakistan over there last sort of twelve months or so,
the wickets are flat January February when they're at their
flattest because they're all fresh. So I would expect the
whole world of the Champions Trophy or particularly the match
is held in Pakistan will be high scoring.
Speaker 3 (01:16):
No doubt about that.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
So this is not a slur on the bowling attacks
of any side we've seen so far. They're just very
flat decks that that's good to know. How do you
combat that with the ball?
Speaker 4 (01:28):
Well, you've got to take wickets and you've got to
find ways of taking wickets. So I mean they're, you know,
t twenty games sides are making two fifty over there,
so you know you would expect well over three hundred.
And as I said, if you don't take wickets, it's
very hard to defend. So yeah, you've got to try
and swing the ball up front, and from a spin
bowling point of view, it's all about changing angles and
(01:50):
trying to set some funky fields to create some wicket
taking opportunities. Otherwise, Yeah, it can be pretty tough to contain.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
It sounds custom made for the new skipper, Mitch Santner.
He's got a tricky mind when it comes to setting
fields and we know what he can do with the ball.
Speaker 3 (02:07):
A lot on him to lead from the front, Yeah,
without doubt.
Speaker 4 (02:10):
I mean he has you know he has with white
ball for years now for New Zealand, so there's no
I don't expect it will be any different, you know
between Mitch and Michael Bracehoo, who's you know, got better
and better with the ball over the last you know,
since he's come back from injury. They'll be asked to
do a big role and I'm sure it will be
about containing but as I said, it will be about
trying to take those middle over wickets. It can't all
(02:32):
be relied on Matt Henry just to do it up front,
so you know, the spinners and the likes of overall
and seers are going to have to play their part
as well.
Speaker 2 (02:40):
Looked pretty fearsome when I saw him first up he
went for a couple, but he looked again like he's
got that inherent aggression and that late steeple bounce as well.
Difficult enough on these decks or he's just serving things
up on a plate.
Speaker 4 (02:56):
I think Karachi in particular, it can be quite steep bounce,
so I mean that will be He'll be really useful there.
I mean once again that game against Pakistan. You know
Pakistan players dote you really like the steep bounce, so
I think.
Speaker 3 (03:08):
O'Rourke will certainly have a role to play there.
Speaker 4 (03:11):
Obviously, the South Africans are a little bit more used
to playing that, and even Bretski talked about how challenging
O'Rourke was in the previous match. So yeah, I think
O'Rourke will play a big role, as I said, particularly
against the subcontinent sides, which is actually the whole of
the Champions Trophy. You know, paul A is New Zealand
and three subcontinent teams, so he will play a big role.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
Yeah. I was going to mention that that seems slightly loaded,
doesn't it. But I suppose if you've got to win
the Champions Trophy and the beauty of an understandable format
like this, you just got to keep winning, don't you.
Speaker 3 (03:44):
Yeah, look you do.
Speaker 4 (03:45):
I mean the first game against Pakistan in Karachi, which is,
you know, funnily enough, a repeat to the final here
is pretty much going to dictate New Zealand's future.
Speaker 3 (03:54):
Really.
Speaker 4 (03:55):
I mean they should be they should be Bangladesh and
Raa Pindi and a run fest up there against India
in Dubai will be a challenge, not as much of
a challenge as it was, you know, without bomb Rabie there,
but but a challenge, no doubt, you know, so that
one game against Pakistan will be critical. Yeah, I think
we pretty much know whether we're going to be involved
(04:16):
in the semi finals after that match.
Speaker 3 (04:18):
I would suggest what happens with Tom Latham.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
He's under the pump right now, consecutive ducks, three on
the bounce so far he's got the gloves.
Speaker 3 (04:27):
I doubt I'll give it to Conway or Phillips. How
long does he last? What would you do in.
Speaker 2 (04:33):
This situation with the lack of form he finds himself.
Speaker 4 (04:37):
Look, I mean betting in the middle over is an ODI.
Cricket is challenging and can happen at any stage. I
mean Tom's you know, three ducks in a row, he'll
be here.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
We got it.
Speaker 4 (04:45):
He's got out three different ways. So it's not like
as a there's a pattern to his dismissals. And he's
one of our better players of spin. So it's not
like we've got another.
Speaker 3 (04:54):
Middle order player ready to take over.
Speaker 4 (04:57):
I mean Chapman potentially, but you know Conway is you know,
is a is a push as a keeper in T
twenty cricket let alone, thinking he's going to do it
in Odie Ice. So Tom Nathan will be there for
the rest of the Champions Trophy and rightfully so. And
I think he's still you know, if New Zealand are
going to win the Champions Trophy, Tom's going to have
to do a great job through the middle against spin.
Speaker 3 (05:18):
So yeah, I.
Speaker 4 (05:20):
Wouldn't be too worried about it at the moment. Obviously
it's a chance to review it again. At the end
of the Champions Trophy.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
It looked a characters like Glenn Phillips, a lot of
pressure on him. I suppose to tweaker we but to
assault the leather with his willow.
Speaker 3 (05:34):
He's in form right now? Is the time right, do
you think for him?
Speaker 2 (05:37):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (05:37):
Look, I think so.
Speaker 4 (05:38):
I mean he hadn't scored an eight eight hundred before
this tournament. You know, he scored fifty runs in the
last four overs himself, so we know that he can
be destructive. And New Zealand has always, you know, been
searching for that that real finisher that you know, the
likes of the West and he's often have you know,
players that can be really destructive in the last five
(05:59):
to ten overs and between Michael Brace will you know
Satner and Glenn Phillips.
Speaker 3 (06:04):
You've got three players there who can take.
Speaker 4 (06:06):
The game by the scruff of the neck. So and
Phillips is certainly the most dominant of those. But look,
he's in great touch. He looked confident and took down
Shahenshaha Fredi for twenty five in the last over, which
is is a pretty tough feat. So clearly he's pretty
confident in his own game.
Speaker 2 (06:22):
And as far as the Bottoing line up, Mike Keessing
goes and we'll let you go shortly. You're happy enough
with the attack, they're going to have him mention the
spinners and how key is going to be for the
you've got a rot, You've got Henry ben Sears comfortable
enough with that?
Speaker 4 (06:36):
Yeah, I don't think they've got any other options. I mean,
they picked ben Sears to be that middle over enforcer.
Speaker 3 (06:41):
He's he's perfect for that role. You know, he's got speed.
As long as he stays.
Speaker 4 (06:45):
On the park, he can create a bit of reverse
swinging if that's on offer, especially you know maybe in
a week to ten days time when there's a couple
of years wickets out there. He's a guy who can
you know, attack new batters with a bit of pace
and bowls a skiddy bouncer. So you know, I think
the attacks as good as it's got at the moment. Obviously,
(07:07):
with a couple of injuries heading into the tournament, that's
pretty much the three seamers they've gotten, and Phillip says,
your sixth bowler.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
There you go, dun and dusted. Looking forward to Friday night,
how no sleep. Saturday morning show is going to be awful, but.
Speaker 1 (07:20):
So be it.
Speaker 2 (07:20):
I'm an addict, as I'm sure you are as well.
Mike Heston forman is Helling coach. Thanks very much for
your time, Pleasure Darcy.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
For more from sports Talk, listen live to News Talks
it'd be from seven pm weekdays, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio.
Popular Podcasts
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
The Bobby Bones Show
Listen to 'The Bobby Bones Show' by downloading the daily full replay.
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.