Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
Kyoda. I'm Georgina Campbell in for Chelsea Daniels and this
is the Front Page, a daily podcast presented by The
New Zealand Herald. Last week, kingny to Haitia, the seventh
Maldi Monarch, passed away aged sixty nine, a little over
(00:25):
a week after marking eighteen years of his reign. By
his shock death has seen a week of morning at
Turanga yy Madi, the official residence for the head of
the kingy Tongua Movement, political leaders have paid their respects.
(00:48):
Prime Minister Christopher Luxen's voice broke with emotion when he
spoke last week. He later explained to journalists.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
I was just remembering some times that I had actually
in the photo with him, and whenever I came, we always,
you know, his wonderful wife arranged white bait fritters for
me and it was lovely and so so I was
just remembering that, and I was also thinking of the family.
You know, you know, I've lost a husband, I've lost
a dad, not just the king, but you know they've
(01:16):
lost a family member as well. So for me, yeah,
it was emotional as I was getting through my remarks.
Speaker 1 (01:21):
Labor Party leader Chris Hipkins recalled a conversation with kingy
to Hatia when he admitted being nervous about his too
Dow Maldi and co Papa Maldi needing some work.
Speaker 3 (01:33):
And I recall the advice that he gave to me
at the time, and I've carried it with me ever since.
He said, the important thing is that you try, and
you'll get more respect from trying than from getting it perfect.
And so I've remembered that.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
Green Party co leader Chloe Smallbrick said he saw the
nation we could be and invited us all to live
up to it.
Speaker 4 (01:54):
Can Ktahitanga on the national agenda as our guiding star
to build thee that all of us deserve. His legacy
is one of unity, kindness and truly listening to understand.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
Tens of thousands of mourners from throughout the country have
been at tudangaway Wi for the tongue hunger of the
Maldi king and the Defense Force has been called in
to feed them.
Speaker 5 (02:20):
New Zealand Defense Force was requested through Tipunikooki by tung
Awaiwimi to provide catering support and so we have behind
me now a catering detachment of twenty eight personnel, nine
vehicles and various pieces of equipment. Essentially, we have three
field kitchens behind me and they have been providing support
(02:41):
to the fighter Coo and wed A Hair for the
multitudes that have arrived for King you Do Haitia's tongue Hunger.
Speaker 1 (02:49):
The next Maldi monarch will officially be revealed this morning,
just hours before King to Haitia is laid to rest.
Proceedings will begin at Tu Dunga yy Madi at ten am.
Kingy Too Haitia's funeral will then take place before his
casket is taken to the banks of the Wykuttle River.
(03:10):
A guard of honour will be there from members of
Nati Mahanger and the New Zealand Defense Force for Waka
will take the late King's casket along the river towards
his final resting place on Topity Mountain. The late King's
casket will then be carried to the summit. Today on
(03:30):
the front page to discuss the legacy of kingy To Haitia,
we're joined by professor of Political science at Charles Sturt University,
Dominic O'Sullivan. Dominic, can you start by explaining the background
(03:51):
of the King Tunga movement For those who aren't familiar.
Speaker 6 (03:55):
Well, it was established in the eighteen fifties in response
to increase in colonization and in response to fears that
perhaps from the government's perspective, to tidity your waiting, he
wasn't going to be upheld, and promises contained in the
agreement were promises that the government didn't see his binding.
(04:21):
And it was thought that political unity among the different
Dewy of New Zealand would be a good thing. It
would be a way of being able to achieve more
coordinated and cohesive resistance to colonial expansion. And not all
the we had agreed with this, but many did, and
(04:45):
King to Hatia's ancestor port Tototo Federal Federal was chosen
as the first king.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
And how has the movement grown since then?
Speaker 6 (04:56):
Well, it's always been very important to the world Tony
people and other Ewi, but it does at different times
take on great national significance. It is the longest continuing
political institution in New Zealand outside Parliament. Parliament's only a
(05:17):
few years older than kingy Tonga and King e tong
Ha set me older than any of the political parties
that we have in Parliament at the moment. I think
we saw in January when King two Ata called a
meeting hue a Ewe to discuss how people might respond
(05:38):
to the new government's treaty policies and genuine undermining of
in general undermining of Maori culture and that who he
attracted ten thousand people from all over the country. So
it's a much bigger movement than just wyatt or tiny.
(06:00):
It has that that broader significance, and I think that
simplicity of two Ata's messages is really important. At the
coronation celebrations in August, for example, he made the really
simple but far reaching observation that manamute haak needs that
(06:21):
there's room for everybody. And you know that is a
very powerful political statement. I think there's room for everybody,
and that has far reaching policy implications that can test
the direction that the present government is taking. But also
really I think creates a juxtaposition with the government's preference
(06:46):
for a less cohesive, less united community and Quotahitanga unity
is an enduring theme that the King Tunga brings into politics,
and it does stand in quite significant contrast I think
(07:06):
with the policy directions that the government is wanting to
take at present.
Speaker 1 (07:11):
Yes, and as you say, his death comes at a
really difficult time for relationships between martyrdom and the Crown,
largely driven by the Coalition government's policies. Are you able
to expand on the policies that are challenging and what
(07:31):
impact do you think, you know, the loss of his
leadership could have in regards to those policies.
Speaker 6 (07:37):
Well, I think the policies range from the petty to
the potentially transformative. For example, one of the first policy
priorities of the government was to diminish the use of
the Maori language and the public service. We weren't allowed
(07:58):
to say what a quarte we had to say the
New Zealand Transport Agency because that was too much of
a concession from the government's point of view, to a
Maori presence in the broader New Zealand culture. And at
a more substantive level, we have the Treaty Principles Bill
(08:19):
which the act Party is preparing to introduce, and that
really rewrites the Treaty of White Honey. The proposed principles
bear no relation at all to the original agreement and
the intention is to diminish the Marii capacity and authority
(08:40):
basically to be themselves to diminish Runga Teatunga, as one
of the original treaty promises that Mary would retain authority
over their own affairs. So what the Treaty Principles Bill
is intended to do is really create an assimilationist kind
(09:00):
of policy regime where Mary participation in public life is
conditional on not expressing themselves in a distinctively Mary way,
not wanting to protect traditional environments and traditional authority, like
I said, not really being allowed to protect the right
(09:21):
to be marty. So it creates, I think a class
of citizenship for Mary people that doesn't reflect the promises
of equality that tutility made, and that's why people are
so worried about it. There are other measures like the
repeal of section seven AA of the orung Atomiki Act
(09:44):
that's the act that establishes ortung Atomariki as the government's
childcare and protection agency. And a succession of reports show
that the state does a very very poor job looking
after Mardi kids at risk, and this particular section of
the legislation that the government has taken exception to is
(10:09):
one that made sure that Maori people and Mary communities
could take a leadership role in making decisions about how
to look after kids who couldn't be looked after well
by their their their parents, by involving grandparents and aunties
and uncles and other members of a child's world in
(10:32):
their in their care and protection, instead of taking them
off to strangers to be looked after or not looked after,
as is often the case by by the state. It's
quite interesting that you know that the act Party, for example,
comes to politics with a general philosophy of small government.
(10:52):
It seems to set that philosophy aside and want big
government over mary lives and Mahi resources and so on,
big government in terms of diminishing the Mahdi language. And
those are the sorts of things that people went to
Tudanngawaiwei to air their concerns about back in January. As
(11:16):
I said, ten thousand people attended. They're also the concerns
that Tukta raised just as recently as last month that
the annual celebrations to mark the anniversary for coronation. When
he made that comment, there's room for everybody in that message.
I think what he was trying to say is that
Madi people looking after their own kids when they're in
(11:37):
trouble doesn't diminish the space that there is for other
people to do their thing and to exercise their rights
of citizenship and so on. His message really is that
Marti people wanting to be Mary is not a threat
to anybody. There's room for that, just as there's room
(11:59):
for everyone body else.
Speaker 1 (12:13):
Do you think that the government heard to Hata's message
or that his passing might have any spay on the
government's response in terms of its policies.
Speaker 6 (12:24):
Well before the big Quebec in January, the National Party
had indicated it wasn't too keen on the act Party's
Treaty Principles Bill and would support it to a first
reading in Parliament because that's what it had agreed to
in the coalition agreement, but it wasn't too keen on
(12:47):
going any further. But after that, Christopher Luxon came out
and said quite categorically that the National Party wouldn't support
this legislation beyond a second reading. So that means although
the bill will go to a select committee and people
will be able to make their submissions, it won't be
(13:09):
passed into law. And I think the size of the
whoy that to Ato was able to convene was a
significant influence on that decision, and I think the numbers
of people that we're seeing in aadawaha this week is
again that's a measure of people's support for the idea
(13:30):
of for Tahitanga that Kingtunga has represented since its inception
back in eighteen fifty eight. You know, that might have
some influence on the National Party. I don't think it'll
have any influence on ACT or New Zealand. First, they
represent a sector of the population that is probably not
widely represented at Notawaha this week, you know, appealing to
(13:54):
that that base remains important to those parties. But the
National Party needs to attract support beyond its base, and
it needs to attract the support of people who agree
with that statement. Is room for everybody, and the National Party,
I think, to attract support beyond its space, and it
(14:16):
needs to be mindful of those kinds of things and
mindful of not wanting to cause unnecessary conflict. Whereas the
ACT Party is very much ideologically focused. If to make
its point it needs to generate conflict and as a
result of that conflict, perhaps it doesn't do so well
at the election next time. It's not so worried about that.
(14:39):
If the National Party generates conflict which diminishes its electoral support,
that's a real problem for it going into the next election.
It wants to be in government, and that's more important
than perhaps what the act Party sees as the points
of principle that it's advocating.
Speaker 1 (14:55):
And as you say, that recent Hui is such a
strong and recent example of kingy to Hatia's leadership. He
was in this role for eighteen years, though, what are
some of the highlights of that reign.
Speaker 6 (15:11):
I think that is a highlight because at no prior
point in the last eighteen years has the Treaty of
Waitangi been undermined in the way that it has been
in the last few months. At no point have things
like the Mardi language been undermined in this way. So often,
(15:34):
leadership is most obvious and most pronounced when there's a
concrete political issue around which leaders can galvanize people, and
we just haven't had that in the last eighteen years.
That's not to say that Marti crown relationships are always good.
There are always points of contention, and we should expect
(15:59):
that political relationship with different perspectives and different ideas conflict
itself isn't necessarily a problem, but when it reaches the
scale that the government has provoked in the last year
or so, that does create space for leadership that just
(16:21):
doesn't bear in ordinary times.
Speaker 7 (16:24):
As the country mourns the death of King E Tuaia,
attention is slowly turning to who will be his successor.
But the Marti movement isn't as straightforward as traditional monarchs.
It's not hereditary, and the king or queen is instead
appointed by the leaders of the EWE involved in the
Mali king movement known as the king E Tongue. Despite
(16:45):
not needing to be, the monarchy has been hereditary in effect,
as every new Marty monarch has been the previous monarch's heir.
The King's Council is meeting with EWE leaders this week
and tod on a Yi and that I to discuss
the criteria for two highs successor. The successor will likely
be appointed on Thursday, the day of his funeral and
(17:06):
before the burial. Now a successor and new monarch will
be revealed this morning. Can you explain what the monarch
role is in this system and how it works, what
sort of duties or responsibilities does that monarch.
Speaker 6 (17:22):
Have well, I think we go back to eighteen fifty
eight when Portoitou became the first king and the point
was called Teitong unity. So to provide a figurehead for
that unity among erewe to provide more coordinated and cohesive
(17:47):
resistance to colonial expansion. And in the eighteen fifties and
sixties it was avert military aggression, the confiscation of lands
and so on. You know, one of the King of
Tongue Is main priorities between then and the settlement in
nineteen ninety five was to achieve that settlement. But it's
(18:08):
a bigger purpose now. So it's a person that can
command the respect of people across the country, across the
Maori world and beyond. Is what makes this position an
important one or conversely, what potentially diminishes it if the
(18:29):
job is not well done.
Speaker 1 (18:31):
So is it unity then that you think will be
front of mind for those make that choice today?
Speaker 6 (18:38):
I think so, and they'll be wanting to choose somebody
that they have confidence to be able to make a
contribution to that and to lead that objective.
Speaker 1 (18:48):
Thanks so much for joining us, Dominik. That's it for
this episode of the Front Page. You can read more
about today's stories stinks of news coverage at inzidherld dot
co dot inzid. The Front Page is produced by Ethan Sills.
Dan Goodwin is the sound engineer. I'm Georgina Campbell. Subscribe
(19:12):
to the Front Page on iHeartRadio or where of it
you get your podcasts, and tune in tomorrow for another
look behind the headlines.