February 12, 2025 • 15 mins
It is Pride Month in New Zealand, with the LGBTQ plus community making the most of the summer sun to celebrate.
But, at the same time it’s a celebration that feels increasingly under threat.
The return of the Trump administration has seen a rise in laws attacking the trans community and limiting Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion initiatives.
It’s even seen one US state look at trying to overturn gay marriage.
And while the US may be thousands of k's away, our connected world means attitudes there can be easily imported here... We already saw that last year with rainbow crossing vandalisms and the ongoing backlash against drag queen story times.
Today on The Front Page, chair of the Auckland Pride board, Bhen Goodsir, is with us to discuss how Pride celebrations are going in an uncertain landscape.
Follow The Front Page on iHeartRadio, Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts.
You can read more about this and other stories in the New Zealand Herald, online at nzherald.co.nz, or tune in to news bulletins across the NZME network.
Host: Chelsea Daniels
Sound Engineer/Producer: Richard Martin
Producer: Ethan Sills
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
Yea. I'm Chelsea Daniels and this is the Front Page,
a daily podcast presented by the New Zealand Herald. It's
Pride Month in New Zealand, with the LGBTQ plus community
making the most of the summer sun to celebrate, but
at the same time, it's a celebration that feels increasingly
(00:27):
under threat. The return of the Trump administration has seen
arise in laws attacking the trans community and limiting diversity,
equity and inclusion initiatives. In the US. It's even seen
one US state look at trying to overturn gay marriage.
And while the US may be thousands of k's away,
our connected world means attitudes there can easily be imported here.
(00:52):
We already saw that last year with the Rainbow Crossing
vandalisms and the ongoing backlash against drag Queen's story Times
Today on the front Page, Chair of the Auckland Pride Board,
Ben Goodsir, is with us to discuss how Pride celebrations
are going in an uncertain landscape. Then Pride events are
(01:16):
underway here in Auckland. How's the festival been so far?
Speaker 2 (01:20):
The festival has been amazing. We kicked off last week
with the opening of the festival, which is called Timatanga
and was an incredible event at season Gallery, a great
way to coep off the festival and since then it
has been at full steamer Heads. Pride Elevates started this
week with Brady pat launching her show just called What
(01:45):
Happened to Marianne at Q Theater last night, another amazing event,
and that's alongside over one hundred and ninety plus events
all across the city which are going on this month.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
Do you wish Pride Month was every month?
Speaker 2 (02:00):
I think we would having trade month and a month
means that we can keep our focus and keep our
energy up for the whole month. But it is a
big month and we couldn't do it without the incredible
start at Orkan Pride, who are looking after all of
the people running events and also all of our partners
including Auckland Council who hosts more than Sidney events all
(02:24):
across our community centers and libraries, and so having it
in one month really gives us a chance to put
that extra effort and have our really impact.
Speaker 1 (02:33):
If we look overseas, I guess the return of Donald
Trump to the White House has seen LGBTQ plus rights
under assault and straight off the bat. Trump declared in
his inauguration speech that there was only two genders.
Speaker 3 (02:46):
As of today, it will henceforth be the official policy
of the United States government that there are only two genders,
male and female.
Speaker 1 (02:58):
And then he signed an executive order on it. Last week,
he signed another executive action banning trans women from taking
part in women's sports. And on top of that, DEI
initiatives in the US have been scrapped across the government,
with information about HIV treatment being removed from government websites
as well. For example, when you see these things happening
in the US, how do you feel.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
This is really just tapping off a trend over the
last few years of an increasingly vocal minority really pushing
back against what has been important progress for recognizing the
dignity and importance of rainbow communities. But with Donald Trump,
(03:41):
what we're seeing is, I guess a small group of billionaires,
including Elon Musk and Make Zuckerberg, who are really pushing
these agendas right to the front. Yeah. I think it
should be concerning for everyone, especially when we have people
like Mark Zuckerberg saying that workplace has become too feminine,
so it becomes really hard to understand how we can
(04:03):
find in place within that for respectful understanding, which I
think is what everyone is really looking for.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
Yeah, a lot of prominent companies have ended their DEI
initiatives or at least removed any reference to them from
their official website since Trump took office. I'm looking at
the likes of Google, Amazon, Meta, General Motors, Intel, PayPal, Pepsi,
Golden Sacks, Deloitte, Disney, and the list goes on. Are
you disappointed that so many private companies seem to have
I guess caved.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
I don't think that we can really look to companies
to be leading the way on these issues. And in
terms of queer ranks, the way it has always been
led by the community and by coming together as gay
and lesbian and by and transgender people to push for
(04:50):
the recognition of our human rights and our dignity. And
I think that's what needs to be the focus. We
can't rely on companies, as we have seen recently, to
be leading the charge on this. And while it's disappointing
and it's certainly a canary in the coal mine, our
focus really needs to be on coming together as community
(05:10):
to support each other.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
Yeah, is there that element that pride or gay rights
and the way companies and corporations interact with the rainbow community,
is there a sense that it's seen as trendy, like
something that can come in and out of fashion, rather
than community based.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
Well, that's what recent developments have suggested that I think
certainly it all compride. That's why our focus has been
building community and building really strong community. And we do
have amazing companies that we work with, and we work
with those companies who are really keen to invest in
developing and supporting grassroots organizing and the amazing works that
(05:50):
are put on throughout the whole festival. But I think
that there has been a real shift and showing that
a lot of the work that companies, as you say,
we're doing a few years ago was just to try
and capture a trend and be on top of it.
And so over the long term, it is the community
and the attitude shifts that we need to build and
(06:13):
that's coming together.
Speaker 4 (06:18):
Okay, roads famous Rainbow crossing has been painted over with
white paint overnight or Concentral MP and Green's co leader
Chloe Swallbrick says she's been in touch with the relevant
authorities to have the crossing fixed immediately. No one's yet
taken responsibility for the vandalism here in Auckland, but Destiny
Church leader Brian Tamaki issued a statement this morning saying
(06:40):
the painters had clearly had enough and that this was
just the beginning.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
Some might argue that what happens in the US shouldn't
be a concern or isn't a concern here, and we're
a pretty socially liberal country, fairly agnostic without that same
kind of Christian ideology that the Americans have. But we
haveeing backlash towards the Rainbow community here, haven't we. Last
year a Destiny Church member painted over the Rainbow crossing
on Kaangahabe Road. But we've also seen protests at drag
(07:10):
queen readings in small towns. I guess are you concerned
we could see more of this attitude take center stage
over the next few years.
Speaker 2 (07:18):
Yeah, I am concerned. The US is a really culturally
dominant force in the world, and so people listen to
what's happening there, and I think we can see in
the United States the same groups who have campaigned in
many cases successfully against access to abortion healthcare now using
(07:40):
those same strategies to campaign against access to trans healthcare,
and those strategies are starting to be adopted more and
more in New Zealand, and especially seeing that our new
Health Minister Samine Brown was leading anti abortion groups when
he was at university. That makes me really concerned about
the state of our healthcare in New Zealand and access
(08:03):
for Rainbow communities to healthcare, not only in terms of
the specific healthcare that is available, but also just in
terms of people being able to trust that their doctors
are that the health system are going to be looking
out for them, because if people don't trust the system,
that they're not going to go and get treatment, even
for the day to day things that are really important.
(08:26):
So I think it is a concern and the influences
really neat.
Speaker 1 (08:45):
Looking at the UK as well, there's a Dolly part
in musical touring the UK at the moment, and there's
a gay lead character in the show. Apparently the musical
keeps getting interrupted by people getting vocally angry in the
audience over the fact that there's a gay storyline in
a Dolly Heart and musical. Do you think people are
getting more emboldened to be homophobic or transphobic in public now.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
I think when the tone is set from the top,
and that's what we're seeing both in the States and
in New Zealand, that does embolden people to feel like
they speak out against their communities. That that's not something
that we should be sitting by and letting happen, because
(09:27):
those types of activities make people feel uncomfortable just being
themselves in public, and that's not okay. We should have
space for people to be seen with dignity and respect
in public, and sort of tone that is being said
is really powerful to people's experiences in the public sphere.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
Do you want to see more from the government to
promote LGBTQ plus equity.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
I mean, this government right from the start has baked
in a number of anti LGBT policies into their coalition agreement,
and so it's really hard to see how they can
promote equity and stick to their agreement. But I think
a good start would be just really recognizing the fundamentals
that these things are human rights, transact to human rights,
(10:16):
queer right to human rights, and they are protected in
our human rights legislation, and so the government really has
an obligation to show how they are upholding human rights
and their actions. The Coalition agreement just can't unilaterally rewrite
what legislative protections for rainbow communities. It's really hard to
(10:37):
see a hopeful way forward with the Coalition government while
they have those their policies written into their agreement.
Speaker 1 (10:45):
What are some of those policies.
Speaker 2 (10:46):
Some of the policies include some of the same policies
that we're seeing in the States, especially around the inclusion
of trans people in sports, and especially in community sports,
where it's really about people getting involved, being healthy, and
being involved in their community, because we know that when
people are surrounded by loving and supporting community and involved locally,
(11:12):
they do have better mental and physical power. But also
policies around access for transgender healthcare and a range of
other funding arrangements for local community groups. But even just
more broadly, with public services being cut back, those other
public services that people with more health care needs really need,
(11:36):
and that has a disproportion of effect not just on
rainbow communities, but on a wide range of colocal communities.
Speaker 5 (11:49):
Our trends and non binary and gender minority found are
disproportionately represented in mental ill health, addiction and suicide statistics
current and MT. It's driven by rhetoric from the likes
of your party, and I expect it's driven out for
course now transgendering or transitioning well than ever before.
Speaker 2 (12:10):
Take a sick.
Speaker 1 (12:11):
There's actually a lot of lesbians in a lot of
gays that are actually are you talking on.
Speaker 5 (12:14):
Behalf of the women and the lisbos.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
Now, what would your advice be to straight people, for example,
what should they do if they see something that they
think is a bit oft in public against the rainbow community.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
I think it just is about making it clear that's
not okay, and just looking out for one another. It's basic,
it's basic respect, it's basic empathy or people and or
their experiences. And I would hope that anyone being harassed
in public, whether it's because they're part of the rainbow
(12:56):
community or for any other reason, that New Zealanders do
believe in doing what's right and looking out for one another.
And I would hope that anyone straight gay would be
there to stand up for their neighbors.
Speaker 1 (13:11):
And finally, Ben, what would you say to perhaps parents
listening to this who are worried for the well being
of the queer youth in their lives and how can
they cope over the next four years. I suppose what's
your advice?
Speaker 2 (13:24):
I mean a really pelful parents and the challenges that
they face supporting young people going through these situations. I
know for a lot of queer people, both young and
who have grown up, what really makes the difference as
having role models and having people out there that young
(13:45):
people can see themselves in. And hopefully that's a part
of what pot comply the office as well. We have
so many events and such a range of opportunities to
show off the amazing, incredible work that people are doing
their communities on the stage, in artworks all across the city,
and hopefully that provides a really positive experience for young
(14:09):
people and for all of our communities to get out
there and in the most everything else that is happening,
to see the joy and see the beauty and everything
we do, and I think holding on to that is
really important. We can't survive with just dealing with the
darkness all of the time. There needs to be some
pope and there. I have seen so much hope and
(14:31):
so much beauty so far on the festival, and I
would really approach people to get out there and get
a master.
Speaker 1 (14:37):
So thanks for joining us, Ben.
Speaker 2 (14:38):
Thanks Chelsea, have a great day.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
That's it for this episode of the Front Page. You
can read more about today's stories and extensive news coverage
at enzadherld dot co dot nz. The Front Page is
produced by Ethan Sills and Richard Martin, who is also
our sound engineer. I'm Chelsea Daniels. Subscribe to the Front
Page on iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts, and
(15:06):
tune in tomorrow for another look behind the headlines.
Yea. I'm Chelsea Daniels and this is the Front Page,
a daily podcast presented by the New Zealand Herald. It's
Pride Month in New Zealand, with the LGBTQ plus community
making the most of the summer sun to celebrate, but
at the same time, it's a celebration that feels increasingly
(00:27):
under threat. The return of the Trump administration has seen
arise in laws attacking the trans community and limiting diversity,
equity and inclusion initiatives. In the US. It's even seen
one US state look at trying to overturn gay marriage.
And while the US may be thousands of k's away,
our connected world means attitudes there can easily be imported here.
(00:52):
We already saw that last year with the Rainbow Crossing
vandalisms and the ongoing backlash against drag Queen's story Times
Today on the front Page, Chair of the Auckland Pride Board,
Ben Goodsir, is with us to discuss how Pride celebrations
are going in an uncertain landscape. Then Pride events are
(01:16):
underway here in Auckland. How's the festival been so far?
Speaker 2 (01:20):
The festival has been amazing. We kicked off last week
with the opening of the festival, which is called Timatanga
and was an incredible event at season Gallery, a great
way to coep off the festival and since then it
has been at full steamer Heads. Pride Elevates started this
week with Brady pat launching her show just called What
(01:45):
Happened to Marianne at Q Theater last night, another amazing event,
and that's alongside over one hundred and ninety plus events
all across the city which are going on this month.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
Do you wish Pride Month was every month?
Speaker 2 (02:00):
I think we would having trade month and a month
means that we can keep our focus and keep our
energy up for the whole month. But it is a
big month and we couldn't do it without the incredible
start at Orkan Pride, who are looking after all of
the people running events and also all of our partners
including Auckland Council who hosts more than Sidney events all
(02:24):
across our community centers and libraries, and so having it
in one month really gives us a chance to put
that extra effort and have our really impact.
Speaker 1 (02:33):
If we look overseas, I guess the return of Donald
Trump to the White House has seen LGBTQ plus rights
under assault and straight off the bat. Trump declared in
his inauguration speech that there was only two genders.
Speaker 3 (02:46):
As of today, it will henceforth be the official policy
of the United States government that there are only two genders,
male and female.
Speaker 1 (02:58):
And then he signed an executive order on it. Last week,
he signed another executive action banning trans women from taking
part in women's sports. And on top of that, DEI
initiatives in the US have been scrapped across the government,
with information about HIV treatment being removed from government websites
as well. For example, when you see these things happening
in the US, how do you feel.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
This is really just tapping off a trend over the
last few years of an increasingly vocal minority really pushing
back against what has been important progress for recognizing the
dignity and importance of rainbow communities. But with Donald Trump,
(03:41):
what we're seeing is, I guess a small group of billionaires,
including Elon Musk and Make Zuckerberg, who are really pushing
these agendas right to the front. Yeah. I think it
should be concerning for everyone, especially when we have people
like Mark Zuckerberg saying that workplace has become too feminine,
so it becomes really hard to understand how we can
(04:03):
find in place within that for respectful understanding, which I
think is what everyone is really looking for.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
Yeah, a lot of prominent companies have ended their DEI
initiatives or at least removed any reference to them from
their official website since Trump took office. I'm looking at
the likes of Google, Amazon, Meta, General Motors, Intel, PayPal, Pepsi,
Golden Sacks, Deloitte, Disney, and the list goes on. Are
you disappointed that so many private companies seem to have
I guess caved.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
I don't think that we can really look to companies
to be leading the way on these issues. And in
terms of queer ranks, the way it has always been
led by the community and by coming together as gay
and lesbian and by and transgender people to push for
(04:50):
the recognition of our human rights and our dignity. And
I think that's what needs to be the focus. We
can't rely on companies, as we have seen recently, to
be leading the charge on this. And while it's disappointing
and it's certainly a canary in the coal mine, our
focus really needs to be on coming together as community
(05:10):
to support each other.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
Yeah, is there that element that pride or gay rights
and the way companies and corporations interact with the rainbow community,
is there a sense that it's seen as trendy, like
something that can come in and out of fashion, rather
than community based.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
Well, that's what recent developments have suggested that I think
certainly it all compride. That's why our focus has been
building community and building really strong community. And we do
have amazing companies that we work with, and we work
with those companies who are really keen to invest in
developing and supporting grassroots organizing and the amazing works that
(05:50):
are put on throughout the whole festival. But I think
that there has been a real shift and showing that
a lot of the work that companies, as you say,
we're doing a few years ago was just to try
and capture a trend and be on top of it.
And so over the long term, it is the community
and the attitude shifts that we need to build and
(06:13):
that's coming together.
Speaker 4 (06:18):
Okay, roads famous Rainbow crossing has been painted over with
white paint overnight or Concentral MP and Green's co leader
Chloe Swallbrick says she's been in touch with the relevant
authorities to have the crossing fixed immediately. No one's yet
taken responsibility for the vandalism here in Auckland, but Destiny
Church leader Brian Tamaki issued a statement this morning saying
(06:40):
the painters had clearly had enough and that this was
just the beginning.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
Some might argue that what happens in the US shouldn't
be a concern or isn't a concern here, and we're
a pretty socially liberal country, fairly agnostic without that same
kind of Christian ideology that the Americans have. But we
haveeing backlash towards the Rainbow community here, haven't we. Last
year a Destiny Church member painted over the Rainbow crossing
on Kaangahabe Road. But we've also seen protests at drag
(07:10):
queen readings in small towns. I guess are you concerned
we could see more of this attitude take center stage
over the next few years.
Speaker 2 (07:18):
Yeah, I am concerned. The US is a really culturally
dominant force in the world, and so people listen to
what's happening there, and I think we can see in
the United States the same groups who have campaigned in
many cases successfully against access to abortion healthcare now using
(07:40):
those same strategies to campaign against access to trans healthcare,
and those strategies are starting to be adopted more and
more in New Zealand, and especially seeing that our new
Health Minister Samine Brown was leading anti abortion groups when
he was at university. That makes me really concerned about
the state of our healthcare in New Zealand and access
(08:03):
for Rainbow communities to healthcare, not only in terms of
the specific healthcare that is available, but also just in
terms of people being able to trust that their doctors
are that the health system are going to be looking
out for them, because if people don't trust the system,
that they're not going to go and get treatment, even
for the day to day things that are really important.
(08:26):
So I think it is a concern and the influences
really neat.
Speaker 1 (08:45):
Looking at the UK as well, there's a Dolly part
in musical touring the UK at the moment, and there's
a gay lead character in the show. Apparently the musical
keeps getting interrupted by people getting vocally angry in the
audience over the fact that there's a gay storyline in
a Dolly Heart and musical. Do you think people are
getting more emboldened to be homophobic or transphobic in public now.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
I think when the tone is set from the top,
and that's what we're seeing both in the States and
in New Zealand, that does embolden people to feel like
they speak out against their communities. That that's not something
that we should be sitting by and letting happen, because
(09:27):
those types of activities make people feel uncomfortable just being
themselves in public, and that's not okay. We should have
space for people to be seen with dignity and respect
in public, and sort of tone that is being said
is really powerful to people's experiences in the public sphere.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
Do you want to see more from the government to
promote LGBTQ plus equity.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
I mean, this government right from the start has baked
in a number of anti LGBT policies into their coalition agreement,
and so it's really hard to see how they can
promote equity and stick to their agreement. But I think
a good start would be just really recognizing the fundamentals
that these things are human rights, transact to human rights,
(10:16):
queer right to human rights, and they are protected in
our human rights legislation, and so the government really has
an obligation to show how they are upholding human rights
and their actions. The Coalition agreement just can't unilaterally rewrite
what legislative protections for rainbow communities. It's really hard to
(10:37):
see a hopeful way forward with the Coalition government while
they have those their policies written into their agreement.
Speaker 1 (10:45):
What are some of those policies.
Speaker 2 (10:46):
Some of the policies include some of the same policies
that we're seeing in the States, especially around the inclusion
of trans people in sports, and especially in community sports,
where it's really about people getting involved, being healthy, and
being involved in their community, because we know that when
people are surrounded by loving and supporting community and involved locally,
(11:12):
they do have better mental and physical power. But also
policies around access for transgender healthcare and a range of
other funding arrangements for local community groups. But even just
more broadly, with public services being cut back, those other
public services that people with more health care needs really need,
(11:36):
and that has a disproportion of effect not just on
rainbow communities, but on a wide range of colocal communities.
Speaker 5 (11:49):
Our trends and non binary and gender minority found are
disproportionately represented in mental ill health, addiction and suicide statistics
current and MT. It's driven by rhetoric from the likes
of your party, and I expect it's driven out for
course now transgendering or transitioning well than ever before.
Speaker 2 (12:10):
Take a sick.
Speaker 1 (12:11):
There's actually a lot of lesbians in a lot of
gays that are actually are you talking on.
Speaker 5 (12:14):
Behalf of the women and the lisbos.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
Now, what would your advice be to straight people, for example,
what should they do if they see something that they
think is a bit oft in public against the rainbow community.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
I think it just is about making it clear that's
not okay, and just looking out for one another. It's basic,
it's basic respect, it's basic empathy or people and or
their experiences. And I would hope that anyone being harassed
in public, whether it's because they're part of the rainbow
(12:56):
community or for any other reason, that New Zealanders do
believe in doing what's right and looking out for one another.
And I would hope that anyone straight gay would be
there to stand up for their neighbors.
Speaker 1 (13:11):
And finally, Ben, what would you say to perhaps parents
listening to this who are worried for the well being
of the queer youth in their lives and how can
they cope over the next four years. I suppose what's
your advice?
Speaker 2 (13:24):
I mean a really pelful parents and the challenges that
they face supporting young people going through these situations. I
know for a lot of queer people, both young and
who have grown up, what really makes the difference as
having role models and having people out there that young
(13:45):
people can see themselves in. And hopefully that's a part
of what pot comply the office as well. We have
so many events and such a range of opportunities to
show off the amazing, incredible work that people are doing
their communities on the stage, in artworks all across the city,
and hopefully that provides a really positive experience for young
(14:09):
people and for all of our communities to get out
there and in the most everything else that is happening,
to see the joy and see the beauty and everything
we do, and I think holding on to that is
really important. We can't survive with just dealing with the
darkness all of the time. There needs to be some
pope and there. I have seen so much hope and
(14:31):
so much beauty so far on the festival, and I
would really approach people to get out there and get
a master.
Speaker 1 (14:37):
So thanks for joining us, Ben.
Speaker 2 (14:38):
Thanks Chelsea, have a great day.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
That's it for this episode of the Front Page. You
can read more about today's stories and extensive news coverage
at enzadherld dot co dot nz. The Front Page is
produced by Ethan Sills and Richard Martin, who is also
our sound engineer. I'm Chelsea Daniels. Subscribe to the Front
Page on iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts, and
(15:06):
tune in tomorrow for another look behind the headlines.
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