July 23, 2024 • 17 mins
Nearly three-thousand experiences have been heard in 133 days of public hearings, and more than a million documents received.
It’s been five and a half years since the Royal Commission of Inquiry into Abuse in Care was established – to investigate the abuse of children, young people, and vulnerable adults within state and faith-based institutions.
Over the years, the Inquiry’s heard from countless survivors, government heads and church leaders. Common themes have included significant sexual, verbal and physical violence, over-medicalisation, isolation and unsanitary conditions.
Finally, the Inquiry’s final report will be released publicly today after it’s presented in Parliament.
Senior Investigative Reporter Michael Morrah has been covering this inquiry since it started, and joins us today on The Front Page.
A warning - this episode of The Front Page contains distressing content such as details about sexual and physical abuse.
Follow The Front Page on iHeartRadio, Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts.
You can read more about this and other stories in the New Zealand Herald, online at nzherald.co.nz, or tune in to news bulletins across the NZME network.
Host: Chelsea Daniels
Sound Engineer: Paddy Fox
Producer: Ethan Sills
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Kilda. I'm Chelsea Daniels and this is the Front Page,
a daily podcast presented by the New Zealand Herald. Nearly
three thousand experiences have been heard in one hundred and
thirty three days of public hearings and more than a
million documents received. It's been five and a half years
(00:29):
since the Royal Commission of Inquiry into Abuse and Care
was established to investigate the abuse of children, young people
and vulnerable adults within state and faith based institutions. Over
the years, the inquiries heard from countless survivors, government heads
and church leaders. Common themes have included significant sexual, verbal
(00:53):
and physical violence, over medicalization, isolation and unsanitary conditions. Finally,
the Inquiry's final report will be released publicly today after
it's presented in Parliament. Senior investigative reporter Michael Mora has
been covering this inquiry since it started and joins us
(01:16):
today on the Front Page. Michael, can you give us
a bit of an explainer on what the Abuse and
Care Inquiry actually is?
Speaker 2 (01:28):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (01:29):
Well, it was set up in twenty eighteen by the
then Labor government to investigate allegations of historic state abuse
and faith abuse. Initially, this was between nineteen fifty and
nineteen ninety nine, but that time frame was actually extended
in the end. Now, the first interim report from this
(01:49):
Commission of Inquiry actually came out of the end of
twenty twenty, and incredibly it estimated that about a quarter
of a million people were abused in state or church care,
though the report noted that the real figure is likely
much much higher. So most of those abuse came from
Maori and Pacifica families, disabled people, women and girls. And
(02:13):
the abuse of behavior is harrowing. I mean it ranged
from physical assault to sexual assault, restraint, cruel, inhumane and
degrading medical procedures such as shock therapy being used as punishment.
And when this interim report came out, and I remember
reporting on it at the time, the recommendation at that
(02:34):
time in twenty twenty was that there should be an
independent redress system set up at that time. But nothing,
nothing has happened, and survivors are still waiting and in
fact many are dying. Chris Hipkins at the time stood
up after this interim report and said he accepted the recommendations,
(02:56):
action would be taken, and yet we have not seen anything.
Speaker 4 (03:01):
One of the key messages from the report is that
we need to actually work with the survivors to co
design a redress process that's going to work for them
and one that they're going to have trust and confidence in.
It's clear the previous attempts to provide redress have fallen short,
so I think it's important that we do that work
with the victims rather than to them.
Speaker 1 (03:23):
You've been covering this since its inception in twenty eighteen,
but you've spoken to so many survivors over the years.
What stories stick out to you.
Speaker 3 (03:32):
I've spoken to many many survivors, from state institutions to
church groups, church homes. One of the guys that always
stood out to me as a chap called Pool Zenfield,
and I think he's been one of the leading voices
in this ongoing saga. He was tortured at the old
Lake Alice Hospital. You've probably heard of that. It's near Martin.
(03:55):
He was given electric shock treatment for doing things like
whetting the bed as a fourteen year old. But despite
so many setbacks, Paul has never really given up in
his quest for justice and accountability. He supports other survivors
and he's just a real sort of Kiwi Batler. He
even took a case to the UN Committee against Torture,
(04:17):
which was upheld in twenty twenty, and that recommended at
the time that the government investigate claims of torture. And
there's you know, other people, which I think was really impactful.
I mean, I met a man whose name I won't
say because he asked me, and the story I did
with him, we did not identify him. But when this
all started, he told me that one day he just
(04:42):
was in tears and his wife came upstairs and said,
what's going on. And at that point, decades and decades
after his abuse, he disclosed to his wife what had happened.
And he had been raped every week for a two
(05:04):
year period by a Marius brother known as Brother Giles.
And this story really hit me hard, and it was
hugely impactful because I sat down with this guy, a
grown man who has his own kids, who was in
tears recounting and publicly revealing for the very first time
(05:28):
exactly what he had endured as a boy. And that
was so significant because this was abuse that he had
buried and tried to forget for decades, and he opened
up about it.
Speaker 5 (05:41):
Yeah, I went into Kewinos too. There are very few
of us who have actually made it out unscathed. There
are very few of us that can look back at
our childhoods and be happy about them. The whole process
has shown us what things like boot camps and criminalizing
young people that it shows us the pathway that young
(06:02):
people take when they're put into situations like that from
people in authority.
Speaker 1 (06:10):
I guess over the years there have been some key moments.
One that comes to my mind is when Gloria Vale
leaders fronted the inquiry. How rare is such a move
for this notoriously secretive sect.
Speaker 3 (06:22):
I guess, well, Gloria Vale's leader, Howard Temple, never likes
to ready be seen in public, nor does he like
to comment publicly on anything. So yes, he was forced
to come before the Commission, just like he was forced
to come before the Employment Court during a recent case
taken by Leavers against the leaders there. So that is
(06:44):
incredibly rare. There were a lot of key moments.
Speaker 4 (06:47):
You know.
Speaker 3 (06:47):
It wasn't just Gloriavale's leader. I remember hugely significant apology
from place. It was the former Commissioner Tom Fitzgerald who
turned up at the Commission of Inquiry and essentially said
sorry for multiple botched investigations into allegations of abuse and
(07:08):
torture at Lake Alice Hospital. And that related to investigations
between two thousand and two and twenty ten where police
not only failed to investigate complaints thoroughly, they lost key
witness statements given to them by survivors, and they just
did not commit enough resources to the case. Now, when
(07:31):
a police front and apologized publicly, you know that there's
been a pretty monumental stuff up.
Speaker 1 (07:38):
Yeah, and I mean, and that's just one of the
apologies that we've seen over the years. Hey, it's also
seen apologies from church leaders from just about every denomination.
How have survivors you've spoken to reacted to those apologies?
Speaker 3 (07:52):
Yeah, well, look, you're right. I mean, I clearly remember
Cardinal John Joe of the Catholic Church stepping up and
apologize and acknowledging that Catholic church systems and its culture
allowed children to be abused. And that was a hugely
significant day. I think that a lot of these apologies
fall on deaf airs. Some of these survivors have been
(08:15):
raising these concerns for decades and have not felt listened to.
They have not felt believed. So the apologies I think
for many ring hollow. What they want to see is
actual action. You know, it's a bit like Lake Alice.
I mean, some of the horrific abuse that occurred there
(08:39):
and the lack of accountability that we've seen, and you know,
let's be clear about what the Commission has determined about
places like Lake Alice. I mean, this was mass torture
of vulnerable children, and the really disgraceful thing was that
complaints and concerns raised at the time went nowhere. And
so for so long survivors have felt that they know
(09:00):
we're not listened to. So the apologies, as I said,
rang hollow, at least at this point. You know, they
have found a place in the Commission, which has done
lengthy and an extraordinary inquiry in my view, into what
really went on.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
Why has it taken nearly six years to get from
the inception to the final report.
Speaker 3 (09:32):
There's been lots of back and forth. Like I said
at the beginning of this chat, there were changes to
the timeline. Initially it was like we're going to investigate
between nineteen fifties to nineteen ninety nine. Then there was
concerns from survivors that that doesn't actually consider what's happening
(09:52):
right now, and so the scope of the inquiry changed.
There have been various people who have come and gone
from the Commission's leadership structure, and I think that the
amount of work has been underestimated by the Commission. There
have been thousands of written statements, thousands of hearings from
(10:14):
people in person turning up to tell their stories in person,
and it's been very disappointing for survivors that it has
been pushed out and pushed out. You know, we were
expecting to have the final report out well before today
in saying that we have got to this stage and
it is a huge day for thousands of survivors.
Speaker 2 (10:39):
Well, it's exposed, I think, just the extent of abuse
and that it's gone right across all aspects of state
and faith based care. You know, now we have about
two thousand active claims. A lot of those clients now
are in their early to mid twenties, some sadly are
in their teams. It's certainly not something of the past.
(11:00):
It is you know, it's still very much something that
is happening now and I think, sadly, will continue into
the future, and with.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
Faith based institutions, they weren't originally included.
Speaker 3 (11:14):
Were they No, they were not originally included, and so
that was another add on, and there was a lot
of advocacy and pressure to ensure that they were included,
and in fact, some of the most depraved defending has
come from some of these faith based institutions. One place
(11:34):
that comes to mind is Maryland's School in christ Church.
This was described by survivors as a state supported church
run brothel for pedophiles. I mean, it was particularly infamous
because many of the victims were disabled, and we learned
a lot about what the church did at the time
(11:55):
if priests got found out that they were molesting children,
and that was not to call the cops. It was
to shift them to another place where they would continue
abusing other children. The police went called, there was no investigation,
and this was a pattern that occurred time and time again.
Speaker 1 (12:15):
Is there a redress process in place at the moment
or are we expecting to learn more about that?
Speaker 3 (12:20):
Yeah, so there is a redress process at the moment.
So a lot of survivors I've spoken to have entered
into this redress process with agencies like the Ministry of
Social Development or with the Ministry of Health, and they
will go to their lawyers and the lawyers will make
a claim for some compensation. The problem with this is
that it is very very drawn out. In fact, I
(12:43):
spoke with a leading lawyer in the Serius Sonya Cooper,
who has thousands of clients from state abuse, and she
said the average time it takes to have some form
of compensation or payout is about six years. So it's
incredible ready, and you can imagine that people are actually
dying before they get any form of redress. So that
(13:07):
is in part where survivors can get redress get compensation.
There are schemes and systems in place with these government
departments to organize those compensation payments. However, what has always
been called for is that there is some form of
independent body which oversees this redress. That has been a
(13:29):
key thing. It's a bit like the Catholic Church's body
for investigating complaints, which is the National Office of Professional Standards.
That is a church run operation. Now there's inherently some
concerns about survivors about that, and they would like to
see the investigative body taken away from being church controlled
(13:50):
and actually being an independent investigative body and for complaints
and investigations to be conducted independently. And the same with redress. Again,
we know that the interim report recommended an independent redress system,
so we'd be pretty sure that that would be the
same recommendation today.
Speaker 6 (14:10):
Look, survivors, especially of my era, are dying at an
ever increasing rate, and they have waited far, far too
long for redress, and we need to do that to
be able to move on and focus on the terrible
rates of abuse that are still happening.
Speaker 1 (14:24):
Now.
Speaker 6 (14:24):
We have to deal with both. They don't sit in
isolation to each other. The best way to stop abuse
and care is to keep them out of there in
the first place. So that means resourcing our communities of
all cultures to be able to look after their own.
Speaker 1 (14:40):
There's been a lot of talk about how to actually
quantify someone's trauma as well with the redress.
Speaker 3 (14:46):
Hey, oh absolutely, and a lot of this is kind of,
you know, providing evidence from when you were a child,
any records that can be found, and this is in
part why it takes so long. If you go to
the Ministry of so Development and the lawyer makes an
application to get all the records. It takes some time
to get all those records, and then you have to
(15:07):
kind of build the case. And there's lenk the interviews
that take place about a man or a woman's life,
how that has gone, what difficulties they've faced, How could
that be attributed? Is that attributed to the abuse that
they occurred? So all those sorts of things you need
to be considered.
Speaker 1 (15:25):
Prime Minister Christopher Luxen is expected to deliver an apology
on behalf of the country in November, but what should
be the next steps after that?
Speaker 3 (15:35):
Survivors would hope that action begins well before November. This
is an incredibly dark chapter in New Zealand where survivors
were silenced, some claimed cover ups of complaints, and this
has impacted the most marginalized groups in society. We had
church leaders who befriended families to get access to and
(15:58):
sexually abused chill children. And it's about time we faced
up to this. It's about time the church authorities face
up to this and the government and we see some
sort of tangible action because that's the concern from survivors.
It's time for accountability and action. And the important thing
to remember is that survivors have come out and done
(16:19):
this to prevent it happening again, and as we know
that the abuse is ongoing at the moment, there's no
shortage of stories of concerns about the functions of agencies
like ordering a tamadiki. So I guess the next steps
in terms of what survivors would want is real action
(16:41):
and real accountability.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
Now, thanks for joining us, Michael. That said, for this
episode of the Front Page. You can read more about
today's stories and extensive news coverage at enzadherld dot co
dot z. The Front Page is produced by Ethan Seles
with sound engineer Paddy Fox. I'm Chelsea Daniels. Subscribe to
(17:07):
The Front Page on iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts,
and tune in to Morrow for another look behind the headlines.
Kilda. I'm Chelsea Daniels and this is the Front Page,
a daily podcast presented by the New Zealand Herald. Nearly
three thousand experiences have been heard in one hundred and
thirty three days of public hearings and more than a
million documents received. It's been five and a half years
(00:29):
since the Royal Commission of Inquiry into Abuse and Care
was established to investigate the abuse of children, young people
and vulnerable adults within state and faith based institutions. Over
the years, the inquiries heard from countless survivors, government heads
and church leaders. Common themes have included significant sexual, verbal
(00:53):
and physical violence, over medicalization, isolation and unsanitary conditions. Finally,
the Inquiry's final report will be released publicly today after
it's presented in Parliament. Senior investigative reporter Michael Mora has
been covering this inquiry since it started and joins us
(01:16):
today on the Front Page. Michael, can you give us
a bit of an explainer on what the Abuse and
Care Inquiry actually is?
Speaker 2 (01:28):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (01:29):
Well, it was set up in twenty eighteen by the
then Labor government to investigate allegations of historic state abuse
and faith abuse. Initially, this was between nineteen fifty and
nineteen ninety nine, but that time frame was actually extended
in the end. Now, the first interim report from this
(01:49):
Commission of Inquiry actually came out of the end of
twenty twenty, and incredibly it estimated that about a quarter
of a million people were abused in state or church care,
though the report noted that the real figure is likely
much much higher. So most of those abuse came from
Maori and Pacifica families, disabled people, women and girls. And
(02:13):
the abuse of behavior is harrowing. I mean it ranged
from physical assault to sexual assault, restraint, cruel, inhumane and
degrading medical procedures such as shock therapy being used as punishment.
And when this interim report came out, and I remember
reporting on it at the time, the recommendation at that
(02:34):
time in twenty twenty was that there should be an
independent redress system set up at that time. But nothing,
nothing has happened, and survivors are still waiting and in
fact many are dying. Chris Hipkins at the time stood
up after this interim report and said he accepted the recommendations,
(02:56):
action would be taken, and yet we have not seen anything.
Speaker 4 (03:01):
One of the key messages from the report is that
we need to actually work with the survivors to co
design a redress process that's going to work for them
and one that they're going to have trust and confidence in.
It's clear the previous attempts to provide redress have fallen short,
so I think it's important that we do that work
with the victims rather than to them.
Speaker 1 (03:23):
You've been covering this since its inception in twenty eighteen,
but you've spoken to so many survivors over the years.
What stories stick out to you.
Speaker 3 (03:32):
I've spoken to many many survivors, from state institutions to
church groups, church homes. One of the guys that always
stood out to me as a chap called Pool Zenfield,
and I think he's been one of the leading voices
in this ongoing saga. He was tortured at the old
Lake Alice Hospital. You've probably heard of that. It's near Martin.
(03:55):
He was given electric shock treatment for doing things like
whetting the bed as a fourteen year old. But despite
so many setbacks, Paul has never really given up in
his quest for justice and accountability. He supports other survivors
and he's just a real sort of Kiwi Batler. He
even took a case to the UN Committee against Torture,
(04:17):
which was upheld in twenty twenty, and that recommended at
the time that the government investigate claims of torture. And
there's you know, other people, which I think was really impactful.
I mean, I met a man whose name I won't
say because he asked me, and the story I did
with him, we did not identify him. But when this
all started, he told me that one day he just
(04:42):
was in tears and his wife came upstairs and said,
what's going on. And at that point, decades and decades
after his abuse, he disclosed to his wife what had happened.
And he had been raped every week for a two
(05:04):
year period by a Marius brother known as Brother Giles.
And this story really hit me hard, and it was
hugely impactful because I sat down with this guy, a
grown man who has his own kids, who was in
tears recounting and publicly revealing for the very first time
(05:28):
exactly what he had endured as a boy. And that
was so significant because this was abuse that he had
buried and tried to forget for decades, and he opened
up about it.
Speaker 5 (05:41):
Yeah, I went into Kewinos too. There are very few
of us who have actually made it out unscathed. There
are very few of us that can look back at
our childhoods and be happy about them. The whole process
has shown us what things like boot camps and criminalizing
young people that it shows us the pathway that young
(06:02):
people take when they're put into situations like that from
people in authority.
Speaker 1 (06:10):
I guess over the years there have been some key moments.
One that comes to my mind is when Gloria Vale
leaders fronted the inquiry. How rare is such a move
for this notoriously secretive sect.
Speaker 3 (06:22):
I guess, well, Gloria Vale's leader, Howard Temple, never likes
to ready be seen in public, nor does he like
to comment publicly on anything. So yes, he was forced
to come before the Commission, just like he was forced
to come before the Employment Court during a recent case
taken by Leavers against the leaders there. So that is
(06:44):
incredibly rare. There were a lot of key moments.
Speaker 4 (06:47):
You know.
Speaker 3 (06:47):
It wasn't just Gloriavale's leader. I remember hugely significant apology
from place. It was the former Commissioner Tom Fitzgerald who
turned up at the Commission of Inquiry and essentially said
sorry for multiple botched investigations into allegations of abuse and
(07:08):
torture at Lake Alice Hospital. And that related to investigations
between two thousand and two and twenty ten where police
not only failed to investigate complaints thoroughly, they lost key
witness statements given to them by survivors, and they just
did not commit enough resources to the case. Now, when
(07:31):
a police front and apologized publicly, you know that there's
been a pretty monumental stuff up.
Speaker 1 (07:38):
Yeah, and I mean, and that's just one of the
apologies that we've seen over the years. Hey, it's also
seen apologies from church leaders from just about every denomination.
How have survivors you've spoken to reacted to those apologies?
Speaker 3 (07:52):
Yeah, well, look, you're right. I mean, I clearly remember
Cardinal John Joe of the Catholic Church stepping up and
apologize and acknowledging that Catholic church systems and its culture
allowed children to be abused. And that was a hugely
significant day. I think that a lot of these apologies
fall on deaf airs. Some of these survivors have been
(08:15):
raising these concerns for decades and have not felt listened to.
They have not felt believed. So the apologies I think
for many ring hollow. What they want to see is
actual action. You know, it's a bit like Lake Alice.
I mean, some of the horrific abuse that occurred there
(08:39):
and the lack of accountability that we've seen, and you know,
let's be clear about what the Commission has determined about
places like Lake Alice. I mean, this was mass torture
of vulnerable children, and the really disgraceful thing was that
complaints and concerns raised at the time went nowhere. And
so for so long survivors have felt that they know
(09:00):
we're not listened to. So the apologies, as I said,
rang hollow, at least at this point. You know, they
have found a place in the Commission, which has done
lengthy and an extraordinary inquiry in my view, into what
really went on.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
Why has it taken nearly six years to get from
the inception to the final report.
Speaker 3 (09:32):
There's been lots of back and forth. Like I said
at the beginning of this chat, there were changes to
the timeline. Initially it was like we're going to investigate
between nineteen fifties to nineteen ninety nine. Then there was
concerns from survivors that that doesn't actually consider what's happening
(09:52):
right now, and so the scope of the inquiry changed.
There have been various people who have come and gone
from the Commission's leadership structure, and I think that the
amount of work has been underestimated by the Commission. There
have been thousands of written statements, thousands of hearings from
(10:14):
people in person turning up to tell their stories in person,
and it's been very disappointing for survivors that it has
been pushed out and pushed out. You know, we were
expecting to have the final report out well before today
in saying that we have got to this stage and
it is a huge day for thousands of survivors.
Speaker 2 (10:39):
Well, it's exposed, I think, just the extent of abuse
and that it's gone right across all aspects of state
and faith based care. You know, now we have about
two thousand active claims. A lot of those clients now
are in their early to mid twenties, some sadly are
in their teams. It's certainly not something of the past.
(11:00):
It is you know, it's still very much something that
is happening now and I think, sadly, will continue into
the future, and with.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
Faith based institutions, they weren't originally included.
Speaker 3 (11:14):
Were they No, they were not originally included, and so
that was another add on, and there was a lot
of advocacy and pressure to ensure that they were included,
and in fact, some of the most depraved defending has
come from some of these faith based institutions. One place
(11:34):
that comes to mind is Maryland's School in christ Church.
This was described by survivors as a state supported church
run brothel for pedophiles. I mean, it was particularly infamous
because many of the victims were disabled, and we learned
a lot about what the church did at the time
(11:55):
if priests got found out that they were molesting children,
and that was not to call the cops. It was
to shift them to another place where they would continue
abusing other children. The police went called, there was no investigation,
and this was a pattern that occurred time and time again.
Speaker 1 (12:15):
Is there a redress process in place at the moment
or are we expecting to learn more about that?
Speaker 3 (12:20):
Yeah, so there is a redress process at the moment.
So a lot of survivors I've spoken to have entered
into this redress process with agencies like the Ministry of
Social Development or with the Ministry of Health, and they
will go to their lawyers and the lawyers will make
a claim for some compensation. The problem with this is
that it is very very drawn out. In fact, I
(12:43):
spoke with a leading lawyer in the Serius Sonya Cooper,
who has thousands of clients from state abuse, and she
said the average time it takes to have some form
of compensation or payout is about six years. So it's
incredible ready, and you can imagine that people are actually
dying before they get any form of redress. So that
(13:07):
is in part where survivors can get redress get compensation.
There are schemes and systems in place with these government
departments to organize those compensation payments. However, what has always
been called for is that there is some form of
independent body which oversees this redress. That has been a
(13:29):
key thing. It's a bit like the Catholic Church's body
for investigating complaints, which is the National Office of Professional Standards.
That is a church run operation. Now there's inherently some
concerns about survivors about that, and they would like to
see the investigative body taken away from being church controlled
(13:50):
and actually being an independent investigative body and for complaints
and investigations to be conducted independently. And the same with redress. Again,
we know that the interim report recommended an independent redress system,
so we'd be pretty sure that that would be the
same recommendation today.
Speaker 6 (14:10):
Look, survivors, especially of my era, are dying at an
ever increasing rate, and they have waited far, far too
long for redress, and we need to do that to
be able to move on and focus on the terrible
rates of abuse that are still happening.
Speaker 1 (14:24):
Now.
Speaker 6 (14:24):
We have to deal with both. They don't sit in
isolation to each other. The best way to stop abuse
and care is to keep them out of there in
the first place. So that means resourcing our communities of
all cultures to be able to look after their own.
Speaker 1 (14:40):
There's been a lot of talk about how to actually
quantify someone's trauma as well with the redress.
Speaker 3 (14:46):
Hey, oh absolutely, and a lot of this is kind of,
you know, providing evidence from when you were a child,
any records that can be found, and this is in
part why it takes so long. If you go to
the Ministry of so Development and the lawyer makes an
application to get all the records. It takes some time
to get all those records, and then you have to
(15:07):
kind of build the case. And there's lenk the interviews
that take place about a man or a woman's life,
how that has gone, what difficulties they've faced, How could
that be attributed? Is that attributed to the abuse that
they occurred? So all those sorts of things you need
to be considered.
Speaker 1 (15:25):
Prime Minister Christopher Luxen is expected to deliver an apology
on behalf of the country in November, but what should
be the next steps after that?
Speaker 3 (15:35):
Survivors would hope that action begins well before November. This
is an incredibly dark chapter in New Zealand where survivors
were silenced, some claimed cover ups of complaints, and this
has impacted the most marginalized groups in society. We had
church leaders who befriended families to get access to and
(15:58):
sexually abused chill children. And it's about time we faced
up to this. It's about time the church authorities face
up to this and the government and we see some
sort of tangible action because that's the concern from survivors.
It's time for accountability and action. And the important thing
to remember is that survivors have come out and done
(16:19):
this to prevent it happening again, and as we know
that the abuse is ongoing at the moment, there's no
shortage of stories of concerns about the functions of agencies
like ordering a tamadiki. So I guess the next steps
in terms of what survivors would want is real action
(16:41):
and real accountability.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
Now, thanks for joining us, Michael. That said, for this
episode of the Front Page. You can read more about
today's stories and extensive news coverage at enzadherld dot co
dot z. The Front Page is produced by Ethan Seles
with sound engineer Paddy Fox. I'm Chelsea Daniels. Subscribe to
(17:07):
The Front Page on iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts,
and tune in to Morrow for another look behind the headlines.
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