November 9, 2024 • 36 mins
With exam season just around the corner, John Cowan joins Tim Beveridge to let you know how you can help your children in the lead-up.
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from news Talk s'b.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
I was waiting for the lyrics to change for that song,
but it's pretty much we Are Family, and it just
keeps going over. But it was a great way to
introduce my next hour, which is The Parents Squad. By
the way, if you've missed any of our previous hours,
I'm Tim Beveridge. This is the Weekend Collective and that
is what you search for when you go to IART Radio,
look for the Weekend Collective and we get our hours
up pretty quickly. After the show's finished, you can catch
up with any anything you've missed, but of course the
(01:00):
time to call in is while it's live eight one
hundred eighty ten eighty text nine two nine two. But
by the way, just if you did miss the panel,
we had a great time with a peat, Wolf Camp
and Brad Olsen and my previous guest for a one
roof radio show was Ed McKnight. But right now we're
moving on because it's the Parents Squad and as I say,
we want your cause my guest is no studio, he's
(01:21):
no stranger. In fact, he's part of the newstalk Zibbie family. Really,
he's a parent, any expert in all round lovely chap
and he looks like he's on a shirt today. It's
John Cowan.
Speaker 3 (01:30):
Oh yeah, I actually been to three funerals today.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
Oh oh my godness. Ok, well that makes me feel
a bit stink.
Speaker 3 (01:38):
Actually it wasn't your funeral, so it's okay.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
Well, no, that would be something of a miracle, wouldn't ad.
I was managed to host my own radio show afterwards. Okay, well,
I'm sorry to hear that was it from?
Speaker 3 (01:50):
And I was officiating it too, and a friend of
the third one.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
I'm sorry to hear that. John.
Speaker 3 (01:56):
Yeah, but it's an odd, odd day that you go
to the year. I've never had to do that before.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
No, that is a very intense. God, she must be
rung out. Are you rung out?
Speaker 3 (02:05):
If I'm not after while I'm actually talking, just reach
across and give us the nuge? But no, no, it's fine.
They were, it's it's it's stimulating. It's actually interesting being
a celebrant. It puts you're right in the midst of
a whole lot of family life and humanity and humanity.
And the good thing was we didn't have to tell
any lies today. They were lovely people that we sadly miss,
(02:25):
but there are great stories.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
It is they are also occasion if someone has lived,
unless it's a tragedy, if somebody has lived a full life.
It's amazing how much laughter can be at funerals because
they were always. While there's sadness, there are always lovely,
heartwarming stories and funny things, recollections and things.
Speaker 3 (02:47):
People sometimes wonder if that's appropriate or not, But I
think a few good funeral's got shape. Yes, where you
do descend down into feeling very sad and grieving, there
is tragic you know, even an old person like that
day today. One of the people I buried today was
more than one hundred yet still said, and but you
(03:08):
you do come back up out of that, and it's
pit of the healing I think after after a bereavement.
Speaker 2 (03:13):
Yeah, so whole range of emotions. Well, yeah, anyway, that's
not what we're talking about.
Speaker 3 (03:16):
But you did comment on my shirt, Lareen's at an exponent.
Speaker 4 (03:19):
Actually, what I was thinking, I was thinking that flirt
that shirt is a little too festive for me, A
fairly festive funeral shirt. Anyway, if I had, if I
if I was really going to go the whole hog,
and then I'd be like, let's take a photo of
John's shirt, stick it on the weekend, collect the Facebook
page and.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
Say too festive.
Speaker 3 (03:40):
Anyway, if there's not too many bananas and oranges on anyway,
The parents are fairly low key.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
I'm very tempted to take that photo on the break,
but we'll think about that anyway. I one highty ten eighty. Look,
we want to talk about that is exam season, and
I don't know if exam stress is more than it
was when in my day I stressed about exams, but
I I wasn't neurotic about it. I wasn't didn't really
I crammed, I did everything last minute, and I guess
(04:11):
I backed myself. I didn't really. I don't recall worrying
about exams, but.
Speaker 3 (04:16):
I should have worried more.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
You should have worried more. And one of my daughters
is into the exam age where it's early days and
they aren't that consequential. And I think part of the
reason the school has exams, you know, and the tour
the two years proceeding in CEA, is so that the
kids can get ready for it. But there is a
lot of anxiety that goes with it, And I just
(04:39):
wonder what you do as a parent with in terms
of encouraging your kids and how to deal with it
when they are sort of losing the plot.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
Well, the stress profiles, I guess for different kids vary
with their personality, but also a big factor is the
stress of the parent. Some parents project upon their kids
their own anxieties and stress, possibly stemming from the fact
that they are living their life for care through their kids.
Their children's success is their success, and so you better
not let me down by failure this exam, Oh my god.
(05:12):
And kids are very sensitive to that. They've probably been
picking that up their whole life. But there are things
you can do to help your kids with stress. And
you're talking about your kids doing exams early on, that's
fantastic to lay down some good attitudes to exams. And
the big thing is, of course, get in early and
start laying down the groundwork. You know, the people that
(05:37):
gets most stress to the ones that are just hovering
around whether they're going to pass or not, and those
that are aiming for let's get one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
And I think probably where it can come from is
that the kids have this expectation that if they can't
get an excellent or something, then that's a fail. And
I've heard that from I was chatting with friends whose
kids are like that. They've just got their expectations so
high that that's where the in fact, they think. Even
(06:05):
my daughter was expressing what she really wanted to get,
why she was worried that what it would mean if
she didn't, I said, honey, it won't mean anything. Well,
I'm not sure if that was the right way to
put it, but I said, I said, these exams don't matter.
All they are is an opportunity for you to learn
and get some practice. And you know what, if you
if everything was easy, then you'd wonder what the point
(06:26):
of it all was. But I'm not sure I dealt
with the brilliant ame. So we want your course, how
do you help your kids deal with exam anxiety.
Speaker 3 (06:36):
I'd also like to know whether people think exams have
passed their cell by date, like I'm sure favor that's
a hot take. And but you know, in all the
different ways of assessing performance and how people are doing,
do exams really have their place anymore?
Speaker 5 (06:52):
You know?
Speaker 3 (06:53):
I have an opinion that yes, they usually give an
indication of how much someone knows about something, but it's
pretty rough and when it comes down to discern you
know that someone who's got forty nine percent doesn't qualifying
someone that got fifty one percent does.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
Thank goodness for that, say.
Speaker 3 (07:13):
Ces for degrees, Yes, that's the phrase.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
That is. I think that's kind of a retro approach
to get degrees.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
And the thing is that attitude, which where you think
you're clever, you know you work, you get forty nine percent,
you didn't work hard enough for fifty one percent, you
work too hard. That's that's such a dumb idea because
it robbed me of what you're really at school and
university for, and that's actually learned something.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
And that's the thing.
Speaker 3 (07:41):
The exam prep sometimes, I think works against actually getting
an education if you're just thinking what's going to be
in that exam paper rather than let's master this topic
and I've got example show that.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
Actually that's interesting because I'm not so much for schoolwork.
But when I was doing music extracurricularly, that's the word extra, Yes,
I was, I was having great word yeah, but I
gave up doing the exams to get through the different
grades simply because I wasn't enjoying the music any longer,
but I kept up the piano. But because I think
(08:15):
actually mums supported this because she was sicking of her
in the same three pieces for a year, because how
you do the exam where there were three performance pieces
you would have to do. I think it was that,
and so I would start learning them a year out
because some of them are quite complex. And I think
my mum supported me getting off the exams, but it
(08:36):
was like sid, if I hear that piece of me
that one more time. But that is the point around
exams that if all your schooling is about just exams.
But of course if you are aiming for certain careers
you want to get to med school you or you
want to get into well, many tertiary courses are competitive. Unfortunately,
(08:57):
you've got to have a sort of objective standard. Therefore
it has to be an external assessment. And that's life.
Speaker 3 (09:03):
As much as I might have some name be p
be liberal attitudes to exams, it's not going to change
the world, and your kids are going to probably have
to encounter them, so they might as well do it well.
But the thing is just keep in focus the idea
that you're wanting your kids to actually learn, and the
best thing to do is to start that encouragement early on,
you know. And so a good you know, exams will
(09:25):
a kid that does the work will pass.
Speaker 2 (09:28):
That's that's the basic thing, you know.
Speaker 3 (09:30):
And so it's not so much a measure matter where
you're clever or dumb. It's a measure of actually have
you put the put the yards in.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
And if you've got a young a young person who's
doing exams, how and they are saying, I really I'm
just really so scared about this because I you know,
I've worked hard and everything, but I just you know,
I'm just worried. I'm going to panic and if I
don't finish, I'm not going to get the mark. And
they're just expressing whole lot of things. What is what
(09:58):
is okay? Father or Uncle John?
Speaker 3 (10:01):
I would say, look, I'm going to help you get
through for a start, I'm going to get your I'm
not going to let your work too hard. I'm going
to make sure that you take breaks. Never out of
reverse psychology. Now, making sure that they take breaks means
that you're also making sure that they're doing some work.
I'm going to make sure that on your study timetable
is you know, you've noted down your bedtime, you've noted
down the fact that you're going to get play in
(10:22):
PlayStation and you know, and look, that's going to win
them over, because honestly, they if they spend four or
five seasions or twenty minutes in a night studying rather
than just sitting there in a fizz worrying for hour
after hour doing doodles.
Speaker 2 (10:38):
And actually probably making sure they take a break as yeah,
well that's there. That's definitely a stage one, isn't it.
Of course they even say that really you can only
really work effectively in twenty or thirty minute in conscience.
Speaker 3 (10:50):
Right, And if your kid learns how to drive his
brain through doing this, he's done so well. If he
learns that, you know, I can stay up all night
and drink lots of coffee and everything like that, he's
learned a very very bad way of functioning.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
And yeah, so what about when I because I was
chatting to one of my daughters about this, and I
just said, you know, she was expressing some anxiety. I
don't like to share too much about when my kids
are on national radio, but you would understand, like many kids,
she's one of many who who feels a little bit
of stress about the outcome, And was it the right
(11:26):
thing for me to say? Look, ultimately, this is great
practice for you. It's an opportunity, and when something doesn't
work out, you make a decision as to how you
can do something differently, or you learn from it. But
I said, ultimately, in terms of your future, this year's
exams they don't mean anything. Or it is an opportunity
for you to just have a crack and see how
(11:48):
you go. Yeah, it feels as I was explaining that
that I didn't quite put that very well.
Speaker 3 (11:56):
Well, how did it go down?
Speaker 2 (11:58):
I don't know.
Speaker 3 (11:59):
You see the press, I wouldn't know. I would take
the opportunity to first of all, project your confidence in them.
Speaker 2 (12:06):
Yeah, And I said, I think you're amazing and you
don't have to prove anything to us, and this is
just and I don't want you to feel you have
to prove anything too much to yourself.
Speaker 3 (12:15):
Well, no, just express confidence around their performance in the exam.
You can just say you know this, you know, you
show every sign that you're going to fly through this.
Some exams you'll do work better than others, and yeah.
The thing is, as I mentioned before, the two ones
that get The ones that get most anxious about exams
(12:36):
are the ones that are just anxious about whether they'll
scrape over to get a decent past mark sort of thing,
and those that are gaming for perfection, the ones that say,
I know they don't measure exams and percentages very much
these days, but if a kid is getting forty five
percent needs fifty percent, you say, great, you know what,
how much extra do you need five percent? You know
(12:59):
you've already got forty five percent, you just need five percent.
And that puts it in perspective for them rather than thinking, oh,
I'm only a forty five percenter. No, you're a forty
five percent who needs five percent and you can do that.
Speaker 2 (13:10):
You can do that. The ones I haven't I feel
for the ones who are trying to get you know,
either requisent ninety seven percent to get into med school
or something. And the pressure, Yeah, the pressure you'd feel.
There's no way of saying, look, you can't say to them,
I don't worry, it's it's no big deal.
Speaker 3 (13:27):
If it's a life dream and everything, it's a yeah,
med school. And some of those other ones which have
a very limited intake and base it all on academic performance. Yeah,
that's a that's a big topic that I sat next
to the president of the Society of Physicians of Australasia
or something, and I said, how are we getting the
(13:48):
right students as med students just by doing it on
academic progress? He said absolutely not, which I thought was
interesting that but so that's a that's a different topic.
Speaker 2 (13:58):
That's a different topic. Yeah, that is an interesting topic.
Speaker 3 (14:00):
But we say that aren't necessarily the you know, the
ones who have academic prowess, the ones of a huge
range of intellectual and social skills.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
Yeah, well that's probably where they should also be interviewing them.
And I sit down as well.
Speaker 3 (14:12):
I'm sure they do.
Speaker 2 (14:13):
Actually, perhaps they do, and I don't know about that.
To comment, let's take some calls on this. How do
you account your kids deal with their own expectations and
their own anxiety around exam performance. Give us a call
if you have the answer, we'd love to hear from you.
At eight one hundred eighty ten eighty text ninety two Helen, Hello.
Speaker 6 (14:33):
Oh, yeah, hi, I'd like to talk about the problems
for some anyway, students with disabilities oh, having exams now,
if you've got a writing problem or you know, and
you just can't write very fast or can't write much
at all, and you can't and you can't do it
by computer because everything's too you're too slow. Well, they
(14:55):
used says, give you a red writer. But I think
that's absolutely ridiculous, because why can't you do direct direct
onto you, direct audio instead of having this person in between. Now, now,
I just remember while I was waiting for this call
about a woman called Joyce, who I met when after
I left school, when I was at the White you know,
(15:20):
living at the YWCCA. Now, she was blind and what
had happened to her was that she was partially cited,
and then she had two exams in one day and
they were an extra half hour, and when she woke
up the next morning, she was completely blind because she'd
exhausted all her vision. And it is a real problem.
(15:41):
And I think that the I think, for instance, that
the reader writer thing should be scrapped and you should
be able to do your exam directly into a cete
taper whatever they equivalent.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
That is a pretty specialist area actually for us to
be able to offer any well, I'm not going to
offer any wisdom on.
Speaker 3 (15:56):
It, but I'm grateful Helen that you've sort of alerted
me the idea that, yes, gosh, there's some people that
will be a lot more difficult for people, and not
people just not just people with disabilities, but people for
whom they may have come into New Zealand with English
as a second language and all sorts of extra things.
I hope, Hongwood, hope that our educationalists take that into
(16:17):
account of it. But you're saying that there's still these troubles.
Speaker 2 (16:19):
But yeah, but.
Speaker 3 (16:21):
Thanks very much for bring us to our attention.
Speaker 2 (16:23):
Yeah, thanks, thanks for calling that gets thought about and
acted upon. Yeah, Actually, somebody, there's quite quite a few
somebody just saying that actually exams are about I'm just
trying to find the text that I suddenly disappeared from
my screen. Sorry, but that Sam's are on your performance. Indeed,
(16:45):
that exams are actually a test of people's discipline and
a certain extent. That's right. Well, that's right, And I
don't actually know how the if it's at what point
everything is external, because there is often an internal assessment component.
Speaker 3 (17:01):
But well, that's why I like the NZCA system to
a large extent, because it isn't just based on exams.
There's other assessments that go and exams mainly measure how
good you are at doing exams, and if I could
do a little bit of a boast, I was a
terrible student who was quite good at doing exams, and I,
(17:22):
you know, my exam marks were probably no indication really
of you know, there were people around me that were
probably learning more and knew more about the topics than
I did. I could, I could just pull it out
during the exams, So the terrible thing to be.
Speaker 2 (17:37):
I'm not proud of that.
Speaker 3 (17:38):
I'm just saying exams are flawed in that respect.
Speaker 2 (17:41):
You you got under pressure, then.
Speaker 3 (17:43):
Well that's that's what I say. I'm good at doing exams,
But whether or not that's what you should be measuring.
If you're measuring someone's ability to knuckle down and know
how to study and things like that and learn about something,
that's far more valuable.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
The argument, I mean, I guess there's the reality argument
that often a lot of the think tests that you
have to sort of that you are undergo in the
real world are not always fair in a sort of
a group hard are they? That life is tough and
if exams, if exams are just one of those things
that if you learn discipline, this person says absolutely not.
(18:19):
Of course they do. They teach discipline. We're tested daily
in the real world, and exams are important. So that's
a little bit pretty much as close as it gets
to listen that they happen, suck it up, just get
into it. Actually, is there something in that? Of course
there is something that you just say, listen, darling, this
is something you have to deal with, and you know
(18:40):
what everyone asks us to deal with it, and it
just get into it and do your best. That's what
you can explore.
Speaker 3 (18:47):
I just sometimes wonder whether exams unfairly don't really show
the performance of some people that are actually working quite
hard and do everything like that. As I say, I'm
still basically in favor of exams. I just think they
could be done a bit better and augmented with other
forms of assessment, which I think they do.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
Okay, So look, maybe we could put this another way.
It's exams and that's that time of the year, but
it's about just performance in general. If your kids are
stressed about having to reach a certain standard, how do
you help them deal with that anxiety. In fact, how
do you teach them about putting everything in perspective? I
think that's probably the broader way of asking that question,
(19:26):
isn't it.
Speaker 3 (19:26):
Well, Actually, learning to handle stress is one of life's
big life, big master skills. I mean, most of us
will probably die for the stress related illnesses later in life.
And you know, don't stress, honey, It'll kill you. Knowing
how to handle stress is a great skill to learn.
Maybe this is a learning opportunity, and I can talk
a bit, but we'll get into that in just a moment.
(19:48):
We're going to take a moment, though. You can give
us a call. We'd love to hear from you.
Speaker 2 (19:51):
One hundred and eighty ten eighty How do you help
your children keep their perspective amongst when it comes to
performance anxiety? Given that it is now exam season and
there may be some stressful people in your household, how
do you help them deal with it? Eight hundred eighty
ten eighty text nine two it's coming out to twenty
seven past five news talks. He'd be.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
The fall of the way in the night.
Speaker 2 (20:39):
Yes, welcome back to the parents Squad on the weekend
Collective Onton Beverage My guest is John Cown. He's a
parenting expert and all round good guy and a very
festive shirt today. May I say sorry, I'm just you're
just kidding, because yeah, I thought, actually when when you
when John turned up, I thought, that's a really lovely
fest of shirt. And then he mentioned he'd been officiating
(21:01):
at a couple of funerals, and I was like, oh,
but it was a plain time dark jackets. So I'm
teasing you because it's fun teasing me. Yeah, I am. Look,
we're talking about exam stress with kids and how do
you deal with it. Let's do a few We'll have
a look at a bit of the text. Correspondse we'd
love to hear from you on e one hundred and
eighty ten to eighty. Kids don't need this nonsense. Leave
them alone. If they fail, that's fine. It's for them
(21:21):
to find their own way. That's actually sort of what
do we make of that, because there's this part of
that text sort of appeals to me. It's like, look,
just do your best. If you fail, then you know
the life will reveal another path. That's right.
Speaker 3 (21:36):
I mean, you don't want to dump a whole lot
of your extra stress on them, though I would like
to think we would also encourage them to do their best.
Speaker 2 (21:44):
But yeah, okay. Another one says, if your test kids regularly,
then they don't get tested and freaked out by exams. Look,
I think that's the whole thing. Practice makes perfect, and
I would support all the schools who actually do introduce
some sort of testing in the years before n CEA,
so when the children do encounter those external exams, it's
not something new. It's been sort of off in the distance,
(22:06):
like that train coming towards you.
Speaker 3 (22:08):
Now.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
Other one says him back in the day, I got
quite anxious about exams. I am academically inclined sixth form certificate.
Remember that. I recall my friend Rachel saying, well, if
you don't pass, imagine how many other people won't pass,
which brought me back to earth. It's a tenant I
apply to others and to myself this day. Everything in perspective.
It's a mixture between realizing that everyone's in the same boat,
(22:29):
but also perhaps charden freud, because you know, if I fail,
then it's wow, these other people have been really bad.
I was once in an exam for law school for
a paper called advanced public law, and I deliberately took
it on because I hated public law, but I thought,
I need to conquer this my bet noir, my demon
(22:53):
sort of subject. And the exam question was really hard,
was really hard. And the funny thing was I was
almost relieved when the brightest guy in law school, who
got a pluses for every exam he ever did, and
with a PhD in philosophy, he locked up and looked
(23:14):
around the room with this gesture like, oh my god,
what is this? And I thought, I thank goodness, Paul
finds it hard. It was such a relief. The brightest
guy in the room was outraged, and there we go.
Another one says exams are engauge on how much you
know about a specific subject, but also learning how to
deal with pressuous situations. It's part of learning, and it's
(23:36):
how to manage your anxiety. You learn, it's all the better.
Speaker 3 (23:38):
And that's where parents can do some extra coaching. So
can I urge you too, now, go in often while
your kids are studying with snacks and things like that,
and just check how they're doing, and just to make
sure that they're not drifting off and watching techtok and
things like that. Because that's kids are very easily distracted,
but also some of the things that they need to
learn about anxiety and handling stress. One is what you
(24:00):
do for your body, you're doing for your brain. And
so get them out jogging, get them going to the gym,
and like a lot of things, you know, doing a
little bit of extra of something physical. Just boost your
performance academically. And so this is a great thing they
can do that stress that they do need to sleep
That on all night and all night cramming session is
(24:26):
so counterproductive. It might seem like a brilliant idea, but yeah,
so teaching them how to handle stress. But watch your
kids because some kids, older adolescents tip into genuine mental
health problems at about that age, and so you've got
to be watching your kids and making sure that they
are well coping and having breaks and having rest and
eating well and sleeping well.
Speaker 2 (24:48):
It does time to something else I wanted to talk
about as well, to do with anxiety and disappointment, and
that is helping your kids navigate heartbreak, which is something
that's quite different, but it nevertheless can cause more misery
than anything. Because here's the way I A I will
look at it the first boyfriend or girlfriend. Now this
(25:10):
sounds a bit miserable, but of course it is ultimately
headed for disappointment because it's going to end. Not many
people end up marrying their school sweetheart, So most, I
would say, ninety nine percent of boy first boyfriends and
girlfriends and on the head for heartbreak. How pessimistic, But.
Speaker 3 (25:29):
Could I suggest that you don't dump that on your
adolescent when sighing, do ide about their later about their
about their first love.
Speaker 2 (25:39):
Just letten, you ride the waves of ecstasy and disappointment.
Actually you have to, don't you. Well.
Speaker 3 (25:45):
Survey after survey shows that the greatest source of human
happiness is intimate relationships. You know, the fact that we're
in our loving relationships really really most makers happy. It's
the opposite for young teenagers young you know, my thirty
(26:06):
seven year old marriage is a great the greatest source
of happiness, stability, and mental health in my life. But
for young teenagers it's the opposite. It is the biggest
source of stress. And one of the things is what
it does for your self esteem. When someone is telling
you you're beautiful, you're handsome, you're capable, you're the one,
you're so funny and everything like this. You of course
(26:29):
you believe it when it's coming from someone you love,
and it does wonderful things for your self esteem. But
then when the relationship breaks, as you say inevitably it will,
it reverses all those statements. And so that's the thing.
When your teenager is broken hearted, it's not just that
they have lost someone that they were caring about, that
(26:50):
lost something in themselves. It reverses so much of their
self esteem. They doubt themselves and that makes them very,
very vulnerable to rebound, which is a real real thing
because they will seek to get that affirmation from someone
else and they could be.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
Taking What is the best way for parents to handle that?
Because I've thought ahead to this and I've thought that
all I'm going to do is just be there and
listen to them and give them hugs and just be
that ere that they can pour out everything they want
to and just say and you're not trying to offer advice,
because I think trying to offer advice. It's all you
need to do, is I understand. I guess I'm guessing,
(27:29):
and this is where I've run it by you. But
you just say, look, I love you, darling, and I'm
just here to listen. And I know it must really hurt.
I remember how bad it is, and you know, just
trust me that you will feel better eventually. But when
you're you know, I'm just here for you. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (27:43):
Good on you with the attitude to advice, because culture
as supposed to.
Speaker 2 (27:49):
Get over it. You'll find another.
Speaker 3 (27:51):
Culture makes our teenager's brains teflong coated to advice. But
could I suggest that when your teenagers are in a relationship,
be so friendly to their new partner or boyfrid friend.
Give them food, invite them in, treat them like they're like,
like they are wonderful, and everything like this, because then
(28:12):
at least you can talk to your child about them afterwards.
If you treat them like there's something you'd scrape off
your shoe, if you can see that they're a loser,
if you can see that they you know, no way
is this relationship going away. And you show that and
treat them with contempt or you know, put them down
as well, your child will never talk to you about
that boyfriend, girlfriend or any other boyfriend or girlfriend. But
(28:35):
if you're polite, welcoming and let them, you know, invite
them into your home and everything like that there's a
number of good things that will come from that. For
the resart, your teenager will talk to you about them
when you say, yeah, what do they think about such
and such? He seems like a nice guy? Is he
doing okay at school? What's their mum and dad?
Speaker 6 (28:49):
You know?
Speaker 3 (28:49):
And you can talk about things like that, which will
switch your kid's brain on about actually he's not that smart. Yeah,
and no, he's not really aligned with the things that
I think are important. You know, they've got a brain,
they've got your brain.
Speaker 2 (29:02):
Actually, it's funny. I think my kids will probably be
the opposite. Prom They'll be like, can you stop? Don't
They'll they'll think I'm trying to be too friendly, and
they are like, okay, stop talking.
Speaker 3 (29:11):
That's a good problems. That's a better problem than not
treating them. Well, okay, if you're gonna have if you're
gonna make a mistake, that'd be the way. And and
the other I remember meeting. I haven't seen this. It
wasn't firsthand, but I've met I've seen parents in action
where dad was really nice to the new boyfriend because
(29:33):
they had seen former other boyfriends get their hearts broken
by their daughter.
Speaker 2 (29:38):
I've got to be nice to you because eventually my
daughter is going to break your heart, and so you
don't need any grief from me.
Speaker 3 (29:46):
The other thing is if you treat it, perhaps you
know your daughter's boyfriend, your son's girlfriends, well, if they
like you, they'll treat your son or daughter better. I
mean this is just a general rule. If you treat
your kid's friends well, they'll reward you by first of
all not breaking in and robbing your house, but also
I lock it, but because they want your friendship, because
(30:08):
teenagers love the friendship really of older adults, not so
much their own parents, but they love it when you
show them respect, genuine has freaked in interest, and so
they all reward you by looking after your kid.
Speaker 2 (30:22):
We'd love to hear from you on how you've how
you've met. We started the show talking about anxiety when
it comes to performance, anxiety with exams, but the other
side of you just your kids soaring emotions, your teenagers
soaring emotions, but also how do you help them handle
their first heartbreak? Give us a call eight hundred eighty
ten eighty text nine nine two. John Cown is my guest,
(30:42):
as if I needed to tell you those reassuring mellifluous
tones of the cowen will be back after the break,
which is allowed Forlis Milifluous. I had to look that
up to twenty minutes to sex News talks, he'd be.
Speaker 1 (31:05):
Guess.
Speaker 2 (31:06):
Welcome back to the Weekend Collective. This is the parents Squad.
My guest is John Cown talking about dealing with well,
you're broadly speaking, your teenagers soaring emotions, whether it be
exams or heartbreak. Let's go to Jan.
Speaker 7 (31:17):
Hello, Hi there, John, and Tim.
Speaker 2 (31:20):
Hello jam Hi.
Speaker 7 (31:23):
Now I think it's good to sit at the table
and talk as a family. Often siblings will be more
honest with each other rather than hearing it from parents.
And if parents can just ask questions to draw them out,
and then the other siblings will give some honest answers
(31:45):
and they have more right to because they're on the
way same wavelength.
Speaker 2 (31:50):
Are siblings? Are sibling's kind? Those siblings can be quite brutal,
can't they?
Speaker 7 (31:55):
Yeah, But at least they're honest, do you know? And
they can respond to each other, which they might not
do to parents. But just leave it as an open discussion,
get it out on the table, so to speak, and
with it. Sam good to do wrote learning if you
(32:16):
teach them the first letter of lists of things to
make it into a sort of poem, you know, jumped
over the lazy horse, easy to remember lists. And also
parents can be involved in the study process by testing them,
(32:40):
you know, asking them questions about the subject and testing
the knowledge level.
Speaker 3 (32:47):
And fine learning right from an early age is very
very valuable.
Speaker 2 (32:55):
Thank you very much for that. Thanks, I'm good. Throwing
it open to your brothers and sisters is always helpful.
Imagine with the heartbreak, it's like, you know how little
little Amy's got a heartbroken and Johnny help her out. Ah, well, yeah.
Speaker 3 (33:12):
Look a heartache or broken heartedness or something like this.
So I was, I was intrigued because normally it's just
talked about dismissively and everything. And I was looking up
looking it up on the internet a year or two back,
and it is sort of a mental illness to that,
that terrible depression, that pain of emotions, you know. And
(33:33):
so we might sometimes be sort of somewhat mocking or
amused at our kids pain about that, thinking it's only
puppy love, but it's real enough to the puppies pain.
Speaker 4 (33:45):
You.
Speaker 2 (33:45):
Okay, look, let's not talk about the pain of you
adult divorce and all that sort of thing, but the
emotional highs of that first heartbreak up limit intense.
Speaker 3 (33:54):
Especially because it's probably the first time in your life
you felt something like that.
Speaker 2 (33:58):
I remember. Actually, let's get another call Jeff.
Speaker 5 (34:01):
Hello, Yeah, I guys, how are you good?
Speaker 2 (34:04):
Thanks?
Speaker 5 (34:06):
Just going back to your earlier comments regarding the education
system and exams, I just sort of wonder if we
should sort of be going back to where we were.
I mean, I'm sixty years old and I went through
the education system right up to university entrance level. So
(34:29):
I'm just sort of chucking it out there. What was
actually wrong with the original system like schools to forget Well,
I can.
Speaker 3 (34:36):
Tell you what's wrong with it. I can tell you
what's wrong with it. I was designed to make half
the people going to school feel like failures. I mean,
when I went to good Old Henderson Maximum Security High
back in the nineteen seventies, because I'm only just a
year or two older than you, you know, half the
school left when they turned fifteen, and then half the
people that sat school were expected to fail it. In fact,
(34:58):
I think it was scaled it so and so you're
out of a school of over one thousand, you had
one hundred in the sixth form, seventeen in the seventh
form year twelve or thirteen, and so it was of
course you've got to get great performances from those kids
that actually get through it. But it's already scraped a
whole lot of kids off and say, you're not you're
not going to kid any any good.
Speaker 5 (35:19):
I get what you're saying.
Speaker 3 (35:20):
That.
Speaker 5 (35:20):
Back in the day, we've also had and two A
sists over the sex form level. So those that performed
contestant way throughout the year, yeah, were credit credited.
Speaker 3 (35:34):
That was a progressive approach to it. But the actual
school cert exam that I thought you were sort of
referring to, I thought was you know it was it
was cruel.
Speaker 2 (35:43):
I forgot about the old credited that you think. Anyway, Hey, look,
time's flown so much. We're going to wrap it up there, John,
But oh you know, yeah, I know where to go. Well,
you can hang around for the Sports wrap, which is
always very exciting. We've got Clay Wilson John us to
have a chat about what's come out with sport. But
any parting sort of.
Speaker 3 (36:01):
Words of observation I would say that we was to
do a lot worse than listen at seven Thirtymorrow night
to Real Life. And I've got Mark Vetti, the animal
trainer who trained the dogs to drive the cars and
blimey and been on three TV shows and train dogs
for Lord of the Rings and things like that.
Speaker 2 (36:17):
So he'll be my.
Speaker 3 (36:18):
Guest tomorrow at Real Life.
Speaker 2 (36:20):
The brain's just about potty training your dog. I've been
give him to drive the cards like I'll ask him
good stuff, John. We'll be back to rat sport in
just a moment. It's eleven minutes to Sex News Talks EDB.
Speaker 1 (36:36):
For more from the weekend collective, listen live to News
Talks EDB weekends from three pm, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio
You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from news Talk s'b.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
I was waiting for the lyrics to change for that song,
but it's pretty much we Are Family, and it just
keeps going over. But it was a great way to
introduce my next hour, which is The Parents Squad. By
the way, if you've missed any of our previous hours,
I'm Tim Beveridge. This is the Weekend Collective and that
is what you search for when you go to IART Radio,
look for the Weekend Collective and we get our hours
up pretty quickly. After the show's finished, you can catch
up with any anything you've missed, but of course the
(01:00):
time to call in is while it's live eight one
hundred eighty ten eighty text nine two nine two. But
by the way, just if you did miss the panel,
we had a great time with a peat, Wolf Camp
and Brad Olsen and my previous guest for a one
roof radio show was Ed McKnight. But right now we're
moving on because it's the Parents Squad and as I say,
we want your cause my guest is no studio, he's
(01:21):
no stranger. In fact, he's part of the newstalk Zibbie family. Really,
he's a parent, any expert in all round lovely chap
and he looks like he's on a shirt today. It's
John Cowan.
Speaker 3 (01:30):
Oh yeah, I actually been to three funerals today.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
Oh oh my godness. Ok, well that makes me feel
a bit stink.
Speaker 3 (01:38):
Actually it wasn't your funeral, so it's okay.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
Well, no, that would be something of a miracle, wouldn't ad.
I was managed to host my own radio show afterwards. Okay, well,
I'm sorry to hear that was it from?
Speaker 3 (01:50):
And I was officiating it too, and a friend of
the third one.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
I'm sorry to hear that. John.
Speaker 3 (01:56):
Yeah, but it's an odd, odd day that you go
to the year. I've never had to do that before.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
No, that is a very intense. God, she must be
rung out. Are you rung out?
Speaker 3 (02:05):
If I'm not after while I'm actually talking, just reach
across and give us the nuge? But no, no, it's fine.
They were, it's it's it's stimulating. It's actually interesting being
a celebrant. It puts you're right in the midst of
a whole lot of family life and humanity and humanity.
And the good thing was we didn't have to tell
any lies today. They were lovely people that we sadly miss,
(02:25):
but there are great stories.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
It is they are also occasion if someone has lived,
unless it's a tragedy, if somebody has lived a full life.
It's amazing how much laughter can be at funerals because
they were always. While there's sadness, there are always lovely,
heartwarming stories and funny things, recollections and things.
Speaker 3 (02:47):
People sometimes wonder if that's appropriate or not, But I
think a few good funeral's got shape. Yes, where you
do descend down into feeling very sad and grieving, there
is tragic you know, even an old person like that
day today. One of the people I buried today was
more than one hundred yet still said, and but you
(03:08):
you do come back up out of that, and it's
pit of the healing I think after after a bereavement.
Speaker 2 (03:13):
Yeah, so whole range of emotions. Well, yeah, anyway, that's
not what we're talking about.
Speaker 3 (03:16):
But you did comment on my shirt, Lareen's at an exponent.
Speaker 4 (03:19):
Actually, what I was thinking, I was thinking that flirt
that shirt is a little too festive for me, A
fairly festive funeral shirt. Anyway, if I had, if I
if I was really going to go the whole hog,
and then I'd be like, let's take a photo of
John's shirt, stick it on the weekend, collect the Facebook
page and.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
Say too festive.
Speaker 3 (03:40):
Anyway, if there's not too many bananas and oranges on anyway,
The parents are fairly low key.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
I'm very tempted to take that photo on the break,
but we'll think about that anyway. I one highty ten eighty. Look,
we want to talk about that is exam season, and
I don't know if exam stress is more than it
was when in my day I stressed about exams, but
I I wasn't neurotic about it. I wasn't didn't really
I crammed, I did everything last minute, and I guess
(04:11):
I backed myself. I didn't really. I don't recall worrying
about exams, but.
Speaker 3 (04:16):
I should have worried more.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
You should have worried more. And one of my daughters
is into the exam age where it's early days and
they aren't that consequential. And I think part of the
reason the school has exams, you know, and the tour
the two years proceeding in CEA, is so that the
kids can get ready for it. But there is a
lot of anxiety that goes with it, And I just
(04:39):
wonder what you do as a parent with in terms
of encouraging your kids and how to deal with it
when they are sort of losing the plot.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
Well, the stress profiles, I guess for different kids vary
with their personality, but also a big factor is the
stress of the parent. Some parents project upon their kids
their own anxieties and stress, possibly stemming from the fact
that they are living their life for care through their kids.
Their children's success is their success, and so you better
not let me down by failure this exam, Oh my god.
(05:12):
And kids are very sensitive to that. They've probably been
picking that up their whole life. But there are things
you can do to help your kids with stress. And
you're talking about your kids doing exams early on, that's
fantastic to lay down some good attitudes to exams. And
the big thing is, of course, get in early and
start laying down the groundwork. You know, the people that
(05:37):
gets most stress to the ones that are just hovering
around whether they're going to pass or not, and those
that are aiming for let's get one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
And I think probably where it can come from is
that the kids have this expectation that if they can't
get an excellent or something, then that's a fail. And
I've heard that from I was chatting with friends whose
kids are like that. They've just got their expectations so
high that that's where the in fact, they think. Even
(06:05):
my daughter was expressing what she really wanted to get,
why she was worried that what it would mean if
she didn't, I said, honey, it won't mean anything. Well,
I'm not sure if that was the right way to
put it, but I said, I said, these exams don't matter.
All they are is an opportunity for you to learn
and get some practice. And you know what, if you
if everything was easy, then you'd wonder what the point
(06:26):
of it all was. But I'm not sure I dealt
with the brilliant ame. So we want your course, how
do you help your kids deal with exam anxiety.
Speaker 3 (06:36):
I'd also like to know whether people think exams have
passed their cell by date, like I'm sure favor that's
a hot take. And but you know, in all the
different ways of assessing performance and how people are doing,
do exams really have their place anymore?
Speaker 5 (06:52):
You know?
Speaker 3 (06:53):
I have an opinion that yes, they usually give an
indication of how much someone knows about something, but it's
pretty rough and when it comes down to discern you
know that someone who's got forty nine percent doesn't qualifying
someone that got fifty one percent does.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
Thank goodness for that, say.
Speaker 3 (07:13):
Ces for degrees, Yes, that's the phrase.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
That is. I think that's kind of a retro approach
to get degrees.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
And the thing is that attitude, which where you think
you're clever, you know you work, you get forty nine percent,
you didn't work hard enough for fifty one percent, you
work too hard. That's that's such a dumb idea because
it robbed me of what you're really at school and
university for, and that's actually learned something.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
And that's the thing.
Speaker 3 (07:41):
The exam prep sometimes, I think works against actually getting
an education if you're just thinking what's going to be
in that exam paper rather than let's master this topic
and I've got example show that.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
Actually that's interesting because I'm not so much for schoolwork.
But when I was doing music extracurricularly, that's the word extra, Yes,
I was, I was having great word yeah, but I
gave up doing the exams to get through the different
grades simply because I wasn't enjoying the music any longer,
but I kept up the piano. But because I think
(08:15):
actually mums supported this because she was sicking of her
in the same three pieces for a year, because how
you do the exam where there were three performance pieces
you would have to do. I think it was that,
and so I would start learning them a year out
because some of them are quite complex. And I think
my mum supported me getting off the exams, but it
(08:36):
was like sid, if I hear that piece of me
that one more time. But that is the point around
exams that if all your schooling is about just exams.
But of course if you are aiming for certain careers
you want to get to med school you or you
want to get into well, many tertiary courses are competitive. Unfortunately,
(08:57):
you've got to have a sort of objective standard. Therefore
it has to be an external assessment. And that's life.
Speaker 3 (09:03):
As much as I might have some name be p
be liberal attitudes to exams, it's not going to change
the world, and your kids are going to probably have
to encounter them, so they might as well do it well.
But the thing is just keep in focus the idea
that you're wanting your kids to actually learn, and the
best thing to do is to start that encouragement early on,
you know. And so a good you know, exams will
(09:25):
a kid that does the work will pass.
Speaker 2 (09:28):
That's that's the basic thing, you know.
Speaker 3 (09:30):
And so it's not so much a measure matter where
you're clever or dumb. It's a measure of actually have
you put the put the yards in.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
And if you've got a young a young person who's
doing exams, how and they are saying, I really I'm
just really so scared about this because I you know,
I've worked hard and everything, but I just you know,
I'm just worried. I'm going to panic and if I
don't finish, I'm not going to get the mark. And
they're just expressing whole lot of things. What is what
(09:58):
is okay? Father or Uncle John?
Speaker 3 (10:01):
I would say, look, I'm going to help you get
through for a start, I'm going to get your I'm
not going to let your work too hard. I'm going
to make sure that you take breaks. Never out of
reverse psychology. Now, making sure that they take breaks means
that you're also making sure that they're doing some work.
I'm going to make sure that on your study timetable
is you know, you've noted down your bedtime, you've noted
down the fact that you're going to get play in
(10:22):
PlayStation and you know, and look, that's going to win
them over, because honestly, they if they spend four or
five seasions or twenty minutes in a night studying rather
than just sitting there in a fizz worrying for hour
after hour doing doodles.
Speaker 2 (10:38):
And actually probably making sure they take a break as yeah,
well that's there. That's definitely a stage one, isn't it.
Of course they even say that really you can only
really work effectively in twenty or thirty minute in conscience.
Speaker 3 (10:50):
Right, And if your kid learns how to drive his
brain through doing this, he's done so well. If he
learns that, you know, I can stay up all night
and drink lots of coffee and everything like that, he's
learned a very very bad way of functioning.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
And yeah, so what about when I because I was
chatting to one of my daughters about this, and I
just said, you know, she was expressing some anxiety. I
don't like to share too much about when my kids
are on national radio, but you would understand, like many kids,
she's one of many who who feels a little bit
of stress about the outcome, And was it the right
(11:26):
thing for me to say? Look, ultimately, this is great
practice for you. It's an opportunity, and when something doesn't
work out, you make a decision as to how you
can do something differently, or you learn from it. But
I said, ultimately, in terms of your future, this year's
exams they don't mean anything. Or it is an opportunity
for you to just have a crack and see how
(11:48):
you go. Yeah, it feels as I was explaining that
that I didn't quite put that very well.
Speaker 3 (11:56):
Well, how did it go down?
Speaker 2 (11:58):
I don't know.
Speaker 3 (11:59):
You see the press, I wouldn't know. I would take
the opportunity to first of all, project your confidence in them.
Speaker 2 (12:06):
Yeah, And I said, I think you're amazing and you
don't have to prove anything to us, and this is
just and I don't want you to feel you have
to prove anything too much to yourself.
Speaker 3 (12:15):
Well, no, just express confidence around their performance in the exam.
You can just say you know this, you know, you
show every sign that you're going to fly through this.
Some exams you'll do work better than others, and yeah.
The thing is, as I mentioned before, the two ones
that get The ones that get most anxious about exams
(12:36):
are the ones that are just anxious about whether they'll
scrape over to get a decent past mark sort of thing,
and those that are gaming for perfection, the ones that say,
I know they don't measure exams and percentages very much
these days, but if a kid is getting forty five
percent needs fifty percent, you say, great, you know what,
how much extra do you need five percent? You know
(12:59):
you've already got forty five percent, you just need five percent.
And that puts it in perspective for them rather than thinking, oh,
I'm only a forty five percenter. No, you're a forty
five percent who needs five percent and you can do that.
Speaker 2 (13:10):
You can do that. The ones I haven't I feel
for the ones who are trying to get you know,
either requisent ninety seven percent to get into med school
or something. And the pressure, Yeah, the pressure you'd feel.
There's no way of saying, look, you can't say to them,
I don't worry, it's it's no big deal.
Speaker 3 (13:27):
If it's a life dream and everything, it's a yeah,
med school. And some of those other ones which have
a very limited intake and base it all on academic performance. Yeah,
that's a that's a big topic that I sat next
to the president of the Society of Physicians of Australasia
or something, and I said, how are we getting the
(13:48):
right students as med students just by doing it on
academic progress? He said absolutely not, which I thought was
interesting that but so that's a that's a different topic.
Speaker 2 (13:58):
That's a different topic. Yeah, that is an interesting topic.
Speaker 3 (14:00):
But we say that aren't necessarily the you know, the
ones who have academic prowess, the ones of a huge
range of intellectual and social skills.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
Yeah, well that's probably where they should also be interviewing them.
And I sit down as well.
Speaker 3 (14:12):
I'm sure they do.
Speaker 2 (14:13):
Actually, perhaps they do, and I don't know about that.
To comment, let's take some calls on this. How do
you account your kids deal with their own expectations and
their own anxiety around exam performance. Give us a call
if you have the answer, we'd love to hear from you.
At eight one hundred eighty ten eighty text ninety two Helen, Hello.
Speaker 6 (14:33):
Oh, yeah, hi, I'd like to talk about the problems
for some anyway, students with disabilities oh, having exams now,
if you've got a writing problem or you know, and
you just can't write very fast or can't write much
at all, and you can't and you can't do it
by computer because everything's too you're too slow. Well, they
(14:55):
used says, give you a red writer. But I think
that's absolutely ridiculous, because why can't you do direct direct
onto you, direct audio instead of having this person in between. Now, now,
I just remember while I was waiting for this call
about a woman called Joyce, who I met when after
I left school, when I was at the White you know,
(15:20):
living at the YWCCA. Now, she was blind and what
had happened to her was that she was partially cited,
and then she had two exams in one day and
they were an extra half hour, and when she woke
up the next morning, she was completely blind because she'd
exhausted all her vision. And it is a real problem.
(15:41):
And I think that the I think, for instance, that
the reader writer thing should be scrapped and you should
be able to do your exam directly into a cete
taper whatever they equivalent.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
That is a pretty specialist area actually for us to
be able to offer any well, I'm not going to
offer any wisdom on.
Speaker 3 (15:56):
It, but I'm grateful Helen that you've sort of alerted
me the idea that, yes, gosh, there's some people that
will be a lot more difficult for people, and not
people just not just people with disabilities, but people for
whom they may have come into New Zealand with English
as a second language and all sorts of extra things.
I hope, Hongwood, hope that our educationalists take that into
(16:17):
account of it. But you're saying that there's still these troubles.
Speaker 2 (16:19):
But yeah, but.
Speaker 3 (16:21):
Thanks very much for bring us to our attention.
Speaker 2 (16:23):
Yeah, thanks, thanks for calling that gets thought about and
acted upon. Yeah, Actually, somebody, there's quite quite a few
somebody just saying that actually exams are about I'm just
trying to find the text that I suddenly disappeared from
my screen. Sorry, but that Sam's are on your performance. Indeed,
(16:45):
that exams are actually a test of people's discipline and
a certain extent. That's right. Well, that's right, And I
don't actually know how the if it's at what point
everything is external, because there is often an internal assessment component.
Speaker 3 (17:01):
But well, that's why I like the NZCA system to
a large extent, because it isn't just based on exams.
There's other assessments that go and exams mainly measure how
good you are at doing exams, and if I could
do a little bit of a boast, I was a
terrible student who was quite good at doing exams, and I,
(17:22):
you know, my exam marks were probably no indication really
of you know, there were people around me that were
probably learning more and knew more about the topics than
I did. I could, I could just pull it out
during the exams, So the terrible thing to be.
Speaker 2 (17:37):
I'm not proud of that.
Speaker 3 (17:38):
I'm just saying exams are flawed in that respect.
Speaker 2 (17:41):
You you got under pressure, then.
Speaker 3 (17:43):
Well that's that's what I say. I'm good at doing exams,
But whether or not that's what you should be measuring.
If you're measuring someone's ability to knuckle down and know
how to study and things like that and learn about something,
that's far more valuable.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
The argument, I mean, I guess there's the reality argument
that often a lot of the think tests that you
have to sort of that you are undergo in the
real world are not always fair in a sort of
a group hard are they? That life is tough and
if exams, if exams are just one of those things
that if you learn discipline, this person says absolutely not.
(18:19):
Of course they do. They teach discipline. We're tested daily
in the real world, and exams are important. So that's
a little bit pretty much as close as it gets
to listen that they happen, suck it up, just get
into it. Actually, is there something in that? Of course
there is something that you just say, listen, darling, this
is something you have to deal with, and you know
(18:40):
what everyone asks us to deal with it, and it
just get into it and do your best. That's what
you can explore.
Speaker 3 (18:47):
I just sometimes wonder whether exams unfairly don't really show
the performance of some people that are actually working quite
hard and do everything like that. As I say, I'm
still basically in favor of exams. I just think they
could be done a bit better and augmented with other
forms of assessment, which I think they do.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
Okay, So look, maybe we could put this another way.
It's exams and that's that time of the year, but
it's about just performance in general. If your kids are
stressed about having to reach a certain standard, how do
you help them deal with that anxiety. In fact, how
do you teach them about putting everything in perspective? I
think that's probably the broader way of asking that question,
(19:26):
isn't it.
Speaker 3 (19:26):
Well, Actually, learning to handle stress is one of life's
big life, big master skills. I mean, most of us
will probably die for the stress related illnesses later in life.
And you know, don't stress, honey, It'll kill you. Knowing
how to handle stress is a great skill to learn.
Maybe this is a learning opportunity, and I can talk
a bit, but we'll get into that in just a moment.
(19:48):
We're going to take a moment, though. You can give
us a call. We'd love to hear from you.
Speaker 2 (19:51):
One hundred and eighty ten eighty How do you help
your children keep their perspective amongst when it comes to
performance anxiety? Given that it is now exam season and
there may be some stressful people in your household, how
do you help them deal with it? Eight hundred eighty
ten eighty text nine two it's coming out to twenty
seven past five news talks. He'd be.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
The fall of the way in the night.
Speaker 2 (20:39):
Yes, welcome back to the parents Squad on the weekend
Collective Onton Beverage My guest is John Cown. He's a
parenting expert and all round good guy and a very
festive shirt today. May I say sorry, I'm just you're
just kidding, because yeah, I thought, actually when when you
when John turned up, I thought, that's a really lovely
fest of shirt. And then he mentioned he'd been officiating
(21:01):
at a couple of funerals, and I was like, oh,
but it was a plain time dark jackets. So I'm
teasing you because it's fun teasing me. Yeah, I am. Look,
we're talking about exam stress with kids and how do
you deal with it. Let's do a few We'll have
a look at a bit of the text. Correspondse we'd
love to hear from you on e one hundred and
eighty ten to eighty. Kids don't need this nonsense. Leave
them alone. If they fail, that's fine. It's for them
(21:21):
to find their own way. That's actually sort of what
do we make of that, because there's this part of
that text sort of appeals to me. It's like, look,
just do your best. If you fail, then you know
the life will reveal another path. That's right.
Speaker 3 (21:36):
I mean, you don't want to dump a whole lot
of your extra stress on them, though I would like
to think we would also encourage them to do their best.
Speaker 2 (21:44):
But yeah, okay. Another one says, if your test kids regularly,
then they don't get tested and freaked out by exams. Look,
I think that's the whole thing. Practice makes perfect, and
I would support all the schools who actually do introduce
some sort of testing in the years before n CEA,
so when the children do encounter those external exams, it's
not something new. It's been sort of off in the distance,
(22:06):
like that train coming towards you.
Speaker 3 (22:08):
Now.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
Other one says him back in the day, I got
quite anxious about exams. I am academically inclined sixth form certificate.
Remember that. I recall my friend Rachel saying, well, if
you don't pass, imagine how many other people won't pass,
which brought me back to earth. It's a tenant I
apply to others and to myself this day. Everything in perspective.
It's a mixture between realizing that everyone's in the same boat,
(22:29):
but also perhaps charden freud, because you know, if I fail,
then it's wow, these other people have been really bad.
I was once in an exam for law school for
a paper called advanced public law, and I deliberately took
it on because I hated public law, but I thought,
I need to conquer this my bet noir, my demon
(22:53):
sort of subject. And the exam question was really hard,
was really hard. And the funny thing was I was
almost relieved when the brightest guy in law school, who
got a pluses for every exam he ever did, and
with a PhD in philosophy, he locked up and looked
(23:14):
around the room with this gesture like, oh my god,
what is this? And I thought, I thank goodness, Paul
finds it hard. It was such a relief. The brightest
guy in the room was outraged, and there we go.
Another one says exams are engauge on how much you
know about a specific subject, but also learning how to
deal with pressuous situations. It's part of learning, and it's
(23:36):
how to manage your anxiety. You learn, it's all the better.
Speaker 3 (23:38):
And that's where parents can do some extra coaching. So
can I urge you too, now, go in often while
your kids are studying with snacks and things like that,
and just check how they're doing, and just to make
sure that they're not drifting off and watching techtok and
things like that. Because that's kids are very easily distracted,
but also some of the things that they need to
learn about anxiety and handling stress. One is what you
(24:00):
do for your body, you're doing for your brain. And
so get them out jogging, get them going to the gym,
and like a lot of things, you know, doing a
little bit of extra of something physical. Just boost your
performance academically. And so this is a great thing they
can do that stress that they do need to sleep
That on all night and all night cramming session is
(24:26):
so counterproductive. It might seem like a brilliant idea, but yeah,
so teaching them how to handle stress. But watch your
kids because some kids, older adolescents tip into genuine mental
health problems at about that age, and so you've got
to be watching your kids and making sure that they
are well coping and having breaks and having rest and
eating well and sleeping well.
Speaker 2 (24:48):
It does time to something else I wanted to talk
about as well, to do with anxiety and disappointment, and
that is helping your kids navigate heartbreak, which is something
that's quite different, but it nevertheless can cause more misery
than anything. Because here's the way I A I will
look at it the first boyfriend or girlfriend. Now this
(25:10):
sounds a bit miserable, but of course it is ultimately
headed for disappointment because it's going to end. Not many
people end up marrying their school sweetheart, So most, I
would say, ninety nine percent of boy first boyfriends and
girlfriends and on the head for heartbreak. How pessimistic, But.
Speaker 3 (25:29):
Could I suggest that you don't dump that on your
adolescent when sighing, do ide about their later about their
about their first love.
Speaker 2 (25:39):
Just letten, you ride the waves of ecstasy and disappointment.
Actually you have to, don't you. Well.
Speaker 3 (25:45):
Survey after survey shows that the greatest source of human
happiness is intimate relationships. You know, the fact that we're
in our loving relationships really really most makers happy. It's
the opposite for young teenagers young you know, my thirty
(26:06):
seven year old marriage is a great the greatest source
of happiness, stability, and mental health in my life. But
for young teenagers it's the opposite. It is the biggest
source of stress. And one of the things is what
it does for your self esteem. When someone is telling
you you're beautiful, you're handsome, you're capable, you're the one,
you're so funny and everything like this. You of course
(26:29):
you believe it when it's coming from someone you love,
and it does wonderful things for your self esteem. But
then when the relationship breaks, as you say inevitably it will,
it reverses all those statements. And so that's the thing.
When your teenager is broken hearted, it's not just that
they have lost someone that they were caring about, that
(26:50):
lost something in themselves. It reverses so much of their
self esteem. They doubt themselves and that makes them very,
very vulnerable to rebound, which is a real real thing
because they will seek to get that affirmation from someone
else and they could be.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
Taking What is the best way for parents to handle that?
Because I've thought ahead to this and I've thought that
all I'm going to do is just be there and
listen to them and give them hugs and just be
that ere that they can pour out everything they want
to and just say and you're not trying to offer advice,
because I think trying to offer advice. It's all you
need to do, is I understand. I guess I'm guessing,
(27:29):
and this is where I've run it by you. But
you just say, look, I love you, darling, and I'm
just here to listen. And I know it must really hurt.
I remember how bad it is, and you know, just
trust me that you will feel better eventually. But when
you're you know, I'm just here for you. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (27:43):
Good on you with the attitude to advice, because culture
as supposed to.
Speaker 2 (27:49):
Get over it. You'll find another.
Speaker 3 (27:51):
Culture makes our teenager's brains teflong coated to advice. But
could I suggest that when your teenagers are in a relationship,
be so friendly to their new partner or boyfrid friend.
Give them food, invite them in, treat them like they're like,
like they are wonderful, and everything like this, because then
(28:12):
at least you can talk to your child about them afterwards.
If you treat them like there's something you'd scrape off
your shoe, if you can see that they're a loser,
if you can see that they you know, no way
is this relationship going away. And you show that and
treat them with contempt or you know, put them down
as well, your child will never talk to you about
that boyfriend, girlfriend or any other boyfriend or girlfriend. But
(28:35):
if you're polite, welcoming and let them, you know, invite
them into your home and everything like that there's a
number of good things that will come from that. For
the resart, your teenager will talk to you about them
when you say, yeah, what do they think about such
and such? He seems like a nice guy? Is he
doing okay at school? What's their mum and dad?
Speaker 6 (28:49):
You know?
Speaker 3 (28:49):
And you can talk about things like that, which will
switch your kid's brain on about actually he's not that smart. Yeah,
and no, he's not really aligned with the things that
I think are important. You know, they've got a brain,
they've got your brain.
Speaker 2 (29:02):
Actually, it's funny. I think my kids will probably be
the opposite. Prom They'll be like, can you stop? Don't
They'll they'll think I'm trying to be too friendly, and
they are like, okay, stop talking.
Speaker 3 (29:11):
That's a good problems. That's a better problem than not
treating them. Well, okay, if you're gonna have if you're
gonna make a mistake, that'd be the way. And and
the other I remember meeting. I haven't seen this. It
wasn't firsthand, but I've met I've seen parents in action
where dad was really nice to the new boyfriend because
(29:33):
they had seen former other boyfriends get their hearts broken
by their daughter.
Speaker 2 (29:38):
I've got to be nice to you because eventually my
daughter is going to break your heart, and so you
don't need any grief from me.
Speaker 3 (29:46):
The other thing is if you treat it, perhaps you
know your daughter's boyfriend, your son's girlfriends, well, if they
like you, they'll treat your son or daughter better. I
mean this is just a general rule. If you treat
your kid's friends well, they'll reward you by first of
all not breaking in and robbing your house, but also
I lock it, but because they want your friendship, because
(30:08):
teenagers love the friendship really of older adults, not so
much their own parents, but they love it when you
show them respect, genuine has freaked in interest, and so
they all reward you by looking after your kid.
Speaker 2 (30:22):
We'd love to hear from you on how you've how
you've met. We started the show talking about anxiety when
it comes to performance, anxiety with exams, but the other
side of you just your kids soaring emotions, your teenagers
soaring emotions, but also how do you help them handle
their first heartbreak? Give us a call eight hundred eighty
ten eighty text nine nine two. John Cown is my guest,
(30:42):
as if I needed to tell you those reassuring mellifluous
tones of the cowen will be back after the break,
which is allowed Forlis Milifluous. I had to look that
up to twenty minutes to sex News talks, he'd be.
Speaker 1 (31:05):
Guess.
Speaker 2 (31:06):
Welcome back to the Weekend Collective. This is the parents Squad.
My guest is John Cown talking about dealing with well,
you're broadly speaking, your teenagers soaring emotions, whether it be
exams or heartbreak. Let's go to Jan.
Speaker 7 (31:17):
Hello, Hi there, John, and Tim.
Speaker 2 (31:20):
Hello jam Hi.
Speaker 7 (31:23):
Now I think it's good to sit at the table
and talk as a family. Often siblings will be more
honest with each other rather than hearing it from parents.
And if parents can just ask questions to draw them out,
and then the other siblings will give some honest answers
(31:45):
and they have more right to because they're on the
way same wavelength.
Speaker 2 (31:50):
Are siblings? Are sibling's kind? Those siblings can be quite brutal,
can't they?
Speaker 7 (31:55):
Yeah, But at least they're honest, do you know? And
they can respond to each other, which they might not
do to parents. But just leave it as an open discussion,
get it out on the table, so to speak, and
with it. Sam good to do wrote learning if you
(32:16):
teach them the first letter of lists of things to
make it into a sort of poem, you know, jumped
over the lazy horse, easy to remember lists. And also
parents can be involved in the study process by testing them,
(32:40):
you know, asking them questions about the subject and testing
the knowledge level.
Speaker 3 (32:47):
And fine learning right from an early age is very
very valuable.
Speaker 2 (32:55):
Thank you very much for that. Thanks, I'm good. Throwing
it open to your brothers and sisters is always helpful.
Imagine with the heartbreak, it's like, you know how little
little Amy's got a heartbroken and Johnny help her out. Ah, well, yeah.
Speaker 3 (33:12):
Look a heartache or broken heartedness or something like this.
So I was, I was intrigued because normally it's just
talked about dismissively and everything. And I was looking up
looking it up on the internet a year or two back,
and it is sort of a mental illness to that,
that terrible depression, that pain of emotions, you know. And
(33:33):
so we might sometimes be sort of somewhat mocking or
amused at our kids pain about that, thinking it's only
puppy love, but it's real enough to the puppies pain.
Speaker 4 (33:45):
You.
Speaker 2 (33:45):
Okay, look, let's not talk about the pain of you
adult divorce and all that sort of thing, but the
emotional highs of that first heartbreak up limit intense.
Speaker 3 (33:54):
Especially because it's probably the first time in your life
you felt something like that.
Speaker 2 (33:58):
I remember. Actually, let's get another call Jeff.
Speaker 5 (34:01):
Hello, Yeah, I guys, how are you good?
Speaker 2 (34:04):
Thanks?
Speaker 5 (34:06):
Just going back to your earlier comments regarding the education
system and exams, I just sort of wonder if we
should sort of be going back to where we were.
I mean, I'm sixty years old and I went through
the education system right up to university entrance level. So
(34:29):
I'm just sort of chucking it out there. What was
actually wrong with the original system like schools to forget Well,
I can.
Speaker 3 (34:36):
Tell you what's wrong with it. I can tell you
what's wrong with it. I was designed to make half
the people going to school feel like failures. I mean,
when I went to good Old Henderson Maximum Security High
back in the nineteen seventies, because I'm only just a
year or two older than you, you know, half the
school left when they turned fifteen, and then half the
people that sat school were expected to fail it. In fact,
(34:58):
I think it was scaled it so and so you're
out of a school of over one thousand, you had
one hundred in the sixth form, seventeen in the seventh
form year twelve or thirteen, and so it was of
course you've got to get great performances from those kids
that actually get through it. But it's already scraped a
whole lot of kids off and say, you're not you're
not going to kid any any good.
Speaker 5 (35:19):
I get what you're saying.
Speaker 3 (35:20):
That.
Speaker 5 (35:20):
Back in the day, we've also had and two A
sists over the sex form level. So those that performed
contestant way throughout the year, yeah, were credit credited.
Speaker 3 (35:34):
That was a progressive approach to it. But the actual
school cert exam that I thought you were sort of
referring to, I thought was you know it was it
was cruel.
Speaker 2 (35:43):
I forgot about the old credited that you think. Anyway, Hey, look,
time's flown so much. We're going to wrap it up there, John,
But oh you know, yeah, I know where to go. Well,
you can hang around for the Sports wrap, which is
always very exciting. We've got Clay Wilson John us to
have a chat about what's come out with sport. But
any parting sort of.
Speaker 3 (36:01):
Words of observation I would say that we was to
do a lot worse than listen at seven Thirtymorrow night
to Real Life. And I've got Mark Vetti, the animal
trainer who trained the dogs to drive the cars and
blimey and been on three TV shows and train dogs
for Lord of the Rings and things like that.
Speaker 2 (36:17):
So he'll be my.
Speaker 3 (36:18):
Guest tomorrow at Real Life.
Speaker 2 (36:20):
The brain's just about potty training your dog. I've been
give him to drive the cards like I'll ask him
good stuff, John. We'll be back to rat sport in
just a moment. It's eleven minutes to Sex News Talks EDB.
Speaker 1 (36:36):
For more from the weekend collective, listen live to News
Talks EDB weekends from three pm, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio
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