August 30, 2025 • 8 mins
The women’s Rugby World Cup has entered round two in England.
The Black Ferns face Japan in their second cup match tomorrow morning.
Former rugby player Alice Soper is in England for the tournament. She told Francesca Rudkin that the competition has exploded in popularity in recent years.
'The last time England hosted this tournament was in 2010. They had sold 30,000 tickets total to the tournament, and now, It's over 400,000'
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Sunday Session podcast with Francesca Rudgin
from News Talks.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
I'd be right. The Women's Rugby World Cup is into
round two in England. A little over an hour ago,
the biggest match of the round wrapped up with a
thirty one all draw between Australia and the US. The
Black Fans face Japan and their second Cup match tomorrow morning.
Alice Soper is in England for the cap. She joins me, now,
good morning, Alice.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
Well good evening from me. But yeah, well we what
a weekend it's been so far.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Australia versus the uisay thirty one all draw. What did
you make of the match?
Speaker 3 (00:42):
I mean it was everything that you hope these type
of matches are. It was the total arm wrestle. Things
went back and forth and back again, and then the
final moments ended up with bizarre kicks from both teams,
so you know, it then just sets up everything gorgeously
for the final match next week, where both teams unfortunately
now are in that horrible position where you have to
worry about not just your own score but other people's.
(01:03):
So yes, very fun as a kind of mutual third
party to observe that one. I don't know if I
would be quite so excited about it if I had
been the Black Friends in that position, But yeah, I
think if you were got to see any of it, Yeah,
just a lot of fun to see the two teams
go tip for tat.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
Talk me through the tournament so far. What's it like
over there?
Speaker 3 (01:27):
Oh? I mean, we knew that this one was going
to be huge. We had seen that, you know, before
even a minute had kcked off, we had more than
doubled the attendance, you know, the ticket sales that we'd
had if you put it in context, right, the last
time England hosted this tournament was in twenty ten. At
that time they had sold thirty thousand tickets total to
(01:50):
the tournament, and now it's over four hundred thousand that
have been sold for this one. It's just the rapid
pace of growth of unreal that it's landing here at
this time in a country that has been a lot
of time developing its women's rugby audience, you know, with
its invest in the domestic competition that's been up now
for almost a decade, Like this is all kind of
(02:11):
all the pieces are in place now to kind of
just click in and become something really quite special. And
I have to say I think that the English fans,
you know, the locals, have been fantastic about receiving it.
It's been so cool to hear people in full voice
and not just you know, cheering for England who had
fantastic support, for the likes of Samoa, for Fiji, you know,
(02:32):
everybody getting in behind all of these different teams. It's
just been it's been a joy to witness, Alice.
Speaker 2 (02:37):
I've been reading that a lot of the fans are
new fans and young fans to rugby.
Speaker 3 (02:44):
Yeah, well, I mean we saw this pattern emerge in
our own World Cup. I think it was something like
seventy nine percent of those that attended the last World
Cup final had never attended a rugby game before. And
so this is you know, consistent with that. Right. The
reality is is that women's rugby offers a relational reset
for the game of rugby union with its population. It
(03:04):
is something new, it is something different. It does bring
with it different audiences, but also like different engagement with
those audiences. I think, you know, one of the big
things I've seen at this tournament is everything off it
you know, we've got more access behind the scenes with
all the different players showing you their perspectives of the
tournament than ever before. The use of social media is
(03:25):
just you are overwhelmed as with content that you can consume.
It's just fantastic. But yes, been seeing a lot of
young families in the crowd and you know, girls and boys,
and you know, dads and daughters and moms and sons.
You know, it's been gorgeous to see all the mix
of people getting in getting it cited. And we had
(03:45):
that research that came out just before the tournament that
said in the women's game, in our fan base, forty
one percent of our fans don't actually have like a team.
You know, we don't have club teams, we don't have
that tribal you know lines that you might experience in
the men's game. We're just there to support women's rugby.
And I just think that that's been something that's been
carried over everyone has received these teams over the last week.
Speaker 2 (04:10):
Alice. Not all the games have been crackers like this morning.
A fair few one sided matches so far. I mean
that's to be expected in Paul play. But is it
a bit of a problem or do you think that
will change other time.
Speaker 3 (04:21):
I mean, we had this in the men's World Cup.
This is just what happens in World Cups because you
you know, very very rarely do you end up giving
the opportunity for you know, a sixteenth ranked team in
the world to play a first ranked team. You know,
and that's that's the excitement and also the lopsidedness of
the context. And I think it's you know, I always
challenge too. I tend to find there's a bit of
(04:43):
a trend when it comes between the way that this
plays out in men's sports versus women's sports. I often true,
there are people that will you know, they'll focus on
the dominance in a men's game. They'll say, oh, that
was a completely dominant performance by this team, whereas in
the women's game, we're quick to say, oh, that's a
sign of weakness, where really, yeah, like I say, this
is you know, opening round. I don't think there was
a single one of those score lines that surprised me
(05:06):
as someone that you follows it as religiously as I do.
I think maybe with the exception of Scotland really getting
their revenge on Wales, other than that they were pretty
consistent with the world rankings as they are currently Alice.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Let's talk about Porscha Woodman Wickliffe. She is on the
verge of a pretty impressive record. She's currently scored forty
nine tries and twenty nine tests. One more would make
her New Zealand New Zealand Rugby's all time leading tri scorer.
She's currently tied with Doug Hawlett. How good is she?
Speaker 3 (05:37):
I mean once in a generational player right, because it's
the combination of being the all round skill. Shit is
set that she is right, She's all of that talent.
She can run, she can just you know size, step
run over, you run around, you do everything. But also
coming to her full apex of power at the same
time as our game was emerging. When you have moments
(05:59):
like this when you need, you know, a character for
people to latch on and really get them behind. She
was that gateway for so many Zealanders to really look
in and see women's rugby. And so she has been
a fantastic ambassador in a moment when I sport needed one.
We couldn't have asked for a better one. And so
to have her come out of retirement, Oh what a joy.
(06:19):
That was after what Sugar and Super Rugby opecky round one.
We were begging for it because there's no way she
was done. So it's just so exciting to have her back,
to have her on the field for it, and to
be able to break yet another record. I mean, how
many of them does she have left?
Speaker 2 (06:35):
I'm confident she's going to break that record tomorrow. Of course,
the Black fans are playing Japan. What can we expect
from the game, do you think?
Speaker 3 (06:42):
Well, look, Japan is an interesting team. I mean, I
think they're probably a great example for people to think
about lopsided scores right because they have been one that
in the past. They have experienced quite heavy defeats both teams,
but they've been closing that gap and have been getting
better and better all the time. They've got fantastic set piece.
We should expect a fast style of play, not dissimilar
(07:04):
to their men. They tend to try and keep them
up quite a bit. They don't want to get stuck
in the meat in the middle, but it will be
you know, look, we should expect that this is a
strong performance from New Zealand against Japan. It's interesting that
they have named probably closer to the team that we
will expect to be named when it comes to the knockouts.
(07:26):
Whereas last week, you know, we had quite a few
of our finishes in the starting line up. This week
it's a lot more settled, so I think we will,
you know, should see there be quite a strong performance
straight out the gate, and then it will be interesting
to see whether or not the coaches use this opportunity
to kind of continue to spread those minutes around the
squad and build up that development and be very interesting
(07:48):
to see when Renee Holmes comes on where they end
up putting her.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
Alie Soper, thanks so much for your time, and enjoy
the game in the morning.
Speaker 3 (07:57):
Oh I sure well, I can't wait to be there
being really loud and cheering them on.
Speaker 2 (08:02):
That was Alis Soper from the Women's Rugby World capin
If you'd like to chair on the Black Owns tomorrow morning.
The match kicks off at one am New Zealand.
Speaker 1 (08:11):
Time for more from the Sunday session with Francesca Rudkin.
Listen live to News Talks at B from nine am Sunday,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to the Sunday Session podcast with Francesca Rudgin
from News Talks.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
I'd be right. The Women's Rugby World Cup is into
round two in England. A little over an hour ago,
the biggest match of the round wrapped up with a
thirty one all draw between Australia and the US. The
Black Fans face Japan and their second Cup match tomorrow morning.
Alice Soper is in England for the cap. She joins me, now,
good morning, Alice.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
Well good evening from me. But yeah, well we what
a weekend it's been so far.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Australia versus the uisay thirty one all draw. What did
you make of the match?
Speaker 3 (00:42):
I mean it was everything that you hope these type
of matches are. It was the total arm wrestle. Things
went back and forth and back again, and then the
final moments ended up with bizarre kicks from both teams,
so you know, it then just sets up everything gorgeously
for the final match next week, where both teams unfortunately
now are in that horrible position where you have to
worry about not just your own score but other people's.
(01:03):
So yes, very fun as a kind of mutual third
party to observe that one. I don't know if I
would be quite so excited about it if I had
been the Black Friends in that position, But yeah, I
think if you were got to see any of it, Yeah,
just a lot of fun to see the two teams
go tip for tat.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
Talk me through the tournament so far. What's it like
over there?
Speaker 3 (01:27):
Oh? I mean, we knew that this one was going
to be huge. We had seen that, you know, before
even a minute had kcked off, we had more than
doubled the attendance, you know, the ticket sales that we'd
had if you put it in context, right, the last
time England hosted this tournament was in twenty ten. At
that time they had sold thirty thousand tickets total to
(01:50):
the tournament, and now it's over four hundred thousand that
have been sold for this one. It's just the rapid
pace of growth of unreal that it's landing here at
this time in a country that has been a lot
of time developing its women's rugby audience, you know, with
its invest in the domestic competition that's been up now
for almost a decade, Like this is all kind of
(02:11):
all the pieces are in place now to kind of
just click in and become something really quite special. And
I have to say I think that the English fans,
you know, the locals, have been fantastic about receiving it.
It's been so cool to hear people in full voice
and not just you know, cheering for England who had
fantastic support, for the likes of Samoa, for Fiji, you know,
(02:32):
everybody getting in behind all of these different teams. It's
just been it's been a joy to witness, Alice.
Speaker 2 (02:37):
I've been reading that a lot of the fans are
new fans and young fans to rugby.
Speaker 3 (02:44):
Yeah, well, I mean we saw this pattern emerge in
our own World Cup. I think it was something like
seventy nine percent of those that attended the last World
Cup final had never attended a rugby game before. And
so this is you know, consistent with that. Right. The
reality is is that women's rugby offers a relational reset
for the game of rugby union with its population. It
(03:04):
is something new, it is something different. It does bring
with it different audiences, but also like different engagement with
those audiences. I think, you know, one of the big
things I've seen at this tournament is everything off it
you know, we've got more access behind the scenes with
all the different players showing you their perspectives of the
tournament than ever before. The use of social media is
(03:25):
just you are overwhelmed as with content that you can consume.
It's just fantastic. But yes, been seeing a lot of
young families in the crowd and you know, girls and boys,
and you know, dads and daughters and moms and sons.
You know, it's been gorgeous to see all the mix
of people getting in getting it cited. And we had
(03:45):
that research that came out just before the tournament that
said in the women's game, in our fan base, forty
one percent of our fans don't actually have like a team.
You know, we don't have club teams, we don't have
that tribal you know lines that you might experience in
the men's game. We're just there to support women's rugby.
And I just think that that's been something that's been
carried over everyone has received these teams over the last week.
Speaker 2 (04:10):
Alice. Not all the games have been crackers like this morning.
A fair few one sided matches so far. I mean
that's to be expected in Paul play. But is it
a bit of a problem or do you think that
will change other time.
Speaker 3 (04:21):
I mean, we had this in the men's World Cup.
This is just what happens in World Cups because you
you know, very very rarely do you end up giving
the opportunity for you know, a sixteenth ranked team in
the world to play a first ranked team. You know,
and that's that's the excitement and also the lopsidedness of
the context. And I think it's you know, I always
challenge too. I tend to find there's a bit of
(04:43):
a trend when it comes between the way that this
plays out in men's sports versus women's sports. I often true,
there are people that will you know, they'll focus on
the dominance in a men's game. They'll say, oh, that
was a completely dominant performance by this team, whereas in
the women's game, we're quick to say, oh, that's a
sign of weakness, where really, yeah, like I say, this
is you know, opening round. I don't think there was
a single one of those score lines that surprised me
(05:06):
as someone that you follows it as religiously as I do.
I think maybe with the exception of Scotland really getting
their revenge on Wales, other than that they were pretty
consistent with the world rankings as they are currently Alice.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Let's talk about Porscha Woodman Wickliffe. She is on the
verge of a pretty impressive record. She's currently scored forty
nine tries and twenty nine tests. One more would make
her New Zealand New Zealand Rugby's all time leading tri scorer.
She's currently tied with Doug Hawlett. How good is she?
Speaker 3 (05:37):
I mean once in a generational player right, because it's
the combination of being the all round skill. Shit is
set that she is right, She's all of that talent.
She can run, she can just you know size, step
run over, you run around, you do everything. But also
coming to her full apex of power at the same
time as our game was emerging. When you have moments
(05:59):
like this when you need, you know, a character for
people to latch on and really get them behind. She
was that gateway for so many Zealanders to really look
in and see women's rugby. And so she has been
a fantastic ambassador in a moment when I sport needed one.
We couldn't have asked for a better one. And so
to have her come out of retirement, Oh what a joy.
(06:19):
That was after what Sugar and Super Rugby opecky round one.
We were begging for it because there's no way she
was done. So it's just so exciting to have her back,
to have her on the field for it, and to
be able to break yet another record. I mean, how
many of them does she have left?
Speaker 2 (06:35):
I'm confident she's going to break that record tomorrow. Of course,
the Black fans are playing Japan. What can we expect
from the game, do you think?
Speaker 3 (06:42):
Well, look, Japan is an interesting team. I mean, I
think they're probably a great example for people to think
about lopsided scores right because they have been one that
in the past. They have experienced quite heavy defeats both teams,
but they've been closing that gap and have been getting
better and better all the time. They've got fantastic set piece.
We should expect a fast style of play, not dissimilar
(07:04):
to their men. They tend to try and keep them
up quite a bit. They don't want to get stuck
in the meat in the middle, but it will be
you know, look, we should expect that this is a
strong performance from New Zealand against Japan. It's interesting that
they have named probably closer to the team that we
will expect to be named when it comes to the knockouts.
(07:26):
Whereas last week, you know, we had quite a few
of our finishes in the starting line up. This week
it's a lot more settled, so I think we will,
you know, should see there be quite a strong performance
straight out the gate, and then it will be interesting
to see whether or not the coaches use this opportunity
to kind of continue to spread those minutes around the
squad and build up that development and be very interesting
(07:48):
to see when Renee Holmes comes on where they end
up putting her.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
Alie Soper, thanks so much for your time, and enjoy
the game in the morning.
Speaker 3 (07:57):
Oh I sure well, I can't wait to be there
being really loud and cheering them on.
Speaker 2 (08:02):
That was Alis Soper from the Women's Rugby World capin
If you'd like to chair on the Black Owns tomorrow morning.
The match kicks off at one am New Zealand.
Speaker 1 (08:11):
Time for more from the Sunday session with Francesca Rudkin.
Listen live to News Talks at B from nine am Sunday,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
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