Dr Glenn Colquhoun and Dr Art Nahill: doctors launch Hīkoi for Health to raise awareness over struggling health system

Sick of inaction from politicians around our ailing health system, two Kiwi doctors are taking matters into their own hands. 

GP Dr Glenn Colquhoun and general hospital physician Dr Art Nahill yesterday launched Hīkoi for Health: A People’s Inquiry.

They’ve hit the road in a bright yellow 'vanbulance' in a bid to protest the state of the health system - and collect stories from people who've been impacted by the health system.

"I've gradually seen conditions, both for patients and for healthcare providers, deteriorate - to the point where I didn't feel like I could bear anymore of what I would call moral injury from trying to treat and discharge patients in a broken system."

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Sunday Session podcast with Francesca Rudkin
from News talks'b.

Speaker 2 (00:13):
Sick of an action from politicians around our ailing health system,
two Kiwi doctors are taking matters into their own hands.
GP doctor Glenn Carhoun and General hospital physician doctor Art
Nahil yesterday launched Takway for Health, a people's inquiry. They've
hit the road and a bright yellow v ambulance their
aim not only to protest the state of our health system,

(00:34):
but to collect stories from people of New Zealand around reform.
Yesterday they departed Kaitaia on route for Parliament, and Glenn
and Art joined me now from their journey. Good morning,
Good morning Art. If I can start with you, I
want to look at your careers within the health system.

Speaker 3 (00:50):
First.

Speaker 2 (00:50):
You've both been working as doctors for more than thirty years,
so you have been through many governments, many reforms, haven't you.

Speaker 3 (00:58):
Well, yes, I've actually been in New Zealand since two
thousand and five working as a hospital physician.

Speaker 2 (01:05):
What about you, Glenn?

Speaker 4 (01:08):
Yep I nearly clocking up thirty years. I've worked as
a GP in Ewee Health for half my career and
then an elegant health withven with young people the other half.

Speaker 2 (01:19):
Art I believe or I understand that you've decided to
retire from clinical practice. Can you talk me through why
you made that decision?

Speaker 3 (01:26):
Sure? I think I would characterize it as a reluctant retirement.
As I said, have been here for twenty years, and
when I first arrived, I could, with hand on heart
say that the New Zealand's health system was an excellent
health system. And I've gradually seen conditions both for patients
and for healthcare providers deteriorate to the point where I

(01:47):
just didn't feel I could bear any more what I
would call moral injury from trying to treat and discharge
patients in a broken system.

Speaker 2 (02:00):
Glenn, when did we get into trouble? When did things
start to go wrong?

Speaker 4 (02:07):
I think it's been happening for a generation, at least
when I was a young PP. I remember our college
saying to government of the time, we're going to run
out of VPS in a generation, and you're going to
get a cohort of baby boomers through with quite a
lot of health.

Speaker 3 (02:24):
Me and those two.

Speaker 4 (02:25):
Waves are going to crash at the same time, And
no one did anything and now it's crashing.

Speaker 2 (02:33):
Glen, you talk about the need for a bottom up
approach to health, talk me through that.

Speaker 4 (02:39):
I guess, you know, and I'm sure Art would agree.
Where doctors who have worked in a trench and I
have learned over the years, years, to my chagrin, that
patients are so often right and they know communities have
a wisdom in them if they feel respected, cared for,

(03:02):
and that you're going to be constant and build relationship
with them, and there's an enormous wisdom that comes out
of them. They have the ability to put others first,
to identify what the really important drivers of their health are.
And yeah, I'm humbled by working in a trench with them,

(03:22):
and it's part of the outright. It's that down here
you've ignored the brain of the health system, and you've
those who have led have have assumed that they're the
brain and it's and they've proved that they're not.

Speaker 2 (03:41):
And aren't people want to be listened to, don't they?

Speaker 3 (03:45):
Absolutely? I think that's one of the best medicines there is.
I think that you know, we've been trying to focus
on treating patients when they have established well advanced diseases
and that system is just not sustainable. One of the
one of the taglines we have ambulance is the ambulance

(04:08):
at the top of the cliff. I think for too
long we've been waiting for people to get sick. We've
been expecting to people to come into the health system
when they are unwell, and we need to spend a
lot more time, effort, and resource trying to keep people healthy.

Speaker 2 (04:27):
Are you both in your sixties, nearing retirement or plan already?
Does that play a part and you'll need to take
action now? Are you worried about what you're leaving behind?

Speaker 3 (04:40):
Well? For me, absolutely, I feel like this is a
sort of an elegy to my career in some ways,
And I think the thing that most worries me is
that I see the trajectory going in the wrong direction.
If I felt like there were viable alternatives out there,

(05:00):
viable plans for reform, I might be able to retire
a bit more easily. But all I keep hearing is
let's just pour more money into the system to train
more doctors and more nurses, which may help for a time,
but will not be the ultimate solution to a sustainable
health system.

Speaker 2 (05:22):
SIG Glenn, talk me through this people's inquiry you're leading.

Speaker 4 (05:27):
So we've got the ambulance, which was beautifully painted up
by Nigel Brown. It's like driving a piece of art
through the country. It's a wonderful vehicle for us to
take down the North Island. We're stopping in fourteen I
think different towns through the North Island. We have a

(05:49):
website Health Reforming z dot org where people can see
the itinery. We're asking people to come to who at
towns we're stopping along the way, they can give us
a written submission to the website. They can talk to
us and we'll write down what they say. We have
young filmmakers Olive Hakaraia and Emily kat who are recording

(06:15):
their thoughts and views in the back of the van,
which doubles as a little studio film studio. We're going
to wrap up all those thoughts, summarize them and construct
a plan that people think might work better for them.
And then we'll put that together in a bit of
a book and we'll arrive in Parliament on May the

(06:38):
eighth and tell people what people have said.

Speaker 2 (06:43):
This so people are getting to have their say, but
also those who work in the House system will also
welcome to come and have They say, why is that important?

Speaker 3 (06:51):
Well, because I think there's just a tremendous level of
frustration and anger out there, and anger and frustration if
there isn't a creative, positive outlet for it, I think
degenerates into cynicism and apathy. And so we're trying to
say that we are all in this situation together. We've

(07:13):
dubbed May eighth as band Aid Day, where we're asking everyone,
particularly healthcare providers, to wear a bandage or a plaster
in a prominent place as a symbol of frustration over
the government's approach to healthcare reform. It's plaster over plaster

(07:35):
over plaster.

Speaker 2 (07:37):
In January we saw doctor Shane Rittie replaced with Simeon
Brown as Health Minister. Has that left to you more
or less encouraged about the direction of Health New Zealand?

Speaker 3 (07:47):
Well, I mean, I don't know Simeon Brown. I'm sure
he's a well intentioned individual. But one of the things
that worries me is I believe now we have a
Minister of Health and a Director General of Health, neither
of whom has very much experience in the healthcare sector,
and I think person only. One of the things that
has been the most problematic in watching the degradation of

(08:11):
the health system is that the health system has been politicized.
We have one government who wants to do things one way.
The next government wants to change everything and do it
the other way. When what we're advocating for is a
long term plan that has the support of all parties

(08:33):
or as many parties as possible, based on data, based
on stakeholder experience, and based on international models. It shouldn't
be a political football.

Speaker 2 (08:48):
Art and Glenn, thank you so much for your time
this morning. The best of luck with the hikoy.

Speaker 3 (08:53):
Thank Brinch, Edgar, thank you, Francesca.

Speaker 2 (08:56):
That was doctor Glenn Cahoun and doctor Art Nahil And
if you'd like to find out more about the HIKOY,
you can heat Health reformen z dot org.

Speaker 1 (09:07):
For more from the Sunday session with Francesca Rudkin, listen
live to News Talks at B from nine am Sunday,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.