August 24, 2024 • 8 mins
New research has revealed microplastics have infiltrated human brain tissue to a 'concerning' degree.
This adds to studies finding tiny shards of plastic in critical organs - as microplastics have been found in lungs, bone marrow, blood vessels, reproductive organs, livers and kidneys, to name a few.
Chemical scientist Dr Joel Rindelaub is unsurprised by this discovery.
"I'm not sure if these will be the final numbers, but there's some pretty good confidence that there's probably plastic in people's brains."
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Sunday Session podcast with Francesca Rudkin
from News Talks EDB.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
To discuss this, I'm joined by chemical scientist doctor Joel
Rinde Lab. How are you, Joel, Good to have you with.
Speaker 3 (00:18):
Us, Yeah, great to be here, Fuzzy, can you.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Explain to us just to find what these microplastics are?
Speaker 3 (00:24):
Again, microplastics are basically tiny, tiny pieces of plastics that
have broken down, So we're talking even things that are
on the nanometer or micro scale, so that's like at
least a million times smaller than a meter in size,
so we're a real small.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
Were you surprised by this finding?
Speaker 3 (00:45):
Unfortunately, I was not surprised by this founding because everywhere
scientists have looked, they've found plastics. So they've been found
in lungs, the bloodstream, the testicles, just all the way across.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
The body, and I think most of us are familiar
with that. But there's just something about the idea of
but being in the brain that feels more significant than
other finder, is it?
Speaker 3 (01:08):
Yeah, it turns out the brain is a pretty important
organ in the body, so having plastic in there is
it is concerning. It is concerning and it's something that
we would probably want to avoid.
Speaker 2 (01:23):
Probably more concerning is the fact that the brain tissue
head up to twenty times more microplastics than other organs.
Speaker 3 (01:31):
Yes, they found actually an absurdly high amount of plastic
in the brain, but I will warrant listeners. This is
what's known as a pre print study. It has not
yet been peer reviewed, so I'm not sure those will
be the final numbers, but there is, you know, some
pretty good confidence that, yes, there is probably plastic in
(01:52):
people's brains.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
How's it getting there?
Speaker 3 (01:55):
So that is another really good question, and it basically
comes down to exposure. So there's a lot of plastic.
Let's say you're eating it or all. So as we're
finding out, you could also be inhaling it as well. Okay, yeah,
the plastics in the air, like if you're probably breathing
(02:16):
them in right now.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
Don't want to panickeep one on a Sunday morning.
Speaker 3 (02:21):
But just trying to wake people up a little bit.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
You know.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
So, how can we stop microplastics entering our bodies? Is
it something you can do to limit exposure or is
it just the world we live in?
Speaker 3 (02:33):
So there are things that we can do, So I'll
preface that, of course, I mean the biggest issue is
that we are as a society producing plastics and an
exponential right, So if you think there's a lot going
out now, in a couple of years, it's only going
to be getting worse and worse. But that being said,
so buckle up. There are two things that you could
(02:54):
probably do to really help yourself out. So the first
one is if we think about exposure, So if there's
plastics in the air, especially in your indoors for instance,
where there is not as good ventilation, I would recommend
having a nice high quality air filter, like especially in
your bedroom where you're spending most of your time, hopefully
(03:17):
around eight hours a night or so. But that's a
good way to make sure you have clean air. So
that's number one. Number two, in your diet, try to
limit the amount of plastic you're using in the kitchen
and cooking or food storage. And this is especially relevant
when you're adding heat. So if you're putting that plastic
container in the microwave, absolutely not a good idea, or
(03:40):
using here's a scary one, a plastic kettle to make
your tea in the morning, to try to avoid applying
heat to any of the plastic that you're using it
in the kitchen.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
Okay, what about on a wider societal scale? You know,
are these deeps that we can be taken to decrease this.
Speaker 3 (03:59):
So we are, as I mentioned, producing plastic at a
crazy high rate and its own getting worse. We're on
pace to double the amount of plastics that have ever
been created on the planet as twenty fifty, and so
what we need to do is to come up with
better solutions where we're not creating so much single use,
(04:22):
throwaway plastic and instead pressure our governments, our industries and
have us together working to make sure that we have
more reusable options and to limit the amount of plastics
that we're producing.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
Job are the government standards when it comes to plastic
particles in food and water?
Speaker 3 (04:44):
There are not. There are no standards on this right now,
and it's something of course people are looking into. And importantly,
when it comes to plastic pollution, it's not always just
the polymer itself, but it's some of these chemical additives
that give it certain properties. So like that's why IV
bag might be soft and flexible, while maybe you're food
(05:06):
container might be hard and brittle, even though it's the
same type of polymer, they have different chemical additives in it.
They give it different properties, and some of those chemicals
can leach out and might have negative effects on the body.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
So not all plastic is the same.
Speaker 3 (05:21):
No, in fact, none of them are very similar down
to the exact chemical formula, just because they have so
many different functions.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
So do we know what products are most likely to
need to be causing the micro microplastics in our bodies?
Speaker 3 (05:39):
So unfortunately, basically all plastic is going to break down
to these tiny particles, but each one of them will
have those different formulations with a different chemical additives which
could have different health effects.
Speaker 2 (05:53):
So going back to these microplastics in our brain, do
we actually know what impact their heaven?
Speaker 3 (05:59):
And that is another good question in a very active
area of research, because we don't know exactly what the
impacts are, but we have some hints and there could
be things like oxi native stress, or impacts on like
(06:19):
the immune system. But it comes down to those chemical
additives what we're calling like endocrine disrupting species. Basically, they
can attack or mimic hormones in your body, which of
course could affect things like fertility or other issues potentially
even cancers. We don't know that yet. I just want
(06:41):
to be clear, But those are the things that we're
really looking at the most.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
So we kind of know what we don't.
Speaker 3 (06:48):
Know, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
So how long will it take us to get a
care of picture?
Speaker 3 (06:54):
Do you think it's gonna be It's gonna be tough,
but it's gonna be probably years down the line, because
it's actually when looking at things like plastic exposure, like
if you eat some plastic, you're not going to have
(07:15):
any what we call it acute effect, Like you're not
going to, let's say, die tomorrow. It might taint years
for that to happen. So it's it's again, it's not
an acute effect. So it's a difficult study, but we
luckily have a lot of people working on it and
they're making some very good progress.
Speaker 2 (07:35):
Look, while I've got you on a completely separate night,
I believe that you've had a bit of success in
the old comedy circuit and doctor Joel Science is on
joke how to sold outrun at the comedy festival here.
I believe you've been in the US. Is it a
good demand for science based comedy?
Speaker 3 (07:52):
Well, yeah, it turns out people do like to listen
to science. So I do have a show coming up
at Q Theater on August thirtieth and thirty first, where
I talked about, among other things, and some of my
views on plastics and what we can actually do about
(08:13):
them from a societal standpoint, along with a lot of
other fun and quirky topics.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
So it's all about making science kind of cool and entertaining.
Is that the kind of goal?
Speaker 3 (08:25):
Funny? Yeah, the idea is, yeah, just to sit back,
maybe learn a thing or two and have a good laugh.
Speaker 2 (08:32):
Fantastic You enjoying it?
Speaker 3 (08:35):
Yeah, Yeah, it is a lot of fun because I
get to I get to nerd out on stage a
little bit.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
I love it. Hey, thank you very much for your
time in talking us through that this morning. Dr Joel rendelab.
Speaker 1 (08:47):
There for more from the Sunday session with friend Jessica Runken.
Listen live to News Talks it B from nine am Sunday,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to the Sunday Session podcast with Francesca Rudkin
from News Talks EDB.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
To discuss this, I'm joined by chemical scientist doctor Joel
Rinde Lab. How are you, Joel, Good to have you with.
Speaker 3 (00:18):
Us, Yeah, great to be here, Fuzzy, can you.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Explain to us just to find what these microplastics are?
Speaker 3 (00:24):
Again, microplastics are basically tiny, tiny pieces of plastics that
have broken down, So we're talking even things that are
on the nanometer or micro scale, so that's like at
least a million times smaller than a meter in size,
so we're a real small.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
Were you surprised by this finding?
Speaker 3 (00:45):
Unfortunately, I was not surprised by this founding because everywhere
scientists have looked, they've found plastics. So they've been found
in lungs, the bloodstream, the testicles, just all the way across.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
The body, and I think most of us are familiar
with that. But there's just something about the idea of
but being in the brain that feels more significant than
other finder, is it?
Speaker 3 (01:08):
Yeah, it turns out the brain is a pretty important
organ in the body, so having plastic in there is
it is concerning. It is concerning and it's something that
we would probably want to avoid.
Speaker 2 (01:23):
Probably more concerning is the fact that the brain tissue
head up to twenty times more microplastics than other organs.
Speaker 3 (01:31):
Yes, they found actually an absurdly high amount of plastic
in the brain, but I will warrant listeners. This is
what's known as a pre print study. It has not
yet been peer reviewed, so I'm not sure those will
be the final numbers, but there is, you know, some
pretty good confidence that, yes, there is probably plastic in
(01:52):
people's brains.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
How's it getting there?
Speaker 3 (01:55):
So that is another really good question, and it basically
comes down to exposure. So there's a lot of plastic.
Let's say you're eating it or all. So as we're
finding out, you could also be inhaling it as well. Okay, yeah,
the plastics in the air, like if you're probably breathing
(02:16):
them in right now.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
Don't want to panickeep one on a Sunday morning.
Speaker 3 (02:21):
But just trying to wake people up a little bit.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
You know.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
So, how can we stop microplastics entering our bodies? Is
it something you can do to limit exposure or is
it just the world we live in?
Speaker 3 (02:33):
So there are things that we can do, So I'll
preface that, of course, I mean the biggest issue is
that we are as a society producing plastics and an
exponential right, So if you think there's a lot going
out now, in a couple of years, it's only going
to be getting worse and worse. But that being said,
so buckle up. There are two things that you could
(02:54):
probably do to really help yourself out. So the first
one is if we think about exposure, So if there's
plastics in the air, especially in your indoors for instance,
where there is not as good ventilation, I would recommend
having a nice high quality air filter, like especially in
your bedroom where you're spending most of your time, hopefully
(03:17):
around eight hours a night or so. But that's a
good way to make sure you have clean air. So
that's number one. Number two, in your diet, try to
limit the amount of plastic you're using in the kitchen
and cooking or food storage. And this is especially relevant
when you're adding heat. So if you're putting that plastic
container in the microwave, absolutely not a good idea, or
(03:40):
using here's a scary one, a plastic kettle to make
your tea in the morning, to try to avoid applying
heat to any of the plastic that you're using it
in the kitchen.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
Okay, what about on a wider societal scale? You know,
are these deeps that we can be taken to decrease this.
Speaker 3 (03:59):
So we are, as I mentioned, producing plastic at a
crazy high rate and its own getting worse. We're on
pace to double the amount of plastics that have ever
been created on the planet as twenty fifty, and so
what we need to do is to come up with
better solutions where we're not creating so much single use,
(04:22):
throwaway plastic and instead pressure our governments, our industries and
have us together working to make sure that we have
more reusable options and to limit the amount of plastics
that we're producing.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
Job are the government standards when it comes to plastic
particles in food and water?
Speaker 3 (04:44):
There are not. There are no standards on this right now,
and it's something of course people are looking into. And importantly,
when it comes to plastic pollution, it's not always just
the polymer itself, but it's some of these chemical additives
that give it certain properties. So like that's why IV
bag might be soft and flexible, while maybe you're food
(05:06):
container might be hard and brittle, even though it's the
same type of polymer, they have different chemical additives in it.
They give it different properties, and some of those chemicals
can leach out and might have negative effects on the body.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
So not all plastic is the same.
Speaker 3 (05:21):
No, in fact, none of them are very similar down
to the exact chemical formula, just because they have so
many different functions.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
So do we know what products are most likely to
need to be causing the micro microplastics in our bodies?
Speaker 3 (05:39):
So unfortunately, basically all plastic is going to break down
to these tiny particles, but each one of them will
have those different formulations with a different chemical additives which
could have different health effects.
Speaker 2 (05:53):
So going back to these microplastics in our brain, do
we actually know what impact their heaven?
Speaker 3 (05:59):
And that is another good question in a very active
area of research, because we don't know exactly what the
impacts are, but we have some hints and there could
be things like oxi native stress, or impacts on like
(06:19):
the immune system. But it comes down to those chemical
additives what we're calling like endocrine disrupting species. Basically, they
can attack or mimic hormones in your body, which of
course could affect things like fertility or other issues potentially
even cancers. We don't know that yet. I just want
(06:41):
to be clear, But those are the things that we're
really looking at the most.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
So we kind of know what we don't.
Speaker 3 (06:48):
Know, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
So how long will it take us to get a
care of picture?
Speaker 3 (06:54):
Do you think it's gonna be It's gonna be tough,
but it's gonna be probably years down the line, because
it's actually when looking at things like plastic exposure, like
if you eat some plastic, you're not going to have
(07:15):
any what we call it acute effect, Like you're not
going to, let's say, die tomorrow. It might taint years
for that to happen. So it's it's again, it's not
an acute effect. So it's a difficult study, but we
luckily have a lot of people working on it and
they're making some very good progress.
Speaker 2 (07:35):
Look, while I've got you on a completely separate night,
I believe that you've had a bit of success in
the old comedy circuit and doctor Joel Science is on
joke how to sold outrun at the comedy festival here.
I believe you've been in the US. Is it a
good demand for science based comedy?
Speaker 3 (07:52):
Well, yeah, it turns out people do like to listen
to science. So I do have a show coming up
at Q Theater on August thirtieth and thirty first, where
I talked about, among other things, and some of my
views on plastics and what we can actually do about
(08:13):
them from a societal standpoint, along with a lot of
other fun and quirky topics.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
So it's all about making science kind of cool and entertaining.
Is that the kind of goal?
Speaker 3 (08:25):
Funny? Yeah, the idea is, yeah, just to sit back,
maybe learn a thing or two and have a good laugh.
Speaker 2 (08:32):
Fantastic You enjoying it?
Speaker 3 (08:35):
Yeah, Yeah, it is a lot of fun because I
get to I get to nerd out on stage a
little bit.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
I love it. Hey, thank you very much for your
time in talking us through that this morning. Dr Joel rendelab.
Speaker 1 (08:47):
There for more from the Sunday session with friend Jessica Runken.
Listen live to News Talks it B from nine am Sunday,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
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