The Government says it's charting a course towards more growth on conservation land.
It's upped entry fees to $40 dollars for overseas visitors looking to visit areas like Cathedral Cove, Tongariro Crossing and Aoraki Mount Cook.
Conservation Minister Tama Potaka says there was demand from Kiwis to charge foreign tourists.
"Not only that, some recent international visitor surveys also suggested international visitors are prepared to pay the charges - as they are in a variety of places...I don't think it's new for international tourists."
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Sunday Session podcast with Francesca Rudkin
from News Talks EDB.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Foreign tourists will now have to pay to visit our
most popular Department of Conservation sites and walking tracks. The
fee of twenty to forty dollars will be charged for
Cathedral Cove, Tonga Edo Crossing, the Milford Track and Mount Cook,
where it's estimated tourist makeup about eighty percent of all visitors.
It's also been announced concessions Conservation Land to discuss conservation.
(00:32):
Minister Tama Portaka is with me now, I very much
appreciate your time this morning, minister.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
Good morning mo Torokyota, and thanks for having me on
the show.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
Hey, how do you determine what sites would have fees
in which one won't, which won't.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Well, we've done an assessment. Look, we're really clear that
right around the world, particularly in our friendly neighbors like Australia, Canada,
United States, people get charged to go on to national parks,
and we think that in some places in his own
very small number of places, particularly where they are high
visitor numbers, where they are high international churt numbers, tourist numbers,
(01:10):
and where there's some infrastructure costs that go with it
that we should contemplate it in these four places of
the first four that we really want to look into
in charge.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
Are you confident tourists will pay the fee and won't
just avoid those sites.
Speaker 3 (01:25):
Yes, and I'm very confident that over the recent months
we undertook public consultation and key wes actually want foreign
tourists to be charged in some places. Not only that
some recent international visitors. So those also suggest that international
visitors are prepared to pay the charge as they are
in a variety of places, whether you get a band
or ULARU or whole range of other well known iconic
(01:47):
locations throughout the Pacific RIM. So I don't think it's
new to international tourists to have to pay to go
to these sorts of iconic and logistic locations. But importantly,
we can use that money to reinvest and BUI diversity,
reinvest in infrastructure around these places where they're being charged.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
You've estimated that this is going to bring in sixty
two million in revenue. What's that based on.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
It's based on assessments that the team down at the
Timement of Conservation has done doing some comparisons and estimating
the total numbers of international tourists that a visit in
these places like it might be more, it might be less.
But that's the current sort of middle of the range estimate.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
Is that sixty two million per year? Yes, okay, So
if I had I had looked at the I looked
at the Department of Conservation and the number of people
that they estimated cross Tonguerero in the last sort of
twenty twenty three, twenty twenty four seasons only one hundred
and five thousand people. You've got fourteen thousand on Milford
Track per year. I can't quite get up to sixty
two million. Get I get to about twelve, you know,
(02:46):
and I'm kind of going, I'm scratching. We hit a
little bit.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
It's actually Melford Sound, not just Milford Track. Melford Track
has two walks. One's a guided walk and one is
the public work. But we're actually Melford Sound. So I
think you might have read a report that and advertinently
it said Milford Track. Yes, no, the Prime Minister when
you go to the Melford Sound, yeah, will Milford Sound
is about a million visitors a year? And did it
an old ocky man Okay, there's a lot of visitors.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
That makes a little bit more sense now that your
prime prime Minister actually said Milford track yesterday in his speech.
So I was, I was, I was going off the
Prime minister. Okay, that makes sense? Sound yeah great? Okay,
So how do you colict that?
Speaker 3 (03:27):
How do you There's a variety of ways, mate. So
in the well, let me let me use an example.
I was responsible for coordinating a concession out in the
Hodaky Gulf with boats going out to dung Etolto or
to Tapoo Anti Tity MARTINGI yep. And a concession fee
was paid by the boat operator to DOC might have
been two bucks fifty per tourists. Wasn't just international terrorists,
(03:50):
it was all terrists. So you can run it through
concession holders that are already in place and operating, and
they can collect it and just pass it through to DOC.
That's one way. Another way, if you go to a
place called Wildpoo down in between d and Topul, there's
actually a turnstyle, so you've got to walk for a
turnstyle to go in and see the champagn Pool, another
(04:11):
beautiful geothermal features down in that part of town. There's
different ways you can do it. We just have to
figure out what's the most optimal way, and one that
thinks in with the concession holders already actually is helpful.
Speaker 2 (04:24):
Are you likely to add more sites in the future.
Speaker 3 (04:27):
We'll look at adding a couple of sites, but let's
just start looking at these four. And I don't think
it's most of the conservation in this estate or the
vast majority of some of these places might be keen,
might be fifteen, but it's not a thousand or three hundred.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
So how will.
Speaker 3 (04:42):
There's only so many places where you've got a high
level of international terroists, yes, and that are suited to
this type of arrangement. It's not all places, and it's
not most places. How will the here is one pay
mate here.
Speaker 2 (04:56):
And they shouldn't have to nature. How we're going to
make sure that they're not being hit up for that money.
Speaker 3 (05:02):
Well, I'll give you an example. There's differential pricing in
the Great Walks, so international terists actually pay more than
keywis when you go in the Great Walks and use
those beautiful huts out in the boonies. And that's the
sort of approach we might be able to use for this.
But again, the implementation details are yet to be resolved,
but we just want to foreshadow. Actually we want to
generate more revenue in some of these iconic places, reinvest
(05:26):
it back into those places, but make sure also recognize
that these are worth going to and people should pay,
just like you and I would pay if we went
to ularu Is Romanos.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
Absolutely absolutely don't have a problem with that. The money reinvested,
where is it going to be reinvested? Is it going
to come back to your ministry?
Speaker 3 (05:45):
Well, my expectation has reinvested in place in those places
where the money has been generated. Yea. And particularly for
the Bide diversity challenges were because you know, we've got
a lot of endangered species in this country. It makes
other things and actually a lot of weeds as well,
things like wild and pines and other things. So these
places they do have their own needs. Let's say Cathedral,
(06:06):
go motor Hills. If I'm going to beautiful place, Marine
Reserve absolutely gorgeous. I don't know if you've been there,
but everyone must go so down there. There have been
some problems with the car parking, bit of movement in
the in the concrete, it's all broken up up the
top of Cathedral Cove. We've had to put in some
money to fix up tracks after cycling Gabrielle, and there's
(06:28):
also just adjacent to or nearby, there's some other beautiful
tracks which a lot of people actually don't know about.
So you know, when we if we're able to implement
that at Cathedral Cove, reinvest that money and help with
some of the infrastructure there and some of the biodivision.
Of course, love to see more Firognteri City and ice creams.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
That I'm sure the locans. You have also announced more
concessions would be creative for businesses to run on conservation land.
What kind of businesses we talking about? And can you
guarantee that these concessions will still protect the conservation land?
Speaker 3 (07:02):
Yeah? Yeah, I think straight up. Conservation legislation is pretty close.
It's very busy and it's actually hard for decision makers
to get to a decision at times around awarding concessions, permits, licenses,
leases or not. We just want to make it easier
so both decision makers and also applicants, the businesses, organizations,
(07:23):
community groups, environmental groups who are using the estate have
far more clarity about how decisions have been made and
the timing to make those decisions. So we want to
help generate more jobs. It's well foreshadowed and well known.
This government really wants to create the opportunities for businesses
to create more jobs and more growth, more higher wages.
(07:45):
And to do that on the conservation estate, we need
to change the legislation to enable these application processes just
to come a lot more decluttered. That's the reasoning behind
it all. We expect if we are able to make
it easier for conservation decision makers to pump artify, good
hard working people down at dock decisions. If we declutter
(08:09):
the legislation, they can make those decisions in a more
time and matter, and more businesses will be able to
unleash their economic potential alongside and within and on dock lands.
We're talking about thirty three percent, about a third of
all land in New Zealand, and it generates about sixty
million dollars for the Department of Conservation right now. Well,
(08:32):
I don't think that that's really what New Zealanders want.
We want to be able to generate more jobs and
come by using the conservation estate, but also reinvest that
into protection things that are very important to us, nature,
the environment, these endangered species, those especially birds and skinks
and other things.
Speaker 2 (08:54):
Tama Potucker, thank you very much for your time this morning.
Appreciate it, no problem tucking down all.
Speaker 1 (08:59):
For more from the Sunday session with Francesca Rudken. Listen
lived to us Talks there'd be from nine am Sunday,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio
You're listening to the Sunday Session podcast with Francesca Rudkin
from News Talks EDB.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Foreign tourists will now have to pay to visit our
most popular Department of Conservation sites and walking tracks. The
fee of twenty to forty dollars will be charged for
Cathedral Cove, Tonga Edo Crossing, the Milford Track and Mount Cook,
where it's estimated tourist makeup about eighty percent of all visitors.
It's also been announced concessions Conservation Land to discuss conservation.
(00:32):
Minister Tama Portaka is with me now, I very much
appreciate your time this morning, minister.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
Good morning mo Torokyota, and thanks for having me on
the show.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
Hey, how do you determine what sites would have fees
in which one won't, which won't.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Well, we've done an assessment. Look, we're really clear that
right around the world, particularly in our friendly neighbors like Australia, Canada,
United States, people get charged to go on to national parks,
and we think that in some places in his own
very small number of places, particularly where they are high
visitor numbers, where they are high international churt numbers, tourist numbers,
(01:10):
and where there's some infrastructure costs that go with it
that we should contemplate it in these four places of
the first four that we really want to look into
in charge.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
Are you confident tourists will pay the fee and won't
just avoid those sites.
Speaker 3 (01:25):
Yes, and I'm very confident that over the recent months
we undertook public consultation and key wes actually want foreign
tourists to be charged in some places. Not only that
some recent international visitors. So those also suggest that international
visitors are prepared to pay the charge as they are
in a variety of places, whether you get a band
or ULARU or whole range of other well known iconic
(01:47):
locations throughout the Pacific RIM. So I don't think it's
new to international tourists to have to pay to go
to these sorts of iconic and logistic locations. But importantly,
we can use that money to reinvest and BUI diversity,
reinvest in infrastructure around these places where they're being charged.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
You've estimated that this is going to bring in sixty
two million in revenue. What's that based on.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
It's based on assessments that the team down at the
Timement of Conservation has done doing some comparisons and estimating
the total numbers of international tourists that a visit in
these places like it might be more, it might be less.
But that's the current sort of middle of the range estimate.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
Is that sixty two million per year? Yes, okay, So
if I had I had looked at the I looked
at the Department of Conservation and the number of people
that they estimated cross Tonguerero in the last sort of
twenty twenty three, twenty twenty four seasons only one hundred
and five thousand people. You've got fourteen thousand on Milford
Track per year. I can't quite get up to sixty
two million. Get I get to about twelve, you know,
(02:46):
and I'm kind of going, I'm scratching. We hit a
little bit.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
It's actually Melford Sound, not just Milford Track. Melford Track
has two walks. One's a guided walk and one is
the public work. But we're actually Melford Sound. So I
think you might have read a report that and advertinently
it said Milford Track. Yes, no, the Prime Minister when
you go to the Melford Sound, yeah, will Milford Sound
is about a million visitors a year? And did it
an old ocky man Okay, there's a lot of visitors.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
That makes a little bit more sense now that your
prime prime Minister actually said Milford track yesterday in his speech.
So I was, I was, I was going off the
Prime minister. Okay, that makes sense? Sound yeah great? Okay,
So how do you colict that?
Speaker 3 (03:27):
How do you There's a variety of ways, mate. So
in the well, let me let me use an example.
I was responsible for coordinating a concession out in the
Hodaky Gulf with boats going out to dung Etolto or
to Tapoo Anti Tity MARTINGI yep. And a concession fee
was paid by the boat operator to DOC might have
been two bucks fifty per tourists. Wasn't just international terrorists,
(03:50):
it was all terrists. So you can run it through
concession holders that are already in place and operating, and
they can collect it and just pass it through to DOC.
That's one way. Another way, if you go to a
place called Wildpoo down in between d and Topul, there's
actually a turnstyle, so you've got to walk for a
turnstyle to go in and see the champagn Pool, another
(04:11):
beautiful geothermal features down in that part of town. There's
different ways you can do it. We just have to
figure out what's the most optimal way, and one that
thinks in with the concession holders already actually is helpful.
Speaker 2 (04:24):
Are you likely to add more sites in the future.
Speaker 3 (04:27):
We'll look at adding a couple of sites, but let's
just start looking at these four. And I don't think
it's most of the conservation in this estate or the
vast majority of some of these places might be keen,
might be fifteen, but it's not a thousand or three hundred.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
So how will.
Speaker 3 (04:42):
There's only so many places where you've got a high
level of international terroists, yes, and that are suited to
this type of arrangement. It's not all places, and it's
not most places. How will the here is one pay
mate here.
Speaker 2 (04:56):
And they shouldn't have to nature. How we're going to
make sure that they're not being hit up for that money.
Speaker 3 (05:02):
Well, I'll give you an example. There's differential pricing in
the Great Walks, so international terists actually pay more than
keywis when you go in the Great Walks and use
those beautiful huts out in the boonies. And that's the
sort of approach we might be able to use for this.
But again, the implementation details are yet to be resolved,
but we just want to foreshadow. Actually we want to
generate more revenue in some of these iconic places, reinvest
(05:26):
it back into those places, but make sure also recognize
that these are worth going to and people should pay,
just like you and I would pay if we went
to ularu Is Romanos.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
Absolutely absolutely don't have a problem with that. The money reinvested,
where is it going to be reinvested? Is it going
to come back to your ministry?
Speaker 3 (05:45):
Well, my expectation has reinvested in place in those places
where the money has been generated. Yea. And particularly for
the Bide diversity challenges were because you know, we've got
a lot of endangered species in this country. It makes
other things and actually a lot of weeds as well,
things like wild and pines and other things. So these
places they do have their own needs. Let's say Cathedral,
(06:06):
go motor Hills. If I'm going to beautiful place, Marine
Reserve absolutely gorgeous. I don't know if you've been there,
but everyone must go so down there. There have been
some problems with the car parking, bit of movement in
the in the concrete, it's all broken up up the
top of Cathedral Cove. We've had to put in some
money to fix up tracks after cycling Gabrielle, and there's
(06:28):
also just adjacent to or nearby, there's some other beautiful
tracks which a lot of people actually don't know about.
So you know, when we if we're able to implement
that at Cathedral Cove, reinvest that money and help with
some of the infrastructure there and some of the biodivision.
Of course, love to see more Firognteri City and ice creams.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
That I'm sure the locans. You have also announced more
concessions would be creative for businesses to run on conservation land.
What kind of businesses we talking about? And can you
guarantee that these concessions will still protect the conservation land?
Speaker 3 (07:02):
Yeah? Yeah, I think straight up. Conservation legislation is pretty close.
It's very busy and it's actually hard for decision makers
to get to a decision at times around awarding concessions, permits, licenses,
leases or not. We just want to make it easier
so both decision makers and also applicants, the businesses, organizations,
(07:23):
community groups, environmental groups who are using the estate have
far more clarity about how decisions have been made and
the timing to make those decisions. So we want to
help generate more jobs. It's well foreshadowed and well known.
This government really wants to create the opportunities for businesses
to create more jobs and more growth, more higher wages.
(07:45):
And to do that on the conservation estate, we need
to change the legislation to enable these application processes just
to come a lot more decluttered. That's the reasoning behind
it all. We expect if we are able to make
it easier for conservation decision makers to pump artify, good
hard working people down at dock decisions. If we declutter
(08:09):
the legislation, they can make those decisions in a more
time and matter, and more businesses will be able to
unleash their economic potential alongside and within and on dock lands.
We're talking about thirty three percent, about a third of
all land in New Zealand, and it generates about sixty
million dollars for the Department of Conservation right now. Well,
(08:32):
I don't think that that's really what New Zealanders want.
We want to be able to generate more jobs and
come by using the conservation estate, but also reinvest that
into protection things that are very important to us, nature,
the environment, these endangered species, those especially birds and skinks
and other things.
Speaker 2 (08:54):
Tama Potucker, thank you very much for your time this morning.
Appreciate it, no problem tucking down all.
Speaker 1 (08:59):
For more from the Sunday session with Francesca Rudken. Listen
lived to us Talks there'd be from nine am Sunday,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio
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