April 20, 2025 • 11 mins
Investing can be an intimidating area and yet it may be one of the best ways to get ahead financially.
But with a lot of us emotionally invested in our finances, we're reluctant to take the leap and instead don't even try.
How do we feel the fear and do it anyway? Or is that fear telling us something?
Financial Adviser and Coach Katie Wesney's joins Tim Beveridge for Smart Money.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News Talk SEDB.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
And her name is Katie Wesney and Katie's with me. Now,
how are you doing really well?
Speaker 3 (00:14):
Thank you, thanks for having.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Me, Thank you for coming out. Now you've come all
the You've come all the way from Wyhiki.
Speaker 3 (00:21):
A different climate over here?
Speaker 2 (00:23):
Is that because it's easter You've got cabin fever the weather.
I've got to get out of the house. Look, I'll
come into the studio.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
Three children and a dog.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Mum has to go. I've just got to catch that.
Speaker 3 (00:35):
She's helping people.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
How long have you How long have you been involved
in the money game?
Speaker 3 (00:41):
Over twenty years now? Is really showing my age different forms?
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Really?
Speaker 3 (00:46):
Yeah? So started as a chartered accountant at KPMG, traveled overseas,
worked at an investment bank that I've been with enabled
me for the last decade.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Wow. So well, first, before you become an accountant, you've
got to get a university. What attracted you to doing
side of things in the first place or did you
justus you went one of those people who I'm going
to go to university and my parents and give me
the hassle. I'll do a be calm.
Speaker 3 (01:15):
Yeah, I landed there. I really enjoyed my accounting papers.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
I knew that to being in a financial advisor and
coach was it?
Speaker 3 (01:26):
Well? Yeah, the tangled where we weave. Hannah McQueen, who
founded Enablement, I were at KPMG as graduates together. So
when she wanted to set up one of her offices
on the North Shore, she picked up the phone and
it really enticed me around helping people. So yeah, the
rest is history.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
What what sort of what sort of accountant were you
when you were when you were practicing at in your earlier.
Speaker 3 (01:52):
Days small business?
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Okay? And is that something? Is that something that's what's
what's generally people's financial literacy? Like? Do you think that?
I mean, I'm not sure why I found literacy. I'm
not going to rate myself. I know how to do
a spreadsheet, but in terms of making smart decisions around money,
not too great. Is it something you felt and there
was a big need out there that you could address?
Speaker 3 (02:15):
Yeah? I think New Zealanders as a whole work incredibly hard.
But I also know that doesn't necessarily translate translate to
the financial progress we deserve so or a nation of
really hard workers but terrible stats in terms of financial
well being. I read last week that ninety two percent
(02:36):
of us don't feel comfortable in terms of their finances.
Ninety two percent.
Speaker 2 (02:44):
I guess I'm part of that.
Speaker 1 (02:46):
Well.
Speaker 2 (02:46):
Actually, justically you'd have to take a guess that someone
who worked in the arts for a couple of decades
and hours in this gig, yeah, i'd probably be one
of that night. I'm definitely one of that ninety percent.
I'm not going to pussy foo around. Are you actually
in that ninety two percent?
Speaker 3 (03:00):
Absolutely not.
Speaker 2 (03:01):
That the talk you do.
Speaker 3 (03:03):
I think people sniffcricy when they're talking to people, so
I walk the talk.
Speaker 2 (03:07):
Did you always walk the talk?
Speaker 3 (03:10):
Absolutely not. I've learned really good lessons, and I think
that's part of being a good financial coach is relating
to people and really empathizing with them, really listening carefully
because there is a lot of fear and I actually
think a lot of shame around money.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
Yeah, because we don't have a class society here where
you're up a middle or lower class. You've just we've
sort of got a what's your income brack at top
of society in a way because you talk about it
openly no, but you drive a Tesla or you drive
a second a third hand Toyota.
Speaker 4 (03:46):
I guess we do.
Speaker 3 (03:48):
I also know that smoke and mirrors what you see
is not Ah, yes, of course up the bonnet.
Speaker 2 (03:53):
I was amazed actually just I mean, I don't want
to get off the topic here, but I was amazed
at the number of cars that are leased. And suddenly,
you know, business goes south and you see someone and
all of a sudden that cars disappeared.
Speaker 4 (04:04):
Is it quite? Is that one of the things you have?
Speaker 3 (04:08):
Absolutely? And I think there is a focus of earning
whereby we forget it's not what we earn, it's what
we keep that gets us ahead.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
What was the biggest lesson or the first what's the
biggest financial lesson? You remember learning that was ties into
what you're doing now you thank godness me. I advise
this all the time, But how back such and such
this is the first big mistake I made or lesson?
Speaker 3 (04:34):
Yeah? I think it was for me. I was always
to focus on the next pay rise and upskilling myself,
so really focused on that kind of career capital. But
also I have an inclination to shop, and.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
If this was television, that would have been a world
of a delivered line there, because there's a bit of
extra emphasis in the expression.
Speaker 3 (04:58):
So again, it's not it's not what you earn, it's
what you keep. And I really had a light mold
moment when I was thinking about, well, how do we
buy a property, how do I set my kids, uf,
et cetera. I really want to focus on doing this, Well,
how can I do that?
Speaker 4 (05:15):
Is it so?
Speaker 2 (05:16):
Was it for you that you just realized did you
have to teach yourself? Not teach yourself. I'm putting this
the wrong way. But when you, if you like to shop,
I'm thinking you had a look and you go go,
what am I buying all this stuff for? What am
I spending?
Speaker 1 (05:27):
Oh?
Speaker 2 (05:27):
My goodness, this is how much on spending every month
or something on stuff that I don't need?
Speaker 4 (05:33):
Is it a bit like that?
Speaker 3 (05:34):
A little bit? And I think it comes first to
really assessing your own situation, which is actually kind of
tricky to do yourself, which is why I think lots
of people reach out for external advice to do that,
and just assessing cash and cash out. If I carry
on the way I am, I'm going to have to
work a really long time. How do I do the
smarter How do I grow my assets other than just
(05:57):
focusing on myself and earning, because that's the ticket out
of perpetually earning.
Speaker 2 (06:03):
It's an interesting journey, isn't it. Of course you would
talk about how long do you have to work for
sort of thing. But the funny thing is when you
get to that age where you can quit, then all
of a sudden, your question becomes different. It becomes about
the choice to work because of other reasons, and that,
to me would be the definition of success. That I'm
choosing to work simply because I enjoy it.
Speaker 3 (06:24):
I absolutely agree with you, and lots of people enjoy
their job. I actually love what I do. It's a
whole different mindset shift around working because you want to
versus you have to, which for the vast majority of
New Zealanders we have to because we haven't built up
enough assets or passive income that would replicate what you're doing.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
Yeah, every time this topic comes up, I always think
of course, if we've been working in Australia, there's decisions
are almost made for you with them.
Speaker 3 (06:54):
What is it?
Speaker 2 (06:54):
The contributions to Souper just colossal, aren't they. What's the
most common mistake you think that new Zealanders make or
new clients of yours. That It's a bit like when
I do a topic with Alex, so I know someone's
going to there are common threads that pop up, and
I'm waiting for a particular corn on a particular subject.
So I'm like, well, this is going to happen. Do
you have that with financial advice, that there are certain
(07:15):
common mistakes? We go, Yeah, of course you're doing that.
I'm not surprised you will join the club.
Speaker 3 (07:19):
Yeah. And I think for most people it's the fact
that they don't have a plan that is a really
big obstacle when it comes to finances, and they look
at things at a really micro level. For example, a
client might come in saying, my mortgage is really high
and I've got a mortgage rolling off. How long should
I fix for? So that's their focus area versus what
(07:42):
I'd rather than be focusing on, is I have a mortgage,
what's my strategy around paying that off? How does that
fit into my wider investment strategy. So we go really
micro and we obsess about things that largely are out
of our control, like interest rates.
Speaker 4 (08:02):
How often it is the I've had this discussion recently
on This hour about people who say, look, the best
thing you can do is pay your mortgage off, And
then there's someone called up and said, well, actually, if
you'd stuck every available dolly you had into the S
and P five.
Speaker 2 (08:18):
Hundred, you'd be well way better off. Of course, but
you don't know how the SMP is going to predict
or do we? I don't know, especially not now.
Speaker 4 (08:27):
We don't.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
Haven't got a bloom and clue, have we? But is
that a good default starting point? It's like, you know,
I've got this mortgage. You know, if it's six percent
or five and a half, you'd have to earn eight
nine percent before you pay tax on it, So you
might as well just pay your mortgage off as quickly
as possible. Is that a common what's your take on that?
Speaker 3 (08:49):
Yeah? And I can give you an example. I saw
some lovely clients last week who have done exceptionally well
and focused just on pay off the mortgage. So they
have another four years left on that mortgage, which is
absolutely fantastic. And to answer your question, paying off your
home mortgage, it's unproductive debt. A that's an important cornerstone
(09:12):
for a financial plan. But it shouldn't be the only
thing you do, because actually, if that's your only focused
there's an opportunity cost of doing that, and that your
equity just sits in that one property doing nothing. You
could have potentially tapped into that to buy another property
or diversified in terms of other investments. So paying off
(09:33):
your mortgage faster absolutely a cornerstone, but you've got to
look at what else you should be doing. So for
most of my clients, it's you pay off debt and
you grow wealth concurrently.
Speaker 2 (09:43):
Okay, well, I previewed this hour or prefaced it by
talking about the emotional of investment and then the emotionality
of investing and how emotions get in the way. How
big a deal in your experience is emotion and making
these decisions, because I don't know many people who are
just sort of siph who don't feel that, you know,
(10:06):
don't feel like they just go, well, this makes sense,
I'll do that. Most people go ah ah yeah, and.
Speaker 3 (10:13):
Then they do nothing, which and I think also with couples,
there can be quite different money personalities which play into
how they interact with their finances. So, for example, our
savior is generally really good at paying off debt, so
they can be really focused on doing that versus a
shopper and kind of like the idea of paying off debt,
(10:36):
but it's hard for them to sustain that, so they
often need a bigger goal that's sexy enough and motivating
enough for them to try harder and stick to a
particular strategy. So it's generally the interplay of couples as
well who come to see us, which is, how do
we craft a strategy that will speak to you both?
Speaker 2 (10:56):
Okay, well, we love your cause on this, I mean,
how do you cope with if you're listening, how do
you cope with the emotion of it? Or is it
simply that emotion is because you haven't really In fact,
I'm throwing this to you as well, Katie, I'm just
taking a guess at this, but I think emotion takes
over when you don't have enough information as well, and
you're scared of what you might know, so you refuse
(11:18):
to know, and then it's just this big, amorphous, undefinable
thing that you're worried about. I'm talking from a self here,
probably yea that there are certain things I'm sort of
scared of addressing because I don't want to know how
stuffed I am.
Speaker 3 (11:33):
Yeah, but knowledge is power. It is and I think
for lots of people, they come in and they're like,
money's not important to me. But I don't believe them
because it's that it often wakes us up at night.
It's that really, it's that thing that we know that
it's really creeping into every facet of our life.
Speaker 1 (11:54):
For more from the Weekend Collective, listen live to News
Talk z'd be weekends from three pm, or follow the
podcast on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News Talk SEDB.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
And her name is Katie Wesney and Katie's with me. Now,
how are you doing really well?
Speaker 3 (00:14):
Thank you, thanks for having.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Me, Thank you for coming out. Now you've come all
the You've come all the way from Wyhiki.
Speaker 3 (00:21):
A different climate over here?
Speaker 2 (00:23):
Is that because it's easter You've got cabin fever the weather.
I've got to get out of the house. Look, I'll
come into the studio.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
Three children and a dog.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Mum has to go. I've just got to catch that.
Speaker 3 (00:35):
She's helping people.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
How long have you How long have you been involved
in the money game?
Speaker 3 (00:41):
Over twenty years now? Is really showing my age different forms?
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Really?
Speaker 3 (00:46):
Yeah? So started as a chartered accountant at KPMG, traveled overseas,
worked at an investment bank that I've been with enabled
me for the last decade.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Wow. So well, first, before you become an accountant, you've
got to get a university. What attracted you to doing
side of things in the first place or did you
justus you went one of those people who I'm going
to go to university and my parents and give me
the hassle. I'll do a be calm.
Speaker 3 (01:15):
Yeah, I landed there. I really enjoyed my accounting papers.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
I knew that to being in a financial advisor and
coach was it?
Speaker 3 (01:26):
Well? Yeah, the tangled where we weave. Hannah McQueen, who
founded Enablement, I were at KPMG as graduates together. So
when she wanted to set up one of her offices
on the North Shore, she picked up the phone and
it really enticed me around helping people. So yeah, the
rest is history.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
What what sort of what sort of accountant were you
when you were when you were practicing at in your earlier.
Speaker 3 (01:52):
Days small business?
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Okay? And is that something? Is that something that's what's
what's generally people's financial literacy? Like? Do you think that?
I mean, I'm not sure why I found literacy. I'm
not going to rate myself. I know how to do
a spreadsheet, but in terms of making smart decisions around money,
not too great. Is it something you felt and there
was a big need out there that you could address?
Speaker 3 (02:15):
Yeah? I think New Zealanders as a whole work incredibly hard.
But I also know that doesn't necessarily translate translate to
the financial progress we deserve so or a nation of
really hard workers but terrible stats in terms of financial
well being. I read last week that ninety two percent
(02:36):
of us don't feel comfortable in terms of their finances.
Ninety two percent.
Speaker 2 (02:44):
I guess I'm part of that.
Speaker 1 (02:46):
Well.
Speaker 2 (02:46):
Actually, justically you'd have to take a guess that someone
who worked in the arts for a couple of decades
and hours in this gig, yeah, i'd probably be one
of that night. I'm definitely one of that ninety percent.
I'm not going to pussy foo around. Are you actually
in that ninety two percent?
Speaker 3 (03:00):
Absolutely not.
Speaker 2 (03:01):
That the talk you do.
Speaker 3 (03:03):
I think people sniffcricy when they're talking to people, so
I walk the talk.
Speaker 2 (03:07):
Did you always walk the talk?
Speaker 3 (03:10):
Absolutely not. I've learned really good lessons, and I think
that's part of being a good financial coach is relating
to people and really empathizing with them, really listening carefully
because there is a lot of fear and I actually
think a lot of shame around money.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
Yeah, because we don't have a class society here where
you're up a middle or lower class. You've just we've
sort of got a what's your income brack at top
of society in a way because you talk about it
openly no, but you drive a Tesla or you drive
a second a third hand Toyota.
Speaker 4 (03:46):
I guess we do.
Speaker 3 (03:48):
I also know that smoke and mirrors what you see
is not Ah, yes, of course up the bonnet.
Speaker 2 (03:53):
I was amazed actually just I mean, I don't want
to get off the topic here, but I was amazed
at the number of cars that are leased. And suddenly,
you know, business goes south and you see someone and
all of a sudden that cars disappeared.
Speaker 4 (04:04):
Is it quite? Is that one of the things you have?
Speaker 3 (04:08):
Absolutely? And I think there is a focus of earning
whereby we forget it's not what we earn, it's what
we keep that gets us ahead.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
What was the biggest lesson or the first what's the
biggest financial lesson? You remember learning that was ties into
what you're doing now you thank godness me. I advise
this all the time, But how back such and such
this is the first big mistake I made or lesson?
Speaker 3 (04:34):
Yeah? I think it was for me. I was always
to focus on the next pay rise and upskilling myself,
so really focused on that kind of career capital. But
also I have an inclination to shop, and.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
If this was television, that would have been a world
of a delivered line there, because there's a bit of
extra emphasis in the expression.
Speaker 3 (04:58):
So again, it's not it's not what you earn, it's
what you keep. And I really had a light mold
moment when I was thinking about, well, how do we
buy a property, how do I set my kids, uf,
et cetera. I really want to focus on doing this, Well,
how can I do that?
Speaker 4 (05:15):
Is it so?
Speaker 2 (05:16):
Was it for you that you just realized did you
have to teach yourself? Not teach yourself. I'm putting this
the wrong way. But when you, if you like to shop,
I'm thinking you had a look and you go go,
what am I buying all this stuff for? What am
I spending?
Speaker 1 (05:27):
Oh?
Speaker 2 (05:27):
My goodness, this is how much on spending every month
or something on stuff that I don't need?
Speaker 4 (05:33):
Is it a bit like that?
Speaker 3 (05:34):
A little bit? And I think it comes first to
really assessing your own situation, which is actually kind of
tricky to do yourself, which is why I think lots
of people reach out for external advice to do that,
and just assessing cash and cash out. If I carry
on the way I am, I'm going to have to
work a really long time. How do I do the
smarter How do I grow my assets other than just
(05:57):
focusing on myself and earning, because that's the ticket out
of perpetually earning.
Speaker 2 (06:03):
It's an interesting journey, isn't it. Of course you would
talk about how long do you have to work for
sort of thing. But the funny thing is when you
get to that age where you can quit, then all
of a sudden, your question becomes different. It becomes about
the choice to work because of other reasons, and that,
to me would be the definition of success. That I'm
choosing to work simply because I enjoy it.
Speaker 3 (06:24):
I absolutely agree with you, and lots of people enjoy
their job. I actually love what I do. It's a
whole different mindset shift around working because you want to
versus you have to, which for the vast majority of
New Zealanders we have to because we haven't built up
enough assets or passive income that would replicate what you're doing.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
Yeah, every time this topic comes up, I always think
of course, if we've been working in Australia, there's decisions
are almost made for you with them.
Speaker 3 (06:54):
What is it?
Speaker 2 (06:54):
The contributions to Souper just colossal, aren't they. What's the
most common mistake you think that new Zealanders make or
new clients of yours. That It's a bit like when
I do a topic with Alex, so I know someone's
going to there are common threads that pop up, and
I'm waiting for a particular corn on a particular subject.
So I'm like, well, this is going to happen. Do
you have that with financial advice, that there are certain
(07:15):
common mistakes? We go, Yeah, of course you're doing that.
I'm not surprised you will join the club.
Speaker 3 (07:19):
Yeah. And I think for most people it's the fact
that they don't have a plan that is a really
big obstacle when it comes to finances, and they look
at things at a really micro level. For example, a
client might come in saying, my mortgage is really high
and I've got a mortgage rolling off. How long should
I fix for? So that's their focus area versus what
(07:42):
I'd rather than be focusing on, is I have a mortgage,
what's my strategy around paying that off? How does that
fit into my wider investment strategy. So we go really
micro and we obsess about things that largely are out
of our control, like interest rates.
Speaker 4 (08:02):
How often it is the I've had this discussion recently
on This hour about people who say, look, the best
thing you can do is pay your mortgage off, And
then there's someone called up and said, well, actually, if
you'd stuck every available dolly you had into the S
and P five.
Speaker 2 (08:18):
Hundred, you'd be well way better off. Of course, but
you don't know how the SMP is going to predict
or do we? I don't know, especially not now.
Speaker 4 (08:27):
We don't.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
Haven't got a bloom and clue, have we? But is
that a good default starting point? It's like, you know,
I've got this mortgage. You know, if it's six percent
or five and a half, you'd have to earn eight
nine percent before you pay tax on it, So you
might as well just pay your mortgage off as quickly
as possible. Is that a common what's your take on that?
Speaker 3 (08:49):
Yeah? And I can give you an example. I saw
some lovely clients last week who have done exceptionally well
and focused just on pay off the mortgage. So they
have another four years left on that mortgage, which is
absolutely fantastic. And to answer your question, paying off your
home mortgage, it's unproductive debt. A that's an important cornerstone
(09:12):
for a financial plan. But it shouldn't be the only
thing you do, because actually, if that's your only focused
there's an opportunity cost of doing that, and that your
equity just sits in that one property doing nothing. You
could have potentially tapped into that to buy another property
or diversified in terms of other investments. So paying off
(09:33):
your mortgage faster absolutely a cornerstone, but you've got to
look at what else you should be doing. So for
most of my clients, it's you pay off debt and
you grow wealth concurrently.
Speaker 2 (09:43):
Okay, well, I previewed this hour or prefaced it by
talking about the emotional of investment and then the emotionality
of investing and how emotions get in the way. How
big a deal in your experience is emotion and making
these decisions, because I don't know many people who are
just sort of siph who don't feel that, you know,
(10:06):
don't feel like they just go, well, this makes sense,
I'll do that. Most people go ah ah yeah, and.
Speaker 3 (10:13):
Then they do nothing, which and I think also with couples,
there can be quite different money personalities which play into
how they interact with their finances. So, for example, our
savior is generally really good at paying off debt, so
they can be really focused on doing that versus a
shopper and kind of like the idea of paying off debt,
(10:36):
but it's hard for them to sustain that, so they
often need a bigger goal that's sexy enough and motivating
enough for them to try harder and stick to a
particular strategy. So it's generally the interplay of couples as
well who come to see us, which is, how do
we craft a strategy that will speak to you both?
Speaker 2 (10:56):
Okay, well, we love your cause on this, I mean,
how do you cope with if you're listening, how do
you cope with the emotion of it? Or is it
simply that emotion is because you haven't really In fact,
I'm throwing this to you as well, Katie, I'm just
taking a guess at this, but I think emotion takes
over when you don't have enough information as well, and
you're scared of what you might know, so you refuse
(11:18):
to know, and then it's just this big, amorphous, undefinable
thing that you're worried about. I'm talking from a self here,
probably yea that there are certain things I'm sort of
scared of addressing because I don't want to know how
stuffed I am.
Speaker 3 (11:33):
Yeah, but knowledge is power. It is and I think
for lots of people, they come in and they're like,
money's not important to me. But I don't believe them
because it's that it often wakes us up at night.
It's that really, it's that thing that we know that
it's really creeping into every facet of our life.
Speaker 1 (11:54):
For more from the Weekend Collective, listen live to News
Talk z'd be weekends from three pm, or follow the
podcast on iHeartRadio.
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