July 16, 2019 • 27 mins
When we think of the mob today, most Americans think of New York City -- and why not? After all, films, books and TV shows often depict New York as the heart of mob country. Yet, as the guys discover in today's episode, the story of the Italian-American mafia has a surprisingly different (and often forgotten) origin point.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Ridiculous History is a production of I Heart Radio. You
(00:27):
come into my house on a day my daughter is
to be married. You who asked me to do murder
for money? Welcome to the show. Ridiculous Historians thinks so
much for tuning in circumstances. Find us recording on a
lovely almost one hundred degree morning here in Atlanta, Georgia.
I'm Ben, I'm no Ben? Was that from Dirty Harry? Uh?
(00:50):
That is a quote from Don Vito Corleone in The Godfather. Yes,
famously portrayed by Clint Eastwood in the film Dirty Hair
working under his face? Miss pseudonym Marlon Brando, which is
a pretty fake name if you think about. You know
who only uses their real name here in the United States.
That's our good friend and super producer Casey Pegram Viva
(01:14):
La Bush, Viva Bush. Wait. Wait wait did we say
your name yet? I don't know? Okay, Well you're no,
I am no, that's true? What's my name that? I am?
Not a member of LaCOSA Nostro, But I do enjoy
a good mob flick from time to time. And rewatching
the Sopranos lately got my start doing it on an
airplane where it was censored in a hilarious way. Um,
(01:34):
So I watched one through three of season one in
that fashion, and then once the swears started getting back
in the mix, it was borderline shocking. Ben. Let me
tell you, these guys really love their fs and Jeff's
I still have it. I still haven't watched Sopranos all
the way through? Are you kidding me? Wow? It's really good.
I know how it is. Watched the last episode. It
ends with a Journey song and a cut to black.
(01:56):
And that's not a spoiler. Well, it can't be a spoiler.
We have statutes established for this. I think it's it's
past the statute of limitations. Here's the thing about the
statue limitation of spoilers. Yes it exists, But are you
still being a bit of a schmuck if you do
it and don't prepare someone for something that they're enjoying
so much content out there in the world. That's weird.
Are you saying that you're doing a complete one eight
from your previously passionately completely opposite stance. Now, listen, Ben,
(02:20):
we were talking specifically about the ending of Loss that
I did not even actually spoil. I was accused of
spoiling it. But the thing I said was not in
fact a spoiler at all. I believe in that situation,
which was probably more than a few years, because yeah,
in that situation, Um, my position is that the creators
of Laws spoiled the ending more than any Yeah, exactly.
(02:44):
But but I am a huge fan of mafia films,
a lot of crime films, but mafia films in particular,
and off air, we were kicking around this idea, Casey,
what are some of your favorite crime films, specifically organized
crime called a no straw mafia. Well, then when you
asked me about this, my mind was completely blank because
(03:04):
the first thing that jumped to my head was Scorsese's Casino,
which is far from obscure, but it is. It is
definitely one of my favorites, along with Good Fellows. But
you know, if you if you want to go a
little deeper cut, I would say, check out one of
the films of Jean Pierre Melville, like uh Les circ
Lar Rouge or maybe Bob La Flambert. What about Las
Samurai isn't then that's me and El and uh yeah,
(03:29):
that's a good one as well, Casey. On the Case
Film Edition man, we should do that more often. That'd
be cool. Yeah, if it comes up, Yeah, just let
us know, Casey, if the spirit moves you. I don't
ever want it to be something where you feel stressed, like,
oh crap, I have to come up with a movie homework?
Who cares about homework? What's the crime film you like?
(03:49):
I'll tell you what I watched recently was The French Connection.
I've never seen him before. It is a um oh gosh,
William Friedkin William fried Kent film um famously directed The
Exorcist and uh, what else is he directed? Was really great,
which I've not seen Santa. He also did a trucking
a movie about like like, what's it called, oh, Sorcerer Sorcerer,
(04:10):
which has a tangerine dream sound track that you're like,
but um, the thing that was so cool about French
Connection is it's very naturalistic. It's just very like. Something
about it makes you feel like you're really in the room.
I think a lot of it was improvised. Um. There's
this incredible chase sequence where Gene Hackman is chasing a
New York subway train that's at the portion where it's
(04:30):
on an elevated track and he's in this like car
that he's common deer, and he's driving underneath the track
and it's just such a dynamic, cool, badass chase sequence,
really really frenetic, high energy film. You know. Robert de Niro,
I thought, did a good job taking the directorial position
with a bronx tail. Do you guys remember that one?
I never saw that. Actually, it was pretty it's it's
it triggers some nostalgia for me, which may be part
(04:53):
of the reason I liked it. Another old one that
I really enjoyed was The Big Heat. That's like nineteen fifties.
I think The Big Heat is for its slaying. Actually,
he's a great German filmmaker that came over to the
States after Gebel's offered him the German film industry the
whole thing, yeah on a platter. Yeah uh, and he
thought maybe not and he fled Germany that night. It's uh.
(05:16):
The Big Heat is pretty dark as fifty noirs go,
but it's it's worth a watch, especially if it's something
that you've seen pop up on some film list and
you've you've never quite gotten around too. I'd say it's
worth a watch. It's surprisingly violent for the time today's
show is about organized crime, specifically the mafia, specifically the
(05:38):
Italian American Mafia. However, it is not about New York City. No,
It's about another place entirely ben that does have a
reputation for revelry, it does have a reputation for seediness,
a certain element, but I've never in my life associated
it with organized crime until he started looking into this topic.
It's a place referred to often as the Big Easy
(05:59):
No All No La or New Orleans or New Orleans,
that's correct. Yeah, New Orleans, beautiful city, home to almost
a parallel branch of American history. You know, one thing
that is confusing too many kids growing up in the
United States outside of Louisiana is the concept of parishes
(06:21):
rather than counties. Because Louisiana has parishes, and that is
a that is one of the many vestigial traditions carried
down from its history as a French city of French
territory or region. And of course, this city is home
to so many amazing things that are influential, not just
(06:41):
in the US but in the world entire and it
is also home to the mafia. As we found out.
You see many of us myself included in the past,
would reasonably assume that the mafia, the Italian American mafia
specifically had its roots in the Big Apple, New York City, NYC.
(07:02):
Because this is where you see The Godfather being set,
this is where the five great crime families are based,
and this is where millions and millions of Italian immigrants
originally came. They first came to New York City, Statue
of Liberty, Ellis Island, the whole nine. In reality, though,
the first Italian American mafia came from New Orleans. That
(07:28):
that was the first one, and it's also the site
of the first major let's say, maybe a conflict, but
mafia incident, mafia murder. Yeah, it's true, Ben And and
the thing is the actual Like, first on the list
for immigration from Italy was places like Argentina and Brazil,
which I would never have really considered either because they
(07:51):
had similar cultures to what the Italian immigrants were used
to in their homeland. Uh, New Orleans became a popular
second choice. Yeah, this was during the eighteen hundreds, mainly
because there was already so much trade with New Orleans
and cities and regions in Brazil and Argentina. This is
(08:12):
weird because it already began to trigger some xenophobia amongst
people who were not Sicilian or not Italian. The New
Orleans Times reported back in eighteen sixty nine that parts
of the city were overrun with get this quote, well
known and notorious Sicilian murderers, counterfeitters, and burglars who in
(08:35):
the last month have formed a sort of general co
partnership or stock company for the plunder and disturbance of
the city. That's not the that's not the kind of
elements you want coming into your city. I mean, that's
how you would describe a mafia if you had never
heard of the mafia before. That's true, but this is
a time where this is very new, right for for
(08:56):
the US. They didn't know about the crime families in Italy.
You know, there was no Internet. It wasn't like super
common knowledge. This was like a very new thing that
was kind of invading their community. And this sort of
tension continues building between the average the squares, the non
criminal citizens, the authorities in New Orleans, and the mafia.
(09:19):
It reaches ahead and what it started to describe this earlier.
The first major incident, the first murder occurs on October
fift There are probably other ones, but this is the
first one we know about. New Orleans Police Superintendent David
Hennessy is assassinated, basically murdered execution style, and then public
(09:40):
outrage and hysteria breaks. Hundreds of Sicilians get arrested, eventually
nineteen or fingered for the crime, but then they were acquitted. Yeah,
and just before that happened Giuseppe Esposito, who was one
of the first known Sicilian mafia members to come to
the United States. He actually came to New York um.
And this is after he and six of his cronies
(10:02):
murdered the chancellor and a vice chancellor of a province
in Sicily, in addition to eleven very very influential and
rich landowners. And he was arrested in New Orleans in
eighty one, and then he was extradited to Italy. And
New Orleans is becoming a hotbed of this kind of activity,
and it's sort of starting to bubble over with this
(10:22):
incident that you're describing, ben and led to some pretty
serious consequences, didn't it. Yeah. So on October fifte David
Hennessy has murdered nineteen, As they said, hundreds of Sicilians
arrested nineteen go to trial, but they're acquitted. And this
(10:43):
makes everyone else in the city say someone was bribing them,
someone was scaring the witnesses. So the citizens of New Orleans,
the squares I mentioned earlier, organize a lynch mob and
they kill eleven of those nineteen people who got away.
Two of them were hanged, nine of them were shot,
and the other eight escaped. We're not sure what happened
(11:05):
to them. But this, along with that criminal you're describing, Knowle,
gives us a very different image of New Orleans. You know.
We we imagine the many other problems the city happen
at the time, but we don't really think of imported
Italian criminal enterprise. You know. We know that there has
been uh fairly rich research on this, especially by the
(11:28):
Sicilian historian Salvatore Lupo. In his History of the Mafia,
he talks about how you can trace the spread of
the mafia in the US directly to Sicilian immigration to
New Orleans, and by the end of the nineteenth century,
New Orleans had the largest Sicilian population in the US,
(11:51):
which surprised me. I guess I just always assumed it
would have been New York. I would have too, and
apparently as well. Been. One reason this was the case
is the state of Louisiana was working with sugar planters
to replace slave labor, so that kind of immigration, opening
up that kind of immigration was part of that effort. Yes,
(12:11):
so they've got booming agricultural business, right, this is a
world class port. That alone is very attractive to the mafia.
But if you throw in the disorganized city functions and
the corrupt administration, boom boom boom, we've got a mafia
moth heading toward an illicit flame. Very nice image there been,
(12:33):
uh and that flame ended up being the French Quarter
and Bourbon Street specifically. So when you think of Bourbon
Street anyone that's been that's visited New Orleans, you kind
of think of it as being the trashy, kind of
tourist d spot that's not necessarily where you want to
hit if you're like kind of going for off the
beaten path kind of stuff. But the original Bourpons of
what led to that reputation, the original Bourbon Street as
(12:56):
kind of like you know, established by some of these uh,
these Sicilian mobsters was a just absolute smorgue sport of
things like jazz clubs, speakeasies, restaurantsnudy bars, strip clubs, all
that kind of stuff. And it was all run and
operated or at least largely people were getting a cut
that were members of this mafia group. Yeah. Richard Campanella,
(13:19):
the author of Bourbon Street, a History, has it this
way if he he's on the same page with us here,
because he says they didn't necessarily control all of Bourbon Street,
but they had this behind the scenes influential consortium. You know,
imagine imagine it like this. You don't own every house
(13:43):
of ill repute on Bourbon Street, but you do coordinate
what they can charge for things, and they do pay
you a certain percentage and you help keep people's turf
boundaries clear. It's that same thing you see in like
a show like Sopranos, where uh, the mob of underbosses
or some of the what do they call him, like
enforcers I guess, go door to door to businesses, collecting
(14:06):
collections what they call it. And that means that the
mob has a hand in offering protection to these businesses
as long as they're given a cut. So they sort
of set the tone, I guess for for the kind
of businesses that are lucrative and that are going to
generate enough money to get them, keep them paid, and
keep them happy. Right. Yeah, And this is this is
an interesting way to look at We've got this quote
(14:27):
from Campanilla. He's describing the extent of Bourbon Street. You know,
he says, thirteen blocks in the quarter were more block
in another place. Half his residential halfs commercial, couple hundred businesses.
This is where he gets to a specific example of
mafia involvement. He says, quote, you'd have bars, some clubs,
a restaurant, and something completely unrelated like an electrical store.
(14:50):
And in the back rooms of many bars and clubs,
you might have a pinball machine that really was controlled
by the mob They paid off the bartender to make
sure only they got the money. There were these bookmakers,
poker machines, illegal gambling. Meanwhile, a legitimate bar was up
and running and the bartenders might not have anything to
do with the mobsters. But make no mistake, a number
(15:11):
of owners were out and out mobsters. So you could
have like Casey could have uh, you know, crazy Casey's
crawfish and jazz club, and it could be totally legitimate
and on the up and up, but there could be
a back room where people go to gamble and it's
just sort of like contracted out to the mob. Yeah,
(15:31):
and the mobsters get points on those poker games, illegal
poke games, or they're like out now controlled by the
mom So for sure. Uh, this is a little bit
off topic, but really funny. I was in Brooklyn recently
and I went to the most Brooklyn establishment I've ever
been to in my life. It was a combination laundromat,
pinball emporium and bar. Probably controlled by the mob. You think,
(15:52):
so one would assume, well, we don't know if it's
We also can't profile mobs. We have to be fair
to organize crime. It could be Irish mob. It's also true.
I don't know. I'm just saying, So, where's the origin
of the word mafia come from and mafia versus mob? Well,
if we check the handy dandy last minute etymology, dive
mafia originally derives from a Sicilian adje mafiu so, which
(16:16):
roughly translated means swagger, oldness or bravado got it. And
then the idea of abo the mob refers to literally
like a gang, you know, a group of individuals that
have a common purpose. Let's look at that. That's interesting,
mafia versus mob. So the mafia is gonna be Italian
because as that Sicilian origin, but the mob can refer
(16:40):
to other organized groups or organized crime in general, so
like corrupt teamsters could be a mob. So a mob
is not necessarily the mafia, but mob is also a
synonym or nickname for the Italian mafia. Interesting, it is interesting.
So the mafia would specifically refer to this idea of
la cosa nostra, which is something we've talked about off
(17:03):
Mike plenty, right, this thing of ours omerta is the code.
There's a gradient, Campanella says, from a proper noun to
a common noun. So he breaks it down saying, there's
mafia with a capital M, and then there's the mob
capital M, and then there's just no capital M mob,
and then there's mobsters, there's organized crime, and they're all
(17:25):
these affiliated parties. So he says, it's challenging and one
must be careful about the terminology. And it's interesting because
the government of Louisiana did not originally settle on mass
immigration of Sicilians. They apparently tried to recruit people from China,
they tried to recruit people from Scandinavia, Greece, Portugal, Spanish,
(17:51):
but they were able to entice Sicilian populations because in
post unification Sicily there were a ton of reasons for
people to get out. Life just wasn't super great. However,
as this is a history show, we have to admit
there is a compelling reason that people think of the
mafia in New York now and not in New Orleans,
(18:12):
and that's because it's not near as prominent now. Because
you know, we we said that those first inklings of
problems began in the eighteen hundreds. By the eighteen seventies,
the Matrungka crime family has already been established in New Orleans.
They're collecting tributes their engagement racketeering, prostitution, extortion and so on.
(18:33):
But they're not the only game in town. And fighting
is already breaking out in the eighteen eighties between the
crime families. They want to see who controls the waterfront, right,
and we talked this is ultimately what led to Hennessy's
death and then later the Lynch Mob, and it gave
the mafia a lesson that they never forgot because in
(18:57):
Sicily there's a bit of a stereotype, but in other
in Italy overall, at the time criminals could act without
much regard for authorities or societies. But now they learned, Okay,
there limits to what we can get away with here.
And this a lot of people will tell you that
this is what set the Italian American mafia on its
(19:20):
on its course of following strict rules against targeting law
enforcement outside of very very special circumstances. Don't want to
keep it quiet absolutely. I mean, it's a big deal,
even in like these crime shows and movies when you
kill a policeman or somebody that's a member of law enforcement,
because that that is going to open you up for retaliation.
(19:41):
And ultimately you want to keep things as copasetic as
possible and as contained as possible so you can continue operating,
because at the end of the day, it's a business,
it's not They're not just there to wreak mass havoc
and terror and terrorize the community. They actually want to
kind of be loved a little bit and revered in
some of these communities and have shop keep is feel
like they're kind of getting something for their money, you
(20:03):
know what I mean, when they're paying these collections. Sure
it's a little bit of a pain, but at the
end of the day, they're being protected from the enemy,
from the other you know, crime families, or from anyone
that would maybe rob them. Because you're part of the community,
right right, it's a it's almost a parallel branch of society,
sort of like how the yaquaza will give out aid
(20:24):
to victims of natural disasters. Uh, the mafia will also
aid members of the community when it feels expedient and
advantageous for business. This is the crazy part though. So
we have all these Sicilians in the French quarter, right,
(20:46):
and the French quarters not the biggest quarter. So eventually,
say the nineteen thirties and forties, a lot of Sicilians
who live there begin to move out. And of course,
being a Sicilian it's silly that we have to say this,
but just to cover our bases. Being a Sicilian American
obviously does not automatically make you a member of the
(21:08):
mob of not only the cool ones. Yeah, you gotta
you gotta be made. You have to be a main man. Yeah,
you have to be made. So it's weird because during
the twentieth century, the nineteen hundreds, it seems like the
Sicilian population was becoming more and more suburban. And now
they're only maybe a handful of Sicilian residents or people
(21:32):
of Sicilian heritage living in the French Quarter, that's right.
And uh, not only that, probably even fewer um made
men that are living in uh in New Orleans and
continuing to do any kind of Kosa Nostra associated business
because you know, the mafia still exists. It is a thing.
You definitely don't hear as much about it because it
seems like because of FBI UH changes in the way
(21:56):
they can prosecute organized crime, it's a little bit more
difficult to get away with it, like the Rico Act
and such. But you know, I mean there's I'm sure
they just kind of adapted and changed the game a
little bit and try and stay a little bit more
under the radar. And we do have we do have
at least one example, right of a famous Sicilian mafio
so from New Orleans. Yeah, that's right. Carlos Marcella kind
(22:19):
of became the head honcho UM in New Orleans organized crime. Uh.
He was born to a Sicilian family in Tunisia. His
name was Carlo Gero Mina Coori. Ohh, and we know
him as Carlos little Man, that's right. And he immigrated
directly to Louisiana in nineteen eleven, and he turned to
(22:41):
crime before he was even a teenager and already began
working in the French Quarter, which at that point was
the cities little Italy, right right. He joined the Matrona family.
We mentioned earlier that they were also known as the
Black Hand or Sicilian black Hand, and he, along with
(23:01):
the rest of the crime family, controlled operations at New
Orleans Docks. So they were smuggling prostitution, uh, drug trafficking,
gambling and then of course as soon as prohibition kicks in,
you know what that means money, money, monde legging, the speaker,
speakeasies and all that stuff. And that's that's the kind
of thing you think about. You can picture in New
(23:22):
Orleans during that time. It's like these kind of smoky
underground lounges with like jazz singers and uh, you know,
cocktails flowing and all that stuff. Right, And Marcelo sort
of has a story that that could be an episode
of its own. You know, he he got into and
out of jail. He had been arrested and beat raps before.
(23:45):
Like it's it's surprising. I would be surprised if there
was not already a film about his life. But even
today he is the subject of speculation and conspiracy theories,
and you'll hear that he is one of the people
who was part of the conversation that led to the
assassination of President JFK in November of nineteen. That's right,
(24:09):
because Robert Kennedy was a big proponent of bringing down
Marcelo because of the fact that he had done such
a good job of avoiding any kind of consequences to
his career and organized crime. In fact, I don't think
it was until uh the age of like seventy two
that he got convicted of any kind of felonies. So, yeah,
(24:30):
you're right, then maybe he gets his own episode for sure.
I love the conspiracy angle and the fact that Robert, Yeah,
there's Jack Rubies tied up in all of this and
Dallas and Lee Harvey Oswald all that stuff, big central
figure in the whole JFK thing. But that is for
another day. That is for a another day. However, no
I propose that this counts as our Louisiana episode. It
(24:51):
has to. It was definitely about Louisiana, AM and Louisiana.
New Orleans have been on on my mind, in particular
given the threatening weather that's coming through as this podcast
is recorded and releases. We want to wish everybody out
there best of luck, Stay safe, stay dry, stay connected,
(25:13):
have have a plan. I've got some friends in New
Orleans who have been keeping me up to date. Until
just a few days ago they thought they might have
to evacuate. Everybody was on the edge of their seat.
So if you are listening from New Orleans, please say
hello to your fair metropolis. Love it, miss it. Always
want to go check out the city and let us
know some of your favorite New Orleans stories. You don't
(25:36):
have to be from there to tell us. It doesn't
have to be a huge historical moment. What's a good
time you had in New Orleans. I've only been the
ones and the weather was terrible. The whole time was
rainy and dreary, But I loved every second and it
was so much fun and I really hope to go
back again soon. Um yeah, you can write us all
that stuff at Ridiculous at I Heart radio dot com.
You can check us out on our Facebook group, the
(25:56):
Ridiculous Historians, where you can interact with your other members.
There was a really good one. Somebody posted a meme today.
Uh it was. It was a very meta meme because
it was an image of Christopher Columbus and his crew
and it says, I don't steal memes, I discover them.
I saw that one. Yes, you can also find us
on Instagram and Twitter. I'm at Ben Pollan HSW on Twitter.
(26:17):
You can see my various work and non work adventures
on Instagram where I am at Ben Boland. I don't
really do the Twitter, but you can find me on
Instagram at how Now. Noel Brown big big thanks as
always to Casey le Bush pegram Big thanks to our
friend of the show, Christopher Haciotis, who we need to
have on. Uh it's been too long, it has been
(26:38):
to Those are some of my favorite episodes that we
do with Christopher. Thanks to Alex Williams, who compose our
theme research associate Gabe Luzier for always being a boss.
And thanks to you, Ben for um not having me
whacked yet. Omert is the code. I am a legitimate
businessman working in imports, so I guess the best thing
to say is not my department, no, A welcome, We'll
(27:01):
see you next time Fox. For more podcasts from My
Heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast,
or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Ridiculous History is a production of I Heart Radio. You
(00:27):
come into my house on a day my daughter is
to be married. You who asked me to do murder
for money? Welcome to the show. Ridiculous Historians thinks so
much for tuning in circumstances. Find us recording on a
lovely almost one hundred degree morning here in Atlanta, Georgia.
I'm Ben, I'm no Ben? Was that from Dirty Harry? Uh?
(00:50):
That is a quote from Don Vito Corleone in The Godfather. Yes,
famously portrayed by Clint Eastwood in the film Dirty Hair
working under his face? Miss pseudonym Marlon Brando, which is
a pretty fake name if you think about. You know
who only uses their real name here in the United States.
That's our good friend and super producer Casey Pegram Viva
(01:14):
La Bush, Viva Bush. Wait. Wait wait did we say
your name yet? I don't know? Okay, Well you're no,
I am no, that's true? What's my name that? I am?
Not a member of LaCOSA Nostro, But I do enjoy
a good mob flick from time to time. And rewatching
the Sopranos lately got my start doing it on an
airplane where it was censored in a hilarious way. Um,
(01:34):
So I watched one through three of season one in
that fashion, and then once the swears started getting back
in the mix, it was borderline shocking. Ben. Let me
tell you, these guys really love their fs and Jeff's
I still have it. I still haven't watched Sopranos all
the way through? Are you kidding me? Wow? It's really good.
I know how it is. Watched the last episode. It
ends with a Journey song and a cut to black.
(01:56):
And that's not a spoiler. Well, it can't be a spoiler.
We have statutes established for this. I think it's it's
past the statute of limitations. Here's the thing about the
statue limitation of spoilers. Yes it exists, But are you
still being a bit of a schmuck if you do
it and don't prepare someone for something that they're enjoying
so much content out there in the world. That's weird.
Are you saying that you're doing a complete one eight
from your previously passionately completely opposite stance. Now, listen, Ben,
(02:20):
we were talking specifically about the ending of Loss that
I did not even actually spoil. I was accused of
spoiling it. But the thing I said was not in
fact a spoiler at all. I believe in that situation,
which was probably more than a few years, because yeah,
in that situation, Um, my position is that the creators
of Laws spoiled the ending more than any Yeah, exactly.
(02:44):
But but I am a huge fan of mafia films,
a lot of crime films, but mafia films in particular,
and off air, we were kicking around this idea, Casey,
what are some of your favorite crime films, specifically organized
crime called a no straw mafia. Well, then when you
asked me about this, my mind was completely blank because
(03:04):
the first thing that jumped to my head was Scorsese's Casino,
which is far from obscure, but it is. It is
definitely one of my favorites, along with Good Fellows. But
you know, if you if you want to go a
little deeper cut, I would say, check out one of
the films of Jean Pierre Melville, like uh Les circ
Lar Rouge or maybe Bob La Flambert. What about Las
Samurai isn't then that's me and El and uh yeah,
(03:29):
that's a good one as well, Casey. On the Case
Film Edition man, we should do that more often. That'd
be cool. Yeah, if it comes up, Yeah, just let
us know, Casey, if the spirit moves you. I don't
ever want it to be something where you feel stressed, like,
oh crap, I have to come up with a movie homework?
Who cares about homework? What's the crime film you like?
(03:49):
I'll tell you what I watched recently was The French Connection.
I've never seen him before. It is a um oh gosh,
William Friedkin William fried Kent film um famously directed The
Exorcist and uh, what else is he directed? Was really great,
which I've not seen Santa. He also did a trucking
a movie about like like, what's it called, oh, Sorcerer Sorcerer,
(04:10):
which has a tangerine dream sound track that you're like,
but um, the thing that was so cool about French
Connection is it's very naturalistic. It's just very like. Something
about it makes you feel like you're really in the room.
I think a lot of it was improvised. Um. There's
this incredible chase sequence where Gene Hackman is chasing a
New York subway train that's at the portion where it's
(04:30):
on an elevated track and he's in this like car
that he's common deer, and he's driving underneath the track
and it's just such a dynamic, cool, badass chase sequence,
really really frenetic, high energy film. You know. Robert de Niro,
I thought, did a good job taking the directorial position
with a bronx tail. Do you guys remember that one?
I never saw that. Actually, it was pretty it's it's
it triggers some nostalgia for me, which may be part
(04:53):
of the reason I liked it. Another old one that
I really enjoyed was The Big Heat. That's like nineteen fifties.
I think The Big Heat is for its slaying. Actually,
he's a great German filmmaker that came over to the
States after Gebel's offered him the German film industry the
whole thing, yeah on a platter. Yeah uh, and he
thought maybe not and he fled Germany that night. It's uh.
(05:16):
The Big Heat is pretty dark as fifty noirs go,
but it's it's worth a watch, especially if it's something
that you've seen pop up on some film list and
you've you've never quite gotten around too. I'd say it's
worth a watch. It's surprisingly violent for the time today's
show is about organized crime, specifically the mafia, specifically the
(05:38):
Italian American Mafia. However, it is not about New York City. No,
It's about another place entirely ben that does have a
reputation for revelry, it does have a reputation for seediness,
a certain element, but I've never in my life associated
it with organized crime until he started looking into this topic.
It's a place referred to often as the Big Easy
(05:59):
No All No La or New Orleans or New Orleans,
that's correct. Yeah, New Orleans, beautiful city, home to almost
a parallel branch of American history. You know, one thing
that is confusing too many kids growing up in the
United States outside of Louisiana is the concept of parishes
(06:21):
rather than counties. Because Louisiana has parishes, and that is
a that is one of the many vestigial traditions carried
down from its history as a French city of French
territory or region. And of course, this city is home
to so many amazing things that are influential, not just
(06:41):
in the US but in the world entire and it
is also home to the mafia. As we found out.
You see many of us myself included in the past,
would reasonably assume that the mafia, the Italian American mafia
specifically had its roots in the Big Apple, New York City, NYC.
(07:02):
Because this is where you see The Godfather being set,
this is where the five great crime families are based,
and this is where millions and millions of Italian immigrants
originally came. They first came to New York City, Statue
of Liberty, Ellis Island, the whole nine. In reality, though,
the first Italian American mafia came from New Orleans. That
(07:28):
that was the first one, and it's also the site
of the first major let's say, maybe a conflict, but
mafia incident, mafia murder. Yeah, it's true, Ben And and
the thing is the actual Like, first on the list
for immigration from Italy was places like Argentina and Brazil,
which I would never have really considered either because they
(07:51):
had similar cultures to what the Italian immigrants were used
to in their homeland. Uh, New Orleans became a popular
second choice. Yeah, this was during the eighteen hundreds, mainly
because there was already so much trade with New Orleans
and cities and regions in Brazil and Argentina. This is
(08:12):
weird because it already began to trigger some xenophobia amongst
people who were not Sicilian or not Italian. The New
Orleans Times reported back in eighteen sixty nine that parts
of the city were overrun with get this quote, well
known and notorious Sicilian murderers, counterfeitters, and burglars who in
(08:35):
the last month have formed a sort of general co
partnership or stock company for the plunder and disturbance of
the city. That's not the that's not the kind of
elements you want coming into your city. I mean, that's
how you would describe a mafia if you had never
heard of the mafia before. That's true, but this is
a time where this is very new, right for for
(08:56):
the US. They didn't know about the crime families in Italy.
You know, there was no Internet. It wasn't like super
common knowledge. This was like a very new thing that
was kind of invading their community. And this sort of
tension continues building between the average the squares, the non
criminal citizens, the authorities in New Orleans, and the mafia.
(09:19):
It reaches ahead and what it started to describe this earlier.
The first major incident, the first murder occurs on October
fift There are probably other ones, but this is the
first one we know about. New Orleans Police Superintendent David
Hennessy is assassinated, basically murdered execution style, and then public
(09:40):
outrage and hysteria breaks. Hundreds of Sicilians get arrested, eventually
nineteen or fingered for the crime, but then they were acquitted. Yeah,
and just before that happened Giuseppe Esposito, who was one
of the first known Sicilian mafia members to come to
the United States. He actually came to New York um.
And this is after he and six of his cronies
(10:02):
murdered the chancellor and a vice chancellor of a province
in Sicily, in addition to eleven very very influential and
rich landowners. And he was arrested in New Orleans in
eighty one, and then he was extradited to Italy. And
New Orleans is becoming a hotbed of this kind of activity,
and it's sort of starting to bubble over with this
(10:22):
incident that you're describing, ben and led to some pretty
serious consequences, didn't it. Yeah. So on October fifte David
Hennessy has murdered nineteen, As they said, hundreds of Sicilians
arrested nineteen go to trial, but they're acquitted. And this
(10:43):
makes everyone else in the city say someone was bribing them,
someone was scaring the witnesses. So the citizens of New Orleans,
the squares I mentioned earlier, organize a lynch mob and
they kill eleven of those nineteen people who got away.
Two of them were hanged, nine of them were shot,
and the other eight escaped. We're not sure what happened
(11:05):
to them. But this, along with that criminal you're describing, Knowle,
gives us a very different image of New Orleans. You know.
We we imagine the many other problems the city happen
at the time, but we don't really think of imported
Italian criminal enterprise. You know. We know that there has
been uh fairly rich research on this, especially by the
(11:28):
Sicilian historian Salvatore Lupo. In his History of the Mafia,
he talks about how you can trace the spread of
the mafia in the US directly to Sicilian immigration to
New Orleans, and by the end of the nineteenth century,
New Orleans had the largest Sicilian population in the US,
(11:51):
which surprised me. I guess I just always assumed it
would have been New York. I would have too, and
apparently as well. Been. One reason this was the case
is the state of Louisiana was working with sugar planters
to replace slave labor, so that kind of immigration, opening
up that kind of immigration was part of that effort. Yes,
(12:11):
so they've got booming agricultural business, right, this is a
world class port. That alone is very attractive to the mafia.
But if you throw in the disorganized city functions and
the corrupt administration, boom boom boom, we've got a mafia
moth heading toward an illicit flame. Very nice image there been,
(12:33):
uh and that flame ended up being the French Quarter
and Bourbon Street specifically. So when you think of Bourbon
Street anyone that's been that's visited New Orleans, you kind
of think of it as being the trashy, kind of
tourist d spot that's not necessarily where you want to
hit if you're like kind of going for off the
beaten path kind of stuff. But the original Bourpons of
what led to that reputation, the original Bourbon Street as
(12:56):
kind of like you know, established by some of these uh,
these Sicilian mobsters was a just absolute smorgue sport of
things like jazz clubs, speakeasies, restaurantsnudy bars, strip clubs, all
that kind of stuff. And it was all run and
operated or at least largely people were getting a cut
that were members of this mafia group. Yeah. Richard Campanella,
(13:19):
the author of Bourbon Street, a History, has it this
way if he he's on the same page with us here,
because he says they didn't necessarily control all of Bourbon Street,
but they had this behind the scenes influential consortium. You know,
imagine imagine it like this. You don't own every house
(13:43):
of ill repute on Bourbon Street, but you do coordinate
what they can charge for things, and they do pay
you a certain percentage and you help keep people's turf
boundaries clear. It's that same thing you see in like
a show like Sopranos, where uh, the mob of underbosses
or some of the what do they call him, like
enforcers I guess, go door to door to businesses, collecting
(14:06):
collections what they call it. And that means that the
mob has a hand in offering protection to these businesses
as long as they're given a cut. So they sort
of set the tone, I guess for for the kind
of businesses that are lucrative and that are going to
generate enough money to get them, keep them paid, and
keep them happy. Right. Yeah, And this is this is
an interesting way to look at We've got this quote
(14:27):
from Campanilla. He's describing the extent of Bourbon Street. You know,
he says, thirteen blocks in the quarter were more block
in another place. Half his residential halfs commercial, couple hundred businesses.
This is where he gets to a specific example of
mafia involvement. He says, quote, you'd have bars, some clubs,
a restaurant, and something completely unrelated like an electrical store.
(14:50):
And in the back rooms of many bars and clubs,
you might have a pinball machine that really was controlled
by the mob They paid off the bartender to make
sure only they got the money. There were these bookmakers,
poker machines, illegal gambling. Meanwhile, a legitimate bar was up
and running and the bartenders might not have anything to
do with the mobsters. But make no mistake, a number
(15:11):
of owners were out and out mobsters. So you could
have like Casey could have uh, you know, crazy Casey's
crawfish and jazz club, and it could be totally legitimate
and on the up and up, but there could be
a back room where people go to gamble and it's
just sort of like contracted out to the mob. Yeah,
(15:31):
and the mobsters get points on those poker games, illegal
poke games, or they're like out now controlled by the
mom So for sure. Uh, this is a little bit
off topic, but really funny. I was in Brooklyn recently
and I went to the most Brooklyn establishment I've ever
been to in my life. It was a combination laundromat,
pinball emporium and bar. Probably controlled by the mob. You think,
(15:52):
so one would assume, well, we don't know if it's
We also can't profile mobs. We have to be fair
to organize crime. It could be Irish mob. It's also true.
I don't know. I'm just saying, So, where's the origin
of the word mafia come from and mafia versus mob? Well,
if we check the handy dandy last minute etymology, dive
mafia originally derives from a Sicilian adje mafiu so, which
(16:16):
roughly translated means swagger, oldness or bravado got it. And
then the idea of abo the mob refers to literally
like a gang, you know, a group of individuals that
have a common purpose. Let's look at that. That's interesting,
mafia versus mob. So the mafia is gonna be Italian
because as that Sicilian origin, but the mob can refer
(16:40):
to other organized groups or organized crime in general, so
like corrupt teamsters could be a mob. So a mob
is not necessarily the mafia, but mob is also a
synonym or nickname for the Italian mafia. Interesting, it is interesting.
So the mafia would specifically refer to this idea of
la cosa nostra, which is something we've talked about off
(17:03):
Mike plenty, right, this thing of ours omerta is the code.
There's a gradient, Campanella says, from a proper noun to
a common noun. So he breaks it down saying, there's
mafia with a capital M, and then there's the mob
capital M, and then there's just no capital M mob,
and then there's mobsters, there's organized crime, and they're all
(17:25):
these affiliated parties. So he says, it's challenging and one
must be careful about the terminology. And it's interesting because
the government of Louisiana did not originally settle on mass
immigration of Sicilians. They apparently tried to recruit people from China,
they tried to recruit people from Scandinavia, Greece, Portugal, Spanish,
(17:51):
but they were able to entice Sicilian populations because in
post unification Sicily there were a ton of reasons for
people to get out. Life just wasn't super great. However,
as this is a history show, we have to admit
there is a compelling reason that people think of the
mafia in New York now and not in New Orleans,
(18:12):
and that's because it's not near as prominent now. Because
you know, we we said that those first inklings of
problems began in the eighteen hundreds. By the eighteen seventies,
the Matrungka crime family has already been established in New Orleans.
They're collecting tributes their engagement racketeering, prostitution, extortion and so on.
(18:33):
But they're not the only game in town. And fighting
is already breaking out in the eighteen eighties between the
crime families. They want to see who controls the waterfront, right,
and we talked this is ultimately what led to Hennessy's
death and then later the Lynch Mob, and it gave
the mafia a lesson that they never forgot because in
(18:57):
Sicily there's a bit of a stereotype, but in other
in Italy overall, at the time criminals could act without
much regard for authorities or societies. But now they learned, Okay,
there limits to what we can get away with here.
And this a lot of people will tell you that
this is what set the Italian American mafia on its
(19:20):
on its course of following strict rules against targeting law
enforcement outside of very very special circumstances. Don't want to
keep it quiet absolutely. I mean, it's a big deal,
even in like these crime shows and movies when you
kill a policeman or somebody that's a member of law enforcement,
because that that is going to open you up for retaliation.
(19:41):
And ultimately you want to keep things as copasetic as
possible and as contained as possible so you can continue operating,
because at the end of the day, it's a business,
it's not They're not just there to wreak mass havoc
and terror and terrorize the community. They actually want to
kind of be loved a little bit and revered in
some of these communities and have shop keep is feel
like they're kind of getting something for their money, you
(20:03):
know what I mean, when they're paying these collections. Sure
it's a little bit of a pain, but at the
end of the day, they're being protected from the enemy,
from the other you know, crime families, or from anyone
that would maybe rob them. Because you're part of the community,
right right, it's a it's almost a parallel branch of society,
sort of like how the yaquaza will give out aid
(20:24):
to victims of natural disasters. Uh, the mafia will also
aid members of the community when it feels expedient and
advantageous for business. This is the crazy part though. So
we have all these Sicilians in the French quarter, right,
(20:46):
and the French quarters not the biggest quarter. So eventually,
say the nineteen thirties and forties, a lot of Sicilians
who live there begin to move out. And of course,
being a Sicilian it's silly that we have to say this,
but just to cover our bases. Being a Sicilian American
obviously does not automatically make you a member of the
(21:08):
mob of not only the cool ones. Yeah, you gotta
you gotta be made. You have to be a main man. Yeah,
you have to be made. So it's weird because during
the twentieth century, the nineteen hundreds, it seems like the
Sicilian population was becoming more and more suburban. And now
they're only maybe a handful of Sicilian residents or people
(21:32):
of Sicilian heritage living in the French Quarter, that's right.
And uh, not only that, probably even fewer um made
men that are living in uh in New Orleans and
continuing to do any kind of Kosa Nostra associated business
because you know, the mafia still exists. It is a thing.
You definitely don't hear as much about it because it
seems like because of FBI UH changes in the way
(21:56):
they can prosecute organized crime, it's a little bit more
difficult to get away with it, like the Rico Act
and such. But you know, I mean there's I'm sure
they just kind of adapted and changed the game a
little bit and try and stay a little bit more
under the radar. And we do have we do have
at least one example, right of a famous Sicilian mafio
so from New Orleans. Yeah, that's right. Carlos Marcella kind
(22:19):
of became the head honcho UM in New Orleans organized crime. Uh.
He was born to a Sicilian family in Tunisia. His
name was Carlo Gero Mina Coori. Ohh, and we know
him as Carlos little Man, that's right. And he immigrated
directly to Louisiana in nineteen eleven, and he turned to
(22:41):
crime before he was even a teenager and already began
working in the French Quarter, which at that point was
the cities little Italy, right right. He joined the Matrona family.
We mentioned earlier that they were also known as the
Black Hand or Sicilian black Hand, and he, along with
(23:01):
the rest of the crime family, controlled operations at New
Orleans Docks. So they were smuggling prostitution, uh, drug trafficking,
gambling and then of course as soon as prohibition kicks in,
you know what that means money, money, monde legging, the speaker,
speakeasies and all that stuff. And that's that's the kind
of thing you think about. You can picture in New
(23:22):
Orleans during that time. It's like these kind of smoky
underground lounges with like jazz singers and uh, you know,
cocktails flowing and all that stuff. Right, And Marcelo sort
of has a story that that could be an episode
of its own. You know, he he got into and
out of jail. He had been arrested and beat raps before.
(23:45):
Like it's it's surprising. I would be surprised if there
was not already a film about his life. But even
today he is the subject of speculation and conspiracy theories,
and you'll hear that he is one of the people
who was part of the conversation that led to the
assassination of President JFK in November of nineteen. That's right,
(24:09):
because Robert Kennedy was a big proponent of bringing down
Marcelo because of the fact that he had done such
a good job of avoiding any kind of consequences to
his career and organized crime. In fact, I don't think
it was until uh the age of like seventy two
that he got convicted of any kind of felonies. So, yeah,
(24:30):
you're right, then maybe he gets his own episode for sure.
I love the conspiracy angle and the fact that Robert, Yeah,
there's Jack Rubies tied up in all of this and
Dallas and Lee Harvey Oswald all that stuff, big central
figure in the whole JFK thing. But that is for
another day. That is for a another day. However, no
I propose that this counts as our Louisiana episode. It
(24:51):
has to. It was definitely about Louisiana, AM and Louisiana.
New Orleans have been on on my mind, in particular
given the threatening weather that's coming through as this podcast
is recorded and releases. We want to wish everybody out
there best of luck, Stay safe, stay dry, stay connected,
(25:13):
have have a plan. I've got some friends in New
Orleans who have been keeping me up to date. Until
just a few days ago they thought they might have
to evacuate. Everybody was on the edge of their seat.
So if you are listening from New Orleans, please say
hello to your fair metropolis. Love it, miss it. Always
want to go check out the city and let us
know some of your favorite New Orleans stories. You don't
(25:36):
have to be from there to tell us. It doesn't
have to be a huge historical moment. What's a good
time you had in New Orleans. I've only been the
ones and the weather was terrible. The whole time was
rainy and dreary, But I loved every second and it
was so much fun and I really hope to go
back again soon. Um yeah, you can write us all
that stuff at Ridiculous at I Heart radio dot com.
You can check us out on our Facebook group, the
(25:56):
Ridiculous Historians, where you can interact with your other members.
There was a really good one. Somebody posted a meme today.
Uh it was. It was a very meta meme because
it was an image of Christopher Columbus and his crew
and it says, I don't steal memes, I discover them.
I saw that one. Yes, you can also find us
on Instagram and Twitter. I'm at Ben Pollan HSW on Twitter.
(26:17):
You can see my various work and non work adventures
on Instagram where I am at Ben Boland. I don't
really do the Twitter, but you can find me on
Instagram at how Now. Noel Brown big big thanks as
always to Casey le Bush pegram Big thanks to our
friend of the show, Christopher Haciotis, who we need to
have on. Uh it's been too long, it has been
(26:38):
to Those are some of my favorite episodes that we
do with Christopher. Thanks to Alex Williams, who compose our
theme research associate Gabe Luzier for always being a boss.
And thanks to you, Ben for um not having me
whacked yet. Omert is the code. I am a legitimate
businessman working in imports, so I guess the best thing
to say is not my department, no, A welcome, We'll
(27:01):
see you next time Fox. For more podcasts from My
Heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast,
or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
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