August 18, 2022 • 59 mins
In a world where the iconic McDonald's arches became as recognizable as the Pope or Mickey Mouse, Ronald McDonald himself became synonymous with not just fast food -- but the United States, western imperialism and capitalism overall. In the second part of this episode, Ben, Max and returning special guest, the (ostensibly) reformed Jonathan Strickland, aka the Quizster, take a case-by-case look at the alleged causes of Ronald's demise, from anti-obesity activists to changing cultural tastes, a real-life clown terror craze, and more.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Ridiculous History is a production of I Heart Radio. Welcome
(00:27):
back to the show, Ridiculous Historians. Thank you, as always
so much for tuning in. Let's give a hand to
the one and only, the Man, the myth, the legend,
our super producer, Mr Max Williams. They called me Ben
my heart thought in it today. I'm sorry. Sorry, Well, hey, hey,
(00:47):
you've made it to the wou you know. Okay, So
this is funny because I have no idea what this
is gonna sound like after after Max gives it his
magic much but I trust you and we, as we
said earlier, this is the second part of a two
(01:07):
part series on a mystery in the world of fast food?
What happened to Ronald McDonald? Uh? As we said earlier, Uh,
my dear friend Mr Noel Brown is out at the moment,
but we'll be returning soon. In the meantime, we were
lucky enough to get one of the busiest men in
(01:27):
the history of podcasting to come on and flash up
our show. Fellow Ridiculous Historians joined me and welcoming back,
Jonathan Strickland. This little man called Jonathan certainly pushed around
and how Jonathan must be found? Man and a little
(01:55):
episode Jonathan maca just fast as they can and a
little like thank you, Ben. Technically on some days I'm
(02:19):
two of the busiest men. It's it's gonna be weird
over there. Gained a lot of weight in the pandemic. Ben, Okay,
it's been like Okay, I thought you were going for
like a multiplicity thing, you know, in multiple mean I
could be a man of two minds because I am
someone who likes to eat healthy, and yet I am
(02:40):
sitting here with a lot of McDonald's food in front
of me, just for a joke that was only for you.
Because no one who's listening can actually see it. We
described it though. I thought it was well done, because
I thought that was a good bit. What do you think. Yeah,
we also got to go on about how we all
have mesophonius and no one eat around us, which is amazing.
I mean, the more week to stay that out loud,
I think, the better it is for the world. Yes, yeah,
(03:03):
maybe there's an episode in the future for that. We'll
have to have you back on Jonathan for the history
of noises people hate, which is hopefully not our voices. Yeah,
I didn't want to turn this into a muck Bang podcast.
So oh oh yeah, wow, how's that? That's such a
fascinating genre. Anyway, look it up if you if you
want to know what we're talking about, we will leave
(03:25):
that discovery to you because we have another mystery. We
have another discovery on our hands. Knowing everything that we
know now after part one of what happened to Ronald McDonald,
we have to ask ourselves, where is he? Now? How
did a world famous figure, as you know, well known,
(03:46):
some would say is Jesus Christ or Santa Claus suddenly
go the way of the Dodo? I think, and you
put this in our notes earlier, Jonathan, I think it's
a really good point. Seriously, Ronald McDonald probably not as
recognizable as Mickey Mouse, right, that's what I think. Like
the the reference you you are citing is from a book, right,
(04:10):
So there was a book by Eric Schlausser which was
called Fast Food Nation, and in that Schlosser makes the
assertion that, uh, Ronald McDonald was the second most famous
fictional character behind Santa Claus. I submit that Mickey Mouse
is definitely in contention. I would be shocked if Mickey
(04:33):
Mouse was lower, especially well now, obviously it would be
clear that Mickey Mouse would win out because Ronald, as
we are going to talk about, the Star, has been
on the decline for quite some time. And and honestly,
part of the reason we're having this episode, and you know,
the reason why we built it up so much in
the first episode is you had a character who was
(04:57):
synonymous with the franchise across the world, not just the
United States. You know, we started off in the US,
but by this point it's a global phenomenon. Someone that
you know they're branding was incredibly recognizable and yet seemingly
in very short order, was largely erased. And you think,
(05:20):
how do you get to that point where you've you've
poured this capital, this amount of resources and assets as
a corporation into your marketing and then you say, you
know what, we're gonna switch gears, We're gonna throw this away.
So why would that happen? Was did something happen to
the resource itself, Ronald McDonald that poison the well and
(05:41):
perhaps necessitated a move away. Yeah, yeah, that's a very
just so that's a very good way to put it.
Because we're not blowing smoke here. Ronald McDonald began to
become a symbol for capitalism overall. In other parts of
the world, he started to represent some idea of the
(06:02):
United States. Protesters began dressing as the clown Capital c
when they were, you know, doing different demonstrations, and a
troubling discourse began if this was a murder and they
were likely multiple conspirators, or to be more realistic, there
are multiple factors. Uh. There is a fantastic Vice article
(06:25):
written by a journalist named Amelia Tate. This is an
interesting thing about this article. She is, this journalist is
looking into the story and trying to figure out what
happened to uh, the most famous clown in the world
of fast food, and oddly enough she gets kind of
stone walled in a really strange way. First, she goes
(06:49):
to the official McDonald's website and they say they're a
little ahead of the curve in the United Kingdom. They say,
with afraid that Ronald McDonald's no longer appears in McDonald's
UK advertising. Yeah, he still travels up and down the
country to visit restaurants and make sure everyone is enjoying
their meals. Um, it was a little bit arch on
(07:13):
that way. Yeah, but but but she right, Yeah, no,
that's a good point. So she is able to speak
with the press office for McDonald's UK and they said
they refused to elaborate or to really explain in depth
(07:33):
what happened to Ronald, but they say they do confirm
he hasn't appeared in any UK advertising since, including appearances
in restaurants. She asked for more information and the press
officer says, I'm afraid we don't have anything further to add.
And that's where she starts, you know, has the starts
doing some forensics, some detective work, and comes up with
(07:56):
one of my favorite phrases. She said, as it seems
that sometime in something made Ronald Amelia's words here personna
non hemburger brilliant. I mean it's clear we have a
real plastic knives out situation here. Perfect. Yes, uh, she did,
(08:20):
though she did find herself stone walled. She asked a
veteran of the advertising game for scoop. This person used
to work for McDonald's UK for some time, and this
person only replied, I don't fancy being sued by a clown,
which I didn't know was being concern I mean it
(08:41):
happens all the time here in the United States. But
the thing I was going to mention is that in
our first episode we kind of alluded to the fact
that there was an extremely strict series of rules that
were laid down for actors who were playing the part
of Ronald McDonald. We only touched on some of those.
There were actually it a few more, including the part
(09:01):
where there's only one Ronald McDonald. It doesn't matter how
many actors are playing Ronald McDonald throughout the various territories.
There's only one Ronald McDonald, right. So you start hearing
this and you're thinking, all right, this is an extension
of that same kind of veil of secrecy that the
company took extremely serious when Ronald McDonald was like front
(09:23):
and foremost in in the restaurant business. And now we're
seeing that same level of of attention and uh, careful
approach now that Ronald has mysteriously vanished. And obviously there
are a lot of hypotheses you could come up with,
and in fact, chances are the reason for Ronald's disappearances
(09:46):
due to a combination of factors that we're gonna talk about.
But you know, it's frustrating when you can't get a
solid answer, not even from people who have left the
company for fear that the documents they had sign those
NBA's will still hold a legal threat over them. Yeah. Yeah,
(10:08):
and this, I mean, this is a serious concern. Tate
runs into multiple instances of this. She speaks with a
guy named A J. Who was a former Ronald and
actually had a big hand in writing that official rule
book we mentioned in part one, and Jay says that
they're not allowed to talk about this. Uh. The author
(10:29):
of an earlier version of the rule book, the one
that said if you're Ronald, you can't tell children where
hamburgers come from. They also declined to speak uh. And
then she goes to the people who make those Ronald
McDonald's statues and I think a lot of us in
the crowd today remember those. It's it's Ronald frozen and
(10:51):
tableau on a bench, usually with like an arm out
so that you can sit next to the statue and
it looks like he has his arm around you when
you're just you know, hanging on a public bench with
a clown. Before before we move on, though, I am
not gonna let this accidental pun go without being pointed out.
You said A J had a big hand in writing
(11:13):
the rule book. What uh, I don't think I get
my own pun there? Oh you got a big hand
like Ronald McDonald, did you have? I thought he was
more of a like big foot guy. Am I missed
remembering the story had big hands? You figure this out, hey,
it's future Max here to correct something that passed. Max said,
(11:37):
Robald McDonald hand size very normal, completely normal. There is
nothing larger about his hands. I mean there bright and
yellow and weird. But so that's Ronald McDonald. He's bright
and yellow and red and weird. So yeah, I don't
know what past Max was thinking. But yeah, back to
(11:58):
the story, Ben, there is a good news kind of take.
Does find an answer when she talks to a guy
named well, Guy More, which makes me think of uh,
nominative determinism. Guy More, Yeah, is the He's the co
(12:20):
founder of something called Creative Coalition. He's an admin. Between
two thousand four and two thousand fourteen, he worked for
that advertising agency Leo Burnett the I'm loving It folks,
and he also won several prizes for a McDonald's ad
he did called just passing By, and it's frankly poetic.
(12:45):
I think maybe we can play just a little clip
here now the laborers and cables and council motion table
is with just passing by, and the guffey types and
scuffy types, and like the three frothy types with just
passing by, those on their own whilst on the phone
don key McNuggets and having a mom with just passing by,
(13:07):
the driving through with hungry crew who just pulled off
the A three two, We just passing by. Okay, So
what we're what we're seeing here and what we're hearing
here is a is this almost like spoken word monologue
about all the different people who eat at McDonald's, quick
glimpse into their lives. Gone is the clown. And as
(13:30):
Guy points out, when he started working with McDonald's, it
wasn't maybe the best year because two thousand and four
was also the year a certain documentary came out. I think, um,
I think you you probably remember this one, to Jonathan
Morgan Spurlock. I I have. I have distinct memories of
(13:52):
this this era. Uh, most of them don't involve McDonald's,
because by then I had moved on to other I'd
put away childish things, and I moved moved on to
to local regional chains. But no I mean, I remember
very much the Supersize Me documentary, and the documentary is
(14:16):
an interesting way of putting it. I remember the Supersize
Me film, and I remember that that did kind of
it generated a wave of concern about the nature of
the obesity issue in the United States and the connection
to things like fast food restaurants. I would say that
(14:37):
was the starting point for that conversation. I would not
take supersize me as like the thesis statement that you
should follow. There is some some showmanship and supersize me,
but it definitely it definitely got the conversation moving more
toward we need to do better for ourselves and for
our children. We need to make certain that we are
(14:59):
provide healthier options for meals because as it's going, uh,
things are taking a very unhealthy turn. And the real
concern was that in the long run, we might see
things like life expectancy start to go down for people
in the United States because of the various health issues
(15:20):
you can get through through morbid obesity. And so that
was kind of where that conversation got going. And obviously
that's a very complicated conversation. It's one that it goes
well beyond just fast food or exercise. It goes into
all sorts of different things. You cannot simplify this down
to like a bite size uh bullet point, but it
(15:45):
is the sort of thing that got a lot more
attention and scrutiny directed towards the fast food industry in
general and McDonald's in particular. Yeah. Yeah, the big revelation
of supersize me, which does have showman ship in it.
I agree with that is surprise, surprise. Eating fast food
all the all day, all the time, isn't super great
(16:08):
for you? Not the same as you know, a more
varied diet guy. More is working during this time when
the when the pushback and concern about McDonald's really really
kicks into high gear and gets into the public uh.
He says that internally McDonald's had a serious issue with
childhood obesity and lots of rumors about what goes into
(16:32):
the burger. This is also the time where we see
the rise of speculation about like what's in McNuggets? Right,
what is the what are the true ingredients of a
hamburger or a big Mac. This leads McDonald's and their
roster of ad agency Boffin's, to say, look, when people
have these real concerns, regardless of how how much weight
(16:55):
they put in something like supersize me, We need to
realize it may not be the best look to have
what More describes as a joker at the table. So
McDonald's begins to pivot and their ad campaigns are increasingly
targeting adults more so than children. This is a big
change for this company. About eleven, there's another backlash that occurs,
(17:17):
and nonprofit out of Boston starts calling for Ronald McDonald's retirement.
They say he exploits children, he promotes obesity. Critics are
saying that he's undermining the authority of parents right by saying, hey, kids,
make your parents go do this, which is how a
lot of advertising for children works. To your excellent point earlier, Max,
and he says, this guy's really he's kind of a
(17:40):
pie piper figure. You know, he's enticing kids with sugar
and cool toys into bad decisions that may potentially have
life impact in consequences. So that's how in just a
few years, the world's most famous clown, this kind of
Santa secular Santa Claus of America, is being compared directly
to cigarette mascots like Joe Campbell. I will say that
(18:10):
being Enticed by Sugar and super Cool Toys could be
my autobiography title. Also, I think a good strong contender
for my autobiography title is a phrase you uttered earlier,
Mr Bolan, gone is the clown? Both of those would
work really well. Uh yeah, yeah. So here here's here's
(18:30):
another take that I have. It's it's interesting because it's
not something that we really address in the notes. And
part of it is that McDonald's had not only was
it starting to look at Ronald McDonald as a potential
liability for the company right like it's it's a bad look.
As the kids say, or they used to. I don't
know what kids say anymore. I don't understand them. So
(18:52):
the the other thing, though, is that the generation that
grew up with Ronald McDonald as the this icon that
enticed them into McDonald's, they are grown now, they're adults,
they have kids of their own, they have already established
a habit of going to McDonald's. You don't have to
go after the kids to get the people into the restaurants.
(19:14):
Now the kids have grown up to be the adults
and they're going into the restaurants already, So it's almost
like you're like, hey, we got them, we hooked them.
Now we just have to perpetuate the cycle and watch
the money roll in. So that's another kind of cynical
way of looking at this. At that one, Ronald McDonald
was representing a potential risk that it was uh standing
(19:36):
in as a symbol for some negative things, and that's
never what you want for your marketing campaign. And too
really it had done its job already. Yeah, that's a
very good point. And that's when I hadn't considered, you know,
because um Max is our our marketing expert here, so
I would I would defer to I would defer to
(19:57):
your expertise here. But next that I I would say,
that doesn't even sound cynical. That sounds very on the money.
Oh yeah, that that's the marketing one on one right there.
That's that's perfect. I mean, it's like, you know, marketing
is all measured in impressions. You've already made the impressions
with Jonathan's point, with the adults, with the people who
are your audience. You want who have disposal income, who
(20:21):
are going to spur on the next generation. So instead
of just con and let's be honest. I mean, like,
I'm a child of the nineties. I clowns by the
time around, we're really kind of an outdated image. I
mean I don't even think it was like even like
the like creepiness had fully set in yet of clowns.
But it was also just like not it wasn't something
(20:44):
that was pertinent in my like thinking or if I
want to complicated my zeitgeist. It was like and so
it's just like, you know, moving moving on from this thing.
As Jonathan said, who's just like it's not making any
money and soon it's gonna start costing you money. So
uh so it just makes a lot of sense, you know,
for them to you know, just think instead of like
(21:08):
trying to get impressions with this thing that's clearly not
gonna make it so much money, let's, you know, instead
be like, this is the McDonald's that you got your
happy meal out when you're a kid. Now you can
get your whatever they advertise to adults. I don't know
why your kid gets your happy happy meal. Spin it
that way. Nostalgia for you, maybe not nostalgia, but like
(21:33):
you know, like remember ince an enjoyment for you and
then building that memory and like of like like going
McDonald's as a kid with your kids and stuff. There. Yeah,
that's I think you guys nailed it. Um. Ronald was
not ready to give up the ghost just yet. He
(21:54):
wasn't after that big big Mac in the sky at
one last hurrah, you know, rage, rage against the dying
of the fries, etcetera. So he ditches the jumpsuit and
he cleans up a little. He's got a blazer now,
a red blazer. He's got a sharp bow tie, and
he begins tweeting directly from McDonald's official Twitter account. Uh
(22:19):
is for people who are very experienced with Twitter, like
like you, Jonathan. Uh You've We've seen this happen before
with mixed results, where an official Twitter account goes into
a little bit internet trolleing, or they try a campaign.
Sometimes they work really well, like the Windy's mixtape. Sometimes
they fall flat. Unfortunately, the latter is what happened with
(22:43):
our poor boy Ronnie. People were literally hashtag not loving it,
and we're not kidding that was a trending hashtag. Yeah
to all the brands out there, before you decide to
have a snarky, fun Twitter marketing push, really think it
(23:03):
over because one, if it's not really kind of zany
and fun, the audience picks up on it immediately. If
it's not sincere, then they know and you might get
a lot of traction, but it's not gonna be positive. Uh.
And to just like think over that snarky joke a lot.
E A recently got into trouble because they posted a
(23:25):
tweet that read She's a ten except you find out
she only plays single player games. That did not go
over well. So yeah, this, the Ronald McDonald experience is
a is an example of this kind of trend of
brands trying to embrace new communication on Twitter is not
(23:45):
new but newish communication channels and finding that their approach
to messaging is just a complete misfire for that particular audience. Right, So,
at this moment, if we could wax poetic in the
spirit of Guy more and is just passing by add
and performance, we can picture Ronald McDonald like the scene
(24:09):
in Um part way through so many rom coms. He's
standing in the rain outside of America's dining room window
and he's humming to himself the song he's humming, the
oldie hit Everyone Loves a clown. Everybody loves a clown,
so why don't you. Yeah, he's got cute cards, you know,
(24:29):
maybe he's got a boom box. But the makeover doesn't
work out spoilers. So first he has he has grim
is holding a boombox. Yeah, I'm you're mixing too many
movie metaphors to say anything, guys, just say anything, well done. Points. Also,
(24:51):
we're just gonna keep piling on. Hamburglar is like a
Syrano character and he's in the bushes. He's gonna keep
adding the beef to this, yes, beef it and so
he's like he's trying to uh, he's trying to tell
Ronald McDonald what to say, but because he's the hamburglary's
speaking in gibberish. So it's just like rubble rob rubble
rubble and s and seen uh so and then sun
(25:15):
then Sundays there, and Sunday just looks at the camera goes,
are you happy? Jonathan? I have I have to say.
I have to say that this is making me feel
like we are all in improv level three class guys,
be specific. What kind of bush is the Hamburgler hiding behind?
(25:38):
Uh uh? And we're going through so much cool, weird
stuff in this series today, folks. Uh, you may be
hearing some thunder in the background, and I think it's
appropriate to the way our story has turned apart two,
so we're gonna keep it in. Uh, there's something else.
McDonald's tries another mascot. It is an anthropomorphic happy Meal
(26:02):
named in a burst of creativity. Happy Happy is not successful.
I hesitate to put a picture in the chat, but
you can. You can find it and you'll kind of
see why. But that was not the final Uh. I
was not the final fry in the coffin because something
(26:23):
else happened in Yeah, this was completely out of McDonald's control.
This was one of those cultural moments where a trend
starts and begins to build and has rippling repercussions for
unrelated entities. So McDonald's in a way is a victim,
(26:47):
as were we all. So what Mr Boland is referring
to is that very special time in six where, for
reasons that never really became apparent, people were dressing up
as scary clowns and scaring people in a scary way. Right,
And that's true. It's a look collectively, everybody listening to
(27:12):
this show now we've all been through a lot in
the past few years. Sixteen seems a shockingly long time ago,
but it is true. For unspecified reasons. Uh, people across
the United States, in the Midwest, the South, all along
the East Coast began seeing, you know, clowns just out
(27:33):
in the wild, sometimes standing creepily like the old school
Ronald McDonald when he thought the camera was done rolling, uh,
sometimes trying to engage with people. People thought it might
be a weird gorilla marketing campaign for a movie, you know,
Blair Witch Style or something, But there was no way
of knowing who would be motivated to dress as a clown.
(27:54):
There was no way of knowing whether there was a
concerted effort or whether it was just organic le a
trend that other people were independently picking up on. And
there's not a way to address the issue in this country.
You can't really make the act buying a costume illegal,
and things start to escalate across that summer. It's August.
(28:17):
I think when law enforcement in South Carolina gets reports
that suspicious individuals dressed like clowns are literally trying to
lure children into the woods, and then there are more
stories about this. It continues, we even did a stuff
they don't want you to know episode on it. Eventually
McDonald's who I agree with you, Jonathan, They are a
(28:38):
victim here. This is beyond their control. Eventually they have
to make a statement, which is something you know, you
probably never think about when you join a pr for
firm or you work for McDonald's. You never think one day,
I'm gonna have to talk on record about all these
clowns and make sure that our clown is separated from
(28:59):
that conference agent. But it really comes up, and the
it rarely comes up in the interview process, right right,
Welcome to improv Level three or McDonald's corporate. Here's the question.
So yeah, I don't think people plan that way. But
the company did come out with a statement. I think
(29:20):
it was the right thing to do. They said they're
being thoughtful in respect to Ronald McDonald's participation in community
events as a result of the quote current climate around
clown sightings in communities, meaning in playing English, the sun
was setting on McDonald land and then like you brilliantly
(29:41):
foreshadowed in part one of this episode. A year later,
Stephen King's newest adaptation of it hits the big screen.
The main villain of it is, and this is not spoiling,
it is an evil clown named Pennywise, originally played in
(30:01):
a made for TV adaptation by Tim Curry and then
in this big screen adaptation also two parts. Uh is
played by one of those Scars Guard kids, right, Yes,
one of them. It's one of the it's the same
one from Himlock Growth, Yeah, yes, yes, he and we
(30:22):
we talked about this. We're not going to get into
like favorites or anything, because everyone has their own favorite.
But I will say I have a soft spot in
my heart for Tim Curry, largely because I was a
kid when that, yeah, teenager, when that mini series came out,
and I had already read the book by the time
the mini series had come out, and so I feel like, well,
(30:44):
there's a lot of stuff that's in that book that
I don't think it's appropriate for children, a lot of
the because it follows kids. It speaks to a kid's
sense of adventure, like it's a horror novel, but it
is also an adventure book. Um, And so like, I
have a soft spot for the Tim Curry version. That
being said, I definitely would not want my corporate mascot
(31:07):
to be associated or compared in any way to this
monstrous clown that gets even more monstrous and the more
recent adaptations. Yeah, it's like think about, um, think about
like the afflack Duck, or what the Geico the get
(31:28):
it's a gecko right, Um, Well, if you're going with Geico,
you've got about eight different mascot choices you could go with.
There could be caven, it could be a pile of cash.
Yeah that's true. But in any one of those cases,
you could be caught flat out if the wrong thing
happens in the real world. So it looks like because
(31:50):
they made the decision to pull Ronald back even further
due to literally sightings of grazed clowns, it looks like
they dodged the bullet because as they got out just
a year before, it's once again ruined clowns for a generation.
So whither our hapless Ronald? What's up with old Ronnie
(32:10):
these days? He's not tweeting anymore. Checked just to confirm
you're not going to see him in a commercial anytime soon.
McDonald land has probably been paved over. We're going to
skip that terrible joke I made. Look Let's be honest,
a lot of people in the United States have some
degree of what's called cool roophobia, fear of clowns. And
(32:32):
I would argue, uh, for many of us listening today,
it's because we grew up in a post John Wayne
Gaycy America. Right sure, And there's a clear yeah, I
am I over am I like assigning too much power
to that. I don't think so. I think that that was,
you know, this this real world monster who took an
(32:56):
image that previously had been associated with childhood on an
innocence and then used it to such horrific extent it
ended up fueling tons of horror fiction for the following decades.
Right that, there's that become tropes that were based off
(33:16):
this real world incident that to this day, like the
evil Clown is something that just is like a standard
stock monster. And I would argue that that gay Cy
was kind of the launching point for that to really
become a thing. To some extent, We've seen that sort
of association with childish things in the past, whether it's
(33:37):
like a ventriloquist dummy or a doll or something like that.
There always is something slightly creepy with any element where
a child's imagination creates some of the anima for that thing.
And I think clowns fall into that category to even
though they're portrayed obviously by hopefully animated people. But yeah,
I think that gay cy that was like a real
(33:57):
turning point and and kind of became an inspiration if
you will. It's terrible to use that word for someone
like that, but an inspiration for a lot of horror
novelists and filmmakers moving forward. Yeah, I agree with we've
put it, and I will say whenever we talked about
this kind of stuff, it is important to note hashtag
(34:19):
not all clowns. Uh, easily confused with the hashtag no
tall clowns. But but there are plenty there. I'm not
above it, but there are plenty of people who are,
you know, working as clowns. There are prestigious clown academies
right in different parts of the world. There is an
ancient tradition and there is an art to it. There
(34:41):
is a craft. So we're not saying that all clowns
are bad. We're just saying it's inescapable. Uh, it's inescapable,
at least in the minds of many US residents to
not see a clown and think there's some sort of
implied sinister aspect. We can blame it on Penny Eyes,
we can blame it on Gaycy, we can blame it
(35:02):
on you know, honestly, anything other than the cinematic masterpiece
Killer Clowns from Outer Space. You guys remember an amazing
theme song by the Dickies. So yeah, that's like, that's like,
that's like Gold Cinema. I'm sure it's in the Criterion collection. Yes,
it should be. Max. Have you seen Killer Clowns from
(35:24):
Outer Space? I am pretty certain I have. It's been
a long time if I have though of that theme
song to Hear to Hear the uh the entrance of
the Gladiators, which is the famous tune that we always
associate with clowns, but being played speed metal style and
a guitar man one of my favorite movie soundtracks of
(35:47):
all time. Yeah, true classic of of goofy schlock horror one.
How dare you to just kidding? Yeah, it's definitely it.
The leap is some schlock. It puts the shock and
schlock um and you're gonna have the most fun watching
that film if you do not worry about the motivations. Uh,
(36:09):
and don't bother addressing plot holes or indeed plot so
we can't deny that what happens here is that Ronald
McDonald was, in this case found guilty by association. His
whimsy was also kind of outdated. More and more people
saw him less like a fun goofball and more like
(36:29):
that pie Piper character you know, who is getting kids,
getting into minds of children and leading them towards quite
possibly serious health problems. McDonald's leadership is aware of all
these factors. That's why today if you go into the
modern McDonald's, if you stroll into one of well most
(36:50):
of the thirty six thousand, eight hundred eighty nine or
so locations across a hundred nineteen countries, sorry Russia, you
will have to look pretty closely to find a trace
of what I think we could call a fast food Osamandius.
I would love to travel around McDonald's of the world
and just take that, take that line from Ozamandius, look
(37:13):
upon my works mighty in despair and just like put
it in a little placard by by the statue. I
don't know. I have to admit ben a peek behind
the curtain really quickly. We do have these notes that
we share with one another, and we contribute. We all
contributed to it. Ben did the vast majority of the contribution.
And when I read this, this comparison to Ozamandius, I
(37:39):
was so delighted to know you. Oh man, uh likewise,
likewise I used that reference way too often. By the way,
it's it's gonna be a problem. So thank thank you
for enabling my myopia, uh thematic as it is. And um,
(38:00):
there's the thing though, I think we can all agree
nostalgia is a heck of a drug, Max Jonathan. That's
something we've been talking about in part one. It's something
we're talking about in part two, and it still remains
the case today. People pretty much everywhere we will remember
Ronald McDonald, or not everywhere, but in many parts of
the world, you can stroll into a place and you
(38:23):
can say, hey, do you remember Ronald McDonald, And even
if they don't know the name, you can strow them
the picture and they'll go, oh, yeah, yeah, the uh
yeah McDonald's. They might even just call him McDonald's. In
some places, people still like have a hot market for
happy Meal toys. I used to love those Uh, I
didn't know that some of them would be worth money later.
(38:46):
You can, right, it's not what we're some of your
favorite Happy Meal toys guys. You know what's interesting because
like I remember back when the toys were completely independent
of any other type of branding, and then there was
(39:07):
a shift where you started to see partnerships between McDonald's
and other um popular brands that were out there, and
you would get tie ins, especially Disney. There was like
a string of Disney tie ins with Happy Meals for
a while. But I almost said it, Oh my gosh,
I almost said in my day, the toys, the toys
(39:32):
weren't like that, and uh, you know, I I just
remember getting these little toys that I thought were fun
and diverting from maybe like a day or two, and
then they find their way at the bottom of the
toy box and never emerge again. And then you know,
flash four thirty years and you're like, I could have
paid my college debt with that one toy if I
(39:54):
had just not played with it and kept it in
good condition. Yeah, I mean, I was kind to think
about it. Like then you post a question, I'm like,
I can't think of a single toy and then Jonathan,
you said that part about it being tied in, and
I'm like, so yeah, I mean, like a lot of
times I remember, I remember like whatever movie or TV
show or whatever I like, if they had a McDonald's toy, Oh,
we had to go get it. We had go get it.
(40:16):
I remember being definitely way too old for happy Meals
and getting happy meals still because you need to get
the toy. I think eventually they worked out some sort
of system where you could buy the toy if you
wanted to what You didn't have to get happy meals,
but there will be like stories of people buying it
happy It was like full grown adults buying happy meals,
so you get the toy and stuff. I particularly remember
(40:39):
um Sub I don't know if they were tied to anything,
but there was a series of these little figures that
were that would transform from uh, from you know, like
a coup of soda or a basket of fries into robots,
the robot characters, and I thought, I thought they were
(41:01):
so cool and you know, be living a life of
leisure now if I had just held onto them, you know,
But I can't I can't remember if those were tied
in with transformers or maybe go bots thing that a
lot of people don't remember. But just to remind you,
gobots came first, Transformers came after gobots. There's just that
(41:24):
the Transformers were let me check my notes here one
billion times better. So uh, let's I also just want
to see if we can get a sense of scale
hero and I don't want to give us too many regrets. Um,
but you can find any number of list This is
(41:44):
just a cursory duct duct go search and find any
number of lists of highly prized McDonald's happy Meal toys. Uh.
Number one apparently is ties teeny Panie Booze, so like
Beanie babies. Uh. You could sell them for four and
(42:05):
fifty dollars, so not quite not quite a mortgage yet,
but we still should have saved them. I got one
right here. I have one from Kids Kids Meals, Kids
Meal fandom page, and it has like a list of
all the ones and the first half meal toys they
have listed is from nineteen nine for a Star Trek,
(42:26):
the motion picture that's random and weird. It was great
because those toys were just as boring as the movie was. Really,
you guys agree on that Star Trek the Motionless Picture.
I was watching in four kmaster one day. It was
so bad. I mean, there's so bad. There's a segment
(42:48):
that has to be at least five or six minutes
long where they're just doing a slow orbit of the
Enterprise as the movie theme is playing. That movie theme
is the one that they would repurpose for Star Trek
the next generation many years later. And and I mean,
it's it's a pretty ship. And you understand that at
(43:10):
the time that this was a real achievement in special effects,
but it destroys any sense of pacing that you have
when you're you're taking like literally five to six minutes
out of your movie just to do heroes shots of
your your spaceship. It's so bad. And uh, it's even
worse when you see afterwards the difference in budgets between
(43:31):
that and the Wrath of Con Like. The Motionless Pictures
budget was so much bigger than Wrath, like twice the
biggest the Wrath of cons budget. Wow, you guys are
schooling me here. Also, as you can tell, Jonathan Max
is in addition to be our resident curing expert, our
resident expert on Star Trek, so we might have to
(43:51):
have you back when we we finally do our Star
Trek episode. Right now, what we can say is that
people still you'll find very ardent fans of Ronald McDonald. Uh.
He didn't entirely leave social media. He has an official Instagram. Uh.
And maybe most importantly, Ronald McDonald House Charities that that
(44:13):
organization is still around. They're still doing good work and
who knows. Really it's a a pop culture is a
study of cyclical things, right, so a lot of things
that shine one day we'll find their way into a
spotlight again. And with the sheer enormity of the shadow
Ronald McDonald cast, we can't ever quite say he's gone
(44:34):
for sure. So what we have witnessed could perhaps be
described as the first age of the clown. So we
have so much crazy stuff that we got to. We
found a lot of really interesting tangents in trivia. We
sprinkled some throughout the show. I wanted to ask, Jonathan,
are there something that we didn't get to that really
stood out to you? The only one I would really
(44:56):
mention is the fact that you talked about how you
had these Ronald McDonald's statues. Some places had statues where
it was like a seven foot tall clown standing there,
and others. It was the bench one where there's a
sitting clown with its arm extended, where you could have
sit down and maybe have your picture taken with Ronald
giving the old yawn and reach move on you on
(45:20):
the bench next to you. Um. But what was really
interesting is obviously those became targets for vandalism throughout the years,
like teenagers and college students would often target these and
it became kind of almost like a contest to see
if you could steal one from your local McDonald's. And
I've got a few examples. In nineteen eighty one, Ronald
(45:42):
McDonald was found sleeping with the fishes. Uh so, this
full size statue of Ronald was pulled out of the
theta U pond at Oklahoma State University. Nineteen eight six,
it happened again, but this time it wasn't Oklahoma. It
was in Florida at Lake Sumter Community College. And then
you started you you'll see other reports of this too.
Sometimes a lot of times they didn't find the statue,
(46:04):
but there were some interesting ones. There was one where
a statue was stolen in ninety one and turned up
in the middle of the desert outside of Phoenix, Arizona.
And my favorite was there was an a military officer
or military a member of the military I shall say,
I want, won't say officer who stole a Ronald McDonald
(46:24):
statue with the goal of setting it onto a raft
off the Santa Monica pere. Now. He stole it in Biloxi, Mississippi,
which is not close to Santa Monica, right drove it
across the country to California, but was unable to complete
his plan. He was caught with the statue. The statue
was returned to its location in Mississippi via an Air
(46:49):
Force flight, so Ronald McDonald had a military escort bring
him back to Mississippi from California. Think about how much
you regret your actions turned that drive because you steal
that statue and you're like, yeah, this is great, and
then you have that entire drive to think about like
it is this bit really that funny? And then you're like,
(47:10):
you know, if I set him off the coast, like
who else gonna know about this? This is gonna go
down on the ocean. And then by the time you're
in the middle of nowhere, Texas on that drive, you're like,
why am I this way? Why do I do things
like why why am I risking a court martial over
a Ronald McDonald's statue? Also, another good question to ask
(47:30):
is why do we taxpayers foot the bill for the
Air Force to take a statue of Ronald McDonald back
to Mississippi. That's my only thing I vote for is
to make sure that happens. I'm a single issue voter,
and that's all. That's all that I I look at
what I consider a candidate and I'll ask him to
I'll write to the campaign and say, where are we
(47:51):
at with McDonald's statues? Um, yeah, no, this is all
a true story. Uh. And that member of the military's
name was Colin Powell. You can read about it being
his autobiography. Uh, that's might not be true. Don't in
fact check that part of the show, folks. But we
(48:13):
are going to call it the day. We're gonna call
it the week. We have found the the official explanation
for the demise of Ronald McDonald. Now, given again his
his enormous influence of pop culture, it's fair to say
he's kind of maybe Cathulu esque right, dead but dreaming
(48:33):
and may rise again. But uh, for now. We hope
you enjoyed the ride. Thanks to our super producer Mr
Max Williams. Thanks again to Chris Frosciotis, Eve's Jeff Code,
our research associates, Zach Williams, no relation, Jeff Bartlett, and
of course one of my absolute favorite people, Mr Noel Brown,
who will be returning soon. Uh. And with that, Jonathan,
(48:58):
I'm sure you can hear our outra music. I want
to thank you specifically. Man. Uh. This has been an
absolute blast. I can't wait for you to come back
again on the show. Thanks so much, Ben. And if
you guys are interested in hearing, are sorry. If you
guys are interested, wait, no, I got this. I got this.
(49:21):
If you guys are interested in hearing these are sucked
at it. Damn it you did? Uh the quister a K.
Jonathan Strickland. I can't believe. I can't believe you're back.
(49:43):
I'm back you you you see that I have ripped
off my Terraway clothing to reveal my doublet injustors hat underneath.
I uh, you got us, man, I thought we were
gonna I was actually surprised. I thought we were just
talking to your alter ego. Jonathan Strickland. But it seems
(50:04):
your true colors are shining through. You have flam mixed us. Uh,
well you've yet to fla mix us hopefully, but but yeah,
you got us. I thought we were going to get
away clean. Not this time, Mr Bolan. No, for those
of you who are unaware, blissfully as to what the
heck is going on right now, welcome to the most
(50:27):
cringe worthy segment in All Love podcasting, where I the
quiz to quiz your beloved host and his plucky producer
on some scenarios. I present three scenarios too are true,
one is false, and the contestants have to decide which
(50:51):
what's the false one. It's definishly clever. So it's just
it's just a game show. I mean, that's your devilishly
clever thing. It's just those standard basic game show. Ever,
is that what I'm herring McDonald's is just a fast
food restaurant? Max to Shap, Sure, I I give that
to you, But yeah, I don't think we were ever
(51:11):
up to debate that that was a just a fast
food restaurant. But you know what, buddy, I'll let you
have this one. I'll let you have this one. I'll
go ahead, right here we go. I shall I shall
present three scenarios. You shall have three minutes between the
two of you to debate which of the scenarios is
the false one. And as always, I will allow you
to ask me questions, but only if you first preface
(51:34):
your question with a particular phrase of my choosing. And
this time the phrase shall be BAA, I'm loving it.
M hmm, Okay, that's it. Yes. Scenario number one. The
regional fast food chain Rax Roast Beef, at one point
(51:54):
boasted more than five hundred locations across the United States.
These days, that number has dwindled down to less than
half a dozen. Reasons for the restaurants decline on many,
but perhaps one of the most pertinent to our discussion
today was the introduction of a certain Mister Delicious. This
was an animated character in commercials, a sad sack divorcee
(52:16):
who was supposed to lure adult diners into the fast
food establishment. Shortly after his introduction, the company filed for bankruptcy.
Scenario two. The first location of Doggie Diner opened in Oakland, California,
in nineteen The mascot for this hot dog and hamburger
(52:36):
fast food joint was a ducks and wearing a bow
tie and a chef's hat, which you could see outside
some of their establishments, a three dimensional one. And not
only that, the dog's head would rotate exorcist style, letting
you know the victuals inside were devilishly good. But the
spread of larger franchises ultimately spelled doom for the poor doggie,
(52:59):
and by nine the company was out of business. Scenario three.
In the late nineteen sixties, a regional restaurant chain in
the Upper Midwest called doc Oh the Bay promised to
bring quote unquote fresh seafood to the landlocked States. The
chain's mascot was a fish doctor. By that, I mean
(53:21):
it was a fish wearing a stethoscope and a head mirror,
not a human who tended to sick fish. It was,
of course named doc Perhaps it was a bad idea
to associate a sea food restaurant with a doctor like that.
The experiment only lasted until nineteen seventy seven, when Long
John Silver's lay broadsides against the little chain and sunk it.
(53:43):
By that, I mean Doctor the Bay went out to business.
Begin Okay, I'm running to our running towards timer. We
spent a lot of a lot of the show budget
on this one, so we are going to have three minutes.
Let me get the clock rolling. Okay, I'm I'm running,
I'm running, and go Ben, what you feeling? First impression?
(54:08):
Which one are you saying? Which ones he say is real?
Which ones he say in her falls? I gotta say
maybe because the most recent my memory, the fish Doctor
one seems sucks. What do you think? I don't know.
Being a born in the Midwest, that seems very Midwestern
to do some of that. I think number one is
totally real. That's what I'm coming off. As as soon
as I heard, I'm like that sounds I've heard of. Okay, um,
(54:31):
we need you know what we need to recap in
number two? Uh? Popa poppop pop. I'm loving it. Wow,
we did two full podcasts. You still don't have their
catchphrase right? So number two was the Doggie Doggie Diner
hot dog and Hamburger fast food joint that a mascot
was a docksin wearing a chef's hat and a bow tie.
(54:53):
They had essentially a bust of this character outside some
of the restaurants that would wrote three hundred sixty degrees,
spreading its endless gaze across all the lands, judging throughout
all of time, at least until nine when the restaurant
went under. Yeah, I totally think that's real. Do you
(55:15):
think so? I don't know. I think they're all real.
They all sound like something terrible that that people would
would do. Okay, how about this, Max, Let's let's you
and I. Um let's leave it to chance. I'm gonna
say that I think I feel like I'm having a
(55:35):
tough time to sign between number two and number three.
Let me ask, but I'm loving it. Oh, well done, Max.
What's your quest? So we've already both trashed on Star
Trek the emotion less picture. What is your favorite Star
Trek movie? Oh? That would be Star Trek to the
Wrath of Colin. I think that that one is the
most It's not like Star Trek the series, which was
(55:58):
much more thoughtful and more about working things out and exploration.
But as an action film, Star Trek two is phenomenal.
Now if I wanted to go beyond that, maybe I
don't know. Star Trek four of the Voyage Home is fun,
but I mean it's very cheesy and Star Trek six
has Shakespeare, so that's also one. Okay, we've got just
(56:21):
a few seconds now, all right, don't let him distract you, Max.
He's taking the time, that's what he's doing, all right.
So Ben, which one are you going with? Uh? It's
three or two for me? Man, which one are you
feeling strong? Or? I can go either way myself? Three
fish doctors? Weird? Let's go fish doctor. We're locking it
in three to one. Well, so, so you really thought
(56:50):
there was a doggie, Dina, there was? You were right?
It was number three. That was the one I made up.
Congratulations you have you have picked the correct one. Uh.
My favorite of those is, in fact, the Rax Roast Beef,
because there are videos about that establishment online that you
need to watch to really understand exactly how strange that
(57:15):
marketing campaign was. It was. It was like taking the
spirit of Sunday the Dog and putting it into a
divorced cartoon character. Well, uh, you know, that really was
up to chance for Max and myself. And I think
one thing at least that I learned with that is
(57:36):
that um fast food campaigns can be so surreal and strange. Anyhow,
that all three of those seemed believable to me, So
I guess I just right like, thank goodness for fish doctor,
But very well done, Jonathan. We just scraped by with
that one. Thank you for most of your work on
(58:01):
these two series or on these two episodes. So uh
we we can't wait to have you back on the air,
ridiculous historians. We can't wait for you to tune in
when Max, Noel and I are diving into more strange stories,
possibly with more returning guests in the meantime, quister where
can people find you under your daylight cover identity? Jonathan Strickland, Well,
(58:26):
they can find him as the host of the tech
Stuff podcast. They can find me and that flash of
lightning just before the light completely goes dark, look out
your window. I'm there. Oh that's amazing. It feels anticlimactic
to say that Max and I are on Twitter. Yeah
you can find me on Twitter. I'm at it fail
(58:47):
underscore Max Williams, So, um yeah, I will be there,
and um yeah I don't. I'm like a little too
terrified as to anything else right now. So Ben, why
don't you go away with stuff? Sure? Sure, we've got
sure you can find me at Ben Bull and H.
S W. On Twitter. You can find me on Instagram
(59:07):
where I'm at Ben Bulling bo w L I N
be sure to tune in next week thanks to all
our research associates. A big special thanks to our ride
or Die, Mr Noel Brown. In his words, We'll see
you next time, folks. For more podcasts from My Heart Radio,
(59:30):
visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever
you listen to your favorite shows
Ridiculous History is a production of I Heart Radio. Welcome
(00:27):
back to the show, Ridiculous Historians. Thank you, as always
so much for tuning in. Let's give a hand to
the one and only, the Man, the myth, the legend,
our super producer, Mr Max Williams. They called me Ben
my heart thought in it today. I'm sorry. Sorry, Well, hey, hey,
(00:47):
you've made it to the wou you know. Okay, So
this is funny because I have no idea what this
is gonna sound like after after Max gives it his
magic much but I trust you and we, as we
said earlier, this is the second part of a two
(01:07):
part series on a mystery in the world of fast food?
What happened to Ronald McDonald? Uh? As we said earlier, Uh,
my dear friend Mr Noel Brown is out at the moment,
but we'll be returning soon. In the meantime, we were
lucky enough to get one of the busiest men in
(01:27):
the history of podcasting to come on and flash up
our show. Fellow Ridiculous Historians joined me and welcoming back,
Jonathan Strickland. This little man called Jonathan certainly pushed around
and how Jonathan must be found? Man and a little
(01:55):
episode Jonathan maca just fast as they can and a
little like thank you, Ben. Technically on some days I'm
(02:19):
two of the busiest men. It's it's gonna be weird
over there. Gained a lot of weight in the pandemic. Ben, Okay,
it's been like Okay, I thought you were going for
like a multiplicity thing, you know, in multiple mean I
could be a man of two minds because I am
someone who likes to eat healthy, and yet I am
(02:40):
sitting here with a lot of McDonald's food in front
of me, just for a joke that was only for you.
Because no one who's listening can actually see it. We
described it though. I thought it was well done, because
I thought that was a good bit. What do you think. Yeah,
we also got to go on about how we all
have mesophonius and no one eat around us, which is amazing.
I mean, the more week to stay that out loud,
I think, the better it is for the world. Yes, yeah,
(03:03):
maybe there's an episode in the future for that. We'll
have to have you back on Jonathan for the history
of noises people hate, which is hopefully not our voices. Yeah,
I didn't want to turn this into a muck Bang podcast.
So oh oh yeah, wow, how's that? That's such a
fascinating genre. Anyway, look it up if you if you
want to know what we're talking about, we will leave
(03:25):
that discovery to you because we have another mystery. We
have another discovery on our hands. Knowing everything that we
know now after part one of what happened to Ronald McDonald,
we have to ask ourselves, where is he? Now? How
did a world famous figure, as you know, well known,
(03:46):
some would say is Jesus Christ or Santa Claus suddenly
go the way of the Dodo? I think, and you
put this in our notes earlier, Jonathan, I think it's
a really good point. Seriously, Ronald McDonald probably not as
recognizable as Mickey Mouse, right, that's what I think. Like
the the reference you you are citing is from a book, right,
(04:10):
So there was a book by Eric Schlausser which was
called Fast Food Nation, and in that Schlosser makes the
assertion that, uh, Ronald McDonald was the second most famous
fictional character behind Santa Claus. I submit that Mickey Mouse
is definitely in contention. I would be shocked if Mickey
(04:33):
Mouse was lower, especially well now, obviously it would be
clear that Mickey Mouse would win out because Ronald, as
we are going to talk about, the Star, has been
on the decline for quite some time. And and honestly,
part of the reason we're having this episode, and you know,
the reason why we built it up so much in
the first episode is you had a character who was
(04:57):
synonymous with the franchise across the world, not just the
United States. You know, we started off in the US,
but by this point it's a global phenomenon. Someone that
you know they're branding was incredibly recognizable and yet seemingly
in very short order, was largely erased. And you think,
(05:20):
how do you get to that point where you've you've
poured this capital, this amount of resources and assets as
a corporation into your marketing and then you say, you
know what, we're gonna switch gears, We're gonna throw this away.
So why would that happen? Was did something happen to
the resource itself, Ronald McDonald that poison the well and
(05:41):
perhaps necessitated a move away. Yeah, yeah, that's a very
just so that's a very good way to put it.
Because we're not blowing smoke here. Ronald McDonald began to
become a symbol for capitalism overall. In other parts of
the world, he started to represent some idea of the
(06:02):
United States. Protesters began dressing as the clown Capital c
when they were, you know, doing different demonstrations, and a
troubling discourse began if this was a murder and they
were likely multiple conspirators, or to be more realistic, there
are multiple factors. Uh. There is a fantastic Vice article
(06:25):
written by a journalist named Amelia Tate. This is an
interesting thing about this article. She is, this journalist is
looking into the story and trying to figure out what
happened to uh, the most famous clown in the world
of fast food, and oddly enough she gets kind of
stone walled in a really strange way. First, she goes
(06:49):
to the official McDonald's website and they say they're a
little ahead of the curve in the United Kingdom. They say,
with afraid that Ronald McDonald's no longer appears in McDonald's
UK advertising. Yeah, he still travels up and down the
country to visit restaurants and make sure everyone is enjoying
their meals. Um, it was a little bit arch on
(07:13):
that way. Yeah, but but but she right, Yeah, no,
that's a good point. So she is able to speak
with the press office for McDonald's UK and they said
they refused to elaborate or to really explain in depth
(07:33):
what happened to Ronald, but they say they do confirm
he hasn't appeared in any UK advertising since, including appearances
in restaurants. She asked for more information and the press
officer says, I'm afraid we don't have anything further to add.
And that's where she starts, you know, has the starts
doing some forensics, some detective work, and comes up with
(07:56):
one of my favorite phrases. She said, as it seems
that sometime in something made Ronald Amelia's words here personna
non hemburger brilliant. I mean it's clear we have a
real plastic knives out situation here. Perfect. Yes, uh, she did,
(08:20):
though she did find herself stone walled. She asked a
veteran of the advertising game for scoop. This person used
to work for McDonald's UK for some time, and this
person only replied, I don't fancy being sued by a clown,
which I didn't know was being concern I mean it
(08:41):
happens all the time here in the United States. But
the thing I was going to mention is that in
our first episode we kind of alluded to the fact
that there was an extremely strict series of rules that
were laid down for actors who were playing the part
of Ronald McDonald. We only touched on some of those.
There were actually it a few more, including the part
(09:01):
where there's only one Ronald McDonald. It doesn't matter how
many actors are playing Ronald McDonald throughout the various territories.
There's only one Ronald McDonald, right. So you start hearing
this and you're thinking, all right, this is an extension
of that same kind of veil of secrecy that the
company took extremely serious when Ronald McDonald was like front
(09:23):
and foremost in in the restaurant business. And now we're
seeing that same level of of attention and uh, careful
approach now that Ronald has mysteriously vanished. And obviously there
are a lot of hypotheses you could come up with,
and in fact, chances are the reason for Ronald's disappearances
(09:46):
due to a combination of factors that we're gonna talk about.
But you know, it's frustrating when you can't get a
solid answer, not even from people who have left the
company for fear that the documents they had sign those
NBA's will still hold a legal threat over them. Yeah. Yeah,
(10:08):
and this, I mean, this is a serious concern. Tate
runs into multiple instances of this. She speaks with a
guy named A J. Who was a former Ronald and
actually had a big hand in writing that official rule
book we mentioned in part one, and Jay says that
they're not allowed to talk about this. Uh. The author
(10:29):
of an earlier version of the rule book, the one
that said if you're Ronald, you can't tell children where
hamburgers come from. They also declined to speak uh. And
then she goes to the people who make those Ronald
McDonald's statues and I think a lot of us in
the crowd today remember those. It's it's Ronald frozen and
(10:51):
tableau on a bench, usually with like an arm out
so that you can sit next to the statue and
it looks like he has his arm around you when
you're just you know, hanging on a public bench with
a clown. Before before we move on, though, I am
not gonna let this accidental pun go without being pointed out.
You said A J had a big hand in writing
(11:13):
the rule book. What uh, I don't think I get
my own pun there? Oh you got a big hand
like Ronald McDonald, did you have? I thought he was
more of a like big foot guy. Am I missed
remembering the story had big hands? You figure this out, hey,
it's future Max here to correct something that passed. Max said,
(11:37):
Robald McDonald hand size very normal, completely normal. There is
nothing larger about his hands. I mean there bright and
yellow and weird. But so that's Ronald McDonald. He's bright
and yellow and red and weird. So yeah, I don't
know what past Max was thinking. But yeah, back to
(11:58):
the story, Ben, there is a good news kind of take.
Does find an answer when she talks to a guy
named well, Guy More, which makes me think of uh,
nominative determinism. Guy More, Yeah, is the He's the co
(12:20):
founder of something called Creative Coalition. He's an admin. Between
two thousand four and two thousand fourteen, he worked for
that advertising agency Leo Burnett the I'm loving It folks,
and he also won several prizes for a McDonald's ad
he did called just passing By, and it's frankly poetic.
(12:45):
I think maybe we can play just a little clip
here now the laborers and cables and council motion table
is with just passing by, and the guffey types and
scuffy types, and like the three frothy types with just
passing by, those on their own whilst on the phone
don key McNuggets and having a mom with just passing by,
(13:07):
the driving through with hungry crew who just pulled off
the A three two, We just passing by. Okay, So
what we're what we're seeing here and what we're hearing
here is a is this almost like spoken word monologue
about all the different people who eat at McDonald's, quick
glimpse into their lives. Gone is the clown. And as
(13:30):
Guy points out, when he started working with McDonald's, it
wasn't maybe the best year because two thousand and four
was also the year a certain documentary came out. I think, um,
I think you you probably remember this one, to Jonathan
Morgan Spurlock. I I have. I have distinct memories of
(13:52):
this this era. Uh, most of them don't involve McDonald's,
because by then I had moved on to other I'd
put away childish things, and I moved moved on to
to local regional chains. But no I mean, I remember
very much the Supersize Me documentary, and the documentary is
(14:16):
an interesting way of putting it. I remember the Supersize
Me film, and I remember that that did kind of
it generated a wave of concern about the nature of
the obesity issue in the United States and the connection
to things like fast food restaurants. I would say that
(14:37):
was the starting point for that conversation. I would not
take supersize me as like the thesis statement that you
should follow. There is some some showmanship and supersize me,
but it definitely it definitely got the conversation moving more
toward we need to do better for ourselves and for
our children. We need to make certain that we are
(14:59):
provide healthier options for meals because as it's going, uh,
things are taking a very unhealthy turn. And the real
concern was that in the long run, we might see
things like life expectancy start to go down for people
in the United States because of the various health issues
(15:20):
you can get through through morbid obesity. And so that
was kind of where that conversation got going. And obviously
that's a very complicated conversation. It's one that it goes
well beyond just fast food or exercise. It goes into
all sorts of different things. You cannot simplify this down
to like a bite size uh bullet point, but it
(15:45):
is the sort of thing that got a lot more
attention and scrutiny directed towards the fast food industry in
general and McDonald's in particular. Yeah. Yeah, the big revelation
of supersize me, which does have showman ship in it.
I agree with that is surprise, surprise. Eating fast food
all the all day, all the time, isn't super great
(16:08):
for you? Not the same as you know, a more
varied diet guy. More is working during this time when
the when the pushback and concern about McDonald's really really
kicks into high gear and gets into the public uh.
He says that internally McDonald's had a serious issue with
childhood obesity and lots of rumors about what goes into
(16:32):
the burger. This is also the time where we see
the rise of speculation about like what's in McNuggets? Right,
what is the what are the true ingredients of a
hamburger or a big Mac. This leads McDonald's and their
roster of ad agency Boffin's, to say, look, when people
have these real concerns, regardless of how how much weight
(16:55):
they put in something like supersize me, We need to
realize it may not be the best look to have
what More describes as a joker at the table. So
McDonald's begins to pivot and their ad campaigns are increasingly
targeting adults more so than children. This is a big
change for this company. About eleven, there's another backlash that occurs,
(17:17):
and nonprofit out of Boston starts calling for Ronald McDonald's retirement.
They say he exploits children, he promotes obesity. Critics are
saying that he's undermining the authority of parents right by saying, hey, kids,
make your parents go do this, which is how a
lot of advertising for children works. To your excellent point earlier, Max,
and he says, this guy's really he's kind of a
(17:40):
pie piper figure. You know, he's enticing kids with sugar
and cool toys into bad decisions that may potentially have
life impact in consequences. So that's how in just a
few years, the world's most famous clown, this kind of
Santa secular Santa Claus of America, is being compared directly
to cigarette mascots like Joe Campbell. I will say that
(18:10):
being Enticed by Sugar and super Cool Toys could be
my autobiography title. Also, I think a good strong contender
for my autobiography title is a phrase you uttered earlier,
Mr Bolan, gone is the clown? Both of those would
work really well. Uh yeah, yeah. So here here's here's
(18:30):
another take that I have. It's it's interesting because it's
not something that we really address in the notes. And
part of it is that McDonald's had not only was
it starting to look at Ronald McDonald as a potential
liability for the company right like it's it's a bad look.
As the kids say, or they used to. I don't
know what kids say anymore. I don't understand them. So
(18:52):
the the other thing, though, is that the generation that
grew up with Ronald McDonald as the this icon that
enticed them into McDonald's, they are grown now, they're adults,
they have kids of their own, they have already established
a habit of going to McDonald's. You don't have to
go after the kids to get the people into the restaurants.
(19:14):
Now the kids have grown up to be the adults
and they're going into the restaurants already, So it's almost
like you're like, hey, we got them, we hooked them.
Now we just have to perpetuate the cycle and watch
the money roll in. So that's another kind of cynical
way of looking at this. At that one, Ronald McDonald
was representing a potential risk that it was uh standing
(19:36):
in as a symbol for some negative things, and that's
never what you want for your marketing campaign. And too
really it had done its job already. Yeah, that's a
very good point. And that's when I hadn't considered, you know,
because um Max is our our marketing expert here, so
I would I would defer to I would defer to
(19:57):
your expertise here. But next that I I would say,
that doesn't even sound cynical. That sounds very on the money.
Oh yeah, that that's the marketing one on one right there.
That's that's perfect. I mean, it's like, you know, marketing
is all measured in impressions. You've already made the impressions
with Jonathan's point, with the adults, with the people who
are your audience. You want who have disposal income, who
(20:21):
are going to spur on the next generation. So instead
of just con and let's be honest. I mean, like,
I'm a child of the nineties. I clowns by the
time around, we're really kind of an outdated image. I
mean I don't even think it was like even like
the like creepiness had fully set in yet of clowns.
But it was also just like not it wasn't something
(20:44):
that was pertinent in my like thinking or if I
want to complicated my zeitgeist. It was like and so
it's just like, you know, moving moving on from this thing.
As Jonathan said, who's just like it's not making any
money and soon it's gonna start costing you money. So
uh so it just makes a lot of sense, you know,
for them to you know, just think instead of like
(21:08):
trying to get impressions with this thing that's clearly not
gonna make it so much money, let's, you know, instead
be like, this is the McDonald's that you got your
happy meal out when you're a kid. Now you can
get your whatever they advertise to adults. I don't know
why your kid gets your happy happy meal. Spin it
that way. Nostalgia for you, maybe not nostalgia, but like
(21:33):
you know, like remember ince an enjoyment for you and
then building that memory and like of like like going
McDonald's as a kid with your kids and stuff. There. Yeah,
that's I think you guys nailed it. Um. Ronald was
not ready to give up the ghost just yet. He
(21:54):
wasn't after that big big Mac in the sky at
one last hurrah, you know, rage, rage against the dying
of the fries, etcetera. So he ditches the jumpsuit and
he cleans up a little. He's got a blazer now,
a red blazer. He's got a sharp bow tie, and
he begins tweeting directly from McDonald's official Twitter account. Uh
(22:19):
is for people who are very experienced with Twitter, like
like you, Jonathan. Uh You've We've seen this happen before
with mixed results, where an official Twitter account goes into
a little bit internet trolleing, or they try a campaign.
Sometimes they work really well, like the Windy's mixtape. Sometimes
they fall flat. Unfortunately, the latter is what happened with
(22:43):
our poor boy Ronnie. People were literally hashtag not loving it,
and we're not kidding that was a trending hashtag. Yeah
to all the brands out there, before you decide to
have a snarky, fun Twitter marketing push, really think it
(23:03):
over because one, if it's not really kind of zany
and fun, the audience picks up on it immediately. If
it's not sincere, then they know and you might get
a lot of traction, but it's not gonna be positive. Uh.
And to just like think over that snarky joke a lot.
E A recently got into trouble because they posted a
(23:25):
tweet that read She's a ten except you find out
she only plays single player games. That did not go
over well. So yeah, this, the Ronald McDonald experience is
a is an example of this kind of trend of
brands trying to embrace new communication on Twitter is not
(23:45):
new but newish communication channels and finding that their approach
to messaging is just a complete misfire for that particular audience. Right, So,
at this moment, if we could wax poetic in the
spirit of Guy more and is just passing by add
and performance, we can picture Ronald McDonald like the scene
(24:09):
in Um part way through so many rom coms. He's
standing in the rain outside of America's dining room window
and he's humming to himself the song he's humming, the
oldie hit Everyone Loves a clown. Everybody loves a clown,
so why don't you. Yeah, he's got cute cards, you know,
(24:29):
maybe he's got a boom box. But the makeover doesn't
work out spoilers. So first he has he has grim
is holding a boombox. Yeah, I'm you're mixing too many
movie metaphors to say anything, guys, just say anything, well done. Points. Also,
(24:51):
we're just gonna keep piling on. Hamburglar is like a
Syrano character and he's in the bushes. He's gonna keep
adding the beef to this, yes, beef it and so
he's like he's trying to uh, he's trying to tell
Ronald McDonald what to say, but because he's the hamburglary's
speaking in gibberish. So it's just like rubble rob rubble
rubble and s and seen uh so and then sun
(25:15):
then Sundays there, and Sunday just looks at the camera goes,
are you happy? Jonathan? I have I have to say.
I have to say that this is making me feel
like we are all in improv level three class guys,
be specific. What kind of bush is the Hamburgler hiding behind?
(25:38):
Uh uh? And we're going through so much cool, weird
stuff in this series today, folks. Uh, you may be
hearing some thunder in the background, and I think it's
appropriate to the way our story has turned apart two,
so we're gonna keep it in. Uh, there's something else.
McDonald's tries another mascot. It is an anthropomorphic happy Meal
(26:02):
named in a burst of creativity. Happy Happy is not successful.
I hesitate to put a picture in the chat, but
you can. You can find it and you'll kind of
see why. But that was not the final Uh. I
was not the final fry in the coffin because something
(26:23):
else happened in Yeah, this was completely out of McDonald's control.
This was one of those cultural moments where a trend
starts and begins to build and has rippling repercussions for
unrelated entities. So McDonald's in a way is a victim,
(26:47):
as were we all. So what Mr Boland is referring
to is that very special time in six where, for
reasons that never really became apparent, people were dressing up
as scary clowns and scaring people in a scary way. Right,
And that's true. It's a look collectively, everybody listening to
(27:12):
this show now we've all been through a lot in
the past few years. Sixteen seems a shockingly long time ago,
but it is true. For unspecified reasons. Uh, people across
the United States, in the Midwest, the South, all along
the East Coast began seeing, you know, clowns just out
(27:33):
in the wild, sometimes standing creepily like the old school
Ronald McDonald when he thought the camera was done rolling, uh,
sometimes trying to engage with people. People thought it might
be a weird gorilla marketing campaign for a movie, you know,
Blair Witch Style or something, But there was no way
of knowing who would be motivated to dress as a clown.
(27:54):
There was no way of knowing whether there was a
concerted effort or whether it was just organic le a
trend that other people were independently picking up on. And
there's not a way to address the issue in this country.
You can't really make the act buying a costume illegal,
and things start to escalate across that summer. It's August.
(28:17):
I think when law enforcement in South Carolina gets reports
that suspicious individuals dressed like clowns are literally trying to
lure children into the woods, and then there are more
stories about this. It continues, we even did a stuff
they don't want you to know episode on it. Eventually
McDonald's who I agree with you, Jonathan, They are a
(28:38):
victim here. This is beyond their control. Eventually they have
to make a statement, which is something you know, you
probably never think about when you join a pr for
firm or you work for McDonald's. You never think one day,
I'm gonna have to talk on record about all these
clowns and make sure that our clown is separated from
(28:59):
that conference agent. But it really comes up, and the
it rarely comes up in the interview process, right right,
Welcome to improv Level three or McDonald's corporate. Here's the question.
So yeah, I don't think people plan that way. But
the company did come out with a statement. I think
(29:20):
it was the right thing to do. They said they're
being thoughtful in respect to Ronald McDonald's participation in community
events as a result of the quote current climate around
clown sightings in communities, meaning in playing English, the sun
was setting on McDonald land and then like you brilliantly
(29:41):
foreshadowed in part one of this episode. A year later,
Stephen King's newest adaptation of it hits the big screen.
The main villain of it is, and this is not spoiling,
it is an evil clown named Pennywise, originally played in
(30:01):
a made for TV adaptation by Tim Curry and then
in this big screen adaptation also two parts. Uh is
played by one of those Scars Guard kids, right, Yes,
one of them. It's one of the it's the same
one from Himlock Growth, Yeah, yes, yes, he and we
(30:22):
we talked about this. We're not going to get into
like favorites or anything, because everyone has their own favorite.
But I will say I have a soft spot in
my heart for Tim Curry, largely because I was a
kid when that, yeah, teenager, when that mini series came out,
and I had already read the book by the time
the mini series had come out, and so I feel like, well,
(30:44):
there's a lot of stuff that's in that book that
I don't think it's appropriate for children, a lot of
the because it follows kids. It speaks to a kid's
sense of adventure, like it's a horror novel, but it
is also an adventure book. Um, And so like, I
have a soft spot for the Tim Curry version. That
being said, I definitely would not want my corporate mascot
(31:07):
to be associated or compared in any way to this
monstrous clown that gets even more monstrous and the more
recent adaptations. Yeah, it's like think about, um, think about
like the afflack Duck, or what the Geico the get
(31:28):
it's a gecko right, Um, Well, if you're going with Geico,
you've got about eight different mascot choices you could go with.
There could be caven, it could be a pile of cash.
Yeah that's true. But in any one of those cases,
you could be caught flat out if the wrong thing
happens in the real world. So it looks like because
(31:50):
they made the decision to pull Ronald back even further
due to literally sightings of grazed clowns, it looks like
they dodged the bullet because as they got out just
a year before, it's once again ruined clowns for a generation.
So whither our hapless Ronald? What's up with old Ronnie
(32:10):
these days? He's not tweeting anymore. Checked just to confirm
you're not going to see him in a commercial anytime soon.
McDonald land has probably been paved over. We're going to
skip that terrible joke I made. Look Let's be honest,
a lot of people in the United States have some
degree of what's called cool roophobia, fear of clowns. And
(32:32):
I would argue, uh, for many of us listening today,
it's because we grew up in a post John Wayne
Gaycy America. Right sure, And there's a clear yeah, I
am I over am I like assigning too much power
to that. I don't think so. I think that that was,
you know, this this real world monster who took an
(32:56):
image that previously had been associated with childhood on an
innocence and then used it to such horrific extent it
ended up fueling tons of horror fiction for the following decades.
Right that, there's that become tropes that were based off
(33:16):
this real world incident that to this day, like the
evil Clown is something that just is like a standard
stock monster. And I would argue that that gay Cy
was kind of the launching point for that to really
become a thing. To some extent, We've seen that sort
of association with childish things in the past, whether it's
(33:37):
like a ventriloquist dummy or a doll or something like that.
There always is something slightly creepy with any element where
a child's imagination creates some of the anima for that thing.
And I think clowns fall into that category to even
though they're portrayed obviously by hopefully animated people. But yeah,
I think that gay cy that was like a real
(33:57):
turning point and and kind of became an inspiration if
you will. It's terrible to use that word for someone
like that, but an inspiration for a lot of horror
novelists and filmmakers moving forward. Yeah, I agree with we've
put it, and I will say whenever we talked about
this kind of stuff, it is important to note hashtag
(34:19):
not all clowns. Uh, easily confused with the hashtag no
tall clowns. But but there are plenty there. I'm not
above it, but there are plenty of people who are,
you know, working as clowns. There are prestigious clown academies
right in different parts of the world. There is an
ancient tradition and there is an art to it. There
(34:41):
is a craft. So we're not saying that all clowns
are bad. We're just saying it's inescapable. Uh, it's inescapable,
at least in the minds of many US residents to
not see a clown and think there's some sort of
implied sinister aspect. We can blame it on Penny Eyes,
we can blame it on Gaycy, we can blame it
(35:02):
on you know, honestly, anything other than the cinematic masterpiece
Killer Clowns from Outer Space. You guys remember an amazing
theme song by the Dickies. So yeah, that's like, that's like,
that's like Gold Cinema. I'm sure it's in the Criterion collection. Yes,
it should be. Max. Have you seen Killer Clowns from
(35:24):
Outer Space? I am pretty certain I have. It's been
a long time if I have though of that theme
song to Hear to Hear the uh the entrance of
the Gladiators, which is the famous tune that we always
associate with clowns, but being played speed metal style and
a guitar man one of my favorite movie soundtracks of
(35:47):
all time. Yeah, true classic of of goofy schlock horror one.
How dare you to just kidding? Yeah, it's definitely it.
The leap is some schlock. It puts the shock and
schlock um and you're gonna have the most fun watching
that film if you do not worry about the motivations. Uh,
(36:09):
and don't bother addressing plot holes or indeed plot so
we can't deny that what happens here is that Ronald
McDonald was, in this case found guilty by association. His
whimsy was also kind of outdated. More and more people
saw him less like a fun goofball and more like
(36:29):
that pie Piper character you know, who is getting kids,
getting into minds of children and leading them towards quite
possibly serious health problems. McDonald's leadership is aware of all
these factors. That's why today if you go into the
modern McDonald's, if you stroll into one of well most
(36:50):
of the thirty six thousand, eight hundred eighty nine or
so locations across a hundred nineteen countries, sorry Russia, you
will have to look pretty closely to find a trace
of what I think we could call a fast food Osamandius.
I would love to travel around McDonald's of the world
and just take that, take that line from Ozamandius, look
(37:13):
upon my works mighty in despair and just like put
it in a little placard by by the statue. I
don't know. I have to admit ben a peek behind
the curtain really quickly. We do have these notes that
we share with one another, and we contribute. We all
contributed to it. Ben did the vast majority of the contribution.
And when I read this, this comparison to Ozamandius, I
(37:39):
was so delighted to know you. Oh man, uh likewise,
likewise I used that reference way too often. By the way,
it's it's gonna be a problem. So thank thank you
for enabling my myopia, uh thematic as it is. And um,
(38:00):
there's the thing though, I think we can all agree
nostalgia is a heck of a drug, Max Jonathan. That's
something we've been talking about in part one. It's something
we're talking about in part two, and it still remains
the case today. People pretty much everywhere we will remember
Ronald McDonald, or not everywhere, but in many parts of
the world, you can stroll into a place and you
(38:23):
can say, hey, do you remember Ronald McDonald, And even
if they don't know the name, you can strow them
the picture and they'll go, oh, yeah, yeah, the uh
yeah McDonald's. They might even just call him McDonald's. In
some places, people still like have a hot market for
happy Meal toys. I used to love those Uh, I
didn't know that some of them would be worth money later.
(38:46):
You can, right, it's not what we're some of your
favorite Happy Meal toys guys. You know what's interesting because
like I remember back when the toys were completely independent
of any other type of branding, and then there was
(39:07):
a shift where you started to see partnerships between McDonald's
and other um popular brands that were out there, and
you would get tie ins, especially Disney. There was like
a string of Disney tie ins with Happy Meals for
a while. But I almost said it, Oh my gosh,
I almost said in my day, the toys, the toys
(39:32):
weren't like that, and uh, you know, I I just
remember getting these little toys that I thought were fun
and diverting from maybe like a day or two, and
then they find their way at the bottom of the
toy box and never emerge again. And then you know,
flash four thirty years and you're like, I could have
paid my college debt with that one toy if I
(39:54):
had just not played with it and kept it in
good condition. Yeah, I mean, I was kind to think
about it. Like then you post a question, I'm like,
I can't think of a single toy and then Jonathan,
you said that part about it being tied in, and
I'm like, so yeah, I mean, like a lot of
times I remember, I remember like whatever movie or TV
show or whatever I like, if they had a McDonald's toy, Oh,
we had to go get it. We had go get it.
(40:16):
I remember being definitely way too old for happy Meals
and getting happy meals still because you need to get
the toy. I think eventually they worked out some sort
of system where you could buy the toy if you
wanted to what You didn't have to get happy meals,
but there will be like stories of people buying it
happy It was like full grown adults buying happy meals,
so you get the toy and stuff. I particularly remember
(40:39):
um Sub I don't know if they were tied to anything,
but there was a series of these little figures that
were that would transform from uh, from you know, like
a coup of soda or a basket of fries into robots,
the robot characters, and I thought, I thought they were
(41:01):
so cool and you know, be living a life of
leisure now if I had just held onto them, you know,
But I can't I can't remember if those were tied
in with transformers or maybe go bots thing that a
lot of people don't remember. But just to remind you,
gobots came first, Transformers came after gobots. There's just that
(41:24):
the Transformers were let me check my notes here one
billion times better. So uh, let's I also just want
to see if we can get a sense of scale
hero and I don't want to give us too many regrets. Um,
but you can find any number of list This is
(41:44):
just a cursory duct duct go search and find any
number of lists of highly prized McDonald's happy Meal toys. Uh.
Number one apparently is ties teeny Panie Booze, so like
Beanie babies. Uh. You could sell them for four and
(42:05):
fifty dollars, so not quite not quite a mortgage yet,
but we still should have saved them. I got one
right here. I have one from Kids Kids Meals, Kids
Meal fandom page, and it has like a list of
all the ones and the first half meal toys they
have listed is from nineteen nine for a Star Trek,
(42:26):
the motion picture that's random and weird. It was great
because those toys were just as boring as the movie was. Really,
you guys agree on that Star Trek the Motionless Picture.
I was watching in four kmaster one day. It was
so bad. I mean, there's so bad. There's a segment
(42:48):
that has to be at least five or six minutes
long where they're just doing a slow orbit of the
Enterprise as the movie theme is playing. That movie theme
is the one that they would repurpose for Star Trek
the next generation many years later. And and I mean,
it's it's a pretty ship. And you understand that at
(43:10):
the time that this was a real achievement in special effects,
but it destroys any sense of pacing that you have
when you're you're taking like literally five to six minutes
out of your movie just to do heroes shots of
your your spaceship. It's so bad. And uh, it's even
worse when you see afterwards the difference in budgets between
(43:31):
that and the Wrath of Con Like. The Motionless Pictures
budget was so much bigger than Wrath, like twice the
biggest the Wrath of cons budget. Wow, you guys are
schooling me here. Also, as you can tell, Jonathan Max
is in addition to be our resident curing expert, our
resident expert on Star Trek, so we might have to
(43:51):
have you back when we we finally do our Star
Trek episode. Right now, what we can say is that
people still you'll find very ardent fans of Ronald McDonald. Uh.
He didn't entirely leave social media. He has an official Instagram. Uh.
And maybe most importantly, Ronald McDonald House Charities that that
(44:13):
organization is still around. They're still doing good work and
who knows. Really it's a a pop culture is a
study of cyclical things, right, so a lot of things
that shine one day we'll find their way into a
spotlight again. And with the sheer enormity of the shadow
Ronald McDonald cast, we can't ever quite say he's gone
(44:34):
for sure. So what we have witnessed could perhaps be
described as the first age of the clown. So we
have so much crazy stuff that we got to. We
found a lot of really interesting tangents in trivia. We
sprinkled some throughout the show. I wanted to ask, Jonathan,
are there something that we didn't get to that really
stood out to you? The only one I would really
(44:56):
mention is the fact that you talked about how you
had these Ronald McDonald's statues. Some places had statues where
it was like a seven foot tall clown standing there,
and others. It was the bench one where there's a
sitting clown with its arm extended, where you could have
sit down and maybe have your picture taken with Ronald
giving the old yawn and reach move on you on
(45:20):
the bench next to you. Um. But what was really
interesting is obviously those became targets for vandalism throughout the years,
like teenagers and college students would often target these and
it became kind of almost like a contest to see
if you could steal one from your local McDonald's. And
I've got a few examples. In nineteen eighty one, Ronald
(45:42):
McDonald was found sleeping with the fishes. Uh so, this
full size statue of Ronald was pulled out of the
theta U pond at Oklahoma State University. Nineteen eight six,
it happened again, but this time it wasn't Oklahoma. It
was in Florida at Lake Sumter Community College. And then
you started you you'll see other reports of this too.
Sometimes a lot of times they didn't find the statue,
(46:04):
but there were some interesting ones. There was one where
a statue was stolen in ninety one and turned up
in the middle of the desert outside of Phoenix, Arizona.
And my favorite was there was an a military officer
or military a member of the military I shall say,
I want, won't say officer who stole a Ronald McDonald
(46:24):
statue with the goal of setting it onto a raft
off the Santa Monica pere. Now. He stole it in Biloxi, Mississippi,
which is not close to Santa Monica, right drove it
across the country to California, but was unable to complete
his plan. He was caught with the statue. The statue
was returned to its location in Mississippi via an Air
(46:49):
Force flight, so Ronald McDonald had a military escort bring
him back to Mississippi from California. Think about how much
you regret your actions turned that drive because you steal
that statue and you're like, yeah, this is great, and
then you have that entire drive to think about like
it is this bit really that funny? And then you're like,
(47:10):
you know, if I set him off the coast, like
who else gonna know about this? This is gonna go
down on the ocean. And then by the time you're
in the middle of nowhere, Texas on that drive, you're like,
why am I this way? Why do I do things
like why why am I risking a court martial over
a Ronald McDonald's statue? Also, another good question to ask
(47:30):
is why do we taxpayers foot the bill for the
Air Force to take a statue of Ronald McDonald back
to Mississippi. That's my only thing I vote for is
to make sure that happens. I'm a single issue voter,
and that's all. That's all that I I look at
what I consider a candidate and I'll ask him to
I'll write to the campaign and say, where are we
(47:51):
at with McDonald's statues? Um, yeah, no, this is all
a true story. Uh. And that member of the military's
name was Colin Powell. You can read about it being
his autobiography. Uh, that's might not be true. Don't in
fact check that part of the show, folks. But we
(48:13):
are going to call it the day. We're gonna call
it the week. We have found the the official explanation
for the demise of Ronald McDonald. Now, given again his
his enormous influence of pop culture, it's fair to say
he's kind of maybe Cathulu esque right, dead but dreaming
(48:33):
and may rise again. But uh, for now. We hope
you enjoyed the ride. Thanks to our super producer Mr
Max Williams. Thanks again to Chris Frosciotis, Eve's Jeff Code,
our research associates, Zach Williams, no relation, Jeff Bartlett, and
of course one of my absolute favorite people, Mr Noel Brown,
who will be returning soon. Uh. And with that, Jonathan,
(48:58):
I'm sure you can hear our outra music. I want
to thank you specifically. Man. Uh. This has been an
absolute blast. I can't wait for you to come back
again on the show. Thanks so much, Ben. And if
you guys are interested in hearing, are sorry. If you
guys are interested, wait, no, I got this. I got this.
(49:21):
If you guys are interested in hearing these are sucked
at it. Damn it you did? Uh the quister a K.
Jonathan Strickland. I can't believe. I can't believe you're back.
(49:43):
I'm back you you you see that I have ripped
off my Terraway clothing to reveal my doublet injustors hat underneath.
I uh, you got us, man, I thought we were
gonna I was actually surprised. I thought we were just
talking to your alter ego. Jonathan Strickland. But it seems
(50:04):
your true colors are shining through. You have flam mixed us. Uh,
well you've yet to fla mix us hopefully, but but yeah,
you got us. I thought we were going to get
away clean. Not this time, Mr Bolan. No, for those
of you who are unaware, blissfully as to what the
heck is going on right now, welcome to the most
(50:27):
cringe worthy segment in All Love podcasting, where I the
quiz to quiz your beloved host and his plucky producer
on some scenarios. I present three scenarios too are true,
one is false, and the contestants have to decide which
(50:51):
what's the false one. It's definishly clever. So it's just
it's just a game show. I mean, that's your devilishly
clever thing. It's just those standard basic game show. Ever,
is that what I'm herring McDonald's is just a fast
food restaurant? Max to Shap, Sure, I I give that
to you, But yeah, I don't think we were ever
(51:11):
up to debate that that was a just a fast
food restaurant. But you know what, buddy, I'll let you
have this one. I'll let you have this one. I'll
go ahead, right here we go. I shall I shall
present three scenarios. You shall have three minutes between the
two of you to debate which of the scenarios is
the false one. And as always, I will allow you
to ask me questions, but only if you first preface
(51:34):
your question with a particular phrase of my choosing. And
this time the phrase shall be BAA, I'm loving it.
M hmm, Okay, that's it. Yes. Scenario number one. The
regional fast food chain Rax Roast Beef, at one point
(51:54):
boasted more than five hundred locations across the United States.
These days, that number has dwindled down to less than
half a dozen. Reasons for the restaurants decline on many,
but perhaps one of the most pertinent to our discussion
today was the introduction of a certain Mister Delicious. This
was an animated character in commercials, a sad sack divorcee
(52:16):
who was supposed to lure adult diners into the fast
food establishment. Shortly after his introduction, the company filed for bankruptcy.
Scenario two. The first location of Doggie Diner opened in Oakland, California,
in nineteen The mascot for this hot dog and hamburger
(52:36):
fast food joint was a ducks and wearing a bow
tie and a chef's hat, which you could see outside
some of their establishments, a three dimensional one. And not
only that, the dog's head would rotate exorcist style, letting
you know the victuals inside were devilishly good. But the
spread of larger franchises ultimately spelled doom for the poor doggie,
(52:59):
and by nine the company was out of business. Scenario three.
In the late nineteen sixties, a regional restaurant chain in
the Upper Midwest called doc Oh the Bay promised to
bring quote unquote fresh seafood to the landlocked States. The
chain's mascot was a fish doctor. By that, I mean
(53:21):
it was a fish wearing a stethoscope and a head mirror,
not a human who tended to sick fish. It was,
of course named doc Perhaps it was a bad idea
to associate a sea food restaurant with a doctor like that.
The experiment only lasted until nineteen seventy seven, when Long
John Silver's lay broadsides against the little chain and sunk it.
(53:43):
By that, I mean Doctor the Bay went out to business.
Begin Okay, I'm running to our running towards timer. We
spent a lot of a lot of the show budget
on this one, so we are going to have three minutes.
Let me get the clock rolling. Okay, I'm I'm running,
I'm running, and go Ben, what you feeling? First impression?
(54:08):
Which one are you saying? Which ones he say is real?
Which ones he say in her falls? I gotta say
maybe because the most recent my memory, the fish Doctor
one seems sucks. What do you think? I don't know.
Being a born in the Midwest, that seems very Midwestern
to do some of that. I think number one is
totally real. That's what I'm coming off. As as soon
as I heard, I'm like that sounds I've heard of. Okay, um,
(54:31):
we need you know what we need to recap in
number two? Uh? Popa poppop pop. I'm loving it. Wow,
we did two full podcasts. You still don't have their
catchphrase right? So number two was the Doggie Doggie Diner
hot dog and Hamburger fast food joint that a mascot
was a docksin wearing a chef's hat and a bow tie.
(54:53):
They had essentially a bust of this character outside some
of the restaurants that would wrote three hundred sixty degrees,
spreading its endless gaze across all the lands, judging throughout
all of time, at least until nine when the restaurant
went under. Yeah, I totally think that's real. Do you
(55:15):
think so? I don't know. I think they're all real.
They all sound like something terrible that that people would
would do. Okay, how about this, Max, Let's let's you
and I. Um let's leave it to chance. I'm gonna
say that I think I feel like I'm having a
(55:35):
tough time to sign between number two and number three.
Let me ask, but I'm loving it. Oh, well done, Max.
What's your quest? So we've already both trashed on Star
Trek the emotion less picture. What is your favorite Star
Trek movie? Oh? That would be Star Trek to the
Wrath of Colin. I think that that one is the
most It's not like Star Trek the series, which was
(55:58):
much more thoughtful and more about working things out and exploration.
But as an action film, Star Trek two is phenomenal.
Now if I wanted to go beyond that, maybe I
don't know. Star Trek four of the Voyage Home is fun,
but I mean it's very cheesy and Star Trek six
has Shakespeare, so that's also one. Okay, we've got just
(56:21):
a few seconds now, all right, don't let him distract you, Max.
He's taking the time, that's what he's doing, all right.
So Ben, which one are you going with? Uh? It's
three or two for me? Man, which one are you
feeling strong? Or? I can go either way myself? Three
fish doctors? Weird? Let's go fish doctor. We're locking it
in three to one. Well, so, so you really thought
(56:50):
there was a doggie, Dina, there was? You were right?
It was number three. That was the one I made up.
Congratulations you have you have picked the correct one. Uh.
My favorite of those is, in fact, the Rax Roast Beef,
because there are videos about that establishment online that you
need to watch to really understand exactly how strange that
(57:15):
marketing campaign was. It was. It was like taking the
spirit of Sunday the Dog and putting it into a
divorced cartoon character. Well, uh, you know, that really was
up to chance for Max and myself. And I think
one thing at least that I learned with that is
(57:36):
that um fast food campaigns can be so surreal and strange. Anyhow,
that all three of those seemed believable to me, So
I guess I just right like, thank goodness for fish doctor,
But very well done, Jonathan. We just scraped by with
that one. Thank you for most of your work on
(58:01):
these two series or on these two episodes. So uh
we we can't wait to have you back on the air,
ridiculous historians. We can't wait for you to tune in
when Max, Noel and I are diving into more strange stories,
possibly with more returning guests in the meantime, quister where
can people find you under your daylight cover identity? Jonathan Strickland, Well,
(58:26):
they can find him as the host of the tech
Stuff podcast. They can find me and that flash of
lightning just before the light completely goes dark, look out
your window. I'm there. Oh that's amazing. It feels anticlimactic
to say that Max and I are on Twitter. Yeah
you can find me on Twitter. I'm at it fail
(58:47):
underscore Max Williams, So, um yeah, I will be there,
and um yeah I don't. I'm like a little too
terrified as to anything else right now. So Ben, why
don't you go away with stuff? Sure? Sure, we've got
sure you can find me at Ben Bull and H.
S W. On Twitter. You can find me on Instagram
(59:07):
where I'm at Ben Bulling bo w L I N
be sure to tune in next week thanks to all
our research associates. A big special thanks to our ride
or Die, Mr Noel Brown. In his words, We'll see
you next time, folks. For more podcasts from My Heart Radio,
(59:30):
visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever
you listen to your favorite shows
Ridiculous History News
Hosts And Creators
Ben Bowlin
Noel Brown
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